December 1, 2023 • 40 mins
Ever wonder about the intricate journey of your morning java? Prepare to have your curiosity quenched. We sat down with coffee expert and industry innovator, Mariana Faerron Gutierrez, owner of Tico Coffee Roasters, to explore the complexities of the coffee industry. Brace yourself for a stimulating conversation as we traverse the terrain of coffee origins, growth methods, and environmental impact. Uncover the secrets behind the world's second most traded commodity and the factors that influence the taste of your favorite brew.
Mariana doesn't stop at the beans - she dives deep into the challenges that the coffee industry is currently facing. From climate change disrupting coffee production to the decreasing number of coffee pickers due to migration and low wages, Mariana offers a first-hand account of these pressing issues. She also sheds light on the influential role women play in coffee production, sharing her personal mission to empower women through her work in the field.
We also scratch the surface of sustainable farming and conscious consumption. Mariana reveals the critical importance of sustainability in coffee farming, advocating for consumer awareness and fair trade practices. As we uncover the significance of agriculture certifications and their impact, you'll realize how vital it is to be informed and involved in the coffee industry. This episode is brimming with insights, perfect for coffee lovers and conscious consumers alike. Brew a pot, sit back and soak up a conversation that will change how you view the humble coffee bean.
Tico Coffee Roasters
Interview with Mariana Faerron
Things that make you say "Wow"!
For more episodes and additional information visit the Two Chicks and a Hoe website and our Facebook page.
Big thanks to our Producer, Casey Kennedy.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Coffee is coffee.
Is coffee right?
Well, kinda, but not really.
As we know from the varyingprices of a cup of coffee,
coffee is not just coffee.
There are so many factors thatare going to bring in you that
delicious cup of coffee and,according to the numbers, over
2.25 billion of us drink atleast one cup of coffee every
day.
Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa,whoa.
I think I've had too many cupsof coffee this morning.
I was saying coffee is coffeeright?
(00:24):
Well, kinda, but not really.
As we know from the varyingprices of a cup of coffee,
coffee is not just coffee.
There are so many factors thatare going to bring in you that
delicious cup of coffee and,according to the numbers, over
2.25 billion of us drink atleast one cup of coffee every
(00:44):
day.
Hey everybody, it's Vanessafrom Two Chicks in a Hoe, the
podcast that talks to amazingpeople doing wonderful things in
our world.
We're going to dig deep intocoffee.
(01:06):
I don't think many of us knowwhere it's grown, how it's grown
, who grows it and the impactthat it has on our environment.
But let's start with a coupleof fun facts.
First, brazil is the largestcoffee produced in the world.
Vietnam is second.
Coffee was outlawed severaltimes throughout history.
Leaders in Mecca outlawed thedrink in 1511 because they
(01:30):
believed it sparked radicalthinking.
Coffee was also attempted to bebanned by certain 16th century
Italian clergymen who called thedrink Satanic.
Pope Clement VII, on the otherhand, was so fond of coffee that
he abolished the ban and had itbaptized in the year 1600.
The biggest consumers are Finns, drinking 27 pounds a year.
(01:57):
Coffee is the world's secondlargest traded commodity.
Crude oil is first, and coffeewas discovered by goat herders,
yep.
The legend says that the firstcoffee berries were discovered
by an Ethiopian goat herd around800 AD.
The shepherd noticed that thegoat started to jump happily
(02:18):
every time they chewed on thecherry red berries.
Today we have the pleasure ofchatting with Mariana Faerron
(02:46):
Gutierrez, owner of Tico CoffeeRoasters in Campbell, California
.
She's going to fill us in onthe coffee industry from the
field to the cup, the impacts onthe environment, the future of
coffee and the role of women inthe coffee industry.
She's also going to share howTico Coffee Roasters is going
(03:07):
about it differently than manyof the big players.
So hi, welcome.
So much, Mariana, for beingwith us today and sharing your
wealth of information in yourbeautiful coffee roasting
facility.
Speaker 2 (03:18):
Thank you, Vanessa.
Thank you for inviting me toyour podcast.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
I love it.
So let's chat.
Let's chat about this, let'schat about coffee, with the
thing that I think so many of usyou know was at 2.25 billion
cups a day.
That's a lot of coffee andthat's a lot of people drinking
coffee across the globe.
It's amazing, so I guess let'sdig right into it.
Tell me a little bit aboutwhere is the majority of coffee
(03:42):
grown.
Speaker 2 (03:43):
So coffee grown around the equator, bail around
the world around the equator,bail around the world.
So Latin America, africa, asiaPacific, india, that's basically
.
And then Hawaii, of coursethat's a little bit more south,
it belongs to the US but it's alittle bit more south in the
latitude.
And then there is anexperimental farm now in Santa
(04:07):
Barbara, california Really, butit's a greenhouse.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
Oh, I was gonna say, isn't it under a freeway, or
something like that?
I heard that somebody wasgrowing coffee next to a freeway
?
Speaker 2 (04:18):
Yeah, but it's a greenhouse.
But naturally it's on theequator belt.
Speaker 1 (04:23):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (04:24):
Yes, all right.
Speaker 1 (04:25):
So and that's.
They say that's 25 degreesnorth and 30 degrees south of
the equator.
They call it the coffee belt,correct?
Yes, okay, so there's.
I was reading.
There's so many different waystraditional, more industrial,
under the shade in the sun, tellme a little bit about how
(04:47):
coffee the plant itself hasgrown.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
So coffee grows mostly in higher altitudes?
Speaker 1 (04:54):
Oh, I didn't know that In Latin.
Speaker 2 (04:54):
America and in some parts in Asia Pacific as well.
Speaker 1 (04:58):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
It can also grow so high altitude I mean above 1000
meters over sea level, Okay, andit can go up to 2000,.
Some places in Panama evenclose to 3000 meters.
So it's a really high altitudegrown crop and it needs to have
that altitude.
So the it's very similar to thewine industry, something that
(05:24):
people can relate to, Okay.
And so the higher the altitudeit allows the plant to produce
the cherries.
And each fruit has two coffeebeans inside.
Okay, there's a few mutations,but that's how it works.
So the higher the altitude,then it has some more cooler
weather, that it has sunexposure during the day and then
(05:47):
cooler or foggy evenings, Okay,and that allows the fruit to
mature slowly but also allowsthe beans to get harder and
harder.
That also influence for goodquality.
So the beans are kind of theseed, the seeds of the fruit.
Basically, that's what we buy,Okay.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
Okay, and what we roast?
Okay.
So do they need a lot of water?
Speaker 2 (06:10):
They do need a lot of water, and that's why the
tropics are ideal for that right, because we have more rainfall
compared to other parts of theworld.
Speaker 1 (06:17):
Exactly yes, okay, okay.
So Santa Barbara in agreenhouse.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (06:22):
There you go, we'll see.
Yeah, we'll see.
Okay, all right, so tell me thedifference.
So I hear about the traditionalway of growing coffee
originally was within the forest, correct?
Yes, so that's considered shadegrown.
Speaker 2 (06:38):
Yes, basically it is in between the forest right and
coffee is originally fromEthiopia.
Wait a minute.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
Ethiopia.
See.
No, when I think of Ethiopia, Idon't think of forest, even
though I know that there areforests.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
Yes, I had the option to visit some of our partners
in 2018.
And so we went and there isforest, there's a lot of forest
in Ethiopia, and the country,the capital, is about 1500
meters from mistaken, so theweather is really nice.
That's ideal.
(07:14):
It's ideal.
It doesn't really feel hot Likewhen people think on Africa.
We all think, oh, my God, it'sso hot, it's so sunny, it's
desert, it's not.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
Right.
Speaker 2 (07:23):
Ethiopia is in a higher altitude and it was
discovered there, so it grows onthe trees and, mixed with other
plants, got it.
So that's kind of like theoriginal way of the coffee plant
and they are very tall overthere, very high plants.
Is that the Arabic bean?
They are Arabic, but they arealso heirloom varieties, so very
(07:45):
ancient.
They haven't really beenbreeded with other varieties, so
they still keep a lot of theendemic characteristics and
flavors as well.
Okay.
Okay, in other parts of theworld, like in Latin America,
they are also shade grown, butthese have been planted and the
plantation has been designed ina certain way that allows the
(08:06):
farmers easier.
And that's, I quote, unquote,because coffee farming is not
easy.
So I understand, yes, but it'seasier for them to manage the
plantation but at the same timeget the shade that the plants
need so they are healthier.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Okay.
So, with the 2.25 billion of usdrinking coffee every day,
that's a huge, huge crop.
That my understanding.
The idea that they grow fasterin the sun, in a full sun is
that correct?
The coffee bean itself.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
They don't necessarily grow faster.
I think it has to do more withenvironmental or geographic
conditions.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
Right.
Speaker 2 (08:54):
Okay, it has to do more with what is available to
them and how.
What kind of variety they haveplanted in their fields?
Okay, some of them produce ahigher yield or they grow just
faster.
They have been brewed for thatspecific characteristic.
Speaker 1 (09:14):
Okay, so the shade sun thing is not really a
problem, or is it in terms ofdeforestation, for to grow more
crop then?
Speaker 2 (09:25):
I would say the shade grown.
The advantage of that is thatit protects the plant from
diseases.
So it allows it to grow like ina better temperature or more
constant temperature, and no, bestressed like full exposure
during the day and not at night.
Okay, so it's a more constanttemperature that allows the
plant to behave in better.
(09:46):
It also keeps more humidityOkay, so it doesn't need so much
water, like if it will be fullyexposed to the sun.
Speaker 1 (09:53):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
And it also protects with the seasons.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
If the plant is stronger and it's healthier, of
course it's going to be lesssusceptible to pests, because I
understand that there's a lackof genetic diversity within the
plants, within the coffee plants, but also too, of course, then
that's stressing the potentialfor disease of the plants as
well.
Yeah, yes, so we had aconversation with Dr Rodrigo
(10:20):
Medellin in Mexico about blueagaves and how they are all so
similar to each other clone-likethat one disease can wipe the
entire species out, and it'sstarting to sound like that
might be the case with coffee aswell, in terms of the idea that
it could get a type of diseasethat can wipe that out because
(10:42):
of its lack of genetic diversity.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
And it has happened before in the 70s and 80s with
the leaf rust.
It's a fungus that growsunderneath the leaves.
It's a yellow dot and it growsmany yellow dots underneath the
leaves.
And what it is, you know?
It releases spores.
So it is very easy, easilyspreadable through the wind
(11:06):
through different plants andplantations, and what the plant
does is that it starts losingthe leaves to get rid of what is
harming the plant.
But if the plant doesn't haveany leaves, there's no
photosynthesis and obviouslywon't be any coffee production.
So the plant might survivecompletely stressed, but there
(11:27):
is no harvest.
So that's the problem.
And if there is a lot ofinfection, the farmers have
pretty much no choice.
If they didn't control it ontime with pesticides, what they
have to do is basically just cut, get rid of the plantation If
they can save it like stump, andwait about four years for the
(11:48):
plant to regrow and to produceharvest again.
So there's a big financial lossfor them because of these
fungus.
Speaker 1 (11:55):
Is it so?
Is that why there's so manypesticides used in the growing
of coffee?
Because for disease prevention,for something just?
Speaker 2 (12:03):
like that.
Speaker 1 (12:05):
What I keep reading about is that there's this I
don't know if it's a fear for uscoffee drinkers that they say
by the year 2050 that we're notgoing to have coffee as we know
it, that there's so much stuffgoing on with the plants with,
in particular, because ofclimate change, the increase in
temperatures and how importantit is to have it cooler for the
(12:26):
plants, that and, of course,changes in rainfalls because of
temperature increases that thecoffee we know we won't have
anymore.
Have you heard that as well?
Speaker 2 (12:38):
Yeah, there is a big concern in the industry and it's
a combination of factors.
One that is really critical isdefinitely climate change and
it's the raising in temperature.
So coffee needs that coolweather to optimally grown and
harvest or produce the harvest.
And if the plant is exposed, orcertain plants or breeds, like
(13:00):
we have them now pretty mucharound the world, they are
designed to survive or to thrivein certain climate and if they
don't have that idealtemperature, they might not
produce the same amount ofcoffee and or they will be
exposed to more pests or thesame different diseases.
Speaker 1 (13:20):
So we're potentially facing a coffee crisis, so to
speak.
Speaker 2 (13:24):
Yes, and there's a lot of research right now in
different parts of the world tobreed or create hybrids to make
plants more resistant to certainspecific environmental
variables or some specificdiseases.
Oh, okay, so to try to providefarmers with an alternative
right?
If this plant doesn't work foryou, perhaps this one will
(13:46):
because it has been designed inthe labs for that.
But the problem is not just Imean, that's, I think, probably
the biggest climate change.
Also, how much the rain patternhas changed around the world.
And it's somethinguncontrollable, right?
Some parts that used to havelike a regular rainfall now they
(14:10):
don't, or places that used tobarely had any rain, now there's
floating, and this you knowlike.
We all are exposed to this inmany different ways, and this
industry, specifically, isfacing a lot of challenges
because of that.
Another challenge is thedecrease, I would say, of coffee
(14:32):
pickers.
So you need Coffee pickers arejust the people that go to the
farm to harvest the coffeecherries.
In the past it was very easy tohire them.
I would say it's people that go, you know, just in my country
I'm from Costa Rica.
It's a small country, but wehave different coffee regions
(14:54):
and, depending on the altitude,the harvest is happening at
different times.
Maybe a month of different, twomonths they were here in
Tarasub, then they moved toOrozzi Valley and then they went
to some other places, or thenthey went out to Panama, for
example.
Right now it's really hardbecause of migration, economic
forces that are, you know,forcing people to really move to
(15:17):
other areas, because it'sreally expensive, it's a job
that is labor intensive butdoesn't pay enough.
So then, and then youngergenerations they just don't want
to deal, they don't want to dothis job.
They don't want to do it.
So that's another issue forcoffee farmers in the industry
in general, like how do you keepthe labor that you need but
also reward them and this issomething that we emphasize a
(15:39):
lot to our consumers here.
Right, everybody wants thisgreat cup of coffee, correct,
but they don't want to pay forthat.
They don't want to pay for that.
And there's people suffering, alot of people suffering,
because they're not getting themoney that they deserve.
Speaker 1 (15:52):
So let's talk about that.
Who's growing the coffee?
Speaker 2 (15:58):
Coffee has been passed through generations,
family to family.
Speaker 1 (16:01):
This is globally correct.
Globally, yes, Okay.
Speaker 2 (16:04):
It's mostly family owned.
A lot of knowledge, definitely,that these people have and they
teach it to their children.
And, you know, next generationcomes and takes over the family
business.
And so men, women, even youthparticipate in the coffee
production.
And coffee production is yearround, it never stops.
(16:26):
It's just the harvest.
They have to fertilize, theyhave to prune, they have to
apply other things, then theharvest comes, then it has to be
dry, then it has to be back.
Someone has to do the work.
Exports.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
It never stops.
It never stops, yes, so interms of who does it?
So I was reading too that themajority of the labor workforce
and I'm assuming this isglobally as well that 70% of it
is women that's actually doingthe physical labor, the
harvesting, the planting, thepicking, that type of thing.
(17:03):
Is that correct?
Speaker 2 (17:05):
I would say it's a high percentage.
I'm not really sure and I haveto be honest that if it is 70%,
they take out toll not just inpicking the coffee cherries
right and at the fields, whichis really, really hard because a
lot of them are in steepterrain so they have to walk
with the With the children yeswith the children, with the
(17:26):
basket where they're picking thecoffees, everything.
But it's not just that.
It's also people who arecooking, people who are doing
some other things that is notnecessarily the farm but are
directly related to the harvest.
So this is a harvest season, Iwould say, and throughout the
year.
Some countries, unfortunately,they relate more on women and
(17:49):
they don't get rewarded for whatthey do.
I think some other countries,the situation is more even it's
men and women.
Speaker 1 (17:56):
So, mariana, tell me a little bit about this project
that you were telling me brieflyabout when I met you originally
, and it was about empoweringwomen.
Yes, please tell me some moreabout that.
Speaker 2 (18:10):
Yeah, this is something that I'm really
excited about and, as Imentioned to you, I came to the
United States 16 years ago,originally from Costa Rica, and
I came here because I married myhusband and he works in tech.
We're in the Silicon Valley, soa very easy path for him to
move to this area of the world,and when I came here, I didn't
(18:31):
really have a network or a jobor anything to do, so for me
there was a lot of disconnectand a little bit of loss of
identity.
I would say, like what would Ido now that I'm in this new
place?
So I had to start learningeverything making friends, going
out, even going something assimple as going to the
supermarket, right, right.
(18:52):
And in that search or learningprocess I started trying to find
coffee shops and then I went tomy local coffee shop and then I
tried that coffee and then Iwas thinking this doesn't taste
like it tastes at home.
Speaker 1 (19:07):
And I've been to Costa Rica.
I know we brought so muchcoffee home from Costa Rica.
We got stopped at customs.
They looked at us.
They didn't even touch our bags, they could smell.
They said you got a lot ofcoffee, don't you?
Yeah?
We do so.
Yes, amazing coffee, yes.
Speaker 2 (19:23):
And so you know it happened the next one and the
next one, and then also meetingpeople.
I told them where I came fromand a lot of people told me I
really like your country.
I have been there.
It's really great.
It's a great environment, thePura Vida life, which means pure
life people are so friendly.
And then I kept hearing the samemessage.
(19:45):
And then the other side of thestory, you know, looking at the
coffee.
I started agriculturaleconomics in Costa Rica and I
work with coffee farmers there,so then finally it clicked.
And then I said, well, this iswhat I know.
I have friends that grow coffee.
People love coffee.
Americans drink a lot of coffee.
(20:05):
They contribute to that toBillion Cops.
Speaker 1 (20:08):
I think they're the number one contributor.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
Yes, and so I thought well, there's something that
can be changed.
There's so great coffee, andnot just the quality, but also
the stories that are missed inthis equation.
Yes, who is growing this coffee?
Who is participating on thislabor?
Who is actually making thisgreat product for you?
Yes, and so that's how TicoCoffee Roasters was born, and
(20:33):
Tico is a nickname for CostaRican people.
Oh, that's right.
Yes, and so I wanted to name thecompany that, something that
resembles my heritage, thatresembles our lifestyle.
It's not really about me, butlike who do we want to be as a
company in this place?
What is the change that we wantto create?
So our mission is to empower,protect and nourish lives from
farm to crop, and theempowerment part comes from
(20:56):
working directly with farmers inmy country and in other
countries, our relationshipsthat we have developed for the
last 11 years and this is reallyimportant for me because,
growing there, I mean, I wasliterally surrounded by coffee
plantations, so I could seeevery year, right, the trucks
full of the cherries, thatdelicious smell, the blooming
(21:19):
season, all families reallyengage into the activity, and
how that has been disappearingbecause the pricing or different
crisis, that is just reallyhard for families to continue in
something that they used to doRight, and I wanted to be able
to share those stories, to beable to buy a great product,
(21:40):
because people deserve a bettercup of coffee Nice, but also the
people who grow it.
They deserve to be acknowledgedand they deserve to be paid for
what they are producing.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (21:51):
Yes.
So a lot of our coffees, morethan 60% of our coffees, come
from direct relationships indifferent countries in Latin
America, africa and Indonesia.
And we also started a projectabout five years ago and me, as
a woman and as an immigrant,really wanted to make a
difference in highlighting thework of women in the coffee
(22:13):
industry, buying more lotsproduced by women or women
collectives.
So right now we have fourdifferent lots and there is one
more coming.
It's here in Oakland, actually,we just have to wait for the
release.
It's coming up and it's reallyexciting and really, I think,
provides a lot of hope for meand also for consumers, because
(22:36):
women now are more aware andthey feel more supported and
that they are finally being seenand that they can really take
over or really like to stand upand speak up and for what they
are doing, basically, andgetting the recognition that
they deserve.
Speaker 1 (22:54):
So are you saying that you're buying coffee?
You say in lots from theseplaces around the globe, but
from women owned Correct Coffee?
Yes, farms yes, I'm trying tofigure out what they call it.
Yes, coffee farms Excellent.
Speaker 2 (23:09):
For example, we have a lot of.
It's a collective of some womenfarmers in Chiapas in Mexico
that they are really far in themountain, but there is a lady
that really took over thatproject and created this
collective.
And the ladies it's like oneafter another.
I want to belong to this group.
I really want to be part ofthis change, because now they're
(23:29):
finally getting the money.
It was always their husbandsand now they are getting money
and they want to be empowered.
They want to be able to buywhat they need.
They want to be able to feedtheir children or even send them
to school right, like before itwasn't possible.
And another great example thatI have is a very young woman.
We started working with herprobably like about five years
ago, and I think when I met hershe was just 24, 25.
(23:51):
Now she's close to 30, but justan example of young people.
All of these younger generationis like the comeback to the
coffee industry.
My generation I'm 45 and peoplewho had education or even a
little bit older than me.
They didn't want to do anythingwith agriculture.
(24:13):
It's like I'm finally doneright.
I don't want to be working inthe fields like my father's did,
my parents did.
I'm sorry, but this generationis.
You know what I got education,I'm bilingual or even sometimes
I speak three languages, and youknow what I can make this
business better.
Now they have the knowledge thatI guess before it was not that
(24:35):
people didn't have the knowledge, but they didn't have the
vision.
And this generation has avision, and so there's a lot of
young people, youngprofessionals, young people they
have education that areinvolved in the corporate
production and they are changingthe landscape and this is
really really exciting For thebetter right.
Yes, correct.
Speaker 1 (24:53):
So for the better, for not only for the community,
yes, okay but the environment aswell.
They're going about itdifferently.
Yes, got it.
And then, of course, for thewomen yes, tell me a story about
you mentioned that now thewomen have money and everything
and they could potentially sendtheir kids to school.
Tell me what else.
Tell me what else is happeningnow that women are becoming more
(25:16):
empowered through this, throughthis industry.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
I think a very good example is the same young woman
her name is Daniela the house.
She started working.
I mean she was, she grew up inthe farm and when she graduated
from university she said I wantto work with you.
She told her dad.
He said okay, but he was stilllike in his mind you know, she's
just going to be just rightnext to me and she started
(25:40):
trying to take over or likeasking more questions, getting
more involved.
So she shared last time that wewent in Costa Rica that there
was like kind of friction right,because he didn't want to let
go.
And it's not that he wasexcluding her, it's just the
mindset.
Speaker 1 (25:54):
It's more of a tradition, right.
Speaker 2 (25:56):
Like years of, you know, horticism that they had to
be breaking down.
Yes, but she was, I guess,persistent enough that she
started taking a little bit overthat.
Now she's in charge of exports,she deals with all the buyers
and everything.
And when before her father usedto get paid like two, three
months later she figured how toget paid like in two weeks, nice
(26:20):
.
And then her father told her,like what did you do?
How did you do that?
He said well, did you stop?
Right, you negotiate.
And it's just such a greatexample of how the equation
changes when women are involvedin an, involved with vision.
I think, right, it's not justgrowing coffee, they are also
(26:40):
business people.
Speaker 1 (26:40):
Yes, and they are having a voice now and you've
given them that voice.
Yes, that's Bravo.
Thank you Very nice.
Thank you, very nice.
So where do you see the futureof Tico coffee roasters?
Speaker 2 (26:52):
I see the future increase in distribution.
We sell online throughout theUnited States, but I would like
to probably get into some likebigger accounts here in Northern
California, some distributionwith some stores that are
conscious and also participatingmore into more, I would say,
(27:14):
like regional or in countryprograms in terms of
sustainability.
That's my passion.
Speaker 1 (27:19):
In country where the coffee is grown.
Correct, got it.
Yeah, okay, okay.
Speaker 2 (27:23):
Teaching sustainability, showing them how
to farm sustainably, that kindof of education I would say
probably programs that are moresuitable not just to grow coffee
, but maybe what else is neededor was forgotten, I guess
throughout the years.
Yes, to make not just theproduction but the whole
(27:44):
ecosystem.
Yes, sustainable.
They have a lot of knowledge.
I don't have anything to teachthem.
Right, but it's more like whatelse can be done to create not
just your coffee plantation butsomething else that can
contribute to the ecosystemRight.
And involving youth and women inthis.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
You're just reminding them.
Speaker 2 (28:00):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (28:01):
Correct, you're right , they know, they know they have
all the knowledge it's beenpassed down.
Yes, that's awesome.
Speaker 2 (28:07):
That's really awesome , great.
Speaker 1 (28:09):
So people can buy your coffee online?
Yes, okay, and if you are inthe Bay Area, you can come to
Campbell California.
Come in the morning, you canget a cup of coffee right here,
and then you can also purchasefresh beans here, freshly
roasted beans, yes, so great.
So we'll have all thatinformation up on the website
and tell you where you can goorder coffee.
(28:31):
And, Mariana, is there anythingelse you'd like to share with
us about your story?
Speaker 2 (28:40):
I would like to share .
Let's see what I would like toshare.
Speaker 1 (28:42):
I know one of those, I think question.
Speaker 2 (28:45):
Yeah, yes, I think for everyone to, to get more
involved, to be curious aboutwhere your food comes from.
Not just coffee but everythingthat you purchase.
Be curious about it, because Ithink the change is in our hands
.
Putting the change into bigcorporations?
We know that that is not goingto work.
(29:07):
Putting the change or theresponsibility into companies
like small businesses like mine?
Yeah, we're working directlywith farmers.
But I think we are allresponsible and I think the more
that you ask questions, themore that you get involved in
trying to figure out okay, isthis product really supporting
families?
Is this product reallysupporting the environment?
With everything that we see inthe news now, we cannot afford
(29:31):
not to be involved, not to beignorant about what's happening
and also the power that we haveas consumers.
So, I encourage every singleperson, anything and everything
that you buy, be curious aboutit and try to find a way to get
involved, to make a change.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
Love it Beautiful.
Thank you so much.
Thank you for inviting me.
Wait, wait, I have a few morequestions.
I had the chance to ask Marianaabout the terms we hear so
often associated with coffee, soI want a better understanding
of what fair trade means.
I mean, there's some coffeeterms, coffee industry terms
(30:11):
that we see on labels, but Idon't think we really know what
those mean and sometimes I thinkpeople think, oh, I have to buy
that because.
But what does that mean?
What does fair trade mean andwhat does it mean to the people
that are actually growing thecoffee?
Speaker 2 (30:26):
Yeah, so fair trade is an organization in the United
States that certifies differentcrops, not just coffee, but cow
, pineapple and some other cropsaround the world.
Okay, so what the organizationis that they are going to pay a
minimum price in the market plusan incentive to per pound of,
(30:50):
in this case, coffee.
In the rest of the productsworks the same way like an
incentive over the minimum price, so the farmers can get a
little bit more money for whatthey've grown.
Okay, so it guarantees that itdoesn't matter what the seed
market or the stock market isright, because prices go up and
(31:14):
down.
It guarantees a minimum price,which is a good thing.
Speaker 1 (31:18):
So, but it guarantees a minimum price for the growers
, the farmers, right, correct.
So this really fair tradereally is about protection for
the farmers.
Yes, excellent, okay, so thatmakes sense.
Speaker 2 (31:30):
And also they have to go through different audits and
requirements to be certified,and so it also guarantees, for
example, healthy workingconditions, that there's no
child labor or inconsistentcompensations Got it.
What is sometimes a little bitof, I would say, like maybe not
(31:52):
ideal for the farmers, is thatthey have to be organized in a
co-op or certain type of group,so the incentives are paid to
the organization and then theywill have to distribute that
among all the farmers that areassociated.
Speaker 1 (32:08):
Got it.
Speaker 2 (32:09):
Sometimes that is a little bit diluted because they
also have to cover the auditcosts, inspections.
Speaker 1 (32:16):
There's other people that need to get paid.
Speaker 2 (32:18):
Exactly.
So then at the end sometimeswhat the farmer gets is not
really, let's say, 25 centsextra.
They get five, three centsextra, and so that is at least
it's something guaranteed and atleast the minimum, but it
doesn't allow for a decentliving Right.
Like there's so many things thatneed to be covered for any
(32:38):
family your food, housing, basicservices, water, electricity,
sending your children to schoolso it provides certain safety, I
would say, but it's still a lotto be done and at least I would
say it's something that ensuresto give certain peace of mind
(33:01):
to the consumer.
But it's more than it needs tobe done, because what is paid is
not enough.
There's a lot of labor involvedin crop production around the
world cacao, oranges, pineapple,coffee, vanilla, you name it.
There's a lot of labor involvedand a lot is in the field, so
(33:21):
long distances has to betraveled, so people need to
cover all those bases.
Something that we do as abusiness is what is called
direct trade, and this is whatwe, when we buy directly from
the farmer.
Speaker 1 (33:36):
There's no middleman.
Speaker 2 (33:37):
There's no middleman, and so we meet these people, we
establish those relationshipsand many of them we have had
since we started our business,so basically 11 years ago and
the reason for that is that wecan get the quality of the
coffee that we want.
We can work with them todevelop, for example, a new
(33:57):
process.
So say you know, we're going tobuy this lot and we want you to
process or dry it this way andwe commit to buy it.
Speaker 1 (34:05):
So you actually have a little bit more involvement so
to speak which is good, whetherthe crop is.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
You know the result of the experiment was good or
not.
We commit to buy it.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
Right right.
Speaker 2 (34:16):
And also they really, you know, go above like even
the first rate prices.
So let's say, right now themarketing is like 150, 170.
We pay three, four, five, sevendollars a pound upon a coffee.
Speaker 1 (34:32):
Is that indirect trade?
So the farmer really benefitsdirectly or incredibly from that
, correct?
Okay?
So, and I guess you know theidea that, like you said, all of
our crops, all of our foodproducts, the fresh food
products and all of those thingsare so labor intensive but
we're for so long we've reallynever paid that, correct?
(34:55):
So now those people aresuffering and now the true costs
of their labor, so to speak, iscoming out and they need to get
paid for that.
It's going to change pricing ofthings dramatically.
Speaker 2 (35:09):
It's going to change pricing, but I think it also has
to bring the awareness of theappreciation of food for
consumers.
Yes, because we're used to haveeverything anytime.
Yes, right, like I rememberwhen I was a child, we got
apples.
I lived in Central Americaduring Christmas time.
Yes, and that was it Right.
(35:29):
We didn't get apples, or likebarely any other time of the
year, right, right.
Now you get apples any time ofthe year.
You get kiwis, you get.
I mean, you get anything.
Speaker 1 (35:39):
Right, because it's all brought in from other parts
of the world.
Speaker 2 (35:42):
Correct and there's nothing bad with, you know,
trading and globalization Right.
And the problem is the overuseof our environment soil that
gets damages because it's usedover and over and over again.
Speaker 1 (35:58):
It doesn't get a resting time, it doesn't have
time to regenerate.
Speaker 2 (36:01):
Got it.
And then also the laborintensive that is needed in
every crop and is not rewarded.
That is the problem, got it,Wow.
Speaker 1 (36:13):
So the other thing that we do see on labels a lot,
in particular associated withcoffee is the term Rainforest
Alliance Certified, which soundswonderful to me, but to tell
you the truth, I don't reallyknow what that means.
It means, you know, tell us hername.
I mean, I think it's a logowith a little frog on it.
I know that, yes.
Speaker 2 (36:34):
It has to do with the amount of forest that is in the
farm, and it doesn't mean thatthe coffee is shaped, grown,
it's.
You can have, I don't know,like 40 hectares of coffee, and
then, additionally, you have 10hectares of forest.
So it doesn't have to be I'mwhat?
Yes, yes.
Speaker 1 (36:53):
So I thought it really did mean that coffee was
grown within the forest kind ofa situation.
So is it about protecting those10 hectares of forest, correct.
Speaker 2 (37:03):
Ah, okay.
So basically, yeah, that's whatit is that farmers, all
depending on the plantation theyhave to commit to keep certain
area, that is like basicallyforest, that they also how do
you say, like offset the carbonfootprint because they have a
forest.
Speaker 1 (37:21):
Oh, okay, got it, but it doesn't mean that Carbon
sequestration Got it.
Speaker 2 (37:26):
It doesn't mean that the coffee is shaped grown.
Speaker 1 (37:28):
Oh, interesting.
Okay, yes, I have to say Inever.
I realized, no, you know what?
I never realized howcomplicated the coffee business
industry really is.
Speaker 2 (37:43):
It's very complicated , yeah.
Speaker 1 (37:44):
Nor did I actually.
You know when.
You know, when you say 2.
And I didn't even know how tosay it initially 2.25 billion
cups of coffee a day, a day yes,I did that.
That wows me and that justreally wows me that this, this
crop, is so big, so immense andit takes up such a large part of
(38:11):
landscapes to cultivate.
I had, I really didn'tunderstand.
And then all the complicationsinvolved and how labor-intensive
it really is.
I think it's really good for,like you said, for our listeners
to understand the path that thecoffee bean takes before it
ends up in their cup, but toreally understand where does our
food come from.
Speaker 2 (38:32):
Yeah, correct.
Speaker 1 (38:33):
Yeah, yeah.
And who's bringing our food tous?
Speaker 2 (38:37):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (38:37):
Yeah, that's awesome.
Speaker 2 (38:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (38:40):
Thank you so much.
You're very welcome.
All right, we'll talk to yousoon.
We'll have all the informationup on the website and you can
order coffee directly onlinefrom Tico Coffee Roasters.
That's right.
Thank you so much, mariana.
Thank you, thank you, take care.
The coffee we enjoy so much hasa journey and challenges I
(39:04):
hadn't fully understood beforethe conversation with Mariana.
From dealing with climatechange and diseases to shifts in
the way families do business,to now the chance to support
women-owned coffee companies,the coffee scene has evolved.
Mariana's focus on the originsof our food raises important
(39:24):
questions about fair pay and anenvironmental impact.
She doesn't just provide greatcoffee beans.
She connects us globally,reminding us that our choices
impact people we may never meet,but play roles in our lives.
Coffee is coffee.
Is coffee right?
Well, kinda, but not really.
As we know from the varyingprices of a cup of coffee,
coffee is not just coffee.
There are so many factors thatare going to bring in you that
delicious cup of coffee and,according to the numbers, over
2.25 billion of us drink atleast one cup of coffee every
day.
Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa,whoa.
I think I've had too many cupsof coffee this morning.
I was saying coffee is coffeeright?
(00:24):
Well, kinda, but not really.
As we know from the varyingprices of a cup of coffee,
coffee is not just coffee.
There are so many factors thatare going to bring in you that
delicious cup of coffee and,according to the numbers, over
2.25 billion of us drink atleast one cup of coffee every
(00:44):
day.
Hey everybody, it's Vanessafrom Two Chicks in a Hoe, the
podcast that talks to amazingpeople doing wonderful things in
our world.
We're going to dig deep intocoffee.
(01:06):
I don't think many of us knowwhere it's grown, how it's grown
, who grows it and the impactthat it has on our environment.
But let's start with a coupleof fun facts.
First, brazil is the largestcoffee produced in the world.
Vietnam is second.
Coffee was outlawed severaltimes throughout history.
Leaders in Mecca outlawed thedrink in 1511 because they
(01:30):
believed it sparked radicalthinking.
Coffee was also attempted to bebanned by certain 16th century
Italian clergymen who called thedrink Satanic.
Pope Clement VII, on the otherhand, was so fond of coffee that
he abolished the ban and had itbaptized in the year 1600.
The biggest consumers are Finns, drinking 27 pounds a year.
(01:57):
Coffee is the world's secondlargest traded commodity.
Crude oil is first, and coffeewas discovered by goat herders,
yep.
The legend says that the firstcoffee berries were discovered
by an Ethiopian goat herd around800 AD.
The shepherd noticed that thegoat started to jump happily
(02:18):
every time they chewed on thecherry red berries.
Today we have the pleasure ofchatting with Mariana Faerron
(02:46):
Gutierrez, owner of Tico CoffeeRoasters in Campbell, California
.
She's going to fill us in onthe coffee industry from the
field to the cup, the impacts onthe environment, the future of
coffee and the role of women inthe coffee industry.
She's also going to share howTico Coffee Roasters is going
(03:07):
about it differently than manyof the big players.
So hi, welcome.
So much, Mariana, for beingwith us today and sharing your
wealth of information in yourbeautiful coffee roasting
facility.
Speaker 2 (03:18):
Thank you, Vanessa.
Thank you for inviting me toyour podcast.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
I love it.
So let's chat.
Let's chat about this, let'schat about coffee, with the
thing that I think so many of usyou know was at 2.25 billion
cups a day.
That's a lot of coffee andthat's a lot of people drinking
coffee across the globe.
It's amazing, so I guess let'sdig right into it.
Tell me a little bit aboutwhere is the majority of coffee
(03:42):
grown.
Speaker 2 (03:43):
So coffee grown around the equator, bail around
the world around the equator,bail around the world.
So Latin America, africa, asiaPacific, india, that's basically
.
And then Hawaii, of coursethat's a little bit more south,
it belongs to the US but it's alittle bit more south in the
latitude.
And then there is anexperimental farm now in Santa
(04:07):
Barbara, california Really, butit's a greenhouse.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
Oh, I was gonna say, isn't it under a freeway, or
something like that?
I heard that somebody wasgrowing coffee next to a freeway
?
Speaker 2 (04:18):
Yeah, but it's a greenhouse.
But naturally it's on theequator belt.
Speaker 1 (04:23):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (04:24):
Yes, all right.
Speaker 1 (04:25):
So and that's.
They say that's 25 degreesnorth and 30 degrees south of
the equator.
They call it the coffee belt,correct?
Yes, okay, so there's.
I was reading.
There's so many different waystraditional, more industrial,
under the shade in the sun, tellme a little bit about how
(04:47):
coffee the plant itself hasgrown.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
So coffee grows mostly in higher altitudes?
Speaker 1 (04:54):
Oh, I didn't know that In Latin.
Speaker 2 (04:54):
America and in some parts in Asia Pacific as well.
Speaker 1 (04:58):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
It can also grow so high altitude I mean above 1000
meters over sea level, Okay, andit can go up to 2000,.
Some places in Panama evenclose to 3000 meters.
So it's a really high altitudegrown crop and it needs to have
that altitude.
So the it's very similar to thewine industry, something that
(05:24):
people can relate to, Okay.
And so the higher the altitudeit allows the plant to produce
the cherries.
And each fruit has two coffeebeans inside.
Okay, there's a few mutations,but that's how it works.
So the higher the altitude,then it has some more cooler
weather, that it has sunexposure during the day and then
(05:47):
cooler or foggy evenings, Okay,and that allows the fruit to
mature slowly but also allowsthe beans to get harder and
harder.
That also influence for goodquality.
So the beans are kind of theseed, the seeds of the fruit.
Basically, that's what we buy,Okay.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
Okay, and what we roast?
Okay.
So do they need a lot of water?
Speaker 2 (06:10):
They do need a lot of water, and that's why the
tropics are ideal for that right, because we have more rainfall
compared to other parts of theworld.
Speaker 1 (06:17):
Exactly yes, okay, okay.
So Santa Barbara in agreenhouse.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (06:22):
There you go, we'll see.
Yeah, we'll see.
Okay, all right, so tell me thedifference.
So I hear about the traditionalway of growing coffee
originally was within the forest, correct?
Yes, so that's considered shadegrown.
Speaker 2 (06:38):
Yes, basically it is in between the forest right and
coffee is originally fromEthiopia.
Wait a minute.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
Ethiopia.
See.
No, when I think of Ethiopia, Idon't think of forest, even
though I know that there areforests.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
Yes, I had the option to visit some of our partners
in 2018.
And so we went and there isforest, there's a lot of forest
in Ethiopia, and the country,the capital, is about 1500
meters from mistaken, so theweather is really nice.
That's ideal.
(07:14):
It's ideal.
It doesn't really feel hot Likewhen people think on Africa.
We all think, oh, my God, it'sso hot, it's so sunny, it's
desert, it's not.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
Right.
Speaker 2 (07:23):
Ethiopia is in a higher altitude and it was
discovered there, so it grows onthe trees and, mixed with other
plants, got it.
So that's kind of like theoriginal way of the coffee plant
and they are very tall overthere, very high plants.
Is that the Arabic bean?
They are Arabic, but they arealso heirloom varieties, so very
(07:45):
ancient.
They haven't really beenbreeded with other varieties, so
they still keep a lot of theendemic characteristics and
flavors as well.
Okay.
Okay, in other parts of theworld, like in Latin America,
they are also shade grown, butthese have been planted and the
plantation has been designed ina certain way that allows the
(08:06):
farmers easier.
And that's, I quote, unquote,because coffee farming is not
easy.
So I understand, yes, but it'seasier for them to manage the
plantation but at the same timeget the shade that the plants
need so they are healthier.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Okay.
So, with the 2.25 billion of usdrinking coffee every day,
that's a huge, huge crop.
That my understanding.
The idea that they grow fasterin the sun, in a full sun is
that correct?
The coffee bean itself.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
They don't necessarily grow faster.
I think it has to do more withenvironmental or geographic
conditions.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
Right.
Speaker 2 (08:54):
Okay, it has to do more with what is available to
them and how.
What kind of variety they haveplanted in their fields?
Okay, some of them produce ahigher yield or they grow just
faster.
They have been brewed for thatspecific characteristic.
Speaker 1 (09:14):
Okay, so the shade sun thing is not really a
problem, or is it in terms ofdeforestation, for to grow more
crop then?
Speaker 2 (09:25):
I would say the shade grown.
The advantage of that is thatit protects the plant from
diseases.
So it allows it to grow like ina better temperature or more
constant temperature, and no, bestressed like full exposure
during the day and not at night.
Okay, so it's a more constanttemperature that allows the
plant to behave in better.
(09:46):
It also keeps more humidityOkay, so it doesn't need so much
water, like if it will be fullyexposed to the sun.
Speaker 1 (09:53):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
And it also protects with the seasons.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
If the plant is stronger and it's healthier, of
course it's going to be lesssusceptible to pests, because I
understand that there's a lackof genetic diversity within the
plants, within the coffee plants, but also too, of course, then
that's stressing the potentialfor disease of the plants as
well.
Yeah, yes, so we had aconversation with Dr Rodrigo
(10:20):
Medellin in Mexico about blueagaves and how they are all so
similar to each other clone-likethat one disease can wipe the
entire species out, and it'sstarting to sound like that
might be the case with coffee aswell, in terms of the idea that
it could get a type of diseasethat can wipe that out because
(10:42):
of its lack of genetic diversity.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
And it has happened before in the 70s and 80s with
the leaf rust.
It's a fungus that growsunderneath the leaves.
It's a yellow dot and it growsmany yellow dots underneath the
leaves.
And what it is, you know?
It releases spores.
So it is very easy, easilyspreadable through the wind
(11:06):
through different plants andplantations, and what the plant
does is that it starts losingthe leaves to get rid of what is
harming the plant.
But if the plant doesn't haveany leaves, there's no
photosynthesis and obviouslywon't be any coffee production.
So the plant might survivecompletely stressed, but there
(11:27):
is no harvest.
So that's the problem.
And if there is a lot ofinfection, the farmers have
pretty much no choice.
If they didn't control it ontime with pesticides, what they
have to do is basically just cut, get rid of the plantation If
they can save it like stump, andwait about four years for the
(11:48):
plant to regrow and to produceharvest again.
So there's a big financial lossfor them because of these
fungus.
Speaker 1 (11:55):
Is it so?
Is that why there's so manypesticides used in the growing
of coffee?
Because for disease prevention,for something just?
Speaker 2 (12:03):
like that.
Speaker 1 (12:05):
What I keep reading about is that there's this I
don't know if it's a fear for uscoffee drinkers that they say
by the year 2050 that we're notgoing to have coffee as we know
it, that there's so much stuffgoing on with the plants with,
in particular, because ofclimate change, the increase in
temperatures and how importantit is to have it cooler for the
(12:26):
plants, that and, of course,changes in rainfalls because of
temperature increases that thecoffee we know we won't have
anymore.
Have you heard that as well?
Speaker 2 (12:38):
Yeah, there is a big concern in the industry and it's
a combination of factors.
One that is really critical isdefinitely climate change and
it's the raising in temperature.
So coffee needs that coolweather to optimally grown and
harvest or produce the harvest.
And if the plant is exposed, orcertain plants or breeds, like
(13:00):
we have them now pretty mucharound the world, they are
designed to survive or to thrivein certain climate and if they
don't have that idealtemperature, they might not
produce the same amount ofcoffee and or they will be
exposed to more pests or thesame different diseases.
Speaker 1 (13:20):
So we're potentially facing a coffee crisis, so to
speak.
Speaker 2 (13:24):
Yes, and there's a lot of research right now in
different parts of the world tobreed or create hybrids to make
plants more resistant to certainspecific environmental
variables or some specificdiseases.
Oh, okay, so to try to providefarmers with an alternative
right?
If this plant doesn't work foryou, perhaps this one will
(13:46):
because it has been designed inthe labs for that.
But the problem is not just Imean, that's, I think, probably
the biggest climate change.
Also, how much the rain patternhas changed around the world.
And it's somethinguncontrollable, right?
Some parts that used to havelike a regular rainfall now they
(14:10):
don't, or places that used tobarely had any rain, now there's
floating, and this you knowlike.
We all are exposed to this inmany different ways, and this
industry, specifically, isfacing a lot of challenges
because of that.
Another challenge is thedecrease, I would say, of coffee
(14:32):
pickers.
So you need Coffee pickers arejust the people that go to the
farm to harvest the coffeecherries.
In the past it was very easy tohire them.
I would say it's people that go, you know, just in my country
I'm from Costa Rica.
It's a small country, but wehave different coffee regions
(14:54):
and, depending on the altitude,the harvest is happening at
different times.
Maybe a month of different, twomonths they were here in
Tarasub, then they moved toOrozzi Valley and then they went
to some other places, or thenthey went out to Panama, for
example.
Right now it's really hardbecause of migration, economic
forces that are, you know,forcing people to really move to
(15:17):
other areas, because it'sreally expensive, it's a job
that is labor intensive butdoesn't pay enough.
So then, and then youngergenerations they just don't want
to deal, they don't want to dothis job.
They don't want to do it.
So that's another issue forcoffee farmers in the industry
in general, like how do you keepthe labor that you need but
also reward them and this issomething that we emphasize a
(15:39):
lot to our consumers here.
Right, everybody wants thisgreat cup of coffee, correct,
but they don't want to pay forthat.
They don't want to pay for that.
And there's people suffering, alot of people suffering,
because they're not getting themoney that they deserve.
Speaker 1 (15:52):
So let's talk about that.
Who's growing the coffee?
Speaker 2 (15:58):
Coffee has been passed through generations,
family to family.
Speaker 1 (16:01):
This is globally correct.
Globally, yes, Okay.
Speaker 2 (16:04):
It's mostly family owned.
A lot of knowledge, definitely,that these people have and they
teach it to their children.
And, you know, next generationcomes and takes over the family
business.
And so men, women, even youthparticipate in the coffee
production.
And coffee production is yearround, it never stops.
(16:26):
It's just the harvest.
They have to fertilize, theyhave to prune, they have to
apply other things, then theharvest comes, then it has to be
dry, then it has to be back.
Someone has to do the work.
Exports.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
It never stops.
It never stops, yes, so interms of who does it?
So I was reading too that themajority of the labor workforce
and I'm assuming this isglobally as well that 70% of it
is women that's actually doingthe physical labor, the
harvesting, the planting, thepicking, that type of thing.
(17:03):
Is that correct?
Speaker 2 (17:05):
I would say it's a high percentage.
I'm not really sure and I haveto be honest that if it is 70%,
they take out toll not just inpicking the coffee cherries
right and at the fields, whichis really, really hard because a
lot of them are in steepterrain so they have to walk
with the With the children yeswith the children, with the
(17:26):
basket where they're picking thecoffees, everything.
But it's not just that.
It's also people who arecooking, people who are doing
some other things that is notnecessarily the farm but are
directly related to the harvest.
So this is a harvest season, Iwould say, and throughout the
year.
Some countries, unfortunately,they relate more on women and
(17:49):
they don't get rewarded for whatthey do.
I think some other countries,the situation is more even it's
men and women.
Speaker 1 (17:56):
So, mariana, tell me a little bit about this project
that you were telling me brieflyabout when I met you originally
, and it was about empoweringwomen.
Yes, please tell me some moreabout that.
Speaker 2 (18:10):
Yeah, this is something that I'm really
excited about and, as Imentioned to you, I came to the
United States 16 years ago,originally from Costa Rica, and
I came here because I married myhusband and he works in tech.
We're in the Silicon Valley, soa very easy path for him to
move to this area of the world,and when I came here, I didn't
(18:31):
really have a network or a jobor anything to do, so for me
there was a lot of disconnectand a little bit of loss of
identity.
I would say, like what would Ido now that I'm in this new
place?
So I had to start learningeverything making friends, going
out, even going something assimple as going to the
supermarket, right, right.
(18:52):
And in that search or learningprocess I started trying to find
coffee shops and then I went tomy local coffee shop and then I
tried that coffee and then Iwas thinking this doesn't taste
like it tastes at home.
Speaker 1 (19:07):
And I've been to Costa Rica.
I know we brought so muchcoffee home from Costa Rica.
We got stopped at customs.
They looked at us.
They didn't even touch our bags, they could smell.
They said you got a lot ofcoffee, don't you?
Yeah?
We do so.
Yes, amazing coffee, yes.
Speaker 2 (19:23):
And so you know it happened the next one and the
next one, and then also meetingpeople.
I told them where I came fromand a lot of people told me I
really like your country.
I have been there.
It's really great.
It's a great environment, thePura Vida life, which means pure
life people are so friendly.
And then I kept hearing the samemessage.
(19:45):
And then the other side of thestory, you know, looking at the
coffee.
I started agriculturaleconomics in Costa Rica and I
work with coffee farmers there,so then finally it clicked.
And then I said, well, this iswhat I know.
I have friends that grow coffee.
People love coffee.
Americans drink a lot of coffee.
(20:05):
They contribute to that toBillion Cops.
Speaker 1 (20:08):
I think they're the number one contributor.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
Yes, and so I thought well, there's something that
can be changed.
There's so great coffee, andnot just the quality, but also
the stories that are missed inthis equation.
Yes, who is growing this coffee?
Who is participating on thislabor?
Who is actually making thisgreat product for you?
Yes, and so that's how TicoCoffee Roasters was born, and
(20:33):
Tico is a nickname for CostaRican people.
Oh, that's right.
Yes, and so I wanted to name thecompany that, something that
resembles my heritage, thatresembles our lifestyle.
It's not really about me, butlike who do we want to be as a
company in this place?
What is the change that we wantto create?
So our mission is to empower,protect and nourish lives from
farm to crop, and theempowerment part comes from
(20:56):
working directly with farmers inmy country and in other
countries, our relationshipsthat we have developed for the
last 11 years and this is reallyimportant for me because,
growing there, I mean, I wasliterally surrounded by coffee
plantations, so I could seeevery year, right, the trucks
full of the cherries, thatdelicious smell, the blooming
(21:19):
season, all families reallyengage into the activity, and
how that has been disappearingbecause the pricing or different
crisis, that is just reallyhard for families to continue in
something that they used to doRight, and I wanted to be able
to share those stories, to beable to buy a great product,
(21:40):
because people deserve a bettercup of coffee Nice, but also the
people who grow it.
They deserve to be acknowledgedand they deserve to be paid for
what they are producing.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (21:51):
Yes.
So a lot of our coffees, morethan 60% of our coffees, come
from direct relationships indifferent countries in Latin
America, africa and Indonesia.
And we also started a projectabout five years ago and me, as
a woman and as an immigrant,really wanted to make a
difference in highlighting thework of women in the coffee
(22:13):
industry, buying more lotsproduced by women or women
collectives.
So right now we have fourdifferent lots and there is one
more coming.
It's here in Oakland, actually,we just have to wait for the
release.
It's coming up and it's reallyexciting and really, I think,
provides a lot of hope for meand also for consumers, because
(22:36):
women now are more aware andthey feel more supported and
that they are finally being seenand that they can really take
over or really like to stand upand speak up and for what they
are doing, basically, andgetting the recognition that
they deserve.
Speaker 1 (22:54):
So are you saying that you're buying coffee?
You say in lots from theseplaces around the globe, but
from women owned Correct Coffee?
Yes, farms yes, I'm trying tofigure out what they call it.
Yes, coffee farms Excellent.
Speaker 2 (23:09):
For example, we have a lot of.
It's a collective of some womenfarmers in Chiapas in Mexico
that they are really far in themountain, but there is a lady
that really took over thatproject and created this
collective.
And the ladies it's like oneafter another.
I want to belong to this group.
I really want to be part ofthis change, because now they're
(23:29):
finally getting the money.
It was always their husbandsand now they are getting money
and they want to be empowered.
They want to be able to buywhat they need.
They want to be able to feedtheir children or even send them
to school right, like before itwasn't possible.
And another great example thatI have is a very young woman.
We started working with herprobably like about five years
ago, and I think when I met hershe was just 24, 25.
(23:51):
Now she's close to 30, but justan example of young people.
All of these younger generationis like the comeback to the
coffee industry.
My generation I'm 45 and peoplewho had education or even a
little bit older than me.
They didn't want to do anythingwith agriculture.
(24:13):
It's like I'm finally doneright.
I don't want to be working inthe fields like my father's did,
my parents did.
I'm sorry, but this generationis.
You know what I got education,I'm bilingual or even sometimes
I speak three languages, and youknow what I can make this
business better.
Now they have the knowledge thatI guess before it was not that
(24:35):
people didn't have the knowledge, but they didn't have the
vision.
And this generation has avision, and so there's a lot of
young people, youngprofessionals, young people they
have education that areinvolved in the corporate
production and they are changingthe landscape and this is
really really exciting For thebetter right.
Yes, correct.
Speaker 1 (24:53):
So for the better, for not only for the community,
yes, okay but the environment aswell.
They're going about itdifferently.
Yes, got it.
And then, of course, for thewomen yes, tell me a story about
you mentioned that now thewomen have money and everything
and they could potentially sendtheir kids to school.
Tell me what else.
Tell me what else is happeningnow that women are becoming more
(25:16):
empowered through this, throughthis industry.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
I think a very good example is the same young woman
her name is Daniela the house.
She started working.
I mean she was, she grew up inthe farm and when she graduated
from university she said I wantto work with you.
She told her dad.
He said okay, but he was stilllike in his mind you know, she's
just going to be just rightnext to me and she started
(25:40):
trying to take over or likeasking more questions, getting
more involved.
So she shared last time that wewent in Costa Rica that there
was like kind of friction right,because he didn't want to let
go.
And it's not that he wasexcluding her, it's just the
mindset.
Speaker 1 (25:54):
It's more of a tradition, right.
Speaker 2 (25:56):
Like years of, you know, horticism that they had to
be breaking down.
Yes, but she was, I guess,persistent enough that she
started taking a little bit overthat.
Now she's in charge of exports,she deals with all the buyers
and everything.
And when before her father usedto get paid like two, three
months later she figured how toget paid like in two weeks, nice
(26:20):
.
And then her father told her,like what did you do?
How did you do that?
He said well, did you stop?
Right, you negotiate.
And it's just such a greatexample of how the equation
changes when women are involvedin an, involved with vision.
I think, right, it's not justgrowing coffee, they are also
(26:40):
business people.
Speaker 1 (26:40):
Yes, and they are having a voice now and you've
given them that voice.
Yes, that's Bravo.
Thank you Very nice.
Thank you, very nice.
So where do you see the futureof Tico coffee roasters?
Speaker 2 (26:52):
I see the future increase in distribution.
We sell online throughout theUnited States, but I would like
to probably get into some likebigger accounts here in Northern
California, some distributionwith some stores that are
conscious and also participatingmore into more, I would say,
(27:14):
like regional or in countryprograms in terms of
sustainability.
That's my passion.
Speaker 1 (27:19):
In country where the coffee is grown.
Correct, got it.
Yeah, okay, okay.
Speaker 2 (27:23):
Teaching sustainability, showing them how
to farm sustainably, that kindof of education I would say
probably programs that are moresuitable not just to grow coffee
, but maybe what else is neededor was forgotten, I guess
throughout the years.
Yes, to make not just theproduction but the whole
(27:44):
ecosystem.
Yes, sustainable.
They have a lot of knowledge.
I don't have anything to teachthem.
Right, but it's more like whatelse can be done to create not
just your coffee plantation butsomething else that can
contribute to the ecosystemRight.
And involving youth and women inthis.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
You're just reminding them.
Speaker 2 (28:00):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (28:01):
Correct, you're right , they know, they know they have
all the knowledge it's beenpassed down.
Yes, that's awesome.
Speaker 2 (28:07):
That's really awesome , great.
Speaker 1 (28:09):
So people can buy your coffee online?
Yes, okay, and if you are inthe Bay Area, you can come to
Campbell California.
Come in the morning, you canget a cup of coffee right here,
and then you can also purchasefresh beans here, freshly
roasted beans, yes, so great.
So we'll have all thatinformation up on the website
and tell you where you can goorder coffee.
(28:31):
And, Mariana, is there anythingelse you'd like to share with
us about your story?
Speaker 2 (28:40):
I would like to share .
Let's see what I would like toshare.
Speaker 1 (28:42):
I know one of those, I think question.
Speaker 2 (28:45):
Yeah, yes, I think for everyone to, to get more
involved, to be curious aboutwhere your food comes from.
Not just coffee but everythingthat you purchase.
Be curious about it, because Ithink the change is in our hands
.
Putting the change into bigcorporations?
We know that that is not goingto work.
(29:07):
Putting the change or theresponsibility into companies
like small businesses like mine?
Yeah, we're working directlywith farmers.
But I think we are allresponsible and I think the more
that you ask questions, themore that you get involved in
trying to figure out okay, isthis product really supporting
families?
Is this product reallysupporting the environment?
With everything that we see inthe news now, we cannot afford
(29:31):
not to be involved, not to beignorant about what's happening
and also the power that we haveas consumers.
So, I encourage every singleperson, anything and everything
that you buy, be curious aboutit and try to find a way to get
involved, to make a change.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
Love it Beautiful.
Thank you so much.
Thank you for inviting me.
Wait, wait, I have a few morequestions.
I had the chance to ask Marianaabout the terms we hear so
often associated with coffee, soI want a better understanding
of what fair trade means.
I mean, there's some coffeeterms, coffee industry terms
(30:11):
that we see on labels, but Idon't think we really know what
those mean and sometimes I thinkpeople think, oh, I have to buy
that because.
But what does that mean?
What does fair trade mean andwhat does it mean to the people
that are actually growing thecoffee?
Speaker 2 (30:26):
Yeah, so fair trade is an organization in the United
States that certifies differentcrops, not just coffee, but cow
, pineapple and some other cropsaround the world.
Okay, so what the organizationis that they are going to pay a
minimum price in the market plusan incentive to per pound of,
(30:50):
in this case, coffee.
In the rest of the productsworks the same way like an
incentive over the minimum price, so the farmers can get a
little bit more money for whatthey've grown.
Okay, so it guarantees that itdoesn't matter what the seed
market or the stock market isright, because prices go up and
(31:14):
down.
It guarantees a minimum price,which is a good thing.
Speaker 1 (31:18):
So, but it guarantees a minimum price for the growers
, the farmers, right, correct.
So this really fair tradereally is about protection for
the farmers.
Yes, excellent, okay, so thatmakes sense.
Speaker 2 (31:30):
And also they have to go through different audits and
requirements to be certified,and so it also guarantees, for
example, healthy workingconditions, that there's no
child labor or inconsistentcompensations Got it.
What is sometimes a little bitof, I would say, like maybe not
(31:52):
ideal for the farmers, is thatthey have to be organized in a
co-op or certain type of group,so the incentives are paid to
the organization and then theywill have to distribute that
among all the farmers that areassociated.
Speaker 1 (32:08):
Got it.
Speaker 2 (32:09):
Sometimes that is a little bit diluted because they
also have to cover the auditcosts, inspections.
Speaker 1 (32:16):
There's other people that need to get paid.
Speaker 2 (32:18):
Exactly.
So then at the end sometimeswhat the farmer gets is not
really, let's say, 25 centsextra.
They get five, three centsextra, and so that is at least
it's something guaranteed and atleast the minimum, but it
doesn't allow for a decentliving Right.
Like there's so many things thatneed to be covered for any
(32:38):
family your food, housing, basicservices, water, electricity,
sending your children to schoolso it provides certain safety, I
would say, but it's still a lotto be done and at least I would
say it's something that ensuresto give certain peace of mind
(33:01):
to the consumer.
But it's more than it needs tobe done, because what is paid is
not enough.
There's a lot of labor involvedin crop production around the
world cacao, oranges, pineapple,coffee, vanilla, you name it.
There's a lot of labor involvedand a lot is in the field, so
(33:21):
long distances has to betraveled, so people need to
cover all those bases.
Something that we do as abusiness is what is called
direct trade, and this is whatwe, when we buy directly from
the farmer.
Speaker 1 (33:36):
There's no middleman.
Speaker 2 (33:37):
There's no middleman, and so we meet these people, we
establish those relationshipsand many of them we have had
since we started our business,so basically 11 years ago and
the reason for that is that wecan get the quality of the
coffee that we want.
We can work with them todevelop, for example, a new
(33:57):
process.
So say you know, we're going tobuy this lot and we want you to
process or dry it this way andwe commit to buy it.
Speaker 1 (34:05):
So you actually have a little bit more involvement so
to speak which is good, whetherthe crop is.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
You know the result of the experiment was good or
not.
We commit to buy it.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
Right right.
Speaker 2 (34:16):
And also they really, you know, go above like even
the first rate prices.
So let's say, right now themarketing is like 150, 170.
We pay three, four, five, sevendollars a pound upon a coffee.
Speaker 1 (34:32):
Is that indirect trade?
So the farmer really benefitsdirectly or incredibly from that
, correct?
Okay?
So, and I guess you know theidea that, like you said, all of
our crops, all of our foodproducts, the fresh food
products and all of those thingsare so labor intensive but
we're for so long we've reallynever paid that, correct?
(34:55):
So now those people aresuffering and now the true costs
of their labor, so to speak, iscoming out and they need to get
paid for that.
It's going to change pricing ofthings dramatically.
Speaker 2 (35:09):
It's going to change pricing, but I think it also has
to bring the awareness of theappreciation of food for
consumers.
Yes, because we're used to haveeverything anytime.
Yes, right, like I rememberwhen I was a child, we got
apples.
I lived in Central Americaduring Christmas time.
Yes, and that was it Right.
(35:29):
We didn't get apples, or likebarely any other time of the
year, right, right.
Now you get apples any time ofthe year.
You get kiwis, you get.
I mean, you get anything.
Speaker 1 (35:39):
Right, because it's all brought in from other parts
of the world.
Speaker 2 (35:42):
Correct and there's nothing bad with, you know,
trading and globalization Right.
And the problem is the overuseof our environment soil that
gets damages because it's usedover and over and over again.
Speaker 1 (35:58):
It doesn't get a resting time, it doesn't have
time to regenerate.
Speaker 2 (36:01):
Got it.
And then also the laborintensive that is needed in
every crop and is not rewarded.
That is the problem, got it,Wow.
Speaker 1 (36:13):
So the other thing that we do see on labels a lot,
in particular associated withcoffee is the term Rainforest
Alliance Certified, which soundswonderful to me, but to tell
you the truth, I don't reallyknow what that means.
It means, you know, tell us hername.
I mean, I think it's a logowith a little frog on it.
I know that, yes.
Speaker 2 (36:34):
It has to do with the amount of forest that is in the
farm, and it doesn't mean thatthe coffee is shaped, grown,
it's.
You can have, I don't know,like 40 hectares of coffee, and
then, additionally, you have 10hectares of forest.
So it doesn't have to be I'mwhat?
Yes, yes.
Speaker 1 (36:53):
So I thought it really did mean that coffee was
grown within the forest kind ofa situation.
So is it about protecting those10 hectares of forest, correct.
Speaker 2 (37:03):
Ah, okay.
So basically, yeah, that's whatit is that farmers, all
depending on the plantation theyhave to commit to keep certain
area, that is like basicallyforest, that they also how do
you say, like offset the carbonfootprint because they have a
forest.
Speaker 1 (37:21):
Oh, okay, got it, but it doesn't mean that Carbon
sequestration Got it.
Speaker 2 (37:26):
It doesn't mean that the coffee is shaped grown.
Speaker 1 (37:28):
Oh, interesting.
Okay, yes, I have to say Inever.
I realized, no, you know what?
I never realized howcomplicated the coffee business
industry really is.
Speaker 2 (37:43):
It's very complicated , yeah.
Speaker 1 (37:44):
Nor did I actually.
You know when.
You know, when you say 2.
And I didn't even know how tosay it initially 2.25 billion
cups of coffee a day, a day yes,I did that.
That wows me and that justreally wows me that this, this
crop, is so big, so immense andit takes up such a large part of
(38:11):
landscapes to cultivate.
I had, I really didn'tunderstand.
And then all the complicationsinvolved and how labor-intensive
it really is.
I think it's really good for,like you said, for our listeners
to understand the path that thecoffee bean takes before it
ends up in their cup, but toreally understand where does our
food come from.
Speaker 2 (38:32):
Yeah, correct.
Speaker 1 (38:33):
Yeah, yeah.
And who's bringing our food tous?
Speaker 2 (38:37):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (38:37):
Yeah, that's awesome.
Speaker 2 (38:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (38:40):
Thank you so much.
You're very welcome.
All right, we'll talk to yousoon.
We'll have all the informationup on the website and you can
order coffee directly onlinefrom Tico Coffee Roasters.
That's right.
Thank you so much, mariana.
Thank you, thank you, take care.
The coffee we enjoy so much hasa journey and challenges I
(39:04):
hadn't fully understood beforethe conversation with Mariana.
From dealing with climatechange and diseases to shifts in
the way families do business,to now the chance to support
women-owned coffee companies,the coffee scene has evolved.
Mariana's focus on the originsof our food raises important
(39:24):
questions about fair pay and anenvironmental impact.
She doesn't just provide greatcoffee beans.
She connects us globally,reminding us that our choices
impact people we may never meet,but play roles in our lives.
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