August 28, 2025 • 49 mins
In this explosive episode of Two Mikes, Dr. Michael Scheuer and Col. Mike sit down with renowned libertarian thinker and financial expert Murray Sabrin to break down how America’s economic and foreign policy disasters stem from one root cause—Washington’s addiction to intervention. Dr. Sabrin makes the case that both capitalism and national security thrive when the federal government steps back and lets the people, not bureaucrats, determine outcomes. From propping up failed businesses with taxpayer dollars to dragging America into endless, unwinnable wars, interventionism has bankrupted our economy and bled our military dry. Sabrin also drops a bombshell, announcing that he’s considering a 2028 presidential run and launching a new app, “Make Americans Financially Independent,” to engage citizens directly on solutions like ending the income tax and dismantling federal overreach. This is a bold conversation about restoring real liberty by returning power to We The People.
Follow Two Mikes on Pickax - https://pickax.com/twomikes
MY GOLD GUY - https://mygoldguy.com/twomikes
As inflation surges and global elites toy with our financial future, My Gold Guy empowers you to safeguard your wealth with physical gold and silver – a real asset for real Americans. Get your FREE Gold & Silver Guide today!
Follow Two Mikes on Pickax - https://pickax.com/twomikes
MY GOLD GUY - https://mygoldguy.com/twomikes
As inflation surges and global elites toy with our financial future, My Gold Guy empowers you to safeguard your wealth with physical gold and silver – a real asset for real Americans. Get your FREE Gold & Silver Guide today!
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Ah right, this is Colonel Mike two Mike's Podcast to
Mike's dot US. Two Mikes dot us. You can always
find us on Network Radio dot US. You could find
us on America out Loud, dot news and UH. Our
Rumble channel is Maverick Broadcasting. We're making a message from
the old Rumble Channel to the new Rumble Channel. All right,
we want to thank you once again for listening and
(00:24):
to all of you who have been on the shows
in the last five years. We appreciate it. If you
want to come back, contact us or Fuddy and we
hope to bring you some more good shows in the
next few months. As we come down to the end
of nine twenty twenty five.
Speaker 2 (00:38):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (01:07):
Let's start it up with Liberty and Justice for All.
We welcome back to our show, Murray Sabred of the
Missus Institute. Hey, you know we've had Murray on the
two mics, We've had Murray on the National Security out before,
and why do we want to have Murray on this week? Well,
you know that big beautiful bust out, as Tony Soprano
would say in New Jersey, right, the bust out bill. Murray,
(01:28):
welcome back.
Speaker 3 (01:29):
Great to be with you, Mike and Mike, Mike and Michael,
so I can get everyone correct on today's show.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
All right, Murray, let's do a little commercial for you.
Next week is the big one at Missus Institute. Correct.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
Yeah, Next Friday at five pm Eastern time, I'll be
debating Spencer Morrison, who has been one of the leading
voices for protectionism and tariffs with his book called Reshure
How tariffs will basically save the world and save and
save America. And so I'm going to be doing a debate
with him at the Mesas Institute. And so it would
(02:02):
be a lot of fun because I read his book
and it's amazing how many how many myths there are
in the book and erroneous assertions about the economy. So
I have all my material ready to go, and it's
just going to be a great opportunity for people around
the world of tuning into the Mess's website and the
(02:24):
mess YouTube channel to see this live stream that will
be archived, because this is another example of Mike and
Michael of how the interventionalist mindset has captured not only
the political class, but a lot of fundits out there
who think that government is God, government knows exactly that
(02:48):
the people that got to know exactly what to do.
But if in the private sector they're done, they're stupid.
But once they go to Washington, they're IQ jumps fifty points.
And that seems to be the mindset that out there,
that somehow people in Washington know how to plan the economy.
And here's the irony of this whole situation. And I'm
(03:08):
going to put this on my sub stack probably later today,
namely that Mamdami who just got the Democratic nomination for
mayor in New York City and who's a self described
Democratic socialist and Donald Trump. Basically I cut from the
same pot, believe it or not, even though Trump has
(03:31):
called him a communist, the Marxist, the socialist. Well, what
is Trump doing in the international trade area. He's trying
to use the government to structure the world economy and
especially the US economy with tariffs and all sorts of
interventions in the US economy. So what Trump is giving
us is socialism light and Mandamie wants to give us
(03:53):
socialist socialism on steroids. That's the difference between the two
of them. And it just shows you that Washington and
these local politicians think that they know how to create
better economic conditions. And I have a chart that I'm
going to show in my opening remarks, the power in
my PowerPoint that comes from Murray Rothbud's great little monograph
(04:15):
called the Case one hundred percent Goal Dollar. And when
I first read this back in the eighties, maybe even
the seventies, I said, this is it. This is how
you explain the economy. And I think it's the best
tool we have for those of us that believe in
free markets, that non intervention domestically and internationally can just
undercut this whole notion that the people in Washington somehow
(04:39):
have this magic bullet that they can just wave a
wind or do an executive order or pass the law
to make the economy better. And this description of the
economy is essentially the las a faire approach to economics,
which has been around for a couple hundred years, maybe
(05:00):
even longer. But it just summarizes exactly how an economy
functions without government's intervention. And the beauty of this approach
is that it just shows how poverty declines and prosperity
increases without a penny of taxpayer dollars, without any government
(05:21):
special carve outs for businesses without any subsidies. And like
I said, when I first saw this, it was an epiphany.
Since I started teaching at Rampo College in nineteen eighty five,
the first day of every class that I taught in
the finance program, I showed students this approach to economics
and finance and they got it because they can be
(05:42):
working in the private sector, most of them. And then
I said, this is your role is to be in
the private sector and make sure your customers are satisfied.
And that's what an economy is rolled about, satisfying customers
with all the tools at your disposal. And that takes
a lot of work. Because we all know, at least
we should know, except as socialists, it takes a lot
(06:02):
of energy, creativity, leadership, management skills, marketing skills, finance skills
to run a business. And the people in Washington, some
of them think that businesses automatically make profits. But as
Mazie's pointed out in one of his great estates, is
that we live in a profit and loss economy and therefore,
(06:22):
when consumers say no to a company and its products,
they suffer losses. And that's a signal for the entrepreneurs
to either improve their products or get out of the
way and let those resources be used by better entrepreneurs.
And I came up with a list Michael Michael that
really blows away the notion of protectionism. It's a list
(06:45):
of all the companies in America that have collapsed the
last fifty years that are no longer with us. From
the airlines TWA Eastern pan am and there was an
airline called Trump Shuttle that's no longer around. So because
Trump Shuttle is no going around, should there have been
a government program to bail out Trump Shuttle or People's
Express that operated out of Newark. So many retailers are
(07:09):
out of business. The A and P supermarket chain, Wilworth,
the five to ten cents store that have been around
for ages. Sears, one of the most dominant retailers in
the history of America, no longer exists. Kmart is basically gone.
They now walked into a foot locker. So I have
a list of about several hundred companies that are longer
(07:31):
in existence. Everyone remembers Blockbuster with videos. Now we have streaming,
So technology change dynamism in the marketplace causes a lot
of companies to go under and when it comes to
the trade. I think the other thing also is you
mentioned Kmart and Sears. A lot of these companies they
wound up getting eaten by the vultures and basically they
(07:53):
just picked the bones, they kept the real estate and
closed the companies. Just the other day, I was talking
to somebody about the old Remember the Sears catalogs.
Speaker 1 (08:01):
Yes, I mean everybody enjoyed a Sears catalog you know,
or what was it, JC Whitney catalogs. You don't even
have catalogs anymore. Everything is online, you know.
Speaker 3 (08:11):
Well, this has been one I think the greatest boon
to customers. We do not a lot of shopping, but
a fair amount of shopping on Amazon. And it's amazing.
You can order something in the evenings and it's in
your residence the next day. That was unheard of decades ago.
And in the newspaper every day they have this day
(08:32):
in history. Well, the other day was the thirtieth anniversary
of Amazon and Jeff Bezos sold his first book online.
Speaker 1 (08:40):
And look at the.
Speaker 3 (08:42):
Juggernaut it's become in thirty years. You can get literally
everything on Amazon. I don't know if it's all with
automobiles yet, but literally you can get anything. And as
far as trade deficits go, which is a big buggaboo,
as you know it was Trump and his acolytes regarding trade,
is that the trade deficit is harmful to America. I
(09:04):
don't know what that means, because we all run trade deficits.
I just had a quick calculation the other day of
my trade deficit last year with the independent living facility
that we live in and all the online shopping that
we do plus the local shopping, it was well over
six figures. So I'm running a huge trade deficit. My
wife and I we're not losing any sleep. Why because
(09:26):
we have income to make it possible for us to
buy the things that we need in order to live
our lives. So the whole notion of a national trade
deficit is just a bogus concept.
Speaker 1 (09:37):
Well, you know, the geniuses like you said that they
get fifty points when they get to Washington. Remember, most
of these guys, Murray, are either attorneys or accountants. They
can't do laws, they can't do legislation, and they can't
do budgets. And now you know they're so smart. What
are we up to thirty five trillion dollars now?
Speaker 3 (09:55):
What's the mo I just checked the US government debt
dot org. We're over thirty seven trillion, and it's going
to be forty trillion at the end of next year,
if not sooner, and it's probably gonna be fifty trillion
by the early twenty thirties. And so if you just
(10:15):
apply a four percent interest rate on the national debt,
we're talking about one point six trillion dollars an interest
expense by the end of the decade, and possibly what
excuse me, two trillion dollars by the middle of the
next decade. This is going to crowd out spending or
(10:37):
the federal Reserve is going to come in and buy
up this debt, and that's called monetizing the debt. And
then we then we become Argentina as the economy is
flooded with money and we made the double and possibly
even triple digit inflation down the road. Unless something dressedic
happens with reducing spending and getting the budget under control,
(11:00):
I don't see that happening. Trump has the opportunity to
do it. This budget, this big, beautiful budget built, which
is the same as what build back better from Biden.
So there were all three bees and so.
Speaker 1 (11:12):
It's a big, beautiful bust out, as Tony Soprano would say,
that's what it is.
Speaker 3 (11:16):
Well, it just keeps on the welfare, warfare, state spending.
There are some tweaks here on medicaid. There's a huge
increase in military spending, well beyond what we need to
protect America. I mean, Trump, according to some people, committed
an impeachable offense by bombing Iran was a thirty thousand
(11:37):
pound buster bomb. I mean, he didn't go to Congress
to declare war on Iran, who's no threat to America.
And so you have really a problem in Washington that
dwarfs anything we've seen since World War Two, because we
have uncontrolled spending in Washington, massive debt. The money print
(12:00):
is that the Fed is still at it. In fact,
Trump wants the Fed to press on the accelerator to
pump more money in to get the interest rates down
by three percentage points. That would eviscerate savers who have
money and money market finds, which are now getting over
four percent. He wants money market He wants savers to
get one percent on their saving. That's a huge transfer
(12:21):
of wealth from from savers in America, which is which
are low and middle income folks to Wall Street, because
Wall Street benefits enormously from low interest rates that raises
asset values and stocks of the primary asset that increases
in value during a cheap money period.
Speaker 1 (12:39):
You know, he's he's really turned out to be a
one to eighty at this point. We're only six months,
seven months down the road, and in my opinion, I
think he's he's just obliterated Maga. You know, it's it's
it's not make America great, it's whatever I want to do,
dictatorship kind of thing. And eventually we're probably going to
go to a coin, Murray. Him and Wit Costs kids,
(13:02):
I mean his kids and Wit Costs kids already got
this world liberty financial thing hooked up, and they're going
to want to go to a coin and then you
could put your face in a camera and see if
you could spend money like you know, red China.
Speaker 4 (13:14):
Yeah, I think, you know, in some ways, Murray, I
think the problem is more is as much that this
country is interventionist. Yeah, whenever there is a there's a problem,
from the grassroots to the government, somebody wants somebody to
get involved and help them, and instead of them helping themselves.
(13:34):
And I don't really know how we changed that short
of a catastrophe. That kind of reteaches people that they
have to depend on themselves a little.
Speaker 1 (13:44):
And Murray, I wanted you say this.
Speaker 3 (13:46):
Last night. Trump said he's so excited that.
Speaker 5 (13:50):
The prime the crown prints came in from Bahrain and
they're talking about deals and it's thirteen million or whatever
it is that they're going to spend and and you know,
cross trade, and he sits there, you know, in that
toilet toilet bowled pose that he does very well in
the chair, and you know, bragging about these trade deals
(14:13):
in Saudi Arabia and we're doing here, there and everywhere.
Speaker 1 (14:16):
And then he lets little Marco come in at the
end and.
Speaker 6 (14:19):
Say, well, I don't know what's going on in Syria,
but you know we're looking into it. You know, just's
it's like a hoople conversation. It doesn't even look professional.
You know, you could do like a sidebar on that one.
But again it's always the trade deals.
Speaker 7 (14:34):
Look, we're making business, you know, and what we're really
doing is we're just burying ourselves in debt and you know,
worried about you know, spending more money in defense, which
is actually the big thing.
Speaker 1 (14:45):
You know. Now, all these hospitals, I want to mention
that to you. What you think about it? A lot
of these hospitals were in financial dire straits before COVID.
COVID bailed them out, basically bailed out the banks and
bailed out a lot of the healthcare systems. Now they're
screaming around the country that we're going to be closing
in hospitals. People are not going to give medical care.
(15:07):
There are some systems that are not going to stay
on under two feet, and some people may have to
drive fifty miles. What do you think about that money?
Speaker 3 (15:13):
Well, here's another example of Ronald Reagan's famous insight that
the most dangerous sentence in the English language is I'm
from the governments, that I'm here to help you. So
once you go down the road of subsidies, it becomes
like an addiction that you're not entrepreneurial. You're dependent upon
government contracts and government subsidies or patient subsidies, and that's
(15:38):
how you stay in business. Way, a good portion of
your revenue cashflow comes from the government, the taxpayer. And
this is why we need to get back to as
Michael pointed out before the break, we need to get
back to personal responsibility and financial independence, which is the
theme that I'm advocating on my sub stack, and I
developed a new hat basebook cat called MAFI Make Americans
(16:02):
Financially Independent, which is really a supplement to the declaration
of independence, a political independent, a political independence. So we
need to reinstate, if you will, the concept of independence
from the government, both politically and economically and financially. And
so that's why on July fourth, on Jo Sanson subsect
(16:25):
where we did a podcast, I announced that I may
be seeking the I create an exploratory committee to seek
the GOP nomination for president in twenty twenty eight. What
is what is so interesting about that, guys, is that,
as you know, I was born in West Germany right
(16:46):
after World War Two. What many people don't know is
I was born in the American occupation zone. So I
was born under the American flag. So I'm going to
invoke my birthright citizenship and say, listen, since I was
born under the American flag, I'm eligible to be president
because according to the fourteenth Amendment or whatever I think
that's supporting amendment that anyone born in the United States,
(17:10):
and since West Germany the American Occupation Zone, coul could
be considered part of the United States. That's what I
would invoke my birthright sitience strip. I don't think the
Supreme Court has ruled on that. But even if the
Supreme Court rules against me, if it goes that far,
here's the point I would make. You still are allowed
to run for president even if you're not eligible to
(17:32):
be president, because someone in twenty twenty four grand for
president who is an immigrant like I am, but I'm
making the case that I really am someone who's born
overseas on the American flag. Having said that, if we're
going to apply the Constitution to presidential eligibility, shouldn't we
also apply the Constitution to federal spending Because Article one,
(17:53):
section eight outlines the permissible spending of the federal government,
and according to my reading of Article one, section eight,
virtually everything in the federal budget is unconstitutional, all the
social welfare spending, all the foreign aid and overseas spending.
And I can make the case that the Federal Reserve
(18:15):
is unconstitutional. So if I go ahead with this, there
would be a two prong process. One is I would
announce an Exploratory Committee for President, which I wouldn't have
to follow any paperwork with the FAC the Federal Election
Commission until I raised five thousand dollars. But here's the
beauty of what I would do if I do this
(18:36):
is the themes of the campaign would be piece abroad.
In other words, stop endless wars, sew, stop endless wars,
abolish the income tax, abolish the Federal Reserve, and abolish
intervention overseas. Now, the interesting thing about the income tax, gentlemen,
(18:57):
is that thirty percent or more of the American people
don't pay the federal income tax. So I'm saying, let
us really have Liberation Day in America by everyone not
paying the income tax, which would be what April protection.
If a portion of the population is not paying the
income tax, the other portion shouldn't pay the income tax either. So,
having said that, we need to have a strong dollar,
(19:18):
a dollar backed by gold. And that's where brought Bot's
the Case one hundred percent Gold Dollar comes in. That
is one of the most important monographs ever written in
American history, and so everyone can read it at the
mecis dot org website miss dot org. The Case for
one hundred Percent goal dollar. It's absolutely a brilliant essay
into why the dollars should be as good as gold,
(19:42):
and so I would make the case that if we're
going to apply the notion of constitutionality for eligibility for president,
then we should also apply it for spending. In addition,
if I go ahead with this, gentlemen, I would not
raise any money because if there would be a campaign,
(20:03):
it would be strictly with volunteers, which would be another
component of the campaign that the nonprofit sector, the voluntary
sector would provide the services that the American people need
because they wouldn't have to pay the income tax. They
could support the local food bank, the Habitat Humanity, the
pregnancy crisis centers, and all the other nonprofits around the
(20:25):
country that are doing great work to help people without
government intervention. So there's a multiprome platform that I would
run on that would be consistent with the Declaration of Independence,
the Bill of Rights, and the rest of the Constitution.
So I'm excited about the possibility of doing this. Not
only doing it, but I would run a virtual campaign.
(20:46):
We have zoom. I could zoom into every Republican group
in the country and say, listen, we've tried it the
big government way for decades, for more than a century.
Why don't we go back to the roots of our
country the pens and next year is a two hundred
and fifth anniversary, and people should read the Declaration of
Dependence because it outlines the grievances by the colonists against
(21:09):
King George. We can do the same thing right now, gentlemen.
We have the same grievances or worse than what the
colonists had back two hundred and fifty years ago, because
we have a federal reserve, we have a military industrial complex,
we have a welfare state, we have the income tax,
we have all the trappings of the things that colonists
revolted against. And I'm not calling for a revolt. I'm
(21:31):
calling for an ideological change in this country, back to
our roots, which would increase wealth, prosperity, reduce poverty, and
create peace.
Speaker 1 (21:42):
Not only of the slogan could be it's more than
a cup of tea. Yeah, absolutely absolutely.
Speaker 3 (21:50):
I'm going to give everyone a seven course meal with
a lais fair economy.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
By the way, I think you're a lot more. I
think you have a much better chance than the guy
that was born in Kenya. Let's put it that way,
and he won.
Speaker 3 (22:08):
Well, see, this is what I would need to do.
I would need to get on every podcast there is
from Joe Rogan, which is the top podcast, to everyone
in the top one hundred, if you will, because I
need to reach tens of millions of Americans, and the
way we can do so is through podcasts like yours.
(22:28):
Are really welcome the opportunity to get the message out
to your listeners. And the other thing we're going to
do is.
Speaker 1 (22:37):
We have the.
Speaker 3 (22:39):
Make Americans Financial in Dependent brand coming out next month.
It's gonna be available online. There'll be the green and
white cap, which is the original one with a little
tweak to it, and then there'll be a black one
with gold lettering because to reflect the fact that the
gold is the premiere money in society. And so we're
gonna have those two hats available next next month. And
(23:00):
I'm hoping that we build up our sub stack to
one hundred thousand by the end of the year, which
is a big hold. But here's here's the real big hole.
A million strong by July fourth, twenty twenty six. If
we if I have a million sub subscribers and many
of them buy the hat. We can get this concept
(23:21):
across the country, make Americans financial independent, because I don't
know anyone any parent who teaches their kids not to
be financially independent when they're growing up. I was taught
by my parents, go to school, get an education, and
have a career. That's what I did from the time
I was sixty years old. Went to school in PS
(23:41):
ninety one in the Bronx, the Junior High School seventy nine,
the Bronx High School of Science, Hunt The College, Lehman College,
then Rutgers I went. I got an education from nineteen
fifty three to nineteen eighty one and got my PhD,
which allowed me to have the career I wanted, which
is teaching college being in the ninety in eighty five.
So I'm an example of find something that you really
(24:06):
love to do, whether it's teaching, whether it's podcasting, whether
it's clothing, whether it's whatever. Whatever there is. There's so
many opportunities in America today. Find out what you're really
love to do and do it and you'll have a
successful life ahead.
Speaker 4 (24:21):
Mike, you know, and I wanted to ask, Mari, will
there be a component of what you might call on
Lincolning America. I've read your colleagues books, the Lorenzo. Yeah,
it seems to me that the real kink, or one
of the real kinksent our system, is that the states
are virtually powerless.
Speaker 3 (24:42):
Yeah. Absolutely, Yeah, that's another point. I'm glad you brought
that up. Michael. I would say that the reason we
have this mess that we have today is because we're
not following the Tenth Amendment, which states very clearly, if
it's not authorized by the Constitution, it reversed in the states,
and the people that would put the federal government un
noticed that if we really want to have a cohesive nation,
(25:07):
which is difficult given all the different ideologies that are
out there, we need to decentralized. So if California wants
to subsidize abortion, that's up to them. If Louisiana wants
to abolish abortion, that's up to them. If people want
to have their Second Amendment rights protected in various states,
that's fine. But you cannot violate people's fundamental rights that
(25:30):
are in the Bill of Rights because that's applicable to
the states as well. So this is an opportunity for
us those believe who believe in freedom and limited government
and constitutional republic to make our voices heard. This guy
Amdami in New York City is a disgrace Ideologically he
may be a wonderful person, but ideologically, how could you
(25:52):
believe in socialism today? When we saw the Soviet Union
collapse with for our eyes now he was probably what
he was too years old when that happened. So he
has to get some videotape of the Soviet Union collousing
and the Berlin World, Berlin World coming down. And I
visited Cuba. I saw the difference between whatever free enterprise
(26:13):
they had and the government run stores they had. The
government run stores in Cuba is a throwback to the
nineteenth century stores in the Wild West where even stores,
yet even those stores were better supplied than the government
stores in Cuba today. I mean, we were there about
twelve years ago, and it's just amazing that Cuba, ninety
(26:36):
miles from Florida, should be a natural trading partner of
the United States and should be the premier tourist destination
for Americans. And it's because of this failed ideology of
socialism that they're clinging on to a concept that Niss
demolished in his nineteen twenty two book called Socialism, for
(26:58):
which he should have won a Nobel Prize. When you
show it's impossible to have a socialist economy because you
cannot calculate profits and losses, which is the essence of
a free market economy.
Speaker 1 (27:09):
Marie, there's there's youtub's right now showing what it is
like to walk around, just walk around Havana. Yea, you
have beautiful colonial you know, Spanish colonial architecture. That's you know, deteriorated.
Walls are collapsed, there's no paint. The streets are full
of garbage.
Speaker 3 (27:26):
You know.
Speaker 1 (27:26):
People have phones and you know, headphones on and they're
just showing you, like, you know, the streets of Havana.
I could just picture at night how dangerous it is
walking out of a building there for anybody, whether it's
a woman or man, you know. And people are like, oh, yeah,
the Cubans they get free health care, right, they get
(27:46):
free health care. You know, in America we gotta pay
for it. Well, no, I want to touch on that
thing you just mentioned a little while ago. You said
thirty percent of the people don't pay income text. Now,
is that the top end or the bottom end of Americans?
Speaker 3 (27:59):
Who that's the BUTTEF. The Tax Foundation had a breakdown
from data from the IRS showing who pays the income tax.
And I think the top ten percent pay like seventy
percent of the income tax. So again, if we believe
in equality, there's certainly a skew when it comes to
paying the income tax. And so I don't have those
figures in front of me. But when I saw those numbers,
(28:22):
I said, every time Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren AOC
talk about wealthy people paying their fair share, I'm tempted
to get up my sixth hour and say, listen, read
the data from the IRS. The people who pay the
bulk of the income tax are in the top ten
percent of income earnest.
Speaker 1 (28:41):
But you know what they say at that point, Murray,
they say.
Speaker 8 (28:44):
Well, they are tax shelters. There's well, that's in the
tax law. They could use whatever the tax law is
to make deductions. If you're driving the car you have
a lease. You know, people are so dumb, I mean
because they don't want to educate them in American schools.
Speaker 1 (28:59):
You know that. So to them it's like, well, you know,
they don't pay any tax. No, what they're doing is
they're taking advantage of whatever the tax law is. Now,
how many messages are in the tax law? Was it
four thousand pages today?
Speaker 3 (29:11):
Oh? I think it's longer than that. It's a monstrosity.
I mean, how taxes shouldn't be more difficult to pay
than it is to pay your what cell phone bill?
Or your cable bill? I mean, the interesting thing about
the tax code right now, I think I just read
that seventy or eighty percent of the American people take
(29:32):
the standard of deduction, so they filled out that their
taxes are basically on what is essentially a postcard, but
they don't have to itemize. And so the tax code
had become a political football since it was introduced in
nineteen fourteen, after the sixteen A Member was passed in
nineteen thirteen. And you look at the rates on taxes,
they go up and down, up and down, up and down.
(29:52):
And again this shows you how dysfunctional Washington is, where
they can't have a tax that is that is the
same throughout history, but they use it for political purpose,
and they claim for economic purpose as well. But the
point is, I'm calling to the end of the income text,
(30:13):
which I did in my first book, Tax for two thousand,
which is a roadmap to create a tax for society
in twenty first.
Speaker 1 (30:18):
Sentday signing better and better. Before we go to our
commercial break, where do you get the hat?
Speaker 3 (30:24):
Well, it's going to be available soon at the mesis
dot org store. They have Mesi's hats and I just
did an arrangement with them. The hats are being produced
right now. I guess the hats come have to come
from China because guess what. When I got the invoice
for the hats, there's a dollar per hat tariff on it.
(30:44):
So I'm eating. I'm eating. I'm eating that tariff. I'm
not passing it along to the Mesa's institute to sell
the hats, so it's lowering my profit margin on that calla.
Speaker 1 (30:58):
We got on the hat green there's.
Speaker 3 (31:01):
Green with white lettering green for money, and then we
have a black hat with gold lettering gold being the
preeminent money.
Speaker 1 (31:07):
Very good, very good, Oh gosh, this is fantastic. And
you know, Murray, a lot of good ideas on how
to run for president. And it's cost effective too, which
is part of your platform being cost effective and saving
you know, how do we get out of there? Let
me ask you a question. Let's say you win. We'll
take a hypothetically you're going to win, and what do
you do your first six months? Do you put terroiffs
(31:29):
on everybody? Is that what you do? You can tell everybody, Hey, listen,
we need a little bit more war.
Speaker 3 (31:34):
Well, here's the thing, is if the Supreme Court, because
it has to go to the Supreme Courts, because I
don't think they they ruled on if you're born in
an US occupation zone, are you you have birth right citizenship? Now,
the Supreme Court ruled or at least the course of
rule that John McCain, who was born in Panama Canal,
(31:54):
his parents obviously were American citizens. So even though he
wasn't born in America, he is a US. So neither
of my parents were you are citizens because they were
They were from Poland when I was born in nineteen
forty six. So I would be the oldest president elected,
the oldest individual elected president, and the first Jewish president.
And we need a Jewish president desperately because I can
(32:17):
run the government wholesale as supposed to retail the way
he's been done in Martina.
Speaker 1 (32:23):
All right, now, I got to ask you a big question.
You opened up Pandora's box.
Speaker 3 (32:28):
Yeah, will you be will you.
Speaker 1 (32:29):
Be supporting all this crap that Trump's doing in regards
to the Middle East? I doubt it.
Speaker 3 (32:35):
No. I mean, you know what, we need a Jewish president,
need somebody to bring Ntanyau back to the White House
and say, listen, the United States foreign policy is not
Israel's foreign policy. It's America first foreign policy, which means
protecting our borders. And if you have any beef with
your neighbors, you've got to sit down with them in
neutral place like Switzerland or wherever and hash out your
(32:57):
disagreement with them. And the other point I would is,
if Iran shouldn't have a nuclear weapon, and they on
record as not wanting a nuclear weapon, why does Israel
have at least eighty nukes in their arsenal? And so
we need to we need No one's talking about Israel's nukes,
which is really amazing. This is this is a subject
that is taboo in the media. No one is allowed
(33:20):
to talk about Israel's nukes. And Israel was the was
the country the first country to introduce nukes into the
Mid East, which we know is a destabilizing approach to
foreign policy in your region.
Speaker 1 (33:34):
Wow, that is very good statement. You know, Mandy Pittamkin
is out on record now, you know the actor right right,
he's really pissed off about Bebe because he says, you know,
he's he's he's really putting the target on almost every
Jews back around the world with his policy. And you know,
this guy, I don't know. To me, this guy's just
I call him Satan Yahoo. This guy's got such evil
(33:56):
I mean, you know, you just can't you can't say
that this is my neighbor and I want to annihilate
or level this.
Speaker 3 (34:03):
Look just last.
Speaker 1 (34:04):
Week in Syria, more bombing going on goal On Heights, Lebanon.
How do you say we want to make a peace
deal when there's you know, almost nobody left to make
the peace deal with.
Speaker 3 (34:14):
You know, Well, here's something that someone wrote on substack
who writes about foreign policy, which is true. What if
the people in Gaza were Jews and the Palestinians controlled
what is now Israel, and they were trying to and
the Jews and Godza felt they were being oppressed by
the Palestinians who controlled Israel, a Palestine as it would
(34:36):
probably be called, what would the world's reaction be to
Jews being bombed in Gaza, if the tables would turn.
And I think that that probably no one wants to
answer that question because it speaks volumes about the double
standard we have regarding the Palestinians. And it's not anti
Semitic to criticize the government of Israel. It Israel has
(35:00):
a government. We know, all governments are violent, That's been
through throughout history, and so the Israeli government is no
different than any other government, except they claim that they're
surrounded by hostile people and therefore they need to protect
themselves using extraordinary means, like in Gaza. I mean, I've
(35:22):
seen pictures of Gaza and it looks no different than
Germany after World War Two. Everything is destroyed, and the
American taxpayer is going to help a payment for the
rebuilding of gods.
Speaker 1 (35:34):
I think very much. So, you know, you know, he
came here, and right after he came here, you know,
we're supposed to have the peace president. He hands this paper, Murray,
he hands his paper to Trump that he's nominating for
the Nobel Prize. I mean, this is like doctor Death,
you know, handing this paper to Trump, who's grinning ear
to ear he should get a Nobel Prize for death,
(35:57):
not for peace. I mean, come on, you know, like
you said, there was no reason to go after Iran
and do what he did. You know, there's no real
proof to the fact that what they would doing or
what they had. And by the way, if they're surrounded
by people with all these news, certain they have some too.
I mean it's fair play then, right.
Speaker 3 (36:16):
Well, and the other thing is Ukraine is not getting rearmed.
I mean Trump is rearming Ukraine. Our supply of armaments
are being depleted, and so we're basically in a two
front war here without any declaration from Congress. And so
this is why people have called the presidency in modern
(36:39):
times under both Republics and Democrats, the imperial presidency. And
so we need to get away from having an imperial
presidency and having a constitutional republic once again, which means
constant consultation between the president and the Congress. And that's
what I would advocate as president, saying I have no
desire to make policy unilaterally if I get to the
(37:02):
point where I would be elected, which again is mentally
a long shot, especially with the citizenship aspect. But the
point is you've got to start somewhere and educate the
American people that we are on this road under the
political establishment of Washington, which is harming future generations with debt,
(37:24):
with money printing, and be stabilizing parts of the world
with our intervention. And we need to have Diplomacy is
the foremost part of state crift, not dropping bombs on people.
You know.
Speaker 1 (37:42):
Trump doesn't let anybody do diplomacy. I mean, Rubio is
just to figure him, let's say, but there's got to
be somebody, you know, Mike and I go around people
in the State Department over the years, there's people that
could have talks, you could have back channels, you know.
But Trump, he puts Rubio in a room like a
little kid, you know, on a high chair, and then
he's talking all about you know, the the foreign policy.
(38:04):
Rubio should be able to do that with his people.
You know, remember the Sykes Pico agreement which the Brits
did with the Middle East. They're trying to do now.
I just saw it this morning, Murray. They're trying to
do something like that in regards to Ukraine. Break it up.
You know, drawer line, red line, gray line, whatever it
may be. Give RuSHA this, you take this and so
(38:24):
on and so forth. Those those agreements turned out to
be negative. They were not positive.
Speaker 4 (38:30):
You know.
Speaker 1 (38:31):
They cut they cut barriers, they made demarcations. We don't
need more Sykes Pico. We need reality. And reality is
this is their land, that's your land. And if you
claim this, that's fine. But let these people hash it out.
And it may not be the un which is you know,
that's another whole debacle. But you know, like you say,
you go to Switzerland, go to the Bahamas, go somewhere,
(38:54):
you know what I mean to go somewhere, spend four
or five days hash it out. Got you got camp, David.
You got to deal right now with mosquitos. You know,
you have mosquitoes. They would love to have some people
to eat. You know.
Speaker 3 (39:05):
Well, that's why Mesis wrote about foreign policy in many
of his writings, and he said, the best way to
have peaceful relations among people of different ethnicities and nationalities
is to have a plebiscite where people would vote who
they want to with, whom they want to affiliate with.
And that's exactly the way it should be done in
the Mid East, that's the way it should be done
(39:25):
in Ukraine. And just have peaceful relations because Ukraine is
virtually destroyed. I mean a good portion of the country
is just non existent, and so the American tax pay
is going to fund more building of Ukraine. I mean,
what busted. I mean, We're gonna have a two trillion
dollar deficit this year, a two trillion dollar deficit probably
(39:47):
next year. And the numbers are staggering. And so anyone
who thinks that tariffs of the answer is probably smoking
some funny little cigarettes in their study or whatever.
Speaker 1 (39:58):
Medical now you could get it, you get it free
with the doctor Mario. Is this the first show you
announced that you want to run for president?
Speaker 3 (40:05):
Well, I announced it on Joe Sansone show on July fourth.
Then I was on Adam Troit's podcast a week or so,
a week and a half or so ago. And this
is the third show that I'm mentioning this, and I
put it on my substack the other day as well,
and I'm just going to keep on staying to people listen.
I'm not doing this for any personal benefit because this
(40:28):
is my last rodeo. I mean, Trump and I are
the same age, and I've had a wonderful career teaching
finance for thirty five years. The question is what do
I do after a teaching career, And given my activity
in politics in New Jersey, I said, even though I
didn't win anything, I affected public policy when I ran
for governor in nineteen ninety seven. So even if I
(40:51):
don't come anywhere near winning, I would bring to the
attention to the American people what's gone wrong and what
the solutions are. That's how you run a campaign. You
don't call people names, You just talk about here is
where we are today, here's how we got here, and
here's how we make things better for everybody except the
people who want to live off of Washington. I eat
(41:12):
the tax payer.
Speaker 4 (41:14):
Go ahead, Michael, Yeah, Murray. The other thing that always
bothers me. We were a people who were founded on
the writings of Cato of Trenchhart and I can't remember
the other fellow's name, but one of the lessons they
taught was what we're living through at the moment is
(41:34):
the danger of a standing military that becomes a source
of disruption in the country through the money they spend,
through the actions they take. And I can't think of
something that needs more reform. I don't want to say
(41:55):
Americans shouldn't love their soldiers, But as the colonel always says,
there's a lot of difference between the soldier who joins
up for a career and one who's drafted. And I
don't you know, I don't quite exactly know how I
would try to fix that. But you know, the idea
that we have forty four or five star generals for
a two million man military, and we had four in
(42:19):
World War Two when we had twelve million people under
the flag. So I don't know, what do you what
do you think about that?
Speaker 3 (42:28):
Well, here's where you need to do. Quote an audit,
a full audit of what is the optimal military, optimal
sized military we need to defend the country. And David
Stockman has written about this in his writings about submarine
based nukes surrounding the country, aircraft carriers surrounding the country,
(42:51):
and having the land based missiles and having a military
because we are protected by two oceans and we have
two friendly neighbors to the north and south, so no
one's going to invade us. The problem is Russia has
hypersonic missiles, China may probably have them as well, and
so they could reach us pretty quickly. That's why it's
(43:12):
so dangerous. With Trump and the EU is a NATO
are doing in Ukraine by arming them to the teeth.
And now what if Ukraine gets missiles to fire into
Moscow and Saint Petersburg, Then we're then we're talking about
a whole new ball game, and that would be crossing
the red line for World War three, where Russia would
then probably lob some nukes into Western Europe or even
(43:35):
in the United States. So we are entering very dangerous territory.
And we need to make the case that peace is
the natural order of things, that war is the opposite
of the natural order of things. And if we believe
in the natural order of things, then we have to
have diplomacy and settle our differences through negotiations as opposed
(43:56):
to dropping thirty thousand pound bombs.
Speaker 1 (44:00):
Laurie I think the European Union has a death wish.
It's either the death wish or it's like all wars,
when your economy goes bad, we go to war, right yep.
Speaker 3 (44:15):
Well, that's what happened in nineteen forty one, after a
decade of depression, that Roosevelt maneuvered us into World War two,
first with the boycott of the Japanese and again, Trump
is now talking about increasing the boycott on Russia of
anyone who buys from Russia will be tariff enormously. So
(44:38):
our head should be exploding for what Trump is trying
to do with tariffs, to try to do diplomacy or
a non diplomacy to tariffs, and it creates conflict that
the tariff's our history, of course conflict, and that lesson
apparently hasn't been learned by Trump Navarro.
Speaker 1 (44:54):
And that's what I forgot to mention on the show
today with you. I wanted to get your opinion. You know,
his problem is loyalty. NAVARROO went to jail. So now
Navarro is a genius on the economy. You know, if
Navarro puts his finger in the wind blows that way,
that's the economy.
Speaker 3 (45:10):
You know.
Speaker 1 (45:11):
This is by the way, I just want to say
this on this show, we never say FDR. We say
Saint FDR. You know, he's canonized in the American Ice, you.
Speaker 3 (45:22):
Know, oh yeah, yeah, I mean he did so much damage.
We're coming up to the ninetieth anniversary of Social Security
and then coming up to the sixtieth anniversary of Medicare
and Medicaid. I mean we have all these mega programs
that have no constitutional basis, that are financially unsustainable, and
yet people think they're the greatest things in slice spread.
(45:44):
And this is another example that Michael talked about, is
that people are willing are willing to take responsibility for
their lives. I learned at a young age because I
saw my father go to work, work eight ten hours
a day, drive a cab on the weekends, provide for
a spam lead, not had to go on welfare or
anything like that. And so saving was a part of
(46:06):
their culture, the part of their worldview, and so that
was instilled in me. And so when I started working
at the college, I saved the maxim I could into
a four to one K for thirty five years. And
that's why I'm very comfortable today having a substantial IRA
that I draw down from in order to pay my expenses.
And that's what generation well, that's yeah, I mean, unfortunately,
(46:31):
there are too many people who are living paycheck to paycheck,
and it was a reflection of the Federal Reserve increasing
prices which make it very difficult for families to make
their ends meet. And then the other problem is which
of course is very bolton to say is that people
are having truer when they can afford to raise them financially,
and that's a real problem in the country, and so
(46:54):
you can't even talk about that, probably on mainstream media.
So we need to get back to basic financial, personal
and national economics. And if we do that, I think
will be in great shape.
Speaker 4 (47:08):
Yep, we're down in the last minute, Mike, go ahead. Yeah,
I just I tend to think that we've made World
War two when the Depression into a cult. Oh absolutely,
and no one really you know, Tom Brokaw has been
doing all of this, and you know, to call the
World War two demonstrator generation the greatest generation in America
(47:33):
is really a stretch for me. When you think about
the Revolutionary War, both armies, and the Civil War, just
even the French and Indian Wars. Those are amazing generations.
And I don't want to take anything away from the
people who fought, they risked their lives what they were
told was our liberty.
Speaker 3 (47:52):
Yeah, I mean, world War two, it never should have happened.
World War two happened because of World War One. Well,
and Franklin Roosevelt, Yeah, I mean, and the Great Depression
and the trade wars, during World War Two, during the thirties,
because of the depression, nations basically put up walls against
trade and it was a disaster of an absolute disaster.
(48:15):
And the boycotts that FDR did against against Japan, that's
economic warfare, that's a.
Speaker 1 (48:25):
That's a declaration of warry. That's exactly what he did.
Speaker 3 (48:29):
Again.
Speaker 1 (48:29):
People, by the way, Japan is walking away from us now,
they're starting to look at us like, Okay, enough is enough.
You know, Trump's the psychopath. I don't know how far
we get down the road this year in twenty twenty five,
were already in July. But if this keeps up, you know,
we're going to have to check him out for the
cognitive results. Maybe somebody's got to do a little bit
of tap on the shoulder and say listen, either sit
(48:52):
in the seat or you know, go take the test
because it's not looking good. Gentlemen, Hey, Mury, thanks so
much for coming on.
Speaker 4 (48:58):
Appreciate it great, Thank you for coming back.
Speaker 1 (49:01):
Hey, we want to thank Mary Sabran of Mesa's Institute.
Don't forget you're gonna want to listen to that debate.
Mariy Sabran, have a great week.
Speaker 3 (49:07):
Thank you. Sir, thank you, thanks gaming,
Ah right, this is Colonel Mike two Mike's Podcast to
Mike's dot US. Two Mikes dot us. You can always
find us on Network Radio dot US. You could find
us on America out Loud, dot news and UH. Our
Rumble channel is Maverick Broadcasting. We're making a message from
the old Rumble Channel to the new Rumble Channel. All right,
we want to thank you once again for listening and
(00:24):
to all of you who have been on the shows
in the last five years. We appreciate it. If you
want to come back, contact us or Fuddy and we
hope to bring you some more good shows in the
next few months. As we come down to the end
of nine twenty twenty five.
Speaker 2 (00:38):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (01:07):
Let's start it up with Liberty and Justice for All.
We welcome back to our show, Murray Sabred of the
Missus Institute. Hey, you know we've had Murray on the
two mics, We've had Murray on the National Security out before,
and why do we want to have Murray on this week? Well,
you know that big beautiful bust out, as Tony Soprano
would say in New Jersey, right, the bust out bill. Murray,
(01:28):
welcome back.
Speaker 3 (01:29):
Great to be with you, Mike and Mike, Mike and Michael,
so I can get everyone correct on today's show.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
All right, Murray, let's do a little commercial for you.
Next week is the big one at Missus Institute. Correct.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
Yeah, Next Friday at five pm Eastern time, I'll be
debating Spencer Morrison, who has been one of the leading
voices for protectionism and tariffs with his book called Reshure
How tariffs will basically save the world and save and
save America. And so I'm going to be doing a debate
with him at the Mesas Institute. And so it would
(02:02):
be a lot of fun because I read his book
and it's amazing how many how many myths there are
in the book and erroneous assertions about the economy. So
I have all my material ready to go, and it's
just going to be a great opportunity for people around
the world of tuning into the Mess's website and the
(02:24):
mess YouTube channel to see this live stream that will
be archived, because this is another example of Mike and
Michael of how the interventionalist mindset has captured not only
the political class, but a lot of fundits out there
who think that government is God, government knows exactly that
(02:48):
the people that got to know exactly what to do.
But if in the private sector they're done, they're stupid.
But once they go to Washington, they're IQ jumps fifty points.
And that seems to be the mindset that out there,
that somehow people in Washington know how to plan the economy.
And here's the irony of this whole situation. And I'm
(03:08):
going to put this on my sub stack probably later today,
namely that Mamdami who just got the Democratic nomination for
mayor in New York City and who's a self described
Democratic socialist and Donald Trump. Basically I cut from the
same pot, believe it or not, even though Trump has
(03:31):
called him a communist, the Marxist, the socialist. Well, what
is Trump doing in the international trade area. He's trying
to use the government to structure the world economy and
especially the US economy with tariffs and all sorts of
interventions in the US economy. So what Trump is giving
us is socialism light and Mandamie wants to give us
(03:53):
socialist socialism on steroids. That's the difference between the two
of them. And it just shows you that Washington and
these local politicians think that they know how to create
better economic conditions. And I have a chart that I'm
going to show in my opening remarks, the power in
my PowerPoint that comes from Murray Rothbud's great little monograph
(04:15):
called the Case one hundred percent Goal Dollar. And when
I first read this back in the eighties, maybe even
the seventies, I said, this is it. This is how
you explain the economy. And I think it's the best
tool we have for those of us that believe in
free markets, that non intervention domestically and internationally can just
undercut this whole notion that the people in Washington somehow
(04:39):
have this magic bullet that they can just wave a
wind or do an executive order or pass the law
to make the economy better. And this description of the
economy is essentially the las a faire approach to economics,
which has been around for a couple hundred years, maybe
(05:00):
even longer. But it just summarizes exactly how an economy
functions without government's intervention. And the beauty of this approach
is that it just shows how poverty declines and prosperity
increases without a penny of taxpayer dollars, without any government
(05:21):
special carve outs for businesses without any subsidies. And like
I said, when I first saw this, it was an epiphany.
Since I started teaching at Rampo College in nineteen eighty five,
the first day of every class that I taught in
the finance program, I showed students this approach to economics
and finance and they got it because they can be
(05:42):
working in the private sector, most of them. And then
I said, this is your role is to be in
the private sector and make sure your customers are satisfied.
And that's what an economy is rolled about, satisfying customers
with all the tools at your disposal. And that takes
a lot of work. Because we all know, at least
we should know, except as socialists, it takes a lot
(06:02):
of energy, creativity, leadership, management skills, marketing skills, finance skills
to run a business. And the people in Washington, some
of them think that businesses automatically make profits. But as
Mazie's pointed out in one of his great estates, is
that we live in a profit and loss economy and therefore,
(06:22):
when consumers say no to a company and its products,
they suffer losses. And that's a signal for the entrepreneurs
to either improve their products or get out of the
way and let those resources be used by better entrepreneurs.
And I came up with a list Michael Michael that
really blows away the notion of protectionism. It's a list
(06:45):
of all the companies in America that have collapsed the
last fifty years that are no longer with us. From
the airlines TWA Eastern pan am and there was an
airline called Trump Shuttle that's no longer around. So because
Trump Shuttle is no going around, should there have been
a government program to bail out Trump Shuttle or People's
Express that operated out of Newark. So many retailers are
(07:09):
out of business. The A and P supermarket chain, Wilworth,
the five to ten cents store that have been around
for ages. Sears, one of the most dominant retailers in
the history of America, no longer exists. Kmart is basically gone.
They now walked into a foot locker. So I have
a list of about several hundred companies that are longer
(07:31):
in existence. Everyone remembers Blockbuster with videos. Now we have streaming,
So technology change dynamism in the marketplace causes a lot
of companies to go under and when it comes to
the trade. I think the other thing also is you
mentioned Kmart and Sears. A lot of these companies they
wound up getting eaten by the vultures and basically they
(07:53):
just picked the bones, they kept the real estate and
closed the companies. Just the other day, I was talking
to somebody about the old Remember the Sears catalogs.
Speaker 1 (08:01):
Yes, I mean everybody enjoyed a Sears catalog you know,
or what was it, JC Whitney catalogs. You don't even
have catalogs anymore. Everything is online, you know.
Speaker 3 (08:11):
Well, this has been one I think the greatest boon
to customers. We do not a lot of shopping, but
a fair amount of shopping on Amazon. And it's amazing.
You can order something in the evenings and it's in
your residence the next day. That was unheard of decades ago.
And in the newspaper every day they have this day
(08:32):
in history. Well, the other day was the thirtieth anniversary
of Amazon and Jeff Bezos sold his first book online.
Speaker 1 (08:40):
And look at the.
Speaker 3 (08:42):
Juggernaut it's become in thirty years. You can get literally
everything on Amazon. I don't know if it's all with
automobiles yet, but literally you can get anything. And as
far as trade deficits go, which is a big buggaboo,
as you know it was Trump and his acolytes regarding trade,
is that the trade deficit is harmful to America. I
(09:04):
don't know what that means, because we all run trade deficits.
I just had a quick calculation the other day of
my trade deficit last year with the independent living facility
that we live in and all the online shopping that
we do plus the local shopping, it was well over
six figures. So I'm running a huge trade deficit. My
wife and I we're not losing any sleep. Why because
(09:26):
we have income to make it possible for us to
buy the things that we need in order to live
our lives. So the whole notion of a national trade
deficit is just a bogus concept.
Speaker 1 (09:37):
Well, you know, the geniuses like you said that they
get fifty points when they get to Washington. Remember, most
of these guys, Murray, are either attorneys or accountants. They
can't do laws, they can't do legislation, and they can't
do budgets. And now you know they're so smart. What
are we up to thirty five trillion dollars now?
Speaker 3 (09:55):
What's the mo I just checked the US government debt
dot org. We're over thirty seven trillion, and it's going
to be forty trillion at the end of next year,
if not sooner, and it's probably gonna be fifty trillion
by the early twenty thirties. And so if you just
(10:15):
apply a four percent interest rate on the national debt,
we're talking about one point six trillion dollars an interest
expense by the end of the decade, and possibly what
excuse me, two trillion dollars by the middle of the
next decade. This is going to crowd out spending or
(10:37):
the federal Reserve is going to come in and buy
up this debt, and that's called monetizing the debt. And
then we then we become Argentina as the economy is
flooded with money and we made the double and possibly
even triple digit inflation down the road. Unless something dressedic
happens with reducing spending and getting the budget under control,
(11:00):
I don't see that happening. Trump has the opportunity to
do it. This budget, this big, beautiful budget built, which
is the same as what build back better from Biden.
So there were all three bees and so.
Speaker 1 (11:12):
It's a big, beautiful bust out, as Tony Soprano would say,
that's what it is.
Speaker 3 (11:16):
Well, it just keeps on the welfare, warfare, state spending.
There are some tweaks here on medicaid. There's a huge
increase in military spending, well beyond what we need to
protect America. I mean, Trump, according to some people, committed
an impeachable offense by bombing Iran was a thirty thousand
(11:37):
pound buster bomb. I mean, he didn't go to Congress
to declare war on Iran, who's no threat to America.
And so you have really a problem in Washington that
dwarfs anything we've seen since World War Two, because we
have uncontrolled spending in Washington, massive debt. The money print
(12:00):
is that the Fed is still at it. In fact,
Trump wants the Fed to press on the accelerator to
pump more money in to get the interest rates down
by three percentage points. That would eviscerate savers who have
money and money market finds, which are now getting over
four percent. He wants money market He wants savers to
get one percent on their saving. That's a huge transfer
(12:21):
of wealth from from savers in America, which is which
are low and middle income folks to Wall Street, because
Wall Street benefits enormously from low interest rates that raises
asset values and stocks of the primary asset that increases
in value during a cheap money period.
Speaker 1 (12:39):
You know, he's he's really turned out to be a
one to eighty at this point. We're only six months,
seven months down the road, and in my opinion, I
think he's he's just obliterated Maga. You know, it's it's
it's not make America great, it's whatever I want to do,
dictatorship kind of thing. And eventually we're probably going to
go to a coin, Murray. Him and Wit Costs kids,
(13:02):
I mean his kids and Wit Costs kids already got
this world liberty financial thing hooked up, and they're going
to want to go to a coin and then you
could put your face in a camera and see if
you could spend money like you know, red China.
Speaker 4 (13:14):
Yeah, I think, you know, in some ways, Murray, I
think the problem is more is as much that this
country is interventionist. Yeah, whenever there is a there's a problem,
from the grassroots to the government, somebody wants somebody to
get involved and help them, and instead of them helping themselves.
(13:34):
And I don't really know how we changed that short
of a catastrophe. That kind of reteaches people that they
have to depend on themselves a little.
Speaker 1 (13:44):
And Murray, I wanted you say this.
Speaker 3 (13:46):
Last night. Trump said he's so excited that.
Speaker 5 (13:50):
The prime the crown prints came in from Bahrain and
they're talking about deals and it's thirteen million or whatever
it is that they're going to spend and and you know,
cross trade, and he sits there, you know, in that
toilet toilet bowled pose that he does very well in
the chair, and you know, bragging about these trade deals
(14:13):
in Saudi Arabia and we're doing here, there and everywhere.
Speaker 1 (14:16):
And then he lets little Marco come in at the
end and.
Speaker 6 (14:19):
Say, well, I don't know what's going on in Syria,
but you know we're looking into it. You know, just's
it's like a hoople conversation. It doesn't even look professional.
You know, you could do like a sidebar on that one.
But again it's always the trade deals.
Speaker 7 (14:34):
Look, we're making business, you know, and what we're really
doing is we're just burying ourselves in debt and you know,
worried about you know, spending more money in defense, which
is actually the big thing.
Speaker 1 (14:45):
You know. Now, all these hospitals, I want to mention
that to you. What you think about it? A lot
of these hospitals were in financial dire straits before COVID.
COVID bailed them out, basically bailed out the banks and
bailed out a lot of the healthcare systems. Now they're
screaming around the country that we're going to be closing
in hospitals. People are not going to give medical care.
(15:07):
There are some systems that are not going to stay
on under two feet, and some people may have to
drive fifty miles. What do you think about that money?
Speaker 3 (15:13):
Well, here's another example of Ronald Reagan's famous insight that
the most dangerous sentence in the English language is I'm
from the governments, that I'm here to help you. So
once you go down the road of subsidies, it becomes
like an addiction that you're not entrepreneurial. You're dependent upon
government contracts and government subsidies or patient subsidies, and that's
(15:38):
how you stay in business. Way, a good portion of
your revenue cashflow comes from the government, the taxpayer. And
this is why we need to get back to as
Michael pointed out before the break, we need to get
back to personal responsibility and financial independence, which is the
theme that I'm advocating on my sub stack, and I
developed a new hat basebook cat called MAFI Make Americans
(16:02):
Financially Independent, which is really a supplement to the declaration
of independence, a political independent, a political independence. So we
need to reinstate, if you will, the concept of independence
from the government, both politically and economically and financially. And
so that's why on July fourth, on Jo Sanson subsect
(16:25):
where we did a podcast, I announced that I may
be seeking the I create an exploratory committee to seek
the GOP nomination for president in twenty twenty eight. What
is what is so interesting about that, guys, is that,
as you know, I was born in West Germany right
(16:46):
after World War Two. What many people don't know is
I was born in the American occupation zone. So I
was born under the American flag. So I'm going to
invoke my birthright citizenship and say, listen, since I was
born under the American flag, I'm eligible to be president
because according to the fourteenth Amendment or whatever I think
that's supporting amendment that anyone born in the United States,
(17:10):
and since West Germany the American Occupation Zone, coul could
be considered part of the United States. That's what I
would invoke my birthright sitience strip. I don't think the
Supreme Court has ruled on that. But even if the
Supreme Court rules against me, if it goes that far,
here's the point I would make. You still are allowed
to run for president even if you're not eligible to
(17:32):
be president, because someone in twenty twenty four grand for
president who is an immigrant like I am, but I'm
making the case that I really am someone who's born
overseas on the American flag. Having said that, if we're
going to apply the Constitution to presidential eligibility, shouldn't we
also apply the Constitution to federal spending Because Article one,
(17:53):
section eight outlines the permissible spending of the federal government,
and according to my reading of Article one, section eight,
virtually everything in the federal budget is unconstitutional, all the
social welfare spending, all the foreign aid and overseas spending.
And I can make the case that the Federal Reserve
(18:15):
is unconstitutional. So if I go ahead with this, there
would be a two prong process. One is I would
announce an Exploratory Committee for President, which I wouldn't have
to follow any paperwork with the FAC the Federal Election
Commission until I raised five thousand dollars. But here's the
beauty of what I would do if I do this
(18:36):
is the themes of the campaign would be piece abroad.
In other words, stop endless wars, sew, stop endless wars,
abolish the income tax, abolish the Federal Reserve, and abolish
intervention overseas. Now, the interesting thing about the income tax, gentlemen,
(18:57):
is that thirty percent or more of the American people
don't pay the federal income tax. So I'm saying, let
us really have Liberation Day in America by everyone not
paying the income tax, which would be what April protection.
If a portion of the population is not paying the
income tax, the other portion shouldn't pay the income tax either. So,
having said that, we need to have a strong dollar,
(19:18):
a dollar backed by gold. And that's where brought Bot's
the Case one hundred percent Gold Dollar comes in. That
is one of the most important monographs ever written in
American history, and so everyone can read it at the
mecis dot org website miss dot org. The Case for
one hundred Percent goal dollar. It's absolutely a brilliant essay
into why the dollars should be as good as gold,
(19:42):
and so I would make the case that if we're
going to apply the notion of constitutionality for eligibility for president,
then we should also apply it for spending. In addition,
if I go ahead with this, gentlemen, I would not
raise any money because if there would be a campaign,
(20:03):
it would be strictly with volunteers, which would be another
component of the campaign that the nonprofit sector, the voluntary
sector would provide the services that the American people need
because they wouldn't have to pay the income tax. They
could support the local food bank, the Habitat Humanity, the
pregnancy crisis centers, and all the other nonprofits around the
(20:25):
country that are doing great work to help people without
government intervention. So there's a multiprome platform that I would
run on that would be consistent with the Declaration of Independence,
the Bill of Rights, and the rest of the Constitution.
So I'm excited about the possibility of doing this. Not
only doing it, but I would run a virtual campaign.
(20:46):
We have zoom. I could zoom into every Republican group
in the country and say, listen, we've tried it the
big government way for decades, for more than a century.
Why don't we go back to the roots of our
country the pens and next year is a two hundred
and fifth anniversary, and people should read the Declaration of
Dependence because it outlines the grievances by the colonists against
(21:09):
King George. We can do the same thing right now, gentlemen.
We have the same grievances or worse than what the
colonists had back two hundred and fifty years ago, because
we have a federal reserve, we have a military industrial complex,
we have a welfare state, we have the income tax,
we have all the trappings of the things that colonists
revolted against. And I'm not calling for a revolt. I'm
(21:31):
calling for an ideological change in this country, back to
our roots, which would increase wealth, prosperity, reduce poverty, and
create peace.
Speaker 1 (21:42):
Not only of the slogan could be it's more than
a cup of tea. Yeah, absolutely absolutely.
Speaker 3 (21:50):
I'm going to give everyone a seven course meal with
a lais fair economy.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
By the way, I think you're a lot more. I
think you have a much better chance than the guy
that was born in Kenya. Let's put it that way,
and he won.
Speaker 3 (22:08):
Well, see, this is what I would need to do.
I would need to get on every podcast there is
from Joe Rogan, which is the top podcast, to everyone
in the top one hundred, if you will, because I
need to reach tens of millions of Americans, and the
way we can do so is through podcasts like yours.
(22:28):
Are really welcome the opportunity to get the message out
to your listeners. And the other thing we're going to
do is.
Speaker 1 (22:37):
We have the.
Speaker 3 (22:39):
Make Americans Financial in Dependent brand coming out next month.
It's gonna be available online. There'll be the green and
white cap, which is the original one with a little
tweak to it, and then there'll be a black one
with gold lettering because to reflect the fact that the
gold is the premiere money in society. And so we're
gonna have those two hats available next next month. And
(23:00):
I'm hoping that we build up our sub stack to
one hundred thousand by the end of the year, which
is a big hold. But here's here's the real big hole.
A million strong by July fourth, twenty twenty six. If
we if I have a million sub subscribers and many
of them buy the hat. We can get this concept
(23:21):
across the country, make Americans financial independent, because I don't
know anyone any parent who teaches their kids not to
be financially independent when they're growing up. I was taught
by my parents, go to school, get an education, and
have a career. That's what I did from the time
I was sixty years old. Went to school in PS
(23:41):
ninety one in the Bronx, the Junior High School seventy nine,
the Bronx High School of Science, Hunt The College, Lehman College,
then Rutgers I went. I got an education from nineteen
fifty three to nineteen eighty one and got my PhD,
which allowed me to have the career I wanted, which
is teaching college being in the ninety in eighty five.
So I'm an example of find something that you really
(24:06):
love to do, whether it's teaching, whether it's podcasting, whether
it's clothing, whether it's whatever. Whatever there is. There's so
many opportunities in America today. Find out what you're really
love to do and do it and you'll have a
successful life ahead.
Speaker 4 (24:21):
Mike, you know, and I wanted to ask, Mari, will
there be a component of what you might call on
Lincolning America. I've read your colleagues books, the Lorenzo. Yeah,
it seems to me that the real kink, or one
of the real kinksent our system, is that the states
are virtually powerless.
Speaker 3 (24:42):
Yeah. Absolutely, Yeah, that's another point. I'm glad you brought
that up. Michael. I would say that the reason we
have this mess that we have today is because we're
not following the Tenth Amendment, which states very clearly, if
it's not authorized by the Constitution, it reversed in the states,
and the people that would put the federal government un
noticed that if we really want to have a cohesive nation,
(25:07):
which is difficult given all the different ideologies that are
out there, we need to decentralized. So if California wants
to subsidize abortion, that's up to them. If Louisiana wants
to abolish abortion, that's up to them. If people want
to have their Second Amendment rights protected in various states,
that's fine. But you cannot violate people's fundamental rights that
(25:30):
are in the Bill of Rights because that's applicable to
the states as well. So this is an opportunity for
us those believe who believe in freedom and limited government
and constitutional republic to make our voices heard. This guy
Amdami in New York City is a disgrace Ideologically he
may be a wonderful person, but ideologically, how could you
(25:52):
believe in socialism today? When we saw the Soviet Union
collapse with for our eyes now he was probably what
he was too years old when that happened. So he
has to get some videotape of the Soviet Union collousing
and the Berlin World, Berlin World coming down. And I
visited Cuba. I saw the difference between whatever free enterprise
(26:13):
they had and the government run stores they had. The
government run stores in Cuba is a throwback to the
nineteenth century stores in the Wild West where even stores,
yet even those stores were better supplied than the government
stores in Cuba today. I mean, we were there about
twelve years ago, and it's just amazing that Cuba, ninety
(26:36):
miles from Florida, should be a natural trading partner of
the United States and should be the premier tourist destination
for Americans. And it's because of this failed ideology of
socialism that they're clinging on to a concept that Niss
demolished in his nineteen twenty two book called Socialism, for
(26:58):
which he should have won a Nobel Prize. When you
show it's impossible to have a socialist economy because you
cannot calculate profits and losses, which is the essence of
a free market economy.
Speaker 1 (27:09):
Marie, there's there's youtub's right now showing what it is
like to walk around, just walk around Havana. Yea, you
have beautiful colonial you know, Spanish colonial architecture. That's you know, deteriorated.
Walls are collapsed, there's no paint. The streets are full
of garbage.
Speaker 3 (27:26):
You know.
Speaker 1 (27:26):
People have phones and you know, headphones on and they're
just showing you, like, you know, the streets of Havana.
I could just picture at night how dangerous it is
walking out of a building there for anybody, whether it's
a woman or man, you know. And people are like, oh, yeah,
the Cubans they get free health care, right, they get
(27:46):
free health care. You know, in America we gotta pay
for it. Well, no, I want to touch on that
thing you just mentioned a little while ago. You said
thirty percent of the people don't pay income text. Now,
is that the top end or the bottom end of Americans?
Speaker 3 (27:59):
Who that's the BUTTEF. The Tax Foundation had a breakdown
from data from the IRS showing who pays the income tax.
And I think the top ten percent pay like seventy
percent of the income tax. So again, if we believe
in equality, there's certainly a skew when it comes to
paying the income tax. And so I don't have those
figures in front of me. But when I saw those numbers,
(28:22):
I said, every time Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren AOC
talk about wealthy people paying their fair share, I'm tempted
to get up my sixth hour and say, listen, read
the data from the IRS. The people who pay the
bulk of the income tax are in the top ten
percent of income earnest.
Speaker 1 (28:41):
But you know what they say at that point, Murray,
they say.
Speaker 8 (28:44):
Well, they are tax shelters. There's well, that's in the
tax law. They could use whatever the tax law is
to make deductions. If you're driving the car you have
a lease. You know, people are so dumb, I mean
because they don't want to educate them in American schools.
Speaker 1 (28:59):
You know that. So to them it's like, well, you know,
they don't pay any tax. No, what they're doing is
they're taking advantage of whatever the tax law is. Now,
how many messages are in the tax law? Was it
four thousand pages today?
Speaker 3 (29:11):
Oh? I think it's longer than that. It's a monstrosity.
I mean, how taxes shouldn't be more difficult to pay
than it is to pay your what cell phone bill?
Or your cable bill? I mean, the interesting thing about
the tax code right now, I think I just read
that seventy or eighty percent of the American people take
(29:32):
the standard of deduction, so they filled out that their
taxes are basically on what is essentially a postcard, but
they don't have to itemize. And so the tax code
had become a political football since it was introduced in
nineteen fourteen, after the sixteen A Member was passed in
nineteen thirteen. And you look at the rates on taxes,
they go up and down, up and down, up and down.
(29:52):
And again this shows you how dysfunctional Washington is, where
they can't have a tax that is that is the
same throughout history, but they use it for political purpose,
and they claim for economic purpose as well. But the
point is, I'm calling to the end of the income text,
(30:13):
which I did in my first book, Tax for two thousand,
which is a roadmap to create a tax for society
in twenty first.
Speaker 1 (30:18):
Sentday signing better and better. Before we go to our
commercial break, where do you get the hat?
Speaker 3 (30:24):
Well, it's going to be available soon at the mesis
dot org store. They have Mesi's hats and I just
did an arrangement with them. The hats are being produced
right now. I guess the hats come have to come
from China because guess what. When I got the invoice
for the hats, there's a dollar per hat tariff on it.
(30:44):
So I'm eating. I'm eating. I'm eating that tariff. I'm
not passing it along to the Mesa's institute to sell
the hats, so it's lowering my profit margin on that calla.
Speaker 1 (30:58):
We got on the hat green there's.
Speaker 3 (31:01):
Green with white lettering green for money, and then we
have a black hat with gold lettering gold being the
preeminent money.
Speaker 1 (31:07):
Very good, very good, Oh gosh, this is fantastic. And
you know, Murray, a lot of good ideas on how
to run for president. And it's cost effective too, which
is part of your platform being cost effective and saving
you know, how do we get out of there? Let
me ask you a question. Let's say you win. We'll
take a hypothetically you're going to win, and what do
you do your first six months? Do you put terroiffs
(31:29):
on everybody? Is that what you do? You can tell everybody, Hey, listen,
we need a little bit more war.
Speaker 3 (31:34):
Well, here's the thing, is if the Supreme Court, because
it has to go to the Supreme Courts, because I
don't think they they ruled on if you're born in
an US occupation zone, are you you have birth right citizenship? Now,
the Supreme Court ruled or at least the course of
rule that John McCain, who was born in Panama Canal,
(31:54):
his parents obviously were American citizens. So even though he
wasn't born in America, he is a US. So neither
of my parents were you are citizens because they were
They were from Poland when I was born in nineteen
forty six. So I would be the oldest president elected,
the oldest individual elected president, and the first Jewish president.
And we need a Jewish president desperately because I can
(32:17):
run the government wholesale as supposed to retail the way
he's been done in Martina.
Speaker 1 (32:23):
All right, now, I got to ask you a big question.
You opened up Pandora's box.
Speaker 3 (32:28):
Yeah, will you be will you.
Speaker 1 (32:29):
Be supporting all this crap that Trump's doing in regards
to the Middle East? I doubt it.
Speaker 3 (32:35):
No. I mean, you know what, we need a Jewish president,
need somebody to bring Ntanyau back to the White House
and say, listen, the United States foreign policy is not
Israel's foreign policy. It's America first foreign policy, which means
protecting our borders. And if you have any beef with
your neighbors, you've got to sit down with them in
neutral place like Switzerland or wherever and hash out your
(32:57):
disagreement with them. And the other point I would is,
if Iran shouldn't have a nuclear weapon, and they on
record as not wanting a nuclear weapon, why does Israel
have at least eighty nukes in their arsenal? And so
we need to we need No one's talking about Israel's nukes,
which is really amazing. This is this is a subject
that is taboo in the media. No one is allowed
(33:20):
to talk about Israel's nukes. And Israel was the was
the country the first country to introduce nukes into the
Mid East, which we know is a destabilizing approach to
foreign policy in your region.
Speaker 1 (33:34):
Wow, that is very good statement. You know, Mandy Pittamkin
is out on record now, you know the actor right right,
he's really pissed off about Bebe because he says, you know,
he's he's he's really putting the target on almost every
Jews back around the world with his policy. And you know,
this guy, I don't know. To me, this guy's just
I call him Satan Yahoo. This guy's got such evil
(33:56):
I mean, you know, you just can't you can't say
that this is my neighbor and I want to annihilate
or level this.
Speaker 3 (34:03):
Look just last.
Speaker 1 (34:04):
Week in Syria, more bombing going on goal On Heights, Lebanon.
How do you say we want to make a peace
deal when there's you know, almost nobody left to make
the peace deal with.
Speaker 3 (34:14):
You know, Well, here's something that someone wrote on substack
who writes about foreign policy, which is true. What if
the people in Gaza were Jews and the Palestinians controlled
what is now Israel, and they were trying to and
the Jews and Godza felt they were being oppressed by
the Palestinians who controlled Israel, a Palestine as it would
(34:36):
probably be called, what would the world's reaction be to
Jews being bombed in Gaza, if the tables would turn.
And I think that that probably no one wants to
answer that question because it speaks volumes about the double
standard we have regarding the Palestinians. And it's not anti
Semitic to criticize the government of Israel. It Israel has
(35:00):
a government. We know, all governments are violent, That's been
through throughout history, and so the Israeli government is no
different than any other government, except they claim that they're
surrounded by hostile people and therefore they need to protect
themselves using extraordinary means, like in Gaza. I mean, I've
(35:22):
seen pictures of Gaza and it looks no different than
Germany after World War Two. Everything is destroyed, and the
American taxpayer is going to help a payment for the
rebuilding of gods.
Speaker 1 (35:34):
I think very much. So, you know, you know, he
came here, and right after he came here, you know,
we're supposed to have the peace president. He hands this paper, Murray,
he hands his paper to Trump that he's nominating for
the Nobel Prize. I mean, this is like doctor Death,
you know, handing this paper to Trump, who's grinning ear
to ear he should get a Nobel Prize for death,
(35:57):
not for peace. I mean, come on, you know, like
you said, there was no reason to go after Iran
and do what he did. You know, there's no real
proof to the fact that what they would doing or
what they had. And by the way, if they're surrounded
by people with all these news, certain they have some too.
I mean it's fair play then, right.
Speaker 3 (36:16):
Well, and the other thing is Ukraine is not getting rearmed.
I mean Trump is rearming Ukraine. Our supply of armaments
are being depleted, and so we're basically in a two
front war here without any declaration from Congress. And so
this is why people have called the presidency in modern
(36:39):
times under both Republics and Democrats, the imperial presidency. And
so we need to get away from having an imperial
presidency and having a constitutional republic once again, which means
constant consultation between the president and the Congress. And that's
what I would advocate as president, saying I have no
desire to make policy unilaterally if I get to the
(37:02):
point where I would be elected, which again is mentally
a long shot, especially with the citizenship aspect. But the
point is you've got to start somewhere and educate the
American people that we are on this road under the
political establishment of Washington, which is harming future generations with debt,
(37:24):
with money printing, and be stabilizing parts of the world
with our intervention. And we need to have Diplomacy is
the foremost part of state crift, not dropping bombs on people.
You know.
Speaker 1 (37:42):
Trump doesn't let anybody do diplomacy. I mean, Rubio is
just to figure him, let's say, but there's got to
be somebody, you know, Mike and I go around people
in the State Department over the years, there's people that
could have talks, you could have back channels, you know.
But Trump, he puts Rubio in a room like a
little kid, you know, on a high chair, and then
he's talking all about you know, the the foreign policy.
(38:04):
Rubio should be able to do that with his people.
You know, remember the Sykes Pico agreement which the Brits
did with the Middle East. They're trying to do now.
I just saw it this morning, Murray. They're trying to
do something like that in regards to Ukraine. Break it up.
You know, drawer line, red line, gray line, whatever it
may be. Give RuSHA this, you take this and so
(38:24):
on and so forth. Those those agreements turned out to
be negative. They were not positive.
Speaker 4 (38:30):
You know.
Speaker 1 (38:31):
They cut they cut barriers, they made demarcations. We don't
need more Sykes Pico. We need reality. And reality is
this is their land, that's your land. And if you
claim this, that's fine. But let these people hash it out.
And it may not be the un which is you know,
that's another whole debacle. But you know, like you say,
you go to Switzerland, go to the Bahamas, go somewhere,
(38:54):
you know what I mean to go somewhere, spend four
or five days hash it out. Got you got camp, David.
You got to deal right now with mosquitos. You know,
you have mosquitoes. They would love to have some people
to eat. You know.
Speaker 3 (39:05):
Well, that's why Mesis wrote about foreign policy in many
of his writings, and he said, the best way to
have peaceful relations among people of different ethnicities and nationalities
is to have a plebiscite where people would vote who
they want to with, whom they want to affiliate with.
And that's exactly the way it should be done in
the Mid East, that's the way it should be done
(39:25):
in Ukraine. And just have peaceful relations because Ukraine is
virtually destroyed. I mean a good portion of the country
is just non existent, and so the American tax pay
is going to fund more building of Ukraine. I mean,
what busted. I mean, We're gonna have a two trillion
dollar deficit this year, a two trillion dollar deficit probably
(39:47):
next year. And the numbers are staggering. And so anyone
who thinks that tariffs of the answer is probably smoking
some funny little cigarettes in their study or whatever.
Speaker 1 (39:58):
Medical now you could get it, you get it free
with the doctor Mario. Is this the first show you
announced that you want to run for president?
Speaker 3 (40:05):
Well, I announced it on Joe Sansone show on July fourth.
Then I was on Adam Troit's podcast a week or so,
a week and a half or so ago. And this
is the third show that I'm mentioning this, and I
put it on my substack the other day as well,
and I'm just going to keep on staying to people listen.
I'm not doing this for any personal benefit because this
(40:28):
is my last rodeo. I mean, Trump and I are
the same age, and I've had a wonderful career teaching
finance for thirty five years. The question is what do
I do after a teaching career, And given my activity
in politics in New Jersey, I said, even though I
didn't win anything, I affected public policy when I ran
for governor in nineteen ninety seven. So even if I
(40:51):
don't come anywhere near winning, I would bring to the
attention to the American people what's gone wrong and what
the solutions are. That's how you run a campaign. You
don't call people names, You just talk about here is
where we are today, here's how we got here, and
here's how we make things better for everybody except the
people who want to live off of Washington. I eat
(41:12):
the tax payer.
Speaker 4 (41:14):
Go ahead, Michael, Yeah, Murray. The other thing that always
bothers me. We were a people who were founded on
the writings of Cato of Trenchhart and I can't remember
the other fellow's name, but one of the lessons they
taught was what we're living through at the moment is
(41:34):
the danger of a standing military that becomes a source
of disruption in the country through the money they spend,
through the actions they take. And I can't think of
something that needs more reform. I don't want to say
(41:55):
Americans shouldn't love their soldiers, But as the colonel always says,
there's a lot of difference between the soldier who joins
up for a career and one who's drafted. And I
don't you know, I don't quite exactly know how I
would try to fix that. But you know, the idea
that we have forty four or five star generals for
a two million man military, and we had four in
(42:19):
World War Two when we had twelve million people under
the flag. So I don't know, what do you what
do you think about that?
Speaker 3 (42:28):
Well, here's where you need to do. Quote an audit,
a full audit of what is the optimal military, optimal
sized military we need to defend the country. And David
Stockman has written about this in his writings about submarine
based nukes surrounding the country, aircraft carriers surrounding the country,
(42:51):
and having the land based missiles and having a military
because we are protected by two oceans and we have
two friendly neighbors to the north and south, so no
one's going to invade us. The problem is Russia has
hypersonic missiles, China may probably have them as well, and
so they could reach us pretty quickly. That's why it's
(43:12):
so dangerous. With Trump and the EU is a NATO
are doing in Ukraine by arming them to the teeth.
And now what if Ukraine gets missiles to fire into
Moscow and Saint Petersburg, Then we're then we're talking about
a whole new ball game, and that would be crossing
the red line for World War three, where Russia would
then probably lob some nukes into Western Europe or even
(43:35):
in the United States. So we are entering very dangerous territory.
And we need to make the case that peace is
the natural order of things, that war is the opposite
of the natural order of things. And if we believe
in the natural order of things, then we have to
have diplomacy and settle our differences through negotiations as opposed
(43:56):
to dropping thirty thousand pound bombs.
Speaker 1 (44:00):
Laurie I think the European Union has a death wish.
It's either the death wish or it's like all wars,
when your economy goes bad, we go to war, right yep.
Speaker 3 (44:15):
Well, that's what happened in nineteen forty one, after a
decade of depression, that Roosevelt maneuvered us into World War two,
first with the boycott of the Japanese and again, Trump
is now talking about increasing the boycott on Russia of
anyone who buys from Russia will be tariff enormously. So
(44:38):
our head should be exploding for what Trump is trying
to do with tariffs, to try to do diplomacy or
a non diplomacy to tariffs, and it creates conflict that
the tariff's our history, of course conflict, and that lesson
apparently hasn't been learned by Trump Navarro.
Speaker 1 (44:54):
And that's what I forgot to mention on the show
today with you. I wanted to get your opinion. You know,
his problem is loyalty. NAVARROO went to jail. So now
Navarro is a genius on the economy. You know, if
Navarro puts his finger in the wind blows that way,
that's the economy.
Speaker 3 (45:10):
You know.
Speaker 1 (45:11):
This is by the way, I just want to say
this on this show, we never say FDR. We say
Saint FDR. You know, he's canonized in the American Ice, you.
Speaker 3 (45:22):
Know, oh yeah, yeah, I mean he did so much damage.
We're coming up to the ninetieth anniversary of Social Security
and then coming up to the sixtieth anniversary of Medicare
and Medicaid. I mean we have all these mega programs
that have no constitutional basis, that are financially unsustainable, and
yet people think they're the greatest things in slice spread.
(45:44):
And this is another example that Michael talked about, is
that people are willing are willing to take responsibility for
their lives. I learned at a young age because I
saw my father go to work, work eight ten hours
a day, drive a cab on the weekends, provide for
a spam lead, not had to go on welfare or
anything like that. And so saving was a part of
(46:06):
their culture, the part of their worldview, and so that
was instilled in me. And so when I started working
at the college, I saved the maxim I could into
a four to one K for thirty five years. And
that's why I'm very comfortable today having a substantial IRA
that I draw down from in order to pay my expenses.
And that's what generation well, that's yeah, I mean, unfortunately,
(46:31):
there are too many people who are living paycheck to paycheck,
and it was a reflection of the Federal Reserve increasing
prices which make it very difficult for families to make
their ends meet. And then the other problem is which
of course is very bolton to say is that people
are having truer when they can afford to raise them financially,
and that's a real problem in the country, and so
(46:54):
you can't even talk about that, probably on mainstream media.
So we need to get back to basic financial, personal
and national economics. And if we do that, I think
will be in great shape.
Speaker 4 (47:08):
Yep, we're down in the last minute, Mike, go ahead. Yeah,
I just I tend to think that we've made World
War two when the Depression into a cult. Oh absolutely,
and no one really you know, Tom Brokaw has been
doing all of this, and you know, to call the
World War two demonstrator generation the greatest generation in America
(47:33):
is really a stretch for me. When you think about
the Revolutionary War, both armies, and the Civil War, just
even the French and Indian Wars. Those are amazing generations.
And I don't want to take anything away from the
people who fought, they risked their lives what they were
told was our liberty.
Speaker 3 (47:52):
Yeah, I mean, world War two, it never should have happened.
World War two happened because of World War One. Well,
and Franklin Roosevelt, Yeah, I mean, and the Great Depression
and the trade wars, during World War Two, during the thirties,
because of the depression, nations basically put up walls against
trade and it was a disaster of an absolute disaster.
(48:15):
And the boycotts that FDR did against against Japan, that's
economic warfare, that's a.
Speaker 1 (48:25):
That's a declaration of warry. That's exactly what he did.
Speaker 3 (48:29):
Again.
Speaker 1 (48:29):
People, by the way, Japan is walking away from us now,
they're starting to look at us like, Okay, enough is enough.
You know, Trump's the psychopath. I don't know how far
we get down the road this year in twenty twenty five,
were already in July. But if this keeps up, you know,
we're going to have to check him out for the
cognitive results. Maybe somebody's got to do a little bit
of tap on the shoulder and say listen, either sit
(48:52):
in the seat or you know, go take the test
because it's not looking good. Gentlemen, Hey, Mury, thanks so
much for coming on.
Speaker 4 (48:58):
Appreciate it great, Thank you for coming back.
Speaker 1 (49:01):
Hey, we want to thank Mary Sabran of Mesa's Institute.
Don't forget you're gonna want to listen to that debate.
Mariy Sabran, have a great week.
Speaker 3 (49:07):
Thank you. Sir, thank you, thanks gaming,
Popular Podcasts
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.