Ep17: Have No Fear, God is Here!

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Richard and Pat discuss the common emotions of fear and anxiety that most of us deal with throughout our lives. They talk about the harmful effect that it has on us, and how putting our trust in Him, and reminding ourselves of His faithfulness can give us the life of peace, joy, and boldness that He intended for us to live.  

Episode Transcript

Pat (00:23):
And welcome to the two Unlikely Christians podcast.
I am recovering Slacker, patMcCool and comedian.
And now across the AtlanticOcean to the beautiful British
Isles to the man who once stoleDavid Beckham's first girlfriend
at Aland and Rave, just to provethat he could renowned

(00:45):
psychotherapist and addictionspecialist Richard Turrell.

Rich (00:49):
Thanks, pat.
What an intro man.
I mean, like, just for likecontext.
Um, and this may be hard tobelieve, yeah.
But back in the nineties whenDavid Beckham was, you know,
making his, his splash, um, andappearing on the, on the scene,
I, I was not in a position to bestill in anyone's girlfriend.
You know, it's, it may be hardto believe Pat, but actually

(01:11):
back then I wasn't, I wasn'tthat cool.
Which, which,

Pat (01:14):
which makes it more amazing that you did.
Yes.

Rich (01:19):
Yes,

Pat (01:20):
pat.
Yeah.
That's my, that's my story andI'm sticking with it.
That's

Rich (01:23):
your, that's your reality, pat.
Yes.
I live in

Pat (01:25):
my world, Richard.

Rich (01:28):
Yeah.
My role is to understand yourreality and not force mine on
you, you know?
So, however, distorted ordisturbed that that may be, so,
yeah.
Yeah.
But none.

Pat (01:41):
It's all working for me.
So, uh, the, you know, Ipanicked, uh, just a minute ago
because, or what, so you guysfall back in time.

Rich (01:53):
The, yeah, we fell back in time.
Yellow box went back.
Yeah.
Yeah.

Pat (01:59):
Well that's what happens.
You know, I mean, we pop it backin hour.
Oh,

Rich (02:03):
it's simple lock.

Pat (02:07):
I'm in the bathroom and my wife yells at me and she says,
does England.
Change their time like we do.
'cause if not, you better get upinto the studio'cause you're
about to be late.
And I went into full fledgedpanic.
'cause I didn't know if you, theguys did the same thing We did.

Rich (02:21):
Yeah.
We traveled back in time.
I, I tense traveled back intime.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Are, are you, are

Pat (02:25):
you a fan of going, are you a fan of the darker days or the
lighter days?

Rich (02:30):
Well, there's an argument, right, that they, so they, the,
the time change is supposedly tosupport farmers, right?
So they get more, more light atthe start of the day.
But I'm not a farmer.
So what that means is that itgets dark much earlier or an
hour earlier.
And then obviously it continuesto get earlier and earlier as we

(02:51):
progress into the winter.
So I don't love it.
I'm not someone that.
Deals amazingly.
You know, I, I prefer havingmore sunshine.
It's better for my mentalhealth.
Um, so, but it is what it is,isn't it?
You know?
Um, it is what it is.
You can't do too much about it.

Pat (03:07):
I didn't think of the mental health, but I like it the
darker the days that, that'sgood for me.
The sooner it can get dark, Ican close the curtains, pop up
in the bed.
I'm, I'm more the, I'm the onlyperson I know that's like this,
but, but I literally like, andthe whole moving the time up to
give farmers more time makeszero sense because the farmer
just has to get up when the suncomes up.

(03:30):
The, we have a saying over here,it's called, I work from CAN to
canned.
Or in the south we say can.
Can, can, we're working, can tocan't.
But you get up in the morningwhen, so what difference, what
the clock says, the sun comes,you have the same amount of
daylight.

Speaker 3 (03:48):
Yeah.
Just

Pat (03:48):
get up.
Don't say, well this, thedaylight, if they would move
that time back, I would go aheadand get up an hour earlier.
So the whole thing that make anysense.
But I, I am one of the fewoutliers that, uh, you know, I
got a little Dracula in me, Iguess.

Rich (04:01):
Yeah, well, thinking about it as well, and I, I know that
obviously I'm, you know, it'snot uncommon for me on this
podcast to poke a little bit offun at the, the culture, uh,
that you live in.
But, but in that part of, youknow, having spent time in
Mississippi when we, as youknow, pat, when we met.
Actually the summers for youguys are like, they're, they're
pretty unpleasant, you know,like with the, like the humidity

(04:21):
and typhoons and you know, andall this kinda stuff.
So like, I can actuallyunderstand the attraction of
winter.
Whereas here, like our weathergoes and we actually had quite a
nice summer, you know, summer,we can really enjoy summer here,
you know, for the, for the mostpart.
So I can't understand whywouldn't are.
Um, and darker and cooler may bea little more attractive to you
than it is to us.

Pat (04:44):
Seven degrees.
I just don't like it gettingdark at eight, you know, eight
or eight 30.
I like to go ahead and slide upin the rack.
So, uh, anyway, let's get on toour topic and, welcome to
everyone that's joining us andtoday, we want to talk about,
have no fear.
God is near, but.
Because I believe the majorityof people go through life
anxious.

(05:04):
They go through life with fear.
They go through life.
You're always expectingsomething bad to happen.
God didn't make us to live thatway.
He gave us everything we need totrust him.
He's shown us all through ourlives, to trust him over and
over again.
And this is an important thingfor people to master, to live a
much better life.

(05:25):
As I said once before, fear notis said over and over in the
Bible that God tells us to fearor not.
It is not said 365 times, whichI said in an earlier episode.
I should have researched thatbecause as.
Albert Einstein once postedonline that half of what you
read on the internet is justmade up.

(05:46):
So, uh, 365 times is not true,but it's 74 times in the King
James version to be exact.
But there's a reason that it hassaid over and over and over, and
if you pause with me one second.

(06:08):
But it's said so many timesbecause fear is the opposite of
faith and learning to trust Godin all aspects of our lives.
One of the most important thingswe can do to live a life of
peace and joy and the repetitiveverses are there to offer
reassurance and emphasize thatGod is in control always present
in our lives.
As he says in Isaiah 41 10, Godsays, do not fear for I am with

(06:30):
you.
Do not.
Be dismayed for.
I am your God, right there.
He's saying, do not fear.
I'm your God.
I'm always with you.
What are your thoughts on that,

Rich (06:42):
rich?
I mean.
It's hard, isn't it?
I mean, I find it hard to be,you know, to live in completely,
not to live by faith alone.
I, I met this woman, but I wasat church a couple of weeks ago
and they had a, a lady who wasleading a mission in Guatemala.
And the mission itself, it wasworking with kids from, you

(07:05):
know, hard backgrounds.
Um, and the mission itself wasfunded by a charity, but she,
her presence over there, herliving situation, her housing,
her food, her water, herelectricity was not, was not
funded.
And, and she lived entirely onfaith, you know, so like,
somehow for the whole durationof her time over there, she'd

(07:27):
been over there for some years.
Uh, she was.
Everything that they needed hadto like, come to them somehow.
You know, like, and, and youknow, the house had turned up,
the, you know, money for thishad turned up, money for that
had turned up.
You know, like, so she, shelived, she lived completely on
faith.
Right.
And I just thought that was soamazing.
You know, like, you know, liketo be able to do that is really,

(07:49):
you know, is something I I, I, Idon't embody, you know, but, um.
You know, that kind of absenceof fear and that the presence of
that kind of faith I foundincredibly inspiring.
I think that you look at thedisciples, you know, and the
boat when the storm blows up,you know, and um, and Jesus just

(08:09):
quiets the storm.
And I, I think that's themetaphor for what we're talking
about really, is that like, ifwe've got that faith, then the
storm, it doesn't have to be ascary thing.
It doesn't have to be a scarything.
Um, and you know, like I, andwhat I try and do more so, and
sometimes I better at thanothers, but when there's

(08:31):
uncertainty, so, you know, wewent through a bit of an
uncertain period in my, my homerecently where my other half
was, um, no, her, her employmentsituation became quite unstable.
You know, and actually what Iwas able to do and she was able
to do, and we were able toprompt the other two do it when,

(08:51):
you know, when we were, youknow, maybe one or one of us was
struggling with it, is justlike, do you know what, it's
okay.
You know, like, we'll, we'll beokay, you know, we'll be
provided for.
And, um, and actually thingshave, you know, have turned out.
For the good.
Very much so.
But yeah, so basically, what amI saying?
I, I don't find it a really easything to do every single moment
of every single day.

(09:11):
But it is, you know, having thatfaith and not, uh, being, you
know, dominating with anxietyabout what might happen and what
might not happen or what couldhappen or what's gonna happen,
you know?
I do have something to likereturn to, I can return to my
faith.
You know, I can remind myself,oh, okay, it's all right.
It's gonna be okay.
Gonna be okay.
You know?

(09:31):
So those are initial thoughts.
Patrick, comment emanating frommy, the large brain that you
believe that I have.

Pat (09:41):
South of Hadrian's Wall and you brought up a point that I
didn't really think about'causeI'm kind of, I always try to
relate things back into my life.
The woman you're talking about.
We kind of had no choice.
Mm-hmm.
You know, maybe, I mean, I'vebeen in situations when my, in
my life when I had no choice.

(10:05):
So it, you know, it's, it couldpossibly be that we, we turn and
completely trust God.
When we don't really have anychoice, but the more comfortable
our lives get, maybe the easierwe get, the more these fears we
pop up in, you know, that we popup into our head.
Because if this one, this womandoesn't have any choice, she's
not over there just making up anirrational fear that they may

(10:26):
not have, uh, food or they,because they may not, she
doesn't know where it's comingfrom.
She's just literally having to,to trust God to provide, and he
does it over and over again, andthen when he does it over and
over again, it solidifies you.
That's what's happened in mylife.
In my life.
We'll talk in a minute.

(10:46):
The, um, the more he's done it.
The more you've seen it happen,the more it gets into your, into
your mind, the more it gets intoyour heart that you know God is
there.
But it's one of the mostdifficult things that we do in
life.
I don't know if it's humannature.
I don't know if it's just Satanthat's attacking us doing this.
I don't know where the fear camefrom.

(11:08):
Um, but it's a real thing thateverybody has and if they can
learn to master that, you canlive in a lot better peace.
I know I am in.
Far, far better shape than Iused to be in that regard,'cause
of what I've learned.
Is there any kind of clinicalaspect do you see in your
practice?
You know, when you're talking topeople with addictions and in
therapy where they, they'reafraid of things or scared?

(11:29):
I, you know, I know it's not aspiritual thing, but do, do you
see where fear plays into?
Into people's lives that, that,you know, might affect them in
addiction, might affect them in,in some of the problems they're
having in their lives.

Rich (11:43):
I mean, yeah, for sure.
There's so many different waysto slice that up.
So, I mean, if you come fromthat 12 step kind of aa na
perspective, you know what, youknow, I've heard addiction
referred to as a fear-basedillness, you know, um, there's a
bit in the Narcotics Anonymousliterature where it talks about.
You know, when you strip back,uh, the symptoms of the disease

(12:04):
of addiction, what you'll findunderneath is a swamp of
self-centered fear.
So it's revert, you know, fearthat's all based around the
self.
I won't have, what about, youknow, what, what about me?
You know, I'm not gonna get whatif this happens to me?
You know?
So, yeah, I mean, fear plays amassive role in it.
I mean, when people are carryingtrauma, they often, they will

(12:24):
project or distort theirreality.
And see things differentlybecause of their past
experiences.
And so things might appearscarier than they really are.
Um, you know, anxiety is, itgoes hand in hand with, with a,
with addiction, you know,anxiety, you know, anxiety,

(12:45):
depression, and addiction.
They're also.
You know, closely kind ofentwined and come along
together.
And for some people they're me.
They might be medicating theanxiety or the depression.
For other people, the anxietyand depression is purely a re
you a much more purely a resultof their addiction and the
impact that it has on the brain,so on and so forth.

(13:05):
So like yeah, it's like it is,it's, it is live in the therapy
room for sure.
From a cognitive behavioralperspective.
You would perhaps sit withsomeone and get them to like,
analyze their fears, start tothink about them, you know, how
likely is this gonna happen?
Has it happened before?
What evidence do you have thatthis is gonna happen?
And there may be some evidencethat it's gonna happen, but
there's probably lots ofevidence that it won't.

(13:28):
So yeah, fear, I mean like fear,anxiety, all of those things.
Definitely kind of very muchalive and, and present in the,
in the therapy room for sure.

Pat (13:43):
Followers of Jesus are equipped with something to, to
overcome that fear and wipe outthat fear.
'cause I've all it, it justseems like most everything we
fear is actually irrational.
You know, 99% of the things youthought were going to go, or
probably even more don'tactually happen, but we bring up
fear in our mind.

(14:03):
We create a lot of it.
It's like I, I remember when Ifirst became, I.
A comedian, uh, you know, I hadthe fear of public speaking just
like everybody else, and forwhatever reason, think about the
fear of public speaking.
I mean, nobody can physicallyhurt you, but we're all, we're
all scared of it.
So it's, to me, that's anirrational fear.

(14:23):
Before I went on stage, the veryfirst time, uh, two weeks, I was
just doing a five minute openmic in front of people that
would never see me again.
Mm-hmm.
It was at a pretty nice club,but.
I was sick to my stomach forlike two weeks.
I wasn't even talking to people.
My daughter looked at my wifeone time, like, what's wrong

(14:44):
with him?
Just leave him alone.
I, I get over to this place, Iget to the hotel and I'm trying
to drink a cup of coffee, and myhand was literally doing that
for people listening.
My hand was just shaking andcoffee was spilling out of the
cup.
I was so, I was so frightened ofthis fear and I, um.

(15:06):
I had spoke, you know, when Iwas in the corporate world for
20 years, I'd had to get up andspeak a lot of times and I was
always nervous about that, butit always worked well.
But I was just very, uh, verynervous about it.
And I get over to the place andI started praying.
I walked in like, God, you know,help me get through this, and.
When they announced my name,when I got back there, it was

(15:28):
kinda like with the handgrenade.
Remember with the hand grenade?
I told you how nervous I was.
I heard the boom and I was like,oh my gosh, I don't know if I
really wanna be John Wayne.
And then when I got the handgrenade in my hand, all of a
sudden this complete calm cameover me.
I'm like, there's no way I'mmessing this up.
Uh, it was the same way all of asudden, a calm.
Came over me.
They announced my name.
I stepped out.
Somebody, a place three and ahalf hours away from me went yay

(15:49):
pat.
Like they knew me.
You know, like I, like I hadfans there and all of a sudden
kinda gave me a calm, I got tothe microphone, my leg was
shaking my right leg, kind ofdoing on an Elvis, you know how
Elvis, you know, gave a littlebit of a.
They obviously couldn't see itbecause the owner of the club
later said, yeah, you lookedreally relaxed, you know, and

(16:10):
you got good stage president.
I'm sitting there thinking I wasmortified, but anyway, I calmed
down, did five minutes, thatplace exploded.
It was almost like God carriedme out onto the stage.
I still refer to it sometimes,like, God, thank you for
carrying me out on that stage.
The point was I was justmortified.
I mean, probably one of thescaredest I've been in my life

(16:30):
to walk up and talk to people.
It was all basically irrational.
I mean, it, it didn't warrantthat kind of fear.
Uh, and, and that's kind of astretch of an analogy for most
people in their lives, but Ithink everything that people
fear in life, most everythingthat they think that they're
constantly worrying about issomething irrational do.

(16:50):
Do you see it that way?
Do you see that it's irrational?

Rich (16:55):
I mean, there's lots of things we can be scared of that
are irrational.
Not all of them, like they, youknow, fears, uh, you know,
emotions evolve.
You know, like they'reevolutionary, you know, like
they all, they serve theirpurpose like anger.
Anger gets a bad rap, butactually anger's what tells us,
like, something's not right.
It's not okay for us.
Our boundaries have beencrossed, but it gets our hand

(17:15):
and becomes problematic, youknow, but we need some anger,
guilt, and shame.
Also get a bad rap.
Not bad.
Actually.
Imagine a world without guiltand shame.
Like when no one had any guilt,no one had any shame.
They're like, uh, their emotionsthat really govern human
behavior, you know?
And if we lived in a guilt isshame in this world.
Then if people would just doexactly what they wanted all the

(17:37):
time, you know, their, you know,their most basic, basic human
animal instincts would, theywould be acting upon them,
right?
So they're important emotions tohave.
And fear is as well, you know,we evolve to feel fear.
Fear, fear of public speaking.
That's about needing to belong.
Like we evolve to belong.

(17:58):
We evolve to be in groups,right?
Like, you know, if we are ingroups, you know, tribes.
Yeah.
Keeping it biblical, right?
If we are in tribes, you know,when the other tribe comes along
or when the, you know, theanimals come along that wanna
try and eat us.
If we are in groups, we have amuch better chance of survival
than if we're an individual.
So we, we, we kind of evolved tobelong.

(18:19):
So that fear that one might feelin public speaking, it's like,
whoa, if I get this wrong.
Yeah.
Or you know, whatever, wrongmen, or if I bomb on stage and
you know, these people are gonnareject me, right?
And if they reject me, thenthey're not part of the group.
So that's why that's very scaryfor people, you know, for, you
know, for many.
Right?
So, I can't remember exactlywhere we started Pat, but like

(18:43):
fit, yes.
Right.
So fear is, fear is fear com acompletely irrational thing?
Not always, you know, but often,you know, often it's irrational,
you know?

Pat (18:56):
Reminded something, uh, when you're saying that because
I think it's fear ofembarrassing yourself.
'cause now that I think about itgoing back to childhood, we all
embarrassed ourselves aschildren.
And you remember how mortifyingthat was when everybody laughed
at you.
Not like happened at you at acomedy club, but when that
happened, boy, that was probablyone of the worst things that
ever happened in your life.

Rich (19:15):
Yeah, I still got.
I still got memory seared intomy brain of those kind of
things, you know, like for sure,like when you're a kid.
Absolutely.

Pat (19:25):
Yeah.
I didn't really think aboutthat.
But the, the fear of the publicspeaking was a little bit of, a
little bit of a side joggle,but, uh, but that is a really
good point.
I didn't really think aboutthat.
But a lot of times we gothrough, we're afraid of.
Uh, of embarrassing ourselves,which is, and I didn't think
about the whole group, the wholegroup thing, but, um, in general
though, people fear things.

(19:46):
They, it, it's financial thingswith family, things going wrong.
And to me, in, in many cases forthe Christian, it's a complete
lack of trust.
God, it's putting your faith inGod and realizing he's there,
realizing he's able to take,he's going to take care of us
and we're going to come throughit.
Okay.

(20:07):
Um, is a way to eliminate thefear or really tamp it down.
And a lot of times fear, in myopinion, can cause problems, uh,
that wouldn't have happened.
I mean, it can also, it cancause us to be deceitful.
You know, even in marriages,things like the fear of
sometimes telling people thetruth, for example.
Um.

(20:29):
One, like in in, in business, asI've mentioned to you before,
you know, when I was in thecorporate world, when I was, I
was a believer in God, but Iwasn't a follower in Jesus and I
was, you know, I wasn't lettingthe Holy Spirit take control of
me, and my thought processwasn't putting my trust in God.
Something came up on a businessdeal.
Boy, whatever it needed to comeoutta my mouth just came out.

(20:52):
And my wife would be like, isthat true?
I'm like, well, not exactly, butit's like, well, you're not
putting your trust in God.
You're thinking that you gottabend the truth to get what
you're trying to get.
Which that, to me, if you'relying in life in any way, shape,
form, or fashion, that is adisplay of a lack of trust in
God, in my opinion.

(21:12):
And it can also lead to thingslike in marriage, not.
Not telling, you know, bad newsabout a child or about, uh, I
don't mean bad, bad news.
I mean, there's just things thatyou hold back or you don't wanna
say, or something that'sfinancial and you hold it back
and then whereas if you justalways told the truth or

(21:34):
upfront, put your faith in Godthat.
Always going to take care ofeverything.
You're going to have that peacebecause when you're being a
little deceitful or you'reholding back information, it's
eventually going to blow up.
It's eventually going to cause aproblem.
And a lot of times the problemof not telling the truth, not
being straightforward is goingto be a lot bigger than what the
original problem was.

(21:56):
Uh, what are your thoughts onthat?

Rich (21:58):
Uh, I agree.
I think we can often be thearchitects of our own doom and
we create, we, we can oftencreate the very thing we're
trying to avoid.
You know, like I, I often comeback to, you know, you'll get a
pattern in relationships wheresay, one partner's very insecure
and like.
You know, frightened of, youknow, that the other partner's
gonna leave them or cheat onthem, or, you know, whatever it

(22:20):
might be.
So that, so the, the frightenedpart, the insecure one, is
constantly, where are you going?
Who are you with?
Dah dah.
Who's that on the phone, youknow?
And.
And then what that does is itactually pushes people away.
And you know, so you can kind ofend up in that serious role.
If I'm being accused of doingall these things, then I might
as well, you know, this is avery simple example.

(22:41):
Um, there's a line, right,that's just in, it's from
Matthew and, um, it's, it echoesthrough my head sometimes when
I'm like, you know, wrapped upand, you know, look, but
financial insecurity is a thingfor me, and it doesn't make any
sense.
It is irrational, you know,without.
You know, like, God, you know,my, in terms of, sorry,

Pat (23:02):
did you say financial insecurity?

Rich (23:04):
Yeah, financial insecurity.
You know, it's like, ah, I'm getkind of bogged down and,

Pat (23:08):
you know.
Well, it's in your brain'causeyou've been there, you've been,
you've been broke.

Rich (23:12):
Yeah, I've been broke and, and you know, and I work for
myself.
And so like you pat, like, youknow, like, you know, one day
the phone might stop ringing.
Right.
But, um, um.
I've

Pat (23:21):
been in, not to cut you off, but I've been in situations
Oh yeah.
That the biggest thing in your,in a person's mind is a fear of
all of a sudden not being ableto provide, not having things.
That's is the point was I've hadexamples over and over and over
where there were moments likethat throughout my life, but God
came through in just theseincredible ways.

(23:42):
Just like you're talking aboutthe woman.
Down in South America over andover, but those fears come from,
it's like being embarrassed as achild.
Those fears come from we havebeen there.

Rich (23:52):
Yeah.
And then the, the, the line ofthe, of scripture that always
echos through my head is like,well, Jesus says the disciples,
are you still so dull?
Are you still so dull?
Right?
It's like, don't you get it yet?
You know, like, it's like, Ibought you this far, right?
Like, don't you get it yet?
Like, you're gonna, you're gonnabe okay.

(24:13):
You know?
And I really believe that.
And, you know, I don't thinkOkay.
Always looks like what we wantit to look like.
Yeah.
But like, I'll be Okay.
A friend of mine, you know, a, aguy, a real kind of old timer
in, in, you know, in my recoveryworld, you know, my 12 step
recovery world and interestingguy, lovely guy.
I spent a lot of time with himover the years and, um, and he

(24:36):
had some.
You know, issues around moneyand stuff is a bit of a
compulsive spender and, and allthat kind of stuff.
But he, he said, when he saidthis beautifully simple thing to
me, and he said, you know, whenI get wrapped up in the fear
around money and I think aboutmy relationship with God, it's
like I've always been lookedafter, right?
They said I might not have hadeverything I wanted, but I've

(24:58):
always had a roof over my head.
I've always had a, been able toget a hot meal and I've always
had somewhere to sleep.
That's it.
You know, and it's like, so it'slike being, you know, whatever
Okay.
Is it might not look like what Iwant it to look like.
You know, it might not have thezeros in it at the end of it,
like I want, but it's like, youlike, it's like, are you still

(25:19):
so dull?
Like, don't you get it?
Yeah.
You know?
And um, it's like, it's havingthat faith.
I've been in John six a bitrecently, right.
And, um.
This, you know, I read it, Ikind of, I got really stuck into
it.
I read it over and over and overagain and it's where like Jesus,
he feeds the 5,000 and then he,you know, he has a little wander
about on the water, sails abouta bit, and the crowds follow

(25:43):
him, right?
And he says to him like,'causethey're like, rabbi, where have
you been?
And teacher, where have youbeen?
You know?
And, and he's like, well, youlike are only here.
I've got it here.
Alright, lemme see if I can justfind it quickly.
They found him on the other sideof the lake.
They said to him, rabbi, whendid you come here?
Jesus answered them very truly.

(26:05):
I tell you, you're looking forme, not because you saw signs,
but because you ate your fill ofthe loaves.
And I really kind of looked intothat, right?
And, and, and kind of meditatedon it, I suppose.
It's like sometimes we, youknow, we, or I, I speak for me
it's like I, I wanna, well I,Jesus must have my back because
look at all these things I'vegot, you know, look at my nice

(26:27):
new house and my, you know, mynice.
And, you know, blah, blah, blah.
Right?
But actually that's not, youknow, having faith in him and,
and knowing it will be allright.
Is it about having faith in him?
Not what he can, might or willdo for us, you know?
But if you've got that faith,you'll be all right.
You know?
I know.
I'll be all right.
It might not be all like I wantit.

(26:48):
But I know that I'll be allright.
And that's, and I think that'swhat it really, when you boil it
down to like its essence, that'swhat this is about, right?
It's like, I don't know whatit's gonna look like, but I know
I don't need to be scared of it,you know?
Um, yeah.
That's what I think.
And I think where we live inthis, like that, you know, I
think the reason we get so, um.

(27:11):
You know, in the, in the, in thewest, maybe we get so focused on
the loaves is'cause we'resurrounded with them.
Right.
We have a lot, you know, we havea lot of loaves and even people.
Of course there's poverty in mycountry.
There's poverty in your country,but our idea of what poverty is,
is, is very different to what itmight be in another country.
Right.
You know, in other parts of theworld.
Right.
And um, and I was reading thisarticle recently.

(27:32):
It was about an African countryand, um, there were these guys,
you know, there was a revolutionin this country.
They locked a lot of people up,a lot of like, uh, people that.
You know, post revolutionbecame, they were like the
enemy, like, you know, they wereon the wrong side of things,
right?
And they locked them all up inthese makeshift cells and like,
you know, they'd have 30 of themin this tiny room, like the size

(27:55):
of them that we're in now.
They didn't even have room tolie down.
They're just in there allsquashed in like side thems.
And they were singing Psalms,you know, that's what they, they
just sung Psalms, you know, likeall, you know, that's what they
lived on.
That kind of faith, you know?
And that's being, you know,that's like, that's living on
faith.
Do you know what I mean?
It's like being willing, youknow, to have that kind of faith

(28:18):
in Jesus.
And it's like, I'll be okay.
Might not be what I want it tobe, but I know that I'll be okay
if I've got faith in Jesus.
You know?
And that, you know, that's, thatcomes up for me talking about
this.

Pat (28:29):
And that's a great way to end it because that's it.
I, again, I think a lot of timesthe more comfortable we have,
the more fears we bring up inour heads.
Exactly That, that we create allthese in our mind.
When God has given us, select awoman in South America, she
didn't have any choice.
She relied on God and alwayshappened.
The reason why I feel like Icould have a little experience
here,'cause I've had moments andI can remember laying down in

(28:52):
the bed going, God, you're all Ihave.
And then a voice came to me, nota loud voice, but I heard this
is all you need.
And I've had many situationswhere I thought, this isn't
gonna work out, and it didn'twork out.
What did work out actuallyturned out to be a lot better.
The main thing is.
God has you.
God is here and he's here in ourlives.

(29:14):
And if you can put your faith,it's not easy to do.
This is what we're talkingabout.
Everybody has it.
Me and you have it.
We just have it a lot lessbecause we put our faith in God
and we're, we're quick to goback to the word of God and
think about the things.
I personally just have such atrack record of him being in my
life and taking care of me andeverything working out good and
most of the time working outeven better.

(29:35):
And like you said.
You're always taken care of.
So, uh, people listening, I justhope you get encouraged by that.
And just remember, just remindyourself of all the times you
were afraid that and somethingdidn't happen.
'cause that goes to everybodythat's listening there.
If you look back on your life,you've been afraid of things
over and over again.
That did not happen, or when itdidn't happen, as we talked

(29:57):
about, um.
It worked out fine.
Yeah.
And all you did was make, allyou did was made yourself
miserable.
And uh, and you're kind ofshowing God you don't fully
trust him.
And the more you show God youtrust him, the more you're going
to feel his peace in your life.
And you can do that and show youtrust him by praying and talking
to him, on a daily basis.

(30:17):
Just fill your head with what hetells us in that instruction
manual called the Bible.
And there are so many verses inthere.
And we will just leave with afew of them.
Joshua one, nine.
Have I not commanded you?
Be strong enough of goodcourage.
Do not be afraid, nor bedismayed for the Lord your God
is with you wherever you go.

(30:38):
Again, he's saying, I am rightthere with you.
It's just up for you to, toacknowledge his presence and
know that everything's takencare of.
John 1427.
Peace.
I leave with you.
My peace I give you.
I do not give to you as theworld gives.
Do not let your hearts betroubled and once again, do not
be afraid.

(31:00):
And Tim two Timothy one sevenfor the Spirit God gave us does
not make us timid, but gives uspower, love, and
self-discipline.
Think about that.
He gives us power.
He wants us to be bold.
He wants us to be strong in ourfaith, and we let these things
in our mind come in that aren'treally rational and we should

(31:20):
live in strength.
We should live in power.
Um, choose faith over fear.
And that's the way to go throughlife and make sure your life is
filled with peace and joy andnot anxiety and stress, which is
what we're trying to help peopledo there.
Rich.
And we will, wrap it up andleave it there.

(31:41):
Do you have any final thoughts?

Rich (31:44):
Just, um, from the sermon at church last night?
Uh, there was a, the, thepreacher, the pastor, he said,
uh.
He said, this thing reallystayed with me, and I think it's
relevant.
He said like, prayer isn't apractice, it's a posture, you
know, and it's like, it's, it'sa, it's a posture of the heart,
you know?
So it's like when these thingscome along, can we, like, can we

(32:04):
turn to him?
You know, like, is that, youknow, can we make that our
first.
Reaction.
You know, like, okay, this,this, this has happened, or it
could happen, or it mighthappen.
Okay, turn to him, you know,this has happened.
It could happen.
It might happen.
Okay.
Can you turn to him?
You know, can that be, can wedevelop that as a reflex?
You know, to, and I thought thatwas really cool.

(32:25):
And then the other thing I wouldsay is, um.
For those who are involved oryou know, have some knowledge of
the 12 steps.
You know, the third step is likewe made a decision to turn our
will in our lives over to thecare of God as we understand
him.
You know, and it talks about,you know, some of the 12 step
literature.
It says, you know, we make thisdecision as often as we need to.

(32:45):
You know, we might need to makehim multiple times a day.
But it's just like, am I, do Ibelieve that I'm in the care of.
Yeah, I do.
Sorry.
Yeah, that's me, pat.
That's, that's what I've got.
That's what I've got for youbrother.

Pat (32:57):
That's all we need.
'cause those are excellentpoints and I hope everybody
listening,, can remember whatRichard just said.
That is make it your reflex.
You make it your reflex.
Trust God.
And you'll find that peace andjoy and start eliminating that
fear and that anxiety.
Alright Rich, see you next timeman.
Y'all take care over there.
Patrick, happy hunting.

(33:18):
See you later.