EP.151 - Player Development and Community Impact: Insights from Andrew Milne of the Canmore Eagles - Up My Hockey with Jason Podollan

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
The honesty of Todd saying, like listen, you're not
very good at this, but you aregood at that, and if you
continue to build on that, youknow that could be something
that can take you to where youwant to go at the National
Hockey League level.
And I do the same thing here.
I mean, todd taught me that ata young age.
You know being honest andupfront with is far more
important.
It maybe stings a little bitearly, but we're not closing the
door.

(00:20):
We're just telling you there'ssome certain things you're going
to have to work on to get there.
And I think that's been onething that I've sort of stuck
with in my recruiting and mycoaching is that you know I'm
not saying you can't get there,but I'm saying you're not there
right now.

Speaker 2 (00:32):
That was Andrew Milne , the head coach and general
manager of the AJHL's CanmoreEagles, and you are listening to
the Up my Hockey podcast withJason Padolan.

Speaker 3 (00:53):
Welcome to Up my Hockey with Jason Padolan, where
we deconstruct the NHL journey,discuss what it takes to make
it and have a few laughs alongthe way.
I'm your host, jason Padolan, a31st overall draft pick who
played 41 NHL games but thoughthe was destined for a thousand.
Learn from my story and thoseof my guests.
This is a hockey podcast aboutreaching your potential.

Speaker 2 (01:17):
Hey there, welcome to , or welcome back to, the Up my
Hockey podcast with JasonPadolan.
I am your host, jason Padolan,and you are here for episode 151
.
And today we're talking withAndrew Milne, currently the head
coach and general manager ofthe Canmore Eagles of the
Alberta Junior Hockey League,the AJHL.
Andrew and I were teammatesbriefly in Spokane my 19 year

(01:43):
old year.
He was a younger, a younger manuh that ended up getting traded
throughout the WHL, which wetalk about Uh, and he got into
coaching shortly after hisplaying career was done.
Uh spent some time with theCamels Blazers and the Swift
Current uh uh Broncos of the WHLas an assistant coach and then
got into uh the Canmore EaglesAssociation after being fired

(02:06):
which we don't talk about withcameras.
There's new ownership came inand uh the current coaching
staff there got let go.
He came over to the CanmoreEagles and has been here now.
I think, geez, this is 18thyear, potentially a long time
16th maybe year uh long run inCanmore.
For those of you who aren'tfamiliar with Canmore, it's one
of the most beautiful places inthe world uh, nestled right in
uh the Canadian Rockies.

(02:28):
Absolutely gorgeous place tocall home Uh and the players
that get to play there are verylucky to uh to play junior
hockey in Canmore and and uh andAndrew's done an amazing job
there.
You know that the team iscurrently first place in the

(02:48):
entire AJHL uh, with a 29, 11and four a record for 63 points.
At the time of this podcast, uhairing and doing a great job
there.
They got their sights set onhopefully, a championship this
year and uh, or at least a deeprun.
And uh and he's doing a greatjob with with recruiting.
Now the the landscape of juniorhockey is changing dramatically
.
Uh, unfortunately in thisepisode we didn't get a chance
to talk too much about that withscholarships now being able to

(03:11):
be awarded to CHL players,canadian Hockey League players
of the OHL, qmjhl and theWestern League.
This has changed things a lot.
Even with the AJHL splitting upand some of the teams moving to
the BCHL has changed things.
That was last year.
Uh, now we're dealing with thisnew NCAA ruling, so lots, lots
have changed for someone likeAndrew, especially in his chair,

(03:34):
about who he's recruiting andwhere his players can go and
can't go and what that's goingto look like for the landscape
of hockey.
But regardless, uh, the AJHL isone of the top Junior A Leagues
in Canada to play and,regardless of where you can or
can't play, this is a goodopportunity and a great league
to be playing in.
So Andrew talks about some ofhis development tactics, some of

(03:58):
his coaching tactics.
Who he's looking for in aplayer in this scenario.
We also talk a little bit aboutHockey Day in Canada, which
came over to Canmore this year,which Andrew played a big part
in.
So a really good discussion.
Andrew himself, super personableguy I mean, you're going to get
that right away.
He's easy to talk to, easy totalk with Very funny storyteller

(04:19):
.
He has me laughing every timeI'm around him.
So I know you're going to enjoythis, this episode, and and
lots to learn from him.
You know someone who's been inthe game in his capacity for as
long as he has been, uh,developing others with the hopes
of not only winning hockeygames but, of course, moving
players onto the next level, uh,to do that in one spot for 16
years, uh, you must be doing agood job of it.

(04:39):
So, uh, yeah, without furtherado, I bring you my former
teammate and current head coachand general manager of the
Canmore Eagles, andrew Milne.
All right, here we are forepisode 151 of the Up my Hockey
podcast and we have on the headcoach and general manager and a
former teammate of mine for ahot minute there back in Spokane
, mr Andrew Milne.
Thanks for joining us today,andrew.

Speaker 1 (05:01):
Yeah, thanks for having me, pods.

Speaker 2 (05:07):
Really appreciate the opportunity to come and chat
with you.
Yeah, it'll be fun.
I think that there's a lot tochat about.
For my audience, we haven'treally covered the AJHL pathway
that much and obviously you'resuper familiar with that.
The junior landscape in generalin Western Canada is crazy, but
we'll definitely stay on therails, too, with just the
development aspect, so we're notalienating everybody.
Uh, all of my us listeners arefrom, from the east coast there,
so, uh, with that in mind, uh,maybe we'll just start with that

(05:30):
give, give people an idea ofyour background and, uh, and
where you came to arrive at theplace you're at now yeah, well,
I think you know you know morethan anybody it wasn't a great
hockey player.

Speaker 1 (05:41):
So I I was fortunate enough to get, uh, you know, in
my minor hockey in St Albert andplayed through there and played
some juniorA and, you know,played in St Albert when we won
actually we had, you know,fernando Paisani and Stevie
Reinprecht and some guys you'refamiliar with that played in the
National League and you know, Iplayed there as a young guy in
my hometown.
And then, you know, I was a onedimensional player player.

(06:01):
I couldn't do a whole lot morethan scrap.
So made my way to the westernleague and, and you know,
started and spoke.
I was fortunate enough, I sayalways to get traded a bunch of
times.
So started and spoke, playedwith babs, you know, traded over
to swift current and got toplay for todd mcclellan um, you
know.
And then ended up gettingtraded quickly over to medicine
hat and back to swift currentand ended my career in swift

(06:22):
current with todd and thenplayed a year pro before I
started coaching with Todd,which is great.
And then I had Dean Chenelf asanother coach of mine in Swift
Current.
So I was doing that the wholetime and then I took advantage
of the Western Hockey Leagueschool money.
I was able to get, you know,four years paid for from the
Western League.
So I went to U of A and took asports management degree.
Well, you know, at that point Iwas coaching with the hometown

(06:46):
team in St Albert, so coachedthere for a bunch of years and
then went back on my degree andthen went back to the Western
League.
I was fortunate enough to goback to Swift Current and then
over to Kamloops with anotheryou know great coach in Dean
Clark for a bunch of years andthen the team got sold and we
all got fired and ended upcoming to Canmore and I really
thought I'd be here for a cup ofcoffee and a year or two and
then maybe move back onto theWestern League.

(07:06):
And I had a pretty good idea ofmy path.
But you know, things change andnow, 16 or 17 years later, I'm
still here.

Speaker 2 (07:12):
Yeah, they do change, and that's not a bad place to
be hanging your hat.

Speaker 1 (07:16):
Yeah, absolutely.
That's part of the reason why Ihaven't ventured too far from
here.

Speaker 2 (07:20):
Right, yeah, right, yeah.
For any Canadian fans out there, uh, maybe you you saw hockey
day in Canada, was in, was inCanmore this year and uh, right,
nestled in the heart of theRockies and absolutely
picturesque, gorgeous place, uh,and, yeah, we'll talk about
that too.
But, uh, what a great place toplay junior hockey, great place
to coach it.
I can see why you haven't left.
Uh, you talk about ToddMcClellan, so, like and and Babs

(07:43):
and for those who don'tunderstand Babs, that's Mike
Babcock, now a little bit of astrange hockey coach in the
world, but for a period of timewas probably recognized as maybe
the best coach in the NHL.
So you had your taste with Babs.
You also had your taste withMcClellan, who is now currently
coaching Detroit.
Just got hired on there andthey're on a big run with him.
You told me last time a funnystory with Todd, because wasn't

(08:06):
he the one that said hey, man,you might want to start thinking
about coaching.
However, he put, it.

Speaker 1 (08:12):
Yeah, he pulled me in my office typical 19-year-old
at the end of the season andasked me what my plan was for
the 20-year-old year and movingforward.
No-transcript knack for the forthe coaching side, but maybe

(08:33):
not on the playing side.
So actually at 19 I startedworking with Todd and the
scouting staff in Swift Currentand I did a bunch of the
prospects cups and toured withthem on all their scouting, went
through the Bantam Draft at 19and so I really got my, my
insight quickly from from thoseguys and then played out you
know a little bit of my 20 yearold year with them as well and
was able to stay on involvedwith them and then went and

(08:55):
played a year of pro.
As you know, you sort of getthat year of grace period with
the school money from theWestern League.
So I did that over in the UKand with actually a good friend
of Todd's was the head coachover there, randy Smith, and I
went over and played and thenwhen that ended I came back to
coach with them and sort ofstarted my coaching career at 21
.
So I've been in the game a longtime.
I've been doing it a long timeand Todd's been a great mentor

(09:16):
of mine.
Along the way I talk to Toddquite frequently Lots of advice
he's given me.
You know I was really fortunatewhen I played in Swift Current
I got to meet Patrick Marleauand we became really good
friends and so, you know, withTodd being the coach in San Jose
and Patrick playing there asthe captain, I got a real, you
know, good insight to how itworks between player and coach

(09:37):
relationships.
And you know there's oftentimes when I'd be out for dinner
with Marleau and Joe Thorntonand Pavelski and then in the
office the next morning withTodd McClellan and his coaching
staff at, you know, seveno'clock, going over pregame and
ice and everything like that.
So it was really cool sort ofopportunity for me to get to see
both sides that's cool.

Speaker 2 (09:54):
I mean, I'm writing a ton of notes here and hopefully
we can, we can touch on themall but that, so I'm laughing
and you're laughing about thisconversation happened as a 19
year old uh, through your eyesand you have these plans.
Yet this coach I mean obviouslynow a very super accomplished
coach yeah, gives you some hardnews.
You know, like that's not easyand that's not easy to hear,

(10:17):
probably as a 19 year old.
It's sometimes not easy forcoaches to deliver, and
especially in this world of yes,yes, yes to death, people right
, uh, that players can turn theother way and go the other way
and listen somewhere else.
For coaches to deliver, andespecially in this world of yes,
yes, yes to death, people right, that players can turn the
other way and go the other wayand listen somewhere else.
Can we dive into that a littlebit?
Like you know, how did you takethat?

(10:37):
How did you respect that in themoment and how have you even
used that as a coach yourself?

Speaker 1 (10:41):
now delivering some hard messages.
Yeah, you know what?
Again, I think you know I wassort of just, you know, playing
hockey at a at a level when Iwas younger, without much
thought into what I was doing.
I mean, I was like I said I waswas a limited skilled player.
I didn't have a ton of skill.
I sort of found a niche in thatif I, you know, I I could
protect some of my players andstick up for guys.
And then, you know, when Iplayed junior in St Albert, I

(11:02):
realized it was also a bit of anentertainment value.
I mean, I was a local kid, youknow I'd have 100 of my buddies
at the game, you know, to watchme scrap and you know, realizing
that was like well, there's abusiness there too.
And I could see why I was onthe team for a while when I was
putting bums in seats and ableto do that.
And I went to Swift Current,you know, stick up for my
teammates and be a team guy andyou know the terminology we use

(11:23):
now is the glue guy and I thinkI did that.
I was always there for guys andyou know I got a quick story on
that.
Sergei Varlamov, who you'dremember was was a CHL player of
the year that year.
He'd come over from the Ukraineand didn't understand English
very well and and he was anelite player.
I mean he was really good andSergei and I got a bit of a
relationship and I, I canremember once Sergey walked into
Todd's office and he gave him ahundred dollars for curfew and

(11:47):
Todd said what do you mean?
He said well, I know hometonight, I know home.
And Todd said that's not how itworks.
He said yeah, you said ahundred dollars curfew, I know
home tonight.
So I get a phone call at abouteight, 30 at night at my house
and my billets and Todd says,hey, get to this party, sergey's
at the party and we never knowwhat kind of trouble Sergey is
going to get into.
So I was given the green lightto go to the party as long as I

(12:07):
babysat Sergey a little bit.
So for me my role was prettyevident and and you know, I did
sort of a lot of things that youknow maybe you know guys that
were weren't playing as muchdidn't do.
I was really aware of what wasI had and the path that I was

(12:27):
going to have to have if Iwanted to play at the pro level
was going to be prettyphysically demanding, hard on
the face, hard on the hands, andI just sort of made a conscious
decision after that Todd'scomment that, like he's probably
right, there's more to lifethan just scrapping my way
through the minor pro levels andyou know, and you know if I can
help coach and be a part ofthat.
You know it was interestingthat that.
You know it's a tough pill toswallow when he first tells you

(12:48):
that, but you know, all of asudden the typical Todd he
followed up with.
But there's a, there's a lightat the end of this tunnel,
andrew, I think you can.
You can be in the nationalhockey league just not as a
player.

Speaker 2 (13:03):
Yeah, I love, I love that there is another door that
he was opening for you, and Ithink that's a that's an
important thing as a coach andeven as a parent, like I find,
like the conversations maybeI'll put my parent hat on with
with my own boys is trying to beas honest as we can be, without
putting a ceiling on themeither, because's amazing I know

(13:25):
you've seen it a thousand timeswith how long you've been
around the game like boy, canplayers change, you know, and
and they can develop and thereis room to grow.
And that's all that I'm aboutwith.
What I do with players is like,hey, there, I don't want there
to be a ceiling, but I think, insaying that we need to know who
we are, because there issomething that is essential to
us, a thing that we providevalue with.

(13:46):
And I think, like you know when, when you have a guy that might
be the prototypical third linekind of power forward guy who
thinks he's, you know, tiptoeingthrough through the uh, through
the middle all the time andwith his toe drags, he's not
really understanding who he is,now does that mean he can't beat
a guy one-on-one ever?
No, now, does that mean hecan't beat a guy one-on-one ever
?
No, but he needs to understandhis identity, right?
So I think there's a fine linethere, right, between allowing

(14:07):
players to understand how theyprovide value and allowing them
to grow, yet being honest enoughwith them to say, hey, this is
where your wheelhouse is for youto be effective.

Speaker 1 (14:16):
And I think that you're right.
You're bang on and that's alsoimmediately, like you know, time
and a place for a toe dragthrough the middle, um, when
you're playing on the third line, I mean I want you to be free
to be able to do that, but youknow, if the turnover costs us
the game, that's a bit of a youknow a difficult position to put
us in.
But you know time and a placeis important to that.
And I think you know freedom of, of developing, I mean players

(14:36):
not just change on the ice butoff the ice, and that's
something that I think as acoach now in junior we're also
really put in a position of notjust teaching these guys all
about the game on the ice butoff the ice.
And you know, as I deal withjunior hockey players all the
time, there's all sorts ofthings that come into play and
the development of a tough18-year-old year because a
player got a girlfriend and thenbroke up with a girlfriend, and
you know that educationalperiod of like you know they've

(14:58):
got to learn what that is and gothrough that to be better as a
19-year-old, to be better as a20-year-old.
There's a reason that juniorhockey is that long.
It can be a five-year careerfor some guys, but there's a lot
of things that change over that.
Five years of development, notjust off the ice but on the ice
as well.
Players develop and change.
In Junior A we've seen what Icall the slower development plan

(15:19):
.
A lot of guys are into theWestern League at 16 and are
quickly, you know, in that pathof development and have to be
somewhere by 18 and somewhere by19.
Whereas our guys get that, youknow, what we always say is that
16 to 20 year old year oflearning and developing, and
then you can jump into collegeat 21 and you have another four
or five years of college beforeyou need to play pro hockey.
So you know it is a long termplay and that's hard for some

(15:42):
guys to look at.

Speaker 2 (15:43):
For sure you know it is a, it is a long-term play and
that's hard for some guys tolook at.
For sure.
What I think is fun is actuallywhen someone walks through my
door that maybe hasn't been asdedicated or committed, you know
, and hasn't been exposed to asmany developmental options.
Because that's when there'slike this explosive growth, you
know, and it's kind ofinteresting because we're all
trying to, you know, we, we Imean you identify potential

(16:05):
right.
How good can this guy be for me?
What's he going to be at 19?
Nhl scouts are doing it all thetime too, and sometimes players
are so polished.
Right now, like the last five,6% of your potential is the
hardest to get right.
You have to put in the mosttime, the most effort.
If you're, if you're alreadyoperating at around a 70%, you
haven't done anything likethere's a, there's a lot of room
there.
So it's kind of interestingwhen you, when you talk about
that because I don't thinkthat's on many people's spectrum

(16:28):
as far as like development cuesor questions to ask, like
sometimes it's it's when you'retrying to project it's almost
better to have somebody that'smore raw.

Speaker 1 (16:37):
I agree.
I mean that you're right.
We talk about that 10,000 hoursand how we have to hit that in
order to develop.
You know, and I always tellguys, you've got to be mentally
mature enough to hit the 10,000hours.
I mean we can skate all we wantwhen we're young and then
something changes.
You know, at an age of 16 orpuberty hits and things change
drastically.
And I've always said that, like,the idea of development is so

(16:57):
fun because you're right, youget to see, guys, that maybe you
look at a player and say, geez,he hasn't had much coaching, he
hasn't had much commitment tothe gym, he hasn't had much off
ice work, and so when you seethat and a player realizes that,
hey, if I put in the work,there's going to be a reward, um
, for us, that's the player weseek out, right, that's the guy
we want to find, that's the guythat you know.
You know the guys have been goodat a young age, haven't had to

(17:18):
solve a lot of problems, right,it's just a pretty easy problem.
I mean, you know, I'm sure youwere in that position when you
played.
You could skate out of anyproblem you had.
Where, you know, once guyscaught up to you.
You got to figure out otherways to get out of those
problems.
Skating didn't work for youevery time, and now you're going
to use strength or speed oragility or you know, hockey IQ.
So I say that all the time,like, solving problems is what
hockey is all about, and ifyou've to solve that problem and

(17:41):
that tool isn't there anymore,you're kind of in trouble yeah,
I love that analogy, that'sgreat.

Speaker 2 (17:45):
uh, I, I think, talking about the development
piece, it's just it's front andpresent for me right now,
because I, on monday mornings, Iwork with just a small group of
young players.
Right, I usually don't workwith players that young, but I
got some 10, 11 year olds thatare just doing skating work with
me and this one, this oneplayer, came like really raw
right, like playing, playing,rep, playing, playing, rep,
playing at a high level, but youcan tell he hasn't either

(18:06):
hasn't played long or hasn't hadany instruction and and he was
having a hard time with simpleedge work and but through the
course of one hour, right Towatch this guy it was, it was
noticeably different in one hour.
And then we went on this icethis morning again for my second
session with him and he hadworked on it.
Hey, this morning again for mysecond session with him and he
had worked on it.
Hey, hint to everyone out there, right, just don't do it in
your skill session, but work onit on your own time.

(18:28):
This guy was like a new player,you know, like it was so
exciting for me, like I justlove seeing that when guys buy
in the lights go on for them andthere's so much room right when
you're starting kind of withthat low bar.
That is so fun to be a part ofthat and and it's exciting for
me to see that it's harder atyour guys' level, but it still
happens.
I'm sure you see an immenseamount of growth from some

(18:50):
players from the beginning tothe end.

Speaker 1 (18:52):
Yeah, and you know, what I think is interesting,
claude, is when we grew up, thecoaches always worked with the
best players, right?
So if you weren't one of thebest players, you never got the
best coaching and therefore youprobably weren't getting the
best educational pieces youcould from coaches.
And we'll call it second andthird tier coaching was
occurring, and nowadays it seemslike, like you just said, that
player can get on the ice with acoach like yourself who's got

(19:14):
the experience, who's got that,and that's odd, I think, from
back when we were playing thegame.
Now you know you get access togreat coaches all the way
through it.
It doesn't you don't have to beplaying the U18 AAA team or the
Bantam AAA team.
I mean, I say that to guys allthe time, like the guys that
play the Bantam AAA.
You know, as their underageyear are the best players
regardless.
You know it's.
That doesn't mean that they'renot going to develop younger

(19:35):
players.
We just need to get access tothose guys and, like you just
said, there's a young kid thatgets access to you and learns
and takes it all in and absorbsit, and you know the ceiling for
him is huge and that's wherehockey's gotten.
I think we've gotten, you know,a lot better, in the sense that
we're giving more opportunitiesfor maybe not the mainstream
guys to get coaching, but theother guys, and that's where

(19:56):
we're going to see our programin Hockey Canada develop.
We're going to get younger guysthat maybe aren't great at 9,
10, and 11, but are going to bereally good at 16, 17, 18.
And that's where we have tostick with it Because, like you
just said earlier, they start toweed out by guys not paying
attention to everything, liketheir off-ice, their habits.
Their development isn't justskating on the ice, it's being
in the gym, it's nutrition, it'ssleep, it's mentally Like it's

(20:18):
everything.
You've train everything.
Now you know, and that'ssomething that I think we've
lacked in the last you know,probably in the last 10 years,
prior to that right going backto that truth piece.

Speaker 2 (20:30):
So I've just now I put on the hat, like your hat,
of being a recruiter.
You're also a recruiter at yourlevel, being a general manager,
and you need to have playersthat want to come to your
program.
And players want to be toldthat they're going to be big
pieces of a program and they'regoing to do this and they're
going to do that, and and I'veseen it a thousand times where
those promises fall flat andthen you're left with a unhappy

(20:53):
player, unhappy family.
How do you balance that line ofbeing honest, you know, hopeful
, yet not painting a picturethat everyone's going to be on
the first line power play, whichthey probably all want to hear?

Speaker 1 (21:06):
Yeah, well, I say that all the time.
I mean, the only thing you canleave when you're done with this
game is your integrity.
And you know I learned thatlesson from Todd right there,
like the honesty of Todd sayinglike listen, you're not very
good at this, but you are goodat that.
And if you continue to build onthat, you know that could be
something that can take you towhere you want to go at the
National Hockey League level.
And I do the same thing here.
I mean Todd taught me that at ayoung age.

(21:27):
You know being honest andupfront with is far more
important.
It maybe stings a little bitearly, but we're not closing the
door.
We're just telling you there'ssome certain things you're going
to have to work on to get there.
And I'm saying you're not thereright now.
And you know the good news iswe've got, you know, a 19 year

(21:48):
old ahead of you who's been herefor three years, who started
where you were, that you get tolearn from and watch and observe
and and just just watch the waythey train on a daily basis at
17.
You get to see what that 19year old does, because when he
was 17, he did the exact samething you did, and so there has
to be a development plan inplace for the entire group and I
think that's that's reallyyou're right.
That's difficult for kids tosee me.
I mean, if I recruited, I Ialways tell people I could

(22:10):
recruit.
I can tell you exactly what youwant to hear.
You're going to be on the firstline power play.
You know you're going to be onthe first line.
You're going to be a top sixforward.
You're going to live in a fivemillion dollar house up on the
hill in Canmore that has a hottub, you know, overlooking the
valley.
Like I'm recruiting you witheverything you want to hear.
You know the reality is, is ittrue, like you know?
Then you get here and all of asudden that's not true, that

(22:30):
maybe there's a bit of adisconnect between you and I as
a player and a coach, because Ilied to you and if I don't play
on that line, you know I tellguys the only guarantee in
hockey is that there is noguarantee guarantee.
You know I say to players a lotif you can guarantee me 10
goals in your first 10 games,can you do that?
They say no, but I can'tguarantee you're going to be on
the power play, but if you score10 goals in your first 10 games
, there's a good chance you'regoing to be playing on the top

(22:51):
line, right?
The guarantees are just so hardto give, and anyone who's
giving you a guarantee I thinkthat's for young players I would
tell them that right off thebat.
Any our league pods and theWestern league is when you get
drafted by the Western hockeyleague.
You have no choice.
You're going there.
I got listed by Spokane, thefurthest team away from St
Albert, and I had to walk intomy mom and say, mom, I'm moving
to Spokane and she was like,absolutely not like.

(23:13):
But that's not how this works,mom.
You have to go to Spokane.
That's who's listed me, youknow.
And so you get no say in thatversus our league.
You get pro choice or you getto decide where you sign, and so
you know.
I think that becomes aninteresting dynamic when we're
getting kids that, like, we haveto tell them, like you know,
from a truth perspective, islike you know, we want you to
play here.
Here's what we want to do withyou over the next four or five

(23:35):
years, but it's going to be along-term play, right, you don't
.
You don't get to, you don't getto sort of say we don't get to
say that we've already got yourrights, so ha ha, like we've got
you and there's nothing you cando.
So so it is about beingtruthful, and that's one of the
big things I think we prideourselves on in Canmore is being
honest with kids, like andsometimes it hurts us and
sometimes it really helps us,yeah.

Speaker 2 (23:55):
I think the downside of that and even with the uh,
the ability to transfer in theNCAA now is that it makes
adversity more avoidable, andand you and I both know how
advantageous adversity can be ifwe can find our way through it
instead of leaving it.
You know, so, like, even ifthat's adversity is as a 16 or a

(24:16):
17 year old in your league thatyou know having a hard time
getting in and out of the lineup.
There might be a team down theroad, like you said, that says
hey, man, you're gonna be on ourthird line every night, come on
over.
Yeah, right, and that cherry,that grass is greener, like that
sounds so good, right, like, oh, I do want to be there.
But if you have someone likeyourself that actually has a
plan for you and this is whereyou need to be right now, please

(24:38):
believe in me.
You know it's not hurting you,it's helping you.
As soon as you walk out thatdoor, you've just hurt yourself
because you haven't givenyourself the opportunity to
persevere.
Through this mini obstacle thatyou have, you're losing the
value of what hockey can provide.
I don't know.
Can you speak on that a littlebit?
How do you feel about theportal and all this stuff that's
coming up now and after players.

Speaker 1 (24:59):
You're bang on.
I think when you and I talk, ifI talk with a family, I say
listen, you've got four years at60 games.
You got 240 games.
That's our plan 240 games toget you to the next level, you
know, and that's going to taketime.
You're going to be, you know,healthy scratch.
There's going to be some baddates, there's going to be some
good games, but we've got 240 ofthem.
To prepare you to play at thenext level is daunting to a lot

(25:21):
of kids.
They want it right now.
They want to see, I want toscore today and I want to be
good tomorrow, whereas you and Iboth know that's not how it
works.
And so that development planthat we put in place and we talk
about that with our players,like, listen, this is not an
overnight fix here.
If it was, you wouldn't beplaying at our level.
If you were the Sidney Crosbyor let's use Patrick Marleau,
patrick Martle, I mean, you knowthose guys in the world, we'd

(25:42):
know about you.
You know, connor McDavid couldhave played ring at his draft
year and he would have gotdrafted first overall.
Like, it's not about you know,it's not about you know, those
guys are easy to identify.
It's the other ones that sayyou're going to take some time.
And if you accelerate that andyou only need 150 games or you
need 200, as opposed to the 240,the good news is we've got a
240 game plan and if you canaccelerate that and get out of

(26:04):
here by 130, then great.
But if you need the extra 240,at least it's there and it
should give players more of amentality.
But I think you're bang on withthe adversity thing.
That's one of the challengeswe're faced with.
The grass is always greener isa big struggle, you know.
Again, there's.
So the one thing I always tellpeople that they have to realize
is, once you've left the minorhockey system, this is a

(26:25):
business, it's a business andit's a big business.
I mean, the Western HockeyLeague is huge business.
You know, our league is still abusiness.
It's not as big as that, butit's still a business.
And so there's all sorts ofdecisions that are made on the
business side that maybe youngkids, young families don't
realize.
Right Like and right like.

(26:48):
And that's where, like, yeah, Ineed you, I'm going to tell you
what you want to hear.
You're on the third line in can, or maybe the?
Or the fourth line in camera,but you can be on the third line
in our team and you thinkthat's better.
Well, there's a short-term playthere and I think
short-sightedness is a bigchallenge right now in the game
and everybody wants it right nowand wants to go and wants to
move on.
But the reality is you needtime to develop and that's the
only thing that is going to helpyou for sure is time.
I mean, if you can accelerateit, great, but I hate the portal
.

Speaker 2 (27:07):
Sorry to cut you off, but I think that track record
of a team now I'm speaking moreto the parents that are
listening here and the playerstoo right, like to do your
homework on the team and thereare programs that consistently
develop guys, like as you'retalking about, through that
three-year window, four-yearwindow, and where the players
start is not where they finishand the players stay on the same

(27:28):
team, like that's such a hugething to watch for If you're
trying to identify where to goas a parent and as a player,
because there's lots of teamsthat don't they'll bring in guys
in there If they don't performin the first two months.
You're out the window.
Or you bring in the shiny newpenny and all these guys are
sitting on the bench and that'sthe culture that they have built
.
So I mean, the proof is in thehistory and the and of the
pudding, right.
So take a look and I do believe, like being in one spot, like

(27:51):
me being in spokane for fouryears I didn't know how great
that was until I became a proand then I was everywhere right,
like to be able to grow rootssomewhere, to feel a part of
something, to feel like you'vegrown up in something is uh is
such a cool thing to be able toexperience and if you get on the
right junior program, man likethat's, that's a massive
opportunity yeah, and we alwayssit here like making junior

(28:12):
hockey is one thing, it'sfinishing that's a whole nother
thing.

Speaker 1 (28:15):
Right, like to go through the process and play,
like you said, four years andand you know all the life
lessons that you were taughtfrom the spokane days and that
you taught others.
I mean that's an interesting,you know story.
I told the story pods all thetime when I, when I was playing
in Spokane and you won'tremember this, but we were
playing in the old arena and Iwas just there for I'd come to
my first camp and you know youwere the hot item coming out of

(28:36):
there, the best player, andeverybody was, you know, florida
draft, and everybody wasexcited and I I was walking down
to practice.
You had to go that long walkdown off the dressing room right
to the arena and this kid stopsme and he asked me for my
autograph and I was superembarrassed because I'm not a
player that signs autographs.
I have no idea.
So I said no and I walked pastthis kid and I went on the ice

(28:58):
by myself and I think you mighthave been second or third behind
me coming on and you'd stoppedto sign the kid's shirt and I
didn't, and then came up to meand said hey, listen, you know.
Yeah, that kid doesn't know whoyou are, but you're wearing the
Spokane Chiefs jersey and untilyou don't wear that jersey,
you're somebody.
And I took that in and went youknow, you're right.
Like that was a what anopportunity to be a part of the
Spokane Chiefs organization.
And you're right, it wasn'tAndrew Mill, that was the

(29:18):
Spokane Chiefs logo that thatkid wanted, but I was wearing
the jersey.
I learned that lesson realquick and I signed every single
autograph I could, because onceI left the Western League, no
one's asked me for my autograph.
So it's those life lessons,those skills, those developments
I pass it on to my players.
Like representing CanmoreEagles now in Canmore is so
important to the hockey side,but also off the ice.

(29:39):
You are part of the community.
You're part of something and wetake a lot of pride in the
community.
And I say it you heard me sayit on hockey night in Canada
like I can't guarantee you'regoing to play in the National
Hockey League, but I canguarantee you're going to be an
active member of a societysomewhere and if we can teach
you a little bit about that andhow to become a better member of
society.
I think that's a hugeaccomplishment for us.
We're going to do our best tohelp you get to the National

(29:59):
League and play a pro orwherever it is you want to go,
but the reality is, you know,when you come into a program
that's committed to not justhelping players develop on the
ice but off the ice, I thinkthat's a massive win for you
know, the family and the player.

Speaker 2 (30:12):
Yeah, and I think that's the gift of a team sport
like hockey, and I think hockeyis the best at it when it's done
right, absolutely yeah.
The brotherhood in the room,you know the, the way you have
to go to bat for each other, theway, the way you have to stick
up for each other good, bad orindifferent, like with the
personality structure thatdoesn't mean crap.
I can't believe, I mean, whathappened in Vancouver.

(30:32):
It's such a weird thing I I'venever experienced that in my
life that there's some type of apersonality dispute that just
can't be.
Uh, got over.
But anyways, regardless, I'mright there with you.
I mean, I think all the greatthings the game teaches us is
used well beyond the days oftrying to put a puck in the net.

(30:56):
Just take a short break from myconversation with Andrew Millen
to talk about the UMH 68,because it kind of makes sense.
The UMH 68 Alberta edition,2012, born Alberta edition, is
coming to Can at this point inall of Alberta to our Best of
Alberta event, which means thetop 68 players is our goal.
So please be watching for thosein your inboxes.

(31:29):
Sad state of affairs right nowwith my client management system
, my CRM.
It's sending emails to junkboxes.
So if you happen to be inAlberta right now and you are
waiting for your invitation, byall means check your junk
mailbox.
For some reason, filters aremaking it go in there for some
people, which is unfortunatebecause I don't have phone

(31:51):
numbers for a lot of players andplus, that makes it a lot
longer to personally inviteeverybody through a phone call.
So if I did have your number, Iwould be, I would be using it,
but for most of you I don't.
So, yes, check that out.
We are going to Canmore andCanmore is such a great location
.
I'm so stoked over uh, over thefacility that they have at the

(32:11):
Canmore Eagles.
They have, um, these reallycool dressing room setups, which
is which is a big piece of whatthe experience is like for the
players at the UMH 68Invitational, and the facility
staff there at the RecreationCenter has been fantastic.
We're getting the workshopsorganized, we have all the
dressing rooms in place, we havebeen able to secure a hotel

(32:32):
there and a caterer, andeverything is looking so
fantastic for that event.
Really excited to bring thefirst annual Alberta event to
Canmore this spring.
So, for those of you who don'tknow about the 68, it's
available on the website, mywebsite, upmyhockeycom.
We are coming to Manitoba aswell.
We're having a 2011 division inManitoba that will be held in

(32:55):
Brandon.
We are coming to Martinsville,saskatchewan, for a 2012
division and we are hosting a2012 and a 2011 division in
British Columbia.
That'll be the third year weare running those events in BC
and, due to the resoundingsuccess we've had in BC, we are
expanding the brand to all ofWestern Canada.
So super exciting times here atUp my Hockey with the UMH 68.

(33:19):
Again, if you are in either oneof those provinces and want to
make sure that your player getsnoticed, by all means you can
refer them to a watch list form,which is on the website
upmyhockeycom, to make sure thatwe have eyes on you and we'll
give you some consideration.
This is also the watch list isalso an option for coaches out
there that are listening.
I know there's a lot of you.
If you have a player that youwant to refer, that you believe

(33:41):
should be noticed in the top 68category for their age group, by
all means send in a referralform for them.
We do take a lot of value fromwhat coaches have to say, just
like we just had thisconversation with Andrew right
that coaches matter, theintegrity of what the coach says
matters, and a coach willing togo to bat per se for for a
player on their team uh tells mesomething.

(34:04):
Uh tells me that the coach seessomething in them and believe
something in them, that uh, thatthey deserve this opportunity,
and that is uh, that is weightyin the decision-making process.
So, coaches, if you are outthere and you want to go to bat
for somebody to support yourplayers, by all means.
We'd love to hear about it.
Now let's get back to theconversation with Andrew Milne.
That's funny, I mean.

(34:27):
I'm glad you told that story.
That's great.
I mean, one of the things that Italk with my minor hockey
players, even like when I wascoaching my oldest son at the
U13 level you know the rep teamin Vernon I got them involved
with the U11 rep and the U9 reppractices.
You know they would wear theirMustangs jersey which was a cool
thing here in Vernon and andtalk to them about, like for

(34:48):
lack of a better word the brandof what that Mustangs meant and
that, even though you guys are12 years old, guess what A
nine-year-old looks up to you.
You are an example and everytime you have that jersey on,
even, or your jacket on, is thatyou're making an impression on
somebody and you have theability to do that.
And uh, and I think when we usethe game in that type of
context to understand thatthere's things around us that

(35:09):
are bigger than ourselves andthat we have an influence over,
like, it gives us confidence inone aspect and it also gives us
this responsibility in anotherright that that we start
thinking outside of just what'sgoing on in our head.
So, uh, thanks for thanks forsharing that.
I'm glad, I'm glad.

Speaker 1 (35:26):
I think it's different yeah, well, I think
even take it further, pods.
Like I came into canmore myfirst year here and we had the
canmore eagles junior, a hockeyteam, and then the minor hockey
was called the ice cats and Ijust couldn't wrap my head
around that.
So we we've got these like fiveand six-year-olds that are
looking up to a total differentteam, like when, in reality,
like those five and six andseven-year-olds should have

(35:47):
looked and said you know, I'm anEagle, one day I can be part of
the big Eagles.
And you know it just sort ofblew me away and I take that to
that Spokane moment.
It wasn.
We can both laugh about it now.
I wasn't signing the autographbecause I was a good player.
I was signing the autographbecause I was wearing a Spokane
Chiefs jersey and that kidlooked up to me as a Spokane
Chief and I had a sense ofresponsibility and I was taught

(36:10):
that by yourself and Babs andBill Peters and all the other
guys that were there that saidyou know, you have a sense of
responsibility here, andrew, tohandle yourself properly and
behave.
And I wanted that kid to lookup and potentially say he's
going to play.
So when I came to Canmore thatwas one of my first tasks was
why are we two separate entities?
And so I take a lot of pride inknowing that we, we eventually
changed that to become theCanmore Eagles and, and you know
, you see, our facility isbranded with eagles.

(36:31):
Those little kids look up toour eagles and, and you know,
they, they, we had a skate witheagles yesterday after our game
two o'clock game.
We, we had a skate with theEagles.
There's 150 kids on the ice andthey all want to play for the
Canmore Eagles one day.
So you know, for for my playersit looks as like wow, I, I, my
actions have consequences andthese kids really look up to me,
and I thought that was a huge,like I'll call it a win for the

(36:53):
community of Canmore when webecame the same and I think
there's a lot of youth, we'vegot a kid on our team now.
Our leading scorer, born andraised in canmore, played for
the canmore eagles at when hewas, you know, four and five and
is now our leading scorer at 20.
So you know, that's the, thepath like you talked about with
your, you know, you 13 teamthat's.
We got to do more of that, inmy opinion.
We got to get those kids outmore right, whether it's you

(37:13):
know the pros, I think need todo it as much as they can too,
and teach these kids like you,learn about all the different
paths that everyone's done toget to where they get to, and
it's.
It used to be linear and it'snot anymore.
Every path is completelydifferent well, it's such a
grounding.

Speaker 2 (37:26):
It is a grounding thing, uh, being involved with
younger age groups and andwhatever level that be like.
I already talked about, youknow, 12 year olds working with
nine year olds, that's a.
That's a.
That's a generation gap in inthat, in that age group.
Right like this is a.
This is a big thing to look upto these players.
Some of the players I work within my mindset group that I call
the inner circle, like thegraduates of my program.

(37:47):
We talked about gratitude theother day and ways we can give
back to the game.
Right Like this thing thatwe're taking a lot.
It seems like, especially whenyou're younger.
Right Like you're takingparents are writing checks and
you're taking in all thisinformation and all this
opportunity and all these roadtrips and okay, well, so how do
we give back?
Yeah, you can give back withyour effort, for sure.
Yeah, you can give back withyour enthusiasm.

(38:09):
But the another way to give backis to like volunteer your time
and to be a part of somebodyelse's journey, and there was a
couple of players that did that,and and uh, and there was a
couple of players that did thatand it was like remarkable,
because you hear it at an NHLlevel, pro level, when guys have
kids.
I never have had kids when Iplayed pro, so my results and
the wins and losses were thebiggest thing in my day and in
my week, right, there wasnothing else bigger than that.

(38:31):
And sometimes you can get toohigh and too low with that.
Guys with kids, they come home.
The kids don't give a shit,right, the kids.
Kids want to see dad andthey're pumped that he's there
and it levels you out, right, sothat in its own way of like
these, these adolescents, these15, 16 year olds going to a
youth practice is a way of that.
It levels them out.
You mean what they're doing andtheir chase and their journey

(38:52):
and they want to be here andthey want to be here.
It just connects you to themoment and you're allowing
yourself to give back to a game.
I think it keeps you groundedand I think anytime we can have
an opportunity to consciously dothat, not be told to do it it's
that's a way to build characteras well.

Speaker 1 (39:05):
I agree.
I agree, I mean, and it alsosort of gets a lot of those kids
to remember that it is a game,like it's a lot of fun, that's
the best time when you're havingfun, like when you're having
fun, and then and you realizethat the smiles on those kids
face when a 15 year old goes outand practices with a 10 year
old like doesn't seem like thatmuch you know difference, but
it's huge for those 10 year oldslike oh, wow, that's, I want to
get to where that kid got to,where that player got to, and so

(39:28):
good, so good, so big yeah,he's sick, he's dirty, he's all
these things I mean.
But we see that in the westernleague right, like you know, we
were fortunate because, like Isaid, you were a little older
than me but we have guys youknow I mean could use Sir Jack
or Carter Alley or, you know, isit Dimitri Leonov?
I moved in and, like you, learn.
You just like wow, that guy isso good.
But you learn because you'repart of it.
And then they spend time, youknow, like you did after

(39:50):
practice with working on askillset that maybe I never
thought about, like that.
Like you know, when Babs tellsyou something, you know he's
always got that snarl and he'she's, he's mad about something
that didn't go well.
But when a player tells you,it's really resonates a lot more
than maybe your coach.
Or like, hey, you know you'rehaving a tough time getting the

(40:11):
puck off the wall and Babs isn'tgoing to be happy about that.
Let's maybe try this and youjust learn a skill set from the
players.
We do it in the western leaguebetween the 16 and 20 year olds.
Why don't we do it between the,you know, the 16 and the 10
year olds?

Speaker 2 (40:23):
yeah, yeah, within the community yeah, yeah, I
agree, I agree, and it connects,it connects, it connects the
community and it connects themto each other.
And I, I think, uh, there's somuch age division now too, like
it's even gone into singular agegroups that you're never
exposed to, like that older guy,those older conversations,
those older skills or theyounger side of it too.
Right now you have to put onthe hat of being the leader and

(40:44):
the guy who's responsible.
So I, I do like trying to findand create situations where that
still exists, even in ourschool system.
I'm diverging a little bit here, but like they have their own
freaking uh fields that they canplay on, like grade six is here
, grade seven's there, and youcan'tollinate, like at some of
the schools.

Speaker 1 (41:01):
I mean, I can't fathom that and how that's good
for anybody, but anyways, itmust have happened to you at a
young age.
I mean, you were obviously apretty skilled, good player in
the 90s when it was a tough timeto play in that time, right,
like it was physical, it washard.
But you, I don't know, pick aguy like, uh, you know, ty jones

(41:25):
or a younger guy came in thatwas a good player and go, holy
cow, I didn't see what he'sdoing with the puck.
I should try that.
Like you know what I mean, likeyou must have saw that in your
development and gone.
You can learn just as much fromthe young guys.
They're more skilled probablythan you were.
Right, the 15 year old thatcame in when you were 15 was
more skilled than you and you'rekind of going oh, I learned
that skill I.
I learned from the young guy,like man, the confidence with
the puck.
I mean we see it now with thenational hockey league right,
that those young guys, like thezegras, are trying michigans and
stuff that the older guys wouldnever even thought doing, and

(41:46):
so it is an interesting sort of.
It works both ways, right, theold guys teaching the young and
the young teaching the old well,lessons are everywhere.

Speaker 2 (41:53):
right, that's one of the things that I talk about
with my players all the time.
It's like if you, if you learnto be a learner, right like,
like and I think you can, likeHoly smokes, talk about
compounding your development,right, like, it's all around you
If you want to ask the rightquestions and look for it, you
know, if you want to you want toclose your eyes and have the
blinders on, then it's going totake you a little bit longer,
and that was one of the thingsthat I learned, unfortunately,

(42:14):
um, from not doing.
it is I didn't ask enoughquestions, especially in the nhl
level, like I was so worriedabout like fitting in, you know,
and being a guy and being there, that I I couldn't get into the
comfort zone of like hey, mattsundin, like how do you do that?
Or like what?
how do you prepare?
Or, like my god, like you know,being surrounded by that level

(42:35):
of talent and not reallydedicating yourself to
extracting as much from them asyou can is so foolish, right,
but again, it's a confidencething right.
That's a confidence thing andan understanding of the social
dynamic, of how to do it in away that you know you don't need
to be embarrassed about it,it's actually helping you.

Speaker 1 (42:52):
Yeah, well, interesting on that point.
I went to the coachesconference in Columbus.
It was a draft in Columbus someyears ago and I was with Todd
and a bunch of the Todd was withDetroit at the time and
Detroit's like the Harvard ofhockey, when you get all those
guys together, right.
And we had this coachesconference where you got to
break off into groups and Iended up with Todd McClellan
sitting at a table with Todd andit was, you know, as Todd was

(43:14):
there, there was just a wholebunch.
Babs was sitting there with usand you know, eiserman was at
the table and then scotty bowmanhappened to be sitting right
beside me, just because todd wasat the table, and so we're
chatting as a group and they'rechatting I'm listening,
obviously and scotty leans overand sort of says like where do
you coach?
And started asking me questionsand what we do.
And you know, I thought that initself was unbelievable.
But then we proceeded to talkabout you know how do we develop

(43:36):
as coaches because you know, inmy, in my level, we're so
competitive with one another Ican't phone you up as the, the
opposition say hey, pods, yourpower play is killing us.
Like what?
What do you do.
And how do I beat that?
Because you're not going totell me you want to continue to
beat me.
So as coaches, we struggle withthis.
Like you know what do I do?
And and and Scotty flipped overa business or a piece of paper.
He wrote his number in the car.

(43:57):
He says you call me with anyquestions you have.
I'll be more than happy to helpyou, because and he was
coaching at the time this wasScotty's era like that's what
Scotty was going to give back tocoaches.
And and you know I can relatethat here in Canmore we're
struggling with our diesel inthe beginning of the year and
we're kind of going back andforth with terminology and what
to do and how to control it.
And you know, as a staff,there's three of us in the

(44:18):
office.
We couldn't get it sorted outand you know I thought, well,
who can we talk to about this?
And I thought this was a timewhen Todd wasn't working and I
said, well, I know a guy that'sgot nothing to do today.
So we ended up phoning Todd andwe got him on the phone for two
hours with the coaching staffin my office going through it,

(44:44):
and I mean two hours of his.
You could just hear the passion, you could just hear the.
This is what you need to do andthis is how we do it and this
is the terminology and I mean,you know, today our goals
against is the best in theleague.
Um, you know.
So, you know, detroit's on abit of a heater well,
defensively.
So those are the things whereyou talk about the development
side from both sides, like as aplayer and as a coach.
Right, that's a hugeopportunity.
I feel confident to phone toddand say, hey, what do I do here?
Do here?
Or phone Babs, or phone Dean,chanel, or phone these guys and
say, you know, you guys have agreat power play.
What are you doing?
Like why can, how can we beatthat?

(45:05):
And that's you know both as aplayer.
You just said it like youshould have asked more questions
when you're in Toronto andthose there's, and now I've
learned that as a coach, Ishould ask more questions.

Speaker 2 (45:14):
Yeah, questions are fantastic and I think cause, and
I think cause I've done quite abit of work there in the psych,
you know the psychology aspectof that and I find that a lot of
times players don't ask aquestion.
Because if you ask a questionit means you don't know the
answer, which then means thatmaybe you're not smart or you're
exposing yourself right.
There's a level ofvulnerability there, um, but

(45:36):
that's such bullshit anyways,like that whole thing in of
itself is bullshit, like youneed to get more information,
which means you have to askquestions and and yes, there are
some people say there's,there's not such a thing as a
bad question.
I kind of think there is.
Like, sometimes you know, ifthe answer was just just told
you by the coach and you knowyou ask the same question again,
that's a, it shows you weren'tlistening right.

(45:57):
But for the most part, like youknow, be thoughtful, be
introspective, be curious and ifyou're a curious athlete and
you ask good questions, boy,like I know, as a coach, I love
athletes that ask good questions.

Speaker 1 (46:11):
Yeah, and you know what I think.
To go back to that point of nosuch thing as dumb question, I
always say to my guys, likethere's a reason he asked that
question.
You know he's lackingconfidence.
He wants to hear the he knowswhat I'm going to say, but he
wants to hear what I have to say, just to resonate that he's
right and he's confident, hefeels good.
And I think that's an importantpiece of the development side.
Is that, like when they ask aquestion?
You know, a lot of times Ialways say, like why did he ask

(46:34):
that question as opposed to youknow, he knew the answer Well,
answer Well, he wanted to hearthat, or he wanted to validate
that, or he wanted to feel goodabout himself.
Because you're bang on, likethat's, and we can get into that
a little later, but you knowwhat you're doing with the
mindset.
Stuff is phenomenal becausethat's one of our biggest
challenges as coaches is themindset.
Like they just don't haveenough of that.
We, we all toe drag, we allone-timer, we all, you know,

(46:55):
work on skills, but none of uswork on when things don't go
well.
And I'll tell you right nowjunior hockey is a young guy, as
you know it's not going to gowell and it's how you get out of
the not going well phase to getto the good phase.
And that's I always tell guys.
We're peaks and valleys allyear, right, and our job as
coaches to make sure the valleysdon't last long and that we can
get back up on a peak.
And that's a real interestingpart of how we have to coach.

(47:19):
Now is the mindsets of playersand development side of that and
what we're dealing with on adaily basis.

Speaker 2 (47:23):
How do you do that?
And I don't mean to put you onthe spot with this, but like,
yeah it's, I think people, Ithink the players are arriving
at the party in a different spotthan, say, 20 years ago, you
know.
So some of these basic, maybemental toughness skills are, are
, are, are less, are lessavailable, uh, and so there
would be a different approach.

(47:44):
I'm sure than you, than youwalking into a locker room when
you were a 19 year old yourselfor an 18 year old yourself, that
you can't really compare theit's not apples to apples.
So how do you handle that, asnow, as a coach, gm, to try and
give your players these tools?

Speaker 1 (47:56):
Well, you know, I listened to your podcast with
Ryan Reeves and he made thecomment there's no participation
awards in his house, right?
And he made the comment on yourpodcast there's none in mine
either.
And I think that's aninteresting approach.
That, like just showing updoesn't allow you to be
successful here.
You know, and I think there's aonce we get rid of that
entitlement phase of like, well,I'm here and it's mine and it's
I deserve to be here and, asopposed to, I've earned it, and

(48:18):
I think that's part of what wetalk about every day is that,
you know, there's a we're prettyloyal to our players here in
Camelot.
That's something we take a lotof pride in, but that's also a
lot of pressure on our coachingstaff to make sure that we help
them through those downsides.
We talked about it earlier thatyou know, when you don't
produce in the next, in the nexttwo weeks, three weeks, they
just get ready and the new guycomes in and they start all over
again, whereas ours, ourphilosophy, is we want to work

(48:39):
with the players, because Ithink they all inherently want
to do right, they want to makethe coach happy, they want to be
successful.
We just have to work themthrough the downside.
And and hey, this morning, pods, we've got, we've got.
Our fourth line is we've hadseven goals scored against us in
two games.
All seven have been against ourfourth line.
Um, so the easy answer is notplaying right.
But that doesn't help anybody,and so we had him in this

(49:00):
morning working with him on justlittle details.
I mean it's I said you've hadseven goals against and it's
probably about nine seconds ofbad decisions, right for seven
goals again.
So how do we eliminate that?
How can we create that?
You know, how can we make thembetter?
You know we can't give up onthem, because it's not, this is
not the philosophy.
But they also have to take someaccountability.
They're just so beat up upright now.
Every time they touch the puck,they're so scared they're going

(49:20):
to get scored.
On that.
We need to sort of change theirmindset a bit and like you're
good players, you're really goodplayers, Like you guys are
doing the right thing.
It's just you know that splitsecond decision is wrong, or
it's just costing you or abounce or a bump or this and it

(49:45):
to that we would.
We wouldn't be talking about it.
But it is a mindset and that'swhere we talked about this
morning as a staff, the more Ithink players need to spend more
time doing mindset work, likelike you talked about, and you
know we spend hours onone-timers and practice and
skills and toe dragging and allthis stuff.
We don't spend anywhere nearenough time working on when
things don't go right.
How am I going to get out of it?
How am I going to get out of it?

Speaker 2 (49:57):
I love that, that, yeah, I love that.
I think part of the piece forme is, when I'm working with
athletes is like the recognitionof knowing that they're in a
place that they need to get outof.
You know, not recognizing it asthis thing that's happening to
them.
It's actually happening forthem.
You know, and now and now, Ineed to be a problem solver, a
solution finder that you weretalking about.

(50:18):
Right, that's just like aproblem on the ice, like now you
have this thing that you'reidentifying yourself as a, as a
solution finder.
Right, I'm going to be aproblem solver here, and it
changes the mindset completelyjust in that one moment, by
understanding that there's adifference, there's a different
choice to be made in thisscenario, and I love what you're
talking about.
Earn it because, uh, again, themore that we can wire that in, I

(50:38):
think, not only from a culturalside, but even as, like, a
family culture side you knowthat you get what you've earned
and when you put in the work, inwhatever capacity it is, and
you see yourself getting better,that's because you earn that
and because you earn that skillset.
Now you get to play this manyminutes and because you continue
to work, you get to play here.
I think that is all part ofthat pathway.

(51:01):
You know that we were talkingabout the development pathway,
and when you find that in ajunior team, that is what you
want and not just the like Isaid, the grass is greener on
the other side of the fence andthey're going to give me more
minutes, being the same playerthat I am over here, I don't
know.
I just think that there's somany layers to that earning it.
You know that that allows youto have this confidence that all
these players want.

Speaker 1 (51:21):
Yeah, it's trust.
I think, as a coach, you sayearn.
I say trust, like if I know Ican trust you and again, you're
going to make mistakes withinthat trust, but I trust that the
decisions you make are withinthe best interest of the team.
And you know, and if I knowthat, and I'm going to work with
you because I trust that yourmindset is right, that you're
trying your best to do it, butyou struggle with guys that you

(51:42):
said well, I don't quite likewhat the coach is telling me, so
I'll go to the next coach andhe's told me he's going to give
me more and if he doesn't, thenit's his fault.
And we see that all the time.
We're blaming everybody, right,as opposed to blaming ourselves
, like I tried to tell thoseguys this morning don't want to
get scored on.
I trust you're trying to dowhat's right, but we're making
some poor decisions and thisleads to that and that leads to

(52:03):
this goal against.
And if our players know thatagain it goes back to coaching
If they know that we have trustin them, they're going to play
with more confidence, they'regoing to feel better about
themselves.
Can you imagine as a player?
I mean, I went through as aplayer because I wasn't very
good.
You didn't.
You had the puck on your stickand were able to gain possession
and do things, and in order,I'm assuming in order to get

(52:24):
away with stuff, you had to makemistakes, right, and you knew
that.
You know, in my game I wasn'tgoing to be back on the ice if I
made a simple mistake, whereas,you know, other guys are giving
a little more creativity, butit works out and majority of
your learning is done in failure, right, like you've learned
that it doesn't, it doesn't comeoff.
When, when the toe drag works,you know, I'm the first to say,
hey, great, that worked out foryou, but the reality is that's
not going to work.
You know, nine out of 10 times,right, so let's avoid that,

(52:47):
like you know.
Let's.
Let's avoid that.
Let's try to figure out anothersolution to that or another way
around that.

Speaker 2 (52:58):
Cause, when it doesn't work, it's multiple
times behind the bench, wherethat you know.
The one that comes to mind isthis is player that would always
drive the puck wide and alwaysmake a wraparound like attempt
right and and you know and, andone out of you know 15 times it
would go in and and jacked andcelebration, and every time I'd
be like, oh, I love that youscored and you know really great

(53:18):
job there.
But just want you to understandthat that was the wrong play.

Speaker 1 (53:22):
Yeah, or, or what other tool can we get?
My game is the golf analogywhat other club can we put in
your bag?
You can't use the driver onevery shot, right?
You need to have differentclubs and you need to have a
different tool and a differentidea.
And I think that you're payingon in that, like we deal with
that all the time.
Guys have those habits rightand it works.
So it's going to work again.
It's going to work again, it'sgoing to work again and
eventually we have to say thatto when it does work.

(53:42):
Like imagine if you had a wholebunch of different skill sets
that you could utilize in thatsituation, whether it's a cut to
the middle, whether it's aquick outside shot, whether it's
delay, whether it's a drop pass, whatever it is, you know it'd
be nice to have those because,again, your level I'm assuming
that was minor hockey you dothat 15 times and you know
better than anybody pods.
We've watched video and all ofa sudden we see that happening.
We're going to have our D gostraight to the back post.

(54:04):
Yeah, you know you're.
You're going to get buriedpretty hard at our level because
we've watched it and we knowwhat your tendencies are.

Speaker 2 (54:09):
Yeah, for sure.
You talked about connections.
Well, you didn't actually talkabout them, but that was the
connection that I made when,when you said that a game with
Todd you ended up going to playpro with somebody that Todd knew
.
Now, that is something that Ilove to trumpet and to talk
about, and it's not favoritism,but it's about building
connections, right, it's aboutbuilding a network, it's about
having somebody trust you You'veused that word, right.

(54:31):
So for some reason, todd sawsomething in you that he wanted
to get behind, right, like hewas a fan of you and, uh, and
and and again, maybe not as thehockey player, but as the person
and saw something in you that,hey, this, this, this guy can go
on and he can do something.
Those things really matter alot in our business.
How did you think consciouslyor unconsciously did you build

(54:54):
that trust with todd?
And?
And how do you do that now as acoach, with your players?

Speaker 1 (54:59):
that's a good point.
Like I I don't know if Iconsciously did it I just I knew
that there was a guy that caredabout me and the way I played
and how he could help me.
And I feel like you know, whenhe would say something to me at
the time as a player I was like,well, I got to trust that he's
got my back because he's donesome things to show me.
And so you know, when I wastalking about going overseas to
play and and todd found a anopportunity for me to go it was

(55:20):
a friend of his that they playedin the saskatoon blades
together in the late 80s uh, hisname's randy smith and randy
was playing over there and waswas almost like the wayne
gretzky of hockey in the uk atthe time.
He was the best player and howit worked.
So funny, I go over there andplay and had a year of playing
with randy and then randy wassort of retiring and wanting to
get into coaching.
You know he ended up gettingthe job in Swift Current where

(55:42):
I'd just been for the last threeyears.
So you know it was sort of mycall back to them to say here's
a guy who knows the game.
He's coming back, he's fromSaskatoon and I couldn't agree
with you more, paz.
The game is is everybody's sortof I'm not going to say equal,
but but I think you you know 70,80, 90 points.
You know what separates themfrom the next guy and it's all
character.

(56:03):
It's all character and it's allyou know.
Somebody wants to help somebodyalong the way.
I tell guys a lot, you know.
It's what you know, but it'smore importantly of who you know
.
And if that guy leaves and saysyou know what I remember, that
player is a pretty hard-working,honest, integral kind of piece
of the team and was reallywilling to do whatever.
I'll give them an opportunitypost hockey, or maybe that's
still in hockey, but I mean youcan just see that all the way

(56:25):
through.
I mean I see a ton of my timehere in Canmore.
I've been here now for a longtime and I've done more.
You know reference checks forplayers than I could have ever
imagined in my life and it'salways about, you know, that
time that I had them as a playerand you and I both talk about
work ethic and accountabilityand teamwork and these are all
things you're going to needmoving forward in life and you
know, if I can remember a playerthat played for me or that I

(56:46):
played with, that I go yeah,what a good teammate, what a
good, you know guy that I wouldgo to bat for at the time.
And yeah, a lot of years havepassed, but I remember him when
we played and you know theintegrity that player had was
something I could get behind andthat that's something I think,
todd and again, you know he'staking a little responsibility
now in my career and has givenme good advice along the way and
I take it, you know,wholeheartedly.

(57:08):
Like you know, maybe with threekids now and in a beautiful
place like this, maybe it isn'tin my best interest to jump into
a coaching job that you knowmay be disrupting the family a
little bit, or you know thattime with the players and I'll
be honest with you, babs wasprobably one of the best for
that I had a great opportunity.
I went to Patrick Martel'sretirement game in San Jose and

(57:28):
Babs was there.
Babs had Patty at the Olympicsand went to bat for Patty both
2010 and 2014.
And so they have a bit of aspecial relationship and
obviously being in Torontotogether and I went there and I
got a good opportunity to sitwith babs for you know, a couple
hours and chat about his pathand his career and you know,
obviously he's been a supersuccessful coach but that family

(57:51):
is so important.
That was his advice, like youknow don't sacrifice that.
The time you have with the kidsis so short.
It's so important because youslay such a foundation, uh, as a
father and as a parent, thatthat it's important to stay
involved in them as much as youcan.
And I think that was somethingI really took from him when that
conversation that was only acouple years ago, you know, to
stay involved in the family andthat sort of solidified the
things Todd was telling me andsolidified my decisions to maybe

(58:12):
stay in Canada until the kidsgrow up a bit yeah, yeah, good
for you.

Speaker 2 (58:15):
The uh, the idea we talked about this just in person
.
I remember like the idea thatwhen you have a player on your
team that somebody's interestedin whether it be at the next
level or whatever the case maybe that you need to give an
honest response to whatever thatis right.
And, yeah, you're not going tothrow a player under the bus,

(58:37):
but you need to be honest,because your recommendation or
your word is is one of the mostvaluable things you can have.
Right, that's, that's theintegrity you given an honest,
an honest answer.
When players talk to me about,like, whether they need an agent
or whether they need an advisoror that type of stuff, I've,
I've no issue with advisors andagents.
They do, they do a fantasticjob.
But if you're getting somebodyfor a recruitment style of you

(59:00):
know, if that's the reason whyyou're getting one, your coach
is the number one guy that youshould be worried about.
Like, what is he going to saywhen the phone rings?
Or is he willing to pick up thephone for you without anyone
calling him?
Right?
Like that's, like I'm sure thatyou can relate to that, like
when a coach will call you oryou call a coach and it's a
ringing endorsement fromsomebody that you trust, like

(59:20):
it's almost a no-brainer,because you have to trust people
in this industry, right?
Because you're not going to beable to see him, you're not
going to be able to know what'sgoing on.
So can you just talk about thataspect a little bit and how
players should be trying toforge those relationships with
the people that are making thedecisions on ice time?

Speaker 1 (59:35):
yeah, you're, you're bang on, and I again, that
lesson to me was learned.
I coached Western Hockey Leagueat 21.
And so I coached some playersthat I played with and I have a
lot of guys I can remember.
A great player in Lane, ulmer,was a friend of mine and we were
good friends.
He played in Swift Current thewhole time.
And you know, when I got askedby an NHL scout when I was
coaching, you know, tell meabout Lane, and of course I was

(59:55):
excited, for I want to tell himeverything I could tell and make
.
You know, make up as much.
And you know cause I liked Laneand I and you know the advice I
got from a guy named BradMcEwen who was in Swift at the
time, was be careful what yousay here, andrew, because that
scout could be the generalmanager of a team one day and if

(01:00:17):
you lie to him or you, you know, try to give him false advice.
Then, and they were going tosign him and I wanted Lane to
sign, I thought it would havebeen awesome, right, great for
me, great for everybody, and andI did, you know he did sign.
So I did give him therecommendation he needed.
But I think I learned thatlesson right there.
Like you said, that integrity,and I maybe won't give all the
information to a scout or, uh,you know another coach, but I,
but I definitely will give theright information that I can

(01:00:38):
give to help support the player.
And you're bang on.
I mean, that's the agent game.
You said you don't have anissue with that.
I, I'm a little bit, I'll be alittle more political, but I do
have an issue with with gettingrepresentation for someone.
You pay to tell me everythinggood about you, right, you pay
somebody to tell me.
I always tell my players youshould just get your mom or dad

(01:00:59):
to phone a grandma or grandpabecause they love you no matter
what you do, right, whereas youknow oftentimes, you know I have
to give the honest opinion yeah, he's great here, he's
exceptional here, this is wherehe's lacking, this is the things
that he doesn't do really well.
Or, you know, if I was a coach,this is what I, not the nature
of the business, right?

(01:01:20):
So you're, you're bang on inthe sense to try to create as
many positives you can with yourcoach, like whether it's your
work, ethic, off the ice and Ican spin, or sell, or, or we
always talk about selling ourplayers.
I can sell you to somebody withyou know, fantastic work.
I got a parent call me, you know, last year and said he's the
hardest working player in thegym.
He was trying to sell me hiskid.
I said he's the hardest workingplayer in the gym.

(01:01:40):
He says, yeah, he works out.
Uh, you know, five days a weekat 10 30 in the morning at this
gym in Calgary.
And I said, oh, really, sointerestingly, you go to the gym
with him every morning at 10 30.
Well, no, well then how do youknow he's the hardest working
player in the gym?
Well, he tells me okay,interesting, Well, they all tell
me that.
So I have to decipher whatthey're telling me.
So this is an agent or a parent.
Why, he tells you I need to seeit and the integrity of the

(01:02:03):
parent is not there.
Right, you're going to supportyour kids no matter what.
So so I would say, when anagent comes in and he's trying
to tell me something, but you'repaying him to tell me, that's a
big difference then.
And your coach, who's notgetting paid, you know, and says
gym, because you know, or maybelittle johnny isn't the most
polite kid off the ice or youknow, has that.

(01:02:23):
You know he loves to blame guyswhen he, when things don't go
his way, he likes to blame guys,and so I I've always said to
our guys just keep as manypositives and as many things.
You know in my sort of realmthat I can relate to coaches and
scouts and people that I can,because everywhere you go,
somebody's watching you andeverything you do somebody's
watching and everybody is thehardest working player in the

(01:02:43):
gym, everybody's the best player, everybody is in this level of
of competitiveness, and so thereality is I can see on the ice,
I can watch a video and tell ifa player can play the game at
this level.
What I can't do is tell whatthey're like off the ice.
And that's where I really put alot of trust into the coaching
staff and I think you're bang onand coaches are the ones that
are going to give you the honestopinion because at the end of
the day, they know if they wantto continue coaching, they're

(01:03:04):
going to have to be carefulabout their word.

Speaker 2 (01:03:07):
Yeah, and that's the personal development side that
I'm so passionate about Right,like that's the piece that
people don't connect to beingadvancing through the hockey
aspect, right and right, and itcan't be faked.
And that's the thing, like, whenit comes in and disingenuous or
inauthentic, like that's theworst, that's even worse than
somebody just being lazy, likeI'd hate to somebody to pretend
not to be lazy but really islazy.
It's like that drives me nuts.

(01:03:29):
But if you actually have theseintangibles that you've been
working on, that you understandthat there's value there and it
comes, it comes through assomething that you're working on
or towards uh boy, like that'sthe real deal, like that's what
guys want.
They want guys that they knowwant to improve and want to get
better and understand thatthere's value there, like then.
Then, like you have that puzzle.

(01:03:51):
Not only does it help you inthat office uh branding scenario
that we're talking about youknow people are looking and
watching and who's going to pickup the phone but it also helps
you in your development on theice as a teammate and as an
individual player.
So parents out there don't everunderestimate the personal
development side players as well.
It's a such a big piece of thepuzzle and it can be the

(01:04:11):
differentiator that you need toget yourself into that next door
.

Speaker 1 (01:04:15):
It's almost more so.
Pods Like it's almost more sonow, because everybody's pretty
good, everybody can skate,everybody.
So, pause, like it's almostmore so now, because everybody's
pretty good, everybody canskate, everybody can shoot,
everybody's got skills.
It's the other things that aregoing to separate the players
like easily, because you know, Ialways jokingly say every coach
above you is a better coach andthat's what they all believe,
right, so well, yeah, okay, hedoesn't.
He doesn't shoot the puck verywell, but his work ethic is
second to none.
Well, I can, because we canwork on those things that aren't

(01:04:38):
very good.
But if you say to me, yeah, hedoesn't shoot the puck very well
, but you know he doesn't workat it very hard and I don't
think he will, well, then we'reout, you know.
So I'll take a, I'll take aless, you know, a real hard shot
but doesn't want to work onimproving or get it through or
accuracy is down.
And I'll take a player who,well, you might be the best

(01:04:59):
player at that time, in thatsituation, at that moment, but,
like you alluded to earlier, myjob is to forecast who's going
to be the best player.
And the work ethic, you know,the willingness to be coach.
Coachability is another hugeone that we talk about, and
listening and hearing and thentrusting the coach that's almost
more important sometimes thanthe actual skills the player has
.

Speaker 2 (01:05:18):
Yeah, I believe it.
One more short break from theconversation with Andrew Mill
and to tell you how excited weare for the 25-26 season to
begin here at Up my Hockey.
I have been bringing onassociate coaches and we are
building programs in thebackground and we are ready to

(01:05:41):
support the association oracademy that you are serving.
This is, as I mean, it justkeeps coming up time and time
again that you are serving.
This is, I mean, it just keepscoming up time and time again.
What is Andrew Milne saying onthis podcast?
Over and over again?
That the mindset developmentcomponent is something that is
overlooked and it is somethingthat players need, maybe more so

(01:06:02):
than ever.
Yet we spend all this time onskill development for players
and all this money on ice time,yet we aren't investing into the
personal development and themental fitness side of the
player.
Well, Up my Hockey solves thatproblem for your team, for your
player or for your associationor your academy.
These are tailored programsthat are delivered in a way that

(01:06:25):
players are receiving theinformation.
It is not workshop-based.
Workshop-based programs foryoung athletes do not work
anymore.
Players do not have theattention span to sit for 60
minutes and to be lectured toand in hopes that they are going
to apply something from that 60minutes Up.
My Hockey does it in a way thatthey are familiar with

(01:06:47):
Short-form content delivered totheir device on their own time
and in their own convenience,when we have a coaching call
after they've learned thematerial, after they've done the
assignments, so we can makesure that the information has
been digested and metabolizedand help them take action steps
and make these things actionableand executable.

(01:07:09):
That's a huge difference.
It's a thing to rally your teamaround, it's a thing that your
players can grow through yourassociation with, and it takes
the formality and the extraburden off your coaches to make
sure that they're supplying thistype of training to their
players.
So why don't you look upupmyhockeycom, see if you can
throw your hat in the ring forthe 24 or 25, 26 season and get

(01:07:33):
your players and your teams thetraining that they need to help
them not only be their bestplayers as individuals, but also
help them be a more cohesive,structured, resilient team that
is going to be more successfulon the ice.
Now let's get back to theconversation with Andrew Millen.
Now, let's get back to theconversation with Andrew Millen.

(01:07:54):
We should talk about Hockey Dayin Canmore and your involvement
with that.
I mean, that was a whirlwind.
It was a big show for a smalltown.
How did maybe just walkeveryone through my American
listeners as well what HockeyDay in Canada is all about and
what it's trying to do?

Speaker 1 (01:08:10):
Yeah, so it's just basically a celebration of the
game of hockey in Canada.
You know, sportsnet it'ssponsored by Scotiabank, but
Sportsnet picks a location everyyear and Ron McLean and the
hockey night in Canada panelcome to town and host from that
venue and all seven Canadianteams play that day on air, you
know, and you just celebrate thegame from all the stories about

(01:08:30):
the game that we love andeverything.
And so Canmore was sort of thehost city for that, the 25th
anniversary of Scotiabank HockeyDay in Canada to celebrate the
game we love, and I mean Ron is.
I mean everybody in Canadaobviously knows who Ron McLean
is and the icon and the Americanlisteners probably.
You know, we'll find out realquick.
Ron is an absolute, you know,will find out real quick.

(01:08:51):
Ron is an absolute, you know, Isay savant.
His memory is phenomenal.
His passion for the game, his,his, his knowledge, his, his
willingness to give time toeverybody was phenomenal and, um
, you know, he just absolutelyloves the game of hockey and
loves everybody involved in itand feels like there's a place
for everybody and it was greatto have the, the panel here and
and get a chance to, to see themon a daily basis and what they
do.

(01:09:11):
You know we're here sort ofTuesday all the way through
until Saturday broadcast day andyou know a whole bunch of
events go into that.
We celebrate hockey at everylevel.
We had minor hockey, kidsrunning clinics, you know, tons
of NHL guys back to support theclinics, and on ice and on the
pond with Ron and sledge hockeyand female hockey.
We had a ref's clinic.
We had everything you canpossibly think about in the game

(01:09:32):
of hockey going on throughoutthe town of Canmore for five
days.
So it was definitely a lot, youknow.
Then we had on broadcast day.
Not only did all NHL teams play, but we had a U18 game going on
here in town.
Then we had a U sports femalegame going on and then our game
was sort of in the evening ofthat night.
So there was a lot of hockeygoing on.
There's a lot of of ofcelebration in the game, but it

(01:09:54):
was also a ton of fun.
Like you know, theopportunities to get to, to meet
and greet the stanley cup washere.
The lineup for that never ended.
Um, you know we hosted the 32thoughts podcast here with
elliot and kyle koskis.
Yeah, which is really cool, um,and just listening to those
guys talk.
I mean Glenn Sater was in townand went on the podcast and just
different people that areinvolved in the game and then

(01:10:14):
celebrating Canmore.
So it was a huge event and aton of fun.

Speaker 2 (01:10:18):
That's cool, yeah, and you had a really big role in
that, I know, in a volunteeraspect, so thank you for doing
that, and it takes a lot ofpeople behind the scenes to pull
something like that off.
So I know there's probably alot of problems or solutions
that you're finding in the lasthours there.

Speaker 1 (01:10:31):
Yeah, I mean, the event is so large you really
have a tough time understandingthe magnitude of that event with
the broadcast and the panel andhosting and everything they
were doing.
And I think a lot of people inCanmore you know knew the event
but didn't quite know themagnitude of the event until it
went off on Saturday.
And I thought, you know, ofcourse we had a beautiful day.
You know, I think that I canresonate with the F-18 flyover
that we had go right throughCanmore and just showcase how

(01:10:52):
beautiful the town was.
That was one of the only timesI was outside where I got to see
that, but the day worked outperfectly.
We had a little bit of overcastin the day before and then when
broadcast day hit it was blueskies and showcased our
community pretty well.
Yeah, what a special placepretty well.

Speaker 2 (01:11:12):
Yeah, what a special place.
Uh, if I mean with thecelebration, I I do.
I do believe there's a, there'sa, a plethora of great things
about our game, and we all,we're always trying to grow it
and we always know that there'sthings that need to be improved.
What if you could?
If you could, uh, put putsomething in each bucket there,
like what, what's?
What do you love about the gameas far as, like, what's going
well right now with the game andour place in it?
And and what do you love aboutthe game as far as, like, what's
going well right now with thegame and our place in it?
And and what do you think needsto be improved from a, from a
hockey level?

Speaker 1 (01:11:34):
oh, I think at the amateur level I mean there's
more involvement.
I think there's a lot ofcompanies getting involved.
I know ccm ran a uh ran a greatlearn to play program you know
here where they were bringingnew canadians in and teaching
them how to play hockey and andtry to expose them.
I mean all the financial sideof hockey is huge, right, and
now I think the more people wecan get playing the game, at
whatever capacity, it's great.

(01:11:54):
And so CCM came in and did agreat program here in Scotiabank
, hockey Day, where they broughtin 15 kids that are new to
hockey, taught them a little bitabout how to get dressed and
the equipment and then actuallygave them the equipment.
So now we've got 15 newCanadians in Canmore that now
have full sets of equipment thatthat will be hockey players
eventually.
And I think that part of thegame is great.
Hockey Alberta did one, you know, in partnership with Scotiabank

(01:12:17):
, where they brought in, youknow, a bunch of kids that
aren't aren't necessarilyexposed to hockey on a regular
basis and brought them intoCanmore, went on the ice, got to
tour around the facility, gotto see the Stanley Cup, meet
some alumni, celebrities.
I mean just to grow.
That game is super important.
I think that's great.
We're seeing it all over Canadawhere everybody's getting
exposed to the game.
We don't want to make it anelite sport.

(01:12:38):
We don't want to make it out ofreach financially for everyone
to get involved.
So I think that was huge for meto see that On that side.
That's the positive side, Ithink, of where hockey's going
On the that side, you knowthat's the positive side, I
think where hockey's going.
On the negative side, I thinkat the elite levels we're maybe
seeing a little bit too much uh,individual focus on that as
opposed to still the team aspect.
And you know I'll say before,like, I think kids are playing

(01:12:59):
for points, uh, and that's justthat's.
The devastating part of this is,you know we talked about
earlier how much teamwork andhard work and being on a team
and respect and integrity allthese things are a part of the
development of youth.
You know, when we play forpoints, I think that's a bit of
a challenge that we're going tohave to avoid.
And you know there's a bigmisconception that points equal
success and that's just not thecase and that's something that I

(01:13:21):
think we have to sort of at theelite level coaches, in my
opinion at the minor levels,believe that if they win at all
costs that that'll give themsuccess.
And I just really harp on thefact that if you develop, you're
going to have success.
I don't care who wins.
You know the Bantam AAA league.
I want to see who's developingand sometimes you have to
sacrifice some wins fordevelopment and that's

(01:13:42):
absolutely.
You know, the idea that weshould get behind is we're here
to develop hockey players andmove them on, and I think behind
is we're here to develop hockeyplayers and move them on um,
and and I think that if coachescan understand the development
path is so important, I thinkwe'll have a better long-term
play for hockey players.
We sort of weed guys outbecause they didn't have the
success that that they thoughtthey should have at the the you
know, under 18 level and theyquit and they're not playing

(01:14:04):
long-term hockey because, oh, Ionly made the double a team and
there's no chance I'm going toplay at the next level if I play
AA, which is completely false.
You know, I talked about itearlier.
When someone develops we can'tcontrol, but in order to develop
, you've got to be playing thegame.
In order to be playing the game.
You've got to love playing thegame and you've got to be
enjoying what you're doing, andthat's where something we have
to get back to, in my opinion.

Speaker 2 (01:14:25):
We should tell the listeners like so we were
talking about this, the growthof the game, and you know Junior
Hockey League being a businessand sometimes, you know,
different opportunities arisedepending on where you're at.
You were telling me the storyabout those tour groups coming
through in the summer, can you?
I think that's just a riot, somaybe explain what that's all
about.

Speaker 1 (01:14:48):
Well, I think you know, when you look at junior
hockey it used to be an eightmonth a year business and it's
it's no longer, it's a 12 montha year business.
And so, you know, here inCanmore we just sort of fished
around with the summer monthsseeing just tour buses coming
through the Valley here inCanmore, banff, and looking for
activities and things to do andobviously, like hiking and being
outdoors is great.
But Canadian pastime is hockey.
And so we sort of spawned thisprogram where we want to teach
people about Canada's pastimeand give them a little bit of

(01:15:10):
information.
It's the summer months butpeople come to Canada and they
want to have a hockey experience.
Right, that's part of being inCanada is understanding hockey.
So we do that, we give them ahockey experience and you know,
we give them about a 45-minutepresentation on hockey.
We talk some culture, somehistory, some superstition.
We then tour them through thedressing room where we talk

(01:15:35):
again about the, the history ofthe dressing room, the
superstitions in the dressingroom, the, the seating plan, the
logos you know how they behavein the dressing room.
And then, and then we actuallydress them and head to toe
equipment and take them out onthe ice for what could be a
twirl or could be a photo op oras much as they can do.
I this is people that have neverseen hockey before, so getting
the equipment on it, you know,getting dressed, is about a 35,
45 minute process because theyjust don't know what those wear,

(01:15:56):
but it seems to be a ton of fun, you know.
And again they come into Canadaand they see the beauty of
Canada and Canmore and then allof a sudden they all say that
you know, in order to come andleave Canada, you have to have a
hockey experience of some sort,and so we take them through
that and I think that'ssomething that's super unique
for us, but it also, on one side, helps offset the bottom line

(01:16:16):
and keep the budgeting going forour team, but also to teach
people about hockey and gainhockey fans as much as we can.

Speaker 2 (01:16:23):
Yeah, I love that.
I think that's so cool.
I mean I love it because itjust makes so much sense, like
from a puzzle piece standpoint.
I mean, nobody's on the ice,you're not using it, a lot of
the players aren't there, right,but so the ice is in.
You have all these, you've allthese tourists rolling through
that want something, and thenyou created this, this
environment, that that is athat's a valuable one, and then,
and then go figure that peopleactually pay you to do it.

(01:16:55):
Would love to be in that roomto see, to see a bunch of
tourists trying to put on hockeygear.
Is it new stuff or is it likeold, stinky stuff?

Speaker 1 (01:17:00):
hopefully you give them the old, stinky stuff to be
part of the experience when Istarted, it was the players gear
which, as you know, is not verypretty and it didn't smell
great and and, as we've learnedover the years, I mean we've had
to get new equipment and makesure it's not because, hey, the
players don't want anyonetouching their gear.
You know how superstitious theyare and, yeah, some of the guys
like their gloves soaking wet,some guys like to wear wet gear,
some guys, like you know.

(01:17:20):
So we, we learned real quickly.
We got off the bus one night.
Our bus broke down on one ofthese programs, were coming back
from fort murray and by thetime we got home it was about
7.30 in the morning and the gearwas completely frozen, solid,
and you know, the program ran at9.
And so I opened the dressingroom door at 9 o'clock, just as
the gear thawed after a gameplayed the night before, and I

(01:17:41):
didn't know what to say Evenmyself.
It didn't smell very good andthis group's standing there and
a couple of people are likereally plugging their noses, and
I just sort of said, likethat's the odor of success.
We won last night.
That's what it's going to taketo be successful in junior
hockey.
And we learned at that point.
We got to get our own equipment.

Speaker 2 (01:17:58):
So you do run it during the season then.

Speaker 1 (01:18:01):
A very few of them.
We run a couple of them hereand there for special groups.
Like we might run 10 during theyear, during the year.
It's almost easier during theyear because all the players are
here and they have a riot tooright.
Like we have 50 sets of gearthat we can pull down and take
and dress and the players thinkthis is hilarious, like
something they've done sincethey were two or three and
they're teaching you know a 45year old, you know Australian
how to put on equipment is justhilarious and they love it.

(01:18:23):
So it's it's fun for bothgroups we run.

Speaker 2 (01:18:25):
Maybe you know maybe a dozen of them during the
season, but the rest of them arefall into that spring and
summer.
That's great, that's awesome.
Well, I'm looking forward tobringing my event to uh, to you
and to your town there.
I know we talked about that.
It kind of goes in line withwhat we've been talking about,
you know, like having theseyoung, these young 2012s from
alberta, come from all acrossalberta, come there and and
hopefully have some interactionwith either you or with some of

(01:18:46):
your players and, you know, givethem that, that experience and
that junior, that junior feelit's a great town to do it and
I'm excited, to excited, tobring it there yeah, well, we're
looking forward to having youguys come.

Speaker 1 (01:18:55):
It's going to be a fun event.
I know our staff will be here.
Some of our local players willbe around, for sure, and again,
like we talked about as much aswe can give back to help those
kids, and you've got some of thetop talent coming, so it's
great to a little bit probablyearly for me, but but again, the
idea that we can teach them athing or two about what we've
talked about today is huge.

Speaker 2 (01:19:12):
Yeah, yeah, I love that pathway too.
It's like open, opening thatdoor.
I know, uh, I know when Spokanelisted me which I guess is a
different experience, but theywere allowed to do that at 13
back in the day, like my 13thbirthday, I got a letter or a
phone call from Spokane that Iwas on their list and like
instantly it was like, wow, youknow, and I knew how to, like I
drew the logo in my garage and Istarted working on this and I

(01:19:34):
started working on that, likeit's just, it keeps you part of
the system and I think thatthat's cool.
Like we do that here in vernontoo with the vipers.
You know the vipers are aroundand and exposing them to that,
uh, to what that's like right,like that's the dream.
Now that can be the dream and Ithink that's a really cool
dream to have exposing them tothat, to that Canmore Eagle
facility and culture there.
So I'll let you go.

(01:19:55):
Is there any words of advicefor for players or for parents
out there who want to put on aCanmore Eagle jersey one day?

Speaker 1 (01:20:04):
Well, that's a good question.
I mean, I think obviously theprogram sells itself outside of
the rink.
I mean, it's pretty easy tolook up Canmore and think how
beautiful it is.
But you know, I think from ourstandpoint, if I was giving
anyone advice to come throughthe program, I'd understand.
We have three words and youprobably heard this.
You know it's work ethic, systemskill, and it's not going to
deviate from that.
It's nothing that's going tochange.
You know you can be the to besuccessful and I think that's

(01:20:34):
important for players to realizeat a young age that that work
ethic is non-negotiable.
Here in canada, where you haveto have it, um, it's the first
thing that gets you through thedoor.
You know, after that we have toplay a strong system, um, and
the game is evolving so muchwith video and techniques and
how we play.
We have two full-time assistantcoaches that are always
pre-scouting and so we're awareof tendency, so the system is so
important for us.
And then, third level, that is,we're gonna have the skills to
play.
So you know that's somethingthat we talk a lot about.
We recruit is like we gotta,you know, get to know the people

(01:20:54):
.
Uh, that's the sort of plan wehave in place.
And then, from our standpoint,we want quality people.
You know we talk about that alot.
We can teach you how to playhockey.
We can't always teach you howto be a good person.
So, like you and I talked a lottoday about you know becoming a
quality individual and having alot of people speak highly of
you is going to help you more sothan your toe drag, because we
think we can work with you andthat's why I think what you're

(01:21:14):
doing is phenomenal with themindset stuff.
I mean, we all have to teachskills and that's a big part of
what we do.
But to be able to teach kidsthat the you know intangibles
that go into this and the thingsyou've learned over your career
, you know, for me as a coach, Iwant guys that have worked with
guys that have been there,because you've taught them like,
hey, you know, during the harddays, this is how you're gonna
have to handle that.
Or you know, when things don'tgo your way, or when you're on

(01:21:35):
the fourth line, you think youshould be on the third line.
Here's how to approach that.
You know versus you know.
You know these guys that justcome in say I'm just the best
player I've always been.
Why am I not anymore?
You know I don't have a lot oftime for that and I think we
need to find more opportunitiesto teach and educate.
You know kids mindsets than wedo the skills yeah, I really
appreciate that.

Speaker 2 (01:21:53):
Thanks, uh, yeah, thanks, that's super valuable, I
think.
I think from a lessonstandpoint.
I'll just add one, one cherryto what you just said there.
Like that work ethic thing forplayers listening right now
you're a hard worker.
Compared to what?
And compared to exactly youknow and like, so we all like,
if I walk into a locker room,really like probably even a
triple, a u15 team, right, andI'll be and especially at your

(01:22:16):
level, because I've done it atyour level where I say, hey,
who's lazy in here?
No one puts up their hand.
Right, because no one really isin that standpoint.
Right, you're not going to getthere if you're lazy.
Everyone thinks that they're ahard worker.
But then when you actually like, if you to give yourself an
analysis of like, how hard do Ireally work compared to jimmy,
bobby, james, jesse, even inyour own locker room and led

(01:22:38):
around the league, that's awhole different conversation.
And then when you step intojunior, you people listening out
there, you're against 16, 17,18, 19, 20, right, are you a
hard worker compared to the 20year old?
And you already brought that upright.
So I think that standard ofeffort can totally be graded and
evaluated, and it is somethingthat you can change your own

(01:23:00):
effort level when it comes to.
That right that I am going tobe a harder worker here.
I'm going to be a harder workerhere because there is room for
me to grow there.
If you can take that consciouschoice as an athlete and really
self-evaluate and get yourselfinto that top three in a room
like that, you would raise yourhand and say, yes, he's my
hardest worker or one of myhardest workers, like, wow, what

(01:23:20):
a valuable thing to have.
So I love that that's first onyour intangible list there.

Speaker 1 (01:23:25):
And to add to that, paz, I always tell guys work
ethic isn't just sweatingEverybody.
And to add to that, paz, Ialways tell guys work ethic
isn't just sweating.
Everybody equates it tosweating.
Like you know, hard work ismentally too Like we talk about
that a lot.
Like you have to be mentallyprepared.
You have to eliminatedistraction.
You have to work hard, whateveryour situation is personally.
You know it's hard work for youto stay focused for 60 minutes.
Maybe that's harder than justyou know you could.

(01:23:46):
60 minutes and not getdistracted by all the other
distractions we have in theworld right now.
That's hard work and I tell myguys that a lot.
You know everybody thinks likethe parent who told me his kid's
the hardest working player inthe gym.
That's great, you know.
But we can measure that Likethat's.
You know we do fitness tests inthe beginning of the year to
see that.
But that doesn't alwaysindicate the hardest work,
because there's a lot of thingsthat go into work ethic wise

(01:24:07):
distractions and and andopportunities to be pulled away
from what you need to do right.
And that's hard work.
It's hard work for me to stayfocused.
It's hard work for me to stayin the moment.
It's hard work for me to sortof maybe bite my lip when
somebody isn't as competitiveand not be a, you know and I'm
going to use the term bully, butnot be that outspoken guy.

(01:24:28):
It's hard work for me to dothese things.
I got to bite my lip every nowand then, you know, or to be
lacking competitiveness in thesense of, like you know, when I
played, obviously you knowfighting was still in the game,
it was a huge part of it and itwas you know you could always
say, oh, that guy, he caresbecause he fights.
Well, does he shot?
You know, hard work now is is,is being disciplined, right, and
that's something that you knowfor me to control my emotions

(01:24:53):
and not take a bad penalty.
That's hard work for me, maybedifferent than you, but but it's
still hard work, yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:24:58):
I love that.
I love that, yeah, definitely.
And the ability toself-evaluate and self-assess on
that is huge.
Right, like where, where is,where is my hard work?
And to be able to shine a lighton that and to work at it.
Um, yeah, what a great, what agreat way to leave.
So awesome man, I reallyappreciate your time.
Uh, awesome stories.
I.
I love chatting with youbecause you make me laugh all
the time.
Uh, so uh always good to hangout and uh and yeah, I know that

(01:25:21):
that's going to be a lot of alot of value for for for the
audience today.
So best of luck with the restof your year there, andrew.
I know you guys are doing wellthere.
Hopefully there's achampionship on the horizon and
just keep doing what you'redoing.

Speaker 1 (01:25:32):
Yeah, thanks, Pods, Thanks for having me and thanks
for all the hard work you'redoing and helping the game grow
the game.

Speaker 2 (01:25:37):
Appreciate that, cheers.
Thank you so much for beinghere for episode 151 with Andrew
Milne.
I had a blast on today's call.
He's got a million stories andI really appreciated his
perspectives and I think it'sreally insightful to hear the

(01:26:00):
perspective of a coach and GMwho sees these players you know
these 16 through 20-year-oldplayers come through his locker
room doors and stating thatmental fitness and personal
development is something thatthey all need and they hold he
holds in high priority as far aswhat they need to focus on.
So if that's a note to self, Ithink it should be.

(01:26:24):
If you are a player out there,it's hard to know what you don't
know.
I recognize that especially asa you know 15 year old hockey
player, an 18 year old hockeyplayer.
We don't know.
We only know what we know.
We only know what we've beenexposed to.
So to understand what personaldevelopment even means, or to
understand what mental fitnessmeans and how you might train it
, can be a little bit daunting.

(01:26:44):
But again, going back to theconversation, being curious and
asking the right questions andasking the right questions to
the right people will get youanswers that benefit you and you
will be blown away by how youcan double down on your
development with an investmentin yourself.

(01:27:05):
When it comes a little bitoutside of the norm of what
you've been exposed to, when itcomes a little bit outside of
the norm of what you've beenexposed to, and when players and
teams experience this together,it can have a resounding impact
.
So I love hearing that fromsomebody other than maybe me on
this channel, who you obviouslyknow that I trumpet the idea of
mental fitness and mindset andpersonal development and how it

(01:27:26):
is so key to reaching yourpotential.
When you hear somebody that isactually making decisions about
who will join his team and whogets ice time and what he looks
for, and you're hearing it fromhim that this is a lacking skill
and a lacking focus area forplayers, that might be even more
incentive to say, hey, this issomething that I might want to

(01:27:46):
get involved in.
So I really appreciate Andrew'stime, really appreciate you
being here.
I hope you were able to gainsome insight into the things
that you were a little unsureabout before and maybe getting a
little more crystal clear onyour path, and maybe the AJHL is
an option for you if you'resomeone from Western Canada and
if not, there's obviouslylessons in every hockey story
and from every hockey league ifwe choose to hear them.

(01:28:08):
So hockey story, and from everyhockey league, if we choose to
hear them.
So until next time, play hardand keep your head up.

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EP.151 - Player Development and Community Impact: Insights from Andrew Milne of the Canmore Eagles

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}EP.151 - Player Development and Community Impact: Insights from Andrew Milne of the Canmore Eagles