Episode 03 - Minds & Methods: Lt. Rich Qualls and Master Corrections Officer Kyle Appleby - View from 100

Episode Transcript
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Jay Armbrister (00:00):
There. So it's live. Oh yeah, yeah. Now we got

(00:05):
it okay, but I'm gonna do itagain. Yeah, okay,
all right. So welcome back toepisode number three of the view
from 100 podcast. I am yoursheriff and the host, Jay
Armbruster. I am fortunateenough to have not only a couple
of friends here with me, but twoguys that I've worked with for
many years. And we're going todelve into the training aspect

(00:29):
of not just Douglas CountySheriff's Office, but
corrections and operations as awhole for the state and country.
But so training, we always talkabout resources. Every everybody
needs resources, but everybodyagrees that the number one
resource that every agency,every entity, has is their

(00:52):
people and their staff. But whatyou do with those people is what
makes your place go or not go insome cases. And so training has
been probably the number onepriority when it comes to how do
we make sure that our folks areout there doing the right thing,
the right way, for the rightreasons. And so
it kind of gets lost in theshuffle that everybody assumes

(01:15):
that we train, but nobody reallyknows how, and we're what
sometimes. So I think this is aperfect opportunity for us to
kind of shed some light on that,but also talk about how things
have changed over the years. Youknow, in 1998 in the late 1900s
when I started with sheriff'soffice, I went to work and they
put they they put me with atraining officer for two weeks,

(01:38):
and I followed her around, andthen I was on my own. When I
went out on patrol, they hadstarted develop a field training
officer program, but it was, Ithink it was six weeks or
something, and they passed mearound to different people. But,
you know, the training that Igot back then was, was unique. I
guess we should say to how thewere the world operates today. I

(02:02):
can still remember my very firsttraining officer. We had a an in
car camera, which was fairly newtechnology in 2000 and he said,
he said, Look, you can use thatcamera if you want, but don't
you ever use that microphone,because it's just going to get
you in trouble. And that was thepervasive that was, that was the
belief back then, because youknow, you could say and do

(02:25):
things that you know you didn'twant people to see. And so I
feel, you know, obviously, thatculture has changed and moved
all the way to the other end ofthe spectrum, which is good for
us, because it holds usaccountable. It makes us much,
much better at what we do. Butalso I personally, through my
career, figured out because Iworked a lot of night shifts for

(02:48):
a lot of years, I was on nightsfor like, six years straight at
one point, and I worked a lot ofDUI cases, and I found that a
juries didn't believe you if youdidn't have video, and that the
CSI effect is real. But also isthat if you had a video, you
really didn't have to write yourreport, because it told the
story for you. And judges,juries, attorneys and
defendants, all were like, yeah,that yeah, the only thing you

(03:12):
can't do is you can't smell thedrunk, but you can see
everything else, hear it all.
And so I got to where I wouldn'twork without a camera or a
microphone, because I knew thatit just made it protected me,
and so that just kind of a storyabout how training has shifted
over the years. So, So enoughtalking about me, but So to
introduce my guest today, I haveLieutenant rich Qualls, who

(03:35):
comes to us, you've been withus. Well, I'll let you tell us
how. I'll let you tell us allabout yourself, and then master
corrections. Kyle Appleby, who'sbeen with us for 17 to 50 years,
I can't remember, somewhere inthat ballpark, somewhere in
there, and I just want, I'mgonna start with you rich, to
just tell the people who youare, where you come from. Why
are you here? Why do you stay?

(03:56):
And what do you do? Okay,

Rich Qualls (04:00):
my name is Rich, quals, and currently I am
assigned to the trainingdivision as the lieutenant
for the sheriff's office. I'veworked as a deputy, a sergeant
and a lieutenant on incorrections and patrol, and then
I worked as the admin, theoperations administrative

(04:20):
lieutenant, yes, which is sortof a catch all position
downtown. So supervised, IA,investigations, civil process,
courtroom, security, records andanything else that comes up.

Yeah. Where'd you come from? Oh, okay,

yeah, a little background, yeah, what brought
you here? What brought me here?
Okay, so I know where you camefrom and these people, yeah,
that's right. So in I was bornand raised in Southeast Kansas,
rural, rural, and I was ready toget out of

four. Scott, Columbus, Pittsburgh. Chanute,
Okay, gotcha Absolutely.

I was ready to get out of high school. I was done.
So I figured out the scheme wasmy senior year in high school, I
could leave and go take EMTcourses. Oh, yeah. So I went and
get out to get out of class,right, and get a real job. So I
went and did that. I reallyliked the first responder aspect

(05:25):
down there. You know, there'snot a lot of resource,
especially then there was hardlyany resources. So, you know, the
ambulance left right from theER, and so you'd help out in the
ER, you know, when you could,and learned a lot. I mean,
obviously you come out of highschool, you don't have any idea
what the real world has in storefor anything? Yeah. So you know,

(05:46):
as I got older, I I'm young andyoung and dumb, and it looks
like the cops are having morefun, so I decided that's what
I'm gonna do. So sure i That's2009 and so in 2009 it was hard
to get a job. It was hard to geta job in law enforcement. You
had to apply everywhere theycould tell you, you know, hey,

(06:06):
we're Topeka. PD, we got eightspots. Here's the testing dates.
You show up, and there'shundreds of applicants. I mean,
it was a very differentenvironment. And so the job I
got was in Joplin, Missouri. AndJoplin is a rough town. Was
Jasper County, no Jasper andNewton. Oh, new Okay, got both.

(06:27):
And so I worked there for aboutfour years. Got a lot of
experience. I was there duringthe tornado. I was gonna say
they had a hell of a tornadodown there. Yeah, and working
almost all evening, nightshifts, you know, because I'm
young and dumb and want theaction, and that's where it is.
So, so, yeah, so I bid those. Igot a lot of experience. I mean,

(06:50):
my my first four years, I wasjust running call to call, and
then, like, probably 50% 60% ofour department, I met a woman
and

a story as old as time.

So obviously what we want to do is, is go where
she wants to go. So so I wasstill, I still wanted the
action, and so I got a job withJohnson County Sheriff's Office,
and went up there, and it wasgood job. I really, like, really
respect their department. Wework a lot with them, obviously

(07:28):
being our neighbors, and nothingbut good experiences there,
sure. But for me, personally,growing up in a small town when
I moved there, and I mean, 500deputies, you know what? 1718,
law enforcement agencies like,you know, you you people, bring
folks into us, and I'd never seethem before. Haven't seen them

(07:51):
since, you know, I'd go to thecourthouse to testify, and those
guys have never seen me, right?
And and so that wasn't for me,sure, you know, it was a great
agency, but it wasn't for mepersonally, so my also a story
as old as time for cops. My nowex was from Lawrence.

I can't believe it. It's

truly shocking. So we were living over here at the
time, so I've applied forDouglas County, and, you know,
it's been a great experience. Itfits me a lot better. We're big
enough that you can do a lot ofthings, but we're small enough
that you always know somebody,or you know somebody who

knows somebody.
We are the biggest small town inKansas by a long exactly. So, so
there's a lot of

best of both worlds. You know, you get, you
get to do the exciting things,but at the same time, there's a
lot of freedom, because we don'tabsolutely, you know, our
resources are usually stretchedpretty thin. So if you, if you
want to take on something, youcan do it

absolutely, absolutely, well, perfect.
That's great intro. So we'regonna go to Kyle, wow,

Kyle Appleby (09:03):
I know you're still I can't wait to hear it
again. I'm not sure my resume isgonna match. Yeah, nope. Well,
my name is Kyle Appleby,currently signed to the Training
Division, sure, until the boss

man, he's not

good. I'm from Bolivar, Missouri, little small
town, Southwest by Springfield.
Isn't

that where Brad Pitt's from? It is the two best
things that come out ofMissouri. Brad Pitt and I 70,
that's it. Yeah. Have you evernoticed both their big cities
are on each end and look likethey're trying to get out. They
are.

They are trying to get out. Yep, Governor. I worked
for the governor. That was myfirst job. Was that Polk County
Sheriff's

Office, Jeff City, I guess then, or was it in
in Bolivia? Well, he was

our sheriff at the time. Mike Parsons, oh, so he
hired me for my first job.
Really, I was working at jail atnight, going to high school
during the day. For sure.

So, yeah, 18 a story that is not

as old as time. So I got a lot of experience there.
Got to see some of my friendsget her, you know, yeah, come
through and yeah. Got to processthem, take their homework from
their bag,

copy it. You might want to check number nine
and 16 when you get out.

So, yeah, that's where I was born and raised.
Came up here in 2006 to thesheriff's office and been in
corrections my bread and buttersince then.

Yeah. So, so the part that I want the people that
are listening to understand isthat is that when an agency and
it's kind of a differencebetween the sheriff's office and
a PD, and I've obviously, I'mvery biased towards towards
sheriff's offices, but in apolice department, you have

(10:52):
patrol officers, you havesupervisors, you have
detectives, but maybe you have atraining unit, maybe you have
evidence, some other things. Butin the sheriff's office, we have
all those things too, plus wehave an entire another half of
our organization in theCorrections Department, which is
our jail, where you can make acareer and excel and and we are.

(11:15):
We're fortunate to have peoplelike like Kyle and some others
who have, who have dedicatedtheir careers to the corrections
division, and it it's one ofthose deals is like the jail
kind of exists in this weird,little nebulous world that
people pretend doesn't exist allthe time until something bad has

(11:35):
happened, or someone that isconnected to them is involved in
that. But for the most part,jails are operated completely
out of sight, out of mind,hoping that nobody ever hears
about us, because that meanssomething bad. And that's kind
of kind of a we're kind oftrying to make that change to
where we're trying to kind ofthrow our jail and our jail
staff back out into the sunlightwhere they belong, because it is

(11:59):
a very difficult job. It is avery rewarding job, if done
correctly, but it's alsoextremely high leverage. When it
comes to civil litigation, youwant to get sued run a jail. I
mean, I'm not kidding you. Itis. It's unbelievable, the
things that that a sheriff and asheriff's department will get
sued for, but also the the rulesthat a jailer must follow in
order to make sure that peopleare treated with respect, but

(12:21):
their rights are not infringedupon. I mean just something as
simple as US Mail, making surethat they have their mail, and
if we take their mail from them,for some reason, we have to
follow. It has to fall intothese very narrow places and and
you can, and we, I we have beensued over over mail, and even
I'm not saying successfully, butwe've always, we always make

(12:45):
sure and learn more and makesure that we are doing it right.
But it's, it's little thingslike that that people just don't
think about. And so, and also,as our world has changed in the
last decade, our jails havebecome the de facto mental
health institutions. And so thestakes are even higher because
we're dealing with folks who arejust some they are simply

(13:07):
mentally unhealthy. They'redangerous. And so it's not, it's
not the Barney or the Andy andBarney locking up the drunk Otis
every night and him lettinghimself out every day that those
days may have existed at somepoint and not not for me, but
that is absolutely not the caseanymore. And and the jail is a

(13:30):
place where we start people andthey work their way through, but
sometimes they move on,sometimes they stay there,
because that's just what worksfor them. And and so we're very
so lucky to have you and theothers who have chosen the
corrections division as the astheir, their their move. So
appreciate that. Yeah,absolutely no. I appreciate you

(13:53):
so but I guess really where theconversation I think ought to go
for people to understand istraining. You know, anytime we
have a major situationnationwide, it always comes back
to, how were these officerstrained? How were these deputies
and trained? What is yourtraining? And in the state of
Kansas, we have being acertified. And I guess I better

(14:16):
make sure to make sure make thisdistinction as well. When we
talk about corrections officersor jailers. They are a civilian
employee. They are not acertified law enforcement
officer, but when we talk aboutdeputies, they are a certified
law enforcement officer, butthey can be working in the jail
or they can be working on theroad. And so when we talk about
training, you know, jail staffcorrections officers, the

(14:39):
requirement for them is veryminimal to operate and work
within the state, but if you'rea certified law enforcement
officer, you have to get your 40hours every year. You have to
qualify. You have to do thesecertain things, I guess, talk to
me about what is, what are therequirements across the state of
Kansas, for training, foruniform, for. Personnel, both

(15:01):
corrections and deputies, butalso, what's the difference
between what's required by thestate versus what we do as an
agency, by policy or bypractice?

Okay? The Yeah, all right. We'll see. We'll see, if
I remember all these so for adeputy, for a certified law
enforcement officer in the stateof Kansas, 40 hours of sorry,
initially, you have to attendthe Kelly TC or satellite a
cashier run by the state. Youhave to be 21 you have to

(15:34):
complete that they sign off. TheState gives you a commission. So
now, after that point everyyear, every training year, you
have to get 40 hours incontinuing education that
includes a firearmsqualification and bias, anti
bias, bias based policing, biasbased police training for

(15:58):
corrections officers, yeah,there is no requirement exactly
in the state. That's the point Iwant. There is, there is you can
start 18 years old, start whenyou're 18 years old. And if you,
if your agency does not supplythat training to you, you get a
set of keys and a pat on theback and good luck, yeah, and

a well wish. So, so, but, but in the in our
agency we've built, and I'm notabout to take any credit for
this. This started long ago, buthas been built for years, where
we as an agency viewed thatopportunity to take those folks
who are starting, because let'stake this is almost exclusively

(16:42):
entry level folks who are comingin just like me. Had I was a
mechanic, had been married for acouple of years, and I thought
that I would give it a try, so Iwent to work for the sheriff's
office, and they put me in thejail, having never worked a
night shift in my life. Hadnever, you know, and like like
Kyle, I walked into a jail about10% full of my friends but

(17:05):
family, you know. And there's norequirement on on that, on that
person who's entering that jailsetting, so. But as an agency,
we were like, man, we reallyneed to make sure that these
folks are trained up before theyhit the floors. And so
initially, I think it started aslike a three or four week, I
think so, something like that.
And then when we're talking,like 1015, years ago, but now

(17:27):
kind of talk through, what isour what does our jail Academy
look like?

I'll give some big picture. You give the details?
Yeah, absolutely. So now ourstructure is eight weeks of
initial classroom, academytraining, followed by eight
weeks of on the job. We'llprobably start referring to it
as JTO, or where they have ajail training officer that is

(17:59):
assigned one trainee, and theywork together. And during that
eight weeks, you know, it startsout that the trainee is doing
nothing and watching the jailtraining officer, and by the end
of it, and there's a process, bythe end of it, the training
officer is doing nothing exceptevaluating the trainee to make
sure that they can do the jobindependently. And well, don't
get hurt and don't get hurt,right? And so, you know, I, my

(18:23):
first cop Job was a is at a PD,and then I went into
corrections, and I would havethe learning curve would have
been cut down so much if I wouldhave started, oh, my God, in the
jail, yes, if I would havestarted learning those skills
first, I would have been so muchbetter off, not that, not that

(18:45):
my path was bad, right? Yeah. Sowe look at the corrections
Academy as foundational LawEnforcement Training percent. So
we are. We're teaching, youknow, not only what the federal,
state statute and policyrequires, but we are, we're
trying to impart to them how tohow to think like a cop, sure,

(19:07):
right? Because while the job isdifferent and requires different
skill sets, the mindset is isexactly the same. You know, it's
the same people that succeed inthese roles. So it's
foundational. We're teaching,you know, risk mitigation,
threat evaluation, criticalthinking skills, right? So we

(19:28):
can, so we can solve theseproblems, in addition to the to
the tactics, and, hey, here'sactually how you handcuff
somebody, right, right? Here's,here's how you investigate, you
know, when something getsstolen, yeah. So, no, I

think, I think it's, I love the term
foundational, because really, atour core, we are communicators.
And no place on earth will a lawenforcement officer learn better
how to communicate with somebodythan inside a jail setting I've
long said, and so in my personalstory is. That I went, I was in

(20:01):
Pittsburgh, Kansas, going tocollege for to be a mechanic,
and I had to stay, I had to moveout of my dorms, because during
the holidays they would, youknow, scrub down all the
disgustingness that little boysleave behind. And but I had a
job, so I needed a place to stayfor a week and a half or
something. And some familyfriends had a son that lived
there, and he was a CrawfordCounty deputy, and so that was

(20:23):
my first exposure to lawenforcement that didn't involve
me dumping out my beer orsigning for a ticket and and so.
But he said he was like, man.
He's like, You ought to thinkabout it. He's like, you kind
of, you know, you seem likeyou'd be good at it, but he's
like, but my advice is simple,go to a sheriff's office. He
said you're going to go intojail. You're going to learn
who's bad. You're going to lose,learn who's not bad, but did
something bad, and you're goingto learn who's dangerous, like

(20:45):
truly dangerous, and then you'regoing to learn how to work with
all of them, because you haveto, you absolutely have to.
Plus, he said, sheriff's office,you know, I have so many more
options and things to do. Andwhen I came to work, I just
followed that path. I didn'tquestion it, and it wasn't until
later where I would see young,young cops hitting the streets
alongside me who didn't have theexperience that I had, who were

(21:09):
just simply struggling to evenfigure out what is going on and
who to even talk to, whereas I'mlike, hey, you need to talk to
that guy. You need to get hurtover here, you know, and so I
have that has been driven homethrough the years to where we
send our, you know, ourcorrections officers who are
being promoted to Deputy to anacademy, and they've got 234,

(21:32):
years in a jail setting, andthen they go into these law
enforcement situations, and theyare perfectly comfortable
talking to people and figuringthings out, but also making
decisions and taking control orcharge, whereas these other
folks have never had that. And Ifirmly believe that every PD
officer should have to work fora week or two in their jail that

(21:54):
they will be taking people to inorder to graduate and become a
patrol officer in the city,wherever they're at, because not
only are you going to learnagain who's the bad guy, who's
not the bad guy, what you know,and that kind of stuff, but
you're going to learn the jailstaff too, and just you're going
to get those skills. So that'snever going to happen,
obviously, but, but I thinkit's, it's part of it's, it's,

(22:15):
it's one of the little thingsthat sets sheriff's offices, and
especially Douglas CountySheriff's Office, apart is that
we come up, and I always like touse the joke that we're our
agency is a bit like a tube oftoothpaste, where all the good
stuff is back here, and we haveto keep squeezing it up and out
the front in order to promotebecause we start people here on

(22:36):
the foundation in the jail, Andthen as they move, they move up
and out into these other roles,as opposed to just hiring people
directly to patrol or hiringthese people directly into
supervisory roles or intodetectives, they come from
within. And we have that hasbeen so beneficial for to keep
our culture as a communicatorsand person first attitudes that

(22:58):
has been essential for us. And Ithink that's the number one
reason that we we kind of havethe culture in the community
trust that we do is simplybecause of the way we do the
right things, the right ways,for the right reasons and and
that was what was instilled inus as babies, and that's what we
continue to instill people. Andagain, I'm going off again on a
total tirade, but, and I don'teven really remember where we

(23:23):
were, but so, but about this, itreally starts with this, this
corrections Academy. So thesepeople come to us and it's
eight, eight weeks now, right?
Yeah, eight weeks, classroompractical, plus then then the
training officer stuff. So talkto me about the details of it,
like, what are they what, what'srequired, but what do they get?

(23:45):
Anyways? Well, they're gonna

get, they get a lot. We're very, very lucky to
have the training division andhave the support and the
resources and the resourceAbsolutely, to put people
through this. Yeah, you know, asyou mentioned earlier, we hire
18 years old. You know, we're,hiring kids, yeah, I can say
that with the white and my beardnow,

Chrome. We like to call that Chrome.

Yeah. So we're hiring kids, and this is gonna
be their first job. Might betheir first law enforcement.
This is a good start for them,but they don't know how to deal
with someone who you know, somebad people redoing some bad
people. Most good just made badchoices. Sure,

or they're they're good, but they've put
something inside their body thathas changed them fundamentally.
So rough with the nicest person.
Oh my gosh, I can I haven't Ihave names on the tip of my
tongue, yeah, sober, I'd takeyou to dinner right now.

You know, it's a it's such a good experience for
again, white my beard. We're nowdoing a generation who really
has no communication skills.
It's lacking what they doabsolutely everything was from a
keyboard or, you know, that'show they communicate. It sure.
And we can't text our, you know,detainees, you know, we gotta
deal with them. We gotta be, youknow, communicate. And so I

(25:05):
think that Academy is we'resetting them up to succeed,
sure, right? If you're back inthe day, same when I first
started, here's your keys. And,yeah, go right. Go for shadow,
someone who probably didn't wantanyone assigned to them, you
know. So it's really awkward, 12hour shift for sure, just
watching someone just angry,yeah. So we designed this
program that is is so uniquethat I don't know any other

(25:30):
sheriff's office anywhere thathas what we have, sure. And
we're just doing so many coolthings in this in this academy,
just team building stuff and howto manage stress. You're gonna
see things, hear things, smellthings that you should never,
ever have to see, hear or smell,yeah, but that is the field

(25:52):
we're in, so we got to get themprepared for that. Yeah, that's

the reality of it. And, you know, we talk about
hiring high school kids, and Ithink people lose the side of
the fact that we actually hadone. She still works for us.
She's a deputy on patrol now,but she graduated high school on
a Saturday or Sunday, and thenstarted with us on, like,
Monday. I mean, it was, and sheturned into a great day, and

(26:18):
she's great, and she's doinggreat, you know, but that
doesn't always work out. We'vehad several, several issues,
but, but these are children whoare going are moving directly
into a very adult and difficultjob and and I think it's, I
always joke that it's like everygeneration thinks the next
generation is going to fail,like, you know, you know, as

(26:39):
soon as you start saying, youknow, kids these days, you've
officially moved on to thegeneration that's the next one,
and I am there. But it is. It'sdifferent. They were raised.
Came up through a world that wasjust more disconnected, like the
joke is, my mom didn't knowwhere I was for most of the 80s,
and well now we have live 360and everybody knows where

(27:00):
everybody's at, and you'realways on camera. So it was, it
was pretty easy for me to getaway with that, but there, there
they struggle with that. Butalso we, we're when you, when
you hire entry level young kids,there is always a period of
mourning for that person's lossof childhood. When I was a
supervisor, especially in thejail. I noticed that when the

(27:21):
new ones would come on afterabout six months to a year, you
would see this kind of mourningprocess begin, where they
realized that they were now anadult, they were now having to
work, they were now needinginsurance, they were now looking
for someone to spend the rest oftheir life with, and life had
changed. You know, Mom and Dadweren't buying groceries

(27:41):
anymore. Weren't making, youknow, having dinner for you. You
didn't get to go to school ateight, off at three, do whatever
you wanted after that. And sothat's just another one of those
little things that we we have towork through that is not a job
specific deal, but it'ssomething that affects their
job, and we have to help, helpmake them see how this is all

(28:04):
part of the process, and they'regoing to be okay. You're just
going to have to accept thatyou're not a kid anymore. And,
and, and we have real lifeconsequences. This is not a
game. You don't you don't get tohit the reset button. You don't
get to you don't have anotherlife. Or where the or the person
on the other side does not haveanother life to go into the game
further, and so the jail Academyis just the perfect place to

(28:29):
ease into it, but to learn howto do it, but still have a
little bit of a safety net ortraining wheels before you
really hit the ground running. Imean, I'm not saying I wish I
had when I was coming through,because I had a lot of freedoms
and I was able to do a lot ofthings, but it really would have
benefited me to have somebodywith me a little bit more often.
Be like, Hey, you might want tothink about maybe not doing that

(28:51):
ever again. Or, you know, maybethis is how you should handle
that. Well,

then in 2025 you know, if you're 18, you're
Everyone makes mistakes, but ifyou're growing up, you're going
to make a lot more mistakes. Andin 2025 you can't it's you
cannot make mistakes.

Margin for error is extremely thin, and I just
said it last night at ourcitizen Academy, is that we as
an agency do have and will makemistakes. And the reason that is
is because we only hire humanbeings. They're the only people
who can, they're the only oneswho can, can, can do this job.
But with that comes mistakes,but, but for us, it's always

(29:31):
been kind of, what kind of amistake was it? You know, was
this something that you thoughtwas right, you absolutely were
doing your best, and it justturned out to be wrong, or it
didn't work out. That's onething. And then you tattled on
yourself, and then we workedthrough we worked through it
absolutely we were down withthat. Or did you knowingly
violate a rule or a law and thentry to hide it? That is a
different mistake and handledcompletely differently. And so

(29:54):
the the main thing that I liketo instill, especially in our
young ones, is that you aregoing to make. Mistakes, the
harder you work, the moremistakes or more potential you
have for mistakes. We understandthat. But if you do make
mistake, own it, fix it, learnfrom it and move on, but also
share it so other people canlearn from it too. I think it

(30:15):
was Van Helsing in in Dracula.
He said, we learn. We learn notfrom our successes, but from our
mistakes. And nothing made me abetter cop, like a DUI cop, than
getting my can I say I'm gettingmy ass kicked on the stand by a
good defense attorney, because Itook that out of there. And I'm
like, Okay, I've I have to dothis totally different same way
with mistakes. I want people tolearn just like I tried I was

(30:37):
wrong. Here's what we need to dobetter. Here's what I'm going to
do better. Here's what everybodyneeds to do better. And I think
we've, we've really done a goodjob with the culture on getting
that to happen. So absolutely,sorry. Very commentary. You have
some

things to say, I guess, apparently, that's good.
Hey, you support training. Sothat's exactly you're the
sheriff for me

absolutely. So I guess when it comes to and I
know I don't want it to make itseem like we're only bragging on
us, but you made the point islike there's not many other
places doing this kind of thing,especially in the state of
Kansas and and a that's becausea lot of these we we in as a

(31:22):
state. Douglas County is a largeagency, right? Nationally, I
would say we are a medium tomedium small, probably, agency,
because, you know, there's a lotof places we have 70 years, 78
sworn or something. Whereas youtalk about like Johnson County
has 500 you know, you go to NewYork, PD, and they got 5000

(31:44):
sworn you know, LA or howevermany they have. We are very
small, but by the statestandards for state of Kansas,
we are a larger agency. And sowe have, we have more resources.
We have more funding, becauseour tax base is larger. You get
out into the western part of thestate, and they just simply
don't have the tax base or theability in the hiring pool that
we do. So we are extremelyfortunate. I totally get that

(32:08):
but, but on the flip side isit's not something that we are
required to do, right? We justfeel like it's what's made it,
what it is, what makes us thebest agency for our community,
and so that's why we really,really invest in it. Well,

you know, we haven't talked about this, but
again, training like adminLieutenant is sort of a catch
all right, like whenever youstart dealing with training,
then you're gonna, it's gonna gointo all these other things.
You're gonna go into equipment.
Well, how do we get that? Well,now you're stuck right in
grants. Well now we gotta docommunity events to do this. And
then, then, now you guys aregood at running events, so when

(32:43):
we have something else. Sorecruiting, hiring, recruiting
and retention also falls in ourwheelhouse, you know. And so
something that we have greatlybenefited from the training that
we provide is we were ragging onthe kids earlier, about not

(33:05):
being able to communicate withothers, but something positive,
especially about the youngerpeople and young professionals
you know, up to about, I'd say30, if they know why They're
doing something, yeah, they are.
They will work hard atbasically, I mean, much more

(33:25):
than you know, if I, if I get anold cop who knows how to do the
job, but is, you know, he just,he just wants to clock in, clock
out and get paid. Yep, then I'lltake the young kid that doesn't
know anything, but wants to knowthe why, and then will dedicate
themselves than that, and so byinvesting in the training, which
we did, to better our ownpeople, oh yeah, it has

(33:48):
attracted these kids to us. Weactually, we're not, I don't
think we're full staff, right?

We're, well, our jail is getting full, but again,
the tube of toothpaste, as itfills up, we'd end up pushing
more out to patrol, right? Andso we're still, we're still
short there,

so, right? And so in that process, you know, we're
getting ready to to backfill.
And so we opened up, and we gotoverwhelmed with applications,
like we actually had to shutdown some of the the campaigning
that we were doing because,yeah, because kids are like,
Hey, this is, yeah, I could dothis, right? This makes sense to
me.

Yeah. And the best recruiters we have are
people who work for us. One ofthe biggest compliments I think,
this agency has ever been paid,in my opinion, was when a young
lady came to work for us, wentup through the jail, and then
all of a sudden, her mom came towork for us. At some point, she
had told her mom, you ought tocome work here. It's really
cool. I mean, it's like, howdoes that conversation even

(34:44):
happen? And and thank you forfeeling like we are, we were
safe enough that you would riskputting your mother.

Unknown (34:53):
I'm not gonna go that

far. For me, it's like, Mom, you can come
work here, but I'm never workingwith you. I. Absolutely not. But
no, and I think it's a greatpoint too, about we, you know,
as a society, we talk aboutmillennials, but we're, we just
basically mean entry levelfolks, people who are just
starting out into the nonacademic world. I too, have

(35:15):
found the positive that I, thatI have seen in in those is that
they're, they're a littledistrustful as a whole, coming
out of the gate, especially withfolks in authority. But once you
earn their trust or theirrespect or whatever, they are
loyal to a fault at times, theyonce they are bought in, they

(35:36):
are in and so I think that whilethey are difficult and unique in
some aspects, at times, itdoesn't really matter, because
they are the future. Sotherefore, it is not on them to
change. It is on how do we adaptto make them successful? Just
because they're not going to dothe job the way I did it and

(35:56):
think it should be done doesn'tmean it's wrong, and that's
hard. That's a me problem. Like,that's hard for me to be like,
No, you need to do this, becausethat's how I did it. But really,
we're just, we're just creatingan environment for them to learn
how to be successful and dothese things, maybe in their own
way, or maybe they pull the TVoff on their head a time or two,
and they're like, that doesn'twork. And then they're like,
What was that thing you saidabout how you did it? You know,

(36:18):
maybe they come back, but youhave to have that trust and that
loyalty for them to even belike, hey, all right, I can't
figure this out. What are youguys? What do you think? And so
I think, I think the millennialsget a bad rap at times, but then
again, sometimes they don't helpthemselves out.

And we're actually past millennials. We're
millennials

really, yeah, I am proud. Gen X, yeah, Gen X. I
think we were the lastgeneration to enter adulthood
without any major technology,you know, without computers,
really, and especially cellphones. And so it's, it was a

(36:59):
different world. But it's also Imean, I when I was 14, my
parents dropped me and my friendoff at a Greyhound bus station
at sixth and Michigan to ridethe bus at on a Saturday morning
to Emporia, Kansas to visit afriend of mine whose parent said
they were going to pick pick usup. I would not drop my 14 year
old child off at the gray had aGreyhound bus station that had

(37:23):
to stop in Topeka on its way toEmporia, but it was at the time
that's just what you did. It wasno big deal. So the world has
really, really changed.
Something's good, some thingsmaybe not. But So if, if you
could whisper into the mind ofevery person in this community.
One thing about what it is thatyou do or that this agency does

(37:43):
that you don't think they knowor understand. Like, I wish
everybody knew this. One thingabout me, us this, what would
that be?

Unknown (37:56):
Very good question.
Yeah, good, yeah. That's

you go first.
Yeah. Thanks. Well, so like,like, under Sheriff Simmons, she
said, when I asked her that, shesaid, I would want people to
know that we are not thenational narrative when it comes
to law enforcement and policing,we see these things too, and
that is not us, not so I thoughtthat was an excellent answer.
But something, where would you,where would you think? Where
would you go with that? I thinkjust

in the topic of this conversation that we were
having today is the resourcesthat we have for training. It is
amazing. We are now gettingasked by kltc to train other
counties, other agencies, yeah,so they're now pulling from us.
We're doing things correct,right? When we're getting calls
saying, Hey, can you come I wasin case Kansas City, Kansas

(38:45):
training their officers a coupleweeks ago. Sure, that's unique.
That is, that is amazing thatwe're we have those resources,
and we have the staff and thepeople that we have working for
us,

top notch. Yeah, they're top notch. They're not
just good at what they do.
They're very good at teachingpeople how to do it again.
Anecdotal, Ted Williams wasprobably one of the greatest, if
not the greatest baseball hitterof all time, but when he left
the game and tried to come backas a coach, he struggled deeply,
because he didn't have theability. He couldn't. He

(39:20):
couldn't say, Just do it likethis. That's, you know, just do
it like this. This is how I doit. Just do it like this. He
didn't have the ability toteach. And that is a unique
gift. I am not a good teacher.
My wife gets so frustrated withme when we go and play golf, and
she's like, well, what am Idoing wrong? I'm like, Well, you
know, you just, I don't know,you're just not doing it right.
She's like, he's like, I don'twant to play golf with you

(39:43):
anymore, so, but you know thatis not my strong suit. But that
is also what is so amazing aboutthis agency, is that we have
those people, and we've beenable to move them into these
positions, Deputy Maldonadomaster. Deputy Maldonado. I just
last night, he came walking in.
With his uniform and this thesebig totes. I'm like, What's up,
man? He's like, Oh, I just gotback from the Kelly DC training

(40:03):
academy where I was teaching aclass on, I think it was like,
vest

people tactics, yeah, defensive tactics too,
yeah. We'll grab it on to thecounter carrier.

The external vests are now have now become
something that people willutilize to against police,
because they can grab and holdon to and move you. And also, I
mean, for those that don't know,inside our carriers is this big
loop that comes out, and that isbecause if we have an officer
down, we need to have a way todrag them. But that loop is now

(40:35):
a liability, because if it comesout, or they know it's there,
they now have a hold of you, orthey can even get it around you
so, so he is out teaching otheragencies how to be prepared and
how to not get hurt and to

build upon that.
That same class that was a classthat was asked by kltc to for us
to create. So this was not thatno one offers that kind of

crap. They identified a need and said, Hey,
can you guys do this,

he'll come to us. Yeah, absolutely. So, again,
we're just bragging. That's allright, the view from the 100
about bragging on the sheriff'soffice. Do you ever come up with
anything? Yeah, have a

the one thing you know that's, that's tough, yeah,
sure, come down here, but you'regonna think

of it at midnight tonight.

You know, I, I've, I've been very fortunate in my
career, and I've had a widebreadth of experience, you know,
I've got to work with a lot ofagencies, for three different
agencies, been involved in a lotof critical incidents, you know,
with even agencies I didn't workfor, you know, yeah, I've done

(41:43):
IA investigations, and I've now,I've done a lot of hiring, and I
think what I would want peopleto know about cops, and again,
this is my experience, maybeit's region specific, is that
nobody gets into this professionselfishly or for bad reasons.

(42:05):
They when they come in, theygenuinely want to help and make
a difference. When it goeswrong, it's because of the bad
things they've seen and that wehave failed to train them how to
deal with that properly, or theproper way to solve these
problems that they come across.
So training is the answer.

(42:32):
People are right on that, right,but it's honestly the initial
training. We can always improvethat, right? We can get that,
but we're getting good peoplethat actually want to help their
communities and are willing tomake these sacrifices. So now we
just have to equip them when itcomes time to make these
sacrifices. Here's how you'regoing to have to deal with it.

(42:52):
Sure.

Well, I think, I think there's two things, 2.1 on
one. I'll push back a little bitin that I agree with you that an
overwhelming majority get intothis for the right reasons.
That's fair and that's fair,but, but again, that's on us,
the good cops, to sort out thebad cops, root them out and run
them out, but also make themunable to get a job somewhere

(43:15):
else. And that's a whole, wholeother but I think, I think it's
such a everybody says we need tobe training. We need to be
training. We need to betraining. I can. I could train
every deputy for 100 hours amonth on firefight tactics and
defensive tactics. We could, wecould exclusively, and we could
have the the baddest group ofwarrior minded individuals that

(43:41):
you've ever seen, but is thatthe kind of training that our
community wants us to have? Theyneed us to have a little bit of
that, but they would rather ushave those tactics, as well as
de escalation, bias basedpolicing, mental health for for
the folks who we come in contactwith, but also for ourselves. I
would rather do 100 hours of allof it as opposed to just being

(44:04):
like, Nope, we're just gonnalearn how to win a firefight.
We're gonna learn how to surviveand

not to interrupt, yeah, but I do wanna jump in.
That's one of the things that wetrain a lot in, is how to
identify when to switch back andforth. Sure. Oh, because it can
happen instantaneously, and youhave to switch it off. You have
to switch it off and switch iton. Yeah, right. And so which
hat are you wearing? Because youare gonna play every role you

(44:32):
can think of in a matter

of seconds. In a matter of seconds. I've said it
for years, other than perhapsour military, I don't know of an
of a job outside of lawenforcement, where you have to
be prepared in a split second totake a life or give somebody a
hug you and, and it may even bethe same person you just don't

(44:54):
even know. And, and I think thatthat that gets lost a lot in the
national narrative, but also. Soyou know, even like when it
comes to let's say there's adeadly force incident where a
person is shot and killed, thoseofficers who took that life, as
soon as that threat is renderedno longer they have to take that

(45:16):
warrior hat off and put thehuman hat back on and be like
now, let's get you the help youneed, if we can and do all we
can to try to help you throughthis. And that is a very
difficult I mean, for folks,I've never been involved in
shooting, and I hope I never am,but that would be a very

(45:36):
difficult thing to go through,is to be in a position that you
need to stop a threat that maytake a life and then immediately
switch into trying to save thatlife. And so I think that's a
great point. Is that that thatthat nationally and locally, I
wish people would would takethat into account and understand

(45:56):
that it's not as simple as justsaying, Why aren't you helping
him? Because I just because thisjust happened, my body is
trying, is screaming at me to dosomething totally different, and
so, but then and then and then,in a kind of the same but
separate is, again, people areso tired of hearing me talk
about mental health for firstresponders. But again, it's like

(46:20):
if we are not taking care ofpeople, we why are we sending
them into the most stressful anddangerous situations our
community can provide to us andexpecting them to handle them
perfectly? And so I was on apodcast years ago with this guy
who's mental health professionalsomewhere up in the in the New
England states, and he made suchan amazing point, and he we were

(46:41):
talking about first respondermental illness wellness, and he
said, He's like, he's like, he'slike, tell me this, Jay, if you
were sitting at your shift tablewaiting for your shift to start
and your partner walks in andhe's limping, and you say, Hey,
why are you limping? What'sgoing on? He's like, Oh, I'm
fine. You'd be like, Okay, well,I hope you're okay. But then if

(47:01):
he walks in and he's got a bonesticking out of his leg, and
you're like, what's wrong withyour leg? He says, Nothing. I'm
fine. You don't accept thatanswer, like, this is not
happening. You are not goingout. We're not doing this. Why
do we let somebody with a mentalsituation where they are not
well, go out into thesesituations, and it's the same
thing so as and again, this is aculture issue where, for even

(47:27):
I'm not saying this is not tosay that the sheriff's office
that I grew up in didn't care.
It was just that we had a workwe had a job that we had to do,
and we had a group of people whodid it, and if you showed an
ounce of weakness, you were notgoing to be in that group
anymore. And so we were, we werethe get back in the saddle. You
got a job to do, eat it in here,chew it outside, kind of, kind

(47:48):
of mentality, and we havelearned that just wasn't quite
right. And so now we teach a lotof mental health stuff in our
academy, in our continuingeducation. But also we've, we've
created initiatives within theagency to just let people know
is like, hey, what you just sawthat was not okay, and, and, and
selfishly, I'm glad you're hurta little bit, because that means

(48:13):
you're human, like, it means youcare. Like, if that bothers you,
because it should. That's theright response. Now, how do we
get you to where you're feelingokay about it and you're ready
to go to work and do that kindof stuff? And I think that that
culture has shifted nationallyas well, but in our agency, it's
it's been amazing just to seethe amount of people who are
willing. And again, we go backto these millennial folks. They

(48:34):
are way more prepared to handletheir mental health than any of
us, like they come into us readyto be better and be okay, and
talk about things that we werenever prepared to so so of we
can talk all the bad thingsabout that generation. They are.
They are on top of their mentalhealth. That

is so true for sure. Yeah, yeah. And that's
something we offer. You know,when we are bringing them in for
their interviews, I mean, we hitthat pretty hard. We're going to
be here for you if you can signon. Sure. You know we're a good
fit, we're going

to take care of you. Yeah, and, and that is not
something we can fail at, no,and there is no room for error
in that. So I feel pretty goodabout where we've gone and the
programs we got in place. So Ido want to talk briefly Kyle
more specifically towards you.
Yeah, no, I want you to talkabout, you have a title, and I'm
going to get it wrong, but it'sthe LGBTQ. I A rep something.

(49:25):
What it before? I totallyscrewed.

Now you're going to the LGBTQ plus liaison
courtly. Or courtly is on Jesus,the liaison for the for the LGBT
community,

okay? And it's specifically for the Sheriff's
Office, but also you do a lot ofwork locally and regionally,
yeah,

so we do have a, it's a call it the Kansas City
Metro Law Enforcement Network,all the LGBTQ liaisons for the
entire area. So we hit differentdifferent events. It's sure,
just being present, yeah, we'refirst and foremost. Everyone
kind of comes to us saying, Hey,what are you guys doing? Are you

(50:07):
gonna get this event? Can weshare your table? Or, you know,
it is a fantastic experiencethat I got to deal with this
Sure, I you know, as a gay male,surprise anymore.

Unknown (50:24):
Nobody in this room is

surprised, not surprised. Coming into this
field, you know, in lawenforcement, as a gay male,
yeah, that wasn't easy. Sure. Ihad my own, my own experiences,
not sure, not very positive,especially kind of where I came
from, sure, smaller town, Biblebelt, you know. And I understand

(50:48):
that there the the conflict thatyou might have with law
enforcement being in a in theLGBT community, there's, we work
for the government, right? Soevery decision that the
government makes, right? Itaffects them. Yeah. Affects
people in our community, whetherit be executive orders, whether

(51:09):
it be new laws, whether that bewhatever that may be, yeah,
we're seen as the governmentright, and we're the ones that
have to enforce those linessometimes, yeah? So we made we
just look like the bad guyssometimes. And we gotta, that's
the hand we're dealt with, sure.
So we have to work through that.

(51:30):
So we have to show yeah, thatwe're out there. Oh, man, yeah.
We have a such a diverse agencywith full spectrums of everyone
from our community, in thatcommunity, in that community,
100% and that's why, that's whyit works out so well, yeah, we
have a lot of support in thecommunity. We do because we are
reflection, yeah,

that, and that's what that is, one of the one of
the kind of the feathers in ourcaps is that we are somewhat
representative of our community.
Now, do I wish we had more folksfrom other diverse cultures. Of
course, I do. I wish we butagain, sometimes it's hard to
earn that trust. You know, Italk constantly about the
beautiful and strong NativeAmerican population in this in
this college and this universitythat we have in our town, I that

(52:13):
has been an underutilizedrelationship that I have not
done my part to to to engenderinto to to gain, make track, you
know, make it work. But when itcomes to the LGBTQ community, I
feel like Lawrence, first off,is a leader

in I call it the San Fran of cancer. We

absolute, we we very, we are, we are we are
Berkeley, we are Austin, we are,you know, and I, but I, I'm with
you in that, you know, I know, Iknow my heart, and I know where,
where I am on these, on theseissues, but when I put that
uniform on, I can't help the waythat they see or perceive me and

(53:07):
that uniform and you know, eventhrough the Pride Parade, we
would get calls from peoplescreaming, protect us, you know,
and and that that is notoffensive at All, and it's not a
threat, it's not an anger thatis their truth, and it's being
shouted at me, and I want toshout back, I will, or I want

(53:28):
to, but there again, there aretimes that the government does
things that we simply can't, youknow, you know, do anything with
or or change but, but the thingthat we're trying to show the
community is that We are hereand we want to make sure
everybody is safe, everybodyfeels safe, and everybody feels
heard. But if there is somethingbad that happens, we're here to

(53:50):
work with you to get you throughit. You may not like the
outcome. You know, it mayinvolve an arrest, but just like
with our trans community, ifthey if one of those folks are
arrested, we work very, veryhard with that person to make
sure that they are housed in away that is a legal because the
state has mandated how we housefolks when it comes to male or

(54:11):
female biologically, but theycannot legislate how we work
with them through that process.
And so that is, again, one ofthose things that I feel like we
are. We're very ahead of thecurve on we've had, we've had
folks who identify say, femalehoused, female treated female in
our jail, because that's that'show it should be. But as soon as

(54:34):
they leave our jail and go tothe Kansas Department of
Correction or prison, they arethrown straight into a male
housing unit because theybiologically fit that criteria.
To me, that's heartbreaking,absolutely heartbreaking, but
it's also something I have nocontrol over. But what I what we
do have control over, is howyou're treated while you're in
with us and so and

you know every every member, when you get hired
on goes, I do put on a classroomfor them. I. Contacts with LGBT
community, you know, especiallyfor our trans folks, yeah,
they're going through a lotright now, they're going through
a lot, so we have to be verytransparent. Yeah, you know,
when we talk about policereports, it may have a name that

(55:17):
they don't go by any right? Sowe have to be conscious to say
this is why this name isn'there, but we have to go by
illegally. What this is, this iswhat the process is going to
look like when, you know, in thejail. Yep, we may have to ask
certain personal questions,sure, but we need to explain why
we're asking questions. Just betransparent, absolutely and

(55:39):
we're going to mess up.

Absolutely I'm going

to misgender somebody, I'll be the first to
admit it, and you apologize andyou move on. Yeah,

yeah. Pronouns are difficult for me, just
because, simply, they don't workgrammatically. Sometimes, sure
they is a very difficult thingto utilize, especially what I've
noticed is if it's somebody I'vehad a previous relationship and
have known them in anothersince. It was hard for me, but,
but I just think again likethat, like my child. My children

(56:10):
are 20 and 22 their generationis just not a big it's not a
thing to nothing. They somebodysays that, hey, you know my
pronouns are this. They're justlike, bam, got it. But you get
the old, crusty white dude likeme, and I'm just like, I'm
trying my best. I really am.
But, but, you know, and that's,that's a best case scenario. On
the flip side, some people arejust treated with contempt and

(56:30):
hatred, and so, so, yeah, Ijust, I wanted to, I wanted to
touch on that, and just to kindof talk through is like, again,
we're fortunate enough to have acommunity that supports this
initiative. But it's also isthat we just see this as we
treat humans like, humans likeand how they deserve to be, no
matter how they choose to livetheir life, inside or outside of

(56:51):
our jail. But it's, I justthink, it's I think it's
something that that the world isbeginning to turn a little bit
more towards. But we're there'sa lot of work to be done. And
again, those communities thatfeel unsafe, you know, I get it.
I've never lived that life, andI'm not going to sit here and
tell you, No, you are safe,because you might not be, but
what I am telling you is that ifyou come in contact with one of

(57:13):
us, we are going to do our verybest to treat you in a human
first approach, and especiallybecause most of the times, by
the time that we're involved inanything, it's a bad situation,
it could very well be the worstsituation they've ever been in.
So we take that very seriously.
So thank you so much for for thework you do on that. But also
just kind of explaining it tofolks. Let's see any other, any

(57:37):
other things that you think thatwe need to tell the people
about, you know, because we'regonna have like nine people
listen to this thing.

Unknown (57:42):
So, so it's a big impact. Yeah, huge, huge.
Something's jumping out at me.

Okay, well, I always, I always ask the same
dumb question, but I'm gonna,I'm gonna ask you both, as part
of learning whom you are, Ialways like to know what was
your first concert? What wasyour most recent concert, and
what was your favorite concert?
Those could be those all threecould be the same thing, but
they may be vastly different,and you may not. And that's the

(58:12):
things I've learned through thistoo, is like some people just
aren't music people, they'relike, I've never been to a
concert, which makes me judgeyou harshly.

Well, I've seen you do this before, so I knew
already got it down. So yeah, Iwas well, and my first concert
was in Lawrence. I had a one ofmy childhood friends, his older
brother had a metal band, andthey got a gig. And so me and my

(58:42):
friend, we weren't old enough todrive, so his mom had to drive
us up here. And I, I remember itbeing at the bottleneck. I mean,
that's the name I remember. Butnow that I've been, you know, in
the bars downtown, I think itwas the replay, like that makes
more sense, like with thememories, sure, you know, but
yeah, heavy metal. I can't evenremember the name, right?

(59:02):
Absolutely. Yeah, older brother,so he's got to be the coolest

guy. Yeah, a metal scene in Lawrence for a
small show would be, that'd bepretty intense. That's a

Unknown (59:14):
good time, right? Yeah, it was, especially at 14

educational,

yeah, my most recent and my favorite was Luke
combs at arrowhead. Oh yeah, acouple two years ago, maybe,
sure, yeah, my wife's niecewanted to go, and so we got
floor tickets. I mean, you know,right, it was, it was a good
show. I

admittedly am not a country newer country fan,
which he tends to fall in thatcategory. But I've he's been
guests on some hunting showsthat I really enjoy, the meat
eater podcast and that kind ofstuff. I'm pretty sure I can
hang out with that dude thathe's just a good, good guy,
seems like. So yeah, I'm withyou. That'd be, that'd be a good
show. I bet he puts on a good.
It was pretty good time.

Kyle Appleby (01:00:02):
Well, my first concert was called Fleming and
John and some

Jay Armbrister (01:00:09):
No, no, I got nothing. Were they Yeah? Were
they like a one hit wonder or

Yeah? They were in the late 90s, early 2000s kind
of Fleming and John, Fleming andJohn and they were the Ozark
Empire fair. Where was that? AtSpringfield? Springfield, okay,
yeah, so that was good. That wasmy first. My last one was pink.
And I think my favorite, oh, Ihad parents above Lady Gaga was

(01:00:35):
my, oh, man,

that was my.
Where was that AT T Mobile? Howlong ago? A couple years or,
yeah, gosh, four years ago. Ibet that would be quite a
spectacle.

It was good, yeah, so if you didn't know I was gay
before, well, it's,

Unknown (01:00:48):
yeah, I resisted saying anything.

No, I'm gonna, I'm gonna do you one better.
Years and years ago, through thegrapevine, I was on patrol, and
you were a new correctionsofficer, and somebody was like,
hey, Appleby, he won tickets tosee Britney Spears, and he's
getting a go. He's, he's superexcited, so he rented a limo.
And I'm like, Really, yep, dead.
I should have known that's aclue. Yeah, absolutely. So,

(01:01:12):
okay, well, I think we've,we've, we've broached all the
subjects that we had hoped toget through. Obviously, I say
this every time people are tiredto hear me, I just I really
appreciate the work that youguys do. I appreciate the two of
you just so deeply because ofthe not just the impact you have
on the folks that we have, butthe future. Because the people

(01:01:35):
you train today are going to bethe trainers in five years, and
they're going to be theadministrators in 10 years and
15 years, and so it is. It'ssuch a butterfly effect that if
you treat them right now,they're going to turn into
better employees and betterleaders in the future. So I
think people lose sight of howmuch that impact is. But also,

(01:01:56):
you know it, this is an agencythat I love deeply, and I want
to be successful for centuriesto come, but knowing that how we
what we're doing now, is goingto affect the agency that I'm
not going to work for, but it'sgoing to be the one that's going
to be protecting me and myfamily, because I'm never
leaving here. And so thank youso much for that, for that. But

(01:02:18):
other than that, I think, Ithink that pretty well does it
for us today, we got one

Rich Qualls (01:02:26):
more thing. Oh, what was that to the eight
people? If you want to come workfor us, we're almost full, we're
almost full staff, but go to thewebsite, DGS, oh.org, yep. And I
think there's a employment tab.
Click on that, and then it'llgive you into the pre screening.

And I have to, I have to shout out our our county
commission, because a year and ahalf ago, they passed through a
pay package being nestled rightnext to Johnson County that has
a tax base that is roughly thesize of the East Coast. I think,
right, we can't compete withthem. You know, not just Johnson
County Sheriff's Office, but thenext says overland parks and the

(01:03:06):
Olathe. We can't compete withthem. And we were losing people
simply for money. We were We hademployees that actually left us
and say, I would, I would stayand work here if I can make that
money. And and so they, they sawthat, they helped us out, and we
got a pay package pushedthrough. And the results of that
have been magical, I would say.
But I think, if I'm notmistaken, the starting pay for a

(01:03:29):
corrections officer today is ahair under $28

Unknown (01:03:35):
I think 2799 an hour.

So a hair one secretary one, yeah, roughly,
roughly. And so that has reallyoffered us the opportunity to
not just get more applications,but be a little bit more
selective and make sure thatwe're getting the right fits.
And so again, the Commissionwent out on a limb and helped us

(01:03:59):
out by doing that you know, hugeway. And so we're very
fortunate. But yeah, if you wantto come and work for the
Sheriff's Office, we welcome it.
The other thing is, like, Wehire a lot of civilians as well.
You know, we have a lot ofcivilian positions, and we're
learning now, we're seeing nowthat those don't turn over as
much. Maybe people are happyhere, but it's also the county
has very good benefits. It's sofunny, because when I hired in,

(01:04:21):
they were like, Oh my gosh, theretirement is amazing, the
insurance is amazing. And here Iam, this 22 year old kids, like,
I don't care. Can I have thekeys to the car or not? You
know? And but now that I'm I'mkind of snuggling up to
retirement. I'm like, man, wehave really great retirement. We
have really great insurance andall that stuff. So yeah, it's
been a fantastic place to work.

(01:04:45):
So thank you so much for beingon thank you for coming and
joining me. I doubt that they'regoing to the people listening
are going to get out of thisconversation what I did, because
I just love listening andhearing about it. But thank you
so much for doing it, and weappreciate everything you do.
You. And we'll see you. I don'tknow what some catch phrase now
we'll see you on the flip side,or something. I don't know.

(01:05:06):
Thank you so much. Have a goodrest your week. Thank you.

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Episode 03 - Minds & Methods: Lt. Rich Qualls and Master Corrections Officer Kyle Appleby

Episode Transcript

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Episode 03 - Minds & Methods: Lt. Rich Qualls and Master Corrections Officer Kyle Appleby