Discover the secrets to bulletproofing your financial future with Hillel Presser, a leading asset protection attorney.
Have you ever wondered how some of the most successful entrepreneurs stay judgment-proof in today's litigious environment?
Gain insights from Hillel's extensive experience, including working with top figures in sports and entertainment, as he unveils strategies to safeguard your wealth and protect your business assets.
GREAT nuggets here on becoming uncollectible and securing your financial legacy.
People routinely pay Hillel tens of thousands of dollars for a consultation but you can get some great info right here on our podcast!
Be sure to request a FREE copy of his book, "Asset Protection Secrets," for a deeper dive into protecting your entrepreneurial endeavors. Visit www.assetprotectionattorneys.com and mention you found them on our show!
Visit www.weboughtafranchise.com to subscribe.
Send us your questions for an upcoming episode at 305-710-0050.
From your pals in franchise ownership, Jack and Jill Johnson.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hi everyone.
Welcome back to the we Bought aFranchise podcast.
I'm Jack Johnson.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
I'm Jill Johnson.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
And today we have a very special guest for you guys,
Hillel Presser, who is themanaging partner and founder of
the Presser Law Firm.
Hillel, how are you Welcome tothe show?
Speaker 3 (00:17):
I'm doing great.
Thanks for having me today.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
So, for all of our listeners out there, hillel is a
little bit of a different guestthan our normal guest, right?
Normally, hillel, we havebusiness owners, franchise
owners.
Of course, you are amulti-business owner, but this
is something what Hillel does.
He's an asset protectionattorney and for those of you
out there that are businessowners, that are striving to
become business owners, this issomething that you absolutely
(00:42):
need to know about.
This might be one of our mostimportant podcasts, because as
you grow a business, as you makemore money, you need to protect
it.
And, hillel, I think it was twodays ago on LinkedIn, I'm
scrolling through my feed andthere's Damon John and he's
talking about like five booksevery business owner needs to.
Did you see it?
(01:02):
And the first one that he talksabout is your book Asset
Protection Secrets.
Dude, how are you like on thiskind of you know first name
basis with Damon?
Tell us about that.
Speaker 3 (01:14):
Well, Damon's a very good friend of mine Obviously
I've helped him with a lot ofstuff and we do a lot of work
together but, most importantly,just a great person, great human
being and a great friend, sojust always happy to help him
and anyone else who needs it.
Speaker 1 (01:30):
I mean, what a great testimony.
I mean he's a freaking shark.
He's on our TV every night andyou're like part, you work with
him.
I mean, I mean, you guys,that's a killer testimonial
right off the bat.
I have to tell you guys, youguys, that's a killer
testimonial right off the bat.
I have to tell you guys, as wedig in with Hillel, people
routinely pay him tens ofthousands of dollars for a
session.
So this information you guysare going to get today, any
(01:53):
nuggets that Hillel is going toshare, you better listen up
because they're very important.
And so, hillel, you know whereto begin.
Maybe tell us a little bitabout what your company does,
what you do and what you thinkpeople need to know about.
Speaker 3 (02:06):
Sure.
So I tease and I say that I amthe lawyer that hates lawyers.
You know there's probablyhundreds, if not thousands, of
lawyers in every single citytrying to find a way to take
money from you.
How can they sue you and howcan they redistribute the wealth
?
I'm one of only a few in theentire country that actually
(02:27):
teach people how to protect it.
So everybody's so worried aboutmaking money, but obviously the
only worst thing than notmaking money is losing it.
So I always tell clients I willnever make you one penny richer
.
It's my job to make sure thatyou don't become one penny poor,
and it's so important and it'ssomething admitted to make sure
that you don't become one pennypoor, and it's so important and
it's something, admittedly, youknow as you're on your way up as
(02:48):
an entrepreneur.
Speaker 1 (02:49):
You're right, I mean, everybody's thinking about how
do we make it right, how do youmake money, but it's something
everyone needs to be aware of ishow to protect yourself as you
grow your assets and how yougrow your business, um and and
so I think this information isso crucial, especially to
entrepreneurs.
You know, maybe, hillel, let'stalk about some of the things
(03:09):
that people what are peopleapproaching you for generally,
what are the biggest pain points?
Speaker 3 (03:16):
Sure.
Well, first of all, people arecoming to me from all across the
country because they've workedhard and they want to take their
chips off the table and theywant to become as uncollectible
and judgment-proof as possible.
They know that we live in avery litigious, frivolous
society.
They know that one lawsuit canwipe them out, and it doesn't
even have to be something thatthey do.
They can be sued because theirkid drives their car and gets in
(03:39):
an accident or their employeedoes something on behalf of the
business.
So clients come to me to helptake their chips off the table
and what I do is I make it sodifficult, so expensive, if not
impossible, for anybody tocollect against my client that
they don't want to sue my clientin the first place.
If I can stop my client frombeing sued, we've saved hundreds
(04:02):
of thousands or millions ofdollars right there.
If they do sue my clientbecause you can never stop
somebody for suing my client Iwant to make them as
uncollectible and judgment-proofas possible, which allows my
clients to settle their case for5, 10, 15 cents on the dollar.
So there's always that doubt asto liability who's going to win
(04:24):
the case?
What we do is we create thedoubt as to collectability.
We tell them that even if youwin the case which we don't
think you will my client isuncollectible and judgment proof
and you can spend the next fiveor 10 years finding that out
yourself or going after them, orwe can settle right now, and
we've been able to settle $20million lawsuits for $250,000,
(04:47):
$5 million judgments for$500,000, not because my clients
won the case, but because myclients made it difficult and
expensive to collect againstthem.
Speaker 1 (04:59):
That's a really good point, so it's very interesting
the things that you're saying.
I was curious to see Hillel andmaybe you could talk about this
, for example, in our own state.
Hillel lives in Florida, justlike we do.
Some of the protections thatHomestead provides to homeowners
.
Frankly, it's amazing.
I don't know that all stateshave this kind of protection.
Speaker 3 (05:19):
Absolutely.
And I'll tell you first of all,I love what you guys do, so
thank you.
I love the franchise industry.
It is tough, obviously.
I know in franchise they sayit's not if you get sued, it's
when you get sued.
But I love the franchiseindustry, so thank you for what
you're doing.
I find it fascinating whatyou're talking.
I actually call and I have aname for it.
I call it jurisdiction shopping.
(05:40):
So just like you go to the malland you shop for a jacket, just
like people pick a state basedon taxes, people pick a state
based on what assets areprotected.
So living in Florida I joke andI tease it's a great place to
live if you want to be a debtor.
It might be the reason why OJmoved here, probably the reason
(06:01):
why all the big CEOs from NewYork City move here and buy a
$30 million mansion at BocaRaton right before they get sued
.
Because in Florida there arewhat are called exemptions, and
exemptions are state laws thatprotect certain assets.
And in Florida your house isprotected.
In Florida, your retirementaccounts are protected.
(06:23):
In Florida, your life insurance, your annuities, your wages are
protected.
I could go on and on.
Now contrast that with a statelike New York or California.
You know, in New York orCalifornia your house may only
be protected up to a couplehundred thousand dollars.
So if I have a client in NewYork or California, I'm telling
them do not buy an expensivehouse.
(06:43):
And if you do buy an expensivehouse, don't pay off the
mortgage.
I don't want there to be equityto lose in a lawsuit.
When I'm counseling a Floridaclient, I tell them buy the most
expensive house you can and payoff the mortgage because no one
can take it.
And no different withretirement accounts.
I think last time I checked thelaw for protection of
retirement accounts inCalifornia was to the extent
(07:07):
reasonably necessary for supportdeemed by a judge.
I don't know about you, but Idon't want a judge telling me
what part of my retirementaccounts are protected.
So again, people move todifferent states.
Florida is a great state.
Texas is a great state.
Based on the laws and based onwhat's protected, you can be
worth $100 million in Floridaand as long as that $100 million
(07:31):
is spread out between yourhouse, your retirement accounts,
your annuities, your lifeinsurance and some other items,
nobody can take what you workedso hard for.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
It's amazing.
I mean, it's one of thosethings that it's like you don't
really think about it untilmaybe it happens to you.
So getting the word out rightnow is so important because you
don't want to end up in thatsituation and say you know it's
actually like as franchiseconsultants, we have a lot of
people who you know go buy afranchise and then realize it's
not for them and they say, gosh,I wish I knew about you, guys,
(08:01):
it's the same with you.
This is so important for peopleto know, because sometimes it's
too late and then you look atthem and say I helped you.
So I love that we're talkingabout this now, because I think
we can help so many people.
Speaker 3 (08:16):
Yeah, and I always tell people.
You know.
People always say when doesasset protection not work?
And it's simple.
There's two ways it doesn'twork.
Number one is when you're notproactive.
If you go out there you get ina car accident and six months
later you try and protectyourself, there's a chance they
can try and unwind what you did.
So you want to be proactive soyou can protect all your assets
(08:38):
from everyone every time.
The other thing is when peopledon't follow their structure.
I always call it honor thystructure.
I always tell people I can puttogether a bulletproof, rock
solid plan.
But if you don't honor yourstructure, if you get sued and
you go in front of a judge, whywould you expect the judge to
(08:58):
honor your structure?
So super important to beproactive, super important to
honor your structure and reallyimportant just to educate
yourself.
You know what important tohonor your structure and really
important just to educateyourself.
You know what I do is a nichewhich someone may look at as a
great thing, but the issue is alot of people don't know that we
exist until it's too late.
So, unlike every radio station,tv station, billboard, bus
(09:20):
bench, et cetera.
That's promoting the personalinjury attorneys.
Who can I sue?
Well, there's only a few of usin the entire country that
actually teach people how toprotect it.
So, unfortunately, sometimeswhen people find out it's after
the fact and it may be too late.
So Halal.
Speaker 1 (09:36):
I have a question for you, and this is a you know
something people are probablygoing to want to know as they
listen.
What size should I mean forsomeone to come to you?
If someone's got like a hundredgrand, that's probably not your
client, right?
What, what, what size client?
And I don't know if this is aquestion you can answer, but
what size client should betalking to you?
Speaker 3 (09:55):
Sure.
So, first of all, my missionand my purpose is to educate and
help as many people as I can.
So I help clients who don'thave a lot of money and I
probably lose money on thoseclients and I'm okay with it
because I want to help them andI always give this example.
You know we've represented Idon't know 30, 40 professional
athletes, nfl, nba players.
(10:16):
Well, take a professional NFLplayer who signs a $50 million
contract.
If they get sued for $5 million, they're not happy, but they
still have $45 million left.
Now contrast that with a schoolteacher.
She's worked her entire lifeand saved up a couple hundred
thousand dollars.
If she gets sued for a milliondollars, she's wiped out.
(10:37):
It's catastrophic.
There's no coming back for it.
So I can actually argue theless you have, the more
important asset protectionbecomes.
Now, obviously I'm not going touse the same strategies and
tools and techniques for theschool teacher with $200,000 as
I would for the football playerwith 45 million.
You know you have to do anopportunity.
You know cost benefit analysis.
(10:58):
But anybody who has anythingthat they don't want to lose
should protect themselves andthere's a lot of things that
don't cost money that you can do.
You know, just like one of theexamples that we spoke about
were the exemptions.
So somebody, just based on whatstate they live in, if they
have $100,000, maybe byinvesting that in a certain
asset class, whether it be lifeinsurance, annuities, retirement
(11:21):
accounts, et cetera just bydoing that they can protect
themselves and they don't needto pay one penny to do that.
Speaker 1 (11:28):
It's amazing.
Awesome.
That's great information.
That's really good Halal.
You're doing always so manythings.
You're an interesting guy.
Do you want to talk about someof the other businesses that
you're working on?
How about let's talk a littlebit about business exit advisors
?
Is that something you'd like totalk about?
(11:49):
Sure.
Speaker 3 (11:50):
So, like you said, look, I love business.
I'm an entrepreneur at heart.
I love it.
My asset protection law firm isalways my baby.
I will always have it.
I will never stop doing it.
That's where I spend themajority of my time.
But you know, I'm anentrepreneur by heart and I love
the hunt.
And one of the other businessesthat I'm involved with not so
much on the day-to-day isBusiness Exit Advisors.
(12:13):
And what Business Exit Advisorsis is it's a business brokerage
.
So if I asked you, how manypeople do you know real estate
agents that could sell yourhouse?
The problem is you know toomany.
If you give it to your friend,your sister gets mad.
If you give it to your sister,your cousin gets mad.
It seems like everybody in theworld is a real estate agent,
but when I say to people, howmany people do you know that can
(12:36):
actually sell your business?
Nobody really knows anyone.
And last time I checked thestats it was something crazy.
It was like for every 400 realestate agents, there's one
business broker.
So again, very, very specialniche.
And that business Business ExitAdvisors helps people sell
(12:56):
their business, franchise theirbusiness or consults their
business to get them ready forsale, and their tagline is our
business is selling yourbusiness.
Now again, I'm not involved withthe day-to-day.
I have a phenomenal team.
I'm some of the best people whohave been around in the
industry forever and have helpedbuild some of the best people
who have been around in theindustry forever and have helped
build some of the biggestbusiness brokerages out there.
(13:16):
But I love the business and Ilove seeing all the different
businesses and our businesseskind of go hand in hand because
if you think about it, ifsomebody sells their business,
this is actually pretty crazy.
People don't realize.
The biggest lawsuit I seebesides car accidents and slip
and falls and things like thatare when people sell their
business and people always havea tough time understanding this.
They say what do you mean?
(13:37):
I sold my business and now Ihave no liability, and it's the
largest lawsuit we see.
74% of business transactionseither fail to materialize or
end up in litigation within acertain period of time.
Materialize or end up inlitigation within a certain
period of time.
55% of US companies lose a bareminimum of 40% of their gross
(13:59):
revenues during an ownershiptransition and if you think
about it, it makes sense, right?
Nobody will ever run thebusiness like you.
So when you sell the business,a lot of times not always income
goes down, expenses go up.
A lot of times not alwaysincome goes down, expenses go up
and all of a sudden, a year ortwo later, the new owner is
suing the old owner for fraud.
I always call it renegotiation.
(14:20):
So I always tell my businessowner clients, whether they're
through the business brokerageor not, the minute you sell your
business you get those chipsoff the table because you never
know if there's going to be aclawback.
Speaker 2 (14:31):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:32):
You know, that's really, that's a really really
good point.
And when we counsel our clientsto think about selling their
business, or they come to us andthey say, listen, it's not for
me.
We often advise them to look atit like selling your home.
When you go to sell your house,you want to make sure that
thing looks great, right, youwant to.
(14:53):
You've got to get it ready forshowings.
You want to make sure whenpeople walk in they say, man,
this house is amazing, I've gotto have it.
If you didn't do that, peopleare going to walk in and say,
man, this is dumb, I'm nevergoing to buy it Right.
Speaker 2 (15:04):
I mean, you have your , your fixer uppers that think
that they can come in and fix itup, but there's a lot of issues
with that.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
Well, and it's another reason why when people,
when we're advising people onhow they should build their
franchise, the aiming point andthis is a hard thing for
entrepreneurs to hear, becausewe all want to be special, we
all want to be the stars, butultimately you should build your
business to run without you.
Ultimately, if you can build abusiness to where it does not
(15:32):
need your daily intervention,you've done a fabulous thing.
Because the owners.
What happens is, if the ownersare too involved in the business
, if they are too attached tothe employees, the minute that
business sells, half the teamquits.
You're right, the revenue goesdown, so you want that thing to
be as good as possible when yougo to sell it.
And then, hillel, aninteresting thing happens All of
(15:54):
a sudden.
You've built your business backup, someone's ready to buy it
and you're like wait a second.
Speaker 2 (15:58):
You remodel your house to sell it and you're like
wait, this is gorgeous, likewhy am I leaving?
So yeah, it does happen, butbut it is.
Speaker 3 (16:07):
And I and I totally agree with you you know a lot of
people who think they havebusinesses and listen, I'm not
excluded by any means.
It's easy to it's always easyto say something.
It's much tougher to dosomething.
But a lot of people who thinkthey have businesses, they don't
have businesses.
They may make a lot of moneybut they may just be getting
paid very, very highly for theirtime.
So if they're involved in thebusiness and it can't run
(16:28):
without them, there's an issue.
And you know, to your othercomment, I've been involved in
billion dollar businesstransactions where at the last
minute the owner decided hedidn't want to sell and instead
of a third party coming in andbuying out call it the two or
three partners one or twopartners say Nope, I want to
stay, and either they buy outthe business or they buy it with
(16:50):
the new buyer and only some ofthe owners leave.
Because you know again people.
You know they work theirbusiness up to sell it, but they
wake up the next day and all ofa sudden they have no purpose.
So something that we'll do atBusiness Exit Advisors is not
just sell your business, getyour business ready for sale,
franchise your business, protectthe proceeds.
But what's your purpose afterthe sale?
(17:12):
You know you could have an exit.
I don't care if it's for a hugenumber $300 million but when
you wake up on Monday and youhave nothing to do, you may feel
like you're at your lowestpoint, even though you just sold
the business last week.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
Yeah, so that's a that's a really good point in
franchising, because the thingthat makes a franchise special,
ultimately, is the hustle of thefranchise owner.
I mean, even as, and Jill and Iinvested in our Pink's
franchise because, you're right,as franchise consultants we're
just glorified salespeople.
I mean, everything we make iswhat we do.
(17:46):
I mean we're here to counselclients and share our knowledge,
but the business can't runwithout us.
Yeah, it's us, the business isus and share our knowledge.
Speaker 2 (17:51):
but the business can't run without us.
Yeah, it's us, the business isus.
Speaker 1 (17:53):
It's us Right.
So even if on paper I couldshow you a great looking P&L,
you'd never pay me what I thinkthe business is worth, because
Jill and I are the ones thatmake it go and that's where,
ultimately, we knew we had tobuy the Pinks franchise, because
we need a business thatultimately can run without us.
Speaker 3 (18:10):
Yeah, and, as you know, I love that Pakes
franchise business.
I think it's genius, I thinkit's brilliant.
I see your trucks all over thecity doing great, great work and
great, great jobs so phenomenal.
I mean, you guys got to that.
I remember even talking aboutit and it was after you guys did
it and I was like man, I wish Iwas involved in that, but you
(18:37):
said it right, which is you gotto have the fire in the belly.
It's not about the kill, it'sabout the hunt.
You know, making money is justthe scorecard, it's just, it
just shows you that you did itright.
A real business owner, a realentrepreneur, has to love what
they do.
You know, I always love thequote Somebody asked me to you
know, donate to a school that Idonated a bunch of money to, and
for me it's like I need to havea connection, like I need to
have a connection, I need tohave an emotional, and they said
, hey, can you just donate?
You know x room, and I said no,because x room means nothing to
me.
(18:57):
And you know I looked at theand I donated the fashion
classroom because my wife wasinto fashion and I had made a
donation with my partner becauseit was special for me, and my
partner and I looked at theplans and you know there was
nothing really that I had anemotional connection to and I
said said to them.
I said I have an idea.
I said I would like to donateall of your elevators and they
(19:17):
said to me our elevators, we'renot even looking for a donation
for the elevators.
I said I'd like to write acheck for the elevators because
in my mind it was a businessschool.
The elevator went from thebottom floor to the top floor
and I said I'd like to put aquote in each elevator.
I said I'd like to put a quotein each elevator and one of the
quotes I put in there is if youlove what you do, you'll never
work a day in your life.
So you gotta have that fire inthe belly, you gotta love
(19:39):
business, otherwise you'll neverbe successful.
You gotta eat, breathe andsleep it yeah, I mean you're 100
right.
Speaker 1 (19:46):
I mean you got it.
It's again it.
Business ownership can be oneof the most rewarding things,
absolutely.
Speaker 2 (19:55):
I mean, don't you think, since we've well, yeah, I
mean because we both had ourcorporate jobs and I mean that's
ultimately why we startedfranchise insiders, because we
were working for other peopleand we didn't have that fire.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
We just didn't want to you know, I mean we, we did
our job.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
But we were frustrated because we were doing
so well and then, you know, noreward.
So we said we need to dosomething for ourselves and
since we started it it's justbeen amazing because it I mean
it definitely feels like work.
Don't get me wrong sometimes,but it's.
It's our baby, it's ourbusiness.
So when one of us or Jack hasto take a phone call on a
Saturday or late at night totalk to a client, he's happy to
(20:32):
do it and I'm never annoyed whenthat happens because it doesn't
feel like it.
Speaker 3 (20:38):
I think that when you have your wins, without those
losses, without the hard work,the wins don't feel as good.
And I've had the opportunity tomeet some of your clients and I
see the smiles on their facesand I see how much you've helped
them, which is why I love whatyou guys do.
And it's similar with me when Igo to work every day I get up
and I say what I want to do is Iwant to go to work, I want to
(20:59):
have fun, I want to help peopleand I want to make money.
And if I can't do those things,I might as well stay home.
Speaker 1 (21:09):
Yeah, I think that that's that's really well said.
I mean, I I've always said, thefirst five months of franchise
insiders, we made nothing, zero.
But when I look back on it, Idon't remember the fear, I
remember the excitement.
I remember that, hey, we'refinally building something,
we're finally doing it, andthat's I still look at it as one
of my most favorite times inour life, you know, because we
(21:30):
finally had control.
We didn't have to, we weren'tsitting and traveling on
airplanes for other people,other people weren't determining
our time we wanted to trysomething for the business we
could right.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
You know, we didn't have to ask permission or do
anything, it was like it was ourdecision.
So if we failed, we fail fastand we move forward.
And when we found somethingthat worked, you know, we
applauded ourselves because itwas, you know, our idea.
And so if we fail, we fail fastand we move forward, and when
we found something that worked,you know, we applauded ourselves
because it was, you know, ouridea and something that we tried
so so much more fulfilling too.
Speaker 3 (21:56):
And look, rome wasn't built in a day.
You know, little drops fill thebuckets.
You got to crawl before youwalk.
You got to walk before you run.
And it's the same thing I tellpeople with asset protection.
You know.
I tell them you know.
Number one just educate yourself.
Know that there's somethingthat you can do.
Whether you choose to dosomething or not, who cares?
Number one educate yourself andknow there's something you can
(22:18):
do.
Number two inventory yourwealth.
Okay, people have way more thanthey think they do.
When I ask people what they have, they mention the cash.
They mention you know thebusiness.
They mention the real estate.
But what about a potentialinheritance?
What about crypto?
Did you loan somebody money?
The money owed to you is anasset.
What about the phone number anddomain name to your business?
(22:39):
That's an asset.
How would you like it if acreditor took it and pointed it
to someone else?
So I always tell people educateyourself and inventory your
wealth.
After that you can pick oneasset.
You don't need to do everything.
What's my largest asset?
Okay, it's my business.
Protect your business.
Do nothing else and wait sixmonths After you see that it
(23:01):
really hasn't changed the wayyou live your life and has
probably made your life easier.
What's my next biggest asset?
Maybe it's my real estateportfolio.
Protect the real estateportfolio and nothing else.
And then, after a few months,you could do more.
And the challenge I give toevery single person is this
we're all worried about growth,growth, growth.
How do we make money?
Preservation of principle is soimportant.
(23:22):
I tell them, for every 60minutes you spend making money,
stop and spend 60 secondsthinking about how to protect it
.
Speaker 1 (23:31):
That's great and again, hillel, until I met you,
I'll be completely honest, Ididn't spend any time thinking
about it, because it's like awhole new mindset.
Speaker 3 (23:42):
Yeah, and not only that.
We get misconceptions.
Every day at my office.
Somebody walks in and they havea revocable living trust and
every one of them thinks they'reprotected.
And I have to explain to themthat a revocable living trust
gives you 0% asset protection.
You are 100% unprotected.
(24:03):
A revocable living trust is agreat estate planning tool for
when you die, it does nothingfor you to protect yourself
while you're alive.
So I have people who walk inevery day who even think they're
protected because they have atrust, but the trust gives them
0% protection.
Speaker 1 (24:20):
Interesting.
So is it then an irrevocabletrust that provides greater
protection.
Speaker 3 (24:25):
So the answer is yes, but that doesn't mean you
always want to use anirrevocable trust.
So the great thing about anirrevocable trust is it can help
you with estate tax planningand also it really helps you
with asset protection.
The problem with an irrevocabletrust is it's irrevocable, so
you have to give up allownership and all control.
(24:45):
I had a client, a couple, ahusband and wife, who came to me
Before they'd come to me, yearsago.
They had put everything theyowned in an irrevocable trust
for their kids.
Well, the parents ran out ofmoney.
They asked the kids for a loanand the kids told them to screw
off.
So I don't know about you, but Idon't want to fight with my
nine-year-old and myfour-year-old because they are
(25:06):
tough, as you know.
I don't want to fight with themover pizza and McDonald's money
.
So while an irrevocable trustis great for asset protection
and tax planning, it may not begreat for what you need.
So there's dozens and dozens ofother things LLCs, limited
partnerships I mean we couldtalk for hours on any one of
these items that might be ahappy medium to the revocable
(25:29):
trust versus the irrevocabletrust.
Speaker 1 (25:31):
So I mean, in all of this is so great.
Again, I think our audience ismade up of, like I said,
business owners of all shapesand sizes and people who want to
be business owners and, likefor me, thinking about this for
our clients.
This is something for all ofyou, like, as you are putting
your vision on the wall of whereyou want your company to go.
Like Kalel says, you're focusedon revenue.
(25:52):
Also, protect yourself, and soI think that's where Kalel
someone being able to reach outto you and speak to you about
how you, your firm, canpotentially help them.
What's the best way for them todo that?
Speaker 3 (26:06):
Yeah, so if they go to our website, it's
wwwassetprotectionattorneyscom.
That'swwwassetprotectionattorneyscom.
As long as they mention theJack and Jill franchise show,
I'm happy to send themcomplimentary copies of the
latest books that we authored onasset protection we have that.
Speaker 1 (26:28):
Got it right here.
You know it's so funny.
Our son, trey, wrote his firstbook this week.
He sure did, and I love it.
We were talking about it andwe've had your since you were
coming on the podcast.
We've had your book on ourkitchen table for a week and he
was looking at it.
He was like you know, I can'twait to publish my book.
(26:50):
So, hillel, in a way you helpedreally influence Trey.
He saw this and he's like I'vegot to do it.
And you've seen books be such avaluable asset for your company
, right?
Hasn't it been a great tool forfurther helping your clients?
Speaker 3 (27:05):
Yeah, you know, it's just a great educational tool.
Again, one of my purposes, oneof our missions, is to educate
as many people as possible andthere's no better way to do it
and I'm old school than a book.
And of course we do the audiobooks and the ebooks and all
that.
But think about the pleasure,right, I get to educate so much
of the population that I'llnever even see, which, you know,
just makes me feel great.
(27:26):
And then think about the peoplewho actually come to sit down
to me.
You know they come in and theysay hey, I read on page 87.
Here's something that we can dowith my assets and it's so
great because they make them aneducated customer.
So now when I'm speaking tosomeone, now when I'm helping
someone, a client, they know alot more than probably just the
average person coming in on thestreet because they've read my
(27:48):
book.
And you know, one of thebiggest things I talk and
they're just trying to give asmany takeaways as I, as I can to
your listeners is own nothing,control everything, own nothing,
control everything.
So if you own an asset, you canlose it.
So if you have a checkings, asavings, a stocks, bonds, CDs,
(28:10):
money market brokerage account.
If you get sued, you lose it.
If you have real estate, youlose it.
If you have shares in abusiness, you lose it.
What people want to do is theywant to own nothing and control
everything.
Take that real estate out ofyour name and put it into a
protective entity like an LLC.
Take those liquid assets out ofyour name and put it into a
protective entity like an LLC.
Take those liquid assets out ofyour name, put it into a
protective entity like a limitedpartnership, an LLC, a trust,
(28:34):
etc, etc.
Etc.
But own nothing, controleverything.
And that goes the same with bothpersonal assets and business
assets.
So, for example, if somebodyhas a business right and the
business has intellectualproperty that's worth $4 million
, if the business gets sued theycan lose the $4 million of
intellectual property.
Why not take the intellectualproperty out, put it in an LLC
(28:57):
and lease it back to thebusiness?
Now, if the business gets sued,you don't lose the intellectual
property.
You know, if you have $2million of furniture, $3 million
of stereo equipment, if thebusiness gets sued, you lose the
$2 million in furniture, the $3million in stereo equipment.
Why not strip those assets outand lease them back.
So on the personal side and thebusiness side, really big key
(29:20):
for the listeners is own nothing, control everything, because if
you own it you can lose it.
Speaker 1 (29:27):
So here's a question, because all what you're saying
sounds incredible and like Iwant to hire you to do all of
this stuff.
Do you guys actually do this?
Is this something you guys arewhen you help someone?
How much of this does your firmassist people with doing, and
how much of it is it?
Is it you guys saying, here'sthe things you need to do, and
they go out and execute?
Speaker 3 (29:48):
Yeah.
So we help with everything.
And the way we kind of break upour engagement with most people
is we just break it up into twostages the architectural stage
and the building stage.
So pretend you wanted to builda house.
You don't just go startbuilding, you hire the architect
.
The architect gives you allyour options.
You then pick from thoseoptions and you decide what you
(30:09):
want to build and what you don'twant to build.
We do the same thing.
We do a very, verycomprehensive review of
everybody's personal andbusiness assets.
We're looking at them from anasset protection point of view,
an estate planning point of view, a tax planning point of view,
a business succession planningpoint of view, and they hire us
to be their financial architect.
(30:30):
That's stage one.
After that we come back to themwith the financial blueprints,
the financial architecturalplans, and we tell them here's
anything and everything you cando, in order of priority most
important to least important.
And then the client tells us aslittle or as much as they want
to do.
So it's never all or nothing.
So I always tell them it's ourjob to educate, it's our job to
(30:53):
recommend.
At the end of the day, theclients have to decide what they
want to do.
Speaker 2 (30:58):
It's actually similar to our business We've been
talking about that a lot latelythat when we work with clients
at Franchise Insiders, it's ourjob to educate and our job to
make the recommendations.
So what they do after isultimately their choice.
So you know we're there to helpthem and guide them through the
process, but after that youknow that's it.
Speaker 1 (31:21):
I mean you can lead a horse to water, but it's
exactly right.
I mean it's.
It's one of those things thatall of us here have, these sorts
of these, these things that wecan help people with.
It's like someone called meyesterday and he's about to buy,
um, a really expensive retailfranchise.
Um, but he's like you know, Iheard your podcast and I figured
(31:42):
I should just give you a calland see what you think.
So we start to talk about well,what is the what's said in the
item 19?
What are the other franchiseessaying?
What is the cost and what canhe invest?
And, as it turns out, best casethis is a franchise that can
net him.
You know low six figures andhe's going to spend a million
dollars.
And I said, listen, know lowsix figures and he's going to
(32:04):
spend a million dollars.
And I said, listen, you can do alot more for your money and you
could potentially make a lotmore on half of that investment.
But the challenge is is thatit's going to be in businesses
that are less glamorous.
Right, it's not as sexy to owna painting franchise as it is to
own the coolest new, you know.
But at the end of the day abusiness owner, whether it's a
(32:24):
painting franchise, a plumbingfranchise or the hottest new
burger franchise, you ultimatelyare leading a team, you are
driving sales and deliveringexceptional customer service, no
matter what business you'rerunning.
Those are the three pillars andso when we kind of help people
to see, look, ultimately,whatever business you own as the
owner, you need to work on it,not in it, and lead that team
(32:47):
and drive sales.
Speaker 3 (32:48):
Yeah, and think about the time and money that you
saved that client.
Right here they were, they wereready to write the check and
maybe everything would have beenokay.
They would have made their youknow $100,000 a year on their
investment.
But by having that one callwith you, they were able to gain
insight and information onthings that they have no clue.
And that's why I think what youguys do as advisors no
(33:08):
different than what we do asadvisors is so important.
You know people can't affordnot to call you because they
don't know what they don't know.
So you know the five, the six,the 700 franchises.
You know all the franchises inthe industry.
You know what language should bethere, shouldn't be there,
where people get tricked up.
And nothing can beat experienceand I can't tell you.
(33:31):
There's been times before wheresomeone came to me.
They didn't wanna hire me.
That's okay, they don't need to.
They went out there, they triedto do it on their own.
They came back.
It cost them twice as muchbecause now I need to fix
everything that they did andthen do the correct plan.
So that architecting, thatadvising when people call you,
when people call me, it's evenmore important than the building
(33:52):
.
You know, once you have theplans, you know at least you can
argue, maybe anybody couldbuild it.
Who knows if they build itright with the right clauses.
But you know that one phonecall, who knows that, could have
saved that guy.
You know a million dollars andyou know six years of
opportunity costs Easy.
Speaker 1 (34:09):
I mean it, and it's just understanding fundamentally
how franchises work.
Now the other thing, Hillel,that's interesting is that you
can take that same paintingfranchise and one guy's out
there building 20 units to amega business and another guy's
out there doing nothing, andit's the same franchise, it's
the same support, it's the samemarketing.
(34:30):
But there again is where theart of what a franchise
consultant does is.
We need to understand who ourclients are and make
recommendations accordingly.
Again, it's up to them.
So it's like you know.
This is where, no matter whatit is, all of us can give great
advice, but it is up to theclient, the franchise owner,
(34:51):
your clients, to execute thegame plan.
Speaker 3 (34:54):
Well, you know what they say.
I mean normally when there's anincident, it's pilot error,
right?
So I mean, if you have, youknow, a franchise that has a
hundred different franchiseesand they're all doing phenomenal
and then one guy's not, youknow, look, it could be
something.
It could be it was a bad choiceof location.
It could be that, for whateverreason, that product or service
isn't working in that market.
You never know what it is, butmore than likely it probably
(35:17):
comes down to the pilot.
You know the business owner,which probably then comes down
to what we talked about earlier.
You know that fire in the belly, the hunt, the love for
business, the love forentrepreneurship.
You know, again, you have towork hard, and then you have to
work a little harder, and thenyou have to work a little harder
.
Speaker 2 (35:32):
Yeah, we had an example on one of our past
podcasts with the the limpy subs.
Speaker 1 (35:37):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (35:37):
Yeah, and one owner that was like killing it and
loved his business and wasgetting involved in the
community and was just, you know, doing so well, and the other
one hated what he was doing andhe was grumpy and wasn't doing
well.
But that's just.
That's the same example.
You know.
You can take the same exactthing and have wildly different
experiences.
It really depends on who'sbehind it.
Speaker 3 (36:00):
And it's the same thing with asset protection.
You know it's not one size fitsall.
You know, when I'm working witha client, I always tell people
we don't do any cookie cutterwork.
Everything needs to beindividualized, customized and
tailored to your specific assets.
You know your personal assets,your business assets, your needs
.
You know one guy may be beingproactive, another guy may be
(36:21):
protecting against a teenagedriver, a third guy may be
protecting against a fourthmarriage.
Everybody needs somethingdifferent.
Some like chocolate, some likevanilla.
And again, that's your job tohelp put the right person in the
right place with the rightfranchise.
Speaker 1 (36:37):
That's exactly right, yeah, and once you have it,
it's like Jill said, it's liketaking a call on a Saturday
evening is is is fun becauseyou're building business.
Speaker 3 (36:47):
Yeah, I always say not to be corny, or, but you
know my clients end up being myfriends because you know you
have to like who you're doingbusiness with, Otherwise it's
just not worth it.
Speaker 1 (36:57):
Yeah, I agree.
Well, hello, I think we've saida lot.
Anything that we haven't saidthat you think is important for
people to know.
Speaker 3 (37:03):
No, I appreciate you having me here.
Speaker 2 (37:05):
I hope that it was timely, educational and valuable
and I hope, if nothing else,the listeners can get at least
one good idea to take from here.
Yeah, there's a lot to you.
Provided us with a lot, so ustoo.
Speaker 1 (37:20):
Again, I want to emphasize you know what we said
at the beginning of the podcast.
I mean, look at the testimonial, look at who is mentioning
Hillel's book, and if you go tohis website, you can get a
complimentary copy.
If you mentioned that, youfound us on the.
We bought a franchise podcast,but again, this is such great
information for all of youbusiness owners out there,
(37:40):
potential business owners outthere Not only should you be
focused on making your money,but you want to protect it too,
because it's so hard to build abusiness to a point where you
can build those assets.
So hello, Thank you so much.
It's been wonderful having youon the show today.
Speaker 3 (37:53):
Absolutely.
It's not what you make, it'swhat you keep.
Love it, love it.
Thank you, sir.
Hi everyone.
Welcome back to the we Bought aFranchise podcast.
I'm Jack Johnson.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
I'm Jill Johnson.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
And today we have a very special guest for you guys,
Hillel Presser, who is themanaging partner and founder of
the Presser Law Firm.
Hillel, how are you Welcome tothe show?
Speaker 3 (00:17):
I'm doing great.
Thanks for having me today.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
So, for all of our listeners out there, hillel is a
little bit of a different guestthan our normal guest, right?
Normally, hillel, we havebusiness owners, franchise
owners.
Of course, you are amulti-business owner, but this
is something what Hillel does.
He's an asset protectionattorney and for those of you
out there that are businessowners, that are striving to
become business owners, this issomething that you absolutely
(00:42):
need to know about.
This might be one of our mostimportant podcasts, because as
you grow a business, as you makemore money, you need to protect
it.
And, hillel, I think it was twodays ago on LinkedIn, I'm
scrolling through my feed andthere's Damon John and he's
talking about like five booksevery business owner needs to.
Did you see it?
(01:02):
And the first one that he talksabout is your book Asset
Protection Secrets.
Dude, how are you like on thiskind of you know first name
basis with Damon?
Tell us about that.
Speaker 3 (01:14):
Well, Damon's a very good friend of mine Obviously
I've helped him with a lot ofstuff and we do a lot of work
together but, most importantly,just a great person, great human
being and a great friend, sojust always happy to help him
and anyone else who needs it.
Speaker 1 (01:30):
I mean, what a great testimony.
I mean he's a freaking shark.
He's on our TV every night andyou're like part, you work with
him.
I mean, I mean, you guys,that's a killer testimonial
right off the bat.
I have to tell you guys, youguys, that's a killer
testimonial right off the bat.
I have to tell you guys, as wedig in with Hillel, people
routinely pay him tens ofthousands of dollars for a
session.
So this information you guysare going to get today, any
(01:53):
nuggets that Hillel is going toshare, you better listen up
because they're very important.
And so, hillel, you know whereto begin.
Maybe tell us a little bitabout what your company does,
what you do and what you thinkpeople need to know about.
Speaker 3 (02:06):
Sure.
So I tease and I say that I amthe lawyer that hates lawyers.
You know there's probablyhundreds, if not thousands, of
lawyers in every single citytrying to find a way to take
money from you.
How can they sue you and howcan they redistribute the wealth
?
I'm one of only a few in theentire country that actually
(02:27):
teach people how to protect it.
So everybody's so worried aboutmaking money, but obviously the
only worst thing than notmaking money is losing it.
So I always tell clients I willnever make you one penny richer
.
It's my job to make sure thatyou don't become one penny poor,
and it's so important and it'ssomething admitted to make sure
that you don't become one pennypoor, and it's so important and
it's something, admittedly, youknow as you're on your way up as
(02:48):
an entrepreneur.
Speaker 1 (02:49):
You're right, I mean, everybody's thinking about how
do we make it right, how do youmake money, but it's something
everyone needs to be aware of ishow to protect yourself as you
grow your assets and how yougrow your business, um and and
so I think this information isso crucial, especially to
entrepreneurs.
You know, maybe, hillel, let'stalk about some of the things
(03:09):
that people what are peopleapproaching you for generally,
what are the biggest pain points?
Speaker 3 (03:16):
Sure.
Well, first of all, people arecoming to me from all across the
country because they've workedhard and they want to take their
chips off the table and theywant to become as uncollectible
and judgment-proof as possible.
They know that we live in avery litigious, frivolous
society.
They know that one lawsuit canwipe them out, and it doesn't
even have to be something thatthey do.
They can be sued because theirkid drives their car and gets in
(03:39):
an accident or their employeedoes something on behalf of the
business.
So clients come to me to helptake their chips off the table
and what I do is I make it sodifficult, so expensive, if not
impossible, for anybody tocollect against my client that
they don't want to sue my clientin the first place.
If I can stop my client frombeing sued, we've saved hundreds
(04:02):
of thousands or millions ofdollars right there.
If they do sue my clientbecause you can never stop
somebody for suing my client Iwant to make them as
uncollectible and judgment-proofas possible, which allows my
clients to settle their case for5, 10, 15 cents on the dollar.
So there's always that doubt asto liability who's going to win
(04:24):
the case?
What we do is we create thedoubt as to collectability.
We tell them that even if youwin the case which we don't
think you will my client isuncollectible and judgment proof
and you can spend the next fiveor 10 years finding that out
yourself or going after them, orwe can settle right now, and
we've been able to settle $20million lawsuits for $250,000,
(04:47):
$5 million judgments for$500,000, not because my clients
won the case, but because myclients made it difficult and
expensive to collect againstthem.
Speaker 1 (04:59):
That's a really good point, so it's very interesting
the things that you're saying.
I was curious to see Hillel andmaybe you could talk about this
, for example, in our own state.
Hillel lives in Florida, justlike we do.
Some of the protections thatHomestead provides to homeowners
.
Frankly, it's amazing.
I don't know that all stateshave this kind of protection.
Speaker 3 (05:19):
Absolutely.
And I'll tell you first of all,I love what you guys do, so
thank you.
I love the franchise industry.
It is tough, obviously.
I know in franchise they sayit's not if you get sued, it's
when you get sued.
But I love the franchiseindustry, so thank you for what
you're doing.
I find it fascinating whatyou're talking.
I actually call and I have aname for it.
I call it jurisdiction shopping.
(05:40):
So just like you go to the malland you shop for a jacket, just
like people pick a state basedon taxes, people pick a state
based on what assets areprotected.
So living in Florida I joke andI tease it's a great place to
live if you want to be a debtor.
It might be the reason why OJmoved here, probably the reason
(06:01):
why all the big CEOs from NewYork City move here and buy a
$30 million mansion at BocaRaton right before they get sued
.
Because in Florida there arewhat are called exemptions, and
exemptions are state laws thatprotect certain assets.
And in Florida your house isprotected.
In Florida, your retirementaccounts are protected.
(06:23):
In Florida, your life insurance, your annuities, your wages are
protected.
I could go on and on.
Now contrast that with a statelike New York or California.
You know, in New York orCalifornia your house may only
be protected up to a couplehundred thousand dollars.
So if I have a client in NewYork or California, I'm telling
them do not buy an expensivehouse.
(06:43):
And if you do buy an expensivehouse, don't pay off the
mortgage.
I don't want there to be equityto lose in a lawsuit.
When I'm counseling a Floridaclient, I tell them buy the most
expensive house you can and payoff the mortgage because no one
can take it.
And no different withretirement accounts.
I think last time I checked thelaw for protection of
retirement accounts inCalifornia was to the extent
(07:07):
reasonably necessary for supportdeemed by a judge.
I don't know about you, but Idon't want a judge telling me
what part of my retirementaccounts are protected.
So again, people move todifferent states.
Florida is a great state.
Texas is a great state.
Based on the laws and based onwhat's protected, you can be
worth $100 million in Floridaand as long as that $100 million
(07:31):
is spread out between yourhouse, your retirement accounts,
your annuities, your lifeinsurance and some other items,
nobody can take what you workedso hard for.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
It's amazing.
I mean, it's one of thosethings that it's like you don't
really think about it untilmaybe it happens to you.
So getting the word out rightnow is so important because you
don't want to end up in thatsituation and say you know it's
actually like as franchiseconsultants, we have a lot of
people who you know go buy afranchise and then realize it's
not for them and they say, gosh,I wish I knew about you, guys,
(08:01):
it's the same with you.
This is so important for peopleto know, because sometimes it's
too late and then you look atthem and say I helped you.
So I love that we're talkingabout this now, because I think
we can help so many people.
Speaker 3 (08:16):
Yeah, and I always tell people.
You know.
People always say when doesasset protection not work?
And it's simple.
There's two ways it doesn'twork.
Number one is when you're notproactive.
If you go out there you get ina car accident and six months
later you try and protectyourself, there's a chance they
can try and unwind what you did.
So you want to be proactive soyou can protect all your assets
(08:38):
from everyone every time.
The other thing is when peopledon't follow their structure.
I always call it honor thystructure.
I always tell people I can puttogether a bulletproof, rock
solid plan.
But if you don't honor yourstructure, if you get sued and
you go in front of a judge, whywould you expect the judge to
(08:58):
honor your structure?
So super important to beproactive, super important to
honor your structure and reallyimportant just to educate
yourself.
You know what important tohonor your structure and really
important just to educateyourself.
You know what I do is a nichewhich someone may look at as a
great thing, but the issue is alot of people don't know that we
exist until it's too late.
So, unlike every radio station,tv station, billboard, bus
(09:20):
bench, et cetera.
That's promoting the personalinjury attorneys.
Who can I sue?
Well, there's only a few of usin the entire country that
actually teach people how toprotect it.
So, unfortunately, sometimeswhen people find out it's after
the fact and it may be too late.
So Halal.
Speaker 1 (09:36):
I have a question for you, and this is a you know
something people are probablygoing to want to know as they
listen.
What size should I mean forsomeone to come to you?
If someone's got like a hundredgrand, that's probably not your
client, right?
What, what, what size client?
And I don't know if this is aquestion you can answer, but
what size client should betalking to you?
Speaker 3 (09:55):
Sure.
So, first of all, my missionand my purpose is to educate and
help as many people as I can.
So I help clients who don'thave a lot of money and I
probably lose money on thoseclients and I'm okay with it
because I want to help them andI always give this example.
You know we've represented Idon't know 30, 40 professional
athletes, nfl, nba players.
(10:16):
Well, take a professional NFLplayer who signs a $50 million
contract.
If they get sued for $5 million, they're not happy, but they
still have $45 million left.
Now contrast that with a schoolteacher.
She's worked her entire lifeand saved up a couple hundred
thousand dollars.
If she gets sued for a milliondollars, she's wiped out.
(10:37):
It's catastrophic.
There's no coming back for it.
So I can actually argue theless you have, the more
important asset protectionbecomes.
Now, obviously I'm not going touse the same strategies and
tools and techniques for theschool teacher with $200,000 as
I would for the football playerwith 45 million.
You know you have to do anopportunity.
You know cost benefit analysis.
(10:58):
But anybody who has anythingthat they don't want to lose
should protect themselves andthere's a lot of things that
don't cost money that you can do.
You know, just like one of theexamples that we spoke about
were the exemptions.
So somebody, just based on whatstate they live in, if they
have $100,000, maybe byinvesting that in a certain
asset class, whether it be lifeinsurance, annuities, retirement
(11:21):
accounts, et cetera just bydoing that they can protect
themselves and they don't needto pay one penny to do that.
Speaker 1 (11:28):
It's amazing.
Awesome.
That's great information.
That's really good Halal.
You're doing always so manythings.
You're an interesting guy.
Do you want to talk about someof the other businesses that
you're working on?
How about let's talk a littlebit about business exit advisors
?
Is that something you'd like totalk about?
(11:49):
Sure.
Speaker 3 (11:50):
So, like you said, look, I love business.
I'm an entrepreneur at heart.
I love it.
My asset protection law firm isalways my baby.
I will always have it.
I will never stop doing it.
That's where I spend themajority of my time.
But you know, I'm anentrepreneur by heart and I love
the hunt.
And one of the other businessesthat I'm involved with not so
much on the day-to-day isBusiness Exit Advisors.
(12:13):
And what Business Exit Advisorsis is it's a business brokerage
.
So if I asked you, how manypeople do you know real estate
agents that could sell yourhouse?
The problem is you know toomany.
If you give it to your friend,your sister gets mad.
If you give it to your sister,your cousin gets mad.
It seems like everybody in theworld is a real estate agent,
but when I say to people, howmany people do you know that can
(12:36):
actually sell your business?
Nobody really knows anyone.
And last time I checked thestats it was something crazy.
It was like for every 400 realestate agents, there's one
business broker.
So again, very, very specialniche.
And that business Business ExitAdvisors helps people sell
(12:56):
their business, franchise theirbusiness or consults their
business to get them ready forsale, and their tagline is our
business is selling yourbusiness.
Now again, I'm not involved withthe day-to-day.
I have a phenomenal team.
I'm some of the best people whohave been around in the
industry forever and have helpedbuild some of the best people
who have been around in theindustry forever and have helped
build some of the biggestbusiness brokerages out there.
(13:16):
But I love the business and Ilove seeing all the different
businesses and our businesseskind of go hand in hand because
if you think about it, ifsomebody sells their business,
this is actually pretty crazy.
People don't realize.
The biggest lawsuit I seebesides car accidents and slip
and falls and things like thatare when people sell their
business and people always havea tough time understanding this.
They say what do you mean?
(13:37):
I sold my business and now Ihave no liability, and it's the
largest lawsuit we see.
74% of business transactionseither fail to materialize or
end up in litigation within acertain period of time.
Materialize or end up inlitigation within a certain
period of time.
55% of US companies lose a bareminimum of 40% of their gross
(13:59):
revenues during an ownershiptransition and if you think
about it, it makes sense, right?
Nobody will ever run thebusiness like you.
So when you sell the business,a lot of times not always income
goes down, expenses go up.
A lot of times not alwaysincome goes down, expenses go up
and all of a sudden, a year ortwo later, the new owner is
suing the old owner for fraud.
I always call it renegotiation.
(14:20):
So I always tell my businessowner clients, whether they're
through the business brokerageor not, the minute you sell your
business you get those chipsoff the table because you never
know if there's going to be aclawback.
Speaker 2 (14:31):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:32):
You know, that's really, that's a really really
good point.
And when we counsel our clientsto think about selling their
business, or they come to us andthey say, listen, it's not for
me.
We often advise them to look atit like selling your home.
When you go to sell your house,you want to make sure that
thing looks great, right, youwant to.
(14:53):
You've got to get it ready forshowings.
You want to make sure whenpeople walk in they say, man,
this house is amazing, I've gotto have it.
If you didn't do that, peopleare going to walk in and say,
man, this is dumb, I'm nevergoing to buy it Right.
Speaker 2 (15:04):
I mean, you have your , your fixer uppers that think
that they can come in and fix itup, but there's a lot of issues
with that.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
Well, and it's another reason why when people,
when we're advising people onhow they should build their
franchise, the aiming point andthis is a hard thing for
entrepreneurs to hear, becausewe all want to be special, we
all want to be the stars, butultimately you should build your
business to run without you.
Ultimately, if you can build abusiness to where it does not
(15:32):
need your daily intervention,you've done a fabulous thing.
Because the owners.
What happens is, if the ownersare too involved in the business
, if they are too attached tothe employees, the minute that
business sells, half the teamquits.
You're right, the revenue goesdown, so you want that thing to
be as good as possible when yougo to sell it.
And then, hillel, aninteresting thing happens All of
(15:54):
a sudden.
You've built your business backup, someone's ready to buy it
and you're like wait a second.
Speaker 2 (15:58):
You remodel your house to sell it and you're like
wait, this is gorgeous, likewhy am I leaving?
So yeah, it does happen, butbut it is.
Speaker 3 (16:07):
And I and I totally agree with you you know a lot of
people who think they havebusinesses and listen, I'm not
excluded by any means.
It's easy to it's always easyto say something.
It's much tougher to dosomething.
But a lot of people who thinkthey have businesses, they don't
have businesses.
They may make a lot of moneybut they may just be getting
paid very, very highly for theirtime.
So if they're involved in thebusiness and it can't run
(16:28):
without them, there's an issue.
And you know, to your othercomment, I've been involved in
billion dollar businesstransactions where at the last
minute the owner decided hedidn't want to sell and instead
of a third party coming in andbuying out call it the two or
three partners one or twopartners say Nope, I want to
stay, and either they buy outthe business or they buy it with
(16:50):
the new buyer and only some ofthe owners leave.
Because you know again people.
You know they work theirbusiness up to sell it, but they
wake up the next day and all ofa sudden they have no purpose.
So something that we'll do atBusiness Exit Advisors is not
just sell your business, getyour business ready for sale,
franchise your business, protectthe proceeds.
But what's your purpose afterthe sale?
(17:12):
You know you could have an exit.
I don't care if it's for a hugenumber $300 million but when
you wake up on Monday and youhave nothing to do, you may feel
like you're at your lowestpoint, even though you just sold
the business last week.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
Yeah, so that's a that's a really good point in
franchising, because the thingthat makes a franchise special,
ultimately, is the hustle of thefranchise owner.
I mean, even as, and Jill and Iinvested in our Pink's
franchise because, you're right,as franchise consultants we're
just glorified salespeople.
I mean, everything we make iswhat we do.
(17:46):
I mean we're here to counselclients and share our knowledge,
but the business can't runwithout us.
Yeah, it's us, the business isus and share our knowledge.
Speaker 2 (17:51):
but the business can't run without us.
Yeah, it's us, the business isus.
Speaker 1 (17:53):
It's us Right.
So even if on paper I couldshow you a great looking P&L,
you'd never pay me what I thinkthe business is worth, because
Jill and I are the ones thatmake it go and that's where,
ultimately, we knew we had tobuy the Pinks franchise, because
we need a business thatultimately can run without us.
Speaker 3 (18:10):
Yeah, and, as you know, I love that Pakes
franchise business.
I think it's genius, I thinkit's brilliant.
I see your trucks all over thecity doing great, great work and
great, great jobs so phenomenal.
I mean, you guys got to that.
I remember even talking aboutit and it was after you guys did
it and I was like man, I wish Iwas involved in that, but you
(18:37):
said it right, which is you gotto have the fire in the belly.
It's not about the kill, it'sabout the hunt.
You know, making money is justthe scorecard, it's just, it
just shows you that you did itright.
A real business owner, a realentrepreneur, has to love what
they do.
You know, I always love thequote Somebody asked me to you
know, donate to a school that Idonated a bunch of money to, and
for me it's like I need to havea connection, like I need to
have a connection, I need tohave an emotional, and they said
, hey, can you just donate?
You know x room, and I said no,because x room means nothing to
me.
(18:57):
And you know I looked at theand I donated the fashion
classroom because my wife wasinto fashion and I had made a
donation with my partner becauseit was special for me, and my
partner and I looked at theplans and you know there was
nothing really that I had anemotional connection to and I
said said to them.
I said I have an idea.
I said I would like to donateall of your elevators and they
(19:17):
said to me our elevators, we'renot even looking for a donation
for the elevators.
I said I'd like to write acheck for the elevators because
in my mind it was a businessschool.
The elevator went from thebottom floor to the top floor
and I said I'd like to put aquote in each elevator.
I said I'd like to put a quotein each elevator and one of the
quotes I put in there is if youlove what you do, you'll never
work a day in your life.
So you gotta have that fire inthe belly, you gotta love
(19:39):
business, otherwise you'll neverbe successful.
You gotta eat, breathe andsleep it yeah, I mean you're 100
right.
Speaker 1 (19:46):
I mean you got it.
It's again it.
Business ownership can be oneof the most rewarding things,
absolutely.
Speaker 2 (19:55):
I mean, don't you think, since we've well, yeah, I
mean because we both had ourcorporate jobs and I mean that's
ultimately why we startedfranchise insiders, because we
were working for other peopleand we didn't have that fire.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
We just didn't want to you know, I mean we, we did
our job.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
But we were frustrated because we were doing
so well and then, you know, noreward.
So we said we need to dosomething for ourselves and
since we started it it's justbeen amazing because it I mean
it definitely feels like work.
Don't get me wrong sometimes,but it's.
It's our baby, it's ourbusiness.
So when one of us or Jack hasto take a phone call on a
Saturday or late at night totalk to a client, he's happy to
(20:32):
do it and I'm never annoyed whenthat happens because it doesn't
feel like it.
Speaker 3 (20:38):
I think that when you have your wins, without those
losses, without the hard work,the wins don't feel as good.
And I've had the opportunity tomeet some of your clients and I
see the smiles on their facesand I see how much you've helped
them, which is why I love whatyou guys do.
And it's similar with me when Igo to work every day I get up
and I say what I want to do is Iwant to go to work, I want to
(20:59):
have fun, I want to help peopleand I want to make money.
And if I can't do those things,I might as well stay home.
Speaker 1 (21:09):
Yeah, I think that that's that's really well said.
I mean, I I've always said, thefirst five months of franchise
insiders, we made nothing, zero.
But when I look back on it, Idon't remember the fear, I
remember the excitement.
I remember that, hey, we'refinally building something,
we're finally doing it, andthat's I still look at it as one
of my most favorite times inour life, you know, because we
(21:30):
finally had control.
We didn't have to, we weren'tsitting and traveling on
airplanes for other people,other people weren't determining
our time we wanted to trysomething for the business we
could right.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
You know, we didn't have to ask permission or do
anything, it was like it was ourdecision.
So if we failed, we fail fastand we move forward.
And when we found somethingthat worked, you know, we
applauded ourselves because itwas, you know, our idea.
And so if we fail, we fail fastand we move forward, and when
we found something that worked,you know, we applauded ourselves
because it was, you know, ouridea and something that we tried
so so much more fulfilling too.
Speaker 3 (21:56):
And look, rome wasn't built in a day.
You know, little drops fill thebuckets.
You got to crawl before youwalk.
You got to walk before you run.
And it's the same thing I tellpeople with asset protection.
You know.
I tell them you know.
Number one just educate yourself.
Know that there's somethingthat you can do.
Whether you choose to dosomething or not, who cares?
Number one educate yourself andknow there's something you can
(22:18):
do.
Number two inventory yourwealth.
Okay, people have way more thanthey think they do.
When I ask people what they have, they mention the cash.
They mention you know thebusiness.
They mention the real estate.
But what about a potentialinheritance?
What about crypto?
Did you loan somebody money?
The money owed to you is anasset.
What about the phone number anddomain name to your business?
(22:39):
That's an asset.
How would you like it if acreditor took it and pointed it
to someone else?
So I always tell people educateyourself and inventory your
wealth.
After that you can pick oneasset.
You don't need to do everything.
What's my largest asset?
Okay, it's my business.
Protect your business.
Do nothing else and wait sixmonths After you see that it
(23:01):
really hasn't changed the wayyou live your life and has
probably made your life easier.
What's my next biggest asset?
Maybe it's my real estateportfolio.
Protect the real estateportfolio and nothing else.
And then, after a few months,you could do more.
And the challenge I give toevery single person is this
we're all worried about growth,growth, growth.
How do we make money?
Preservation of principle is soimportant.
(23:22):
I tell them, for every 60minutes you spend making money,
stop and spend 60 secondsthinking about how to protect it
.
Speaker 1 (23:31):
That's great and again, hillel, until I met you,
I'll be completely honest, Ididn't spend any time thinking
about it, because it's like awhole new mindset.
Speaker 3 (23:42):
Yeah, and not only that.
We get misconceptions.
Every day at my office.
Somebody walks in and they havea revocable living trust and
every one of them thinks they'reprotected.
And I have to explain to themthat a revocable living trust
gives you 0% asset protection.
You are 100% unprotected.
(24:03):
A revocable living trust is agreat estate planning tool for
when you die, it does nothingfor you to protect yourself
while you're alive.
So I have people who walk inevery day who even think they're
protected because they have atrust, but the trust gives them
0% protection.
Speaker 1 (24:20):
Interesting.
So is it then an irrevocabletrust that provides greater
protection.
Speaker 3 (24:25):
So the answer is yes, but that doesn't mean you
always want to use anirrevocable trust.
So the great thing about anirrevocable trust is it can help
you with estate tax planningand also it really helps you
with asset protection.
The problem with an irrevocabletrust is it's irrevocable, so
you have to give up allownership and all control.
(24:45):
I had a client, a couple, ahusband and wife, who came to me
Before they'd come to me, yearsago.
They had put everything theyowned in an irrevocable trust
for their kids.
Well, the parents ran out ofmoney.
They asked the kids for a loanand the kids told them to screw
off.
So I don't know about you, but Idon't want to fight with my
nine-year-old and myfour-year-old because they are
(25:06):
tough, as you know.
I don't want to fight with themover pizza and McDonald's money
.
So while an irrevocable trustis great for asset protection
and tax planning, it may not begreat for what you need.
So there's dozens and dozens ofother things LLCs, limited
partnerships I mean we couldtalk for hours on any one of
these items that might be ahappy medium to the revocable
(25:29):
trust versus the irrevocabletrust.
Speaker 1 (25:31):
So I mean, in all of this is so great.
Again, I think our audience ismade up of, like I said,
business owners of all shapesand sizes and people who want to
be business owners and, likefor me, thinking about this for
our clients.
This is something for all ofyou, like, as you are putting
your vision on the wall of whereyou want your company to go.
Like Kalel says, you're focusedon revenue.
(25:52):
Also, protect yourself, and soI think that's where Kalel
someone being able to reach outto you and speak to you about
how you, your firm, canpotentially help them.
What's the best way for them todo that?
Speaker 3 (26:06):
Yeah, so if they go to our website, it's
wwwassetprotectionattorneyscom.
That'swwwassetprotectionattorneyscom.
As long as they mention theJack and Jill franchise show,
I'm happy to send themcomplimentary copies of the
latest books that we authored onasset protection we have that.
Speaker 1 (26:28):
Got it right here.
You know it's so funny.
Our son, trey, wrote his firstbook this week.
He sure did, and I love it.
We were talking about it andwe've had your since you were
coming on the podcast.
We've had your book on ourkitchen table for a week and he
was looking at it.
He was like you know, I can'twait to publish my book.
(26:50):
So, hillel, in a way you helpedreally influence Trey.
He saw this and he's like I'vegot to do it.
And you've seen books be such avaluable asset for your company
, right?
Hasn't it been a great tool forfurther helping your clients?
Speaker 3 (27:05):
Yeah, you know, it's just a great educational tool.
Again, one of my purposes, oneof our missions, is to educate
as many people as possible andthere's no better way to do it
and I'm old school than a book.
And of course we do the audiobooks and the ebooks and all
that.
But think about the pleasure,right, I get to educate so much
of the population that I'llnever even see, which, you know,
just makes me feel great.
(27:26):
And then think about the peoplewho actually come to sit down
to me.
You know they come in and theysay hey, I read on page 87.
Here's something that we can dowith my assets and it's so
great because they make them aneducated customer.
So now when I'm speaking tosomeone, now when I'm helping
someone, a client, they know alot more than probably just the
average person coming in on thestreet because they've read my
(27:48):
book.
And you know, one of thebiggest things I talk and
they're just trying to give asmany takeaways as I, as I can to
your listeners is own nothing,control everything, own nothing,
control everything.
So if you own an asset, you canlose it.
So if you have a checkings, asavings, a stocks, bonds, CDs,
(28:10):
money market brokerage account.
If you get sued, you lose it.
If you have real estate, youlose it.
If you have shares in abusiness, you lose it.
What people want to do is theywant to own nothing and control
everything.
Take that real estate out ofyour name and put it into a
protective entity like an LLC.
Take those liquid assets out ofyour name and put it into a
protective entity like an LLC.
Take those liquid assets out ofyour name, put it into a
protective entity like a limitedpartnership, an LLC, a trust,
(28:34):
etc, etc.
Etc.
But own nothing, controleverything.
And that goes the same with bothpersonal assets and business
assets.
So, for example, if somebodyhas a business right and the
business has intellectualproperty that's worth $4 million
, if the business gets sued theycan lose the $4 million of
intellectual property.
Why not take the intellectualproperty out, put it in an LLC
(28:57):
and lease it back to thebusiness?
Now, if the business gets sued,you don't lose the intellectual
property.
You know, if you have $2million of furniture, $3 million
of stereo equipment, if thebusiness gets sued, you lose the
$2 million in furniture, the $3million in stereo equipment.
Why not strip those assets outand lease them back.
So on the personal side and thebusiness side, really big key
(29:20):
for the listeners is own nothing, control everything, because if
you own it you can lose it.
Speaker 1 (29:27):
So here's a question, because all what you're saying
sounds incredible and like Iwant to hire you to do all of
this stuff.
Do you guys actually do this?
Is this something you guys arewhen you help someone?
How much of this does your firmassist people with doing, and
how much of it is it?
Is it you guys saying, here'sthe things you need to do, and
they go out and execute?
Speaker 3 (29:48):
Yeah.
So we help with everything.
And the way we kind of break upour engagement with most people
is we just break it up into twostages the architectural stage
and the building stage.
So pretend you wanted to builda house.
You don't just go startbuilding, you hire the architect
.
The architect gives you allyour options.
You then pick from thoseoptions and you decide what you
(30:09):
want to build and what you don'twant to build.
We do the same thing.
We do a very, verycomprehensive review of
everybody's personal andbusiness assets.
We're looking at them from anasset protection point of view,
an estate planning point of view, a tax planning point of view,
a business succession planningpoint of view, and they hire us
to be their financial architect.
(30:30):
That's stage one.
After that we come back to themwith the financial blueprints,
the financial architecturalplans, and we tell them here's
anything and everything you cando, in order of priority most
important to least important.
And then the client tells us aslittle or as much as they want
to do.
So it's never all or nothing.
So I always tell them it's ourjob to educate, it's our job to
(30:53):
recommend.
At the end of the day, theclients have to decide what they
want to do.
Speaker 2 (30:58):
It's actually similar to our business We've been
talking about that a lot latelythat when we work with clients
at Franchise Insiders, it's ourjob to educate and our job to
make the recommendations.
So what they do after isultimately their choice.
So you know we're there to helpthem and guide them through the
process, but after that youknow that's it.
Speaker 1 (31:21):
I mean you can lead a horse to water, but it's
exactly right.
I mean it's.
It's one of those things thatall of us here have, these sorts
of these, these things that wecan help people with.
It's like someone called meyesterday and he's about to buy,
um, a really expensive retailfranchise.
Um, but he's like you know, Iheard your podcast and I figured
(31:42):
I should just give you a calland see what you think.
So we start to talk about well,what is the what's said in the
item 19?
What are the other franchiseessaying?
What is the cost and what canhe invest?
And, as it turns out, best casethis is a franchise that can
net him.
You know low six figures andhe's going to spend a million
dollars.
And I said, listen, know lowsix figures and he's going to
(32:04):
spend a million dollars.
And I said, listen, you can do alot more for your money and you
could potentially make a lotmore on half of that investment.
But the challenge is is thatit's going to be in businesses
that are less glamorous.
Right, it's not as sexy to owna painting franchise as it is to
own the coolest new, you know.
But at the end of the day abusiness owner, whether it's a
(32:24):
painting franchise, a plumbingfranchise or the hottest new
burger franchise, you ultimatelyare leading a team, you are
driving sales and deliveringexceptional customer service, no
matter what business you'rerunning.
Those are the three pillars andso when we kind of help people
to see, look, ultimately,whatever business you own as the
owner, you need to work on it,not in it, and lead that team
(32:47):
and drive sales.
Speaker 3 (32:48):
Yeah, and think about the time and money that you
saved that client.
Right here they were, they wereready to write the check and
maybe everything would have beenokay.
They would have made their youknow $100,000 a year on their
investment.
But by having that one callwith you, they were able to gain
insight and information onthings that they have no clue.
And that's why I think what youguys do as advisors no
(33:08):
different than what we do asadvisors is so important.
You know people can't affordnot to call you because they
don't know what they don't know.
So you know the five, the six,the 700 franchises.
You know all the franchises inthe industry.
You know what language should bethere, shouldn't be there,
where people get tricked up.
And nothing can beat experienceand I can't tell you.
(33:31):
There's been times before wheresomeone came to me.
They didn't wanna hire me.
That's okay, they don't need to.
They went out there, they triedto do it on their own.
They came back.
It cost them twice as muchbecause now I need to fix
everything that they did andthen do the correct plan.
So that architecting, thatadvising when people call you,
when people call me, it's evenmore important than the building
(33:52):
.
You know, once you have theplans, you know at least you can
argue, maybe anybody couldbuild it.
Who knows if they build itright with the right clauses.
But you know that one phonecall, who knows that, could have
saved that guy.
You know a million dollars andyou know six years of
opportunity costs Easy.
Speaker 1 (34:09):
I mean it, and it's just understanding fundamentally
how franchises work.
Now the other thing, Hillel,that's interesting is that you
can take that same paintingfranchise and one guy's out
there building 20 units to amega business and another guy's
out there doing nothing, andit's the same franchise, it's
the same support, it's the samemarketing.
(34:30):
But there again is where theart of what a franchise
consultant does is.
We need to understand who ourclients are and make
recommendations accordingly.
Again, it's up to them.
So it's like you know.
This is where, no matter whatit is, all of us can give great
advice, but it is up to theclient, the franchise owner,
(34:51):
your clients, to execute thegame plan.
Speaker 3 (34:54):
Well, you know what they say.
I mean normally when there's anincident, it's pilot error,
right?
So I mean, if you have, youknow, a franchise that has a
hundred different franchiseesand they're all doing phenomenal
and then one guy's not, youknow, look, it could be
something.
It could be it was a bad choiceof location.
It could be that, for whateverreason, that product or service
isn't working in that market.
You never know what it is, butmore than likely it probably
(35:17):
comes down to the pilot.
You know the business owner,which probably then comes down
to what we talked about earlier.
You know that fire in the belly, the hunt, the love for
business, the love forentrepreneurship.
You know, again, you have towork hard, and then you have to
work a little harder, and thenyou have to work a little harder
.
Speaker 2 (35:32):
Yeah, we had an example on one of our past
podcasts with the the limpy subs.
Speaker 1 (35:37):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (35:37):
Yeah, and one owner that was like killing it and
loved his business and wasgetting involved in the
community and was just, you know, doing so well, and the other
one hated what he was doing andhe was grumpy and wasn't doing
well.
But that's just.
That's the same example.
You know.
You can take the same exactthing and have wildly different
experiences.
It really depends on who'sbehind it.
Speaker 3 (36:00):
And it's the same thing with asset protection.
You know it's not one size fitsall.
You know, when I'm working witha client, I always tell people
we don't do any cookie cutterwork.
Everything needs to beindividualized, customized and
tailored to your specific assets.
You know your personal assets,your business assets, your needs
.
You know one guy may be beingproactive, another guy may be
(36:21):
protecting against a teenagedriver, a third guy may be
protecting against a fourthmarriage.
Everybody needs somethingdifferent.
Some like chocolate, some likevanilla.
And again, that's your job tohelp put the right person in the
right place with the rightfranchise.
Speaker 1 (36:37):
That's exactly right, yeah, and once you have it,
it's like Jill said, it's liketaking a call on a Saturday
evening is is is fun becauseyou're building business.
Speaker 3 (36:47):
Yeah, I always say not to be corny, or, but you
know my clients end up being myfriends because you know you
have to like who you're doingbusiness with, Otherwise it's
just not worth it.
Speaker 1 (36:57):
Yeah, I agree.
Well, hello, I think we've saida lot.
Anything that we haven't saidthat you think is important for
people to know.
Speaker 3 (37:03):
No, I appreciate you having me here.
Speaker 2 (37:05):
I hope that it was timely, educational and valuable
and I hope, if nothing else,the listeners can get at least
one good idea to take from here.
Yeah, there's a lot to you.
Provided us with a lot, so ustoo.
Speaker 1 (37:20):
Again, I want to emphasize you know what we said
at the beginning of the podcast.
I mean, look at the testimonial, look at who is mentioning
Hillel's book, and if you go tohis website, you can get a
complimentary copy.
If you mentioned that, youfound us on the.
We bought a franchise podcast,but again, this is such great
information for all of youbusiness owners out there,
(37:40):
potential business owners outthere Not only should you be
focused on making your money,but you want to protect it too,
because it's so hard to build abusiness to a point where you
can build those assets.
So hello, Thank you so much.
It's been wonderful having youon the show today.
Speaker 3 (37:53):
Absolutely.
It's not what you make, it'swhat you keep.
Love it, love it.
Thank you, sir.
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