September 24, 2025 • 39 mins
After a long hiatus, I’m back...and I’m not holding back. In this brutally honest return episode, I talk about why I walked away from the mic: burnout, grief, disillusionment with the true crime space, and a world that feels increasingly unrecognizable. From Charlie Kirk to Chris Chan...we're back.
Let's talk about what you can expect from WSTD in the future.
------------
Patreon: http://www.patreon.com/wesawthedevil
Discord: https://discord.gg/X2qYXdB4
Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/WeSawtheDevil
Instagram: http://www.instagram.com/wesawthedevilpodcast.
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/we-saw-the-devil-a-true-crime-podcast--4433638/support.
Let's talk about what you can expect from WSTD in the future.
------------
Patreon: http://www.patreon.com/wesawthedevil
Discord: https://discord.gg/X2qYXdB4
Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/WeSawtheDevil
Instagram: http://www.instagram.com/wesawthedevilpodcast.
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/we-saw-the-devil-a-true-crime-podcast--4433638/support.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Sunny spaces, smiling faces, happy places. But every sunny space
holds a shadow. Behind every smile, our sharp teeth, and
every happy place has something sinister lurking just below the surface.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Welcome to We Saw the Devil, the podcast diving deep
into the chilling realms of true crime. Join your host
Robin as she unravels mysteries that have left investigators baffled
and armchair sleuth's obsessed. Be forewarned, dear listener, We Saw
the Devil is not for the faint of heart. Our
unflinching exploration will take you to the darkest corners of
(00:41):
the psyche and through the unimaginable depths of human darkness
to unearth stark secrets. To the harsh light of day.
Nothing will be left untouched. Are you ready? Are you sure?
We Saw the Devil?
Speaker 3 (00:59):
Hello everyone, and you are listening to We Saw the Devil.
This is Robin, and yes it's really me. I am back.
I promise not you know, one or two episodes and
then disappearing again. I am actually back. This isn't so
much of an episode as just a realigning of what
(01:20):
you guys can expect, because just let me rip the
band aid off. Just go ahead and do that. I
took a break from podcasting because I was completely and
utterly drained. I'm talking creatively, emotionally, politically, and even though
I'm a non believer spiritually. I ended up getting I mean,
(01:42):
as everyone recalls, I ended up getting laid off from
a job, I got a new job, I got engaged,
I got married, and beyond that, I mean, just dealing
with life and the kind that doesn't make it into
a polished episode, you know, the kind that just kind
of breaks you down in exhaust you and I just
(02:02):
really had nothing to say. I guess that's only half
the story. I mean, the real reason that I took
a break. The last episode that I said that I
was going to do was back when the Karen Reid
trial was going and I was really excited about the
Karen Reid trial. I followed it daily. I for whatever reason,
was just really particularly interested in how this, especially the
(02:26):
second trial, was going to shape up. I just came
to the realization. I know that a lot of you,
you know, listen to other podcasts, and you're well aware
of the amount of work that goes into producing a
single episode in terms of research and recording, and you
know all of that. And I just I was scrolling
through Twitter looking at updates on the Karen Reid trial,
(02:49):
and I just realized in that moment, I just had
had an epiphany. I'm done. I'm over it. The infighting.
I'll get into that in a moment, but I'm not
over true crime. But I'm over this version of true crime,
you know what I mean. I feel like true crime
has begun to treat human tragedy like a fidget spinner
(03:15):
for the morally bored. I don't even know, you know,
And I didn't originally start this podcast. We saw the
devil to be part of the problem. I did it
because my friends and I like true crime at the time,
and I truly cared about the stories. And I wanted
to put out a true crime podcast that shines a
(03:37):
light on disenfranchised or oppressed groups, right that don't get
the press or media coverage that a lot of these
other cases do. I just truly wanted to, you know,
obviously explore the darker sides of humanity, right, but I
wanted to have and retain empathy I did not like.
(04:00):
My biggest fear in starting a true crime podcast was
I didn't want to just be exploitative. And then somewhere
along the way, especially with the Lori Valo case, true
crime stopped it being about truth or research or a
good story and just became about like content and click
(04:20):
bait and gossip. It started to feel off watching people
treat dateline and true crime binges like some sort of
personality trait, you know, like I get it. You watch
a few documentaries. You've seen the staircase and making a
murderer an unknown caller or a non number or whatever.
So have I that I found that a lot of
(04:43):
people make their entire personality. Oh my god, I follow
this like the serial killer stories every night. My husband
thinks I'm a weird now, but ahaha, and I see them,
not them as if I'm talking about a certain group
of people. I guess I kind of am the T
shirt in the merch that's coming out about true crime
all the time, or true crime and chill. And I
(05:06):
just came to a cross roads where I was asking
myself why I've had people directly ask me for the
gory details of a family friend's murder like they were
just ordering coffee, and it was, you know, I was
a Barisa or something like really good friends who are
into true crime ask for gory details, and I just
(05:28):
I've reached this point where it's just this culture that
we're in doesn't just desensitize us to violence. I feel
like it truly rewires how we treat people and real grief.
I see it over and over and over again in
a lot of cases that I've discussed in the past.
And then when you take into account and I know,
(05:50):
especially if you're you know, on true crime Reddit to
those places, it's even worse when you start looking behind
the curtain. So many shows and podcasts don't even ask
a victim's family for consent, and I've seen time and
time again how some of even the largest podcasts in
(06:11):
the true crime genre, the families will speak out. I
just got so tired of these people's pain, like pain
is just up for grabs as long as the public
records are available and the intro music slaps. I guess
I just came to the realization that I was disgusted
by what I was doing, and I really really do
(06:32):
not want to be another voice that's feeding the machine,
especially with so much going on right now in America.
Whatever the hell timeline we are unfortunately living in now.
I don't know how many of you guys followed rapture
talk on TikTok, but a lot of you know, Christians
(06:53):
believed that the twenty third. As I'm recording this is
ten forty pm on the twenty third, on Twoday, the
twenty third, you know, the rapture. I woke up today
and I was fully prepared to be raptured, but alas
it did not happen, and that has been such an
amazing rabbit hole to go down. And then I realized,
and I saw another perspective on it from a sociologist
(07:18):
that mass events of religious psychosis like these actually lead
to a lot of suicides and people taking their pets
in to be euthanized prematurely and selling their homes, their cars,
and their possessions. Juxtapose that the rapture that we're having,
(07:39):
on top of the news that that, you know, whatever
the fuck is hurtling towards us in space, you have
a couple fringe people saying that's an alien spaceship. You
have the dowsing rod people all over TikTok, and it's
just on top of that you have Israel and Gaza
and Trump and Jimmy Kemmel and Charlie Kirk. What made
(08:03):
me post on the Instagram about I'm back, I'm mad
as hell, like I'm coming back, I'm doing a new episode,
and whatnot was Charlie Kirk and a couple people unfollowed
me on Facebook because I posted a screenshot from the
threads about if you're being doxxed for speaking your mind
(08:25):
on Charlie Kirk, you know, here are some steps you
can take, and that immediately turned into how dare you say? Murders? Okay,
I'm unfollowing you. Bye. Okay, Well, first of all, good
fucking riddance. And secondly, I'm gonna state this right now.
What happened to Charlie Kirk is not okay. It was vile,
(08:47):
it was disgusting. I hope the full extent of the
law comes down on the perpetrator's head, whoever that may be,
because I'm not convinced this is good but discussing I
do not convote political violence in any capacity, you know, Honestly,
I'm just gonna go off the rails here. I'm mad
at both sides, y'all. As a die in the wole
(09:09):
liberal I do not consider myself progressive. I do consider
myself a liberal in the modern sense, not classical. But
you guys, I just like I'm mad at everyone. I'm
so mad at everyone. So before I get on this soapbox,
before I get on the soapbox, I'm going to tell you, guys,
part of the reason why I got so burned out
(09:30):
doing this podcast is because I have censored myself for
freaking years. I try to walk the line down the
middle of We're not gonna talk about any controversial opinions here.
I'm not gonna divulge how I feel on certain issues
because I don't want to make people mad. And this
is true crime and I can't talk about this or
I'm gonna alienate so and so. I am gonna say
(09:52):
this with my whole chest. I don't give a fuck.
I don't give a fuck. I love hearing both sides
of an issue. In fact, I absolutely I have to.
I'm not one of those people that you know, believes
a certain way or belongs to a certain group or
something like that, and then just immediately believes everything that
(10:13):
is being fed to me. Also, I don't know if
you guys can hear my dog, but she is actually
one of them is in here with me, and she
is beating her tail on the ground. So if that
is being picked up, I apologize. But I'm not that
type of person that just believes everything. I have always
been inquisitive by nature. I used to argue with my
parents all the time at like six years old. I'm
not doing that anymore. You guys, I love podcasting. I
(10:37):
love talking to you, I love meeting people. Back when
I had my horror podcast, I had so many friends
and you know, contacts that I'm still friends with twenty
years later. And I can't censor myself anymore. If that
means that my political beliefs don't align with yours and
you don't want to hear it, or you don't like
(10:57):
what I believe or my commentary, then maybe it is
better if you listen to a new podcast. I'm going
to give my honest to God thoughts and opinions on everything.
At this point, I tried to play the middle ground
far too much, and I can't do it anymore, you know,
trying to talk about and have a true crime podcast
and talk about court cases and justice while Donald Trump
(11:20):
is out here practically speed running fascism has made me
feel like I am screaming into the void on a
daily basis. You know, every day it's some new authoritarian bullshit,
whether it's him openly threatening judges, promising to round up
immigrants and doing it casually, not even casually, well yeah,
(11:41):
casually hinting at the DOJ to go after his political enemies.
This the Charlie Kirk stuff, and that's what got me
back into I am not gonna stay quiet, and I'm
not gonna pretend. I miss podcasting, I miss talking about
true crime and cases, but can't do it in its
former iteration anymore. And like I just said, Charlie Kirk
(12:02):
is the reason that this happened. I saw that he
was killed. Actually I watched the video minutes after it happened,
because that went viral everywhere. I was absolutely horrified and disgusted.
I just I'm sure all of you had that moment too.
With the tensions that are going on in this country
right now, the infighting, I mean, I feel like Republicans
are infighting Democrats, you know, progressives like you know, we
(12:25):
have a lot of infighting on our side as well,
Like I want a podcast again. Just watching people's response,
like I stay quiet about the Charlie Kirk stuff for
a couple days. I'm sitting here watching them basically canonize
him like he has almost been sainted. At this point,
I was talking to a couple friends because obviously on
(12:46):
the left side of the aisle, I have watched a
considerable amount of Charlie Kirk in my time and after
his death as well. I actually I was going to
do a full episode on Charlie Kirk. This was originally
going to be a full episode on Charlie Kirk, and
then watching the discourse online, I realized that would be
a feudile attempt. That would be futile because I feel
(13:07):
like each side is so hell bent on their own
you know, narrative that there's not going to be a hey, guys,
really listen here here he isn't his own words, and
then talk about it no fucking point. What I will
say is that the tensions on each side right now,
like the political climate in this country, is beyond fucked up.
(13:29):
What I will also say to any Republican or right
leaning people who for whatever reason may still be listening
to this, and if you were really really upset and
saying the Democrats were celebrating his death and so on
and so forth. Yeah, some were, some were, and I
don't necessarily condone that either. But you know what, I
(13:50):
don't have a problem with it. I don't have a
problem with it. There is free speech, and yes, I
do know the difference between protective free speech versus you
can utilize your free speech, but you may not be
free from consequences. I realize that as well. Whereas I
don't believe that employers should necessarily in most cases fire
(14:11):
or let people go, I can concede and understand how
people in positions such as teachers, law enforcement, things like
that are held to a much higher standard. So I
will concede that. And again, before anyone twists my words
or goes back to the default of your celebrating, is
(14:31):
that no, I'm not. I think it is horrible and terrible,
and I feel for his family on that never should
have happened. But what I need you guys to consider
for a moment is that Charlie Kirk was a very,
very very devout Christian. Oh and another point that I
wanted to make is I was talking to a friend
about this who's a Republican and she loves Charlie Kirk
(14:55):
Loves Loves, Loves Charlie Kirk, and we have very honest
and intimate conversations about Paula. And I was just like,
you're a Republican, but you're you know, very socially liberal,
So like, how exactly can you justify or reconcile the
really hateful shit that he said. I'm just trying to understand.
(15:16):
And she was like, I don't, I don't know what
you're talking about, and so I you know, like a
lot of people did sent her clips of him almost
like Charlie Kirk's greatest hits, like joking about the genocide
and Gaza, or talking about how transgenderism is a mental
disorder or multiculturalism is a cancer to Western civilization. I mean,
(15:38):
I'm sure you guys have heard the greatest hits about
how when he goes onto a plane and sees a
black pilot he gets nervous, and just like, I hope
they're okay. You know, when he attacked the Supreme Court
justices and said that don't lack the brain power, and
I'm not going to get into the full quotes. Something
that I'm noticing is that a lot of people with
Charlie Kirk quotes are saying, you're taking him out of contact.
(15:59):
Listen to the full thing, Oh I did. I've probably
listened to close to eighty hours of Charlie Kirk in
the last two weeks or actually, like in my lifetime.
I'm well aware I've seen full episodes of Charlie Kirk.
I am well aware because that is just who I
am as a human being. I like to know and
understand before I just get on the bandwagon. And I'm
gonna say this with my whole chest. I think Charlie
(16:22):
Kirk is a fucking piece of shit. I think that
he was a grifter. I think that he was hateful.
I think that a lot of what he came out
does not belong in Western society, in modern Western society,
full stop, in period. That's how I felt about Charlie Kirk.
But you know what, I would go to the floor.
(16:45):
I would go I would fight to the death for
his right to say everything that he had to say,
all of it. And as I was talking to my
friend about this, she did not understand what I was
talking about. And then I realized that for a lot
of people who just who saw some quotes because I
feel like a lot of us our algorithm. I don't
know if any of you work on your algorithm, but
(17:06):
like my TikTok algorithm is finally tuned, my instant algorithm
is finally tuned. You know, a lot of us are
being inundated with media sources from sites, websites and so
on and so forth that align with our own personal beliefs.
And I realized that my friend had no idea the
stuff that Charlie Kirk had actually been saying at times,
(17:27):
because Charlie Kirk did say a lot of wonderful, faith
based things that were uplifting and good. And if you're
inundated with those clips of Charlie Kirk, I can absolutely
understand how you think that he wasn't the person that, unfortunately,
the quote unquote other side has painted him out to be.
(17:50):
And as someone who has watched a lot of Charlie
Kirk out of curiosity, I can completely understand that. But
for other people who may have differing beliefs than you, Again, I,
as a gay woman, don't really like the fact that
he thinks that being gay should be illegal. I mean,
why would I? You can look it up anywhere, and
(18:10):
the thing about it. It's not taken out of context.
The man did not want women, wanted women to more
so be at home submit to their husbands. Like he
said that dozens of times women submit to your husbands.
I'm not submitting to anyone, much less a husband. That
wouldn't happen anyway. But I'm not submitting to anyone. And
(18:33):
I just I realized that it was a battle of algorithms.
And so I feel like the left side and the
Democrats are internally infighting. We're having purity tests right of
is our nominee or politician of the hour? Are they
liberal enough? Do they give us one hundred percent of
what we're asking for? No, well fuck them. You know,
(18:56):
the Democrats are pathetic at this point, like absolutely athetic.
The Republicans seem to be split. The Republican you know,
the right wing is actually pretty fractured. You have some
that are you know, never Trumpers, you have some that
feel betrayed by Trump. You still have the hardline maga
and it's just it's a mess, you guys, It is
(19:16):
an absolute mess. I was just so pissed, and then
when Charlie Kirk was shot again, horrified, disgusted. I but
here's the thing. I can understand why so many people
were borderline happy about it. I'm not saying that I was,
because I don't personally wish ill on anyone, really, but
(19:36):
I can understand how people who feel as though they
are being oppressed by someone. I saw a wonderful breakdown
by a therapist and they basically said, yes, it's normal
to be happy about the death of a controversial political figure.
This is a man, and if you agree with him,
I don't know why you're listening to me in this
(19:58):
podcast right now if you agreed with some of the
more egregious things he said, because our values clearly don't
align the gay community, the bipop community. That was redundant.
But here is a figure who publicly stated, you know,
all trans people are mentally ill. It should be illegal.
They're predators. Black people don't have, you know, black processing power.
(20:19):
They took a white man slot, I'd be nervous about
a black pilot. The Gaza clip where he was talking
about how he always laughs when he sees people protesting
or whatever with a free Gaza shirt with like a
gay Pride flag or sticker, because it's like they would
have thrown you off a building. Huh, I guess they
don't have any buildings left. Haha, too soon direct quote you, guys.
(20:42):
But I got really, really, really mad because everyone started
losing their jobs. And I was watching as people not
celebrating his death, just quoting him directly, just quoting him directly.
We're losing their jobs. We're losing their jobs over it.
And and the witch that yep Republicans, random people online,
(21:03):
far far right middle road Republicans making websites. If you
ever even said one thing about Charlie Kirk, they would
call your employer. I mean, here in the state of Tennessee,
at least twenty teachers have been fired a bunch of people.
There are two restaurants here locally in my town. I
know employees from one of them. He actually made a
(21:24):
comment to a co worker and said something to the
effect of, oh, well, anyway, the owner of this restaurant
heard that and fired him for that, like privately between
him and a coworker. I'm sorry, guys, but you have
to acknowledge that so many people lost their jobs for bullshit,
(21:44):
for bullshit, especially in this economy, with how with where
everything is right now, And again I am conceding to
people in places of power or certain responsibilities. I can
understand because some people, yes, very much, were celebrating this stuff.
But it made me mad, y'all. It absolutely made me
mad that the president of our country can say heinous, heinous, heinous,
(22:07):
heinous things that a Fox News post literally, quite literally
said that homeless people, if they don't get help, should
be involuntarily euthanized. Can you imagine? Can you imagine what
would happen to you if you went into HR or
you started talking about how your job, how homeless people
(22:30):
should be involuntarily euthanized. Better, yet, the challenge should be,
how about you go and take some of Charlie Kirk's
worst things, go into HR at your company and say,
I get nervous whenever I see a black employee. I
feel like they took a white man's spot, a white
person's spot. All of this madness for Charlie Kirk. And
I don't think it even necessarily has anything to do
with Charlie Kirk. I think it's the fact right now
(22:52):
that there's so much tension, resentment, upset, I mean, in
some sense hatred between the various political parties in this
climate right now. I think that it was just a spark.
It was just a spark. I also got into an
argument with someone who posted on my Facebook that it's
amazing that left wing is responsible for, you know, almost
(23:13):
all the political violence. Actually, that is bullshit. I can
pull up fifty different fucking sources, including including Donald Trump's
own Department of Justice as well as the FBI, that
shows that right wing violence accounts for like seventy percent
of all political violence, you know, political domestic terrorism in
(23:36):
the United States. That is a fact. Of course, the
week of Charlie Kirk's death, that change. There's also a
billion sources showing that that was changed on the White
House website, the FBI's website. But you guys, it doesn't matter.
I don't care if you're a Republican. I don't care
if you're a Democrat. I don't care if you're a
political I don't care what you are. I don't care
(23:58):
if you're mad at me, hate my belief, don't believe
I should even be a person. Please, for the love
of God, just don't believe everything. And this goes for
Democrats and Republicans. Please don't believe everything you hear from
someone at face value. Please do your own research and
double check everything, because there's so much bullshit online these days,
(24:22):
so much. You know, the Charlie Kirk's murderer, liberals started
photoshopping him wearing a Trump shirt and circulating that, which
was not the case. And it's just it's both sides.
It's both sides, and I really personally don't want a
civil war at all. I love my Republican friends, I
love all my neighbors, and I just like, can we
(24:44):
just take a step back and calm down, maybe stop
the witch hunts and trying to like get people removed
because we disagree with someone who actually, you know, was
advocating for our oppression and then hate democrats. I'm going
to say something that's maybe a hot take, and I
know some of you may not like it. Stop calling
everyone a fucking nazi. First of all, it's offensive. I
(25:06):
talked about it, actually. I talked about it actually in
an episode not too long ago. I went to Antioch
College for a couple of years and in Ohio, super
super super left wing liberal, and I had a world
peace It was a peace studies class and it was
world peace and one of the most amazing professors i've
ever had. She was an ambassador at the unn top
(25:26):
of her field. She was an incredible, incredible woman. And
in one of my classes when I was a freshman,
came in and there was an older woman sitting there,
like really really really old, and she starts talking and
she rolls up her sleeve and revealed a tattoo and
she had been in a concentration camp and she had
the tattoo. That was the second the second class that
(25:50):
I took, that was a second meeting of that class.
I just I feel like we have been so quick
to calling everyone racist that it's lost its meeting at
this point. I feel like racist is just thrown out
as a given at this point when we you know,
argue or fight or whatever. But I think that calling
people Nazis is at this point just offensive, and please
(26:13):
don't let them the actual meaning of the word Nazi
get to that place. Look, I realize that we are
we're in fascism. We are just a couple clicks short
of the handmade tale at this point, and they are
making goddamn sure that they are trying their hardest. I
realize that. But when we're calling Kletus Iowa the farmer
(26:36):
Kletus who just has a wife and the kids and
he votes for what you know, however, and we're just
like Nazi Nazi Nazi. I'm sorry, you guys, It is
probably not the best way to go about that. I
realize that we are heading towards a very very very
very dark future. And I do also realize that there's
a lot of overlap from the late nineteen thirties and
(26:59):
early nineteen forties to where we are now. There are
whole websites dedicated to a play by play, but the
systematic state sponsored genocide carried out by the Nazi regime
that killed over you know, roughly, you know, over under
six million Jewish men, women and children is still it
diminishes the historical weight of the Holocaust and the emotional
(27:22):
impact of it as well, because that is that term
definitely represents, It raises the stakes of a discussion, and
a lot of the time ends it all together. And
that's something that I found very, very very fascinating. I
do find I was watching Bill Maher last week on Friday,
well the last week right after Charlie Kirk had been shot,
and he acknowledged and said that in his experience from
(27:45):
what he's seen, you know, right wing you know or
Republicans are much more willing to debate or sit down
and have a discussion than their liberal counterparts. And that
has also been my experience, especially now as a white woman.
I recognize that I have a great deal of privilege
(28:09):
in going through the world and whatnot right. And that's
why I am not condemning people who may have been
a little bit excited about Charlie Kirk is because it
is not my job or it is not up to
me to dictate how other people respond to their oppressors.
(28:32):
Something happening to their oppressors that's not on me, that
is not on me. So all of that to say,
I was going to do an episode on Charlie Kirk
and try to do just an unbiased as much as
humanly possible look at both sides and tell everyone to
calm the fuck down. And I just didn't think that
would be useful. So that's why I am back you guys.
(28:55):
We can talk about what you can expect. I am
going to continue. First of all, Well, first of all,
the amount, the sheer number of messages that I have
received regarding the finishing the Charlie the Chris Chan series.
It's been immense and apparently people have found it and
it has been posted in various places and people are like, please,
(29:17):
for the love of God, finish the series. I have
to know. I got tired of it. And again, I
felt like it was exploitative, because I mean, that's a
low hanging fruit, right, So I just that was another
reason that I got burned out. I didn't feel like
it was helping the conversation. I felt like it was exploitative.
But it is true crime. And I did get like
(29:39):
nineteen or twenty episodes into it, and I'm only two
to three away. So based on your request, I will
finish the Chris Chan series. There's probably three episodes left.
Chris Chan is actually still alive, and well if you
know where the where the episode is heading and in
terms of what happens the crime that he commits, shall
(30:01):
I say he was just spotted with the woman he
offended against. So there's a lots of there. You know,
there's some updates there is what I'm getting at. So, yes,
I am going to be finishing the Chris Chan series.
That will be the next episode is going to be,
you know, the next episode in the Chris chan series again.
(30:21):
I literally went through nineteen or twenty of them only
to stop, you know, with two to go. That that's cheap.
So yes, I will finish the Christian. That will be
the next episode. I will talk about true crime and
you know, true crime cases as they come out. I
will continue to do that, but I am also going
to be talking about what is happening in this country
(30:43):
because it is terrifying. If you have been following the
Jimmy Kimmel stuff, that's terrifying. I don't even like Jimmy Kimmel.
I think he's a horrible comedian. I've never laughed at
a single thing he's ever said, and I don't think
I've ever seen his show. But what happened was terrifying.
Hegseth coming out and saying that journalists can only report
(31:04):
approved things otherwise their licenses, you know, and the press
credentials will be removed and suspended. That's terrifying, you guys,
that's terrifying. We don't want that. If a Democratic president
Biden had said that, oh my god, red flag, red
flag five alarm. You know, we are not okay right
(31:27):
now in this country. And I'm sure some of you.
And if you believe that that's fine, you're fine with
watching families be ripped apart and people round it up
and sent to camps, and then the camps magically lose
like a thousand of them and nobody has any idea
where they are. Like, I'm gonna say that if you
(31:48):
are reveling in what is happening in our country right now,
with the ice raids, with the National Guard being dispatched,
if with cancer funding, all of the you know, research
being suspended, PBS, all of that, Jimmy Kimmel, it's terrifying.
And if you wholeheartedly support that, you do you, honeybooboo,
(32:11):
but this is not the podcast for you. I was
tired of. I wouldn't say I was pandering. I was
just trying to walk a narrow, you know, road down
the middle and not be too controversial. Fuck that, I
needed to stop and ask myself why I was giving
my time, energy and heart to a space that felt
(32:32):
increasingly hollow, exploitative, and out of sync with who I
am as a person. So that being said, no more
tiptoeing around anything, No more shaping content around breaking news
or what the algorithm wants to see. Or for the
you know, quirky true crime girlies. Sorry, guys, I'm not
doing that anymore. And that means true crime stories that
(32:56):
matter that I feel as though they matter. That means
pulling apart political hypocrisy. That means weird internet, rabbit holes, cults, history,
pop culture, whatever the hell else I want to cover,
or whatever you know keeps me up at night. I'm
going to talk about the things that I actually care about,
and not just the latest gruesome case with the high
(33:18):
SEO value. But if you are here, if you are
like me, and you are exhausted, constantly disgusted, if you're empathetic,
if you're full of rage, god, nuance, even and maybe
a slight bit of hope, then I hope that you
will continue listening to the podcast and continuing. You know,
(33:40):
the world is loud, the Internet is heinously cruel, and
politics are exhausting. But I plan to use my voice
to talk about all of that, and then also on
the true crime front, try to cut through the what
gave me the ick? So I know that this has
been a very long and rambling episode, but I just
(34:02):
wanted to pop in let everyone know that I am
still here. I'm mad as hell at the state of
the world and people and everything in it. I am
also exhausted and also excited because I haven't felt free
or happy or excited about doing this podcast in years
(34:25):
in years, And y'all, I know I'm sensitive. I am sensitive.
I'm probably too sensitive to even be doing this if
I'm gonna be perfectly honest with you, But I don't
care anymore unrelated, but I like to have my finger
on the pulse of what's going on in the news
or just how people are generally responding right like I love.
(34:46):
I think part of what's fascinating to me about the
rapture talk right now is that it's literally mass hysteria.
It's mass religious psychosis. Right I can see how many
people see the people believing it and feeding off of
each other. And I saw this same and true crime
when I was coming to do the Karen Reid case,
so much hatred and vitriol. And I'm not new, I
(35:07):
wasn't born yesterday. I'm a child of the Internet. I
was like twelve years old on rotten dot Com and
eBaum's World and watching gross shit and beheadings. And I've seen,
you know, I've been on Reddit since the beginning. I
know how the internet operates, looking up the Karen Reid
case just to see news updates, and you know, time
(35:28):
by time when court was active. A pro Karen Read
free Karen Read person was like, I think she's innocent
because of x YZ. Some other person would be like,
you dumb fucking bitch, Da da da da duh, How
the fuck are you so stupid you can't realize God,
y'all are pathetic, or even the reverse of how the
hell do you think KARENRII could have done it? Da
da dada da? Are you stupid? And it's just people
(35:49):
fighting and being nasty all the damn time. And then
you have figures like turtle Boy from the Karen ree
case out there being disgusting, stalking people, harassing peace. People
got popped for that that he had a huge, huge
platform talking about Karen Reid and people would give him
money and he would just be a bully and nasty
(36:10):
and call people involved in the case of the prosecutor or,
you know, people like fat and ugly and disgusting, And
it's just I'm not that person. And it disgusts me
that people who have large platforms just go to the
lowest common denominator and bully Mike Boudet of Sword and
Scale prime example of just being hateful and nasty all
(36:32):
the time to people doxing people, and I just like,
I don't have time for it, you guys, I don't
have time for it. So in short, I am back.
I'm going to talk about a lot of different things. Yes,
true crime, but we are going to cover random rabbit holes,
true crime documentaries, just anything that I find interesting I'm
going to cover, and that is going to now because
(36:55):
of the state of the world right now, that will
in fact include politics occasionally. I'm not here to attack
the opposing side. I am here to talk about random
things that I find interesting. If you don't agree with me,
that's completely fine. I hope that you stick around. I
hope that you listen if you don't know hard feelings.
But I just want to make it explicitly clear that
(37:16):
the content is going to be different. I am going
to largely be unhinged and open and honest for the
first time probably since I founded this podcast. Beyond that,
just again, the next episode is going to be coming
out on Saturday. Episodes, and I promise you guys, imagine
me pricking my finger and making a blood oath like
I'm a twelve year old girl to sleepover. Episodes will
(37:37):
be available first thing Saturday morning. Expect deep dives, weird stories, history, psychology,
media critique, political critiques, and maybe even a little bit
of hope, because honestly, I need that too. I'm not
here to be the human embodiment of investigation Discovery Channel.
I'm here to talk about things that interest me and
(37:59):
hopefully interest you. So I'm just gonna close this out
by saying, if you're still with me, thank you. I'm honored.
And if you're not, that's okay too. There are plenty
of other podcasts that I'm sure that you listen to
and are happy to continue with. If I'm going to
keep doing this, it's going to be because I care,
(38:19):
not just whatever horrifying headline is trending this week. I
realize me finishing up the Chris chan case is a
little antithetical to everything that I just said. However, Comma,
I owe it to you guys to finish something, and
going through twenty twenty one episodes and not finishing kind
(38:39):
of makes me an asshole. So that being said, there
is a new website that is coming. I actually did
start to work on that a little bit ago. I
need to get it up and publish, but for now,
in the meantime, you can follow the podcast at We
Saw the Double Podcast on Instagram, We Saw the Devil
on Facebook and Twitter, and last but not least, if
you want to follow fow me on my personal Instagram.
(39:01):
You can also do that as well at Robin Underscore WSTD.
And with that, guys, I'll talk to you on Saturday.
Sunny spaces, smiling faces, happy places. But every sunny space
holds a shadow. Behind every smile, our sharp teeth, and
every happy place has something sinister lurking just below the surface.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Welcome to We Saw the Devil, the podcast diving deep
into the chilling realms of true crime. Join your host
Robin as she unravels mysteries that have left investigators baffled
and armchair sleuth's obsessed. Be forewarned, dear listener, We Saw
the Devil is not for the faint of heart. Our
unflinching exploration will take you to the darkest corners of
(00:41):
the psyche and through the unimaginable depths of human darkness
to unearth stark secrets. To the harsh light of day.
Nothing will be left untouched. Are you ready? Are you sure?
We Saw the Devil?
Speaker 3 (00:59):
Hello everyone, and you are listening to We Saw the Devil.
This is Robin, and yes it's really me. I am back.
I promise not you know, one or two episodes and
then disappearing again. I am actually back. This isn't so
much of an episode as just a realigning of what
(01:20):
you guys can expect, because just let me rip the
band aid off. Just go ahead and do that. I
took a break from podcasting because I was completely and
utterly drained. I'm talking creatively, emotionally, politically, and even though
I'm a non believer spiritually. I ended up getting I mean,
(01:42):
as everyone recalls, I ended up getting laid off from
a job, I got a new job, I got engaged,
I got married, and beyond that, I mean, just dealing
with life and the kind that doesn't make it into
a polished episode, you know, the kind that just kind
of breaks you down in exhaust you and I just
(02:02):
really had nothing to say. I guess that's only half
the story. I mean, the real reason that I took
a break. The last episode that I said that I
was going to do was back when the Karen Reid
trial was going and I was really excited about the
Karen Reid trial. I followed it daily. I for whatever reason,
was just really particularly interested in how this, especially the
(02:26):
second trial, was going to shape up. I just came
to the realization. I know that a lot of you,
you know, listen to other podcasts, and you're well aware
of the amount of work that goes into producing a
single episode in terms of research and recording, and you
know all of that. And I just I was scrolling
through Twitter looking at updates on the Karen Reid trial,
(02:49):
and I just realized in that moment, I just had
had an epiphany. I'm done. I'm over it. The infighting.
I'll get into that in a moment, but I'm not
over true crime. But I'm over this version of true crime,
you know what I mean. I feel like true crime
has begun to treat human tragedy like a fidget spinner
(03:15):
for the morally bored. I don't even know, you know,
And I didn't originally start this podcast. We saw the
devil to be part of the problem. I did it
because my friends and I like true crime at the time,
and I truly cared about the stories. And I wanted
to put out a true crime podcast that shines a
(03:37):
light on disenfranchised or oppressed groups, right that don't get
the press or media coverage that a lot of these
other cases do. I just truly wanted to, you know,
obviously explore the darker sides of humanity, right, but I
wanted to have and retain empathy I did not like.
(04:00):
My biggest fear in starting a true crime podcast was
I didn't want to just be exploitative. And then somewhere
along the way, especially with the Lori Valo case, true
crime stopped it being about truth or research or a
good story and just became about like content and click
(04:20):
bait and gossip. It started to feel off watching people
treat dateline and true crime binges like some sort of
personality trait, you know, like I get it. You watch
a few documentaries. You've seen the staircase and making a
murderer an unknown caller or a non number or whatever.
So have I that I found that a lot of
(04:43):
people make their entire personality. Oh my god, I follow
this like the serial killer stories every night. My husband
thinks I'm a weird now, but ahaha, and I see them,
not them as if I'm talking about a certain group
of people. I guess I kind of am the T
shirt in the merch that's coming out about true crime
all the time, or true crime and chill. And I
(05:06):
just came to a cross roads where I was asking
myself why I've had people directly ask me for the
gory details of a family friend's murder like they were
just ordering coffee, and it was, you know, I was
a Barisa or something like really good friends who are
into true crime ask for gory details, and I just
(05:28):
I've reached this point where it's just this culture that
we're in doesn't just desensitize us to violence. I feel
like it truly rewires how we treat people and real grief.
I see it over and over and over again in
a lot of cases that I've discussed in the past.
And then when you take into account and I know,
(05:50):
especially if you're you know, on true crime Reddit to
those places, it's even worse when you start looking behind
the curtain. So many shows and podcasts don't even ask
a victim's family for consent, and I've seen time and
time again how some of even the largest podcasts in
(06:11):
the true crime genre, the families will speak out. I
just got so tired of these people's pain, like pain
is just up for grabs as long as the public
records are available and the intro music slaps. I guess
I just came to the realization that I was disgusted
by what I was doing, and I really really do
(06:32):
not want to be another voice that's feeding the machine,
especially with so much going on right now in America.
Whatever the hell timeline we are unfortunately living in now.
I don't know how many of you guys followed rapture
talk on TikTok, but a lot of you know, Christians
(06:53):
believed that the twenty third. As I'm recording this is
ten forty pm on the twenty third, on Twoday, the
twenty third, you know, the rapture. I woke up today
and I was fully prepared to be raptured, but alas
it did not happen, and that has been such an
amazing rabbit hole to go down. And then I realized,
and I saw another perspective on it from a sociologist
(07:18):
that mass events of religious psychosis like these actually lead
to a lot of suicides and people taking their pets
in to be euthanized prematurely and selling their homes, their cars,
and their possessions. Juxtapose that the rapture that we're having,
(07:39):
on top of the news that that, you know, whatever
the fuck is hurtling towards us in space, you have
a couple fringe people saying that's an alien spaceship. You
have the dowsing rod people all over TikTok, and it's
just on top of that you have Israel and Gaza
and Trump and Jimmy Kemmel and Charlie Kirk. What made
(08:03):
me post on the Instagram about I'm back, I'm mad
as hell, like I'm coming back, I'm doing a new episode,
and whatnot was Charlie Kirk and a couple people unfollowed
me on Facebook because I posted a screenshot from the
threads about if you're being doxxed for speaking your mind
(08:25):
on Charlie Kirk, you know, here are some steps you
can take, and that immediately turned into how dare you say? Murders? Okay,
I'm unfollowing you. Bye. Okay, Well, first of all, good
fucking riddance. And secondly, I'm gonna state this right now.
What happened to Charlie Kirk is not okay. It was vile,
(08:47):
it was disgusting. I hope the full extent of the
law comes down on the perpetrator's head, whoever that may be,
because I'm not convinced this is good but discussing I
do not convote political violence in any capacity, you know, Honestly,
I'm just gonna go off the rails here. I'm mad
at both sides, y'all. As a die in the wole
(09:09):
liberal I do not consider myself progressive. I do consider
myself a liberal in the modern sense, not classical. But
you guys, I just like I'm mad at everyone. I'm
so mad at everyone. So before I get on this soapbox,
before I get on the soapbox, I'm going to tell you, guys,
part of the reason why I got so burned out
(09:30):
doing this podcast is because I have censored myself for
freaking years. I try to walk the line down the
middle of We're not gonna talk about any controversial opinions here.
I'm not gonna divulge how I feel on certain issues
because I don't want to make people mad. And this
is true crime and I can't talk about this or
I'm gonna alienate so and so. I am gonna say
(09:52):
this with my whole chest. I don't give a fuck.
I don't give a fuck. I love hearing both sides
of an issue. In fact, I absolutely I have to.
I'm not one of those people that you know, believes
a certain way or belongs to a certain group or
something like that, and then just immediately believes everything that
(10:13):
is being fed to me. Also, I don't know if
you guys can hear my dog, but she is actually
one of them is in here with me, and she
is beating her tail on the ground. So if that
is being picked up, I apologize. But I'm not that
type of person that just believes everything. I have always
been inquisitive by nature. I used to argue with my
parents all the time at like six years old. I'm
not doing that anymore. You guys, I love podcasting. I
(10:37):
love talking to you, I love meeting people. Back when
I had my horror podcast, I had so many friends
and you know, contacts that I'm still friends with twenty
years later. And I can't censor myself anymore. If that
means that my political beliefs don't align with yours and
you don't want to hear it, or you don't like
(10:57):
what I believe or my commentary, then maybe it is
better if you listen to a new podcast. I'm going
to give my honest to God thoughts and opinions on everything.
At this point, I tried to play the middle ground
far too much, and I can't do it anymore, you know,
trying to talk about and have a true crime podcast
and talk about court cases and justice while Donald Trump
(11:20):
is out here practically speed running fascism has made me
feel like I am screaming into the void on a
daily basis. You know, every day it's some new authoritarian bullshit,
whether it's him openly threatening judges, promising to round up
immigrants and doing it casually, not even casually, well yeah,
(11:41):
casually hinting at the DOJ to go after his political enemies.
This the Charlie Kirk stuff, and that's what got me
back into I am not gonna stay quiet, and I'm
not gonna pretend. I miss podcasting, I miss talking about
true crime and cases, but can't do it in its
former iteration anymore. And like I just said, Charlie Kirk
(12:02):
is the reason that this happened. I saw that he
was killed. Actually I watched the video minutes after it happened,
because that went viral everywhere. I was absolutely horrified and disgusted.
I just I'm sure all of you had that moment too.
With the tensions that are going on in this country
right now, the infighting, I mean, I feel like Republicans
are infighting Democrats, you know, progressives like you know, we
(12:25):
have a lot of infighting on our side as well,
Like I want a podcast again. Just watching people's response,
like I stay quiet about the Charlie Kirk stuff for
a couple days. I'm sitting here watching them basically canonize
him like he has almost been sainted. At this point,
I was talking to a couple friends because obviously on
(12:46):
the left side of the aisle, I have watched a
considerable amount of Charlie Kirk in my time and after
his death as well. I actually I was going to
do a full episode on Charlie Kirk. This was originally
going to be a full episode on Charlie Kirk, and
then watching the discourse online, I realized that would be
a feudile attempt. That would be futile because I feel
(13:07):
like each side is so hell bent on their own
you know, narrative that there's not going to be a hey, guys,
really listen here here he isn't his own words, and
then talk about it no fucking point. What I will
say is that the tensions on each side right now,
like the political climate in this country, is beyond fucked up.
(13:29):
What I will also say to any Republican or right
leaning people who for whatever reason may still be listening
to this, and if you were really really upset and
saying the Democrats were celebrating his death and so on
and so forth. Yeah, some were, some were, and I
don't necessarily condone that either. But you know what, I
(13:50):
don't have a problem with it. I don't have a
problem with it. There is free speech, and yes, I
do know the difference between protective free speech versus you
can utilize your free speech, but you may not be
free from consequences. I realize that as well. Whereas I
don't believe that employers should necessarily in most cases fire
(14:11):
or let people go, I can concede and understand how
people in positions such as teachers, law enforcement, things like
that are held to a much higher standard. So I
will concede that. And again, before anyone twists my words
or goes back to the default of your celebrating, is
(14:31):
that no, I'm not. I think it is horrible and terrible,
and I feel for his family on that never should
have happened. But what I need you guys to consider
for a moment is that Charlie Kirk was a very,
very very devout Christian. Oh and another point that I
wanted to make is I was talking to a friend
about this who's a Republican and she loves Charlie Kirk
(14:55):
Loves Loves, Loves Charlie Kirk, and we have very honest
and intimate conversations about Paula. And I was just like,
you're a Republican, but you're you know, very socially liberal,
So like, how exactly can you justify or reconcile the
really hateful shit that he said. I'm just trying to understand.
(15:16):
And she was like, I don't, I don't know what
you're talking about, and so I you know, like a
lot of people did sent her clips of him almost
like Charlie Kirk's greatest hits, like joking about the genocide
and Gaza, or talking about how transgenderism is a mental
disorder or multiculturalism is a cancer to Western civilization. I mean,
(15:38):
I'm sure you guys have heard the greatest hits about
how when he goes onto a plane and sees a
black pilot he gets nervous, and just like, I hope
they're okay. You know, when he attacked the Supreme Court
justices and said that don't lack the brain power, and
I'm not going to get into the full quotes. Something
that I'm noticing is that a lot of people with
Charlie Kirk quotes are saying, you're taking him out of contact.
(15:59):
Listen to the full thing, Oh I did. I've probably
listened to close to eighty hours of Charlie Kirk in
the last two weeks or actually, like in my lifetime.
I'm well aware I've seen full episodes of Charlie Kirk.
I am well aware because that is just who I
am as a human being. I like to know and
understand before I just get on the bandwagon. And I'm
gonna say this with my whole chest. I think Charlie
(16:22):
Kirk is a fucking piece of shit. I think that
he was a grifter. I think that he was hateful.
I think that a lot of what he came out
does not belong in Western society, in modern Western society,
full stop, in period. That's how I felt about Charlie Kirk.
But you know what, I would go to the floor.
(16:45):
I would go I would fight to the death for
his right to say everything that he had to say,
all of it. And as I was talking to my
friend about this, she did not understand what I was
talking about. And then I realized that for a lot
of people who just who saw some quotes because I
feel like a lot of us our algorithm. I don't
know if any of you work on your algorithm, but
(17:06):
like my TikTok algorithm is finally tuned, my instant algorithm
is finally tuned. You know, a lot of us are
being inundated with media sources from sites, websites and so
on and so forth that align with our own personal beliefs.
And I realized that my friend had no idea the
stuff that Charlie Kirk had actually been saying at times,
(17:27):
because Charlie Kirk did say a lot of wonderful, faith
based things that were uplifting and good. And if you're
inundated with those clips of Charlie Kirk, I can absolutely
understand how you think that he wasn't the person that, unfortunately,
the quote unquote other side has painted him out to be.
(17:50):
And as someone who has watched a lot of Charlie
Kirk out of curiosity, I can completely understand that. But
for other people who may have differing beliefs than you, Again, I,
as a gay woman, don't really like the fact that
he thinks that being gay should be illegal. I mean,
why would I? You can look it up anywhere, and
(18:10):
the thing about it. It's not taken out of context.
The man did not want women, wanted women to more
so be at home submit to their husbands. Like he
said that dozens of times women submit to your husbands.
I'm not submitting to anyone, much less a husband. That
wouldn't happen anyway. But I'm not submitting to anyone. And
(18:33):
I just I realized that it was a battle of algorithms.
And so I feel like the left side and the
Democrats are internally infighting. We're having purity tests right of
is our nominee or politician of the hour? Are they
liberal enough? Do they give us one hundred percent of
what we're asking for? No, well fuck them. You know,
(18:56):
the Democrats are pathetic at this point, like absolutely athetic.
The Republicans seem to be split. The Republican you know,
the right wing is actually pretty fractured. You have some
that are you know, never Trumpers, you have some that
feel betrayed by Trump. You still have the hardline maga
and it's just it's a mess, you guys, It is
(19:16):
an absolute mess. I was just so pissed, and then
when Charlie Kirk was shot again, horrified, disgusted. I but
here's the thing. I can understand why so many people
were borderline happy about it. I'm not saying that I was,
because I don't personally wish ill on anyone, really, but
(19:36):
I can understand how people who feel as though they
are being oppressed by someone. I saw a wonderful breakdown
by a therapist and they basically said, yes, it's normal
to be happy about the death of a controversial political figure.
This is a man, and if you agree with him,
I don't know why you're listening to me in this
(19:58):
podcast right now if you agreed with some of the
more egregious things he said, because our values clearly don't
align the gay community, the bipop community. That was redundant.
But here is a figure who publicly stated, you know,
all trans people are mentally ill. It should be illegal.
They're predators. Black people don't have, you know, black processing power.
(20:19):
They took a white man slot, I'd be nervous about
a black pilot. The Gaza clip where he was talking
about how he always laughs when he sees people protesting
or whatever with a free Gaza shirt with like a
gay Pride flag or sticker, because it's like they would
have thrown you off a building. Huh, I guess they
don't have any buildings left. Haha, too soon direct quote you, guys.
(20:42):
But I got really, really, really mad because everyone started
losing their jobs. And I was watching as people not
celebrating his death, just quoting him directly, just quoting him directly.
We're losing their jobs. We're losing their jobs over it.
And and the witch that yep Republicans, random people online,
(21:03):
far far right middle road Republicans making websites. If you
ever even said one thing about Charlie Kirk, they would
call your employer. I mean, here in the state of Tennessee,
at least twenty teachers have been fired a bunch of people.
There are two restaurants here locally in my town. I
know employees from one of them. He actually made a
(21:24):
comment to a co worker and said something to the
effect of, oh, well, anyway, the owner of this restaurant
heard that and fired him for that, like privately between
him and a coworker. I'm sorry, guys, but you have
to acknowledge that so many people lost their jobs for bullshit,
(21:44):
for bullshit, especially in this economy, with how with where
everything is right now, And again I am conceding to
people in places of power or certain responsibilities. I can
understand because some people, yes, very much, were celebrating this stuff.
But it made me mad, y'all. It absolutely made me
mad that the president of our country can say heinous, heinous, heinous,
(22:07):
heinous things that a Fox News post literally, quite literally
said that homeless people, if they don't get help, should
be involuntarily euthanized. Can you imagine? Can you imagine what
would happen to you if you went into HR or
you started talking about how your job, how homeless people
(22:30):
should be involuntarily euthanized. Better, yet, the challenge should be,
how about you go and take some of Charlie Kirk's
worst things, go into HR at your company and say,
I get nervous whenever I see a black employee. I
feel like they took a white man's spot, a white
person's spot. All of this madness for Charlie Kirk. And
I don't think it even necessarily has anything to do
with Charlie Kirk. I think it's the fact right now
(22:52):
that there's so much tension, resentment, upset, I mean, in
some sense hatred between the various political parties in this
climate right now. I think that it was just a spark.
It was just a spark. I also got into an
argument with someone who posted on my Facebook that it's
amazing that left wing is responsible for, you know, almost
(23:13):
all the political violence. Actually, that is bullshit. I can
pull up fifty different fucking sources, including including Donald Trump's
own Department of Justice as well as the FBI, that
shows that right wing violence accounts for like seventy percent
of all political violence, you know, political domestic terrorism in
(23:36):
the United States. That is a fact. Of course, the
week of Charlie Kirk's death, that change. There's also a
billion sources showing that that was changed on the White
House website, the FBI's website. But you guys, it doesn't matter.
I don't care if you're a Republican. I don't care
if you're a Democrat. I don't care if you're a
political I don't care what you are. I don't care
(23:58):
if you're mad at me, hate my belief, don't believe
I should even be a person. Please, for the love
of God, just don't believe everything. And this goes for
Democrats and Republicans. Please don't believe everything you hear from
someone at face value. Please do your own research and
double check everything, because there's so much bullshit online these days,
(24:22):
so much. You know, the Charlie Kirk's murderer, liberals started
photoshopping him wearing a Trump shirt and circulating that, which
was not the case. And it's just it's both sides.
It's both sides, and I really personally don't want a
civil war at all. I love my Republican friends, I
love all my neighbors, and I just like, can we
(24:44):
just take a step back and calm down, maybe stop
the witch hunts and trying to like get people removed
because we disagree with someone who actually, you know, was
advocating for our oppression and then hate democrats. I'm going
to say something that's maybe a hot take, and I
know some of you may not like it. Stop calling
everyone a fucking nazi. First of all, it's offensive. I
(25:06):
talked about it, actually. I talked about it actually in
an episode not too long ago. I went to Antioch
College for a couple of years and in Ohio, super
super super left wing liberal, and I had a world
peace It was a peace studies class and it was
world peace and one of the most amazing professors i've
ever had. She was an ambassador at the unn top
(25:26):
of her field. She was an incredible, incredible woman. And
in one of my classes when I was a freshman,
came in and there was an older woman sitting there,
like really really really old, and she starts talking and
she rolls up her sleeve and revealed a tattoo and
she had been in a concentration camp and she had
the tattoo. That was the second the second class that
(25:50):
I took, that was a second meeting of that class.
I just I feel like we have been so quick
to calling everyone racist that it's lost its meeting at
this point. I feel like racist is just thrown out
as a given at this point when we you know,
argue or fight or whatever. But I think that calling
people Nazis is at this point just offensive, and please
(26:13):
don't let them the actual meaning of the word Nazi
get to that place. Look, I realize that we are
we're in fascism. We are just a couple clicks short
of the handmade tale at this point, and they are
making goddamn sure that they are trying their hardest. I
realize that. But when we're calling Kletus Iowa the farmer
(26:36):
Kletus who just has a wife and the kids and
he votes for what you know, however, and we're just
like Nazi Nazi Nazi. I'm sorry, you guys, It is
probably not the best way to go about that. I
realize that we are heading towards a very very very
very dark future. And I do also realize that there's
a lot of overlap from the late nineteen thirties and
(26:59):
early nineteen forties to where we are now. There are
whole websites dedicated to a play by play, but the
systematic state sponsored genocide carried out by the Nazi regime
that killed over you know, roughly, you know, over under
six million Jewish men, women and children is still it
diminishes the historical weight of the Holocaust and the emotional
(27:22):
impact of it as well, because that is that term
definitely represents, It raises the stakes of a discussion, and
a lot of the time ends it all together. And
that's something that I found very, very very fascinating. I
do find I was watching Bill Maher last week on Friday,
well the last week right after Charlie Kirk had been shot,
and he acknowledged and said that in his experience from
(27:45):
what he's seen, you know, right wing you know or
Republicans are much more willing to debate or sit down
and have a discussion than their liberal counterparts. And that
has also been my experience, especially now as a white woman.
I recognize that I have a great deal of privilege
(28:09):
in going through the world and whatnot right. And that's
why I am not condemning people who may have been
a little bit excited about Charlie Kirk is because it
is not my job or it is not up to
me to dictate how other people respond to their oppressors.
(28:32):
Something happening to their oppressors that's not on me, that
is not on me. So all of that to say,
I was going to do an episode on Charlie Kirk
and try to do just an unbiased as much as
humanly possible look at both sides and tell everyone to
calm the fuck down. And I just didn't think that
would be useful. So that's why I am back you guys.
(28:55):
We can talk about what you can expect. I am
going to continue. First of all, Well, first of all,
the amount, the sheer number of messages that I have
received regarding the finishing the Charlie the Chris Chan series.
It's been immense and apparently people have found it and
it has been posted in various places and people are like, please,
(29:17):
for the love of God, finish the series. I have
to know. I got tired of it. And again, I
felt like it was exploitative, because I mean, that's a
low hanging fruit, right, So I just that was another
reason that I got burned out. I didn't feel like
it was helping the conversation. I felt like it was exploitative.
But it is true crime. And I did get like
(29:39):
nineteen or twenty episodes into it, and I'm only two
to three away. So based on your request, I will
finish the Chris Chan series. There's probably three episodes left.
Chris Chan is actually still alive, and well if you
know where the where the episode is heading and in
terms of what happens the crime that he commits, shall
(30:01):
I say he was just spotted with the woman he
offended against. So there's a lots of there. You know,
there's some updates there is what I'm getting at. So, yes,
I am going to be finishing the Chris Chan series.
That will be the next episode is going to be,
you know, the next episode in the Chris chan series again.
(30:21):
I literally went through nineteen or twenty of them only
to stop, you know, with two to go. That that's cheap.
So yes, I will finish the Christian. That will be
the next episode. I will talk about true crime and
you know, true crime cases as they come out. I
will continue to do that, but I am also going
to be talking about what is happening in this country
(30:43):
because it is terrifying. If you have been following the
Jimmy Kimmel stuff, that's terrifying. I don't even like Jimmy Kimmel.
I think he's a horrible comedian. I've never laughed at
a single thing he's ever said, and I don't think
I've ever seen his show. But what happened was terrifying.
Hegseth coming out and saying that journalists can only report
(31:04):
approved things otherwise their licenses, you know, and the press
credentials will be removed and suspended. That's terrifying, you guys,
that's terrifying. We don't want that. If a Democratic president
Biden had said that, oh my god, red flag, red
flag five alarm. You know, we are not okay right
(31:27):
now in this country. And I'm sure some of you.
And if you believe that that's fine, you're fine with
watching families be ripped apart and people round it up
and sent to camps, and then the camps magically lose
like a thousand of them and nobody has any idea
where they are. Like, I'm gonna say that if you
(31:48):
are reveling in what is happening in our country right now,
with the ice raids, with the National Guard being dispatched,
if with cancer funding, all of the you know, research
being suspended, PBS, all of that, Jimmy Kimmel, it's terrifying.
And if you wholeheartedly support that, you do you, honeybooboo,
(32:11):
but this is not the podcast for you. I was
tired of. I wouldn't say I was pandering. I was
just trying to walk a narrow, you know, road down
the middle and not be too controversial. Fuck that, I
needed to stop and ask myself why I was giving
my time, energy and heart to a space that felt
(32:32):
increasingly hollow, exploitative, and out of sync with who I
am as a person. So that being said, no more
tiptoeing around anything, No more shaping content around breaking news
or what the algorithm wants to see. Or for the
you know, quirky true crime girlies. Sorry, guys, I'm not
doing that anymore. And that means true crime stories that
(32:56):
matter that I feel as though they matter. That means
pulling apart political hypocrisy. That means weird internet, rabbit holes, cults, history,
pop culture, whatever the hell else I want to cover,
or whatever you know keeps me up at night. I'm
going to talk about the things that I actually care about,
and not just the latest gruesome case with the high
(33:18):
SEO value. But if you are here, if you are
like me, and you are exhausted, constantly disgusted, if you're empathetic,
if you're full of rage, god, nuance, even and maybe
a slight bit of hope, then I hope that you
will continue listening to the podcast and continuing. You know,
(33:40):
the world is loud, the Internet is heinously cruel, and
politics are exhausting. But I plan to use my voice
to talk about all of that, and then also on
the true crime front, try to cut through the what
gave me the ick? So I know that this has
been a very long and rambling episode, but I just
(34:02):
wanted to pop in let everyone know that I am
still here. I'm mad as hell at the state of
the world and people and everything in it. I am
also exhausted and also excited because I haven't felt free
or happy or excited about doing this podcast in years
(34:25):
in years, And y'all, I know I'm sensitive. I am sensitive.
I'm probably too sensitive to even be doing this if
I'm gonna be perfectly honest with you, But I don't
care anymore unrelated, but I like to have my finger
on the pulse of what's going on in the news
or just how people are generally responding right like I love.
(34:46):
I think part of what's fascinating to me about the
rapture talk right now is that it's literally mass hysteria.
It's mass religious psychosis. Right I can see how many
people see the people believing it and feeding off of
each other. And I saw this same and true crime
when I was coming to do the Karen Reid case,
so much hatred and vitriol. And I'm not new, I
(35:07):
wasn't born yesterday. I'm a child of the Internet. I
was like twelve years old on rotten dot Com and
eBaum's World and watching gross shit and beheadings. And I've seen,
you know, I've been on Reddit since the beginning. I
know how the internet operates, looking up the Karen Reid
case just to see news updates, and you know, time
(35:28):
by time when court was active. A pro Karen Read
free Karen Read person was like, I think she's innocent
because of x YZ. Some other person would be like,
you dumb fucking bitch, Da da da da duh, How
the fuck are you so stupid you can't realize God,
y'all are pathetic, or even the reverse of how the
hell do you think KARENRII could have done it? Da
da dada da? Are you stupid? And it's just people
(35:49):
fighting and being nasty all the damn time. And then
you have figures like turtle Boy from the Karen ree
case out there being disgusting, stalking people, harassing peace. People
got popped for that that he had a huge, huge
platform talking about Karen Reid and people would give him
money and he would just be a bully and nasty
(36:10):
and call people involved in the case of the prosecutor or,
you know, people like fat and ugly and disgusting, And
it's just I'm not that person. And it disgusts me
that people who have large platforms just go to the
lowest common denominator and bully Mike Boudet of Sword and
Scale prime example of just being hateful and nasty all
(36:32):
the time to people doxing people, and I just like,
I don't have time for it, you guys, I don't
have time for it. So in short, I am back.
I'm going to talk about a lot of different things. Yes,
true crime, but we are going to cover random rabbit holes,
true crime documentaries, just anything that I find interesting I'm
going to cover, and that is going to now because
(36:55):
of the state of the world right now, that will
in fact include politics occasionally. I'm not here to attack
the opposing side. I am here to talk about random
things that I find interesting. If you don't agree with me,
that's completely fine. I hope that you stick around. I
hope that you listen if you don't know hard feelings.
But I just want to make it explicitly clear that
(37:16):
the content is going to be different. I am going
to largely be unhinged and open and honest for the
first time probably since I founded this podcast. Beyond that,
just again, the next episode is going to be coming
out on Saturday. Episodes, and I promise you guys, imagine
me pricking my finger and making a blood oath like
I'm a twelve year old girl to sleepover. Episodes will
(37:37):
be available first thing Saturday morning. Expect deep dives, weird stories, history, psychology,
media critique, political critiques, and maybe even a little bit
of hope, because honestly, I need that too. I'm not
here to be the human embodiment of investigation Discovery Channel.
I'm here to talk about things that interest me and
(37:59):
hopefully interest you. So I'm just gonna close this out
by saying, if you're still with me, thank you. I'm honored.
And if you're not, that's okay too. There are plenty
of other podcasts that I'm sure that you listen to
and are happy to continue with. If I'm going to
keep doing this, it's going to be because I care,
(38:19):
not just whatever horrifying headline is trending this week. I
realize me finishing up the Chris chan case is a
little antithetical to everything that I just said. However, Comma,
I owe it to you guys to finish something, and
going through twenty twenty one episodes and not finishing kind
(38:39):
of makes me an asshole. So that being said, there
is a new website that is coming. I actually did
start to work on that a little bit ago. I
need to get it up and publish, but for now,
in the meantime, you can follow the podcast at We
Saw the Double Podcast on Instagram, We Saw the Devil
on Facebook and Twitter, and last but not least, if
you want to follow fow me on my personal Instagram.
(39:01):
You can also do that as well at Robin Underscore WSTD.
And with that, guys, I'll talk to you on Saturday.
Popular Podcasts
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.