January 2, 2025 • 9 mins
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This episode shares the challenges freelancers face when working with frustrating clients. It illustrates the importance of communication, proactive management, and learning from obstacles.
• The struggles of getting detailed responses from a new client
• The challenges faced when clients fail to be forthcoming with information
• The role of a freelance copywriter in client communication
• The importance of monitoring project timelines and client feedback
• Lessons learned about managing expectations in freelancing
• Reflections on the balance between creating and waiting for client input
• The adaptability needed to keep projects moving forward
• An invitation for listeners to share their own experiences and feedback
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Cathy Sirvatka (00:00):
Hello fellow freelancers, in today's episode
I'm going to share somethingthat happened at work.
I think this kind of episodewill be helpful to show you a
behind-the-curtain view of theday-to-day in a freelance web
design business.
Today's episode talks about acommunication issue with a
client and, though not all ofthese brief episodes will have
drama, they will all coverissues that I think will be of
(00:23):
interest to you.
It's to share what I do in myfreelance business and maybe it
will help you.
Here we go.
Welcome to the Web Pro SavvyPodcast.
This is your host, CathySirvatka .
(00:49):
I started a website project witha new client in the beginning
of August.
We'll call this client Bob.
He had gotten my name from agraphic designer I work with and
highly respect, so I knew Iwanted to treat him really well.
As with all new clients, we meton the phone to talk about his
business.
You know what he does, who heserves, but I got very minimal
answers.
Honestly, I felt like I wastrying to pull someone out of
(01:09):
quicksand.
He just wasn't forthcomingabout his information.
I did learn that Bob runs an ITsolutions firm and that his old
website didn't reflect what hedoes today.
Following that meeting, I sentout a survey as I do with all my
clients that asked him moredetailed questions, hoping I
could get more out of him, but Ireceived back the most minimal
(01:31):
answers possible.
Now he needed all new copy forthis new site, so this was
definitely going to be an issue.
I enlisted the help of afreelance copywriter to contract
with me and I was also hopingshe would be able to take the
time to draw details out of him.
So I connected Bob and thecopywriter to get that part of
the project going.
(01:51):
I told Bob I wouldn't want tobegin designing until I could
see some of the homepage copy,even if not the final version
that informs my decisions aboutlayout as well as the look and
feel I would aim for.
So then I see that Bob and thewriter had already had a Zoom
meeting and the writer had comeup with some initial concepts
(02:12):
but needed more information fromBob.
I see several emails from thecopywriter and only a couple
from Bob in which he apologizesfor not getting back to her
because he's been traveling orbusy, but will get back to her
over.
He's been traveling or busy,but we'll get back to her over
the weekend.
I saw where he said he wouldgather more information about
employee bios and industry usecases, but I never actually saw
(02:34):
any of that information or hisfeedback.
So I think maybe he's just notcopying me on all his
communications.
I'm not hearing complaints fromthe writer, so I still think
everything is okay.
What I kept seeing in emailsfrom Bob were sorry, I'm late
with this, I was traveling or Iwas busy, or give me until
Monday to get this to you, butmy writer finally sends him a
(02:57):
first pass of copy.
Then about five days later thecopywriter emails to Bob have
you been able to look at thecopy I sent?
And Bob says I was out of townReviewing.
The copy is at the top of mylist.
You get where I'm going withthis right.
Eight days later I receivedthis email from the copywriter.
If it works for you, I'd liketo send along my invoice.
(03:19):
I worry we're not going to getmuch back from Bob and wonder if
it's best for you all toproceed with the copy that you
have.
So I'm thinking now, that's nothow I like to do things Now.
I always pay my contractorsdirectly, so the client only has
one touch point.
I'm worried because I need topay her, but we haven't
completed the deliverables ofcompleted copy and design in
(03:42):
order to invoice the client.
Well, she sent him the copy shewas able to create and states
that she was essentially closingout her time with him and she
made herself available if hewanted to do more work with her.
Now, granted, she was onlyinvoicing for the actual time
she had spent because she wascharging hourly.
His response to that was tryingto find the time has proven
(04:04):
challenging, but I will work onit tonight.
For sure I will reach outtomorrow.
By now we can see these areempty promises, right?
It's so frustrating.
So I in turn send an invoice toBob for the writing, and at
this point I think heunderstands that the writing
portion is completed becausehe's given all he's willing to
give.
(04:24):
So I send an invoice to himjust for the copy.
So that was the backstory.
Here we are today.
I got this email Not done withcopy yet Still haven't reviewed.
Need more time.
Please let the writer know I'msuper busy and trying to find
time.
Need you both to be patientwith me.
Then I got a second email.
(04:44):
It's been challenging for me tofind the time to comment.
That is why I reached out tothe both of you.
I sent example websites of theones I like, along with our
competition.
I would like to take bits andpieces from those sites and mold
it into our own.
And then he says to the writeras for the content, I'm looking
to you for ideas and writing thecontent based on who we are and
(05:07):
what we provide.
So I'm getting frustrated evenjust reading this.
He goes on.
Perhaps it's best if we alllook at the website live, Cathy,
are we ready to see something?
As for the copy, I think weneed more meat.
We do all the things the othercompanies do, yeah.
So I'm wondering what the heckjust happened.
(05:28):
What exactly went on over thistime where the copy was supposed
to be getting done?
What exactly went on over thistime where the copy was supposed
to be getting done?
I just called the writer todiscuss the situation and found
out that Bob had not ever givenher any feedback over a period
of four weeks, not once.
He only offered excuseswhenever she followed up with
him.
So everything that I saw fromhim was all he sent.
(05:50):
So here's what I see he'sfailed to notice that he dropped
the ball by giving no feedbackand constantly putting us off.
I dropped the ball by notmonitoring their activities more
closely.
Now he's expecting the writerto make up and even plagiarize
copy, and he doesn't rememberthat I told him I need copy
(06:11):
before creating a design and nowhe's trying to control the
project.
Now, just as a side note becauseI'm me, I actually did start a
design, because that's what I doI just think at this point, I
just need to get this projectdone.
Taking the bull by the horns, Iam going to make this project
happen.
I want it done and off my plate, and I still need the money.
(06:34):
I don't want to just blow thisguy off.
I'm going to work with thelittle I have to create not just
a homepage design, but theentire website.
I am going to create itdirectly in WordPress.
I'm skipping all the normaldesign process.
It's not ideal, but it's what Ineed to do.
I feel like now I'm in thetrenches.
So lessons I've learned in this?
(07:01):
Because when these things happen, we have to reflect and figure
out why it happened and how notto let it happen again.
Many times, clients will notacknowledge when they've done
something wrong and insteadthey'll lash out at you and tell
you where you failed.
And let's face it, most of usstruggle to admit when we're
wrong, but when things go wronglike this, I do like to stop and
take inventory.
So, number one I assumed thewriter had things under control.
(07:24):
I assumed that if there was aproblem she would have let me
know, but she didn't.
I should have been directly andregularly checking in with both
the writer and the client tomonitor the progress and sort
out any issues, and in doingthat, I would have had a serious
talk with the client aboutbeing timely.
I would have reminded him thatour contract says we require
(07:47):
timely responses and submissionof any requested information, or
else I could levy a $20 per dayfee.
It also says in the contractthat I can actually end the
project if there's no responsewithin 15 business days, and
that did actually happen.
But that's the worst casescenario and not actually
something I want to do.
I don't like to leave peoplestranded and I want to have a
(08:09):
full project completed and Iwant the money.
Number two this would have beenhard for me to see, but custom
copywriting was more than thisguy actually wanted.
Did he need it?
Yes, he sure did.
He had a whole website of copythat needed to be written, but
he just didn't want to do hispart.
He didn't want to answerquestions.
So ultimately, I am creatingthe rest of the content
(08:32):
utilizing ChatGPT.
I'll have it create a siteoutline and merge that with the
info that I got from the writer.
I'm going to make it work.
Number three I should have beenpointing out where we were in
the project timeline to keep Bobenergetic with responses, but
now this project just needs toproceed methodically and
(08:53):
expeditiously.
So that's where we are now.
I'll keep you posted as to howit turns out.
Thanks for listening to mystory.
I would love to hear about thesurprises you faced and how you
handled it.
Go to my podcast page,webprosavvy.
com/ podcast, and you can leaveme a voice message about your
experience and you can also askme questions.
(09:14):
I may answer your questions ina future episode.
Hello fellow freelancers, in today's episode
I'm going to share somethingthat happened at work.
I think this kind of episodewill be helpful to show you a
behind-the-curtain view of theday-to-day in a freelance web
design business.
Today's episode talks about acommunication issue with a
client and, though not all ofthese brief episodes will have
drama, they will all coverissues that I think will be of
(00:23):
interest to you.
It's to share what I do in myfreelance business and maybe it
will help you.
Here we go.
Welcome to the Web Pro SavvyPodcast.
This is your host, CathySirvatka .
(00:49):
I started a website project witha new client in the beginning
of August.
We'll call this client Bob.
He had gotten my name from agraphic designer I work with and
highly respect, so I knew Iwanted to treat him really well.
As with all new clients, we meton the phone to talk about his
business.
You know what he does, who heserves, but I got very minimal
answers.
Honestly, I felt like I wastrying to pull someone out of
(01:09):
quicksand.
He just wasn't forthcomingabout his information.
I did learn that Bob runs an ITsolutions firm and that his old
website didn't reflect what hedoes today.
Following that meeting, I sentout a survey as I do with all my
clients that asked him moredetailed questions, hoping I
could get more out of him, but Ireceived back the most minimal
(01:31):
answers possible.
Now he needed all new copy forthis new site, so this was
definitely going to be an issue.
I enlisted the help of afreelance copywriter to contract
with me and I was also hopingshe would be able to take the
time to draw details out of him.
So I connected Bob and thecopywriter to get that part of
the project going.
(01:51):
I told Bob I wouldn't want tobegin designing until I could
see some of the homepage copy,even if not the final version
that informs my decisions aboutlayout as well as the look and
feel I would aim for.
So then I see that Bob and thewriter had already had a Zoom
meeting and the writer had comeup with some initial concepts
(02:12):
but needed more information fromBob.
I see several emails from thecopywriter and only a couple
from Bob in which he apologizesfor not getting back to her
because he's been traveling orbusy, but will get back to her
over.
He's been traveling or busy,but we'll get back to her over
the weekend.
I saw where he said he wouldgather more information about
employee bios and industry usecases, but I never actually saw
(02:34):
any of that information or hisfeedback.
So I think maybe he's just notcopying me on all his
communications.
I'm not hearing complaints fromthe writer, so I still think
everything is okay.
What I kept seeing in emailsfrom Bob were sorry, I'm late
with this, I was traveling or Iwas busy, or give me until
Monday to get this to you, butmy writer finally sends him a
(02:57):
first pass of copy.
Then about five days later thecopywriter emails to Bob have
you been able to look at thecopy I sent?
And Bob says I was out of townReviewing.
The copy is at the top of mylist.
You get where I'm going withthis right.
Eight days later I receivedthis email from the copywriter.
If it works for you, I'd liketo send along my invoice.
(03:19):
I worry we're not going to getmuch back from Bob and wonder if
it's best for you all toproceed with the copy that you
have.
So I'm thinking now, that's nothow I like to do things Now.
I always pay my contractorsdirectly, so the client only has
one touch point.
I'm worried because I need topay her, but we haven't
completed the deliverables ofcompleted copy and design in
(03:42):
order to invoice the client.
Well, she sent him the copy shewas able to create and states
that she was essentially closingout her time with him and she
made herself available if hewanted to do more work with her.
Now, granted, she was onlyinvoicing for the actual time
she had spent because she wascharging hourly.
His response to that was tryingto find the time has proven
(04:04):
challenging, but I will work onit tonight.
For sure I will reach outtomorrow.
By now we can see these areempty promises, right?
It's so frustrating.
So I in turn send an invoice toBob for the writing, and at
this point I think heunderstands that the writing
portion is completed becausehe's given all he's willing to
give.
(04:24):
So I send an invoice to himjust for the copy.
So that was the backstory.
Here we are today.
I got this email Not done withcopy yet Still haven't reviewed.
Need more time.
Please let the writer know I'msuper busy and trying to find
time.
Need you both to be patientwith me.
Then I got a second email.
(04:44):
It's been challenging for me tofind the time to comment.
That is why I reached out tothe both of you.
I sent example websites of theones I like, along with our
competition.
I would like to take bits andpieces from those sites and mold
it into our own.
And then he says to the writeras for the content, I'm looking
to you for ideas and writing thecontent based on who we are and
(05:07):
what we provide.
So I'm getting frustrated evenjust reading this.
He goes on.
Perhaps it's best if we alllook at the website live, Cathy,
are we ready to see something?
As for the copy, I think weneed more meat.
We do all the things the othercompanies do, yeah.
So I'm wondering what the heckjust happened.
(05:28):
What exactly went on over thistime where the copy was supposed
to be getting done?
What exactly went on over thistime where the copy was supposed
to be getting done?
I just called the writer todiscuss the situation and found
out that Bob had not ever givenher any feedback over a period
of four weeks, not once.
He only offered excuseswhenever she followed up with
him.
So everything that I saw fromhim was all he sent.
(05:50):
So here's what I see he'sfailed to notice that he dropped
the ball by giving no feedbackand constantly putting us off.
I dropped the ball by notmonitoring their activities more
closely.
Now he's expecting the writerto make up and even plagiarize
copy, and he doesn't rememberthat I told him I need copy
(06:11):
before creating a design and nowhe's trying to control the
project.
Now, just as a side note becauseI'm me, I actually did start a
design, because that's what I doI just think at this point, I
just need to get this projectdone.
Taking the bull by the horns, Iam going to make this project
happen.
I want it done and off my plate, and I still need the money.
(06:34):
I don't want to just blow thisguy off.
I'm going to work with thelittle I have to create not just
a homepage design, but theentire website.
I am going to create itdirectly in WordPress.
I'm skipping all the normaldesign process.
It's not ideal, but it's what Ineed to do.
I feel like now I'm in thetrenches.
So lessons I've learned in this?
(07:01):
Because when these things happen, we have to reflect and figure
out why it happened and how notto let it happen again.
Many times, clients will notacknowledge when they've done
something wrong and insteadthey'll lash out at you and tell
you where you failed.
And let's face it, most of usstruggle to admit when we're
wrong, but when things go wronglike this, I do like to stop and
take inventory.
So, number one I assumed thewriter had things under control.
(07:24):
I assumed that if there was aproblem she would have let me
know, but she didn't.
I should have been directly andregularly checking in with both
the writer and the client tomonitor the progress and sort
out any issues, and in doingthat, I would have had a serious
talk with the client aboutbeing timely.
I would have reminded him thatour contract says we require
(07:47):
timely responses and submissionof any requested information, or
else I could levy a $20 per dayfee.
It also says in the contractthat I can actually end the
project if there's no responsewithin 15 business days, and
that did actually happen.
But that's the worst casescenario and not actually
something I want to do.
I don't like to leave peoplestranded and I want to have a
(08:09):
full project completed and Iwant the money.
Number two this would have beenhard for me to see, but custom
copywriting was more than thisguy actually wanted.
Did he need it?
Yes, he sure did.
He had a whole website of copythat needed to be written, but
he just didn't want to do hispart.
He didn't want to answerquestions.
So ultimately, I am creatingthe rest of the content
(08:32):
utilizing ChatGPT.
I'll have it create a siteoutline and merge that with the
info that I got from the writer.
I'm going to make it work.
Number three I should have beenpointing out where we were in
the project timeline to keep Bobenergetic with responses, but
now this project just needs toproceed methodically and
(08:53):
expeditiously.
So that's where we are now.
I'll keep you posted as to howit turns out.
Thanks for listening to mystory.
I would love to hear about thesurprises you faced and how you
handled it.
Go to my podcast page,webprosavvy.
com/ podcast, and you can leaveme a voice message about your
experience and you can also askme questions.
(09:14):
I may answer your questions ina future episode.
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