October 22, 2025 • 19 mins
✨ Free Resource: Download my guide, 100 Practices That Can Increase Your Access to Rest & Renewal — filled with simple, doable ways to rest your body, mind, and spirit.
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Feeling tired yet never truly restored is not a personal failure; it’s your nervous system doing its best to protect you. We unpack how trauma and challending life experiences reshape the body’s priorities, keeping you in survival cycles that block deep rest. Using Polyvagal Theory as a guide, we walk through the three core states—ventral vagal safety, sympathetic fight or flight, and dorsal shutdown—and show how a loss of flexibility can make stillness feel dangerous instead of soothing.
You’ll learn how neuroception, the body’s subconscious threat-detection system, constantly weighs cues of safety and danger. When danger outweighs safety, rest becomes inaccessible, no matter how early you go to bed. We draw a clear line between shutdown and restoration, explaining why doomscrolling until you pass out isn’t rest and why “just relax” often backfires. If you’ve lived in a loop of daytime overdrive and nighttime collapse, or if depression has felt like being stuck in molasses, this conversation offers a compassionate map that makes sense of your experience.
Subscribe for weekly insights, share this with someone who needs it, and leave a review to help others find the show. Then tell us: what’s one cue of safety you can add today?
If you and your partner are ready to co-create the roadmap to the relationship of your dreams, join us for the next in-person "Getting the Love You Want" Weekend Couples Retreat!
For support in how to have deeper connections and better communication in the relationships that matter most in your life, follow the host, Trish Sanders on Instagram , Bluesky or LinkedIn.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_00 (00:00):
Hello and welcome to the When Depression is in Your
Bed podcast.
Are you someone who tries torest but never actually feels
rested?
Or are you someone who wishesyou could rest, but with
everything on your to-do list,who has time for that?
Well, if you're either of thesepeople, please tune in today as
I talk about how our nervoussystem can be affected by trauma
(00:21):
and how that affects our actualphysical ability for restorative
rest.
And I won't stop there.
In the next episode, I willshare some steps that you can
take to help heal your system soyou can begin to get the rest
and renewal that you deserve.
I'm your host, Trish Sanders,and I am delighted that you are
here.
Let's get started.
(00:42):
Today I am sharing informationthat has been absolutely
integral in my owntransformation and my own
ability to feel more rested somuch more of the time.
Understanding the role of mynervous system in what has been
a lifelong inability to reallyfeel rested has helped me not
only to increase my ability tobe self-compassionate and reduce
(01:04):
my negative self-talk and myself-criticism and
self-judgment, but it has alsoreally guided me on what to do
to be able to take action, totake deep, true care of myself,
which has allowed me tocultivate rest and renewal
practices.
And in my own experience, I sortof figured this out almost in
reverse because I startednoticing the benefits for me of
(01:27):
how my body was able to rest ina different way than it had
before.
And then I started to understandwhat I was doing to contribute
to the healing process.
And then I started learningabout my nervous system's role
and what was happening for me.
And once I had that level ofinformation, this knowledge that
I want to share with you today,then I started to be so much
more conscious in my practicesfor rest and renewal.
(01:48):
And it has really helped totransform so much in my life
because it's not just about howI'm able to rest or create
spaciousness in my life, butit's how I then can function in
my life.
Because if we're exhausted or ifwe're striving and pushing and
overwhelmed and in chaos andnever slowing down, never able
to slow down, then we're notliving our best life.
(02:09):
And as I have been working onthese practices over the last
few years, my whole life hasbeen transforming.
And I don't use that termlightly.
I really mean that the way mylife looks and feels and how I'm
able to show up in my day-to-daylife is in a completely
different place than it was justa few years ago.
And because I am so much moreconscious of what I'm doing, I'm
(02:30):
aware I know many of the choicesthat I'm making so that I can
continue to make more choicesthat really serve me.
And I can't wait to see what mylife looks like in a year from
now or five years from now ormore, because this information
has really supported me increating so much more of the
life I want to have.
And I can only imagine that it'sgoing to get better from here.
(02:50):
And I hope that this isinspiring for you so that you
too can cultivate rest andrenewal practices that support
better functioning in all areasof your life.
So, in the last few episodes, Ihave been referencing these
survival cycles that I certainlyidentify strongly with, and
perhaps you too identify withthem.
Before I describe them, I'lljust do a quick little nervous
system review for anyone who maybe new to nervous system
(03:13):
language.
The information that I referenceis from Polyvagal Theory, which
was created by Dr.
Stephen Porgis, and Deb Dana isan amazing clinician who has
brought the theory of polyvagalinto practice in the clinical
world.
And that's really what Ireference and where this comes
from.
So the nervous system has threestates.
The first is called ventralvagal, and it's our social
engagement state where we feelconnected and safe and grounded.
(03:36):
And then the other two nervoussystem states are both survival
states.
We can either be in a mobilizedstate of survival, which means
we sense a threat and we have todo something about it.
That's called our sympatheticstate, and it's our fight or
flight response.
We either have to attack or run,or we can be in what's called
the dorsal vagal state, which isan immobilized response to
threat, which is that there's athreat happening, but I don't
(03:57):
have the resources or capacityto fight it, or perhaps it's
safer to disappear or withdraw.
So I collapse and shut down inorder to hopefully survive
through this.
Okay.
So our three states (04:07):
ventral vagal, sympathetic, and dorsal
vagal.
The cycles I've been talkingabout over the last few episodes
is that many of us live in somecombination of survival states
as opposed to in our ventralsafe grounded state so much of
the time.
And this is largely because ofthe impact of some sort of
trauma on our lives.
And I won't go into what traumais and what trauma means.
(04:29):
I'm going to use it in a prettybroad sense today and am happy
to talk more about the detailsin other episodes.
But I want to just get reallyinto the impact trauma can have,
but it can be relational orchronic trauma or acute trauma.
But we all go through differentthings that impact our nervous
system because our nervoussystem is shaped through our
experiences.
So even if you don't relate tobeing traumatized at some point
(04:52):
in your life, your experiencesare still impacting your nervous
system.
And our experiences can cause usto get stuck in survival
patterns.
And so many of us are stuck in asympathetic, striving place,
pushing, going, doing, runningall day, off and on caffeine,
go, go, go, getting things done,and crashing into a dorsal
shutdown only to wake up thenext morning, not really fully
(05:14):
recharge, but to do it all againover and over each day.
So that's fluctuating betweensympathetic and dorsal.
And then there are people whoare stuck in a more dorsal state
where this doesn't necessarilyhave to be full immobilization,
like full depressed, can't getout of bed every day.
You could be going through themotions, feeling kind of numb,
not caring too much about life,doing the bare minimum just to
(05:35):
get by.
And at night, you might befinding yourself feeling tired,
but you feel more numbed out ordisconnected.
You might be doom scrolling forhours or watching something on
Netflix until way too late.
And then again, going to sleep,waking up, not feeling really
restored, and doing it allagain.
And this state could be spikedby little moments of sympathetic
(05:56):
surge, where for me, this lookslike when there's a deadline for
something historically in mylife.
If I had a due date, then youknow, the day before the paper
was due or the night before thepaper was due, I'd be like, oh
my gosh, I have to do this.
And then I'd be filled with thissurge of sympathetic energy and
I'd push and strive.
And it was very taxing on mybody, but I would get it done at
least most of the time.
But then I would feel exhaustedagain because that push was
(06:18):
really taxing on my system.
So being stuck in these twosurvival states prevents us from
getting true restorative rest.
And if you know how exhaustingit can be to be stuck in these
survival cycles, you probablyalso know how frustrating it is
to want to feel rested and notbe able to, no matter how much
you try or how much you wish youcould slow down.
(06:40):
And it also can get to a feelingof either hopelessness, like I
can't do anything about it, orit can get to a feeling of this
is just how it is.
There's no other option for mebecause you don't even think you
have any power.
And feeling like you don't havepower to change your life can be
devastating.
So I'm going to shareinformation with you today that
hopefully will inspire you andhelp you to feel more hopeful
(07:02):
and certainly more empowered totake action in your life that
really makes sense for you sothat you can take true care of
yourself.
So, on to more information aboutour nervous systems.
Our nervous system is constantlyscanning the environment for
cues of safety and cues ofdanger.
This exchange of information iscalled neurosception.
It's our nervous system'sperception of our internal
(07:25):
working.
If we have a pain or somethingdoesn't feel quite right in our
body, and then also in our outerworld and in our relationships
between us and others.
So we are constantly perceivingcues of threats, cues of danger,
and we're weighing that.
And our nervous system isletting our brain know if we
need to protect ourselves insome way.
And in order to truly rest, wehave to have a neurosception of
(07:48):
safety.
And what this means is if youimagine a scale, the weight of
our cues of safety must begreater than the weight of our
cues of danger.
And then our body knows, like,oh, okay, I'm safe.
I'm able to rest.
But if our cues of danger areheavier, if they outweigh our
cues of safety, restorative restis not accessible to us because
(08:10):
our brain is receiving themessage that protection is the
priority.
And that's what we have to focuson.
And as is the case with trauma,when we have had the experience
of being unsafe, our nervoussystem's ability to perceive
safety can be disrupted.
And even safe moments when weare actually safe, our bodies
may remain stuck in a state ofdefense, in a state of
(08:31):
protection.
And we cannot rest when our bodyis on guard.
And with trauma, our ability tomove with flexibility through
all of our nervous system statesbecause they're all very
necessary for our body tofunction.
And of course, when there's realcue of danger, when there's a
true threat, we need our body tobe able to go into our
sympathetic fight or flightdefense mode to protect us.
And there's a lot of times whenbeing in a withdrawn shutdown of
(08:55):
dorsal is also really servingus.
And so we actually want to haveflexibility.
We want our nervous system to beable to move through all of our
states appropriately when thesituation really calls for it.
But when we experience trauma,our nervous system flexibility
can be impacted and we might notbe able to move so freely.
We might end up getting stuck.
We may not be able to accessventral safety and groundedness
(09:17):
in the way that we were born tobe able to.
And safety cues may not actuallyregister as safety cues.
We may be paying attention soacutely to cues of danger that
we miss cues of safety.
And our sympathetic fight orflight system may end up staying
online even when there's not acue of imminent danger present.
Or we may be stuck in our dorsalstate feeling numb and
disconnected and have a reallack of energy to do anything
(09:40):
about anything.
So, what does this all mean?
When our nervous system isimpacted by trauma or
challenging experiences, insteadof being able to experience true
restorative rest, our nervoussystem may be stuck in either
hyper-arousal and our body can'trelax, slowing down doesn't feel
safe, or we end up getting stuckin a state of hypoarousal, in
(10:01):
which the body shuts down inorder to protect itself and we
are not able to benefit fromrestorative rest.
And instead, we end up justfeeling fatigued and
disconnected and numb.
So I think it's really importantto know that trauma can affect
the body's capacity for rest.
And our nervous system can berewired for protection rather
(10:22):
than restoration.
And when your body is stuck inthat sympathetic state, when you
try to rest, you may end upexperiencing a racing heart or
agitation.
It might feel difficult to rest.
You may end up needing some helpto rest.
That's like a glass of wine atnight or a sleeping pill or
something like that, some sortof downer because your body
doesn't feel safe enough toactually slow down.
(10:43):
Or if you're stuck in thatdorsal experience, you may be
feeling numb.
And even though you might beexhausted, you might not go to
sleep, you might just be stuckdoom scrolling or something like
that until your eyes can't stayopen anymore and you fall
asleep, but your body doesn'tactually experience that
restorative rest.
And trauma can also make itharder to sustain connection
with our ventral experience,which is really our authentic
(11:05):
self.
So the bottom line is thatunless your body can actually
feel safe, you are not going tobe able to experience
restorative rest.
And many people may be beingtold things like just slow down,
just relax, just take it easy.
But if you're stuck insympathetic, slowing down is not
that simple.
And slowing down itself may be acue of danger.
(11:27):
So even though you may belonging for rest and the idea of
a vacation might sound wonderfulin your head when it comes into
actual practice, if you try toslow down, that in and of itself
may be the perceived danger.
And this can be the case if wehad the experience of needing to
stay alert, keep moving, keepproducing, and that doing that
has helped us survive in thepast, and that can contribute to
(11:49):
our nervous system getting stuckin that go mode.
This is also true, even if thiswasn't necessarily your personal
experience.
If your ancestors had thisexperience that they had to keep
moving, keep producing, stayalert to stay alive, then being
stuck in sympathetic state canbe passed on to you because
trauma can be inherited as canhealing, which is the really
(12:11):
good news and such an importantpart of what I'm sharing today,
because you're not stuck, evenif you're stuck right now.
So basically, if your nervoussystem has had this experience,
then your brain is likely tocreate a story that if you stop,
you won't be safe.
And this will make true restinaccessible.
I think it's really importanthere to talk about depression
(12:31):
and what I perceive as thatstuckness in that dorsal
immobilized state, because fromthe outside, it might look like
a depressed person is doing verylittle or resting all the time
or doing nothing.
And why don't they feel rested?
And it can be very confusing anda source of stigma around
depression.
In reality, a person who's stuckin dorsal shutdown is not
resting at all.
(12:52):
They are in a state ofbiological slowdown because in
the dorsal survival state, ourbody knows that it needs to
power down in order to hopefullysurvive.
It knows that it has to conserveenergy in some way to become
less visible, to protect us.
And so this biological shutdown,again, from the outside, could
(13:13):
look a lot like doing nothing orrest or not taking up very much
energy.
But this slowdown is not thesame as restorative rest.
And that's why somebody who isdepressed can feel exhausted
even if they've been in bed allday or if they've slept for 12
hours, they don't feel wellrested.
And this can be reallyfrustrating, certainly from
someone on the outside.
But as a depressed person, whichI have been for so much of my
(13:35):
life, it can feel so hopelessand frustrating that no matter
what you do, you can't feel goodenough to function at the level
you want to function at.
And this is really difficult andcontributes, certainly in my
case, in my own experience,contributed so much to my
self-criticism.
Like, what is wrong with me thatI can't just do what I want to
(13:56):
be able to do or what I think Ishould do or what I think I
should be able to do because Ifeel like I'm just dragging
through my life and no amount ofcoffee is helping me to really
get to the level that I want tobe at.
And as I've come to understandthis nervous system experience,
I have been able to have so muchmore compassion for myself and
actual appreciation instead offrustration around my body doing
(14:20):
what it was biologicallysupposed to do.
And my nervous system and mybrain were just acting like
nervous systems and brains act.
And it wasn't that there wassomething wrong with me for not
being able to rest or, you know,beating myself up at night when
I stayed up way too late when Iknew I was exhausted, and then I
feel terrible in the morning andI'm so frustrated.
Like, why didn't I just go tosleep?
(14:41):
Why can't I just go to sleep?
But for most of my life, like Iknew that going to sleep earlier
would be better for me, but Ijust couldn't do it.
And now I understand that was anervous system piece that
slowing down into rest, likefull rest, going to sleep, felt
like a cue of danger for me.
And so my body wouldn't let medo it.
(15:01):
And so I would stay awake waytoo late, doing things that
probably were not a priority.
And the conscious story a lot ofthe time was well, I don't have
any downtime during the day.
I have so much going on in mylife, I need this time to
unwind.
And some of that was probablytrue.
But realistically, as I havecome to do my own inner work, I
realized how much of this was mynervous system and the impact of
my life experiences on mynervous system, preventing me
(15:24):
from being able to have thatflexibility and allow true rest
to feel safe.
So, in closing for today, Ireally want you to hear that
trauma doesn't keep us fromresting just by making us stuck
being busy and sympathetic or bymaking us just stuck in dorsal
collapse.
But our brains attach a story toall that stuckness that we are
(15:44):
not safe.
And so we have to keep going inthe way that we're going,
because if we do somethingdifferent, which actually could
be slowing down, getting thatbeautiful restorative rest and
renewal that we're longing for,there's something that's telling
us in our narrative, ourinternal narrative, that that's
not actually safe and what weneed.
And so, in order to heal thisexperience, in order to heal our
(16:06):
nervous systems, we need to beable to allow stillness to shift
from being a cue of danger to acue of safety.
So when we allow our bodies toslow down, we can actually lean
into that and ease into that andthat can feel comfortable and
safe and where we belong.
So we can truly receive thatrest that we need.
(16:27):
And if you want to know how youactually do that, please tune in
next week where I talk about theprocess.
In the meantime, please checkout my free resource on 100
practices that can help makerest and renewal more accessible
to you.
It's a great place to begin.
And you can really check in withyour nervous system to see what
practices feel like they'reaccessible, like they're
(16:48):
achievable, things that you cantry to receive the free guide.
You can go toregulatedrelationships.kit dot
com forward slash rest.
And you can also go in my shownotes right below the podcast
title, and there's a link therefor you to get that free
resource as well.
And it is filled with simplethings that you can start doing
(17:09):
today to help heal your nervoussystem so you can finally get
the rest that you're longingfor.
I look forward to talking morewith you next time.
As our time comes to a close, Iask you to keep listening for
just a few more moments becauseI want to thank you for showing
up today.
And I want to leave you with aninvitation as you hit stop and
move back out into the world onyour own unique wellness
(17:32):
journey.
In order to move from where youare today to the place where you
want to be, the path may seemlong or unclear or unknown.
And I want you to know that ifthat seems scary or daunting or
downright terrifying or anythingelse, that is totally okay.
Know that you do not have tocreate the whole way all at
(17:53):
once.
We don't travel a whole journeyin one stride.
And that is why my invitation toyou today is to take a step,
just one.
Any type, any size, in anydirection.
It can be an external step thatcan be observed or measured, or
it could be a step you visualizetaking in your mind.
It can be a step towards actionor towards rest or connection or
(18:17):
self-care or whatever step makessense to you.
I invite you to take a steptoday because getting to a place
that feels better, more joyful,more connected than the place
where you are today is possiblefor everyone, including you, and
even when depression is in yourbed.
If today's episode resonatedwith you, please subscribe so
(18:39):
you can be notified when eachweekly episode gets released.
I encourage you to leave areview and reach out to me on
social media attrish.sanders.lcsw.
Your feedback will help guidefuture episodes, and I love
hearing from you.
Also, please share this podcastwith anyone who you think may be
interested or who may getsomething from what I have
(19:00):
shared.
Until the next time we connect,take care of yourself and take a
step.
Hello and welcome to the When Depression is in Your
Bed podcast.
Are you someone who tries torest but never actually feels
rested?
Or are you someone who wishesyou could rest, but with
everything on your to-do list,who has time for that?
Well, if you're either of thesepeople, please tune in today as
I talk about how our nervoussystem can be affected by trauma
(00:21):
and how that affects our actualphysical ability for restorative
rest.
And I won't stop there.
In the next episode, I willshare some steps that you can
take to help heal your system soyou can begin to get the rest
and renewal that you deserve.
I'm your host, Trish Sanders,and I am delighted that you are
here.
Let's get started.
(00:42):
Today I am sharing informationthat has been absolutely
integral in my owntransformation and my own
ability to feel more rested somuch more of the time.
Understanding the role of mynervous system in what has been
a lifelong inability to reallyfeel rested has helped me not
only to increase my ability tobe self-compassionate and reduce
(01:04):
my negative self-talk and myself-criticism and
self-judgment, but it has alsoreally guided me on what to do
to be able to take action, totake deep, true care of myself,
which has allowed me tocultivate rest and renewal
practices.
And in my own experience, I sortof figured this out almost in
reverse because I startednoticing the benefits for me of
(01:27):
how my body was able to rest ina different way than it had
before.
And then I started to understandwhat I was doing to contribute
to the healing process.
And then I started learningabout my nervous system's role
and what was happening for me.
And once I had that level ofinformation, this knowledge that
I want to share with you today,then I started to be so much
more conscious in my practicesfor rest and renewal.
(01:48):
And it has really helped totransform so much in my life
because it's not just about howI'm able to rest or create
spaciousness in my life, butit's how I then can function in
my life.
Because if we're exhausted or ifwe're striving and pushing and
overwhelmed and in chaos andnever slowing down, never able
to slow down, then we're notliving our best life.
(02:09):
And as I have been working onthese practices over the last
few years, my whole life hasbeen transforming.
And I don't use that termlightly.
I really mean that the way mylife looks and feels and how I'm
able to show up in my day-to-daylife is in a completely
different place than it was justa few years ago.
And because I am so much moreconscious of what I'm doing, I'm
(02:30):
aware I know many of the choicesthat I'm making so that I can
continue to make more choicesthat really serve me.
And I can't wait to see what mylife looks like in a year from
now or five years from now ormore, because this information
has really supported me increating so much more of the
life I want to have.
And I can only imagine that it'sgoing to get better from here.
(02:50):
And I hope that this isinspiring for you so that you
too can cultivate rest andrenewal practices that support
better functioning in all areasof your life.
So, in the last few episodes, Ihave been referencing these
survival cycles that I certainlyidentify strongly with, and
perhaps you too identify withthem.
Before I describe them, I'lljust do a quick little nervous
system review for anyone who maybe new to nervous system
(03:13):
language.
The information that I referenceis from Polyvagal Theory, which
was created by Dr.
Stephen Porgis, and Deb Dana isan amazing clinician who has
brought the theory of polyvagalinto practice in the clinical
world.
And that's really what Ireference and where this comes
from.
So the nervous system has threestates.
The first is called ventralvagal, and it's our social
engagement state where we feelconnected and safe and grounded.
(03:36):
And then the other two nervoussystem states are both survival
states.
We can either be in a mobilizedstate of survival, which means
we sense a threat and we have todo something about it.
That's called our sympatheticstate, and it's our fight or
flight response.
We either have to attack or run,or we can be in what's called
the dorsal vagal state, which isan immobilized response to
threat, which is that there's athreat happening, but I don't
(03:57):
have the resources or capacityto fight it, or perhaps it's
safer to disappear or withdraw.
So I collapse and shut down inorder to hopefully survive
through this.
Okay.
So our three states (04:07):
ventral vagal, sympathetic, and dorsal
vagal.
The cycles I've been talkingabout over the last few episodes
is that many of us live in somecombination of survival states
as opposed to in our ventralsafe grounded state so much of
the time.
And this is largely because ofthe impact of some sort of
trauma on our lives.
And I won't go into what traumais and what trauma means.
(04:29):
I'm going to use it in a prettybroad sense today and am happy
to talk more about the detailsin other episodes.
But I want to just get reallyinto the impact trauma can have,
but it can be relational orchronic trauma or acute trauma.
But we all go through differentthings that impact our nervous
system because our nervoussystem is shaped through our
experiences.
So even if you don't relate tobeing traumatized at some point
(04:52):
in your life, your experiencesare still impacting your nervous
system.
And our experiences can cause usto get stuck in survival
patterns.
And so many of us are stuck in asympathetic, striving place,
pushing, going, doing, runningall day, off and on caffeine,
go, go, go, getting things done,and crashing into a dorsal
shutdown only to wake up thenext morning, not really fully
(05:14):
recharge, but to do it all againover and over each day.
So that's fluctuating betweensympathetic and dorsal.
And then there are people whoare stuck in a more dorsal state
where this doesn't necessarilyhave to be full immobilization,
like full depressed, can't getout of bed every day.
You could be going through themotions, feeling kind of numb,
not caring too much about life,doing the bare minimum just to
(05:35):
get by.
And at night, you might befinding yourself feeling tired,
but you feel more numbed out ordisconnected.
You might be doom scrolling forhours or watching something on
Netflix until way too late.
And then again, going to sleep,waking up, not feeling really
restored, and doing it allagain.
And this state could be spikedby little moments of sympathetic
(05:56):
surge, where for me, this lookslike when there's a deadline for
something historically in mylife.
If I had a due date, then youknow, the day before the paper
was due or the night before thepaper was due, I'd be like, oh
my gosh, I have to do this.
And then I'd be filled with thissurge of sympathetic energy and
I'd push and strive.
And it was very taxing on mybody, but I would get it done at
least most of the time.
But then I would feel exhaustedagain because that push was
(06:18):
really taxing on my system.
So being stuck in these twosurvival states prevents us from
getting true restorative rest.
And if you know how exhaustingit can be to be stuck in these
survival cycles, you probablyalso know how frustrating it is
to want to feel rested and notbe able to, no matter how much
you try or how much you wish youcould slow down.
(06:40):
And it also can get to a feelingof either hopelessness, like I
can't do anything about it, orit can get to a feeling of this
is just how it is.
There's no other option for mebecause you don't even think you
have any power.
And feeling like you don't havepower to change your life can be
devastating.
So I'm going to shareinformation with you today that
hopefully will inspire you andhelp you to feel more hopeful
(07:02):
and certainly more empowered totake action in your life that
really makes sense for you sothat you can take true care of
yourself.
So, on to more information aboutour nervous systems.
Our nervous system is constantlyscanning the environment for
cues of safety and cues ofdanger.
This exchange of information iscalled neurosception.
It's our nervous system'sperception of our internal
(07:25):
working.
If we have a pain or somethingdoesn't feel quite right in our
body, and then also in our outerworld and in our relationships
between us and others.
So we are constantly perceivingcues of threats, cues of danger,
and we're weighing that.
And our nervous system isletting our brain know if we
need to protect ourselves insome way.
And in order to truly rest, wehave to have a neurosception of
(07:48):
safety.
And what this means is if youimagine a scale, the weight of
our cues of safety must begreater than the weight of our
cues of danger.
And then our body knows, like,oh, okay, I'm safe.
I'm able to rest.
But if our cues of danger areheavier, if they outweigh our
cues of safety, restorative restis not accessible to us because
(08:10):
our brain is receiving themessage that protection is the
priority.
And that's what we have to focuson.
And as is the case with trauma,when we have had the experience
of being unsafe, our nervoussystem's ability to perceive
safety can be disrupted.
And even safe moments when weare actually safe, our bodies
may remain stuck in a state ofdefense, in a state of
(08:31):
protection.
And we cannot rest when our bodyis on guard.
And with trauma, our ability tomove with flexibility through
all of our nervous system statesbecause they're all very
necessary for our body tofunction.
And of course, when there's realcue of danger, when there's a
true threat, we need our body tobe able to go into our
sympathetic fight or flightdefense mode to protect us.
And there's a lot of times whenbeing in a withdrawn shutdown of
(08:55):
dorsal is also really servingus.
And so we actually want to haveflexibility.
We want our nervous system to beable to move through all of our
states appropriately when thesituation really calls for it.
But when we experience trauma,our nervous system flexibility
can be impacted and we might notbe able to move so freely.
We might end up getting stuck.
We may not be able to accessventral safety and groundedness
(09:17):
in the way that we were born tobe able to.
And safety cues may not actuallyregister as safety cues.
We may be paying attention soacutely to cues of danger that
we miss cues of safety.
And our sympathetic fight orflight system may end up staying
online even when there's not acue of imminent danger present.
Or we may be stuck in our dorsalstate feeling numb and
disconnected and have a reallack of energy to do anything
(09:40):
about anything.
So, what does this all mean?
When our nervous system isimpacted by trauma or
challenging experiences, insteadof being able to experience true
restorative rest, our nervoussystem may be stuck in either
hyper-arousal and our body can'trelax, slowing down doesn't feel
safe, or we end up getting stuckin a state of hypoarousal, in
(10:01):
which the body shuts down inorder to protect itself and we
are not able to benefit fromrestorative rest.
And instead, we end up justfeeling fatigued and
disconnected and numb.
So I think it's really importantto know that trauma can affect
the body's capacity for rest.
And our nervous system can berewired for protection rather
(10:22):
than restoration.
And when your body is stuck inthat sympathetic state, when you
try to rest, you may end upexperiencing a racing heart or
agitation.
It might feel difficult to rest.
You may end up needing some helpto rest.
That's like a glass of wine atnight or a sleeping pill or
something like that, some sortof downer because your body
doesn't feel safe enough toactually slow down.
(10:43):
Or if you're stuck in thatdorsal experience, you may be
feeling numb.
And even though you might beexhausted, you might not go to
sleep, you might just be stuckdoom scrolling or something like
that until your eyes can't stayopen anymore and you fall
asleep, but your body doesn'tactually experience that
restorative rest.
And trauma can also make itharder to sustain connection
with our ventral experience,which is really our authentic
(11:05):
self.
So the bottom line is thatunless your body can actually
feel safe, you are not going tobe able to experience
restorative rest.
And many people may be beingtold things like just slow down,
just relax, just take it easy.
But if you're stuck insympathetic, slowing down is not
that simple.
And slowing down itself may be acue of danger.
(11:27):
So even though you may belonging for rest and the idea of
a vacation might sound wonderfulin your head when it comes into
actual practice, if you try toslow down, that in and of itself
may be the perceived danger.
And this can be the case if wehad the experience of needing to
stay alert, keep moving, keepproducing, and that doing that
has helped us survive in thepast, and that can contribute to
(11:49):
our nervous system getting stuckin that go mode.
This is also true, even if thiswasn't necessarily your personal
experience.
If your ancestors had thisexperience that they had to keep
moving, keep producing, stayalert to stay alive, then being
stuck in sympathetic state canbe passed on to you because
trauma can be inherited as canhealing, which is the really
(12:11):
good news and such an importantpart of what I'm sharing today,
because you're not stuck, evenif you're stuck right now.
So basically, if your nervoussystem has had this experience,
then your brain is likely tocreate a story that if you stop,
you won't be safe.
And this will make true restinaccessible.
I think it's really importanthere to talk about depression
(12:31):
and what I perceive as thatstuckness in that dorsal
immobilized state, because fromthe outside, it might look like
a depressed person is doing verylittle or resting all the time
or doing nothing.
And why don't they feel rested?
And it can be very confusing anda source of stigma around
depression.
In reality, a person who's stuckin dorsal shutdown is not
resting at all.
(12:52):
They are in a state ofbiological slowdown because in
the dorsal survival state, ourbody knows that it needs to
power down in order to hopefullysurvive.
It knows that it has to conserveenergy in some way to become
less visible, to protect us.
And so this biological shutdown,again, from the outside, could
(13:13):
look a lot like doing nothing orrest or not taking up very much
energy.
But this slowdown is not thesame as restorative rest.
And that's why somebody who isdepressed can feel exhausted
even if they've been in bed allday or if they've slept for 12
hours, they don't feel wellrested.
And this can be reallyfrustrating, certainly from
someone on the outside.
But as a depressed person, whichI have been for so much of my
(13:35):
life, it can feel so hopelessand frustrating that no matter
what you do, you can't feel goodenough to function at the level
you want to function at.
And this is really difficult andcontributes, certainly in my
case, in my own experience,contributed so much to my
self-criticism.
Like, what is wrong with me thatI can't just do what I want to
(13:56):
be able to do or what I think Ishould do or what I think I
should be able to do because Ifeel like I'm just dragging
through my life and no amount ofcoffee is helping me to really
get to the level that I want tobe at.
And as I've come to understandthis nervous system experience,
I have been able to have so muchmore compassion for myself and
actual appreciation instead offrustration around my body doing
(14:20):
what it was biologicallysupposed to do.
And my nervous system and mybrain were just acting like
nervous systems and brains act.
And it wasn't that there wassomething wrong with me for not
being able to rest or, you know,beating myself up at night when
I stayed up way too late when Iknew I was exhausted, and then I
feel terrible in the morning andI'm so frustrated.
Like, why didn't I just go tosleep?
(14:41):
Why can't I just go to sleep?
But for most of my life, like Iknew that going to sleep earlier
would be better for me, but Ijust couldn't do it.
And now I understand that was anervous system piece that
slowing down into rest, likefull rest, going to sleep, felt
like a cue of danger for me.
And so my body wouldn't let medo it.
(15:01):
And so I would stay awake waytoo late, doing things that
probably were not a priority.
And the conscious story a lot ofthe time was well, I don't have
any downtime during the day.
I have so much going on in mylife, I need this time to
unwind.
And some of that was probablytrue.
But realistically, as I havecome to do my own inner work, I
realized how much of this was mynervous system and the impact of
my life experiences on mynervous system, preventing me
(15:24):
from being able to have thatflexibility and allow true rest
to feel safe.
So, in closing for today, Ireally want you to hear that
trauma doesn't keep us fromresting just by making us stuck
being busy and sympathetic or bymaking us just stuck in dorsal
collapse.
But our brains attach a story toall that stuckness that we are
(15:44):
not safe.
And so we have to keep going inthe way that we're going,
because if we do somethingdifferent, which actually could
be slowing down, getting thatbeautiful restorative rest and
renewal that we're longing for,there's something that's telling
us in our narrative, ourinternal narrative, that that's
not actually safe and what weneed.
And so, in order to heal thisexperience, in order to heal our
(16:06):
nervous systems, we need to beable to allow stillness to shift
from being a cue of danger to acue of safety.
So when we allow our bodies toslow down, we can actually lean
into that and ease into that andthat can feel comfortable and
safe and where we belong.
So we can truly receive thatrest that we need.
(16:27):
And if you want to know how youactually do that, please tune in
next week where I talk about theprocess.
In the meantime, please checkout my free resource on 100
practices that can help makerest and renewal more accessible
to you.
It's a great place to begin.
And you can really check in withyour nervous system to see what
practices feel like they'reaccessible, like they're
(16:48):
achievable, things that you cantry to receive the free guide.
You can go toregulatedrelationships.kit dot
com forward slash rest.
And you can also go in my shownotes right below the podcast
title, and there's a link therefor you to get that free
resource as well.
And it is filled with simplethings that you can start doing
(17:09):
today to help heal your nervoussystem so you can finally get
the rest that you're longingfor.
I look forward to talking morewith you next time.
As our time comes to a close, Iask you to keep listening for
just a few more moments becauseI want to thank you for showing
up today.
And I want to leave you with aninvitation as you hit stop and
move back out into the world onyour own unique wellness
(17:32):
journey.
In order to move from where youare today to the place where you
want to be, the path may seemlong or unclear or unknown.
And I want you to know that ifthat seems scary or daunting or
downright terrifying or anythingelse, that is totally okay.
Know that you do not have tocreate the whole way all at
(17:53):
once.
We don't travel a whole journeyin one stride.
And that is why my invitation toyou today is to take a step,
just one.
Any type, any size, in anydirection.
It can be an external step thatcan be observed or measured, or
it could be a step you visualizetaking in your mind.
It can be a step towards actionor towards rest or connection or
(18:17):
self-care or whatever step makessense to you.
I invite you to take a steptoday because getting to a place
that feels better, more joyful,more connected than the place
where you are today is possiblefor everyone, including you, and
even when depression is in yourbed.
If today's episode resonatedwith you, please subscribe so
(18:39):
you can be notified when eachweekly episode gets released.
I encourage you to leave areview and reach out to me on
social media attrish.sanders.lcsw.
Your feedback will help guidefuture episodes, and I love
hearing from you.
Also, please share this podcastwith anyone who you think may be
interested or who may getsomething from what I have
(19:00):
shared.
Until the next time we connect,take care of yourself and take a
step.
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