Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hello and welcome to
the One Depression is in your
Bed podcast.
Today I want to talk about ourinner brilliance and how we,
often unconsciously, are drawnto things that help meet our
needs, even when we don'trealize that that's actually
what's happening.
I will share something that Ihave done for decades that has
been a truly important part ofmy life and has served me very,
very well, even if it's noteverybody's cup of tea.
(00:22):
If you want to hear more,please keep listening.
I'm your host, trish Sanders,and I am so delighted that you
are here.
Let's get started.
So the topic that I'm going totalk about today, the specifics
of it, may not be something thatmost people relate to, but it
is something that I've beenthinking about for the last
several years, and I didn't knowI was going to do a podcast
(00:43):
episode about it, because when Ifirst started really noticing
and realizing the importance ofthis activity that I participate
in, I didn't have a podcast anddidn't know that I was going to
have a podcast, but I knew thatthis was something that is so
near and dear to my heart and isspecial to one of the
communities that I'm a part of.
That I knew I wanted to addressit in some way, because it felt
(01:05):
like revelations for me as Istarted to understand how me
being drawn to this particularthing has served me over 30
years of my life.
And the specifics again may notbe something that you relate to
directly, but I think the ideaof how we are truly brilliant
and as young children and asteenagers and young adults, and
(01:27):
certainly later on in adulthood,we do in fact find ways,
without even knowing, to get ourneeds met, and I think that
this is truly extraordinary andI have really been appreciating
that about myself.
And I'm inviting you today tothink about the things that you
are drawn to and maybe you areaware that they're things that
you are drawn to, and maybe youare aware that they're helpful
and that they're meeting needsfor you.
(01:48):
And maybe there are things thatyou do and you think they meet
one need, but perhaps there'ssome deeper reason that you do
them and if you bringconsciousness to those reasons,
those deeper reasons, sometimeswe can use those things either
more consciously when we needthem, or if we're aware of the
needs that are being met, thatare being met, that are so
important to us, then we cansometimes find even additional
(02:08):
things to do to help meet ourneeds, and that's really the
purpose of today's conversation.
So the specifics that I'm goingto talk about today is that I
myself am somebody who has founda love of mosh pits.
I go to a lot of concerts and myhusband and I both enjoy music
and I've always enjoyed musicthat tends to have a mosh pit.
It's not the only kind of musicthat I listen to or my husband
listens to, but if we go to aconcert, for me I usually say
(02:31):
that I measure a concert basedon how sweaty I get, which means
how hard I'm dancing and howactive and bouncy and fun the
mosh pit is.
And in case you don't know whata mosh pit is, it is just that
down front section at a concertwhere people are kind of jumping
around, and there are differentkinds of mosh pits.
If you're not familiar withbeing in them, then it really
doesn't make much of adifference.
But I will say that there aremosh pits for heavier music that
(02:54):
could be more aggressive andmore violent, and I'm not
talking about those types ofmosh pits, although I think to a
certain degree a lot of whatI'm saying would relate to those
mosh pits, but I'm notsupporting or encouraging
violence in any way.
I'm talking about moshing as aform of dance and I'm going to
share a little bit about myexperience being in mosh pits,
since I was 14 years old andstill in my 40s, going to mosh
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pits pretty regularly and what Ihave noticed.
And again, you may or may notdirectly relate to the idea of
going into a mosh pit, but I betyou do, whether you know it or
not, have things that you'vedone for a lot of your life,
whether you did them as a kidand no longer do them or found
new ways to do those things, orwhether you found things later
on.
But, like I said, I think thatwe are so brilliant and if we
(03:38):
give ourselves credit and westart to notice how we are
really built for wellness, weare designed in such a way that
our nervous system knows what itneeds.
Unfortunately, sometimes thingsget lost in translation because
when our nervous system has anexperience and it sends a
message up to our brain thatthere's a need, a need for
safety, is often the messagethat gets triggered and then our
(03:59):
brain goes into theself-protective place and we
only respond with that fight orflight, sympathetic energy or
that dorsal shut down andwithdraw, collapse energy, and
we can really limit ourselves inour response because we're
trying to take care of ourselvesand that's what our brains and
our nervous systems are reallydesigned to do.
But when we can sort of slowthat down and notice that that's
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not what's happening we're notalways in danger, even if we
feel like we are we can start toreally understand what we're
drawn to, what gives us afeeling that we want to move
away from, what does make uswant to hide or collapse, and we
can start to really identifyand address our needs in a much
more helpful, productive way.
We don't have to live stuck inthat survival place and the
perspective that I take is thatbeing depressed is being stuck
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in a dorsal nervous system state, which is the nervous system
state of collapse and shutdownand being withdrawn and avoidant
.
I have noticed as a depressedteenager that I was really drawn
into mosh pits and I went intomy first mosh pit when I was 14
years old with my dad and it wasactually at Woodstock 1994, the
25th anniversary of Woodstockand it was for Metallica and
(05:05):
Nine Inch Nails, which was apretty sweet mosh pit and being
at Woodstock was a prettyamazing experience with my dad.
He stood with his two armsaround me so that, as I was
getting kind of like pushed andknocked over a bit by the crowd,
I never fell and really it wasjust joyful.
It was just a fun experienceand it really set the tone for,
(05:26):
like I said, the entire rest ofmy life.
I tend to be drawn to sort oflike punkier, bouncier music and
, as I referenced, there's sortof different kinds of mosh pits
and if you were in a green daymosh pit, that might have a
different energy than aMetallica mosh pit or some
heavier metal bands.
But I go in mosh pits for avariety of different type of
music.
But back then I would just saylike, oh yeah, I just like mosh
pits.
They're fun, they're energetic,I just like them.
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I'm not sure even really what Iwould have said at 14 or 16 or
20 about what I really likedabout them specifically.
They were just a way that Iknew I had fun.
However, over the last severalyears particularly because it's
also something that I havecontinued to do and my
relationship to it, while Istill really enjoy mosh pits
quite a bit, as a matter of fact, I was just in a mosh pit last
(06:09):
week, which I think made mereally think about doing this
episode today.
I have noticed my relationshipto mosh pits have changed in
some way, and I've been not inany negative way at all, but
there's more consciousnessaround it.
I really understand why I havebeen so drawn to mosh pits over
the course of my life, and I'vereally started to see what
benefit they've had for me, andso that's what I want to
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actually talk about today, sothat if you yourself like mosh
pits, perhaps you'll relate.
And even if you don't like moshpits, I do think that a lot of
the things that have drawn me tomosh pits are needs that many
people have.
So, even though the specificway I've gotten the needs met
may not be your thing, I thinkthat some of the needs I have
are somewhat universal or common, and so that's what I really
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wanted to address and dive intotoday.
The first thing that I startedto really notice about the
benefits of mosh pits for me isthat they made me feel alive,
and again, I was a verydepressed teenager, and as a
very depressed teenager, mynervous system was often in that
dorsal state that shut down,collapsed, lack of energy,
immobilized state.
Doing things felt hard.
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I didn't have a lot ofmotivation a lot of the time,
that kind of thing.
And I noticed pretty quicklyagain, not totally consciously,
like I wouldn't have describedit this way when I was 14, but I
felt alive in a mosh pit.
I came alive.
There was so much energy thereand I really felt in my body,
which was also something thatwas not something that I felt
particularly comfortable with.
In a lot of other areas in mylife I was pretty disconnected
(07:34):
from my body experience.
But in a mosh pit it's a veryvisceral experience, very
sensory experience.
There's sights and sounds,you're touching things and
you're feeling things and eventhe taste in your mouth.
It's really everything you know.
You're hearing the music.
All of that stuff is reallyhappening.
So it really helps you bepresent in the moment.
And the music I listen towhether it's like punky sort of
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bouncy music or the heaviermetal sort of music literally I
can feel the beat of the musicin my chest.
The heavier the music sometimes, the heavier the beat, of
course, but I can literally feelit.
I can feel my heart beatingwith the music.
That's a pretty key experienceof aliveness, to feel your heart
beating and you know you'realive, you know you exist.
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And when you're depressed andwhen you're shut down, you don't
feel that way, you feel likeyou don't matter, you're not
there, you could feel invisibleand being in the mosh pit really
supported the need I really hadto know that I existed and I
was there and it also gave methat experience being in my body
, that I was able to move inwhatever way felt comfortable
and safe to me, which mightsound interesting.
(08:36):
If you don't go in mosh pits,you might not identify mosh pits
and safe sort of together andadmittedly, they can be a little
bit dangerous.
I've certainly gotten somebruises and things out of many
years of being in mosh pits, butgenerally speaking, I do not
come out of mosh pits injuredAlthough, like I said, you
certainly could but again, notbeing connected to my body.
I did not like dancing in otherplaces because you can be seen
(08:58):
if you're dancing on a stage oreven a dance floor where there's
space between people.
I didn't want to be seen.
That was very uncomfortable forme.
I was extremely self-conscious.
I think I'm probably still kindof self-conscious.
I have my moments where I'mmore so and moments where I'm
less so.
But I didn't really want to beseen.
I didn't want to be perceived.
That felt scary, that feltthreatening to me.
(09:18):
I didn't participate in sportsas a kid either, so all of those
ways that I could have been inmy body didn't feel safe and I
wasn't drawn to them as ayounger person.
Later on, more recently, overthe last several years, I have
gotten more into my body and Iam much more drawn to things
where I can be more physical inother ways and feel my strength
and my power which is, of course, another thing that comes out
(09:38):
in mosh pits feeling strong andpowerful but the need to move my
body when I didn't have accessto other ways that felt safe.
The mosh pit was prettyextraordinary because I could
move my body again in ways thatfelt safe and good to me.
But I didn't have any of theself-consciousness because I
didn't worry about anybodylooking at me because you know
you can't look at anyone's bodytoo much because you know you're
pressed pretty closely togetherand so I had this little space
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that was mine in the world.
That felt really protected andI felt like I could just be
myself in the mosh pit, and Ithink that that's another thing
that the mosh pit in many waysprovides.
It's a space of community andacceptance of who you are.
There's sort of like a show upas you will mentality, I think,
in mosh pits, because peoplecome looking all sorts of ways
and all sorts of makeup orcostumes or anything and it's
(10:24):
kind of like anything goes, likejust be yourself, show up how
you want, and that welcomingenvironment that you could just
be a part of this community andit was so immediately accepting.
And again, I'm aware that thismight not be everyone's mosh pit
experience, and there are moshpits that are perhaps not like
that, but by and large, for themost part this has absolutely
been my experience that I couldjust be a part of a community
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and it's like plug and playyou're there, you're ready and
everybody has this sharedinterest because at the very
least you're all there to seethe same band right, and so you
have some common interestalready and it creates this
community and there's a lot ofkindness in mosh pits.
If you do get knocked over,then people make room and pick
you up.
Or if you drop something, yourkeys or your phone or your shoe
(11:05):
comes off or whatever thingsthat happen in the mosh pit,
people will make space for youso that you can get on the
ground and look for it, so thatyou're not being harmed.
Being harmed, and all of thisreally serves as creating this
space where, again, as adepressed teen, I didn't feel
like I had a lot of community, alot of the time, and so to be
able to go and just feelcompletely accepted by these
people.
(11:26):
However, I showed up, whateverI looked like, was a pretty
profound experience for me,certainly, and it was a very
grounding experience for me aswell.
That body piece but also theenergy of the crowd.
I think I felt, as I mentioned,alive and present and grounded,
like I felt, like I was thereand I mattered and I felt seen
in a way that, again, as Imentioned before, felt safe, it
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didn't feel threatening, itdidn't feel intrusive to me and
some people might feel like amosh pit is intrusive.
Again, this is my experienceand I'm not saying that everyone
should feel this way or doesfeel this way.
I think that people who comeinto mosh pits may relate to
this certainly, or at least incertain parts, but a mosh pit
experience, again with thatcommunity, that connection, that
acceptance.
It's a very intimate experiencebecause you're really sharing
(12:07):
very close space.
You're skin to skin with peopleand you don't know them, but
yet you feel like family, youfeel like you're all a part of
each other and you know.
Again, many people might belike, oh, the idea of being skin
to skin with all these sweatypeople that I don't know may
sound totally gross, and Itotally understand that.
I definitely do shower after Icome home from every single mosh
pit, but being there, it justfeels to me like this very human
(12:29):
experience, like you're justaccepted for who you are Sweat
and grime and dirt and all.
We're our messy, human selvesand it's okay.
And to me that has been a veryreassuring message that I didn't
always have Me feeling messyand me trying to hide that or
that not being okay hasdefinitely been one of the
stories that I've carried withme for as long as I can remember
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in my life and I also felt veryI guess I would say criticized
or unseen.
You know, growing up I did haveblack hair and wore all black
makeup and all black clothes allthe time and people would say
like, oh, you know, you'd be sopretty if you didn't wear all
that makeup or you know, why areyou wearing so many dark things
?
Why don't you wear colors?
And I didn't feel understood,because to me I think this
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probably is a related but maybedifferent conversation wearing
all those clothes, like, Ireally felt like I was sort of
just showing myself, like I felta lot of darkness on the inside
and I just reflected that onthe outside, and people didn't
always understand it.
They tried to make me feelbetter, which I get.
I totally understand.
If you see somebody who'shaving a hard time, there's
certainly an urge to make themfeel better and that could be
(13:31):
really lovely.
But I didn't feel validated inmy experience.
But in a mosh I did, becausethere were a lot of people who I
knew felt similarly to me andvalidation doesn't have to be
agreement, which again is awhole other episode too but I
didn't feel like I needed to besomebody else in the mosh pit,
no matter who I was, no matterhow I showed up, if I came in
with black hair or you know, ifI come in with purple hair, or
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if I come in with makeup or if Icome in with no makeup,
whatever it is, however, I showup, it's okay to be me and that
feels like a message that Ireally received and have always
received and continue to receivegoing into Mosh Pits.
And the last piece, which I'vereally grown to have a deep
appreciation of in the last fewyears, is that mosh pits are a
place where, I would say again,my experience and not every
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single mosh pit is exactly thesame, but I do think that mosh
pits are a place that reallyhonors all feelings, including
joy and excitement.
Of course you're happy to seethe band and hear them play your
favorite song kind of thing,but also deep sadness or
connecting with deep sadness Imean people cry from certainly
sometimes big excitement butalso, you know, singing a song
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that touches your soul.
You can be holding this spacein a safe way, in a protected
way, where you're feeling againthis community and you're not
feeling alone, but you can feelvery deep, painful feelings.
I would say that mosh pits arealso a place that tend to honor
sacred rage and it's a placewhere you can be angry and it's
accepted.
And again, I'm not talkingabout when mosh pits are violent
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and people are overlyaggressive.
I'm talking about mosh pitswhere there is a respect for
everybody and you're allowed tojust show up as you are, with
the feelings that you have, andit's a place where you can
scream and cry in community, andI think that for me, again,
that has been a place I didn'thave to hide anything or deny
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anything or pretend.
It was a place that I couldjust really be me and experience
and release all of my feelings.
I don't really know why Iexactly started thinking about
this, except I do know that thevery first time I started really
thinking about it was I waslike wow, I found a way to move
my body in a way that didn'tfeel self-conscious and that
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felt like a big aha moment.
Many years ago, and as I'veconsidered mosh pits and the
needs that they served, I'vejust started to deepen my
appreciation for my nervoussystem, but also in general for
our nervous systems and how weknow exactly what we need.
And if it's not readilyavailable to us as oftentimes it
is not in childhood especiallythe things we need are not
always readily available to uswe find ways, and I think that
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that is something that is veryreassuring and is a powerful
coping thought for me, and soI'm here to offer it to you that
, even if we want things that wecan't quite have.
We have needs that can't quitebe met in the way that we wish
they could be met, like if youwish your mom was this way, or
you wish your dad was that way,or you wish your family was able
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to provide this to you in acertain way.
Maybe they couldn't, but thatdoesn't mean we're stuck or
we're totally out of luck.
We actually have a whole worldof opportunity to connect with.
We have ourselves to connectwith in deeper ways and take
care of ourselves.
We have others, we have thelarger world.
We have, whatever it means toyou, nature, spirit beyond.
There's always a way to find away, and that's kind of what
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I've been thinking about, and soI invite you to think about
yourself and your life.
And, like I said, maybe moshpits are not your thing, but I
would bet that you have foundthings in your life that meet
your needs, and maybe that meansthat they're healthy things,
like forms of dance or sport orsome sort of hobby, and maybe
they're not healthy things,right.
Maybe they're things that harmyou.
Maybe it's drinking or drugs orgambling or shopping too much,
(17:07):
or sex or whatever.
But when we start to reallyidentify what we've been drawn
to and the needs that it'smeeting, we start to have a lot
more clarity and a lot morechoice.
We can start to see is thishaving only a positive impact or
is this having a negativeimpact as well?
And again, I can talk aboutthat on another episode, because
I think that that's a reallyvaluable piece.
But for me, mosh pits havealways been something that are
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really important, and they'realso really important to my
husband, ben.
So we've always gone to a lotof concerts and if you would
have asked me when I was 16,what are some qualities that are
important to you in a futurehusband I don't think at 16, I
would have said to you he has togo in mosh pits.
But after being with Ben for 21years and being able to
continue going into mosh pitstogether and sharing music and
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this experience of community andnow we've moved on to sharing
this with our 13 year old son aswell, because we bring him in
Moshpits he enjoys a lot of themusic that we like and he is now
sharing the experience with usit really has been something
that's just been really special.
It's a very connecting andjoyful experience for us, and
it's something that I feelreally fortunate to have.
I also have started to see howI've evolved and how things have
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shifted, and I feel much lessself-conscious than I used to,
and so I feel more comfortablegoing into other types of body
movement, like a yoga class,where technically there's people
seeing me, but I feel safethere.
I don't only have to be in amosh pit when it comes to moving
my body.
I find other ways to feelstrong with, like weightlifting
or other kinds of exercise.
I find community in many placesnow, although I do still find a
(18:42):
strong sense of community atconcerts oftentimes, and in a
mosh pit still, and so the moreI start to become clear on this,
the more I can start to usethis consciously.
And you know, a mosh pit mightnot always be available when I
need one, but I definitely doget the feeling of like, ooh, I
could use a good mosh pit rightnow.
And if I don't have a mosh pitavailable, what else can I do if
I can really identify the needunderneath it?
And so sometimes I need a spacewhere I can express that sacred
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rage, where I can honor theanger inside of me.
And how do I do that today andI don't just do it in mosh pits
and I don't feel restricted.
I feel like more myself,certainly now, than I did myself
, certainly now than I did, Ithink, when I was a kid, when I
was a teenager.
I'm discovering more and moreof myself and I like a wider
array of music, which I thinkI've mentioned before on the
podcast that I listen to musicthat I would not have liked five
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or 10 years ago because itdidn't have a heavy bass that
made my heart feel alive andgave me this experience of like
I'm here, I exist and I feel myheart beating.
I can listen to music that'ssofter and more gentle, that,
honestly, I would have said wasboring a few years ago and
certainly as a teenager I wouldhave said was boring.
But now I connect with itdifferently, because music
serves many purposes in my lifebeyond just what historically it
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has done for me, which is a lot.
And certainly music issomething that Ben and I have
connected on since we met andit's been something that has
been unifying for us.
So as I move to close today'sepisode, I do invite you to
think about what you do, whatyou've always done, without even
knowing that meets your needs,that helps you feel safe or have
community, gives you a place toexpress yourself, gives you a
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place to move your body, givesyou a place to feel strong or
powerful, because sometimes wedon't feel those ways, we don't
have those needs met, and it canfeel really awful Again when
you're depressed.
It can be a pretty painfulexperience and we can feel
really stuck, feeling like we'llnever get those needs met or
maybe even worse, that we don'tdeserve to get those needs met.
And those are just dysregulatedstories that come with a
(20:29):
dysregulated nervous system.
And I would like to invite youto think about the ways that you
can get those needs met,because, of course, you deserve
to have your needs met andthere's not just one way that
our needs can be met.
And if we honor the brillianceof our systems, then we can
actually trust that we can findthe things that are just right
(20:49):
for us.
As our time comes to a close, Iask you to keep listening for
just a few more moments, becauseI want to thank you for showing
up today and I want to leaveyou with an invitation as you
hit stop and move back out intothe world on your own unique
wellness journey In order tomove from where you are today to
the place where you want to be.
(21:10):
The path may seem long orunclear or unknown, and I want
you to know that if that seemsscary or daunting or downright
terrifying or anything else,that is totally okay.
Know that you do not have tocreate the whole way all at once
.
We don't travel a whole journeyin one stride, and that is why
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my invitation to you today is totake a step, just one, any type
, any size, in any direction.
It can be an external step thatcan be observed or measured, or
it could be a step youvisualize, taking in your mind.
It can be a step towards actionor towards rest or connection
or self-care, or whatever stepmakes sense to you.
(21:53):
I invite you to take a steptoday because getting to a place
that feels better, more joyful,more connected than the place
where you are today is possiblefor everyone, including you, and
even when depression is in yourbed.
If today's episode resonatedwith you, please subscribe so
you can be notified when eachweekly episode gets released.
(22:15):
I encourage you to leave areview and reach out to me on
social media at trishsanderslcsw.
Your feedback will help guidefuture episodes, and I love
hearing from you.
Also.
Please share this podcast withanyone who you think may be
interested or who may getsomething from what I have
shared.
Until the next time we connect,take care of yourself and take
(22:37):
a step.