April 2, 2025 • 23 mins
Have you been thinking about ending your relationship but something keeps holding you back? You're not alone. This raw and thoughtful exploration unpacks the invisible barriers that keep us stuck in relationships we're contemplating leaving.
Drawing from 20 years of personal experience in a relationship complicated by depression, I walk through the first of my seven-question framework designed to clarify relationship decisions. By examining the real obstacles that prevent us from moving forward, we can transform seemingly impenetrable walls into challenges we can address with compassion and strategy.
Financial fears often loom largest when contemplating separation. When I faced this barrier, creating detailed budgets helped me see that while changes would be necessary, survival was possible. For parents, concern about impact on children creates profound hesitation. The truth? Both staying in an unhappy relationship and ending it will affect your children - what matters most is how you support them through either decision.
Many of us also struggle with letting go of the "fairy tale future" we envisioned, feeling trapped by time already invested, or fearing dating again or permanent solitude. Perhaps most heartbreaking is the fear that ending a relationship might trigger a partner's mental health crisis or self-harm - an impossible position that requires tremendous self-compassion.
Whatever obstacles stand between you and relationship clarity, identifying them is your first step toward making an authentic decision aligned with your values, whether that means staying or leaving. Join me in this vulnerable conversation about finding your way forward when depression complicates your relationship choices.
Take a step today - whether toward action, rest, connection or self-care. Getting to a more joyful, connected place is possible for everyone, even when depression is in your bed.
- If you are looking to take the first step towards improving your connection and communication with your partner, check out this FREE monthly webinar on "Becoming a Conscious Couple,".
- If you and your partner are ready to co-create the roadmap to the relationship of your dreams, join us for the next in-person "Getting the Love You Want" Weekend Couples Retreat!
For support in how to have deeper connections and better communication in the relationships that matter most in your life, follow the host, Trish Sanders on Instagram , Bluesky or LinkedIn.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hello and welcome to when Depression is in your Bed
podcast.
Have you been reallyconsidering ending your
relationship, but it feels likethere's some obstacle preventing
you from actually making thebig decision.
If so, join me for today'sepisode, in which I talk about
some common obstacles anddifferent ways that you can move
towards being able to workaround them instead of being
(00:22):
stopped by them.
I'm your host, trish Sanders,and I can't wait to share more
with you today.
Let's get started.
Today, I'm going to continuethe conversation that I've been
having through the last fewepisodes about things that may
help you make a decision aboutthe future of your relationship,
if that's something that you'restruggling with.
In the first episode that I didon this topic, I talked about
(00:45):
the seven question frameworkthat I developed that has, in
fact, helped me make a consciousdecision about staying in my
relationship, and then the lastepisode just felt like the next
part of the conversation for me.
It was a conversation aboutdifferent types of hope and
other factors that may berelevant for people who have a
tendency to think about breakingup or divorce frequently, such
(01:07):
as myself.
I have thought about breakingup and separating and divorce
many times over my last 20 yearswith my partner and through
that experience I've really cometo a much deeper understanding
about why I have thought aboutdivorcing and separating so many
times and, in truth, most ofthe the time it wasn't actually
because I wanted to leave mypartner at all, but there were a
lot of other factors and Idiscussed that in the last
(01:29):
episode.
Today I wanted to talk throughthose seven questions and my own
personal thought process, usingthis self-exploration and, to
be honest, this may end up beinga two-parter, because I don't
quite know how long it'll takefor me to explore these
questions but I want to be ashonest and open and vulnerable
with you as I can be, becausethese may be some things that
you're wondering about andperhaps how I've thought through
(01:51):
some of these things may besimilar to your own thought
process and in other ways maybethey'll be very different from
your own thought process.
But either way, I hope that mesharing my experience will help
you shed some light in somehelpful way on your own
experience and in your owndecision process, if this is
something that you are trying tofigure out.
So the first question that Ilisted was what are the real or
(02:14):
perceived obstacles that come tomind when you think about
leaving the relationship, andthen how can you address them?
And the purpose of this isreally to think about the scary
things that may feel likethey're in your way if you
actually decided, hey, I want toend this relationship, but I
can't because dot, dot, dot.
And it's those becauses thosereasons that I recommend
(02:36):
starting there, because you canstart to deconstruct them and
make a plan for how to addressthem.
So if they are in factobstacles, they're obstacles
that you can find a workaround,instead of being obstacles that
actually stop you in your tracksand prevent you from making a
decision that perhaps you reallywant to make.
I think one of the big thingsthat comes up as an answer to
this question certainly was highon my list were financial
(02:57):
concerns or considerations, andfor me, even though I myself
have always had a job while Iwas in this relationship, there
would have been a considerablefinancial impact and I would not
have been able to continueliving in the same way that I
had, and that would have meantthat I couldn't have continued
living in a house, certainly notowning a house.
My child care costs would havechanged.
(03:17):
I very well could have had totake on new clients or change my
hours or even consider goinginto an agency job or school
social work or something thatmaybe would have given me hours
that could have been a littlebit more helpful for me if I was
going to be a single mom right.
Working with clients until nineo'clock or ten o'clock at night
wasn't always going to work outso well.
So when I thought about allthose financial things and how
(03:40):
the quality of my life, thethings I was used to, the things
that my kids were used to, youknow what activities that I
could afford to put them in,thinking about how all of that
would change was really scaryfor me.
So I used to make budgets toreally see what could I actually
afford and the gap between youknow where I wanted to be and
where I was.
I tried to plan about how Icould close that gap right, like
(04:00):
how could I increase my income,how could I decrease my
expenses.
I realized that, at least inthe short term, many things also
would have to change.
Like for me, I probably wouldhave ended up moving in with my
mom, at least temporarily, whileI got back on my feet and
sorted everything, and so for mebeing able to look, even though
things were tight and I wouldhave had to make changes that
maybe I didn't necessarily wantto make, like I wouldn't
(04:22):
necessarily want to take my kidsout of certain activities or
move their school district orthings like that.
But it helped me to really seein these black and white numbers
that it was possible.
And even if in the short term Ihad to make changes, in the
longer term I could get myselfback on my feet, figure out a
way to work with those finances.
And I had conversations with mymom about hey, can I live here
(04:44):
right?
About how she and her husbandfelt about the possibility of me
and my son moving in, and so itwas helpful for me because,
even though I wouldn't say myfinancial plan was ideal and
what I absolutely wanted, itreally gave me a lot of ease to
know that it was possible.
And, as I said, I've always hada job, so I already had an
income stream, and not everybodyis in that position, and so
there can be some greatfinancial barriers, but there's
(05:06):
also things that can be figuredout in time and there's long and
short term plans, and that'sthe point of this exercise is to
really think about that.
So I mentioned some things abouthow my financial constraints
would have potentially impactedmy kids, and the actual effect
on my children was also a reallybig concern for me.
Like maybe I would choose toget separated, but I really
(05:27):
can't because I don't want tohave a negative impact on my
children.
This is also a pretty commonconcern.
Now, the truth is that whetheryou stay in a relationship in
which you and your partner areunhappy, or if you choose to end
a relationship in which you andyour partner are unhappy,
either choice will have animpact on your child or children
, and some of the impact will bepositive, some of the impact
(05:49):
will be neutral and some of theimpact will be negative, and so
I really had to talk myselfthrough that that I didn't have
a crystal ball.
I had no way of knowing whichdecision would have less
negative impact on my children,and so what I really focused on
was being able to support themin whatever current decision I
(06:09):
was making, and when my husbandand I were separated, I had to
support my son through thatprocess.
He was just about three yearsold at that time and in all the
rest of the time that we've beentogether but it's tension or
difficulty or whatever has beenhappening.
I tried to just support my son,and again now my daughter as
well, in helping them have anage appropriate understanding of
what's going on.
So I would talk to them abouttheir feelings, I would ask them
(06:32):
questions, and this is reallyimportant because, just like
adults, if children don't knowwhat's going on, they will make
up a story about what'shappening and the story can be
scarier or even moredisempowering than the reality.
And so being able to share withkids again age appropriate
about your relationship withyour partner, whether it's their
biological parent or not, isreally important and the lines
(06:53):
can be hard sometimes to figureout.
But if you have a partner or ifyou yourself are dealing with
depression, there's reallyimportant and healthy ways to
talk about what that means to akid and sometimes for myself.
If I was feeling on edge and Iknew I was really irritable and
if my mental health was in sortof a tough place, I would be
forthcoming with my kids and Itell them hey, you know, mommy
has on her cranky pants todayand it has nothing to do with
(07:16):
you.
I'm a little bit on edge.
I might sound frustrated, butI'm not really frustrated at you
and I just want you to knowthat and I'm taking care of
myself, I'm doing what I need todo to take care of me and I
will feel better soon.
But I just want you to know,because they need to understand,
or because you're mad at themthat you're just kind of having
(07:36):
a bad day.
And many years ago, when Benwould not partake in family
activities or he would spend theday in bed, I would tell my son
you know, oh, daddy's justhaving a tough time, he's taking
care of himself.
We can send him love and he'sworking on doing what he needs
to do to feel better.
Because it's very important tome to send the message that it's
not my children'sresponsibility to take care of
(07:58):
me or my husband.
But yet I want to acknowledgethat something's going on
because they notice and so beingable to have those
conversations again in an ageappropriate way and sometimes
getting some support from achild therapist or something
like that, can be very, veryhelpful.
And I also help support them inexpressing their own feelings.
Like, if I say something from aplace of frustration and it
(08:18):
lands as an ouch for one of mykids, I address that and I say I
want you to be able to tell meif something lands as a hurt for
you.
And so all of these becomeconversations and so I share it
in this way because, again, wedon't know what the future holds
and for some people it feelsvery important to them to keep a
family intact quote unquote forthe kids.
And if that's the decisionyou're making and it feels like
that's a fit for you, thenyou're entitled to make that
(08:39):
decision.
But maybe you're living in astressful environment, whether
it's argumentative ordisconnected, stressful if one
parent is in bed or if the waythat their depression shows up
is that they're just likechecked out and at work
constantly.
You know those sorts of thingsdo need to be addressed with
children, and being able to givea child enough information so
that they can be validated intheir experience Like hey, it
(09:05):
makes sense that this is hardfor you is really quite
important, and I would say thatthat was the focus that I came
back to time and time again.
I have to support my child inthe decision that I'm making
because you know it's a littleunfair, but the truth is that
parents' decisions do, in fact,have a pretty direct impact on
kids and it can feel reallypowerless to not be involved in
the decision-making process, butit's not really appropriate for
kids to be making decisionsabout the future of your
relationship Again, whether yourpartner is their biological
(09:26):
parent or not.
So I think that realizing whatyou can do to support your kids
is more helpful than worryingabout what decision will have
more or less negative impact onyour kids, because the truth is,
most situations you probablywon't know and there might be
things that you think will havea terrible impact on your kid,
that if you ended up gettingdivorced actually wouldn't have
(09:47):
such a negative impact at all,and then there might be things
that you thought that they wouldbe totally fine with that end
up being really troublesome andhaving a negative impact.
So supporting your child andgetting your child support
externally again with a childtherapist or something like that
is really helpful.
Also, with the idea of children,but in a very different way,
many years ago, before weactually had gotten separated, I
(10:09):
really had the idea wow, thingsare really tough and I don't
know what's going to happen withthe future of our relationship,
but I really want to have asecond kid.
We only had our son at thattime and it feels a little
embarrassing and there's even abit of shame, I think, although
I've really processed throughthis a lot on my own and with my
husband.
But I really had an idea.
(10:30):
It was sort of like this fairytale, right like I meet my
husband and we fell in love andwe both wanted two kids and we
had our son after we got marriedand then I wanted to have a
second child and I felt like ifwe got divorced it would really
pop my fantasy bubble.
There was a lot of grief for mein the thought of losing this
future family that I hadenvisioned having, and so we did
(10:52):
try to get pregnant before wegot separated and ended up
getting separated after a yearof trying.
But it ended up being a reallywonderful thing for me because
it gave me this experience of,hey, I might have to face this
grief that maybe the future thatI envision for myself and for
my family might not look thesame the way that I had thought.
And I also had to really askmyself do I want to stay in this
(11:15):
relationship because I want tohold on to this vision that I
have for this future that Iwanted to create, or am I
staying in this relationshipbecause I actually want to be
with my husband?
That was a really hard thingfor me, but I really did a lot
of very deep work at that timeand I did realize that I truly
wanted to be with my husband andI actively worked through our
(11:35):
separation to start us going tocouples therapy, which took a
few months, but my husband dideventually agree.
I also worked really hard to getus to go to getting the Love
you Want couples workshop, whichI was aware of existed before
we got separated, but for somereason I just didn't think to go
, or it didn't seem like theurgency around going, or the
financial investment or gettingchildcare for the whole weekend
(11:55):
or whatever didn't seemaccessible.
Until it was like you're indire straits and we either did
something about our relationshipor we were going to get
divorced because we were alreadyseparated.
And so when we got backtogether, my husband
understandably was concernedbecause he knew how much I
wanted a second child and he hadevery right to ask and did ask
are we only getting backtogether so we can have a second
kid?
And again, at that point myanswer was absolutely.
(12:16):
I understand your concern hereand I'm with you because I want
to be with you, and it took awhile to do enough repair for us
to be able to try again, and wedid, and eventually we did have
our daughter.
Our kids are seven and a halfyears apart, actually because of
all of this relationshipturmoil, but me holding on to
this dream before we gotseparated definitely was an
(12:36):
obstacle for a long time, untilthe relationship was so painful
and then it was like all right,well, listen, I have to give up
this dream because I can't stayin a relationship that feels
like this.
And for us, the separation gaveus the space that we needed,
the breathing room that weneeded to be able to figure
things out and move forward in adifferent way, and I am forever
grateful for us that we hadthat experience.
(12:58):
Of course, separating doesn'tguarantee that experience for
everyone by any means, but forthis piece, my point really is
is that getting separated gaveme the mirror that I needed to
say, hey, look at this, youmight have to give up your dream
.
And if you have to give up yourdream, you'll dream up another
dream.
You know, like whatever thatwas, whether I would get married
, whether I would have arelationship with someone else,
(13:19):
or have a kid in the future withsomebody else, or if I would
have chosen to have a child onmy own, which was something that
I also considered back then.
But it was really important forme to grieve a little bit and
say, okay, maybe I have to letthis go.
And now let me make a cleardecision about my relationship,
not one that's clouded by thispull to have this life that I
(13:39):
thought that I wanted to have.
Another common obstacle forpeople considering if they want
to leave a relationship or notis the idea of how much time
they've already invested in therelationship.
So it's kind of like well,things aren't great, the
relationship's been hard for awhile, but we've been together
for so long Like, is it reallyworth it?
And for me, I absolutely feltthat way, and even pretty early
(14:00):
on.
I think back as a matter offact.
I clearly remember the veryfirst time that I really was
considering breaking up, a fewmonths before our one year
dating anniversary, and I knowthis very clearly because we had
a trip planned to Montreal forour anniversary and I had a lot
of internal conversations about,by the time we get back from
Montreal, if we haven't sortedout some of these things, I
(14:21):
think I'm going to break up withhim.
We went to Montreal.
Some of the vacation wasamazing, some of it was
extremely challenging and I cameback and I was like gosh, I've
already spent a year with thisguy.
You know, some of it's good, alot of it's hard.
Oh, do I really want to throwin the towel after a year, which
, of course, is kind ofhilarious to me now I'm not
discrediting anyone who may alsofeel that way after being
(14:42):
together a year, but now thatwe've been together for 20 years
, I'm like, oh my gosh.
But I think that there were alot of factors at that time, so
many factors that I won't namenow, but I've touched on already
in the podcast and otherepisodes and we'll absolutely
talk about more in futureepisodes.
But there were certainly a lotof things that kept me in the
relationship after that,including the fact that I really
do see my husband to be awonderful partner for me in so
(15:02):
many ways.
Even if we weren't experiencingthat really connected wonderful
relationship a lot of the time,I knew it was there and I've
mentioned before that can bechallenging if you have this
little tiny, itsy bitsy.
Part of a relationship thatfeels nice and a lot of it is
absolutely awful.
Certainly if there's abuse, ifthere's domestic violence, this
changes the conversation.
So I just want to be very clearthat was not my situation.
(15:22):
So for other types ofrelationships where conflicts
get physical or violent, someonemight really need to make a
very different decision forthemselves, not just like oh
well, sometimes we're soconnected and so in love, but
again, more on that another time.
I just wanted to point that out.
But certainly, as time went on,and definitely after we got
married, I kind of did this likecost benefit analysis, like
what's the cost of leaving,what's the benefit of leaving,
(15:45):
what's the cost of staying andwhat's the benefit of staying
after this amount of time andhow much time did I put in and
what was I going to lose.
And it was this whole likething that I went through
several times, I would say, overthe course of our relationship.
And I do completely understandthat feeling of I've wasted time
.
If I end a relationship, I'vewasted all this effort and I
think any time in relationshipis an opportunity for growth and
(16:08):
so, even if things don't workout the way you had hoped,
you're still taking a lot oflearning from that relationship
and if you can think about yourrelationship in that way, when
you're in the middle of a lot ofpain and hurt, it might not be
accessible to you in that moment, but eventually in time it's
really a grief process.
When you lose somebody and inthis case, when you lose a
(16:29):
relationship, you can move intoa place where you come to
understand the lessons that youtook and how you grew and maybe
clarity on things that youdidn't want, the things that
weren't okay for you inrelationship, and you take that
into a new relationship or intoyour future and you have a more
clear understanding of what youdo want and you have more
ability to create that.
(16:50):
Even though it can certainlyfeel like wasted time and it
certainly can be a griefexperience time is not wasted.
When you choose to end arelationship.
It's sort of the death of onepart of your life.
It's also the birth of the nextpart of your life and my
perspective would be if you'reputting time into yourself, then
that's time well spent,whatever decision you make.
(17:11):
Another common fear I don't knowif I want to be in the dating
world again or even the fear ofI'm scared to be alone or I
might be alone forever.
This is better than that.
There's likely some unconsciousstuff mixed up in there, which
is the next question that I'llgo into.
But I think people have toreally get into a regulated a
place as they can, which is veryhard when they're asking some
of these potentiallylife-changing questions, but
(17:33):
coming to a place of saying like, well, do I really want and
does it make sense to stay inthis relationship?
Because I really don't want tobe dating or because I'm scared
to be alone forever?
Is this relationship better?
Do I get more from staying inthis relationship?
Does it make more sense for meto stay in this relationship to
avoid all that fear?
And the truth is that eachperson truly needs to make that
decision for themselves.
And if you choose like, hey,you know what I want, to stay in
(17:53):
this relationship because allthat stuff is too scary, if that
feels like an authenticallyaligned decision for you, then
that's the decision for you.
And if you're like, hey, youknow what I really need to end
this relationship even thoughit's scary, then that's your
aligned, authentic decision.
This isn't about right or wrong.
It's really about what trulymakes sense to you and the last
piece that I will address, whichcan be present in any
(18:13):
relationship, but I think,especially if your partner has
struggled with depression, thisis a very common thing that can
keep people in relationship andcertainly has been on my mind in
the past which is, sometimespeople can really have a fear
that if they end a relationship,that their partner might harm
themselves in some way,including even killing
themselves, and they're not onlyafraid that that will happen,
(18:34):
but if something horrific likethat does in fact happen, they
don't want to live with theguilt, and this is an absolute,
horrible position to be in.
It's the choice between do Istay in a relationship and
continue to sacrifice my needs,potentially in a way to
hopefully keep my partner alive,or do I end a relationship and
(18:54):
potentially live with this guiltfeeling if my then ex-partner
decides to die by suicide ormake a suicide attempt or
self-harm in some way, and thisis just an impossible decision,
and this may sound harsh and Iapologize in advance if it does,
but the truth is is that nobodyis responsible for anybody
else's life.
No adult is responsible for anyother adult's life, and I'm not
(19:18):
saying that if you were in thissituation and you chose to
leave the relationship and yourex partner did self-harm or did
attempt suicide or did die bysuicide, that it wouldn't have a
deep emotional impact on you.
Of course, that's anunimaginable situation.
I have not been in thatsituation where I have ended a
relationship and my partner hasattempted suicide or died by
suicide.
(19:38):
I have been in relationshipswhere I left and my partner has
threatened suicide, not with myhusband, but I did have
relationships in my teenage lifewhere that happened and it was
horrible and, having had thatexperience, I can say what my
perspective was.
Then I actually told my ex Ireally really hope that you
don't do something so horribleand drastic and I hope that you
(19:58):
get the support that you need tobe able to get through this and
be okay.
I can't come back into arelationship that feels so bad
to keep you alive.
I can't do that and at thattime if my ex had taken action
which he did not I don't knowwhat would have happened.
But I share this to say thatit's a horrible decision, but
taking care of yourself is thething you have the most power
(20:18):
over, and sacrificing yourselffor somebody else will not
create the environment where youcan really improve your
relationship because you'resacrificing yourself to try to
meet someone else's needs, andit probably doesn't even quite
work that way anyhow.
So this is a very, very hardposition to be in, but I think
it's important to recognize itand certainly this is something
that if you need to get support,then I absolutely recommend
(20:42):
that you do so.
So I talked a lot about questionone today.
I think questions two throughseven I can cover in the next
episode altogether, but I thinkthat there's a lot of obstacles
that felt like they were in theway for me over many years and I
think that a lot of people sortof stop even trying to make the
decision whether they shouldend a relationship or not
because of these factors.
So I wanted to cover the thingsthat really have been on my
(21:04):
mind over the years.
I hope that this was helpfulfor you.
I will cover more questionshopefully all six remaining
questions in the next episode.
As our time comes to a close, Iask you to keep listening for
just a few more moments, becauseI want to thank you for showing
up today and I want to leaveyou with an invitation as you
hit stop and move back out intothe world on your own unique
(21:26):
wellness journey In order tomove from where you are today to
the place where you want to be.
The path may seem long orunclear or unknown, and I want
you to know that if that seemsscary or daunting or downright
terrifying or anything else,that is totally okay.
Know that you do not have tocreate the whole way all at once
(21:49):
.
We don't travel a whole journeyin one stride, and that is why
my invitation to you today is totake a step, just one, any type
, any size, in any direction.
It can be an external step thatcan be observed or measured, or
it could be a step youvisualize, taking in your mind.
It can be a step towards action, or towards rest or connection
(22:12):
or self-care, or whatever stepmakes sense to you.
I invite you to take a steptoday because getting to a place
that feels better, more joyful,more connected than the place
where you are today is possiblefor everyone, including you, and
even when depression is in yourbed.
If today's episode resonatedwith you, please subscribe so
(22:34):
you can be notified when eachweekly episode gets released.
I encourage you to leave areview and reach out to me on
social media at trishsanderslcsw.
Your feedback will help guidefuture episodes and I love
hearing from you.
Also, please share this podcastwith anyone who you think may
be interested or who may getsomething from what I have
(22:55):
shared.
Until the next time we connect,take care of yourself and take
a step.
Hello and welcome to when Depression is in your Bed
podcast.
Have you been reallyconsidering ending your
relationship, but it feels likethere's some obstacle preventing
you from actually making thebig decision.
If so, join me for today'sepisode, in which I talk about
some common obstacles anddifferent ways that you can move
towards being able to workaround them instead of being
(00:22):
stopped by them.
I'm your host, trish Sanders,and I can't wait to share more
with you today.
Let's get started.
Today, I'm going to continuethe conversation that I've been
having through the last fewepisodes about things that may
help you make a decision aboutthe future of your relationship,
if that's something that you'restruggling with.
In the first episode that I didon this topic, I talked about
(00:45):
the seven question frameworkthat I developed that has, in
fact, helped me make a consciousdecision about staying in my
relationship, and then the lastepisode just felt like the next
part of the conversation for me.
It was a conversation aboutdifferent types of hope and
other factors that may berelevant for people who have a
tendency to think about breakingup or divorce frequently, such
(01:07):
as myself.
I have thought about breakingup and separating and divorce
many times over my last 20 yearswith my partner and through
that experience I've really cometo a much deeper understanding
about why I have thought aboutdivorcing and separating so many
times and, in truth, most ofthe the time it wasn't actually
because I wanted to leave mypartner at all, but there were a
lot of other factors and Idiscussed that in the last
(01:29):
episode.
Today I wanted to talk throughthose seven questions and my own
personal thought process, usingthis self-exploration and, to
be honest, this may end up beinga two-parter, because I don't
quite know how long it'll takefor me to explore these
questions but I want to be ashonest and open and vulnerable
with you as I can be, becausethese may be some things that
you're wondering about andperhaps how I've thought through
(01:51):
some of these things may besimilar to your own thought
process and in other ways maybethey'll be very different from
your own thought process.
But either way, I hope that mesharing my experience will help
you shed some light in somehelpful way on your own
experience and in your owndecision process, if this is
something that you are trying tofigure out.
So the first question that Ilisted was what are the real or
(02:14):
perceived obstacles that come tomind when you think about
leaving the relationship, andthen how can you address them?
And the purpose of this isreally to think about the scary
things that may feel likethey're in your way if you
actually decided, hey, I want toend this relationship, but I
can't because dot, dot, dot.
And it's those becauses thosereasons that I recommend
(02:36):
starting there, because you canstart to deconstruct them and
make a plan for how to addressthem.
So if they are in factobstacles, they're obstacles
that you can find a workaround,instead of being obstacles that
actually stop you in your tracksand prevent you from making a
decision that perhaps you reallywant to make.
I think one of the big thingsthat comes up as an answer to
this question certainly was highon my list were financial
(02:57):
concerns or considerations, andfor me, even though I myself
have always had a job while Iwas in this relationship, there
would have been a considerablefinancial impact and I would not
have been able to continueliving in the same way that I
had, and that would have meantthat I couldn't have continued
living in a house, certainly notowning a house.
My child care costs would havechanged.
(03:17):
I very well could have had totake on new clients or change my
hours or even consider goinginto an agency job or school
social work or something thatmaybe would have given me hours
that could have been a littlebit more helpful for me if I was
going to be a single mom right.
Working with clients until nineo'clock or ten o'clock at night
wasn't always going to work outso well.
So when I thought about allthose financial things and how
(03:40):
the quality of my life, thethings I was used to, the things
that my kids were used to, youknow what activities that I
could afford to put them in,thinking about how all of that
would change was really scaryfor me.
So I used to make budgets toreally see what could I actually
afford and the gap between youknow where I wanted to be and
where I was.
I tried to plan about how Icould close that gap right, like
(04:00):
how could I increase my income,how could I decrease my
expenses.
I realized that, at least inthe short term, many things also
would have to change.
Like for me, I probably wouldhave ended up moving in with my
mom, at least temporarily, whileI got back on my feet and
sorted everything, and so for mebeing able to look, even though
things were tight and I wouldhave had to make changes that
maybe I didn't necessarily wantto make, like I wouldn't
(04:22):
necessarily want to take my kidsout of certain activities or
move their school district orthings like that.
But it helped me to really seein these black and white numbers
that it was possible.
And even if in the short term Ihad to make changes, in the
longer term I could get myselfback on my feet, figure out a
way to work with those finances.
And I had conversations with mymom about hey, can I live here
(04:44):
right?
About how she and her husbandfelt about the possibility of me
and my son moving in, and so itwas helpful for me because,
even though I wouldn't say myfinancial plan was ideal and
what I absolutely wanted, itreally gave me a lot of ease to
know that it was possible.
And, as I said, I've always hada job, so I already had an
income stream, and not everybodyis in that position, and so
there can be some greatfinancial barriers, but there's
(05:06):
also things that can be figuredout in time and there's long and
short term plans, and that'sthe point of this exercise is to
really think about that.
So I mentioned some things abouthow my financial constraints
would have potentially impactedmy kids, and the actual effect
on my children was also a reallybig concern for me.
Like maybe I would choose toget separated, but I really
(05:27):
can't because I don't want tohave a negative impact on my
children.
This is also a pretty commonconcern.
Now, the truth is that whetheryou stay in a relationship in
which you and your partner areunhappy, or if you choose to end
a relationship in which you andyour partner are unhappy,
either choice will have animpact on your child or children
, and some of the impact will bepositive, some of the impact
(05:49):
will be neutral and some of theimpact will be negative, and so
I really had to talk myselfthrough that that I didn't have
a crystal ball.
I had no way of knowing whichdecision would have less
negative impact on my children,and so what I really focused on
was being able to support themin whatever current decision I
(06:09):
was making, and when my husbandand I were separated, I had to
support my son through thatprocess.
He was just about three yearsold at that time and in all the
rest of the time that we've beentogether but it's tension or
difficulty or whatever has beenhappening.
I tried to just support my son,and again now my daughter as
well, in helping them have anage appropriate understanding of
what's going on.
So I would talk to them abouttheir feelings, I would ask them
(06:32):
questions, and this is reallyimportant because, just like
adults, if children don't knowwhat's going on, they will make
up a story about what'shappening and the story can be
scarier or even moredisempowering than the reality.
And so being able to share withkids again age appropriate
about your relationship withyour partner, whether it's their
biological parent or not, isreally important and the lines
(06:53):
can be hard sometimes to figureout.
But if you have a partner or ifyou yourself are dealing with
depression, there's reallyimportant and healthy ways to
talk about what that means to akid and sometimes for myself.
If I was feeling on edge and Iknew I was really irritable and
if my mental health was in sortof a tough place, I would be
forthcoming with my kids and Itell them hey, you know, mommy
has on her cranky pants todayand it has nothing to do with
(07:16):
you.
I'm a little bit on edge.
I might sound frustrated, butI'm not really frustrated at you
and I just want you to knowthat and I'm taking care of
myself, I'm doing what I need todo to take care of me and I
will feel better soon.
But I just want you to know,because they need to understand,
or because you're mad at themthat you're just kind of having
(07:36):
a bad day.
And many years ago, when Benwould not partake in family
activities or he would spend theday in bed, I would tell my son
you know, oh, daddy's justhaving a tough time, he's taking
care of himself.
We can send him love and he'sworking on doing what he needs
to do to feel better.
Because it's very important tome to send the message that it's
not my children'sresponsibility to take care of
(07:58):
me or my husband.
But yet I want to acknowledgethat something's going on
because they notice and so beingable to have those
conversations again in an ageappropriate way and sometimes
getting some support from achild therapist or something
like that, can be very, veryhelpful.
And I also help support them inexpressing their own feelings.
Like, if I say something from aplace of frustration and it
(08:18):
lands as an ouch for one of mykids, I address that and I say I
want you to be able to tell meif something lands as a hurt for
you.
And so all of these becomeconversations and so I share it
in this way because, again, wedon't know what the future holds
and for some people it feelsvery important to them to keep a
family intact quote unquote forthe kids.
And if that's the decisionyou're making and it feels like
that's a fit for you, thenyou're entitled to make that
(08:39):
decision.
But maybe you're living in astressful environment, whether
it's argumentative ordisconnected, stressful if one
parent is in bed or if the waythat their depression shows up
is that they're just likechecked out and at work
constantly.
You know those sorts of thingsdo need to be addressed with
children, and being able to givea child enough information so
that they can be validated intheir experience Like hey, it
(09:05):
makes sense that this is hardfor you is really quite
important, and I would say thatthat was the focus that I came
back to time and time again.
I have to support my child inthe decision that I'm making
because you know it's a littleunfair, but the truth is that
parents' decisions do, in fact,have a pretty direct impact on
kids and it can feel reallypowerless to not be involved in
the decision-making process, butit's not really appropriate for
kids to be making decisionsabout the future of your
relationship Again, whether yourpartner is their biological
(09:26):
parent or not.
So I think that realizing whatyou can do to support your kids
is more helpful than worryingabout what decision will have
more or less negative impact onyour kids, because the truth is,
most situations you probablywon't know and there might be
things that you think will havea terrible impact on your kid,
that if you ended up gettingdivorced actually wouldn't have
(09:47):
such a negative impact at all,and then there might be things
that you thought that they wouldbe totally fine with that end
up being really troublesome andhaving a negative impact.
So supporting your child andgetting your child support
externally again with a childtherapist or something like that
is really helpful.
Also, with the idea of children,but in a very different way,
many years ago, before weactually had gotten separated, I
(10:09):
really had the idea wow, thingsare really tough and I don't
know what's going to happen withthe future of our relationship,
but I really want to have asecond kid.
We only had our son at thattime and it feels a little
embarrassing and there's even abit of shame, I think, although
I've really processed throughthis a lot on my own and with my
husband.
But I really had an idea.
(10:30):
It was sort of like this fairytale, right like I meet my
husband and we fell in love andwe both wanted two kids and we
had our son after we got marriedand then I wanted to have a
second child and I felt like ifwe got divorced it would really
pop my fantasy bubble.
There was a lot of grief for mein the thought of losing this
future family that I hadenvisioned having, and so we did
(10:52):
try to get pregnant before wegot separated and ended up
getting separated after a yearof trying.
But it ended up being a reallywonderful thing for me because
it gave me this experience of,hey, I might have to face this
grief that maybe the future thatI envision for myself and for
my family might not look thesame the way that I had thought.
And I also had to really askmyself do I want to stay in this
(11:15):
relationship because I want tohold on to this vision that I
have for this future that Iwanted to create, or am I
staying in this relationshipbecause I actually want to be
with my husband?
That was a really hard thingfor me, but I really did a lot
of very deep work at that timeand I did realize that I truly
wanted to be with my husband andI actively worked through our
(11:35):
separation to start us going tocouples therapy, which took a
few months, but my husband dideventually agree.
I also worked really hard to getus to go to getting the Love
you Want couples workshop, whichI was aware of existed before
we got separated, but for somereason I just didn't think to go
, or it didn't seem like theurgency around going, or the
financial investment or gettingchildcare for the whole weekend
(11:55):
or whatever didn't seemaccessible.
Until it was like you're indire straits and we either did
something about our relationshipor we were going to get
divorced because we were alreadyseparated.
And so when we got backtogether, my husband
understandably was concernedbecause he knew how much I
wanted a second child and he hadevery right to ask and did ask
are we only getting backtogether so we can have a second
kid?
And again, at that point myanswer was absolutely.
(12:16):
I understand your concern hereand I'm with you because I want
to be with you, and it took awhile to do enough repair for us
to be able to try again, and wedid, and eventually we did have
our daughter.
Our kids are seven and a halfyears apart, actually because of
all of this relationshipturmoil, but me holding on to
this dream before we gotseparated definitely was an
(12:36):
obstacle for a long time, untilthe relationship was so painful
and then it was like all right,well, listen, I have to give up
this dream because I can't stayin a relationship that feels
like this.
And for us, the separation gaveus the space that we needed,
the breathing room that weneeded to be able to figure
things out and move forward in adifferent way, and I am forever
grateful for us that we hadthat experience.
(12:58):
Of course, separating doesn'tguarantee that experience for
everyone by any means, but forthis piece, my point really is
is that getting separated gaveme the mirror that I needed to
say, hey, look at this, youmight have to give up your dream
.
And if you have to give up yourdream, you'll dream up another
dream.
You know, like whatever thatwas, whether I would get married
, whether I would have arelationship with someone else,
(13:19):
or have a kid in the future withsomebody else, or if I would
have chosen to have a child onmy own, which was something that
I also considered back then.
But it was really important forme to grieve a little bit and
say, okay, maybe I have to letthis go.
And now let me make a cleardecision about my relationship,
not one that's clouded by thispull to have this life that I
(13:39):
thought that I wanted to have.
Another common obstacle forpeople considering if they want
to leave a relationship or notis the idea of how much time
they've already invested in therelationship.
So it's kind of like well,things aren't great, the
relationship's been hard for awhile, but we've been together
for so long Like, is it reallyworth it?
And for me, I absolutely feltthat way, and even pretty early
(14:00):
on.
I think back as a matter offact.
I clearly remember the veryfirst time that I really was
considering breaking up, a fewmonths before our one year
dating anniversary, and I knowthis very clearly because we had
a trip planned to Montreal forour anniversary and I had a lot
of internal conversations about,by the time we get back from
Montreal, if we haven't sortedout some of these things, I
(14:21):
think I'm going to break up withhim.
We went to Montreal.
Some of the vacation wasamazing, some of it was
extremely challenging and I cameback and I was like gosh, I've
already spent a year with thisguy.
You know, some of it's good, alot of it's hard.
Oh, do I really want to throwin the towel after a year, which
, of course, is kind ofhilarious to me now I'm not
discrediting anyone who may alsofeel that way after being
(14:42):
together a year, but now thatwe've been together for 20 years
, I'm like, oh my gosh.
But I think that there were alot of factors at that time, so
many factors that I won't namenow, but I've touched on already
in the podcast and otherepisodes and we'll absolutely
talk about more in futureepisodes.
But there were certainly a lotof things that kept me in the
relationship after that,including the fact that I really
do see my husband to be awonderful partner for me in so
(15:02):
many ways.
Even if we weren't experiencingthat really connected wonderful
relationship a lot of the time,I knew it was there and I've
mentioned before that can bechallenging if you have this
little tiny, itsy bitsy.
Part of a relationship thatfeels nice and a lot of it is
absolutely awful.
Certainly if there's abuse, ifthere's domestic violence, this
changes the conversation.
So I just want to be very clearthat was not my situation.
(15:22):
So for other types ofrelationships where conflicts
get physical or violent, someonemight really need to make a
very different decision forthemselves, not just like oh
well, sometimes we're soconnected and so in love, but
again, more on that another time.
I just wanted to point that out.
But certainly, as time went on,and definitely after we got
married, I kind of did this likecost benefit analysis, like
what's the cost of leaving,what's the benefit of leaving,
(15:45):
what's the cost of staying andwhat's the benefit of staying
after this amount of time andhow much time did I put in and
what was I going to lose.
And it was this whole likething that I went through
several times, I would say, overthe course of our relationship.
And I do completely understandthat feeling of I've wasted time
.
If I end a relationship, I'vewasted all this effort and I
think any time in relationshipis an opportunity for growth and
(16:08):
so, even if things don't workout the way you had hoped,
you're still taking a lot oflearning from that relationship
and if you can think about yourrelationship in that way, when
you're in the middle of a lot ofpain and hurt, it might not be
accessible to you in that moment, but eventually in time it's
really a grief process.
When you lose somebody and inthis case, when you lose a
(16:29):
relationship, you can move intoa place where you come to
understand the lessons that youtook and how you grew and maybe
clarity on things that youdidn't want, the things that
weren't okay for you inrelationship, and you take that
into a new relationship or intoyour future and you have a more
clear understanding of what youdo want and you have more
ability to create that.
(16:50):
Even though it can certainlyfeel like wasted time and it
certainly can be a griefexperience time is not wasted.
When you choose to end arelationship.
It's sort of the death of onepart of your life.
It's also the birth of the nextpart of your life and my
perspective would be if you'reputting time into yourself, then
that's time well spent,whatever decision you make.
(17:11):
Another common fear I don't knowif I want to be in the dating
world again or even the fear ofI'm scared to be alone or I
might be alone forever.
This is better than that.
There's likely some unconsciousstuff mixed up in there, which
is the next question that I'llgo into.
But I think people have toreally get into a regulated a
place as they can, which is veryhard when they're asking some
of these potentiallylife-changing questions, but
(17:33):
coming to a place of saying like, well, do I really want and
does it make sense to stay inthis relationship?
Because I really don't want tobe dating or because I'm scared
to be alone forever?
Is this relationship better?
Do I get more from staying inthis relationship?
Does it make more sense for meto stay in this relationship to
avoid all that fear?
And the truth is that eachperson truly needs to make that
decision for themselves.
And if you choose like, hey,you know what I want, to stay in
(17:53):
this relationship because allthat stuff is too scary, if that
feels like an authenticallyaligned decision for you, then
that's the decision for you.
And if you're like, hey, youknow what I really need to end
this relationship even thoughit's scary, then that's your
aligned, authentic decision.
This isn't about right or wrong.
It's really about what trulymakes sense to you and the last
piece that I will address, whichcan be present in any
(18:13):
relationship, but I think,especially if your partner has
struggled with depression, thisis a very common thing that can
keep people in relationship andcertainly has been on my mind in
the past which is, sometimespeople can really have a fear
that if they end a relationship,that their partner might harm
themselves in some way,including even killing
themselves, and they're not onlyafraid that that will happen,
(18:34):
but if something horrific likethat does in fact happen, they
don't want to live with theguilt, and this is an absolute,
horrible position to be in.
It's the choice between do Istay in a relationship and
continue to sacrifice my needs,potentially in a way to
hopefully keep my partner alive,or do I end a relationship and
(18:54):
potentially live with this guiltfeeling if my then ex-partner
decides to die by suicide ormake a suicide attempt or
self-harm in some way, and thisis just an impossible decision,
and this may sound harsh and Iapologize in advance if it does,
but the truth is is that nobodyis responsible for anybody
else's life.
No adult is responsible for anyother adult's life, and I'm not
(19:18):
saying that if you were in thissituation and you chose to
leave the relationship and yourex partner did self-harm or did
attempt suicide or did die bysuicide, that it wouldn't have a
deep emotional impact on you.
Of course, that's anunimaginable situation.
I have not been in thatsituation where I have ended a
relationship and my partner hasattempted suicide or died by
suicide.
(19:38):
I have been in relationshipswhere I left and my partner has
threatened suicide, not with myhusband, but I did have
relationships in my teenage lifewhere that happened and it was
horrible and, having had thatexperience, I can say what my
perspective was.
Then I actually told my ex Ireally really hope that you
don't do something so horribleand drastic and I hope that you
(19:58):
get the support that you need tobe able to get through this and
be okay.
I can't come back into arelationship that feels so bad
to keep you alive.
I can't do that and at thattime if my ex had taken action
which he did not I don't knowwhat would have happened.
But I share this to say thatit's a horrible decision, but
taking care of yourself is thething you have the most power
(20:18):
over, and sacrificing yourselffor somebody else will not
create the environment where youcan really improve your
relationship because you'resacrificing yourself to try to
meet someone else's needs, andit probably doesn't even quite
work that way anyhow.
So this is a very, very hardposition to be in, but I think
it's important to recognize itand certainly this is something
that if you need to get support,then I absolutely recommend
(20:42):
that you do so.
So I talked a lot about questionone today.
I think questions two throughseven I can cover in the next
episode altogether, but I thinkthat there's a lot of obstacles
that felt like they were in theway for me over many years and I
think that a lot of people sortof stop even trying to make the
decision whether they shouldend a relationship or not
because of these factors.
So I wanted to cover the thingsthat really have been on my
(21:04):
mind over the years.
I hope that this was helpfulfor you.
I will cover more questionshopefully all six remaining
questions in the next episode.
As our time comes to a close, Iask you to keep listening for
just a few more moments, becauseI want to thank you for showing
up today and I want to leaveyou with an invitation as you
hit stop and move back out intothe world on your own unique
(21:26):
wellness journey In order tomove from where you are today to
the place where you want to be.
The path may seem long orunclear or unknown, and I want
you to know that if that seemsscary or daunting or downright
terrifying or anything else,that is totally okay.
Know that you do not have tocreate the whole way all at once
(21:49):
.
We don't travel a whole journeyin one stride, and that is why
my invitation to you today is totake a step, just one, any type
, any size, in any direction.
It can be an external step thatcan be observed or measured, or
it could be a step youvisualize, taking in your mind.
It can be a step towards action, or towards rest or connection
(22:12):
or self-care, or whatever stepmakes sense to you.
I invite you to take a steptoday because getting to a place
that feels better, more joyful,more connected than the place
where you are today is possiblefor everyone, including you, and
even when depression is in yourbed.
If today's episode resonatedwith you, please subscribe so
(22:34):
you can be notified when eachweekly episode gets released.
I encourage you to leave areview and reach out to me on
social media at trishsanderslcsw.
Your feedback will help guidefuture episodes and I love
hearing from you.
Also, please share this podcastwith anyone who you think may
be interested or who may getsomething from what I have
(22:55):
shared.
Until the next time we connect,take care of yourself and take
a step.
Popular Podcasts
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com