June 9, 2024 • 50 mins
Embark on an enchanting journey through the heart of North Africa as Lamya Alaoui guides us through the colorful tapestry that is Morocco. With her insider's perspective, Lamya brings us tales from the crossroads of African, European, and Eastern traditions that define the nation's captivating architecture and delectable cuisine. From the romance of Casablanca to the serenity of the Blue City, we discover the harmonious blend of the old and the new that pulses through the streets of Morocco.
Venture with us through bustling marketplaces and tranquil landscapes as we lay out an essential itinerary for any traveler yearning for the Moroccan allure. We'll venture past the economic heartbeat in Casablanca and dive into the historic grandeur of Rabat, Fez, and Meknes, punctuating our travels with the stories of Morocco's dual judicial system and the influential Jewish community.
To wrap up, we feast on the culinary masterpieces Morocco has to offer, from tagines to honey-laden bread, while mixing in invaluable travel tips that will have you navigating the country like a seasoned local. Whether you're curious about navigating transportation, keen to experience traditional music and dance, or eager to catch waves at renowned surf spots, this episode serves as a treasure map to the countless wonders hidden within this North African gem. Join our conversation for cultural insights and practical advice that will elevate your Moroccan adventure from a simple getaway to a journey of a lifetime.
Map of Morocco
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:15):
Hi, welcome to our podcast.
We're Next Travel with Kristenand Carol.
I am Kristen and I am Carol,and we're two long-term friends
with a passion for travel andadventure.
Each episode, we interviewpeople around the globe to help
us decide where to go next.
Today, we are learning aboutMorocco, in Northern Africa,
(00:35):
from Lamia, who is from Moroccoand now living in California.
Lamia gives us insights at thevarious areas of her home
country that you may have heardof, including Casablanca,
marrakesh, the Blue City, plussome hidden gems.
It is a very inviting country.
If you have a country thatyou'd like to learn more about
(00:56):
or like to be a guest on ourpodcast, please DM us on
Instagram at where next podcast.
Enjoy.
Thanks, lamia, for joining ustoday, and we understand you're
going to talk to us aboutMorocco.
Thank you so much for joiningYay.
Speaker 2 (01:10):
Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
And I guess I'll start from so how do you
pronounce your last name?
Speaker 2 (01:17):
The French way or the Arabic way, whichever both.
So in Arabic it's Lalaoui andin French or English it would be
Alaoui.
Speaker 1 (01:27):
So you were born and raised in Morocco, correct?
Speaker 2 (01:32):
I was born and raised in Rabat yes, in the capital.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
And tell us all about growing up.
And I know you came here.
How many years again growing up.
And I know you came here.
How many years again, 11.
11 years Okay, that was notlong ago.
And then do you go back andforth too, to see family back
there?
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Yes, I fly at least once a year to go see my dad and
my friends.
I'm an only child and everyyear I take one of my daughters
with me, so it's our annualinternational trip.
I have three daughters, soevery year it's one of them
going.
This year it was quitedifferent, because I went twice,
and then your husband's fromthere as well.
(02:14):
My husband is French.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
Oh, he's French.
Okay, got it.
Okay, excellent, you just likethe romantic allure of just the
word Morocco.
I haven't even looked furtherinto you know just some of that,
right, and where does that comefrom?
And you know, I don't know ifit's a Hollywood thing, but it,
you know, and I'm just glancingat the pictures and the Sahara
Desert and just the architecture, it's just, it's beautiful
landscape and everything what.
Speaker 2 (02:45):
I guess I'll kind of start with that and let you open
so I think the the meaning inarabic some morocco, in arabic
is called al maghrib and becauseit's where the sun sets and
it's at the the end of um, youknow, of the peninsula, or yeah,
the whole, like the southern or, I'm sorry, the the most
(03:07):
northern tip of africa like that, but it's all the way to, to
the west.
when you're looking at it, youknow, from arabic speaking
countries perspective.
And, yeah, the country has beenaround for quite some long time
.
Actually, you still have thisplace near Fest, or you still
(03:28):
have Roman ruins from God knowshow many thousands of years, but
in a really great shape.
So you have the mosaics.
Everyone stopped by, we had thevandals, the Romans, the
Ottoman Empire didn't make itthere for some reason, but the
architecture is a result of allthese influences.
(03:49):
We're really at the intersectionof a lot of places.
We are at the intersection ofAfrica, europe and the East, and
we had a lot of routes manycenturies ago for commerce, so
everyone had to go through a lotof routes, you know, many
centuries ago for commerce.
So everyone had to go through alot of influences, including,
(04:10):
you know, a lot of Moroccanspices are actually Indian
spices, for example, that we usein our cuisine.
So it's a melting pot at theintersection of a lot of
cultures, including theMediterranean one.
The joke is like we're a littlebit of everything, just because
of where the country is.
Speaker 1 (04:29):
in itself, Well, it's almost like at the mouth of a
whole peninsula or an inlet, abody of water that spans many
countries.
So it's like right below, it'slike you and Spain right, and
I'm assuming then there must be.
I don't think things areconnected.
It looks like it from far away.
(04:50):
So the waterway that's theStrait of Gibraltar, yes, who
manages it?
Who governs?
Speaker 2 (04:58):
that that's a very loaded question.
It is for the longest time.
Speaker 1 (05:03):
Depends who you're asking, huh.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
Because Tangier had the status of international city
.
So if you look at the historyof Morocco in the early 1900s,
the country was split betweenthe French and the Spanish.
It was not occupied, but it wasplaced under protection.
(05:26):
So it was not fully occupied,but they still have a lot of
power.
I will spare you the details ofhistory.
Where they even tried to, theyexiled the actual king, placed
somebody else, from the samedynasty still, but not from the
(05:47):
family that has been ruling forquite some time, because you
know, the dynasty has manybranches.
But they did this whole thing.
And now you just take the ferryfrom tanger, which is moroccan,
uh, but you would have to havea visa to get, um, so when you
get to lgs us, it's 30 minutesby ferry from morocco to spain,
(06:07):
by the way well, I was going tosay it looks really close.
Speaker 1 (06:10):
And what's so interesting is you said the
spanish influence, but that thefrench influence and france is
above spain.
So it's like morocco, spain andthen france and it's, you know,
all of spain.
But it sounds like there's alot like where was france trying
to take it over or something ora lot of influence of, and
maybe they were just goingthrough through Morocco.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
They, they divided the country.
So when you go now you can seethe results of that step.
So from Tangier there is acoffee called Le Haffa, which is
literally means the edge.
So when you're having yourcoffee or your tea there, you
can see Spain.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
Oh wow, that's neat.
Speaker 2 (06:49):
It's really close and I have a former colleague of
mine who actually crossed theDetroit Swimming oh, I wonder,
how long did it take?
Oh, that I don't remember.
It was many years ago.
Speaker 1 (07:05):
I could see Kristen doing that.
No, that, no, no, no.
I was just curious, like howmany miles is it?
Did you?
Do you know how many miles itis?
No but I think that big deal 10or something.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
It's really not not that close but not far from
ferry no, yeah, not, not quite.
Speaker 1 (07:24):
What's this dotted line in throughout that splits
Morocco?
And it says it says LawinSaqiyah al-Hamra.
Speaker 2 (07:35):
Yeah, so Saqiyah al-Hamra is the dotted line.
It's the national cause,because there was a separatist
group that wants the Sahara tobe independent and for many
centuries it has been Moroccan.
When you look at the old maps,even Mauritania at some point
(07:58):
was Moroccan.
Of course, you know, with thedynasties changing and the world
evolving, the mapping or thezoning changed out a little bit.
But yeah, there have been a lotof talks about referendums.
It has been discussed in the UNfor a very long time.
(08:18):
There is a separatist groupthat they want to have a
republic.
Morocco is a monarchy and it'sa longstanding issue.
Yeah, and that's why, anddepending on the countries, you
will either find the map withthe dotted line or without.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
Oh, interesting.
So I have not heard of.
Let's see, what was thatcountry?
Mauritania I'm not familiarwith that country and it's
pretty big, and so you saidMorocco was all of that.
Atitania I'm not familiar withthat country and it's pretty big
, and so you said Morocco wasall of that at one point.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
Yes, not the current zoning that we have, but it was.
I mean I can try to find someIf I was in Morocco.
We have few in our homes of theold maps.
There was a lot of movement inthat region, especially when the
Ottoman Empire was coming inand out, Because, for example,
(09:13):
algeria, if you look in Tunisiaand Libya, it might have been
smaller or bigger depending onthe time.
It's the desert, it's not likeyou can have, it's the Sahara.
You can have a strict, you knowum frontier between countries,
dunes of sand, like how are yougonna divide it properly?
(09:34):
So things are always in motionfor for a little while.
Um, I mean that the joke evenis, on the east of Morocco there
is this city.
It's so close to the Algerianborder that you don't really
know, or you haven't known foryears, until there was military
presence, and now you can seethe clear line between both
(09:58):
countries.
But, for many, many years, therewas nothing.
So, are you in Algeria, are?
Are you in Morocco?
You don't know.
Now there is heavy militarypresence on, presence on both
sides, and and therefore it's acomplicated region.
Speaker 1 (10:14):
That's all I have to say, wow, that's so interesting
and that's and I was justlooking at the Sahara desert
because I didn't know.
But if I guess it, becauseAfrica yeah.
North Africa goes across thewhole thing, right, and then
it's it's also the tail end, Iguess.
It goes across the whole thing,right, and then it's also the
tail end, I guess would bethrough Morocco.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
So because if you look at the other countries,
they're wider and they're closerto the Mediterranean side,
including Libya, where Moroccois we're really like on the edge
of it, so the country goes alittle bit farther.
But also, since we're theclosest and I will get a little
(10:54):
bit like into the politics rightnow we are the gate to both
Europe and Africa, and so a lotof people from you know Europe
and Africa and so a lot ofpeople from you know Central
West African countries who aretrying to immigrate will stop by
Morocco and even the restplanes-wise, like people that
(11:17):
live in France or in Netherlands, germany, and they're flying to
West and Central Africancountries.
They will have their layover inMorocco.
So we're kind of this routejust because of how close we are
.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
You have beaches, deserts and from the topography
it seems like mountains.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
We have one of the highest peaks in Africa.
How high is the highest inAfrica?
So I think it's the Kilimanjaro.
Okay, we're right behind.
The Tupka is the second highestpeak and we have eternal snows.
Believe it or not, it does snowin Morocco and people go to ski
(12:08):
there.
Speaker 1 (12:09):
Wow, that's surprising.
Yeah, I think of it like likesouthern spain, very tropical.
Yeah, it says mount tubcal, yes, and it's 13 665, so 13 165
feet, that's pretty tall so, butI think that's the beauty of
morocco.
Speaker 2 (12:28):
Like you have everything that you need in one
country.
You want in the mountains, gofor hikes or go ski, and you can
do that.
Uh, you want to explore thedesert.
You have two types of desert.
Speaker 1 (12:40):
You have the one which is like more rocky, and
the one with, you know, dunes ofsand everywhere uh you have
both the ocean and the sea,because we have the
mediterranean sea but also theatlantic ocean okay, and so I'm
seeing on the the pictures, alot of like buildings like
(13:01):
sandstone or red rock buildingslike built into mountains.
What town is that?
Is that marrakesh, or is that asmall town or?
Speaker 2 (13:10):
that's a little bit outside of marrakesh, so you're
the ones that are um, you knowwith with the reddish, with the
terracotta color.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
That's a little bit outside of Marrakesh, on your
way farther south Very pretty.
It's gorgeous, but this is thebeauty of it you have the ones
in the mountains where often youcan also see them.
You know, because they makerocks, where often you can also
see them.
You know because they makerocks.
So when you're driving by inthe mountains to get whatever
(13:40):
you want to get, there's thissmall town that I love going to.
It's called Imlil.
It's in the mountains, but toget there you have to drive and
you can see all the rocks being,you know, displayed because
they're making them dry.
It's just like Is it clay?
It is I don't know the word inin in English, but it's like, um
(14:04):
, almost like I think it'smortar.
Okay.
Speaker 1 (14:10):
Yeah, yeah.
And what was the town in the inthe mountains that you like?
But how do you spell that?
Speaker 2 (14:15):
Uh, I M, l, I L.
So you drive in the mountainsthat you like, but how do you
spell that I-M-L-I-L?
So you drive through that andthen you get to this town where
you have waterfalls.
I mean, you have to hike to getto it and it's very green and
you know it's really beautiful.
But you're going through placeswhere you think there's no
(14:36):
water and then you just hike foranother hour and you have
waterfalls that are gorgeous.
You can also decide to gofarther south to this ancient
fort called Qisbet Eid al-BinHiddur.
I wouldn't recommend doing whatI've done not so long ago, which
(14:56):
is going there during the monthof July, while I came there
because it was insanely warm.
Again, the riverbed is dry, butduring spring it's all green
everywhere, and then you havethe fort.
You know that is red.
You know that is red and you'renot expecting that.
(15:21):
Uh, I mean that whole region isjust beyond beautiful.
Because it's rough, uh, theelements like during winter.
You really don't want to bethere.
Uh, it's really cold.
Kids cannot go to school whenit's snowing, but during summer
it's really nice.
The people who live there arejust beyond generous and
hospitable.
They don't have much, but theystill take care of whomever is
(15:46):
visiting.
The kids are helping theirparents.
You can see a way of life thatalmost doesn't exist anywhere,
and for me, I was born andraised in the country but it has
something magical because italmost feels like the time
stopped and you're and you'restepping back and it's yes, for
(16:11):
me it's magical.
I know I have a lot of myfriends, moroccan, say what
would you like?
What would you rather go thereinstead of going other places?
I say I don't know.
It's just beautiful.
You have a lot of forts thathave been abandoned but still in
great shape.
You can just wander around andyou can look at those beautiful
(16:35):
ceilings.
The craftsmanship is insane.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
nobody lives there anymore, but it's still standing
oh really, and we're stilltalking about Imlil right oh,
it's the whole.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
Imlil is one of the most known villages oh, with the
whole area there of the wholearea and it's, I think, three
hours ish from Marrakesh okay,got it.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
That's so neat yeah so if someone's gonna go to like
say you had, like, you knowyou're in europe, you want to go
to morocco for a week or twoweeks, is it like?
A month or two, like a couple,like slow travel.
I would say, yeah, right, whereis where like must go to?
Speaker 2 (17:17):
Where to go.
That's a great question.
I have some friends that comewith me almost every year.
I told them, if you really wantto know the country in and out,
we can go for the next 20 yearsevery year.
Speaker 1 (17:32):
What would be the top places to visit for beaches,
for things to do at the desert?
Speaker 2 (17:40):
So I think two weeks is a pretty decent amount of
time.
Casablanca you know, thanks tothe movie, everyone romantizes
Casablanca.
Yep, I lived in Casablanca,it's.
I mean, there are a couple ofthings that, yes, you want to
see over there, but what Ialways recommend is you land
(18:01):
there, you spend one night.
Speaker 1 (18:05):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (18:05):
And you can like spend the day over there.
You have amazing food scene.
Think about Casablanca as NewYork, it's the largest city in
Morocco.
Oh, it is York, it's thelargest city in Morocco.
Speaker 1 (18:19):
Oh, it is.
Speaker 2 (18:20):
It's the financial center, it's the economic center
.
Speaker 1 (18:24):
Okay, gotcha, it looks like they have a quaint
tower similar to what made methink of it.
It looks like a church tower orsomething.
Speaker 2 (18:32):
Yes, that would be the cathedral.
It's a cathedral that we haveover there.
There are a few of them, butthat's Sacred Heart and it's the
oldest one that we have.
It's a beautiful piece ofarchitecture, that's for sure.
And then you can have threedifferent directions in which
(18:56):
you can go.
So you can go up northCasablanca is right in the
middle, on the coast so you candecide to go up north and
therefore what you're going todo is you're going to stop by
the capital, rabat.
You know it's my hometown.
We do have beautiful monumentsfrom, you know, including old
(19:17):
Portuguese forts, like right onthe delta between one of the
Moroccan main rivers and theAtlantic Ocean.
You can again and I'm notkidding, we love things on the
edge or at the intersection, butyou can have your tea, like
(19:38):
sitting right above the deltaand you can see it.
You can see another small townfrom across the river.
From there.
We have two other imperialcities close by, which are Fess
and McNeice.
What a lot of people don't knowis Fess has the first
university that was built ever,and it was built by a woman.
Wow, that was built ever and itwas built by a woman Wow.
(19:58):
I think in the 1100s, and itnever stopped operating so
universities as we know now.
It stinks to her.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
Wow, that's so cool.
You said Fez, f-e-z.
Yeah, I see it right there,okay.
Speaker 2 (20:12):
So, fez, yeah, it's the oldest university in the
world 1100s, you said it was wasbuilt.
I think it was 1100.
Wow, 80, yeah, and it was builtand founded by a woman wow, and
it's still going to this day.
Speaker 1 (20:26):
Oh yeah, that's incredible.
Speaker 2 (20:28):
I'm actually looking at it okay, I can try to find
the name for that.
So fez is one of the imperialcities and it had you many, many
dynasties throughout Moroccanhistory.
It was their capital throughoutMoroccan history, for centuries
and centuries.
It also has one of the oldestsynagogues in North Africa.
(20:50):
But, morocco, we have twojudicial systems, because we
used to have an extremely largeJewish community.
So we have the secular court,which is mostly inspired by
(21:11):
French law, or clause enoughanyway, with a mix of, you know,
muslim law when it comes toinheritance and other things,
and then there is the hebraiclaw as well.
So for marriages, divorces andall that.
So there are two differentsystems that have been existing
in the country for god knows howlong.
(21:34):
Um, so a rabbit outside the fest, or between fez and mcness,
which is the other imperial city, you have volubilis, which is
totally worth going to because alot of people don't realize
that romans were reallyeverywhere, and it's one of the
rare places outside of italywhere you can still see what
(21:58):
they built.
How do you spell it?
What's the city?
Volubilis, v-o-l-u-b-i-l-i-s.
Speaker 1 (22:08):
Okay, I was like Volubilis, not quite, but
Volubilis, oh.
Oh.
No, there it is, yep.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
I'm sorry, yep I was just looking at.
Speaker 1 (22:19):
Did you have it?
Oh yeah, I did.
Oh wow, it's a partly excavatedBerber Roman city in Morocco,
in the city of Meknes,M-E-K-N-E-S.
Speaker 2 (22:34):
Yes, that's the other imperial city.
There are three imperial citiesin Morocco Fes and Meknes,
close to each other, and thenMarrakech.
Marrakech is that.
So we're going to continue onour north itinerary where, once
you're there, you can go to theBlue City, which is right in the
middle of you know themountains, but close enough to
(22:56):
the water still of the mountains, but close enough to the water
still, and from there you cankeep going north and do the
Mediterranean side, which haveTangier, guadalajara, cosima,
and when you get to there it'slike you're not in Morocco
anymore.
You were talking, carol, about,oh, you think about Spain.
(23:18):
So when you're in Josima, inPuerto Banos, you're almost like
feeling you're in the same spot, even though two different
countries, but you have to getthrough the mountains to get
there, which makes it reallybeautiful, like a trip or road
trip.
So that's one direction.
The other direction you can gois like you're going to go south
(23:42):
, but not too much, because,like, if you want to go to, for
example, rizani or, you know,le'yun, you would have to fly
from Casablanca it's not a longflight but it's still a decent
one and you would have to take acar to get to Merzouga, where
you have a lot of desert camps.
(24:03):
But you can do the other side,which is do Casablanca,
marrakech by car.
It's about two hours and a half.
Marrakech becomes the home baseand then you can visit all
these cities and the mountains.
You can go to Imlil, you can goto Tluwet, you can go to the
(24:26):
lake.
So, not very far from this lake, which is right in the middle
of the mountains, is whereBranson decided to build his own
casbah that he made into ahotel, because, again, the
nature is just the scenery.
I don't even know how todescribe it.
Speaker 1 (24:40):
Did you say Richard Branson?
You said Branson, yes, oh mygosh, and then what city is it?
Speaker 2 (24:47):
So it's not a city, it's in the mountains, but it's
called Kasbah, so K-A-S-B-A-H.
And then Tamadot, that's thehotel that he built, but he
respected the actualarchitecture of Moroccan
villages.
It's T as in Tom A M as in momA D as in Daniel O and T as in
(25:11):
Tom.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
I looked it up.
It looks like a palace.
No, it's beautiful.
And then you said that there'ssome lakes as well.
Paints their buildings.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
I mean there's mostly blue, it's it's beautiful yes,
it's the same way as marrakechis all red, casablanca all white
.
Even though that was is notrespected anymore.
Even in Arabic, it means likethe White House oh okay,
(25:40):
Casablanca.
Many years ago it was all white.
Speaker 1 (25:43):
You've got red, blue and white.
Speaker 2 (25:46):
The Blue City has a name.
It's called Shefshawan, buteveryone refers to it as the
Blue City because Shefshawan, Ithink for non-native speakers
might be a tiny bit.
Speaker 1 (25:58):
Oh is it like chef?
Yeah, it's like it says, startwith chef.
Okay, got it, chef.
Okay, got it, thank you.
And then how do you pronounceit with no F?
Speaker 2 (26:10):
it's just.
You know the emphasis is quitedifferent because there's none
in Morocco, but yeah, you can dothat portion, which usually
takes a good week to do.
And even in marrakesh itself,in the city, because it's an
imperial city you still have alot of the palaces from previous
(26:32):
dynasties.
Some are being restoredcurrently.
Um, some actually saw.
Oh oh, by the way, carol, itwas founded earlier than when I
thought.
Speaker 1 (26:41):
The university.
Oh, it's 859.
859.
Whoa, okay, and so I can't getmy head around that.
That's crazy, Wow.
Speaker 2 (26:51):
It started as a mosque but you know, mosques in
Islam are also a teaching placeand then it started evolving
because people started coming tolearn and it's still mostly
theology studies and theuniversity.
But, yeah, it never stoppedfunctioning since it was founded
.
Speaker 1 (27:11):
That's incredible country.
It's amazing how preserved itis right Of so many.
It's like stepping back intohistory with so much of it and
yet at the same time In Moroccothe previous king, hassan II.
Speaker 2 (27:28):
He was very probably great interviews at all times
there was always an emphasis inMorocco, the past is present.
There are constant reminders ofit, because if you don't know
your past, you cannot build yourfuture.
If you don't know where you'recoming from, you don't know.
(27:49):
Moroccans are very resilientpeople.
We went through a lot of things, a lot of change.
We had so many dynasties I canthink of at least five that went
through in the last maybe 1,000, 1,500 years, and change is the
(28:13):
only constant that we know inthat country.
So it hasn't been the case, youknow, for the last maybe 400
years it's the same dynasty thatis ruling.
If we kind of look past thatFrench and Spanish protector, I
think, but it was so shortbecause I think it was under 20
years.
It didn't certainly have a lotof impact, but the world change
(28:36):
popo has been, uh, you knowwe're we're very focused on
agriculture, uh, and tourism,but then the technology started
happening.
It became like also financialhelp for africa, technology help
for africa.
There is the evolution, maybenot anymore on the structure and
political side of of thecountry but, you know, on the
structural and political side ofthe country, but on the
(28:58):
economic side and the traditionsare still very important.
In Morocco the family units arevery strong in general.
It's a high-context culture.
The group always comes beforethe individual.
It's unique.
Speaker 1 (29:17):
Strong, yeah, it's unique, yeah, community and
belonging.
So I think kind of thestereotype and I just heard this
from my friend that's verywell-traveled and she's like
well, morocco, we're a littlenervous about going there
because of political unrest.
Do you feel there's anyconcerns or preparation we need
to do as Americans come in there?
Speaker 2 (29:38):
What political?
Speaker 1 (29:39):
unrest.
I don't know Anything either.
I know I was like what.
Speaker 2 (29:43):
I don't know.
I mean, we're probably one ofthe rare, you know,
arabic-speaking countries thatdidn't have an Arab Spring.
Right, arab Spring washappening.
What's that?
Speaker 1 (29:57):
I don't know what that means.
Speaker 2 (29:57):
I didn't know what that is so remember, when there
was like a whole bunch ofRevolutions in Arabic speaking
countries and they kind of theywere not happy with the current
Power structure that was inplace.
Some of them were notmonarchies, but felt like it
Because whomever was at the headof the state Was staying for
Many, many, many years.
(30:18):
So there was A lot.
Head of the state was stayingfor many, many, many years.
So there was a lot of unrest,but Morocco was probably one of
the rare ones that were nottouched by it.
But the king Mohammed VI still,you know he heard his people.
There was a whole revision ofthe constitution.
We do have an active monarchy.
(30:40):
It's not a constitutional onelike in the UK or in Spain, so
the king still has executivepower.
But there were like significantamendment made to the
constitution because, you know,the people were asking for
change and that happened.
But from a us moroccoperspective, the relationship
(31:03):
have always been good.
Uh, I think, if my memoryserves me right, one of the rare
countries that has an actual usmonument outside of us soil is
morocco, and it's in tangierokay so there are.
The countries have been veryclose and one of the things I
(31:25):
learned when I came to the us isoh, france was the first
country to recognize the us.
You know the original 13 andI'm like I'm pretty sure they
weren't, because the firstcorrespondence ever was with
Morocco and the king at the time1700s I think answered the 13
(31:48):
colonies, which means that thatwas a diplomatic exchange and a
tacit recognition of the 13original as a country or as a
state, of the 13 original as acountry or as a state.
And, yeah, we were one of thefirst allies of the U?
S and that relationship hasbeen always great.
(32:09):
I would say it's like in anyother country for women
traveling alone.
As unfortunate as it is, it'snot worse than you know Spain,
croatia.
You want to be careful, likewhen you're in the cities.
You're totally fine.
I travel a lot by myself.
I had friends that went ontheir own.
(32:30):
It's really safe.
You just need to be cautious,like anywhere else.
Yeah, okay, your drinks at abar on the day, right for sure.
Speaker 1 (32:42):
I was curious also about like moroccan food and I,
oh, I guess a quick, quick thingin terms of cost things are,
are they very expensive?
So if someone wanted to travelthere, is it more expensive,
reasonable, cheaper?
Speaker 2 (32:56):
it depends where you're going.
Okay, things are veryreasonable.
Things are inexpensive, um, andlike, I mean, we have the best
hotel in the world lemon one,yeah, which is his one as well.
That one is not.
I wouldn't qualify it asreasonable.
Yeah, totally worth it though.
Uh, though, if people canafford it, how is it spelled?
(33:17):
M-a-m-o-u-n-i-a Memonio.
Speaker 1 (33:25):
That's a nice hotel to stay at.
Speaker 2 (33:28):
Extremely nice hotel to stay at.
Speaker 1 (33:29):
Yeah, five star, at least Six star maybe.
Oh, perfect, Excellent.
And then the food.
I was so curious about the food.
Speaker 2 (33:41):
The best lamb you will probably ever have.
Morocco is known for its lamb.
I mean, everyone thinks aboutthe tagine, but we also have a
lot of fish dishes.
What's tagine?
Tagine is the traditional wayof cooking, so it's interesting
because the tagine is the actualdish that you cook in, but it's
(34:03):
also the name of the dishyou're eating, because it's
cooked in that.
Now things have evolved and youcan cook a tagine in, you know,
a pot, like I don't know, likea Dutch oven, and basically it's
a lot of veggies.
You have some savory and sweetones.
You have different variationsof it Really good.
Speaker 1 (34:26):
I just Googled it.
It kind of looks just like aregular pan with two handles.
Speaker 2 (34:32):
Yes, and it's made out of clay.
It needs to be prepped acertain way when you buy a new
one and then it has a cover thatis triangular, everything is
steamed and it's slow cooked.
So you have to be patient ifyou want to eat a tagine,
because it takes like an hour totwo.
One of my favorite one is theeasiest one to make.
(34:54):
It's with preserved lemons andolives.
It's one of the mosttraditional ones.
You can make it with chicken,you can make it with veal, you
can make it with beef, you canmake it with lamb.
You just cannot make it withfish.
And basically you just haveyour onions diced or, you know,
cut in lamellas with olive oil.
You kind of make them sweat abit, you add your meat, your
(35:17):
spices.
You kind of them sweat a bit,you add your meat, your spices.
You kind of again let it cookfor a little bit.
You add water, more onions, butthis time like sliced.
And it's the only dish whereactually I never put salt,
because the preserved lemons andthe olives will release the
salt.
And once the water startsboiling and the the meat getting
(35:38):
tender, you just like put it onslow and for the last 15
minutes this is where you'regonna add your preserved lemons
and um and olives and then cookfor another 15, 20 and then it's
ready.
But you can the base is alwaysthe same almost into jeans and
you can add veggies, carrots,sweet peas, um, artichoke
(35:59):
potatoes, string beans oh, thatsounds so good.
Speaker 1 (36:03):
It sounds very healthy too.
Do you eat healthy there?
Generally speaking, yes we dookay.
Speaker 2 (36:10):
Carbs, we love our carbs like we love so we are
getting close to our time.
Speaker 1 (36:15):
I have the rapid fire questions, but if there's some
less burning question, kristen,I was curious in terms of some
of the activities people like todo and what people do when
they're there and visiting.
Speaker 2 (36:27):
So a lot of shopping, because the fabrics are amazing
.
You have all the traditionalthings like trays made out of
copper, but it's, you know, handcarved.
The glasses, the Moroccantraditional, what is it called?
(36:49):
It's just something you can siton.
It's made out of leather.
Also a lot of spices.
Speaker 1 (36:56):
Oh, okay.
Speaker 2 (36:57):
I mean, we have spices for markets, olives too.
We have whole markets dedicatedto to olives oh wow, argan oil,
uh, cosmetic.
So argan oil in morocco, we eatit, oh, but but not the one that
is being sold for cosmeticpurposes again.
So argan tree only grows inMorocco until like a few years
(37:19):
ago, where, like some familieswho moved to Israel found a way
to do it, but it's mostly inMorocco only, and so we eat
argan oil.
You cannot cook with it, butyou can use it as a dressing for
salads or, you know as, to dipyour bread in it, mostly.
(37:39):
And then someone discoveredthat it was pretty good for your
skin, your hair and all of that, and this is where they would
start producing.
It's not pressed the same way.
It's not prepped the same way.
Speaker 1 (37:52):
And how do you spell that Argon yes, a-r-g-o-n.
No A-R-G-A-r-g-o-n yeah, noa-r-g-a-n, yeah, a-r-g-a-n, oil
can you?
Just buy that in the unitedstates oh yeah, I've seen it
everywhere like people for yourhair.
It comes in little bottles andnot the same quality though no,
yeah, I don't like to say it,but but that's where I've seen
(38:15):
it.
I haven't seen it where it's asalad dressing.
I've seen it as like a hairproduct or something at my salon
or something uh, the, theculinary one is.
Speaker 2 (38:23):
I cannot find it here , I bring it for my face, yeah
for your face.
You can.
You can find some, some goodones.
You also have, uh, somemoroccan brands that are
starting to sell on amazon, sothat one um would, would work,
uh, but you can just like.
The smell and the texture isquite different.
But again, I'm biased yeah,good bias okay.
Speaker 1 (38:46):
So that's a good thing to actually buy when you
go there a lot of, a lot ofhiking, horseback riding,
swimming.
Speaker 2 (38:53):
we do love sitting by the beach and just like
chilling also, nice, nice, yeah,that would be it.
I mean the cultural part.
When you go for the first time,there's so much to see,
especially in terms ofarchitecture, you won't have
time to do anything else.
Speaker 1 (39:09):
Okay, just like be in awe.
Sounds amazing.
And then my last question alsois desserts.
What kind of desserts are afavorite of Moroccan?
Speaker 2 (39:18):
So we eat a lot of fruits after our meals.
Speaker 1 (39:21):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (39:22):
Then we have our tea with sweets.
That would be the sequencing.
One of my favorite dessert ismade with the equivalent of
phyllo dough, and then you makethis custard with milk and
orange, blossom water and a bitof like a zested lemon oh, that
sounds amazing.
Speaker 1 (39:41):
That's my favorite one.
I know I'm looking here, waitwhat shebekia oh, shebekia that
thing is.
Speaker 2 (39:48):
So we eat it mostly during ramadan and it's
basically flour.
It's cooked but it's dipped inhoney.
Okay, I see it's fried, you dipit in honey and you have sesame
seeds on it and you eat it.
And actually it's mostly eatenduring Ramadan, like to break
fast after having dates, milkand all of that, because it has
(40:12):
a lot of calories and it helpspeople kind of recuperate faster
from their fast.
Speaker 1 (40:18):
What's the one that you did with the phyllo dough
and the orange blossom water?
Speaker 2 (40:23):
I can type it in.
It will be much easier.
Speaker 1 (40:28):
How do you pronounce it?
Just curious.
I love it.
Speaker 2 (40:34):
It sounds interesting , that's beautiful Corrector
doesn't even recognize this.
Speaker 1 (40:41):
Oh, it looks like pastila.
Ole, it's just like a coffeedrink.
Oh ole, it sounds like pastila.
Oh, that does look good.
It looks like pancakes almost.
Speaker 2 (40:53):
It looks like it, but it's so much lighter than
pancakes, yeah it does.
It's the equivalent of filodough, but it's not really than
pancakes, because it's theequivalent of phyllo dough, but
it's not really.
In Morocco we don't have phyllodough, we have this thing that
we call feu de brique.
So it's much.
Actually it's much more thinnerthan a phyllo dough yeah, it
sounds.
Speaker 1 (41:14):
It seems like a puffy baklava which you love, love,
kristen, right.
But like more spread out thekind of like same kind of
concept.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (41:25):
Because you cook each sheet like separately and then
you add your custard, anothersheet custard, another one
custard, so you can build ithowever you feel like building
it.
Usually I have like five layers?
Speaker 1 (41:41):
yeah, well, this one looks like it's got 10 layers or
so it looks fantastic.
Yeah, exactly.
Thank you all right, so I'mgonna jump in the rapid fire now
.
So what's the best way to getaround between either trains,
cars, buses or fly for a tourist.
Speaker 2 (42:00):
You can fly Casablanca, Marrakech or Tangier
.
Then trains are pretty good inMorocco.
I would recommend traveling, ifyou're doing I don't know,
Casablanca, Tangier, Casablanca,Marrakech, they're pretty good.
Speaker 1 (42:17):
Would we ever rent a car, or is that like too many
rules and too?
Speaker 2 (42:21):
complicated.
Um, I wouldn't.
I wouldn't drive like if you'refirst time, uh, going to
morocco, yeah, there are norules.
I mean there are rules, but youknow, think about, in morocco
we drive, like the wholemediterranean countries, like,
know, people, think aboutdriving in Rome, okay,
everywhere, yeah, okay.
(42:42):
But you can hire a driver,which I would personally suggest
, because it's really not thatexpensive to have someone with
you every day driving you.
It might cost you like $80.
Speaker 1 (43:02):
Okay, oh, yes, and then when you're staying in
those cities, I've seen me justwalk everywhere, like you know,
in casablanca or rajat and therobot, you can walk almost
everywhere.
Speaker 2 (43:11):
But, yeah, marrakesh you can also walk, but it
depends on when you're staying.
If you're staying inside themedina, yeah, then you can just
like probably walk everywhere,uh, other than that, you might
want to have a car to just likemove between the different parts
of the cities.
Speaker 1 (43:28):
It's not that small after all oh, okay, that's very
big, okay.
And then, when you're there,what do you have for breakfast?
What's a typical breakfast inmorocco?
Speaker 2 (43:35):
I would have probably argan oil with bread honey,
moroccan tea, because it has alot of mint, and coffee.
That's my favorite thing.
Or we also have this cured meatthat we use with eggs to make
an omelet in the morning, butit's really delicious but also
(43:56):
not the healthiest thing to eatevery day.
I stick to maybe having it whenI'm in Morocco, once a week,
maybe once a week.
Speaker 1 (44:06):
Oh, okay, it's more like the weekend, sunday
breakfast or something.
And then how about the music?
I feel like I can hear it in myhead.
Is there very unique music thatis very popular there?
Speaker 2 (44:18):
We have several types of music, so we have the more
what would be the equivalent ofclassic music.
It's, you know, poetry.
There's being sung much longersongs.
We have the things that we usefor weddings, which is, you know
, more upbeat from differentregions, from the mountains.
Dance is a huge part.
Speaker 1 (44:38):
Oh, it is all the ethnic.
Speaker 2 (44:40):
When they say ethnic, I'm looking at it from a tribal
perspective.
The way that people dance, likeyou know, in the sahara is not
the same as in the mountains.
The outfits are different.
Uh, we have troops that are,you know, carry on on the
tradition there.
In terms of sounds, we use alot of drums and violin mostly.
Speaker 1 (45:04):
Okay, and so this dancing?
Is there opportunities forvisitors to like see people
perform?
Is it often like in a park orin the holiday?
Speaker 2 (45:14):
You have to go to very specific places to see it.
Okay, like you have to do yourresearch beforehand, it's not
usually for us.
You're going to have anengagement party, a wedding, a
baptism, something happening andyou would have those people
coming in to perform.
But now you have a lot ofrestaurants are starting to go
(45:38):
beyond having only belly dancersso you can get a glimpse of it,
but it's not the same as youknow going and you know
experiencing in the rightsetting.
Speaker 1 (45:50):
Okay, yes, I need to get hooked in with the local
crowd and go to some events.
All right, and what's the moneycalled?
Dareham, dareham, dareham.
Okay, and is it easy toexchange, or do you always want
to use a credit card, or what doyou recommend?
Speaker 2 (46:05):
So always you can have some cash on you, never
more than the equivalent of $200.
There's nothing that will costthat.
Speaker 1 (46:12):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (46:13):
Unless you're buying a rug.
And when you're buying a rugyou can use your credit card.
Speaker 1 (46:19):
But most places yeah, you can just use your credit
card, okay.
Well, dear ham, d-i-r-h-a-m,dear ham, and then our final
question what's the closestplace to surf?
Since you are in the westernpart of the ocean, I was saying
there's some surfing there.
Is it popular in any cities?
Speaker 2 (46:32):
oh yeah, you can go to this, or you can go farther
south to to Dakhla and Shbiket.
Shbiket is one worth going tobecause you can literally see
the desert meeting the ocean.
The dunes are going into theocean.
How do you?
Speaker 1 (46:47):
say that Tam.
Speaker 2 (46:49):
Here.
Speaker 1 (46:49):
Yeah, thanks.
Oh, my goodness,C-H-B-I-K-A-T-E Like ch by Kate,
ch by Kate.
Speaker 2 (47:00):
B-K-A-T, b-k-a-t, b-k-a-t, b-k-a-t, b-k-a-t in
Arabic it means the little nestT-R-A-Z-U-T that's next to
Agadir.
That's also a really good spot.
I see Agad there is also thisplace, like if you like surfing,
it's just absolutely go righthere.
Speaker 1 (47:21):
Oh my gosh, I'm looking at these really long,
long beaches.
It's very nice.
Speaker 2 (47:27):
So this is also a place you can go surf at and
it's not very far.
So Agadir and Suera are themain, but then you have the
little towns around where it'sreally fun to go, like if you're
into kite surfing, surfing,paragliding, there is another
city oh my God, I forget aboutit.
What is the name?
Okay, it will come back at somepoint and I will send you the
(47:50):
info.
Speaker 1 (47:50):
Okay, very good.
Speaker 2 (47:51):
That one is a hidden gem.
Not a lot of people know aboutit.
Speaker 1 (47:56):
Ooh, that's what we like to hear.
Yeah, so this is before.
I'm just trying to see thegeneral area.
So southwest of Marrakesh justlooks like some of the surf
towns.
Speaker 2 (48:06):
And.
Speaker 1 (48:06):
I've seen camels resting next to a beach with
like.
Speaker 2 (48:12):
That's in the, that's here.
Speaker 1 (48:14):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (48:15):
We did it with some friends.
Speaker 1 (48:17):
They had their camel ride on the beach at sunset oh
nice and then you go and grab aglass of wine and then one hump
or two hump camels there uh, Idon't know actually see, because
I was somewhere, I think whenwe talked about mongolia they
said there's actually two humpsin those.
Speaker 2 (48:36):
I never paid attention because you know they
have the, their whole thing it's, it's prepared, so you don't
see what's under, because theyneed to be comfortable.
Speaker 1 (48:46):
It just looks like you're.
Yeah, I can't tell by thepictures.
They look just that way, like,just you know, a saddle dress
dressed up, fantastic Well,thank you so much for this.
And gosh, gosh you could talk alot longer, for sure there's.
It's so fascinating and it'svery big.
Wow, it's a magical place.
(49:06):
It sounds like so.
Definitely need to put that onmy bucket.
It's yes, it just sounds soamazing.
Absolutely well, fanta well.
Thank you so much for makingthis work.
I know it was a little tricky,but I appreciate all your time
and look forward to possiblygetting that extra secret spot
too.
Speaker 2 (49:28):
I will text you that, Kristen Fantastic.
Speaker 1 (49:31):
Nice, okay, thanks, alana All right.
Bye.
Thanks for listening.
If you enjoyed the podcast, canyou please take a second and do
a quick follow of the show andrate us in your podcast app, and
if you have a minute, we wouldreally appreciate a review.
Following and rating is thebest way to support us.
If you're on Instagram, let'sconnect.
(49:52):
We're at we're Next Podcast.
Thanks again.
Hi, welcome to our podcast.
We're Next Travel with Kristenand Carol.
I am Kristen and I am Carol,and we're two long-term friends
with a passion for travel andadventure.
Each episode, we interviewpeople around the globe to help
us decide where to go next.
Today, we are learning aboutMorocco, in Northern Africa,
(00:35):
from Lamia, who is from Moroccoand now living in California.
Lamia gives us insights at thevarious areas of her home
country that you may have heardof, including Casablanca,
marrakesh, the Blue City, plussome hidden gems.
It is a very inviting country.
If you have a country thatyou'd like to learn more about
(00:56):
or like to be a guest on ourpodcast, please DM us on
Instagram at where next podcast.
Enjoy.
Thanks, lamia, for joining ustoday, and we understand you're
going to talk to us aboutMorocco.
Thank you so much for joiningYay.
Speaker 2 (01:10):
Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
And I guess I'll start from so how do you
pronounce your last name?
Speaker 2 (01:17):
The French way or the Arabic way, whichever both.
So in Arabic it's Lalaoui andin French or English it would be
Alaoui.
Speaker 1 (01:27):
So you were born and raised in Morocco, correct?
Speaker 2 (01:32):
I was born and raised in Rabat yes, in the capital.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
And tell us all about growing up.
And I know you came here.
How many years again growing up.
And I know you came here.
How many years again, 11.
11 years Okay, that was notlong ago.
And then do you go back andforth too, to see family back
there?
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Yes, I fly at least once a year to go see my dad and
my friends.
I'm an only child and everyyear I take one of my daughters
with me, so it's our annualinternational trip.
I have three daughters, soevery year it's one of them
going.
This year it was quitedifferent, because I went twice,
and then your husband's fromthere as well.
(02:14):
My husband is French.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
Oh, he's French.
Okay, got it.
Okay, excellent, you just likethe romantic allure of just the
word Morocco.
I haven't even looked furtherinto you know just some of that,
right, and where does that comefrom?
And you know, I don't know ifit's a Hollywood thing, but it,
you know, and I'm just glancingat the pictures and the Sahara
Desert and just the architecture, it's just, it's beautiful
landscape and everything what.
Speaker 2 (02:45):
I guess I'll kind of start with that and let you open
so I think the the meaning inarabic some morocco, in arabic
is called al maghrib and becauseit's where the sun sets and
it's at the the end of um, youknow, of the peninsula, or yeah,
the whole, like the southern or, I'm sorry, the the most
(03:07):
northern tip of africa like that, but it's all the way to, to
the west.
when you're looking at it, youknow, from arabic speaking
countries perspective.
And, yeah, the country has beenaround for quite some long time
.
Actually, you still have thisplace near Fest, or you still
(03:28):
have Roman ruins from God knowshow many thousands of years, but
in a really great shape.
So you have the mosaics.
Everyone stopped by, we had thevandals, the Romans, the
Ottoman Empire didn't make itthere for some reason, but the
architecture is a result of allthese influences.
(03:49):
We're really at the intersectionof a lot of places.
We are at the intersection ofAfrica, europe and the East, and
we had a lot of routes manycenturies ago for commerce, so
everyone had to go through a lotof routes, you know, many
centuries ago for commerce.
So everyone had to go through alot of influences, including,
(04:10):
you know, a lot of Moroccanspices are actually Indian
spices, for example, that we usein our cuisine.
So it's a melting pot at theintersection of a lot of
cultures, including theMediterranean one.
The joke is like we're a littlebit of everything, just because
of where the country is.
Speaker 1 (04:29):
in itself, Well, it's almost like at the mouth of a
whole peninsula or an inlet, abody of water that spans many
countries.
So it's like right below, it'slike you and Spain right, and
I'm assuming then there must be.
I don't think things areconnected.
It looks like it from far away.
(04:50):
So the waterway that's theStrait of Gibraltar, yes, who
manages it?
Who governs?
Speaker 2 (04:58):
that that's a very loaded question.
It is for the longest time.
Speaker 1 (05:03):
Depends who you're asking, huh.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
Because Tangier had the status of international city
.
So if you look at the historyof Morocco in the early 1900s,
the country was split betweenthe French and the Spanish.
It was not occupied, but it wasplaced under protection.
(05:26):
So it was not fully occupied,but they still have a lot of
power.
I will spare you the details ofhistory.
Where they even tried to, theyexiled the actual king, placed
somebody else, from the samedynasty still, but not from the
(05:47):
family that has been ruling forquite some time, because you
know, the dynasty has manybranches.
But they did this whole thing.
And now you just take the ferryfrom tanger, which is moroccan,
uh, but you would have to havea visa to get, um, so when you
get to lgs us, it's 30 minutesby ferry from morocco to spain,
(06:07):
by the way well, I was going tosay it looks really close.
Speaker 1 (06:10):
And what's so interesting is you said the
spanish influence, but that thefrench influence and france is
above spain.
So it's like morocco, spain andthen france and it's, you know,
all of spain.
But it sounds like there's alot like where was france trying
to take it over or something ora lot of influence of, and
maybe they were just goingthrough through Morocco.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
They, they divided the country.
So when you go now you can seethe results of that step.
So from Tangier there is acoffee called Le Haffa, which is
literally means the edge.
So when you're having yourcoffee or your tea there, you
can see Spain.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
Oh wow, that's neat.
Speaker 2 (06:49):
It's really close and I have a former colleague of
mine who actually crossed theDetroit Swimming oh, I wonder,
how long did it take?
Oh, that I don't remember.
It was many years ago.
Speaker 1 (07:05):
I could see Kristen doing that.
No, that, no, no, no.
I was just curious, like howmany miles is it?
Did you?
Do you know how many miles itis?
No but I think that big deal 10or something.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
It's really not not that close but not far from
ferry no, yeah, not, not quite.
Speaker 1 (07:24):
What's this dotted line in throughout that splits
Morocco?
And it says it says LawinSaqiyah al-Hamra.
Speaker 2 (07:35):
Yeah, so Saqiyah al-Hamra is the dotted line.
It's the national cause,because there was a separatist
group that wants the Sahara tobe independent and for many
centuries it has been Moroccan.
When you look at the old maps,even Mauritania at some point
(07:58):
was Moroccan.
Of course, you know, with thedynasties changing and the world
evolving, the mapping or thezoning changed out a little bit.
But yeah, there have been a lotof talks about referendums.
It has been discussed in the UNfor a very long time.
(08:18):
There is a separatist groupthat they want to have a
republic.
Morocco is a monarchy and it'sa longstanding issue.
Yeah, and that's why, anddepending on the countries, you
will either find the map withthe dotted line or without.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
Oh, interesting.
So I have not heard of.
Let's see, what was thatcountry?
Mauritania I'm not familiarwith that country and it's
pretty big, and so you saidMorocco was all of that.
Atitania I'm not familiar withthat country and it's pretty big
, and so you said Morocco wasall of that at one point.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
Yes, not the current zoning that we have, but it was.
I mean I can try to find someIf I was in Morocco.
We have few in our homes of theold maps.
There was a lot of movement inthat region, especially when the
Ottoman Empire was coming inand out, Because, for example,
(09:13):
algeria, if you look in Tunisiaand Libya, it might have been
smaller or bigger depending onthe time.
It's the desert, it's not likeyou can have, it's the Sahara.
You can have a strict, you knowum frontier between countries,
dunes of sand, like how are yougonna divide it properly?
(09:34):
So things are always in motionfor for a little while.
Um, I mean that the joke evenis, on the east of Morocco there
is this city.
It's so close to the Algerianborder that you don't really
know, or you haven't known foryears, until there was military
presence, and now you can seethe clear line between both
(09:58):
countries.
But, for many, many years, therewas nothing.
So, are you in Algeria, are?
Are you in Morocco?
You don't know.
Now there is heavy militarypresence on, presence on both
sides, and and therefore it's acomplicated region.
Speaker 1 (10:14):
That's all I have to say, wow, that's so interesting
and that's and I was justlooking at the Sahara desert
because I didn't know.
But if I guess it, becauseAfrica yeah.
North Africa goes across thewhole thing, right, and then
it's it's also the tail end, Iguess.
It goes across the whole thing,right, and then it's also the
tail end, I guess would bethrough Morocco.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
So because if you look at the other countries,
they're wider and they're closerto the Mediterranean side,
including Libya, where Moroccois we're really like on the edge
of it, so the country goes alittle bit farther.
But also, since we're theclosest and I will get a little
(10:54):
bit like into the politics rightnow we are the gate to both
Europe and Africa, and so a lotof people from you know Europe
and Africa and so a lot ofpeople from you know Central
West African countries who aretrying to immigrate will stop by
Morocco and even the restplanes-wise, like people that
(11:17):
live in France or in Netherlands, germany, and they're flying to
West and Central Africancountries.
They will have their layover inMorocco.
So we're kind of this routejust because of how close we are
.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
You have beaches, deserts and from the topography
it seems like mountains.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
We have one of the highest peaks in Africa.
How high is the highest inAfrica?
So I think it's the Kilimanjaro.
Okay, we're right behind.
The Tupka is the second highestpeak and we have eternal snows.
Believe it or not, it does snowin Morocco and people go to ski
(12:08):
there.
Speaker 1 (12:09):
Wow, that's surprising.
Yeah, I think of it like likesouthern spain, very tropical.
Yeah, it says mount tubcal, yes, and it's 13 665, so 13 165
feet, that's pretty tall so, butI think that's the beauty of
morocco.
Speaker 2 (12:28):
Like you have everything that you need in one
country.
You want in the mountains, gofor hikes or go ski, and you can
do that.
Uh, you want to explore thedesert.
You have two types of desert.
Speaker 1 (12:40):
You have the one which is like more rocky, and
the one with, you know, dunes ofsand everywhere uh you have
both the ocean and the sea,because we have the
mediterranean sea but also theatlantic ocean okay, and so I'm
seeing on the the pictures, alot of like buildings like
(13:01):
sandstone or red rock buildingslike built into mountains.
What town is that?
Is that marrakesh, or is that asmall town or?
Speaker 2 (13:10):
that's a little bit outside of marrakesh, so you're
the ones that are um, you knowwith with the reddish, with the
terracotta color.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
That's a little bit outside of Marrakesh, on your
way farther south Very pretty.
It's gorgeous, but this is thebeauty of it you have the ones
in the mountains where often youcan also see them.
You know, because they makerocks, where often you can also
see them.
You know because they makerocks.
So when you're driving by inthe mountains to get whatever
(13:40):
you want to get, there's thissmall town that I love going to.
It's called Imlil.
It's in the mountains, but toget there you have to drive and
you can see all the rocks being,you know, displayed because
they're making them dry.
It's just like Is it clay?
It is I don't know the word inin in English, but it's like, um
(14:04):
, almost like I think it'smortar.
Okay.
Speaker 1 (14:10):
Yeah, yeah.
And what was the town in the inthe mountains that you like?
But how do you spell that?
Speaker 2 (14:15):
Uh, I M, l, I L.
So you drive in the mountainsthat you like, but how do you
spell that I-M-L-I-L?
So you drive through that andthen you get to this town where
you have waterfalls.
I mean, you have to hike to getto it and it's very green and
you know it's really beautiful.
But you're going through placeswhere you think there's no
(14:36):
water and then you just hike foranother hour and you have
waterfalls that are gorgeous.
You can also decide to gofarther south to this ancient
fort called Qisbet Eid al-BinHiddur.
I wouldn't recommend doing whatI've done not so long ago, which
(14:56):
is going there during the monthof July, while I came there
because it was insanely warm.
Again, the riverbed is dry, butduring spring it's all green
everywhere, and then you havethe fort.
You know that is red.
You know that is red and you'renot expecting that.
(15:21):
Uh, I mean that whole region isjust beyond beautiful.
Because it's rough, uh, theelements like during winter.
You really don't want to bethere.
Uh, it's really cold.
Kids cannot go to school whenit's snowing, but during summer
it's really nice.
The people who live there arejust beyond generous and
hospitable.
They don't have much, but theystill take care of whomever is
(15:46):
visiting.
The kids are helping theirparents.
You can see a way of life thatalmost doesn't exist anywhere,
and for me, I was born andraised in the country but it has
something magical because italmost feels like the time
stopped and you're and you'restepping back and it's yes, for
(16:11):
me it's magical.
I know I have a lot of myfriends, moroccan, say what
would you like?
What would you rather go thereinstead of going other places?
I say I don't know.
It's just beautiful.
You have a lot of forts thathave been abandoned but still in
great shape.
You can just wander around andyou can look at those beautiful
(16:35):
ceilings.
The craftsmanship is insane.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
nobody lives there anymore, but it's still standing
oh really, and we're stilltalking about Imlil right oh,
it's the whole.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
Imlil is one of the most known villages oh, with the
whole area there of the wholearea and it's, I think, three
hours ish from Marrakesh okay,got it.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
That's so neat yeah so if someone's gonna go to like
say you had, like, you knowyou're in europe, you want to go
to morocco for a week or twoweeks, is it like?
A month or two, like a couple,like slow travel.
I would say, yeah, right, whereis where like must go to?
Speaker 2 (17:17):
Where to go.
That's a great question.
I have some friends that comewith me almost every year.
I told them, if you really wantto know the country in and out,
we can go for the next 20 yearsevery year.
Speaker 1 (17:32):
What would be the top places to visit for beaches,
for things to do at the desert?
Speaker 2 (17:40):
So I think two weeks is a pretty decent amount of
time.
Casablanca you know, thanks tothe movie, everyone romantizes
Casablanca.
Yep, I lived in Casablanca,it's.
I mean, there are a couple ofthings that, yes, you want to
see over there, but what Ialways recommend is you land
(18:01):
there, you spend one night.
Speaker 1 (18:05):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (18:05):
And you can like spend the day over there.
You have amazing food scene.
Think about Casablanca as NewYork, it's the largest city in
Morocco.
Oh, it is York, it's thelargest city in Morocco.
Speaker 1 (18:19):
Oh, it is.
Speaker 2 (18:20):
It's the financial center, it's the economic center
.
Speaker 1 (18:24):
Okay, gotcha, it looks like they have a quaint
tower similar to what made methink of it.
It looks like a church tower orsomething.
Speaker 2 (18:32):
Yes, that would be the cathedral.
It's a cathedral that we haveover there.
There are a few of them, butthat's Sacred Heart and it's the
oldest one that we have.
It's a beautiful piece ofarchitecture, that's for sure.
And then you can have threedifferent directions in which
(18:56):
you can go.
So you can go up northCasablanca is right in the
middle, on the coast so you candecide to go up north and
therefore what you're going todo is you're going to stop by
the capital, rabat.
You know it's my hometown.
We do have beautiful monumentsfrom, you know, including old
(19:17):
Portuguese forts, like right onthe delta between one of the
Moroccan main rivers and theAtlantic Ocean.
You can again and I'm notkidding, we love things on the
edge or at the intersection, butyou can have your tea, like
(19:38):
sitting right above the deltaand you can see it.
You can see another small townfrom across the river.
From there.
We have two other imperialcities close by, which are Fess
and McNeice.
What a lot of people don't knowis Fess has the first
university that was built ever,and it was built by a woman.
Wow, that was built ever and itwas built by a woman Wow.
(19:58):
I think in the 1100s, and itnever stopped operating so
universities as we know now.
It stinks to her.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
Wow, that's so cool.
You said Fez, f-e-z.
Yeah, I see it right there,okay.
Speaker 2 (20:12):
So, fez, yeah, it's the oldest university in the
world 1100s, you said it was wasbuilt.
I think it was 1100.
Wow, 80, yeah, and it was builtand founded by a woman wow, and
it's still going to this day.
Speaker 1 (20:26):
Oh yeah, that's incredible.
Speaker 2 (20:28):
I'm actually looking at it okay, I can try to find
the name for that.
So fez is one of the imperialcities and it had you many, many
dynasties throughout Moroccanhistory.
It was their capital throughoutMoroccan history, for centuries
and centuries.
It also has one of the oldestsynagogues in North Africa.
(20:50):
But, morocco, we have twojudicial systems, because we
used to have an extremely largeJewish community.
So we have the secular court,which is mostly inspired by
(21:11):
French law, or clause enoughanyway, with a mix of, you know,
muslim law when it comes toinheritance and other things,
and then there is the hebraiclaw as well.
So for marriages, divorces andall that.
So there are two differentsystems that have been existing
in the country for god knows howlong.
(21:34):
Um, so a rabbit outside the fest, or between fez and mcness,
which is the other imperial city, you have volubilis, which is
totally worth going to because alot of people don't realize
that romans were reallyeverywhere, and it's one of the
rare places outside of italywhere you can still see what
(21:58):
they built.
How do you spell it?
What's the city?
Volubilis, v-o-l-u-b-i-l-i-s.
Speaker 1 (22:08):
Okay, I was like Volubilis, not quite, but
Volubilis, oh.
Oh.
No, there it is, yep.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
I'm sorry, yep I was just looking at.
Speaker 1 (22:19):
Did you have it?
Oh yeah, I did.
Oh wow, it's a partly excavatedBerber Roman city in Morocco,
in the city of Meknes,M-E-K-N-E-S.
Speaker 2 (22:34):
Yes, that's the other imperial city.
There are three imperial citiesin Morocco Fes and Meknes,
close to each other, and thenMarrakech.
Marrakech is that.
So we're going to continue onour north itinerary where, once
you're there, you can go to theBlue City, which is right in the
middle of you know themountains, but close enough to
(22:56):
the water still of the mountains, but close enough to the water
still, and from there you cankeep going north and do the
Mediterranean side, which haveTangier, guadalajara, cosima,
and when you get to there it'slike you're not in Morocco
anymore.
You were talking, carol, about,oh, you think about Spain.
(23:18):
So when you're in Josima, inPuerto Banos, you're almost like
feeling you're in the same spot, even though two different
countries, but you have to getthrough the mountains to get
there, which makes it reallybeautiful, like a trip or road
trip.
So that's one direction.
The other direction you can gois like you're going to go south
(23:42):
, but not too much, because,like, if you want to go to, for
example, rizani or, you know,le'yun, you would have to fly
from Casablanca it's not a longflight but it's still a decent
one and you would have to take acar to get to Merzouga, where
you have a lot of desert camps.
(24:03):
But you can do the other side,which is do Casablanca,
marrakech by car.
It's about two hours and a half.
Marrakech becomes the home baseand then you can visit all
these cities and the mountains.
You can go to Imlil, you can goto Tluwet, you can go to the
(24:26):
lake.
So, not very far from this lake, which is right in the middle
of the mountains, is whereBranson decided to build his own
casbah that he made into ahotel, because, again, the
nature is just the scenery.
I don't even know how todescribe it.
Speaker 1 (24:40):
Did you say Richard Branson?
You said Branson, yes, oh mygosh, and then what city is it?
Speaker 2 (24:47):
So it's not a city, it's in the mountains, but it's
called Kasbah, so K-A-S-B-A-H.
And then Tamadot, that's thehotel that he built, but he
respected the actualarchitecture of Moroccan
villages.
It's T as in Tom A M as in momA D as in Daniel O and T as in
(25:11):
Tom.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
I looked it up.
It looks like a palace.
No, it's beautiful.
And then you said that there'ssome lakes as well.
Paints their buildings.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
I mean there's mostly blue, it's it's beautiful yes,
it's the same way as marrakechis all red, casablanca all white
.
Even though that was is notrespected anymore.
Even in Arabic, it means likethe White House oh okay,
(25:40):
Casablanca.
Many years ago it was all white.
Speaker 1 (25:43):
You've got red, blue and white.
Speaker 2 (25:46):
The Blue City has a name.
It's called Shefshawan, buteveryone refers to it as the
Blue City because Shefshawan, Ithink for non-native speakers
might be a tiny bit.
Speaker 1 (25:58):
Oh is it like chef?
Yeah, it's like it says, startwith chef.
Okay, got it, chef.
Okay, got it, thank you.
And then how do you pronounceit with no F?
Speaker 2 (26:10):
it's just.
You know the emphasis is quitedifferent because there's none
in Morocco, but yeah, you can dothat portion, which usually
takes a good week to do.
And even in marrakesh itself,in the city, because it's an
imperial city you still have alot of the palaces from previous
(26:32):
dynasties.
Some are being restoredcurrently.
Um, some actually saw.
Oh oh, by the way, carol, itwas founded earlier than when I
thought.
Speaker 1 (26:41):
The university.
Oh, it's 859.
859.
Whoa, okay, and so I can't getmy head around that.
That's crazy, Wow.
Speaker 2 (26:51):
It started as a mosque but you know, mosques in
Islam are also a teaching placeand then it started evolving
because people started coming tolearn and it's still mostly
theology studies and theuniversity.
But, yeah, it never stoppedfunctioning since it was founded
.
Speaker 1 (27:11):
That's incredible country.
It's amazing how preserved itis right Of so many.
It's like stepping back intohistory with so much of it and
yet at the same time In Moroccothe previous king, hassan II.
Speaker 2 (27:28):
He was very probably great interviews at all times
there was always an emphasis inMorocco, the past is present.
There are constant reminders ofit, because if you don't know
your past, you cannot build yourfuture.
If you don't know where you'recoming from, you don't know.
(27:49):
Moroccans are very resilientpeople.
We went through a lot of things, a lot of change.
We had so many dynasties I canthink of at least five that went
through in the last maybe 1,000, 1,500 years, and change is the
(28:13):
only constant that we know inthat country.
So it hasn't been the case, youknow, for the last maybe 400
years it's the same dynasty thatis ruling.
If we kind of look past thatFrench and Spanish protector, I
think, but it was so shortbecause I think it was under 20
years.
It didn't certainly have a lotof impact, but the world change
(28:36):
popo has been, uh, you knowwe're we're very focused on
agriculture, uh, and tourism,but then the technology started
happening.
It became like also financialhelp for africa, technology help
for africa.
There is the evolution, maybenot anymore on the structure and
political side of of thecountry but, you know, on the
structural and political side ofthe country, but on the
(28:58):
economic side and the traditionsare still very important.
In Morocco the family units arevery strong in general.
It's a high-context culture.
The group always comes beforethe individual.
It's unique.
Speaker 1 (29:17):
Strong, yeah, it's unique, yeah, community and
belonging.
So I think kind of thestereotype and I just heard this
from my friend that's verywell-traveled and she's like
well, morocco, we're a littlenervous about going there
because of political unrest.
Do you feel there's anyconcerns or preparation we need
to do as Americans come in there?
Speaker 2 (29:38):
What political?
Speaker 1 (29:39):
unrest.
I don't know Anything either.
I know I was like what.
Speaker 2 (29:43):
I don't know.
I mean, we're probably one ofthe rare, you know,
arabic-speaking countries thatdidn't have an Arab Spring.
Right, arab Spring washappening.
What's that?
Speaker 1 (29:57):
I don't know what that means.
Speaker 2 (29:57):
I didn't know what that is so remember, when there
was like a whole bunch ofRevolutions in Arabic speaking
countries and they kind of theywere not happy with the current
Power structure that was inplace.
Some of them were notmonarchies, but felt like it
Because whomever was at the headof the state Was staying for
Many, many, many years.
(30:18):
So there was A lot.
Head of the state was stayingfor many, many, many years.
So there was a lot of unrest,but Morocco was probably one of
the rare ones that were nottouched by it.
But the king Mohammed VI still,you know he heard his people.
There was a whole revision ofthe constitution.
We do have an active monarchy.
(30:40):
It's not a constitutional onelike in the UK or in Spain, so
the king still has executivepower.
But there were like significantamendment made to the
constitution because, you know,the people were asking for
change and that happened.
But from a us moroccoperspective, the relationship
(31:03):
have always been good.
Uh, I think, if my memoryserves me right, one of the rare
countries that has an actual usmonument outside of us soil is
morocco, and it's in tangierokay so there are.
The countries have been veryclose and one of the things I
(31:25):
learned when I came to the us isoh, france was the first
country to recognize the us.
You know the original 13 andI'm like I'm pretty sure they
weren't, because the firstcorrespondence ever was with
Morocco and the king at the time1700s I think answered the 13
(31:48):
colonies, which means that thatwas a diplomatic exchange and a
tacit recognition of the 13original as a country or as a
state, of the 13 original as acountry or as a state.
And, yeah, we were one of thefirst allies of the U?
S and that relationship hasbeen always great.
(32:09):
I would say it's like in anyother country for women
traveling alone.
As unfortunate as it is, it'snot worse than you know Spain,
croatia.
You want to be careful, likewhen you're in the cities.
You're totally fine.
I travel a lot by myself.
I had friends that went ontheir own.
(32:30):
It's really safe.
You just need to be cautious,like anywhere else.
Yeah, okay, your drinks at abar on the day, right for sure.
Speaker 1 (32:42):
I was curious also about like moroccan food and I,
oh, I guess a quick, quick thingin terms of cost things are,
are they very expensive?
So if someone wanted to travelthere, is it more expensive,
reasonable, cheaper?
Speaker 2 (32:56):
it depends where you're going.
Okay, things are veryreasonable.
Things are inexpensive, um, andlike, I mean, we have the best
hotel in the world lemon one,yeah, which is his one as well.
That one is not.
I wouldn't qualify it asreasonable.
Yeah, totally worth it though.
Uh, though, if people canafford it, how is it spelled?
(33:17):
M-a-m-o-u-n-i-a Memonio.
Speaker 1 (33:25):
That's a nice hotel to stay at.
Speaker 2 (33:28):
Extremely nice hotel to stay at.
Speaker 1 (33:29):
Yeah, five star, at least Six star maybe.
Oh, perfect, Excellent.
And then the food.
I was so curious about the food.
Speaker 2 (33:41):
The best lamb you will probably ever have.
Morocco is known for its lamb.
I mean, everyone thinks aboutthe tagine, but we also have a
lot of fish dishes.
What's tagine?
Tagine is the traditional wayof cooking, so it's interesting
because the tagine is the actualdish that you cook in, but it's
(34:03):
also the name of the dishyou're eating, because it's
cooked in that.
Now things have evolved and youcan cook a tagine in, you know,
a pot, like I don't know, likea Dutch oven, and basically it's
a lot of veggies.
You have some savory and sweetones.
You have different variationsof it Really good.
Speaker 1 (34:26):
I just Googled it.
It kind of looks just like aregular pan with two handles.
Speaker 2 (34:32):
Yes, and it's made out of clay.
It needs to be prepped acertain way when you buy a new
one and then it has a cover thatis triangular, everything is
steamed and it's slow cooked.
So you have to be patient ifyou want to eat a tagine,
because it takes like an hour totwo.
One of my favorite one is theeasiest one to make.
(34:54):
It's with preserved lemons andolives.
It's one of the mosttraditional ones.
You can make it with chicken,you can make it with veal, you
can make it with beef, you canmake it with lamb.
You just cannot make it withfish.
And basically you just haveyour onions diced or, you know,
cut in lamellas with olive oil.
You kind of make them sweat abit, you add your meat, your
(35:17):
spices.
You kind of them sweat a bit,you add your meat, your spices.
You kind of again let it cookfor a little bit.
You add water, more onions, butthis time like sliced.
And it's the only dish whereactually I never put salt,
because the preserved lemons andthe olives will release the
salt.
And once the water startsboiling and the the meat getting
(35:38):
tender, you just like put it onslow and for the last 15
minutes this is where you'regonna add your preserved lemons
and um and olives and then cookfor another 15, 20 and then it's
ready.
But you can the base is alwaysthe same almost into jeans and
you can add veggies, carrots,sweet peas, um, artichoke
(35:59):
potatoes, string beans oh, thatsounds so good.
Speaker 1 (36:03):
It sounds very healthy too.
Do you eat healthy there?
Generally speaking, yes we dookay.
Speaker 2 (36:10):
Carbs, we love our carbs like we love so we are
getting close to our time.
Speaker 1 (36:15):
I have the rapid fire questions, but if there's some
less burning question, kristen,I was curious in terms of some
of the activities people like todo and what people do when
they're there and visiting.
Speaker 2 (36:27):
So a lot of shopping, because the fabrics are amazing
.
You have all the traditionalthings like trays made out of
copper, but it's, you know, handcarved.
The glasses, the Moroccantraditional, what is it called?
(36:49):
It's just something you can siton.
It's made out of leather.
Also a lot of spices.
Speaker 1 (36:56):
Oh, okay.
Speaker 2 (36:57):
I mean, we have spices for markets, olives too.
We have whole markets dedicatedto to olives oh wow, argan oil,
uh, cosmetic.
So argan oil in morocco, we eatit, oh, but but not the one that
is being sold for cosmeticpurposes again.
So argan tree only grows inMorocco until like a few years
(37:19):
ago, where, like some familieswho moved to Israel found a way
to do it, but it's mostly inMorocco only, and so we eat
argan oil.
You cannot cook with it, butyou can use it as a dressing for
salads or, you know as, to dipyour bread in it, mostly.
(37:39):
And then someone discoveredthat it was pretty good for your
skin, your hair and all of that, and this is where they would
start producing.
It's not pressed the same way.
It's not prepped the same way.
Speaker 1 (37:52):
And how do you spell that Argon yes, a-r-g-o-n.
No A-R-G-A-r-g-o-n yeah, noa-r-g-a-n, yeah, a-r-g-a-n, oil
can you?
Just buy that in the unitedstates oh yeah, I've seen it
everywhere like people for yourhair.
It comes in little bottles andnot the same quality though no,
yeah, I don't like to say it,but but that's where I've seen
(38:15):
it.
I haven't seen it where it's asalad dressing.
I've seen it as like a hairproduct or something at my salon
or something uh, the, theculinary one is.
Speaker 2 (38:23):
I cannot find it here , I bring it for my face, yeah
for your face.
You can.
You can find some, some goodones.
You also have, uh, somemoroccan brands that are
starting to sell on amazon, sothat one um would, would work,
uh, but you can just like.
The smell and the texture isquite different.
But again, I'm biased yeah,good bias okay.
Speaker 1 (38:46):
So that's a good thing to actually buy when you
go there a lot of, a lot ofhiking, horseback riding,
swimming.
Speaker 2 (38:53):
we do love sitting by the beach and just like
chilling also, nice, nice, yeah,that would be it.
I mean the cultural part.
When you go for the first time,there's so much to see,
especially in terms ofarchitecture, you won't have
time to do anything else.
Speaker 1 (39:09):
Okay, just like be in awe.
Sounds amazing.
And then my last question alsois desserts.
What kind of desserts are afavorite of Moroccan?
Speaker 2 (39:18):
So we eat a lot of fruits after our meals.
Speaker 1 (39:21):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (39:22):
Then we have our tea with sweets.
That would be the sequencing.
One of my favorite dessert ismade with the equivalent of
phyllo dough, and then you makethis custard with milk and
orange, blossom water and a bitof like a zested lemon oh, that
sounds amazing.
Speaker 1 (39:41):
That's my favorite one.
I know I'm looking here, waitwhat shebekia oh, shebekia that
thing is.
Speaker 2 (39:48):
So we eat it mostly during ramadan and it's
basically flour.
It's cooked but it's dipped inhoney.
Okay, I see it's fried, you dipit in honey and you have sesame
seeds on it and you eat it.
And actually it's mostly eatenduring Ramadan, like to break
fast after having dates, milkand all of that, because it has
(40:12):
a lot of calories and it helpspeople kind of recuperate faster
from their fast.
Speaker 1 (40:18):
What's the one that you did with the phyllo dough
and the orange blossom water?
Speaker 2 (40:23):
I can type it in.
It will be much easier.
Speaker 1 (40:28):
How do you pronounce it?
Just curious.
I love it.
Speaker 2 (40:34):
It sounds interesting , that's beautiful Corrector
doesn't even recognize this.
Speaker 1 (40:41):
Oh, it looks like pastila.
Ole, it's just like a coffeedrink.
Oh ole, it sounds like pastila.
Oh, that does look good.
It looks like pancakes almost.
Speaker 2 (40:53):
It looks like it, but it's so much lighter than
pancakes, yeah it does.
It's the equivalent of filodough, but it's not really than
pancakes, because it's theequivalent of phyllo dough, but
it's not really.
In Morocco we don't have phyllodough, we have this thing that
we call feu de brique.
So it's much.
Actually it's much more thinnerthan a phyllo dough yeah, it
sounds.
Speaker 1 (41:14):
It seems like a puffy baklava which you love, love,
kristen, right.
But like more spread out thekind of like same kind of
concept.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (41:25):
Because you cook each sheet like separately and then
you add your custard, anothersheet custard, another one
custard, so you can build ithowever you feel like building
it.
Usually I have like five layers?
Speaker 1 (41:41):
yeah, well, this one looks like it's got 10 layers or
so it looks fantastic.
Yeah, exactly.
Thank you all right, so I'mgonna jump in the rapid fire now
.
So what's the best way to getaround between either trains,
cars, buses or fly for a tourist.
Speaker 2 (42:00):
You can fly Casablanca, Marrakech or Tangier
.
Then trains are pretty good inMorocco.
I would recommend traveling, ifyou're doing I don't know,
Casablanca, Tangier, Casablanca,Marrakech, they're pretty good.
Speaker 1 (42:17):
Would we ever rent a car, or is that like too many
rules and too?
Speaker 2 (42:21):
complicated.
Um, I wouldn't.
I wouldn't drive like if you'refirst time, uh, going to
morocco, yeah, there are norules.
I mean there are rules, but youknow, think about, in morocco
we drive, like the wholemediterranean countries, like,
know, people, think aboutdriving in Rome, okay,
everywhere, yeah, okay.
(42:42):
But you can hire a driver,which I would personally suggest
, because it's really not thatexpensive to have someone with
you every day driving you.
It might cost you like $80.
Speaker 1 (43:02):
Okay, oh, yes, and then when you're staying in
those cities, I've seen me justwalk everywhere, like you know,
in casablanca or rajat and therobot, you can walk almost
everywhere.
Speaker 2 (43:11):
But, yeah, marrakesh you can also walk, but it
depends on when you're staying.
If you're staying inside themedina, yeah, then you can just
like probably walk everywhere,uh, other than that, you might
want to have a car to just likemove between the different parts
of the cities.
Speaker 1 (43:28):
It's not that small after all oh, okay, that's very
big, okay.
And then, when you're there,what do you have for breakfast?
What's a typical breakfast inmorocco?
Speaker 2 (43:35):
I would have probably argan oil with bread honey,
moroccan tea, because it has alot of mint, and coffee.
That's my favorite thing.
Or we also have this cured meatthat we use with eggs to make
an omelet in the morning, butit's really delicious but also
(43:56):
not the healthiest thing to eatevery day.
I stick to maybe having it whenI'm in Morocco, once a week,
maybe once a week.
Speaker 1 (44:06):
Oh, okay, it's more like the weekend, sunday
breakfast or something.
And then how about the music?
I feel like I can hear it in myhead.
Is there very unique music thatis very popular there?
Speaker 2 (44:18):
We have several types of music, so we have the more
what would be the equivalent ofclassic music.
It's, you know, poetry.
There's being sung much longersongs.
We have the things that we usefor weddings, which is, you know
, more upbeat from differentregions, from the mountains.
Dance is a huge part.
Speaker 1 (44:38):
Oh, it is all the ethnic.
Speaker 2 (44:40):
When they say ethnic, I'm looking at it from a tribal
perspective.
The way that people dance, likeyou know, in the sahara is not
the same as in the mountains.
The outfits are different.
Uh, we have troops that are,you know, carry on on the
tradition there.
In terms of sounds, we use alot of drums and violin mostly.
Speaker 1 (45:04):
Okay, and so this dancing?
Is there opportunities forvisitors to like see people
perform?
Is it often like in a park orin the holiday?
Speaker 2 (45:14):
You have to go to very specific places to see it.
Okay, like you have to do yourresearch beforehand, it's not
usually for us.
You're going to have anengagement party, a wedding, a
baptism, something happening andyou would have those people
coming in to perform.
But now you have a lot ofrestaurants are starting to go
(45:38):
beyond having only belly dancersso you can get a glimpse of it,
but it's not the same as youknow going and you know
experiencing in the rightsetting.
Speaker 1 (45:50):
Okay, yes, I need to get hooked in with the local
crowd and go to some events.
All right, and what's the moneycalled?
Dareham, dareham, dareham.
Okay, and is it easy toexchange, or do you always want
to use a credit card, or what doyou recommend?
Speaker 2 (46:05):
So always you can have some cash on you, never
more than the equivalent of $200.
There's nothing that will costthat.
Speaker 1 (46:12):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (46:13):
Unless you're buying a rug.
And when you're buying a rugyou can use your credit card.
Speaker 1 (46:19):
But most places yeah, you can just use your credit
card, okay.
Well, dear ham, d-i-r-h-a-m,dear ham, and then our final
question what's the closestplace to surf?
Since you are in the westernpart of the ocean, I was saying
there's some surfing there.
Is it popular in any cities?
Speaker 2 (46:32):
oh yeah, you can go to this, or you can go farther
south to to Dakhla and Shbiket.
Shbiket is one worth going tobecause you can literally see
the desert meeting the ocean.
The dunes are going into theocean.
How do you?
Speaker 1 (46:47):
say that Tam.
Speaker 2 (46:49):
Here.
Speaker 1 (46:49):
Yeah, thanks.
Oh, my goodness,C-H-B-I-K-A-T-E Like ch by Kate,
ch by Kate.
Speaker 2 (47:00):
B-K-A-T, b-k-a-t, b-k-a-t, b-k-a-t, b-k-a-t in
Arabic it means the little nestT-R-A-Z-U-T that's next to
Agadir.
That's also a really good spot.
I see Agad there is also thisplace, like if you like surfing,
it's just absolutely go righthere.
Speaker 1 (47:21):
Oh my gosh, I'm looking at these really long,
long beaches.
It's very nice.
Speaker 2 (47:27):
So this is also a place you can go surf at and
it's not very far.
So Agadir and Suera are themain, but then you have the
little towns around where it'sreally fun to go, like if you're
into kite surfing, surfing,paragliding, there is another
city oh my God, I forget aboutit.
What is the name?
Okay, it will come back at somepoint and I will send you the
(47:50):
info.
Speaker 1 (47:50):
Okay, very good.
Speaker 2 (47:51):
That one is a hidden gem.
Not a lot of people know aboutit.
Speaker 1 (47:56):
Ooh, that's what we like to hear.
Yeah, so this is before.
I'm just trying to see thegeneral area.
So southwest of Marrakesh justlooks like some of the surf
towns.
Speaker 2 (48:06):
And.
Speaker 1 (48:06):
I've seen camels resting next to a beach with
like.
Speaker 2 (48:12):
That's in the, that's here.
Speaker 1 (48:14):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (48:15):
We did it with some friends.
Speaker 1 (48:17):
They had their camel ride on the beach at sunset oh
nice and then you go and grab aglass of wine and then one hump
or two hump camels there uh, Idon't know actually see, because
I was somewhere, I think whenwe talked about mongolia they
said there's actually two humpsin those.
Speaker 2 (48:36):
I never paid attention because you know they
have the, their whole thing it's, it's prepared, so you don't
see what's under, because theyneed to be comfortable.
Speaker 1 (48:46):
It just looks like you're.
Yeah, I can't tell by thepictures.
They look just that way, like,just you know, a saddle dress
dressed up, fantastic Well,thank you so much for this.
And gosh, gosh you could talk alot longer, for sure there's.
It's so fascinating and it'svery big.
Wow, it's a magical place.
(49:06):
It sounds like so.
Definitely need to put that onmy bucket.
It's yes, it just sounds soamazing.
Absolutely well, fanta well.
Thank you so much for makingthis work.
I know it was a little tricky,but I appreciate all your time
and look forward to possiblygetting that extra secret spot
too.
Speaker 2 (49:28):
I will text you that, Kristen Fantastic.
Speaker 1 (49:31):
Nice, okay, thanks, alana All right.
Bye.
Thanks for listening.
If you enjoyed the podcast, canyou please take a second and do
a quick follow of the show andrate us in your podcast app, and
if you have a minute, we wouldreally appreciate a review.
Following and rating is thebest way to support us.
If you're on Instagram, let'sconnect.
(49:52):
We're at we're Next Podcast.
Thanks again.
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