The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom Deep Dive - with Katie Shesko - Your Friendly Neighborhood Gamers

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
What's up everybody, welcome back to the neighborhood
and thank you for spending partof your day with us today.
If you're a returning listener,thank you and welcome back, and
if this happens to be yourfirst episode, thank you and
welcome to the show.
On this episode, we're talkingabout the Legend of Zelda Tears
of the Kingdom.
Welcome to the podcast wheretwo longtime friends, and

(00:31):
sometimes a guest, talk abouttheir favorite games from the
perspective of an average player.
My name is Andrew Kimball andI'm Dylan Ren, and we are your
friendly neighborhood gamers.

(00:56):
The Legend of Zelda Tears of theKingdom is a 2023
action-adventure game developedand published by Nintendo for
the Nintendo Switch.
The sequel to the Legend ofZelda Breath of the Wild, tears
of the Kingdom retains the openworld of Hyrule, which has been
expanded to allow for morevertical exploration.
The player controls Link, whomust help Princess Zelda to stop
Ganondorf from destroyingHyrule.

(01:17):
Tears of the Kingdom wasconceived after ideas for Breath
of the Wild's downloadablecontent had exceeded its scope.
Its development was led byNintendo's entertainment
planning and developmentdivision.
It received acclaim for itsimprovements, expanded open
world and features encouragingexploration and experimentation.
It sold more than 10 millioncopies in its first three days

(01:39):
of release.
So this is normally the part ofthe show where I would throw a
prompt to Dylan and have himrespond, but Dylan's not here
because he has not played thisgame, so I brought on a very
special guest for this one,Welcoming Katie Shescoe.
back to the show.
you haven't been on in a minuteand it's been too long probably
.

Speaker 2 (01:58):
I agree.
It's always great to sit andchat with you.

Speaker 1 (02:03):
Yeah, i'm very excited to get into this one.
People that maybe don't knowyou for whatever reason.
you were on our last showtalking about Nier Automata.
We've interviewed you on thisshow, but I couldn't think of
anybody better to bring on forthe Tears of the Kingdom episode
, i think almost as soon as Istarted playing it, i shot you a

(02:23):
message and was like are you?
down to do an episode wheneverwe beat this thing Because you
probably have more hours thanany definitely anybody I know in
Breath of the Wild And Ifigured you were going to do the
same for this one.

Speaker 2 (02:37):
Absolutely Yeah.
I have probably more than Icare to admit in it.

Speaker 1 (02:44):
Yeah, And we talked about it obviously when we
interviewed you.
but if this is anybody's firstepisode, the reason you have so
many hours in that game isbecause you stream and you like
to do speed running stuff andbingos and a lot of Breath of
the Wild content.
So much of the Wild content.

Speaker 2 (03:02):
Yeah, i originally started just playing the game,
fell in love with it definitelyin my top three favorite games
And I was just casually getting100% over and over because, i
don't know, it's just my game tochill and relax And I kind of

(03:22):
stumbled down.
I discovered bingos and kind ofstumbled down that rabbit hole
And then late last year I hadsomeone convince me that doing
the Breath of the Wild 100%speed run was a good idea.
So that's kind of like mypersonal project for the years.
I want to get on the speedrunning leaderboards for 100%.

Speaker 1 (03:41):
So I've kind of taken a detour.

Speaker 2 (03:44):
I've done one run.
I'm doing the DLC, so it's alittle bit longer.
I think that run was about 50hours but I definitely struggled
with some of the trial of theswords.
I lost a lot of time doing that.
So I'm working on my second runbut it's kind of taken a

(04:04):
backseat to Tears of the Kingdom.
But I'm starting to incorporateit back into my weekly stream,
getting back into it Andhopefully by the end of the year
I'll actually like sit downover a weekend and do an
official run.
Right now I'm just kind ofdoing it a couple hours at a
time, going through it.

Speaker 1 (04:21):
What is the time that you have to beat?

Speaker 2 (04:25):
I mean, there's not that many people that run it.
So, like any, i think as longas it's under 60 hours, you're
eligible for the board.
I'd like to get it to about 30hours, which is doable.
I'm still deciding whether ornot I want to run the DLC or if
I just want to do base game.
Right now I'm running the like.

(04:46):
I'm incorporating the DLC intoit, but we'll see, we'll see.
I got six months, five monthsWow.

Speaker 1 (04:55):
Yeah, And then the other half of your content
something that I always think isreally cool to talk about is
you play the flute.

Speaker 2 (05:01):
I do, yeah, i do covers of video game and anime
music And I'm starting to dolive performances at conventions
.
And, yeah, i'm incorporatingthe music streams back into my
weekly rotation for streaming.
So, yeah, it's fun.

Speaker 1 (05:19):
Yeah, it's very cool, It's very unique, I think very
interesting.
So I always want to make surewe bring it up, but we'll give
you a chance to plug all of thattowards the end of the episode.
For now, how about we talkabout some Zelda?

Speaker 2 (05:32):
Absolutely.
I'm so excited.

Speaker 1 (05:34):
So the way this episode is going to break down
as far as spoilers are concernedis we're going to keep them to
the back half of theconversation And we will have a
very obvious spoiler warning,probably a break with some music
or something from the game.
So this first part of theconversation we're going to keep
things a little bit moregeneral, a little bit more broad
, spoiler free, and then we'lldive into the spoiler stuff for

(05:57):
the back half of theconversation, mostly regarding
the story, maybe some of thelike themed dungeons, stuff like
that.
That's cool to experience onyour own for the first time.
But we've already kind oftalked about your history, with
Breath of the Wild getting intoit.
But what about Zelda as a whole?

Speaker 2 (06:15):
Ooh, i got into it growing up, probably like middle
school.
I distinctly remember playingWind Waker on the GameCube,
loved the game.
Game didn't love me.
I got in like the final bossand it glitched And every time I
die it would respawn you withlike a heart and a half.

Speaker 1 (06:37):
You can't eat food in that game, and you?

Speaker 2 (06:38):
can't eat food in that game.
So I was like, ok, i guessthat's good enough.
I eventually did play WindWaker again when my sister moved
in with me and she brought theGameCube or not the GameCube the
Wii U, which I know people liketo not like on the Wii U, but
Wind Waker with the gamepad wasso much better.
It was so easy to like maneuveraround the map anyway.

Speaker 1 (07:00):
Yes, really good remaster too.

Speaker 2 (07:02):
Yeah, it was a really good remaster, so I eventually
did beat it.
It did glitch again, but wefixed it.
So I love Wind Waker.
Wind Waker doesn't love me.

Speaker 1 (07:12):
That's crazy.

Speaker 2 (07:13):
I played Twilight Princess on the Wii, which
Twilight Princess was myfavorite Zelda game prior to
Breath of the Wild.
So I love Twilight Princess.
I played that, i think, in highschool.
No, i played that after I movedout And then when, like I said,
my sister moved in with me fora couple years and she's like,
well, you never did Ocarina ofTime, so we're going to sit down

(07:35):
and play Ocarina.
So I played Ocarina of Time andthen I played Majora's Mask and
she like backsteed me throughall of that.
So, yeah, it started with WindWaker.
But I've just I've always lovedthe Zelda series.
I loved the characters, i lovedhow.
You know it's fun to discuss.
Is there a timeline?
Isn't there a timeline?
How are they all related?
Oh, i did play Skyward Sword.

(07:56):
We're not going to get into it.
Music is fantastic.
Yes, story I liked the gameplaynot so much, but I've played
through Skyward Sword.
I like I tend to 100 percent.
So I have 100 percent at all ofthese games.
I've done all the things,collected all the things.
So, yeah, i just really lovethe Zelda series.
The music is always fantastic,which for me is really important

(08:18):
in a game.
So it has good music.
The characters.
There's a familiarity, but theyalways do something a little
bit different with every game.
And that's what I really likedis like you have that
familiarity.
You know that there's going tobe Link, you know there's going
to be Zelda And you know you'regoing to be fighting Ganon and
it's going to have like a fightand then like kind of a gimmick
fight afterwards, and there's apredictability, but they always

(08:41):
find a way to do something newwith it.
So, yeah, i just I love theseries personally.

Speaker 1 (08:46):
Yeah, me too.
I'm right there with you.
I've probably mentioned my myhistory with the series a bunch
on on the show, so I don't needto go too deep into it.
But yeah, same same as you.
same games Twilight Princess,wind Waker all those are very
nostalgic for me.
They were the ones that Iplayed growing up.
Wind Waker was like the one Iprobably replayed the most.
I don't know, i had that, thatreplay ability to it, that

(09:09):
sometimes games games seem alittle bit too big or too
daunting.
It's like do I really want toreplay that right now?
But Wind Waker was always likethe right size.

Speaker 2 (09:17):
Yeah, definitely.

Speaker 1 (09:19):
So you mentioned music and you music is a very
important part of like who youare.
So it's not necessarily where Iusually start these
conversations, but I do thinkthat that was something I
noticed playing tears of thekingdom, when compared to Breath
of the Wild, was there was moremusic like Breath of the Wild.
They like intentionally mutedthings down.

(09:42):
This had a lot more.
At least I felt like it had alot more overworld music, a lot
more music while you were justdoing random things.
A lot more themes flowing inand out of gameplay.
Did you notice that?

Speaker 2 (09:55):
I definitely noticed that and I think it worked.
I always say that, like Breathof the Wild, music was perfect
for Breath of the Wild.
I don't think it would work inany other game.
It intentionally made you feelisolated, because that's what
you were, and now that the worldis a lot more vibrant, a lot
more alive, there's a lot morepeople floating about.
You're seeing interactionsbetween the different races, and

(10:20):
people are picking up thepieces from the calamity and are
doing new things.
So there's more reason to havemore music because there's more
to the world now.

Speaker 1 (10:34):
Yeah, that's a good point.
That's a really good point.
I really enjoyed the music andsome of it was just the fact
that there was more toexperience.
But then specifically I thinkwhen I went to the Rideau
village without going into toomany spoilers of what's going on
story-wise, you obviously knowthese things kind of follow a

(10:56):
pattern, but all of the racesare dealing with some sort of
struggle that Link has to kindof go in and help them, and so
while the Rideau were still inthat struggle mode, it was kind
of like this melancholy versionof their theme that I just
thought was really pretty.

Speaker 2 (11:10):
It was so good.
Yeah, i really liked it.
Yeah, i agree, definitely.
And that's what I really likeabout the music in these games
is that as the story evolves,the music tends to change a
little bit And the music is usedto tell the story.
You first encounter them in thegame and things aren't so great

(11:34):
And the music reflects that.
It's still the same theme.
You can still hear the Rideauvillage theme underneath, but
it's, like you said, a slightlymore melancholy version.
And then, obviously, as you fixthings, you get back to the
theme And I like that.
It is still the same theme, alittle bit like re-orchestration
, but it's still the same theme.
It's tying that familiarity in.

(11:55):
So I really it's just greatstorytelling through music.

Speaker 1 (12:00):
How do you feel about the fact that these games don't
have some musical instrumentthat Link actually possesses and
uses?

Speaker 2 (12:09):
That's a little sad.
Yeah, I think that's the onedown side and not being able to
pet a dog Still sad that wecan't pet the dogs.

Speaker 1 (12:17):
I know you can feed them and guide them with food.

Speaker 2 (12:21):
You can't pet the dog , so I was really hoping we
would have that in tears.
We didn't get it.
I think that's the one downsidecompared to the previous Zelda
iterations is that Link in thisone doesn't play instruments.
But again, not to get intospoilers, we get to hear some
more instrument playing.
So I'm like, oh, yay, yeah.

Speaker 1 (12:41):
The reason it's called Tears of the Kingdom is
because everybody's crying,because you can't pet the dog.

Speaker 2 (12:46):
Exactly.

Speaker 1 (12:47):
Sorry, spoilers.
So I guess kind of the firstbig thing to maybe kick this off
outside of music and we canjust kind of go from here.
But this game to me felt likemechanically it felt almost like
Breath of the Wild was theprototype, if you will.
And then this game they liketurned it all the way up to 11

(13:08):
with the tool sets, with whatyou can do with the puzzles,
with.
I thought the shrines were alot better, more like more
interesting puzzles.
I guess I really liked UltraHand and all the crafting and
all the stuff you could doAscend.
Any game that doesn't haveAscend in it now is going to
feel super clunky.

Speaker 2 (13:27):
That's such a good ability.
I was a little skeptical withthe Ascend.
I knew it was going to beuseful, obviously, but now that
it's here, i'm like, ooh, theydid some really interesting
puzzles using the Ascend, andthe Koroks use the Ascend too,
and I'm just like, ooh, that'sokay, i like this.

(13:48):
I was a little skeptical, but Ithink they utilized it really
well.

Speaker 1 (13:53):
Yeah, when you look at it in the lineup of all of
the abilities that you have atyour disposal, it seems very
simple and almost like it islacking compared to what some of
the others can do.
But there were so many times inBreath of the Wild where I would
see somewhere I wanted to goand it's like well, i guess I'm
going to eat a bunch of stuff,i'm going to eat a bunch of
stamina food and I'm going toslowly climb up this wall and

(14:14):
I'm going to get to where I'mgoing This one.
There's probably a way you canjust teleport through to get to
the top almost instantly.
There was one time I teleportedbasically through the entire
world and it does it in realtime, so you just kind of wait
for Link to work his way back up, but it's so helpful And then
when you pop up at the top, youhave the option to say whoops,

(14:36):
didn't mean to do this.
You can actually go back downor you can jump out, which I
thought was a really nice touch,because if you just popped
right out and you were like, ohno, this is what I meant to do.

Speaker 2 (14:45):
That could have been a problem.
That's been really helpful,because another thing that they
introduced in the world is caves.
It's not like introducing, butthey've expanded the world a
little bit more by utilizing acave system, And sometimes in
the caves there's multiplelayers, so you would ascend to
see if there's another secondlevel to this cave.

(15:07):
Or I could always tell, allright, yeah, I hit the second
level, or it's going for a while.
I'm like, nope, I'm going tothe top of this mountain.
Yeah, I really liked to be likeno, I want to stay in the cave.
I just thought, just exploring,that there was a second level.
So, yeah, I really appreciatedthat for sure.

Speaker 1 (15:25):
Yeah, that seems like one of the biggest things that
a lot of other games areprobably going to copy in the
future, like the glider was andclimbing was from Breath of the
Wild, because I don't see a lotof games necessarily copying
views and Ultra Hand and stuff.
That's pretty specific andseems like it'd be pretty
challenging.
but ascend is one of those likequality of life things that

(15:45):
people are going to be like.
Oh, this feels like it's alittle like it's missing
something in a post-heres of thekingdom world?
Yeah, when it comes to likeUltra Hand, did you get super
crazy with it and veryexperimental with your crafting?
because I'm much more bruteforce kind of guy.
I'm the kind of guy that wouldjust stick eight logs together

(16:08):
end by end to just be able toslowly walk up a ramp I built to
get to the thing I need to getto.
I'm not building robots oranything crazy like that.

Speaker 2 (16:16):
I haven't done anything super, super crazy.
Thank you for watching.
I pretty much build what I needto get the job done.
So if it just happens to be areally long bridge, then it's a
really long bridge full of thethings that just happen to be
laying around.
I did I Limcube did a video onlike a little flying machine.
It's like two fans with acontrol stick so that you can

(16:39):
like get more vertical heightand you can either go up or
across.
I think that's the craziestI've gone and that was more just
like helping navigate the skyislands more than anything.
I haven't really used itoutside of that.
So, no, i'm very utilitarian,just, oh, here's a puzzle I need

(17:00):
to build something for.
Okay, cool, let me build it andmove on, but I'm not like
trying to build like the robotsand no, that's not me.

Speaker 1 (17:08):
Yeah, so it sounds like we're pretty similar there.
I built a lot of likemonstrosities and you know
there's the guy holding thesigns.
Yeah, you have to help him keepthe signs up.
Some of the things that I threwtogether to keep that sign up
looked absolutely ridiculous.

Speaker 2 (17:24):
Oh, yeah, absolutely Absolutely.
I liked that.
I really like Addison.
I like the little signs.
They're fun little puzzles.
I'm usually not great with likethe 3D spatial awareness
puzzles, but they've been reallyfun to like, try to figure out
and like.
sometimes they're like on ahillside, So like you only need

(17:46):
like one thing.
Other times they're like it's alittle tiny point on a flat
surface and you have to likebuild a contraption to keep it
up.
So it's.
I really liked the addition ofAddison.
It's been fun.

Speaker 1 (17:58):
Did you find yourself using fuse?

Speaker 2 (18:01):
a lot, a lot, all the time For weapons, yeah, all the
time.
Like that's the only way to getgood weapons honestly is by
fusing, and I think I made someof the early bosses that I
fought more difficult because Iwasn't utilizing it as much.
But once I started to realizethat, like you're not going to

(18:23):
find good weapons for the mostpart, that really to get those
big damage numbers you have tofuse a good like a boss monster
part to a weapon, so that'smostly what I use it for.
I thought I would be utilizing,like doing the gems on weapons
for like the fire and stuff, butI have one that I made forever

(18:48):
ago and it's still going strong,so it's like I don't even need
to do that very often.
Like those weapons seem to lastforever.
Like I'm just now starting tobreak some weapons that I made
earlier in my game, so I feellike the durability has greatly
increased, especially whenyou're fusing monster parts to

(19:08):
them.

Speaker 1 (19:09):
Yeah, i think fusing helps with the durability a lot.
I did the same thing with thegems and there's a couple points
where I was very glad I did,where having like a water staff
was very, very helpful.
Yes, and then the last kind oftool I guess that you get with,
the last big one for puzzlesolving is recall That one was a

(19:30):
lot more situational, i feellike.

Speaker 2 (19:32):
Yeah Yeah, that's not one I utilize unless the
situation calls for That's nottrue?
I lied.
There is a little trick that Istarted doing with the wings.
So what I'll do is I'll likeI'll use the Ultra Hand, i'll
lift it up and push it out overthe cliff a little bit, bring it
back and then put it down, andthen I'll use recall And then,

(19:55):
as it's out over the cliff, i'llcancel the recall and then that
way you can start gliding offthe cliff with the wing, because
otherwise you have to like putit on a sled, and that sometimes
gets caught on things whenyou're just trying to get off
the cliff and out.
So, yeah, i started doing that alittle bit, so I'm finding a
little bit more uses for it, butthey're still very situational,

(20:17):
which I think is what it'sreally intended for.

Speaker 1 (20:21):
Yeah, that's a good idea.
with the wings, i remember thefirst time I found like those
gliders.
I spent probably 30 to 45minutes trying to figure out how
to get this thing to because Ididn't have any wheels to like
go down this slope and take offand take me where I needed to go
.
So I tried probably three orfour different contraptions.

(20:42):
Ideas kept diving to my deathkept and my four-year-old
sitting there watching me askingwhy I keep dying And I'm like I
don't know, i'm trying my besthere And that was like early on
in the game.
But I like that about the gamethat it was the mechanics and
stuff it introduced and the juststuff that it would leave

(21:04):
around in the environment.
You're kind of always thinkinglike what can I do with this?
How can I get where I'm goingin a either more efficient way
or a faster way?
There was a point where I hadto get to the very top of like
the Zoro domain And I just founda glider like that near some
water.
So I put some fans on it and acontrol stick and dropped it in

(21:27):
the water.
I was like I wonder if it'lltake off from here, if it's just
going to sink And when I got on, sure enough, it started
skimming.
The water went up in there.
I just flew right to the top ofthe mountain, passing all the
enemies and everything.
This game is amazing.

Speaker 2 (21:40):
It's so good, yeah, and it's been fun to see what
other people are doing in theirgames and like getting ideas.
I had to buy two copies.
I got my son a copy for hisswitch because his birthday was
a couple days before the gamecame out, and that was the one
thing he wanted for his birthday.
I was like, all right, now Idon't have to fight my own kid
for game time.

(22:00):
So we ended up getting twocopies, so it's been really fun.
He'll watch me play a littlebit and then he'll go play and
be like, hey, did you try this?
So it's everyone I know.
I know so many people who playBreath of the Wild who are
obviously playing this.
So it's been fun to be like,hey, how far did you get?
Oh, i didn't think of tryingthat, let me try that when I get

(22:22):
there.
So it's just like the.
This is what I missed aboutBreath of the Wild is the
collaborative nature of so manynew people playing it and so
many different approaches tosolving the same things.
And my husband is playing it,but he still is just going and
fighting Lionels.
He just wants to go fight allthe mini bosses And I think he's

(22:42):
done a couple of dungeons And Idon't even know if he'll finish
it.
But that's all he really caredabout me.
I'm doing all the things.
I'm going to get all the Koroks, i'm going to do all the signs,
i'm going to get all the sidequests, because I have to, and
all the shrines and all thecaves and all of that stuff.
And the other people are like,yeah, i just want to see what
the game has And I'll pick up acouple of side quests, and then

(23:03):
you have the people who aremaking Korok torture devices.
Yeah.
That's always one to grace myTwitter feed.
And then you have the peoplewho are making robots.
And how can I make a bigger andbetter robot to kill this one
little bit cobblin in the middleof a field?

Speaker 1 (23:21):
Exactly, yeah, and so many games?
not so many.
But there are those big gamesthat come out where it's like a
lot of people are playing themat the same time.
I think of Elden Ring and youcan do things in a different way
.
But there's only so much youcould do differently in Elden
Ring You could discover thingsat a different rate or at
different times or maybe in aslightly different order, but

(23:42):
this game you can do completelydifferent.
Like Joe, who's been on theshow a few times, he went a
completely different route thanI did.
Starting the game.
I started in Gerudo and I thinkI didn't ever go to like
Hacariko Village until I wasprobably 60-something hours into
my game.

Speaker 2 (24:02):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (24:03):
And he went there almost immediately.
And it's just very few games.
Can you be that different inhow you play and approach even
just the structure of the game,let alone how you solve the
puzzles, how you do combat, whatthings you choose to build,
what outfits and gear and stuffyou choose to wear?
do you engage with cooking?

(24:24):
There's just so much there.

Speaker 2 (24:26):
Yeah, and I think that's what makes this game
really great And same withBreath of the Wild.
It was truly open world.
You can do anything in anyorder.
You can choose not to do stuff.
You can just like if you justwanted to run around and fight
things, then cool, do that.
And it's like finding thedifferent weapons And now it's

(24:48):
like combining the differentweapons and like the different
cooking like they've added moreingredients to stuff, so like
you have even more options forcooking, and it's just.
There's not very many gameslike that And I'm loving it.
It's just it's great.

(25:08):
Like I said, i love thecollaborative nature of just
seeing everyone's very differentapproaches to playing.

Speaker 1 (25:15):
Yeah.
So along with the kind ofexpanded tool set or slightly
different tool set and way thatinteracts with the world, that
Link gets to use in this gameit's the same map, which I feel
is understating it when peoplejust say, oh yeah, it reuses the
map from Breath of the Wildbecause there's the sky, there's

(25:36):
Hyrule, there's the underground, but Hyrule I still was like,
was this, like this in the firstgame?
And you probably didn't havethis as much because you have
like a million hours in Breathof the Wild So you're probably a
bit more familiar with the map,but for me I was like I don't
remember this, or I don'tremember this being here.
I don't remember this lookinglike this, and so even Hyrule
didn't feel like a one to onecopy.

Speaker 2 (25:58):
It really wasn't.
I mean a lot of like.
The major landmarks are verysimilar, like the dueling peaks,
like you have, the twomountains Yeah, that's the same.
Kakariko's in the same spot,Like you have, you know, Rideau
Village is in the same spot,Like the general big things are
all the same, but theydefinitely added some new

(26:18):
elements.
Some things have been moved,like some of the stables aren't
necessarily the same.
Some of them have been moved.
They've added some newlandmarks, Like there's like
there's like I said, I like itbecause there's a familiarity.
It's nice to go back and belike I remember there was
something here last time.
Is there still something here?
And what has changed?

(26:39):
So yeah, there's definitelysome some noticeable differences
, which is fun to explore.
It's like I remember this, butno, this is, they did something
a little bit different here.

Speaker 1 (26:50):
Yeah, i loved that about exploring Hyrule, about
having kind of, for me, a littlebit more foggy memory of where,
how it was before, and thenseeing because the world changed
, because, like we touched onearlier, the world changed
because time has passed, peopleare rebuilding, they're getting
on with their lives, but alsolike stuff went up into the sky

(27:11):
and stuff fell from the sky Andso there's also a bit of
disaster in this world again.
But I also really enjoyed, fromlike a story and character
perspective, like revisiting allthese places and seeing where
the people from Breath of theWild were now and what was
happening in these villages andwhat was happening with the
characters that you helped thefirst time around.
And that that was one of myfavorite things, probably

(27:34):
story-wise was going back andlike revisiting all the people
and places from the first game.

Speaker 2 (27:40):
Oh yeah, that's been so much fun because it's fun to
see their reactions, because,obviously, without getting too
deep into the story, but, likeyou know, stuff goes down.
So when they see you they'relike, oh wow, like you're here,
cool, like can you help me.
It's like it's great thatyou're alive, but also I'm

(28:03):
having a bit of a problem.
Yes, exactly, so it's beenreally fun to like, see, like
everyone's reactions, becauseyou know, some of the characters
haven't seen Link in a while,not because of like the story,
but because, like the time gapbetween, obviously, breath of
the Wild and Tyr.
So it's just like, oh, wow,it's been a while since I've
seen you.
How have you been?
Oh, i guess Zelda's missing, sowhat's going on with that?

(28:28):
Also, i have this, can you helpme?
So it's I really like that,it's, it's fun.
It's just it's fun storytellingand it's fun to see everyone's
reactions and it's fun to seewhat they've been up to since we
last saw them.

Speaker 1 (28:40):
How did you feel about the sky stuff?

Speaker 2 (28:43):
I haven't really fully explored it.
Personally, i feel like it's alittle bare.
I feel like they could havedone a little bit more with it,
other than the Great Skyland.
Obviously there's a lot on that, but that's like the tutorial
area, so of course it's going tohave a lot.
I feel like they probably couldhave done a little bit more
with it, had a little bit moreto explore.

(29:05):
I like what they did with thelabyrinths, where it's like all
the levels, which is really cool, but other than that, i feel
like it was a little bit bare,but thankfully it's not as big.
Obviously it covers the map, butit's not the same square
footage of the ground, so I feellike they could have done a

(29:27):
little bit more with it.

Speaker 1 (29:29):
Yeah, i feel like I totally get what you're saying.
I think that that just going upand exploring and bouncing from
island to island and stufffeels a little bit like oh,
there's some neat things up herebut it's not, i guess, anything
too mind-blowing.
But I did think that basicallyeverything story or main dungeon

(29:50):
related that happened in thesky was incredible.

Speaker 2 (29:54):
Yeah, that was great What they did with that.
Yeah, like you said, thestory-wise, the main dungeon,
that was all great.
I think they utilized that verywell.
But the random little islandsjust didn't leave a whole lot to
explore.
So it's just like, well, i'mgoing to come here because I
know there's a shrine and I'mgoing to get the shrine and cool

(30:15):
puzzle, but I'm on this littlerandom rock island and there's
nothing here, so I didn't reallyneed to come here.
So I think that's my onlycriticism.
At least, with the sky, thestory beats fantastic.
The general exploration notreally needed.

Speaker 1 (30:33):
Yeah, so we mentioned , i mentioned there's an
underground and it's notsomething that's really talked
about in a lot of promotionalstuff, and so if you want to go
into that completely blind, i'llhave time stamps and you can
skip ahead.
But I'm going to ask now whatdid you think of the underground
?

Speaker 2 (30:50):
Oh, it was so spooky and I loved it.

Speaker 1 (30:53):
Yeah, i didn't know about it.
Going into the game I hadn'tbeen spoiled on it at all, and
so the first time they told meto go down there I had no idea
that it was going to be theentire map.
Again, basically I thoughtmaybe it would be kind of like
the sky, maybe a few littleholes here and there that were
kind of locked off and secluded,which some of them are to a

(31:14):
certain point.
I don't think you can go fromend to end.
But yeah, it was very spooky.
I like what they did with thelight and the music.
Again, the music helped a lotdown there make it spooky, and
then those freaking handmonsters.
It really added a lot oftension.

Speaker 2 (31:30):
That gloom, hand scared.
I don't even think I firstencountered it underground.
I encountered it in a cave andit scared the crap out of me
because I was just exploring andall of a sudden things got dark
and I'm getting attacked.
I'm like what is going on rightnow?
And then I finally beat it andthe thing that I don't want to

(31:51):
spoil it, but the thing thatpops out afterwards I was just
like they did what?
What is this?
I mean I like Slyvamaj, but Iwas just like, and then I had my
butt handed to me.
She's like okay, we're notdoing this again.

Speaker 1 (32:09):
Yeah, they reminded me there were hands like that.
There have been hands like thatin past games, but I remember
there were some in Wind Waker Ithink it was the temple that you
did where you're moving themirrors and the lights and stuff
around and those hands wouldcome out of the ground and grab
you.

Speaker 2 (32:26):
Yeah, Yeah, they're kind of like the homage to the
dead hands in OOT.
That's what I was thinking too.
Yeah, that too.
So, yeah, i definitely feltmore throwbacks to the older
games and all of the armor thatwas kind of hard to get in the
Amiibo and Breath of the Wildare now you can just find it,

(32:47):
which is really cool.
It's fun to see all of the oldarmor from previous games and
you can run around as TwilightPrincess Link if you really
wanted to, and that's fun.
So, yeah, the underground wasjust like it's dark, it's scary.
things are a little bitspookier and hit a little bit
harder and I like it.

(33:09):
But I mean, i love thataesthetic.
I mean I have Halloweendecorations up here around in my
house, so, like anything likedark and spooky, i'm like, oh
yes, i'm here for this.

Speaker 1 (33:18):
Yeah, and then the kind of the twist to it was that
the enemies down there, anytimeyou touch the gloom or the
enemies that had it on them, itwould like permanently remove
your hearts until you either atesomething that would bring
those hearts back or you wouldget to essentially the map
markers for underground and theywould send out a really bright

(33:39):
light for that area and then itwould fix your hearts.
It wouldn't refill them, itwould repair them and then you
had to refill them with food orwhatever you had.
So that was an interesting kindof risk and reward mechanic of
like how much should.
I really want to explore andpoke around before I get to the
next kind of safe spot, becauseI'm losing hearts here if I'm

(34:01):
getting hit.
So I thought that all of thatkind of work together to make me
kind of always on edge andalways pushing forward to the
next goal and not really tryingto dilly-dally too much when I
was underground.

Speaker 2 (34:14):
Yeah, i really liked it.
It was.
you definitely felt a littlebit of that sense of urgency,
but you're also like I want toexplore, like what if there's
something good down here?
and there's a couple of likereally good things that you find
down there?
So it's like, well, i want toexplore it.
but I'm also I only have eighthearts and four of them are no,

(34:36):
i can't refill.
So it's like do I just go tothe service and heal, maybe make
some food, or do I like can Ithink I can get to the next
checkpoint and get that refilled?
and definitely keeps you onyour toes And I like that.
it's fun, because there's notbeen anything quite like that in
any game that I've played.

Speaker 1 (34:57):
No, I mean not with the risk and reward, necessarily
.
I do think it's interestingthat both Elden Ring and Tears
of the Kingdom both had kind oflike surprise underground
sections that were like bigmoments.
That's like, were these guystalking to each other?
What happened?

Speaker 2 (35:13):
I definitely think that.
I mean, i don't know whereTears was in its development
when Elden Ring came out.
My theory is Tears came outlater because I didn't want to
compete with Elden Ring for Gameof the Year.
That's why we got it this year,not last year.
That's my conspiracy theory.
So I don't know where they werein development.
But you can definitely, havingplayed both, you can see that

(35:37):
they kind of played off of eachother.
It seemed like Elden Ringdefinitely took some ideas from
Breath of the Wild previouslyAnd again it seems like Tears
took some elements from EldenRing as well.
And I mean cool, awesome.
Everyone really liked theunderground reveal in Elden Ring

(35:57):
.
I think Elden Ring did it alittle bit better.
But I think, no, chron isstunningly like, visually just
stunning.
I loved it.
I just I want that painted.
I want that color palette formy walls.
It was just stunning.
So I think they did it a littlebit better.
But Tears definitely had thatsurprise element of like oh no,

(36:18):
there's this whole world'sunderground and it has its own
ecosystem And you're seeing thesame enemies, but they hit a
little bit harder Now that whenthey hit you, like you said,
you're losing your hearts untilyou can fix it.
So it just had that like ohcrap.

(36:38):
Moment, which is just I lovestuff like that.
It's so good.
This is why I play video games.

Speaker 1 (36:44):
Yes, exactly, this is one of those like just extra
special video games that remindsyou kind of like the highs that
games can hit sometimes.

Speaker 2 (36:53):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (36:54):
So the way this the game looks pretty much like
Breath of the Wild.
They didn't change too muchhere, which I think Breath of
the Wild looks great.
I think it's a good art style.
I think I'm not tired of it yet.
I think it really helps thegame that is doing so much run
on the Switch that it's gettingpretty old at this point.

(37:14):
I think the game ran remarkablywell.
I had a few there are a fewareas where I noticed like slow
down, but for the most part Iwas pretty impressed with how
well this game ran, especiallywith all the stuff it was
letting you stick together andexperiment with and Oh yeah,
especially because, like youknow, it takes a lot to develop,

(37:35):
for I think you can stick 100things together, i think, or 99
is the max amount of things thatyou can stick together.

Speaker 2 (37:43):
If I were, i haven't tried to reach that limit.

Speaker 1 (37:45):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (37:46):
I think that's just kind of what I've read.
I think it's mostly peopletrying to collect as many Koroks
as they can to do very meanthings to them.
But, like you know, the game isaccounting for all of that.
It has to account for, like theweird things that people are
putting together that like Idon't know.
obviously it's intended, butlike you don't know, but someone

(38:10):
else is going to come up withif you're not thinking in that
respect.
So yeah, i haven't had anyissues with it running.
I like the art style.
I think it works for this game.
I think it looks really good.
But then again, like I said, imostly play Nintendo.
like Switch is my main, is myonly console.
I have a PC but I don't playmany games outside of like the

(38:33):
Nintendo ecosystem.
And when I do, like I don'tknow, i'm not really a graphics
snob.
Like does the graph?
like does the look fit the gameCool, does it run?
well?
Great, i'm pretty easy to keephappy.

Speaker 1 (38:52):
Yeah, and I think a good art style will age better
than you know high end graphics,because that's always getting
better.
So that's why Wind Waker stilllooks amazing, because they went
for a art style, an artdirection rather than you know.
That's probably why TwilightPrincess arguably might age.

(39:13):
The worst is because they weregoing for a bit more of that
realism.
But yeah.
So we can kind of tie these twopoints together as we head
towards spoilers here in aminute, But just generally in
keeping it kind of broad andspoiler free.
Like one of the complaintsabout Breath of the Wild was
that some people didn't like theDivine Beast as much as like

(39:37):
the dungeons of the older games.
So kind of what did you thinkabout what?
how they addressed that, thechanges they did to the dungeons
in this game, and then anygeneral thoughts on like the
story overall, before we put ahard dividing line in this
conversation and go freely withour thoughts.

Speaker 2 (39:56):
Yeah, i think they addressed it a little bit, but
probably not enough for mostpeople whose complaints were
that the like the Divine Beastswere the Divine Beasts And not
the dungeons that we, thatpeople, have grown accustomed to
in previous 3D Zelda's.
So I think they like moved theneedle in the direction of it

(40:21):
being closer, but it's stillvery much like Divine
Beast-esque, like you're stillgoing in, you're still like
activating terminals,essentially, and then you're
fighting a boss.
But you know they I don't wantto spoil it, but like they moved
we'll talk about, i'm surewe'll talk about when we get to
the spoiler section but theymoved the needle a little bit,

(40:42):
but it's still very much.
If you're like I missedtraditional 3D Zelda dungeons,
you're not getting it in thisgame And I'm okay with that, but
you know that's what you'relooking for.
You're not getting it.

Speaker 1 (40:53):
I agree, and I think the direction that they moved
the needle in that regard ismore like thematically, like
each dungeon has its own themenow feels a little bit more
based around its region.
And then I thought that theways in which because you're
right, like the core dungeonstill functions essentially the
same, because you know in theold games you would go halfway

(41:14):
through with small keys andstuff And then you'd fight a
mini boss to get the item youneeded to do the back half of
the dungeon, then you'd fightthe main boss.
Well, you can't really do thatwhen they give you all of your
tools at the beginning of thegame.

Speaker 2 (41:25):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (41:25):
But I thought the way they expanded like what was
around the dungeon or how yougot to the dungeon kind of added
a little bit more of that freeflowing puzzle solving And then
it felt like I was in thedungeon and doing dungeon
activities before I got to likethe core part where they're like

(41:46):
, okay, now go turn on theterminals or whatever.
So I thought that they did agood job of flavoring, but at
its core, yeah, it's not notreally that different, but I do
think that the bosses were muchbetter.

Speaker 2 (41:59):
I do like the bosses.
Yeah, the bosses definitely fitthe theme of the dungeons.
You definitely, i guess I gotsome of those homages to
previous Zelda games, which isreally like it's nice when, like
, they take something thatyou've seen before but they like
rework it So it's new, butyou're like I see the
inspiration for it, so I reallyliked that.

(42:21):
But, yeah, i completely agree,it's.
There was a little bit morelead up to the actual dungeon
itself, but I think, again, idon't mind that And I think
that's what you need if you wanta truly open world game.

Speaker 1 (42:35):
Right.

Speaker 2 (42:35):
You can't really have things progressive And it's
still be open world.
Like if it's open worlds thenyou know, some person might do
that first, immediately aftergetting out, like getting off
the tutorial, And some peoplemight do it 60 hours in when
they have a bunch of experienceand have a bunch of good weapons

(42:56):
.
So like you kind of have tobalance for that in some
respects.
And yeah, I'm sure some peoplecan argue that like yeah, you
could still do it And you'reright, they move the needle a
little bit closer to it.
But I really liked it.
I like what they did, but Ididn't.
That wasn't one of mycomplaints of the game, So Right
.

Speaker 1 (43:14):
And what did you think about the story?
just kind of overall.

Speaker 2 (43:17):
I really liked the story.
It was a good story, i thinkkind of the lead up to the final
boss was really good.
There was kind of a twist to itwhich I really liked.
And then like the final, likegimmick boss best of the Zelda
series, my favorite, absolutelyloved it.
I'm so glad it wasn't spoiledfor me because it was like,

(43:41):
getting to that moment, i'm justlike, oh, we're going there.
Oh, yes, like this iseverything I wanted.
It's like everything I didn'tknow I needed in my life.
I was just like, okay, this was.
I was like I don't know howthey're ever going to talk this,
because this is just too good.
So I really I really liked it.
I liked the story.
I liked that it seemed like theNPCs were a little bit more

(44:04):
invested in the story to, whichwas really nice.
I think that's a nice littledivergence from previous Zelda
games Because I just like moreNPCs were like saying, oh my
gosh, like what happened toZelda?
Are you looking for her?
Like what you know is what canwe do?

(44:25):
Like how can we find Zelda?
What else is going on?
Whereas, like previous games,it's just like some of them are
like didn't even know Zelda wasmissing, so like.
So I really liked that.

Speaker 1 (44:38):
Yeah, it felt well.
For one, it felt like a sequel,because it felt like all these
people are kind of aware of whoyou are and who Zelda is and all
that.
It wasn't like Link's originstory, like so many of the older
games, which is nice, but yeah,then just the, the NPCs in
general around the world, butthen also just like the, the
core cast of characters that youinteract with and that are

(45:00):
helping you.
I felt like we're more involvedand more included this time
around.
And I didn't I didn't reallylove the kind of lead up to the
final boss like playing it, butI thought like thematically and
what was happening was supercool, i was playing it.
I was like man, this is a lot,but but I really I liked what

(45:22):
they were going for as far as,like, the story and the
characters were going wereconcerned.

Speaker 2 (45:29):
Yeah So.

Speaker 1 (45:30):
I think that's probably good for spoiler free.
We will take a quick break here, listen to some Zelda music
more than likely And then whenwe come back it will be spoilers
for Tears of the Kingdom.
A people put some of Katie'sZelda music in there.

Speaker 2 (45:47):
I did cover the tears theme, so All right, we are

(46:31):
back.

Speaker 1 (46:31):
full spoilers.
There's a lot to talk abouthere.
So much to talk.
I don't know, i don't know howwe're going to get to all of it.
But I mean, would you rather Iguess I don't know, it's all
kind of intermingled.
I was going to say, would yourather kind of touch on like
gameplay stuff, or would yourather kind of touch on story
stuff?
Because I was thinking like inmy head, asking that question
specifically about how they,they changed.

(46:51):
You don't just get abilities now, you have like the characters
or like the spirits of thecharacters running around with
you, but that's that's likestory and gameplay, so it's all
kind of like intermingled.
Where do you want to start?
Where would you kick this off?

Speaker 2 (47:03):
I think that's probably a good place to start
is like not only do you get theabilities, but like you get
little ghost versions of thechampions or, i guess, the sages
running around And let me tellyou, Tulan has saved my butt on
more than one occasion, likegetting that, getting that crit
hit.
Yes, So I was not expecting it.

(47:26):
So that was like a nice littlesurprise, Like I was.
I was like there's going to bean ability, I'm going to get an
ability, But I was not expectinglike help, like having little
characters running around.
So I like it and I don't Like.
It definitely feels morecollaborative.
It fits with tiers where thingsare like more we're all in this

(47:48):
together, But also sometimesthey just get in the way and I'm
just like I don't want to likedismiss you, because I do want
to use you in like two seconds,but like just get out of the way
, because I really just want you, nobo, to knock down this rock,
this rock wall.
And I don't need read you sendout an electrical.

Speaker 1 (48:10):
Yeah, that was my thing was like how many times
that I accidentally charged theelectricity when I was trying to
like pick something up orwhatever, and it was like, okay,
yeah, but I did, i did Gerudofirst.
For some reason I went thatdirection and so that was the
start of the story for me, whichis a little bit odd.
I mean, you obviously it'sdesigned to be kind of told in

(48:33):
any direction, but I would tellanybody to go to the Rideau
Village first.

Speaker 2 (48:37):
That's what I did.

Speaker 1 (48:38):
Because, like you mentioned, getting the crit and
combat, but for navigation, forexploration, having that gust so
helpful, so good.

Speaker 2 (48:48):
It's so helpful I thought I would like.
I sometimes miss Ravalli's Galewith the vertical but, like I
also find when I'm going back toBreath of the Wild that I like
I'm trying to go forward like oh, that's wrong game.

Speaker 1 (48:59):
Yeah, and well, there's so many more ways to go
vertical in tiers now, like youcan find a rock and shoot
yourself up into space, or a fanor a rocket or anything like
that, and you know.
So that stuff can help you gohorizontal as well.
But that little gust saved meso many times when I was like
platforming or trying to glidefrom one little spot to another.
Yeah, so I thought I thoughtthe Sage is really cool And I

(49:23):
guess kind of tying into that.
So this game, in the first gameyou're kind of assisting the
memories of the champions, ornot the memories, like the
spirits of the champions, andthen they kind of become one
with the divine beasts and allthat, but they're still from the
past.
In this game you're helpingpeople in your own timeline, but

(49:43):
that doesn't mean there's not asecond timeline, because Zelda
ends up getting sent back to thepast and becoming the Sage of
Time in that time period whereapparently the world as we know
it today came from the elderrace of goat people.
Yeah, hooking up with theHylians, which is, you know,

(50:06):
that is what it is.

Speaker 2 (50:07):
But we're not going to think about that too much,
we're just going to roll with it.

Speaker 1 (50:13):
Yeah, it's, yeah, it is what it is.
But I, you know, aside fromthat, i thought that for one
thing, i thought they did thememories a lot better in this
game as far as being able tofind them without basically
having to look them up or justexploring every square inch of
the map.
And then I thought that thestory it told was super
interesting, the way it all tiedtogether.

(50:34):
I was I don't want to say moreinvested in the story because I
thought Breath of the Wild hadlike a good mystery to it.
But you kind of knew, like youknew exactly what had happened
before Link went down.
Maybe not specifically, but youhad an idea of what went, what
happened before he was out.
And now you know thatultimately you have to go fight
Ganon.
You know where he is, you knowwhat he's doing.

(50:55):
This game I was like I reallydon't know where we're going
with this.
Like, yeah, it's, it's kind ofthere's a lot more unknowns And
I guess in this game you canstill theoretically just go
straight to Ganon and fight himif you want to, but it's not
presented to you that way, it'snot presented as an obvious
option like it in the first game.

(51:15):
There's the castle, it's rightthere, if you want to go knock
yourself out, but in this gameit felt much more like no, you
need to go on the journey first.

Speaker 2 (51:26):
Yeah, i really I definitely enjoyed the journey
because you know it got you tolook out landing.
You got to meet Pura like youknow Pura's life goals, and then
it, you know it like sent youto the depths and there's like,
well, guess what, there's a newSage.

(51:46):
So like, go find this new Sage.
And it's like you go to thecastle and you think, like
that's what I did.
I was like, okay, i'm going tothe castle, i'm going to, i'm
going to beat the game tonight.
And then you realize he's notthere.
You guys do more stuff And Iwas like I'm beating it tomorrow
.
Well, played, well played.

(52:07):
I think I ended up beating itlike the next day, which I liked
that.
That was a twist, because youexpect, like that's how all the
Zelda's were.
You went to the castle, youdefeated Ganon in the end, but
no, it's just like he's notthere.
You got to, you got to figureout where he's at And like once
you think about it, you're like,okay, that's obvious where he's
at, but the journey it took youon to get there, i was just

(52:31):
like I really liked it.
There was like an element likea mystery game, like you were
trying to piece the puzzle, putthe puzzle pieces together of
like where is he, what is goingon, what's the end goal?
And it's just, it was fun, itwas fun.

Speaker 1 (52:47):
Yeah, i loved the journey.
I think that probably my leastfavorite part was that, like
final sage, that was underground, that became a mech.
I was like I mean this, i hadfun with the mech, the gameplay
was kind of fun.
But at that point I, like youwas, i thought that I was going
to have beaten it at that pointAnd it was like, oh no, we're

(53:08):
doing all this here.
So maybe that was it And I wasjust trying to see that how it
ended.
But also I was, i guess, alittle it shouldn't have really
thrown me for a loop based onall the like technology and
stuff we'd been doing up to thatpoint.
But then the fact that she gotput into a mech and then you're
like controlling the mech and islike, oh okay, we're doing this
, But the other four I loved, ithink that.

(53:31):
So I did Gerudo Rideau and thenI did the why can't I think of
the water people's names?

Speaker 2 (53:41):
Zora.

Speaker 1 (53:41):
Yeah, i did the Zora And then I the last ones I did
were the Gorons, which I don'tknow if that's how I'd recommend
people do it, but for somereason I don't know if I just
wanted to be different from howI did it in Breath of the Wild
or what but, i, was like I'mjust going to go this way, So I
had the electric power whichhelped a lot in combat, but it

(54:02):
was that boss was really toughearly on in the game So that was
a bit rough.
But anyways, i think that theZoras I feel like Sidon kind of
got the weakest story in myopinion, like his stuff felt
like the least fleshed out andthe least, i don't know,
impactful It was still.
I still really liked thedungeon.

Speaker 2 (54:24):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (54:25):
But I felt like his character stuff wasn't as strong
as the others.

Speaker 2 (54:29):
Yeah, i could see that.
Yeah, i agree, the dungeon waspretty cool.
I kind of liked some of theanti-gravity and traveling
around in the bubble.
Those yeah, that was fun, itwas interesting.

Speaker 1 (54:41):
When I got off of that dungeon and Link was just
hopping again, I was like man, Ireally missed those slow, long
jumps like you're on the moon.
Yeah, I thought that was cool.

Speaker 2 (54:50):
So good, but yeah, i definitely think that story was
probably the weakest out of allof them.

Speaker 1 (54:56):
But, like we were talking about earlier in the
spoiler-free section, that wewere dancing around.
So the dungeons are all kind ofthemed now around their region
and around their characters.
So you have, like the Zora isall about the water has been
polluted.
You have to figure out what'scausing it.
It's coming from the sky,because everything is coming
from the sky right now.
And then, yeah, you get upthere and it's like ultimately,

(55:20):
yeah, the actual core dungeon isjust you're kind of solving
some puzzles, you're flippingsome switches and then you're
fighting a boss which was such aweird boss.

Speaker 2 (55:29):
It's such a weird.
I looked at it and I was justlike what I'm like, what are we
doing?

Speaker 1 (55:34):
But then you get to it and it's like, oh, but also
you have like bubbles you cantravel through and it's kind of
like way less gravity up here,and so just it was like every
dungeon had that little twist toit that just made it so much
more fun, in my opinion.
I thought that the Rideau wasincredible.
The ship stuff and flying upthrough the air and jumping on

(55:56):
the like trampolines Oh god.

Speaker 2 (55:59):
I loved it.
That was just.
I was like, oh, this is likekid heart right here, exactly
Like just who doesn't want tojump on a giant trampoline and
go flying hundreds of feet inthe air and landing on the next
giant trampoline?
Like that's just.
It was so much fun.
I think the lead up to it was alittle bit long.
I could have done with a littleless with the jumping, but it

(56:22):
was just, it was so much fun Andit's just like a giant boat in
the sky, like I felt like sandship from Skyward Sword.
Again, it's like that littlenod like if you know, you know,
and I like that you needed thechampion to unlock the, to
unlock the terminals, so likethat's where I was kind of

(56:44):
alluding to, like the homage toprevious one where, like, you
needed a tool to solve thepuzzles, but like, it's still
very much like okay, well, ihave the tool, i'm coming into
the dungeon with the tool tounlock it, but so, like it moved
the needle but it's still verymuch like Divine Beast ask.
But the little tweaks that theymade to every dungeon was nice

(57:08):
And, like you said, itdefinitely touched more on the
individuality of each of theregions.

Speaker 1 (57:14):
CB.
Yeah, so we, you have the toollike you mentioned.
But the tool is a characterwhich kind of reminded me again
of those like Wind Wakerdungeons that you did, where you
had to bring the sage in withyou so that they could like
fulfill their duty, and they hadlike a.
They had a gimmick or amechanic that would help get you
through the, through thedungeon.
But yeah, just bouncing yourway up into that storm and then

(57:36):
there at the top is just like agiant pirate ship was like.
This is the most kind of.
This is the fun side of Zelda.
This is like the whimsicalsilly like does this really make
sense?
Not really, but we believe itin this world and it's cool.
Yeah, and then the boss at theend was like, thank God they're
doing like puzzle fights, likepuzzle boss fights again.
they're big, they're grand,this is like a giant flying

(57:59):
scorpion thing, serpent.
And it was like this is Zilta,this is and this is completely
different from the one I justdid in the Gerudo Valley.
So it's like I thought that thedungeons were a pretty
significant step up in qualityand diversity, even if the like
the core element of once you'rein the dungeon is still finding

(58:20):
the like five switches.
I thought all the stuff theydid around it was was much
better.

Speaker 2 (58:24):
I agree, i completely agree.
It definitely fits the storyand it throws throws back to the
previous games a little bitmore.
And, yeah, i definitely a stepup from Breath of the Wild as
far as that goes.

Speaker 1 (58:39):
Yeah, so obviously there's.
There's the ending stuff we'regoing to talk about, but was
there any other maybe, likesmaller story moments or things
that happened in yourplaythrough that you wanted,
that you want to mention or talkabout?

Speaker 2 (58:53):
Yeah, i really like how the race I touched on this
in the spoiler how the races areinteracting more, so like by
Tabantha Bridge there's a Goronand a Rito building a minigame
And I'm like that's just so cuteAnd it's like just showing that
like the world is now comingtogether And like everyone's

(59:16):
interacting more.
I mean, like in Breath of theWild, like yeah, you saw a
random Gerudo in Goron City andlike you know, there'd be like
one NPC in the city, becausethey're like I'm a traveler and
I'm like exploring, but likethis is like the races coming
together to actually work Andlike you go to look out landing
and like you see some of theZora training there like

(59:37):
fighting, and I just I reallyliked that.
It just made the world feel somuch more connected.

Speaker 1 (59:45):
I thought kind of going off that a little bit.
I guess the was it in HatinoVillage where there was like the
mayor competition, like thosekind of things I just I thought
were so like that's the kind ofstuff that you absolutely don't
have to do.
There's no reason to do thatoutside of just that it's.

(01:00:06):
It's just like peak Zeldacontent.
It's just the silly stuff inthe world where there's like
this crazy fashionista who movedinto this village and is
changing the identity and thepeople who live there forever
don't like it And all of herfashion has to do with like
wearing mushrooms on your head.

Speaker 2 (01:00:23):
It's just so weird And it's like this wouldn't work
in any other game.
But it works in a Zelda gamewhere, like, of course, some
weird lady rolls into townmaking mushroom fashion and
wants to, like, become the mayorof the town And of course the
mayor, who's been there forever,is just like no, we should, we

(01:00:45):
should bring back cheese.
Like, why are we making morecheese?

Speaker 1 (01:00:48):
It's just like, yeah, and then the, the, the fashion
lady, is sneaking off in themiddle of the night to eat
vegetables.
She loves the simpler things inlife.
And it's like, man, i see wherethis is going, but I was still.
I loved every second of it.
And then when they finally getup there and you know they, they

(01:01:10):
ultimately, ultimately decideto work together for the good of
the village.
I was like, yeah, man, we didit.
We, you know, i had that proudmoment, even though it was so
silly and so cheesy.
Did you?
obviously, you probably did youplay more of this game than me.
Did you?
do the the like the beachvillage that you rebuild after
they're attacked by the policy.

Speaker 2 (01:01:32):
I actually did that pretty early.
Yeah, same here And probablystruggled more than I needed to
while doing it.
I'm pretty sure it was after Ihad already done Rito, because I
had Tulin, because Tulindefinitely helped me a bit with
that, but it was still prettyearly on.

(01:01:52):
That was really cute.
I liked that.
It's just like oh yeah, a giantpirate ship, like village
destroyed And, of course, likethe guy that built your house
and Breath of the Wild is nowhere and he's going to rebuild
everything.
Like okay, rebuilding.
It was a little rough, i don'tknow if maybe I just didn't
quite have the coordination withUltra Hand, but like getting

(01:02:14):
those tree branches and like Istruggled a lot to do that, like
getting the tree branches inthe middle of the houses, but I
really liked it was just like acute little storyline.
And then like the I don't knowif you did like the water race,
but they're like how do we getmore people to come here?
Well, go back to Terry Town andthey're building like vehicles,

(01:02:34):
like why don't we have like aboat race?
And you can like come build aboat and race a boat.
And it's just like againbridging the gap between Terry
Town and Lerlin, which likedidn't have people that
interacted at all.
And now, like you're doingstuff in Terry Town and they're
moving it to Lerlin to likestimulate Lerlin's economy, Like

(01:02:56):
it's it's just again silly, butit's so, zelda, and it just
like just added more characterto the world.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:03:05):
And it's silly, but it still has so much like heart
and so much charm that it works.
And I didn't do the boat onebecause so I think I've probably
played about 70 or 80 hours.
Okay, because I've done allfour of the main regions And I
don't think I think I had thequest to like find the final
sage.
And then I realized that FinalFantasy 16 was coming out in

(01:03:27):
like a week And I was like Ireally want to see how this ends
before that game comes outbecause I don't want to get
pulled away.
So I definitely I have plans togo back to tears of the kingdom
and do more of like side stuffand things like that that I
haven't done yet, because Ididn't.
I didn't finish the underground, which was something that I
wanted to mention because wetalked a bunch about like how

(01:03:49):
there's some tension and it's alittle spooky and all that.
But what do you find down there?
You find like this weird MadMax-esque stuff going on with
the Yiga clan.

Speaker 2 (01:03:59):
And it's just it's over the top silly and the music
is amazing and hilarious Andit's just like so funny And like
I did that one pretty earlywhere I like I dropped down and
started doing Master Koga andthat fight took me forever
because I had like like six andseven hit attack weapons They
were, so I had such bad weapons.

(01:04:21):
But it was just it was sillyAnd I liked that they did more
with the Yiga clan.
Like they have little bases on,like on the surface, and like
you get you get like the Yigaarmor, you can dress in like
full Yiga And then like you,like you can get a shrine by

(01:04:43):
doing that And like you havelike there's certain things that
you have to get that for AndI'm just like I love that they
did more with this.
It was, it was cute, it wassilly and all the way that the
Yiga clan can be silly And it Iwas just like I love this
edition.
It was well done.

Speaker 1 (01:05:00):
Yeah, and I love that it makes sense in their
underground, because Link kickedhim down that pit in the first
game, so they've been down thereever since.

Speaker 2 (01:05:11):
It's just like, yeah, you thought he was gone because
it was a bottomless pit, Butguess what?
It wasn't a bottomless pit.
Yeah, they've just beenscheming this entire time and
building little bases with, likethe schematics that you get are
like a little nonsensical, likethey're so extra, and I'm like
I'm never going to utilize this,but I still want to get it

(01:05:32):
because like it's just so extra,like I don't know, maybe I will
build that raft with likelittle lasers on Exactly.

Speaker 1 (01:05:40):
Yep, yep, for sure.
Is there anything else you wantto you want to mention, or do
you think it's a good time todive into this crazy ending?

Speaker 2 (01:05:48):
I think the only thing that I don't love is in
the depths.
You can fight all the bossesagain, and there's three
versions of them in the depthsof each one And I'm just like,
did we need this?
I don't like maybe one, likeyeah, it's a scourge of the
depths.

(01:06:08):
We had one above, now we haveone below.
I don't think we needed threeof each in the depths And I that
felt like a little bit ofovercombing.
I'm just like I'm going to doit because I want the defeated,
but I don't think.
I don't think this was needed,but it was like fun to like
stumble upon it.
I'm like, wait, i know thismusic.

(01:06:29):
Wait, whoa, whoa.
Oh, there's Colgarra again.
I guess we're doing this now,which I'm fine, because that
song is a banger.

Speaker 1 (01:06:38):
Yeah, and I mean this is probably a game you could do
an entire run of a podcast onand still not touch everything,
because there's so many likethere's all the quests that you
do for the, for the gazebogazette, and you can find
Zelda's golden horse, andthere's just so many little
things in the world.

Speaker 2 (01:06:59):
So many.
So I'm still like trying tofind stuff, like there's still
some things that I haven't comeout Like.
I think I was about you.
I was about 70 hours betweenlike to defeat it And I think I
did all of the dungeons.
I think I ended up with about250 Koroks that I just like I

(01:07:24):
did them as I encountered them.
I wasn't like necessarilylooking where.
I'm like Oh yeah, i rememberthat there was a Korok here in
Breath of the Wild.
I'm running past it, let mejust see if there's something
here.
And I think I only ended up withlike 39 side quests out of like
139.
I'm like, wow, i thought I didway more side quests, but nope,
i guess, guess not.
I missed a lot And I ended upwith I think 45% of the map done

(01:07:47):
.
So and like all the, i didquite a few shrines.
I had all my stamina upgraded,because that's always the first
thing, i get a couple hearts Butthen I go for the full stamina.
So like 70 hours I was about45% map completion.
So I was like that seems aboutright for just like playing and
not really looking things up,just encountering things And as

(01:08:09):
I come across them I'll do them,and stuff like that.

Speaker 1 (01:08:12):
Yeah, you mentioned stamina, which this can kind of
lead into the ending.
But in the first game to getthe Master Sword you had to have
X amount of hearts.
So I was pumping my hearts up.
I think I maybe had like anextra quarter, maybe an extra
like half ring of stamina, buteverything else was hearts.
So I discovered the hiddenforest, the lost woods, before I

(01:08:38):
had gotten all the memories andstuff that would tell me about
Zelda and the sword and all that.
And so I was like, well, i'mdiving down in this, well, i'm
going to figure out, i'm goingto save these trees.
I go down there, i use a bunchof bomb arrows, i kill the
things down there, and then Iget the sword put on my map and
I realize it's flying around inthe sky.

(01:08:58):
That's weird.
So eventually, get up to thesky, realize it's on a dragon,
i'm like that's pretty cool.
Get to the dragon, realize thatit's not hearts this time, it's
stamina to pull this thing out,and I'm like, well, shit.
So then I go and I rememberedthat there was one of those
statues that could, like convertyour hearts to stamina and vice

(01:09:22):
versa, but it wasn't where itwas in the first game.
So I looked it up to find outwhere it was And I'm like, okay.
So I went down there, unlockthat and swapped out some of my
stuff so I could get the mastersword.
But yeah, so that kind of leadsinto the ending, because the way
the story is given to you andthe memories it tells the story

(01:09:44):
of what Zelda was doing in thepast, and then obviously Link is
piecing together kind of what'shappening in the present And
you're also seeing this, whatyou find out to be an imposter,
zelda, walking around kind ofcausing mischief, like not
really doing anything superdiabolical, just kind of being a
little pain.

(01:10:04):
And so, ultimately, you find outthat in order to come back to
the present and to strengthenthe master sword enough to be
able to kill who they stillhaven't like acknowledged well,
i guess they've said it's a, youknow, it's Ganondorf.
In the past, you see him juststraight up as the man he was

(01:10:26):
before he gets his power.
But In order to defeat him inthe present, the sword needs to
be charged more.
So she turns herself into adragon by eating her secret
stone, which we haven't reallytouched on that All the sages
have these secret stones thatgive them their abilities that

(01:10:46):
they can do.
So she finds out that if sheeats her, she'll turn into a
dragon, and dragons are immortalAnd I'm like this is so crazy.

Speaker 2 (01:10:56):
It was wild.
I was just like, oh, oh, I wasnot expecting you No, me neither
.
So I was just like that's anice twist, because you're
watching these memories andyou're like, how are we going to
rescue her?
How is this going to happen?
And then you realize that sheis a dragon that you've been

(01:11:17):
seeing floating around.
You're like, oh, she's beenhere the whole time and she's
had the masters for this wholetime.
Oh, ok, ok, i guess this ishappening.

Speaker 1 (01:11:30):
Yeah.
So then you get the swordunless you're like me, where you
got it halfway through the gamejust by happenstance And then
you go.
You know, if you've beenplaying the game I don't want to
say correctly, but if you'vebeen playing the game as like
they intend you to play it, youwill at this point have all the
sages And you go down into thedepths where you find Ganondorf

(01:11:53):
And this is the part that I wastalking about, that I didn't
necessarily love, because it'slike it's just a gauntlet to get
to.
I'm like you.
You lose all of your friends ata certain point, which, if
you're like me, you've beenusing them for the whole game.
You're like, oh crap, how do Iplay this game without, without
my friends?
And so which?
then, like I said, i liked whatthey did thematically and story

(01:12:15):
wise, because that allows them.
You lose their spirits, butthen that allows the real
characters to come to your aidat a certain point, when you and
you fight, you fight basicallya small army down there.
You fight waves ofprogressively stronger enemies,
and I'm glad that there's acheckpoint or a save point there
, because I died to Ganondorf.

(01:12:38):
The first time I fought him Ijust could not get my.
I just could not get my like Iwas trying to parry him and I'm
terrible at parrying in thisgame But then I was having, for
some reason, I just could notget my like backflip timing and
stuff right to be able to do theflurries.
Then the second time I went inI, like you know, I sat up
straight and I leaned forwardand I got assumed to the gamer

(01:12:59):
position and actually took itseriously.
But but yeah, so then you gothrough and you end up, like you
said, you fight him for realand then you do the gimmick
fight.
But what did you think aboutthat whole lead up to the boss
fight?

Speaker 2 (01:13:11):
I think it like it was a.
it was a bit of a gauntlet andI had the flashbacks to Skyward
Sword, where you're going downthe spiral and you're fighting
more and more enemies.
So I think that was again kindof an homage to that And I like
that.
you know, everyone came in tohelp again because it just felt

(01:13:32):
like it was bringing the worldtogether and they're always just
like yeah, like we're by yourside and like every other game,
like no, no one's by your side,it's literally just you.
But here, like they're actuallylike no, we're literally here
by your side fighting.
So I really liked that.
it was a really nice touch.
So I didn't mind it.
And, like I said, i really likedthe fact that it wasn't at the
castle, because they kind ofmisdirected you, like you avoid

(01:13:54):
the castle because you're likethis is the end of the game.
And then you get there andyou're like, oh no, it's not the
end of the game.
Oh, i guess I can explore thisnow.
There's stuff I can find andnot have to worry about, like
triggering a cutscene that Iwasn't prepared for.
So I really liked it.
I really liked that gauntlet.
I thought the fight was reallygood.
I liked that he also couldquote flurry rush.

(01:14:16):
I mean, he didn't like hit you,but like he did that like slow
dodge.
And I was just like that's nice,i like that's, that's a nice
touch, that's a nice touch, andit kind of forced you to
probably use mechanics that youdon't use very often.
I too, am usually very bad atparrying, but I felt like the
parrying and the flurry rushwindows were a bit more

(01:14:39):
forgiving compared to Breath ofthe Wild, like you had a little
bit more wiggle room with thetiming, i think.
So it was a really nice fight,i thought.

Speaker 1 (01:14:48):
So then you alluded to this earlier.
Yeah, but Zelda's a dragon, weknow this.
So it only makes sense that,instead of turning into a giant
pig in this game, ganondorf eatshis stone and he turns into
this massive black and reddragon.

(01:15:09):
You go up into the sky and,like you said, it was probably
the coolest kind of finalgimmick fight with Ganon we've
had so far.
You Zelda, of course, like shedoes in pretty much every game
is she's your assist, you know,because you're flying around in
the sky But you're just linkedwith your dinky glider at this
point.
Yeah, so she's there to bringyou back up.

(01:15:32):
You know, to be able to attackagain, you have to land on his
back and hit these spots.
You know typical Zelda formula.
But man, just the spectacle.
And just at that point, likeAdrenaline's pumping, you're
hyped, it's going down.
Zelda dragon is fighting Ganondragon.

Speaker 2 (01:15:49):
You're riding the dragon Like that's what we
wanted in Breath of the Wild andwe got it And like you can even
just ride the dragons now tofarm them, which I haven't quite
done, but like I know you can.
So, like just the fact that,like not only is Zelda a dragon
and she's helping you, but youactually get to ride the dragon

(01:16:10):
and you are having like thisepic aerial dragon fight And
it's just, oh, it's just so good.
But I'm a lover of dragons, ilove all things dragons.
Like this was everything thatyou like wanted in a final
gimmick fight of just like twoaerial dragons dueling it out
and you're just kind of hoppingbetween both of them and

(01:16:31):
fighting.
It's just perfection.
I don't know how.
I don't know how Nintendo isgoing to beat this like in
future games, because like thisis going to be hard to top.

Speaker 1 (01:16:40):
Yeah, for sure.
And what did you think aboutwhat happened after and how,
like, obviously, you beat Ganonand then, through the power of
friendship, you're able to turnZelda back into a human?
How did you feel about how,like it all like actually ended,
the bow they put on it, allthat Did you find it satisfying?

Speaker 2 (01:17:03):
I did.
I thought it wrapped up nicely.
It was like she fulfilled herduty.
so thus, like you know, she wasable to like break out of that
Like everyone's power had beenso amplified.
So I guess that kind of makessense that you can like make
that argument that like everyone, has been amplified and now
that, like this evil has beenvanquished, she gets to turn

(01:17:26):
back and like that final, likereaching for her as an old like
call back to the very beginningwhen, like, you failed, yeah,
but now you get to save her, andI think it was like a great
like ending It was just.
It tied the story togetherreally well.

Speaker 1 (01:17:44):
Yeah, the diving after her was was was really
cool.
That was a really good moment.
I thought that it almost kindof seemed to me like the sages
from the past and like KingRauru and I was at Sonya.
It was like their spirits hadbeen kind of existing in limbo
along with Zelda in order tohelp her defeat this evil, and

(01:18:05):
so then they were able to kindof when they could finally move
on was when she was able to betransformed back.
I mean, it was a lot of kind oflike vague, spiritual, like
timeline mumbo jumbo, butultimately, like you felt good
watching it, it was.
Yeah, i agree, i really lovedthat part of the ending and then

(01:18:26):
you rescuing Zelda and herwaking up and, you know, you
guys having your moment together, and then more happens, which
you know I was like, ok, this iscool, it's a nice little, i
guess, like epilogue for to seethe rest of the characters and
see kind of you know where we'reat with them and to see the
final stage.
I can't remember her name.

Speaker 2 (01:18:45):
Minoru.

Speaker 1 (01:18:45):
Yeah, to see Minoru.
You know she gets to move onnow too, and so I thought that
that had some some really goodmoments, was really sweet and it
was all set up in the sky, sothe backdrop was was really cool
, like yeah, yeah.
Just put a nice little bow onit.
What did you think of that likeepilogue section I?

Speaker 2 (01:19:03):
liked it.
I mean, i just I'm, i'm alwayshere for more story.
It's like, yeah, you had thatfinal moment of saving her.
And then it's like, well,obviously, now that she saved,
everyone else is going to wantto find out and see what
happened.
And, like I and I think we kindof saw Minoru moving on at that
point, because her purpose wasto kind of guide you and give

(01:19:27):
you the information and get youto where you needed to go based
on what she learned back in thepast Now that her duty has been
fulfilled, like everyone kind ofgets their happy ending, you
know she gets to move onEveryone's.
you know the past is at peaceand now Hyrule is at peace for
about five seconds before youknow, something else pops up.

Speaker 1 (01:19:50):
Yeah, exactly Before the, before the next Zelda game.
unless we, unless we hoptimelines again or something,
who knows?

Speaker 2 (01:19:56):
which probably I don't see like a part three to
this.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:20:01):
It'd be I mean, nintendo's crazy.
If anybody could do it.
They could, but it's reallytough for me to see.
Like what, what would they do?
like the whole next game isunderwater, like I don't know
how you could change it up.

Speaker 2 (01:20:13):
Like yeah, i think like they definitely took Breath
of the Wild and they expandedit, while still keeping it very
like it's similar but different,which is really nice.
I just don't.
I don't see another iterationbeing interesting.

Speaker 1 (01:20:29):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:20:30):
What more could you really do?
like more different abilities?
Okay, yeah, but like we'vealready thoroughly, like we had
Breath of the Wild and then weexplored, we expanded it even
more with the caves, theunderground, the sky.
There's really nothing else,unless you're like going to be
hopping timelines, likeNintendo's going to make this an
official time, like part threeis going to be the official
timeline and we're going to behopping timelines between all

(01:20:52):
the games.
You know what?
If Nintendo does that?
I want to kite, but it would besick.
I'm putting it out there now,but I really don't.
Unless they do something likethat, which seems unlikely, i
think, like this is the seriesand the next game is going to be
completely different At least Ihope so.
Like I love this world, butlike I think if you do one more,

(01:21:15):
then you're just going toexhaust people on.
It's going to be too much andyou're going to lose people.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:21:21):
And I know that they've said that they're going
to continue with, like, theBreath of the Wild style of game
.
It's been astronomical,astronomically successful for
them, so it makes sense.
But that doesn't necessarilymean like a bunch.
All the previous games arebasically the same style, but
they're all very different.
So you could still have it beopen world or whatever.

(01:21:42):
You know, whatever they mean bystyle of Breath of the Wild,
but it's still be likethematically very different.
So, yeah, yeah, i'm curious tosee where they go from here.
Is there anything else you wantto say about the story or the
ending before we move into ourverdicts?

Speaker 2 (01:21:57):
No, I think that's like.
That sums it up.
I mean we can, like I said, wecould talk hours about
everything like that.
I feel like we're just barelyscratching the surface.
Yeah, there's just so much totalk about in this game, but I
think that's that kind of sumsit up pretty well.

Speaker 1 (01:22:10):
Exactly, there's only so much time per episode.
but you know, yeah, eventuallymaybe we can do an even deeper
dive, but for now, let's goahead and move into our verdicts
for this episode.
So the review and rank games onthe podcast and on our YouTube

(01:23:24):
channel, i guess too, is we usethe classic letter grade scale A
through F, except that there'ssomething better than A, and
that is an S, s tier is amasterpiece.
So, with that being said, katie, how would you rate Tears of
the Kingdom?

Speaker 2 (01:23:42):
I'm going to give it a solid A.

Speaker 1 (01:23:45):
OK.

Speaker 2 (01:23:46):
I really like it.
I like what they did with thestory.
If someone's tuning in for thespoilers, i don't want to say
but like the final gimmickbattle is like my favorite of
all the Zelda games.
I it's just.
it's really.
it's really really good.
I really really like it.
But I think for me Breath ofthe Wild ekes it out just a
little bit.

(01:24:06):
I like the simplicity of Breathof the Wild.
I feel like this has forsomeone like me who when I play
a game I want to collect all ofthe things I want to like
experience everything the gamehas to offer.
It has won too many things tocollect.
There's just a little too muchto do.
It's I don't mind getting lostand getting sidetracked That's

(01:24:28):
part of the fun of exploration,but I think it just has like one
too many, i think.
but it's, i think it's solidlyan A game, but it's not going to
break us for me, because I likeBreath of the Wild a little bit
better.

Speaker 1 (01:24:41):
Yeah, that makes that makes perfect sense, especially
coming from the way that you'recoming at these games and the
amount of time you've put inBreath of the Wild.
I think for me I was.
I was thinking about this alittle bit and kind of my
thought process was I gaveBreath of the Wild an S.
I think that game is amasterpiece.
I loved it for everything Howit changed up the formula of the

(01:25:02):
series, you know how it was abreath of fresh air, how it did
so much right and it stillmaintained its like core
identity of being Zelda.
And this game is just it'sbuilding on that.
So it kind of loses a littlebit of the magic that Breath of
the Wild had as far asreinventing what Zelda is and

(01:25:26):
can be.

Speaker 2 (01:25:27):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:25:28):
But I don't think that I could sit here and say
that this game is worse in anyway than Breath of the Wild, and
especially as someone like I'mnot going to collect everything,
i'm probably not going to seeevery.
so just for my experiences withboth games I really liked.
I liked a lot of the stuff,that iterations that they did
and the improvements they madeand the changes even if you

(01:25:50):
could argue maybe they're notimprovements, just changes.
as far as like what we'vetalked about dungeons and
flavoring, and then the way youinteract with characters and
stuff, i don't think I couldgive this anything less than
what I gave Breath of the Wild.
So for that I mean, i think itstands on its own as a really
incredible game too.
But basically that's just areally long winded way of me
saying I'm going to give it an S.

Speaker 2 (01:26:11):
Yeah, i could see that.
I think, just because it's likeiterative, that, like that
drops it down a little bit, notthat it makes it bad, but like,
if I'm comparing the two, whatam I probably going to play more
?
I'm probably going to, like goback and play Breath of the Wild
a little bit more than I amgoing to play tiers.
So if it doesn't crack my topthree because my top three are

(01:26:33):
Breath of the Wild, nearautomata and Zed of the
Chronicles three it hasn't beatthose out.

Speaker 1 (01:26:39):
So is it number four?

Speaker 2 (01:26:43):
I don't know, i would have to give thought because,
like, i really like Elden Ring,but like Elden, like do I put
that in the top?
I haven't really thought aboutlike my top five.
Would it probably break my topfive?
Yeah, probably.
I would have to give that a lotmore thought though.
But like for me it didn't likemy top with my top three.
It didn't change my top three,so that's, but it's still a

(01:27:07):
really good game And I feel,from talking to people who have
played both, more people areliking tiers And I'm probably a
little gatekeepery and beinglike but but it's still like at
the core it's still Breath ofthe Wild.
We didn't go back to the 3DZelda, so like it didn't really

(01:27:30):
change what your original grapeswere with Breath of the Wild.
So like I don't get how likethis is somehow so much better
of a game than Breath of theWild.
I don't.
That seems like a little bit ofcognitive dissonance to me.
But if it gets more peopleplaying the game and more people
might check out Breath of theWild, i'm like I'm all for it.

(01:27:50):
Like it's a great game thatpeople should definitely check
it out And it's great for allages too.
Like my kids are playing this.
My kids nine and apparentlykind of broke the game.
I was just reading a discordmessage that he like
inadvertently moved has to andgot a different dialogue because
he did has to so late afterdoing all the dungeon.
So I'm talking with someone who31 Jason, he he's, i'm doing

(01:28:17):
his Breath of the Wild 100%route.
So he's very big in the Breathof the Wild community and like
really big in the tearscommunity and like part of the
glitch hunters and all thatstuff.
So he's just like, yeah, ihaven't seen that yet, so that's
cool.
So yeah, it's great for allages.
And I mean, there's not a wholelot of games that can do that.

Speaker 1 (01:28:38):
Yeah for sure, absolutely Well.
I think that would be a.
That could be a whole topic oflike discussion.
What you were talking aboutbeing gatekeeping and like the
stuff that this one changed.
And do poor?
do people like it more becausethey've had more time to sit
with Breath of the Wild and theindustry has adapted so much
from Breath of the Wild thatthey're used to this Like
there's.
I feel like that would be apretty interesting and fun

(01:29:00):
conversation to kind of pickthat apart.
But yeah, we're pretty much outof time for this episode, so
maybe we'll save that for nexttime.
But absolutely, thank you somuch for coming on and talking
about this game with me.
Like you said, we pretty muchjust like scratch the surface on
all the stuff we couldpotentially talk about, but it
was still a lot of fun.
We still, you know is stillgoing to be a pretty beefy

(01:29:23):
episode.
But before I let you go,definitely want you to plug all
your stuff where people can findyou, what you've got going on,
all that stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:29:31):
Yeah, so you can find me pretty much everywhere I'm
on YouTube.
I have.
I do music videos there of allmy cover songs.
Like we alluded to at thebeginning, i'm a flute player.
I do covers of video game andanime music.
I did cover Tears of theKingdom.
That video is coming soon.
I ended up having surgery inMay So I'm a little bit behind

(01:29:51):
like my production schedule.
But you can find me on Spotify.
All my music is on Spotify,pandora.
Anywhere you stream music, youcan find me there under Katie
Shesco, and I stream on Twitchthree days a week.
I'm doing a little bit of 100percent, doing a little bit of
music and doing a little bit ofTears of the Kingdom, so a lot
of all the Zelda smatterings.
So yeah, twitchtv slash, katieShesco, google my name, you'll

(01:30:15):
find me.
I'm everywhere under my name.
I make it easy.

Speaker 1 (01:30:18):
Yes, and all the links will be in the description
for this episode.
They'll be on our website, forsure, and, if you know, if we
get permission from the artist,maybe we'll have some of Katie's
music in this episode.
So Absolutely, But yeah that'sawesome As far as our show.
Just the usual plugs jump inour discord.
If you want to keep up with us,if you want to chat with us,

(01:30:41):
the YouTube channel is goingstrong.
We've seen some, some tractionon some of our recent videos, so
that's exciting to see.
And if you enjoy the podcast,definitely let us know.
Leave us a rating or review.
If you can, and if this is thefirst time you're hearing Katie,
then go check out our interviewwith her, because that was a

(01:31:03):
lot of fun And you kind of getto know a little bit more of her
background and gaming historyand all that fun stuff.
But yeah that is all we have forthis Tears of the Kingdom
special And thank you all somuch for listening.
We will catch you on the nextepisode.
Thank you, thank you, thank you.

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The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom Deep Dive - with Katie Shesko

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom Deep Dive - with Katie Shesko