What OBJ doesn't understand about winning

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
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(00:28):
Doug Gottlieb Show, Fox Sports Radio. The Dug Gotlip Show
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At Farmers dot com, we are Farmers. Welcome in. Hope
you're great. Hope you have an outstanding weekend. We'll get

(00:48):
you ready for the upcoming NFL season. It's Charles Davis
will be our guest NFL on Fox Analyst. Upcoming in
about fifteen minutes. My boy Matt Holiday, who goes from
a seven time All Star, Ford time Silver Slugger World
Series champ to a college baseball assistant for his brother,
will join us next hour. Nick Right will join us.
Mike Leach, headball coach at Wazoo, will join us fresh

(01:11):
off an incredible season up in Smoke, Vegas. So we
got a lot of football and a little hoops and
some baseball to talk about. Let's talk about Odell Beckham Jr.
Who still doesn't get it. Still doesn't get it because
he says he wants to win. That makes us assume

(01:32):
he wants to win. Right, He says he wants to win,
but it makes he assumes that it just happens. There's
an expression that people use nowadays. It's called speaking it
into existence, and that's exactly what Odell Beckham Jr. Is doing.

(01:54):
I say I want to win, I say I want
to win. I say I want to win, and thus
I want to win. But here's the reality. Way makes
hard really hard. It's really really really really really hard.
And I think that's the biggest issue that most people

(02:19):
run into, is that it's hard to be great at something.
It's not easy. There is failure. Tell me something that's easy.
You know this? This reminds me people. Well, I'll just
make an app. Do you have any idea how hard
that is? Ye? Well, I'll just come up with an

(02:40):
idea that no one else has, so that I have
kind of proprietary information. Then oh yeah, by the way,
I gotta make sure that I get a trademark so
no one else can take this idea or come up
with this idea. Then I have to develop it. Then
once I develop it and roll it out, I have
to have a key marketing strategy and plan. And then

(03:02):
I just kinda gotta hope it hits the right demographic
at the right possible time. That's a lot of hard
ass work and the idea that you say, I want
to win. I want to win. I want to win,
and you don't show up for O T A S
and some and a writer from g Q says, why
didn't you go to T S was a mandatory? Then

(03:26):
you don't actually want to win. Tell me something great,
and I will tell you the hard work that it
went into it. Right. What Tom Brady is doing is
he is paving roads that no one else may be
able to use. Playing high level football into his forties.

(03:47):
How does he do it? He is dedicated, between his diet,
his workouts, his stretching regimen. He doesn't drink in season,
it doesn't party. He's married, he has kids, and he's
a father, and then he gets up every day and
works and works and works and works, and even then,

(04:10):
let's be honest, tom Brady was one off sides call
from losing to the Kansas City Chiefs. If not for
de Ford Uh lining up in the neutral zone. Correct,
tom Brady is great, but not because he decided in
mind I'm gonna be great and said it over and
over again and wrote it on the blackboard at the
beginning of a of a Simpsons episode. Tom Brady is

(04:32):
great because it works his ass off. Colin Coward do
I follow? I was on his show earlier today. I
think I'm really good at this. I put my show
up against anybody like Colin has his days off. He
took Friday off. I did his show. He goes fly fishing.

(04:52):
But ask anybody who's ever worked on his show. He
starts at nine local, he's there at six in the morning.
Why he works his ass off. You don't just wake
up with like, oh, I know exactly how I want
to do a radio show. No, you're getting the room
full of people, you start throwing out ideas, you start
thinking of things, and then you gotta work with TV

(05:14):
people to get the video. Like you know, Steve Jobs
and the Apple guys, they didn't just like, oh, all
of a sudden, let's come up with an idea of
a computer. They started in a garage and worked and
worked and work. They end up making you know, remember
the Apple two E and the Macintosh. But even then
Apple stock went through a dip. And then they came
up with the idea of the iPod, which became the iPhone.

(05:36):
Like all of this through crazy, crazy hard work and
crazy crazy hours. So if you're listening to Odell Beckham Jr.
And you think, oh, he's making total sense, the Giants
disrespected him. The Giants gave him the ultimate in respect.
In the NFL and in any professional sport, the amount

(05:58):
you make, by most people's estimation, equates the amount of
respect you have. Are there other issues with its sure
age where you are, you know what would it cost
to replace you? But the ultimate respect for who you
are and what you bring is based upon how much
somebody's willing to pay you. And they paid him more

(06:19):
than any other wide receiver ever in the history of
the sport. And what did he do well? He did
not properly align himself with his quarterback He called out
his teammates for their lack of work ethic. He bailed
on an onside kick that would have sealed the game.

(06:43):
He got hurt. That's not his fault, but on some level,
whose fault is it when you keep getting hurt? But
more than anything, he pissed them off just enough to
where they go, you know what, we know, we paid
you a lot of money, we know we're kind of
pot community to you, but just goes somewhere else. Yeah. Yeah,
they disrespected him. If that's your your that's your term

(07:03):
of disrespect. But it had to be his act which
ran thin in spite of the fact that they gave him.
We gave you everything where you wanted, and you still
weren't happy. Because you believe you can speak it to existence.
Nothing has ever been spoken into existence. It's been created
by hard work. Democracy is really, really hard. It is.

(07:30):
You got nuts on both sides that that that pushed
the envelope. You've got people that are tied in based
upon who's supporting their campaigns and who supports them at work,
and you've got to get a room full of people
that think differently and act differently and are from different
places and get them to think what's what's the best
idea for the most people. And sometimes things aren't going

(07:51):
to go your way. Our government is not easy. It's
not easy to be a public servant. It's not easy
for any of this stuff to take place. But you
know what, it's the world's best functioning democracy. You know why,
hardass work. And when I hear Odell Beckham Jr. Say
wants to win, he wants to win. He wants to win,

(08:13):
don't care. Don't tell me you're pregnant, show me the baby,
don't tell me you want to win, show me the
work ethic, and whatever you do, don't tell me I
didn't show up somewhere because it wasn't mandatory. Voluntary work
is exactly the work of championship teams. It just is.

(08:33):
And you don't even necessarily have to work as much
as you gotta show up and show your face and
establish relationships and spend time together and be in a
film room and be at lunch together, because those little
bonds tend to be the ones that end up being
the most fruitful. And I don't think Odell and I don't,

(08:53):
I don't. I don't think there's a bad bone in
his body. I just don't think he understands what it means,
what it takes to win. They didn't win big when
he was in college. He hadn't one big with the Giants,
And now it's the boat trip is very much indicative
of who he is and what he's about. It doesn't

(09:16):
mean that they didn't lock in. They had a weekend off,
they went down and got on a boat. But you've
got a whole offseason you can do that. You could
have waited. Additionally, even if you snuck away, you're taking
pictures like you're on the cover of a magazine. If

(09:38):
you want to go and just hang out with your
boys for a day, you can do it. You can
get out of the cold Northeast. People do that all
the time private jet. But then you're gonna publicize it
and be stunned when you get some sort of criticism.
You got the whole offseason to go on any boat
trip anywhere in the world with any guy you want.
You choose your off week before a playoff. Choose choose

(10:00):
it before the playoffs to go down with your boys.
Your first NFL playoffs, you haven't won anything. You didn't
want anything in college. You don't want any in the pros,
and you're gonna go put car to ahead of horse
and act like you're conquering the world when all you
did was clinch a playoffs spot. Of course we're gonna
be critical. You can go down and be on a

(10:24):
boat before the playoffs. You can drive you the car
with your car with your feet. As Chris Rock would say,
that doesn't make it a good idea. Saying you want
to win doesn't mean anything. I want to be a millionaire.
I want to be a billionaire. Ask a kid, what
do you want to go to school? I want to
go to Ivy League school. You do you do cool? Remember?

(10:46):
I want to be a Remember what kids used to
want to be astronauts? Does anybody have any idea how
hard is to be an astronaut? Forget it. Forget about
the physical pain and torture that they put those astronauts
through just to get to the astronaut program him. They're
masters of science, their masters, the brilliant pilots. They're the

(11:06):
best of the best of the best of the best.
And how they get there, you guessed it hardass work.
They didn't go like I want to be an astronaut,
and by the way. There are a lot of people
that worked really hard that didn't get there, that didn't
make it. They are they weren't lucky enough, they didn't
they picked off the wrong people that like people didn't

(11:28):
like them, or maybe they just weren't smart enough. Because
those people are brilliant. They know. It's like it's it
sounds like a child. I want, I want, I want,
I want. What do you want to be when you
grow up? I want to be a basketl player. You're
gonna have to start going to the gym every day. Well,

(11:50):
I do want to be a basketbent player. That bad,
then you're not gonna be one. It's okay. It is
okay to bail on dreams because it's too hard. Just
don't tell me it's because because of any other reason
than it was too hard. You know, all of these
things achievements. You've read the Malcolm Glabbo book Outliers, where

(12:13):
he talked about ten thous hours of work. It's not
just ten thousand hours of showing up in a gym.
It's ten thousand hours of working really hard, perfecting your
craft and whatever it is you do, from the trumpet
and trombone to being a master of science literature to
being on the radio or on television. These things take

(12:34):
hard work, work ethic, buy in, an acceptance that sometimes
when you screw up, it's your fault. If Odell Beckham Jr.
Wants respect well one, he was given it based upon
the contract that he signed in two. It's a mutual thing.
You disrespect your team and teammates when you're critical of

(12:56):
them in front of an open mic, and you disrespect
the process of what it takes to win when you
don't show up for what are seeming as seen as
voluntary workouts, when you're on a new team and you
get run off in spite of a contract which is
gonna hurt your former team. If you really want to win,
and you really want guys to buy in to the

(13:17):
idea that you want to win, you show up, especially
when it's not mandatory. Voluntary workouts are a lot like
the NFL's drug testing policy. I don't know if you
guys know this. The NFL's drug testing policy ass as
follows for recreational drugs. They won't test you the rest
of the year if you pass the first one. It's

(13:38):
not really a drug test, it's an i Q test.
And that's essentially in reality, what voluntary workouts are in
the NFL. It it doesn't determine if you win or lose.
It doesn't you don't put in all of your offense
and all of your defense. But it is that that

(13:59):
lit test for do you really want to win? Or
do you say you want to win? Odell Beckham Jr.
Thought about retiring because it was hard. I don't have
to say anymore after that. That said, I do think
if there's a situation where it could work, Cleveland's Cleveland's

(14:21):
a situation. Well, ask Charles Davis, how likely is it
for all of these unique and tangible personalities to come
together to have a division winning team in Cleveland. We'll
get to that up coming next. Be sure to catch
live editions of The Doug dot Leap Show weekdays at
noon eastern three pm Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and

(14:43):
the I Heart Radio app. This is the Doug gott
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(15:10):
Fox Sports Radio. You know it's funny, Um, Charles Davis
has been outstanding where he's calling college games or pro
games whatever, and Charles think you can appreciate this. It's
I said, it's about ode by km Jr. Like, look,
he's an incredible talent. But there's an article about him
in GQ magazine and he says about he talks about

(15:32):
how people don't understand how much he wants to win.
And then when he was asked why you didn't go
to O t A S he said, it's because it's voluntary,
And I was like, this is just kind of the classic.
I want to win. I want to win, and I
clearly don't know how to put myself in best vision
to win. This is this is like our profession. How
many former athletes do you know that at call you

(15:53):
and ask you how can I get in? How can
I do what you do? And like one getting an
up and he's really hard, but even after you get it,
it's how hard do you want to work? Are you
willing to watch five game tapes? Willing to make a
bunch of phone calls? Are you willing to really get
in there and grind? And because it's a it's a job,
and people that are good at the job not only

(16:14):
work and know what they're supposed to talk about, but
get better at how they're talking about it. That is
so true. And I and your spot on Doug about that.
But what what's what I've seen over time? Which I
think the same as you. They always think that, well,
I know the game well enough, or I know the
sport well enough, and I don't really need to do

(16:36):
the rest of it. I got all that, I've got it.
I had plenty who have gotten in, who have done
the homework? Who who busted there? You know what? So
it's not a blanket indictment. But I think your analogy
is is spot on because it's almost a mixed message.
I really want to do this, I really really want
to do this. Okay, well I'll call you and we
can go over such a Well that doesn't work for

(16:56):
me because you know I'm gonna be going to the
beach that day. Okay. Um, if I remember Crag you
called me first, no problem. Yeah, I have had that
a number of times and and then the other parts
you get as always, so how did you get in?
And then you tell him your story and you tell
them how you worked and whatever, and then what you
get out of that is Okay, that's great, but really

(17:17):
had how did you get in? And how can I
bypass off? Actually this actually a really good question. How
did you get into the industry? I was lucky enough
that someone actually thought I could do it? And then
what they did was they told someone that they thought
I could do it. Wait, let's give them names. Let's
give them you've obviously achieved. Is Mark Mark Whitworth, who

(17:38):
was formerly the Associate Commissioner of the Southeastern Conference. He
was working in sports information at Tennessee when I was
there playing, and then years down the road, he gave
my name to a Fox executive by the name of
Steve Craddock who works on NASCAR now, and Steve had
my name for about two years. And Mark never told

(17:58):
me that he had given my name to Steve. He
never said, hey, you ought to get into broadcast. He
just said, Steve, I think that's the guy who I
think would be good a good game analyst. Two years later,
Steve needed a game analyst, was desperate because it was
eight days before the kickoff. He didn't have that person
and pulled my card, called my name, called called me
on the phone, and we kind of went from there.

(18:20):
So every year to this present time. In fact, actually
did it last week. I said a thank you note
to Mark Whitworth every year because without Mark, my life
goes in an entirely different direction. You know, it's interesting.
So my story is kind of similar. I was shooting
around the day before our first quarterfinal game of the

(18:42):
Big Twelve Tournament in two thousand. I'm at Kemper Arena
and I'm the only player. It was a voluntary shooting time,
and we were playing Kansas that night, and we had
beaten Kansas by thirty three points like two weeks before,
and our shooting town was like seven in the morning,
and so even Coach Sutton was like, I ain't going.

(19:03):
Anybody wants to go. So I went with couple managers
and our trainer and they all worked me out. Meanwhile,
so I'm shooting free throws at the end, and a
guy named Tim Allen walked up to me and said, Hey,
we all at at the Big Twelve office. We all
think you'd be pretty good at this. Have you thought
about broadcast? I said, yes, I have, but I'd like
to play basketball as much as I could. And he said,

(19:24):
here's my card. Call me anytime and we'll get you
some games. And uh. The next year I was, I
got cut in the c b A and I was
getting ready to go play overseas. I did two games
for them, then for ESPN Regional actually and uh right,
and then I and then I did and then I
and then a couple of years later, I just I

(19:46):
got an opportunity to do UM national games, and I
called and Tim helped me help me there, and a
guy named Dan Steer gave me an opportunity to ESPN
and Tim Allen help help me get opportunities with the
Big twelve and with other leagues as well, And it
kind of all starts from there. But it's it's but
then the other part two It is when you get
to do the job. And the first time I did

(20:07):
the NBA Draft two thousand three, I showed up huge
notebook full of stuff. Other guys I was with not
so much, and I felt like milkyper Jr. Because I
knew everything about every guy in the draft. It's one
about getting an opportunity, but to about being prepared to
do the job when you get that opportunity. I tell
people all the time, and you know, after a while
it becomes some people might think is trite, but they

(20:28):
always say, you know, they get on me all the
time and go, yeah, it's always someone to know someone.
You got to know someone to get answered. That's true
in any business out there. And then they get upset
about and so called nepotism. Well, that guy's you know,
kid is in it, and well the kid wants to
be in it. And if the kids not good enough,
that will show down the road. But oftentimes those kids
know what it takes to get the jump done well

(20:51):
and work their butts off and do their homework and
all those other things. The first game I ever did
was a spring game at the University of Tennessee. I described,
you know done, My eligibility was up. I was there
in graduate school, and the legendary voice of the Vols,
Mr John Warrant made the rest in peace, one of
my dearest mentors ever. He you know, they said, hey,
why don't come over to the spring game on radio

(21:12):
with us? Mr Ward did radio for Tennessee for thirty
plush years and right voices of the balls. I show
up because Doug, I know everyone on the team. I
just graduated. You know. This wasn't the old days where
kids came in January and you know all that and
none of that, right, everyone on that roster. I had
just left the locker room with pop over there to
do the spring game with nothing. Okay, so you show

(21:34):
up with your notebooks full of everything. I show up
but nothing because I know these guys. And Mr Warred looked,
says the boards, and I was like, what are boards?
You know, they're spotting boards? And he and he goes,
you know, and this is this was one of the
greatest gentle rebukes that a person has ever given. He
looked me in the eyes said me, know, Charles, I

(21:56):
expected this to happen, So I made a second board
for you and that Yet now that doesn't hit you
across the phase right now. I wasn't in the TV yet.
I wasn't in the broadcast. It wasn't This wasn't the
Mark Whitworth call. This was years before the first experience
I ever had. Do you think that didn't leave an impression?

(22:16):
This is work ethic, This is doing your homework. So
fast forward to when I got the phone call from
Mark whit from Steve Craddock. After Mark Whitworth's recommendation, eight
days before my first game, I went to work, I
created boards, I did my homework, and I remember my
first game like it was yesterday, And I'll tell you
exactly why. In a second. It was Memphis State at

(22:39):
Mississippi State. Rip Shares, coach of Memphis UH Jackie Sheryl's
coach of Mississippi State. Keeper McGee, the star tailback from
Mississippi State, was lost in a pool accident that summer,
so there's a lot of emotion going into the game.
Tough game. Mississippi State kicks the field goal near the buzzer,
wins the game. Why do I remember his August thirty
first Princess Day has her car wreft that night with

(23:03):
Dodi al Fay Odd Dies, I'm up all night watching
CNN because I'm still keyed up from doing my first game.
But you go back to what Mr Ward said to
me that day when the next opportunity came, as you
talked about when you get an opportunity, what are you
gonna do with it? I was going to be prepared
the next time. I would say this Odell has a
great opportunity in front of him, no doubt. And he's

(23:25):
with a good quarterback who's totally sold on him and
very almost almost defensive in his defense of his teammates.
He's got his best friend as another wide receiver. They
have plenty of talent um and they have a division
where the Steelers are at the Steelers of old. The
Ravens lost a bunch on defense and since then he's
coming off a disastrous season with a head coach that

(23:45):
no one could pick out of a lineup. That this
is a great opportunity. Do you think they live up
to the building. I think that they play. I think
that they play well. Dog I still pick Pittsburgh in
that division until proven differently. This is a lot of
great optimism, and rightly so. It's a roster that has
changed drastically, and I know John Dorsey's gonna get the

(24:07):
lion so the credit and he deserves a lot of that.
I get that. As the GM Sasha Brown before he left,
everybody a lot of ridicule. But people have to remember
that draft where they had three first round picks. That
was Sashi Brown's draft and I think they hit on it.
Myles Garrett, Bill Peppers gets moved to get O'Dell Beckham
and the third one was David and Joke who the

(24:27):
tight end that's hitting pretty well? How did the first round?
I believe so that started the process. They turned it over.
Now they've got Freddie Kitchens coaching. He has to prove
himself as a first time head coach. I like where
Baker is and I think that with the couple Baker
and Jarvis Landry being the best on Phiodel Besham Juna,
one of the best things that are ever happened for him.

(24:48):
And Baker is also the type of quarterback as much
as he loves his receivers, if they served too much
in the huddle, dug like he was a point guard
at a certain point. Guys, I'm running this team. Here
we go, and Baker is capable of doing that. We
will talk about the articles and this that this is
a kid who loves ball. You know, whether you like

(25:09):
his approach or not, whether you like the fact that
he's turping to Hugh Jacks or not, take that and
put it aside. And just realized one of the ultimate
Jim Rats and one of the ultimate guys that guys
gravitate around. He'll stay out of people's contracts now because
the team mays tell him, you don't mess with contract
people's money. But other than that, they will follow this
kid and he will be there to produce. I believe. So.

(25:29):
I think Odell Beckham is in a great situation, and frankly,
if it doesn't work out, I would expect it to
be more of what O'Dell does or does not do,
as opposed to the opportunity just go south. I mean,
Jarvis Landry want the great workers out there, Baker want
the great workers, and I think O'Dell is a great
worker as well. When he decides to do it, and
I think that he will do it with those guys

(25:50):
starting with cam Um. Melvin Gordon says he's going to
hold out Zekielt and I totally sold on it. Obviously,
two different levels of back. Melvin Gordon said to five
and change, they would have to be franchised. I've been
told the Chargers offered him in the neighborhood of ten
a year for at least two years. Uh, you know,
front loaded contract. What would you do if your Melvin Gordon,

(26:12):
how would you advise him, well, I think you're you're
playing it, and unfortunately for him, is a lot it's
going to tend to hand with Zeke and you're gonna
have to play this one out. And it's the Kits
a number and the Cowboys figure it out and they
decided to go ahead and do it. It sets the
market again, and Melvin's number is gonna come in with
it's gonna come in lower than Zeke's. So you're gonna

(26:32):
try and get it as much as much as he
can while he can before Zeke sets the market. And also,
I would imagine Silk Rivers is somewhere behind the scenes saying,
we got to get this thing figured out. I don't
have many more opportunities. This is one of my key
weapons here. I want this back on the field. These
guys don't have any other leverage, does you know, running backs,
They don't have a lot else because you know as

(26:53):
much as well as I do, even the great ones. Okay,
we'll plans out for a six round or at all. Wow,
that is round is pretty good, you know, I mean
it just just had me cream Hunt. I know he's
suspended right now, nobody's been through. That's a third wrong guy.
You know, we go on and on with this and
with running back it seems to be especially so. So
Melvin's gonna make his play while he can. And I

(27:15):
think someone's already written. You know they want Moore and
oh and he didn't play last Yes, I don't think
that that is apples to Apple, but it does come up.
Leonard four Nette went through Dada and Jacksonville two years ago,
didn't it or even last year? When he doesn't play,
other guys play the rest of you gotta get it
while you can. So I think the Novan's gonna play
it out. But truthfully, I think we'll see him somewhere

(27:37):
if they don't get the contract thing decided somewhere around
the last week of pre season, first week of the season.
I think they'll be there trying to play because they've
got a chance to be very good. They really really
do and and they and they value him, They just
don't they just don't over over value him. I'm gonna
start the market Doug whatever z comes in with if
the Cowboys decided to do something with him, which I

(27:59):
wouldn't surprise me. Once he sets down, Melvin's number will
come in, but it will come in at a lesser price.
He's not gonna get with de Yeah, I I I'd
be interested to see what what the Cowboys do if
they because he's like two years out, he's not even
close to being in this and they still have to
worry about the Dak thing. How would how do you
believe they will touch the Cooper? How do how do

(28:20):
you think they approach Well, Dak is quarterback. That's a
whole different animal. And Dak's gonna get taken care of.
But you remember what Jerry Jones said last year, Um, yes,
we're gonna take care of Dak and we and I
think they've been paraphrasing something along the lines of we,
So they hope Dak will want to take care of
the Cowboys too. In other words, we value you. But

(28:41):
let's not talk Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers, you know, can
we not talk those numbers played? That's what Jerry is
trying to tell Da Marii Cooper. They've got to justify
giving up a first round pick for him last year,
and he played pretty well. As you mentioned, Zeke's two
years out, But let's be frank about the whole thing.
Who is the most able player on that offense right now, Zeke.

(29:03):
He makes everything work for Dak, for a Mari outside,
for the rest of that team, helps out the defense.
Like he carried the ball on the credible amount last year.
He caught it a bunch. I had a couple of
games where to put some two hundreds uards, you know,
rushing him and catching the football over doing the total.
This guy does it all. And I think Stephen Jones
did the Ricky Johnson phrase on a Disney duck He's

(29:25):
a straw that stirs our drink. And I went, well,
I guess you told everybody and everyone to knew it
anyway to the complishes they want to accomplish. I know,
but he keeps doing dumb He keeps doing dumb stuff,
right Like, look, I think he's great, but he like

(29:46):
he just got out of the commissioner's office. This is like,
this is the kid who just gets back to the
principal's office and doesn't get suspended. And they're sitting there,
sit there going like, hey, um, listen about that about
that extra credit you want to offer, right like, you
know what I think with him, and I think with him, Doug,
And it's because it's the Cowboys. Okay, so understand where
I'm going with dress. The Cowboys don't sit there and

(30:07):
condone everything, but they do their best to make these
things work. Remember pact Man Jones. They they hired someone
to travel be around bac Man. Right, pat Man finally
gets into the final trouble, the guy they hired is
right next to him. In other words, even when you
can do whatever you want, those guys gonna do whatever
they want and eventually get it done. But when I

(30:29):
think of Zeke and I think of the Cowboys, I
remember watching a thing on JFK years ago, and it
was one of those MAS for TV movies, and he
gets in trouble at his I think he was at
and over somewhere that this is this is JFK. And
he gets in trouble and he's in the headmaster's office
and his dad's in there, and the headmaster reads the
Riot Act and dad said, absolutely, we'll do that. And

(30:51):
as soon as they get outside, the old man of
winks and give him the nudge and the risks like
that a boy. It almost feels like Jerry's not saying
out a boy, but you're the prodigal son man. Can
we try not to do this again. That's what it
feels like there. And I understand how because the Dee
talent and anytime there's no no punchment in the Commissioner's office,

(31:11):
cowboys are like, let's go fascinating. Fascinating. They keep doing
the same thing over and over again, expecting a different result,
which is the definition of insanity. Can't wait to can't
wait to take some I talk some actual football with you.
The meantime, we'll just forecast Charles great stuff. Uh, I
believe you guys have retreat that is at an incredible
location up coming the next couple of days. Um. I

(31:33):
won't give away that location. I can only tell you
I am incredibly jealous of said location. Have fun. Say
hi to all those Fox NFL peeps and we'll talk
to you soon. Hey, you, we will do that, Doug,
and you're part of that family. Come crashing, come out
all right? Thanks enough. That's that's Charles Davis, who, of
course you can hear it call NFL games on Fuck
Doug Gottli Show Fox Sports Radio. Is the NFL in

(31:55):
the middle of another domestic violence mess we'll discuss next.
Be sure to catch live editions of the Doug Dot
Leap Show weekdays at noon Eastern three pm Pacific. Doug
Got Leave Show here on Fox Sports Tradeo every day.
This time we'd like to get you caught up on
stories of the day, things you may have missed, and
we give a little poetic license to Dan Byron play game.

(32:18):
This is game time on the Doug got Leap Show.
What he got Doug. The game today is big deal,
little deal, no deal? Alright, big deal, little deal or
no deal. That the NFL suspended Seahawk's defensive lineman Jerin
Read for six games for violating the league's domestic violence policy,

(32:38):
just a few days after Tyreek Hill wasn't suspended by
the league. That feels like a big deal. Feels like
that there's some fire there to the smoke. People thought
Roger Goodell is going soft and he wants to like no. Um.
I think that Roger Goodell and his investigators felt like

(32:59):
I felt like he was like like he was entrapped,
as opposed to Jared Reid deal where this doesn't look
good Um and the Seahawks reacted accordingly, So I think
two different situations. There was some speculation as well, because
this alleged incident with Jared Reid occurred a day before
the NFL Draft, and there was some speculation that maybe

(33:22):
the Seahawks ended up making a pick which was Malik
McDowell whoever, who ended up never playing it down for them,
that maybe they took him speculation only, not nothing, but
that maybe they went defensive linemen because they weren't sure
after hearing about the allegations. I don't know. They also
went with what's the name? They just traded to Kansas City, right,

(33:42):
I mean they have yeah, I mean they've taken chances
in the past, big deal, little deal or no deal
that redskin stackled. Trent Williams will hold out of campus.
He remains unhappy with how the team handled his offseason
surgery to remove a growth from his scalp um. You
only playing like a handful of games last year too
because of injury ran. Yeah, I think that this is

(34:03):
this is kind of twofold because there's a contract portion
of this as well, that now he's not one of
the highest paid tackles in the NFL. When he got
his contract, he was. But it's also you have a
rookie quarterback that could be uh starting for you, very
very soon, and you would like your left tackle. And
you know, the Redskins haven't necessarily handled a lot of
things well with players in the past, so I don't know.

(34:26):
I mean, like, look, he played ten games last year. Um,
they do have a rookie quarterback. But Trent Williams hasn't
been a pro bowler since two thousand thirteen. It's two
thousand he was, he was probably in two thousand twelve.
That was two networks to go for me. That was
a long time ago. I like Trent. He's a great
he's a great interview he's very very honest. Um, and
I think he's a well respected guy. But let's not

(34:47):
go crazy like his contract peaked when he peeked as
a player. Big deal, little dealer, no deal. That Clemson
wasn't a unanimous pick to w in the A C
C Atlantic by members of the media, as the Tigers
received one hundred and seventy one first place votes from
the media. Well Syracuse had the other two. Um, that's

(35:08):
a little deal because the Syracuse mafia choose to vote
for Syracuse as I think the world revolves around Syracuse
because they went to Syracuse and look, Dina Baber has
done a good job. Man, done a really good job,
and they pulled off some upsets in the past. But uh,
and they nearly beat Clemson last year. Of course, Clemson's
quarterback got hurt early in the game and so they

(35:29):
were a different club. But nonetheless, um, that's a Syracuse
MAFI thing. That's a no deal. Okay, you know I'm
gonna get some golfing big deal, a little deal or
no deal. That the Dolphs Final Major ended with Shane
Lowry winning, going to runaway at the Open Champions without
Tiger Parry or Phil playing the weekend, that's a little deal,
as if few in terms of a few people paid

(35:51):
attention because it was Shane. Yeah, I was actually very
nothing against Shane Lowry winning. I just wanted a competitive
final two days. And while It's E three was great
to watch on Saturday, maybe the best thing of all
was watching JB. Homes Super in eight seven. Well not
for JB. Holmes and big, big deal, little deal or
no deal. Finally that John Romos and his wife Susanne

(36:11):
are the proud parents of a new baby boy, as
we revealed Jonah Thomas George Ramos. Welcome to the world.
Big deal that's a big deal. Enormous big deal. I
mean for a man of John's age two years old
to still be productive, it gives hope to us. All

(36:33):
this is game time. On The Duck Gottlieb Show, has
Lee Westwood had the most top five finishes without winning
a major? Like, there's there's other guys that have played
in majors. I just wonder it feels like he's had
more top five finishes not having one a major. You
can research that one buyer if you, if you would like,

(36:57):
there's one NFL head coach we'd love to question, loved
to doubt and this year suddenly the narrative has changed.
Tell you who that is next? On The Doug Otlip Show.
Fox Sports Radio. Fox Sports Radio has the best sports
talk lineup in the nation. Catch all of our shows
at Fox sports Radio dot com and within the I
Heart Radio app search f s R to listen live.

(37:19):
What Up to God Leave Show Fox Sports Radio. Man,
I hope you're having a great day. WHOA, it's a
beautiful day in Southern California. You know It's amazing about
Southern California is the difference in temperature based upon location.
Like I think the outsider has never been to southern

(37:41):
California and San Francisco is much the same way where
they're like, oh, what's the temperature today in southern California,
Ryan Music? Where you live? What's the temperature where you live?
What's the temperature. I'd say it's probably somewhere in the
mid nineties, mid nineties, not upper Uh. I can let
me double check. Let's see for today, it is going

(38:04):
to be two currently with the high of ninety six. Yeah,
I have nine six where I live. Again, it's in
the same is seventy four degrees today with a high
of seventy six. You know, based upon proximity to the water.
But also not all beach cities are the same. Are
you in the valley, are you in the hills? Are

(38:25):
you in the right Whereas when you're in New York, Chicago,
you know where you're in, Uh, Atlanta pretty much the same,
even though it's in there's some hills around there. Like
when it's hot, it is hot, and the only way
to cure it being hot is you get in the water.
Are you go inside? You're very much location dependent. Doug

(38:47):
gotlib Show brought to you by Farmers at Farmers We've
seen almost everything you wanted to cover, almost anything when
it's game time. Having experienced player help you stay at
the game. Put their experience in a play at Farmers
dot com We are Farmers. Last year, at this time,
Bill Belichick had lost his mind. Bill Belichick had lost
his way. Bill Belichick because he had benched Malcolm Butler

(39:10):
had lost the locker room well, with exception of on
this show where I told you like yes, maybe Bill
Belichick lost that game because he chose to sit Malcolm
Butler and the Philadelphia Eagles ended up exposing their lack

(39:32):
of shutdown quarterback play. Or maybe Bill Belichick knew Malcolm
Butler wasn't playing up to his normal level. He wasn't
well the week of the Super Bowl when he missed
the team's flight and checked into a hospital. And maybe,
maybe more importantly, the reason Bill Belichick had been able
to be and in as many Super Bowls as he

(39:53):
had been in was because he was willing to sacrifice
one guy for the betterment of the team. And that
short term loss is long term game. And whether I
was on Speak for Yourself with Jason Whitlock, I didn't
know what I was talking about. Overcalling Calherd. Trust me,
this is gonna resonate or other people's radio shows, other

(40:17):
people's TV shows. I sat there and said, I don't know,
if you have a player who's not playing well, you
have a team doctor. Instead of going to the team doctor,
they go to the hospital when they're supposed to be
getting on a plane to fly to the Super Bowl.
Forget about Tom Brady liking Malcolm Butler's message when he
signed with the Titans. How many guys do we have

(40:38):
to see leave the Patriots and not perform well when
we realized Belichick knows what he's doing. Last year, I
was like the lone defender of of the greatness of
Bill Belichick in spite of the fact that they had
given up so many yards to the Eagles and lost
the hard thought Super Bowl. Because I put it out,

(41:01):
I'm not trying. Many people remember Tom Brady is screwed up.
He misread the defense and he simply threw it in
the flat. He wouldn't have had a strip sack fumble
and they might have beaten the Eagles because they did
not punt against the Eagles. Here's Tony Romo, lead analyst

(41:22):
for CBS Sports on one oh five three the fan
talking about what makes Bill Belichick so special. When I'm
around him, I learned, And that's really a joy. When
you can really learn something more about football with people
around we have people that can teach you the game.
Have you've been studying, that's a really that's a joy.
I mean, I honestly learned every time I'm around it.

(41:43):
That's that's he's really really special. Yeah, he's really smart,
got this thing figured out, kind of step ahead of it,
you know, step ahead of it. And I think it's
interesting that last year this time, people thought he was

(42:04):
behind the times when he was really a step ahead
of it. How good he hear? Malcolm Butler have not
up to level his contract. And the Patriots, as much
as they looked like they were depleted of star caliber
talent to start the season, became a hell of a team,
a hell of a defensive football team. And look at
what they were able to do to the Chiefs in

(42:25):
the first half and to the Rams for the totality
of the game. Well, you can talk about the Rams
not using Todd Gurley. They had a big time offense
that did bub kiss against the Pats. And if you
can name one more than one defensive starter, too defensive
starters for the Pats. I will tip my cap to you.

(42:45):
Some of it comes to the fact that he has
great experience. Some of it comes from the fact that
they play in a depleted division and they always have
with inexperienced coaches and very average quarterback play, so they
have games to figure out what they are. And some
of it comes from the fact that he knows that
they're in a weak division, knows they're gonna be in playoffs,

(43:06):
and so he creates a team that is designed to
win in December and January. Forget about whether or not
you win in September October when it's offense fest. They
play the long play on a yearly basis and not
the short play on a yearly basis, just like it's
the long play forever with the Patriots, as supposed to,

(43:30):
they take the long term look, not the short term.
He actually did want to take the long term effect
with Jimmy Garoppolo and was talked down to it by
the for the short term win with Tom Brady because
of the owner that this is who he is and

(43:51):
as much as we could say it would be hard
to watch the Patriots without Tom Brady. No one on
that roster has ever been exempt for being cut or traded.
Right when father time is about to catch up to you,
I want to quickly comment on the l s U
locker rooms. This is what happens every year about this time,

(44:15):
a big time football school unveils new locker rooms that
are better than the last big time football school. Last year,
this time it was Texas, and I believe Clemson. Clemson
has the slide in theirs as well as like a
family fund zone, and Texas locker room is just filthy, sick, disgusting.

(44:38):
This year it's l s U who has If you've
flown in first class or walked by those new planes
in first class, it basically has those kind of same
lay flat pull out seats which become kind of a
napping cabin. LSU spent twenty eight million dollars to renovate
their locker rooms and create the type of atmosphere that

(45:03):
they help hope will help them in recruiting. Now, it's
interesting to me what people automatically do. The knee jerk is, well,
why don't you just pay the players you have enough
money to do so? Forgetting the fact that if you
pay the players, you have to pay taxes, and college

(45:27):
college schools operate in a tax free exempt bubble. Secondly,
if you pay the men yet to pay the women equally,
that's called title nine. And third, maybe most interesting and
least discussed, is if you split up all that money.
And granted you're not gonna give twenty eight to the
players because the locker rooms also go in line with

(45:50):
the lounge and everything else. But if you think given
a couple of thousand dollars to a college kid is
better than giving a college kid a chef and a
great working environment that lasts for twenty years. Like, what
do we know about college? I always love this? What

(46:12):
do they need that for? Have you ever been around college?
What do you do in college? You go to class
and you take a nap, and then you get up,
eat something, and go to class and do it again
and then that. This is my impression of other college students,
because as a college student athlete, I would have loved
a spot to just take a nap where I don't

(46:33):
have to walk back or let's use case, drive back
to my dorms. I just crash, get a little power nap,
go to the training room, get a little power bar
and go on about my day. One. I think I
think it fits with the college lifestyle too. It actually
teaches kids the smart lesson, which is invest in infrastructure,

(46:56):
not in anything else that you can use cash for.
And three, it's about environment for success of of learning.
It's also about recruiting. Just like all these beautiful classroom
buildings that they have and student centers like that's not
just for the students, that for bringing in the next
generation of students, which is how colleges work. They recruit you,

(47:22):
they land you, you graduate, they ask you for money
to recruit the next group coming up next. Um, you
go from being a superstar All Star baseball player to
being a coach under your brother in your hometown. And

(47:47):
that's a good career move. We'll ask Matt Holiday, seven
time All Star he joins his next Be sure to
catch live editions of The Doug Dot Leap Show weekdays
at noon eastern three pm Pacific on Fox Sports Radio
and the I Heart Radio app Doug glic Show Fox
Sports Radio. We had some football to react to, getting

(48:08):
ready for the football season baseball. Of course, we got
the team's running away with it right Lawyer's Yankees Astros.
His uh. One of his last teams was the Yankees
playing the playoffs against the Astro. Was trying to bring
it back full circle for former Rocky and Cardinal and
current assistant baseball coach at MYLA Mater, Oklahoma State. Matt Holiday,

(48:32):
a friend of the program, joins us on Fox Sports Radio. Matt,
how are you hi, Doug? Um, Okay, there's there's a
bunch to get to here. So I take it that
means you're officially retired. Well, yeah, I mean, I mean
I'm still in shape that I could play if the
right situation arose. But yeah, I mean I'm at a

(48:54):
point now where you know, I'm I'm figuring out what's
next in my life, and you know, kind of what
I want to do next and have an opportunity. Um,
my brother and I talked and and taking this opportunity
to be the volunteer coach and and see if this
is something that I want to get into. And it
was a long term and um just felt like a

(49:15):
good opportunity and and uh so I don't know, I
hate the word retirement. I'm not playing right now, and uh,
there's no good opportunities on the table. So, uh, I
guess technically if you want to call it that, Yes, Um,
I'm excited about this, this opportunity and and still uh,
you know the good thing about this is I still
get to do a lot of a lot of dad's

(49:36):
stuff and watch my kids play and and uh and
so it's, uh, it's it's it's I think it's a
good mix for me. Okay, So I want to get
to the coach. You think, what what is it about
the word retirement? You don't like, I don't know, man,
I'm thirty nine years old. Like when I picture retirement,
when I picture people talking about being retired, Like to me,
that sounds like they're just not doing anything. It's retired

(49:58):
from from profes, you know, baseball, right, Like you're not
retiring from life. So you're gonna sit around and have
have dinner at like five o'clock and go like whoa
looking out the news going on in the crazy nis
in the world, right Like, I don't know, Yeah, I
mean I guess I think you know, just as athletes,
when you still feel like you can do something, it's
hard to say I'm retired, like I'll never do that again.

(50:20):
I mean, well, you were you were last year, you
were training around this time, and then the Rockies called
and gave you a call. What was that experience in
terms of, you know, at the end of it, was
it everything you hoped? Was it missing something to it
fulfill me? What? How would you characterize that experience? It

(50:42):
was great. Honestly, I really enjoyed it because, you know,
I went into it with really just kind of the
expectation was I'm going to the minor leagues and kind
of trying to earn my way back to the major league,
almost like when you first start out, when you sign
at eighteen years old, you're trying to earn earn your
spot and and and earn your way to the major league.

(51:02):
So I kind of treated it as such, and going
to the minor leagues and and spending time and just
you know, when you're on rehab, you know that that
at some point soon you'll be going to the major
league as soon as you tell them that you're healthy
and ready to go. And you know, there was no
promises from the Rockies on on getting called up or
you know, basically it was, hey, do you want an opportunity?

(51:24):
And so it was fun. I really enjoyed, you know,
kind of being around young players that are hungry and
and uh and then you know, playing well enough to
get another chance, uh to play with the Rockies and
and really from really cool moments and and uh and
played really well, I thought. And I had a lot
of fun, made the playoffs and and played in some
in some really cool games and and so it was.

(51:47):
It was a great experience. I enjoyed, uh, pretty much
every facet of of that whole, you know, sort of
two months uh deal Matt Holiday joining us on the
Gotlib Show on Fox Sports Radio. Is the ball different
now than for most of your career? I mean, I
think the triple A that is hard to argue with

(52:08):
triple A using the the Major League Baseball this year
and in the home run percentage being so much higher
than it's ever been. I think it's it's pretty indicative
that something is different. And who knows, whether it's on purpose,
you know, whatever, whatever that argument is about trying to
get more home runs or more offense into the game
for for for entertainment value or MLPs doing it on purpose.

(52:33):
I mean, I don't know the answer to any of that,
but I definitely think that the balls. Are you know
that the balls are obviously leaving the park at a
at a higher rate, And like I said, I don't
know why or who's responsible, but I would say yes, okay,
so that that I mean, this is a little bit
like it's not the steroid era because guys aren't doing

(52:53):
this illegally, right, this is all illegal, but but there
is similar in that this is one of the things
that diminish as guys that did the right way or
played in an arrow when the baseball is it like yourself,
Like you look at your numbers and it's a pretty
it's a sound argument to say you should be a
Hall of Fame baseball player. Right, four time Silver Sucker,
seven time All Star. There's a lot of numbers of

(53:13):
career three hitter. Uh does this in your mind? Will
this diminish your candidacy? Oh? I don't know. Um, I don't,
I don't know. I mean, I think I think it's
one of those things where hopefully it corrects itself. I mean, whoever,
I mean, surely MLB can has the science and the
technology to go in this offseason and and get the

(53:35):
baseball back to more of where it was two years ago,
three years ago. I mean, I don't know how I said,
I don't know a ton about this stuff, but I
hope they get it back to where it's it's playing
like you said, to where it's not you don't feel
like the numbers are skewed or people are questioning whether
a guy hits forty five home runs whether you should

(53:55):
have hit thirty five or thirty or or whatever. Where
everything is on a level ang fields and number wise,
and and and I'm not really worried about like where
I stack up as far as eras and and numbers.
And I'm proud of the career I had. I did
it the right way. UM. I played the game hard.
I I enjoyed it, um And and I can be

(54:17):
proud of that I I worked as hard as I
possibly could. I can look in them here and and
look at my kid's eyes and tell you know, they
know that their dad played the game the right way
and and did everything he could uh to do the
best that he could. And and I think that that's
that's the main thing for me, the most important thing.
And whether or not, you know, I get any votes
for the Hall same or or whatever, that would be

(54:39):
an honor just to get a vote, and so I
don't know, I don't I don't probably not concern myself
about too much that holiday joining us in the Doug
Gotlip Show. Now voluntary assistant at at Oklahoma State. UM.
I want to get to working for your brother and
all the other things and what you ultimately want to accomplish.
But since you're not currently playing and there aren't any offers,
you don't want to call you retired. I do want

(55:02):
to run down a couple of the things I've always
wanted to ask you. Um that now you won't have
to face guys, right, So who owned you? Oh? I mean,
there's a lot of guys that I had a hard
time with. Um. There were some guys that guy named
Brian Lawrence that pitched back in the day with the Padres.

(55:23):
There's some guys that are kind of sneaky that uh
I had a hard time picking up. Um that that Uh,
I'm trying to think if anybody comes to mind. Mean,
obviously all the good guys are hard to hit, you know,
Sure's here and all the all the guys that can
make the ball go kind of running up and end
and down in the way and at high rates of speed. UM,

(55:45):
no one's coming to mind that absolutely dominated me. I mean, like,
I'm sure there are, I'm sure you could. Okay, so
how about this one. Give me somebody that that's really good,
that you dominated, that you own that when you'd see
you'd see them, You're like, Oh, they're pitching today. I'm
gonna have a good day. It's funny. Uh Woody Williams.
Uh the the picture of the picture of the Cardinals

(56:06):
and Astros, It's funny. He's a really good picture. But
I had amazing numbers off of them, and uh just
seemed to find hits and get hits off of him. Uh.
I saw him in Houston and when I was playing
with with St. Louis. Uh, he was living in Houston area,
and I knew him a little bit, not real well.
And and he came into the clubhouse and came up

(56:27):
behind me and said, hey, man, you want me to
get you hot, I'll take you in the cage and
throw you a little VP. So he knew he knew,
so uh yeah, him and him and uh uh Jeff
supon I had really good numbers off of the kind
of come to mind. Um, I don't know, I don't,
I can't those two I I. They were like, they

(56:48):
were really good numbers. Ronson Bronson Royal, you had four
home runs twelve rb I against. Yeah, you saw the
ball well against against I've asked you because did you
see um who is It's the guy from the Mariners,
Mike Leak. So he had a he had a but
a perfect game going into the ninth inning against the Angels,
and and Trout had great numbers against him. And Trout

(57:10):
and three at bats like he hit a streamer down
third base line to the third baseman, hit one with
a shortstop, made a great play, and then hit one
to center where he lined out. Which you know, if
the ball, any of those balls are a foot or
two feet to to a side, it's it's different. And
so sometimes the numbers, even an individual game, aren't indicative
of seeing the ball off a guy, no doubt. I mean,

(57:31):
there's there's guys that you just see the ball better
off of than others. And it's weird because there'll be
guys some of them are really good, and and there'll
be guys that are really struggling but you're having a
hard time with and you know everybody else is kind
of laughing at you because Uh, you know they're carving
you up and and you know they're they're hitting missile
shots off of them. So it's a it's a crazy

(57:53):
uh interaction hitter and picture in your eyes and what's
your eyes see and what they tell your brain and um,
it's a it's quite fascinating like when you when you play,
and like I said, you see pictures and you're like,
he thought it has ninety and nine or a hundred
on the on the radar gun, but it doesn't feel
that hard. And I think they're starting to quantify some

(58:14):
of that with the spin right stuff and and things
like that, but it is, uh, it is pretty crazy. Uh,
Matt Kane, by the way, I owned you. I think
you have one three against him in like forty two
at bats. He just he claimed I had a couple
of homers though, three three homers. So you're all enough
one of these six. You're all or nothing guy, which
by the way, now would make you the greatest player
on earth. That's it's all like when when you came

(58:36):
in strike out for a bigger deal, weren't they Yeah,
for sure. I mean I think that it was embarrassing
to strike out, you know, I think for me even still,
when you know, at the end of my career, I
was always embarrassed, more embarrassed by a strikeout than than
anything else. I mean, I I wanted to hit the
ball and felt like the picture dominated me if I
end up striking out. So, um, I think it is

(58:58):
a little bit of a change. I mean, I also
think that the pitching now is, you know, the velocities
are are crazy high, and these guys, you know, you
only get two shots at the starter most of the time,
and then you're facing a reliever for your last two
at bats that are pretty much specialized and trying to
strike people out. So it's a It's a different game
for sure than when I first came up. But I
do think guys are a little more cavalier about striking

(59:22):
out than maybe they were, you know, as when when
when I first started playing, your favorite hit you ever got,
like if you close your eyes and you say, like,
if you're trying to relate to your grandkids, the best
hit you can remember in baseball is what, um, I
think probably the three run homer I hit, and they
know CS against the Diamondbacks. It was kind of stealed

(59:46):
gave us. I think a four or five run lead
and like the sixth inning pit their sixth inning. It
was kind of like the It was in course field
and it pretty much stealed our our World Series getting
to go to the World Series. So it was three
on Homer and the crowd was going crazy and it
was it was a cool moment. I remember vividly running

(01:00:06):
around the basis on that one. Um, I think the
home run in St. Louis at the end of my
time there. Uh, it's something that that that kind of
stands out in my mind. Yeah, wait for people, don't
for people who don't remember, weren't you told that day? Right?
Wasn't it like before the game you were told that
they wouldn't pick up your option and everyone knew? Or

(01:00:28):
was that actually the last game? Like? How did it
remind me of? How? I remember the home run, but
I don't remember the exact moment. Basically, it was coming
down to the end of the season. I had a
broken tomb, I hadn't been able to play um and
we were getting close to the end and we were
kind of in the playoffs. We were still within striking
distance and making the playoffs, but um, I wasn't I

(01:00:50):
was on the d L and I just basically went
to Mo the general manager of the Cardinals, and and
I kind of wanted to know if this was gonna
be it, if they were not gonna you know, they
didn't plan on having me back, because you know, sometimes
the season end and you never get to really say
goodbye and and and tell people, um, you know, the
club eaes and and the people that you've you've seen
for the last eight years. You never really get to

(01:01:11):
give them the appropriate kind of goodbye. You know, you
don't you don't want the season end and then oh, hey,
we're not picking your option up, and then some of
those people you may not see again. And so I
basically just kind of wanted to know what what his
plan was so that I could, you know, do something
nice for some of the people that that had done
a lot of nice things for me in those eight years.
And he just basically told me, you know, at this point,

(01:01:34):
anything can happen, but we're not playing on picking the
option up, and and so you know, we I think
we decided to let people know that, and they wanted
to activate me. And there was two games left, I
think in the season, and they wanted to activate me
to give me that bat or the crowd to kind
of announce it and then let the crowd, you know, um,

(01:01:55):
you know, do whatever. And uh so I hadn't played
and and like I was coming off a broken tomb
and got that one at bat and um, got down
O two and was thinking, good grief, I don't want
to strike out here. I'll be embarrassing and hit a
curveball on O two out to right center and it
was pretty cool, pretty cool moment, pretty emotional. Crowd went crazy.

(01:02:16):
It was, it was pretty neat. It was. It felt
like a really good closure to my time in St. Louis.
I ended up getting a bat the next day and
got a hit, but it was you know, I like
to think of that as as sort of my last
bat as a cardinal. All right, now that you're probably
not gonna play baseball professionally ever again, Oh seven, game one?

(01:02:37):
Did you touch home plate? I mean, you know, I
think when people ask me that no, no, no, yes,
or no question, did you touch home plate? I don't know.
I mean, what was to me, Like I wasn't looking
down at the at the plate looking to see if
I touched it. It It happened so fast do you know
what the plate feels like? Well, it feels exactly like

(01:03:00):
I mean, it doesn't feel like the dirt. It doesn't
feel like the catcher's cleat. It feels right. Well. Well,
I mean I don't remember, like you know, you don't
the texture of the difference between the plate and the
dirt when you're going as fast as you can in
a moment, split second like that. Like, I don't remember
specifically touching any like anything anything really, So I just say,

(01:03:22):
I just tell people, Look, if there was replay then
like there is now, would they have overturned the safe call?
Was there enough evidence to say that I didn't touch
on plate and would be ruled out? And I don't.
I don't really think there is, so, um, I don't know.
That's what. I don't know if I did or not. Honestly,
I I was trying my hardest to touch it and

(01:03:44):
and bang my chin pretty hard and barely remember the
next fifteen minutes after that. But UM, so sorry, I
don't don't have a great answer. No, I understand, truth
be told, if Oakland lost their baseball team, would you
shed even one tier? You know that that whole thing?
You know? I I just it was just a kind

(01:04:05):
of a rough, a rough year as far as kind
of a transitional period for me. UM, I didn't uh,
you know, I didn't know how long I would be there.
I knew that they weren't interested in signing me as
a free agent. UM I knew that a probably we weren't.
If we weren't in the playoffs, hunt I would be
traded in July. Um. You know, it's it's a tough

(01:04:26):
stadium as far as the facility is, is is tough
for players to prepare in. There's only one or at
the time there was only one batting cage. It was
just not not my favorite season. I Billy Bean was
amazing at the front office, all the people that that
were there, UM I was. I was very impressed with
and and and enjoyed that, you know that that end
of it. But it was just like I said, it was,

(01:04:48):
it was a tough year. I mean, I hope they
get a new stadium. They need a new stadium, and
I I hope that that that organization. You know, they've
got really really bright people running it and and uh
and I think Bob Nolan does an amazing Uh. I
would say, no, that's that's that's not necessarily how I
felt joining us. All right, So now your big brother

(01:05:08):
is the head coach. He's been the head coach at
my alma mater um, which, by the way, you get
credit like by proxy. Like your wife is an alum,
your brothers in. Um, you're not an alum, are you? Like?
You don't have you don't have an Oklama State degree,
do you? No? No, I don't have any any classes passed.
But I would say I would say I'm probably as

(01:05:30):
close to an Oklahoma State alone as somebody who's not
an Oklahoma State alon. Yes, no, I would agree. Um,
so what's it like to take Now you're gonna he's
gonna technically be your boss. Now he's not paying you anything,
so you could quit and walk away anytime. But so
so you do have that card to play. But he's
always been your big brother. Now he's your boss and

(01:05:50):
your big brother. How does that go? I mean, you know, Josh,
I mean, he's the least uh like, he's he would
hold that over over my head, the least amount of
any person that I know. I mean, he's he uh,
he just wants me to help and wants me to
you know, he wants me to be part of it
because he thinks I can bring something to these kids

(01:06:11):
lives and that I can add to what they're already doing.
And and that's pretty much it. Like he's like, you know,
my brother, Like I'm I don't bias, but he's the
he's the least ego ego person that that I know,
and and uh so I'm not. I'm not worried about
him him bossing me around too much. So he uh,
he's fun to be around and and I'm excited to

(01:06:33):
spend even more time with him. Last thing, the most
important thing. Will every oak almostated hitter have the high
knee kick? I don't think so. I Um, I hope
that I've I've learned enough that that's not that's not
the uh the only thing that that uh you know
that I could teach. I I think I know a
little something about a leg kick, but uh uh it's

(01:06:55):
it's it's not easy, you know. There was times in
my career where I tried to cut it down or
even consider trying to eliminate it because of the timing
aspect and trying to trying to be perfect with it.
But um, if if somebody has one or once one.
I think I can help him with it. Well, it's
an incredible resource you offer to him. I know the
new stadiums almost done. I've seen all the footage and whatever. Um,

(01:07:17):
congrats on the new gig and uh at some point
we'll do a retirement thing in the meantime. In the
meantime we we apparently just don't like that word. Thanks
for joining us, dude to it's Matt Holiday joining us
the friend of the program, personal friend of course, now
an assistant baseball coach under his brother at mild moder
at Oklahoma State. Zero class has passed like he's like

(01:07:38):
nine passed any classes? Not one, not not You know,
I took classes one summer and I no, no, no,
haven't passed and taking a class. How valuable is Ezekie Elliott?
A Super Bowl champion running back, has his doubts. Will
discuss next. Be sure to catch live edition so the
Doug Dot Leaps Show week days at noon eastern three

(01:07:59):
p m. Pas. Defac we roll on the Goli Show
here on Fox Sports Trading. I hope you had a
great week. Hand ready for a good week where guys
arriving in trading camp kind of amazing. Right, Tom Brady
entering his first season without Rob Groun cool season through
thousand ten, like his his career has more than doubled
that of Gronks. Well, that's the players come, players go.

(01:08:21):
But Tom Brady is still the quarterback of the Patriots.
Craziness every day at this time, you like to play
for you a portion of a previous show on Fox
Sports One or Fox Sport Trader we call it. And
now this was Reggie Bush, new Fox College Football analysts
on Undisputed this morning talking about the value of Ezeke

(01:08:41):
Elliott the player, and me sympathizes with Zeke because he
is the best running back in the league that we
have to offer since two sixteen, the Cowboys are twenty
two and six when he has twenty plus carres. So
it's not even a question of who this offering runs through.
It runs through Zeke. But the general manager side is thinking, well,

(01:09:05):
his trade value is never gonna be higher than it
is right now. Right, he's just turned twenty four years
old today, he's the best running back in the league. Um,
but running the football would not win you a Super Bowl? Right,
And so even with all the stats that Zeke has
has accumulated. They have nothing to show for it. I
think this is actually a false proclamation. I think it's

(01:09:29):
a false proclamation by Reggie Bush. Now, Reggie Bush for
a running back to say that it's kind of amazing. Now.
He was also very versatile running back who was a
perfect fit for He was Alvin Kamara before Alvin Kamara, right,
a guy who can line up out wide, could line
up in the backfield. You can run him out of
the Jets waye. You do what anybody want with Reggie Bush,
he was a Swiss army knife is a running back.

(01:09:51):
But it's a false proclamation. Look, I understand that strictly
lining up and going too tight ends and mashing people,
you don't want a Super Bowl that way. But you
can absolutely be a primary run team and win a
Super Bowl. The Rams, if Todd Gurley wasn't all banged up,

(01:10:12):
could have won a Super Bowl that way. There they
run the football a ton um. Additionally, it depends upon
how your team is built. Right, if you have the
type of offensive line that the Cowboys have, you can
run the football more often. If you have type of
wide receivers who can make place once they got healthy

(01:10:32):
and once they made a trade for Mary Mary Cooper
and your defense has to be good. But this idea that, well,
you can't. You know, you can't win a Super Bowl
strictly throwing a football, unless you're the Patriots, who at
times have had teams that have won a Super Bowl
throwing the football. You can have whatever you want to win.
There's no one way which you win football games. It

(01:10:53):
just isn't. And by the way, the other part about
a zeke which is incredibly valuable as he can catch
it and he can block, so he does all three
phases of being And the last part is you're not
changing a silly Now. He's got two more years under
his rookie deal. He potentially, if you want to draw
a hard and fast line, would have two more years

(01:11:15):
as a franchise tag player. You don't have to give
him any more money if you don't want to. If
you're the Dallas Cowboys. Now, he may not show up
to work, he may not be happy, but contractually you
don't have to do anything that you don't want to do.
This is all just nonsense talk. Additionally, trading away the

(01:11:36):
top running back in the game in his prime under
a rookie deal when you don't have to trade him
and you don't have to give him a new deal,
would be a nonsensical trade. Yes, Rhymesy, I do feel
like the stat that Reggie had sided there as one
of those It sounds obvious when it sounds like a

(01:12:00):
an impressive stat until you think about it, and then
it sounds really obvious, because wouldn't a running back get
more touch ins in games that you win because you
often have a lead and then you're trying to run
out the clock. Whereas it's the same type of thing
when people throw out stats where they're like, whether too
reliant on the pass game whenever they have more than
forty five pass attempts they end up losing. It's like, well, yeah,

(01:12:21):
that's usually because you're down and you're trying to play
from behind, so you have to throw the ball because
you can't afford to run the ball. So I mean,
when you're ahead, you run the football at time to
run out the clock. It's so it's like when well,
when he touches the ball more than twenty times, they're
twenty two and whatever, It's like, well, yeah, because they're
already winning, so they're gonna give them the football. Right,
and when they throw it a ton, Yeah, when you

(01:12:41):
throw it a bunches because you're behind and you can't
win by throwing the ball that many times, so they
were already losing. It's a right, It's a confirmation stat right.
It really is what it is. It's confirming something we
already knew to be true. And and I just we
just can't fall into the trap of well, you can't

(01:13:04):
build around and running back. You absolutely can't. If he's
a running back who can catch it, if he's a
running back who can block, and if you have other weapons,
and if you have a quarterback who can make plays,
and you get a defense that gets stops like all
these things, you absolutely can't. There is no one way
to win a Super Bowl. You have a defense, but
there's no like, well you have to run a four three.

(01:13:24):
You have to have a three four. You gotta have
the right personnel for whatever you want, and you have
to get the right matchup. So there's a there's a
bunch of different things that you have to do in
order to win a Super Bowl. I just don't like
hard and fast rules. Nick Right's gonna join the show
up coming next Um. He's been a long time defender
of Odell Beckham Jr. Ask him about that. Also will

(01:13:47):
ask him how he feels about the Houston Rockets now
that they've they've revamped to the tune of Chris Paul out,
James Harden in. Right, What do you when I say
James har I mean James Harden and Russell Westbrook. Yet
Russell Westbrook in for Chris Paul And they just switched
out point guards essentially, and statistically Russell westbrooks better and

(01:14:08):
age wise he's better. Is he a better fit? And
is he a good enough fit for the Rockets to
finally get over that invisible hump? And we'll ask him
what he thinks about Kawai Leonard, who seems to have
duped both the Clippers and the Lakers and neither are
happy about it. So we got a lot to get to.

(01:14:30):
We also have Mike Leach the Pirates gonna join us
Washington State head coach. So I got a great hour,
Nick right, Mike Leach next in the Doug Gotlip Show.
Fox Sports Radio. Fox Sports Radio has the best sports
talk lineup in the nation. Catch all of our shows
at Fox sports radio dot com and within the I
Heart Radio app. Search f s R to listen live

(01:14:52):
What Up Tug Gottlieb Show, Fox Sports Radio. M m
m m m m m. I hope you had a
great weekend. What's that it? Would you say? Buyer a
week and a half, we have NFL football sort of,
that's just crazy. Doug Gotli Show is brought to you
by Farmers. At Farmers, we've seen almost everything, so we

(01:15:12):
do not cover almost anything when it's game time. Having
experienced player help you stay at the game, put their
experience into play. At Farmers dot com, we are Farmers.
The article everybody's talking about is in uh GQ magazine
that Jennicer when Gentlemen's Quarterly Magazine. Of course g Q
dot com has it and they've they've put it out
there on blast out on social media. It's an interesting

(01:15:35):
sit down with Odell Beckham Jr. Who is not only
a super talented player and has been as explosive wide
receivers the league has ever seen when he's healthy through
his first four years, as as any wide receiver in
the history of the sport. Now, some of that comes
from the sport having evolved and changed, right, and some

(01:15:56):
of it comes from the guy's just awesome, But after
signing the biggest contract for his position in the history
of the sport last year, he was summarily dealt to Cleveland,
which used to be a death sentence to a career,
but now it almost feels like new life. But instead
of doing a victory lap that he's with his dear

(01:16:19):
friend Jarvis Landry and a young talented quarterback in Baker
Mayfield with an offensive minded coach. Instead, there's a lot
of looking back at what went wrong with the Giants
and um there's finger pointing as to being feeling disrespected
when he was traded or he offered up the possibility

(01:16:40):
that hey, I thought about retiring two years ago. Of course,
he was going through a nasty injury he suffered only
a couple of weeks into the season. But that's the
way that Odell Beckham Jr. Has chosen to handle the
exodus from New York instead of I've learned a lot,
some good, some bad, some great catches the playoffs, and

(01:17:03):
some disappointing years and some injuries, and I'm ready for
a new challenge. He's presenting his point of view and
his opinion of how what happened happened. My takeaway is this, like, look,
no one said the kid can't play. A guy can play,
absolutely can play. But he keeps talking about being a

(01:17:26):
winner and wanting to win and only being about winning.
And that's not all the things he's doing. Things he's
doing at times distract you from winning. The things he's doing,
like not going after an inside kick in his last
game with the Giants against the Bears, keep you from winning.

(01:17:46):
And it feels like the kid that says I want
I want to be an astronaut, all right, we gotta
study up in your science and your math, Like yeah,
I don't really like science of math. I just love space. Sorry, dude,
this is not the way it works. When asked why
he wasn't at O t A S, he said wasn't mandatory,
which is a legitimate reason, unless, of course, you're trying

(01:18:06):
to get to know a new team, new quarterback, a
new system, a new organization, a new city, and you
want to fully dedicate yourself to winning. All right. The
guys at First Things First have a great relationship with
Odell beckham t. They do I they know him, uh,
they've seen him work out, and Nick right of course,

(01:18:27):
has helped kind of foster and grow that relationship. He's
joins us now on the Doug Gotlip Show. By the way,
First Things First is six thirty nine thirty am Eastern Time,
three thirty two six thirty am Pacific Coast Time. Plus.
Nick has a show upcoming every day on Serious XM
satellite Radio. Nick What When? When you read the g
Q article, what's your general takeaway? Well, I have a

(01:18:50):
couple of takeaways from the article. I disagree with almost
everything you said in this introduction, but we can get
into that. But there is one thing that I think
we will agree on, which is Odell Beckham Jr. Is very,
very twenty six years old in two thousand nineteen. And
by that I mean this, and I think we're seeing
this in a lot of the NBA players as well.

(01:19:11):
And you kind of have even though you're not an
old guy, you have an old school mentality. I didn't
know your father, but I imagine you have a lot
of his traits in this regard. There is a growing
belief amongst people just a tick younger than me, or
maybe my age, but I'm thirty four. I think maybe

(01:19:31):
the generation just a little bit behind me, that life
is about fun and O'Dell does mention fun and enjoy
and a lot of these words that to me, that
is not the way I was necessarily raised and maybe
to my own detriment, maybe to my own you know,

(01:19:54):
lack of personal joy. But I think there are moments
of fun, more moments of joy in a pursuit of excellence.
Now where I disagree with you is I think O'Dell
has done all of the things that contribute to winning.
That's how you become the great player that he is.
But there is an element we see it with some
NBA superstars. I think you've see in some of these quotes,

(01:20:17):
which is they at some point in in in life,
they got the memo that the goal here is to
squeeze as much fun out of the orange as possible.
And by the way, maybe that should be the goal.
Maybe that is the happier, healthier way to live. But
it's not that that isn't my my perspective, I don't

(01:20:38):
think it's yours, And I think it's one of the
reasons there's a disconnect for O'Dell and people who cover
the game that are a generation or two older than him. Um,
I think the disconnect would be the fun is in
the winning. The fun is in celebrating the winning. Um,
you know, the fun is not necessarily in the work.

(01:21:00):
Do try and keep the workplace as enjoyable as possible,
But the end of the day, like, hey man, there's
some things you gotta do. It's it's like recovering an
onside kick. You know. To me, I heard you say
that that the that the you're you're talking about a
game that happened this year. What what was the Giants

(01:21:21):
record this year? It wasn't good? Okay, was it was?
It was? Were the playoffs on the line? No, but
they were trying to win out at the end of
the year. But hold on, hold on, hold on if ultimately,
I guess the question to me is this is the
goal of a sports organization to win, to give yourself
the best chance to win any individual game, or is

(01:21:44):
the goal to give yourself the best chance to win
a championship? Because if it's the latter rather than the former,
at the end of the season, when your team is eliminated,
doing something that might set you up to be doing
rehab during the season instead of honing your craft does
not contribute to winning. And the idea that we're gonna

(01:22:05):
there's a lot of fair things Tonacodell for and you
mentioned it, like, listen, this is he's one of guys. Now,
I think it probably one of one Pro Bowl, Pro
Bowl caliber NFL players that I consider a friend. So
if people want to say I'm biased on this, so
be it. But it O'Dell does everything within his power
to contribute to his team's success. And if you're gonna

(01:22:29):
we're gonna all of a sudden act like he dogs
it on the field with any level of regularity, because
in one clip he didn't die for an on site
kick to your satisfaction, I think that's unfair. Was it
wasn't to my satisfaction? Is to anybody's satisfaction? Right? That
I don't even like, I don't this is of of
there's there's a hundred plays on each side of the

(01:22:51):
ball in every football game all year. And if we
decide I'm gonna watch this guy looking for a play
that I can look for a nick and look, I
I understand what you're saying. Okay, but I'll send it
to you if you'd like. They're they're playing the Chicago
Bears at home. The Chicago Bears are lining up for
an on side kick. His job is he has one

(01:23:13):
job unearthed, is that to catch the football, and everybody
else's job is to block the defense coming at him
so that he can catch the football. He is the
primary target on the hands team. He has, by most
people's estimation, if not the best hands in football. He's
in any sort of short short list. Right. He's on
the field for one reason and the ball is coming

(01:23:34):
at him, and he makes the old business decision ol
A to get out of the way with the game
on the line. Know that the actually actually the Giants
end up winning in overtime. Okay, okay, And that was
and this is at the end of the season where
the Giants, I don't know what it wasn't at the
end of the season. He didn't play at the end
of the season. And this was one of the reasons
why that they traded him, is because he says he's

(01:23:57):
about winning, but here's a game playing, which if he
makes to play, they win the game, and he chooses
his career and his which even though he had gotten
a bunch of money up front or whatever, but his
assumption that he was putting himself in harm's way, even
though he stepped on the football field ahead of things
to criticize Odell for, Like this is this is where
I do understand his frustration because of all the things

(01:24:20):
to criticize him for that might be fair. It's like, hey,
there was this game in November when the team was
one and eight that they ended up winning anyway, where
he didn't give requisite effort, and therefore he's he's an
insincere when he says I'm about winning. That's to me nonsense,
Like and I didn't. I didn't even know we're gonna
talk about this when we did, Like when we scheduled

(01:24:42):
the interview with the article, I hadn't even been written.
I'm not trying to come on your show just to
argue with because I just I just think it's there's
I think if I were Odell and I'm and the
and I'm scamming through Fox Sports radios, I'm sure he
often does. And I'm like, you gotta be bleeping kidding me.
This is four thousand word piece where I talked about
a lot of things and within three minutes of the

(01:25:06):
top of the five o'clock Eastern hour. The takeaway is,
remember that one play in the game against Chicago, where
he didn't give the effort that Doug Gottlieb thinks is appropriate,
and therefore that anyone anyone deems appropriate. Your mom man, like,
you've watched enough football, you know. I mean, like, look,
you know the deal. You're trying to win the game.
This is what decides a football game. You either catch

(01:25:27):
it you don't catch it. Because they I mean they won,
but they did. They did, and at the time they
were not five and eleven. They lost. They lost their
last three games when he didn't play. Look, I think
he's I think he's super talented. But but but nowhere
in this is this, Hey, you know what I could
have been I shouldn't have done the interview. He's not
wrong about about Eli Manning. By the way, none of

(01:25:50):
us are wrong in pointing out, like I said, Eli
Manning should have been traded five games into two seasons ago.
He wasn't wrong. He wasn't wrong. Eli man is washed
up and they can't seem to get over They fired
their coach and their general manager because they sat him
for one game for Geno Smith, right, Like, we're not.
But it's the These are things that within the within
the context of a football team. You just can't do.

(01:26:11):
You just can't that. To me, it's like O'Dell, I think,
would tell you his defense of the Liew Wayne Josina
Anderson interview would have been, Man, I I was as
gentle as you could possibly be. I was asked, is
Eli part of the problems, and I said, I don't
know when we damn well all know the answers yes,

(01:26:34):
Like that would be his defense, but that would be
the wrong defense because the truth is what you're saying
in a team environment that in that spot you have
to lie right like they have to. Then say you
you just got the contract. You knew he was the
quarterback when you accepted the contract. In that spot, you've
got to support your quarterback. That I think it's fair.
And by the way, I if people were to and

(01:26:57):
if people would ask me, do I think O'Dell learned
from that? Moving for No, I don't know. I don't
think it's gonna be a problem because I think Baker
is awesome. But I think O'Dell has made it pretty
clear that he is. He is hardheaded enough that a
lot of these kind of silly, uh pot holes he's
fallen into. His his internal responses, why didn't they fix

(01:27:19):
the road rather than why didn't I drive around it?
And that's like that, that is what it is. I
don't to me what what is frustrating as a guy
that considers him a friend, and what I'm certain is
terribly frustrating for him is it does seem like there
are certain guys that we in the media decide we

(01:27:40):
are going to focus of our attention on ten of
the nonsense and we are going to act like the
lie Wayne interview has equal importance to most productive receiver
in the history of the NFL over his first sixty
seven games of their career and that and that if
I were him, it would be very very frustrating. But

(01:28:03):
but but you would, you would you would you would agree, like, Look,
part of the attention is by design, right, like the
hair is by design, and some of it is deserved
because of the production or because of the catch. But
this is we are going to focus our attention on
everything because he is a breakthrough star and this is

(01:28:24):
this are part of the pitfalls to it? Yeah, there's
but there are somebody and it's it's mentioned in the piece.
There are certain guys who asked for all the attention
to the same type of thing, and they and and
they don't get smeared with this. I mean, Gronk is
the perfect example. Grounk. He got just decided he's a

(01:28:44):
dumb frat boy, is how it was positioned. So everything
he says is adorable. Gronk can make a pardon me here,
but this is me quoting a new story. Gronk can
make a sixty nine joke to a female reporter at
a team press count Prince and it's laughed about as
opposed to it being a referendum on sexism in sports

(01:29:06):
media in the me too area era, like the grunk
can do anything up to and including having a party, sex,
booze cruise, and it's just Grounk being Grounk. No one
says it's not part of winning. No one says he's distracting.
No one says any of that. And if I'm if
I'm model, I'm like okay. So he gets that because

(01:29:28):
he got the good forts on the Patriots drafted him.
I would say I would say, I would say it's
part of it's that, and then I would say the
other part is part of Odell's problem is he's had
the antics on the field, right, he gets on the
fight he gets against in the fight against the against
the Panthers, against got suspended for trying to kill a
guy on the field. I understand, but but we we
just you just say, you can get negative attention to it. Okay.

(01:29:51):
There also there was the then he kept carrying on.
Then he's the dog paying on the flat fire hydrant,
and he's doing the thing with the kicking net, and
there's the theatrics on the sideline Like I'm not I'm
not disputing that Gronk has gotten to pass. And most
of it's because they won, right, you win and we
forget about everything, and the Giants didn't help. But yeah,

(01:30:12):
a good helps, I think a good I mean, like, look,
Michael Irvan's still on TV, right, I mean, it has
no no, it's not, it's not all of it, but
it's part. It's a piece of the panta if you
will go ahead, right, But the biggest thing is you
want and the second biggest part element to it is
that the on the field stuff, right, the off the
field stuff, we will turn a blind eye too. If

(01:30:34):
when on the field you just hand the guy the
football or you just celebrate, like every other wide receiver
instead of the kicking net proposal for example. No, no,
he absolutely some of you. Some of this is why
is everyone looking at me while screaming look at me? Yes,
of course I get them. By the way, I said
piece of the pantasy, I meant pizza of the tapestry.

(01:30:56):
It was a bad job by me trying to use
a three dollar word when I didn't need to use
the wrong word. Go ahead, Sorry, that was it. That's
all I got. We agree to disagree about good stuff.
All right, we'll do it again, really really soon. The show,
by the way, is a good ones. First things first,
real quick, I'm up against your gut feelings. Uh, they

(01:31:17):
had to do it. I do think they're better because
I just I don't think those two could coexist. Like,
I think there'll be moments of brilliance. I just I
think that Russ I don't think he's the same athlete
he used to be, and I think he'll get a
little frustrated by it. Um. I don't think he's nearly
as good a defensive player as people want to give

(01:31:38):
him credit and defensive players Chris Ball, but that this like,
let me go ahead, I'm sorry, No, no, Well, you're
you're right. And the last thing is I think people
think that because there won't be a Steven Adams in
the way so he can get to the rim. He's
actually statistically not a great finisher, so I think it

(01:31:58):
makes him better in the short term. I think Chris Paul's,
you know, because he wasn't he wasn't a good fit,
and they didn't he didn't like the fit. It ends
up ending poorly. So I still just don't think they're
a championship team. I still think they're missing something because
everybody else has gotten so much better. I think their
upside went up. I think the variants went up as well,
because it could go terribly, I think, but at this point,

(01:32:21):
Russ is a top twenty guy, even if he's close
to twenty, and I don't know if Chris Paul's top
forty five and Russ three and a half years younger.
I one note on this, and then, even though you
didn't ask me about it, now I'm getting my opinion. Sorry,
I just wanted to um, David Thorpe. I don't know
if you found on Twitter. We I have my my
my podcasting here all the time. That's what I thought,
so he presented. I thought, so a really interesting idea,

(01:32:42):
which is, what if the Rockets on offense used Russ
the way the Warriors used drama like high post initiator.
And I think that could be if they work that out.
I mean, he definitely could be a far more effective
offensive Draymond Green, even if he's not quite the court
vision of Draymond On. That to me is the best
way to do it and could be really interesting. But

(01:33:03):
I here's here's here's the issue with that. James Harden
would have to play without the basketball and that's not
something that he's grown accustomed to doing right neither. Back
when they were in Oklahoma City together, Harden was the
fourth quarter point guard and rust love playing off the
basketball and cutting and and just being kind of a
hybrid player. It was it was a marriage made in heaven.

(01:33:26):
But again that's everyone changes over seven years of becoming
a superstar, and I don't know whether or not they
can devolve anyway. We'll discuss this well, you do it
on your show sometime, Nick write his shows on. Thanks
so much, Nick, Right joining us on the Doug Gotlap Show.
We'll go from uh, mostly football, a little hoops to
college football. How does Mike Leach continue on this unbelievable

(01:33:48):
run at Wazoo after last year having a remarkable season?
We'll ask him next. Be sure to catch live editions
of The Doug dot Leap Show week days at noon
Eastern three pm Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and the
I Heart Radio app Doug Atli Show Fox Sports Radio.
He's coming off an unbelievable season and doing so in

(01:34:09):
a place which is so hard to build a program,
but he's done it. He's Mike Leachy's head coach of
the Washington State Cougars. He joins us on Fox Sports Radio, Coach,
how are you? I'm doing good? How are you doing good? Man? Um? So,
what is it like to to try and reboot this thing?
You know? I mean last year you end up getting
a grad transfer who has a great year at quarterback,

(01:34:31):
and you've had other good ones wherever you've been, but
you kind of take the pack twelve by storm. What's
it been like to to to continue to try and
build this thing on consistency? You know? It's it's kind
of it's been a lot of fun, really, I mean,
it's always fun to build. But then, um uh, you know,
we got a good nucleus. We've got to get better.

(01:34:53):
I mean, the biggest thing you seere is um you
had a good year the year before and then and
we have quite a few guys back, and they have
to have a sense of urgency to improve and get
better if they don't, you know, I mean, and you know,
and everybody through their career can think of some guy
that figured their senior and had it all figured out,
and uh, I didn't get nearly as much accomplished as

(01:35:16):
they should have. But you know, we've got a bunch
of linemen back. We've got some received most of our
receiving corback, We've got our defensive front is fast and
small like usual, um d V. We got some new
faces there, but we're taller and faster than we've been.
So we'll see you. I mean, we're we're excited about
it and and real steady at the linebacker position. You

(01:35:40):
went to the Middle East this summer, correct, Oh yeah,
I was outstanding. Where where specifically did you go? Well, Okay,
so we flew into we flew into Tel Aviv, and
so as I flew into Tel Aviv, I sort of
pretended as Henry Kissinger and somebody you know, or you know,
some big dip thement trying to sort the place out,

(01:36:02):
you know, but Tel Aviv it's kind of it's kind
of modern, but they made The interesting thing is then
you go to the kind of the end of the
peninsula and there's Jaffa, which is, um, you know, a
famous ancient, ancient city. And then one thing fantastic about
Israel is you know, and when you go through Europe,
which is outstanding. When you go through Europe, you're always

(01:36:25):
debating how old everything is, and you know, is it well, okay,
let's see this is wow, this is eleven hundreds, you know,
and and in Israel, so much of that stuff you're
debating how many years before Christ it is? And then
um uh so then we went up the coast, uh,
you know, went through the ruins of a great city cessarea,

(01:36:46):
went through a castle that had a tunnel to the ocean.
Uh that the crusaders youth. We went to uh Massauda,
which is you know, just an outstanding uh site you know,
I mean prior to the um the end of the
Jewish rebellion, where the Romans actually built a road up

(01:37:08):
to this amountain just flat out and built a road
and and and for people, for people who don't know,
because I was actually I lived in Israel and I
was just there coaching a team two years ago in Israel.
Massada is it overlooks the Dead Sea. It's in the
middle of the desert. And yet they built an artificial oasis, uh,
you know, the Jews did. In the Egyptians of course,

(01:37:30):
that was their city, the Egyptians, the Romans you mean, yeah,
the Romans of course, and then the Uh. And then
it was like the last Herod had before that or
before that, Herod had all these palaces, you know, and
not that was like the summer home or something. I
guess it was like Newport, Rhode Island for hero They

(01:37:50):
had they had pools there and baths there, and you're
up on the top of a of a bluff, I mean,
the in the middle of the in the middle of
the desert. It's amazing place. They had, sister, they had
cisterns that lasted for years, I mean for years like that.
And that's why, that's why, that's why, that's why, that's
why the Jews selected it because um that you know,

(01:38:13):
because it was loaded with food, it was loaded with water.
I mean, they could have withstood a long time but
for a road and then the Romans seal in the
place off and then um and then uh, and so
the thing is, it was this grand palace setting thing
and then um, you know you look out over. The

(01:38:34):
other thing that I that caught me was you know
these you know, it's a small space. But you're saying,
all right, where did these guys hide out? Or somebody
get lost in the wilderness, or you know, the Romans
are chasing somebody or sauls chasing David. There's these little
nooks and crannies and the caves. I mean, I'm telling you,
in a small space, you could hide out all kinds

(01:38:56):
of places. And I went to the dead sea floated around,
you float up, you float like a bob or more
your body's out of the water than in the water,
because it's that thick, and it's actually sort of slimy
but not unpleasant. I rubbed it all over my body
so I could pretend that I was at a spawn
and had all that expensive dead sea stuff on me.
And then um, we went to uh a lot, and

(01:39:19):
then I went to Petra, went over into Jordan, went
to Petra, and Petra is outstanding, maybe my favorite stuff
of the place. And then I wish i'd ridden the camel,
but I didn't. And then um, uh so Petra was
really cool. And then I wanted to dive in the
Red Sea but didn't have time. And then do they say,

(01:39:40):
it's just outstanding, it's really clear, and all kinds of
forms of life down there that is just really vibrant.
And then um went to Jerusalem and Jerusalem, I I
don't even know I described Jerusalem. I mean, Jerusalem is
ultimately is totally captivating. I mean it's like, uh, Jerusalem
is like a pie. And you probably know more than

(01:40:02):
I do. Haven't been there or lived there. You know,
I'm gonna say five slices of the pie. I don't know,
probably more. You know where everybody's got their little section
and have you have? You have the center of the
center of the most holy places in both the Jewish
and Christian religions and more and more religions than that

(01:40:23):
even and then more than right. And then you throw
on Islam and which is you know, there's a there's
amount kind of above you know, above the Second Temple
of Jerusalem, which is the whaling Wall, like all kind
of mushed together and all of these ancient stories and
you're like, like, literally you can walk on the road
that Jesus walked on when he was carrying the cross

(01:40:45):
and he was crucified. It's it's an unbelod it really.
It's a place to where you when you walk away,
you go, I'm I cannot believe that. I just this
is a place I visited and then I was that
was just being and there's shops there. It's not like
just it's not like cordoned off or anything either. Oh
and you you'll like, you'll like this too, because I
didn't know you'd coached there, and and so I wanted

(01:41:07):
to meet the head of of of Israeli football and
I did. I met him at the hotel and I
can't remember the gentleman's name. I had his card and everything,
and so you know, they're getting American football going there,
and so we hung out one night and talked and
in Robert Kraft is financing a bunch of that stuff.

(01:41:27):
And so their stadium in their field is like you know,
it's like because I've done camps in in in Clinics
and Italy, I've done them in England, I've done them
in uh, uh, Scotland. I've done them in uh, let's
see Scotland and Italy, France, about several in France and
um there their stadium is really outstanding and because craft

(01:41:53):
is helping them out and and so they they're they're
getting that thing going. We got to go see the
US embassy because there's all kinds of stuff going on
with uh with uh, you know, the US moving their
embassy to Jerusalem, so they're they're moving things and then
and then of course they're trying to you know, stabilize
everything and get everybody, uh to get along, you know.

(01:42:15):
And then went to Bethlehem, which is right there, um
you know, near uh you know, near the Palestinian area,
and I went and saw the banks He's, you know
Banks he is a is a painter, a street artist
that does huge, h sometimes stenciled sprayed paintings that are

(01:42:38):
really famous. And so we got checked out a couple
of famous Banks's. Then went to Turkey, and Turkey was
interesting and and and it was both good and bad.
I'm glad we went at the time, but next time
I make sure it was a lesson busy time. So
it's literally the end of Ramadan, so nobody, uh, nobody's working.

(01:42:59):
It's a big hall of day. So the streets were
just teaming with people. So that was interesting Turkey and
then uh you know, of course that's where Asia meets Europe.
And then this is interesting. This is I mean probably
kind of lamu say, would you tell us that? But anyway,
what I found interesting. So going across the bridge and

(01:43:20):
I can't remember who she played. I think it was
Venus Williams, but it was one of the Williams sisters.
They decided to have a tennis match where the center
court was on the line of Asia and Europe and
and there was some promising tennis player that she played there.

(01:43:43):
And uh so basically, you hit your serve from Europe
to Asia, return it to Europe, back to Asia, back
to Europe back then, and so it went until they
wrapped up the tennis match. They's closed off the bridge,
had the whole tennis match up there. Now are you
do you go to bazaars, you go to markets and
and walk around and you haggle and bring things home
or do you just you just grab a cup of

(01:44:04):
coffee and the Turkish coffee, by the way, it's amazing
I don't know if you had somewhere you're there. Oh
it was good, it was really good. And then um,
I'll haggle a little bit. But the thing is is,
uh what and they are world class hagglers. They love haggling,
and uh uh, you know, I'd knock a few shekels off,
but other than that it would be you know, it'd

(01:44:24):
be like okay, and then and then I just pay
it and buy it because it wasn't that expensive, you know.
And then, um, the food was pretty good. I mean,
all the the New Age help people love it. There's
hummus everywhere, which hopefully they're getting it from Pullman, Washington
because we grow chickpeas all over the place, so hopefully

(01:44:45):
they're helping the economy in eastern Washington. I had no
idea he was a check It was a well spring
of check p chickp activity. I did not know that.
Oh we're big into it. We're big into it, but
I can't say when it comes to eating it, we're
not as big as u uh Israel and Turkey are.
I mean I had it every meal and it was good.
It was kind of uh but at the end, but

(01:45:06):
the end you're like if I don't see Homas for
humas for a couple of months, I'll be good. Right,
That's how I felt. I feel like I love jumas.
I love the Jumas. I just can't do the humas anymore. Um,
didn't you did you recruit Jared Lorensen before you went
to Oklahoma, before you went to Tech? Did you? Did
you sign him? Well? I didn't sign him in Kentucky

(01:45:26):
did But when you were there, you were there though,
right I was. I was there, I was there, Uh
signed him. You know. The thing that's amazing about Jared Lorensen.
One is how good of an athlete he was. The
other is how big he was. And the thing is
the legends of how big he was are kind of distorted.

(01:45:47):
I mean because for example, you know, they always had
him at six five. He won six five. He was
like six too, and um, and everybody said, well we
got a game down to sixty. I'm just telling you,
the way he was, you can't get him done six.
I mean, his shoulders were crazy. Why his wrist is
as big around as my leg, uh and not my

(01:46:09):
ankle either, higher on the leg, and um, you know,
his fingers just he I mean he was just a
big big man. And then the amazing thing about him
and even when he got heavy, he could try to run.
And we timed him there. We timed him there, and
and so we had Tim Couch who was a number
one pick in the draft and I and of course

(01:46:30):
I was there and coached him, uh with you know
how and everybody else. And so then um, and Tim
was a real kind of quick, efficient, elusive four nine
guy who had um Division one basketball scholarships. Okay, we
timed Jared Lorenz and when he got there and he
was heavy then too, and he was like two ninety

(01:46:52):
maybe three oh five or some rant of four seven.
M dam it's it's it's tragic that he passed away. Um.
Last thing I want to ask you one of your
four protege's, or I guess he's one of your protege's.
Cliff Kingsbury is now coaching in the NFL. Brings your offense,
which it began. I mean we we learned about it

(01:47:13):
in college football at Kentucky. Of course that basically taught
the forward past to the big twelve when you got
to Oklahoma, and then you took it after a year
to Texas Tech and you had such a great run there.
Now the SEC started throwing first or a spurrier, okay,
then when we came in, and then a bunch of
teams through it for a while and then and then

(01:47:35):
like you say, went to the Big twelve. But uh no,
it was, it was, it was. It was a fun time.
So so so so with with with Kingsbury in the
pros running a version of your offense, didn't like, do
you is any part of you rooting for his success?
Because it does, whether or not it needs to, it

(01:47:55):
does kind of give legitimacy to the ability for that
offense to work at the pros, not just dominating the
college rinks as it has. Well. I love I love Cliff,
and I always root for Cliff no matter what. And
I do think the Cliffs can have a big time
on offense. And then, uh, you know, but there's other
people that control elements of that team there, you know,
and some of these NFL teams, you know, you're may

(01:48:19):
be called the head coach, but a lot of other
people are making a certain amount of decisions. But he
will run the offense and I think it'll be really
good and um, but you know, if you get right
down to it. Um outside of the you know, yeah,
people just aren't used to labeling it as such. But
the last three Super Bowls have been played by teams

(01:48:42):
with their aid concepts, but the last two in particular,
I mean, New England has been running air raid concepts
for a long time. And if you go back so
when we were at Kentucky and see what New England
was running, or even Coach Belichick, uh, and then compare
it to now, I mean, you know, uh, you know,

(01:49:03):
we're quite similar, and you know they adjusted. I think,
you know, really it's because I think it's it's just
a good way to run offense because it attacks the
whole field. You're just trying to utilize your resources. And
there's a lot of ways to do it. And um,
but you know, the last several Super Bowls and the
and I'll tell you a team I never thought because

(01:49:27):
of their tradition and plus they were they were having success,
the Pittsburgh Steelers. I thought the Pittsburgh Steelers, I thought
they would always be run, run, run. Uh, Pittsburgh Steelers.
You turned them on and there's air rage concepts all
over there. And then of course Andy Reid, who was
at b y U before um I was um. He's

(01:49:49):
been running air raid concepts you know, really pretty much, uh,
since you've been in the league, and now they have
it in Chicago as well running his offense and and
in Philadelphia. My coach can't wait to see you guys
against Mexico State. Obviously enjoy being in town with a
pack telling and you've got big meals and big meetings upcoming,
and you got media day. Thanks so much for spend
some time and telling me somebody who travels in the

(01:50:09):
off season. We'll talk to you really soon. Well, thanks
so much. And uh and uh, you know, in my
book Swing Your Sword, we've talked a lot about the
development of the year raids passing games, so some folks
might find that interesting. And it's on Amazon. Yeah, Singer
Sword leading the charge in football and in life. The
great Mike Leach coach. Thanks so much, Hey, thank you.

(01:50:31):
Does Daniel Jones have a chance to start for the
Giants next season? Find out next be sure to catch
live edition. So the Doug dot Leaps show weekdays at
noon eastern three pm Pacific, every day at this time
of the Doug Got leave Seawan Fox Sports, Right, we
get you caught up as many stories as possibly called
the press the press by or I pinched your time.
Mike Leach actually pitched your time when he got for me.

(01:50:52):
He thought Nick Wright pitched your time to the NFL
networks might care. A fuller reports there's no open competition
for the starting quarterback job with Giants and that Eli
Manning will be the team's Week one starter barring injury. Yeah,
the question is not week one. The quick question is
if they they followed a playoff contention, what do you
do then? Um, we'll see though. I believe all reports
is that Daniel Jones has performed quite well. But you know,

(01:51:14):
benching Eli, that's a hard thing to do. Yeah, and
he's worked out in the O T A S. But
he doesn't have a contract yet, so training camp reporting
for Daniel Jones hopefully will come soon. Other news from
the NFL, Yeah, who Sports says that the charges are
quote dug in end quote on their stance when it
comes to Melvin Gordon's contract request. Doug In Chargers not budging.

(01:51:37):
Uh yeah, look, I don't think the charges are budging.
I talked to the Chargers and like we made him
an offer. Above it's it's I don't know if it's
last and final, but it's pretty close to last and final.
My guess is he sits and then plays on his
current deal and we go through this song and dance again.
Zion Williamson won't be participating in the USA Basketball camp
in preparation for the Feeble World Company. Anybody else. Bradley

(01:52:00):
Bill and Tobias Harris also have withdrawn from the competition.
I almost feel like this is the point. Now the
World Cup can be made up. I feel like with
the Olympic team, we've proven our point that we can
win with our pros. I think we should go back
to the college players or cut the age at like
twenty four, you know, go with our younger players. But uh, look,
there are plenty of talented pros that can go out
and do the job. That's the real secret to us,

(01:52:21):
as we have great depth of talent. Obviously it's not
the same as the Lebrons and the like. The KDS
went healthy in the Kyrie's, but we do have plenty
of young guys and say many nobody wants to play
for their country anymore. Finally, retired legend Tim Duncan retired
no more is now he's a coach. Yes, joining Gregg
Popovich's staff has an assistant for the Spurs and the
team statement. Popovich said, quote, it is only fitting that

(01:52:44):
after I serve loyalty loyally for nineteen years as Tim
Duncan's assistant, that he returns the favor end quote. That's
that's fast, that's interesting, that's a look, um. I think
it's interesting on how cerebral players that they have raised there.
What do you welcome back in Manu as well? Who
takes over that? That gig is going to be fascinating.

(01:53:07):
And I do think the Spurs could be a sneaky
team to sneak into the playoffs. People forgot last year
without de jont Murray, and they have two all stars,
two really good players. And that's the press. BA get
out there and pressed that the pres my Gunny Tomorrow,
Daniel Jeremiah Tomorrow and more of me, The Doug Gotlip Show,
Fox Sports Radio,

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}What OBJ doesn't understand about winning