Full Show Podcast: 16 February 2025

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Sunday Session podcast with Francesca Rudkin
from News Talks EDB. Welcome to the Sunday Session with
Francesca Rudkin and Wiggles for the best selection of great
reads used talks dB.

Speaker 2 (00:27):
Good morning and welcome to the Sunday Session. Coming up
on the show today, MORGANA O'Reilly joins us to talk
about filming and starring in the season three of The
White Lotus, which kicks off tomorrow night. This is a
huge accomplishment for the Kiwi actress being part of one
of the biggest shows on the planet. We talk about
the impact it will have on her career and how
it may help local productions. After eleven, I'm joined by

(00:50):
another impressive New Zealander. Jake Bailey was in his final
year of high school when he was diagnosed with an
aggressive form of cancer. His body was shutting down. He
was given a couple of weeks to live, but Jake
got on with a grueling treatment program and now ten
years later, as a leading educator on resilience, something he
learned the hard way. He's written a book filled with
practical tips to help us be better prepared to deal

(01:12):
with life challenges. So Jake Bailey is with me after eleven,
I'm Pretchesca Rudken, you're with the Sunday session. You can
text any time throughout the morning. On ninety two ninety.

Speaker 3 (01:21):
Two for the Sunday Session.

Speaker 2 (01:27):
So this week I was reminded of the joy of
creating something with my hands. It was nothing special. In fact,
they were very average, imperfect, lopsided. They took two and
a half hours to make. It was by some distance,
the longest I focused on a single thing all week.

(01:48):
I was at a wheel throwing pottery class, trying to
get my clumsy hands to caress clay into the shape
we were aiming for. I got comfortable with failure, although
for about two and a half hours all I thought
about was that damn clay, and I didn't look at
my phone, think about work the rest of the day,

(02:11):
or even the fact that I was completely splattered in clay.
It was awesome being caught up in the moment, but
it brought something else into sharp relief, how terrible my
attention span is for the rest of the week.

Speaker 3 (02:25):
Now.

Speaker 2 (02:25):
Look, I'm not a huge fan of New Year's resolutions,
how they going by the way, but twenty twenty five,
just maybe the year I resuscitate my attention span. According
to doctor Gloria Mark, one of the world's leading attention
span experts, I was experiencing flow, so the state of
deep engagement, total emergent, and inactivity. It's a creative experience

(02:48):
with the reward coming from the doing rather than the result,
which was clearly obvious when you looked at the result.
Flow is almost the complete opposite of what we experience
in the digital world, and that's where we live most
of the time, isn't it. Dr Mark's research shows we've
spent an average of just forty seven seconds on any
screen before shifting our attention. She calls this kinetic attention.

Speaker 4 (03:10):
Now.

Speaker 2 (03:11):
Look, you can blame social media, the Internet, email, the
way apps are designed to manipulate our brains, but it's
still on us to design how we behave online. Whereas
distracted as we let ourselves be, the more we flick
between screens, the more we multitask. Just generally in life,
the busier we are, the more we deplete our attention

(03:32):
capacity and executive functioning. We're just exhausting ourselves. In her book,
Attention Span, Finding Focus for a fulfilling life. Dr Mark
is a huge amount of information on all of this,
but to summarize, if you want to reduce spress and tiredness,
she suggests you take breaks to do things like exercise,
do a crossroad, do some knitting, design your day around
it so that you do your hardest thinking when you

(03:52):
personally are most focused, and stick to a daily goal
to help you get to not get distracted. There are
really simple steps, but they do require conscious effort. Ironically,
I followed none of them when writing this comic piece Forever,
but I am hoping that if I throw a little
more clay this year, the flow will spread to other

(04:13):
areas of my life.

Speaker 3 (04:16):
The Sunday session.

Speaker 2 (04:17):
So, do you do something in your life that totally
absorbs you and it works beautifully to provide you some fulfillment.
Or maybe you've decided that this is the year of
working on your attention span as well? How is it going?
Maybe you've put down the phone or put some restrictions
on your device you so, I'd love to know how
easy that has been. Most welcome to text anytime on

(04:38):
ninety two ninety two? Up next, what is going on
in health? New Zealand? It's eleven past.

Speaker 1 (04:44):
Nine a Sunday with Style, The Sunday Session with Francesca
Rudkin and Wiggles for the best selection of Greg Reeds.

Speaker 2 (04:52):
Use Talk Sevy fourteen past nine. It's been a dramatic
week for Health New Zealand with the resignations from three
top health bosses. On Friday, Director General of Health Diana
Sotharti announced she was leaving the role. That came to
seven days after the sudden resignation of Chief Executive Margie Apper,
and earlier this week, Director of Public Health Nicholas Jones

(05:13):
also announced that he was stepping down. So where to
now for Health New Zealand to discuss, I'm joined by
health commentator n pal Thanks for your time this morning in.

Speaker 5 (05:23):
Oh, that's a pleasure.

Speaker 2 (05:24):
Three pretty big resignations. Has this come as a shock.

Speaker 6 (05:29):
Well not really.

Speaker 5 (05:30):
Well it is a shock, but it's not a surprising shock.
You said dramatic. I think that's an understatement. And also
it's a good reminder that a week is a very
long time in politics. But it has to be seen
in a bit of a wider context because it's just
not those three resignations. There's also within the last twelve

(05:54):
months or less than that, actually about eight months or so,
we have had a board sacked. It helped me on
board sacked. We've had a health minister demoted, taking that
tape removed from the portfolio, and we've had these three
as well. And in my view, what sits behind it
there is a common theme. Each of these has their

(06:17):
own particular specifics and one is not identical to the other. However,
there's a point of commonality, and it's more than the individuals.
What we have is poorly constructed and implemented health restructuring
by the previous government and very poor short sighted leadership

(06:38):
by the current government. Take those two things together and
you have a recipe for the instability, the uncertainty and
the chaos that is now occurring.

Speaker 2 (06:49):
Okay, hence not such a great shock if we take
a look at just this last week, though, are these
three a big loss for our health system? Doctor Dinah
Setharti in particular was very highly regarded.

Speaker 5 (07:02):
Well, yes, that's right. She's got a very strong reputation
that it's well deserved. Her role in establishing the Cancer
Control Authority, for example, agency that was that took a
lot of grunt to do. And a good understanding of
health system complexity to achieve it. I think in her case,

(07:24):
I think the reality was that she is the kind
of director general of health that the health system needs,
but not the kind of director general that fits in
with the current direction of this government, which is the
wrong direction?

Speaker 2 (07:42):
What direction is that?

Speaker 7 (07:43):
In?

Speaker 5 (07:45):
The wrong direction? Sorry? Which?

Speaker 2 (07:50):
Yeah? And why is it the wrong direction?

Speaker 5 (07:52):
Well? The wrong direction is I guess it goes back
to a comment that Christopher Lungs Luxan has known to
have made in the circles, and that is that the
problem with health is that it is led by health.
Now that's a nonsense because you need experience in the

(08:13):
health system in order to understand its complexity. Arguably, health
is the most complex part of the economy of society
because of what it has to deal with with both
health care in the community and health care and highly
complex hospitals. But we have a government that doesn't it

(08:39):
kind of sidelines complexity considerations that goes to the simple options,
and the simple options are usually the ones that are wrong.

Speaker 2 (08:47):
So in are think candidates to replace these three positions?
Will people want to step in, as you say, this
very difficult time, As you know in the sort of
getting New Zealand health back on track.

Speaker 5 (09:03):
Well, I think I think the pool of quality applicants
will be smaller, much smaller than what it deserves to be.
There will be, I'm sure, some quality applicants, but the
volume of the number of them will be considerably reduced
because you're seeking to recruit internationally. People who might make

(09:30):
good appointments are not fools, and they will search the
internet if they don't already know about the state of
the health system and what they might be walking into.
So why come to another part from another part of
the world to hear to such an unstable environment Within
the country. There is a lot of expertise around, but
a lot of that is actually left for health system

(09:52):
as a consequence of this restructurings. So there are many
people who could be considered but wouldn't touch any of
these positions with a barge pole.

Speaker 2 (10:01):
So can it help New Zealand handle these three big
resignations all that once? What impact have?

Speaker 5 (10:07):
Well, the impact is two fold. I suppose one is
its impact on within the leadership itself. It destabilizes it's
uncertain its own head office workforce and managerial workforce. Non
clinical is continually being restructured and this just reinforces that,

(10:30):
and so they don't know really what their future is
from day to day. So how can you have a
functioning system. The other point is that function is undertaken
by Health New Zealand and by the Health Ministry on
a sort of a higher level management level or often unseen.
They are important but often unseen functions that the wider

(10:51):
health system depends on. So I would describe it this
way is that we have a health system leadership that
has become a headless chok. It's desperately trying to find
a GPS to navigate through the system's complexity and I
can't find it.

Speaker 8 (11:04):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (11:04):
So in all of this, there questions about Lester Levy
as the Health New Zealand Commissioner.

Speaker 8 (11:11):
Well impounding.

Speaker 5 (11:13):
This is the report in the media and newsprint mainly
but in the print media that the Minister has declined
to express confidence in the commissioner. Now Simming Brown has

(11:35):
not refuted that and said no, that's wrong, but so
it has to be taken. Is that is his view?
Now in normal circumstances, you would think that the person
you could almost be counting the weeks maybe weeks, but
not too many and even days before that person depart departs.

(11:59):
This is a bit different because the Commissioner was the
solution to the rather manufactured crisis that the government used
as justification to sack the board and put him in
place as the replacement. To recognize that after five months
that's a FIESCO and you need to get rid of

(12:19):
him is a bit of would only make the situation
worse in terms of the optics at the very least.
And so I think probably what will happen is that
he will stay on until his term, which is the
thirteenth of June. The government is looking to appoint a
new board to come effect on the first of July,

(12:40):
and this suggests that Lester Levy will not be the
chair of that new board. That's what I would take
out of it.

Speaker 2 (12:48):
Oh and thank you very much for your time and
your thoughts this morning. Appreciated that was empower their health
commentator the Sunday Session twenty two past nine. Right concern
Engineering roles are in decline. Engineering New Zealand says work
for engineers has dried up and they fear losing skilled
professionals overseas. They're calling on the government to urgently release

(13:09):
infrastructure funds. Engineering New Zealand chief executive doctor Richard Templer,
he joins me, Now, good morning, Richard.

Speaker 5 (13:16):
Cure, and good morning, hey.

Speaker 2 (13:17):
What kind of drop off are we seeing in the
number of engineering roles available?

Speaker 5 (13:23):
So we are seeing hundreds of engineers losing their jobs
with the reduction and infrastructure projects across the board in
education and healthcare, roading, building and construction, and civil infrastructure
such as Three Waters projects have been stopped, they haven't

(13:44):
been restarted, and that's been over a year now that
that work hasn't flowed through, and so engineering firms reluctantly
have had to make hundreds of engineers redundant.

Speaker 2 (13:57):
Because Richard, we've been told that infrastructure is hugely important.
The projects are coming, but is there just not enough
certainty around them.

Speaker 5 (14:05):
So the challenge has been the timing. The projects are
absolutely vital. We know there's well over one hundred and
fifty billion dollar infrastructure deficit and the government, to their credit,
has air marked money and budgets, but that money hasn't
flowed and if you look at the stopping of big
projects such as Dunedin Hospital, the Irex project, which is

(14:27):
the ferries project. That's a huge amount of expenditure that
hasn't occurred, and firms did their best to hang on.
But we're now sort of eighteen months since the projects
were stopped and the money hasn't flowed, and so firms
have had to make the very tough decision to let people,
let people go.

Speaker 2 (14:47):
Government's fast track approvals that regime. Is that going to
make a difference, Richard.

Speaker 5 (14:53):
Well, this is one of the big challenges. There's one
hundred and forty nine projects there. Almost all of them
need engineering to help with the design, and they need
huge numbers of people to construct the project. And if
you think about engineers involved in the design, if they
lose roles in New Zealand, they will leave the travel
overseas but maybe able to work overseas remotely. But the

(15:17):
people who build our roads, build our hospitals, put the
ferry terminals together, are lined up to build the solar farms,
the wind farms, the property developments, the roading all included
in the fast track. They have to move overseas because
you can't build a road virtually, you have to physically

(15:37):
be there.

Speaker 2 (15:38):
What are the opportunities like overseas? Are you expecting quite
a substantial brain drain here.

Speaker 5 (15:44):
Well. In September last year, I visited Australia to meet
with our sister organization Engineers Australia, and I was lucky
enough to meet with some of the key players in
infrastructure in Australia and they were saying, it's fantastic we
can hire significant numbers of engineers. There's a huge infrastructure

(16:05):
program going a head in Australia in terms of upgrading
their rid upgrading their roads including their rail links, and
also significant defense spending, all of which requires engineers. They
can employ people for the same or less than they
can hire Australians. Kiwis are a great cultural fits in
Australia and they don't even need to create extra office

(16:29):
space because New Zealanders can work from home and it's
basically like a shift that starts at six in the morning.
And even more so if they need the engineer to
meet with the client while they can be in Sydney
or Melbourne quicker than someone flying from Perth.

Speaker 2 (16:46):
So Richard, what needs to happen.

Speaker 5 (16:50):
The government has heirmarked a whole lot of money for infrastructure.
What hasn't happened is it hasn't hit procurement, it hasn't
been contracted out, as hasn't started delivery. So we've called
on the government to in their quarterly plans in glued
infrastructure delivery. And they also need to get cracking on

(17:10):
projects like the Denian Hospital. The cheapest time to do
that is today. The need's chiefest time is tomorrow. The
longer we wait, the more expensive it will become.

Speaker 2 (17:22):
Richard, really appreciate your time and your expertise this morning.
Thank you so much. That was Engineering New Zealand chief
executive Doctor Richard templar Ken we psychologist and TV host
Nigel Letter would like us to give something up next month,
all in support of gut cancer. More on this shortly
he's going to join us at is twenty seven past nine.

(17:43):
News Dogs ATB.

Speaker 1 (17:47):
It's the Sunday session with Francesca Rudkin on Newstalgs.

Speaker 2 (17:51):
ATB and time to talk local politics now and I'm
joined to buy news Talk ZDB Political editor Jason Wall's Good.

Speaker 9 (17:58):
Morning, Jason, Good morning.

Speaker 2 (18:00):
Right, David Seymour. It's been a week for him, hasn't it.
There's been the letter, the landrom at the school.

Speaker 3 (18:07):
It's all go it is all go.

Speaker 10 (18:08):
I mean, I mean, I'm struggling to remember all of
it because there has been such a long string of
activities in David Seymour's log book this week. And yeah,
it started off with the polking Horn letter and then
that story was released by the heralds Saturday or Sunday
over the weekend last week. Then at the Prime Minister's
post cabinet press conference he said that that letter was

(18:29):
ill advised.

Speaker 9 (18:30):
Then David Seymour went on to R and Z to say.

Speaker 10 (18:33):
That Chris Luxon calling it ill advised was in and
of itself ill advised. And you don't usually hear a
minister talk about the Prime minister like that. Basically, if
you're a minister, everything the Prime Minister says is correct
all the time, no exceptions.

Speaker 9 (18:48):
But the difference is David.

Speaker 10 (18:50):
Seymour is a politician from a different party in a coalition,
so the rules are a little bit different.

Speaker 9 (18:56):
But both of them played it down.

Speaker 10 (18:57):
Saying it was just a little bit of a you know,
this is just MMP politics, this is just how it works.

Speaker 9 (19:02):
And of course as this.

Speaker 10 (19:03):
Was playing out, we had the land rover up the
front stage of Parliament, which is the dumbest story that
I think I've covered for a while, but it was
still quite rather entertaining because you know, if you asked
me guess two hundred things that are going to happen
this week, I wouldn't have guessed that I would have
needed thousands of guesses to get to that point.

Speaker 9 (19:20):
But anyway it happened.

Speaker 10 (19:22):
It dominated quite a lot of the discourse during question
Time this week, with Speaker Jerry brownly having to stand
up and essentially say that David Seymour had offered somewhat
of an apology, and he actually had to come into
bat for the security guard who David Seymour basically said
that it was his fault for coming up and telling
him to stop coming up the steps of Parliament. So
one heck of a week for David Seymour and the

(19:44):
coalition government.

Speaker 2 (19:45):
So how does his behavior and l's inability to do
anything about it and picked the Prime Minister on his reputation.

Speaker 10 (19:52):
Well, I mean, looking at it from the outside in,
it kind of does look a little bit unstable. You've
got somebody that's ill disciplined sort of running around and
saying and doing exactly.

Speaker 9 (20:02):
What they want.

Speaker 10 (20:03):
But you've got to look at this quite holistically, and
this is what I think is the probably the Prime
Minister's greatest achievement is crafting these coalition agreements so it's
not just about a gray blob of three parties coming
together and losing their identities. The Prime Minister has been
very careful to let Act the Act, to let New Zealand.

Speaker 9 (20:21):
First be New Zealand First.

Speaker 10 (20:22):
And if that means that they act a little bit
differently than a National Party minister, that is okay because
it means these parties still retain a sense of identity
and when it comes to the next election, they'll still
have a good voter base because they didn't.

Speaker 9 (20:36):
Lose the core of who they were. However, I do
think that this is the first.

Speaker 10 (20:40):
Time that we've seen this go too far, and the
Prime Minister will be probably behind the scenes quite annoyed
because it seems like he's been giving David Seymour an
inch and he's been taking one or two miles, and of.

Speaker 2 (20:52):
Course he's going to become our deputy prime minister midway
through this year. Do you think you'll rain himself in
a little bit?

Speaker 9 (21:00):
I do. I do actually think that.

Speaker 10 (21:02):
I mean, he's got to be a statesman, not a
stuntsman when he gets to that point in.

Speaker 9 (21:06):
The political cycle. And you know, like for the most part.

Speaker 10 (21:08):
David Seymour is extremely good at being a statesman. It's
just every once in a while he lets the veil slip,
and I think that he's going to have to probably
rein that in in saying that everybody thought that Winston
Peters was going to be a little bit of a
rogue agent when he was in the deputy prime role,
but he's been anything but. I mean when Winston Peters

(21:29):
is essentially the best foreign minister that New Zealand has
ever had, and he continues that over into his role
as Deputy Prime Minister as well.

Speaker 2 (21:36):
Jason. We also saw this week Nichola Willis say she's
keen to see the grocery market open up, but we
don't really have any seat plan or anything to do that.
It was a little bit sort of hypothetical. Hey, if
you've got a proposal, bring it to me, Well see
what we can do.

Speaker 9 (21:49):
Yeah.

Speaker 10 (21:50):
Yeah, I mean her speech was pretty wishy wash in
that sense. We were expecting an announcement of some sort
or some moving the dial in terms of what's happening,
But it was basically just her repeating her rhetoric about
the fact that she doesn't think that the supermarket sector
is competitive, and we already knew that because the Commerce
Commission had decided that it wasn't competitive. In fact, they

(22:10):
didn't decide that they found evidence to suggest that this
was the fact. So Nikola Willis was essentially just saying
she would like to see another entrant into that market.
The news that we did get is that she had
been approached by another supermarket entity. Now she wouldn't say
what that is, only that they're in discussions. But to
be honest, if it were to actually do something tangible

(22:33):
about the duopoly in New Zealand and do something tangible
about the prices people pay at the supermarket, that would
have to be a massive player. It would have to
be somebody big enough to shake up the system or
else it just seriously wouldn't have much of an impact
at all.

Speaker 2 (22:46):
You mentioned Foreign Minister Winston Peters just before. Of course,
he's been very focused this week on the Cook Islands
signing a deal with China, a little bit of a
diplomatic row here. Do we know anything more about this agreement?

Speaker 9 (23:01):
We at this stage.

Speaker 11 (23:02):
No.

Speaker 10 (23:02):
I mean Mark Brown, who is the Cook Island's Prime Minister,
went over to he didn't consult with New Zealand before
signing this cooperation agreement with them, and basically that's where
we've left it. We've almost been waiting in limbo over
the last couple of days. Now Winston Peters probably knows
more now. The last time we spoke to him about
this was on Thursday, so he probably has some more
information and we'll be looking to probe into that this

(23:25):
week to see what more that we know. But the
problem here is the Cook Islands is such a strong
partner of New Zealand. There's such a they're not technically
an ally the only technical ally that we have as Australia,
but they're a very very close partner. The fact that
they're going away and doing deals with China and not
consulting us or essentially letting New Zealand knows what happened, no,

(23:45):
letting New Zealand to knowing what happened, is quite concerning.
And this is part of a why to push from
China into the Pacific in terms of they're looking at
this charm offensive to get more influence.

Speaker 9 (23:56):
In the region.

Speaker 10 (23:57):
At the same time, the US is really looking to
step up its involvement in the region as well. So
we're seeing the first steps in the sort of soft
power battle, and in fact we've seen actually now scratch that,
we've been seeing soft steps for quite some time.

Speaker 9 (24:10):
This is just another escalation on that front.

Speaker 2 (24:14):
Jason Walls, thanks so much for your time and enjoying
the rest of your Sunday. It is twenty three to ten.
You're with Newstalks Edbs.

Speaker 1 (24:23):
A Sunday Session full show podcast on iHeartRadio powered by
newstalksb You're with the Sunday Session.

Speaker 2 (24:31):
Hey, if you're a fan of The White Lotus, a
new season is kicking off on neon tomorrow night. One
of the stars of the show, Kiwi actress MORGANA O'Reilly,
is going to join us just after ten this morning.
Joining me now, however, is Kiwi psychologist and TV host
Nigel Letter. He is urging us all to give up
something next month in support of gut cancer. For the

(24:51):
month of March, the Gut Cancer Foundation is running its
Give It Up campaign. Nigel himself was diagnosed with stomach
cancer in May last year, and he went public with
his diagnosis in September. He's put his support behind the
campaign and he joins me, good morning, Nigel, thank you
for your time here.

Speaker 6 (25:09):
Good morning.

Speaker 2 (25:10):
Took me through why you've got behind this fundraising campaign, Well,
because I've got it.

Speaker 6 (25:17):
Yeah, it's like and now I have more of an
understanding of what the oncology rulers like.

Speaker 8 (25:21):
So I'd never heard.

Speaker 6 (25:23):
Of a cut cancer foundation before I kind of got
stomach cancer and they look after people with cancers esophagy
of Liverpool, bioduct pancreas, stomach and bowel cancer, so they
kind of do that the whole thing, which affects a
huge number of chemos.

Speaker 8 (25:37):
And the thing that I've learned is that there's.

Speaker 6 (25:40):
An oncology there is a huge inequity in terms of
the sort of healthcare that you can get. So if
you have money, you can get the wonder cures and
if you don't, you don't. And so that's why the
work that these guys do is so important because it
kind of covers off a huge range of cancers and
they're funding research into detection, diagnosing, trading cancers and advocating

(26:03):
as well, which is really important because it's one of
those things that you just kind of every so often
you hear on the news to some politicians saying we're
going to fund ten new cancer drugs and they fund
for or some stupid thing. But when you're on it
and you can see that that big inequity between the
stuff on the shaft that could fix you, but if
you if you don't have the money, then you can't

(26:24):
get it, you know. And funding the research into the
earlier detection stuff is pretty important.

Speaker 2 (26:30):
Oh, absolutely, because it's hard at the moment, isn't it
to get funding for research in New Zealand. So that's
a really vital part.

Speaker 12 (26:36):
Of what they do.

Speaker 8 (26:38):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (26:38):
Yeah, Hey, look, when you are dealing with such a
big life changing thing such as being diagnosed with cancer,
is going public to raise awareness into support campaigns like this?
Is it a hard thing to do? Nigel Law? Is
it sort of helpful a.

Speaker 6 (26:51):
Little way of me because kind of I've sort of
been that for a while now, and I think that
there are some things that I think it's helpful for
just other people to like, I want it helpful when
people send me their stories of oh I was diagnosed
with six months and it's twelve years later, like those
those two is it good. They're not so good. Ones
that my husband's diaris just six months any and need
did two. They're not so good, they're not so happy stories.

(27:14):
But it's got people to know there are other people
out there and to make it easier for people to
talk about because like it's just a it's just a thing.

Speaker 2 (27:22):
How does this fundraiser give it up for gut cancer work?
What are we asking people to do here?

Speaker 6 (27:28):
So basically annual fundraiser and it's the sort of major
fundraiser for the years it sets.

Speaker 8 (27:33):
Works through the years.

Speaker 6 (27:33):
So basically what what what the foundation has asked some
people to do is to give up something so that
actually we sure got alcohol, coffee, socks, I coudn't do
it socks for a month any quite hard for the
month of March in Yeah, much to raise funds and resources.
So it's basically just saying that there's this thing stuff
I quite like, I'm want to go up for months
and my friends and family and people are going to
kind of sponsor me to do that and at the

(27:55):
end of it, I'll see them money after the cake
and foundation.

Speaker 2 (27:58):
It's so very simple and easy to do. Is there
something that you're going to give up for the campaign, Nigel.

Speaker 6 (28:02):
Now, I figure I gave up not having cancer, so
I figure I'm out of I need to. I'm happy
to promote it, but it's like I've there, are there.
I've had to give up alcohol already, so it's like,
oh man, because the US to really love Margarita's, so
I feel like I've given up quite a lot. So
I've see my role now is just being the mouthpiece.

Speaker 2 (28:21):
Now I think you can absolutely, you know, give it
a miss this March. Yeah, no, very much.

Speaker 8 (28:27):
Everyone else shouldn't. Everyone else should get on and get
on a bus.

Speaker 6 (28:31):
In fact, it because one in three people get cancer,
and you always think it's going to be someone else,
and then it could be just like us. For it's
a Monday morning and you're having what you think is
a routine endoscopy and they came out and they.

Speaker 8 (28:43):
Go, oh, you know, your whole life.

Speaker 6 (28:44):
Yep, that's so legan a freaking change, and that can
happen to anyone at any time. So yeah, people should
should should get on board and support this and everybody,
if you can afford it, get really good life insurance
and get advice from an advisor about doing that and
get health insurance if you can, and get an income
protection if you can.

Speaker 8 (29:03):
All of those things are important.

Speaker 2 (29:05):
Nigel, how are you doing? How is the treatment going
pretty good?

Speaker 6 (29:09):
It's like, so cancer is cancer, snakes and ladders, and
you kind of have to learn to live with the
kind of the snakes when you're a beginner. Snake's pretty scary,
and I've had even recently, I've had some sort of
wealthily scary snakes.

Speaker 8 (29:23):
But then you're kind of have these ladders and so
just problems with a little word un cancer, don't worry
about there. It's it's like it's it's it's been.

Speaker 6 (29:33):
It's been up and down. But I've responded really well
to treatment stuff so far, and the fish round of
chemo did really well. I've had some radiation stuff that's
worked really well. I'm back on a different chemo regime
and it seems to be working all right. So it's
kind of living with like whenever I see stuff, when
I see stuff I'm not has terminal cancer, It's like, no,
I freaking don't not has that incurable cancer. And that's

(29:54):
very different because you can live with something that's incurable.

Speaker 8 (29:56):
You can manage it.

Speaker 6 (29:57):
And kind of keep it keep it at a at
a safe level. And that's kind of that's some questions.
I'm actually pretty good, Like I'm kind of looking at
I spent the first few months doing nothing, and then
I wrote a book because I got so bored. And
now I'm getting back into worgan going out the speaking
circuit again because it's like that's what I love doing
the most and it makes me feel alive.

Speaker 8 (30:18):
So I'm doing good here. We're doing good.

Speaker 2 (30:20):
It's really good to hear. Do you think you can
be prepared for a diagnosis like this? I mean someone
such as yourself psychologist. Do you understand resilience and all
sorts of things like that? Can you actually ever really
be prepared that don't?

Speaker 8 (30:33):
You can't.

Speaker 6 (30:33):
And so it's like my wife and I are both
clinical psychologists, and there have both been times where it
just feels like the ground's been Like when we first diagnosed,
we didn't even know how to talk to the kids
about the stuff, and we were like we got fifty
years experience between. When this stuff comes along, your brain
just goes, yeah, I'm I'm just gonna I'm just gonna
unplug for a little bit.

Speaker 12 (30:54):
No.

Speaker 6 (30:55):
Yeah, the only preparation you can do are the practical things,
and that is about, you know, getting weak at the
health cheeks, all the insurance stuff, getting that in place
as much as you can afford put that stuff in place.
There's a lifeboat. And people think that they don't think
about it like that. They think that it's a kind
of a it's like almost like iceberg compensation.

Speaker 8 (31:13):
But it's not. It's a lifeboat.

Speaker 6 (31:14):
It's the thing that will make your life easier if
you do get this bad diagnosis. But no, nothing nothing,
I mean I don't like most people. You know, you
go along, you get a little pain or something weird,
and you think, say cancer, live cancer, and so I
was kind of thinking I've been thinking that on and
a few years, as most people do. Now it's like, no,
I don't have to think about that, because you.

Speaker 13 (31:32):
Know I do.

Speaker 8 (31:32):
I don't cancer. That's a cut. There's no mystery there.
But no, you can't. You can't be prepared for it.

Speaker 6 (31:37):
You just you just the best way that actually one
of the best ways that you can prepare for it
is just surround yourself with good friends and your family
and people that you love and be kind to them
and be nice because when it happens. The other people
who will be in your team and who will keep
you going.

Speaker 2 (31:50):
Oh, Nigel, really nice to talk to you. You're behind
a fantastic cause. Give it Up for Gut Cancer, take care,
look forward to talking to you again soon. So Give
It Up for Gut Cancer runs through March this year.
You can find more information at gut Cancer dot org
dot nz. It is thirteen to ten.

Speaker 1 (32:09):
Putting the tough questions to the newspeakers the mic asking Breakfast.

Speaker 14 (32:13):
Former Australian play miners to Scott Morrison is well, course
you're in the country to talk about economics, which we're
deeply interested in at the moment and trying to grow
the economy. So give us some advice from Australia. How
do you deal with the world and foreign investment and
immigrants and their money without blowing it up politically.

Speaker 15 (32:29):
It's a tough equation to balance.

Speaker 3 (32:30):
The most important thing is people.

Speaker 15 (32:32):
Need to understand that your immigration program has strong rules
and they're enforced, and that your borders are secure. In
our experience in Australia, if people don't think the rules
are being followed and the system's being gained, they won't
buy it. But more broadly on attracting foreign investment, remove
the barriers that are coming through regulation to improve competitiveness.
It's really not rocket science.

Speaker 14 (32:49):
Back tomorrow at six am the Mic Hosking Breakfast with
the rain Driver of the lam Used Talk zed B.

Speaker 3 (32:55):
Relax, it's still the weekend.

Speaker 1 (32:57):
It's a Sunday session with Francesca Rudgin and Whiggles for
the best selection of Greg reeds Use Talk ZEDB.

Speaker 16 (33:04):
I think Guy left him someonwhere are no Longer?

Speaker 17 (33:07):
Ago? And I want you run away now from.

Speaker 2 (33:12):
All the lovely things. We thank you very much for
all your feedback this morning. I started the show by
talking about how it became it's become very apparent my
attention span has diminished over time, and how I'm doing
this pottery class and how for two and a half
hours a week, I do not think of anything else
except this clay and I'm absolutely loving it. I had
a text from Anne who said, I always remember an

(33:35):
article by a psychoneuro endochronologist. I think I got that
right man. She referenced her own ability to read a
regency novel as indicative of her deteriorating brain function. And
we're talking about Austin and Brontes hair with their very
sort of complex structures. Her antidote to a week of
disjunctive ecommunication was to read pride and prejudice. She also

(33:58):
pointed out that we respond to each refresh or scroll
with adrenaline response. It's as if we're physically facing a
new and potentially threatening environment whenever we alter our screen.
There's a fabulous walk in pottery class at Brighton more
than Christ which each Saturday I've been wanting to try.
You've given me, You've convinced me to get my a
enter g go and you're gonna love it. It really is.

(34:19):
I'm just absolutely loving it. I'll tell you that the
results aren't great, but I'm loving the process. Mars text
to say, do you play that song with Patrick Swayzey
and Demi Moore when you do the pottery? No, Mars,
I can completely guarantee you there is nothing sexy about
me doing pottery. It's a bit of a mess, quite frankly.
And I also had another text saying, as a forty
one year old with a stressful job managing a large team,

(34:41):
I took up drumming purely for my own interest to
completely occupies your attention to keep the beat and removes
any foreign thought at all. So thank you very much
for those talking about the engineering too, and the fact
that the projects have sort of been on holt for
the last twelve to eighteen months. Someone said that's the
money hasn't flowed because we're broke. So thank you very
much for your feed back there. Ninety two ninety two

(35:06):
is email if you would like to flick me Sorry
is the text if you'd like to flip me a
text at any point throughout the morning. It is eight to.

Speaker 1 (35:15):
Ten the Sunday Session Full Show podcast on my Heart
Radio powered by News TALKSB.

Speaker 2 (35:24):
Just a little something else I want to mention this.
It's something we have spoken about here on the Sunday Session,
and that is the Consumer Guarantees Right to Repair Amendment bill.
It is set to have its first reading on the nineteenth,
It said this coming week. This is a really interesting amendment.
The right to repair is a movement that emerged to

(35:45):
counter the trend of product manufacturers increasingly restricting the repair
and the repair ability of their products. So they basically
just want you to replace your product. You've probably had
this before. You probably aren't know you had a vacum cleaner,
or you had a computer or something and you went
to repair it and they lock to bettles with you.
We can't get the parts, we can't access the parts,
or we don't know how to repair it, or you know,

(36:06):
when not allowed to repair it. Therefore you just have
to check it out and you have to go and
buy another one, you know, go and get a new
toaster and things. So this is a really interesting amendment
which I would really like to see go through, which
basically means, yeah, that sometimes if you make something, you
might also have to make spare parts and manuals and
have diagnostic information available so that people can get things repaired.
We don't throw things out quite so often, So keep

(36:28):
an eye on that. That's coming up this week, right,
can we? Actress MORGANA Riley, She is o'reiley. She is
really on a bit of a roll. She has been
working NonStop both here in New Zealand and Australia and
in Thailand where she filmed the latest The White Lotus season. Now,
season three is going to kick off tomorrow night. Moghana

(36:49):
is going to join us shortly to talk about what
it was like to live and film in a five
star hotel. Something tells me this might just have ruined
her for future gigs. It wouldn't be too bad, would it.
But we're also going to have a talk about what
this role means for her career and what it can
potentially also mean for the shows she has already appeared.

(37:09):
And I don't know if you've noticed, but Friends like
Her has just popped up on Netflix, and having her
name attached to that and attached to the White Lotus,
it just gives that show another boost and will help
get people's attention. So she is with us. Next you're
with Newstalks, eb you.

Speaker 7 (37:24):
Got and she's stall looking for and ride, And then
you're in the Marrow.

Speaker 3 (37:32):
Heavy and the Marrow.

Speaker 18 (37:35):
Find me so far?

Speaker 9 (37:38):
Send me seven uncle.

Speaker 11 (37:40):
True, nobody knows what I'm going and do get the
devil on your hockey. We someone told me living this
like me try to get away from the stalls like singing.
These boys a medicare's.

Speaker 7 (38:28):
I need some caud No, send me sipping on cold. True,
nobody knows what I'm going and through at the tible,
what the walking my shoes?

Speaker 19 (38:40):
We saw much?

Speaker 11 (38:41):
So they start trying to get away, stay start singing pep.

Speaker 7 (38:53):
All I really need is a little good news. All
I really need is a new something made me bad
ten a middle All I already need.

Speaker 3 (39:06):
This keep It's simple. It's Sunday, the Sunday.

Speaker 1 (39:12):
Session with Francesca Rudkin and Wiggles for the best selection
of graverys, news talks Envy.

Speaker 2 (39:36):
This is the Sunday Session. I'm Francisca Rudkin with you
till midday and this music can only mean one thing.
It's back. The White Lotus returns to our screens tomorrow
for season three, but this time us Kiwis have far
more invested in the show than ever before, with our
very own Morgana O'Reilly cast as one of the characters.
We chatted to Morgana around this time last year after

(39:59):
she was announced in the show, but she couldn't tell
us any of the details. So she is back now
to fit us in on her character and the whole
experien orience of filming this mad show. Morgana O'Reilly, so
great to talk to you again.

Speaker 12 (40:11):
How are you great?

Speaker 20 (40:12):
I'm great.

Speaker 2 (40:14):
How are you feeling ahead of the release. It's tomorrow,
Morgana O'Reilly and The White Lotus. How excited.

Speaker 13 (40:22):
Are you.

Speaker 2 (40:23):
I'm excited.

Speaker 12 (40:24):
Oh my gosh, I'm excited.

Speaker 21 (40:26):
I'm probably not the same kind of excited as everybody
else because obviously I'm a little bit scared. I can't
just watch it the way I have the last two
seasons be like yay. I'm like, oh gosh, okay, there's me. No,
but I'm really excited. It will be the full circle,
you know, from the first audition and then all there's

(40:48):
been so many kind of big wins and flag post
moments along the way.

Speaker 12 (40:54):
It'll be a really it'll bookend the whole thing.

Speaker 2 (40:59):
And yeah, I have seen the first two episodes. I
don't think you've got anything to be scared of. Tell
us a little bit about your character, Pam.

Speaker 12 (41:09):
Oh my goodness, you've seen the first look. You've seen
more than I have. I haven't even seen the first
two episodes. She is a health butler.

Speaker 9 (41:18):
She is.

Speaker 12 (41:21):
Australian.

Speaker 3 (41:22):
She is.

Speaker 21 (41:24):
She's assigned to assist the Ratless Ratless family, who are
headed by Jason Isaacs and Park Posey and their three children.

Speaker 12 (41:36):
Yeah, so she organizes their wellness routine.

Speaker 2 (41:42):
I don't want I don't want to tell anyone anything
about it because it's just so much fun watching everything unfold.
But this show is it's quite out there. It's a
little bit mad. What was it like being on set
filming it?

Speaker 12 (41:57):
Well, on set was really it was great and that
felt that felt like a normal I was.

Speaker 21 (42:07):
I felt really a comfortable in that space actually on
set and we're in these beautiful, beautiful hotels and locations
on these beaches and things like that, and sometimes you
just feel like, I mean, it's just daunting the kind
of juggernauts in which you're working with, you know.

Speaker 12 (42:27):
Like the the welcome scene, when you've got like Lisa.

Speaker 21 (42:32):
From Black Pink, she's just hanging around. She's so lovely
and so sweet and kind and humble. You have no
idea that she's basically Beyonce. I mean, like, yeah, it
was a lot, I tell you what.

Speaker 9 (42:45):
It was great.

Speaker 21 (42:46):
It was a lot of things, a lot of feelings
fluctuating between so glad I'm here too, I don't belong
here and I can't bear this, to be honest.

Speaker 2 (42:57):
The hotel is insane you were living Is it right
that you were living there? I'm sure you mentioned that
to us before you were living there while you were filming.

Speaker 12 (43:05):
Yeah, yeah, so like we had.

Speaker 21 (43:09):
They were all living and working at the Four Seasons
in Kossimoi, So it was like a really amazingly beautiful
retirement home with lots of young and healthy people who.

Speaker 12 (43:22):
Have lots of money, all the all cast and crew.
So it's glorious, how idyllic.

Speaker 21 (43:29):
And then we also shot in Pouquette at a couple
of different places there, and so we'd often live and
work in the in the hotel.

Speaker 2 (43:37):
I wonder if it's ruined you a little bit that,
you know, you get an acting gig which also just
happens to be in a you know, in this incredible
sort of hotel resort. Next time someone puts you up,
you're going to be a bit like, oh is this that?

Speaker 4 (43:48):
I know?

Speaker 12 (43:49):
It's so bad?

Speaker 21 (43:50):
I mean, you don't I need to I need to
sometimes check how much I talk about it, because I
I didn't sort of even click that at a certain
level of hotel, it would be crazy not to have
your own private pool.

Speaker 12 (44:05):
I'm like, what you get one of those? Oh now
I can't go back. I have to share it.

Speaker 2 (44:12):
Was it relaxing having your family? I know that your
family came up at one point, and I think the
kids came as well. Was it relaxing having them there
or so wonderful?

Speaker 21 (44:19):
But then you know, like it was actually and I
was wonderful to have them there because a my husband,
you know, he's a director, so it was really cool
for him to because we're working in this space. So
it was this amazing hotel. But it was also an
active film set, which is just like an absolute treat
when you're in this industry because you get to go

(44:39):
to a hotel, but you get to also like, you know,
I'll be swimming in the pool, but over there is
second unit just filming a couple of cutaway shots of
some things that can cut you, like beautiful foliage and
the ocean, things like that, so you get to sort
of see a film crew over there, or you know,
the kids will be playing madly in the pool, in

(45:01):
the big shared pool with the other kids from the crew,
and then you know, third, fourth or fifth ad would
run down frantically and go please be quiet, please be quiet,
because they're filming, like OOGIEZ.

Speaker 2 (45:14):
Yeah, it was great, so great our screen industry here
in New Zealand, it's amazing. But was it quite a
different experience to other shows you've worked on. When you
get to work on something, you know, a smash show
like this, yes, yes.

Speaker 12 (45:31):
Well no, I mean it's a multifaceted answer.

Speaker 21 (45:34):
I guess my point of view being on set is
I felt really prepared for that bit, which was good.
But then of course the resources in other areas was
definitely a lot greater than I had experienced before. I
also think, you know, to clarify, the New Zealand industry

(45:57):
is kind of multifaceted as well. There is an international
film industry that comes and shoots in New Zealand that
often hire New Zealand crew and a smattering the bare
minimum New Zealand cast. And then there is the New
Zealand TV and film industry which scrapes by as much

(46:18):
as it can and dare I say, is really on
struggle street at the moment.

Speaker 12 (46:24):
To make stuff.

Speaker 21 (46:26):
So whether you're you might be shooting something in New Zealand,
but they can be leagues apart, whether you're shooting the
Luminaries versus.

Speaker 12 (46:34):
Something for SPP, so it's profoundly different.

Speaker 16 (46:38):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (46:40):
How big a break for you is this? Career wise?
Are you bracing yourself for potential exposure? I mean we've
always known that you're brilliant here, but you know, this
is sort of on a global scale, isn't it, MORGANA, I.

Speaker 12 (46:53):
Don't know, you know what, like it's still it feels
like a it feels like I'm on a big cruise ship.
It's moving slow and stare and strongly.

Speaker 21 (47:09):
I'm currently you know, the lead in a six part
thriller series for Paramount, which is Heaven, and I was
essentially offered that role, and I.

Speaker 12 (47:18):
Don't think that that would have happened in that way
without this behind me.

Speaker 16 (47:22):
Which is.

Speaker 12 (47:25):
Which is great. And then once it comes out, you know,
I am sort of bracing myself for many different.

Speaker 21 (47:33):
Realities and all of which I can deal with, all
of which I'm happy for. There's a chance that I
kind of get Nobody really pays too much attention. There's
so many cars, so many characters, and so maybe it's
just a really great thing on my CV and it
gives me a little bit more money in the world,
you know, and makes it easier for other productions to

(47:57):
get people to give them money to make it because
they can say, well, we've got more Ganner and she's
been in White Lotus, so that's nice to help out
other things. Who knows some interesting also like absolutely ripped
apart online.

Speaker 11 (48:12):
I don't know.

Speaker 12 (48:12):
I'm preparing for lots of things.

Speaker 2 (48:16):
I don't think that's going to happen. But that's really
interesting what you say. There's lots of little silver linings,
isn't it. That might not be obvious. You're not necessarily going,
oh yeah, it's going to be great. You know, people
are going to recognize me more and know who I am,
and it's going to be easy to get jobs. Is
actually it can actually trickle down in lots of different
ways and can be really grateful previous shows that you've
been a part of as well, you know, bringing them
to light again.

Speaker 21 (48:37):
That's a real that warms my heart majorly with all that,
you know, I'm going to go up to the premier
year and.

Speaker 12 (48:46):
All this stuff.

Speaker 21 (48:47):
I think, and maybe this is the key we in me,
but at a certain point things feel really indulgent and
they feel like I'm vying for the spotlight that I
don't deserve.

Speaker 3 (48:56):
But the.

Speaker 21 (48:58):
You know, the oxytocin countenance to that quartersole spike is
that it lifts up everybody and everything I'm currently working
on and have work done and so that feels nice.

Speaker 12 (49:12):
That's great, let's do that.

Speaker 2 (49:14):
Tell me a little bit about what you are doing
in Australia at the moment.

Speaker 21 (49:18):
I'm doing a series called Playing Gracie Darling and it's oh,
it's so cool, and especially because I just if I
saw this synopsis, I was like, I would be so
all aboard because it's a mystery series, thriller but with
a little bit of smattering of ghost story spookiness, like

(49:39):
there's it's a bit scary, not in a horror movie sense,
but in a thriller sense. So it's a bit Mayor
of East Town. It's a bit sharp objects, but nice
ohasty stuff and some like flashbacks to the late nineties.

Speaker 12 (49:56):
Oh yeah, come home so.

Speaker 2 (49:59):
Good and look just before it, you guy, I want
to touch base with you on where Stories about My
Body is at because we've spoken to you about that
before turning it into a film. I know that there's
been a bit of crowdfunding going. Have you had any
time to work on that at all?

Speaker 12 (50:12):
Oh my goodness.

Speaker 21 (50:13):
We are so close to finishing the edit and it's
going to go into post production and there is music
being made. There is all these wheels in motion which
like that, something like that, which has been such an
art baby, not just for me but for my husband
and all the people that are involved are our friends

(50:35):
and dear creatives who have given their time and energy
and incredible talents.

Speaker 12 (50:40):
So it's really close to being a little finished. And
then who knows that we have to find somewhere to
put it. But yes, this year I reckon.

Speaker 2 (50:53):
Oh look, one step at a time. Can you do
me a favored Morgana when you turn up at that premiere?
Can you just say, oh, Hi'm Morgana and I deserve
to be here?

Speaker 21 (51:02):
Oh, Kyota, Yes, I will, I will, I'll be I'll
be clutching my PILs looking around the room.

Speaker 12 (51:09):
I'm and I to be here.

Speaker 9 (51:11):
I'm Wiganna and.

Speaker 12 (51:14):
Hi, Jennifer call. It's nice to beet you. I'm more Connor,
and I deserve to be here. It's not my last name.

Speaker 2 (51:20):
You need to work you need to work on that.
But look, hey, thank you so much for your time.
It's always really great to catch up with you and
look forward to catching up with you throughout the year.

Speaker 12 (51:30):
Thanks Jessica.

Speaker 2 (51:32):
Don't forget that The White Lotus Season three starts on
me on tomorrow and also after eleven. I'm joined by
author and resilience educator and cancer survivor Jake Bailey. It
is nineteen past ten. You're the Sunday Session.

Speaker 3 (51:46):
There's no better way to start your Sunday.

Speaker 1 (51:49):
It's a Sunday Session with Francesca Rutkin and Wiggles for
the best selection of great breaths, news Talk sat Be.

Speaker 2 (51:58):
Wickles has a terrific range of products, and this month
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Speaker 3 (52:47):
The Sunday Session.

Speaker 17 (52:50):
If you're feeling down, make you bad Boys sounds around
mag you have your.

Speaker 2 (53:02):
Brain and entertainment time. Now I'm joined by Steve Newle,
editor at flicks dot co, Do dot MZ. Good morning,
Good morning.

Speaker 22 (53:11):
Immediately I feel like checking back.

Speaker 2 (53:13):
In The whitee What I was just going to say
is that going to a new season the White Lotus
does that make you feel happy?

Speaker 22 (53:20):
It certainly does. I mean, that's been two great seasons
of television. I think the second season of this ensemble
kind of black comedy drama scaled heights at the first
season hadn't reached. And Mike White's really perfected this. This
ability to get alchemy from his cast right like this

(53:40):
is I think the strongest thing that season three also
has going for it as well. It's not necessarily in
the writing, although that's kind of incisive and clever, but
it's in being able to pull together the perfect group
of actors. And as we just heard from morgana O'Reilly,
she's part of ensemble that really ticks in season three.

Speaker 2 (54:01):
Because it's often not what they say, it's what they're
not saying that you were reading, and their facial expressions
and this huge part of it is there, and they're
just you know, there their entire sort of body language
and everything. You know, it's a show that.

Speaker 22 (54:15):
Runs on constant readjustments of power, right, So everyone's there's
there's competitions within every group of characters, whether it's three
women who definitely aren't having a midlife crisis holiday, no, No,
they're having a victory lap. That's Leslie Bird, Michelle Monaghan
and Carry Kern, whose subplot's all about, I guess the
kind of jostling that happens within friendships. Then you've got

(54:39):
a family vacate with the legendary Parker Posey playing opposite
Jason Isaac's and an incredible turn from Patrick Schwarzenegger as
this they really Mike White's really milking lots of references
to Annie in these in these early episodes.

Speaker 2 (54:57):
And there are a particular family and they're all actors
who are really happy to embrace how unlikable their characters
are with just joyful glee and wake don't they Yeah,
And And there's.

Speaker 22 (55:08):
Look, there's there's a bit of a wink in a
way I felt anyway to to shots that really frame
up Patrick Schwarzenegger's jawline in a way that makes him
look very army, or or is scanning a pull for
young woman to talk to in the same way that
the terminator would scan a bar for his victims, and
so sort of undercutting I guess a bit of the
a bit of the family.

Speaker 2 (55:29):
Mystique in an You've got line.

Speaker 22 (55:32):
I really really dug this up. But the first two
episodes of this of the season, not to get into
spoil the territory, but just kind of going across this
cast list, there's so much to enjoy. Walton Goggin's huge
personal favor of mine. I can't be happier that the
Righteous Gemstones is coming back.

Speaker 2 (55:47):
And coming do you put me onto?

Speaker 22 (55:49):
That's fantastic comedy. So he's his character here is sort
of in a way, he's probably the most straight dramatic
character of the of the cast so far. Quite a
sort of film noiry, kind of brooding, serious guy, a
little bit of odds with some of the comedy that
you see elsewhere. But playing opposite herm Amy lou Wood

(56:09):
is fantastic. I didn't watch Sex Education, but fans of
that show, we're already on the Amy train. Brings a
great energy to proceedings. And yes, you've got I rather
got Natasha Rothwell returning from season one of The White
Latters as well. So yeah, and populating popular in this
group of characters. He's he's pulled off magic again. Can't

(56:32):
wait like everyone else now, I just can't wait to
see what happens is the season unfolds.

Speaker 2 (56:36):
I know that, can I Look, we're going back in time.
Another eighties classic is going to have a sequel.

Speaker 22 (56:42):
I mean, it doesn't stop, does it. But there's but
there's ones that you kind of go, oh, you saw
that one coming? And then you hear that Steven Spielberg
is producing Gourney's two.

Speaker 2 (56:52):
And I didn't see that one coming.

Speaker 22 (56:55):
Did not see that one coming?

Speaker 2 (56:56):
First one was that what eighty five?

Speaker 17 (56:58):
Yeah?

Speaker 22 (56:58):
And and you know you've got a group of child
actors and very much, very much a family film, although
like like much Spielberg work of that parient sort of
pushing I guess what the ideas of a of a
G rated movie be, pushing it into PG territory. But
there's fans have been clamoring for this for ages, the

(57:19):
cast all still sort of they will turn up at
each other's premieres, so you know you've got You've got
Corey Heldman to Corey Feldman, Josh Brolin, Kahu, Kuan Marlton,
all these guys, guys and gals still very much a
gang that formed in the eighties and still friends. So
you know, there's again, like very much like The White Lotus,

(57:40):
there's a lot of interconnectivity between these actors that will
make a sequel.

Speaker 2 (57:44):
But we don't actually know anything about the sequel. We
don't even know whether they would potentially be involved, do
we We know nothing about the plot at the stage.

Speaker 22 (57:50):
Exactly, but the clamor like, they keep getting asked about it,
and Quan came up for Kwan last week when he
opened his new movie Love Hurts. Corey Feldman was on
the red carpet with him. They just always get asked
about Gois and they always talk about how great it
would be to do another one.

Speaker 2 (58:04):
No one's ever mentioned the Goonies to me, I don't
think twenty years, but obviously it's out there. Well we
shall wait and see. Thank you so much. So The
White Lotus back tomorrow night Monday Night on Neon, isn't it?

Speaker 3 (58:16):
Yeah?

Speaker 22 (58:17):
Neon on Sky, And you know, it's nice to see
the return of the Monday Night's Appointment television.

Speaker 2 (58:22):
It certainly is.

Speaker 22 (58:24):
I'm going to have to pace out these episodes. I
got a couple early, but I don't I want to
join the week by week train. I don't want to
have to wait weeks to find out what happens on
the show.

Speaker 2 (58:32):
I'm very impressed by your restraint. It's not because I
would have probably torn through all of them sometimes. Thank
you much so much, Steve Right, Why when we're full
do we still eat dessert? Well, science has an answer.
That is next. It is ten thirty News Talks AB.

Speaker 1 (58:51):
It's the Sunday session with Francesca Rudkin on News Talks at.

Speaker 2 (58:55):
B Good to have you with us. It is time
for our science study of the week and I'm joined
by doctor Michelle Dickinson. Good morning, Good morning.

Speaker 7 (59:04):
This might be.

Speaker 2 (59:05):
Something that I can relate to many of us. Can
the issue that we are discussing here today.

Speaker 20 (59:11):
So many of us call it a dessert stomach. You
know that extra stomach that you have that always has
room for dessert stuff.

Speaker 2 (59:19):
Even when you you sort of focus on I'm going
to leave some room for dessert, and you know that
you don't hear room for dessert. You still yeah, there's
always room. Yeah, that other stomach that I can put
it in.

Speaker 20 (59:27):
Well, we didn't realize before where this room comes from,
and actually it comes from, thanks to a new study
that's published in the journal Science this week, it comes
from your brain basically trigging you. You don't have extra room,
but your brain has set this up for you. So
this beautiful study, which was tested out on mice, has
actually found this new link in a place called your

(59:48):
in your brain called the hypothalamus, and inside there are
these neurons and they're called p O MC neurons, which
stands for pro opio milano caught in neurons. Don't worry
about the name of it. Basically, these are the neurons
that tell you when you're full. They tell you to
tell you to stop eating, so you're and goes had
too much to eat. It's sort of the connection between

(01:00:09):
your stomach and your brain that says had too much,
stop eating now, otherwise we would eat forever. It's good
that we have these things.

Speaker 3 (01:00:14):
Now.

Speaker 20 (01:00:14):
We've always thought that that's all they did. Were This
new research has actually found that these neurons release natural
opioids called beta endorphins, which trigger a reward sensation in
your brain when they when sugar enters your mouth. So,
when sugar enters your mouth, these POMC neurons that are

(01:00:35):
usually designed to tell you your fun also release basically
an endorphin that goes, oh, wasn't that nice? Can we
have some more of that please? And we all go, yes,
I'll just eat some.

Speaker 2 (01:00:46):
More sugary dessert. That it can even start before you've
put the sugar in your mouth, like even just thinking
about it.

Speaker 15 (01:00:51):
Yees.

Speaker 20 (01:00:51):
So what they did is they took these mice and
they basically gave them a massive dinner, and then nineteen
minutes later, they gave them a sugary dessert, and they
studied their brains and these mice went ballistic for this dilute.
And what they found is the neural activity spiked four
times the level it was drawing their meal in this
POMC neuron area. And then they went, oh, well, let's

(01:01:13):
study it when we just show them the dessert. So
as they started to bring the dessert out, the mice's
brains were going nuts. I meaning that it's not just
the sugar, it's you thinking about the sugar, and this
reward sensation has already gone off that triggers you to go,
I need that sugar. I need that sugar. And then
you have the sugar, and then you get this lovely
release of endorphins you I want more sugar. And what

(01:01:34):
they did is they use this really cool thing called optogenetics,
which is where they can shine light on the brain
of these mice to stop this pathway from working. So
basically it stops these POMC neurons from being able to
give off this lovely endorphin. And as soon as they
did that, the mice basically didn't eat their dessert. So
it shows that that pathway is the pathway. And the

(01:01:56):
reason why this is interesting, other than feeding a whole
bunch of mice sugary desserts, is that now we know
that that is why people are craving sugary things and
they're feeling, oh, my, an addiction to it. I was
going to say, is this proof that you can be
addicted to sugar hundred percent? Oh, you're addicted. You get
a feeling of pleasure which is nice, and so they've gone, well,

(01:02:17):
look we can look at anti obesity drugs, some things
that actually cut this off. Great idea, but I'm just
imagining all these little mice eating all of these desserts,
having lights shin at.

Speaker 2 (01:02:27):
Their brain and then it's taken away.

Speaker 20 (01:02:30):
Well why does this even happen? So they've actually gone
back and gone, we'll back in. When our ancestors time,
sugar was so scarce that if you came across it,
you should really take it in because you need the
energy to boost your system even if you're full. So
it was designed as an override so that when you
saw sugar, which is very rare, you consume it so
you don't waste it and walk past it. But now

(01:02:52):
that sugar is abundant, we.

Speaker 2 (01:02:55):
Just we can just blame all the sun, shall we?

Speaker 20 (01:02:58):
So don't feel bad if you've got a dessert stomach.
It's an ancestral thing that has happened through evolution. But no,
it's there, and if you want it to and off,
you can say no to that's it. You don't have
an extra space or an extrastomach for it. It's just
your brain tricking you.

Speaker 2 (01:03:11):
I love it. Where do we find this study in
the General Science fantastic, Thank you so much. Right, it
was National Lamb Day yesterday, Mike vander Elson takes a
moment to celebrate the meat export industry. Next, it's twenty three.

Speaker 1 (01:03:24):
To eleven the Sunday Session Full Show podcast on iHeartRadio
powered by News Talks IB.

Speaker 2 (01:03:31):
Joining now our resident chief Mike vander Elson.

Speaker 19 (01:03:34):
Good morning, Good morning.

Speaker 2 (01:03:36):
I had no idea until this summer that we had
a National Lamb Day. How exciting.

Speaker 3 (01:03:41):
I know.

Speaker 19 (01:03:42):
I've actually been hearing about it all weeks, so it's
actually had quite a bit of media.

Speaker 2 (01:03:46):
Well, it's incredible history that they're celebrating eighteen eighty two.
We began exporting, didn't we.

Speaker 19 (01:03:53):
I know that was one hundred and forty three years ago,
and they loaded five thousand carcasses onto a boat in
Port Charmer's.

Speaker 5 (01:04:02):
Five thousand cacuters.

Speaker 19 (01:04:03):
Men, how long it would take them one hundred and
forty three year years ago to actually gather five thousand
carcters and load process and get them into a both
and then get them over to England. The trip alone
must have been three months. The sailing must have been
three months, surely. Yeah, And for them to arrive and
still be in peak condition and frozen.

Speaker 2 (01:04:24):
And well, yeah, that's the thing. To be honest with you,
I was thinking, oh, I might not ask too many
details about how how that'll panned out, but you know,
good on them. And of course still you know, of
course today we still have a very very successful, you know,
export business of our high quality meats. And so we're
going to talk a bit a bit of barbecued lamb today.

Speaker 19 (01:04:46):
I thought I'd bring it simple, simple recipe and so
it's it's barbecue lamb because we're still we're still in summer.
We were still in barbecu mode with an avocado fetter whip.
So the avocado fetter whip is the hero to the
dish alongside the amazing lamb. So for this dish, I'm
using lambshow but this could actually, this could be any part.

(01:05:08):
This could be a lamb leg, It could be a
bonus rolled lamb shoulder, it could be a rack of lamb,
it could be probably my favorite, do you know what
My favorite cup of the lamb is Francisca the lamb
rump lamb roum. It's the perfect balance of chewinginess, of flavor,
of moisteness, and it just you cook that medium which

(01:05:32):
is about fifty four fifty five degrees, and then let
it rest and then you slice that. It is the
most delicious cut off the lamb, go the rump rub anyway,
so today we're using lamb shoulders. So marinate lamb chops
or lamb shoulder chops. I've just got a little bit
of oil and some salts and pepper, and then squeeze
over some lemon juice. Set that aside. Let that marinate

(01:05:54):
for at least thirty minutes before you go to barbeca.
In that time, In that thirty minutes, you could turn
your barbecue on, get it crank, and give it a
clean and then we want to make our fatal whip.
So for the I'm using, I've got cows fetter, but
this could also be if you can find some Danish fetter,
it'll be great. You just want a soft fetter, not
a dry, hard fetter. Pop that into a blender along

(01:06:16):
with the flesh of an avocado, a tablespoon of sour cream.
Turn that on, blitz it. As it's blitzing, I pour
in some avocado or I don't use avocado all a lot,
but I do for this because what it does is
it kind of gives you a silky, not a lovely
sheen to the actual fetter whip. But it also introduces
just a little bit of color, a little bit of

(01:06:37):
green color to it. So once they started setting that aside,
chuck your land chops onto the barbecu you cook them.
Depending on thick it's going to take ten to twelve minutes.
If you can buy a temperature prog or if you've
got a temptare probe a digital one, stick them in
you want to take them to about fifty six fifty
seven degrees, then take them off and rest them, and
then we've got a lovely salad to go alongside it.
It's like baby Cosley's, which are just really little crunchy

(01:07:00):
sweet baby gem leaves. Mix that with some fresh crean
and they've got like a half cup of creery and
there's some spring ins that being, maybe some chies, maybe
some fernel, half a cup of mint add there and
then give that a toss together. Serve that alongside your
avocado fetal whip and your barbecue lamb, and if you want,
you can add a little star to that. Some crispy
potatoes will be lovely. Maybe some Israeli cous course, or

(01:07:22):
even just some some toasted pitcher pockets that would be lovely.
It would be great dish.

Speaker 2 (01:07:26):
Yes, sounds great. You mentioned soft cow's fetter, what kind
of feat and do we make a New Zealand we
make a soft one?

Speaker 5 (01:07:33):
Yeah, we make a Danish fetter here.

Speaker 19 (01:07:34):
Yeah, and quite often you see those little logs these
are made of. These are French sherve goat. It's called
goat sherb and it's a little round log. Those work
really well because they basically paste down really well. Where
I find you quite a few fetters they just turn
to crumble. You can't paste them, you can't turn them
into a smooth paste. So I just look out for

(01:07:57):
Danish fetter.

Speaker 5 (01:07:58):
That's my go to.

Speaker 2 (01:07:59):
Okay, I was because when you said that, I wouldn't
know whether you meant actually a Danish produced one or
one made in New Zealand.

Speaker 19 (01:08:05):
Yeah, good, good question. I think we make I think
we make a Danish fetter here, and all it is
is just a soft cows fetter.

Speaker 2 (01:08:14):
Or just since we're celebrating our own lamb, we should
be celebrating our own you know, all the other products
as well.

Speaker 19 (01:08:18):
Shouldn't we Well, you can get a soft lamber. You
can get a sheep's a shop a soft sheeps fetter
as well. Okay, yes you can. The key is just
finding one that's got that soft element to it and
it's not dry, and it's not dry and grumbly. That's
for a different application. This is something that you need
to make soft and you can turn into a nice

(01:08:38):
smooth whip.

Speaker 2 (01:08:40):
Okay, and just very quickly. The best tip for making
sure you've cooked that lamb perfectly on the barbecue temptare Probe.

Speaker 19 (01:08:48):
Go to Bunnings or Mini ten buy yourself a digital
temperture Probe. The non expense it will be like thirty
bucks and lamb. For a lamb rack, take it to
fifty four degrees, then take it off and rest it.
For anything a little bit tougher, like a chop or
a shoulder, take a little bit higher, maybe fifty eight,
possibly going to sexty, take it off and the most
important part after that is to let it rest. Rest

(01:09:10):
it for the same amount of time that you've cooked it.
Don't worry if it goes a little bit cold. You
can always crank your oven up and just fire it
through a really hot oven just beforety seven.

Speaker 3 (01:09:19):
I love it.

Speaker 2 (01:09:20):
You sound like you're in a Cicada zoo this morning.

Speaker 19 (01:09:22):
I know I'm sitting. I'm sitting in my old Highluks
on the side of the motorway about to go into
wood Will Bike Park.

Speaker 2 (01:09:28):
Thank you very much for stopping and planning your biking
trip this morning around us. Really appreciate it. That was
Mike vander Elson good from scratch dot co dot inz as.
We can find that recipe. Of course, you'll also be
able to find it at newstalk ZB dot co dot
m Z forward slash Sunday you'll be able to find
all our interviews and information from today on our website.
We'll get that up for you throughout the day. It

(01:09:51):
is quarter to eleven News Talk ZB grab a cover.

Speaker 1 (01:09:54):
It's the Sunday session with Francesca Rudgin and Wikle for
the best selection of great Reads, News Talk ZEDB Wellness.

Speaker 2 (01:10:02):
Time, and I'm joined by Erin O'Hara. Good morning, Good morning. Okay,
So we always talk about creating good habits and things
like that, but what about actually taking a look at
some of those bad habits that already exist, which are
really draining our energy and things we need atle bit
of motivation sometimes to clean up the bad habits before
we get the good habits in place, don't we? I

(01:10:22):
think absolutely.

Speaker 23 (01:10:23):
I think a lot of people get so focused on
making change and good things they can be doing instead
of what they actually just need to review in their
life with things they could actually just remove and notice
what improvement.

Speaker 2 (01:10:35):
That life has. You might not actually have to do
an overhaul or do too much. It might just be
a bad habit to remove.

Speaker 23 (01:10:42):
And it's a common instinct is that we quite often
when we like get on a healthcare as, we be
quite extreme about it. But it's not about that. It's
about creating a healthy lifestyle that's actually sustainable ongoing. And
energy is something we're always kind of looking for and
I think we look at, oh, how can we get
more energy? But actually today we're going to talk about

(01:11:03):
habits that are draining your energy, that are actually depleting
you and actually not helping you with your energy levels.
And I always think of bad habits as things that
are you know, holding us back and long term they
actually lead to burnout. And so being really mindful of
what things are actually exhausting us and not being good habits.

(01:11:24):
And if you think about energy as being a water
in a cup, and obviously more energy going in is
adding more water in. But if we're looking at habits
that are draining us, is making that whole smaller, so
we're getting less draining of energy out of that water cup.
And so things that are draining our energy can be
things like always looking at your email and social media,

(01:11:46):
which I feel like has become such a big thing.

Speaker 2 (01:11:49):
I started my wanting talking about my attention span because
what I've learned about that is that the more the
more we do and everything, the harder our executive functioning
is working in, our attention span just wears out. And
that's one of the main reasons that you end the
day tired.

Speaker 23 (01:12:05):
Just because you've been overworking massive overload information. And I
feel like just because everyone's got their phone everywhere, they
seem to always have it in their pocket, and they
go to the bathroom and they've still got their phone,
or they're sitting at the traffic lights and they think, oh,
just check my email, But actually always checking your email
and always checking your social media whenever you get a

(01:12:26):
little notification is actually quite depleting. On your energy.

Speaker 2 (01:12:29):
So even just creating some boundaries around that. I noticed
that over summer, and that's what kind of instigated this
whole thought about my attentions, my diminishing attention span. I
was picking up my phone and looking for news that
wasn't there Christmas and New Year, and I'm like, nothing
happens at this time of the year for good, Okay,
just put the news down. I'll be reading a book
and every sort of twenty minutes I'd notice, I'd pick

(01:12:50):
up the phone. Has something happened. No, nothing's happened. Everything's fine.

Speaker 23 (01:12:55):
And that's some that cops it kind of overthinking or
overworrying and actually recognizing when we do do those habits
and how to just actually pull back and not do
those habits can be a really effective way to just
boost our energy and our cognitive function as well. And
then when it comes to diet, you know, reviewing your
diet and not being an extreme about it, but what

(01:13:15):
things actually deplete your energy, which can be simple things
like having too much processed food and things that actually
drain your energy, or too much sugar, too much caffeine,
too much alcohol. So kind of looking at those things
that deplete the energy and actually bring in more things
they're going to build energy, like your fruits and vegetables. Also,
hydration is massive when it comes to energy. Is that

(01:13:38):
when we're not drinking enough water and we're really dehydrated,
that can actually be lowering our energy levels as well.

Speaker 2 (01:13:45):
Just talking about something like coffee, like having one coffee
it does not so bad, but is it an issue
if you're having like three or four? Is it as
simple as going actually, you know what, it's just what
I'm going to try, just one.

Speaker 23 (01:13:55):
Absolutely keeping that balance because coffee if like we've talked
about it in the past over lots of different times,
and there's lots of research that it's actually really beneficial
for coffee things like for the gar and cognition energy,
But it's if we don't have too much. So if
you're having like eight to ten cups of coffee a day,
I'd be like, let's just review that. It's going to

(01:14:16):
be really depleting long term. But keeping that happy balance
might be one cup in the morning or maybe two
at the most, which will just be nice and uplifting. Great,
you'll get the health benefits of it, but not being
energy you're basically saying you don't need to completely kind
of take it out of your life. Maybe it's just
a reduction reduction. Yeah, And that's where when we're looking
at these habits, is just reviewing them and maybe not

(01:14:39):
do it trying to do everything, but just a couple
of things.

Speaker 2 (01:14:42):
How do people know though, if that particular habit is
draining the energy, they might not kind of put the
two together.

Speaker 23 (01:14:49):
So true, so true. I think maybe just even looking
at how it let's look at how it makes you feel,
like even maybe observing how it makes you feel when
you're continually doing that repetitive habit and just nearly like
doing your whole review of your life. Like I watch
your sl like are you sleeping too much or too little?
Because to too much sleep can also make you really lethargic.

(01:15:12):
Too little sleep really exhausted. Looking at exercise, not too much,
not too little as well, when we're not doing any exercise,
we can feel really sluggish, and when we're doing too
much exercise, we feel really exhausted because we've outputted too
much energy. So again getting that happy balance. Looking at
our house and like not having too much clutter around

(01:15:33):
because we've got too much clutter that can be a
really depleting thing as well, cluttered life, cluttered mind. So
maybe just looking at how you can declutter and simplify,
keeping things simple. Sometimes a simple life can just be
the one that can actually uplift your energy in your
whole kind of mood as well, and make it simple
and just keeping that focus on things that make you

(01:15:55):
feel good and things that uplift your and make you
feel the most balanced.

Speaker 2 (01:16:00):
I love it, Thank you so much. Erin It is
six to eleven the.

Speaker 1 (01:16:05):
Sunday session for show podcast on iHeartRadio powered by News
Talks at Me.

Speaker 2 (01:16:12):
Jake Bailey knows all about adversity and yet thirteen, he
was diagnosed with an extremely aggressive form of cancer. His
body was shutting down. He was given two weeks to live.
It was ten years ago.

Speaker 3 (01:16:23):
Now.

Speaker 2 (01:16:24):
Jake is an internationally acclaimed educator on resilience. He's got
a new book out. It's called The Comeback Code, in
which he shares his life experience and practical evidence based
tools to help us all handle life's challenges better. The
remarkable Jake Bailey is with me next and we're going
to finish the hour with a little bit of Paul Simon.
So Saturday Night Live is in the States is turning fifty.

(01:16:46):
The fiftieth anniversary special is tomorrow New Zealand time. It's
been announced that Paul McCartney, Sabrina Carter and Paul Simon
had been added to the musical lineup of our of
the three hour shows. Here's a little bit of Paul
Simon to end the hour back shortly.

Speaker 24 (01:17:07):
No no no no no no no no no no
no no no no no no no no.

Speaker 11 (01:17:21):
H m hm.

Speaker 3 (01:17:25):
M m.

Speaker 17 (01:17:28):
M hm h.

Speaker 3 (01:17:32):
M hmmmmmmm. If you buddy, hey, you know what that means.

Speaker 1 (01:18:01):
It's the Sunday Session with Francesca Rutgers and Wickles for
the best election of Great Reads.

Speaker 3 (01:18:07):
US Talk Sevy.

Speaker 2 (01:18:15):
Coming up this hour on the Sunday Session, Super Rugby
has begun. Can you believe it? Elliot Smith with his
thoughts on the opening weekend. Jojo Moys is back with
a new novel, Joan talks us through it and Meagan
heads to Wellington to check out to Papa's Vivian Westward Exhibition.

Speaker 3 (01:18:32):
The Sunday Session right, I am sure that.

Speaker 2 (01:18:35):
This is one of the news stories that we all remember.
Back in twenty fifteen, christ Church Boys. High head boy
Jake Bailey gave an inspirational end of year speech from
a wheelchair just weeks before he had been diagnosed with
an aggressive form of cancer. Jake's journeys through cancer treatment
left him with many questions around how we face and
overcome adversity once in remission, he studied positive psychology to

(01:18:57):
try and get the answers his vision to give the
next generation the ability to overcome life's ups and downs.
The result is a book called The Comeback Code. So
Jake Bailey joins me.

Speaker 16 (01:19:07):
Now, good morning one in Francesca. How's it going really good?

Speaker 2 (01:19:11):
So good to have you with us.

Speaker 16 (01:19:12):
Oh, stoked to be here. Thank you very much for
the opportunity.

Speaker 2 (01:19:15):
Wondering if you can put into words what it has
been like, what it is like to be told that
you have two weeks to live.

Speaker 13 (01:19:25):
Yeah, it's a funny one. It's a question which I
often get actually, particularly when I work with young people
and students. I think that you know, for them, they
probably heard a little bit of my story and maybe
find themselves trying to picture what that could or would
be like. And as I often tell them, it's a
great question with a really really boring answer, unfortunately, which
is that it feels like not a huge amount. It

(01:19:48):
kind of wasn't necessarily any of the things which you
would expect to feel. I wasn't angry or upset or
scared or afraid or maybe any of those things which
it instinctively expected to be.

Speaker 15 (01:19:58):
Like.

Speaker 16 (01:19:59):
It felt like not a huge amount.

Speaker 13 (01:20:02):
And maybe if there was anything, there was probably a
little bit of a sense of just wanting to crack
it and get started. I knew that, you know, the
only way to get through was going to be going
through the treatment, going through the chemotherapy, and coming out
the other side, and so there was maybe a little
bit of a sense of wanting to get on with it.
But yeah, it doesn't, in my case at least kind
of feel like a huge amount.

Speaker 2 (01:20:23):
Interesting. I mean, you don't do things by halves, do you.
I mean, it was quite a diagnosis. As you say
in the book, you were the usane bolt of dying.

Speaker 13 (01:20:32):
That's yeah, a bold claim to make, particularly without broader
context around it, I suppose, but it's yeah, it was.
It was a very aggressive, very very aggressive and fast
growing full of cancer. And you know, I'm incredibly fortunate
and privileged in many ways, but gus first of all
to have had access to treatment, secondly to have had

(01:20:54):
the opportunity to be treated by and kid for by
an incredible medical team here in christ Church, and then
third to have been really fortunate and really privileged to
have I guess, survived it and been able to come
out the other side and and make it out and
continue to move.

Speaker 16 (01:21:08):
On in life.

Speaker 2 (01:21:09):
So how has having cancer changed you?

Speaker 16 (01:21:12):
Look?

Speaker 13 (01:21:13):
I mean, there's probably so many ways that it would
be easier to list the things which it hasn't changed
as much as that is a cliche, but I think
probably at its core, I guess the resilience was the
main thing that I took away from the cancer. I think,
particularly as a young person, you know, going into the cancer,
being eighteen, where in the weeks and months prior to

(01:21:33):
the diagnosis I've been worried and worrying about these very average,
regular kind of teenage things like you know, bad exam
results or not making sports teams i'd tried for, or
having fallouts with mats, or being self conscious as I
think we all are when we're that age, and then
to come through the cancer, to come out the other
side three months later and to have I guess some

(01:21:56):
skills or tools or strategies around resilience which I've learned
from going through the cancer, which had fundamentally changed how
I felt about life. I mean, I came out and
I was no longer kind of weighed down or bogged
down by a lot of these things which previously had
been quite a burden or had caused me a lot
of I guess, anxiety and worry as a young person.

Speaker 16 (01:22:18):
And yeah, I think it's core.

Speaker 13 (01:22:20):
I mean, that's probably been the biggest change that's allowed
me to be a i'd like to say, a happier, optimistic,
more grateful person after the cancer than I was beforehand.

Speaker 16 (01:22:30):
And I think it's core.

Speaker 13 (01:22:31):
You know, the basis for that in any of those things,
that optimism, that that happiness, all of those positive things
comes from having learned to be more resilient.

Speaker 16 (01:22:40):
And I guess that's where my passion for resilience comes from.

Speaker 2 (01:22:44):
Let's talk about this passion. We can we better equip
people to deal with challenge and challenges life throws at them.
We can we train ourselves to be.

Speaker 13 (01:22:53):
More resilient, absolutely, unequivocally yes, And you know that's not
my opinion that's the research, that's the evidence, that is
what we can see.

Speaker 16 (01:23:02):
And I think, you know, there's.

Speaker 13 (01:23:03):
Something quite empowering about the knowledge of that as well.
I think knowing that we can get better and be
better at getting through tough times allows us to feel
a little bit less untethered during those tough times in adversity.
The knowledge that we can learn to be better at
getting through this challenge makes us feel as though we
have some sort of control and direction over what we

(01:23:25):
go through and I guess how we deal with it.
And I think that there's something quite empowering about that
understanding in itself that a big part of learning to
be more resilient, a big part of learning to be
better at getting through tough times, is actually going through
those tough times. And I think that that knowledge allows
you to meet adversity and challenge with the attitude of
it being I guess a training ground or looking to

(01:23:47):
take something away from it, looking to come out the
other side more resilient and improved by it.

Speaker 16 (01:23:52):
And I think that's kind of I guess, empowering in itself.

Speaker 2 (01:23:55):
Yeah, let's talk about the four S model. I really
like this model. The first S is slow down, and
this is possibly one of my favorites because I think
you can actually put it into play in day to day.
It's the idea of breaking big things down into small,
manageable chunks.

Speaker 13 (01:24:12):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely, And I think that, you know, it's
something which is relevant and applicable to I guess, resilience
into getting through adversity. And I should stress as well
that all of this is you know, evidence and research based,
and it's not you know, me sort of hypothesizing or
proplytizing on things which I think are great or cooler,
things which have worked for me or helped me get
through challenges in life. You know, these are things which

(01:24:33):
we know for a fact make people better at getting
through tough times, make people more resilient. So when it
comes to slowing down, yeah, the idea of breaking things
up into more manageable, bite sized pieces, this is not
something which we just apply to challenge and adversity in life.
You know, this is how we get through anything. So
how we get through a task, This is how we

(01:24:53):
I guess, break down goals and work towards things that
we want to achieve. This is kind of you know,
if you go to the gym, you know I don't,
but I'm reliably informed that you break your work down
into into sort of sets and reps, right like I've
been told by people. You know, I do a bit
of running, you know, and I know that for me,
when I go for a run, I'm mentally breaking it
down into you know, kilometers at a time, or blocks

(01:25:14):
of five k's at a time, whatever it may be,
because it makes it a whole lot easier than trying
to approach it as one big, single book, single lump sum.
And you know, I can pull out a million different
examples of that from you know, cooking and recipes to
so on and so forth, but it's core. I think
it's something which is irrelevant and applicable to going through
tough times as well. You know, it works better when
you take it on whatever sized pieces you can manage,

(01:25:36):
whether that's a month at a time, a week at
a time, a day at a time, an hour at
a time. I know for all of your listeners, they
will have gone through challenge and adversity and suffering over
the course of their lifetime, and they would have found
themselves in moments where the thought I don't know how
I'm going to get through this this week, you know,
this day, that hour, this this whatever I have to
go through. And so the answer is generally you just

(01:25:57):
try and break it down into a smaller piece and
continually take those off one after another.

Speaker 2 (01:26:02):
The second is is salvage. And I know that this
is one of your favorites, that something positive can come
out of adversity. How important do you think a sense
of humor is when dealing with advantags.

Speaker 13 (01:26:14):
I think a sense of humor is pivotal, really, and
again the research and evidence seems to suggest it this.
You know, there's some really fascinating research and evidence which
which shows that young people who come from families that
utilize humor as a coping mechanism or a coping strategy
during adversity, during tough times go on to create young
people who are I guess, far more resilient and robust

(01:26:37):
and well adjusted later on in life. You know, if
you can learn that during tough times, things don't have
to be completely binary, that things are not you know,
if something is bad, it doesn't.

Speaker 16 (01:26:46):
Mean it has to be all bad.

Speaker 13 (01:26:48):
If you can get into this mindset that there can
be you know, silver linings or good within the darkness,
or you know, sorry, light within the darkness, are good
within the bad, then I think you're put you in
a position where you're better able to approach adversity, not
so much as you know, an enemy or a challenge,
but instead to be able to deliberately seek out some
of these positive things. And you know, on that note

(01:27:11):
of humor again, this is sort of what humor is
at its core when it comes to getting through adversity.
If you can find something to laugh at during a
tough time, that really is the you know, the ultimate
and salvaging. If you can take some livity, if you
can take some lightness, if you can take some humor
away from a tough time, then the research shows that
it really helps people gets through. And you know, it's
very easy to talk about, you know, research and evidence

(01:27:32):
and so on and so forth, but I think you know,
if people, if you're listeners, if you know someone who
worked particularly and I like giving the example of nursing
because I've spent a bit of time with nurses, and
when you do, you come to find that they have
exceptionally dark, but incredibly well refined, fantastic senses of humor,
and they do that because it allows them to get through.

(01:27:52):
It's you know, they find themselves in a lot of situations,
whether it's either a laugh or cry moment, and you know,
when your options are those two, there's nothing wrong with
the former, but I think kind of ninety percent of
the time you feel you feel better with the latter.
I think anyone in a high pressure, high stakes profession,
whether it's police or fieries or even teachers, I think

(01:28:13):
a lot of the time these people who operate in
these stressful environs naturally gravitate towards utilizing humor because it works.

Speaker 2 (01:28:21):
Your third s is streamline, and that is the idea
of sort of minimizing and containing those everyday anxieties and
fears we have. And look, I know that this book
is written for everybody, young or old, but I'm going
to be honest with you with as a mother who's
just sent one kid off to university, and a whole
lot of friends who are in that sort of same
process and things when we're watching the way out young

(01:28:42):
adults are adapting to this new sort of stage in life.
I really did. I read this book feeling like it
it sort of kin'd dropped out of the sky into
my lap. At the perfect moment. It feels to me
like resource which is very much going to resonate with
younger people. I think it's about the way. It's the
way you talk in the book, and about the contributors

(01:29:04):
that you talk to. But there's a lot of talk
about life at school, the pressures on teenagers to plan
out their lives, to fit in, to find your thing,
but not every teenager knows that are we focusing on
the wrong things when it comes to growing happy, resilient,
grounded young adults.

Speaker 13 (01:29:22):
It's funny, it's a great question. Are we focusing on
the wrong things? And in some ways potentially in other
ways I guess maybe not, which is a really roundabout
kind of answer, But to sort of expand upon that,
I think, yeah, the way that young people are increasingly
encouraged to begin to hyper specialize in fields of studying

(01:29:42):
education earlier and earlier is creating an expectation for young
people that they ought to have their life planned out
by the time that they're about thirteen or fourteen years old.
And I think often when I present to parents and
communities around this, there's a sense that I might be
kind of utilizing hyperbole to make a point here when
I'm genuinely not. You know, a lot of the time,

(01:30:04):
our schools are expecting students to have sort of a
relatively clear idea on what they want to do by
the time they're kind of thirteen, fourteen, fifteen years old,
because the expectation is you will begin to choose subjects
based on what you want to do during your senior
important years of high school. I suppose, based on what
you want to do when you leave school, based on
what you want to do for the rest of your life.

(01:30:25):
And again, if that sounds like hyperbole, it probably is
just a reflection of how much the education system has
changed then some of your listeners than it was for
when some of your listeners went through that experience. And
I think, as I say in the book, you know,
I've been told, as we all have many times, that
you know, the world is your oyster when you're young,

(01:30:46):
and you've got so many options and opportunities ahead of you,
which is, you know, a fantastic thing and.

Speaker 16 (01:30:51):
A real blessing for us if you're in that position.

Speaker 13 (01:30:54):
But at the same time, you know, for me, looking
back on my time at school, I think I recall
that feeling a lot less kind of empowering or exciting
and feeling a lot more sort of daunting and frightening.
And again it's worth reflecting on the fact that you know,
for young people today, if they're told that, or if
they're in that position, they are incredibly fortunate as I was,
to have the privilege of opportunity ahead of them, because

(01:31:17):
there's a lot of people around the world, and there's
a lot of people even within you know, within our
society and communities who don't necessarily have that. But at
the same time, I think it creates the level of
anxiety for our young people because it's a daunting prospect
and there is a focus and an increasing focus on
our young people doing that earlier and earlier, which I

(01:31:37):
don't think is quite helpful.

Speaker 2 (01:31:40):
And the final S is stand alongside. And the basic
message here is you don't need to climb that mountain alone.
You know, ask for help, accept help.

Speaker 16 (01:31:50):
Yeah, one hundred percent. And I think that that's relatively intuitive.

Speaker 13 (01:31:54):
And actually I should say as well, I hope that
you know, for you and for your listeners, most of
these four s's are kind of relatively intuitive. I think
that you know, as as I present to communities or
businesses and organizations around this. Often when I present around this,
I talk to the audience afterwards and people say, you know,
this really rung a bell for me. That's really resonated

(01:32:16):
with me. These are things which I've utilized. These are
things which I've used in my life. My response to
which is great because it probably means that you're a
relatively resilient, well adjusted adult, and that you've gone through
challenge and adversity over the course of your lifetime. You've
naturally come towards these skills or strategies. You've gravitated towards

(01:32:37):
these because they work, You've learned them, you've retained them,
and you've continued to use them. But there's two things
to note about that, I guess One for our adults,
it's important, I think, sometimes to be able to put
names or concepts to some of these, or I guess
words to some of these concepts, or even put some
further information and research and evidence behind things which people

(01:32:58):
intuitively naturally do. I've chatted to a few people who've
read the book who have said, you know, it's quite
empowering to understand why these things which I've lived lent
on over the course of my lifetime work for me
and kind of what I can do to expand and
grow upon those. But two, I think it's important to
note as well that you know, these are not things which,
as young people we are born with.

Speaker 16 (01:33:18):
They're not sort of in built. We didn't come out
of the womb with these skills or strategies already within us.

Speaker 13 (01:33:24):
If they sound familiar to you, it's because, as I say,
you've learned them through blood and sweet and tears. You've
earned them before our young people, we have the capacity,
we have the opportunity to, I guess, prepare them better
now before they go out into the world for the
challenges and challenges that they will face.

Speaker 16 (01:33:40):
We know that these things work.

Speaker 13 (01:33:42):
We know that they're teachable, tainable, trainable, and entertainable. There's
things which we can which we can equip our young
people with now, hopefully at a stage of life with
the adversity and challenge that they're facing is not too significant,
but certainly before they get out into the into the
big wide world and things start coming at you pretty
fast as they as they kind of tend to for

(01:34:03):
all of us in life, because you know, never adversity
is it's kind of one of those inevitabilities of the
world ahead of us.

Speaker 16 (01:34:10):
You know, they see death and taxes.

Speaker 13 (01:34:12):
Yeah, death, death and Texas they sort of both fall
under that adversity kind of kind of bracket.

Speaker 2 (01:34:17):
You'd think, Hey, yeah, totally Look Jake, before you go,
I've just got to ask, did I just see a
picture of you in Antarctica wearing shorts?

Speaker 16 (01:34:25):
Yeah?

Speaker 13 (01:34:26):
You might have seen that actually as well, which if
you did, it probably means that the health and safety
manager is going to be on the phone for me
very shortly, because I'm not sure, not kind of sure
whether that was in the briefing or not.

Speaker 25 (01:34:39):
Yeah.

Speaker 13 (01:34:39):
I've just been really fortunate to spend some time down
in Antarctica with an incredible organization called the Antarctic Heritage Trust,
who manage and preserve and conserve all of the history
down there, all of their hearts and the artifacts from
the heroic age of exploration down there. And it's really, yeah,
very incredibly privileged and fortunate to have the opportunity to
spend some time down there with their work and to

(01:35:01):
I guess learn a little bit more about some of
the resilience of those incredible early polar explorers as well.

Speaker 16 (01:35:05):
Which you know, the Shackletons, the Scots.

Speaker 13 (01:35:07):
The stories sort of will be incredibly familiar to many
of your listeners, I'm sure, and it was a great
opportunity to learn a little bit more about I guess
what allowed them to get through.

Speaker 2 (01:35:17):
And another one of our listeners would like to know
how old you are? They like, who was this incredibly articulate,
incredibly articulate young man?

Speaker 9 (01:35:24):
How old I am?

Speaker 16 (01:35:26):
That's very kind. I'm twenty seven seven. But I've spent
a lot of time talking over the past few years.

Speaker 13 (01:35:32):
So if I hadn't have picked up a few tips
and tricks by now, you'd probably think I was a
relatively slow learner. I've had a bit of practice talking
about this stuff, to be fair, and fifteen year olds
can throw some pretty left field questions your way, so
you get relatively quick at thinking.

Speaker 16 (01:35:46):
On your feet when you work with schools. But I
appreciate it.

Speaker 2 (01:35:49):
Oh look, Jake, it's been a real pleasy to talk
to you. I got an awful lot out of this book.
But I think if you've got a young adult at home,
then I highly recommend a copy of this book. The
comeback code is in stores this week, but We've got
a couple of copies to give away. All you need
to do is tech to your full name address and
the answer to this very simple question to ninety two

(01:36:11):
ninety two what year at school was Jake when he
was diagnosed with cancer? Twenty five past eleven, You're with
News talksb Sunday.

Speaker 1 (01:36:21):
With Style the Sunday Session with Francesca Rudkin and Wiggles
for the best selection of Greg Reeds News Talks ebb Okay.

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Speaker 1 (01:37:27):
All the highs and lows, talking the big issues of
the week. The panel on the Sunday session.

Speaker 2 (01:37:33):
And on our panel today we have New Zealand Herald
Senior writer Simon Wilson. Hi Simon, Hi, There Francesco and
also joined by z B. Wellington Mornings host Nick Mills High.

Speaker 16 (01:37:43):
Nick morning, Good to have you both with us.

Speaker 2 (01:37:47):
Simon, if I can start with you, David Seymour. He
has been the headlines quite a bit this week. Do
you get the sense that the Prime Minister is tolerating Seymour?

Speaker 25 (01:37:56):
Well, I don't think he's tolerating him. Well, no, I
don't think anybody does. I imagine the Prime Minister himself
doesn't think he's doing it very well. Aim was doing
something that's we haven't really seen too much of in
coalition governments before, and that is that he's playing to
his base in rather than constructively governing. You see that

(01:38:20):
from minor parties when they're not in power, but our
coalition governments to date haven't shown a.

Speaker 3 (01:38:25):
Lot of that.

Speaker 25 (01:38:26):
We've we've seen the usual modus operandis for the minor
party to show that they are a responsible member of
a coalition government and hope to appeal to voters in
that way to re elect them. Seymour has a different approach.
He's going, ah, if nobody else matters, we matter, we
matter because we've got these issues that you care about.
And they the gamblers that that appeals to his base,

(01:38:50):
even if it alienates everybody else, including the Prime minister.

Speaker 2 (01:38:53):
Do you think it's working?

Speaker 3 (01:38:54):
Man?

Speaker 4 (01:38:56):
So I'm just working for him and it's working for that,
and I think there's any question about that. I agree totally,
and I don't often do that. I totally agree that.
I mean, we on our show in Wellington did a
segment saying is the Prime Minister's popularity in effected by
his two coalition partners and undoubtedly as part of it,

(01:39:20):
excuse me, as part of it, I said in front
of me. I've got four articles that are front page
stories in the last twenty four hours about David Seymour,
not about the Corlissen government, not about things about David Seymour.
And my producer picked up one on the next booth
and said another one. It was actually four articles in
twenty four hours all about David Seymour and act and
his plans and his ideas. Nothing about the cars, him

(01:39:43):
bottening up a car up the steps of Parliament. You know,
it was just it's becoming now a sideshow, calling him sideshow. Harry.

Speaker 2 (01:39:52):
Yeah, so Neck, here's my question to you, then, do
you think is when he takes over as deputy Prime
Minister midway through this year, there's going to be a
little bit less stuntman and a little bit more statesman.

Speaker 4 (01:40:03):
No, David Seymour, what's the the saying the best predictor
of the futures the past? I mean, where's where are
we going to see any change in David Seymour? I
kind of little. This is where I disagree a little
bit with Mike Cosking. On Friday he said he thought
that this little bit of megal and Argie Bargie is
just normal for a coalition and then get over ourselves.

(01:40:23):
I think it's going to get worse before it gets better,
and I think we're not seeing the true leadership of
Christopher Luxem because of that. I also call him a
puppet master, where he's got two puppets s Nider side
of him, he's holding them up, trying to control everything.
We're not seeing the truth here that he could possibly
be because of it.

Speaker 25 (01:40:43):
Sorry for Gisco, I'm just going to say I don't
think it's normal for a coalition either. If you think
back to the coalition government twenty seventeen to twenty that
just sinder A Deurne was Prime Minister four but Greens
and New Zealand first could not stand each other, but
it didn't spill over into this kind of thing with
ACT and with the Maori Party under John Key. Again

(01:41:04):
they weren't on the same page very often at all,
but it didn't spill over into this kind of fuss.
Things have changed.

Speaker 2 (01:41:11):
Do you think that he will rain things a little
bit when you become the sema will ragin things a
little bit shortly someone.

Speaker 25 (01:41:18):
At some point he has to show that he is
prime ministerial and this will be his opportunity to do that.
But I think Necker's right. He will feel that what
he's doing now is working for him and it has
become his persona as a politician, So changing it is
going to be very hard for him, and I imagine

(01:41:40):
he will feel that it's not worth the risk changing.

Speaker 3 (01:41:43):
Well.

Speaker 4 (01:41:43):
A completely different that Francisco Well the Congress to that
is how well is Winston Peter's behavior. I mean, I
think he's getting everything. I think he's getting everything he wants.
Don't get me wrong. Look at the Fish three staff.
You look at everything he's getting, you know, the overseas
wealthy people that come into New Zealand car by property.
He's getting everything he wants and he's doing it quietly.

(01:42:05):
I think he's been the hero of the Carlition government. Really.

Speaker 2 (01:42:09):
Yeah, no, I think we'd probably all agree a very
good foreign affairs minister now very quickly. Yeah, I just
want to change the topic completely. A woman in the
Caribbean this week lost both her hands while trying to
take a photo with a shark, or of a shark.
Up to four hundred It's believed that about up to

(01:42:29):
four hundred and eighty people have died taking selfies. How
risk averse are you, Simon? What is it about taking
a perfect photo that will make people take these sort
of extreme measures.

Speaker 25 (01:42:41):
I think this kind of thing is extraordinary. Back I've
got little bit of research. Back in twenty fourteen, which
was called efficiently the year or not officially unofficially the
Year of the selfie in America, thirty three thousand people
injured themselves while driving and using a phone, often to
take selfies. A thing that happens with a phone when

(01:43:02):
you're on it. When you're using it, you zone out
everything else in a way way that doesn't happen if
you're just talking to somebody else or listening to music
or doing anything else that might be a bit distracting.
Phones have an exclusivity about them, that's like the user
of the phones in the dome, and they do not
register what's going on around them, and the consequence of

(01:43:22):
that is really severe if you're in a dangerous situation.

Speaker 2 (01:43:27):
To start with, Nikka, you're good at doing that whole moment,
you know, and going to actually, this wouldn't work well,
this isn't going to end that well for me.

Speaker 4 (01:43:35):
No, And I think that what we're seeing is the
result of extreme stupidity. And I think that a lot
of that stuff, I mean a lot of majority of
that stuff. Will people be climbing up the highest building
they possibly can and taking a photo. So I don't
think that's just you and me driving down the road
of Francisca seeing a cat running across or running up
a tree or I need a photo of that. I

(01:43:55):
think it's these extreme people trying to get extreme shots
to make them the heroes. I mean, I was watching
their All Star NBA basketball game yesterday on television, and
all these stars that they got on the All Star Game,
I've never heard of one of them. They are all
these extreme you know, people that can motivate with photos
and do this with that, I've never even heard of them.
There's a whole new generation of people that just floto influencers.

Speaker 2 (01:44:20):
And influencers, that's what we call them.

Speaker 4 (01:44:23):
We'll look down now superstars in the world wide because
they got the best shot or they got the best story.
Let's just you know, stupid. He prevails.

Speaker 2 (01:44:30):
Oh look, thank you both so much. Simon Wilson and
Nick Mills. It's twenty three to twelve.

Speaker 3 (01:44:38):
It's the Sunday Session with Francesca Rudkin on news talks be.

Speaker 2 (01:44:44):
Coming up at midday as Elliott Smith with Weekend Sports.
He joins me, now, good morning, good morning. I was
so excited about Super Rugby coming back. I really excited
about the Blues Chiefs game last night, and then I
just completely forgot all about it the evenings. Oh rugby,
I forgot the rugby.

Speaker 24 (01:45:00):
Well, I'm glad I didn't forget to show up and
commentate it. You missed a good game, perhaps not so
much of Blues fans first game with their title defense.
They were even fourteen six a half time, and then
the Chiefs just took charge in the second spell. It
was really good performance I thought from the Chiefs, especially
after halftime, and just a little bit of a wake
up call. I think for the Blues is that now

(01:45:20):
they're playing as title favorites. They're playing is the defending champions.
Everyone's coming after them, and so they've got to lift
and perhaps an early reminder of where the standards are
in Super rugby.

Speaker 2 (01:45:31):
Addie so they made his debut for for Winer pacifica
who just lost to the Western by one point.

Speaker 24 (01:45:38):
It was great to see him out there and playing,
and I think there was an immediate lift to more
on a pacifica of quality and just playing for that
jersey a little bit more. They lost, They really should
have won. They were up forty four to thirty one
with four minutes to go, two late tries conceded. They
just left the door slightly a jarff of the Force
and the Force were just too good.

Speaker 3 (01:45:56):
Me.

Speaker 24 (01:45:57):
I think we've got about eighty four to eighty fifth
minute by the time the Force scored. But what I
did like is that they stayed in the game right
until seventy seventh in the eighth minute, and we've often
seen them be there for fifty minutes, be there for
sixty minutes, you know, to get to that point they
should have won. Hopefully it's a sign of things to
come that if they can get closer to icing those games,

(01:46:17):
then there'll be a force in this competition.

Speaker 2 (01:46:18):
Hey, big sports news of the day is world number
one TIS player young Accenter has accepted or somehow negotiated
to himself a three month ban for doping and he's
going to be all good to go to play for
the French Open.

Speaker 24 (01:46:29):
I think this is a dangerous precedent since when the
dopers gets to negotiate how long they're going to spend
away from the game, and he's spending it away from
the game between the Australian Open and the French Showman's.
He's not going to miss any of the Grand Slams.
He misses the biggest window that there is between Grand
Slams in the calendar year. He's coming back around. I
think the Italian Open if memory stands right, or it

(01:46:49):
might be the road Masters. It's remarkable negotiating skills that
next time there's a hostage situation, get young eccentaty because
he's pulled off one of the deals of the century
and be able to bast come back without really any
penalty at all three months out. So we're gonna chat
with Lee Radovanovitch Tennis Common, a former New Zealand tennis player,
as well as going to give his view on that
this afternoon on weekend.

Speaker 2 (01:47:10):
Sport Fantastic Elli. It will be with you at midday.
It is eighteen to twelve.

Speaker 1 (01:47:15):
It's a Sunday session full show podcast on iHeartRadio, powered
by News Talks atb Travel with Winnie Woo, Tours Where
the World Is Yours book Now.

Speaker 2 (01:47:27):
Megan Singleton joins us now to talk travel.

Speaker 18 (01:47:29):
Good morning, Good morning.

Speaker 2 (01:47:31):
I believe you took a little trip to Wellington recently
and popped into Papa's Vivian Westwood exhibition, which I'm hearing
great reviews about.

Speaker 18 (01:47:39):
It was Yeah, I loved it. It was amazing and
you probably need a good hour. In fact, you can
nip round it twice, which is what I did. It's
actually her jewelry collection, which I didn't know. I learned
so much about her. She's a lot more than punk
and protest. Just a little update or synopsis. She died

(01:47:59):
in twenty twenty two, aged eighty one, but she famously
lived with Malcolm McLaren of the Sex Pistols fame in
the sixties and seventies. Together they were disruptors. They were
credited for bringing punk music and fashion into the mainstream.
Then she was into sustainability long before it was fashionable.
She's still potty mouse right.

Speaker 15 (01:48:19):
To the end.

Speaker 18 (01:48:21):
But what I loved is there's five hundred and fifty
pieces of jewelry here at the Tipapa exhibition that is
on and to April twenty seventh. Then it's the first
it's opened in New Zealand, as the first place in
the world and then it's off to Shanghai. So there's
so much there. There's like antiquities pieces, a bronze breastplate

(01:48:43):
that a model has worn, the jeweled skulls and dog
bone necklaces, earrings that would drag your lobes to your shoulders. Honestly,
they're just incredible. I was just I made a little
video actually, because they allow you to do that. The
tiara like headwear with brass bells like massive, I'm holding

(01:49:03):
my head as they show you. And she's got her
diy era where she's used coke cans and trash and
made jewelry. But it's her big jeweled orbs that I loved.
And I didn't know anything about this, but this is
her signature logo. It's basically a little globe. It could

(01:49:24):
be ceramic, or it's silver or gold, or it's encrusted
with precious stones, and she's kind of wrapped like the
rings of satin around it. You know, yes, so it
can be worn like a necklace. But anyway, she's got
these probably fifty sixty more than that orbs just there
mounted on these little sticks and that you just pierce

(01:49:46):
through a glass you know, hood to look at it.
I was just fascinated by those. She took a lot
of her inspiration from the artwork at the Wallace Collection
in London, which was a surprise for me because that's
real highbrow art, you know. So she's a fascinating lady
and I think that exhibit as well worth adding to

(01:50:07):
your little Wellington list of things.

Speaker 17 (01:50:10):
To do.

Speaker 2 (01:50:12):
Because it is so unique. You don't necessarily need to
be a lover of jewelry, do you to go and
enjoy this. It's sort of bigger and broader than that,
isn't it.

Speaker 18 (01:50:21):
What they've done around is so well, yeah, exactly.

Speaker 9 (01:50:24):
So.

Speaker 18 (01:50:24):
There are fifteen fashion pieces, but then all of the
walls are made of fabric and there's a video playing
on those or they are covered in sayings and quotes
and images and stuff, and it's very cool. It's a
very busy thing to walk through. No, it's not just jewelry.
You sort of walk through her legacy really and it's

(01:50:45):
just fascinating. It's thirty dollars to enter, so to Papa
is a free museum. As we know, the Gallipoli exhibition
is still there. That is well worth seeing if you
haven't or even just going back to see if you
haven't seen it for a few years. And then this
one is just a visiting exhibition, so you pay for
that one.

Speaker 2 (01:51:02):
And would you recommend booking or can you just wander
on in and go whenever? Yes, whenever you like, Yeah, no,
you just want her on in.

Speaker 18 (01:51:09):
I mean they were all I went. It was mid
afternoon on Monday, I think Tuesday. Now, there were hardly
anybody in there. That's why I whipped around twice. Well, yeah,
I don't know if you would need to book, might
be worth jumping onto Papa's website to have a lot
because if you're going specially, you wouldn't want to be
behind your school group.

Speaker 2 (01:51:26):
That's right, if you were just a little bit push
for time. Meghan, Thank you so much. Meghan Singleton. You
can find her at blogger at large dot com and
as she mentioned, she's put up a little video that
is on her Facebook page. I'm sure you can get
to that from her blog. It is eleven to twelve.

Speaker 1 (01:51:44):
Books with Wiggles for the best election of Greg Reaves.

Speaker 2 (01:51:56):
It is time to talk books and with a couple
of recommendations for us. Joan McKenzie, Good morning, morning. Jojo
Moyes is back with a new book.

Speaker 11 (01:52:03):
Yes she is.

Speaker 26 (01:52:04):
She's terrific, and she's got a big club of readers,
particularly women I would say, who just love the really
warm I'm going to say, homely stories that she tells,
which are so realistic that sometimes you feel as though
you could almost be reading about your own life. And
she really nails it in this one. Our lead character
is a woman called Lilah, who is an author. She

(01:52:27):
wrote a book she's been in what she thought was
a happy marriage. Her book was all about how to
keep your marriage alive, and two weeks after it was published,
her husband walks out on her. So poor Lilah is embarrassed.
She's a parent who turns up at the school gates,
sees all the other school mothers there, knows that they're
talking about her. It's all pretty miserable, but as I say,
there's so much that you can relate to. And she

(01:52:48):
has two kids who live at home and her stepfather
is with them because her mother had died, so there's
the family that's kind of drawn together from various aspects.
And then her biological birth father one day turns up
and knocks on the door. He's been an actor out
in Hollywood. I think probably a pretty sick rate actor,
but he's been out in Hollywood. And so he comes

(01:53:09):
with a flourish and all of the drama into their
family life. And she doesn't want him there, but he
moves in. And it's about how a family can stitch
itself together and get through things with characters who have
all sorts of flaws and funny ways and very disparate
different people, but families are what holds the center together,

(01:53:30):
and in this book, that's what happens. It's really well done.

Speaker 2 (01:53:32):
And this is classic Jojo Moys like, if you're a fan,
you'll be satisfied.

Speaker 12 (01:53:36):
Yes, you will.

Speaker 2 (01:53:38):
Tell me a little bit about the Sequel by gene hanf.

Speaker 26 (01:53:41):
Corelitz. She is a terrific writer. Some time ago on
your program, I talked about a book called The Plot.
And in the Plot we had a character called Jacob
finch Bonner who was a washed up writer ended up
working at a third rate college where he stole the
plot for a novel from one of his students. You
might remember that. So this now is called the sequel,

(01:54:02):
and it is the sequel. And since that first book,
Jacob has met an untimely death, and his wife, Anna
is busy picking up the royalty checks and having a
very nice time, although she claims to be desperately missing
her husband. But then she gets the idea that she
might also write a book because now she has his
literary connection. So she writes a book, which, yes, it's
a bestseller, goes to the top of the charts, and

(01:54:24):
suddenly she starts getting messages from someone who's saying to her,
we know that you stole this plot and we are
going to expose you, essentially, And that's just as she's
the new darling on the literary circuit, but somebody knows
exactly what she did to get there. And I think
this is really well written. There's a very calculated insinuation
of Anna into the literary life with these derisive snares

(01:54:47):
at her former husband while she's enjoying the fruits of
his own misappropriation. So what goes around really comes around.
And Gina is also a screenwriter too. Yes, she wrote
the book which then became the TV series called The Undoing,
which starred I think it was Hugh Grant and great television.
If anybody's miss that, it's worth finding oh.

Speaker 2 (01:55:07):
Okay, Thank you so much, Joan. Two fabulous choices There
We All Live Here by Jojo Moyes and the sequel
by gene HANF Corolitz.

Speaker 1 (01:55:17):
The Sunday Session Full Show podcast on iHeartRadio powered by
News Talks FB.

Speaker 2 (01:55:24):
Thank you very much for joining me today on the
Sunday Session. Thank you to Kerrie and Mary for producing
the show today. Next week on the show, Mickey Megazeva
joins me to talk about a film called Tina. Now,
I think Tina is going to be one of our
big hits of the year. It is an absolutely beautiful film.
You will not find a film that is more heartbreaking.

(01:55:45):
It is so moving out a heavy and tears, but
it's also righteously funny. It's got this beautiful, warm, New
Zealand sense of humor to it. So He's got this film,
Tina coming out. It's a film about grief and about
the oh the magic of choirs and music as well,
a film that was very much informed by Mickey's own

(01:56:08):
experiences of grief. So we're going to be talking about
that next week. But look, that is out on the
twenty seventh of February. You're gonna want to go and
see this film February. So Mickey is going to be
with us next week. We're going to finish the hour
with a little bit of Foldy. This is a New
Zealand band. They've got some new music and a new
album coming out and and It. Smith is up next

(01:56:29):
with Weekend Sport. Joy the rest of your weekend. See
you next Sunday, Sad.

Speaker 3 (01:56:35):
Sad Day.

Speaker 1 (01:57:00):
For more from the Sunday Session with Francesca Rudgin, listen
live to News Talks it'd be from nine am Sunday,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.

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