Steve Hart: St Thomas of Canterbury College on the group of South Island boys' schools working to help young men

A 13-strong group of boys’ schools across the South Island are uniting to help address the challenges faced by young men.

This group is hoping to improve the outcomes for these boys - in both education and society.

One of the schools involved is St Thomas of Canterbury College, and principal Steve Hart says new data has exposed the issues young men are facing in the modern world.

"Until they understand who they really are and where they fit in, it can be quite difficult getting those really positive outcomes."

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Sunday Session podcast with Francesca Rudkin
from News Talks.

Speaker 2 (00:11):
Edb Right a group of South Island boys schools uniting
to tack all the modern challenges facing boys. The group
includes thirteen schools from Nelson right through to Invercargo, and
they're hoping the union will improve the outcomes of young
men and both education and society. One of the schools
involved is Saint Thomas of Kenterbury College. Principal Steve Hart

(00:34):
is with me. Good morning, Steve.

Speaker 3 (00:37):
Good morning. How are you this morning?

Speaker 2 (00:38):
I am very good thing You've got crital toopy on
a Sunday morning.

Speaker 3 (00:41):
I love it.

Speaker 2 (00:43):
Now tell me this banding together has stemmed from a
UK report that you came across. It was called Lost Boys,
State of the Nation. What was it about this report
that concerned you the most?

Speaker 3 (00:54):
Yeah, that particular report, it's some quite deman statistics throughout it.
But I guess for those of us that have been
involved in and boys' education with probably identified over quite
a period of time, some of the challenges that are
starting to make themselves a bit more apparent for young

(01:16):
men navigating a modern world, So that that particular report
just probably highlighted some of the things that we've probably
seen building over a period of time, and it probably
has just given given us an opportunity to voice some
of those concerns.

Speaker 2 (01:34):
So what are some of those things that you have
been seeing kind of increase over a period of time.

Speaker 3 (01:39):
Yeah, well, I think you know, lots of things are
and come out as measured outcomes, whether it be through
in a school setting, academic achievements, you know, engagement via attendance,
and then beyond school, you know, whether young men are
going off and to study or employment. All of those

(02:00):
kinds of outcomes are very measurable. But the thing for
me at the center of it all is do our
young men have a sense of identity? Do they understand
where they fit into this world? You know, I think
for all young people, you know, until they truly get
a grand and it's clearly a journey throughout your life,

(02:22):
but you know, until they really understand who they are
and where they fit in, you know, it can be
quite difficult, you know, getting those really positive outcomes.

Speaker 2 (02:31):
So, Steve, when do you think that changed or that
it became more of a challenge for young men trying
to find that have you noticed that is I mean,
I hate to throw this out there again, but I'm
going to you know, social media the access to that.
Has that had an impact, do you think or can
you put a time frame monitor or has it just
been something which you've noticed is generally kind of.

Speaker 3 (02:52):
Changed I think in general. I mean, if I go
back probably quite a period in time, I think some
of the really early work from Celia Leshley, Yeah, yeah,
you know in the book, in the book that she
had researched and produced, and you know, if I go
back to that time, that was an original collaboration with
led by boys schools in the South Island, and you know,

(03:13):
I think her work was identified it way back then
and going that's probably going back quite sometimes, you know,
And I think, you know, for us, all it's you know,
how can we collaborate, you know, put all our minds
together so that we can start to help our young
men find their place in this world, achieve be you know,

(03:36):
really good members of our society, because I think that's
what we're all wanting. And and yeah, you're right with
with social media, I think it gives different groups and
people an opportunity to maybe paint a certain picture that
might not be the reality, you know, and sometimes I
think young people can be you know, sucked into there

(03:59):
to we but and so I think that's the place
of you know, particularly boys schools, and we're talking about
young men, to put the right picture in front, or
at least a picture that challenges, you know, some of
those stereotypes that are constantly flooded through social media.

Speaker 2 (04:16):
Steve, is there something that you felt could be better
tackled together as a group rather than on a school
by school basis.

Speaker 3 (04:25):
Yeah, Look, I think I speak on behalf of my
own school and my own journey, and we're at Saint
Thomas's in a very multicultural school, and our journey over
over time has been a really enjoyable one for me personally.
I've been in the school for a long time, and
you know, over time you do pick out some real

(04:47):
gold nuggets and real gems that do work. To me,
it's always felt a real waste for that to just
be kept within one school. So I think collaborating across
a really wide range of schools that all have a
have a shared purpose and that we're all educating quite
a specific group, which our boy it just makes absolute

(05:08):
sense for us to come together and work closely, you know,
and in the hope that you know, we can actually
share that even wider to our colleagues and coeed schools
that are also obviously educating boys.

Speaker 2 (05:20):
No, it makes a lot of sense. So going back
to these sort of social and identity identity issues that
have been highlighted here, how do you tackle those?

Speaker 3 (05:29):
Yeah? Good, good question. I mean one of one of
the things I'm really loving at the moment is, you know,
I've really gone and spoken to a lot of young
a lot of boys and young men, get their view
on the world and how do they see things, how
do they see where they sit? And I, just as
an aside of shameless plug here, have been putting together

(05:50):
a podcast with young people called Educated Hearts and Minds,
And I interviewed a twenty year old just for that
last week. And just listening to young people talk about
how they view the world, how they view their place
in the world, Actually it does fill me with some
quite a quite high level of confidence that actually the

(06:13):
young people are probably for me a step ahead. At times,
I sometimes think it's the adults, or the stereotypes, or
the focus on real negativity, or that kind of deficit
mindset around our young men that actually is holding back
the whole process. I think there's some real, real gold
nuggets and actually listening to the real positive stuff coming
out as young men and focusing on that and using

(06:37):
that as a vehicle for change, Whereas I probably see,
whether it be through social media or for that man
of mainstream media, you know, we do tend to focus
on the really negative behaviors of a minority. It's a
good and then, you know, I think all of a
lot of young men I speak to feel really frustrated.
You know that they are painted, you know, through that

(06:58):
same lens.

Speaker 2 (07:00):
I'm going to join you with the shameless plugs in
my podcast A Little Things. I spoke to and Andrew Rayner,
who wrote a book called of Boys Better Men than
New Masculinity, and he said, you've got to get in
the trenches with these boys, Steve. You've got to listen
to them, You've got to understand what's going on with
them and what's influencing them.

Speaker 1 (07:18):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (07:19):
So you're so true, And I've read that, read his
pockets outstanding. You're did right. And actually, I think ironically
the answer is by getting in the trenches and listening
to our young men, empowering our young men. You know,
I think that's that's so so important. It's it's a
funny one. It's, what ever, a slightly controversial thing to say,
but you know, I feel, you know, in the last

(07:41):
you ten fifteen, twenty years, maybe then longer. And as
as a father of a daughter, you know, a young woman,
have really had constant messaging, you know, around give it
a go, you can do anything, anything's possible. And I
absolutely see that all the time. I think in sometimes
sometimes the message for boys is kind of the opposite
to that. It's like, don't put your head above the trench.

(08:04):
You just stay under the under the rare. Don't talk
too much attention to yourself. You know, sometimes if you
get it wrong, you're going to be a target. And
I think it's time for us to probably switch that up. Awe.
But by focusing on all that wonderful positive stuff out
there rather than the negative stuff of a very small

(08:24):
minority that I think is holding back a culture, you know,
within young men.

Speaker 2 (08:30):
Look, I know they're not your responsibility, but do you
worry about boys in the co ed schools?

Speaker 3 (08:35):
One hundred percent? Yeah, absolutely, And it's interesting because worry.
I worry. It's to be honest, it's more like I
feel a responsibility to put forward the voices of all
those that are really interested in the growth and development
of young men and sharing that good work rather than

(09:00):
you know, as I say, it's kind of a modern world,
this propensity to really focus on negative stuff a minority,
and there's some great stuff going on. I mean, in boys' schools,
we're probably fortunately, we are fortunate, you know, to have
a target market and the young men that are in
our care I know from previous research that we've done

(09:21):
with Phil Cummings from Circle Education, across across all measures,
you know, boys achieve really well, very well in our boys' schools,
So I think there's a lot of really good work
that's going on. I think one of the things I'm
most excited about is across our network is a real
focus on character education. You know, we know if we

(09:43):
build all that work underneath the surface before we focus
on things like academic outcomes, we get those outcomes rather
than doing it the other way. So it's something that
really excites me, you know. I think for me, I
find boys are incredibly relational relationships sets for boys that
have to have a sense of belonging is huge. You know,

(10:05):
I don't think boys can achieve without connection and belonging,
and I see that on a daily basis. It's the
same thing I hear right across our boys' school network,
and I think, you know, the term we hear a
lot is brotherhood coming from our young men, and I
think there's a real, a real need to feel that

(10:26):
sense of brotherhood before they kind of have that confidence
to talk about their own identity and to really be
confident to give everything one hundred percent.

Speaker 2 (10:35):
A sense of belonging. Steve, Hey, look, thank you so
much for your time this morning. Really nice to talk
to you. That was the principal, Steve Hart, from Saint
Thomas IRV, Canterbury College.

Speaker 1 (10:45):
For more from the Sunday session with Francesca Rudgin, listen
live to news Talks there'd be from nine am Sunday,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.