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April 24, 2025 57 mins

On this episode of “Interesting Times,” Ross Douthat is joined by the Rev. James Martin, a Jesuit priest and an editor of America Magazine, to reflect on the legacy of Pope Francis and the challenges facing the next papacy.

  • 02:20 The First Jesuit Pope
  • 05:23 Google Translate and Exchanging Emails 
  • 06:05 The Visual Element of Francis’s Legacy
  • 07:48 The Concrete Changes Made
  • 16:19 Christian Sexual Ethics
  • 25:22 The Church in the Modern World
  • 27:14 What Kind of Leader Will the Next Pope Be?
  • 31:57 The Latin Mass Controversy
  • 34:54 What Draws People to Christianity?
  • 39:21 What Holds Such a Diverse Church Together?
  • 43:09 The Influence of the Pope and the Hierarchy 
  • 46:41 A Renewed Interest in Religion 
  • 48:30 The Church as a Field Hospital 
  • 49:13 What Father Martin Hopes to See in the Next Pope 
  • 49:59 Where Should the New Pope Go? 
  • 52:27 Who Will Be the Next Pope?

(A full transcript of this episode is available on the Times website.) 

Thoughts? Email us at interestingtimes@nytimes.com.

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