Halloween Special: Terrifying Tales Part One

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
When I think of Halloween
and envision trick or treaters,classic horror
films on the TV and haunted houses,I feel excited that in
and of itself is a reason why we as peoplegenerally like scary stories.
It's not the feeling of fear.
It's that there's a depth of emotionsthat can happen.

(00:23):
Suspense. Anticipation.
It's exciting.
I remember of writing teacher.
I had in eighth or ninth grade
when I was attemptingbut failing to write like Edgar Allan Poe.
Talk about how ghost stories arenot just about trying to scare someone.
Historically, they've helped childrenlearn life lessons and build courage.

(00:45):
And as people sit around a campfiresharing stories
like this,they helped develop a sense of community.
Tonight, in the first of a two partHalloween special,
the tradition of tellingscary stories continues.
Friends have graciously agreed
to share some of their favorite Halloweenstories with us.

(01:08):
This is a study of strange.
Welcome to the first part of her two
part Halloween special, Terrifying Tales.
I'm Michael May.
In this series of episodes,I'm going to have friends and colleagues
share some of their favoritescary stories, and they run the gambit.

(01:28):
There's everythingfor personal paranormal experiences.
There is a short story that's going to beread in in next week's episode.
We even have an account of a UFO sighting,which I'm really excited about.
I do want to make one announcementbefore we get into things here.
I have kind of likean additional Halloween
special episode, which is separatefrom these terrifying tales.

(01:49):
It's an in-depth interviewwith Tom Holland,
not Spider-Man Tom Holland, but horrorfilmmaker icon Tom Holland.
Behind thingslike Thinner and Fright Night and Dylan
Collier's and Child's Play.
And that was really fun.
It was such a thrill to sit down with Tom,talk about his career a little bit,
and also interview him about his brandnew book, Fright Night Origins.

(02:13):
So if you want to hear that, I'mgoing to release it
probably a few days before Halloween.
So subscribe to the show so you can getnotified when that episode drops.
So I don't want to spend too much timedoing housekeeping.
It's beginning of Halloweenspecial episodes, so let's get into it.
Our first story tonight is from my friendNick Peterson, an amazing filmmaker.
He's done these vibrant and creative andkind of crazy in a good way, short films.

(02:39):
He's known for musicvideos and commercials,
and the story he's going to tellis a personal experience
he had on a road trip in the ninetieswith a friend.
And it's quite bonkers.
And I got to say,
if you're listening to these in chunks,make sure to listen after his story,
because I have a follow upwith some research I did on the phenomena

(02:59):
he experi insight,and that's all I'm going to say for now.
Enjoy.
With me right now is Nick Peterson,filmmaker.
What are you what are you best known for?
Is it your music videos or commercials?
You know, and I'm best known forit changes depending on the year.
I used to be best known for short films,then I was best known for car commercials.

(03:24):
Now I'm best known for music videos.
Yeah, for a time
I was best known for feature film stuffand it's like you learn these.
I've learned in my careerthat every three years
or four years you have a newwhat are you best known for?
Of course, and.
I'm just rolling with it.
So right nowit's music videos. That's good, though.
You got to roll with it out here.You got to roll with it in the business.

(03:46):
But you do like scary things.Spooky things.
I know your work pretty welland you do have a an edge,
a visual quality, not it's not lynchian,but there is there is a certain
Nick Peterson styleto things that I appreciate.
And because of that, I did want to ask youto be on this episode
telling scary stories because I was like,Oh, you've got to have something,

(04:08):
even if it's made up.
And sure enough,you responded like you do.
Yeah. When you called me about this.
Yeah, I have a, a very personal,actual experience
that happened that I told my kidsand they didn't believe me at first.
And then I called my friendJosh, who was with me
just unprompted,and Josh told them the same exact story.

(04:29):
Oh, and that's why, like,I know what we saw was real,
because we both saw it at the same time
and we both saw the same exact thing.
If I was by myself,I wouldn't have believed it.
But since we saw this thingtwice in one night
at the same time, both of us,I mean, it's real like this.

(04:52):
It's out there. Okay, so this is legit.
I'm not even making it up.
Yeah, this is legit. And.
And I'm a stone sober kid.
Like,there's no weird drug history in my life.
So this is.
This is real.
And when did it happen and where was it?
Probably 90, 94.

(05:17):
We were in high school and Josh and I,we used to travel a lot.
And his he he had a really sweetwent to like like a a VW bus.
Nice. Night. He had a suite.
He's like the rich kid of the familyor that
he's like the rich kidof the neighborhood.
So he had a sweet Landroverand he flipped it
and it was kill like sevenkids. Oh, my goodness.
But no one died.

(05:38):
And his parents got hima more mediocre car, which is this.
VW was formerly a brand new,so we traveled all over Utah with it.
And one night or one daywe drove down south to Saint George, Utah.
We lived in Provo, Utah, because Joshwanted to hook up with our friend sister
and we'd get to their houseand we cooked chili outside their house

(05:59):
in the van, played some banjo,and the girl never showed up.
And it's around,you know, maybe like 11 p.m.
on a Friday night.
And we're like, What do we do now?
We didn't want to go homebecause that's boring.
So we thought, well,we should drive across the state.
What is drive east from Saint Georgeto Indian Creek, which is on

(06:21):
on the other side of Utah, near Moab.
And it's about a six hour drive.
Okay.
This is before GPS, Google Maps.
We just had a map.
So we're like,
yeah, I went up and it's aroundlike 11:00, maybe midnight this time.
So we one of the gas station we filled upand I,
I know I just said I don't use drugs,which is true.

(06:41):
But we did grab some trucker pillsbecause what.
Are trucker pills?
So they're like, you know, beforeRed Bull, which didn't exist in 95.
Yeah. Yeah.
These little packets of, like,
you know, the trucker pills,they keep you awake, okay?
Because, dude, we had just driven,you know, three and a half hours
from Provo down to Saint George and,you know, a chili and played banjo.

(07:04):
And, you know, it'slike 11:00 at midnight,
we're going to drive across the stateand we don't get into an accident.
But trucker pillsdo not make you see things, right?
But it kept us upso we could survive the drive.
Yeah.
So we're driving along the northernArizona highway that goes east,
which kind of dips in and out of Utah,but mainly stays in northern Arizona.

(07:25):
And we're maybe like an hourand a half, 2 hours in the drive,
and we see this guy on the sideof the road, right middle of nowhere.
There's nothing out there.
This is pastFredonia and a few other places.
And we see this dude and it's,you know, it's weird and he's hitchhiking
and we're driving, driving, driving.
And as we get closer to him, we seethis guy dressed in all denim, right?

(07:50):
Denim pants, denim jacket.
But the dude has no faceand I mean no face.
I'm talking like no eyes,no mouth, no nose.
And he's hitchhiking.
So Josh and I, it's just a joke.
We said, screw women.
And we both said at the same time
as a Josh dude,does that guy not have a face?

(08:12):
And Josh do thatguy had no face and he had no face, right?
So we're freaked outbecause we both saw the same thing
and we're driving, you know, we keep ongoing and I lie to you, not again.
This is maybe 3 hours later.
We saw him again.
Same thing,same outfit, same pose, hitchhiking, same.

(08:35):
No face, dude,
all on the same night.
Okay, so.
So the faceless man appeared two different
places, hours apart on foot, I guess.
Or maybe there's more of them.
I don't know, dude.
So all it was itthe same Jay Leno ask all denim, dude.
Same exact thing, same poselike dumb out the air hitchhiker.

(08:58):
And what was the was the face skin color.
Just skin color.Yeah, yeah. Okay. Oh, yeah. Just.
But it had like a texture to it.
It wasn't like smooth.
It was not like alien smooth, you know?
It's like I was, like, pockmarked.
I mean, we were driving,like, 70 miles an hour.
Yeah, but still, dude. Yeah. Faces, man.
Ooh, you wouldn't want to see thatif you were hiking out there.
Yeah, dude, I swore.

(09:19):
I said, Josh, dude, if I see that guy fora third time, I'm going to run him over.
I'm going to kill this dudebecause this is not a real thing.
But apparently it is.
Now, can I ask, was the hitchhikerwas it moving at all or was it station?
He's standing there. He's standingthere. Could not moving.
Could it have been some sort of cut out,like a promotional thing, like, no.

(09:39):
This is 90 I said this 1995.
And this is this is like a highwaythat nobody goes on.
I forgot the highway number.
Yeah, but it justit starts in Saint George.
It kind of goes to the southernpart of Zion, past
Colorado City, past Fredonia,and just goes out there,
northern Arizona, and eventually goes,you know, it leads you north.

(10:02):
I've been to Utah when you're way east,but now this is not like a highway.
It's like a two lane highway.
This isn't a freeway.
Like nobody is out there, dude.
Yeah, except for this guy.
Like, I bet you like, we probably saw.
I mean, I don't remember exactly,but now I'm thinking about it.
I mean, you don't see anyone driving pastyou either.

(10:23):
I mean, you can drivein the middle of the two lanes
for miles before you ever see anybodyto get over into your lane even.
Yeah. It's not desolatelike there's nothing out there.
I mean,this is obviously had an effect on you
because you've even shared itwith your kids.
Do you have any theories? Do you?
I mean,because you keep calling it a dude,
so you actually think it's like a person.But this is a dude.

(10:44):
This guy was like six feet tall. Like,this wasn't a woman.
No, this was like a guy.
But was itsomething supernatural of some kind?
Like it's in 3 hours apart. No face, dude.
That's what we don't know.
Yeah, we don't.
I mean,I don't think the faceless man has a car.
All right?
So he's just in case I cut around this, I.

(11:04):
Will tell the. Audience that.
Well, I'm just going to say itin case we use part of this.
So Nick has attempted to call his friend
Josh to have Josh also confirmand tell this story.
And he's in a meetingbecause he's a lawyer.
But he did text.
No when when Nick talked tohim about the faceless man.

(11:24):
That's hilarious.
Was calling for a confirmation. Yeah.
But no, but that'sthe thing is I like Josh again.
He's a really smart dude.
Right.
And, you know, smart not to be likea real lawyer that makes money.
Like, we're not making this up.
Yeah, of course. And we both saw it.
It wasn't like. I don't know. Didhe had a nose? No.
It was like the same thing.

(11:46):
Now, the weird thing is, I didI promise about it just recently.
And the guy is like 90%exactly what we saw.
Yeah, that's. It's so weird.
Do you mind sharing thatso I could post it. Oh, I see.
So, yeah, yeah.
I'll probably send him to youand it's just so weird.
Now, the one thing that I didn'tget correct is that the guy did at sunset,

(12:10):
but it was pitch black. Dark.
Yeah.
So I didn't pick up on that one,but the same, like, you know,
like the stature and the face and the eye,maybe like like a more white face, like.
Like ghost white,but now he's, like, fleshy.
There's yeah, yeah, yeah.
I will share that in the show notesand probably posted on social too.
Something like that. Yeah.

(12:31):
Well yeah.
Thank you so much for sharing the story.
That is that's a freaky one.
Yeah.
The whole thing of seeing himtwice is kind of like really sad.
If it was once, we would have been like,pray one time one.
Yeah, I believe.
I mean, not in people believe this one,but I bet you dude,
he's been seen by others. There's no way.
There's no way to.Maybe it's like a group.
I don't know, dude.

(12:52):
It's all like, golly, a faceless.
People live in the desert.
Hey, maybe they listen to the podcast.
If you're a faceless person
living in the desertsomewhere near Arizona, Utah border,
send me an email.
A study of stranger gmail.com.
They'll have these stories about, like,young kids, you know, freaked out.
Yep, yep.

(13:13):
Scaringpeople on the highway again for fun.
No, thank you so much.
That is a that that's a good one.
That is a good story.
I really appreciate you sharing thatbecause that is
that is a good onethat I'm going to be thinking about.
It's going to stick with me,I think, just in my own imagination.
Did this happen over 20 years ago?
And I think of it often.
Oh, man. Life is not. Left now.I believe you.

(13:34):
I believe. I think. Thanks again.
Thanks to you.
Before we moveon, I did a little digging into this
faceless hitchhikerthat Nick Peterson talked about,
because I had I had some theoriesabout what this could be.
Suffice to say,I was doing some research and a faceless
hitchhikeris actually a very common phenomena.

(13:54):
This is actually a thing that many peoplehave experienced late at night.
Generally, from what I found,this happens in the Midwest.
Typically Ohio, it seems to be a bit oflike a local legend.
However, I find it so fascinating
that this is not just
a unique experiencefrom a couple of guys out on a road trip.

(14:16):
So I may have to look into that
more and maybe even do an episodeabout faceless hitchhikers in the future.
Now, moving on, our next storyI'm putting here in the lineup
because it takes place in Utah.
So there's some commonality with location.
And this is from Matt Glass, who is one ofthe greatest people on the planet.
I love Mattand he's also one of the most annoyingly

(14:37):
talented people in the entire world.
And he has
this is kind of like a historical accountof something very strange.
Most importantly, before anything, Matt,
you composed the musicfor a study of Strange, the podcast.
That's correct. Yeah. Yeah.

(14:58):
I like how I just askedthat as a question.
Did you do composed the music?
Yes, Your Honor. Yes, yeah. Very well.
No, no, thank you so much.
And I do include a link to your workin all the show notes of the episode.
So people, if you like the music,check out Matt's work in the show notes.
Yes, please.
Thank you for coming on.
I've been wanting youto come on an episode for a while,

(15:19):
so this is a nice this nice wayto dip your toe in, because apparently
you're going to share a storythat is based on factual research.
Yes, I did research
the it's an audio podcast and no one cantell if I'm doing air quotes or not.
It's true. It's true.
You have to use certain inflectionin your voice. Yes.

(15:41):
So, yeah.
Do you want me to tie anything else upor you just want to dove into it?
What do you want?
I guess we.
Can just dove into. It.
Go for it. Jump on it. Diving in.
Okay. The very top.
I wrote this on my notes.I wrote story for Michael's podcast.
So who.
Okay.
I grew up in Utah,which is a horror story in itself.
Not great.

(16:02):
And Utah, northern Utah near Salt Lakeand a town called Ogden.
And one of theif you've been to Ogden, probably not.
Know.
I've been through Salt Lake and Provoand some other places.
There's been in a number.
Of organs a little bit further NorthJunction City, look at it, doing
the largest peak in Ogden.
I think it's the largest it's called BenLohman.
It's well, most of the Rocky Mountainsgo north to the south.

(16:26):
This is me doing visual aids again.
But Ben Lohman goes east to west.
And so it like kind of intersectswith the mountains a little bit.
Like this, perpendicular. Okay, exactly.
So it kind of stands outwhen you are driving up the I-15,
check your Google Maps.
Ben Lohman It's like, yeah, I guessit's the most noticeable thing in Ogden

(16:46):
and Ogden, Utah, is it used to be calledJunction City because, you know,
Promontory Point where thethey're building a railroad
from the West Coast and the East Coastand they met together.
Oh, okay.
Which is a thing. And then they met inUtah is Promontory.
Yeah I'm entry point and it it's not rightbut like any train that was crossing,
the United Stateshad to come through Ogden, Utah.
So it was like Junction City.

(17:07):
And I wondered if perhaps it wasn'tjust a junction for trains,
but perhaps a junction between worlds.
Don't they don't.
Put like put mymusic right there. It's to.
Get. I'll make a queue for it.
Thank you.
But now in the early 1800s,
this is before any white folksthat really settled in the area.

(17:29):
People would go there as to trap.
But it wasn't a river valley settlement,so it was big business
for trappingand fur trading and stuff like that.
But Ben Lowman wasn't such.
It wasn't a placepeople went to for trapping.
Most of the trapperswere terrified of that place.
It kind of had this weird.
There were just a lot of interesting myths
and stuff that people talked aboutin the Ben Lomond area.

(17:51):
Was a lot of talks about how the woodswould mock them and that laugh like repeat
them, their voices at them and they'd hearsounds and horrible, scary things
and that it would scare trappers,I guess I'd be pretty bad to scare trap.
So the big fur traders found it badfor business, apparently from what I read.
So I can rememberthe name of this trapping company.
But they said for every five of their men

(18:11):
that they would enterthat woods only four would leave,
and the survivors would talk abouthow confusing the canopy was
because it was so thick, the trees andtheir compasses wouldn't work properly.
How they'd hear, like if someone got lost,
they would hear their friendyelling and calling their names.
So they would call back, tryto find the guy like, Hey, I'm over here.

(18:32):
But every time they would yell at him,his voice would get quieter and quieter
until he was just gone.
And that was bad for business.
So for traders decided not to trade there.
But in 1945, there was a man called Miles
Goodyear who actually built the first fortin Ogden.
He was kind of the founder of Ogden,I guess, even though it was founded
later on. Doesn't matter.

(18:53):
Do you know what? I didn't.
Did you say 1945. 1845.
80? Okay.
Just to clarify, in two.
Thousand five, when Utah was.
No. Yeah, I forgot to mentiona funny thing about Ben
Lowman is one ofthe founders of Paramount is from there.
And it's thought that Paramount Mountainwas based on Ben Lomond.
He like Drew.
Ben Lomond the thing things like

(19:13):
this is what our logo should be interest,which is something my dad would say
all the time, was like,no, Ben Lomond as the Paramount logo.
Anyway, to give you an idea.
So in 1845,a man called Miles Goodyear who built Fort
what if in the Buenaventura, which was thelike the founding area of Ogden,
he was a trapperand he was successful there.

(19:33):
While everybody else would failor was scared of it,
somehow he was able to doit, never had any trouble, never got lost.
But he was a loner, sopeople would be like, How did you do that?
Let me come with you
and see how you're doing this and be like,No, I have to do this alone.
I have to travel alone.
And because of that solitude,people started to spread rumors
that he made a deal
with whatever this horrible demonor ghost was that was in the woods.

(19:53):
And those rumors were also badfor business for him
because nobody wantedto buy his first furs.
So it didn't really work out thatwell for him either.
Even though he wasn't killed by the woods,it did end up kind of running his career
and time passed.
People got lost in those words
again, over and over againat the base of Ben Lomond.

(20:15):
But it was so infrequentlythat nobody, like, made the connections.
It's just like people get lost sometimes,
but it kind of happens the same way.
Like a child gets lost in the woods,like the trappers
and their family would come to the rescuescreaming out their names,
and they'd hear the kids crying,what with each response to cry,
we get quieter and quieteruntil there was nothing.
And then on August 27th, in 1962,there was an eight year

(20:37):
old named Michael Taylor, who doesn'thave your last name everywhere.
And according to articlesfrom the time he loved to play hide
and seek with his friends,
but he would only play outsidebecause he was claustrophobic
and he wasn't good at hiding indoorsbecause of that.
And so he would wantto play outside all the time.
And he hid really well.
And on August 27th,he went out with his friends, hid.

(21:01):
They looked for him for several hours,couldn't find him.
And so their kidswent home to their families
and we went to play in the woods.He's hiding.
He's doing a great jobbecause we don't know where he is.
But and then so the families and policeand local authorities got together
and they entered the woods.
His mother, of course, was leadingthe charge, screaming out his name,
hoping to find him, you know, screamingso much that she couldn't speak at all.

(21:24):
And then days went by without finding him.
Three days went by because on August 30ththere was an earthquake,
one of the largest recordedin Utah history.
And as the dust settled,everybody collected themselves.
Young Michael walked out of the woods.
Seven miles from where he was, lost,exhausted and malnourished,

(21:45):
his mother was told,and she went to the hospital to meet him.
And when she entered the hospital room,he started screaming at her,
yelling at her to get away.
He said, I'm sorry I chased you.
I'm scared of the dark, things like that.
And just like she couldn't be in the roomwith him and according to him,
when he talked to the police,he was running through the woods
chasing his mother,who kept calling out his name.

(22:05):
But she
she just kept callingand he would get closer,
he thought,but then her voice would be further away.
And then she entered a cave, he said,and he was too afraid to enter the cave
because of his claustrophobia.
So he just waited outside, hopingshe would emerge.
He told the police that she was so mad.This is a kid thing.
He said she was so madthat she shook the earth.

(22:25):
And so he blames his motherfor the earthquake or earthquake.
And so he just ran away
and I think the local newspaperwrote articles about it.
And people, you know, the myths about theBen Lomond Forest, people knew about it.
So a couple of like enthusiastsread the stories, maybe talked to the kid.

(22:48):
It didn't go into that much detail,
but they tried to retrace his stepsand they found the cave,
apparently where he was.
They assume and in the mouth of that cave,they found some old bone fragments,
but they couldn't go any further becausethe inside of the cave had collapsed,
I guess from the earthquake. Oh, yeah.
I don't know what was in that cave.
Nobody knows what was in that cave. But

(23:10):
and who knows what the kid, you know,it was might not be the right cave.
Who knows with what the cave was talkingabout, what's going on. But
I looked up that in
18 known sorry, 1987at the University of Utah,
a couple of studentsdid a study of the area just knowing these
like old myths and stuff,and they used sound mapping equipment.
And this is the bestthat I could understand it.

(23:31):
Like they would measure the time it tookfor like their pings to bounce
off the mountains and stuff like that,like echo location type stuff.
And they discovered this weird phenomenon,apparently
because of the composition of the rocksand the weird L-shape of the mountains.
It's like a parabola type curve.
Okay, that's the way the BenLomond hit the other Rocky Mountains

(23:55):
created this weird, sophisticatedacoustic filter that carried sound
to one specific point on the hillside,which is surrounding that cave.
So the echoes would it's like those soundmachines that they use at football games.
So yeah, yeah,machine went all into the same point.
So when the kid was lost
or any of these people were lost,for example, the kid

(24:15):
his mother would call to himand he would hear her voice
coming from somewhere else.
So she was trying to find him
and that attempt to save himwas pushing him further and further away.
Away. Until he found himself at the cave.
And so, I mean, the soundshe hoped would save him
brought him closer to death and starvationand the cave.
I wrote that for some reason on their kit.

(24:39):
So there's like science behindwhat could have possibly been.
But like, it's clear that
you can read it as like the mountain
feeding on love and support from peoplelooking for lost people in the woods,
which is the I think the trapperfrom the beginning of the story.
His secret was anobody cared where he was hunted.

(24:59):
Nobody cared about himbecause his hands were silent.
He had no issue because the mountain,the mountains don't want loners.
Yeah. So that's
so if you wanna go in the mountains,
don't have any friends, at least.
At least those mountains.
So did you hear about this growing up?
Is that what you thought of thisor is this something you came about later

(25:22):
up later. The Justin Theroux research.
Yeah. Nice, nice.
Oh, that's that's really cool.
It's got the history.
It's got the local law and legends,and it's got the science behind it.
It has all the elements
to a very good, strange talethat's like the kind of thing
I would cover in the show.

(25:43):
So I really appreciate thatthat's I'm going to look it up.
Can you send me a link to some of that?
Well, you can.
I can check it out.
Yeah. Or not cut this out.
But I made up the entire thing completely.
So you're not going to be ableto find articles on this? You
I am going to keep that in.
I think that's really important to have.

(26:04):
No, that was that's amazing.
Is it actually it sets up really like alike a local law type thing.
That's really. Yeah.
I tried to build it aroundactual ideas about the mountain
or like scientificthings like Ben Loehmann's real.
The people I discuss are real,not the kid who got lost,
but I'm sure somebody got lost somewhere.Oh, of course.
It's definitely a phenomenon where, like,mountain mountain echoes oddly

(26:27):
so if people are,
it can make it difficult to locate someonebecause of where they are.
Just the way. Sound, sound.
And the earthquake was a real thing.
Oh, my gut.
Matt. Matt, sorry.
Have you got me? Guys, I'm sorry.
Happy Halloween, indeed.
No, I love it.
Thank you for for doing that.
I really appreciate the twist.
The twist the the twist of the storyis that the story doesn't exist.

(26:50):
The only thing I'm disappointed about is
I literally was going to golike of research this tonight
because that's what I do for funis, look, these things up.
And I would have been like,where did you hear this?
Like, I can't find any.
Yeah.
I must be really good at researchbecause I found.
Yeah.
Now, before you go, we can,we can plug some stuff for you.
Obviously you're a musician.

(27:11):
Links for that are in the show notes,but you also are the co-director
of Goes to the Ozarks.
And we had Jordan on a few episodes ago.
Oh yeah, I heard that, that episode.
Well, thank you for listening.
And people can find that movie for rentpretty much everywhere Goes to the Ozarks,
which you co-directed.
And you also wrote and co-directeda movie called Squirrel, which is on to be

(27:32):
right now.So that's. Correct. Yeah, people watch.
Those. Things, check that out.
Check out Mac Metz work, Mr.
Glass. Yeah, well, thank you so much.
Thank you.
Anything else you want to add to my inmy skipping over or anything in my jump?
It's just.Have a good time. You know, good men.
Look me up on Spotifyif you want to listen to stuff.
Yes, please do.

(27:53):
All right. Thanks so much.Talk to you soon.
Thank you.
Well, met definitely got me on that.
He was dropping all sorts of hintsthat he had made that story up.
And I didn't pick any of them up.
But that was awesome.
So next we have Simon Kissel
who runs a production company on the EastCoast called Magic Doug Productions

(28:15):
and their mission is to empower womenand other marginalized artists.
And Simon is going to read a short storyfrom a writer.
She works with.
Hi, Simon.
Thank you so much for being on and thank.
You so much for having me.
You're in New York, right?
Yes, I'm just north of New Yorkin Stamford, Connecticut.

(28:38):
Okay.
So you're all the way from the East Coastjoining us.
So you're goingto read a story to us today.
So can youcan you tell us a little bit about it
or does that give too much awayto say anything about it?
I don't want to give anything away,but I can tell you that
it's written by my resident writerat my production company,

(28:59):
and she's based in Scotland,originally from America.
So she's got a really exciting and unique
perspectiveon some American things in Scotland.
Oh, that's amazing.
This is the devil's pulpitby Alexandra Grunberg,
and it was originally published in Talesfrom the Moonlit Path.
Lottie Split slipped on the wetred clay coated step

(29:20):
and she supposedthis was something resembling fun.
That was what her mother demanded, thatshe do something resembling fun.
She also demanded that Lottiemake a few friends,
but all she could managewas this outdoor adventure group.
These people were not quite her friends.
No matter how many hill walksthey triumphantly concluded
or hidden waterfalls they discovered.
But maybe there was somethingresembling friends.

(29:42):
And when your leggings were streaked withthick red mud, that was all you needed
here, said Dahlia.
Reaching out her arm is a natural handrailfor Lottie to write herself.
It happens to everyone.
Don't trust the stone steps.
It's easierif you walk a little to the side.
Thanks for the tip, said Lottie.
She followed in his footsteps,placing her boots in the muddy imprints
that found natural support

(30:03):
beside the staircasethat brought them further from the light,
but closer to the thrillingsound of rushing water.
She was pleased to see that
Dahlia was also wearing unfashionablewellies that went up to her knees.
They seemed incongruous on a young womanwith a half shaved head of black hair
and twin piercings embedded on eithercheek and along the curve of her ears.
They belonged more on an uncertainpostgraduate who thought she had

(30:25):
the ability to explore Scotland on her ownand found out quickly that she did not.
She needed someone elseto drive on the left side of the road.
Do you need help down?
As Byron already reaching up to her blacknailed hands, offering a strong support,
somebody did not landso hard on the jagged rocks.
Dahlia was already taking pictures on herphone.
Wendler and Markushad their arms around each other,

(30:47):
long blue hair and tangling with a spikyshort red crop as they tipped their heads
back to take in the immense gorgethey just called down to explore.
Lottie snapped her jaw shutwhen she noticed it was hanging open,
but she could do nothing about her wideawestruck eyes.
The rocks rose high on eitherside of them, split by rushing dark water
that shone red in the shallows where lighthit the pebbles of the river floor

(31:10):
and black, where it will departbefore racing off between between the deep
greenvegetation covered rock falls around them.
Purple flowers sprouted from the green,but quietly, in a way
that meant Lottie could only knowthat they were there
without being able to point them outto memorialize in a photo,
which she could not bring herselfto pull out her cell phone from her park.
I know, said Byron, smiling.

(31:31):
Know what?
It's hard to take a picture, he said.
Feels like it would cheapen it, take awaysome of the magic.
He was right.
Lottie blushed,slipping a hand through her brown hair.
Her mother did not demand thatshe leave it natural, but Lottie assumed
she would be mad
if she shaved any part of her heador mess with colorful hair dyes.
Taking a picture doesn't ruin the magic.

(31:52):
Whispered Byron,like he was sharing an important secret,
though from the waywhen Ella and Markus smirked at her,
it was obvious he was not being quietenough to be much of a secret.
The magic is here.
We come or not.
Everyone get together, demanded Dahlia.
Lottie found herself squeezedbetween Byron and Wendler, a black opal
ringed finger resting on her shoulder.
A tarot card themed necklace diggingthrough the layers of shirts and numbers.

(32:16):
Lottie was chilly,but one doula had already stripped off
her jacket, showing off a watercolor styletattoo on her upper arm of a woman
in a flowing robe acrossand a moon floating above her head.
A pentagram suspendedbeneath, went to the beach.
Her mother also demandedshe find a nice stretch to attend.
Instead, Lottiehad found this group of hill walkers
who would never set footin a house of organized religion.

(32:38):
They preferred to adorn themselveswith their favorite religious esthetics
while they debatedthe corrupting influence of power
as they walked apparently unwanted upthe sloping paths of Scottish
hills that Lottie suspectedwere actually small mountains.
Dahlia took the pictureand gave an approving smile,
lower lip split by a silver ring.
Lottie letterheadfell back and stared up at the jagged rock
edges, dripping water that trickledusually to the river at their feet.

(33:01):
The gurgling of the streamcatching and skipping over large stones
and around the fallen tree branchesthat formed a makeshift
bridge to the shoreon the other side of the gorge
sounded like whispering an incantation.
Lottie wished Dahlia wouldput her phone away if she closed her eyes.
It was almost like she stepped backin time or threw a veil to another world,
far away from cell phones

(33:22):
and smirks and demands to act in waysthat meant nothing to her.
But this place something to her.
This was the kind of placeshe wanted to find.
So this is the devil's pulpit?
She asked, opening her eyes
only when Lola was still beside her,eyeing the water like a poisonous serpent.
As the other three adventurers flashedthrough the carrot with careless abandon.

(33:44):
Byron and Marcusdid not wear appropriate footwear,
and they did not seem to mind theirSO boots and socks.
No, we have to wait to the pulpit, saidGwendolyn, glancing enviously
at Lottie's boots.
But it's notthat far. We've all been here before.
Lottiewas not sure if that was an accusation,
and she did not have timeto interrogate the comment
because Wendel was already hoppingfrom a fallen log to slightly protruding,

(34:05):
stepping stone arriving on the other side,surprisingly dry.
Lottie followed in her steps,glad to have a path to follow
and glad to be here uniform and being herewith people who only resembled friends.
She did not need friends,but she did this.
This water, this red clay and Black River,this green growth accented purple.

(34:26):
She needed thismore than she needed to breathe.
And as she followed the groupalong the shallow edge where the water met
the side of the gorge,she had to remind herself to breathe.
Her efforts were rewardedwith the smell of earth and growing like
in something thick and almost sourand welcoming, but pleasant nonetheless.
Magic it must have been magic.

(34:46):
And Lottie smiled.
And then she could see it.
It was not a terribly large stonelike the overwhelming sides of the gorge,
but it was an odd stonegrowing out of the rocky base
and a series of layers red and brown,white and gray.
Dahlia scrambled on top of itand tossed fire in her phone,
a reckless act considering the waterthat cascaded beside her.
But he caught it without difficulty.

(35:07):
Take my picture, she laughed.
Byron obliged.
And then when Bella and Marcuswere climbing up the pulpit to the base.
It was clearly not meant to holdso many people.
Lottie walked through the water,nearly falling into the current,
holding her legs, demandingthat she follow its meaty design.
But she managed to resist the poleand step from submerged stone
to submerge stone

(35:27):
until she reached a small perch
on the other side of the water, awayfrom the pulpit and the laughing group.
There was a waterfall here.
Again, not large, not imposing,but inspiring all the same in the way
it turned from brown to black to bubbling
white like spit catchescatching at the edges of the gaping mouth.
Lottie shot a dahlia
and she dropped her attention
from the waterfall to the five figurescrowding together at the top of the rock,

(35:51):
muddy leggings pressingagainst a metal studded belt, black
fingernails curling around an estheticallypleasing but meaningless tattoo.
Take our picture.
Lottie unzippedher pants and pulled out her cell phone.
What?
Careful. Didn't Dahlia
more aware of how the currentcould sweep anything it wanted away?
She crouched down to get a better.
A better angle to capture the momentand the lovely scenery around them.

(36:12):
She clicked and clicked again.
She captured the magic in the small,invasive square of technology,
locking in the image of the red stoneand green walls.
Dahlia Byron Wendler.
Marcus and the fifth figurehad joined them on the rock.
Dahlia was the first on the pulpitto see the new member of their group,
though she felt him before she saw him.

(36:33):
The sharp black nails digging into the artso meticulously
pierced on her arm,now dripping in a splash of red.
The others did not seem to be able to moveas they fell under his fire.
Hot eyes and piercing claws.
One by one,their feet planted on the pulpit.
Their mouths gaping, silent screens.
And through itall, Lottie took picture after picture,

(36:55):
keen to completethe act that Dahlia demanded she perform.
Her mother
demanded that she go to church,get a good education, make friends.
But most importantly, she demanded thatLottie go as far away from her as possible
and take the darknessshe attracted with her.
Lottie had flown across an oceanto an island across the Atlantic,
and she wished she could tell her motherwhat Byron knew that the magic was there,

(37:18):
whether Lottie was or not,whether anyone was or not.
It did not matterthat Lottie was so far away from the woods
that she used to explore at nightoutside their house
with its own unwelcoming,doesn't smell magic.
Was still there, waiting for no one,insisting on its own.
It did not matterif Lottie was here or not.
There was magic in the devil's pulpit,
thoughshe smirked as she admitted to herself.

(37:40):
The magic might not have manifestedso directly if she had just stayed
locked in her former room.
Instead of traveling with a bunchof ignorant adventurers to chase fun,
the eyes of the adventurers now havefallen from the rock looked so shocked.
Lottie could not help but laugh.
The sound did not echo.
It was swallowed by the thick green plantsand the hiding hints of purple.
Why should they be so surprised?

(38:02):
What kind of sermon did they expectto receive at the devil's pulpit?
Lottie unzipped her packto put away her phone,
but her cold, numb fingers lost gripand it dropped into the water.
She sighed, frustrated,but not overly upset.
When you went to places like this,you risked a certain amount of loss.
She waited back through the water andalmost envied her discarded, not friends.

(38:24):
At least she did not have to attemptto make their way up the stairs alone.
She hopped up the first few
steps and then had to grab her tootingrocks and roots to hoist herself up.
Her foot slipped
as she belatedly remembered thatshe should not trust the obvious steps
that she would have looked forthe foot made path next to the steps.
But it did not matter.
A cold hand supported her backbefore she could fall very far.

(38:44):
The claws surprisingly gentle as theypressed into the fabric of her jumper
for one moment, she let her weightfall back, let her body be supported
by this phantom hand, by this creatureshe did not dare to name,
but thought might be somethingresembling a friend.
Then she reached for a branchand pulled herself up,
leaving the figure behind her.

(39:08):
Nice.
So you mentioned Redd at the top of that,
that this was originally from Talesfrom the Moonlit Park.
Is that what your pamphlet. Pathtells from the moonlit path?
And what is that?
It's a horror, dark fictionand speculative fiction online magazine.
Okay.
That's what I was hoping would be.
That's all set up later.
Yeah. And tell us Alex's name again.

(39:30):
Alexandra Grunberg.
Alexandra.
Alexandra, I spelled normally Grunberg.
Are you and RG nice.
And what made you think of that.
Like what is your connectionto this story?
Did you just like itor were you searching for something?
I'm a horror filmmakerand one of the things that I really like
is this concept of horror,the horror things or the horror

(39:52):
tropes, potentially being your friend.
Like just because they're spookyor they're monstrous
doesn't mean they're evil.
And that in most content that's horrorbased, it's like this spooky thing,
it's evil.
And I like the idea of communingwith the quote unquote evil spirit
at the devil's
pulpit and finding something familiar,something more familiar to her
than the people she hikes withand her own mother.

(40:14):
And finding kind of a kinship there.
I just think it's I likewhen my horror is also cute and sweet.
Yeah. Yeah, me, too.
I like when horror just triesto do something different.
You know, that's my main thing.
And also,
horror can can exist in so manydifferent levels and it can mean so much
and it can be metaphorsfor so many things.
So I really appreciate thethe story and Alex's work.

(40:37):
And do you want toplug anything about yourself before we go?
Is there anything you want?
I do want to have people find youon Instagram to find some of your work.
What do you what do you want?
Yes, thank you.
I would love to plugmy business magic on Productions.
We've got a couple of featurefilms out on video on demand platforms
like TV and Amazonand Roku and Kings of Horror.
And the one that we're most proud ofand most excited about is called Bugs

(40:59):
the Trilogy.
It's a four and feminist horroranthology movie,
sort of in the style of the 1975trilogy of Terror.
It's out there for free,
if you like, to see womennot be only the victim in horror.
That's out there.
And then we also have a couple of shortsthat will be premiering on shorts
TV in the next couple of weeks.
Hopefully the magic of this across socialsand our films,

(41:20):
our books, the trilogy and houseon video on demand platforms.
Thank you.
Yeah,thank you so much. I'll talk to you soon.
Always a pleasure. Thank you, Michael.
Moving on, we're
going to wrap up the show with threedifferent people sharing some stories
of paranormal or allegedparanormal experiences they had.
First up is Curtis Anderson, an actorand an old friend of mine.

(41:43):
And he's going to share some stories
of a house he lived in as a kidand also some experiences as an adult.
Curtis's entire interview,full of even more paranormal experiences
than he's going to share here,is going to be available on patriotic,
as we actually talked about a lot
of things he experienced and, it was justtoo long to include in the episode,
so be sure to check that out.

(42:04):
You can find that on our website.
A Study of strange rt.com.
And now here's Curtis.
It's a real pleasure to be here.
Thank you for having me.Where do you want to start?
Is that the house you livedin? In Milwaukee? Is that right?
Yeah, I think I think there's probably
a little bit of contextthat needs to be laid out a little bit.
And it's important to knowthat I have a deep family history

(42:26):
with unusual phenomena,
and I should start right off the batby saying you and I are in agreement.
As far as being skepticswho are ready to ready
to experience somethingand ready to be ready to be convinced.
Right.
But when I was younger,
because of what I went through as a child,I was really into the paranormal.

(42:51):
In fact, when I grew up, I thought I wasgoing to be a paranormal investigator.
And back in the lateeighties and early nineties,
you see Irvine actuallyused to have a course in parapsychology.
You could get a degree in that.
So when I was in junior high, I was like,That's what I'm going to major in.
That's where I'm going to go,blah, blah, blah.

(43:11):
Now, of course, as you get olderand you learn more things, all of a sudden
you're like,Wait a minute, now, orbs are bugs.
Like, you know what I mean?
Like all of them,all of a sudden, things that were romantic
and mysterious all of a suddenbecome extraordinarily mundane.
So I kind of lost that.
But it doesn't change the fact
that all of these things actually happen.

(43:31):
So I will preface this by sayingEverything I tell you is exactly how
I remember it happening, and there aren't
really good answers for any of it.
So I used to live in Milwaukee,Wisconsin, and
and the house that we livedin was one of the oldest on the block.

(43:52):
And It was a
two bedroom, one bath, basement, an attic.
The basement was finishedbecause you could do that in the Midwest.
And the attic was onethat you could stand up and walk it.
So it was essentiallylike a three story house.
But everything you livedin was on the main floor.
And my parents had weirdthings happen in that house all

(44:15):
the time.
We we were
putting we had a walk
in closet in the bedroomthat my sister and I shared.
And we were putting hooks insidethe closet to like hang stuff up on.
And so my dad was going to the walllooking for studs.

(44:37):
And while he was knocking,he knocked shave and a haircut.
Oh, yeah.
And then through the wall, we heard
just to reply to slow response knocks
and we thought it was my mom.
So we ran out of the room to go get her
and there was nothingon the other side of the wall.

(45:00):
She was in fact in the basementdoing laundry
in the laundry roomso she could not have responded.
And that was really weird.
And as a kid, seeing your parents facesget really concerned
out of nowherefor something simple that you thought was
simple, that sticks withyou, that sticks with you.

(45:20):
In the basement, there was
an office that had like accordion doorsto separate it out.
It wasit was a lot of house for what it was.
And my parents always told meto not go in there,
mostly because it was my dad's officeand he's an engineer.
So there was like there werethere were sharp things.

(45:41):
There were soldering irons.
There was there was stuffthat I could hurt myself on.
But I always felt likethere was something in that room.
And so I told my parents
that I was scaredof the vampire in that room.
And one day I went down
into the the basement by myself.

(46:02):
And you might be too youngfor this, Mikey,
but do you remember the clip clop horses?
They were plastic horses on springs,and you would ride them and.
Oh yeah, in front of grocery storesand stuff like that.
No, it was, it was actually for home.
So it was something that you could doand you put a nine volt battery
and it would make clip clop noisesas you bounced on it.

(46:24):
Okay. Okay. Well,
as I was going
downstairs, all of a sudden,my clip clop horse started flip flopping
and I ran up the stairs
past my mom, and she was like,What happened?
And I said, Nothing,nothing. Everything's fine.
She went downstairs and saw the horsebouncing

(46:47):
as as as she got closer to itbefore it stopped.
So that was that was freaky.
And then
there was the time I was in the bathroom.
I'm, you know, six years old.
The way the house worked wasit was a bedroom,

(47:10):
a small hallway with a bathroomin the middle, and then the other bedroom,
and then directly across from the bathroomwas the kitchen.
And I was brushing my teeth
and my mom called me from the kitchenand I responded to her.
But when I looked back at the mirror,
my reflection was still brushingits teeth.

(47:34):
Oh, and that's. That's interesting.
That made me afraid of mirrorsfor a good couple decades.
Yeah.
I never didBloody Mary as a child because.
Because that, that sticks with you. Wow.
Wow. That's not one of the typical
sort of tropes of personal experiences.

(47:56):
You don't hear somethinglike that very often. It,
it, it's even talking about it now.
Yeah.
It, it, it just triggersall, all the, all the goose pimples.
It's, it's it wasit was really, really freaky.
That house was scary.It was just kind of scary.

(48:17):
And their other things that we kind of
have to remember as a family.
But I don't talk about as much anymorebecause
I can ignore or disregarda lot of the other things.
Like there used to be strange lights.
There would be times when we would be outin the backyard at night

(48:39):
and we look inside the house
and you would see like what looked likefireflies flying around in the room.
It could have actually been fireflies,you know what I mean?
Weird knocks, which could be anything.
There were.
There were times when I was convincedthere was something outside my window
which made me very nervous about windowsfor a very long time.
But that can just bea scared kid, you know? Yeah.

(49:01):
The stories I just
told you were the visceral memories.
So how long did you guys livein that house, do you know?
Yeah, we were there from 78 to 85.
Okay.
But starting in starting in 83, my parentswere looking for a place to move to.
Mm hmm.
And and then my dadgot transferred to California,

(49:23):
and that ended up being the saving gracebecause.
Yeah, because that's when.
That's when we were actually ableto get out far away.
Yeah.
Far, far, far away again.
Half the country away.
So, so your next bit of informationor stories happened in Edinburgh
and I imagine this is probablywhen you're an adult, is that correct?

(49:45):
Correct. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
So this is interesting then,because now we get to hear some
we get to hear some memoriesfrom the childhood
and now some stuff as an adultand especially in Edinburgh,
which is kind of like historicallya very spooky city, you know?
Spooky. It's spooky, right?
Like you'repredisposed to wanting to be scared.
And to be fair, a lot of these things

(50:08):
were on toursthat were also adding to the spookiness.
But I understand this, you
setting the mood,getting the vibe going and and just,
you know, getting ready to trigger folksso they have a really strong reaction.
So of immune to that part.
So everything I'm going to tell you aboutis the stuff that I truly can't explain

(50:30):
and that I saw with my own eyes.
We did the Edinburgh Ghost Tour,which I highly recommend.
It's a lot of fun.
It's a spooky city,it's got lots of stories
and they have these vaultsunderneath the city
that are amazingand you can tour them to this day.

(50:50):
You can do a regular tourand you could do The Ghost tour.
Of course I did the Ghost Tour.
We go in via
you go in via one of the main plots in
in like on the high road,which is which is old town downtown.
And it's a big gated thing.

(51:12):
It's meant for a lot of trafficand it's underneath an office building.
And we got in to the loading lobby
and the, the,
the guide
started telling us
all the prep stories and it's just kind oflike, okay, forget it, you're late.

(51:34):
And I was like, Buddy, like,I was ready for
I was ready for like the fogand organ music.
But all of a suddenwe start hearing a noise above us
and it sounded like
a chairbeing dragged across a wooden floor.
That's easy to brush off. It's a chair.
It gets a wooden floor.
And and so the host is like,

(51:58):
but there's no one above us, really.
And it's like,Sure, buddy, sure, sure, sure, sure.
So the tour hadn't
started yet,so a couple of us without to go look.
Sure. Off
you could see inside the areathat was directly above the lobby.
We saw the chairin the middle of the floor

(52:21):
and there wasn't anybody in the room.
The lights were off.
It was done.
So unless they were super fastand they would have to be very,
very fast because it's not like we werewe weren't minutes away.
We were seconds away.
Yes. Up the stairs.
And now and it wasn't a very big room.
It's not like
it had a lot of exits or anythingand the front door was definitely locked
because a lot of those old buildings,they have to chain closed.

(52:44):
So it isn't just it isn't just in and out.
There was nobody there
and there was a chair just dragged
to the middle of the floor.
That's the easy one.
We're continuing the tour
and they're setting us up there likethere's a little boy who's in the thing

(53:06):
and and sometimespeople get pictures with him.
So people were taking picturesall over the place
and then somebody got pelted with a stone
and and it was a blond, a blond American.
And she got hit with with a little pebblein the back of her head.
She turned out she was like,what the hell?

(53:27):
And we all turned around
and we actually saw and handed God
actually saw little stones flying
across the room.
To this day,
I, I don't know, I just,I just saw them go
and they came at us, several of them.

(53:49):
And the host was just like,apparently he doesn't want us here.
We should probably just move on.
And so we did.
That was freaky that way,but it was also really, really neat.
It was really, really neatbecause at that point when you see things
move on their own, you're like, Oh, that,that is not something.

(54:13):
I understandthat somehow physics has changed
in this small areaand, and and it's enough.
It was enough to to pelt us withwith like 6 to 8 little stones.
That was freaky.
Those are amazing stories.
That definitely are unexplainable.

(54:34):
You know, as of as of right now, it's.
The it's the reason why they stick with meso hard.
It's because
how does that work?
I appreciate you sharing storiesthat were very personal to you.
Thank you so much for doing this, Curtis.
We'll talk soon and yeah, it was great.
Thank you so much.
Truly my pleasure.

(54:54):
I I'm happy to be back at a time.
Oh. Oh, 1/2.
I forgot to say,where can people find you?
What do you what do you wantto put anything out there?
Absolutely. So
people can find me
on the Instagrams, which is whereI actually spend most of my time.
And that's Curtis Anderson and RCN.
And also look for me and Mikey

(55:16):
in Squirrel on to B2Bthat's playing right now.
Yeah. So yeah yeah and yeah.
Nice, nice. I got it.
I got like a partial plug myselfout of that.
So that's great.
I'm just sad.
One team, one goal, man.
One team, one goal. Lift everybody up.
Well,thank you again. I'll talk to you soon.
All right. Thanks, man.

(55:37):
Next up, we have actor Ana Lily, who,similar to Curtis,
lived in a house for a period of timein her childhood in the Midwest.
That wasn't quite normal.
And as entire interview is also available
on Patreon as an exclusive episode,so be sure to check that out.
Hi, andthank you so much for coming on the show.

(55:59):
Yeah, of course. Thank you for asking.
So you are going to tell usabout some experiences
you had in a couple of housesgrowing up. Yes.
So I'mguessing these are like a paranormal
or could be paranormal activityin a way. Yes.
Oh, this is exciting.
Yeah.
The first house, howwe came to live in these houses is there.

(56:23):
My grandma, my grandpa's house.
And he lived in this old housein the corner of town.
And we were building a house
and the sale of our like our house,we were living in went really quick.
And so we didn't have anywhere to live.
So we moved inwith my grandpa and his house

(56:45):
before living in there.
I always just had like I just feelingwhen you're in the house, it was just like
like you could feelthat there is something else there
in his garage when he moved
in, he found like a trap door in becausethey converted the garage into a bar.

(57:06):
And so there's like carpet andstuff there, but you could pop it open.
And when you go down in there,it's like this whole
other world underneath the garage.
Yeah. And he found some, like,interesting stuff in there.
Some really old stuff, a doll shoes,a key, like, just random little things.
But every time he'd go down to show

(57:27):
people this, things would be moved around
or things would be missing,and then they would appear back.
And the only people who knew about
this was family,but nobody else at that time lived there.
So we moved in and
my parents had a room upstairsand my older sister and I, we were young.

(57:47):
We had to sleep on the couchin the living room.
And we
I thought it was a dream until my sisterstarted talking about it the next day.
And then I realized that herand I saw the same thing.
We woke up in the middle of the nightand there was a little boy
standing at the bottom of the stairsstaring at us,
and he looked to be in like older clothes,like a jacket.

(58:12):
He had a hat on, but he hadhe was holding a rifle
that had like a spear at the end of it.
And I was just like, I saw it and Iwas like, no pain rolled over to the end.
So I wasn't looking and I'm like,I just yeah, I just thought it a dream.
And then the next morningmy sister woke up
and was telling my dad about this boyshe saw.

(58:34):
And my dad's like, okay, whatever.
So then from there, otherlittle things would happen and you kind of
just are like, I don't know,think it would be sitting in the kitchen
and the paper towelwould just start unrolling
and it wasn't like a breeze caughtand it kept.
It was just like it would rolland then I'd roll more.

(58:57):
It was likesomebody was sitting there playing with it
in the bathroom that was right offthe kitchen.
You'd be using the bathroomin the paper towel roll would just start
unrolling the same way.
And it's like
you're trying to justifywhy it's happening,
but it's just happening there.

(59:17):
One day when my dad,
he used to be a hairdresser,we were standing in the dining room
and he was doing my hair and my grandpahad this massive dining room.
And with these really tall back chairsthat do tip over easily,
but they need to be pushed to tip over.
And we were just standing thereand one by one the chairs just started

(59:42):
falling, like somebody was walkingbehind them and just pushing them.
And both of us just stood thereand my dad just like
unplugged stuff and picked me upand we just like walked out.
He, like, carried me out of the room.
So that's I think when my dad
started to be like, okay,something is like
not okay here.

(01:00:03):
And one time we had a cat
and my grandpa had my grandpa owns
like he owns a lot of the landand a lot of the
like buildingsand stuff in our small town.
And so one of the rooms off of his bedroomis his office, but it's just like locked
and with all the deeds and paperworkand all that stuff.
So nobody goes in there.
He's the only one with a key.

(01:00:24):
And one day my stepmom was home by herself
and she could hear like a crying noise.
And she kept, like,you know, searching around
and trying to figure out, like,
where this crying was coming from.
She finally followedit upstairs and into the room,
and she was like listening in.
And it sounded like a baby cryingin like on the other side of the door.

(01:00:47):
So my grandpa comes outlike she calls my grandpa.
He's like, something is going on.
They open up the doorand our cat comes out
and the door is not ever open.
So it's like how the cat got in there,how long the cat had been in there?
We don't know.
But it was just yeah, it was just a

(01:01:07):
thoseare the types of things that would happen.
And then as a family, we'd all congregatewhen we'd have like
family dinners or people coming overto like other families come over to visit.
We would all just congregatein the kitchen and chat.
I feel like that's always the placeeveryone always stands
and there's a windowabove the sink in the kitchen.

(01:01:27):
And I always would just likelook out the window because I always felt
like somebody was looking in on usand watching us.
And I just had that feelingand I just kept looking over.
And this is like over multiple times of uscongregating in the kitchen.
And then one night my uncle is just like,
Does anybody feel likesomebody is watching us?

(01:01:49):
And everybody was like, yes.
And so we all kind of agreed on this,
that like some somebody was there,
my uncle put a lock on.
There was a like a cellar door offthe kitchen and he went down there once.
And then this also confirmed my sistersand I's story of this boy

(01:02:13):
is my uncle went down in the cellar
and he saw the same boy down there
and so he put a lock on the door
like I don't know if he thoughtthat was going to stop it or whatnot, but
but then like we came backand the table was in front of the door.
Like nobody was allowed to go downin the cellar anymore.
And so, yeah, that's like some ofthe stuff that happened in that house.

(01:02:36):
My grandpa
didn't believe us that it was hauntedlike we told him over and over again.
He's like, No, it's not.
And when he moved out,another couple moved in
and they turned the lowerhalf of the house into like a gift shop.
And then they livedon the upper half of the house and they
there was an article in the newspaperthat they kept
reporting that every time they came down,like certain things would be moved.

(01:02:59):
And there's one picture frame that alwaysgot moved to like a different shelf.
And they had somebody come into see if it was haunted.
And they confirmed that there was, youknow, a spirit that lived in the house.
And they do believe that it was
part of
the Underground Railroad at one point.

(01:03:20):
And because there was
a very small passthrough northern Illinois,
and they do believe that that house
and one other house in our townwas like holding
people who were passingthrough the Underground Railroad.
So there was a whole newspaper

(01:03:42):
article about it and about how,yes, there's a spear in this house.
They ended up bulldozing the house downand now there's like a medical center
sits on top of it.
But my grandpa, to this day, still doesn'tbelieve that the house is haunted.
Yeah. So.
And then he moved into anotherhaunted house, and
we lived there for a little bit with him.
So it was a similar type of activityor was there something very different

(01:04:04):
aboutwhat would happen? The other house was
the maid ended up
hanging herself in the attic.
So it was a very old Victorian housethat had like this tiny maid steps
that went down to the kitchen.
The basement was creepy,there was a bomb shelter, like the ground
started sinking in.
And then my grandpa found outthat there was a bomb shelter.

(01:04:27):
Wow. Yeah. In his yard.
And that you could reach itfrom the basement.
There was,like, shelves in front of it and stuff,
and so they pulled it asideand he ended up filling in the ground
and everything like that.
But yeah, the stuff with that housewas just like you
go into the bathroom at the end ofin the hallway, curved, which was weird.
So like you'd go down the hallwayand you'd curve off to the side

(01:04:48):
and then it would be the doorto the attic to go upstairs.
And there's a bathroom
at the end of that hall,and he'd go inside
and it was like always a thingwhere you just like,
look behind the curtainbecause you just felt like
somebody was in there with youand you didn't.
So when my sister and I,we only lived there for a few months
in between, like our apartmentand moving into our house finally.

(01:05:10):
And my sister and I would bring a boomboxinto the bathroom with us
when we had a showerbecause it just like, helped us feel like
whoever was in therewasn't going to bother us.
Yeah.
So it was just more of that type of stuffthat was in that house.
So my first reaction to all this,

(01:05:30):
believe it or not, is that these housessound amazing, like they say.
Oh. Cool.
And so interesting they are.
Bill and I have talked about filmingin the current house that my grandpa lives
in the old Victorian housebecause it's just, it's super interesting
and just the structure of it is so old.

(01:05:50):
Like with the maid steps,with the curved hallway,
there's also a playhouse in the backyardyard, but like kind of far away.
And it mimics the house. And so it's like
but our,
like the that house used to be
like it's on the highest point of Roscoe,
and so it sits on top of this hill.

(01:06:12):
And it used to be likethere was a lot of barns and stuff.
There was a track therethat used to show horses there.
So when we were at thethe reason our house took so long to build
is because they had to stop diggingbecause they found bones and our
my parentscurrent house is built on top of a horse
burial like a horse cemetery.

(01:06:33):
And this is Illinois, correct?
This is. Illinois.This is northern Illinois.
Yeah. There's something about the oldthe old houses.
I mean, they're older,so more stuff has happened, you know?
And if you believe in this kind of stuff,then that means there's more potential
energy and historyand all that kind of stuff. Yes.
But yeah, I'm just I'm fascinated nowwith with these homes.
I just love the the idea of themand what I've pictured in my head.

(01:06:56):
And it's funny that you have a cat story
because my first thoughtwith the paper towels
is that it's something like a cat would doplaying with it with the paper towel.
So the likejust because I'm not sure what to call it,
but they're like crawl spacethat you mentioned near the.
Underneath the garage.
Underneath the garage, yeah.

(01:07:16):
He actually found a doll in there.
Yeah, he found a doll.
He found a shoe.
Like, you know, one of the shoesthat where you had, like
the little key read, pull the buttonthrough, like an older shoe like that.
It was all younger.
It was all kid stuffthat he found down there.
But he did find like an actual key,which we don't know what the key is for.

(01:07:37):
We never found out what the keys for it.
But there has always,in a way, a pair of glasses.
Hmm. Like.
Like reading glasses kind of thing. Yeah.
Yeah, it's interesting.
And that that terrifies mebecause I'm afraid of dolls.
So just the idea of going downinto a space below house
and finding a doll, just.
It just freaks me out. So.

(01:08:00):
Yeah, it's not.
Yeah, yeah.
It's interestingbecause it's like basements are a thing
in Northern Illinois.
I knowthey're not very prevalent out here,
but these weren'tlike your typical basements.
They were like this.
They're like having a basement underthe garage isn't normal.

(01:08:21):
And then I guess the cellar is normal,
but it was a very small area,the off the kitchen.
So I was going to say,especially it being an older home,
that makes sense to have to have a cellar
and also if it was part of the UndergroundRailroad,
that could be a potential placeto hide people if anybody's looking.
So it makes sense for a home like thatto have a space like that.

(01:08:43):
Yeah.
Now keeping a doll down thereis that's just a bad decision.
Like even if you have kids, you'reletting them play down there.
Don't let them keep dolls in crawl spaces.
And you weren't allowedwe weren't allowed to play down there
like we were allowedthe one time to go down and look.
And then like any time of justmy grandma was like, yeah,
I went down there to show somebody elseand, this is what I found.

(01:09:04):
And so like,but for some reason he still didn't.
And he doesn't thinkthe house he lives in now is
haunted.
Yeah, he's just.
It's the of belief.
And I've been talking about itduring my paranormal episodes because now
I'm more of a skeptic,but I want to experience something.
I love the stories of it,
but it's like when people don't believe,they don't believe them.
People believe they very muchbelieve it's.

(01:09:25):
Yeah, I think I also feel likeif you don't believe
like there's a part of youthat's closed off to it and I'm a believer
that like,
you won't experience itunless you're open to it, because
why would they waste their timetrying to contact somebody
who doesn't believe over making contactwith somebody who does believe

(01:09:45):
and being able towhatever it is that they're,
you know, still here for.
So yeah. Yeah.
Thank you so much, Anna, for sharing.
Your. Experiences.
Yeah.
Do you want to plug anythingbefore you go?
Do you want to talk aboutyour social media?
Do you want people to find you anywhere?You don't have to.
I mean, if there's no pressure
on me, on social media,I'm always down to meet new people.

(01:10:07):
It's just Annabeth.
Lilly is my handle.
So when we're.
All one word.
Yeah, yeah.
Well, thank you so much.
And, yeah, I'll talk to you soon.
All right? Great. Thank you.
And lastbut not least, concluding part one is Matt
Mazany, a producer and directorwho's a fantastic storyteller.

(01:10:28):
And I don't think I need to take anythingup about this one.
Enjoy
This feels very official.
It's like I'm a professionaland I'm so excited
that you actually showed interestin doing this because I love your voice.
Matt, you have a great voicefor this kind of thing.
Oh, thank you, though.
I like I like hearing my own voicedue to be honest,
if I had to be completely honest, I'm

(01:10:49):
so happy to get the chanceto just Bello out a scary story.
Yeah, yeah, please do.
So what you're going to talk to us
about is a it'ssomething that really happened to you.
Is that correct? It reallyit really happened to me.
And it's going to sound
it's going to sound like I'mgoing to be goosing some of this up.
But it is like it happened,like this happened.

(01:11:10):
And this is like what we really like.
This is are the feelings that we we had.
This was very realand it's going to sound stupid,
but this was like the scariest thingthat has ever happened to me.
Well, I'm. I'm sorry.
It was a frightening experience,but I'm excited to hear about it.
Let her rip.
So we were being my friend and my friendJoe Barnett.

(01:11:31):
And this is in college.
This is we went to Adams StateCollege in Alamosa, Colorado,
and that's a really small town,just college
town is like a town of 10,000 peoplewithin the colleges there.
It's the highest elevationfootball stadium in the country.
Oh, wow.
It also is is in a valley at this height.

(01:11:52):
I think it's like 7500 feetabove sea level.
And it had this incredible was a desert.
So it had these incrediblelike temperature swings where it'd be like
60 degrees during the dayand -20 at night, just like a crazy,
weird place kind of.
And it was getting into the fall
and it was our last semester at collegewith me and my buddy Joe Barnett.
And, you know, last semester college,you take

(01:12:14):
the last few things you needfor your degree, but you also have like
you can takejust whatever kind of elected classes.
And we had this one classand we decide where we're going to
take all the film classes we can.We weren't film.
He was a history major.
I was an English major.
But we'll take whatever film things
because just to watch moviesand get a credit for it.
And we

(01:12:34):
went and we saw this thingcalled Demagogs at Democracy, which is a
was a film classabout four demographic demagogs.
And the only one I can rememberis facing the crowd.
The, the, yeah.
The moviewith the guy that becomes the mayor,
whatever I haven't seen in a long time.It seems really good.
I think I saw it in film schools.
It's been a long time for me too. Yeah.I should.

(01:12:55):
I should rewatch that,
but that's but and also like this classis the only thing I remember from it.
So we go to week oneand let's say we watch Face of the Crowd.
And it was weirdbecause every other class,
like every other class in in collegethat we've taken and I was there
for for two years, my buddyJoe was there all four years and
was just normal hours.

(01:13:16):
Like it was, you know, from sevenin the morning till five or whatever.
You need to get your own scheduleand stuff.
But this class was at 8:00 at nightand it was in the English building
at the fourth floor, and it waswhen just no other classes were going on.
So we went there to the class.
You just walk up the stairsand it was empty
and usually it's there, you know, peoplethere all day we walk in the classroom.

(01:13:37):
There is a professor that we never seenbefore, that guy named Professor Gornick,
and he was our guy.
But he's going to talking about the thing
and there's only five other peoplein the class besides me and my buddy Joe.
And we watched the movie.
We talked about it after the thing
and that was kind of it.
We went home and then the next
the next weekwe're getting ready to go to this class.

(01:13:59):
This is where we kind of get this work.
It's kind of weirdand me mean you're talking like that.
The class is kind of weird. Last week,you guys, it was a little weird.
Had like a little odd vibe to itit was was that about and they go like,
you know I you've been here for years.
I've been here two years.
Have you ever heard of Professor Gornick?
And he goes like,No, I've never had a class with them.

(01:14:20):
I've never had a never had a teachertalk about another student talk about like
neither have I.
And it's so weirdthat we're in the history
and English Departmentis the history in this building.
We don't know this,you know, teacher or professor
and then it go like,
do you know any of those other kidsin the class?
And he goes like, No, I never metand like everybody in that class.

(01:14:42):
And we're like, we're seniors in college.
It's a small town, you know, everybody
we do not know a singleother person in the class.
And we're and then now we're nowwe're like walking towards the class.
And because he can walk everywhere here
and it's a bit of a long walk
and it's fall and it's darkand we're chatting and we're just like
and we're like.
So. GORNICK We never met these five kids.

(01:15:02):
We've never met. I'm like,
I mean, over the years, how many kids dieat a college?
Like on average, like how many kidsjust like die or whatever in the thing
we're like,I don't know, we're talking about it.
And then we just are going like, I think,
I think we're in a class with ghostsfrom this college
and, and, and we laughed it as a joke.

(01:15:24):
As a joke. Right. It's so funny.
Yeah.
And then we kept on going on about
like how just like,oh yeah, this kid died from this.
Now he's in this class.Just get ready for this nice spasm.
Gornick fell down the stairs.He died from this class.
And so then we go and we open up the door,and we start walking up the stairs
and, like, Joe stops,and it gets really like, he's truly a he's
just his eyes get bigger, bigger socks,and he goes like, I know we're joking,

(01:15:50):
but what if that is real?
And we're like looking aroundthis empty building and we're like, Oh,
I'm like, I don't,I don't think it's real, Joe.
I think it's a good idea.
He goes, I don't know, I got a bad idea.He's kind of a religious guy.
I got a bad feeling. I don't know.I just got too bad. We should go there.
We should go to like, dude,
we're not going to go because our classmight be filled with ghosts.
And then it really is like he goes,I don't read

(01:16:11):
you talk about nobody goesand then you up the stairs
and we turn the cornerand there's like nobody in the hallway.
And we'd walk down room.
We go to the door and to my lifewe open the door and the classrooms
completely empty and we're like, It's8:00, it's Wednesday, this is the class,
and the class is goneand there's nobody there.
And we're just like what?

(01:16:33):
And we just like
like and like we were worked upin a way that we were like, Oh, no.
And we're like, No, we like, oh,and we like run down the stairs
and we like run home like, oh, my God.
Oh, my God, they're there.
Oh, my God. This class isn't real.
We're taking a fake classbecause we're, like, freaking out.
And it was so crazy.

(01:16:54):
And then we checked our emails,and Professor Gornick
had the flu that day,and he wasn't going to go in.
And we pushed the class that week. But
that moment was
it was absolutely real by God, thatthere was like, Yeah, we thought that,
I mean, it felt like it felt likewe stepped into like a ghost class.
It was still like a creepy class,
but it was that it was I feel likehow much you could get worked up.

(01:17:16):
Like if you justif you just like by in a little bit
it was because it wasit was real spooks and scares from us.
Absolutely.
And I think how you buy into those thingsand the talking about it
and the build that you were buildinga belief system essentially,
and then you go into the roomand it's there.
I was going to ask
not knowing what the endingwas going to be, I was going to ask

(01:17:38):
if you thought there was some kindof correlation in to a face in the crowd.
Is that what the movie's called thatyou saw? Yes.
If there was some kind of correlationwith that to whatever experience
was about to happen.But of course, that was before the end.
And Ithink my memory, a face in the crowd,
I think I'm thinking of a LonChaney movie.

(01:17:59):
I'm thinking of something,but maybe The Smiling Man.
I don't think I'm thinking of a facein the crowd.
Well, the thing about face of the crowd,it's it's it's
the star is somebody who is a normal it'sAndy Griffith is the star.
And he plays like this evil manand it's like and that's
what makes it really good, causehe's like,
this charismatic guy who lives up the townand all, like, bad stuff.

(01:18:21):
And then he.
But, but, but it's Andy Griffith, right?
And so it's like a really bizarre thingto see him in that.
Oh, that's interesting. Okay.
So Did you ever see Gornick teaching
any other classes after the moment when itwhen the reality of what this was hit
you did you see them on other listsor you schedules or anything like that?

(01:18:42):
I mean, to be honest,he might have been like a retired
faculty member who just came backto just do something like this.
But no, I've never seen Gornickoutside of this anyways.
So it was kind of likeit was like an odd guy.
And the kidswe did get to know, they were just,
I guess, I guess dorks.
I guess they were justthey were not out and about in the town.

(01:19:03):
And that's why we didn't know that therewas no there's no special reason for this.
It was just that we just didn't knowthese these five other kids.
And then we did know.
GORNICK And it was just like and I guessat that time, like, we're seniors
and we're were you know, me and JoeBarnett are knuckleheads like the big guy
that specifically got so much troublewith this guy.
We we stole an ambulance once

(01:19:27):
back in my
I mean, like I told you,like almost got to -20 degrees.
And so we're walking along.
We walked by the hospital and we're
welcome armored.
And there is there is athere is a warm running
ambulance in front of the hospital.
And he goes, hop in.
And he halves the driver's seat.
I hop in the passenger seat and we startgoing and we're driving toward the house.

(01:19:51):
They go, Joe,what happens when we wake up and?
There's an ambulancein front of the house.
He goes, Who?
That would be a bad idea.
Matt We both hopped out, left.
It was or was it justran like that was the kind of trouble.
So me and me and Barnettwould let's just say we read letters,
our flights of fancy get ahead of usa lot in a lot of different ways,

(01:20:12):
a lot of bad decisions,a lot of bad ideas.
So go sexy wasn't even the worst one,I guess I would say.
Yeah, yeah. Well, no, I love it.
It's this is a very Twilight Zone story,which I will always love.
So I really appreciate you sharing that.
Because I'm sure you have like peopletelling like real truths,
like scary stories, stuff.
But it was funny because what I'mtelling you is that like this felt,

(01:20:33):
I mean, it's stupid and it's a shaggydog story, but this felt so scary.
One of the things that I'mreally interested in when it comes to real
stories is how things in your ownlike belief system
or what you're doing affectswhat you're seeing.
Well, if you're if you're brain,like I said, if, if where our brain state
was at that point, if there was like one

(01:20:58):
puff of mist that or like some
some windy mistthat blew by in front of us after that,
after we revealed that they weren't there,we would have said that was Gornick.
We saw Gornick ghostbecause we were at that,
that the state that we wereat was so impressionable, so excitable,
any bit of evidence that would have likeled us to like this is also
this missing professor,these missing kids.

(01:21:20):
We saw them here.
I made a comment.
I did an episode, my friendBrandi Stilwell, and she's somebody
that has experienceda lot of paranormal phenomena in her life.
And so I had her just sharesome like random stories from her life
to discuss these kind of things.
And one of the things I talked aboutis that there are many scientific studies

(01:21:41):
that have happened where of anthropologyand history and psychology and stuff.
They'll have students over to a house or,you know,
some sort of place, and they're like,Hey, tonight we're going to stay here.
By the way, the place is haunted.
This woman killed herself in the hallwayand blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
And they tell the story.
And then sure
enough, the next morning people will be,I saw the lady that killed herself.

(01:22:03):
And then you find out later, no,it was a study.
No one ever died here.No one killed themselves.
But you had all these peoplesuddenly see it
because they were building itup in their minds.
So you guys kind ofdid that to yourselves.
You did a little science experimenton yourselves without realizing it.
Well, it is like the I
because I'm not I'm not a dog person,paranormal stuff.

(01:22:26):
And I kind of generally don't
I believe it is all like brain tricksand all that stuff in that way.
But I still think about doing
like the Bloody Mary thing in the mirrorand that was so scary to do
in Alaska Native culture.
There's a thing about you don't whistleat the Northern Lights because if you do,
it'll come and cut your head off,which is I think is a cool, spooky story.

(01:22:47):
And then so I'd like just to test it out.
I whistle the northern lightsand then it just there's that moment
when you do it, you just like, Oh,I transgressed something
and something bad could happen.
And that and it's weirdbecause it's just like it's literally
in the universal scale.
Nothing but your brain can just whipeverything
into somethingthat feels as real as anything.

(01:23:07):
Absolutely. 100% it can.
And that's you know, that'spart of my fascination in this stuff.
So I don't want to takeany more of your time,
but do you want to plug anything
that you have coming out or anythingthat's already out?
Do you want to, you know,stand on a soapbox and say something
while you're here?
I always take a plug, man.
Yeah, follow me at Amazon and Twitter.

(01:23:29):
Follow me, Amazon and Instagram.
Watch the con on ABC.
It's all it's on Hulu now,
but I directed all the recreationsfor that show, which is a lot of fun.
Also listen to Get It Again,a wrestling podcast
where me and some other knuckleheads,we watch WCW Thunder
from start to finish and wherewe're well in 1999 and it's been very fun.

(01:23:49):
Journey Oh, that's awesome.That's awesome.
I didn't know you did that.
I am so glad
I gave you an opportunity to plug thatbecause that's, that's really cool.
Yeah, it's fun.
Yeah.
Well, thank you so much for being on Matand I will talk to you soon.
Thanks, Michael.
Thank you for listening to the first partof our two part Terrifying

(01:24:14):
Tales Halloween episodes next week,the Tuesday before Halloween.
We're dropping the second part,and there's going to be people like Molly
Elfman and Zeke Pineroand Joe Russo and myself
sharing a story of the most frighteningthing that's ever happened to me.
In fact, the way I kind of organizethese episodes is next week,

(01:24:37):
about 60% of the stories involve me.
And that's not necessarilya good thing for myself because I'm
the one listening these thingsafter I even record them.
And it's kind of is kind of it'skind of spooky.
It it's kind of spooky,I got to be honest.
But anyway, I hope you enjoy.
Please make sure to subscribe, rateand review his study of strange.

(01:25:00):
Thank you for everybody that's done so.
And also as a reminder,
a couple of the interviews from tonight'sepisode as well as next week's episode
will be available on Patreonin its entirety, unedited.
There's at least three as of this momentthat are going up there.
So check those out and support the show.
Follow us on Instagramat a study of strange email

(01:25:21):
me thoughts, ideas, stories,anything you want.
Add a study of strange at gmail.com.
Visitour website. A study of strange scar.
I can't wait to get backto some true crime.
In a couple of weeks I am going to be darkthe week after Halloween,
but back right after thatwith more strange, true tales.

(01:25:42):
Thank you and good night.

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Halloween Special: Terrifying Tales Part One

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Halloween Special: Terrifying Tales Part One

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