May 6, 2025 • 47 mins
The Mothman, a legendary winged “birdman” with glowing red eyes, was first reported in Point Pleasant, West Virginia, in 1966. Interestingly, similar sightings began this century in Chicago. As far as cryptids go, the myth behind Mothman is more supernatural than zoological, with many believing this creature is a harbinger of doom.
With special guest Oliver Berger!
https://www.instagram.com/oliveraberger/
https://oliveraustinberger.com/
Theme Music by Matt Glass https://www.glassbrain.com/ Instagram: @astudyofstrange Support the Show! astudyofstrange.substack.com/ Website: www.astudyofstrange.com Hosted by Michael May Email stories, comments, or ideas to astudyofstrange@gmail.com! ©2025 Convergent Content, LLC
LINKS
https://www.singularfortean.com/ https://www.singularfortean.com/news/2017/6/10/a-timeline-of-the-chicago-flying-humanoid-sightings-so-far https://www.singularfortean.com/news/2020/6/23/second-pilot-reports-sighting-of-mothman-at-chicagos-ohare-international-airporthttps://www.phantomsandmonsters.com/p/chicago-phantom-sightings-2011-2017.html
https://ufoclearinghouse.wordpress.com/the-latest-ufo-sightings/
https://www.reddit.com/r/cryptids/comments/1kb1ezz/the_chicago_mothman/ https://www.reddit.com/r/cryptids/comments/1bepcqj/recent_mothman_sightings/ https://www.reddit.com/r/Cryptozoology/comments/ejial9/the_chicago_mothman_has_been_seen_eight_times/ https://www.phantomsandmonsters.com/2025/04/john-keels-mothman-reports-collection_30.html https://www.phantomsandmonsters.com/p/chicago-phantom-sightings-2011-2017.html https://q985online.com/mothman-sighting-illinois-airport/ https://airlinegeeks.com/2020/10/24/spooktober-the-mothman-of-chicago-o-hare/ https://www.netflix.com/tudum/articles/unsolved-mysteries-volume-4-episode-5-mothman-revisited https://unsolved.com/gallery/the-mothman-revisited/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u3Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:02):
Just after 7:30 a.m.
on May 31st, 2020,at Chicago's O'Hare International Airport.
A commercial pilotand his copilot are taxiing their aircraft
when something unusual catches their eye.
A massive blackhumanlike figure with wings,
and it ascends rapidly into the sky.
(00:26):
this isn't an isolated incident.
Over the past decade, dozens of similarsightings
have been reported in and around Chicago,particularly near O'Hare.
Witnesses describe a winged humanoidwith glowing red eyes
and some witnessesdescribing a profound sense of dread.
(00:47):
But this phenomenon isn't new.
It shares similaritieswith a creature from events
in the 1960s in Point Pleasant,West Virginia.
A creature that we call the Mothman.
And it was linked to a tragic bridgecollapse.
This is a study of strange.
(01:22):
Welcome back to the show.
I'm your host, Michael May. Today.
The Mothman, the myth, the legend,joining me on this quest is Oliver Berger.
Hi, Oliver. How are you doing?
Yeah.
Yes. Of course.
(01:42):
So when he files your taxes, doeshe use it?
No, I don't.
So, Oliver, I picked you.
I was putting this episode together,and I was literally just around you,
and we were talking about Chicago,and I was like, oh,
I should have Oliver on this episode
because we are goingto be putting ourselves in Chicago.
You're not from there, but you have a lotof life experience in Chicago.
Tell us a little bit about yourselfand how you ended up in Chicago
(02:05):
before you came back to L.A..
(02:50):
Yeah.
And you've been here for 60 years.
Since.
Right? Yes.
You look.
You look great for your age.
So while you were in Chicago,did you ever see the Mothman?
(03:24):
Maybe they're getting mistakenfor the Mothman.
I don'tI don't know, we will discuss that. Okay.
Yeah. Break in the case. So.
so how we met
is you're currently working out of a placeI used to do a TV show at, so we've met,
and and I just want to share thiswith the audience.
So you write youyou do a lot of different things.
But one of the first things I noticed
(03:44):
is that you were working on puppetswhen I first met you, and I was like,
all right,whoever that guy is, he's okay with me.
He's doing a lot of.
Nice.
(04:04):
Yeah. Yes.
And I'll provide links to whateverOliver wants to share in the show notes
(04:26):
so you can look him up.
otherwise,we're going to dive into the Mothman.
Now, Oliver.
I should start
with a very simple question,which is, do you know what the Mothman is?
Are you aware of some of its history or
series or anything else?
Yeah.
(04:50):
Yes. And most people don't.
And that's what's been so interestingabout the Chicago
sightings,which I'll dive into a little bit.
So let me back up to that.
So I'll, I'll give a little bit of historyabout the Mothman.
And it all started in November
of 1966, in Point Pleasant, West Virginia,where two young couples
(05:10):
from Point Pleasant, Roger and LindaScarboro, and Steve and Mary Mallett.
I think it's how you say their name, saidthat they saw this large,
man like creature with glowing red eyesflew down at them
when they were driving their caron the outside of town.
It had expansive wings.
They said it was near like ten feet long.
(05:31):
The wing spread and it basicallychased them away from this area
that was near an abandoned munitions siteknown as the TNT area.
And one of the descriptionsthat I feel no one ever mentions,
and I found thislooking back, the original
at the original newspaper saying isthey described it as having white wings
and you never hear that anymore.
(05:52):
Nowadays it's always like a dark.
The Mothman is darkowl, completely black or white at
different times, different styles.
Yeah, exactly.
But it did pursue them for a shortperiod of time before they drove away
and the story got shared.
And also what's most commonly
what is not shared isoften is a better way to say that is that
(06:14):
there was this bit of like local hysteriawhen people read about this.
They gathered like firearms,guns in went out to this area
to find this creature, to likehunt it down.
(06:40):
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's, Well,it was very much a Scooby-Doo situation,
and I think everybody kind ofwanted it to be a Scooby-Doo situation.
I think they wanted to show upand find somebody dressed in an outfit.
You know, or something, and like,hey, why are you scaring the kids?
But they never did.
And sightings suddenly peaked.
Like, suddenly a lot of people are seeingthis strange creature,
eyeballs in windows or thingsflying overhead.
(07:03):
And this all led to a disasterDecember 15th, 1967.
When the Silver Bridge
collapsed in the area during rush hour,resulting in 46 deaths.
Some locals believe the Mothman sightingswere an omen of this impending disaster,
a harbinger of doom, and this whole storywas popularized by journalist
(07:24):
and writer John Keel in his 1975 bookThe Mothman Prophecies, which was later
adapted into a film with Richard Geer,which is actually a really good movie.
Yeah.
Yes. Yeah, there you go.
And keel the writer of thatI'll just quickly mention,
because I think this is fascinating,people
in the same genreas my podcast will know his name.
(07:45):
He is the first one to coined the termMen in Black.
So that's just a fun tidbit for himfrom Mr.
Keel there.
So there are theories aroundthe initial Mothman sightings.
Some people speculate that because he wasfirst seen by this old munitions area,
even though it was completely abandonedthere, like, oh, there could be chemicals
or radiation or something that's causinghallucinations, things like that,
(08:09):
and many other theories that are more onthe skeptical side of the Mothman.
Think it's could be,
Pro pro versusanti or just trying to figure it out.
So there's people that think it could besandhill cranes or owls.
Sandhill cranes are very large birds,but they're very skinny.
That's where a lot of peoplethat don't believe it.
(08:32):
Well here's the thing.
I have some personal experiencewith sandhill cranes.
And I had this before.
I was aware of the Mothman story.
Yes, yes, yes,
you should have you should have been awareof my experience doing that.
But anyway, so I grew up in Floridaand at a period of time in the year,
(08:57):
the sandhill cranes would come inand they would be there for certain.
What I can't remember,it's the summer, the winter, whatever.
But they come in for a certaintime of year.
I grew up on a golf course,you know, like a golf course.
I mean, it's Florida.
That's the thing is, I think, you know,
and the sandhill craneswere really interesting because at night
and I had friendsthat lived in the neighborhood,
so I'd walkor ride my bike or whatever at night.
(09:18):
And if you saw them, like on the golfcourse
nearby, like by the street,I would think they were people sometimes.
And so a lot of people are like,you can't be a sandhill cranes.
They're too short and whatever.
I'm like, no, if you see them at night
and you can't quite judgedistance and size
and you see this weird thing moving,especially if it flaps its wings
or whatever, you're like, oh, Jesus, fuck,what the hell is that?
(09:40):
And that happenedmultiple times to me growing up.
So I do think there is some validityto thinking that could be cause
for some of the sightings.
Maybe not all of them,but it's some of them.
Owls are also farlarger than people realize.
Yeah. Yep.
(10:00):
Absolutely.
Like I'm going to die,especially if their wings spread is out.
They can get to five and a half six feetlong and their eyes are more human
in like where they areon their heads, basically.
And if a light reflects off the eyes,they can look like they're glowing red.
So there is some validity to that too,that skeptics, deism, people
that are more quoteunquote pro Mothman think that it could be
(10:22):
something supernaturalthat is trying to warn people,
not necessarily attacking people,usually in the thoughts about Mothman.
They're also have been these sightingsacross time, near,
near and close to when some big disastersthis happened,
like Chernobyl and Fukushimaand other bridge collapses.
There's these, like, random accounts ofpeople seeing Mothman before they happen.
(10:45):
I will sayyou can't confirm those accounts.
That just typically happensin like articles.
I'd be like, oh,people saw the Mothman before Fukushima.
And it's like, okay, but whowhere is that?
Where's that evidence?
And it tends to be one ofthose like, internet things.
So he caused it is what you're saying?
(11:06):
Yeah, before we get into Chicagohere, Chicago.
See, I, I drifted into it.
It's just it's just I just wantedto sort of reiterate that people have this
either zoological saying,like Bigfoot, it's just a creature.
We've yet to to discover or this sort ofparent natural parent natural.
That's right.
I host a show I taught a parent at.
(11:28):
Yeah.
Paranormal creature that, is sort of more
interdimensional or something like that.
All right, so Chicago, what does thishave to do with the masked man?
Well, about.
Well, ten plus years ago, around2011 is when it starts.
But suddenly a lot of sightings aroundChicago
(11:50):
of a mothman type of creaturebegins appearing.
And usually aroundthe O'Hare airport area.
2011 iskind of when they relatively start.
Well, wait, wait.
(12:10):
Hold on. You may not be aware of it.
When did you leave Chicago?
So that's about the timethat the sightings start to dip.
I think we're on to something.
(12:32):
I, I think we're you're missing somethinghere, Oliver.
You're not seeing itfrom the perspective of people around you.
You're thinking about it from yourself.I think we're on to something.
I think we figured out why the Mothmanwas in Chicago, and it's all due to you.
Oh, man. Well,that's the end of the episode.
We figured it out.
(12:54):
Wow. I did not expect that.
That is awesome.
So anyway, so let's ignore that.
That Oliver is the Mothman.
Let's look at it from more of a. Yeah.
So in Chicago, I'm going to go oversome of the specific encounters in history
of when this started and rumors,
like I've already mentionedabout the Mothman in Chicago.
First, first surfaced around 2011.
(13:18):
And this is documented.
There's three main researchersthat have been compiling these stories.
I'll providelinks to all their work in the show notes.
A lot of people that are skeptical of thisdon't believe these guys.
I actually thinkthey're really fascinating people,
and I like a lot of their work.
Even though I am also a skepticof of the Mothman,
and there are now hundredsof sightings of the Mothman in Chicago,
(13:41):
sort of informally, more formally,there's like 85 ish, like formal,
like talk to a lot of reporterstried to share information.
Some of them have snapped photos,just a lot of sightings.
So a story where it kind ofstarted is around October 13th, 2011.
Where were you, Oliver?
On October 13th, 2011?
(14:05):
Okay, so maybe it's not you.
Haha.
So on October 13th, 2011,there's a story from a gentleman
who took a photo of this bat like man
looking creature and he describes,
oh shoot, Oliver, I made a mistakeand I I'll, I'll leave this
(14:27):
in October13th is when he shared his story.
But this allegedly happened on August22nd,
probably when you were in Chicago.
Yeah.
Yeah, exactly.
So according to this man, he was travelingthrough the suburbs of Chicago,
and he came across a local businesswith this tall sculpture of, like,
(14:49):
a Native American on its roof.And he thought it was interesting.
And he snapped a photo of this sculptureand then drove.
Tom drove home again. I host a show.
I can talk.
He laternoticed going through these photos
that there's a winged creature offin the distance flying.
And that is the first sort of where
(15:10):
the Chicago sightingssort of began is with this guy.
When he's sharing this photoand sharing the story.
In September,a woman was awakened, terrified
because her roommate was screaming,and she went to go talk to her roommate.
And her roommate said, there's somethingwith red eyes looking through her window.
Her third floor window, mind you,
(15:31):
the roommate sort of.
Yes, yes.
The to add to the story,though, is the roommate that did sort of
come to the
the the woman who was terrified downthen left and threw another window,
(15:53):
saw something that looked like a facewith red eyes looking in.
And yeah, this is what's fascinatingabout these stories,
by the way,because I do not believe in the Mothman.
I love these stories.I love these accounts.
But all the accounts
I'm going to share today,and a lot of the accounts
that anybody can look up on Redditand YouTube and in some newspapers
and other things I can linkto, all the accounts seem very
(16:17):
legitimate.
I think people really did experiencesomething or see something.
It's just okay.
Is it a,you know, a reflection from a brake light?
Is it you know, you're drunk or whatever?
(16:41):
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
I mean, it'sI mean, hey, that's kind of why it fits.
Because a lot of people are like,why do they call it a mothman?
It's like a person with, like, wings.
It could be a bat, man.
Maybe there's a,you know, a litigation issue.
Yeah.
Yeah, it could be the owl dude.
(17:02):
Or, you know, the gargoyle man.
Yeah, I know, I'm sorry. I'm sorry.
So I do want to say that as much as they.
The common story here is that in 2011,some sightings around
Chicago of this Mothman as creaturestart showing up, you can actually trace
reports of a similar creatureto much earlier in the area.
(17:22):
And that is where you and Iare going to do a scene.
Oliver.
So this is a a fictional recreation.
I have to describe that a little better.
So this is a I'm using the real dialog
from this gentleman, Gerald,who you're going to read
who saw something in 1957,in the Chicago area
(17:42):
that is very much akin to Mothman,where this interview is fictional,
is he didn't actually do this,telling it to a reporter.
He shared it in recent years to one of thethe gentleman
who's been investigating these Mothmansightings over email and phone calls. I've
just changed it to a a sit down thing,just to be honest about what I'm doing.
All right.
(18:03):
So, I'll read the descriptionsand the reporter you'll read.
Gerald, you're good to go.
You feel good about this?
And I.
Absolutely. Before we dive into it,you're much smarter than I am.
Do you know how topronounce Gerald's last name?
(18:30):
There you go.
That's what I mean. I'mgoing to go with that.
So when I'm wrong and I get emailsabout it, people complain about you.
We. Yeah.
To write,
to rise, I'mgoing to say I'm going to go with you.
Right. Okay. All right, here we go.
A reporter sits in Gerald terrorizesliving room.
Gerald is a lively 79 years old and entersthe room holding a cup of coffee,
(18:51):
which he hands to the reporter.
Thank you.
Gerald sits in a warm
La-Z-Boy across from the reporter.
So you were telling me about thiscreature?
(19:47):
That.
That was that.
Are there any other details you can share?
(20:12):
You're welcome,
I guess I don't know, So.
Bye. I love how.
So I love the idea that this
something has been seen in the areabefore, like, the notoriety
sort of started happening and where the,the mass media started looking at it.
(20:34):
There are many other earlier accountsthat some researchers have put together,
which you can read about.
I'll provide links in the show notesspecifically on a singular 40 incom,
which is a great site I've usedin the past for other topics, but he has,
put togetherbasically a timeline of sightings,
which is really fun to go through.And you can link to news
articles and interviewsand all sorts of stuff like that.
(20:57):
So yeah.
So the Mothman may not have shown upin 2011 and may have been there
the whole time.
(21:24):
Okay.
Right, right.
(21:49):
Yeah.
(22:17):
Yeah, yeah.
And it.
And also we'll get into some of the,the Chicago accounts here in a minute.
But a lot of the sightingswhen this all sort of picked up
starting in 2011, it kind of culminated.
The peak of the sightings was in 2017.
There were like over 50 sightingsthat year that was reported.
And a lot of them were from pilots.
Like there are pilots. There's a story.
(22:38):
I don't think I have it in my listI'm going to share.
But there were pilots coming in, to landand they saw this, like, distant thing.
We looked at O'Hare. Yeah.
And they saw this distant thing.
Looked like a mansort of off towards the end of the runway.
And then suddenlythe man just sort of lifted up
and looked like it had wingsand, like, flew away.
And it was a pilot and copilotthat saw it.
(22:59):
There's been a lot of other pilotsand like security people
and people working on the runwaysthat have seen just weird
things that are it looks like a giant,
more humansized, shaped bird like creature.
(23:22):
Oh, seriously,
I that's that's so fascinatingbecause one of the big questions,
I literally have it written in my notesright here.
Why the airport, Oliver?
What are why tell me why the airport?
Yeah.
Midway.
Right?
Yeah.
(24:07):
Oh, interesting.
Yeah.
Yeah.
(24:37):
Yeah, that's a good point.
And honestly, it kind of.
It kind of goes down each theory,right, of the people that think
this is some kind of cryptid like,undiscovered creature.
And it also fits into, like,maybe it's a large bird
that's being misidentifiedbecause of distance and lighting
and all the other things that go into sortof misjudging those, those details.
And so it kind of fits into both of those.
(24:59):
I would think.
Yeah.
That's right.
(25:24):
Yeah.
Yeah.
It does.
It really does.
Yeah. Absolutely.
Yeah.
(25:45):
Really?
Oh, okay.
Okay. Yes.
(26:20):
Interesting.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I mean, it's one of the busiest airportsin the country.
I have been delayed in O'Haremore than in any other airport
and I didn't really think about ittill you pointed it out, but it seems it's
(26:43):
most airports are outside of cities,
so you kind of like,got to go outside of the metropolitan area
where O'Hare seems like it's like in amore developed area, which is interesting.
like in even in my time out there,
we saw a giant expansion of
(27:29):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Interesting.
I love your comment about the owls,because that is one of the series
(27:51):
that a lot of thesesightings are just misidentified owls.
And if you're seeing a lot of
owls in Chicagothat is worth taking note of.
So yeah. Interesting.
Do you want to read a sighting?
So I think you can just read
whatever that first little thing is.
(28:48):
that is pulled from Reddit.
I forgot to write down the user.
I will try to look that up or providea link to that so people can find it.
One of my favorite aspects of this story,and I don't do a lot of cryptid stories
on on my show, but I do think the Mothmanis relatively fascinating.
And I do think the fact that, like,Chicago had this huge splurge of Mothman,
(29:08):
so to speak, sightings recentand recent history, that it's fascinating.
But I there are so many accounts on Reddit
that all
are really interesting,including this one, and I like small ones.
Whenever people like describedtoo much, often like, and it's you're
either bullshitting or you totally didsomething like, that's not what it is.
Yeah.
Whereit's like these kind of passive things,
(29:30):
are really fascinating to me.
And so that's one of them.There's another one
from the Chicago subreddit,not from like a mothman subreddit.
Which do you mind reading?
The second one there.
(30:37):
Very nice.
Yeah, yeah.
So, just another interesting.
Oh. Do you really?
(30:59):
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's.
Yeah.
(31:21):
That is a great question.
And I'm not a baseball fan,so I don't let me look at it.
Cubs winning.
2016.
I think
2017 was the peak, butthere were still some sightings of 2016.
I think the account you just readwas later than that.
(31:44):
I didn't write it down, butif memory serves, I think that was 2019.
Yeah. Yes.
Yes. So that's one of my series.
And not just mine.
(32:04):
There are many other peoplethat think that too. And,
so I sort ofput that at the end of various things.
This could be it could bemisidentification of owls or giant birds
or, you know, just misjudging sizeand distance, which is super easy to do.
And the other thing is mass hysteria,
which I look backand I mentioned it with the first Mothman
stories in 1966 where like,the town was like, rebel, rebel, rebel.
(32:27):
Let's go get this thing.
Well, of course,
if the whole town is doing that, peopleare going to think they're seeing it.
And so I do think when, when these storiesin Chicago started to get press,
I do think it caused more sightingsbecause people are now thinking about it.
When you think about something like that,you think you see it,
especially when things are at darkin the distance, like a lot
(32:49):
of the photos that have come up of like,could this be the Mothman?
They're really far awayand they're like zoomed in.
And when you're yes,
you know, in digital photographyyou're getting weird pixel ization.
If you try to create it,if you use AI to like
make it more high def and clean itup, well, AI is just creating information.
It's not using what's really there.
(33:10):
So it's making something look like a wingthat may not have been a wing, and
so on and so forth.
could be something that's sweepingby the camera.
absolutely.
So I do think mass hysteria, that'sone of my favorite theories for this, just
because I think people get really into itand they are people really into it.
People are still sharingstories on Reddit,
(33:31):
on the on these topics constantly, like,oh my God, I saw this thing.
In fact, here there's a story,
I came across researching thisfrom a woman named Lady Jane Gray, a Laura
Jane Grace. Excuse me.
And Lady Jane.
And this is just, on the Instagram.
And I think this was within the last year,but she tells a story
where she's just laying on her porchin Chicago at night,
(33:52):
and this giant human shaped thingflew overhead.
And she said it sort of flewalmost like a Superman pose.
But then it also kind of flipped overon its back, and at one point it went like
almost standing and was like stoppedin the air for a bit and then left.
Which is really weird.
She also mentioned it had a tail.
Not all sightings mentioned. Tails.
(34:12):
A lot of people sayit doesn't have a tail.
Her sighting.She said she thought she saw something.
It looked like a long tailon the creature.
I'll also say this.
Oh, okay.
(34:39):
It does?
Yeah,
yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah I do too, I do too.
And I think peoplethat don't think it's an owl
or even like the sandhill cranes thingwhen I was researching this.
(35:00):
And that's one of the theoriesthat I've brought up a lot today.
But there are peoplethat are like vehemently against that.
They're like, no, no, that'stiny heads or eyes or little, little.
Again,just because I have personal experience
with seeing them multiple times,being like, oh Jesus, like your eyes
and your brain, where humans,we fill in gaps of information.
(35:21):
Yes. Oh,
there there are, there's those big cranesand big owls and things like that.
So, so I do think that's why, again,I think there's validity
to just misidentification.
I'm not saying it's every sighting,but I do think there's misidentification.
I do think cranes could be that, as well,especially when they have like six foot
wide wingspan.
It's like, you see that you're goingto think that's bigger than it is,
(35:43):
especially depending on the angleand stuff that you see it.
Yeah, yeah.
(36:18):
Right.
Yeah.
It makes sense.
Yeah.
Yeah it does.
So here I'm going to share a story.
This is not a quote verbatim storybut it's one that
I particularly likedjust because I think it was kind of scary.
(36:38):
And I like scary things in an eeriesort of way.
But there was a pilot that shared a story,where he was staying
at the airport hotelbefore a flight out the next night,
and he leaves and checks out of the hotel,gets in his shuttle.
It's driving through the O'Hare, you know,whatever the maze, whatever you call it,
to get to get into things.
And as he's on the shuttleout of the window, he sees up on a railing
(37:02):
on, like, this building next to him.
There's a railing that's up high,and there's a creature
crouching on the railing, and it's like,put out its wings, so to speak.
And even though it's crouching,the guy's like,
you could tell it's this huge thing.
He thinks it looks like, man heightand the wings spread was just giant.
And he said, the thingthat was most shocking and scary
(37:24):
are these like red eyesthat seem to reflect.
And it looks like the creature
was watching his shuttle as it drove by,and the eyes kind of followed him,
and he was just super weirded outand didn't know what it was.
And when he got off of the shuttle,he kept looking back in that direction
to be like, oh God, is it following me?
Is that whatever that thing is it
it fly this way, I don't know,he didn't see it again after he drove by.
(37:45):
But again, it's that quickkind of witness account.
It's that which I think I really dothink this guy saw something, you know,
it's like that little bit of thingwith just the right amount of information.
Yeah.
(38:05):
Yeah.
(38:46):
Oh, interesting.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It is, it is.
I'm going to share one more story.
Please. It's a little longer.
(39:07):
And this comes from Phantom in Monsters,a website.
I'll provide links to it.
Run by Lorne Strickler, who was oneof the main researchers behind the Chicago
Mothman, who's been compiling interviewsand talking to witnesses.
And I'm going to read this.
I've edited itvery slightly, just for time.
But it's still a little bit lengthy.
But I'll read this guy's account, andthis was from the Mukwonago, Wisconsin.
(39:31):
So I wanted to share thisbecause it also just shows that Midwest
Lake area,even though it's not Chicago proper.
Yes. All right. So here's his story.
I was sitting inside my car,which was parked facing north
in the driveway at my homelocated between Eagle,
Palmyra and Mukwonago, Wisconsin.
I had been having an extended phoneconversation
(39:52):
with an old friend on the way home,and had not gone inside the house yet.
And remember looking at the radio clockat approximately 10:45 p.m.,
I looked up briefly from the dashof my vehicle and momentarily
noticed someone who was very,very, very tall and very dark.
Just standing in the rainabout 5 to 10ft in front of the vehicle.
(40:13):
I did a double takeand was suddenly, suddenly thought,
wait a minute, what the fuck was that?
I was looking at a creature,for lack of a better term,
that essentially looked like a seven footbat reptile of some sort.
The head was at the level of the roof
of my minivan,or slightly more elevated than the roof,
and it was standing perfectlystill, just staring right at me.
(40:33):
Its eyes were large, and althoughthey were dark like large black eyeballs,
there was a glint of reflection in them,which allowed me to discern
that they were, in fact,definitely its eyes slightly reflective,
light skin or scales of some kind,not feathery or fur covered.
I realizedthat it actually had huge wings,
but they were wrapped around its bodyexactly as a bat
(40:54):
wraps its wings around its bodywhile sleeping upside down.
Exceptthis thing was standing right side up,
looking at me or almost through me.
And let me just say, itdefinitely seemed ominous.
My initial reaction was to tell my buddyon the phone that I was looking right
at a giant bat dragon.
I noticed thatit seemed to very quickly move,
(41:17):
although I did not see itunwrap its wings or walk per se.
But there was simply what I will describeas a brief blur in the headlights,
and it was gone.
Well, that makes sense.
I think it was
yeah, get a wrap up.
It's the Midwest and stuff.
It's got a layer, don't you know poofter.
(41:39):
Yeah.
All right, so.
There are some during the day.
In fact, that first photo that sort ofstarted the whole thing in 2011,
(42:00):
that was during the day.
So that's kind of it's interesting.
But again,it's really far in the distance.
And that kind of.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Most of them are.
Yeah for sure.
Yeah.
(42:37):
That is very true.
And if you even.
that that is a good point.
And I do want to mention one thingtoo, that we haven't come back to,
but there's a lot of thought that the,the original, quote unquote original,
the OG Mothman from Point Pleasant,West Virginia, was this harbinger of doom
or someone providing a warning creature,warning that there's a disaster coming.
(43:01):
And so people brought that up withChicago of like, if the Mothman is real
and that is a thing,what is it trying to say about Chicago?
I'll say the point, pleasant thing.
It was a yearpeople started seeing Mothman.
A year later, there's a disaster.
Chicago, as we've now pointed out tonight,this has been going on a long time.
So I am not one to jumpinto that bandwagon of like, oh,
(43:22):
Chicago should be worried.
But it is scary tothink about that is for sure.
Yeah, yeah,
yeah.
(44:26):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Oh, interesting.
(44:46):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
(45:23):
Way to perfectly wrap up the episode.
Oliver. And
I'm keeping an open mind.
I don't know what this thing is.
I think you're on to something
by by mentioninghow it could be a variety of things.
And I'm definitely keeping an open mindthat it might have been you
(45:45):
the whole time as well, because that's.
But that's my job
as host of a study of strangersI have to keep, even when I'm skeptical.
I have to keep an open mind andI'm always willing to learn something new.
Mothman.
so on that note,
is there anything else you want to share?
Do you want people to find you anywhere?What do you want?
What do you want,Oliver? Tell me. I'll make it happen.
(46:26):
Yes, as you should.
Well, thank you so much for joining me.
This is, a fascinating topic.
Very odd, very strange.
And ends. And so am I.
Thank youfor being part of the strangeness Now,
if you'll excuse me,I have a flight at O'Hare to catch.
Thank youfor listening to a study of strange.
If you're interestedin this topic of Mothman in Chicago.
(46:48):
There's a lot of accounts.
There's a lot of information way too muchto share in one episode of my show.
So I'm providing as many links as I canthink of in the show notes.
Check those out.
Very special thank you to Oliver Bergerfor being our special guest today.
And hey, if you like this stuff,you know what?
Check us out on Instagramat A Study of Strange.
Until next time. Thank you and good night.
Just after 7:30 a.m.
on May 31st, 2020,at Chicago's O'Hare International Airport.
A commercial pilotand his copilot are taxiing their aircraft
when something unusual catches their eye.
A massive blackhumanlike figure with wings,
and it ascends rapidly into the sky.
(00:26):
this isn't an isolated incident.
Over the past decade, dozens of similarsightings
have been reported in and around Chicago,particularly near O'Hare.
Witnesses describe a winged humanoidwith glowing red eyes
and some witnessesdescribing a profound sense of dread.
(00:47):
But this phenomenon isn't new.
It shares similaritieswith a creature from events
in the 1960s in Point Pleasant,West Virginia.
A creature that we call the Mothman.
And it was linked to a tragic bridgecollapse.
This is a study of strange.
(01:22):
Welcome back to the show.
I'm your host, Michael May. Today.
The Mothman, the myth, the legend,joining me on this quest is Oliver Berger.
Hi, Oliver. How are you doing?
Yeah.
Yes. Of course.
(01:42):
So when he files your taxes, doeshe use it?
No, I don't.
So, Oliver, I picked you.
I was putting this episode together,and I was literally just around you,
and we were talking about Chicago,and I was like, oh,
I should have Oliver on this episode
because we are goingto be putting ourselves in Chicago.
You're not from there, but you have a lotof life experience in Chicago.
Tell us a little bit about yourselfand how you ended up in Chicago
(02:05):
before you came back to L.A..
(02:50):
Yeah.
And you've been here for 60 years.
Since.
Right? Yes.
You look.
You look great for your age.
So while you were in Chicago,did you ever see the Mothman?
(03:24):
Maybe they're getting mistakenfor the Mothman.
I don'tI don't know, we will discuss that. Okay.
Yeah. Break in the case. So.
so how we met
is you're currently working out of a placeI used to do a TV show at, so we've met,
and and I just want to share thiswith the audience.
So you write youyou do a lot of different things.
But one of the first things I noticed
(03:44):
is that you were working on puppetswhen I first met you, and I was like,
all right,whoever that guy is, he's okay with me.
He's doing a lot of.
Nice.
(04:04):
Yeah. Yes.
And I'll provide links to whateverOliver wants to share in the show notes
(04:26):
so you can look him up.
otherwise,we're going to dive into the Mothman.
Now, Oliver.
I should start
with a very simple question,which is, do you know what the Mothman is?
Are you aware of some of its history or
series or anything else?
Yeah.
(04:50):
Yes. And most people don't.
And that's what's been so interestingabout the Chicago
sightings,which I'll dive into a little bit.
So let me back up to that.
So I'll, I'll give a little bit of historyabout the Mothman.
And it all started in November
of 1966, in Point Pleasant, West Virginia,where two young couples
(05:10):
from Point Pleasant, Roger and LindaScarboro, and Steve and Mary Mallett.
I think it's how you say their name, saidthat they saw this large,
man like creature with glowing red eyesflew down at them
when they were driving their caron the outside of town.
It had expansive wings.
They said it was near like ten feet long.
(05:31):
The wing spread and it basicallychased them away from this area
that was near an abandoned munitions siteknown as the TNT area.
And one of the descriptionsthat I feel no one ever mentions,
and I found thislooking back, the original
at the original newspaper saying isthey described it as having white wings
and you never hear that anymore.
(05:52):
Nowadays it's always like a dark.
The Mothman is darkowl, completely black or white at
different times, different styles.
Yeah, exactly.
But it did pursue them for a shortperiod of time before they drove away
and the story got shared.
And also what's most commonly
what is not shared isoften is a better way to say that is that
(06:14):
there was this bit of like local hysteriawhen people read about this.
They gathered like firearms,guns in went out to this area
to find this creature, to likehunt it down.
(06:40):
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's, Well,it was very much a Scooby-Doo situation,
and I think everybody kind ofwanted it to be a Scooby-Doo situation.
I think they wanted to show upand find somebody dressed in an outfit.
You know, or something, and like,hey, why are you scaring the kids?
But they never did.
And sightings suddenly peaked.
Like, suddenly a lot of people are seeingthis strange creature,
eyeballs in windows or thingsflying overhead.
(07:03):
And this all led to a disasterDecember 15th, 1967.
When the Silver Bridge
collapsed in the area during rush hour,resulting in 46 deaths.
Some locals believe the Mothman sightingswere an omen of this impending disaster,
a harbinger of doom, and this whole storywas popularized by journalist
(07:24):
and writer John Keel in his 1975 bookThe Mothman Prophecies, which was later
adapted into a film with Richard Geer,which is actually a really good movie.
Yeah.
Yes. Yeah, there you go.
And keel the writer of thatI'll just quickly mention,
because I think this is fascinating,people
in the same genreas my podcast will know his name.
(07:45):
He is the first one to coined the termMen in Black.
So that's just a fun tidbit for himfrom Mr.
Keel there.
So there are theories aroundthe initial Mothman sightings.
Some people speculate that because he wasfirst seen by this old munitions area,
even though it was completely abandonedthere, like, oh, there could be chemicals
or radiation or something that's causinghallucinations, things like that,
(08:09):
and many other theories that are more onthe skeptical side of the Mothman.
Think it's could be,
Pro pro versusanti or just trying to figure it out.
So there's people that think it could besandhill cranes or owls.
Sandhill cranes are very large birds,but they're very skinny.
That's where a lot of peoplethat don't believe it.
(08:32):
Well here's the thing.
I have some personal experiencewith sandhill cranes.
And I had this before.
I was aware of the Mothman story.
Yes, yes, yes,
you should have you should have been awareof my experience doing that.
But anyway, so I grew up in Floridaand at a period of time in the year,
(08:57):
the sandhill cranes would come inand they would be there for certain.
What I can't remember,it's the summer, the winter, whatever.
But they come in for a certaintime of year.
I grew up on a golf course,you know, like a golf course.
I mean, it's Florida.
That's the thing is, I think, you know,
and the sandhill craneswere really interesting because at night
and I had friendsthat lived in the neighborhood,
so I'd walkor ride my bike or whatever at night.
(09:18):
And if you saw them, like on the golfcourse
nearby, like by the street,I would think they were people sometimes.
And so a lot of people are like,you can't be a sandhill cranes.
They're too short and whatever.
I'm like, no, if you see them at night
and you can't quite judgedistance and size
and you see this weird thing moving,especially if it flaps its wings
or whatever, you're like, oh, Jesus, fuck,what the hell is that?
(09:40):
And that happenedmultiple times to me growing up.
So I do think there is some validityto thinking that could be cause
for some of the sightings.
Maybe not all of them,but it's some of them.
Owls are also farlarger than people realize.
Yeah. Yep.
(10:00):
Absolutely.
Like I'm going to die,especially if their wings spread is out.
They can get to five and a half six feetlong and their eyes are more human
in like where they areon their heads, basically.
And if a light reflects off the eyes,they can look like they're glowing red.
So there is some validity to that too,that skeptics, deism, people
that are more quoteunquote pro Mothman think that it could be
(10:22):
something supernaturalthat is trying to warn people,
not necessarily attacking people,usually in the thoughts about Mothman.
They're also have been these sightingsacross time, near,
near and close to when some big disastersthis happened,
like Chernobyl and Fukushimaand other bridge collapses.
There's these, like, random accounts ofpeople seeing Mothman before they happen.
(10:45):
I will sayyou can't confirm those accounts.
That just typically happensin like articles.
I'd be like, oh,people saw the Mothman before Fukushima.
And it's like, okay, but whowhere is that?
Where's that evidence?
And it tends to be one ofthose like, internet things.
So he caused it is what you're saying?
(11:06):
Yeah, before we get into Chicagohere, Chicago.
See, I, I drifted into it.
It's just it's just I just wantedto sort of reiterate that people have this
either zoological saying,like Bigfoot, it's just a creature.
We've yet to to discover or this sort ofparent natural parent natural.
That's right.
I host a show I taught a parent at.
(11:28):
Yeah.
Paranormal creature that, is sort of more
interdimensional or something like that.
All right, so Chicago, what does thishave to do with the masked man?
Well, about.
Well, ten plus years ago, around2011 is when it starts.
But suddenly a lot of sightings aroundChicago
(11:50):
of a mothman type of creaturebegins appearing.
And usually aroundthe O'Hare airport area.
2011 iskind of when they relatively start.
Well, wait, wait.
(12:10):
Hold on. You may not be aware of it.
When did you leave Chicago?
So that's about the timethat the sightings start to dip.
I think we're on to something.
(12:32):
I, I think we're you're missing somethinghere, Oliver.
You're not seeing itfrom the perspective of people around you.
You're thinking about it from yourself.I think we're on to something.
I think we figured out why the Mothmanwas in Chicago, and it's all due to you.
Oh, man. Well,that's the end of the episode.
We figured it out.
(12:54):
Wow. I did not expect that.
That is awesome.
So anyway, so let's ignore that.
That Oliver is the Mothman.
Let's look at it from more of a. Yeah.
So in Chicago, I'm going to go oversome of the specific encounters in history
of when this started and rumors,
like I've already mentionedabout the Mothman in Chicago.
First, first surfaced around 2011.
(13:18):
And this is documented.
There's three main researchersthat have been compiling these stories.
I'll providelinks to all their work in the show notes.
A lot of people that are skeptical of thisdon't believe these guys.
I actually thinkthey're really fascinating people,
and I like a lot of their work.
Even though I am also a skepticof of the Mothman,
and there are now hundredsof sightings of the Mothman in Chicago,
(13:41):
sort of informally, more formally,there's like 85 ish, like formal,
like talk to a lot of reporterstried to share information.
Some of them have snapped photos,just a lot of sightings.
So a story where it kind ofstarted is around October 13th, 2011.
Where were you, Oliver?
On October 13th, 2011?
(14:05):
Okay, so maybe it's not you.
Haha.
So on October 13th, 2011,there's a story from a gentleman
who took a photo of this bat like man
looking creature and he describes,
oh shoot, Oliver, I made a mistakeand I I'll, I'll leave this
(14:27):
in October13th is when he shared his story.
But this allegedly happened on August22nd,
probably when you were in Chicago.
Yeah.
Yeah, exactly.
So according to this man, he was travelingthrough the suburbs of Chicago,
and he came across a local businesswith this tall sculpture of, like,
(14:49):
a Native American on its roof.And he thought it was interesting.
And he snapped a photo of this sculptureand then drove.
Tom drove home again. I host a show.
I can talk.
He laternoticed going through these photos
that there's a winged creature offin the distance flying.
And that is the first sort of where
(15:10):
the Chicago sightingssort of began is with this guy.
When he's sharing this photoand sharing the story.
In September,a woman was awakened, terrified
because her roommate was screaming,and she went to go talk to her roommate.
And her roommate said, there's somethingwith red eyes looking through her window.
Her third floor window, mind you,
(15:31):
the roommate sort of.
Yes, yes.
The to add to the story,though, is the roommate that did sort of
come to the
the the woman who was terrified downthen left and threw another window,
(15:53):
saw something that looked like a facewith red eyes looking in.
And yeah, this is what's fascinatingabout these stories,
by the way,because I do not believe in the Mothman.
I love these stories.I love these accounts.
But all the accounts
I'm going to share today,and a lot of the accounts
that anybody can look up on Redditand YouTube and in some newspapers
and other things I can linkto, all the accounts seem very
(16:17):
legitimate.
I think people really did experiencesomething or see something.
It's just okay.
Is it a,you know, a reflection from a brake light?
Is it you know, you're drunk or whatever?
(16:41):
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
I mean, it'sI mean, hey, that's kind of why it fits.
Because a lot of people are like,why do they call it a mothman?
It's like a person with, like, wings.
It could be a bat, man.
Maybe there's a,you know, a litigation issue.
Yeah.
Yeah, it could be the owl dude.
(17:02):
Or, you know, the gargoyle man.
Yeah, I know, I'm sorry. I'm sorry.
So I do want to say that as much as they.
The common story here is that in 2011,some sightings around
Chicago of this Mothman as creaturestart showing up, you can actually trace
reports of a similar creatureto much earlier in the area.
(17:22):
And that is where you and Iare going to do a scene.
Oliver.
So this is a a fictional recreation.
I have to describe that a little better.
So this is a I'm using the real dialog
from this gentleman, Gerald,who you're going to read
who saw something in 1957,in the Chicago area
(17:42):
that is very much akin to Mothman,where this interview is fictional,
is he didn't actually do this,telling it to a reporter.
He shared it in recent years to one of thethe gentleman
who's been investigating these Mothmansightings over email and phone calls. I've
just changed it to a a sit down thing,just to be honest about what I'm doing.
All right.
(18:03):
So, I'll read the descriptionsand the reporter you'll read.
Gerald, you're good to go.
You feel good about this?
And I.
Absolutely. Before we dive into it,you're much smarter than I am.
Do you know how topronounce Gerald's last name?
(18:30):
There you go.
That's what I mean. I'mgoing to go with that.
So when I'm wrong and I get emailsabout it, people complain about you.
We. Yeah.
To write,
to rise, I'mgoing to say I'm going to go with you.
Right. Okay. All right, here we go.
A reporter sits in Gerald terrorizesliving room.
Gerald is a lively 79 years old and entersthe room holding a cup of coffee,
(18:51):
which he hands to the reporter.
Thank you.
Gerald sits in a warm
La-Z-Boy across from the reporter.
So you were telling me about thiscreature?
(19:47):
That.
That was that.
Are there any other details you can share?
(20:12):
You're welcome,
I guess I don't know, So.
Bye. I love how.
So I love the idea that this
something has been seen in the areabefore, like, the notoriety
sort of started happening and where the,the mass media started looking at it.
(20:34):
There are many other earlier accountsthat some researchers have put together,
which you can read about.
I'll provide links in the show notesspecifically on a singular 40 incom,
which is a great site I've usedin the past for other topics, but he has,
put togetherbasically a timeline of sightings,
which is really fun to go through.And you can link to news
articles and interviewsand all sorts of stuff like that.
(20:57):
So yeah.
So the Mothman may not have shown upin 2011 and may have been there
the whole time.
(21:24):
Okay.
Right, right.
(21:49):
Yeah.
(22:17):
Yeah, yeah.
And it.
And also we'll get into some of the,the Chicago accounts here in a minute.
But a lot of the sightingswhen this all sort of picked up
starting in 2011, it kind of culminated.
The peak of the sightings was in 2017.
There were like over 50 sightingsthat year that was reported.
And a lot of them were from pilots.
Like there are pilots. There's a story.
(22:38):
I don't think I have it in my listI'm going to share.
But there were pilots coming in, to landand they saw this, like, distant thing.
We looked at O'Hare. Yeah.
And they saw this distant thing.
Looked like a mansort of off towards the end of the runway.
And then suddenlythe man just sort of lifted up
and looked like it had wingsand, like, flew away.
And it was a pilot and copilotthat saw it.
(22:59):
There's been a lot of other pilotsand like security people
and people working on the runwaysthat have seen just weird
things that are it looks like a giant,
more humansized, shaped bird like creature.
(23:22):
Oh, seriously,
I that's that's so fascinatingbecause one of the big questions,
I literally have it written in my notesright here.
Why the airport, Oliver?
What are why tell me why the airport?
Yeah.
Midway.
Right?
Yeah.
(24:07):
Oh, interesting.
Yeah.
Yeah.
(24:37):
Yeah, that's a good point.
And honestly, it kind of.
It kind of goes down each theory,right, of the people that think
this is some kind of cryptid like,undiscovered creature.
And it also fits into, like,maybe it's a large bird
that's being misidentifiedbecause of distance and lighting
and all the other things that go into sortof misjudging those, those details.
And so it kind of fits into both of those.
(24:59):
I would think.
Yeah.
That's right.
(25:24):
Yeah.
Yeah.
It does.
It really does.
Yeah. Absolutely.
Yeah.
(25:45):
Really?
Oh, okay.
Okay. Yes.
(26:20):
Interesting.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I mean, it's one of the busiest airportsin the country.
I have been delayed in O'Haremore than in any other airport
and I didn't really think about ittill you pointed it out, but it seems it's
(26:43):
most airports are outside of cities,
so you kind of like,got to go outside of the metropolitan area
where O'Hare seems like it's like in amore developed area, which is interesting.
like in even in my time out there,
we saw a giant expansion of
(27:29):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Interesting.
I love your comment about the owls,because that is one of the series
(27:51):
that a lot of thesesightings are just misidentified owls.
And if you're seeing a lot of
owls in Chicagothat is worth taking note of.
So yeah. Interesting.
Do you want to read a sighting?
So I think you can just read
whatever that first little thing is.
(28:48):
that is pulled from Reddit.
I forgot to write down the user.
I will try to look that up or providea link to that so people can find it.
One of my favorite aspects of this story,and I don't do a lot of cryptid stories
on on my show, but I do think the Mothmanis relatively fascinating.
And I do think the fact that, like,Chicago had this huge splurge of Mothman,
(29:08):
so to speak, sightings recentand recent history, that it's fascinating.
But I there are so many accounts on Reddit
that all
are really interesting,including this one, and I like small ones.
Whenever people like describedtoo much, often like, and it's you're
either bullshitting or you totally didsomething like, that's not what it is.
Yeah.
Whereit's like these kind of passive things,
(29:30):
are really fascinating to me.
And so that's one of them.There's another one
from the Chicago subreddit,not from like a mothman subreddit.
Which do you mind reading?
The second one there.
(30:37):
Very nice.
Yeah, yeah.
So, just another interesting.
Oh. Do you really?
(30:59):
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's.
Yeah.
(31:21):
That is a great question.
And I'm not a baseball fan,so I don't let me look at it.
Cubs winning.
2016.
I think
2017 was the peak, butthere were still some sightings of 2016.
I think the account you just readwas later than that.
(31:44):
I didn't write it down, butif memory serves, I think that was 2019.
Yeah. Yes.
Yes. So that's one of my series.
And not just mine.
(32:04):
There are many other peoplethat think that too. And,
so I sort ofput that at the end of various things.
This could be it could bemisidentification of owls or giant birds
or, you know, just misjudging sizeand distance, which is super easy to do.
And the other thing is mass hysteria,
which I look backand I mentioned it with the first Mothman
stories in 1966 where like,the town was like, rebel, rebel, rebel.
(32:27):
Let's go get this thing.
Well, of course,
if the whole town is doing that, peopleare going to think they're seeing it.
And so I do think when, when these storiesin Chicago started to get press,
I do think it caused more sightingsbecause people are now thinking about it.
When you think about something like that,you think you see it,
especially when things are at darkin the distance, like a lot
(32:49):
of the photos that have come up of like,could this be the Mothman?
They're really far awayand they're like zoomed in.
And when you're yes,
you know, in digital photographyyou're getting weird pixel ization.
If you try to create it,if you use AI to like
make it more high def and clean itup, well, AI is just creating information.
It's not using what's really there.
(33:10):
So it's making something look like a wingthat may not have been a wing, and
so on and so forth.
could be something that's sweepingby the camera.
absolutely.
So I do think mass hysteria, that'sone of my favorite theories for this, just
because I think people get really into itand they are people really into it.
People are still sharingstories on Reddit,
(33:31):
on the on these topics constantly, like,oh my God, I saw this thing.
In fact, here there's a story,
I came across researching thisfrom a woman named Lady Jane Gray, a Laura
Jane Grace. Excuse me.
And Lady Jane.
And this is just, on the Instagram.
And I think this was within the last year,but she tells a story
where she's just laying on her porchin Chicago at night,
(33:52):
and this giant human shaped thingflew overhead.
And she said it sort of flewalmost like a Superman pose.
But then it also kind of flipped overon its back, and at one point it went like
almost standing and was like stoppedin the air for a bit and then left.
Which is really weird.
She also mentioned it had a tail.
Not all sightings mentioned. Tails.
(34:12):
A lot of people sayit doesn't have a tail.
Her sighting.She said she thought she saw something.
It looked like a long tailon the creature.
I'll also say this.
Oh, okay.
(34:39):
It does?
Yeah,
yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah I do too, I do too.
And I think peoplethat don't think it's an owl
or even like the sandhill cranes thingwhen I was researching this.
(35:00):
And that's one of the theoriesthat I've brought up a lot today.
But there are peoplethat are like vehemently against that.
They're like, no, no, that'stiny heads or eyes or little, little.
Again,just because I have personal experience
with seeing them multiple times,being like, oh Jesus, like your eyes
and your brain, where humans,we fill in gaps of information.
(35:21):
Yes. Oh,
there there are, there's those big cranesand big owls and things like that.
So, so I do think that's why, again,I think there's validity
to just misidentification.
I'm not saying it's every sighting,but I do think there's misidentification.
I do think cranes could be that, as well,especially when they have like six foot
wide wingspan.
It's like, you see that you're goingto think that's bigger than it is,
(35:43):
especially depending on the angleand stuff that you see it.
Yeah, yeah.
(36:18):
Right.
Yeah.
It makes sense.
Yeah.
Yeah it does.
So here I'm going to share a story.
This is not a quote verbatim storybut it's one that
I particularly likedjust because I think it was kind of scary.
(36:38):
And I like scary things in an eeriesort of way.
But there was a pilot that shared a story,where he was staying
at the airport hotelbefore a flight out the next night,
and he leaves and checks out of the hotel,gets in his shuttle.
It's driving through the O'Hare, you know,whatever the maze, whatever you call it,
to get to get into things.
And as he's on the shuttleout of the window, he sees up on a railing
(37:02):
on, like, this building next to him.
There's a railing that's up high,and there's a creature
crouching on the railing, and it's like,put out its wings, so to speak.
And even though it's crouching,the guy's like,
you could tell it's this huge thing.
He thinks it looks like, man heightand the wings spread was just giant.
And he said, the thingthat was most shocking and scary
(37:24):
are these like red eyesthat seem to reflect.
And it looks like the creature
was watching his shuttle as it drove by,and the eyes kind of followed him,
and he was just super weirded outand didn't know what it was.
And when he got off of the shuttle,he kept looking back in that direction
to be like, oh God, is it following me?
Is that whatever that thing is it
it fly this way, I don't know,he didn't see it again after he drove by.
(37:45):
But again, it's that quickkind of witness account.
It's that which I think I really dothink this guy saw something, you know,
it's like that little bit of thingwith just the right amount of information.
Yeah.
(38:05):
Yeah.
(38:46):
Oh, interesting.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It is, it is.
I'm going to share one more story.
Please. It's a little longer.
(39:07):
And this comes from Phantom in Monsters,a website.
I'll provide links to it.
Run by Lorne Strickler, who was oneof the main researchers behind the Chicago
Mothman, who's been compiling interviewsand talking to witnesses.
And I'm going to read this.
I've edited itvery slightly, just for time.
But it's still a little bit lengthy.
But I'll read this guy's account, andthis was from the Mukwonago, Wisconsin.
(39:31):
So I wanted to share thisbecause it also just shows that Midwest
Lake area,even though it's not Chicago proper.
Yes. All right. So here's his story.
I was sitting inside my car,which was parked facing north
in the driveway at my homelocated between Eagle,
Palmyra and Mukwonago, Wisconsin.
I had been having an extended phoneconversation
(39:52):
with an old friend on the way home,and had not gone inside the house yet.
And remember looking at the radio clockat approximately 10:45 p.m.,
I looked up briefly from the dashof my vehicle and momentarily
noticed someone who was very,very, very tall and very dark.
Just standing in the rainabout 5 to 10ft in front of the vehicle.
(40:13):
I did a double takeand was suddenly, suddenly thought,
wait a minute, what the fuck was that?
I was looking at a creature,for lack of a better term,
that essentially looked like a seven footbat reptile of some sort.
The head was at the level of the roof
of my minivan,or slightly more elevated than the roof,
and it was standing perfectlystill, just staring right at me.
(40:33):
Its eyes were large, and althoughthey were dark like large black eyeballs,
there was a glint of reflection in them,which allowed me to discern
that they were, in fact,definitely its eyes slightly reflective,
light skin or scales of some kind,not feathery or fur covered.
I realizedthat it actually had huge wings,
but they were wrapped around its bodyexactly as a bat
(40:54):
wraps its wings around its bodywhile sleeping upside down.
Exceptthis thing was standing right side up,
looking at me or almost through me.
And let me just say, itdefinitely seemed ominous.
My initial reaction was to tell my buddyon the phone that I was looking right
at a giant bat dragon.
I noticed thatit seemed to very quickly move,
(41:17):
although I did not see itunwrap its wings or walk per se.
But there was simply what I will describeas a brief blur in the headlights,
and it was gone.
Well, that makes sense.
I think it was
yeah, get a wrap up.
It's the Midwest and stuff.
It's got a layer, don't you know poofter.
(41:39):
Yeah.
All right, so.
There are some during the day.
In fact, that first photo that sort ofstarted the whole thing in 2011,
(42:00):
that was during the day.
So that's kind of it's interesting.
But again,it's really far in the distance.
And that kind of.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Most of them are.
Yeah for sure.
Yeah.
(42:37):
That is very true.
And if you even.
that that is a good point.
And I do want to mention one thingtoo, that we haven't come back to,
but there's a lot of thought that the,the original, quote unquote original,
the OG Mothman from Point Pleasant,West Virginia, was this harbinger of doom
or someone providing a warning creature,warning that there's a disaster coming.
(43:01):
And so people brought that up withChicago of like, if the Mothman is real
and that is a thing,what is it trying to say about Chicago?
I'll say the point, pleasant thing.
It was a yearpeople started seeing Mothman.
A year later, there's a disaster.
Chicago, as we've now pointed out tonight,this has been going on a long time.
So I am not one to jumpinto that bandwagon of like, oh,
(43:22):
Chicago should be worried.
But it is scary tothink about that is for sure.
Yeah, yeah,
yeah.
(44:26):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Oh, interesting.
(44:46):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
(45:23):
Way to perfectly wrap up the episode.
Oliver. And
I'm keeping an open mind.
I don't know what this thing is.
I think you're on to something
by by mentioninghow it could be a variety of things.
And I'm definitely keeping an open mindthat it might have been you
(45:45):
the whole time as well, because that's.
But that's my job
as host of a study of strangersI have to keep, even when I'm skeptical.
I have to keep an open mind andI'm always willing to learn something new.
Mothman.
so on that note,
is there anything else you want to share?
Do you want people to find you anywhere?What do you want?
What do you want,Oliver? Tell me. I'll make it happen.
(46:26):
Yes, as you should.
Well, thank you so much for joining me.
This is, a fascinating topic.
Very odd, very strange.
And ends. And so am I.
Thank youfor being part of the strangeness Now,
if you'll excuse me,I have a flight at O'Hare to catch.
Thank youfor listening to a study of strange.
If you're interestedin this topic of Mothman in Chicago.
(46:48):
There's a lot of accounts.
There's a lot of information way too muchto share in one episode of my show.
So I'm providing as many links as I canthink of in the show notes.
Check those out.
Very special thank you to Oliver Bergerfor being our special guest today.
And hey, if you like this stuff,you know what?
Check us out on Instagramat A Study of Strange.
Until next time. Thank you and good night.
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