February 27, 2024 • 49 mins
When we think about meeting the needs of today’s students, accessibility is front of mind. Join host Zac Macinnes as he sits down with Sara Easler, Ph.D., Assistant Dean of International Programs & Partnerships in the Haslam College of Business at the University of Tennessee, for a critical conversation centered on supporting students with disabilities who seek to study abroad. We’ll touch on accommodations, disclosure, visible vs. invisible needs, and our responsibilities to ensure that our programs are within reach of all students. Tune in to learn more about resources you can use right away to champion access on your campus.
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Episode Transcript
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(00:04):
It intertwines with many conversations thatour campuses are having related to diversity,
equity, inclusion, and especially belonging,and I think fostering environments where students
feel like they can disclose. I think that'sreally step one. Hello, everyone. Welcome to
this episode of World Strive's podcast, ChangingLives Through Education Abroad, a weekly series
(00:26):
of conversations with international education'smost interesting thought leaders. as well as
discussions on emerging trends, best practices,innovation happening in our field. I'm your
host, Sat McInnis, and I work on the CampusPartnerships Team here at World Strides. Today,
we're diving into a very hot and very timelytopic in 2024, accessibility and study abroad.
(00:49):
We'll be talking about how we, as educationabroad practitioners, can best support students
with disabilities and what higher educationinstitutions as a whole can do to enhance support
systems and practices to foster a more inclusivestudy abroad experience for these students.
It's my honor to welcome a distinguished guestonto the podcast to explore this topic with
(01:13):
us. Dr. Sarah Eesler is the Assistant Dean ofInternational Programs and Partnerships in
the Haslam School of Business at the Universityof Tennessee. I know she has spent a lot of
time thinking about this topic, and I can'timagine a better person to help us unpack.
all things related to students with disabilitiesand study abroad. So without further ado, let's
(01:35):
get into it. Dr. Sarah Eesler, welcome to theshow and thank you for being here. Thank you
for having me. Could you please start us offby sharing a bit about your background, your
career trajectory and what you are up to thesedays as Assistant Dean of International Programs
and Partnerships at UT? Well, background, Iam from South Carolina. originally. I am a
(01:58):
graduate triple alumnus from the Universityof South Carolina. I would say that I was one
of those students, particularly as an undergrad,especially as an undergrad, that had really
not a great idea of what I wanted to do or bewhen I grew up. And I was pursuing a degree
in journalism and mass comm and kind of decidedsecond semester of senior year that I wasn't
(02:22):
really sure
But I did know that I needed to pay the bills,and so I wanted to graduate and felt like Mass
Comm Communication degree, that's a great degree,right? Those are skills that you can use in
literally any career path or whatnot. And itwasn't like I had some epiphany of what I did
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want to do. So, you know, changing didn't makea lot of sense. But I was a very lucky young
person in the sense that I was... hired intoa position that really introduced me to international
education, specifically in the field of medicalscience and research. And it really just opened
my eyes to the ways in which we are sharinginformation across the globe, particularly
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among academic institutions, and really gotme fired up and got me a lot of experience
working across borders for the preparation ofacademic medical conferences. And so I gained
a lot of really strong and important administrativeskills in that, but then also sort of found
that I really liked this international thing.I thought it was fun. It allowed me to travel,
(03:26):
which I obviously loved. And so there were piecesof it that I just thought were really great.
And after five years of that, I was hired intothe business school at the University of South
Carolina in international business, where programmingreally was not my job at all. That was not,
I was hired in an administrative position exclusivelyin the Department of International Business.
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And I was... fortunate to have an amazing mentorin that space that really just continued to
nurture and foster this idea of internationaland international business. And he gave me
this amazing opportunity. I found this fledglinglittle faculty led program one day and I was
like what is this thing that's over here thatsometimes I see we have billing for sometimes
we don't what is this thing? And he says youknow well it's a program we run in Central
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Europe sometimes we have enough students mostthe time we don't it's kind of just this thing
that comes and goes from time to time. And hesaid, you know, actually, if you wanted to
take it on, you could travel with the program.We'd pay for you to travel with the students
if you got it. But you know, you gotta like,go do your actual job first. So this would
be like a side project. And I was like, hmm,all I heard in that sentence was free travel.
(04:37):
And so I did. I got the students, traveled withthem for the first time. And man, I was in
love. Traveling and working with students really,was never on my radar, but we just had such
a great time. I got to experience it alongsidethem, which was really fun and inspiring. And
from there, it was one program, and then itwas two, and then it was 21. And before I knew
(05:02):
it, that same mentor was like, let's be honestwith ourselves, this is your job now. And so
I became the director of the program for ourfaculty led and for the international business.
graduate and undergraduate programs at the Universityof South Carolina. And so that's the work I
was doing. In the meantime, during all of that,that same mentor was like, so when are you
(05:24):
getting that master's degree? And then Mit Stridein that master's, he's like, so when are you
getting your PhD? And so he really sort of nudgedme very much along and I'm eternally grateful
for having such amazing guidance from him. We'restill very connected today even.
(05:45):
tell me which direction to go and what I, youknow, why aren't you thinking about this? Or
what are you doing here? And so he was reallycritical to my career. And then of course I
came to Tennessee and had the great opportunityto start a program from scratch there that
didn't exist. The Office of International Programsand Study Abroad was brand new. And so I was
brought on at UT to build it. And who gets thatkind of opportunity? Again, you know, the lucky.
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the lucky turn of events. I mean, no one getsto start from scratch, a brand new office,
a brand new initiative. I was very, very fortunateto get to do that. And then same story just
sort of grew from there. And last year I becamethe Assistant Dean for the college in International
Programs and Furniships. Thank you so much forsharing that, Sarah. I'd like to open our conversation
today by asking you to share some basics forour folks who may be newer to learning about
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accessibility as it relates to study abroad.What, for example, is an accommodation and
how common are disabilities as a whole? So anaccommodation is probably, if people are working
in higher ed or in an education of any space,they've probably heard this term accommodation
before. And really it's just a modificationor alteration of the environment, of the content,
(07:00):
of the delivery method to open up access foran individual who may need. In most cases in
the classroom, we hear about additional timeor testing accommodations, a quieter space,
those kinds of things, in addition to the waysin which accommodation can be related to a
physical disability, increasing access to physicalspaces on your campus or in your classroom.
(07:24):
That term is probably one that people have heardbefore. Often what's attached to that is this
idea of what is considered a reasonable accommodation.That word reasonable appears a lot in the legislature
related to accommodation. All of that in highered especially is determined typically through
an office of student disability services wherethey would evaluate a student must first request,
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which is a big difference between higher edand K through 12 education, a student must
request accommodation and then they're typicallyevaluated off of medical documentation that
the student presents to that office. And thenfrom there reasonable accommodation is determined
by that office of student disability services.The determination of accommodation isn't typically
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ever made, I'm not aware of any instance whereit's made by an academic unit or department
or even a study abroad office. That is reallydriven by the professionals in your disability
services area where they have the credentialsto evaluate the medical diagnoses as well as
the recommended accommodation by a physician.So Sarah, you touched upon the importance of
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the Office of Disability Services on mini campus.Do you have any pro tips for our listeners,
for education abroad practitioners, about partneringwith an office of disability services? How
can we best work together? Get to know thatoffice before you need them. That's my greatest
piece of advice, right? So many times on campuswe're in that reactionary mode. This challenge
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has presented itself, and now I need to figureout who in the world is this contact and where
exactly do they live on campus? And oh, by theway, we don't have a prior relationship, so
I have to start from scratch. That just slowsthe process down, right? And I think that for
any of us in education in general, not necessarilyjust international ed, knowing who these people
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are on campus, who are your colleagues, whoare your content experts on campus, get to
know them early and visit with them with somefrequency, because they're gonna be the experts
on the regulation, what is required and whatis reasonable. They're gonna have the greatest
sense of what that looks like from a legislativestandpoint. They're also gonna have incredible
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guidance for what's going on in the field, intheir field, right? We think about the way
that we connect across international ed. Theyhave their own set of colleagues around the
globe and around the country that they can connectwith to help with resources. And so helping
them to sort of know that you're there, you'reinterested, you care, you want to be a resource
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to students, because that's going to help informationflow in both directions, right? Your challenge
presents itself, you know exactly who you'recalling, it's a familiar face. is someone that
you've built a trusting relationship with andvice versa. The student might present the disability
and desire to study abroad to them and not toyou. And so the same thing happens, right?
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They go to that professional on your campusand then that professional knows who to contact
back. And so it really creates that pathwayof communication and disclosure from students
because one challenge that I have seen morethan once in our programs is that That idea
of disclosure is one that sometimes I neverhear. Sometimes a student never discloses that
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they have any sort of disability or accommodation.Sometimes I hear it too late in the process,
which is very hard to maneuver sometimes. Sometimesit's not that big of a deal and we can sort
of mitigate fairly quickly. Other times it presentsa number of challenges that if I had just had
forewarning, we could have really wrapped ourarms around the situation much more quickly
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and effectively. It just improves outcomes ifwe have that multiple points and avenues of
disclosure. So my tip would be make friends.Make friends. I love what you said about the
communication flowing both ways and us reallysupporting one another. I think that's really
great advice. I want to ask you a broad question.Sarah, in your experience, what are some of
the unique challenges that students with disabilitiesface when they embark on a studying abroad
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journey? That's a complicated question becauseit really depends. It depends on what exactly
is the disability or accommodation that we'reworking with. It depends on the type of programming
that the student is interested in. In many cases,it is a case-by-case basis. There are certainly
some that, you know, as I mentioned, will easilymove through the process and it's not terribly
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disruptive. There are others that are more complicatedand so it's quite situational. For example,
if a student was visiting a host institutionfor a full semester, The challenges that are
presented there are often shared with the partnerinstitution. So what accommodations do they
have? What kind of services and resources dothey have? If it's instead a faculty-led or
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itinerant program that has them doing all kindsof things that might be remote or outside of
cities and, you know, in areas where, you know,we might not be able to control every single
situation. that's really different kind of planningthat has to occur there. And so it really is
very much situational as to what is the kindof program and what is the kind of accommodation
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that the student is seeking or needing. So Iwould encourage anybody that's been presented
with a disclosure to really consider what isthe type of programming. Hopefully you're hearing
about this disclosure very early on in the processand the student is coming to you because they
want your help. identifying and matching tothe right program for that that's best case
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scenario, right? You learn about it early on,what exactly are our needs here and how, and
you have plenty of time to do adequate researchand to guide the student along their path.
That's certainly ideal situation, right? Alternatively,though, it's, we often hear about it after
the fact and it's instead how do we sort ofmatch and best mitigate? Sarah, I wanna lift
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up that you are Dr. Isler. and your terminaldegree included a dissertation titled, A Litigation
Analysis of the Extra-Territoriality of US FederalLaws and International Education. What a fascinating
topic. Clearly, one of your areas of expertiseis around litigation and its relationship to
students with disabilities and the responsibilitiesrelated to discrimination. Could you unpack
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that for us and share a bit about how you cameto be interested in this area of professional
practice? My interest in this is facing in bothdirections. Certainly understanding what are
the students' rights and how can we be supportiveto students is sort of the front-facing, the
access piece is what is really interesting tome and got me on this path. What I discovered,
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however, in this is from an institutional perspective,if I put on my other hat, right, my student
services hat is equity access for the students.And I think that many of us would share that.
I'm not sure why we would be in this field ifwe didn't share those same interests and goals.
My other hat, however, is that of an administratorof the university. And so understanding what
is our role and responsibility and also riskof litigation. And so that's the other side
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of it that I found to be really complex andthere's not this really obvious path or roadmap
as to what exactly is our role and responsibility,particularly when we can't control the environment
entirely. And that's where I think that I becamemost interested as how do we navigate these
statutes that are in place where guidance canchange often, sometimes based on administration
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and how they interpret the guidance.
civil rights and it presents some spaces thatare quite challenging to think through. We
all want to be accommodating and yet we're sendingstudents to destinations that have ancient
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structures and probably not always easy or quickaccess to elevators or ramps in the case of
a physical disability. And those, however, ifwe look at the data really represent a small
portion of the students that are going abroadand instead those quote-unquote hidden disabilities
that really do often require disclosure, wecan't control all of those environments. We
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can't control the statutes abroad. We can'tcontrol the behaviors of our partners. We can
just hope that they're good partners and thatwe've nurtured a relationship of access and
accommodation. And so I think that was the pieceof it where as an administrator, I wanted to
really understand what was our risk and responsibilityin this. I mentioned previously that the statutes
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use this really ambiguous language around reasonableaccommodation, and yet reasonable is never
defined. And what is reasonable to one personor institution may not be reasonable to another.
And that is a really very gray space that weall need to think through and recognize what
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exactly do we determine to be reasonable accommodation.We talked about important partners on campus
and this certainly our offices of disabilityservices are one general council probably needs
to be another because at the end of the daywe want to make sure that we're doing what's
right by the student but we have to also considerinstitutional risk as part of that as well
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and so those are issues that are very oftenin alignment but not always and so it's a complicated
issue and one without. direct answers in manycases. Easy solutions. Yeah, you have to be
thinking about that. The meaning of the wordreasonable and how that can vary from person
to person and there can be so much interpretationthere. And some of these could require an incredible
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amount of cost. And so you think about, well,who determines what is a reasonable cost? And
truly in any given academic year and any givenbudget situation. at any given institution,
right, the variety of available financial resourcesis varied. And so that idea of reasonable accommodation
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is certainly a gray space that is not clearlydefined in the statutes. And who gets to make
that decision, I imagine. And so that leadsme to my next question, Sarah. It's another
broad one, another big one. How can higher educationinstitutions proactively enhance support systems
or practices? to facilitate a more inclusivestudy abroad experience for students with disabilities?
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I think a lot of it comes down to, it intertwineswith many conversations that our campuses are
having related to diversity, equity, inclusion,and especially belonging. And I think fostering
environments where students feel like they candisclose, I think that's really step one, because
we have available resources, right? We havepeople who are professionals in all of these
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areas, and we can bring ourselves together toproblem solve to the best of our ability. but
we can't do it if we don't know that that'san issue. And many students, regardless of
ability status, many students see study abroadas an ability to escape. And sometimes that
means they're escaping turmoil at home. Theywant a little bit of escapism. Oftentimes I
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have heard from students that disclosed laterthat they had this disability with an available
accommodation for any other circumstance oncampus. But for this one semester, they didn't
want to have to have that lens or that stigmaor that identity, and they didn't disclose
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for what was a less than optimal outcome. Andso that environment of having it be a welcoming
space and one where people feel like they cancome talk to you and that you are an advocate
for them, I really think that that's step one.and having those relationships across campus
where it really is that someone feels like theycan, they know who to call when there is a
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situation that requires more than one set ofeyes. You mentioned the importance of early
disclosure. What are some other needs that educationabroad professionals might find it easy to
get tripped up when it comes to working withstudents? And what words of advice would you
have for how we can best create a climate that'sconducive to students disclosing their needs
early and what other advice would you have?I think reminding our students more than once,
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you know, many of us, if we're teaching in theclassroom, we have a syllabus where day one,
syllabus day, we talk about, don't forget todisclose to me and to the Office of Disability
Services, any accommodation for which you mightbe eligible. We do that really frequently in
the classroom. I don't know that we do it asfrequently with our students otherwise. And
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so thinking about how you can encourage youradvisors and otherwise to... almost to have
it as a disclaimer, not every student is gonnaneed to hear it, but it opens an invitation.
And perhaps even the student might not haveeven been thinking about that just yet, right?
Study abroad can be a really overwhelming experiencefor some of our students and the volume of
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questions that they have can be large and intimidating.And so maybe it's not that they're choosing
not to disclose, maybe that's just not enteredtheir thought pathway just yet, right? And
so. kind of reminding students that this isan area of importance and that we need to think
about it and we can help you with that. So howcould we introduce that as just a reminder
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for appointments? And I say that now we needto be reminding with more frequency, we need
to be thinking about this. And so remindingourselves to have that reminder is even something
that needs to happen. And I think to the...The ways in which we can just build relationships
and have them feel like it's a safe space tosay these things is, it's really step one.
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I think also for professionals who might beencountering some of these situations and challenges,
especially, you know, oftentimes if we thinkabout who is frontline with our students every
day doing the high volume of student advisingand appointments and that sort of thing, many
times they can be our younger professionals,newer professionals to the field who are in
those advising roles. even sometimes studentpeer advisors that are in those roles. And
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so having them a pathway for elevating the situation,this comes up in a conversation, it might feel
overwhelming to that person, elevate. It's ateam effort, right? We need to remember that
it is a team effort. And so I wanna make surethat anybody in our team, the minute that someone
discloses something, if it's easy, simple, andwe can solve it really quickly, that's wonderful,
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we probably need to catalog it just so thatwe're following up to ensure that everything
is. going as it should. Some of them might befar more complicated and so helping even our
advisors to understand that you don't have tohave the answers to this. And we say this every
single day to every single advisor and to everysingle student. You don't have to have every
single answer in that moment and that's okay.It's okay to say that. It's okay to say this
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is an interesting situation. I'm gonna needto do some more homework on this and we're
probably gonna need to connect to some otherresources. this is the beginning of the conversation,
not the end of the conversation. And so helpingadvisors to realize that like, you don't have
to have all the answers in the moment. I don'thave all of the answers in the moment. I did
an entire dissertation on this. I don't haveall of the answers on this, and I'm gonna need
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to connect to resources as well. And I can tellyou right now, my very first phone call is
gonna be my friends and colleagues in disabilityservices, because that's exactly what needs
to happen. And so. reminding them to do theexact same things that I would do in a situation,
and it's let's build a team, let's collaborate.Yeah, I love what you said about, you know,
those of us in leadership positions, makingsure that our team members have the resources
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and training and knowledge to be able to advisestudents and knowing when they don't know the
answer and being okay with that. I think that'sreally important. Well, it's okay. It's okay
to not know all of the answers all the timein the moment. From what I hear on our team
and what I'm hearing at Go To Crossroom, othersin the field right now, is that students are
advocating for themselves more these days interms of their disabilities now more than ever
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before. One might say that sigma is decreasing,which is a positive step. What would you add
here and what other evolutions or trends areyou noticing? I think it's absolutely true
that we're seeing more students advocate forthemselves and having the stigma removed for
disclosure, which is that self-advocacy is alwayssomething positive, I think. Particularly because
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I think that in the past, so many students didfeel that stigma related to either their disability
or health situation that has hindered theirability to be really successful in higher ed
and especially to in study abroad where we wantstudents to tell us, we want that disclosure
to happen. I think that any area that I've seena lot of change in the last couple of years
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is related to mental health and psychologicaldisability and the willingness of students
to disclose that. And I think there's a lotof data to support that, especially in study
abroad. If I look at the longitudinal data forreporting of mental health, in the last 10
to 12 years, we've seen 15% increase in disclosureof that across all students, in terms of the
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share of disclosures that students might bepresenting. So it's definitely growing. I think
that... Young students in particular, thosethat are transitioning from high school into
higher ed, they need to be well coached on disclosureand that it is indeed their responsibility
as an adult learner. I know that some of usmight argue that idea of adult learner of an
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18-year-old, but truly and legally that is thecase when they turn 18 and then they come to
a higher ed institution. They have to be proactiveabout going to disability service. and registering
their accommodation. And that process is a formalizedone, and it's not one that can be done retroactively.
And so I think that we need to continue to educatestudents about that difference as they're transitioning
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into higher ed, that they do have more responsibilityin that than maybe they would have experienced
in their accommodation plan that would havebeen built out for them in the K through 12
situation. One of the challenges for many ofus that they don't understand that they need
to disclose until later on. And there are limitationsas to what we can do, both in the classroom
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and study abroad, when it's happening afterthe fact. And so it really is, you know, that
situation I described earlier, where a studentis starting to see that outcomes really aren't
that positive. And then, you know, it's theend of the semester and they're saying, they're
disclosing. And I can't go back and re-offerthe course for that student and that's not.
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the way that it works in higher ed. And so helpingthem to really understand that difference and
that transition for our younger students isreally important. And often that conversation
happens well before they come into internationalprograms and study abroad. And that really
is a responsibility across campus and not justin our area to remind students of what their
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role in this needs to be for higher ed and howthey need to perhaps modify their behaviors
as part of that. One place where I know thingscan get tricky is when a student is in a situation
where their accommodation is recognized herein the United States, but that same need is
not recognized formally or recognized differentlyoverseas. I'll give an example that I know
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has come up often in case it's helpful for ourlisteners. We might have a case where a student
utilizes a service animal here in the US, buttheir program host country views that service
animal differently. How could our colleaguesbest support, advise, or advocate for students
in the case of service animals? Even in theUS context, when it comes to animals, the difference
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between what is formally considered a serviceanimal as compared to something that might
be designated as an emotional support animal,those aren't necessarily considered the same
thing. They're not necessarily supported inthe same way. And they're not necessarily protected.
through litigation and ADA in the same way.And so even that distinction in the United
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States, I think many people will see animalsthat are designated as emotional support and
see them as some, as equivalents to a supportor a service animal, service animal being the
true designator of a protected accommodation.And so I think that that's even inside the
United States when it comes to animals, thisis a space where a distinction needs to be
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made for people often. It's a challenging situationand we have no control truly of the protections
of foreign governments. We have no control overthe policies of our foreign or host institutions.
And so those are areas where certainly we wouldtypically with a student, with a service animal,
that's one where disclosure happens becauseit is visible, right? They would have come
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into our office, we would have been able tosee that this is something that we're talking
about. And that matching process and advisingis where that's probably most critical. What
are the countries that we know are going tobe more supportive or have laws or protections
that are more similar to ours? What are theorganizations where we know that we have strong
relationships and that they have similar policiesand philosophies to ours when it comes to accommodation?
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And so that matching process is really important.Students who also have animals are going to
need to consider also that there are going tobe quarantines and other. rules and regulations
for entry of those animals. And so that mightweigh into the decision about destination as
well. Are they gonna need to be separated fromthat animal from any period of time, or is
there more of a through process for that animal?And even daily navigation of that student,
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what are the challenges that we need to be consideringrelated to access and daily life? I mentioned
earlier, you know, some of these cities arevery old cities, cobblestones, not a lot of
elevators, those kinds of things. Do we needto be weighing all of that? Is it something
else entirely? Often, for example, we see thatservice animals are being attached to conditions
like epilepsy, where they're able to predictan oncoming seizure. And so how do we sort
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of navigate that for the student? What kindof different resources are gonna be necessary
for them? And so in some ways, I cautiouslysay that that's an accommodation that we would
know about fairly quickly, soon. The studentwould probably know that they need to disclose
and seek guidance for that kind of situation.In many ways, that might be an easier student
to deal with because we know it. Back to thisconversation, ongoing, repetitive conversation
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about disclosure, it's easier to disclose thatthose students are well-trained in disclosure,
whereas others that are quote unquote hidden,those can sometimes be a little bit harder
to deal with because this might not know. Howcommon would you say disabilities are? The
data would tell us the census of People reportingdisabilities in 2022, which is the most recent
(30:31):
data that we have available, is about 13% ofour entire US civilian population reports some
form of disability. Now that equates to about40 million people who are over the age of 25
who are reporting some kind of disability intheir daily life. If we translate that into
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students who are pursuing higher ed, you know,that results in about 21% or a little bit more
than 8 million people who are holding a bachelor'sdegree or higher who are reporting a disability.
So if we sort of back out from that data, youknow, that really goes to show that in about
21% of our undergraduates and about 11% of ourgrads in U.S. higher education are reporting
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some kind of disability or accommodation needin their degree. That number is certainly higher
for our student veterans. And so they're reportingmuch higher levels of disability or need for
access than are more traditional undergraduates.That compares to about, you know, 38% of those
that are not reporting their disability, whichtypically that would mean that there are a
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number of students who are, have a diagnosisand they would be eligible for accommodation,
but aren't reporting it through the higher ed,you know, formalized system, which is really
challenging. Really, only about 8% of our studentsare registering their disability on campus.
So I think what that means though is that there'swhen we talk about hidden disabilities, oftentimes
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we're using that terminology for referencinga disability that's not visually available
to us that we don't know immediately that astudent could hide. I think in this case, we
could expand that beyond students who have adisability that's not visible to us, but then
also isn't being disclosed at any point in theprocess, which is quite challenging. For those
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of us in the field, I think that means thatwe really need to be thinking about the students
that have known disabilities to us, as wellas those who are completely unknown to us,
and for whatever reason, are deciding to continuein their life and in their degree without disclosing
their disability. We've talked a lot about theimportance of working across campus and the
(32:46):
importance of that partnership with the Officeof Disability Services. But I want to extend
this conversation to faculty. What advice wouldyou give to faculty who may be listening and
studying abroad offices who work with them toprepare them to be course leaders about working
with students with disabilities? In some ways,our faculty might have more training than we're
(33:08):
giving them credit for, particularly if they'rereally in the classroom. on campus with a lot
of frequency, because they are regularly interactingwith those accommodation letters that come
from students, for students from our studentdisability office. They are probably often
more attuned to that than we give them creditfor. The way that we need to work with them
(33:29):
for our international programs is how does thattranslate outside of the classroom? Typically,
when we're talking about faculty, we're sortof narrowing the scope of activity to our faculty-led
programs. And I would always start with thesame sort of questions that I would ask them
on campus. Are there ways in which you couldmodify your syllabus, your deliverables, the
ways in which you're assessing learning to bemore accessible? So is there anything already
(33:54):
in the syllabus related to their academic performanceor how you're going to assess their grade that
could be modified to be more universally accessibleto students? And so that's always question
number one. That's the one that the minute youask it, they will have had other conversations
on campus about that. So could you modify theenvironment? Could you modify the test taking
(34:19):
if that's part of your syllabus? What kind ofmodifications are out there that you are already
familiar with? The ones that would be more specificto this are typically related to environment.
The environment has now changed. We're not typicallyin study abroad. We're not teaching in a classroom,
right? With a four walled. no windowed spacewith a whiteboard and projector. That's not
(34:42):
typically our environment when we've taken studentsabroad. So what do we need to be thinking about?
Are they related to physical disability? Andwe need to be thinking about those kinds of
accommodations that are gonna occur in the naturalenvironment? Are they learning disabilities
where we need to be thinking differently abouthow we might be presenting information, right?
Oftentimes we are having open dialogue in aspace that might be a bus. hard to hear in
(35:09):
that bus? Is it hard to retain information whenyou're not able to see it visually and hear
it audibly? Is that a challenge? If a studenthas an accommodation for recording their lectures
and academic conversations, are you having conversationsthat maybe that feels less comfortable now
because you're talking about topics that areperhaps controversial? What does that sort
(35:31):
of look like for the student and what does thatlook like for the faculty? And so how can we
sort of pull along and again, understand whatthat disclosure and what those reasonable accommodations
are. Our student disability services, and I'msure that others do this as well, the letter
for what is an eligible accommodation is quiteclear. And so knowing in advance what those
classroom environment modifications might needto be are pretty clear to us. And so it's really
(35:56):
just extending that and that, okay, we're notin that traditional classroom space anymore.
What does it look like now? Our field is sointerconnected and none of us has to go it
alone. I want to highlight briefly our healthand safety team here at World Strides, led
by Robin Relaford, who's a friend of the pod.Our team has five full-time staff and a dedicated
accessibility team. The A team, as we call them,endeavors to be very responsive to student
(36:21):
needs and to protect student privacy. But oursis just one model. When deciding who to partner
with, what are some questions universities shouldbe asking? to ensure that the infrastructure
is in place to support students on partner programs.You said it all partnership. It needs to be
a partnership. In many cases, beyond those thatwe're talking about right now with access for
(36:42):
disabilities, you're going to have to call onthat partner. And if you don't have the relationship
in place to make that phone call and to knowwho to call and to trust that they share the
same values that you do, it's not going to bea good thing. And so... I think really thinking
about that partnership and are they indeed apartner with you in this endeavor. I think
(37:06):
too, particularly in the case of ability andability status, that partnership can lend so
many resources that are hard to deliver yourselfbecause you're not on site. And so I think
particularly whenever you're doing that matchingprocess for students with different abilities,
understanding what kind of resources are availableand which ones you might really need is absolutely
(37:31):
critical. And if I think about, for example,our relationship with ISA Worldstrides, that
means that we have on the ground support throughthe study centers, and they can pull along
and build in add-on services that may not beavailable through the partner. You asked earlier
about this situation where maybe the local lawdoesn't regulate that your host institution.
(37:55):
offer certain kinds of accommodations, wellguess what? Maybe your site does. That tutoring
service, the translation services, the on-the-groundsupport, frequent monitoring, all of those
contacts, those relationships, those are thingsthat they can help you mitigate and you're
not there, especially for a full semester, youcan't be there. And so you have to trust and
(38:18):
lean into the partner relationship and the partnerresources that are available to that. My experience
too is that when we've needed these and we havecollaborated on this exact situation more than
once, you can understand, okay, that matchingprocess, I know that I can make a phone call
and say, okay, this is our student situation,we're not married to destination necessarily.
(38:42):
Where can we maneuver? Where do we see as likeour top destination for providing these services
and accommodations? And then we can go intocurriculum matching from there. So. sort of
rank ordering priority for that student andthen finding that match and using your relationship
and partnership to do that, knowing that theycan often provide services that you may not
(39:02):
be as easily able to. Many of our listenerswould like to grow their knowledge base to
better support students with disabilities. Otherthan this podcast that we're recording right
now, Sarah, what are some resources you'd liketo highlight to help folks become more proficient
and comfortable in their work in this area?Certainly there are a lot of resources through
(39:23):
your partnerships that I hope that professionalsare leveraging. You know, you've mentioned
this podcast, for example, there are othersthat are available, blogs and others that I
think that students and student professionalsshould be accessing. I mentioned just now,
not just student professionals, students. Thisidea of self-advocacy is really important and
(39:43):
helping students to understand what are theirrights and responsibilities and all of this
is part of the battle as well. So I think. Consideringhow we're directing our professionals, but
also our students to these resources is huge.This idea of partnership, I really, I can't
stress it enough. Partnership with your relationshipsfor the people, we use the terminology affiliates,
(40:05):
our affiliate partnerships, leveraging resourcesthrough them, leveraging resources through
your student disability offices, leveragingresources through general counsel, getting
to know the people that are on and off yourcampus who really are content experts. because
you're going to bring a lot of expertise inone area, they've got expertise in another,
that teamwork, that collaboration is reallygoing to be helpful, particularly because as
(40:27):
I mentioned, these regulations do change andthe way that they're interpreted and applied
do change. And so you might be an expert, thatlast case that came through your office, you
might be an expert on what was the reg at thattime, that might've changed and your other
professionals are going to know what it is now.And I think also there's a lot of resources
available through the... the different channelsthat we often access. Some of those are professional
(40:51):
organizations. Some of those, however, theymight be much more legalese and less interesting
content, but important to stay abreast of. Departmentof Education can be very legalese, can be very
dry. You might have to get yourself a freshcup of coffee, but sit down and read the regs.
Inform yourself, educate yourself on what arethe regs. IIE always has amazing up-to-date
(41:15):
data. to know what really is the volume of studentsthat we're talking about for study abroad in
general, but also those that we know from institutionalreporting, what is the volume of disability
reports? What is the breakdown of those disabilityreports? What areas are we talking about? Are
we talking about physical ability? Are we talkingabout learning ability? Are we talking about
(41:38):
mental health, ADHD? What are you most likelyto encounter? Because we all have limited time
and resources. We can't be experts on all ofit but if we know for example that you know
40% of the abilities disabilities and accommodationsthat are going to be reported us are in the
area of mental and Psychological health thenthat's probably an area where you might want
(42:02):
to spend more of your time educating yourselfSo keeping up to date on what are the stats
in the field so that you can really sort ofyou know be efficient with your training and
then and then really sort of understand whatis most likely to come down the pike. Thinking
about things through that lens too, I mentionedIAE and the data that's available to them.
They're also going to talk about top destinationsand, you know, not surprisingly, more than
(42:25):
70% of our students are still going into Europe.It's not a difficult link between physical
environment, but those are perhaps also someof the countries that have the most progressive
legislation related to learning ability. Andso. understanding where our students going
and where there might be great opportunities,but also understanding where your challenges
(42:49):
might lie. We're about out of time, Sarah, butI'd love to sort of wrap things up on a high
note. What is a success story you would liketo share? You know, Zach, this is the hardest
question that you've asked me. It's true, becausethere's so many. How do you choose just one?
I spent some time thinking about this and I...I guess I would call that maybe a success story
(43:13):
related to this that I am really like pleasedwith and a student that's very dear to me and
I had the wonderful opportunity to really likeobserve his experience even though it was not
an easy one. This is a story that presentedmany challenges and it's actually a story that
I worked really closely with my colleagues atISA in. This was a student who presented early
(43:37):
and disclosed early. This was a student that...came in as an early under, you know, lower
classman, and I knew that he wanted to studyabroad, and he gave me ample runway, gave us,
myself and him, ample runway to really workthrough his specific situation. And we worked
(43:58):
closely with our colleagues at ISA to find agood destination that was gonna be a good fit
for him. And... We did all the things, all theplanning. We were great partners in all of
this. And we thought that this was really beautifullyironed out, ready to launch the student only
sort of late stage to realize that we were beingpresented with challenges from the host institution
(44:22):
that were certainly upsetting to us, seemedto be a bit immovable from us. But what we
did recognize in conversations with the hostinstitution was that some of it was a language
barrier. not in the sense that they didn't speakEnglish, but instead in the sense that what
we put on an accommodation letter is inclusiveof every possible accommodation. And perhaps
(44:46):
to the partner seems quite overwhelming. Thislaundry list of things that the student needed,
it wasn't a list of the things that the studentneeded. It was instead a list of what the student
was eligible for. And those were different things.This student was an amazing advocate for themselves
in recognizing that list was probably bigger,not probably, was indeed bigger than what they
(45:08):
actually needed and was able to communicateto us and to the partner that, listen, this
is what I really need to be successful. Thisis what I need. And narrowed that list down,
that was more palatable to the partner. We wereable to also sort of say, okay, within the
scope of their visa, what we could probablydo is maneuver our academic calendar a little
bit more so that we're lessening the courseload. Because what we don't want to do is say,
(45:31):
well, we're shrinking the available accommodations,but oh, by the way, go jump into a full load
of courses in a foreign environment. So we wereable to figure out what was the right combination
of academic coursework for that student. Andwe very closely monitored him, myself and the
ground team monitor him, have very closely providetutoring services, all of those things. And
(45:53):
it was a really, really successful outcome forthat student. It was a wonderful semester with
great academic outcomes. I had the joy and pleasureof this student going immediately from that
study abroad to a study abroad that I was leadingin Iceland. And so I got to spend 10 days with
him afterwards to really get a full debriefon the full situation, which that almost never
happens. That was just, you know, the cherryon top. And he's such a positive outcome. He's
(46:17):
graduated now and I'm still in touch with himfrequently. And despite the hurdles and the
challenges, you know, the work, the front work,you think you have it all dealt with all just
you have. snow plowed a beautiful smooth pathfor the student and then challenges come up
and yet we still were able to have a reallygreat outcome for the student. Thank you so
(46:38):
much for sharing that. Dr. Sarah Eesler, asyou think about education abroad in 2024, what
makes you hopeful? Student interest is up. Itwas a rough couple years there for international
education. It just felt like hurdle, hurdle.But student interest is up. In fact, we are
We have so many students we can't even hardlykeep up right now, which is such a wonderful
(47:00):
problem to have. And so we are trying very hardto keep up with the students. I could focus
easily on the things going on in the world thatmake our jobs harder. And I probably don't
need to name those. Anybody listening to a podcastlike this probably knows exactly what I'm talking
about, you know, war, conflict, disaster, allof these things. And yet I... If I were to
(47:22):
spend that, I guess I would say that the worldgives us really a lot of reasons why our jobs
are so important. And I think 2024 is goingto present us with that. What we do is critical
to the world. And I do think that we are chippingaway at increasing tolerance and compassion
worldwide because it gives our students a chanceto see that. Yeah, we are beautifully different
(47:49):
from our... citizens of the world all over theplace, but we are also incredibly similar in
a variety of different ways. I think it helpsour students to not first go to this idea of
othering. And so in a world that really is tryingto divide us, I do think study abroad brings
us together and all of these challenges onlymake that more important and solidifies all
(48:09):
the reasons why we have to keep doing this workfor our students and for a better world. The
work continues. I can't imagine a better placeto end things than right here. Sarah Eesler,
I can't thank you enough for this conversation.I personally have learned a ton in this past
hour, and thank you so much for being here.My pleasure. Thank you for having me. To our
(48:31):
listeners, thank you for joining us for thisepisode of Changing Lives Through Education
Abroad. I'm your host, Cyp McInnis, and pleasemake sure to join us next week as we continue
to explore topics of international educationand exchange. Thank you to my spectacular World
Strides colleagues, without whom this podcastwould not be possible. Please subscribe to
(48:51):
Changing Lives to Education Abroad on Spotify,Apple, or wherever you get your podcasts. And
share with your friends and colleagues. Let'screate life-changing moments together.
It intertwines with many conversations thatour campuses are having related to diversity,
equity, inclusion, and especially belonging,and I think fostering environments where students
feel like they can disclose. I think that'sreally step one. Hello, everyone. Welcome to
this episode of World Strive's podcast, ChangingLives Through Education Abroad, a weekly series
(00:26):
of conversations with international education'smost interesting thought leaders. as well as
discussions on emerging trends, best practices,innovation happening in our field. I'm your
host, Sat McInnis, and I work on the CampusPartnerships Team here at World Strides. Today,
we're diving into a very hot and very timelytopic in 2024, accessibility and study abroad.
(00:49):
We'll be talking about how we, as educationabroad practitioners, can best support students
with disabilities and what higher educationinstitutions as a whole can do to enhance support
systems and practices to foster a more inclusivestudy abroad experience for these students.
It's my honor to welcome a distinguished guestonto the podcast to explore this topic with
(01:13):
us. Dr. Sarah Eesler is the Assistant Dean ofInternational Programs and Partnerships in
the Haslam School of Business at the Universityof Tennessee. I know she has spent a lot of
time thinking about this topic, and I can'timagine a better person to help us unpack.
all things related to students with disabilitiesand study abroad. So without further ado, let's
(01:35):
get into it. Dr. Sarah Eesler, welcome to theshow and thank you for being here. Thank you
for having me. Could you please start us offby sharing a bit about your background, your
career trajectory and what you are up to thesedays as Assistant Dean of International Programs
and Partnerships at UT? Well, background, Iam from South Carolina. originally. I am a
(01:58):
graduate triple alumnus from the Universityof South Carolina. I would say that I was one
of those students, particularly as an undergrad,especially as an undergrad, that had really
not a great idea of what I wanted to do or bewhen I grew up. And I was pursuing a degree
in journalism and mass comm and kind of decidedsecond semester of senior year that I wasn't
(02:22):
really sure
But I did know that I needed to pay the bills,and so I wanted to graduate and felt like Mass
Comm Communication degree, that's a great degree,right? Those are skills that you can use in
literally any career path or whatnot. And itwasn't like I had some epiphany of what I did
(02:42):
want to do. So, you know, changing didn't makea lot of sense. But I was a very lucky young
person in the sense that I was... hired intoa position that really introduced me to international
education, specifically in the field of medicalscience and research. And it really just opened
my eyes to the ways in which we are sharinginformation across the globe, particularly
(03:06):
among academic institutions, and really gotme fired up and got me a lot of experience
working across borders for the preparation ofacademic medical conferences. And so I gained
a lot of really strong and important administrativeskills in that, but then also sort of found
that I really liked this international thing.I thought it was fun. It allowed me to travel,
(03:26):
which I obviously loved. And so there were piecesof it that I just thought were really great.
And after five years of that, I was hired intothe business school at the University of South
Carolina in international business, where programmingreally was not my job at all. That was not,
I was hired in an administrative position exclusivelyin the Department of International Business.
(03:48):
And I was... fortunate to have an amazing mentorin that space that really just continued to
nurture and foster this idea of internationaland international business. And he gave me
this amazing opportunity. I found this fledglinglittle faculty led program one day and I was
like what is this thing that's over here thatsometimes I see we have billing for sometimes
we don't what is this thing? And he says youknow well it's a program we run in Central
(04:12):
Europe sometimes we have enough students mostthe time we don't it's kind of just this thing
that comes and goes from time to time. And hesaid, you know, actually, if you wanted to
take it on, you could travel with the program.We'd pay for you to travel with the students
if you got it. But you know, you gotta like,go do your actual job first. So this would
be like a side project. And I was like, hmm,all I heard in that sentence was free travel.
(04:37):
And so I did. I got the students, traveled withthem for the first time. And man, I was in
love. Traveling and working with students really,was never on my radar, but we just had such
a great time. I got to experience it alongsidethem, which was really fun and inspiring. And
from there, it was one program, and then itwas two, and then it was 21. And before I knew
(05:02):
it, that same mentor was like, let's be honestwith ourselves, this is your job now. And so
I became the director of the program for ourfaculty led and for the international business.
graduate and undergraduate programs at the Universityof South Carolina. And so that's the work I
was doing. In the meantime, during all of that,that same mentor was like, so when are you
(05:24):
getting that master's degree? And then Mit Stridein that master's, he's like, so when are you
getting your PhD? And so he really sort of nudgedme very much along and I'm eternally grateful
for having such amazing guidance from him. We'restill very connected today even.
(05:45):
tell me which direction to go and what I, youknow, why aren't you thinking about this? Or
what are you doing here? And so he was reallycritical to my career. And then of course I
came to Tennessee and had the great opportunityto start a program from scratch there that
didn't exist. The Office of International Programsand Study Abroad was brand new. And so I was
brought on at UT to build it. And who gets thatkind of opportunity? Again, you know, the lucky.
(06:13):
the lucky turn of events. I mean, no one getsto start from scratch, a brand new office,
a brand new initiative. I was very, very fortunateto get to do that. And then same story just
sort of grew from there. And last year I becamethe Assistant Dean for the college in International
Programs and Furniships. Thank you so much forsharing that, Sarah. I'd like to open our conversation
today by asking you to share some basics forour folks who may be newer to learning about
(06:38):
accessibility as it relates to study abroad.What, for example, is an accommodation and
how common are disabilities as a whole? So anaccommodation is probably, if people are working
in higher ed or in an education of any space,they've probably heard this term accommodation
before. And really it's just a modificationor alteration of the environment, of the content,
(07:00):
of the delivery method to open up access foran individual who may need. In most cases in
the classroom, we hear about additional timeor testing accommodations, a quieter space,
those kinds of things, in addition to the waysin which accommodation can be related to a
physical disability, increasing access to physicalspaces on your campus or in your classroom.
(07:24):
That term is probably one that people have heardbefore. Often what's attached to that is this
idea of what is considered a reasonable accommodation.That word reasonable appears a lot in the legislature
related to accommodation. All of that in highered especially is determined typically through
an office of student disability services wherethey would evaluate a student must first request,
(07:47):
which is a big difference between higher edand K through 12 education, a student must
request accommodation and then they're typicallyevaluated off of medical documentation that
the student presents to that office. And thenfrom there reasonable accommodation is determined
by that office of student disability services.The determination of accommodation isn't typically
(08:09):
ever made, I'm not aware of any instance whereit's made by an academic unit or department
or even a study abroad office. That is reallydriven by the professionals in your disability
services area where they have the credentialsto evaluate the medical diagnoses as well as
the recommended accommodation by a physician.So Sarah, you touched upon the importance of
(08:29):
the Office of Disability Services on mini campus.Do you have any pro tips for our listeners,
for education abroad practitioners, about partneringwith an office of disability services? How
can we best work together? Get to know thatoffice before you need them. That's my greatest
piece of advice, right? So many times on campuswe're in that reactionary mode. This challenge
(08:50):
has presented itself, and now I need to figureout who in the world is this contact and where
exactly do they live on campus? And oh, by theway, we don't have a prior relationship, so
I have to start from scratch. That just slowsthe process down, right? And I think that for
any of us in education in general, not necessarilyjust international ed, knowing who these people
(09:12):
are on campus, who are your colleagues, whoare your content experts on campus, get to
know them early and visit with them with somefrequency, because they're gonna be the experts
on the regulation, what is required and whatis reasonable. They're gonna have the greatest
sense of what that looks like from a legislativestandpoint. They're also gonna have incredible
(09:33):
guidance for what's going on in the field, intheir field, right? We think about the way
that we connect across international ed. Theyhave their own set of colleagues around the
globe and around the country that they can connectwith to help with resources. And so helping
them to sort of know that you're there, you'reinterested, you care, you want to be a resource
(09:53):
to students, because that's going to help informationflow in both directions, right? Your challenge
presents itself, you know exactly who you'recalling, it's a familiar face. is someone that
you've built a trusting relationship with andvice versa. The student might present the disability
and desire to study abroad to them and not toyou. And so the same thing happens, right?
(10:13):
They go to that professional on your campusand then that professional knows who to contact
back. And so it really creates that pathwayof communication and disclosure from students
because one challenge that I have seen morethan once in our programs is that That idea
of disclosure is one that sometimes I neverhear. Sometimes a student never discloses that
(10:38):
they have any sort of disability or accommodation.Sometimes I hear it too late in the process,
which is very hard to maneuver sometimes. Sometimesit's not that big of a deal and we can sort
of mitigate fairly quickly. Other times it presentsa number of challenges that if I had just had
forewarning, we could have really wrapped ourarms around the situation much more quickly
(10:59):
and effectively. It just improves outcomes ifwe have that multiple points and avenues of
disclosure. So my tip would be make friends.Make friends. I love what you said about the
communication flowing both ways and us reallysupporting one another. I think that's really
great advice. I want to ask you a broad question.Sarah, in your experience, what are some of
the unique challenges that students with disabilitiesface when they embark on a studying abroad
(11:24):
journey? That's a complicated question becauseit really depends. It depends on what exactly
is the disability or accommodation that we'reworking with. It depends on the type of programming
that the student is interested in. In many cases,it is a case-by-case basis. There are certainly
some that, you know, as I mentioned, will easilymove through the process and it's not terribly
(11:45):
disruptive. There are others that are more complicatedand so it's quite situational. For example,
if a student was visiting a host institutionfor a full semester, The challenges that are
presented there are often shared with the partnerinstitution. So what accommodations do they
have? What kind of services and resources dothey have? If it's instead a faculty-led or
(12:06):
itinerant program that has them doing all kindsof things that might be remote or outside of
cities and, you know, in areas where, you know,we might not be able to control every single
situation. that's really different kind of planningthat has to occur there. And so it really is
very much situational as to what is the kindof program and what is the kind of accommodation
(12:28):
that the student is seeking or needing. So Iwould encourage anybody that's been presented
with a disclosure to really consider what isthe type of programming. Hopefully you're hearing
about this disclosure very early on in the processand the student is coming to you because they
want your help. identifying and matching tothe right program for that that's best case
(12:49):
scenario, right? You learn about it early on,what exactly are our needs here and how, and
you have plenty of time to do adequate researchand to guide the student along their path.
That's certainly ideal situation, right? Alternatively,though, it's, we often hear about it after
the fact and it's instead how do we sort ofmatch and best mitigate? Sarah, I wanna lift
(13:12):
up that you are Dr. Isler. and your terminaldegree included a dissertation titled, A Litigation
Analysis of the Extra-Territoriality of US FederalLaws and International Education. What a fascinating
topic. Clearly, one of your areas of expertiseis around litigation and its relationship to
students with disabilities and the responsibilitiesrelated to discrimination. Could you unpack
(13:36):
that for us and share a bit about how you cameto be interested in this area of professional
practice? My interest in this is facing in bothdirections. Certainly understanding what are
the students' rights and how can we be supportiveto students is sort of the front-facing, the
access piece is what is really interesting tome and got me on this path. What I discovered,
(14:01):
however, in this is from an institutional perspective,if I put on my other hat, right, my student
services hat is equity access for the students.And I think that many of us would share that.
I'm not sure why we would be in this field ifwe didn't share those same interests and goals.
My other hat, however, is that of an administratorof the university. And so understanding what
is our role and responsibility and also riskof litigation. And so that's the other side
(14:26):
of it that I found to be really complex andthere's not this really obvious path or roadmap
as to what exactly is our role and responsibility,particularly when we can't control the environment
entirely. And that's where I think that I becamemost interested as how do we navigate these
statutes that are in place where guidance canchange often, sometimes based on administration
(14:52):
and how they interpret the guidance.
civil rights and it presents some spaces thatare quite challenging to think through. We
all want to be accommodating and yet we're sendingstudents to destinations that have ancient
(15:13):
structures and probably not always easy or quickaccess to elevators or ramps in the case of
a physical disability. And those, however, ifwe look at the data really represent a small
portion of the students that are going abroadand instead those quote-unquote hidden disabilities
that really do often require disclosure, wecan't control all of those environments. We
(15:37):
can't control the statutes abroad. We can'tcontrol the behaviors of our partners. We can
just hope that they're good partners and thatwe've nurtured a relationship of access and
accommodation. And so I think that was the pieceof it where as an administrator, I wanted to
really understand what was our risk and responsibilityin this. I mentioned previously that the statutes
(15:58):
use this really ambiguous language around reasonableaccommodation, and yet reasonable is never
defined. And what is reasonable to one personor institution may not be reasonable to another.
And that is a really very gray space that weall need to think through and recognize what
(16:20):
exactly do we determine to be reasonable accommodation.We talked about important partners on campus
and this certainly our offices of disabilityservices are one general council probably needs
to be another because at the end of the daywe want to make sure that we're doing what's
right by the student but we have to also considerinstitutional risk as part of that as well
(16:40):
and so those are issues that are very oftenin alignment but not always and so it's a complicated
issue and one without. direct answers in manycases. Easy solutions. Yeah, you have to be
thinking about that. The meaning of the wordreasonable and how that can vary from person
to person and there can be so much interpretationthere. And some of these could require an incredible
(17:06):
amount of cost. And so you think about, well,who determines what is a reasonable cost? And
truly in any given academic year and any givenbudget situation. at any given institution,
right, the variety of available financial resourcesis varied. And so that idea of reasonable accommodation
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is certainly a gray space that is not clearlydefined in the statutes. And who gets to make
that decision, I imagine. And so that leadsme to my next question, Sarah. It's another
broad one, another big one. How can higher educationinstitutions proactively enhance support systems
or practices? to facilitate a more inclusivestudy abroad experience for students with disabilities?
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I think a lot of it comes down to, it intertwineswith many conversations that our campuses are
having related to diversity, equity, inclusion,and especially belonging. And I think fostering
environments where students feel like they candisclose, I think that's really step one, because
we have available resources, right? We havepeople who are professionals in all of these
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areas, and we can bring ourselves together toproblem solve to the best of our ability. but
we can't do it if we don't know that that'san issue. And many students, regardless of
ability status, many students see study abroadas an ability to escape. And sometimes that
means they're escaping turmoil at home. Theywant a little bit of escapism. Oftentimes I
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have heard from students that disclosed laterthat they had this disability with an available
accommodation for any other circumstance oncampus. But for this one semester, they didn't
want to have to have that lens or that stigmaor that identity, and they didn't disclose
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for what was a less than optimal outcome. Andso that environment of having it be a welcoming
space and one where people feel like they cancome talk to you and that you are an advocate
for them, I really think that that's step one.and having those relationships across campus
where it really is that someone feels like theycan, they know who to call when there is a
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situation that requires more than one set ofeyes. You mentioned the importance of early
disclosure. What are some other needs that educationabroad professionals might find it easy to
get tripped up when it comes to working withstudents? And what words of advice would you
have for how we can best create a climate that'sconducive to students disclosing their needs
early and what other advice would you have?I think reminding our students more than once,
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you know, many of us, if we're teaching in theclassroom, we have a syllabus where day one,
syllabus day, we talk about, don't forget todisclose to me and to the Office of Disability
Services, any accommodation for which you mightbe eligible. We do that really frequently in
the classroom. I don't know that we do it asfrequently with our students otherwise. And
(20:04):
so thinking about how you can encourage youradvisors and otherwise to... almost to have
it as a disclaimer, not every student is gonnaneed to hear it, but it opens an invitation.
And perhaps even the student might not haveeven been thinking about that just yet, right?
Study abroad can be a really overwhelming experiencefor some of our students and the volume of
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questions that they have can be large and intimidating.And so maybe it's not that they're choosing
not to disclose, maybe that's just not enteredtheir thought pathway just yet, right? And
so. kind of reminding students that this isan area of importance and that we need to think
about it and we can help you with that. So howcould we introduce that as just a reminder
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for appointments? And I say that now we needto be reminding with more frequency, we need
to be thinking about this. And so remindingourselves to have that reminder is even something
that needs to happen. And I think to the...The ways in which we can just build relationships
and have them feel like it's a safe space tosay these things is, it's really step one.
(21:10):
I think also for professionals who might beencountering some of these situations and challenges,
especially, you know, oftentimes if we thinkabout who is frontline with our students every
day doing the high volume of student advisingand appointments and that sort of thing, many
times they can be our younger professionals,newer professionals to the field who are in
those advising roles. even sometimes studentpeer advisors that are in those roles. And
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so having them a pathway for elevating the situation,this comes up in a conversation, it might feel
overwhelming to that person, elevate. It's ateam effort, right? We need to remember that
it is a team effort. And so I wanna make surethat anybody in our team, the minute that someone
discloses something, if it's easy, simple, andwe can solve it really quickly, that's wonderful,
(21:56):
we probably need to catalog it just so thatwe're following up to ensure that everything
is. going as it should. Some of them might befar more complicated and so helping even our
advisors to understand that you don't have tohave the answers to this. And we say this every
single day to every single advisor and to everysingle student. You don't have to have every
single answer in that moment and that's okay.It's okay to say that. It's okay to say this
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is an interesting situation. I'm gonna needto do some more homework on this and we're
probably gonna need to connect to some otherresources. this is the beginning of the conversation,
not the end of the conversation. And so helpingadvisors to realize that like, you don't have
to have all the answers in the moment. I don'thave all of the answers in the moment. I did
an entire dissertation on this. I don't haveall of the answers on this, and I'm gonna need
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to connect to resources as well. And I can tellyou right now, my very first phone call is
gonna be my friends and colleagues in disabilityservices, because that's exactly what needs
to happen. And so. reminding them to do theexact same things that I would do in a situation,
and it's let's build a team, let's collaborate.Yeah, I love what you said about, you know,
those of us in leadership positions, makingsure that our team members have the resources
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and training and knowledge to be able to advisestudents and knowing when they don't know the
answer and being okay with that. I think that'sreally important. Well, it's okay. It's okay
to not know all of the answers all the timein the moment. From what I hear on our team
and what I'm hearing at Go To Crossroom, othersin the field right now, is that students are
advocating for themselves more these days interms of their disabilities now more than ever
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before. One might say that sigma is decreasing,which is a positive step. What would you add
here and what other evolutions or trends areyou noticing? I think it's absolutely true
that we're seeing more students advocate forthemselves and having the stigma removed for
disclosure, which is that self-advocacy is alwayssomething positive, I think. Particularly because
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I think that in the past, so many students didfeel that stigma related to either their disability
or health situation that has hindered theirability to be really successful in higher ed
and especially to in study abroad where we wantstudents to tell us, we want that disclosure
to happen. I think that any area that I've seena lot of change in the last couple of years
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is related to mental health and psychologicaldisability and the willingness of students
to disclose that. And I think there's a lotof data to support that, especially in study
abroad. If I look at the longitudinal data forreporting of mental health, in the last 10
to 12 years, we've seen 15% increase in disclosureof that across all students, in terms of the
(24:38):
share of disclosures that students might bepresenting. So it's definitely growing. I think
that... Young students in particular, thosethat are transitioning from high school into
higher ed, they need to be well coached on disclosureand that it is indeed their responsibility
as an adult learner. I know that some of usmight argue that idea of adult learner of an
(25:03):
18-year-old, but truly and legally that is thecase when they turn 18 and then they come to
a higher ed institution. They have to be proactiveabout going to disability service. and registering
their accommodation. And that process is a formalizedone, and it's not one that can be done retroactively.
And so I think that we need to continue to educatestudents about that difference as they're transitioning
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into higher ed, that they do have more responsibilityin that than maybe they would have experienced
in their accommodation plan that would havebeen built out for them in the K through 12
situation. One of the challenges for many ofus that they don't understand that they need
to disclose until later on. And there are limitationsas to what we can do, both in the classroom
(25:51):
and study abroad, when it's happening afterthe fact. And so it really is, you know, that
situation I described earlier, where a studentis starting to see that outcomes really aren't
that positive. And then, you know, it's theend of the semester and they're saying, they're
disclosing. And I can't go back and re-offerthe course for that student and that's not.
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the way that it works in higher ed. And so helpingthem to really understand that difference and
that transition for our younger students isreally important. And often that conversation
happens well before they come into internationalprograms and study abroad. And that really
is a responsibility across campus and not justin our area to remind students of what their
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role in this needs to be for higher ed and howthey need to perhaps modify their behaviors
as part of that. One place where I know thingscan get tricky is when a student is in a situation
where their accommodation is recognized herein the United States, but that same need is
not recognized formally or recognized differentlyoverseas. I'll give an example that I know
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has come up often in case it's helpful for ourlisteners. We might have a case where a student
utilizes a service animal here in the US, buttheir program host country views that service
animal differently. How could our colleaguesbest support, advise, or advocate for students
in the case of service animals? Even in theUS context, when it comes to animals, the difference
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between what is formally considered a serviceanimal as compared to something that might
be designated as an emotional support animal,those aren't necessarily considered the same
thing. They're not necessarily supported inthe same way. And they're not necessarily protected.
through litigation and ADA in the same way.And so even that distinction in the United
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States, I think many people will see animalsthat are designated as emotional support and
see them as some, as equivalents to a supportor a service animal, service animal being the
true designator of a protected accommodation.And so I think that that's even inside the
United States when it comes to animals, thisis a space where a distinction needs to be
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made for people often. It's a challenging situationand we have no control truly of the protections
of foreign governments. We have no control overthe policies of our foreign or host institutions.
And so those are areas where certainly we wouldtypically with a student, with a service animal,
that's one where disclosure happens becauseit is visible, right? They would have come
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into our office, we would have been able tosee that this is something that we're talking
about. And that matching process and advisingis where that's probably most critical. What
are the countries that we know are going tobe more supportive or have laws or protections
that are more similar to ours? What are theorganizations where we know that we have strong
relationships and that they have similar policiesand philosophies to ours when it comes to accommodation?
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And so that matching process is really important.Students who also have animals are going to
need to consider also that there are going tobe quarantines and other. rules and regulations
for entry of those animals. And so that mightweigh into the decision about destination as
well. Are they gonna need to be separated fromthat animal from any period of time, or is
there more of a through process for that animal?And even daily navigation of that student,
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what are the challenges that we need to be consideringrelated to access and daily life? I mentioned
earlier, you know, some of these cities arevery old cities, cobblestones, not a lot of
elevators, those kinds of things. Do we needto be weighing all of that? Is it something
else entirely? Often, for example, we see thatservice animals are being attached to conditions
like epilepsy, where they're able to predictan oncoming seizure. And so how do we sort
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of navigate that for the student? What kindof different resources are gonna be necessary
for them? And so in some ways, I cautiouslysay that that's an accommodation that we would
know about fairly quickly, soon. The studentwould probably know that they need to disclose
and seek guidance for that kind of situation.In many ways, that might be an easier student
to deal with because we know it. Back to thisconversation, ongoing, repetitive conversation
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about disclosure, it's easier to disclose thatthose students are well-trained in disclosure,
whereas others that are quote unquote hidden,those can sometimes be a little bit harder
to deal with because this might not know. Howcommon would you say disabilities are? The
data would tell us the census of People reportingdisabilities in 2022, which is the most recent
(30:31):
data that we have available, is about 13% ofour entire US civilian population reports some
form of disability. Now that equates to about40 million people who are over the age of 25
who are reporting some kind of disability intheir daily life. If we translate that into
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students who are pursuing higher ed, you know,that results in about 21% or a little bit more
than 8 million people who are holding a bachelor'sdegree or higher who are reporting a disability.
So if we sort of back out from that data, youknow, that really goes to show that in about
21% of our undergraduates and about 11% of ourgrads in U.S. higher education are reporting
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some kind of disability or accommodation needin their degree. That number is certainly higher
for our student veterans. And so they're reportingmuch higher levels of disability or need for
access than are more traditional undergraduates.That compares to about, you know, 38% of those
that are not reporting their disability, whichtypically that would mean that there are a
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number of students who are, have a diagnosisand they would be eligible for accommodation,
but aren't reporting it through the higher ed,you know, formalized system, which is really
challenging. Really, only about 8% of our studentsare registering their disability on campus.
So I think what that means though is that there'swhen we talk about hidden disabilities, oftentimes
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we're using that terminology for referencinga disability that's not visually available
to us that we don't know immediately that astudent could hide. I think in this case, we
could expand that beyond students who have adisability that's not visible to us, but then
also isn't being disclosed at any point in theprocess, which is quite challenging. For those
(32:24):
of us in the field, I think that means thatwe really need to be thinking about the students
that have known disabilities to us, as wellas those who are completely unknown to us,
and for whatever reason, are deciding to continuein their life and in their degree without disclosing
their disability. We've talked a lot about theimportance of working across campus and the
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importance of that partnership with the Officeof Disability Services. But I want to extend
this conversation to faculty. What advice wouldyou give to faculty who may be listening and
studying abroad offices who work with them toprepare them to be course leaders about working
with students with disabilities? In some ways,our faculty might have more training than we're
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giving them credit for, particularly if they'rereally in the classroom. on campus with a lot
of frequency, because they are regularly interactingwith those accommodation letters that come
from students, for students from our studentdisability office. They are probably often
more attuned to that than we give them creditfor. The way that we need to work with them
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for our international programs is how does thattranslate outside of the classroom? Typically,
when we're talking about faculty, we're sortof narrowing the scope of activity to our faculty-led
programs. And I would always start with thesame sort of questions that I would ask them
on campus. Are there ways in which you couldmodify your syllabus, your deliverables, the
ways in which you're assessing learning to bemore accessible? So is there anything already
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in the syllabus related to their academic performanceor how you're going to assess their grade that
could be modified to be more universally accessibleto students? And so that's always question
number one. That's the one that the minute youask it, they will have had other conversations
on campus about that. So could you modify theenvironment? Could you modify the test taking
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if that's part of your syllabus? What kind ofmodifications are out there that you are already
familiar with? The ones that would be more specificto this are typically related to environment.
The environment has now changed. We're not typicallyin study abroad. We're not teaching in a classroom,
right? With a four walled. no windowed spacewith a whiteboard and projector. That's not
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typically our environment when we've taken studentsabroad. So what do we need to be thinking about?
Are they related to physical disability? Andwe need to be thinking about those kinds of
accommodations that are gonna occur in the naturalenvironment? Are they learning disabilities
where we need to be thinking differently abouthow we might be presenting information, right?
Oftentimes we are having open dialogue in aspace that might be a bus. hard to hear in
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that bus? Is it hard to retain information whenyou're not able to see it visually and hear
it audibly? Is that a challenge? If a studenthas an accommodation for recording their lectures
and academic conversations, are you having conversationsthat maybe that feels less comfortable now
because you're talking about topics that areperhaps controversial? What does that sort
(35:31):
of look like for the student and what does thatlook like for the faculty? And so how can we
sort of pull along and again, understand whatthat disclosure and what those reasonable accommodations
are. Our student disability services, and I'msure that others do this as well, the letter
for what is an eligible accommodation is quiteclear. And so knowing in advance what those
classroom environment modifications might needto be are pretty clear to us. And so it's really
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just extending that and that, okay, we're notin that traditional classroom space anymore.
What does it look like now? Our field is sointerconnected and none of us has to go it
alone. I want to highlight briefly our healthand safety team here at World Strides, led
by Robin Relaford, who's a friend of the pod.Our team has five full-time staff and a dedicated
accessibility team. The A team, as we call them,endeavors to be very responsive to student
(36:21):
needs and to protect student privacy. But oursis just one model. When deciding who to partner
with, what are some questions universities shouldbe asking? to ensure that the infrastructure
is in place to support students on partner programs.You said it all partnership. It needs to be
a partnership. In many cases, beyond those thatwe're talking about right now with access for
(36:42):
disabilities, you're going to have to call onthat partner. And if you don't have the relationship
in place to make that phone call and to knowwho to call and to trust that they share the
same values that you do, it's not going to bea good thing. And so... I think really thinking
about that partnership and are they indeed apartner with you in this endeavor. I think
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too, particularly in the case of ability andability status, that partnership can lend so
many resources that are hard to deliver yourselfbecause you're not on site. And so I think
particularly whenever you're doing that matchingprocess for students with different abilities,
understanding what kind of resources are availableand which ones you might really need is absolutely
(37:31):
critical. And if I think about, for example,our relationship with ISA Worldstrides, that
means that we have on the ground support throughthe study centers, and they can pull along
and build in add-on services that may not beavailable through the partner. You asked earlier
about this situation where maybe the local lawdoesn't regulate that your host institution.
(37:55):
offer certain kinds of accommodations, wellguess what? Maybe your site does. That tutoring
service, the translation services, the on-the-groundsupport, frequent monitoring, all of those
contacts, those relationships, those are thingsthat they can help you mitigate and you're
not there, especially for a full semester, youcan't be there. And so you have to trust and
(38:18):
lean into the partner relationship and the partnerresources that are available to that. My experience
too is that when we've needed these and we havecollaborated on this exact situation more than
once, you can understand, okay, that matchingprocess, I know that I can make a phone call
and say, okay, this is our student situation,we're not married to destination necessarily.
(38:42):
Where can we maneuver? Where do we see as likeour top destination for providing these services
and accommodations? And then we can go intocurriculum matching from there. So. sort of
rank ordering priority for that student andthen finding that match and using your relationship
and partnership to do that, knowing that theycan often provide services that you may not
(39:02):
be as easily able to. Many of our listenerswould like to grow their knowledge base to
better support students with disabilities. Otherthan this podcast that we're recording right
now, Sarah, what are some resources you'd liketo highlight to help folks become more proficient
and comfortable in their work in this area?Certainly there are a lot of resources through
(39:23):
your partnerships that I hope that professionalsare leveraging. You know, you've mentioned
this podcast, for example, there are othersthat are available, blogs and others that I
think that students and student professionalsshould be accessing. I mentioned just now,
not just student professionals, students. Thisidea of self-advocacy is really important and
(39:43):
helping students to understand what are theirrights and responsibilities and all of this
is part of the battle as well. So I think. Consideringhow we're directing our professionals, but
also our students to these resources is huge.This idea of partnership, I really, I can't
stress it enough. Partnership with your relationshipsfor the people, we use the terminology affiliates,
(40:05):
our affiliate partnerships, leveraging resourcesthrough them, leveraging resources through
your student disability offices, leveragingresources through general counsel, getting
to know the people that are on and off yourcampus who really are content experts. because
you're going to bring a lot of expertise inone area, they've got expertise in another,
that teamwork, that collaboration is reallygoing to be helpful, particularly because as
(40:27):
I mentioned, these regulations do change andthe way that they're interpreted and applied
do change. And so you might be an expert, thatlast case that came through your office, you
might be an expert on what was the reg at thattime, that might've changed and your other
professionals are going to know what it is now.And I think also there's a lot of resources
available through the... the different channelsthat we often access. Some of those are professional
(40:51):
organizations. Some of those, however, theymight be much more legalese and less interesting
content, but important to stay abreast of. Departmentof Education can be very legalese, can be very
dry. You might have to get yourself a freshcup of coffee, but sit down and read the regs.
Inform yourself, educate yourself on what arethe regs. IIE always has amazing up-to-date
(41:15):
data. to know what really is the volume of studentsthat we're talking about for study abroad in
general, but also those that we know from institutionalreporting, what is the volume of disability
reports? What is the breakdown of those disabilityreports? What areas are we talking about? Are
we talking about physical ability? Are we talkingabout learning ability? Are we talking about
(41:38):
mental health, ADHD? What are you most likelyto encounter? Because we all have limited time
and resources. We can't be experts on all ofit but if we know for example that you know
40% of the abilities disabilities and accommodationsthat are going to be reported us are in the
area of mental and Psychological health thenthat's probably an area where you might want
(42:02):
to spend more of your time educating yourselfSo keeping up to date on what are the stats
in the field so that you can really sort ofyou know be efficient with your training and
then and then really sort of understand whatis most likely to come down the pike. Thinking
about things through that lens too, I mentionedIAE and the data that's available to them.
They're also going to talk about top destinationsand, you know, not surprisingly, more than
(42:25):
70% of our students are still going into Europe.It's not a difficult link between physical
environment, but those are perhaps also someof the countries that have the most progressive
legislation related to learning ability. Andso. understanding where our students going
and where there might be great opportunities,but also understanding where your challenges
(42:49):
might lie. We're about out of time, Sarah, butI'd love to sort of wrap things up on a high
note. What is a success story you would liketo share? You know, Zach, this is the hardest
question that you've asked me. It's true, becausethere's so many. How do you choose just one?
I spent some time thinking about this and I...I guess I would call that maybe a success story
(43:13):
related to this that I am really like pleasedwith and a student that's very dear to me and
I had the wonderful opportunity to really likeobserve his experience even though it was not
an easy one. This is a story that presentedmany challenges and it's actually a story that
I worked really closely with my colleagues atISA in. This was a student who presented early
(43:37):
and disclosed early. This was a student that...came in as an early under, you know, lower
classman, and I knew that he wanted to studyabroad, and he gave me ample runway, gave us,
myself and him, ample runway to really workthrough his specific situation. And we worked
(43:58):
closely with our colleagues at ISA to find agood destination that was gonna be a good fit
for him. And... We did all the things, all theplanning. We were great partners in all of
this. And we thought that this was really beautifullyironed out, ready to launch the student only
sort of late stage to realize that we were beingpresented with challenges from the host institution
(44:22):
that were certainly upsetting to us, seemedto be a bit immovable from us. But what we
did recognize in conversations with the hostinstitution was that some of it was a language
barrier. not in the sense that they didn't speakEnglish, but instead in the sense that what
we put on an accommodation letter is inclusiveof every possible accommodation. And perhaps
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to the partner seems quite overwhelming. Thislaundry list of things that the student needed,
it wasn't a list of the things that the studentneeded. It was instead a list of what the student
was eligible for. And those were different things.This student was an amazing advocate for themselves
in recognizing that list was probably bigger,not probably, was indeed bigger than what they
(45:08):
actually needed and was able to communicateto us and to the partner that, listen, this
is what I really need to be successful. Thisis what I need. And narrowed that list down,
that was more palatable to the partner. We wereable to also sort of say, okay, within the
scope of their visa, what we could probablydo is maneuver our academic calendar a little
bit more so that we're lessening the courseload. Because what we don't want to do is say,
(45:31):
well, we're shrinking the available accommodations,but oh, by the way, go jump into a full load
of courses in a foreign environment. So we wereable to figure out what was the right combination
of academic coursework for that student. Andwe very closely monitored him, myself and the
ground team monitor him, have very closely providetutoring services, all of those things. And
(45:53):
it was a really, really successful outcome forthat student. It was a wonderful semester with
great academic outcomes. I had the joy and pleasureof this student going immediately from that
study abroad to a study abroad that I was leadingin Iceland. And so I got to spend 10 days with
him afterwards to really get a full debriefon the full situation, which that almost never
happens. That was just, you know, the cherryon top. And he's such a positive outcome. He's
(46:17):
graduated now and I'm still in touch with himfrequently. And despite the hurdles and the
challenges, you know, the work, the front work,you think you have it all dealt with all just
you have. snow plowed a beautiful smooth pathfor the student and then challenges come up
and yet we still were able to have a reallygreat outcome for the student. Thank you so
(46:38):
much for sharing that. Dr. Sarah Eesler, asyou think about education abroad in 2024, what
makes you hopeful? Student interest is up. Itwas a rough couple years there for international
education. It just felt like hurdle, hurdle.But student interest is up. In fact, we are
We have so many students we can't even hardlykeep up right now, which is such a wonderful
(47:00):
problem to have. And so we are trying very hardto keep up with the students. I could focus
easily on the things going on in the world thatmake our jobs harder. And I probably don't
need to name those. Anybody listening to a podcastlike this probably knows exactly what I'm talking
about, you know, war, conflict, disaster, allof these things. And yet I... If I were to
(47:22):
spend that, I guess I would say that the worldgives us really a lot of reasons why our jobs
are so important. And I think 2024 is goingto present us with that. What we do is critical
to the world. And I do think that we are chippingaway at increasing tolerance and compassion
worldwide because it gives our students a chanceto see that. Yeah, we are beautifully different
(47:49):
from our... citizens of the world all over theplace, but we are also incredibly similar in
a variety of different ways. I think it helpsour students to not first go to this idea of
othering. And so in a world that really is tryingto divide us, I do think study abroad brings
us together and all of these challenges onlymake that more important and solidifies all
(48:09):
the reasons why we have to keep doing this workfor our students and for a better world. The
work continues. I can't imagine a better placeto end things than right here. Sarah Eesler,
I can't thank you enough for this conversation.I personally have learned a ton in this past
hour, and thank you so much for being here.My pleasure. Thank you for having me. To our
(48:31):
listeners, thank you for joining us for thisepisode of Changing Lives Through Education
Abroad. I'm your host, Cyp McInnis, and pleasemake sure to join us next week as we continue
to explore topics of international educationand exchange. Thank you to my spectacular World
Strides colleagues, without whom this podcastwould not be possible. Please subscribe to
(48:51):
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