March 3, 2024 • 69 mins
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My Guest is Traci from totalconundrum as we discuss Doveland, WI. a small town that went missing after the Government had built an experimental communications facility near the town. After searching for information about Doveland, Wisconsin I discovered quickly that no one knows exactly where this mysterious town was supposedly located, only that it was a small community located in "the heart of the state".
Where to find Total Conundrum
SOURCES
https://q985online.com/legend-of-doveland-wisconsin-disappearance/
https://www.historicmysteries.com/doveland/
https://www.vox.com/2015/4/10/8381983/project-sanguine
https://obscurban-legend.fandom.com/wiki/Doveland,_Wisconsin
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker A (00:13):
My spooky friends.
I'm John, your host, and welcome to another
episode of Dairyland Frights, the paranormalpodcast that covers everything creepy, spooky,
and mysterious in the midwest.
And today I'm joined by another great spooky
guest on the podcast is Tracy from TotalConundrum podcast.
(00:35):
Hi, Tracy, how are.
Speaker B (00:39):
Oh, how are you?
Speaker A (00:42):
I'm doing great and better that I have you on the show to talk about some
interesting things regarding the paranormaland true crime and some other things.
Speaker B (00:51):
So, yeah, we've had a little difficulty connecting.
I was sick and now Jeremy's sick.
So I'm like, we're going.
We're going for it.
Speaker A (00:58):
We're going.
And we're practically neighbors.
Tracy's in Minnesota.
I'm in Wisconsin.
So I'd love to have a Midwest person on theshow as much as I can get.
Speaker B (01:11):
And we'll try not to throw our accents out there too much.
Speaker A (01:14):
Yeah, we'll try not to be like, yeah, hey, yeah, okay.
Speaker B (01:17):
Yeah, you betcha.
Speaker A (01:17):
Don't you it, you know, people laugh at us, but that's okay.
So tell me about your.
Speaker B (01:28):
We have, our podcast is true crime, paranormal unexplained, a little bit of
everything.
And we research and tell stories as much as we
can.
With the ghost stories and unexplained, it's
really hard to get the true accounts.
(01:48):
You just do your research and go with what the
majority we.
It's my husband and I, Jeremy, and we've been
going for, I think we've been live for aboutseven months now.
And we're loving it.
Absolutely loving it.
Speaker A (02:09):
Yeah. And again, do yourself a favor, my spooky friends, if you have a chance
to listen to the podcast, total conundrum,please do.
These guys are great.
They have great stories, including one of my
favorites about the gentleman who was callingfast food restaurants and making the manager
like, strip search their employees and stuff.
(02:31):
That's crazy.
Talk a little bit about that story.
Just kind of give my spooky friends a little.
Speaker B (02:36):
Yeah. So I came across it watching a documentary, and it's called don't pick up
the phone.
And it's about this guy that lived in Florida
that was calling fast food places all overthe.
And he was, he would give a brief, like a veryvague description of an employee or even a
(03:04):
patron of the restaurant, and then they wouldbring him back to the office and strip search
him, have him do certain things, some very notappropriate sexual things, and then he would
hang up and that would be it.
And one of the girls that was probably the
(03:27):
most assaulted, actually went to court andtook mcdonald's to court, and she won her
case.
And I think there was.
I can't remember how many restaurants, 74 or94, something like that, that had this happen
across the country, and it basically came downto two detectives, one in the east and one in
(03:54):
the south, and they kind of solved the casetogether.
But I won't give away the ending.
But, yeah, it's not a great story, but it's
just incredible how the human psyche willfollow those things.
(04:15):
But in the episode I also talked about, therewas in the scientist did testing, and he had
the scientist, the teacher, the student, orwhatever, and the scientist was just the one
giving, would tell them what to do.
(04:36):
The teacher was trying to teach the student
questions or answers to questions, or.
It was like a memory game.
I think it's been so long since I watched thedocumentary now.
So he would give him, like, five words in arow, and then the student would have to repeat
them.
(04:56):
Well, the student was in on it, but the
teacher didn't know that.
So the teacher would have to issue a shock to
the student, and each time increasing thevoltage, and the student on the other side was
pretending like he was in agony.
And how many people would continue to do this?
(05:17):
And there was this one guy in the video that Iwas watching.
He's like, I can't do this.
I'm going to kill him.
And he's like, you have to.
And so he does.
And I'm like, what?How?
But it's crazy when you think that you're in aposition of having to listen to somebody in
authority.
How many people will not stop?
Speaker A (05:39):
Right? And I saw that experiment, too, and exactly
what you're talking about.
Sometimes the other person was an actor, so
people understand, and they weren't reallybeing shocked.
So understand that, too.
But still, the person didn't know it.
Administering the shots, they had no clue.
They weren't in on it.
And there was just a guy with a clipboard anda lab coat saying, yes, go do it.
(06:04):
No, you got to do it.
And people are like, okay, and here's the
crazy number.
This is a number I'll never forget.
52% of the people continued to give shocks toa fatal level.
Speaker B (06:19):
Yes.
Speaker A (06:20):
Okay. Only 10% to 12% said, no, I'm not doing this.
And got up and left, just like, no, I'm notdoing this.
So think about that for a second, Tracy.
Over half of people were willing to kill a
person because a guy in a clipboard told themto.
Speaker B (06:41):
Right.
Speaker A (06:42):
You have to.
That's insane.
Speaker B (06:46):
No, there's no way.
No way I would do that.
Speaker A (06:49):
I just look at the dude and be like, no, you're crazy, you're crazy.
I'm out of here.
Yeah, and it was the same thing with this.
Go do yourself a favor and watch it.
They made a movie, don't be out of it.
Yeah, don't pick up the phones and maybedocument.
I cannot remember the movie.
(07:10):
If I find it, I'll put it in the show notes.
I remember watching the movie.
It's not a great movie, but it really just
made you just go, wow, is this real?And you're like crazy.
Let's get to the.
Oh, go ahead.
Speaker B (07:30):
I was just going to say in the story that I did, I only covered a handful of
the cases too.
It was insane.
Speaker A (07:39):
It was crazy.
So go ahead and listen to that episode.
You're going to love it.
Along with all the other episodes, Tracy, and
do.
So, Tracy, what got you interested in the
paranormal?Did you have a paranormal experience?
What made you like, hey, let's get thispodcast and talk about all these creepy,
(08:02):
mysterious things, serious things?
Speaker B (08:04):
Well, when I was growing up, I grew up in a very old farmhouse, and to this day I
believe that things happen, but I don't knowif a lot of it.
Sometimes people put it in your head that youwere just a kid, you were imagining your
imagination was getting the best of you.
So this house was so old that it didn't have a
(08:28):
furnace or anything.
It had the wood stove in the basement and then
it had the huge metal grate in the floor inthe living room.
And that's where all the heat came up from,was from the wood stove in the basement.
And then in the two bedrooms on the mainlevel, there was a square hole on the top by
(08:51):
the ceiling in the wall, and then one on thebottom.
And that's how the heat circulated through therooms.
And so in the summertime, my bedroom wasupstairs, in the wintertime, my bedroom had to
be downstairs because the heat didn't getupstairs.
And this house had like the, instead of havingsiding, it had shingles for siding.
(09:13):
It was a really old, old farmhouse.
I wish it still was standing because it'd be
very cool to go back and see it again.
But anyway, there was a night that my mom's
best friend and her were playing cards, andher daughter and I were also best friends.
(09:34):
And we were in bed and there was a hand thatcame out of one of those holes in the wall,
and it was holding a knife and it was, like,floating over us.
And we both have recollections of this.
(09:56):
So it's like, it had to have happened because
I still talk to her to this day, and sheremembers these things.
There was another time when I was older, wemoved out of the house because it needed a
lot.
And we had put a different house on the
property.
(10:16):
And when I was in high school, my girlfriends,
when they'd come over there, we'd dare eachother to sleep upstairs in the old house
because there was all sorts of creepy thingsthat would happen.
And the one night, a girlfriend and I, we did.
We went up to one of the old bedroom or one of
the old bedrooms upstairs and flipped down amattress that was up there and brought snacks
(10:39):
and just kind of chilled and fell asleep.
And we woke up in the middle of the night, and
we heard this crinkling.
And I looked, and I took the flashlight, and
our chip bag was moving across the floor.
And I was like, oh, no. So I woke her up, and
(11:02):
I'm like, we got to get out of here.
Because I didn't know what was going on.
I couldn't see anything moving it.
Anyway, I went running for the stairs, and I
don't remember my feet hitting a single stairgoing down because I was, like, out of there.
And then I was halfway to the other house, andI turned around because I heard my friend
(11:24):
screaming.
And I was like, oh, ****.
She wasn't behind me.
So I ran back into the house, and she was at
the top of the stairs, and I was at thebottom, and she was, like, pushing herself
forward.
And I don't know how to explain it, but she
was kind of, like, at this angle, so sheshould have been falling, but she said she
(11:47):
couldn't move.
Something was holding her, and she was trying
to push against it to get down the stairs.
And then I just screamed, let her go.
And then she kind of fumbled down the stairs.
She didn't fall, but she started to lose her
balance, and then she came down the stairs.
And we've had other incidences, even, like,
(12:08):
the.
We had the old barns.
There was an outhouse on the property that hada heart carved in it, and it said, matt loves
Mabel.
And Matt, at 90, what was he, 97 years old,
came back to the property.
So we got to meet the matt, and the matt loves
(12:30):
Mabel.
So it was kind of cool.
But, yeah, there was weird things that wouldhappen in the barns.
I would see eyes, just weird lights.
And then being outside, even, it was just
always.
You could always felt like something was
watching you.
So I was always scared to death of ghosts.
(12:54):
And when I was in my twenty s, I was awaitress at a bar.
And we actually did an episode on this.
I actually talked to the owner, the current
owner of the bar now, she was just a bartenderback when this happened.
But anyway, I had a little girl ghost followme home one night from the bar.
(13:21):
And she was doing all sorts of crazy thingswith my kids toys.
And I wasn't sleeping.
I couldn't sleep.
But I wasn't brave enough to run into theirroom to see what was.
She never did anything, like, malevolent oranything.
It was just playing with toys, setting thetoys off.
And one night, everybody kept.
My ex told me I was crazy.
(13:42):
I was just hearing things.
But the cherry on the cake, we'll say it was
the one night I kept hearing this plastic bag,like, crumpling and stuff.
And this noise with a plastic bag.
And I finally got up and went into the room.
And my kids were three and one at the time, mytwo oldest.
(14:05):
And there was a little girl's name written onthis plastic bag.
Wow.
And my kids weren't old enough to write.
And so I called a friend of mine.
She came over and saged.
And she told me I had to stand in the middleof my room or the middle of the house or
(14:25):
living room or whatever, and say, I'm sorry,you can't stay here with me.
I need to bring you back to where you belong.
And so that night I went to work.
And the whole ride to work, the hair wasstanding up on the back of my neck.
And I think I quit shortly thereafter.
Because I was like, I can't deal with that.
(14:47):
I can't bring this stuff home.
And another thing I had happened.
I was 18 or 19.
And I don't know if you're familiar with
Hinckley, Minnesota.
Speaker A (15:03):
No.
Speaker B (15:04):
Okay. So Hinckley, Minnesota, was like the big.
It was bigger than Minneapolis in the 18hundreds.
Because it was like the big logging industrywas happening.
And so everybody was moving up their logging.
They were running the logs down the river and
stuff.
So in the 18 hundreds, there was the great
(15:25):
Hinckley fire.
And a lot of people died in a long range,
like, from multiple towns.
And people were on the train trying to get out
of town.
And they were killed because the train ran
into the fire.
And people were going into lakes and rivers
(15:46):
trying to escape.
So in Hinckley, there is a big monument in the
graveyard.
And it's a bunch of unidentified bodies from
the great Hinckley fire.
So it's just like a big mass grave.
But anyway, one night my ex and I were drivingdown the road.
(16:07):
And it suddenly got really foggy.
And it wasn't od for it to be foggy in that
area.
Because there was a lot of.
What do they call those?The fisheries, where they're, like, growing
the baby fish to repopulate the lakes stuff.
So they had a lot of those ponds and stuff in
that area.
So it wasn't uncommon for it to be foggy.
(16:29):
But our headlights were almost, like, shiningback at us.
And it was really hard to see.
And we came out of the fog, and I noticed
there was a guy walking alongside the road.
Excuse me.
And as we got closer to him, I noticed he waswearing an old style suit with the tails.
(16:54):
And he had a top hat on.
And he was walking with a cane.
And he turned and looked at us and he had noface.
And my ex was leaving for vacation with hisfamily the next day for a week.
And I went and stayed at my uncle's house.
Because it was so close to our place.
(17:14):
I didn't want to be there.
Speaker A (17:16):
No kidding.
Speaker B (17:18):
But I love Halloween.
I love decorate.
We do a huge Halloween display every year.
We put on a little animatronics haunted house.
And I love doing that stuff.
But you will not catch me going to a stage
jump scare haunted house.
Because I just don't like being scared.
(17:39):
Jeremy and I have gone out and done a littleparanormal investigating.
We went up to a potter or, excuse me, what doyou call it?
A poor farm cemetery in Duluth that'ssupposedly haunted.
And we did some investigating up there.
I'm slowly getting more at ease with that
(18:02):
because I guess ghosts are better than realpeople.
Because real people suck.
Speaker A (18:07):
Yeah.
Speaker B (18:09):
So I'm getting better at that, where it doesn't scare me as much.
But I hate jump scare stuff.
So I love to do and investigate and learn more
about what happened and to communicate.
That's getting easier for me.
But the jump scare is not for me.
Speaker A (18:29):
I hear you.
I'm totally on board with that.
Because if I would ever see a ghost, I alwaystell people I'd scream like a little girl and
run the other.
Not.
I'm man enough to admit that those are greatstories you shared.
I love that because we're kind of similar inthat way, in the sense of my grandma lived in
(18:51):
Iowa.
We'd always go to my grandma's house to visit
grandma.
She lived in this old farmhouse with Grandpa.
And that was one of my first paranormalexperiences where I was a teenager.
At the time.
And I was just sitting there and I would hear
footsteps at night.
And then everybody, oh, it's grandma, Grandpa,
(19:12):
up.
But one time I was sitting there and I was
just getting ready to leave and the dooropened from the stairs because it was old
crickety wooden stairs, most farmhouses.
And the door opened and I thought it was like
my grandma or my grandpa.
And I said, hey, grandma.
Hi, grandpa.
(19:32):
And nobody was there.
Speaker B (19:34):
And those doors are heavy in those old farmhouses.
Speaker A (19:38):
Yes. And people don't understand.
It's not today with your houses where you can
put your fist through the door if you really.
Whatever.
No, not with those doors.
You would break your hand.
Speaker B (19:54):
Oh, definitely.
They were solid.
Speaker A (19:57):
Yeah. And the other thing you shared about the fire, the patch to go fire
was like the Hinckley fire.
I'm sorry, what was the name of the fire
again?
Speaker B (20:07):
Hinckley.
Speaker A (20:09):
Yeah. Okay. Pestico fire killed more people in Wisconsin, in Pestico than the
great Chicago fire did, and they happened atthe same time.
So nobody remembers the great Pestico fire,which killed more people in a short amount of
time and destroyed the entire town of Pestico.
(20:31):
Very similar to the Hinckley fire.
Speaker B (20:34):
Yeah, the Hinckley fire.
I can't remember where it started.
It actually started north and it took a trailthrough, I know, like sandstone and hinckley.
And I don't remember where it stopped or whereit started.
There is a Hinckley fire museum, and that wasa place that they used to take us in grade
school for a field trip.
(20:55):
Let's take you to a museum that of all of
these people that just perish.
Speaker A (21:00):
Jack, who burned enough.
Speaker B (21:03):
The 80s was an interesting time.
Speaker A (21:06):
Interesting time, right? Look at this.
The skull crossbones.
Speaker B (21:12):
Right.
Speaker A (21:13):
Parents would freak out nowadays, signing waivers, and there'd be lawsuits.
But the Pestico fire, too, it's very similarto that.
They have a museum.
We did an episode on that.
They also have a memorial.
And again, it's very haunted.
You go in that area, it's a mass grave becausethey couldn't figure out who was who because
(21:37):
of all the.
Everybody was just basically charcoal, for
lack of a better word.
You couldn't tell.
So it's a mass grave.
It's extremely haunted.
You look at some of the statistics that theyshared that they think is how many people
died.
It's insane.
Like I said, it totally dwarfs this greatChicago fire as far as mean.
Speaker B (22:01):
And you think about it like, in this day and age, if something like that
happened, most of the people would be able toescape.
But back then their only means oftransportation were wagons, their horses, and
the train.
So they were landlocked.
They were stuck, which is gross.
Speaker A (22:20):
Yeah. If you were poor, maybe you don't have a horse.
Speaker B (22:25):
Right.
Speaker A (22:26):
You don't have a wagon, so you're running for your life.
And to escape a fire.
Not going to happen.
Speaker B (22:33):
No. And then people were.
Speaker A (22:36):
Funny thing is that the pestico fire, similar to the Hinckley fire, kind of
started at one area and then just sweptthrough because of the winds and other things.
Crazy.
Speaker B (22:48):
Yes.
Speaker A (22:50):
The 18 hundreds was not a great time to be alive.
Speaker B (22:56):
No. Sometimes if you made it into your 30s, you were lucky.
Speaker A (23:02):
Yeah. Right.
Speaker B (23:04):
Just crazy.
Speaker A (23:06):
I know.
Well, that sounds great.
Thank you for sharing those stories.
Of course, Tracy.
Those are awesome.
And like I said, I will put on in the show
notes when this comes out, all her greatsocial media sites.
And so you go look at total conundrum andenjoy some of the great stories they do.
Because we do everything a little bitdifferently.
(23:27):
And it's from a Midwest point of view, so Ialways give props to my Midwest view.
Speaker B (23:34):
That's right.
Speaker A (23:36):
All right, so let's get a little teaser, shall we, into today's subject.
Tracy, what if I told you about a small townthat went missing after the government had
built an experimental communications facilitynear the town?
After searching for information aboutDoveland, Wisconsin, or Doveland, Wisconsin, I
(24:02):
discovered quickly that no one knows exactlywhere this mysterious town was supposedly
located and only that it was a small communitylocated in the heart of the state of
Wisconsin.
Speaker B (24:21):
Wow.
Speaker A (24:22):
Interesting.
Speaker B (24:24):
That is very interesting.
Speaker A (24:27):
So here's the thing, and this has really kind of scared me when I was
researching this.
Most people have antivirus protection and
stuff.
You got to have that nowadays for your
computer, right?
Speaker B (24:42):
Right.
Speaker A (24:42):
So no people break in there.
When I was going to these sites, warnings kept
on coming up saying, this is not a malicioussite.
It's whatever.
It's not like.
And then my laptop acted weird, and I wasnever done this before.
(25:05):
When I've been researching things, every timeI put in Dublin, Wisconsin, if something weird
would happen to my laptop.
Speaker B (25:13):
I mean, I know that the government probably hears the same rumors, know, being
from Minnesota, you got that MinnesotaWisconsin rivalry with the Vikings and the
packers.
And they always say, we call people from
Wisconsin sconies, and they always say thesconies know how to tip back those old
(25:37):
Milwaukee's.
So the government think that because they were
in a smaller area and it was a small town,that people would just be drunk and forgot it
existed.
I'm sorry.
Catch the people aren't drinking that much toforget a **** town.
Speaker A (25:55):
Right? So let's get to my sources really quickly,
Tracy, till we get into the heart of thestory, and then I'd love to hear your
opinions.
First is q nine eight five online, the legend
of Dublin, Wisconsin disappearance.
My second one was the history
historicmistries.com website.
(26:16):
The ghost in the cabin website.
Unsolved mysteries, believe it or not, did a,if you remember that, show it all back.
We were younger.
They brought it back.
But it's not the same without Robert Stack.
Speaker B (26:30):
No, you did stack attack.
Speaker A (26:34):
And then vox.com as well as I did some history defined site, too.
So a lot of historic stuff I tried to look up.
Each had their own little story behind Dublin,
Wisconsin.
So let's talk about it.
The mysterious history behind Dubland,Wisconsin, or Dubland, however you pronounce
(26:56):
it, was supposedly a small town that somehowdisappeared.
Now, this is scary, Tracy, in the 1990s.
Yeah.
This is not 18 hundreds.
This isn't 1940 1990.
Speaker B (27:15):
Okay, was that a year that the packers were at the Super bowl or something?
Did they think that would distract us?Yeah, there you go.
They put the pack attack in the Super bowl sothey could disappear at the town.
Speaker A (27:30):
I love the way you think, Tracy.
Me and you are best buds right now.
Okay?So some people in Wisconsin actually allegedly
have shirts, mugs, souvenirs from the town,and some even remember it, like relatives who
live there now.
Yes, you can go and buy a mug or t shirt that
(27:53):
says that they are fake people.
I will say they are fake.
Someone just made them up.
So let's not get too crazy here.
But there are no historical documents thatprove Doveland, Wisconsin existed.
However, later on, I'll tell you some storieshere that make you kind of, huh?
So there are no mentions, Tracy of Doveland onany mentions of Wisconsin maps.
(28:20):
So there's nothing on there.
But Doverland might only be real in people's
imaginations, which is scary to me, that youwould just make up a town in your head.
But let's pretend for a minute that it was areal town and that it did vanish.
Tracy, what could have happened to it?So many conspiracy theorists believe Dublin
(28:46):
was destroyed in connection with the project'self.
Speaker B (28:50):
Okay?
Speaker A (28:51):
And no, not the movie elf with Will Ferrell.
And all evidence of the existence of it hadbeen scrubbed from the Internet and a local
archives.
So what do you think about that?
Do you think someone could do that?Maybe an entire think, Tracy.
Speaker B (29:17):
They've been hiding aliens from us all.
These mean that's the thing they always putsomething.
When there's something that they're doing, itseems like they distract you with something
else to pull your eyes, the wool over youreyes with the other things.
(29:37):
Absolutely.
I would think it would be hard to disappear a
whole town, but it could be that maybewhatever was profiting the town or helping the
people in the town closed down and then itjust kind of dissipated from there.
Yeah, I'm not sure.
Speaker A (29:57):
Right, so let me get into that.
And then you can kind of pipe in whenever you
want to, just chime in or whatever.
It is very difficult to prove that something
doesn't exist.
It is also seems likely that the military
could get away with destroying a town withoutanyone having a concrete memory of it.
Okay, so what is project?Okay, very quickly, so people understand this.
(30:22):
In the 1960s, US Navy officials concocted anambitious plan.
They wanted to bury gigantic grid of cablesunder, roughly get this, 41% of the state of
Wisconsin to turn into the world's largestradio antenna.
(30:49):
Think about that.
Nearly half the state of Wisconsin they wanted
to bury these cables under to communicate withtheir subs, which I'll get into.
So the project was called Project San Green.
And although it sounds crazy, it was logical,
although impractical way of communicating withdeep sea submarines around the world.
(31:14):
The problem is that radio waves don't travelwell through water.
So there was no good way to send signals to anuclear powered subs that stayed submerged
during the months of the cold War.
So project sanguine would have been an antenna
for transmitting.
And this is where elf comes in.
Extremely low frequency waves that canpenetrate water and reach the subs.
(31:40):
Now, okay, believe it or not, this, accordingto most sources, it never happened.
Largely because of the huge cost, potentiallybillions of dollars in environmental
disturbances would have been required.
In other words, they're going to destroy the
environment.
It's going to cost billions of dollars.
Back in 1960s, but they had an idea about asmaller version called Project ELf, which was
(32:09):
eventually built in Wisconsin and Michigan,upper Peninsula, and operated this.
Actually, you can still see the cables between1989 and 2004.
So think about that.
This is actually a thing that happened, okay?
But the cables do not go underneath thebedrock.
(32:31):
They're like telephone wires, for lack of.
Speaker B (32:34):
A better word, okay.
Which is scary in itself, because what kind of
EMF is coming off of those?I know for myself.
We had a cabin up in Swatera, and they put thehigh power lines up there.
And when Duluth had the big flooding, a few.
(32:57):
What was that, like ten years ago, maybe eight
years ago?When it took out, like, the zoo and
everything.
That flooding was affected.
Swatara as well.
And we went up there with our four wheelers
and we had a trailer.
Our four wheelers were on a trailer, and we
were hauling them and stuff.
(33:18):
And we were having to drive through water that
was up to the top of our tires to try to getto our cabin.
And the road was so soft.
The trailer kind of, when we turned to go into
the cabin, the trailer kind of slid into theditch a little bit.
And we got out and we weren't even standing inwater.
It was just the fact that the ground was sowet that I felt like I had a million bugs in
(33:44):
my hair.
And it was from the high power lines.
I had to get back into the car because I couldnot stand it.
I'm like, what is it doing to my brain if Ican feel the electricity?
I was like, we're not staying here.
Sorry.
Speaker A (34:01):
Yeah, absolutely.
So to make it work, one of the things people
forget here is of, like you said, it hadelectricity just kind of just going out there
and kind of freaking people out.
And what they wanted to do was when they were
(34:24):
trying to do it through the bedrock.
This is crazy.
This is something I just want to.
Because they said they didn't do it, but I'm
kind of like, yeah, maybe they did, and theyjust didn't tell us.
The bedrock has a really good conductor ofelectricity current when it was sent through
it.
So the current would throw in the ground in
between, forming a huge loop to complete thecircuit.
(34:44):
Now, get this.
The bedrock throbbed with electricity.
So the electricity would be, like, coming intothe bedrock, but would come out of the
bedrock.
You know what I mean?
So it kind of, like, dissipates through there,and it create a magnetic field that would
generate elf waves.
So in other words, yeah, you're going into
(35:06):
this huge magnetic field, which is never goodfor the human body.
And it was just crazy.
And this is the same thing.
Once they started putting these basicallyholly power lines up, the same thing would
happen, too.
This area would just have these intrusive
cables, and they would just tons ofelectricity and power just coming off of these
(35:33):
things, creating, like, this huge magneticfield in order to send the elf wave to the
subs.
Now.
I know, right?But they did this in.
So this is so stupid.
And nothing against people in Wyoming or the
Appalachians, but this is where they testedit.
Okay, so it's not like you have a lot ofpeople in that area and in Upper Peninsula.
(35:59):
And if you've ever been up there.
If you love fishing, if you love hunting, if
you love hiking, snowmobiling, whatever youlove, you're an outdoors person.
You go up there.
Right.
Speaker B (36:10):
Don't pronounce their lakes wrong though.
Speaker A (36:13):
Yes.
Speaker B (36:13):
Don't they get very upset?
Speaker A (36:16):
They very upset.
Midwest people.
Here's your tip for Midwest people.
You go to Upper Peninsula, learn to do their
lake in the lakes.
Speaker B (36:25):
We went up to go gimmick and we were calling it Geobeck because that's what it
looked like.
And they're like, it is go gimmick.
And I'm like, I'm sorry, but we should knowbetter because Minnesota and Wisconsin also
have a bunch of towns that are impossible toso pronounce.
Speaker A (36:44):
Right. Exactly.
And then people stare at you and then you're
just like, how do I pronounce it?So these elf waves that were being produced.
Getting back to this, the navy officialssettled on.
This is crazy.
On the forest of Upper Wisconsin.
It's the ideal location.
And there's this granite bedroom that had the
(37:05):
right characteristics that they could run thiscable underneath.
They say they could, but they did it.
They keep saying they did, but the granite
thing was really good.
So look at how many miles of cables they laid
in the upper peninsula.
6000 miles.
Speaker B (37:24):
Jeez.
Speaker A (37:26):
Yeah. So it covered the whole entire upper peninsula into Wisconsin.
Speaker B (37:32):
Wow.
Speaker A (37:34):
So imagine these cables.
And again, some of them are still there.
They haven't took them down.
They've been trying to take them down from
time to time, but some are still there.
You still can see them.
Speaker B (37:46):
So they must have had to zigzag them kind of to reach that 6000 because how
far isn't California from Minnesota?Like 2400 miles or something.
Speaker A (38:01):
I'm thinking they went around like so many **** times or something.
Speaker B (38:05):
Maybe that's a lot of cable.
Or a lot of miles.
Speaker A (38:10):
That is a lot of cable.
You're darn right.
So maybe they had to do it two or three, fourtimes.
I don't know, but it just doesn't sound right.
Right?
Speaker B (38:18):
No.
Speaker A (38:19):
Whether that number is right or wrong, it's still like.
Yeah.
Speaker B (38:24):
And going bedrock and granite, that's not an easy task.
Speaker A (38:29):
No, they put this out and they did their best because they were worried about
it's the cold War.
So if anybody's in the.
Tracy, remember the Cold War where you like,at any time the Russians would launch a
nuclear weapon and we'll be attacked and we'llall have to learn russian because they're all
(38:50):
going to take us over.
Right, Tracy, remember that?
Speaker B (38:53):
I remember.
Speaker A (38:56):
Like every time someone said, the Russians are mad.
Everyone would build a bomb shelter.
Speaker B (39:07):
Yeah, it was a crazy time.
Speaker A (39:09):
It was.
It was a crazy time because he just didn't
know.
I mean, there was always the Russians saying
something.
Then the Americans would say then, you know,
Reagan, who was our president at the time,would be like, well, we're going to build Star
wars and we're going to shoot down themissiles.
And you're like, what is going on?
Speaker B (39:30):
My recollection of Reagan, I was born in 75.
And when I remember, I kept thinking whensomebody would talk about our president, I'm
like, oh, our president kissed a monkey.
And he was in that movie bedtime for Bonzo.
That was my thought.
(39:51):
Know who President Reagan was?
Speaker A (40:00):
I don't know.
Some people love him.
This is not a political podcast.
Speaker B (40:04):
Nope. I don't want to go into any politics.
That was just my recollection of him.
Speaker A (40:08):
Yeah, right.
Exactly.
So guess what?Wisconsin residents protested when they heard
about the classified plan.
By the way, it was classified, and it got out.
I have no idea why.
So they went through this, and then in 1973.
So remember this started in the.
(40:28):
They were putting this plan out and talking
about how they're going to do this and allthis good stuff.
So, in 1973, Secretary of Defense Melvin Lairdkilled the plan.
Okay, so, great, right?He said, no, this is too expensive.
We're going to destroy the beautiful Wisconsinwilderness, and people are protesting?
(40:49):
Forget it.
So he said, why don't we just build these
small, modest transmitters, and we'll put themon Clam Lake.
In Clam Lake, Wisconsin, which does exist, bythe way.
Speaker B (41:04):
They didn't make that disappear.
Speaker A (41:07):
Yeah, they didn't make that disappear.
So they said, let's do that.
So, again, more protests, especially from
residents who feared the health and effects ofthe.
You know, elf had many other types of nonionizing radiation.
Oh, by the way, I've got radiation, Tracy.
Speaker B (41:26):
Oh, jeez.
Speaker A (41:27):
When you're in a magnetic field, it has certain radiation effects on you.
You lose your hair.
It causes cancer.
Yeah, all the good stuff.
Yeah.
So one of the things they said was, again,let's try this, let's see what happens.
And then finally said, no, it's not going towork, because everybody is protesting.
(41:49):
It became huge news across the country.
So they just shut it down in 1977.
They said, all right, we're done.
We get it.
Okay.
So, however, under President Reagan, he
revived the project because he basically cameout and said, the Russians are going to kill
(42:09):
us all.
The Russians.
The Russians.
The Russians.
And everybody got scared.
So he said, okay, let's do this.
But this time, like I said, the Wisconsin had28 miles of these cables.
So they didn't build the 6000 miles theywanted to do and put it all over Wisconsin and
Michigan and ever places.
Whatever they had, they were going to do.
(42:29):
They decided to do just a little project,right?
And they strung it on power lines, just likethe wooden power lines you see every day with
electricity.
And they built a little bit of a site in
Wisconsin and then they put some in Michigan.
And the cables were arranged in a crisscross
fashion to broadcast signals both laterallyand longitudinally at each line to reach out
(42:56):
through the subs.
And one of the things too, which we know that
again, they did put some under the bedrockjust to try it.
They said, we're just going to put a littlebit under here.
So they didn't put too much, they just put alittle bit under there.
Nobody knew about it until later when theyreleased the classified documents.
(43:20):
So they lied to us again.
And these elf waves were coming up through the
bedrock and causing issues.
A lot of people were saying, hey, there's the
wildlife.
There's something going on up there.
What's going on?It's affecting the plants, the wildlife,
everything.
And they were like, I thought you said this is
(43:40):
going to do.
Yeah.
I always say, too, it communicated with themole people who had civilizations in hollow
earth.
If any of you guys know about hollow Earth and
there's people under the earth and they have awhole thing, I don't know, I would love that.
Speaker B (44:02):
Kind of go along with the flat earth theory.
Speaker A (44:05):
Correct?
Speaker B (44:07):
Yeah.
Speaker A (44:08):
So again, the residents continued to protest.
And then the cold war ended.
So the installation looked less and less
necessary because we got satellites, we gotall this stuff.
We didn't really need it anymore.
In 1996, a Michigan resident named Tom Howard
(44:29):
Hastings entered the site and cut down severalantenna poles.
And in suing years, Wisconsin senator RussellFeingold, who's no longer our senator anymore,
introduced several bills at closing theproject.
So in other words, there are people going outthere, literally, tracy, and cutting down the
(44:51):
poles, which not a smart idea because theseare high elf waves, very dangerous.
And then Russ Feingld said, we got to get ridof these things because they were still
working, they were still emitting the energyand the radiation and all that stuff.
And everybody was like, oh, well, we turnedoff the power button.
(45:13):
It should not work.
Well, yeah, it still does work.
So in test, like I said, they started to useit again.
I just don't get this, because they said,okay, our satellites are not doing what?
We still need this thing.
Okay.
So what they decided to do is they started toopen up the system again in 1989, because,
(45:39):
like I said during the stuff, they're tryingto solve this and trying the.
So they would secretly just.
Government would say it, well, let's flip the
switch back on and try it.
Because they would reach out to places in the
Arctic that the satellites couldn't hit.
But finally, in 2004, the Navy shut down
(46:00):
project elf, dismantling some 84 miles ofcable.
Thus, the russian navy still uses elf.
So the Russians still use elf.
We supposedly do not.
Yes.
And they use, like, these VFL waves and buoysthat they use are much safer and everything,
(46:24):
like, so what does this have to do withDublin, Wisconsin?
A lot of people think that two or three thingshappened in Dublin, Wisconsin.
So the first thing they said was that the townwas swallowed up by a sinkhole caused by these
(46:47):
waves because they kept on shutting them offand turning them on and everything like that.
So a giant sinkhole swallowed the town.
Okay.
Which you're like, well, I don't know ifyou've heard a lot about sinkholes, Tracy,
but, like, in Florida, they're bad.
Like, people have lost homes and neighborhoods
have been swallowed up by sinkholes.
Just go on YouTube and enter, like, sinkholes
(47:10):
swallowing houses, and you will see an entirehouse go crashing down because of a sinkhole.
Okay.
The other thing is, they thought it was
because of a massive earthquake.
Now, Wisconsin is not typical.
Yeah, so Wisconsin is not in typically fault.
(47:30):
Although people have argued that the vibration
from these waves and everything could havecaused an earthquake per se.
It's not really an earthquake, but it'ssomething that could have done that.
Others believe.
This is my favorite.
Others believe the town was cursed by avengeful spirit who caused the town and its
(47:52):
people to disappear as punishment for a longforgotten transgression.
Now, I looked this up.
What they think happened was that these waves
or radiation awakened at evil spirits.
Spirits.
Speaker B (48:07):
There was a lot of energy for that spirit to be able to feed off, correct?
Speaker A (48:13):
Absolutely.
There you go, Tracy.
So what happened?What they thought was there was this evil
spirit.
This thing sucked up all these energy, and
that said, all right, Dublin, Wisconsin.
Bam.
I'm going to destroy it.
I love that one.
That's my favorite.
Speaker B (48:29):
The energy fits.
And if the spirit was angry enough.
Speaker A (48:34):
Right, as we know from being into the paranormal, that's what paranormal, the
ghost spirits feed off of is energy.
Right.
And imagine a massive amount that could dosomething.
Speaker B (48:49):
Well, you've already got the bedrock underneath, so they feed off of the
energy of the rock.
And if you're powering that, you're.
Yeah, watch out.
Gonna have to call ghostbusters.
Speaker A (49:00):
Yes. The other thing, too, and this has happened to other towns, probably in
Minnesota, too, where they've dammed upcertain rivers and everything.
And the towns near the rivers and stuff, well,they just became ghost towns because, well, we
dammed up the river.
That's what we kind of need to survive.
(49:21):
And they kicked the people out because they'relike, hey, we dammed up this river.
So now you guys got to leave, because if thisGM breaks, it's going to destroy things.
So I'm like, okay, I've looked that up.
That has happened in Wisconsin and around the
midwest and United States.
The military has dammed up certain places, and
(49:44):
for whatever, know, the town just became aghost town.
So it is true.
It does happen.
It does happen.
So one of the things that said, too, is Dublin
residents moved away due to a failing economy.
So similarly, they damp something up with the
military, like all this radiation and stuff.
If people are getting sick, hey, that has
happened, too, mostly because of water.
(50:07):
There's many stories out there where towns
have gotten.
People have gotten leukemia from drinking the
water, cancers, whatever, because ofcorporations or military whatever, and people
that.
Okay, right.
Kind of makes sense.
And then Dublin was what they call a military
(50:27):
town that ceased to exist when the operationwas.
Right.
Right.
Speaker B (50:36):
Makes sense.
Speaker A (50:38):
Yeah, it just happened.
So the other thing then, of course, one of my
favorite was Dublin was destroyed by amilitary science experiment, project sanguine,
that went wrong.
And what they say what happened is there is a
Dublin, Wisconsin, but it's in an alternateuniverse.
So it's like you wake up every morning, Tracy,and you think you're going to work.
(51:00):
Well, you're not in this universe.
You're in a different universe, but you.
Speaker B (51:07):
Got sucked into a whole other timeline.
Speaker A (51:10):
Yeah. You're in a whole different timeline, and you just hide it.
Right.
And you're just like, okay, here I am.
Speaker B (51:19):
Good thing nobody in that town works outside of the town.
Speaker A (51:22):
Right? Exactly.
Like, you go outside the town.
You've seen those maybe movies or stories.
Speaker B (51:28):
Yes. Where you can't cross the borders.
Speaker A (51:30):
Yes. So that could be right.
Who knows?
Speaker B (51:33):
It could be.
Speaker A (51:34):
Now, I want to talk about something really quick.
It's called the Mendela Check.
It's a type of false memory that occurs when
many people incorrectly remember the samething.
It refers to the widespread false memory thatNelson Mandela died in prison in the 1980s.
So this is a real thing.
(51:54):
And I do it all the time where I'll try to
remember something and I'll be like, Iremember you being at that party.
I remember you.
And then my budy goes, no, dude, I was never
at your party.
Like, you sure?
Because I remember you at my party.
He's like, I wasn't at your party.
I don't know if that's ever happened to you,Tracy.
Speaker B (52:13):
Oh, yes.
Speaker A (52:14):
Remember a movie or something that people.
Speaker B (52:16):
Go, we actually did an episode on it.
Yeah, we actually did an episode on it.
And Jeremy was quite funny going through
because he's like, well, if you think thiswas.
I'm like, yeah, it was.
He's like, well, you're wrong.
I'm like, no, I'm not.
(52:37):
So we had a lot of fun with that one.
But there's so much out there.
But the theory that I've heard on it is that
in, was it 2012 that supposedly the worldrebooted and that's when everything changed or
something.
I don't know if I necessarily believe that.
(52:59):
But like Tom Cruise, when in risky business,he goes skirting across in his socks and know
whitey tidies and the button down shirt.
I remember him having sunglasses on.
He doesn't.
Curious George.
He's a monkey.
He should have a. Doesn't.
You know, things like that.
(53:20):
The Mandela effect blows my mind.
Speaker A (53:23):
Yeah. And there's the Bernstein Bears and the Barnstein bears or something
like that.
Speaker B (53:28):
Bernstein.
And.
Speaker A (53:30):
Exactly, exactly.
And then you've got movies.
There's like, there was this one movie.
Speaker B (53:37):
That have caused Shazam.
Speaker A (53:39):
Shazam or Kazam.
Right?
Speaker B (53:41):
Kazam.
One of the.
Speaker A (53:43):
Yeah. And it's supposed to have Shaq in it, but it.
I'm trying to think of the actor's name.
Speaker B (53:49):
Oh, my gosh.
Sinbad.
Yes, Sinbad.
Speaker A (53:52):
Yeah. And people were.
Speaker B (53:53):
That's a big one.
Speaker A (53:55):
Yeah. I remember Sinbad in this movie.
That movie's never exist.
Speaker B (53:59):
Right.
How about the monopoly guy?
Monocle or no monocle.
Speaker A (54:05):
Right. That is.
So what I found was some notable personal
accounts that people say it existed.
So check this out.
Speaker B (54:16):
All right.
Speaker A (54:18):
One of the first accounts is, this is from actually was an army person that
supposedly worked on this project and was inDublin, Wisconsin.
He totally remembers that.
He says, I just learned about all the noise
surrounding Dublin.
And I think I can add some insight.
Dublin was a small town of Wisconsin thathoused many military families.
(54:43):
My father lived there for a year or two andspoke of it occasionally.
The main thing I remember that it had to dowith project sanguine in the early sixty s. I
don't think it was x files type stuff, but thetown was destroyed after an incident.
(55:04):
They were digging up a ton of land forsomething and they flooded the town or
something.
But this is rehash secondhand memory from
years ago.
And this is from Private Jeannie Ivanoff.
Whatever.
I don't know what unit he was in, but see what
(55:25):
he's saying?He's like, he remembers the town.
He remembers his dad living in the town.
Speaker B (55:30):
Right? Hold on 1 second.
Tickle in my throat.
Speaker A (55:39):
So this is the other thing someone said, and this is Nate Allen.
He said that the locations for Dublin don'tcoincide with Project Sanguine, aka Project
Elf.
Due to the bedrock, there are two elf sites no
longer in operation, with one being outside ofClam Lake, Wisconsin, and the other in the
(56:02):
upper peninsula.
That's Michigan.
They are extremely low frequency transmittersthat use the bedrock to bounce signals under
the crust to signal nuclear submarines tosurface to receive action message.
The antennas were above ground and looked likepower lines running through the middle of the
forest.
If the antennas were buried, then they'd be
(56:23):
short out to earth ground and be useless.
I'm an amateur radio operator, so this is
second nature to me.
There is nothing Sci-Fi about sanguine and
nothing that could cause an accident where atown would disappear.
But there have been studies about the like.
He talks about increase in cancer due to the
(56:45):
power and frequencies used at these sites,right?
Nate is like, no, it wouldn't work.
I don't know what they're talking about.
But it's funny that these people bring thisup, right?
Speaker B (56:58):
Oh, totally.
Speaker A (56:59):
It's not in the maps.
There's no history, there's no nothing.
And people are like, I heard about it, or Isaw that the next one I thought was really
interesting too.
So this gentleman, I don't got a name on this
one, but he was countering back to thegentleman who said, hey, Dublin didn't exist.
(57:22):
He says, as someone who has lived in variousplaces in Wisconsin for over 30 years and have
been in the army, never once I have any singleperson ever mentioned Dublin.
So I think that was really interesting.
But he goes on to say, you make a good point,
but actually dovelin was very real.
(57:45):
And I'm like, okay.
My father used to mention it occasionallybefore he passed.
And the only reason I remember it, because Ifound it ironic that a town named Doveland was
populated by almost exclusively militarypersonnel and their families.
And then he would say, I would dig around fora shirt back home.
(58:07):
I don't know what he's kind of shirt he'slooking for.
And if I remember correctly, the town wasbuilt as part of project sanguine in the mid
to late 60s.
Maybe everyone left when the project was
canceled, but I thought something went verywrong.
You could only dig up so much turf for so longbefore you're bound to have.
(58:33):
Even though I don't really think there is aDublin, Wisconsin again, my father would talk
about it.
People would talk about it.
And the other thing he mentioned was thefreaky bit is how many in my family from
Wisconsin say they remember Dublin, Wisconsin.
Speaker B (58:51):
I think when he said he was going to dig around for a shirt, he probably recalls
somebody wearing a shirt with Dublin on.
Speaker A (58:59):
Right, right.
And there is a picture out there, which I'll
put on my social media sites, of a person in arestaurant is a man and woman, and the man's a
waiter, and the woman is with him.
I don't know if it's his wife or girlfriend or
just a friend, whatever, and they're sittingat a table and people have said either it's
(59:21):
fake, obviously, or people are convinced thatsomeone took a picture at this restaurant in
Dublin, Wisconsin, and brought this picturefor it.
Now it's up to you what you, you know, I justfind it so interesting that people, first of
all, sort of remember a town and that this waspart of a project that kind of just went hear.
(59:47):
We've heard from time to time.
Right, Tracy.
Where people said, oh, the military did thisor the military did that, and they released
these classified documents, let's use ufos andaliens, right?
They finally came out and said, yes, they'reufos.
They're real.
There you go.
So what do you think?What do you think?
(01:00:07):
You think there is a Dublin, Wisconsin?You think it ever existed?
Tracy?
Speaker B (01:00:13):
Well, for myself, being in Minnesota, I like how all these people are
saying, I've never heard of a know I, ifsomebody gave me a small town name or even a
large town name in Minnesota, I can't tell youwithout looking at a map if it actually
(01:00:35):
exists, because there are so many small towns.
So for people to know, no matter where.
I've lived all over Minnesota as well.
I've lived in northern Minnesota, I've lived
in southern Minnesota, but there are stillmany towns that I've passed through that know,
like around by us.
There's teeny tiny little town called day.
(01:00:56):
There's a teeny tiny little town called coin.
Never knew they existed.
So to say that there are towns that start offand just dissipate so I can't say whether it
actually existed or not.
To me, the name sounds familiar, Dublin.
(01:01:18):
But I may have heard it from another state orsomething different.
But Dublin definitely sounds familiar to me.
But whether it existed or not, I don't know.
The militaries and the government are good atcovering things up.
Speaker A (01:01:34):
Yeah. Aren't they?
Speaker B (01:01:36):
They are.
Speaker A (01:01:37):
They're totally good at that.
Again, I don't know what to think.
I do know when I used to.
I used to go fishing a lot when I was younger,
before I got married and had a family.
Nothing against my kids and my family, because
I love them, but I didn't have the time to doas much as I would like.
Speaker B (01:01:54):
Right.
Speaker A (01:01:55):
Hopefully in retirement I went, but I used to go off north all the time, the
furthest peninsulas, right.
And frankly, I saw small towns with literally
a grocery store, gas pump, couple homes, maybea little cafe or bar.
(01:02:17):
And that was it.
That was the town, right.
And that town disappeared.
Speaker B (01:02:20):
You blink, you miss it.
Speaker A (01:02:22):
Yeah. If that town disappears.
Tracy.
Tracy.
Okay, it's gone.
Speaker B (01:02:28):
Right?
Speaker A (01:02:29):
I don't know what to tell you.
So some of it, I kind of believe in the sense
there was a town that got destroyed by themilitary, in the sense of the military left.
And everybody just whatever.
If you go on Google maps and look, you will
not find it, obviously.
(01:02:50):
All you'll see is just basically, there's a
town, a little town near there, and justbasically fields and hills, just like in
Wisconsin and Minnesota.
It's just nothing.
Right.
Speaker B (01:03:02):
So you know what you need to do? You need to find somebody that has.
Remember those books that we used to carryaround in our car?
I can't remember what they were.
Map books.
Speaker A (01:03:14):
Yeah, Atlas books.
Speaker B (01:03:17):
Well, the Atlas one would work, too, but they were, like, in the 90s, they
were really popular.
They were, like, spiraled, and they had
multiple pages, and it was, like, for thewhole state, and it had maps for each town and
stuff like that.
So we need to find somebody who hoards and
(01:03:42):
held on to all of those, because if Dublinexisted, it'd be in that map book.
You need to find it outside of the Internet inreality.
Speaker A (01:03:53):
All right, you got me on a mission, Tracy.
Speaker B (01:03:57):
I can't remember what they're called, though.
But they were really nice books.
Every year they would come out with a new one.
Speaker A (01:04:03):
Yeah, I can't remember them either.
Boy, there's a Mandela effect in effect right
there.
Speaker B (01:04:07):
Right? But even an atlas.
Even an atlas.
Because there was a day where we weren't
controlled by the Internet.
We actually had to go and look up about the
Dewey decimal system to find certain books ina library.
Speaker A (01:04:24):
Yes. My children just really quickly is a quick offshoot.
My kids, when I told them, you know, when yourdad had to do research for a book report, you
know what I had to do?I actually had to read and had to go to the
library.
I remember my son's son saying something
really funny.
He goes, oh, you're a sucker, dad.
(01:04:45):
Thanks a lot.
Thanks a lot.
Speaker B (01:04:49):
Yeah, my youngest loves libraries, and that's funny because she's a total Gen Z,
but she loves books.
She loves libraries.
She would live at one if she could, which iscrazy.
So she's my Gen Z, or that should have been aGen xer.
Speaker A (01:05:15):
So I'm going to put this out to my spooky friends and Tracy's followers, too.
If anyone knows anything about Dublin,wisconsin.
Dairylandfrites@gmail.com send me something.
If you remember what those books are that
Tracy and I are trying to figure out, sendthat to us, too.
But before we end up, I'm going.
Speaker B (01:05:35):
To go to the goodwill and see if I can find an old map.
Speaker A (01:05:39):
It, I love it.
Keep me informed, Tracy.
Speaker B (01:05:42):
I will.
Speaker A (01:05:43):
So, Tracy, before we end up the show, because we could talk about this for
hours, I love you.
You've been great.
Some great stories and love being someone fromthe midwest.
So we can kind of get that Midwest feel backon the show here.
So tell me about what's coming up on totalconundrum.
What do you guys got planned?Anything really cool?
(01:06:05):
Just my spooky friends would love to know.
Speaker B (01:06:07):
Yeah, we have a couple of fun episodes coming out.
We just had one that we released.
I think it was on Thursday.
Where.
Are you familiar with ghost hunters?
Yes, the show ghost hunters, and they havetheir taps team.
Well, we interviewed jenny from TCPS,paranormal Twin Cities paranormal society, and
(01:06:35):
she's a part of the Minnesota Taps team.
I didn't know that taps had teams in every
state, and we interviewed her because she usedto work at the Palmer House hotel.
So we have all sorts of fun spooky storiesfrom was telling.
I kind of went over the research I found forthe Palmer house, and she's researched that
(01:07:01):
place multiple times.
She's researched it in and out.
She's investigated it, plus worked there.
And so it was kind of fun to tell her what I
found on the Internet and what she told me,whether it was true or not.
So that was a great episode.
I think it ended up being close to 2 hours.
I could have talked to her for ten.
(01:07:22):
She was amazing.
We have an episode that's going to be comingout this Thursday.
We're touching on cursed movie sets.
Speaker A (01:07:31):
Oh, nice.
Speaker B (01:07:32):
Yeah. Exorcist, the omen, the crow, stuff like that poltergeist.
And then the next week after that, weinterviewed Nash Hoover, who's from Minnesota,
and he has a YouTube channel called ChasingLegends, and they go out and try to find the
(01:07:58):
elusive cryptids.
Speaker A (01:08:00):
Oh, nice.
Speaker B (01:08:02):
Yeah. So we've got a few fun episodes coming out.
Speaker A (01:08:06):
Yeah, that looks great and everything.
And that's one thing people don't understandwith cryptids in the midwest, there's some
pretty big ones.
Like we have the beast of Bray Road, which is
a werewolf.
We also have Hodag.
Speaker B (01:08:25):
The Hodg. Yes.
Speaker A (01:08:27):
Which is kind of a funny one.
We did an episode on.
So. Yeah, that sounds really interesting.
I love all that stuff coming up, and I'm
definitely going to listen.
And hopefully my spooky friends will give you
a listen too.
Because one of the things that we were talking
about, Tracy, we're independent podcasts, sowe don't have the huge budgets like all those
(01:08:48):
big podcasts out there.
So if you're listening to us, please rate us
five stars like us.
Subscribe to us.
I recommend total conundrum as well as all theother people, podcasts and paranormal
investigators, whoever, have on my show,because, hey, we need the love too, right,
Tracy?
Speaker B (01:09:06):
We do.
Speaker A (01:09:08):
Awesome.
Speaker B (01:09:09):
We need all sorts of love.
Speaker A (01:09:11):
Yes. So again, thank you so much.
You're awesome.
Love to have you back on the show again soon.
Sometime maybe we could talk about cryptids
this time.
Speaker B (01:09:21):
Yeah. Make sure Jeremy's feeling up to it, too.
Speaker A (01:09:25):
Yeah, tell Jeremy to feel better.
Definitely.
Anyway, so we end every show by saying, say hito your ghost.
So, hello, ghost.
Because you never know, right?
Stay spooky.
Speaker B (01:09:39):
Stay spooky.
Speaker A (01:09:41):
Thanks, Tracy.
Love you.
Speaker B (01:09:43):
Thank you.
You too.
My spooky friends.
I'm John, your host, and welcome to another
episode of Dairyland Frights, the paranormalpodcast that covers everything creepy, spooky,
and mysterious in the midwest.
And today I'm joined by another great spooky
guest on the podcast is Tracy from TotalConundrum podcast.
(00:35):
Hi, Tracy, how are.
Speaker B (00:39):
Oh, how are you?
Speaker A (00:42):
I'm doing great and better that I have you on the show to talk about some
interesting things regarding the paranormaland true crime and some other things.
Speaker B (00:51):
So, yeah, we've had a little difficulty connecting.
I was sick and now Jeremy's sick.
So I'm like, we're going.
We're going for it.
Speaker A (00:58):
We're going.
And we're practically neighbors.
Tracy's in Minnesota.
I'm in Wisconsin.
So I'd love to have a Midwest person on theshow as much as I can get.
Speaker B (01:11):
And we'll try not to throw our accents out there too much.
Speaker A (01:14):
Yeah, we'll try not to be like, yeah, hey, yeah, okay.
Speaker B (01:17):
Yeah, you betcha.
Speaker A (01:17):
Don't you it, you know, people laugh at us, but that's okay.
So tell me about your.
Speaker B (01:28):
We have, our podcast is true crime, paranormal unexplained, a little bit of
everything.
And we research and tell stories as much as we
can.
With the ghost stories and unexplained, it's
really hard to get the true accounts.
(01:48):
You just do your research and go with what the
majority we.
It's my husband and I, Jeremy, and we've been
going for, I think we've been live for aboutseven months now.
And we're loving it.
Absolutely loving it.
Speaker A (02:09):
Yeah. And again, do yourself a favor, my spooky friends, if you have a chance
to listen to the podcast, total conundrum,please do.
These guys are great.
They have great stories, including one of my
favorites about the gentleman who was callingfast food restaurants and making the manager
like, strip search their employees and stuff.
(02:31):
That's crazy.
Talk a little bit about that story.
Just kind of give my spooky friends a little.
Speaker B (02:36):
Yeah. So I came across it watching a documentary, and it's called don't pick up
the phone.
And it's about this guy that lived in Florida
that was calling fast food places all overthe.
And he was, he would give a brief, like a veryvague description of an employee or even a
(03:04):
patron of the restaurant, and then they wouldbring him back to the office and strip search
him, have him do certain things, some very notappropriate sexual things, and then he would
hang up and that would be it.
And one of the girls that was probably the
(03:27):
most assaulted, actually went to court andtook mcdonald's to court, and she won her
case.
And I think there was.
I can't remember how many restaurants, 74 or94, something like that, that had this happen
across the country, and it basically came downto two detectives, one in the east and one in
(03:54):
the south, and they kind of solved the casetogether.
But I won't give away the ending.
But, yeah, it's not a great story, but it's
just incredible how the human psyche willfollow those things.
(04:15):
But in the episode I also talked about, therewas in the scientist did testing, and he had
the scientist, the teacher, the student, orwhatever, and the scientist was just the one
giving, would tell them what to do.
(04:36):
The teacher was trying to teach the student
questions or answers to questions, or.
It was like a memory game.
I think it's been so long since I watched thedocumentary now.
So he would give him, like, five words in arow, and then the student would have to repeat
them.
(04:56):
Well, the student was in on it, but the
teacher didn't know that.
So the teacher would have to issue a shock to
the student, and each time increasing thevoltage, and the student on the other side was
pretending like he was in agony.
And how many people would continue to do this?
(05:17):
And there was this one guy in the video that Iwas watching.
He's like, I can't do this.
I'm going to kill him.
And he's like, you have to.
And so he does.
And I'm like, what?How?
But it's crazy when you think that you're in aposition of having to listen to somebody in
authority.
How many people will not stop?
Speaker A (05:39):
Right? And I saw that experiment, too, and exactly
what you're talking about.
Sometimes the other person was an actor, so
people understand, and they weren't reallybeing shocked.
So understand that, too.
But still, the person didn't know it.
Administering the shots, they had no clue.
They weren't in on it.
And there was just a guy with a clipboard anda lab coat saying, yes, go do it.
(06:04):
No, you got to do it.
And people are like, okay, and here's the
crazy number.
This is a number I'll never forget.
52% of the people continued to give shocks toa fatal level.
Speaker B (06:19):
Yes.
Speaker A (06:20):
Okay. Only 10% to 12% said, no, I'm not doing this.
And got up and left, just like, no, I'm notdoing this.
So think about that for a second, Tracy.
Over half of people were willing to kill a
person because a guy in a clipboard told themto.
Speaker B (06:41):
Right.
Speaker A (06:42):
You have to.
That's insane.
Speaker B (06:46):
No, there's no way.
No way I would do that.
Speaker A (06:49):
I just look at the dude and be like, no, you're crazy, you're crazy.
I'm out of here.
Yeah, and it was the same thing with this.
Go do yourself a favor and watch it.
They made a movie, don't be out of it.
Yeah, don't pick up the phones and maybedocument.
I cannot remember the movie.
(07:10):
If I find it, I'll put it in the show notes.
I remember watching the movie.
It's not a great movie, but it really just
made you just go, wow, is this real?And you're like crazy.
Let's get to the.
Oh, go ahead.
Speaker B (07:30):
I was just going to say in the story that I did, I only covered a handful of
the cases too.
It was insane.
Speaker A (07:39):
It was crazy.
So go ahead and listen to that episode.
You're going to love it.
Along with all the other episodes, Tracy, and
do.
So, Tracy, what got you interested in the
paranormal?Did you have a paranormal experience?
What made you like, hey, let's get thispodcast and talk about all these creepy,
(08:02):
mysterious things, serious things?
Speaker B (08:04):
Well, when I was growing up, I grew up in a very old farmhouse, and to this day I
believe that things happen, but I don't knowif a lot of it.
Sometimes people put it in your head that youwere just a kid, you were imagining your
imagination was getting the best of you.
So this house was so old that it didn't have a
(08:28):
furnace or anything.
It had the wood stove in the basement and then
it had the huge metal grate in the floor inthe living room.
And that's where all the heat came up from,was from the wood stove in the basement.
And then in the two bedrooms on the mainlevel, there was a square hole on the top by
(08:51):
the ceiling in the wall, and then one on thebottom.
And that's how the heat circulated through therooms.
And so in the summertime, my bedroom wasupstairs, in the wintertime, my bedroom had to
be downstairs because the heat didn't getupstairs.
And this house had like the, instead of havingsiding, it had shingles for siding.
(09:13):
It was a really old, old farmhouse.
I wish it still was standing because it'd be
very cool to go back and see it again.
But anyway, there was a night that my mom's
best friend and her were playing cards, andher daughter and I were also best friends.
(09:34):
And we were in bed and there was a hand thatcame out of one of those holes in the wall,
and it was holding a knife and it was, like,floating over us.
And we both have recollections of this.
(09:56):
So it's like, it had to have happened because
I still talk to her to this day, and sheremembers these things.
There was another time when I was older, wemoved out of the house because it needed a
lot.
And we had put a different house on the
property.
(10:16):
And when I was in high school, my girlfriends,
when they'd come over there, we'd dare eachother to sleep upstairs in the old house
because there was all sorts of creepy thingsthat would happen.
And the one night, a girlfriend and I, we did.
We went up to one of the old bedroom or one of
the old bedrooms upstairs and flipped down amattress that was up there and brought snacks
(10:39):
and just kind of chilled and fell asleep.
And we woke up in the middle of the night, and
we heard this crinkling.
And I looked, and I took the flashlight, and
our chip bag was moving across the floor.
And I was like, oh, no. So I woke her up, and
(11:02):
I'm like, we got to get out of here.
Because I didn't know what was going on.
I couldn't see anything moving it.
Anyway, I went running for the stairs, and I
don't remember my feet hitting a single stairgoing down because I was, like, out of there.
And then I was halfway to the other house, andI turned around because I heard my friend
(11:24):
screaming.
And I was like, oh, ****.
She wasn't behind me.
So I ran back into the house, and she was at
the top of the stairs, and I was at thebottom, and she was, like, pushing herself
forward.
And I don't know how to explain it, but she
was kind of, like, at this angle, so sheshould have been falling, but she said she
(11:47):
couldn't move.
Something was holding her, and she was trying
to push against it to get down the stairs.
And then I just screamed, let her go.
And then she kind of fumbled down the stairs.
She didn't fall, but she started to lose her
balance, and then she came down the stairs.
And we've had other incidences, even, like,
(12:08):
the.
We had the old barns.
There was an outhouse on the property that hada heart carved in it, and it said, matt loves
Mabel.
And Matt, at 90, what was he, 97 years old,
came back to the property.
So we got to meet the matt, and the matt loves
(12:30):
Mabel.
So it was kind of cool.
But, yeah, there was weird things that wouldhappen in the barns.
I would see eyes, just weird lights.
And then being outside, even, it was just
always.
You could always felt like something was
watching you.
So I was always scared to death of ghosts.
(12:54):
And when I was in my twenty s, I was awaitress at a bar.
And we actually did an episode on this.
I actually talked to the owner, the current
owner of the bar now, she was just a bartenderback when this happened.
But anyway, I had a little girl ghost followme home one night from the bar.
(13:21):
And she was doing all sorts of crazy thingswith my kids toys.
And I wasn't sleeping.
I couldn't sleep.
But I wasn't brave enough to run into theirroom to see what was.
She never did anything, like, malevolent oranything.
It was just playing with toys, setting thetoys off.
And one night, everybody kept.
My ex told me I was crazy.
(13:42):
I was just hearing things.
But the cherry on the cake, we'll say it was
the one night I kept hearing this plastic bag,like, crumpling and stuff.
And this noise with a plastic bag.
And I finally got up and went into the room.
And my kids were three and one at the time, mytwo oldest.
(14:05):
And there was a little girl's name written onthis plastic bag.
Wow.
And my kids weren't old enough to write.
And so I called a friend of mine.
She came over and saged.
And she told me I had to stand in the middleof my room or the middle of the house or
(14:25):
living room or whatever, and say, I'm sorry,you can't stay here with me.
I need to bring you back to where you belong.
And so that night I went to work.
And the whole ride to work, the hair wasstanding up on the back of my neck.
And I think I quit shortly thereafter.
Because I was like, I can't deal with that.
(14:47):
I can't bring this stuff home.
And another thing I had happened.
I was 18 or 19.
And I don't know if you're familiar with
Hinckley, Minnesota.
Speaker A (15:03):
No.
Speaker B (15:04):
Okay. So Hinckley, Minnesota, was like the big.
It was bigger than Minneapolis in the 18hundreds.
Because it was like the big logging industrywas happening.
And so everybody was moving up their logging.
They were running the logs down the river and
stuff.
So in the 18 hundreds, there was the great
(15:25):
Hinckley fire.
And a lot of people died in a long range,
like, from multiple towns.
And people were on the train trying to get out
of town.
And they were killed because the train ran
into the fire.
And people were going into lakes and rivers
(15:46):
trying to escape.
So in Hinckley, there is a big monument in the
graveyard.
And it's a bunch of unidentified bodies from
the great Hinckley fire.
So it's just like a big mass grave.
But anyway, one night my ex and I were drivingdown the road.
(16:07):
And it suddenly got really foggy.
And it wasn't od for it to be foggy in that
area.
Because there was a lot of.
What do they call those?The fisheries, where they're, like, growing
the baby fish to repopulate the lakes stuff.
So they had a lot of those ponds and stuff in
that area.
So it wasn't uncommon for it to be foggy.
(16:29):
But our headlights were almost, like, shiningback at us.
And it was really hard to see.
And we came out of the fog, and I noticed
there was a guy walking alongside the road.
Excuse me.
And as we got closer to him, I noticed he waswearing an old style suit with the tails.
(16:54):
And he had a top hat on.
And he was walking with a cane.
And he turned and looked at us and he had noface.
And my ex was leaving for vacation with hisfamily the next day for a week.
And I went and stayed at my uncle's house.
Because it was so close to our place.
(17:14):
I didn't want to be there.
Speaker A (17:16):
No kidding.
Speaker B (17:18):
But I love Halloween.
I love decorate.
We do a huge Halloween display every year.
We put on a little animatronics haunted house.
And I love doing that stuff.
But you will not catch me going to a stage
jump scare haunted house.
Because I just don't like being scared.
(17:39):
Jeremy and I have gone out and done a littleparanormal investigating.
We went up to a potter or, excuse me, what doyou call it?
A poor farm cemetery in Duluth that'ssupposedly haunted.
And we did some investigating up there.
I'm slowly getting more at ease with that
(18:02):
because I guess ghosts are better than realpeople.
Because real people suck.
Speaker A (18:07):
Yeah.
Speaker B (18:09):
So I'm getting better at that, where it doesn't scare me as much.
But I hate jump scare stuff.
So I love to do and investigate and learn more
about what happened and to communicate.
That's getting easier for me.
But the jump scare is not for me.
Speaker A (18:29):
I hear you.
I'm totally on board with that.
Because if I would ever see a ghost, I alwaystell people I'd scream like a little girl and
run the other.
Not.
I'm man enough to admit that those are greatstories you shared.
I love that because we're kind of similar inthat way, in the sense of my grandma lived in
(18:51):
Iowa.
We'd always go to my grandma's house to visit
grandma.
She lived in this old farmhouse with Grandpa.
And that was one of my first paranormalexperiences where I was a teenager.
At the time.
And I was just sitting there and I would hear
footsteps at night.
And then everybody, oh, it's grandma, Grandpa,
(19:12):
up.
But one time I was sitting there and I was
just getting ready to leave and the dooropened from the stairs because it was old
crickety wooden stairs, most farmhouses.
And the door opened and I thought it was like
my grandma or my grandpa.
And I said, hey, grandma.
Hi, grandpa.
(19:32):
And nobody was there.
Speaker B (19:34):
And those doors are heavy in those old farmhouses.
Speaker A (19:38):
Yes. And people don't understand.
It's not today with your houses where you can
put your fist through the door if you really.
Whatever.
No, not with those doors.
You would break your hand.
Speaker B (19:54):
Oh, definitely.
They were solid.
Speaker A (19:57):
Yeah. And the other thing you shared about the fire, the patch to go fire
was like the Hinckley fire.
I'm sorry, what was the name of the fire
again?
Speaker B (20:07):
Hinckley.
Speaker A (20:09):
Yeah. Okay. Pestico fire killed more people in Wisconsin, in Pestico than the
great Chicago fire did, and they happened atthe same time.
So nobody remembers the great Pestico fire,which killed more people in a short amount of
time and destroyed the entire town of Pestico.
(20:31):
Very similar to the Hinckley fire.
Speaker B (20:34):
Yeah, the Hinckley fire.
I can't remember where it started.
It actually started north and it took a trailthrough, I know, like sandstone and hinckley.
And I don't remember where it stopped or whereit started.
There is a Hinckley fire museum, and that wasa place that they used to take us in grade
school for a field trip.
(20:55):
Let's take you to a museum that of all of
these people that just perish.
Speaker A (21:00):
Jack, who burned enough.
Speaker B (21:03):
The 80s was an interesting time.
Speaker A (21:06):
Interesting time, right? Look at this.
The skull crossbones.
Speaker B (21:12):
Right.
Speaker A (21:13):
Parents would freak out nowadays, signing waivers, and there'd be lawsuits.
But the Pestico fire, too, it's very similarto that.
They have a museum.
We did an episode on that.
They also have a memorial.
And again, it's very haunted.
You go in that area, it's a mass grave becausethey couldn't figure out who was who because
(21:37):
of all the.
Everybody was just basically charcoal, for
lack of a better word.
You couldn't tell.
So it's a mass grave.
It's extremely haunted.
You look at some of the statistics that theyshared that they think is how many people
died.
It's insane.
Like I said, it totally dwarfs this greatChicago fire as far as mean.
Speaker B (22:01):
And you think about it like, in this day and age, if something like that
happened, most of the people would be able toescape.
But back then their only means oftransportation were wagons, their horses, and
the train.
So they were landlocked.
They were stuck, which is gross.
Speaker A (22:20):
Yeah. If you were poor, maybe you don't have a horse.
Speaker B (22:25):
Right.
Speaker A (22:26):
You don't have a wagon, so you're running for your life.
And to escape a fire.
Not going to happen.
Speaker B (22:33):
No. And then people were.
Speaker A (22:36):
Funny thing is that the pestico fire, similar to the Hinckley fire, kind of
started at one area and then just sweptthrough because of the winds and other things.
Crazy.
Speaker B (22:48):
Yes.
Speaker A (22:50):
The 18 hundreds was not a great time to be alive.
Speaker B (22:56):
No. Sometimes if you made it into your 30s, you were lucky.
Speaker A (23:02):
Yeah. Right.
Speaker B (23:04):
Just crazy.
Speaker A (23:06):
I know.
Well, that sounds great.
Thank you for sharing those stories.
Of course, Tracy.
Those are awesome.
And like I said, I will put on in the show
notes when this comes out, all her greatsocial media sites.
And so you go look at total conundrum andenjoy some of the great stories they do.
Because we do everything a little bitdifferently.
(23:27):
And it's from a Midwest point of view, so Ialways give props to my Midwest view.
Speaker B (23:34):
That's right.
Speaker A (23:36):
All right, so let's get a little teaser, shall we, into today's subject.
Tracy, what if I told you about a small townthat went missing after the government had
built an experimental communications facilitynear the town?
After searching for information aboutDoveland, Wisconsin, or Doveland, Wisconsin, I
(24:02):
discovered quickly that no one knows exactlywhere this mysterious town was supposedly
located and only that it was a small communitylocated in the heart of the state of
Wisconsin.
Speaker B (24:21):
Wow.
Speaker A (24:22):
Interesting.
Speaker B (24:24):
That is very interesting.
Speaker A (24:27):
So here's the thing, and this has really kind of scared me when I was
researching this.
Most people have antivirus protection and
stuff.
You got to have that nowadays for your
computer, right?
Speaker B (24:42):
Right.
Speaker A (24:42):
So no people break in there.
When I was going to these sites, warnings kept
on coming up saying, this is not a malicioussite.
It's whatever.
It's not like.
And then my laptop acted weird, and I wasnever done this before.
(25:05):
When I've been researching things, every timeI put in Dublin, Wisconsin, if something weird
would happen to my laptop.
Speaker B (25:13):
I mean, I know that the government probably hears the same rumors, know, being
from Minnesota, you got that MinnesotaWisconsin rivalry with the Vikings and the
packers.
And they always say, we call people from
Wisconsin sconies, and they always say thesconies know how to tip back those old
(25:37):
Milwaukee's.
So the government think that because they were
in a smaller area and it was a small town,that people would just be drunk and forgot it
existed.
I'm sorry.
Catch the people aren't drinking that much toforget a **** town.
Speaker A (25:55):
Right? So let's get to my sources really quickly,
Tracy, till we get into the heart of thestory, and then I'd love to hear your
opinions.
First is q nine eight five online, the legend
of Dublin, Wisconsin disappearance.
My second one was the history
historicmistries.com website.
(26:16):
The ghost in the cabin website.
Unsolved mysteries, believe it or not, did a,if you remember that, show it all back.
We were younger.
They brought it back.
But it's not the same without Robert Stack.
Speaker B (26:30):
No, you did stack attack.
Speaker A (26:34):
And then vox.com as well as I did some history defined site, too.
So a lot of historic stuff I tried to look up.
Each had their own little story behind Dublin,
Wisconsin.
So let's talk about it.
The mysterious history behind Dubland,Wisconsin, or Dubland, however you pronounce
(26:56):
it, was supposedly a small town that somehowdisappeared.
Now, this is scary, Tracy, in the 1990s.
Yeah.
This is not 18 hundreds.
This isn't 1940 1990.
Speaker B (27:15):
Okay, was that a year that the packers were at the Super bowl or something?
Did they think that would distract us?Yeah, there you go.
They put the pack attack in the Super bowl sothey could disappear at the town.
Speaker A (27:30):
I love the way you think, Tracy.
Me and you are best buds right now.
Okay?So some people in Wisconsin actually allegedly
have shirts, mugs, souvenirs from the town,and some even remember it, like relatives who
live there now.
Yes, you can go and buy a mug or t shirt that
(27:53):
says that they are fake people.
I will say they are fake.
Someone just made them up.
So let's not get too crazy here.
But there are no historical documents thatprove Doveland, Wisconsin existed.
However, later on, I'll tell you some storieshere that make you kind of, huh?
So there are no mentions, Tracy of Doveland onany mentions of Wisconsin maps.
(28:20):
So there's nothing on there.
But Doverland might only be real in people's
imaginations, which is scary to me, that youwould just make up a town in your head.
But let's pretend for a minute that it was areal town and that it did vanish.
Tracy, what could have happened to it?So many conspiracy theorists believe Dublin
(28:46):
was destroyed in connection with the project'self.
Speaker B (28:50):
Okay?
Speaker A (28:51):
And no, not the movie elf with Will Ferrell.
And all evidence of the existence of it hadbeen scrubbed from the Internet and a local
archives.
So what do you think about that?
Do you think someone could do that?Maybe an entire think, Tracy.
Speaker B (29:17):
They've been hiding aliens from us all.
These mean that's the thing they always putsomething.
When there's something that they're doing, itseems like they distract you with something
else to pull your eyes, the wool over youreyes with the other things.
(29:37):
Absolutely.
I would think it would be hard to disappear a
whole town, but it could be that maybewhatever was profiting the town or helping the
people in the town closed down and then itjust kind of dissipated from there.
Yeah, I'm not sure.
Speaker A (29:57):
Right, so let me get into that.
And then you can kind of pipe in whenever you
want to, just chime in or whatever.
It is very difficult to prove that something
doesn't exist.
It is also seems likely that the military
could get away with destroying a town withoutanyone having a concrete memory of it.
Okay, so what is project?Okay, very quickly, so people understand this.
(30:22):
In the 1960s, US Navy officials concocted anambitious plan.
They wanted to bury gigantic grid of cablesunder, roughly get this, 41% of the state of
Wisconsin to turn into the world's largestradio antenna.
(30:49):
Think about that.
Nearly half the state of Wisconsin they wanted
to bury these cables under to communicate withtheir subs, which I'll get into.
So the project was called Project San Green.
And although it sounds crazy, it was logical,
although impractical way of communicating withdeep sea submarines around the world.
(31:14):
The problem is that radio waves don't travelwell through water.
So there was no good way to send signals to anuclear powered subs that stayed submerged
during the months of the cold War.
So project sanguine would have been an antenna
for transmitting.
And this is where elf comes in.
Extremely low frequency waves that canpenetrate water and reach the subs.
(31:40):
Now, okay, believe it or not, this, accordingto most sources, it never happened.
Largely because of the huge cost, potentiallybillions of dollars in environmental
disturbances would have been required.
In other words, they're going to destroy the
environment.
It's going to cost billions of dollars.
Back in 1960s, but they had an idea about asmaller version called Project ELf, which was
(32:09):
eventually built in Wisconsin and Michigan,upper Peninsula, and operated this.
Actually, you can still see the cables between1989 and 2004.
So think about that.
This is actually a thing that happened, okay?
But the cables do not go underneath thebedrock.
(32:31):
They're like telephone wires, for lack of.
Speaker B (32:34):
A better word, okay.
Which is scary in itself, because what kind of
EMF is coming off of those?I know for myself.
We had a cabin up in Swatera, and they put thehigh power lines up there.
And when Duluth had the big flooding, a few.
(32:57):
What was that, like ten years ago, maybe eight
years ago?When it took out, like, the zoo and
everything.
That flooding was affected.
Swatara as well.
And we went up there with our four wheelers
and we had a trailer.
Our four wheelers were on a trailer, and we
were hauling them and stuff.
(33:18):
And we were having to drive through water that
was up to the top of our tires to try to getto our cabin.
And the road was so soft.
The trailer kind of, when we turned to go into
the cabin, the trailer kind of slid into theditch a little bit.
And we got out and we weren't even standing inwater.
It was just the fact that the ground was sowet that I felt like I had a million bugs in
(33:44):
my hair.
And it was from the high power lines.
I had to get back into the car because I couldnot stand it.
I'm like, what is it doing to my brain if Ican feel the electricity?
I was like, we're not staying here.
Sorry.
Speaker A (34:01):
Yeah, absolutely.
So to make it work, one of the things people
forget here is of, like you said, it hadelectricity just kind of just going out there
and kind of freaking people out.
And what they wanted to do was when they were
(34:24):
trying to do it through the bedrock.
This is crazy.
This is something I just want to.
Because they said they didn't do it, but I'm
kind of like, yeah, maybe they did, and theyjust didn't tell us.
The bedrock has a really good conductor ofelectricity current when it was sent through
it.
So the current would throw in the ground in
between, forming a huge loop to complete thecircuit.
(34:44):
Now, get this.
The bedrock throbbed with electricity.
So the electricity would be, like, coming intothe bedrock, but would come out of the
bedrock.
You know what I mean?
So it kind of, like, dissipates through there,and it create a magnetic field that would
generate elf waves.
So in other words, yeah, you're going into
(35:06):
this huge magnetic field, which is never goodfor the human body.
And it was just crazy.
And this is the same thing.
Once they started putting these basicallyholly power lines up, the same thing would
happen, too.
This area would just have these intrusive
cables, and they would just tons ofelectricity and power just coming off of these
(35:33):
things, creating, like, this huge magneticfield in order to send the elf wave to the
subs.
Now.
I know, right?But they did this in.
So this is so stupid.
And nothing against people in Wyoming or the
Appalachians, but this is where they testedit.
Okay, so it's not like you have a lot ofpeople in that area and in Upper Peninsula.
(35:59):
And if you've ever been up there.
If you love fishing, if you love hunting, if
you love hiking, snowmobiling, whatever youlove, you're an outdoors person.
You go up there.
Right.
Speaker B (36:10):
Don't pronounce their lakes wrong though.
Speaker A (36:13):
Yes.
Speaker B (36:13):
Don't they get very upset?
Speaker A (36:16):
They very upset.
Midwest people.
Here's your tip for Midwest people.
You go to Upper Peninsula, learn to do their
lake in the lakes.
Speaker B (36:25):
We went up to go gimmick and we were calling it Geobeck because that's what it
looked like.
And they're like, it is go gimmick.
And I'm like, I'm sorry, but we should knowbetter because Minnesota and Wisconsin also
have a bunch of towns that are impossible toso pronounce.
Speaker A (36:44):
Right. Exactly.
And then people stare at you and then you're
just like, how do I pronounce it?So these elf waves that were being produced.
Getting back to this, the navy officialssettled on.
This is crazy.
On the forest of Upper Wisconsin.
It's the ideal location.
And there's this granite bedroom that had the
(37:05):
right characteristics that they could run thiscable underneath.
They say they could, but they did it.
They keep saying they did, but the granite
thing was really good.
So look at how many miles of cables they laid
in the upper peninsula.
6000 miles.
Speaker B (37:24):
Jeez.
Speaker A (37:26):
Yeah. So it covered the whole entire upper peninsula into Wisconsin.
Speaker B (37:32):
Wow.
Speaker A (37:34):
So imagine these cables.
And again, some of them are still there.
They haven't took them down.
They've been trying to take them down from
time to time, but some are still there.
You still can see them.
Speaker B (37:46):
So they must have had to zigzag them kind of to reach that 6000 because how
far isn't California from Minnesota?Like 2400 miles or something.
Speaker A (38:01):
I'm thinking they went around like so many **** times or something.
Speaker B (38:05):
Maybe that's a lot of cable.
Or a lot of miles.
Speaker A (38:10):
That is a lot of cable.
You're darn right.
So maybe they had to do it two or three, fourtimes.
I don't know, but it just doesn't sound right.
Right?
Speaker B (38:18):
No.
Speaker A (38:19):
Whether that number is right or wrong, it's still like.
Yeah.
Speaker B (38:24):
And going bedrock and granite, that's not an easy task.
Speaker A (38:29):
No, they put this out and they did their best because they were worried about
it's the cold War.
So if anybody's in the.
Tracy, remember the Cold War where you like,at any time the Russians would launch a
nuclear weapon and we'll be attacked and we'llall have to learn russian because they're all
(38:50):
going to take us over.
Right, Tracy, remember that?
Speaker B (38:53):
I remember.
Speaker A (38:56):
Like every time someone said, the Russians are mad.
Everyone would build a bomb shelter.
Speaker B (39:07):
Yeah, it was a crazy time.
Speaker A (39:09):
It was.
It was a crazy time because he just didn't
know.
I mean, there was always the Russians saying
something.
Then the Americans would say then, you know,
Reagan, who was our president at the time,would be like, well, we're going to build Star
wars and we're going to shoot down themissiles.
And you're like, what is going on?
Speaker B (39:30):
My recollection of Reagan, I was born in 75.
And when I remember, I kept thinking whensomebody would talk about our president, I'm
like, oh, our president kissed a monkey.
And he was in that movie bedtime for Bonzo.
That was my thought.
(39:51):
Know who President Reagan was?
Speaker A (40:00):
I don't know.
Some people love him.
This is not a political podcast.
Speaker B (40:04):
Nope. I don't want to go into any politics.
That was just my recollection of him.
Speaker A (40:08):
Yeah, right.
Exactly.
So guess what?Wisconsin residents protested when they heard
about the classified plan.
By the way, it was classified, and it got out.
I have no idea why.
So they went through this, and then in 1973.
So remember this started in the.
(40:28):
They were putting this plan out and talking
about how they're going to do this and allthis good stuff.
So, in 1973, Secretary of Defense Melvin Lairdkilled the plan.
Okay, so, great, right?He said, no, this is too expensive.
We're going to destroy the beautiful Wisconsinwilderness, and people are protesting?
(40:49):
Forget it.
So he said, why don't we just build these
small, modest transmitters, and we'll put themon Clam Lake.
In Clam Lake, Wisconsin, which does exist, bythe way.
Speaker B (41:04):
They didn't make that disappear.
Speaker A (41:07):
Yeah, they didn't make that disappear.
So they said, let's do that.
So, again, more protests, especially from
residents who feared the health and effects ofthe.
You know, elf had many other types of nonionizing radiation.
Oh, by the way, I've got radiation, Tracy.
Speaker B (41:26):
Oh, jeez.
Speaker A (41:27):
When you're in a magnetic field, it has certain radiation effects on you.
You lose your hair.
It causes cancer.
Yeah, all the good stuff.
Yeah.
So one of the things they said was, again,let's try this, let's see what happens.
And then finally said, no, it's not going towork, because everybody is protesting.
(41:49):
It became huge news across the country.
So they just shut it down in 1977.
They said, all right, we're done.
We get it.
Okay.
So, however, under President Reagan, he
revived the project because he basically cameout and said, the Russians are going to kill
(42:09):
us all.
The Russians.
The Russians.
The Russians.
And everybody got scared.
So he said, okay, let's do this.
But this time, like I said, the Wisconsin had28 miles of these cables.
So they didn't build the 6000 miles theywanted to do and put it all over Wisconsin and
Michigan and ever places.
Whatever they had, they were going to do.
(42:29):
They decided to do just a little project,right?
And they strung it on power lines, just likethe wooden power lines you see every day with
electricity.
And they built a little bit of a site in
Wisconsin and then they put some in Michigan.
And the cables were arranged in a crisscross
fashion to broadcast signals both laterallyand longitudinally at each line to reach out
(42:56):
through the subs.
And one of the things too, which we know that
again, they did put some under the bedrockjust to try it.
They said, we're just going to put a littlebit under here.
So they didn't put too much, they just put alittle bit under there.
Nobody knew about it until later when theyreleased the classified documents.
(43:20):
So they lied to us again.
And these elf waves were coming up through the
bedrock and causing issues.
A lot of people were saying, hey, there's the
wildlife.
There's something going on up there.
What's going on?It's affecting the plants, the wildlife,
everything.
And they were like, I thought you said this is
(43:40):
going to do.
Yeah.
I always say, too, it communicated with themole people who had civilizations in hollow
earth.
If any of you guys know about hollow Earth and
there's people under the earth and they have awhole thing, I don't know, I would love that.
Speaker B (44:02):
Kind of go along with the flat earth theory.
Speaker A (44:05):
Correct?
Speaker B (44:07):
Yeah.
Speaker A (44:08):
So again, the residents continued to protest.
And then the cold war ended.
So the installation looked less and less
necessary because we got satellites, we gotall this stuff.
We didn't really need it anymore.
In 1996, a Michigan resident named Tom Howard
(44:29):
Hastings entered the site and cut down severalantenna poles.
And in suing years, Wisconsin senator RussellFeingold, who's no longer our senator anymore,
introduced several bills at closing theproject.
So in other words, there are people going outthere, literally, tracy, and cutting down the
(44:51):
poles, which not a smart idea because theseare high elf waves, very dangerous.
And then Russ Feingld said, we got to get ridof these things because they were still
working, they were still emitting the energyand the radiation and all that stuff.
And everybody was like, oh, well, we turnedoff the power button.
(45:13):
It should not work.
Well, yeah, it still does work.
So in test, like I said, they started to useit again.
I just don't get this, because they said,okay, our satellites are not doing what?
We still need this thing.
Okay.
So what they decided to do is they started toopen up the system again in 1989, because,
(45:39):
like I said during the stuff, they're tryingto solve this and trying the.
So they would secretly just.
Government would say it, well, let's flip the
switch back on and try it.
Because they would reach out to places in the
Arctic that the satellites couldn't hit.
But finally, in 2004, the Navy shut down
(46:00):
project elf, dismantling some 84 miles ofcable.
Thus, the russian navy still uses elf.
So the Russians still use elf.
We supposedly do not.
Yes.
And they use, like, these VFL waves and buoysthat they use are much safer and everything,
(46:24):
like, so what does this have to do withDublin, Wisconsin?
A lot of people think that two or three thingshappened in Dublin, Wisconsin.
So the first thing they said was that the townwas swallowed up by a sinkhole caused by these
(46:47):
waves because they kept on shutting them offand turning them on and everything like that.
So a giant sinkhole swallowed the town.
Okay.
Which you're like, well, I don't know ifyou've heard a lot about sinkholes, Tracy,
but, like, in Florida, they're bad.
Like, people have lost homes and neighborhoods
have been swallowed up by sinkholes.
Just go on YouTube and enter, like, sinkholes
(47:10):
swallowing houses, and you will see an entirehouse go crashing down because of a sinkhole.
Okay.
The other thing is, they thought it was
because of a massive earthquake.
Now, Wisconsin is not typical.
Yeah, so Wisconsin is not in typically fault.
(47:30):
Although people have argued that the vibration
from these waves and everything could havecaused an earthquake per se.
It's not really an earthquake, but it'ssomething that could have done that.
Others believe.
This is my favorite.
Others believe the town was cursed by avengeful spirit who caused the town and its
(47:52):
people to disappear as punishment for a longforgotten transgression.
Now, I looked this up.
What they think happened was that these waves
or radiation awakened at evil spirits.
Spirits.
Speaker B (48:07):
There was a lot of energy for that spirit to be able to feed off, correct?
Speaker A (48:13):
Absolutely.
There you go, Tracy.
So what happened?What they thought was there was this evil
spirit.
This thing sucked up all these energy, and
that said, all right, Dublin, Wisconsin.
Bam.
I'm going to destroy it.
I love that one.
That's my favorite.
Speaker B (48:29):
The energy fits.
And if the spirit was angry enough.
Speaker A (48:34):
Right, as we know from being into the paranormal, that's what paranormal, the
ghost spirits feed off of is energy.
Right.
And imagine a massive amount that could dosomething.
Speaker B (48:49):
Well, you've already got the bedrock underneath, so they feed off of the
energy of the rock.
And if you're powering that, you're.
Yeah, watch out.
Gonna have to call ghostbusters.
Speaker A (49:00):
Yes. The other thing, too, and this has happened to other towns, probably in
Minnesota, too, where they've dammed upcertain rivers and everything.
And the towns near the rivers and stuff, well,they just became ghost towns because, well, we
dammed up the river.
That's what we kind of need to survive.
(49:21):
And they kicked the people out because they'relike, hey, we dammed up this river.
So now you guys got to leave, because if thisGM breaks, it's going to destroy things.
So I'm like, okay, I've looked that up.
That has happened in Wisconsin and around the
midwest and United States.
The military has dammed up certain places, and
(49:44):
for whatever, know, the town just became aghost town.
So it is true.
It does happen.
It does happen.
So one of the things that said, too, is Dublin
residents moved away due to a failing economy.
So similarly, they damp something up with the
military, like all this radiation and stuff.
If people are getting sick, hey, that has
happened, too, mostly because of water.
(50:07):
There's many stories out there where towns
have gotten.
People have gotten leukemia from drinking the
water, cancers, whatever, because ofcorporations or military whatever, and people
that.
Okay, right.
Kind of makes sense.
And then Dublin was what they call a military
(50:27):
town that ceased to exist when the operationwas.
Right.
Right.
Speaker B (50:36):
Makes sense.
Speaker A (50:38):
Yeah, it just happened.
So the other thing then, of course, one of my
favorite was Dublin was destroyed by amilitary science experiment, project sanguine,
that went wrong.
And what they say what happened is there is a
Dublin, Wisconsin, but it's in an alternateuniverse.
So it's like you wake up every morning, Tracy,and you think you're going to work.
(51:00):
Well, you're not in this universe.
You're in a different universe, but you.
Speaker B (51:07):
Got sucked into a whole other timeline.
Speaker A (51:10):
Yeah. You're in a whole different timeline, and you just hide it.
Right.
And you're just like, okay, here I am.
Speaker B (51:19):
Good thing nobody in that town works outside of the town.
Speaker A (51:22):
Right? Exactly.
Like, you go outside the town.
You've seen those maybe movies or stories.
Speaker B (51:28):
Yes. Where you can't cross the borders.
Speaker A (51:30):
Yes. So that could be right.
Who knows?
Speaker B (51:33):
It could be.
Speaker A (51:34):
Now, I want to talk about something really quick.
It's called the Mendela Check.
It's a type of false memory that occurs when
many people incorrectly remember the samething.
It refers to the widespread false memory thatNelson Mandela died in prison in the 1980s.
So this is a real thing.
(51:54):
And I do it all the time where I'll try to
remember something and I'll be like, Iremember you being at that party.
I remember you.
And then my budy goes, no, dude, I was never
at your party.
Like, you sure?
Because I remember you at my party.
He's like, I wasn't at your party.
I don't know if that's ever happened to you,Tracy.
Speaker B (52:13):
Oh, yes.
Speaker A (52:14):
Remember a movie or something that people.
Speaker B (52:16):
Go, we actually did an episode on it.
Yeah, we actually did an episode on it.
And Jeremy was quite funny going through
because he's like, well, if you think thiswas.
I'm like, yeah, it was.
He's like, well, you're wrong.
I'm like, no, I'm not.
(52:37):
So we had a lot of fun with that one.
But there's so much out there.
But the theory that I've heard on it is that
in, was it 2012 that supposedly the worldrebooted and that's when everything changed or
something.
I don't know if I necessarily believe that.
(52:59):
But like Tom Cruise, when in risky business,he goes skirting across in his socks and know
whitey tidies and the button down shirt.
I remember him having sunglasses on.
He doesn't.
Curious George.
He's a monkey.
He should have a. Doesn't.
You know, things like that.
(53:20):
The Mandela effect blows my mind.
Speaker A (53:23):
Yeah. And there's the Bernstein Bears and the Barnstein bears or something
like that.
Speaker B (53:28):
Bernstein.
And.
Speaker A (53:30):
Exactly, exactly.
And then you've got movies.
There's like, there was this one movie.
Speaker B (53:37):
That have caused Shazam.
Speaker A (53:39):
Shazam or Kazam.
Right?
Speaker B (53:41):
Kazam.
One of the.
Speaker A (53:43):
Yeah. And it's supposed to have Shaq in it, but it.
I'm trying to think of the actor's name.
Speaker B (53:49):
Oh, my gosh.
Sinbad.
Yes, Sinbad.
Speaker A (53:52):
Yeah. And people were.
Speaker B (53:53):
That's a big one.
Speaker A (53:55):
Yeah. I remember Sinbad in this movie.
That movie's never exist.
Speaker B (53:59):
Right.
How about the monopoly guy?
Monocle or no monocle.
Speaker A (54:05):
Right. That is.
So what I found was some notable personal
accounts that people say it existed.
So check this out.
Speaker B (54:16):
All right.
Speaker A (54:18):
One of the first accounts is, this is from actually was an army person that
supposedly worked on this project and was inDublin, Wisconsin.
He totally remembers that.
He says, I just learned about all the noise
surrounding Dublin.
And I think I can add some insight.
Dublin was a small town of Wisconsin thathoused many military families.
(54:43):
My father lived there for a year or two andspoke of it occasionally.
The main thing I remember that it had to dowith project sanguine in the early sixty s. I
don't think it was x files type stuff, but thetown was destroyed after an incident.
(55:04):
They were digging up a ton of land forsomething and they flooded the town or
something.
But this is rehash secondhand memory from
years ago.
And this is from Private Jeannie Ivanoff.
Whatever.
I don't know what unit he was in, but see what
(55:25):
he's saying?He's like, he remembers the town.
He remembers his dad living in the town.
Speaker B (55:30):
Right? Hold on 1 second.
Tickle in my throat.
Speaker A (55:39):
So this is the other thing someone said, and this is Nate Allen.
He said that the locations for Dublin don'tcoincide with Project Sanguine, aka Project
Elf.
Due to the bedrock, there are two elf sites no
longer in operation, with one being outside ofClam Lake, Wisconsin, and the other in the
(56:02):
upper peninsula.
That's Michigan.
They are extremely low frequency transmittersthat use the bedrock to bounce signals under
the crust to signal nuclear submarines tosurface to receive action message.
The antennas were above ground and looked likepower lines running through the middle of the
forest.
If the antennas were buried, then they'd be
(56:23):
short out to earth ground and be useless.
I'm an amateur radio operator, so this is
second nature to me.
There is nothing Sci-Fi about sanguine and
nothing that could cause an accident where atown would disappear.
But there have been studies about the like.
He talks about increase in cancer due to the
(56:45):
power and frequencies used at these sites,right?
Nate is like, no, it wouldn't work.
I don't know what they're talking about.
But it's funny that these people bring thisup, right?
Speaker B (56:58):
Oh, totally.
Speaker A (56:59):
It's not in the maps.
There's no history, there's no nothing.
And people are like, I heard about it, or Isaw that the next one I thought was really
interesting too.
So this gentleman, I don't got a name on this
one, but he was countering back to thegentleman who said, hey, Dublin didn't exist.
(57:22):
He says, as someone who has lived in variousplaces in Wisconsin for over 30 years and have
been in the army, never once I have any singleperson ever mentioned Dublin.
So I think that was really interesting.
But he goes on to say, you make a good point,
but actually dovelin was very real.
(57:45):
And I'm like, okay.
My father used to mention it occasionallybefore he passed.
And the only reason I remember it, because Ifound it ironic that a town named Doveland was
populated by almost exclusively militarypersonnel and their families.
And then he would say, I would dig around fora shirt back home.
(58:07):
I don't know what he's kind of shirt he'slooking for.
And if I remember correctly, the town wasbuilt as part of project sanguine in the mid
to late 60s.
Maybe everyone left when the project was
canceled, but I thought something went verywrong.
You could only dig up so much turf for so longbefore you're bound to have.
(58:33):
Even though I don't really think there is aDublin, Wisconsin again, my father would talk
about it.
People would talk about it.
And the other thing he mentioned was thefreaky bit is how many in my family from
Wisconsin say they remember Dublin, Wisconsin.
Speaker B (58:51):
I think when he said he was going to dig around for a shirt, he probably recalls
somebody wearing a shirt with Dublin on.
Speaker A (58:59):
Right, right.
And there is a picture out there, which I'll
put on my social media sites, of a person in arestaurant is a man and woman, and the man's a
waiter, and the woman is with him.
I don't know if it's his wife or girlfriend or
just a friend, whatever, and they're sittingat a table and people have said either it's
(59:21):
fake, obviously, or people are convinced thatsomeone took a picture at this restaurant in
Dublin, Wisconsin, and brought this picturefor it.
Now it's up to you what you, you know, I justfind it so interesting that people, first of
all, sort of remember a town and that this waspart of a project that kind of just went hear.
(59:47):
We've heard from time to time.
Right, Tracy.
Where people said, oh, the military did thisor the military did that, and they released
these classified documents, let's use ufos andaliens, right?
They finally came out and said, yes, they'reufos.
They're real.
There you go.
So what do you think?What do you think?
(01:00:07):
You think there is a Dublin, Wisconsin?You think it ever existed?
Tracy?
Speaker B (01:00:13):
Well, for myself, being in Minnesota, I like how all these people are
saying, I've never heard of a know I, ifsomebody gave me a small town name or even a
large town name in Minnesota, I can't tell youwithout looking at a map if it actually
(01:00:35):
exists, because there are so many small towns.
So for people to know, no matter where.
I've lived all over Minnesota as well.
I've lived in northern Minnesota, I've lived
in southern Minnesota, but there are stillmany towns that I've passed through that know,
like around by us.
There's teeny tiny little town called day.
(01:00:56):
There's a teeny tiny little town called coin.
Never knew they existed.
So to say that there are towns that start offand just dissipate so I can't say whether it
actually existed or not.
To me, the name sounds familiar, Dublin.
(01:01:18):
But I may have heard it from another state orsomething different.
But Dublin definitely sounds familiar to me.
But whether it existed or not, I don't know.
The militaries and the government are good atcovering things up.
Speaker A (01:01:34):
Yeah. Aren't they?
Speaker B (01:01:36):
They are.
Speaker A (01:01:37):
They're totally good at that.
Again, I don't know what to think.
I do know when I used to.
I used to go fishing a lot when I was younger,
before I got married and had a family.
Nothing against my kids and my family, because
I love them, but I didn't have the time to doas much as I would like.
Speaker B (01:01:54):
Right.
Speaker A (01:01:55):
Hopefully in retirement I went, but I used to go off north all the time, the
furthest peninsulas, right.
And frankly, I saw small towns with literally
a grocery store, gas pump, couple homes, maybea little cafe or bar.
(01:02:17):
And that was it.
That was the town, right.
And that town disappeared.
Speaker B (01:02:20):
You blink, you miss it.
Speaker A (01:02:22):
Yeah. If that town disappears.
Tracy.
Tracy.
Okay, it's gone.
Speaker B (01:02:28):
Right?
Speaker A (01:02:29):
I don't know what to tell you.
So some of it, I kind of believe in the sense
there was a town that got destroyed by themilitary, in the sense of the military left.
And everybody just whatever.
If you go on Google maps and look, you will
not find it, obviously.
(01:02:50):
All you'll see is just basically, there's a
town, a little town near there, and justbasically fields and hills, just like in
Wisconsin and Minnesota.
It's just nothing.
Right.
Speaker B (01:03:02):
So you know what you need to do? You need to find somebody that has.
Remember those books that we used to carryaround in our car?
I can't remember what they were.
Map books.
Speaker A (01:03:14):
Yeah, Atlas books.
Speaker B (01:03:17):
Well, the Atlas one would work, too, but they were, like, in the 90s, they
were really popular.
They were, like, spiraled, and they had
multiple pages, and it was, like, for thewhole state, and it had maps for each town and
stuff like that.
So we need to find somebody who hoards and
(01:03:42):
held on to all of those, because if Dublinexisted, it'd be in that map book.
You need to find it outside of the Internet inreality.
Speaker A (01:03:53):
All right, you got me on a mission, Tracy.
Speaker B (01:03:57):
I can't remember what they're called, though.
But they were really nice books.
Every year they would come out with a new one.
Speaker A (01:04:03):
Yeah, I can't remember them either.
Boy, there's a Mandela effect in effect right
there.
Speaker B (01:04:07):
Right? But even an atlas.
Even an atlas.
Because there was a day where we weren't
controlled by the Internet.
We actually had to go and look up about the
Dewey decimal system to find certain books ina library.
Speaker A (01:04:24):
Yes. My children just really quickly is a quick offshoot.
My kids, when I told them, you know, when yourdad had to do research for a book report, you
know what I had to do?I actually had to read and had to go to the
library.
I remember my son's son saying something
really funny.
He goes, oh, you're a sucker, dad.
(01:04:45):
Thanks a lot.
Thanks a lot.
Speaker B (01:04:49):
Yeah, my youngest loves libraries, and that's funny because she's a total Gen Z,
but she loves books.
She loves libraries.
She would live at one if she could, which iscrazy.
So she's my Gen Z, or that should have been aGen xer.
Speaker A (01:05:15):
So I'm going to put this out to my spooky friends and Tracy's followers, too.
If anyone knows anything about Dublin,wisconsin.
Dairylandfrites@gmail.com send me something.
If you remember what those books are that
Tracy and I are trying to figure out, sendthat to us, too.
But before we end up, I'm going.
Speaker B (01:05:35):
To go to the goodwill and see if I can find an old map.
Speaker A (01:05:39):
It, I love it.
Keep me informed, Tracy.
Speaker B (01:05:42):
I will.
Speaker A (01:05:43):
So, Tracy, before we end up the show, because we could talk about this for
hours, I love you.
You've been great.
Some great stories and love being someone fromthe midwest.
So we can kind of get that Midwest feel backon the show here.
So tell me about what's coming up on totalconundrum.
What do you guys got planned?Anything really cool?
(01:06:05):
Just my spooky friends would love to know.
Speaker B (01:06:07):
Yeah, we have a couple of fun episodes coming out.
We just had one that we released.
I think it was on Thursday.
Where.
Are you familiar with ghost hunters?
Yes, the show ghost hunters, and they havetheir taps team.
Well, we interviewed jenny from TCPS,paranormal Twin Cities paranormal society, and
(01:06:35):
she's a part of the Minnesota Taps team.
I didn't know that taps had teams in every
state, and we interviewed her because she usedto work at the Palmer House hotel.
So we have all sorts of fun spooky storiesfrom was telling.
I kind of went over the research I found forthe Palmer house, and she's researched that
(01:07:01):
place multiple times.
She's researched it in and out.
She's investigated it, plus worked there.
And so it was kind of fun to tell her what I
found on the Internet and what she told me,whether it was true or not.
So that was a great episode.
I think it ended up being close to 2 hours.
I could have talked to her for ten.
(01:07:22):
She was amazing.
We have an episode that's going to be comingout this Thursday.
We're touching on cursed movie sets.
Speaker A (01:07:31):
Oh, nice.
Speaker B (01:07:32):
Yeah. Exorcist, the omen, the crow, stuff like that poltergeist.
And then the next week after that, weinterviewed Nash Hoover, who's from Minnesota,
and he has a YouTube channel called ChasingLegends, and they go out and try to find the
(01:07:58):
elusive cryptids.
Speaker A (01:08:00):
Oh, nice.
Speaker B (01:08:02):
Yeah. So we've got a few fun episodes coming out.
Speaker A (01:08:06):
Yeah, that looks great and everything.
And that's one thing people don't understandwith cryptids in the midwest, there's some
pretty big ones.
Like we have the beast of Bray Road, which is
a werewolf.
We also have Hodag.
Speaker B (01:08:25):
The Hodg. Yes.
Speaker A (01:08:27):
Which is kind of a funny one.
We did an episode on.
So. Yeah, that sounds really interesting.
I love all that stuff coming up, and I'm
definitely going to listen.
And hopefully my spooky friends will give you
a listen too.
Because one of the things that we were talking
about, Tracy, we're independent podcasts, sowe don't have the huge budgets like all those
(01:08:48):
big podcasts out there.
So if you're listening to us, please rate us
five stars like us.
Subscribe to us.
I recommend total conundrum as well as all theother people, podcasts and paranormal
investigators, whoever, have on my show,because, hey, we need the love too, right,
Tracy?
Speaker B (01:09:06):
We do.
Speaker A (01:09:08):
Awesome.
Speaker B (01:09:09):
We need all sorts of love.
Speaker A (01:09:11):
Yes. So again, thank you so much.
You're awesome.
Love to have you back on the show again soon.
Sometime maybe we could talk about cryptids
this time.
Speaker B (01:09:21):
Yeah. Make sure Jeremy's feeling up to it, too.
Speaker A (01:09:25):
Yeah, tell Jeremy to feel better.
Definitely.
Anyway, so we end every show by saying, say hito your ghost.
So, hello, ghost.
Because you never know, right?
Stay spooky.
Speaker B (01:09:39):
Stay spooky.
Speaker A (01:09:41):
Thanks, Tracy.
Love you.
Speaker B (01:09:43):
Thank you.
You too.
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