April 18, 2023 • 48 mins
“Have you ever had something you were looking forward to so much, and you had to put so much effort and energy in planning that thing and it's consumed your mind and kept you up at night? And you're up in the morning and you're barely eating or you're over eating? Because you're putting so much effort into this thing?” (Molly, 1:49) Yeah, this happened to Angela as they prepared for and then hosted a huge, very important event for them, and we dare say the entire ND community. Join us in this episode to hear why Molly says, “A whole bunch of listeners just felt really seen” (34:52).
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Meet Your Hosts Angela LocashioBringing “sense” to the conversation”--from here on her soapbox, she sheds light on the things society doesn’t want you to talk about, you know, the real shit that matters.
Molly HicksI help burnt out busiest fuck neurodivergent and queer entrepreneurs make shit happen by providing out-of-the-box solutions and sustainable systems to grow your biz
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Molly Hicks (00:00):
Welcome to drudgery dreams and in between the
podcast for neurodivergentweirdos and queers who forget
about struggling to adult we'restruggling to human. At least
Angela Locashio (00:08):
that's what everyone's telling us. You're
right, pre shuffle. Hey, I'mAngela, bringing sense to the
conversation. From here on mysoapbox, I shed light on the
things society doesn't want youto talk about, you know, the
real shit that matters.intersectional thinking
sexuality queernessneurodiversity consent, and the
(00:29):
fact that self care is bullshit.For me, it's all about
community, and how we can carefor each other.
Molly Hicks (00:37):
And I'm Molly giving a big Fork you to
Cookie-Cutter Solutions, I helpburn out busiest Fuck
neurodivergent and queerentrepreneurs make shit happen
by providing out of the boxsolutions and sustainable
systems to grow your biz. Forme, it's all about doing what
makes sense for your brain.
Angela Locashio (00:54):
And that's what the chitchat, let's get to it.
Molly Hicks (00:57):
Keep listening. And Together, we'll explore the
drudgery, dreams and all thatshit in between, get ready to
call bullshit on what everyone'ssaying you should be doing
Angela Locashio (01:07):
as we navigate the spectrum between what really
matters to you, and the shitkeeping you from it.
Molly Hicks (01:15):
Good morning, everybody.
Angela Locashio (01:17):
Morning. Oh, my
Molly Hicks (01:20):
gosh, ah, we have such an episode for you today.
And and then my braindisappears. But no, today, we're
going to be talking about acouple of really big things that
we're really excited to sharewith you. And before we get
(01:40):
started, we wanted to kind ofstart with Have you ever we're
going to do a scenario here,guys. Have you ever had
something you were lookingforward to so much, and you had
to put so much effort and energyin planning that thing and it's
consumed your mind and kept youup at night? And you're up in
the morning and you're barelyeating or you're over eating?
(02:02):
Because you're putting so mucheffort into this thing? And then
the thing comes? And it's thething? And then things go to
shit after this thing, notbecause the thing was bad. But
because you have this emotionalcollapse, essentially.
Angela Locashio (02:22):
Energetic? Yes. Yeah.
Molly Hicks (02:26):
100 shot at collapse. And so we wanted to
take a few moments to talk aboutthat. Because Angela, has been
putting her heart and soul intosomething recently, which we're
gonna talk about a few minutes.And today is the day after.
Angela Locashio (02:45):
Today's the day after. That's why my hair looks
so good.
Molly Hicks (02:49):
It looks fantastic.
Angela Locashio (02:53):
It's the leftover hairspray.
Molly Hicks (02:56):
Oh, yes. And so. I mean, you've been spending a
good couple months leading up toYeah, months and months leading
up to last night. Andoccasionally, we've we've taken
a break from an episode just sothat you could kind of get a
(03:18):
little bit of energy regainingmoment. Because sometimes you
only have enough energy to focuson one thing. Not you
specifically. That's true. Ingeneral. That's true. I mean,
also you. And so, tell us alittle bit about that.
Angela Locashio (03:40):
About the energy.
Molly Hicks (03:42):
I mean, just like about how it was building up to
last night, and then last nighthappening and like,
Angela Locashio (03:51):
okay. Yeah, so the last two weeks, especially.
Right, the last two weeksespecially, have been just a lot
of a lot of work. And youexplained it really well. Of the
not eating or eating, you know,just whatever you could get your
(04:18):
hands on at any moment. The Ithink like, for me, there's this
feeling of not even havingemotions, even though I know
they're there. And that but anyemotions that I've had have been
(04:39):
kind of diverted into, like,just being angry and pissy. And,
you know, because I'm just notable to put energy into anything
other than this thing that I'mdoing. Right and the other
people who are involved that Ihave to interact with, so
(04:59):
they're For my partner, poor guyhas to deal with, like, so much,
so much of, of not having accessto me yet me not always being
kind, or I don't know that kindis the right word, but me being
(05:24):
extra needy emotionally and himhaving to expend emotional
energy and put his his own needsto the side in order to take
care of mine because I'm unableto do any of that emotional
lifting.
Molly Hicks (05:43):
CO regulation roles.
Angela Locashio (05:46):
Yeah, and I mean, you know, he does that for
me anyway, right when I need it,that's just, that's, that's what
we do. And I mean, that's beendiscussed and negotiated in our
relationship. But in cases likethis, it can go, it can go a
little bit too far, it can be alittle bit too much. And
(06:06):
regardless of how aware I am, itis how it is. And, you know,
when there's something big likethis, we just have to deal with
the stuff that comes with it forme to be able to, to do that.
(06:27):
And I don't know that I hadplanned on talking about this
today, but I'm going to, thishas always been one of my
biggest issues with, with youknow, everybody's like, you've
got your shit together, you'vereally got your shit together,
because they watch me work andthey watch me do all the things
that I do and, you know, gettingmaster's degrees and and, you
(06:53):
know, being a leader and all ofthese things. But I really
struggle with doing both, Ireally struggle with being able
to work and do the work that Ido to the level that I want to
do it. And maintaining myrelationships.
Molly Hicks (07:15):
Yeah.
Angela Locashio (07:18):
I know that there are lots of people out
there who are really great andwonderful at at doing that. And,
you know, this is why I saybalance, it's just not possible.
You know, in the real world, youcan't balance forever. Like
people even say like the balanceof nature? Well, I don't find
(07:41):
that nature is balanced at all.Rather, it's harmonious. So I
try to find some harmony inthere. Which sometimes means
somebody sings louder thananother person.
Molly Hicks (07:55):
And I think this goes back to a couple episodes
ago, we talked about that matchanalogy. Yep. And like, I think
people assume that you haveenough matches to both have a
positive or completely regulatedpersonal and do this big strong
work thing. When in reality,you're stealing whatever matches
well, not stealing, negotiatedly taking matches from what you
(08:20):
normally allocate to personaland pulling that will last the
microphone for those of you notwatching your Allah eight,
you're taking those matches thatyou've allocated for personnel
and you're just reallocatingthem to be able to focus which
means like, you might have onematch left by the time you get
home and or
Angela Locashio (08:41):
turkey. Yeah, if. So, I mean, I guess the
reason I share that is becausefor some of us, that's normal,
it doesn't matter what job I'mdoing. It doesn't matter what
classes I'm taking, whatever Iam interested in and focused on
is where my time, effort andenergy goes. And often that
(09:04):
comes at a detriment to myrelationships. One of the really
funny things that happen duringmy diagnosis and I say funny,
but when I read this, I cried.Like when I read my report, I
just I cried I cried really hardactually. Because it said Angela
(09:30):
can be rather cold and it'slikely that she has very few
friends and close relationships.Obviously and
Molly Hicks (09:40):
no, you
Angela Locashio (09:43):
I mean, yeah, but I get emotional because it's
also true. It's also true.
Molly Hicks (09:48):
Yeah. at a surface level,
Angela Locashio (09:52):
at a surface level and mind you this is a
diagnostician who, you know, sawme for several hours on several
different ends. Asians and youknow, at one point in the
report, it said that I'mfriendly. And then but the
overall diagnostic piece wasthat I'm cold and don't have
(10:13):
friends or good relationships.So I mean, and that's where that
comes from. Right? That's wherethat comes from is, and that's
kind of one of those stigmasactually, that's out there is of
how we are. And that's, it's notnecessarily true. Again, like
(10:34):
you said, surface level, thatcan be true in some instances,
but overall, as a human being,that's not true.
Molly Hicks (10:42):
It makes me think about like, everybody's like,
you know, specifically withautistic folks. It's so black
and white. No, it's fuckinggray. There's so much fucking
gray out there that, okay,
Angela Locashio (10:57):
there's a reason why it's called a
spectrum. It's not it's notgray. It's a it's a rainbow.
Like, look, we're actuallywearing our rainbows today.
Molly Hicks (11:05):
I am it
Angela Locashio (11:08):
hurts our gray shirts. Right?
Molly Hicks (11:11):
I mean, in the sense of like, yes. In between
the black and the white? Yes,quickly in the black and white.
There's just a lot of gray. Andthere's new ones, and that we
see more new ones? Well,majority of us see more new ones
then. And we're like, oh, butthat scenario hasn't taken
(11:32):
place. And this scenario hasn'ttaken place. So how did these
parallel? And what happenedleading up to that to make it so
that this thing that perfectlylanded this way? And? Yeah.
Exactly. And I feel like it'sthe same thing that you're
describing is like, with thisperson who gave like, I respect
that, that makes you emotionalwhen you read that. But I see it
(11:54):
as all she could see, is youbeing frustrated with the system
of how they're diagnosing you,and that that's coming through
because you know that it's justbullshit, especially with all
the interactions that happenedduring all of that, Oh, yeah.
And how they were blatantly justdescribed. And I think
Angela Locashio (12:15):
I could tell you the exact conversation that
led up to that. And it was veryspecifically a conversation of
these questions that you areasking me, and these things that
you were asking me to do, weredeveloped for little white boys.
And that is not appropriate forwhat we are doing here. And
(12:35):
therefore, before anything evenhappens, we can say that, that
there is no validity to what ishappening here. Like, I mean,
they very specifically saidduring one of the tests,
apparently it was the one whereyou're like playing with the
toys kind of thing. That I wassomewhat rude and questioning
(13:01):
during that part. And I mean,like,
Molly Hicks (13:08):
I mean, I'm gonna redirect us because I feel like
we could talk about thatprocess. And blatant
Angela Locashio (13:14):
this leads directly into what we were going
to talk about today. Right.
Molly Hicks (13:18):
Right. So so the Okay. Yes.
Angela Locashio (13:24):
This is why I do what I do. This is the whole
reason that last night happened.
Molly Hicks (13:29):
Exactly. So for those of you that haven't been
listening very long or didn'tget the memo, that's okay. Um,
Angela, is the CEO of anorganization called umbrella
Alliance. And they had an eventlast night called nd 23. And
(13:55):
it'd be no it was a big deal. Itwas is a big deal. And a huge
deal. It is. I'm going todescribe this and if I do it
wrong, just correct me. Butessentially, this is a
culmination of bringing togetherall the all the different
(14:19):
columns, silos, right? silos,oh, look at me remembering a
word silos of the nd communitythat the neurodivergent
community and making sureeverybody is communicating and
talking so that everybody hasaccess to all the information
that is happening at one timeand because people within the
(14:43):
ADHD community might find somethings that are really helpful
that honestly could helpsomebody in the bipolar nerd
artistic community. And samething in those silos and but but
not everybody's communicating uptill now.
Angela Locashio (14:58):
Right and we those people People have to go
to 500 different places to findinformation instead of it being
in one place. And not just oneplace, but not behind a paywall.
Molly Hicks (15:13):
Correct. And so this is what Angela has been
working on with her team. Andit's very
Angela Locashio (15:23):
you almost called me, AJ?
Molly Hicks (15:26):
I did. I don't, I've never called you, AJ, which
is weird. But I think it'sbecause I saw 30 million times
yesterday. But it's just soincredible. Because there's some
major themes and major topicsthat are being discussed. And
(15:50):
there's you guys had breakoutgroups last night, and it was
just, I'm going to shut up andlet you talk now.
Angela Locashio (16:00):
Okay. Yeah, I mean, nd 23 is the foundation
for all of the work that we willdo. And not just so we're in
Australia, and we're in the US.And we will be in other places
(16:29):
as well. This is not one ofthose things where it's like,
here's this one organization.And this group of people decide
everything for everybody. Weknow that local areas need their
own space, they need their own.They need to look at what they
need locally. And what they needlocally. At this time. context
(16:53):
specific right is not whatsomebody else needs or another
local community needs at thattime. So we can't just do one
single thing and say, This isthe blanket and it works for
everything. We'reneurodivergent. That doesn't
work for us. Right? Right. Sowithin the 23, we are
(17:17):
facilitating we're not doing thework for people, we are
facilitating and creating spaceand providing resources, and
that that foundational supportthat people need, so that they
feel empowered to take action intheir local communities. Because
it can be very daunting. Tothink about, like, these are the
(17:40):
things that I would like to do.But I don't have the resources,
time, effort, energy, access tothe resources that I need, all
of those things. So within d 23.Umbrella is providing those
resources is providing thatplatform for people to take
action in the way that they needto in their local communities.
(18:04):
And then people from each ofthose separate groups are coming
together once a month, andhaving conversations that
decide, you know, whatresources, we need more of what
access is missing? What arewhat's happening in the
education cohort? What'shappening in the employment
(18:26):
cohort? What's happening in thehealthcare cohort? And what's
happening in the socialprotections, cohort? And how are
we not just it's not aboutawareness at this point. It's
not just about awareness, thereare all of these different
siloed organizations that areproviding awareness. We are
(18:46):
taking action on that. It nolonger is it thinking and having
the thinkers over here andhaving the doers over here. The
thinkers and the doers arecoming together. And that's, you
know, that's really what we'redoing. And it's it's, it's very
exciting. And it's, it has apurpose, right, like last night,
(19:10):
Ben Van Hook, who is our projectcoordinator, and amazing young
person who is an incredibleadvocate for the community and
brilliant and one of the thingsthat he said last night was all
humans deserve to have access toresources that they need to
(19:33):
cover their essential needssustainably and with dignity.
And that comes from a reportdone by the International
Committee of the Red Cross, thecover their essential needs
sustainably and with dignity.And it was a report on economic
(19:54):
security. And that is what weare doing at umbrella Alliance.
We are creating Eating thatcommunity led network to fix
isn't the right word. And I'mstruggling with my words right
now to improve outcomes for ourcommunity, because three
(20:17):
quarters of us do not haveeconomic security, and the
Quarter who do are predominantlywhite privileged. And they are
at risk of losing it all thetime as well, because of that
(20:38):
intersection of neurodiversity,and that's unacceptable. It's
completely unacceptable. And itmust be addressed, there's no
reason that three quarters ofthe indie community should not
have access to the resourcesthat they need.
Molly Hicks (20:58):
Truth. I'm sorry, the things you said were like
one of those heavy moments whereyou're like, I don't know how to
follow that. In a good way, in agood way, not like, oh, no,
Angela Locashio (21:15):
no, I get it, I get it. You know, this happens
to me all the time, when Istarted talking about economic
security. Everything goes quiet.And you and I have talked about
it enough that I know that youknow what it means. But number
one, I think when people hearthose statistics, it people need
(21:38):
time to process like, holy shit,am I one of the three quarters?
Or am I one of the fourth? Youknow, which which 1am i And and
then to in the moment, rightthen and there experience the
grief of being that threequarter or experience the grief
of understanding how privilegedyou are to not be in that group
(22:02):
who experiences economicinsecurity. And then there's the
I'm not really sure whateconomic security means. So I'll
tell you really quickly, it'sthe state of being able to care
for yourself and your dependentsfinancial needs, sustainably
over time, including in theevent of an interruption to
(22:26):
that, like COVID, for example,or the loss of a job or being
you know, a medical emergency.And when someone has economic
security, they don't worry thatif they get sick, it will ruin
(22:48):
them financially. Right? Theydon't choose to not go and see a
doctor. Because they can'tafford it. They don't choose to
not take there, they don't haveto choose food over medication.
(23:09):
Because they have access to boththey and it's not just health
care, right, they have access toeducation, and training and
learning opportunities, so thatthey can experience the
employment success that they arelooking for. They have access to
(23:30):
employment and employmentbecomes, you know, accessible,
not just to get a job, butthroughout the process of having
a job. They are able to havequality childcare. And then
there's this piece that peopleforget they're able to interact
(23:54):
meaningfully in their community.Like that's economic security,
and we don't necessarily thinkabout that when we're talking
about economic security peoplethink that it's just money it's
not just money, it's theinfrastructure of everything
that allows us to have access toresources that a lot of people
(24:18):
associate with having moneybecause right now only the
people who have money haveaccess to those resources
Molly Hicks (24:41):
I know you're laughing at me It's so
think okay, so a lot of thingsto talk about. So like, on tick
tock, there's been a couplethings He was going on where
people are like, hey, 75 or 85%of you, how do you keep a job?
(25:05):
Or how do you do these things?And it all comes back to this
like it most the time, it's notbecause well, I mean, in some
cases it might be. Most thetime, it's not because they have
necessarily better coping,coping skills, I have my air
quotes here, guys, copingmechanisms, or their masking
(25:29):
skills are intensely amazing.Also air quoting the amazing. It
it's not necessarily that it'sthat a lot of them just ended up
in a place of privilege to startwith. And so that kind of
continues for them. Right. Andthat doesn't mean that somebody
(25:54):
who currently doesn't haveeconomic security can't gain
economic insecurity, they justneed a lot of support from those
who have economic security, tohelp them themselves do that.
Angela Locashio (26:07):
Right. And not only those in our community,
right, we need we need peopleoutside of the outside of the
the, you know, disabilitycommunity to step up and say,
you know, here, we aresupporting. And, and again, I'm
coming back to that thatprivilege piece, right? When we
(26:30):
look at, you know, one of thebig huge things to me, in fact,
when I wrote the bylaws for theUS, umbrella Alliance us, I very
specifically put in there sothat it is mandated that we have
a justice committee, that thathas the space to come and bring
(26:54):
up anything that goes againstour anti racism policies. And
why was that important to me.Because even though even though
I grew up, at times homeless, wedidn't ever have a lot of money.
I'm the first person in myfamily, you know, like to go and
(27:18):
do the college thing. And, andI, because I am white, have so
much privilege that other peopledon't have. And I saw it all of
the time in, in my students whodidn't have access to, to health
(27:39):
care, who didn't have access todiagnosis, who, you know, in the
case of my black students,especially, who were being sent
home regularly for behavior,quote, unquote, behavior issues,
when there was maybe somethingelse going on? Because the bias
was there, of this as a badperson with bad behavior, simply
(28:04):
because of the color of theirskin. Like, these are the things
that must be addressed and mustchange.
Molly Hicks (28:12):
Right? Well, it's, I am learning new things
culturally, every day, like Isuper pasty white girl,
privileged person. Well, girlwith like an asterix. And then
the I'm learning all the time.But I don't know what I don't
know. And I need to admit, whenI didn't know when I did
(28:34):
something wrong. When I feellike that's what the Justice
Committee is just saying is, wedon't know what we don't know.
So if you bring it up, we canlearn and we can change, we can
apologize, and we can moveforward. And I think that's a
huge piece is like you don'tknow what you don't know. But if
you're open to learning and opento changing, like, that's where
(28:58):
the biggest growth happens. Andthat's where you can make more
changes to society as a whole.Because you're open and
receptive to these things. Andso, it's great that you added
that.
Angela Locashio (29:13):
Yeah, I was actually really proud of it. I
think I went when the lawyer,you know, I said, I said to the
lawyer, uh, we need to add thisinto the bylaws. And she was
like, wow, I've not seen thatbefore. I had this major moment
of pride. And I was like, well,now all of your contracts can
have that in there. And Ithought, you know, this is what,
(29:34):
what it looks like to make adifference. It might be quiet.
And it might be something that'swritten down on this piece of
paper, but it's a start. And I'msure that there are other
organizations who have done thatas well. And we should,
Shouldn't that be part of everylike, not for profit
(29:55):
organization like, I don't knowit to me if you are
Molly Hicks (29:59):
a part of it. Any organization, nonprofit or in or
for profit, like, yeah, if youare truly about change of
culture and being accepting forall, you should have a justice
committee able to do that.
Angela Locashio (30:17):
And not a token justice committee, but one that
is actually empowered to act.And when they when somebody
comes to me and they say, thishappened, you said this, or
somebody within the organizationsaid this, or whatever it's not
met with, I'll look into it.It's okay, what are we gonna do
(30:37):
about it? I'm listening rightnow, everything else is going to
be put off to the side becausethis needs to be addressed.
Right? Not we're going toaddress it three months from
now. Not we're going to put someapology up and leave it at that.
But what action are we going totake right now? And I feel like
that kind of, you know, took usaway from the whole indie 23
(31:00):
thing. But at the same time,it's, that's what this is about.
Right? It's about justice. Andit's about it's about taking
action to do the things that wewant to do. We're gonna you
know, what did they say put upor shut up? Shit or get off the
(31:22):
pot? You know, there are plentyof people who are talking about
things. And that's great. Like Isaid, thinkers plus doers. But
we have to work together.
Molly Hicks (31:35):
So were there any so I don't know, did you go to
different breakout groupsyourself?
Angela Locashio (31:41):
I did not because I was in the chat room.
I only bounced into them. Like,quickly at the end to let people
know, there were a couple ofminutes left. But I have I set
it up so that at the end of eachsession, they had a secretary
and each session. And yeah, andthen so this is my next
(32:04):
question. Yeah. I mean, come on,Molly. You know, I have systems
right.
Molly Hicks (32:17):
choked on breath.
Angela Locashio (32:19):
Saw that looks like it looks like a little gnat
or something flew into you. Butit didn't. It was just air.
Molly Hicks (32:28):
Well, I'm having background story for all of
those that haven't been aroundfor years, like Angela, there
are weeks where my lungs decidethat they no longer want to
operate. And so I'm having oneof those weeks. And so it was
just one of those like, my bodyforgot how to breathe? No.
(32:49):
Anyway, so what I was gonna askbecause that's why I was like.
Honestly, if you only everlisten to our podcast, you might
want to watch it one time, justjust for all the weird to do
with our hands. And the noisesin the house. Okay, anyway, um,
(33:10):
no, my hands or my T Rex armsare out. Okay, were there any
like? I mean, I know that youlove every takeaway that was
made for sure, because of whatit means to have those takeaways
from each of those breakupgroups. But were there some that
you were like, Oh, my God, Ican't wait to talk about this.
Angela Locashio (33:35):
I mean, okay, there was a point, I honestly
can't remember which one ofthese it was there. In fact,
there's a lot that I can't quitejust like, pull out. And
remember from last night, I was,you know, doing a lot of things
all at once. Plus, it was theculmination of that energy
build. And I haven't processedit yet. And I probably won't
(33:58):
until after I have, most likelytomorrow, I'm probably going to
have just a day where I'm justblue. And I'm probably going to
cry a lot and yell into a pillowor, you know, whatever, I will
have to do a lot of regulation.And it definitely will involve
crying.
Molly Hicks (34:16):
Always does, as you say, it helps you get through
the last part of the stresscycle.
Angela Locashio (34:20):
Yeah, absolutely. I have to complete
the stress response cycle. And Ihave been in that cycle for
quite some time. And I need somesleep because I have not been
sleeping well. And last night,it's not like I got sleep
because it was over. I wasperseverating on everything. As
my brain was trying to remember.Like what happened? What did you
(34:40):
do? Did you say the right thing?Did you say the wrong thing? You
know? Did you make everybodyfeel welcome and comfortable and
safe? Did you get your pointacross Do people understand what
you're doing? You know, all ofthat, like
Molly Hicks (34:52):
all of that. A whole bunch of listeners just
felt really seen? Yeah,
Angela Locashio (34:57):
yeah. And that's, that's that's nor Well,
after something like this for meanyway, and I don't think that
that's just a neurodivergentthing. I also don't think that
it's just a stress thing. Ithink that is a normal part of
being human, that a lot ofpeople just don't want to
recognize. Because it means thatthey have to do it, even though
(35:23):
they don't. Anyway, I don't knowwhy people think that so that
poor separation is weird, orwhatever, I think it's normal.
It's normal for me anyway. AndI'm just gonna leave it at that.
So, um, all of our cohorts areimportant. They're all
necessary. education,employment, health care, social
(35:45):
protections. But you know, me,right, the social protections
piece is the piece that I amgoing to focus on, because what
is happening in that space, is?See, I just had that moment of
(36:07):
oh, my gosh, somebody's going tohear that and think that I don't
love them. Not true. All of themare important. But social
protections has a place in myheart specifically, because of
how I work and how I enjoylooking at all of them, at the
same time, from that Justiceaspect. So some of the
(36:31):
questions, I really love this,they said, we discussed the
issue of salience, how do weraise awareness, educate the
public employers, health carepractitioners, organizations?
How do we keep the momentumgoing to create that change? How
do we get the right people?specific issues looking like
(36:55):
modifications and supports fornd folks, often ending with high
school? What supports are outthere for adults? And how can we
create sustainable supports?Who's doing that? What
organizations are doing that?Oh, it's umbrella. Right? It's
not that some of the other silosaren't. But now let's bring them
(37:18):
together so that the people whohave you know, co occurring
conditions don't have to spendall of their time effort and
energy finding those in otherspaces. You know, they don't
have to look in 500 differentwebsites, unless that's what
they want to do. That's calledthe rabbit hole, and it happens.
(37:42):
And the other thing that ishappening in that specific space
is the arts community. The artscommunity, this is where they
are able to make massive amountsof impact. Come on Hollywood,
let's get involved. Right, comeon artists, let's get involved
authors, musicians, all of theseamazing creators that we have on
(38:05):
Tik Tok, let's get involvedtogether to create the impact
that that we want to create. Andcreating that sustainability. So
you know, I really I love this.How do we support and promote
indie creatives without gettinginto inspiration porn. And I
(38:27):
love that, right? Because that'show many people scroll on Tik
Tok for hours and hours andhours. Because it's inspiring,
because it feels good. You know?But then what do we do with it?
When when we get thatinspiration? What do we do?
(38:49):
Right, so I just get excited.That's, that's where I got
excited. And that same questionwas also asked in the other
groups who had really greatspecific, you know, in
education, we talked about thislast time with Rebecca, you
know, IEPs being done in thewrong way, you know, to support
(39:14):
systems in place, that are notsupportive, you know, positive
behavior supports that are notthat are more focused on the
teacher and the classroominstead of the individual. And I
will say, as someone who was onthe PBIS positive behavior
supports committee, I have beenone of those teachers who said,
(39:39):
Okay, across the board, we'reall going to do X. You know, I'm
not saying that I haven't beenthere. But you know, that things
can be done differently. Forexample, RSD and kids who are
being told to stop moving systemAll, you know, sit in one place,
(40:03):
the the cumulative impacts thathappen on those kids go into
adulthood, right? Keep us fromaccessing resources when we do
have access to them. Because wefeel like we can't or we
shouldn't or we hate, you know,screw you, I hate school, I'm
not gonna go to college, I'm notgonna go and be told, again,
(40:24):
that I suck.
Molly Hicks (40:27):
And that right, super young, like, first through
third grade is where kids startmaking those kind of done.
Things like it's really youngpeople don't realize how young
that that impact affects thatperson's entire future.
Angela Locashio (40:48):
Right, right. I mean, okay, they, they have this
thing, it's called the secondarycurriculum, or the hidden
curriculum. And it starts assoon as your kid goes to
daycare. So, at six weeks old,if your kid is going, they care,
because you are lucky enough tohave six weeks off of work, oh,
(41:08):
you had to take your own sickleave and vacation for that.
Anyway, that was my experience.I got the six weeks off work,
but it was my sick leave and,and vacation with one week left
to take care of a newborn andall of their medical needs. And
that is that happens. And that'sprivileged because not everybody
(41:28):
even gets that. But your kidgoes to daycare, and now there's
this hidden curriculum that istelling them who they are
supposed to be and how they aresupposed to be in this world,
you know, you're a boy, you're agirl. Right? You you have to do
this, you have to be this way.And to be a good kid, you have
(41:52):
to sit still. Don't, you know?Don't make that noise. Don't
move that way. You're You're tooloud, quit being so damned
happy, like, don't cry. So allof that are those are things
(42:12):
that that have to be addressed.And it's funny when you look at
it, like in the educationsystem, and then you look over
into what are the needs in theemployment system? There we are
again, right. And same stuff.It's a lot of the same stuff.
(42:32):
And then a lot of theconversation last night was what
are, you know, the people in HR.And the people who the managers
(42:52):
and the leaders, they're,they're not trained, they don't
have access when they aretrained. It's not. It's token
Dei, instead of dei that is ledby neurodivergent people that is
led by black and global majorityindividuals who are also neuro
(43:15):
divergent. And, you know, Imean,
Molly Hicks (43:22):
yeah, I mean, well, half the time. This is not to
negate anything of, of what theracial disparity issues of di,
but when you say Dei, the firstthing people don't think of is
neurodivergent. Humans. Correct.So I mean, that's also a piece
of that as well, that like, allof these back to intersections,
(43:46):
all of these things areimportant, especially when you
are all of the things within it,you know, like,
Angela Locashio (43:54):
right. All right. I said, I said the other
day, and I was really excited tobe quoted it. I was like, Oh,
that's nice. So I said, wecan't, we can't look at one
(44:14):
justice movement and compare itto another justice movement.
Anti ableism includes antiracism. It's not exclusive. And
unfortunately dei programsdon't. Often they don't include
anti ableism or anti racism.Right. Right. Like Ben and
(44:41):
Brady, were telling me they justdid this training. There was a
whole like D training, right?And it was all white people.
Everybody out there they wereall white people and And they
came and you know, we werehaving one of our meetings,
(45:03):
they're like, We have to tellyou how disappointing this was.
You know, they're like, Why? Whywas there this panel for Dei,
and there wasn't a single, blackor global majority person on
this panel? Like, you know, why?Why were people on the panel not
disabled? Like, you know, sothis is still happening today.
(45:28):
It's not like it's just goneaway. So those, those are the
conversations that arehappening, the the work that is
going to be done, I got soexcited. Last night, I was
really like, I'm just thinkingabout it right now. It's just
very
Molly Hicks (45:49):
exciting. I understand that exact sentiment.
Angela Locashio (45:54):
It's exciting because people will be taking
action. People will be comingtogether. It's already happened.
Yes. Like, we have a Discordserver. So so that the people
who are working in these inthese cohorts can talk to each
(46:15):
other. And it's a continuousasynchronous conversation.
Instead of being okay, we'regonna get together once a month
for two hours. And that's goingto create change. No, it's not.
It's a constant, you know,conversation, getting ideas from
other people and then makingaction plans. And I guess I'm
really excited to see thathappen. Even though I'm
(46:38):
exhausted. Even though I'm goingto crash and burn, it may not
even wait until tomorrow. I'mfeeling it right now.
Molly Hicks (46:46):
I was gonna say, close. And it might be just
Angela and Molly. Well, Mollyhelping Angela curricularly
Angela Locashio (46:54):
for a little bit. Maybe like, I kind of want
to just like dive into worktoday. Because I think, like I
have that. That feeling of if Ijust dive in if I just dive into
work? Yeah, yeah. So
Molly Hicks (47:15):
all right, well, we once again, somehow jumped from
15 minutes to 47 minutes. And Inever know how that actually
happens, but it does. So anylast thoughts before we sign
off?
Angela Locashio (47:33):
Um, I hope that anybody who is listening,
messages us like messages,contact us ask us questions. We
will periodically create little,you know, updates on how things
how things are going. And thereare lots of different ways to
(47:53):
get involved. So if that'ssomething that you want to get
involved in, please contact meand let me know and we'll make
it happen.
Molly Hicks (48:02):
All right. Well, then I think that's it for
today.
Angela Locashio (48:08):
Okay, and I don't have the thingy up. So
talk about something for twoseconds. Okay. Actually, you
know what, we're not going toclose out today like we normally
do. It happens when I don't havethe thing up. It's okay. Thank
you for watching drudgery,dreams. And in between a weekly
live podcast. Check me out aweekly live
(48:35):
coming to you every Tuesday at9am Central 7am Pacific on all
of your favorite podcastingplatforms. See you next week.
Molly Hicks (48:51):
See you next week everybody. Bye
Welcome to drudgery dreams and in between the
podcast for neurodivergentweirdos and queers who forget
about struggling to adult we'restruggling to human. At least
Angela Locashio (00:08):
that's what everyone's telling us. You're
right, pre shuffle. Hey, I'mAngela, bringing sense to the
conversation. From here on mysoapbox, I shed light on the
things society doesn't want youto talk about, you know, the
real shit that matters.intersectional thinking
sexuality queernessneurodiversity consent, and the
(00:29):
fact that self care is bullshit.For me, it's all about
community, and how we can carefor each other.
Molly Hicks (00:37):
And I'm Molly giving a big Fork you to
Cookie-Cutter Solutions, I helpburn out busiest Fuck
neurodivergent and queerentrepreneurs make shit happen
by providing out of the boxsolutions and sustainable
systems to grow your biz. Forme, it's all about doing what
makes sense for your brain.
Angela Locashio (00:54):
And that's what the chitchat, let's get to it.
Molly Hicks (00:57):
Keep listening. And Together, we'll explore the
drudgery, dreams and all thatshit in between, get ready to
call bullshit on what everyone'ssaying you should be doing
Angela Locashio (01:07):
as we navigate the spectrum between what really
matters to you, and the shitkeeping you from it.
Molly Hicks (01:15):
Good morning, everybody.
Angela Locashio (01:17):
Morning. Oh, my
Molly Hicks (01:20):
gosh, ah, we have such an episode for you today.
And and then my braindisappears. But no, today, we're
going to be talking about acouple of really big things that
we're really excited to sharewith you. And before we get
(01:40):
started, we wanted to kind ofstart with Have you ever we're
going to do a scenario here,guys. Have you ever had
something you were lookingforward to so much, and you had
to put so much effort and energyin planning that thing and it's
consumed your mind and kept youup at night? And you're up in
the morning and you're barelyeating or you're over eating?
(02:02):
Because you're putting so mucheffort into this thing? And then
the thing comes? And it's thething? And then things go to
shit after this thing, notbecause the thing was bad. But
because you have this emotionalcollapse, essentially.
Angela Locashio (02:22):
Energetic? Yes. Yeah.
Molly Hicks (02:26):
100 shot at collapse. And so we wanted to
take a few moments to talk aboutthat. Because Angela, has been
putting her heart and soul intosomething recently, which we're
gonna talk about a few minutes.And today is the day after.
Angela Locashio (02:45):
Today's the day after. That's why my hair looks
so good.
Molly Hicks (02:49):
It looks fantastic.
Angela Locashio (02:53):
It's the leftover hairspray.
Molly Hicks (02:56):
Oh, yes. And so. I mean, you've been spending a
good couple months leading up toYeah, months and months leading
up to last night. Andoccasionally, we've we've taken
a break from an episode just sothat you could kind of get a
(03:18):
little bit of energy regainingmoment. Because sometimes you
only have enough energy to focuson one thing. Not you
specifically. That's true. Ingeneral. That's true. I mean,
also you. And so, tell us alittle bit about that.
Angela Locashio (03:40):
About the energy.
Molly Hicks (03:42):
I mean, just like about how it was building up to
last night, and then last nighthappening and like,
Angela Locashio (03:51):
okay. Yeah, so the last two weeks, especially.
Right, the last two weeksespecially, have been just a lot
of a lot of work. And youexplained it really well. Of the
not eating or eating, you know,just whatever you could get your
(04:18):
hands on at any moment. The Ithink like, for me, there's this
feeling of not even havingemotions, even though I know
they're there. And that but anyemotions that I've had have been
(04:39):
kind of diverted into, like,just being angry and pissy. And,
you know, because I'm just notable to put energy into anything
other than this thing that I'mdoing. Right and the other
people who are involved that Ihave to interact with, so
(04:59):
they're For my partner, poor guyhas to deal with, like, so much,
so much of, of not having accessto me yet me not always being
kind, or I don't know that kindis the right word, but me being
(05:24):
extra needy emotionally and himhaving to expend emotional
energy and put his his own needsto the side in order to take
care of mine because I'm unableto do any of that emotional
lifting.
Molly Hicks (05:43):
CO regulation roles.
Angela Locashio (05:46):
Yeah, and I mean, you know, he does that for
me anyway, right when I need it,that's just, that's, that's what
we do. And I mean, that's beendiscussed and negotiated in our
relationship. But in cases likethis, it can go, it can go a
little bit too far, it can be alittle bit too much. And
(06:06):
regardless of how aware I am, itis how it is. And, you know,
when there's something big likethis, we just have to deal with
the stuff that comes with it forme to be able to, to do that.
(06:27):
And I don't know that I hadplanned on talking about this
today, but I'm going to, thishas always been one of my
biggest issues with, with youknow, everybody's like, you've
got your shit together, you'vereally got your shit together,
because they watch me work andthey watch me do all the things
that I do and, you know, gettingmaster's degrees and and, you
(06:53):
know, being a leader and all ofthese things. But I really
struggle with doing both, Ireally struggle with being able
to work and do the work that Ido to the level that I want to
do it. And maintaining myrelationships.
Molly Hicks (07:15):
Yeah.
Angela Locashio (07:18):
I know that there are lots of people out
there who are really great andwonderful at at doing that. And,
you know, this is why I saybalance, it's just not possible.
You know, in the real world, youcan't balance forever. Like
people even say like the balanceof nature? Well, I don't find
(07:41):
that nature is balanced at all.Rather, it's harmonious. So I
try to find some harmony inthere. Which sometimes means
somebody sings louder thananother person.
Molly Hicks (07:55):
And I think this goes back to a couple episodes
ago, we talked about that matchanalogy. Yep. And like, I think
people assume that you haveenough matches to both have a
positive or completely regulatedpersonal and do this big strong
work thing. When in reality,you're stealing whatever matches
well, not stealing, negotiatedly taking matches from what you
(08:20):
normally allocate to personaland pulling that will last the
microphone for those of you notwatching your Allah eight,
you're taking those matches thatyou've allocated for personnel
and you're just reallocatingthem to be able to focus which
means like, you might have onematch left by the time you get
home and or
Angela Locashio (08:41):
turkey. Yeah, if. So, I mean, I guess the
reason I share that is becausefor some of us, that's normal,
it doesn't matter what job I'mdoing. It doesn't matter what
classes I'm taking, whatever Iam interested in and focused on
is where my time, effort andenergy goes. And often that
(09:04):
comes at a detriment to myrelationships. One of the really
funny things that happen duringmy diagnosis and I say funny,
but when I read this, I cried.Like when I read my report, I
just I cried I cried really hardactually. Because it said Angela
(09:30):
can be rather cold and it'slikely that she has very few
friends and close relationships.Obviously and
Molly Hicks (09:40):
no, you
Angela Locashio (09:43):
I mean, yeah, but I get emotional because it's
also true. It's also true.
Molly Hicks (09:48):
Yeah. at a surface level,
Angela Locashio (09:52):
at a surface level and mind you this is a
diagnostician who, you know, sawme for several hours on several
different ends. Asians and youknow, at one point in the
report, it said that I'mfriendly. And then but the
overall diagnostic piece wasthat I'm cold and don't have
(10:13):
friends or good relationships.So I mean, and that's where that
comes from. Right? That's wherethat comes from is, and that's
kind of one of those stigmasactually, that's out there is of
how we are. And that's, it's notnecessarily true. Again, like
(10:34):
you said, surface level, thatcan be true in some instances,
but overall, as a human being,that's not true.
Molly Hicks (10:42):
It makes me think about like, everybody's like,
you know, specifically withautistic folks. It's so black
and white. No, it's fuckinggray. There's so much fucking
gray out there that, okay,
Angela Locashio (10:57):
there's a reason why it's called a
spectrum. It's not it's notgray. It's a it's a rainbow.
Like, look, we're actuallywearing our rainbows today.
Molly Hicks (11:05):
I am it
Angela Locashio (11:08):
hurts our gray shirts. Right?
Molly Hicks (11:11):
I mean, in the sense of like, yes. In between
the black and the white? Yes,quickly in the black and white.
There's just a lot of gray. Andthere's new ones, and that we
see more new ones? Well,majority of us see more new ones
then. And we're like, oh, butthat scenario hasn't taken
(11:32):
place. And this scenario hasn'ttaken place. So how did these
parallel? And what happenedleading up to that to make it so
that this thing that perfectlylanded this way? And? Yeah.
Exactly. And I feel like it'sthe same thing that you're
describing is like, with thisperson who gave like, I respect
that, that makes you emotionalwhen you read that. But I see it
(11:54):
as all she could see, is youbeing frustrated with the system
of how they're diagnosing you,and that that's coming through
because you know that it's justbullshit, especially with all
the interactions that happenedduring all of that, Oh, yeah.
And how they were blatantly justdescribed. And I think
Angela Locashio (12:15):
I could tell you the exact conversation that
led up to that. And it was veryspecifically a conversation of
these questions that you areasking me, and these things that
you were asking me to do, weredeveloped for little white boys.
And that is not appropriate forwhat we are doing here. And
(12:35):
therefore, before anything evenhappens, we can say that, that
there is no validity to what ishappening here. Like, I mean,
they very specifically saidduring one of the tests,
apparently it was the one whereyou're like playing with the
toys kind of thing. That I wassomewhat rude and questioning
(13:01):
during that part. And I mean,like,
Molly Hicks (13:08):
I mean, I'm gonna redirect us because I feel like
we could talk about thatprocess. And blatant
Angela Locashio (13:14):
this leads directly into what we were going
to talk about today. Right.
Molly Hicks (13:18):
Right. So so the Okay. Yes.
Angela Locashio (13:24):
This is why I do what I do. This is the whole
reason that last night happened.
Molly Hicks (13:29):
Exactly. So for those of you that haven't been
listening very long or didn'tget the memo, that's okay. Um,
Angela, is the CEO of anorganization called umbrella
Alliance. And they had an eventlast night called nd 23. And
(13:55):
it'd be no it was a big deal. Itwas is a big deal. And a huge
deal. It is. I'm going todescribe this and if I do it
wrong, just correct me. Butessentially, this is a
culmination of bringing togetherall the all the different
(14:19):
columns, silos, right? silos,oh, look at me remembering a
word silos of the nd communitythat the neurodivergent
community and making sureeverybody is communicating and
talking so that everybody hasaccess to all the information
that is happening at one timeand because people within the
(14:43):
ADHD community might find somethings that are really helpful
that honestly could helpsomebody in the bipolar nerd
artistic community. And samething in those silos and but but
not everybody's communicating uptill now.
Angela Locashio (14:58):
Right and we those people People have to go
to 500 different places to findinformation instead of it being
in one place. And not just oneplace, but not behind a paywall.
Molly Hicks (15:13):
Correct. And so this is what Angela has been
working on with her team. Andit's very
Angela Locashio (15:23):
you almost called me, AJ?
Molly Hicks (15:26):
I did. I don't, I've never called you, AJ, which
is weird. But I think it'sbecause I saw 30 million times
yesterday. But it's just soincredible. Because there's some
major themes and major topicsthat are being discussed. And
(15:50):
there's you guys had breakoutgroups last night, and it was
just, I'm going to shut up andlet you talk now.
Angela Locashio (16:00):
Okay. Yeah, I mean, nd 23 is the foundation
for all of the work that we willdo. And not just so we're in
Australia, and we're in the US.And we will be in other places
(16:29):
as well. This is not one ofthose things where it's like,
here's this one organization.And this group of people decide
everything for everybody. Weknow that local areas need their
own space, they need their own.They need to look at what they
need locally. And what they needlocally. At this time. context
(16:53):
specific right is not whatsomebody else needs or another
local community needs at thattime. So we can't just do one
single thing and say, This isthe blanket and it works for
everything. We'reneurodivergent. That doesn't
work for us. Right? Right. Sowithin the 23, we are
(17:17):
facilitating we're not doing thework for people, we are
facilitating and creating spaceand providing resources, and
that that foundational supportthat people need, so that they
feel empowered to take action intheir local communities. Because
it can be very daunting. Tothink about, like, these are the
(17:40):
things that I would like to do.But I don't have the resources,
time, effort, energy, access tothe resources that I need, all
of those things. So within d 23.Umbrella is providing those
resources is providing thatplatform for people to take
action in the way that they needto in their local communities.
(18:04):
And then people from each ofthose separate groups are coming
together once a month, andhaving conversations that
decide, you know, whatresources, we need more of what
access is missing? What arewhat's happening in the
education cohort? What'shappening in the employment
(18:26):
cohort? What's happening in thehealthcare cohort? And what's
happening in the socialprotections, cohort? And how are
we not just it's not aboutawareness at this point. It's
not just about awareness, thereare all of these different
siloed organizations that areproviding awareness. We are
(18:46):
taking action on that. It nolonger is it thinking and having
the thinkers over here andhaving the doers over here. The
thinkers and the doers arecoming together. And that's, you
know, that's really what we'redoing. And it's it's, it's very
exciting. And it's, it has apurpose, right, like last night,
(19:10):
Ben Van Hook, who is our projectcoordinator, and amazing young
person who is an incredibleadvocate for the community and
brilliant and one of the thingsthat he said last night was all
humans deserve to have access toresources that they need to
(19:33):
cover their essential needssustainably and with dignity.
And that comes from a reportdone by the International
Committee of the Red Cross, thecover their essential needs
sustainably and with dignity.And it was a report on economic
(19:54):
security. And that is what weare doing at umbrella Alliance.
We are creating Eating thatcommunity led network to fix
isn't the right word. And I'mstruggling with my words right
now to improve outcomes for ourcommunity, because three
(20:17):
quarters of us do not haveeconomic security, and the
Quarter who do are predominantlywhite privileged. And they are
at risk of losing it all thetime as well, because of that
(20:38):
intersection of neurodiversity,and that's unacceptable. It's
completely unacceptable. And itmust be addressed, there's no
reason that three quarters ofthe indie community should not
have access to the resourcesthat they need.
Molly Hicks (20:58):
Truth. I'm sorry, the things you said were like
one of those heavy moments whereyou're like, I don't know how to
follow that. In a good way, in agood way, not like, oh, no,
Angela Locashio (21:15):
no, I get it, I get it. You know, this happens
to me all the time, when Istarted talking about economic
security. Everything goes quiet.And you and I have talked about
it enough that I know that youknow what it means. But number
one, I think when people hearthose statistics, it people need
(21:38):
time to process like, holy shit,am I one of the three quarters?
Or am I one of the fourth? Youknow, which which 1am i And and
then to in the moment, rightthen and there experience the
grief of being that threequarter or experience the grief
of understanding how privilegedyou are to not be in that group
(22:02):
who experiences economicinsecurity. And then there's the
I'm not really sure whateconomic security means. So I'll
tell you really quickly, it'sthe state of being able to care
for yourself and your dependentsfinancial needs, sustainably
over time, including in theevent of an interruption to
(22:26):
that, like COVID, for example,or the loss of a job or being
you know, a medical emergency.And when someone has economic
security, they don't worry thatif they get sick, it will ruin
(22:48):
them financially. Right? Theydon't choose to not go and see a
doctor. Because they can'tafford it. They don't choose to
not take there, they don't haveto choose food over medication.
(23:09):
Because they have access to boththey and it's not just health
care, right, they have access toeducation, and training and
learning opportunities, so thatthey can experience the
employment success that they arelooking for. They have access to
(23:30):
employment and employmentbecomes, you know, accessible,
not just to get a job, butthroughout the process of having
a job. They are able to havequality childcare. And then
there's this piece that peopleforget they're able to interact
(23:54):
meaningfully in their community.Like that's economic security,
and we don't necessarily thinkabout that when we're talking
about economic security peoplethink that it's just money it's
not just money, it's theinfrastructure of everything
that allows us to have access toresources that a lot of people
(24:18):
associate with having moneybecause right now only the
people who have money haveaccess to those resources
Molly Hicks (24:41):
I know you're laughing at me It's so
think okay, so a lot of thingsto talk about. So like, on tick
tock, there's been a couplethings He was going on where
people are like, hey, 75 or 85%of you, how do you keep a job?
(25:05):
Or how do you do these things?And it all comes back to this
like it most the time, it's notbecause well, I mean, in some
cases it might be. Most thetime, it's not because they have
necessarily better coping,coping skills, I have my air
quotes here, guys, copingmechanisms, or their masking
(25:29):
skills are intensely amazing.Also air quoting the amazing. It
it's not necessarily that it'sthat a lot of them just ended up
in a place of privilege to startwith. And so that kind of
continues for them. Right. Andthat doesn't mean that somebody
(25:54):
who currently doesn't haveeconomic security can't gain
economic insecurity, they justneed a lot of support from those
who have economic security, tohelp them themselves do that.
Angela Locashio (26:07):
Right. And not only those in our community,
right, we need we need peopleoutside of the outside of the
the, you know, disabilitycommunity to step up and say,
you know, here, we aresupporting. And, and again, I'm
coming back to that thatprivilege piece, right? When we
(26:30):
look at, you know, one of thebig huge things to me, in fact,
when I wrote the bylaws for theUS, umbrella Alliance us, I very
specifically put in there sothat it is mandated that we have
a justice committee, that thathas the space to come and bring
(26:54):
up anything that goes againstour anti racism policies. And
why was that important to me.Because even though even though
I grew up, at times homeless, wedidn't ever have a lot of money.
I'm the first person in myfamily, you know, like to go and
(27:18):
do the college thing. And, andI, because I am white, have so
much privilege that other peopledon't have. And I saw it all of
the time in, in my students whodidn't have access to, to health
(27:39):
care, who didn't have access todiagnosis, who, you know, in the
case of my black students,especially, who were being sent
home regularly for behavior,quote, unquote, behavior issues,
when there was maybe somethingelse going on? Because the bias
was there, of this as a badperson with bad behavior, simply
(28:04):
because of the color of theirskin. Like, these are the things
that must be addressed and mustchange.
Molly Hicks (28:12):
Right? Well, it's, I am learning new things
culturally, every day, like Isuper pasty white girl,
privileged person. Well, girlwith like an asterix. And then
the I'm learning all the time.But I don't know what I don't
know. And I need to admit, whenI didn't know when I did
(28:34):
something wrong. When I feellike that's what the Justice
Committee is just saying is, wedon't know what we don't know.
So if you bring it up, we canlearn and we can change, we can
apologize, and we can moveforward. And I think that's a
huge piece is like you don'tknow what you don't know. But if
you're open to learning and opento changing, like, that's where
(28:58):
the biggest growth happens. Andthat's where you can make more
changes to society as a whole.Because you're open and
receptive to these things. Andso, it's great that you added
that.
Angela Locashio (29:13):
Yeah, I was actually really proud of it. I
think I went when the lawyer,you know, I said, I said to the
lawyer, uh, we need to add thisinto the bylaws. And she was
like, wow, I've not seen thatbefore. I had this major moment
of pride. And I was like, well,now all of your contracts can
have that in there. And Ithought, you know, this is what,
(29:34):
what it looks like to make adifference. It might be quiet.
And it might be something that'swritten down on this piece of
paper, but it's a start. And I'msure that there are other
organizations who have done thatas well. And we should,
Shouldn't that be part of everylike, not for profit
(29:55):
organization like, I don't knowit to me if you are
Molly Hicks (29:59):
a part of it. Any organization, nonprofit or in or
for profit, like, yeah, if youare truly about change of
culture and being accepting forall, you should have a justice
committee able to do that.
Angela Locashio (30:17):
And not a token justice committee, but one that
is actually empowered to act.And when they when somebody
comes to me and they say, thishappened, you said this, or
somebody within the organizationsaid this, or whatever it's not
met with, I'll look into it.It's okay, what are we gonna do
(30:37):
about it? I'm listening rightnow, everything else is going to
be put off to the side becausethis needs to be addressed.
Right? Not we're going toaddress it three months from
now. Not we're going to put someapology up and leave it at that.
But what action are we going totake right now? And I feel like
that kind of, you know, took usaway from the whole indie 23
(31:00):
thing. But at the same time,it's, that's what this is about.
Right? It's about justice. Andit's about it's about taking
action to do the things that wewant to do. We're gonna you
know, what did they say put upor shut up? Shit or get off the
(31:22):
pot? You know, there are plentyof people who are talking about
things. And that's great. Like Isaid, thinkers plus doers. But
we have to work together.
Molly Hicks (31:35):
So were there any so I don't know, did you go to
different breakout groupsyourself?
Angela Locashio (31:41):
I did not because I was in the chat room.
I only bounced into them. Like,quickly at the end to let people
know, there were a couple ofminutes left. But I have I set
it up so that at the end of eachsession, they had a secretary
and each session. And yeah, andthen so this is my next
(32:04):
question. Yeah. I mean, come on,Molly. You know, I have systems
right.
Molly Hicks (32:17):
choked on breath.
Angela Locashio (32:19):
Saw that looks like it looks like a little gnat
or something flew into you. Butit didn't. It was just air.
Molly Hicks (32:28):
Well, I'm having background story for all of
those that haven't been aroundfor years, like Angela, there
are weeks where my lungs decidethat they no longer want to
operate. And so I'm having oneof those weeks. And so it was
just one of those like, my bodyforgot how to breathe? No.
(32:49):
Anyway, so what I was gonna askbecause that's why I was like.
Honestly, if you only everlisten to our podcast, you might
want to watch it one time, justjust for all the weird to do
with our hands. And the noisesin the house. Okay, anyway, um,
(33:10):
no, my hands or my T Rex armsare out. Okay, were there any
like? I mean, I know that youlove every takeaway that was
made for sure, because of whatit means to have those takeaways
from each of those breakupgroups. But were there some that
you were like, Oh, my God, Ican't wait to talk about this.
Angela Locashio (33:35):
I mean, okay, there was a point, I honestly
can't remember which one ofthese it was there. In fact,
there's a lot that I can't quitejust like, pull out. And
remember from last night, I was,you know, doing a lot of things
all at once. Plus, it was theculmination of that energy
build. And I haven't processedit yet. And I probably won't
(33:58):
until after I have, most likelytomorrow, I'm probably going to
have just a day where I'm justblue. And I'm probably going to
cry a lot and yell into a pillowor, you know, whatever, I will
have to do a lot of regulation.And it definitely will involve
crying.
Molly Hicks (34:16):
Always does, as you say, it helps you get through
the last part of the stresscycle.
Angela Locashio (34:20):
Yeah, absolutely. I have to complete
the stress response cycle. And Ihave been in that cycle for
quite some time. And I need somesleep because I have not been
sleeping well. And last night,it's not like I got sleep
because it was over. I wasperseverating on everything. As
my brain was trying to remember.Like what happened? What did you
(34:40):
do? Did you say the right thing?Did you say the wrong thing? You
know? Did you make everybodyfeel welcome and comfortable and
safe? Did you get your pointacross Do people understand what
you're doing? You know, all ofthat, like
Molly Hicks (34:52):
all of that. A whole bunch of listeners just
felt really seen? Yeah,
Angela Locashio (34:57):
yeah. And that's, that's that's nor Well,
after something like this for meanyway, and I don't think that
that's just a neurodivergentthing. I also don't think that
it's just a stress thing. Ithink that is a normal part of
being human, that a lot ofpeople just don't want to
recognize. Because it means thatthey have to do it, even though
(35:23):
they don't. Anyway, I don't knowwhy people think that so that
poor separation is weird, orwhatever, I think it's normal.
It's normal for me anyway. AndI'm just gonna leave it at that.
So, um, all of our cohorts areimportant. They're all
necessary. education,employment, health care, social
(35:45):
protections. But you know, me,right, the social protections
piece is the piece that I amgoing to focus on, because what
is happening in that space, is?See, I just had that moment of
(36:07):
oh, my gosh, somebody's going tohear that and think that I don't
love them. Not true. All of themare important. But social
protections has a place in myheart specifically, because of
how I work and how I enjoylooking at all of them, at the
same time, from that Justiceaspect. So some of the
(36:31):
questions, I really love this,they said, we discussed the
issue of salience, how do weraise awareness, educate the
public employers, health carepractitioners, organizations?
How do we keep the momentumgoing to create that change? How
do we get the right people?specific issues looking like
(36:55):
modifications and supports fornd folks, often ending with high
school? What supports are outthere for adults? And how can we
create sustainable supports?Who's doing that? What
organizations are doing that?Oh, it's umbrella. Right? It's
not that some of the other silosaren't. But now let's bring them
(37:18):
together so that the people whohave you know, co occurring
conditions don't have to spendall of their time effort and
energy finding those in otherspaces. You know, they don't
have to look in 500 differentwebsites, unless that's what
they want to do. That's calledthe rabbit hole, and it happens.
(37:42):
And the other thing that ishappening in that specific space
is the arts community. The artscommunity, this is where they
are able to make massive amountsof impact. Come on Hollywood,
let's get involved. Right, comeon artists, let's get involved
authors, musicians, all of theseamazing creators that we have on
(38:05):
Tik Tok, let's get involvedtogether to create the impact
that that we want to create. Andcreating that sustainability. So
you know, I really I love this.How do we support and promote
indie creatives without gettinginto inspiration porn. And I
(38:27):
love that, right? Because that'show many people scroll on Tik
Tok for hours and hours andhours. Because it's inspiring,
because it feels good. You know?But then what do we do with it?
When when we get thatinspiration? What do we do?
(38:49):
Right, so I just get excited.That's, that's where I got
excited. And that same questionwas also asked in the other
groups who had really greatspecific, you know, in
education, we talked about thislast time with Rebecca, you
know, IEPs being done in thewrong way, you know, to support
(39:14):
systems in place, that are notsupportive, you know, positive
behavior supports that are notthat are more focused on the
teacher and the classroominstead of the individual. And I
will say, as someone who was onthe PBIS positive behavior
supports committee, I have beenone of those teachers who said,
(39:39):
Okay, across the board, we'reall going to do X. You know, I'm
not saying that I haven't beenthere. But you know, that things
can be done differently. Forexample, RSD and kids who are
being told to stop moving systemAll, you know, sit in one place,
(40:03):
the the cumulative impacts thathappen on those kids go into
adulthood, right? Keep us fromaccessing resources when we do
have access to them. Because wefeel like we can't or we
shouldn't or we hate, you know,screw you, I hate school, I'm
not gonna go to college, I'm notgonna go and be told, again,
(40:24):
that I suck.
Molly Hicks (40:27):
And that right, super young, like, first through
third grade is where kids startmaking those kind of done.
Things like it's really youngpeople don't realize how young
that that impact affects thatperson's entire future.
Angela Locashio (40:48):
Right, right. I mean, okay, they, they have this
thing, it's called the secondarycurriculum, or the hidden
curriculum. And it starts assoon as your kid goes to
daycare. So, at six weeks old,if your kid is going, they care,
because you are lucky enough tohave six weeks off of work, oh,
(41:08):
you had to take your own sickleave and vacation for that.
Anyway, that was my experience.I got the six weeks off work,
but it was my sick leave and,and vacation with one week left
to take care of a newborn andall of their medical needs. And
that is that happens. And that'sprivileged because not everybody
(41:28):
even gets that. But your kidgoes to daycare, and now there's
this hidden curriculum that istelling them who they are
supposed to be and how they aresupposed to be in this world,
you know, you're a boy, you're agirl. Right? You you have to do
this, you have to be this way.And to be a good kid, you have
(41:52):
to sit still. Don't, you know?Don't make that noise. Don't
move that way. You're You're tooloud, quit being so damned
happy, like, don't cry. So allof that are those are things
(42:12):
that that have to be addressed.And it's funny when you look at
it, like in the educationsystem, and then you look over
into what are the needs in theemployment system? There we are
again, right. And same stuff.It's a lot of the same stuff.
(42:32):
And then a lot of theconversation last night was what
are, you know, the people in HR.And the people who the managers
(42:52):
and the leaders, they're,they're not trained, they don't
have access when they aretrained. It's not. It's token
Dei, instead of dei that is ledby neurodivergent people that is
led by black and global majorityindividuals who are also neuro
(43:15):
divergent. And, you know, Imean,
Molly Hicks (43:22):
yeah, I mean, well, half the time. This is not to
negate anything of, of what theracial disparity issues of di,
but when you say Dei, the firstthing people don't think of is
neurodivergent. Humans. Correct.So I mean, that's also a piece
of that as well, that like, allof these back to intersections,
(43:46):
all of these things areimportant, especially when you
are all of the things within it,you know, like,
Angela Locashio (43:54):
right. All right. I said, I said the other
day, and I was really excited tobe quoted it. I was like, Oh,
that's nice. So I said, wecan't, we can't look at one
(44:14):
justice movement and compare itto another justice movement.
Anti ableism includes antiracism. It's not exclusive. And
unfortunately dei programsdon't. Often they don't include
anti ableism or anti racism.Right. Right. Like Ben and
(44:41):
Brady, were telling me they justdid this training. There was a
whole like D training, right?And it was all white people.
Everybody out there they wereall white people and And they
came and you know, we werehaving one of our meetings,
(45:03):
they're like, We have to tellyou how disappointing this was.
You know, they're like, Why? Whywas there this panel for Dei,
and there wasn't a single, blackor global majority person on
this panel? Like, you know, why?Why were people on the panel not
disabled? Like, you know, sothis is still happening today.
(45:28):
It's not like it's just goneaway. So those, those are the
conversations that arehappening, the the work that is
going to be done, I got soexcited. Last night, I was
really like, I'm just thinkingabout it right now. It's just
very
Molly Hicks (45:49):
exciting. I understand that exact sentiment.
Angela Locashio (45:54):
It's exciting because people will be taking
action. People will be comingtogether. It's already happened.
Yes. Like, we have a Discordserver. So so that the people
who are working in these inthese cohorts can talk to each
(46:15):
other. And it's a continuousasynchronous conversation.
Instead of being okay, we'regonna get together once a month
for two hours. And that's goingto create change. No, it's not.
It's a constant, you know,conversation, getting ideas from
other people and then makingaction plans. And I guess I'm
really excited to see thathappen. Even though I'm
(46:38):
exhausted. Even though I'm goingto crash and burn, it may not
even wait until tomorrow. I'mfeeling it right now.
Molly Hicks (46:46):
I was gonna say, close. And it might be just
Angela and Molly. Well, Mollyhelping Angela curricularly
Angela Locashio (46:54):
for a little bit. Maybe like, I kind of want
to just like dive into worktoday. Because I think, like I
have that. That feeling of if Ijust dive in if I just dive into
work? Yeah, yeah. So
Molly Hicks (47:15):
all right, well, we once again, somehow jumped from
15 minutes to 47 minutes. And Inever know how that actually
happens, but it does. So anylast thoughts before we sign
off?
Angela Locashio (47:33):
Um, I hope that anybody who is listening,
messages us like messages,contact us ask us questions. We
will periodically create little,you know, updates on how things
how things are going. And thereare lots of different ways to
(47:53):
get involved. So if that'ssomething that you want to get
involved in, please contact meand let me know and we'll make
it happen.
Molly Hicks (48:02):
All right. Well, then I think that's it for
today.
Angela Locashio (48:08):
Okay, and I don't have the thingy up. So
talk about something for twoseconds. Okay. Actually, you
know what, we're not going toclose out today like we normally
do. It happens when I don't havethe thing up. It's okay. Thank
you for watching drudgery,dreams. And in between a weekly
live podcast. Check me out aweekly live
(48:35):
coming to you every Tuesday at9am Central 7am Pacific on all
of your favorite podcastingplatforms. See you next week.
Molly Hicks (48:51):
See you next week everybody. Bye
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