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EPISODE DESCRIPTION
Episode 101: Matt and Taylor are joined by Colleen Wilson. Colleen is the Co-Founder, Owner, President, & CEO of Meridian Development from Saskatoon, Saskatchewan. A real estate development corporate brand and winner of several Heritage Awards. Meridian primarily develops and constructs residential projects from luxury condominiums and hotels to massive innovative university student housing projects, including the beautiful Eminence at Knox Mountain in Kelowna. Behind the scenes, Colleen is also the Director of Meridian’s Legal Affairs and Design Director, with her passion for design and well known sense of style, which is visible in every Meridian project.
Simultaneous with her work with Meridian, Colleen also remains in her role as the VP of Legal Affairs & Design Director for Landmark Projects for The Mid-West Group. A multi-award winning organization largely known for constructing, developing, and/or financing commercial and residential real estate projects throughout Western Canada and the United States.
An efficient multitasker, Colleen was awarded with the Queen Elizabeth II Platinum Medal for her outstanding service to her province and country. She was inducted into the JA Saskatchewan Business Hall of Fame in 2018, and has served as chair of both the Saskatchewan Liquor and Gaming Commission and the Saskatchewan Horse Racing Commission, and as Governor of the National Theatre School in Montreal. She has guest lectured at the U of S College of Law, was a member of the U of S WCVM Advisory Board, and is also the Founder of the highly successful charitable festival, "Pets in the Park", raising money for homeless companion animals.
Colleen has a big profile in media, and is still widely known as a Global television personality, having produced and been the host of her own television show for 25 years. After having been a member of numerous national/international panels, Colleen was selected by BMO as the keynote speaker for their national initiative, "Celebrating Women", which recognizes highly accomplished women and provides them with a platform to inspire others.
Colleen is here to discuss: → The vision of the Eminence project, who would thrive living at Eminence, and the availability of phase 1 (completed) and phase 2 (pre-sale) units. → The reality for developers working in BC, and how the cost to build in BC compares to other states and provinces. → The challenges of condo development & sales including pre-sales, vacancy tax, & the foreign buyers ban, and the impact of the current Canada/US relations on building.
1st Episode About Eminence at Knox Mountain (#45): https://KelownaRealEstate.podbean.com/e/45-karl-miller-scott-brown/
Eminence at Knox Mountain Website: www.eminenceliving.ca
Eminence at Knox Mountain Instagram: @eminence_living
Eminence at Knox Mountain Facebook: @EminenceAtKnoxMountain
Meridian Development Corp Website: www.meridiandevelopment.ca
Meridian Development Corp Instagram: @meridiandevelopment
Meridian Development Corp Facebook: @MeridianDevelopment
Meridian Development Corp LinkedIn: @MeridianDevelopmentCorp
***
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Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
All right, welcome back to theColonial Real Estate Podcast.
(00:01):
I'm your mortgage broker host,Taylor Atkinson.
And I'm your real estate agenthost, host, Matt Glenn.
What's shaking today, Taylor?You know, I got spoiled this
weekend.
Happy Father's Day to you, Matt.
Yes, you too.
Yeah, it was good.
Yeah, we just hung out, you know,had some brunch, went on the boat,
played pickleball, softball, justall the dad stuff.
Yeah, it was a great weekend.
You know what, like summer's here.
And I know last summer we werekind of talking about like...
(00:23):
Tourism's down and businesses aresuffering, but I feel like some
really great entrepreneurs in ourcircle, you know, one of them,
Dina Steele, who runs Keys toKelowna, just pivots so well, like
looks at regulations.
It's, you know, coming down
provincially, federally.
And it's like, hey, I may not like
have the best business right now.
And like Airbnb models, boom,
opens up a wicked coffee shop,wicked location.
(00:44):
Yeah.
On Lakeshore.
Like if you haven't been there,check it out.
Right across the street from GyroBeach.
Yeah.
Yeah.
She is just like a top likeperformer, you know, like
everything she does is likeincredible.
So yeah, we've been there a fewtimes now and you'll see her
walking around the blocks,checking out her places at Caban
and Aqua and then running forcoffee.
(01:04):
So yeah, shout out to Dina.
Just wicked job.
Awesome.
Awesome to see.
Yeah.
Summer's here.
We're just enjoying the localcommunity.
stuff.
I think this summer is going to be
a little bit more up.
Right.
Like more than last year.
I think this is going to be a good
summer for Kelowna.
Yeah.
And there's a few new businessespopping up and some existing ones
seem to be doing well and justlike, yeah, just pivoting.
So love to see it.
Yeah.
(01:24):
I like it.
Yeah.
Me too.
This episode too was also a ton of
fun to record.
of fun to record.
Yeah.
I mean, I probably speak for you
as well.
I love speaking to developers.
It's kind of like some of myfavorite shows we've had.
You get like.
pull back the curtains a little
bit.
So today we have on Colleen
Wilson.
She's the co -founder, president,
CEO of Meridian Development.
Started out as a lawyer, but she
was also on TV for like 25 years.
(01:46):
And it comes through on the
podcast.
She should be hosting the show.
Yeah, honestly.
Yeah, she was great.
So we did have a previous podcastwith the Meridian Group.
They're developing on KnoxMountain.
So Eminence, if you haven't.
listen to that podcast, go back
and re -listen to that one, butyou can go and check out their
sales center.
(02:06):
Phase one is, I think, mostly sold
out now.
There's still a couple of units
left, she said.
Phase two is open for sales.
Yeah, really cool project right onKnox.
So go check it out.
check it out.
It is a cool project to check out,no doubt.
It is built right on Knox, closeto town.
check it Beautiful building.
More coming.
The amenities aren't even thereyet and they're going to be nice
too.
Yeah.
Like something she said was theywere building like pathways in
collaboration with the city intoKnox as well.
(02:28):
Yeah.
she said was they were building
like pathways in collaborationwith the city into Knox as well.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I didn't know that.
That's pretty cool.
Yeah.
More walking trails.
If you're a dog person, petfriendly.
Or a hike person.
Yeah.
Or a bike.
Anything.
Anything Knox.
This is where you want to be.
Yeah.
That's funny.
You know, when I was in my roadbike phase, I rode my road bike up
to top of Knox right to the top.
And it kind of cruised through
Magic Estates at the top.
(02:49):
And it came down Clifton, right
past Eminence.
And I had a Speedo on my bike, and
I hit 90k an hour coming down.
And it Really?
Yeah.
That's the fastest I've ever been.
And it was terrifying.
Yeah.
That's funny.
When were you in a road bike
phase?I didn't know this.
know this.
I still am a bit, but not as much.
Yeah, a few years ago, I had got abike and ripped on it.
(03:12):
But yeah, so I was all proud ofmyself for going up Knox, which is
a feat in its own.
And then you get to the top and
then you just rip down Clifton andholy shit.
That was, yeah, it was awesome.
Yeah.
So every time I drive up Cliftonor go see Eminence.
I always think about that.
I mean, yeah, I've been biking a
lot too.
Mostly hauling the kids to daycare
and back in the trailer.
Oh, what?
(03:32):
That sounds awesome.
It is.
Yeah.
It's a quick like 5K there, 5K
back.
But yeah, everyone enjoy the show
and enjoy summer.
Get out and support some
businesses.
Absolutely.
And this episode, like everyepisode, sponsored by Century 21
Insurance Realty, best brokeragein town.
We're a real estate office,residential.
We do commercial real estate.
We have property management.
Basically, if it's real estaterelated, we do it.
Reach out.
If you are a person looking to buy
(03:54):
or sell, commercial, lease, callit for the agent.
Or if you're an agent looking tomake a switch, we're the brokerage
for you.
Yeah, it's a great place.
I love being there.
It's my spot.
I love telling people about it.
Enjoy the show.
Okay, Colleen Wilson, thanks forjoining us.
Pleasure to be here.
Pleasure to be here.
So how we like to just start ourshow connecting you with our
(04:15):
listeners is just what's yourperfect Friday look like?
What do you do?Well, you know, the old thank
goodness it's Friday.
I think we all feel that to some
degree.
I like to go into Friday thinking
I'm going to wrap up a lot ofloose ends from the week.
Sometimes that happens.
Sometimes it doesn't.
But in a perfect Friday, that'swhat would happen.
A lot of things I knew from thebeginning of the week that needed
to get dealt with would feel likethey were.
(04:36):
reasonably well dealt with, notthat I wouldn't be working on the
weekend, but I can work with aclearer conscience, a clearer mind
that those things have been dealtwith.
So that feels like a good Fridayto me.
I still, like I said, workSaturday and Sunday, but I like to
know that I cleared off my platewhat I intended to get cleared off
by Friday.
Nice.
And where are you geographicallylocated?
I'm born and raised in Saskatoon,Saskatchewan.
I'm a Western Canadian prairiegirl.
I've been fortunate to travel alot and I have a home in the U .S.
(04:58):
as well.
But that is my home.
That will always be my home.
And we keep our head office there.
But my husband and I, our companyhas operations in the United
States.
We have American companies.
We pay our American taxes andeverything down there.
And the extra tax we sometimeshave to pay in Canada.
That's a whole other conversation.
But we do business a lot of
places.
But we're really ingrained in
our... community there and i lovesaskatoon and so that's still home
(05:20):
to me yeah well obviously you lovecolonna as well because you're i
love colonna here today in thestudio and we're talking about
eminence i have a bit of a historyhere because i have my dad's
family a lot of them are in bc andi have cousins here in colonna so
i started coming to colonna when iwas a little girl and i have
wonderful memories of coming hereso the thought of developing here
(05:42):
is great my husband and i havedone some commercial development
here as well so i love colonna andwell obviously you love colonna as
well because you're i i lovecolonna here today in the studio
and we're talking about eminencehave a bit of a history here
because i have my dad's family alot of them are in bc and i have
cousins here in colonna so istarted coming to colonna when i
was a little girl and i havewonderful memories of coming here
so the thought of developing hereis great my husband and i have
done some commercial developmenthere as well so i love colonna and
Everybody in my company, when theyget a chance to come to Kelowna,
it's like, I think I need to go toKelowna calling.
Yeah, I need to come on this trip.
So we all love it here.
So is that why you chose Kelownaas a place to develop?
My late business partner lovedKelowna.
late business partner lovedKelowna.
I think it was one of his dreamlocations.
He like got in Beverly Hills.
And I mean, I it is a beautiful
(06:03):
place to come and it's part ofCanada, which makes it easy.
And we kind of have a motto, andthis goes back to my husband and
I, we don't really want to engagein any work in places that we
don't enjoy.
going so it's probably no
coincidence that the places wherewe develop property whether it's
here in the united states areplaces that we like because we
assume other people will like themtoo and so that was part of the
impetus for coming to cologne andwe thought there was a lot of
(06:24):
potential here as well yeah and wewill highlight like yeah we did
record an episode with carl yourlate business partner awesome
episode we just loved speakingwith him so much like the energy
he had was amazing and the way hetalked about eminence too was and
we will highlight like yeah we didrecord an episode with carl your
late business partner awesomeepisode we just loved speaking
with him so much like the energyhe had was amazing and the way he
(06:45):
talked about eminence too wasYeah, I was very passionate about
it.
I find that's what's so important
about pre -sales is to learn thedeveloper, which it's really hard
to do when these big projects goup.
So I feel that's why like thepodcasts are so nice.
But yeah, you're obviouslycarrying on the project.
And yeah, do you just want to kindof highlight?
But Sure.
Well, I think something that we
always believed in was before wedid a project, we always wanted to
put our head in the space of theperson that we thought would be
our target market to see if wewere them, what we would want.
We did it when we built studentresidences.
the university we did it withevery condo project and even our
(07:05):
recent apartment projects thatwe've done we give people resort
style living because we think ifwe were in an apartment that's
what we'd want so we always dothat so we try to imagine who our
end buyer will be who's going tobe living there and what they want
so we become very inspired by whowe're building for and also where
we're building and everything webuild we try to make it fit with
that part of the community so witheminence we're on the side of knox
(07:26):
mountain regional park beautifularea we think is a super special
location.
It was not an easy project to get
approved and developed because ofhow special the location is,
because you've got that feelingthat you're in, you know, the
Pacific Northwest, which beingfrom Saskatchewan, we want to feel
that when we're here, right?The feeling of the mountains and
the trails and that lifestyle, butwe want to be close to the
vibrancy of downtown and we'relike a six minute drive.
from eminence to downtown.
(07:47):
So we get the best of both worlds.
So we also wanted to be cognizantthough of something that would
blend with the architecture of themountains and would look good
there rather than maybe justsomething that was a box.
Yeah.
Like when I envision Knox, I'm
thinking hiking trails, dogs.
You've got it.
We're always pet friendly.
You've got it.
We're always pet friendly.
(08:08):
So every building has a beautiful
view terrace on the top of thebuilding that all of the residents
of that building can use andenjoy.
Part of phase three, there will bea clubhouse built with a pool, a
fitness center, some kind offacilities for outdoor dining and
indoor self -serve bar area, youknow, beautiful pool and spa.
So it's going to have that resortfeel.
And we've developed that conceptinitially.
tread into that with our apartmentbuildings where we have resort
(08:30):
style living and people reallylike it we're of course taking it
up a notch with condominiums wherethere's pride of ownership so that
comes with phase three so we'rejust completing phase one now but
even each building has thisbeautiful terrace and the views
from that terrace are breathtakingso i can already picture it i can
hardly wait to get a unit there soi don't have to stay in the hotel
(08:50):
i'll have a home at eminence wheni come out and sitting up on the
terrace with friends and neighborsand enjoying a glass of okanagan
wine yeah i'm gonna try some ofthose wines or a cup of coffee you
know i'm a chai tea latte drinkerup on the terrace because the
views are spectacular and whencarl and i first walked on that
property we went wow like you knowwe were kind of trying to envision
(09:13):
climbing up and i had high heelson up the side of the mountain a
little bit to see what it would belike like we're going to have
views from here out over thevalley and to the mountains around
and from the back you knowLiterally, the mountain is in your
backyard.
So the hiking trails are there.
You mentioned about dogs, Taylor.
We're all animal people at
Meridian and at Eminence.
So it's all pet friendly.
And what a great way to, you know.
(09:35):
kind of enjoy some time with your
dog going up the trails.
Yeah.
And this is built like right intothe side of Knoxville.
It is.
is. When you're on the back, like
the mountain is there, you willsee wildlife come by.
We've seen some deer and you areliving in the Pacific Northwest
right there.
And at the top of that mountain is
Lake Kathleen.
And it's a lovely hike, you know,
up the mountain.
(09:56):
And as part of our commitment to
the community, we're building somehiking trails, one with each phase
to augment the trail system that'salready there.
So it's great for the wholecommunity.
But for people who like mountainbiking and that, you can keep your
bike there, just ride up thetrail.
So you look out the back, you'vegot the Pacific Northwest.
You look to the front, you've gotthe Okanagan Valley and a six
-minute drive to downtown.
(10:16):
And a six -minute drive to
downtown, it's an easy drive.
It's a really easy drive.
It's a really easy drive.
Kelowna is...
You know, a great place to go.
I enjoy going down to the marina.
And, you know, I've heard itdescribed.
This isn't me saying it.
I've heard people say Kelowna is
the Lake Como of Canada.
And it is.
I mean, we don't have Europeanarchitecture here, but it has that
charm and that feel that LakeComo, Italy has.
(10:39):
Definitely has that.
And I think it makes it super
unique.
I mean, the lake, all the water
activities in the summer.
And then in the winter, you've got
all these world -class ski resortsand year -round wineries.
fabulous wineries here when isoccupancy for phase one it's
pretty soon it's happening overthe summer people will be taking
up residency in their unit summitwe call it as phase one of
eminence this summer so we'llstart moving people in in july and
(11:00):
then gradually not everybody'sgoing to move in the same day in
july we'll have that in an orderlyway but they will move in over the
course of the summer i've movedpeople into apartments too many at
one time i know we don't do thatwe just want to orderly everyone
to get in and get settled in iimagine as a developer this has to
be like is occupancy for phase oneit's pretty soon it's happening
over the summer people will betaking up residency in their unit
(11:23):
summit we call it as phase one ofeminence this summer so we'll
start moving people in in july andthen gradually not everybody's
going to move in the same day injuly we'll have that in an orderly
way but they will move in over thecourse of the summer i've moved
people into apartments too many atone time i know we don't do that
we just want to orderly everyoneto get in and get settled in i
(11:45):
imagine as a developer this has tobe like I mean, outside acquiring
the land and kind of getting thevision for it, this has to be the
most exciting part, like seeing itcome together.
It is.
And, you know, it's so rewarding,
even years later, when you find agreat fit for people.
Because I was just in the storerecently in Saskatoon.
A lady came up to me, introducedherself.
And she said, you won't rememberme.
I thought, oh, you know, because Itold you I worked a long time in
TV.
And I thought.
Did I meet her somewhere along theline in TV?
She said, no, I was one of yourbuyers in the first condo project
that you and your partner did inSaskatoon years ago.
And she said, I just wanted totell you, I just love living
there.
And she sold her unit at one
point.
Somebody talked her into buying
something else.
So unhappy.
She got rid of that and boughtback into this.
place she'd originally been andshe said you know I just wanted to
tell you it changed my life it waswonderful another girlfriend of
mine bought into our luxury condoin Saskatoon she said moving there
actually changed her life and sothat's what we want we want to
(12:08):
enhance people's lifestyle wedon't just build buildings We
create the envelope for you tohave a terrific lifestyle.
We're a lifestyle company, really.
Nice.
Yeah.
That's pretty cool.
pretty We build your lifestyle foryou.
Cool.
Yeah.
So I guess at this point, like ifpeople are interested, are you
going to have showroom up therenow?
We do.
We do.
We have our presentation centersopen and we have a model in
addition to the presentationcenter.
So people can go in, get a look atthe finishes.
People are telling us they...
(12:28):
really love the way our show home
is looking and they're free to goup we're open five days a week we
have people up there i can't gothrough the hours right now but go
to our website eminenceliving ca and you will see that and we've
got josh and chris and karina upthere and they'd be happy to
welcome people and give them atour if you're a little interested
or a lot interested we're happy tosee you and just show you what
(12:49):
we're what we're doing And soavailability in phase two and
phase three, I guess, when arethose going to be coming?
So I still have a few select unitsavailable in phase one that are
beautiful units.
to be coming?
So I still have a few select unitsavailable in phase one that are
beautiful units.
We are selling now in phase two,
not in phase three yet.
The market has shifted just
(13:11):
recently.
We've got a lot of sales activity
going on.
A lot of people coming to us both
on phase one, but also on phasetwo.
So for people who are looking forsomething right away, phase one,
for people who.
are thinking, you know, a move
down the road a little bit.
This is the reality.
This is not a developer speaking.
This is just the truth.
Construction costs are going up.
That was even before tariffs.
They're just going up.
(13:31):
It's a reality.
We've got our phase two pricedown.
We've been holding the prices.
The reality is I can't really
justify building it for what I'mselling it for now.
So at some point, those prices aregoing to go up.
now is the time to get in when youbuy in pre -sales is always when
you get the best deal because thedeveloper knows you've got to hang
in there till it gets built and soyou're getting the advantage not
(13:53):
only of pricing but you also getthe advantage that you can semi
-customize at eminence at thattime once the units are built and
done you can walk in and see itbut it is what it is people can
now go and pick out their colorscheme we've also got a few
options they can select from anoptions list or a few sort of
different features in phase two sothey have the ability to really
put their own stamp on it still atthis point so great time to buy
and like what happens is thedeveloper's margin shrinks even if
(14:15):
you put the prices up a bitbecause our construction costs are
going up more so Great time forpeople to buy in phase two.
Now we can feel people gettingmore excited again.
Have you had first -timehomebuyers reach out since the GST
rebate?you had first -time homebuyers
reach out since the GST rebate?We've had some questions asked,
some questions asked, but a lot ofpeople seem a little confused as
(14:36):
to how it works.
Our sales team can certainly walk
people through that.
I think some people were hoping it
applied to every new home, butit's for first -time homebuyers.
Yes, we've talked about that.
we've talked I think people would
have loved it if it had been morebroadly extended.
I think developers would haveloved it, especially because We
love BC, but the environment forbuilding condominiums in BC is not
conducive to encouragingdevelopers to build here.
(14:56):
It's the cranes like we talkedabout that you see in the air
around Kelowna, they're forapartments.
I think we're going to feel thisbecause like, and this is being
built, there's a couple othercondo buildings that are in
construction near completion, butthere's like no new ones coming.
That's right.
People, they've been kind of
sitting and waiting and somepeople want a single family home.
Some people want a rentalapartment for their main home.
But there's a whole broad range ofpeople that love condominium
(15:18):
living.
It's lock and leave.
So young professionals like it.
People that are empty nesters like
it.
Some of them go to Arizona,
California, Florida, Texas for thefew months in the winter.
They like it.
The odd times see a family, you
know, we'll take a condo and astack unit.
It's not done as much here, but inbig cities, you see that all the
time.
Not just townhouse families being
attracted to townhomes.
They also buy in development that
are.
like more the apartment style,
like stacked units.
(15:38):
So there's a lot of people that
really want condos.
And right now that product,
developers are not interested inbuilding it.
I'm not sure if your provincialgovernment is aware.
It would be great if they wouldmaybe engage with some developers,
find out why they're not beingbuilt.
They say they want more housingbuilt.
Then you've got to make sureyou're covering all the bases, not
just single family homes and notjust apartments.
(16:00):
There's going to be a lot ofapartments here in Kelowna.
Not everybody wants to live in anapartment.
Yeah, I mean, maybe you want totouch on this a little bit.
As a developer, and the few thatwe've spoken to, it seems like BC
is really putting handcuffs on youguys.
Financially, is it really worthit?
It seems almost more of a passionproject to be like, hey, we'd love
to be in Kelowna and buildsomething.
But does it make sense anymore tobuild here?
(16:21):
It doesn't.
It's going to create a void in the
market where there is no productlike that.
I'm still going to be therebecause I'm trying to forge ahead
here, but I really wish thegovernment would take a serious
look at how developers rely onlenders, how that works when you
have to tie that into how Redma,the Real Estate Marketing
Development Act works, and how youhave to have all your pre -sales
(16:42):
done within a year.
Or there's an opportunity for your
buyers that are now supposedlycommitted buyers to rescind their
contracts.
It creates a whole feeling of
uncertainty.
It's not realistic to think that's
going to happen in a year.
And while it's great to have
offered buyer protections, I don'tknow that in the end that's
helping buyers have certaintyeither.
Because a developer may justdecide, you know what, this isn't
(17:03):
making sense.
I'm not going to do it.
And that's what a lot ofdevelopers have done.
And they've put other... projects,condo projects on hold, some of
them have abandoned themaltogether.
But like I said, we're there,we're committed to seeing this
done.
And so I think at a certain point,
people are going to go, Oh, mygoodness, we want a condo.
And there's not a lot ofselection.
But I think the government reallyneeds to jump on that and have a
(17:24):
look.
And you know, sometimes when
people are working in government,they're busy, there's maybe a bit
of a disconnect between them andwhat's really going on, I think
would be really worthwhile foryour premier, his key ministers to
sit down and talk to developerswho are investing time and money
and want to be a part of theBritish Columbia communities.
And for us here in Kelowna,they're not making it conducive to
us.
We recently had the first
ministers conference was held inSaskatoon.
(17:44):
And I was really hoping that yourpremier would be there because I
was invited to some events wheresome of those people were there.
There were connections.
I was hoping to be able to.
have a few minutes to speak tothem.
Because again, sometimes you needto enlighten them.
You need to make them understandfrom your point of view.
This is not about being a greedydeveloper who wants all these
(18:05):
things.
It's just, it's the reality of the
way it is.
The environment here is not great
for people who want to developcondos.
Yeah.
Can you maybe walk us through the
pre -sale?process then so you guys obviously
you come up with your your designyou acquire the land you propose
it to the city and then you haveto release it in phases and right
you have to meet a certainthreshold of pre -sale within that
(18:26):
one year for phase one and thesame for phase two that's right or
people get an opportunity to walkon the deal but lenders are not
prepared to say well you don'thave enough pre -sales but we'll
waive it and we'll say that youhave your financing confirmed
because you need to have yourfinancing confirmed you the same
for phase two that's right orpeople get an opportunity to walk
on the deal but lenders are notprepared to say well you don't
(18:48):
have enough pre -sales but we'llwaive it and we'll say that you
have your financing confirmedbecause you need to have your
financing confirmed And as withall lenders, they're looking for a
certain pre -sale commitment.
And you think you've got a certain
number, and then all of a sudden,if you fall short by a few, that
date comes up, and now it createsall this uncertainty.
And by the time a developer getsto that point, the amount of money
(19:10):
you've got committed in landvalue...
The cost of getting it todevelopment stage, getting all
your architectural drawings done,and then taking out the building
permit, which triggers thedevelopment cost charges, the
DCCs, it's like a tax.
Very expensive here in Kelowna.
More expensive than I think anyplace, including places in the U
S., that we've encountered.
So there's that huge charge on top
of it all.
So you've got all of that money in
and maybe even quite a few buyersthat want to buy.
(19:32):
But you're left in this limbo ofuncertainty because of the way the
government regulations interactwith what lenders require to make
it possible to build these.
Yeah.
What would be easier solutions forthat?
Would it be like extending thatyear rescission period from a year
to two years?That would help.
Be a big help.
Delaying DCC fees until like
project completion.
That would be a help.
would be a help.
But certainly they've got to look
(19:54):
at having a reasonable length oftime for pre -sales.
I guess they're trying to protectthe buyer.
If you're creating a situation ofuncertainty where they thought
they were going to have a unit andthen other people, maybe their
circumstances have changed.
Now the developer goes, well,
maybe it doesn't make sense to goahead with it.
You're really causing problems forsome buyers.
So I think, you know, people needto look at their future and
decide, should I buy there?And then the developer has to have
a realistic amount of time to getthose pre -sales.
Other jurisdictions do not havethat.
Provincially, I have notencountered it in the U .S.
either.
We built condos in Washington,
California.
I've looked at building condos in
Florida.
We built them in Arizona.
Nowhere have we encountered thosekind of restrictive provisions.
(20:15):
Provincially, perhaps all wellintentioned for buyers but when it
gets to the point where developersdon't want to build that product
anymore because that's one of manythings that are plaguing the
market you've got flipping tax nowas they like to call it which i
should point out there's the two-year hold period so people who
are interested in being aninvestor they should buy pre
-sales because by the time youtake possession those two years
(20:38):
will have passed But still, it'sanother.
It just sounds bad.
And for people that are buying
units that are ready right now,they know they have to hold them
for two years.
People that are investing don't
want restrictions on them, even ifthey thought, well, I probably
want to hold it that long anyway.
They don't like the idea that
they're being told they can't.
The other thing that's problematic
(21:00):
is the vacancy tax.
I have people where I live in
Saskatchewan that have said,Colleen, we buy a condo from you
sight unseen.
They know we have a very well
-known reputation in Saskatchewanas quality builders.
They go, we buy it from you sightunseen.
We love Kelowna.
We love going there.
But we don't want to rent ourunit.
We want to go out.
When we want to go out, we don't
want to have to keep track likewe're living in some.
(21:23):
communist regime like how oftenwe're there we want to come and go
to our vacation home and we don'twant the vacancy tax another
deterrent then there's the federalforeign buyers ban if california
arizona florida texas they alltook that attitude i don't know
what would happen to theireconomies i mean the snowbirds
wouldn't be able to buy any homesdown there There are American
buyers that have said, like, lookhow far our dollar would go in
(21:43):
Canada.
We'd love to go and buy a
condominium tube.
Canada sounds exotic to a lot of
Americans.
We have friends in Washington.
They'd love to have a place uphere.
They ski.
They can't buy.
They're prohibited from buying onemore layer.
So you start loading all theselayers on, and it's like, why do I
(22:03):
do that?I feel like these layers come on
when the market's hot, and we'rein like a...
It was hot for a long time.
But then when the market cools,
it's just like a massive weight totry and get the industry out of
this.
I know.
And yet I'm sure that the premierwants the best for the province.
But I think they need to engagewith developers to really hear
(22:24):
their side of the story andunderstand that they're making it
so it's not conducive to buildcondos in British Columbia.
There's still people trying to doit, but it's tougher in some areas
than others.
Cologne is not a huge market.
So it's not like, you know.
We'll build it and they will come.
You've got to be a little morestrategic as a developer.
And when you're encountering allthose hurdles, most of which were
not in place when we startedbuilding eminence.
(22:46):
When we started this podcast,every week there's a new law.
I know.
I know.
I'll tell you, even some of therealtors, I don't think clearly
understand the way some of thelaws work, like who is actually a
foreign buyer.
And then they have language in the
forums that is difficult.
Like you have to declare that
you're not non -Canadian.
Like it's kind of a double name.
get it but you have to think aboutit for a minute and decide and i
(23:08):
think that it's it's confusing topeople and i'm a believer very
much in a more open market i'm afree enterprise type person i
think people should make their owndecisions honestly like so right
now we're in a bit of a spat withthe u
s and there's a major chance yeahi don't know if you've heard but
(23:28):
uh i've been thinking about this alot obviously there's everyone
else but like there's anopportunity for a major brain
drain from the u s to the canada like so right now
we're in a bit of a spat with theu
s and there's a major chance yeahi don't know if you've heard but
uh i've been thinking about this alot obviously there's everyone
else but like there's anopportunity for a major brain
(23:49):
drain from the u s to the canada And we just have
this stupid foreign buyer's banthat says, come here, but you have
to rent in one of our billionbuildings.
a major You can't buy a vacationhome here.
It's crazy.
And I mean, this spat, trade war,
whatever they want to call it.
You We live in the longest
undefended border in the world,you know, next to the United
States.
We are going to be trading
partners regardless.
(24:09):
We will get it worked out.
I have great confidence that thatwill happen.
And Canadian and American people.
love each other like it's not you
know so we kind of end up beingthe pawns in the game as this
stuff is going on and theamericans are trying to protect
their turf and we're trying toprotect our turf but in the end we
all know the reality is we have towork it out i think it's great if
(24:31):
canada expands you know to othermarkets and finds other markets
that's always a healthy thing todo in any business but we are
going to end up trading with the us that's all there is to it we
live too close to one another andwe're so similar in so many ways
so we will get it worked out butWhy would we want to put
prohibitions up?I hear people say, oh, we don't
(24:52):
feel welcome in the U .S.
anymore.
Not true.
I feel completely welcome in the U
.S.
and I'm happy for any of our U .S.
friends to come to Canada at anytime.
There's narratives created aboutit that serve certain purposes and
that's just not reality.
Yeah, we were in Mexico over the
winter and actually had likeAmericans apologizing for tariffs.
Like, oh, we're so sorry this ishappening.
It's not your fault.
I don't want to support the
(25:12):
government.
I'm definitely not known to be
like, you know, applauding theirefforts.
But I do think some of thesepolicies like have good
intentions.
They have good intentions.
And like media wise, they're greatfor the media.
But if everyone just had theirhead in the sand and was not
hearing about these policies, themarket would be fine.
I know, but they scare people.
That's all they do.
You know, we've spoken to BrendanOgbenson, chief economist, and I
was just at a presentation of hislast week.
He's like the most charismatic.
economist ever he's he's so
awesome but his data on all ofthis like speculation vacancy
foreign buyers like it does notmove the needle at all it is zero
impact Other than this massiveimpact of like our mindset of, oh,
no, what's going to happen now?and scare people.
(25:33):
That's all they do.
I know.
But, you know, we've seen themedia do that before.
And I say it with fondness becauseI've worked in media for many
years.
They have a lot of power and they
have to be careful how they useit.
And sometimes things are notrepresented exactly as they should
be.
Even the whole narrative about it
being a trade war.
I think that was not an
(25:54):
appropriate narrative.
The American government did what
they thought was right for theUnited States.
Maybe they were just sending awake -up call.
If I were in charge, I would havereacted in a completely different
way than they did.
That's me.
I think I would have been moresuccessful reacting in a different
way.
It will work itself out.
There's no point in making badfriends over it.
Actually, as a developer, thething that hurt us the most was
when our country put retaliatorytariffs on.
That's when people really startedto feel it.
We were finishing a hotel.
(26:14):
in BC, and we were doing business
with some American suppliers, itcost us, I don't even want to tell
you how much more, because of thetariffs our government applied for
us bringing in American product.
Yeah.
Kind of on that note, this issomething that is always
interesting to me, but let's saysomewhere in the prairies compared
to somewhere in BC, like cost persquare foot or for the finished
product.
Why is it, I don't want to say
(26:34):
more affordable, but just likemore cost effective elsewhere?
Like BC seems so expensive to docost of business.
Is it land acquisition or likelabor?
Well, your land is more expensivehere.
your land is more expensive here.
Your DCCs for a developer, I mean,
people in retail businesses have adifferent set of rules, but for
developers, those DCCs are brutal.
Timelines are pretty slow here.
It's not easy, as easy to developin BC as it is in a lot of other
(26:57):
jurisdictions.
Codes.
Codes?Yeah.
Well, you know, the codes aregetting, I think, more restrictive
all the time, even thoughSaskatoon are.
City Council has seen fit to takeus to tier two for sustainability
for new homes.
Other cities are not doing that.
I don't think they understand.
It's just shifting more costs to
homeowners.
You've got to be careful when
you're trying to do all thesesustainability things.
Everybody's all in favor of ituntil it affects them.
(27:18):
So in the end, if you have to tellbuyers that this is going to cost
you more, that's just one moredeterrent, right?
And then they kind of blame thedeveloper for it.
Why is this costing that much?Because...
There's code issues orenvironmental compliance or
sustainability compliance issuesthat are costing us more to build
it.
You know, like on Taylor's point,
you see a house like in Texas.
I don't know.
You're reading my mind.
I don't know about Saskatchewan.
But Texas, you see like thismansion.
(27:38):
I forget how much acres it's on,but it's like a six bedroom, just
a massive house.
And it's like 600 ,000.
I know.
know.
I saw that a lot in NorthCarolina.
It was crazy.
I saw I went there and I looked in
their home magazine.
went there and I looked in their
home magazine.
These beautiful homes for sale for
like a fraction of what we'd payin Canada.
Part of it is labor.
(27:58):
Part of it, I think the labor is
less down there.
The taxes are not as bad in a lot
of places in the U .S.
California is another tough one to
build in.
California and B .C.
have a lot in common.
Majority of people get their way.
But the reality is when you lookon the map, they represent just a
very slender sector of that.
province or state but they're the
(28:18):
vocal ones that seem to get theirway and they're the ones that have
all the votes in their regions butthey both created environments
that are very difficult to dobusiness in both california and
british columbia have a lot incommon in that they are so
beautiful they should haveeverything going for them in the
world and they don't because oflaws messing things up to the
regulation yeah you know it'sfunny like i do have some clients
(28:40):
that bring up the same point we'retalking about it's like well why
would the market not equal outlike why should bc not come down
in a home price and i think it'skind of a compounding issue right
because if it is cost of labor youknow that cost of labor they have
to live here and it's expensive tolive here it's expensive to buy
that home that they're building solike we have to pay them to be
(29:04):
able to afford to live here so idon't see it the regulation yeah
you know it's funny like i do havesome clients that bring up the
same point we're talking aboutit's like well why would the
market not equal out like whyshould bc not come down in a home
price and i think it's kind of acompounding issue right because if
it is cost of labor you know thatcost of labor they have to live
(29:25):
here and it's expensive to livehere it's expensive to buy that
home that they're building so likewe have to pay them to be able to
afford to live here so i don't seeit ever coming down, like the cost
to build.
No, I don't think so.
It's also like, you know, you'recomparing California and Kelowna
and Lake Como, like, like No, Idon't think so.
It's you know, they're expensiveplaces because they're beautiful.
(29:46):
They are.
They are.
But if I'm running the province,I'm going to want to encourage,
you know, development in theprovince.
And I think, you know, there'ssome people here too that are
maybe not so interested in having.
It developed, but it will get
developed.
I mean, it's progress.
It's what happens, right?And you do want to develop in a
responsible and sustainable way.
But again, there's a balance.
code and regulatory requirementsstart imposing a ton of costs, it
ends up shifting to the buyer inthe end and puts housing out of
(30:09):
reach.
So the dream of owning a home
becomes more difficult, you know,for people.
But it's well insulated.
Yeah, it's well insulated.
That's right.
It's well insulated.
Cold.
Yeah, it's well insulated.
That's right.
It's Cold, yeah.
No, I agree totally.
And I just, when we're talking
about affordability is like thename of the game seems the last
few years.
And then you just look at the code
and just adding more and more.
Do they realize they're doing that
(30:31):
or?Maybe we just need to sit down and
have a face -to -face conversationwith stakeholders and government
people making the rules so thatthey understand how in the end
it's affecting the buyer and notallowing them to buy.
It's going to get worse.
That's why I say now is a great
time to actually buy beforeeverybody realizes this shift is
going to happen.
People are going to go, okay, we
feel things are starting tostabilize.
(30:52):
We're starting to buy.
We can feel it shifting now.
But when that happens, There's nota lot of condos out there.
That will drive the prices ofwhat's available out, supply and
demand, right?It is the supply and demand.
Yeah, that's right.
Right now, there is some
saturation.
There are some good deals to buy.
But if no one's starting any newprojects in three years from now,
there's not going to be a lot ofsupply.
So if I were an investor, supply.
So if I were an investor, I'm
going to go into a condo projectthat's being sold now at prices
now that's going to be ready in acouple of years.
I don't have to close for two, twoand a half years.
I'm going to buy it now, lock inthat price.
And in two and a half years,there's not going to be a lot of
other stuff because we know what'sgoing on in the market.
Supply and demand is going to beworth more money.
So to build on that a bit, buildon that a bit, like I totally
agree.
So you have the prices, like
Taylor just said, the price ofbill is not going to go down.
(31:12):
Like the labor's not going down,the materials are not going down.
Land prices might come down, butthey're not going to come down a
lot.
Maybe like a correction of 10 % or
something, which is not going tochange the price.
So the only way these condos aregoing to get built in the future
is when the market, appreciates tothe point where it can make sense
for the developer again that'sright so you're basically buying
(31:32):
on the low end of where it's goingto go that's right so i think an
investor came in and say boughtfive units in a condo building now
pre -sales knows that he's notgoing to have to come up with that
money for two and a half yearsthen those two years for the
flipping tax are gone he'sprobably got or he or she probably
has a great deal where then theycan sell it and make some money
(31:54):
right so i think an investor camein and say bought five units in a
condo building now pre -salesknows that he's not going to have
to come up with that money for twoand a half years then those two
years for the flipping tax aregone he's probably got or he or
she probably has a great dealwhere then they can sell it and
make some money right away becausethere's just not going to be any
product around and people arestill going to want condos and the
(32:17):
pricing will have gone up so if adeveloper starts to build one then
price is going to be that muchhigher it's interesting too for
eminence because all the othercondo buildings in town seem to be
completing in the next two to sixmonths right so like you're
probably one of the few that areon the docket for the next two or
three years that's right yeah andinteresting too for eminence
(32:38):
because all the other condobuildings in town seem to be
completing in the next two to sixmonths right so like you're
probably one of the few that areon the docket for the next two or
three years that's right yeah andIt's a beautiful project.
We hope everyone comes to see it.
It really is.
And we take a lot of pride in whatwe build and we take pride in
meeting our buyers.
We've had a couple of buyer
(32:59):
appreciation nights where we'vemet our phase one and some of our
phase two buyers already.
And it's great.
Like we like to know those peoplebecause like I said, they are
actually the inspiration for whatwe want to build.
The land, the community andknowing.
who they are and what we can buildfor them.
And you're going to be having acondo in there too.
everyone comes to see it.
in there too.
I am.
am. So I'm going to be there.
They're going to know where I am.
There's any deficiencies.
You know, and I stay at ourfriend's hotel when we're here.
(33:19):
It was a great hotel.
We built it for them.
Yeah.
And we stay there, but it'll be
nice to get moved in there and tobe more a part of the community.
And have a chance to kind of livethe life that we've imagined for
our buyers.
Like I love coming out here and,
you know, being able to hike upthe trails.
My cats, I don't know if they'regoing to cooperate as well, but
I'm always up for a dog.
I would say to my husband, your
son, Beau, wants a dog.
(33:40):
That's one of our cats.
He loves dogs.
So I need to get a little dog and
a big dog, little dog, any dog atall will do, you know, and spend
some time on the trails, eitherthat or teach Finn and Beau to
lead better.
am. So I'm going to be there.
They're going to know where I am.
There's any Yeah.
What a cool situation.
Especially when being a developer
in a hotel, you get to stay in allthese places that you built over
(34:00):
the years.
Oh, yeah.
It was crazy.
The other night I stayed, last
weekend I was out in Chilliwackfor our new hotel.
I was the first person to sleep inthe hotel.
My husband was in... the roomalready sawing a log.
I was the first person to sleep inthe hotel.
And I got up 2 .30 in the morningand just walked around the halls.
And I took a little video and Iput it on social media.
And I said, this is the weirdestfeeling ever.
We're the only people in thehotel.
He's sound asleep.
I'm roaming the hallways at two o
'clock.
It didn't feel at all like The
Shining.
Just so you know, it felt really
good.
But I actually locked the gate on
the construction site that nightmyself and locked the front door
of the hotel.
Very strange.
Just so you know, it felt Yeah, itis neat.
I know when we opened our hotel inVancouver to be sleeping in there
(34:23):
the first night we got occupancyand just our internal staff were
in there that night.
But it's a neat feeling.
So what hotel did you build inKelowna?
So what hotel did you build inKelowna?
In Kelowna, Kelowna, we built theHoliday Inn Express.
We don't own it.
Our partners pay our hotels that
we're partners with in otherhotels.
They convinced us to build thathotel for them.
So we stay there and I have alittle favorite restaurant in
there.
I'll give them a little plug
there.
It's great.
kind of close this out before weget into our wrap -up questions
for for phase two of eminencewhere are you guys at in the pre
-sales like have you met yourthreshold no we haven't met it yet
but we're working on it we've gotactually five sales right now in
(34:44):
progress like i said things arestarting to pick up so we're
hoping that we will you know meetthat threshold and get there we're
committed we want to get this donei would imagine that as a
developer you basically we haven'tmet it yet but we're working on it
we've got actually five salesright now in progress like i said
things are starting to pick up sowe're hoping that we will you know
meet that threshold and get therewe're committed we want to get
this done i would imagine thatwould imagine that as a developer
you basically not sell at adiscount but sell aggressively to
(35:06):
meet that threshold and then afterwe're exactly right so all the
more reason this is the time tobuy you don't have to come up with
the money for quite a whilebecause it's a waste down the road
till it's going to be done and bythen you won't have a flipping tax
issue you'll have owned it forwell not owned it but you'll have
been under contract for more thantwo years what percentage do you
have to meet you know it dependson the lender typically you can
(35:28):
expect 50 percent is prettytypical some of the lenders are a
little more exactly right so allthe more reason this is the time
to buy you don't have to come upwith the money for quite a while
because it's a waste down the roadtill it's going to be done and by
then you won't have a flipping taxissue you'll have owned it for
well not owned it but you'll havebeen under contract for more than
two years what percentage do youhave to meet you know it depends
on the lender typically you canexpect 50 percent is pretty
typical some of the lenders are alittle more lenient it just
(35:50):
depends depends how much equityyou're going to put in as well as
a builder but remember how muchyou've already got in by the time
you buy the land pay for yourarchitectural drawings building
permit everything's got to be donefor that that process and pay your
dccs you're in deep so that's whyit's kind of hard to turn the ship
around after that's why we'rewe're in it and we're going
forward but i very much believe inthe project the more i come out
and i see it looking so good whereit is and our buyers coming over
(36:12):
and really enthused at what theysee the reaction we're getting
from people who are interested inbuying now despite all this
background noise of what's goingon in the economy and everything i
think We will come to agreementswith our partners to the south of
the border, our trade partners,and it'll be good.
And in the interim, if we expandour market more, explore Canada a
little bit more, that's all a goodthing too.
(36:33):
So it's all going to be okay.
But it's created this great
opportunity to buy.
So I've got some great units still
left in phase one that people canmove into right away and some
wonderful units in phase two.
And, you know, there's even in
terms of condos, if people arelooking for the cheapest thing on
the market, That won't be us, butwe're not giving you the cheapest
finishes either.
I think we're the best value in
the market.
There's multi -million dollar
condos you can buy, but noteverybody wants to spend that kind
(36:54):
of money on a home.
So I think we did a demographic of
a lot of people, like I said,young professionals.
We have some single people thathave bought in there, younger
single people, older singlepeople.
It's a very mixed group of people,but they're all people that I
think have discerning taste.
They're not out looking for the
cheapest thing.
but they're looking for value.
And that's what we want to deliveris really good value.
I've never built the cheapestthing, but I've always wanted to
know that they're getting morethan they expected.
And that's been the reaction we'vegotten from people that have seen
that when we opened our salesunit, we were over on St. Paul
Street for a while.
Then we opened our sales center
and model on site.
And that's the reaction we have
from people.
And that's what I want them to
(37:16):
feel.
We've taken the time and the care
and I've put some of the bestpeople out there.
I've got a terrific crew makingsure that all the details are
taken care of.
Well, we can't wait to come out.
Yeah, I hope you guys can come outand see it.
I've been there a few times, butnot.
Bring your clients and you get themortgages in place for them.
We'll dive into our wrap -upquestions if that's okay with you.
I hope you guys We'll dive intoour wrap -up questions if that's
(37:37):
okay with you.
I mean, this one seems obvious,
but maybe it's not.
If you could buy one property in
the Okanagan in the next 12months, what would it be?
Would it include mine?okay with it include mine?
Yeah, yeah.
You know what?
I would love to and will have acondominium in our project, even
at the end when all is said anddone and it's built.
I'd love to have one out here.
I love coming out to Kelowna.
But if I took that off of thetable, maybe I'd... want a winery
but you know what they say aboutwineries what do you call a
billionaire after they buy awinery a millionaire a millionaire
well i'm no billionaire so i can'trisk that kind of downgrade but i
think it would be a wonderful ideato buy a wine i have family that
got in the wine business here manyyears ago and i I'd like to be
able to spend more time out hereto explore some of that myself
because I know that it's so great.
(37:59):
I just love going down around the
waterfront by King Taps and CactusClub and some of those restaurants
there.
It's beautiful.
you know what they say downgradebut wine i And we found some other
great places to eat and thewineries have wonderful food.
Yeah, yeah.
And you've got some nice
microbreweries here as well.
And you've got some nice
microbreweries here as well.
Yeah, that's how I convinced my
wife Emily.
Like we were relocating back from
(38:20):
overseas to Kelowna and I waslike, you know, we could like live
on a vineyard if we moved toKelowna.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I got to plant a couple grapes inthe backyard.
I got to plant a couple grapes inthe backyard.
That's funny.
funny.
All right, Colleen, if you couldgive your 20 -year -old self any
advice, what would it be?Expect the unexpected.
I've been through it in spades.
You hear people say that, but it
is the reality.
Always hope for the best, but
(38:41):
always have a bit of a rainy daybackup plan because things can
happen that you're not expecting.
And always be in a business that
you're passionate about becauseeven when you're passionate about
it, some days will feel like work,but at least you're working in an
area that you really like.
So for anybody out there, whatever
it is they're passionate about,that's what they need to pursue.
And then they need to figure outhow to make their passion into
(39:04):
their business.
BMO has asked me to speak at their
celebrating women event for womenin business.
And I said, well, what do you wantme to talk about?
Just talk about your career, theysaid, and what inspires you.
And the truth is I've taken allthe things I enjoyed in life and
turned it into business somehow.
Like I love design.
I love.
building things even when I was a
(39:25):
little girl I loved looking atarchitecture but I also loved
animals so all our buildings arepet friendly and I've combined a
lot of things that I like to dothe things that I enjoy I've had
young people come to me and say Iwant to be an entrepreneur how do
I do that well the first thing iswhat are you passionate about you
don't just become an entrepreneurto sell widgets.
You got to want to sell thosewidgets.
(39:45):
You have to have a passion.
Like we never sell a condo that I
would not live in myself.
I don't build an apartment to rent
somebody that I would not live inmyself.
I can't do that.
I don't build boxes.
My partner and I didn't, myhusband and I don't, because I
wouldn't be inspired living in abox.
So do something, whatever it is,whatever, you know, inspires you
do that, pursue that as abusiness, follow your heart
because you've got to find a wayto pay the bills.
So you, Got to find a way to makewhat you love into a business that
(40:07):
can sustain you.
Good answer.
That is a good answer.
What's your favorite charity or
how do you get back?Well, I probably alluded to it.
I do a lot for animals.
My girlfriend and I ran an event
pre -COVID for 15 years calledPets in the Park.
We raised hundreds of thousands ofdollars for homeless animals.
I like to do a lot of work withthat.
My husband and I contribute tomedical matters where someone in
our family has been touched.
by something that matters to me.
(40:29):
And I enjoy the arts as well.
So we've done things to support
the arts, but I have to saychildren and animals are probably
my weakness.
My husband likes a lot of things
related to kids' sport.
My There's no kid that ever calls
him that needs some help withsomething that he says no to.
I probably shouldn't say thatpublicly, but he does, you know.
But we're people that kind of liketo see more tangibly what our
efforts have done, even with theanimals.
(40:51):
I love it when people come backand tell me stories of how
something that we did or gave tothem helped them with their
animals.
Even all my years, 25 years in
television, while I was doing thisat the same time, people still
come to me on the street and say,you know, Colleen, remember how
you did your segment to adoptanimals for the rescue
organization?I adopted that dog from you years
ago or that cat and that likechanged my life and it was like
the best thing that happened tome.
I love those stories.
Awesome.
Yeah.
(41:11):
That is awesome.
So Eminence is pet friendly, ofcourse.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
No, that's great.
All right.
How can Taylor or I or ourlistener get back to you?
How can we help you?Well, we'd love for all of you,
you two guys included, to come outto our sales center and see our
show home at Eminence.
Please come out.
It doesn't mean you have to buysomething.
Just please come out and see it.
Maybe you know someone who would
(41:32):
like to buy there.
We want to be part of your
community.
Go to our website, eminenceliving
.ca.
Our sales center is open five days
a week.
Spread the word.
Come see us.
If you see me on the street, stop
me.
People who knew me from TV often
do.
So just come up and introduce
yourself.
I'm always happy to talk to people
and watch social media.
We're going to share some social
(41:53):
media.
You guys are way younger than me.
So this social media thing isstill something I'm... need people
to help me to understand, but I doknow that it works.
Don't worry.
worry.
We're not good at social media.
You have people who do that,
right?You have Nikki and I have Nikki.
We have different Nikki.
Awesome.
people who Nikki.
Awesome.
Well, thank you so much for comingon today.
(42:13):
It's been a pleasure.
Enjoy your stay out here until
your condo is finished.
We always look forward to our
trips out to Kelowna and they willbe more frequent going forward.
condo is finished.
We always look forward to our
trips out to Kelowna and they willbe more frequent going forward.
And yeah, and then I'll be outthere with all of our buyers as
well.
Awesome.
Thank you very much.
Thanks so much.
All right, welcome back to theColonial Real Estate Podcast.
(00:01):
I'm your mortgage broker host,Taylor Atkinson.
And I'm your real estate agenthost, host, Matt Glenn.
What's shaking today, Taylor?You know, I got spoiled this
weekend.
Happy Father's Day to you, Matt.
Yes, you too.
Yeah, it was good.
Yeah, we just hung out, you know,had some brunch, went on the boat,
played pickleball, softball, justall the dad stuff.
Yeah, it was a great weekend.
You know what, like summer's here.
And I know last summer we werekind of talking about like...
(00:23):
Tourism's down and businesses aresuffering, but I feel like some
really great entrepreneurs in ourcircle, you know, one of them,
Dina Steele, who runs Keys toKelowna, just pivots so well, like
looks at regulations.
It's, you know, coming down
provincially, federally.
And it's like, hey, I may not like
have the best business right now.
And like Airbnb models, boom,
opens up a wicked coffee shop,wicked location.
(00:44):
Yeah.
On Lakeshore.
Like if you haven't been there,check it out.
Right across the street from GyroBeach.
Yeah.
Yeah.
She is just like a top likeperformer, you know, like
everything she does is likeincredible.
So yeah, we've been there a fewtimes now and you'll see her
walking around the blocks,checking out her places at Caban
and Aqua and then running forcoffee.
(01:04):
So yeah, shout out to Dina.
Just wicked job.
Awesome.
Awesome to see.
Yeah.
Summer's here.
We're just enjoying the localcommunity.
stuff.
I think this summer is going to be
a little bit more up.
Right.
Like more than last year.
I think this is going to be a good
summer for Kelowna.
Yeah.
And there's a few new businessespopping up and some existing ones
seem to be doing well and justlike, yeah, just pivoting.
So love to see it.
Yeah.
(01:24):
I like it.
Yeah.
Me too.
This episode too was also a ton of
fun to record.
of fun to record.
Yeah.
I mean, I probably speak for you
as well.
I love speaking to developers.
It's kind of like some of myfavorite shows we've had.
You get like.
pull back the curtains a little
bit.
So today we have on Colleen
Wilson.
She's the co -founder, president,
CEO of Meridian Development.
Started out as a lawyer, but she
was also on TV for like 25 years.
(01:46):
And it comes through on the
podcast.
She should be hosting the show.
Yeah, honestly.
Yeah, she was great.
So we did have a previous podcastwith the Meridian Group.
They're developing on KnoxMountain.
So Eminence, if you haven't.
listen to that podcast, go back
and re -listen to that one, butyou can go and check out their
sales center.
(02:06):
Phase one is, I think, mostly sold
out now.
There's still a couple of units
left, she said.
Phase two is open for sales.
Yeah, really cool project right onKnox.
So go check it out.
check it out.
It is a cool project to check out,no doubt.
It is built right on Knox, closeto town.
check it Beautiful building.
More coming.
The amenities aren't even thereyet and they're going to be nice
too.
Yeah.
Like something she said was theywere building like pathways in
collaboration with the city intoKnox as well.
(02:28):
Yeah.
she said was they were building
like pathways in collaborationwith the city into Knox as well.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I didn't know that.
That's pretty cool.
Yeah.
More walking trails.
If you're a dog person, petfriendly.
Or a hike person.
Yeah.
Or a bike.
Anything.
Anything Knox.
This is where you want to be.
Yeah.
That's funny.
You know, when I was in my roadbike phase, I rode my road bike up
to top of Knox right to the top.
And it kind of cruised through
Magic Estates at the top.
(02:49):
And it came down Clifton, right
past Eminence.
And I had a Speedo on my bike, and
I hit 90k an hour coming down.
And it Really?
Yeah.
That's the fastest I've ever been.
And it was terrifying.
Yeah.
That's funny.
When were you in a road bike
phase?I didn't know this.
know this.
I still am a bit, but not as much.
Yeah, a few years ago, I had got abike and ripped on it.
(03:12):
But yeah, so I was all proud ofmyself for going up Knox, which is
a feat in its own.
And then you get to the top and
then you just rip down Clifton andholy shit.
That was, yeah, it was awesome.
Yeah.
So every time I drive up Cliftonor go see Eminence.
I always think about that.
I mean, yeah, I've been biking a
lot too.
Mostly hauling the kids to daycare
and back in the trailer.
Oh, what?
(03:32):
That sounds awesome.
It is.
Yeah.
It's a quick like 5K there, 5K
back.
But yeah, everyone enjoy the show
and enjoy summer.
Get out and support some
businesses.
Absolutely.
And this episode, like everyepisode, sponsored by Century 21
Insurance Realty, best brokeragein town.
We're a real estate office,residential.
We do commercial real estate.
We have property management.
Basically, if it's real estaterelated, we do it.
Reach out.
If you are a person looking to buy
(03:54):
or sell, commercial, lease, callit for the agent.
Or if you're an agent looking tomake a switch, we're the brokerage
for you.
Yeah, it's a great place.
I love being there.
It's my spot.
I love telling people about it.
Enjoy the show.
Okay, Colleen Wilson, thanks forjoining us.
Pleasure to be here.
Pleasure to be here.
So how we like to just start ourshow connecting you with our
(04:15):
listeners is just what's yourperfect Friday look like?
What do you do?Well, you know, the old thank
goodness it's Friday.
I think we all feel that to some
degree.
I like to go into Friday thinking
I'm going to wrap up a lot ofloose ends from the week.
Sometimes that happens.
Sometimes it doesn't.
But in a perfect Friday, that'swhat would happen.
A lot of things I knew from thebeginning of the week that needed
to get dealt with would feel likethey were.
(04:36):
reasonably well dealt with, notthat I wouldn't be working on the
weekend, but I can work with aclearer conscience, a clearer mind
that those things have been dealtwith.
So that feels like a good Fridayto me.
I still, like I said, workSaturday and Sunday, but I like to
know that I cleared off my platewhat I intended to get cleared off
by Friday.
Nice.
And where are you geographicallylocated?
I'm born and raised in Saskatoon,Saskatchewan.
I'm a Western Canadian prairiegirl.
I've been fortunate to travel alot and I have a home in the U .S.
(04:58):
as well.
But that is my home.
That will always be my home.
And we keep our head office there.
But my husband and I, our companyhas operations in the United
States.
We have American companies.
We pay our American taxes andeverything down there.
And the extra tax we sometimeshave to pay in Canada.
That's a whole other conversation.
But we do business a lot of
places.
But we're really ingrained in
our... community there and i lovesaskatoon and so that's still home
(05:20):
to me yeah well obviously you lovecolonna as well because you're i
love colonna here today in thestudio and we're talking about
eminence i have a bit of a historyhere because i have my dad's
family a lot of them are in bc andi have cousins here in colonna so
i started coming to colonna when iwas a little girl and i have
wonderful memories of coming hereso the thought of developing here
(05:42):
is great my husband and i havedone some commercial development
here as well so i love colonna andwell obviously you love colonna as
well because you're i i lovecolonna here today in the studio
and we're talking about eminencehave a bit of a history here
because i have my dad's family alot of them are in bc and i have
cousins here in colonna so istarted coming to colonna when i
was a little girl and i havewonderful memories of coming here
so the thought of developing hereis great my husband and i have
done some commercial developmenthere as well so i love colonna and
Everybody in my company, when theyget a chance to come to Kelowna,
it's like, I think I need to go toKelowna calling.
Yeah, I need to come on this trip.
So we all love it here.
So is that why you chose Kelownaas a place to develop?
My late business partner lovedKelowna.
late business partner lovedKelowna.
I think it was one of his dreamlocations.
He like got in Beverly Hills.
And I mean, I it is a beautiful
(06:03):
place to come and it's part ofCanada, which makes it easy.
And we kind of have a motto, andthis goes back to my husband and
I, we don't really want to engagein any work in places that we
don't enjoy.
going so it's probably no
coincidence that the places wherewe develop property whether it's
here in the united states areplaces that we like because we
assume other people will like themtoo and so that was part of the
impetus for coming to cologne andwe thought there was a lot of
(06:24):
potential here as well yeah and wewill highlight like yeah we did
record an episode with carl yourlate business partner awesome
episode we just loved speakingwith him so much like the energy
he had was amazing and the way hetalked about eminence too was and
we will highlight like yeah we didrecord an episode with carl your
late business partner awesomeepisode we just loved speaking
with him so much like the energyhe had was amazing and the way he
(06:45):
talked about eminence too wasYeah, I was very passionate about
it.
I find that's what's so important
about pre -sales is to learn thedeveloper, which it's really hard
to do when these big projects goup.
So I feel that's why like thepodcasts are so nice.
But yeah, you're obviouslycarrying on the project.
And yeah, do you just want to kindof highlight?
But Sure.
Well, I think something that we
always believed in was before wedid a project, we always wanted to
put our head in the space of theperson that we thought would be
our target market to see if wewere them, what we would want.
We did it when we built studentresidences.
the university we did it withevery condo project and even our
(07:05):
recent apartment projects thatwe've done we give people resort
style living because we think ifwe were in an apartment that's
what we'd want so we always dothat so we try to imagine who our
end buyer will be who's going tobe living there and what they want
so we become very inspired by whowe're building for and also where
we're building and everything webuild we try to make it fit with
that part of the community so witheminence we're on the side of knox
(07:26):
mountain regional park beautifularea we think is a super special
location.
It was not an easy project to get
approved and developed because ofhow special the location is,
because you've got that feelingthat you're in, you know, the
Pacific Northwest, which beingfrom Saskatchewan, we want to feel
that when we're here, right?The feeling of the mountains and
the trails and that lifestyle, butwe want to be close to the
vibrancy of downtown and we'relike a six minute drive.
from eminence to downtown.
(07:47):
So we get the best of both worlds.
So we also wanted to be cognizantthough of something that would
blend with the architecture of themountains and would look good
there rather than maybe justsomething that was a box.
Yeah.
Like when I envision Knox, I'm
thinking hiking trails, dogs.
You've got it.
We're always pet friendly.
You've got it.
We're always pet friendly.
(08:08):
So every building has a beautiful
view terrace on the top of thebuilding that all of the residents
of that building can use andenjoy.
Part of phase three, there will bea clubhouse built with a pool, a
fitness center, some kind offacilities for outdoor dining and
indoor self -serve bar area, youknow, beautiful pool and spa.
So it's going to have that resortfeel.
And we've developed that conceptinitially.
tread into that with our apartmentbuildings where we have resort
(08:30):
style living and people reallylike it we're of course taking it
up a notch with condominiums wherethere's pride of ownership so that
comes with phase three so we'rejust completing phase one now but
even each building has thisbeautiful terrace and the views
from that terrace are breathtakingso i can already picture it i can
hardly wait to get a unit there soi don't have to stay in the hotel
(08:50):
i'll have a home at eminence wheni come out and sitting up on the
terrace with friends and neighborsand enjoying a glass of okanagan
wine yeah i'm gonna try some ofthose wines or a cup of coffee you
know i'm a chai tea latte drinkerup on the terrace because the
views are spectacular and whencarl and i first walked on that
property we went wow like you knowwe were kind of trying to envision
(09:13):
climbing up and i had high heelson up the side of the mountain a
little bit to see what it would belike like we're going to have
views from here out over thevalley and to the mountains around
and from the back you knowLiterally, the mountain is in your
backyard.
So the hiking trails are there.
You mentioned about dogs, Taylor.
We're all animal people at
Meridian and at Eminence.
So it's all pet friendly.
And what a great way to, you know.
(09:35):
kind of enjoy some time with your
dog going up the trails.
Yeah.
And this is built like right intothe side of Knoxville.
It is.
is. When you're on the back, like
the mountain is there, you willsee wildlife come by.
We've seen some deer and you areliving in the Pacific Northwest
right there.
And at the top of that mountain is
Lake Kathleen.
And it's a lovely hike, you know,
up the mountain.
(09:56):
And as part of our commitment to
the community, we're building somehiking trails, one with each phase
to augment the trail system that'salready there.
So it's great for the wholecommunity.
But for people who like mountainbiking and that, you can keep your
bike there, just ride up thetrail.
So you look out the back, you'vegot the Pacific Northwest.
You look to the front, you've gotthe Okanagan Valley and a six
-minute drive to downtown.
(10:16):
And a six -minute drive to
downtown, it's an easy drive.
It's a really easy drive.
It's a really easy drive.
Kelowna is...
You know, a great place to go.
I enjoy going down to the marina.
And, you know, I've heard itdescribed.
This isn't me saying it.
I've heard people say Kelowna is
the Lake Como of Canada.
And it is.
I mean, we don't have Europeanarchitecture here, but it has that
charm and that feel that LakeComo, Italy has.
(10:39):
Definitely has that.
And I think it makes it super
unique.
I mean, the lake, all the water
activities in the summer.
And then in the winter, you've got
all these world -class ski resortsand year -round wineries.
fabulous wineries here when isoccupancy for phase one it's
pretty soon it's happening overthe summer people will be taking
up residency in their unit summitwe call it as phase one of
eminence this summer so we'llstart moving people in in july and
(11:00):
then gradually not everybody'sgoing to move in the same day in
july we'll have that in an orderlyway but they will move in over the
course of the summer i've movedpeople into apartments too many at
one time i know we don't do thatwe just want to orderly everyone
to get in and get settled in iimagine as a developer this has to
be like is occupancy for phase oneit's pretty soon it's happening
over the summer people will betaking up residency in their unit
(11:23):
summit we call it as phase one ofeminence this summer so we'll
start moving people in in july andthen gradually not everybody's
going to move in the same day injuly we'll have that in an orderly
way but they will move in over thecourse of the summer i've moved
people into apartments too many atone time i know we don't do that
we just want to orderly everyoneto get in and get settled in i
(11:45):
imagine as a developer this has tobe like I mean, outside acquiring
the land and kind of getting thevision for it, this has to be the
most exciting part, like seeing itcome together.
It is.
And, you know, it's so rewarding,
even years later, when you find agreat fit for people.
Because I was just in the storerecently in Saskatoon.
A lady came up to me, introducedherself.
And she said, you won't rememberme.
I thought, oh, you know, because Itold you I worked a long time in
TV.
And I thought.
Did I meet her somewhere along theline in TV?
She said, no, I was one of yourbuyers in the first condo project
that you and your partner did inSaskatoon years ago.
And she said, I just wanted totell you, I just love living
there.
And she sold her unit at one
point.
Somebody talked her into buying
something else.
So unhappy.
She got rid of that and boughtback into this.
place she'd originally been andshe said you know I just wanted to
tell you it changed my life it waswonderful another girlfriend of
mine bought into our luxury condoin Saskatoon she said moving there
actually changed her life and sothat's what we want we want to
(12:08):
enhance people's lifestyle wedon't just build buildings We
create the envelope for you tohave a terrific lifestyle.
We're a lifestyle company, really.
Nice.
Yeah.
That's pretty cool.
pretty We build your lifestyle foryou.
Cool.
Yeah.
So I guess at this point, like ifpeople are interested, are you
going to have showroom up therenow?
We do.
We do.
We have our presentation centersopen and we have a model in
addition to the presentationcenter.
So people can go in, get a look atthe finishes.
People are telling us they...
(12:28):
really love the way our show home
is looking and they're free to goup we're open five days a week we
have people up there i can't gothrough the hours right now but go
to our website eminenceliving ca and you will see that and we've
got josh and chris and karina upthere and they'd be happy to
welcome people and give them atour if you're a little interested
or a lot interested we're happy tosee you and just show you what
(12:49):
we're what we're doing And soavailability in phase two and
phase three, I guess, when arethose going to be coming?
So I still have a few select unitsavailable in phase one that are
beautiful units.
to be coming?
So I still have a few select unitsavailable in phase one that are
beautiful units.
We are selling now in phase two,
not in phase three yet.
The market has shifted just
(13:11):
recently.
We've got a lot of sales activity
going on.
A lot of people coming to us both
on phase one, but also on phasetwo.
So for people who are looking forsomething right away, phase one,
for people who.
are thinking, you know, a move
down the road a little bit.
This is the reality.
This is not a developer speaking.
This is just the truth.
Construction costs are going up.
That was even before tariffs.
They're just going up.
(13:31):
It's a reality.
We've got our phase two pricedown.
We've been holding the prices.
The reality is I can't really
justify building it for what I'mselling it for now.
So at some point, those prices aregoing to go up.
now is the time to get in when youbuy in pre -sales is always when
you get the best deal because thedeveloper knows you've got to hang
in there till it gets built and soyou're getting the advantage not
(13:53):
only of pricing but you also getthe advantage that you can semi
-customize at eminence at thattime once the units are built and
done you can walk in and see itbut it is what it is people can
now go and pick out their colorscheme we've also got a few
options they can select from anoptions list or a few sort of
different features in phase two sothey have the ability to really
put their own stamp on it still atthis point so great time to buy
and like what happens is thedeveloper's margin shrinks even if
(14:15):
you put the prices up a bitbecause our construction costs are
going up more so Great time forpeople to buy in phase two.
Now we can feel people gettingmore excited again.
Have you had first -timehomebuyers reach out since the GST
rebate?you had first -time homebuyers
reach out since the GST rebate?We've had some questions asked,
some questions asked, but a lot ofpeople seem a little confused as
(14:36):
to how it works.
Our sales team can certainly walk
people through that.
I think some people were hoping it
applied to every new home, butit's for first -time homebuyers.
Yes, we've talked about that.
we've talked I think people would
have loved it if it had been morebroadly extended.
I think developers would haveloved it, especially because We
love BC, but the environment forbuilding condominiums in BC is not
conducive to encouragingdevelopers to build here.
(14:56):
It's the cranes like we talkedabout that you see in the air
around Kelowna, they're forapartments.
I think we're going to feel thisbecause like, and this is being
built, there's a couple othercondo buildings that are in
construction near completion, butthere's like no new ones coming.
That's right.
People, they've been kind of
sitting and waiting and somepeople want a single family home.
Some people want a rentalapartment for their main home.
But there's a whole broad range ofpeople that love condominium
(15:18):
living.
It's lock and leave.
So young professionals like it.
People that are empty nesters like
it.
Some of them go to Arizona,
California, Florida, Texas for thefew months in the winter.
They like it.
The odd times see a family, you
know, we'll take a condo and astack unit.
It's not done as much here, but inbig cities, you see that all the
time.
Not just townhouse families being
attracted to townhomes.
They also buy in development that
are.
like more the apartment style,
like stacked units.
(15:38):
So there's a lot of people that
really want condos.
And right now that product,
developers are not interested inbuilding it.
I'm not sure if your provincialgovernment is aware.
It would be great if they wouldmaybe engage with some developers,
find out why they're not beingbuilt.
They say they want more housingbuilt.
Then you've got to make sureyou're covering all the bases, not
just single family homes and notjust apartments.
(16:00):
There's going to be a lot ofapartments here in Kelowna.
Not everybody wants to live in anapartment.
Yeah, I mean, maybe you want totouch on this a little bit.
As a developer, and the few thatwe've spoken to, it seems like BC
is really putting handcuffs on youguys.
Financially, is it really worthit?
It seems almost more of a passionproject to be like, hey, we'd love
to be in Kelowna and buildsomething.
But does it make sense anymore tobuild here?
(16:21):
It doesn't.
It's going to create a void in the
market where there is no productlike that.
I'm still going to be therebecause I'm trying to forge ahead
here, but I really wish thegovernment would take a serious
look at how developers rely onlenders, how that works when you
have to tie that into how Redma,the Real Estate Marketing
Development Act works, and how youhave to have all your pre -sales
(16:42):
done within a year.
Or there's an opportunity for your
buyers that are now supposedlycommitted buyers to rescind their
contracts.
It creates a whole feeling of
uncertainty.
It's not realistic to think that's
going to happen in a year.
And while it's great to have
offered buyer protections, I don'tknow that in the end that's
helping buyers have certaintyeither.
Because a developer may justdecide, you know what, this isn't
(17:03):
making sense.
I'm not going to do it.
And that's what a lot ofdevelopers have done.
And they've put other... projects,condo projects on hold, some of
them have abandoned themaltogether.
But like I said, we're there,we're committed to seeing this
done.
And so I think at a certain point,
people are going to go, Oh, mygoodness, we want a condo.
And there's not a lot ofselection.
But I think the government reallyneeds to jump on that and have a
(17:24):
look.
And you know, sometimes when
people are working in government,they're busy, there's maybe a bit
of a disconnect between them andwhat's really going on, I think
would be really worthwhile foryour premier, his key ministers to
sit down and talk to developerswho are investing time and money
and want to be a part of theBritish Columbia communities.
And for us here in Kelowna,they're not making it conducive to
us.
We recently had the first
ministers conference was held inSaskatoon.
(17:44):
And I was really hoping that yourpremier would be there because I
was invited to some events wheresome of those people were there.
There were connections.
I was hoping to be able to.
have a few minutes to speak tothem.
Because again, sometimes you needto enlighten them.
You need to make them understandfrom your point of view.
This is not about being a greedydeveloper who wants all these
(18:05):
things.
It's just, it's the reality of the
way it is.
The environment here is not great
for people who want to developcondos.
Yeah.
Can you maybe walk us through the
pre -sale?process then so you guys obviously
you come up with your your designyou acquire the land you propose
it to the city and then you haveto release it in phases and right
you have to meet a certainthreshold of pre -sale within that
(18:26):
one year for phase one and thesame for phase two that's right or
people get an opportunity to walkon the deal but lenders are not
prepared to say well you don'thave enough pre -sales but we'll
waive it and we'll say that youhave your financing confirmed
because you need to have yourfinancing confirmed you the same
for phase two that's right orpeople get an opportunity to walk
on the deal but lenders are notprepared to say well you don't
(18:48):
have enough pre -sales but we'llwaive it and we'll say that you
have your financing confirmedbecause you need to have your
financing confirmed And as withall lenders, they're looking for a
certain pre -sale commitment.
And you think you've got a certain
number, and then all of a sudden,if you fall short by a few, that
date comes up, and now it createsall this uncertainty.
And by the time a developer getsto that point, the amount of money
(19:10):
you've got committed in landvalue...
The cost of getting it todevelopment stage, getting all
your architectural drawings done,and then taking out the building
permit, which triggers thedevelopment cost charges, the
DCCs, it's like a tax.
Very expensive here in Kelowna.
More expensive than I think anyplace, including places in the U
S., that we've encountered.
So there's that huge charge on top
of it all.
So you've got all of that money in
and maybe even quite a few buyersthat want to buy.
(19:32):
But you're left in this limbo ofuncertainty because of the way the
government regulations interactwith what lenders require to make
it possible to build these.
Yeah.
What would be easier solutions forthat?
Would it be like extending thatyear rescission period from a year
to two years?That would help.
Be a big help.
Delaying DCC fees until like
project completion.
That would be a help.
would be a help.
But certainly they've got to look
(19:54):
at having a reasonable length oftime for pre -sales.
I guess they're trying to protectthe buyer.
If you're creating a situation ofuncertainty where they thought
they were going to have a unit andthen other people, maybe their
circumstances have changed.
Now the developer goes, well,
maybe it doesn't make sense to goahead with it.
You're really causing problems forsome buyers.
So I think, you know, people needto look at their future and
decide, should I buy there?And then the developer has to have
a realistic amount of time to getthose pre -sales.
Other jurisdictions do not havethat.
Provincially, I have notencountered it in the U .S.
either.
We built condos in Washington,
California.
I've looked at building condos in
Florida.
We built them in Arizona.
Nowhere have we encountered thosekind of restrictive provisions.
(20:15):
Provincially, perhaps all wellintentioned for buyers but when it
gets to the point where developersdon't want to build that product
anymore because that's one of manythings that are plaguing the
market you've got flipping tax nowas they like to call it which i
should point out there's the two-year hold period so people who
are interested in being aninvestor they should buy pre
-sales because by the time youtake possession those two years
(20:38):
will have passed But still, it'sanother.
It just sounds bad.
And for people that are buying
units that are ready right now,they know they have to hold them
for two years.
People that are investing don't
want restrictions on them, even ifthey thought, well, I probably
want to hold it that long anyway.
They don't like the idea that
they're being told they can't.
The other thing that's problematic
(21:00):
is the vacancy tax.
I have people where I live in
Saskatchewan that have said,Colleen, we buy a condo from you
sight unseen.
They know we have a very well
-known reputation in Saskatchewanas quality builders.
They go, we buy it from you sightunseen.
We love Kelowna.
We love going there.
But we don't want to rent ourunit.
We want to go out.
When we want to go out, we don't
want to have to keep track likewe're living in some.
(21:23):
communist regime like how oftenwe're there we want to come and go
to our vacation home and we don'twant the vacancy tax another
deterrent then there's the federalforeign buyers ban if california
arizona florida texas they alltook that attitude i don't know
what would happen to theireconomies i mean the snowbirds
wouldn't be able to buy any homesdown there There are American
buyers that have said, like, lookhow far our dollar would go in
(21:43):
Canada.
We'd love to go and buy a
condominium tube.
Canada sounds exotic to a lot of
Americans.
We have friends in Washington.
They'd love to have a place uphere.
They ski.
They can't buy.
They're prohibited from buying onemore layer.
So you start loading all theselayers on, and it's like, why do I
(22:03):
do that?I feel like these layers come on
when the market's hot, and we'rein like a...
It was hot for a long time.
But then when the market cools,
it's just like a massive weight totry and get the industry out of
this.
I know.
And yet I'm sure that the premierwants the best for the province.
But I think they need to engagewith developers to really hear
(22:24):
their side of the story andunderstand that they're making it
so it's not conducive to buildcondos in British Columbia.
There's still people trying to doit, but it's tougher in some areas
than others.
Cologne is not a huge market.
So it's not like, you know.
We'll build it and they will come.
You've got to be a little morestrategic as a developer.
And when you're encountering allthose hurdles, most of which were
not in place when we startedbuilding eminence.
(22:46):
When we started this podcast,every week there's a new law.
I know.
I know.
I'll tell you, even some of therealtors, I don't think clearly
understand the way some of thelaws work, like who is actually a
foreign buyer.
And then they have language in the
forums that is difficult.
Like you have to declare that
you're not non -Canadian.
Like it's kind of a double name.
get it but you have to think aboutit for a minute and decide and i
(23:08):
think that it's it's confusing topeople and i'm a believer very
much in a more open market i'm afree enterprise type person i
think people should make their owndecisions honestly like so right
now we're in a bit of a spat withthe u
s and there's a major chance yeahi don't know if you've heard but
(23:28):
uh i've been thinking about this alot obviously there's everyone
else but like there's anopportunity for a major brain
drain from the u s to the canada like so right now
we're in a bit of a spat with theu
s and there's a major chance yeahi don't know if you've heard but
uh i've been thinking about this alot obviously there's everyone
else but like there's anopportunity for a major brain
(23:49):
drain from the u s to the canada And we just have
this stupid foreign buyer's banthat says, come here, but you have
to rent in one of our billionbuildings.
a major You can't buy a vacationhome here.
It's crazy.
And I mean, this spat, trade war,
whatever they want to call it.
You We live in the longest
undefended border in the world,you know, next to the United
States.
We are going to be trading
partners regardless.
(24:09):
We will get it worked out.
I have great confidence that thatwill happen.
And Canadian and American people.
love each other like it's not you
know so we kind of end up beingthe pawns in the game as this
stuff is going on and theamericans are trying to protect
their turf and we're trying toprotect our turf but in the end we
all know the reality is we have towork it out i think it's great if
(24:31):
canada expands you know to othermarkets and finds other markets
that's always a healthy thing todo in any business but we are
going to end up trading with the us that's all there is to it we
live too close to one another andwe're so similar in so many ways
so we will get it worked out butWhy would we want to put
prohibitions up?I hear people say, oh, we don't
(24:52):
feel welcome in the U .S.
anymore.
Not true.
I feel completely welcome in the U
.S.
and I'm happy for any of our U .S.
friends to come to Canada at anytime.
There's narratives created aboutit that serve certain purposes and
that's just not reality.
Yeah, we were in Mexico over the
winter and actually had likeAmericans apologizing for tariffs.
Like, oh, we're so sorry this ishappening.
It's not your fault.
I don't want to support the
(25:12):
government.
I'm definitely not known to be
like, you know, applauding theirefforts.
But I do think some of thesepolicies like have good
intentions.
They have good intentions.
And like media wise, they're greatfor the media.
But if everyone just had theirhead in the sand and was not
hearing about these policies, themarket would be fine.
I know, but they scare people.
That's all they do.
You know, we've spoken to BrendanOgbenson, chief economist, and I
was just at a presentation of hislast week.
He's like the most charismatic.
economist ever he's he's so
awesome but his data on all ofthis like speculation vacancy
foreign buyers like it does notmove the needle at all it is zero
impact Other than this massiveimpact of like our mindset of, oh,
no, what's going to happen now?and scare people.
(25:33):
That's all they do.
I know.
But, you know, we've seen themedia do that before.
And I say it with fondness becauseI've worked in media for many
years.
They have a lot of power and they
have to be careful how they useit.
And sometimes things are notrepresented exactly as they should
be.
Even the whole narrative about it
being a trade war.
I think that was not an
(25:54):
appropriate narrative.
The American government did what
they thought was right for theUnited States.
Maybe they were just sending awake -up call.
If I were in charge, I would havereacted in a completely different
way than they did.
That's me.
I think I would have been moresuccessful reacting in a different
way.
It will work itself out.
There's no point in making badfriends over it.
Actually, as a developer, thething that hurt us the most was
when our country put retaliatorytariffs on.
That's when people really startedto feel it.
We were finishing a hotel.
(26:14):
in BC, and we were doing business
with some American suppliers, itcost us, I don't even want to tell
you how much more, because of thetariffs our government applied for
us bringing in American product.
Yeah.
Kind of on that note, this issomething that is always
interesting to me, but let's saysomewhere in the prairies compared
to somewhere in BC, like cost persquare foot or for the finished
product.
Why is it, I don't want to say
(26:34):
more affordable, but just likemore cost effective elsewhere?
Like BC seems so expensive to docost of business.
Is it land acquisition or likelabor?
Well, your land is more expensivehere.
your land is more expensive here.
Your DCCs for a developer, I mean,
people in retail businesses have adifferent set of rules, but for
developers, those DCCs are brutal.
Timelines are pretty slow here.
It's not easy, as easy to developin BC as it is in a lot of other
(26:57):
jurisdictions.
Codes.
Codes?Yeah.
Well, you know, the codes aregetting, I think, more restrictive
all the time, even thoughSaskatoon are.
City Council has seen fit to takeus to tier two for sustainability
for new homes.
Other cities are not doing that.
I don't think they understand.
It's just shifting more costs to
homeowners.
You've got to be careful when
you're trying to do all thesesustainability things.
Everybody's all in favor of ituntil it affects them.
(27:18):
So in the end, if you have to tellbuyers that this is going to cost
you more, that's just one moredeterrent, right?
And then they kind of blame thedeveloper for it.
Why is this costing that much?Because...
There's code issues orenvironmental compliance or
sustainability compliance issuesthat are costing us more to build
it.
You know, like on Taylor's point,
you see a house like in Texas.
I don't know.
You're reading my mind.
I don't know about Saskatchewan.
But Texas, you see like thismansion.
(27:38):
I forget how much acres it's on,but it's like a six bedroom, just
a massive house.
And it's like 600 ,000.
I know.
know.
I saw that a lot in NorthCarolina.
It was crazy.
I saw I went there and I looked in
their home magazine.
went there and I looked in their
home magazine.
These beautiful homes for sale for
like a fraction of what we'd payin Canada.
Part of it is labor.
(27:58):
Part of it, I think the labor is
less down there.
The taxes are not as bad in a lot
of places in the U .S.
California is another tough one to
build in.
California and B .C.
have a lot in common.
Majority of people get their way.
But the reality is when you lookon the map, they represent just a
very slender sector of that.
province or state but they're the
(28:18):
vocal ones that seem to get theirway and they're the ones that have
all the votes in their regions butthey both created environments
that are very difficult to dobusiness in both california and
british columbia have a lot incommon in that they are so
beautiful they should haveeverything going for them in the
world and they don't because oflaws messing things up to the
regulation yeah you know it'sfunny like i do have some clients
(28:40):
that bring up the same point we'retalking about it's like well why
would the market not equal outlike why should bc not come down
in a home price and i think it'skind of a compounding issue right
because if it is cost of labor youknow that cost of labor they have
to live here and it's expensive tolive here it's expensive to buy
that home that they're building solike we have to pay them to be
(29:04):
able to afford to live here so idon't see it the regulation yeah
you know it's funny like i do havesome clients that bring up the
same point we're talking aboutit's like well why would the
market not equal out like whyshould bc not come down in a home
price and i think it's kind of acompounding issue right because if
it is cost of labor you know thatcost of labor they have to live
(29:25):
here and it's expensive to livehere it's expensive to buy that
home that they're building so likewe have to pay them to be able to
afford to live here so i don't seeit ever coming down, like the cost
to build.
No, I don't think so.
It's also like, you know, you'recomparing California and Kelowna
and Lake Como, like, like No, Idon't think so.
It's you know, they're expensiveplaces because they're beautiful.
(29:46):
They are.
They are.
But if I'm running the province,I'm going to want to encourage,
you know, development in theprovince.
And I think, you know, there'ssome people here too that are
maybe not so interested in having.
It developed, but it will get
developed.
I mean, it's progress.
It's what happens, right?And you do want to develop in a
responsible and sustainable way.
But again, there's a balance.
code and regulatory requirementsstart imposing a ton of costs, it
ends up shifting to the buyer inthe end and puts housing out of
(30:09):
reach.
So the dream of owning a home
becomes more difficult, you know,for people.
But it's well insulated.
Yeah, it's well insulated.
That's right.
It's well insulated.
Cold.
Yeah, it's well insulated.
That's right.
It's Cold, yeah.
No, I agree totally.
And I just, when we're talking
about affordability is like thename of the game seems the last
few years.
And then you just look at the code
and just adding more and more.
Do they realize they're doing that
(30:31):
or?Maybe we just need to sit down and
have a face -to -face conversationwith stakeholders and government
people making the rules so thatthey understand how in the end
it's affecting the buyer and notallowing them to buy.
It's going to get worse.
That's why I say now is a great
time to actually buy beforeeverybody realizes this shift is
going to happen.
People are going to go, okay, we
feel things are starting tostabilize.
(30:52):
We're starting to buy.
We can feel it shifting now.
But when that happens, There's nota lot of condos out there.
That will drive the prices ofwhat's available out, supply and
demand, right?It is the supply and demand.
Yeah, that's right.
Right now, there is some
saturation.
There are some good deals to buy.
But if no one's starting any newprojects in three years from now,
there's not going to be a lot ofsupply.
So if I were an investor, supply.
So if I were an investor, I'm
going to go into a condo projectthat's being sold now at prices
now that's going to be ready in acouple of years.
I don't have to close for two, twoand a half years.
I'm going to buy it now, lock inthat price.
And in two and a half years,there's not going to be a lot of
other stuff because we know what'sgoing on in the market.
Supply and demand is going to beworth more money.
So to build on that a bit, buildon that a bit, like I totally
agree.
So you have the prices, like
Taylor just said, the price ofbill is not going to go down.
(31:12):
Like the labor's not going down,the materials are not going down.
Land prices might come down, butthey're not going to come down a
lot.
Maybe like a correction of 10 % or
something, which is not going tochange the price.
So the only way these condos aregoing to get built in the future
is when the market, appreciates tothe point where it can make sense
for the developer again that'sright so you're basically buying
(31:32):
on the low end of where it's goingto go that's right so i think an
investor came in and say boughtfive units in a condo building now
pre -sales knows that he's notgoing to have to come up with that
money for two and a half yearsthen those two years for the
flipping tax are gone he'sprobably got or he or she probably
has a great deal where then theycan sell it and make some money
(31:54):
right so i think an investor camein and say bought five units in a
condo building now pre -salesknows that he's not going to have
to come up with that money for twoand a half years then those two
years for the flipping tax aregone he's probably got or he or
she probably has a great dealwhere then they can sell it and
make some money right away becausethere's just not going to be any
product around and people arestill going to want condos and the
(32:17):
pricing will have gone up so if adeveloper starts to build one then
price is going to be that muchhigher it's interesting too for
eminence because all the othercondo buildings in town seem to be
completing in the next two to sixmonths right so like you're
probably one of the few that areon the docket for the next two or
three years that's right yeah andinteresting too for eminence
(32:38):
because all the other condobuildings in town seem to be
completing in the next two to sixmonths right so like you're
probably one of the few that areon the docket for the next two or
three years that's right yeah andIt's a beautiful project.
We hope everyone comes to see it.
It really is.
And we take a lot of pride in whatwe build and we take pride in
meeting our buyers.
We've had a couple of buyer
(32:59):
appreciation nights where we'vemet our phase one and some of our
phase two buyers already.
And it's great.
Like we like to know those peoplebecause like I said, they are
actually the inspiration for whatwe want to build.
The land, the community andknowing.
who they are and what we can buildfor them.
And you're going to be having acondo in there too.
everyone comes to see it.
in there too.
I am.
am. So I'm going to be there.
They're going to know where I am.
There's any deficiencies.
You know, and I stay at ourfriend's hotel when we're here.
(33:19):
It was a great hotel.
We built it for them.
Yeah.
And we stay there, but it'll be
nice to get moved in there and tobe more a part of the community.
And have a chance to kind of livethe life that we've imagined for
our buyers.
Like I love coming out here and,
you know, being able to hike upthe trails.
My cats, I don't know if they'regoing to cooperate as well, but
I'm always up for a dog.
I would say to my husband, your
son, Beau, wants a dog.
(33:40):
That's one of our cats.
He loves dogs.
So I need to get a little dog and
a big dog, little dog, any dog atall will do, you know, and spend
some time on the trails, eitherthat or teach Finn and Beau to
lead better.
am. So I'm going to be there.
They're going to know where I am.
There's any Yeah.
What a cool situation.
Especially when being a developer
in a hotel, you get to stay in allthese places that you built over
(34:00):
the years.
Oh, yeah.
It was crazy.
The other night I stayed, last
weekend I was out in Chilliwackfor our new hotel.
I was the first person to sleep inthe hotel.
My husband was in... the roomalready sawing a log.
I was the first person to sleep inthe hotel.
And I got up 2 .30 in the morningand just walked around the halls.
And I took a little video and Iput it on social media.
And I said, this is the weirdestfeeling ever.
We're the only people in thehotel.
He's sound asleep.
I'm roaming the hallways at two o
'clock.
It didn't feel at all like The
Shining.
Just so you know, it felt really
good.
But I actually locked the gate on
the construction site that nightmyself and locked the front door
of the hotel.
Very strange.
Just so you know, it felt Yeah, itis neat.
I know when we opened our hotel inVancouver to be sleeping in there
(34:23):
the first night we got occupancyand just our internal staff were
in there that night.
But it's a neat feeling.
So what hotel did you build inKelowna?
So what hotel did you build inKelowna?
In Kelowna, Kelowna, we built theHoliday Inn Express.
We don't own it.
Our partners pay our hotels that
we're partners with in otherhotels.
They convinced us to build thathotel for them.
So we stay there and I have alittle favorite restaurant in
there.
I'll give them a little plug
there.
It's great.
kind of close this out before weget into our wrap -up questions
for for phase two of eminencewhere are you guys at in the pre
-sales like have you met yourthreshold no we haven't met it yet
but we're working on it we've gotactually five sales right now in
(34:44):
progress like i said things arestarting to pick up so we're
hoping that we will you know meetthat threshold and get there we're
committed we want to get this donei would imagine that as a
developer you basically we haven'tmet it yet but we're working on it
we've got actually five salesright now in progress like i said
things are starting to pick up sowe're hoping that we will you know
meet that threshold and get therewe're committed we want to get
this done i would imagine thatwould imagine that as a developer
you basically not sell at adiscount but sell aggressively to
(35:06):
meet that threshold and then afterwe're exactly right so all the
more reason this is the time tobuy you don't have to come up with
the money for quite a whilebecause it's a waste down the road
till it's going to be done and bythen you won't have a flipping tax
issue you'll have owned it forwell not owned it but you'll have
been under contract for more thantwo years what percentage do you
have to meet you know it dependson the lender typically you can
(35:28):
expect 50 percent is prettytypical some of the lenders are a
little more exactly right so allthe more reason this is the time
to buy you don't have to come upwith the money for quite a while
because it's a waste down the roadtill it's going to be done and by
then you won't have a flipping taxissue you'll have owned it for
well not owned it but you'll havebeen under contract for more than
two years what percentage do youhave to meet you know it depends
on the lender typically you canexpect 50 percent is pretty
typical some of the lenders are alittle more lenient it just
(35:50):
depends depends how much equityyou're going to put in as well as
a builder but remember how muchyou've already got in by the time
you buy the land pay for yourarchitectural drawings building
permit everything's got to be donefor that that process and pay your
dccs you're in deep so that's whyit's kind of hard to turn the ship
around after that's why we'rewe're in it and we're going
forward but i very much believe inthe project the more i come out
and i see it looking so good whereit is and our buyers coming over
(36:12):
and really enthused at what theysee the reaction we're getting
from people who are interested inbuying now despite all this
background noise of what's goingon in the economy and everything i
think We will come to agreementswith our partners to the south of
the border, our trade partners,and it'll be good.
And in the interim, if we expandour market more, explore Canada a
little bit more, that's all a goodthing too.
(36:33):
So it's all going to be okay.
But it's created this great
opportunity to buy.
So I've got some great units still
left in phase one that people canmove into right away and some
wonderful units in phase two.
And, you know, there's even in
terms of condos, if people arelooking for the cheapest thing on
the market, That won't be us, butwe're not giving you the cheapest
finishes either.
I think we're the best value in
the market.
There's multi -million dollar
condos you can buy, but noteverybody wants to spend that kind
(36:54):
of money on a home.
So I think we did a demographic of
a lot of people, like I said,young professionals.
We have some single people thathave bought in there, younger
single people, older singlepeople.
It's a very mixed group of people,but they're all people that I
think have discerning taste.
They're not out looking for the
cheapest thing.
but they're looking for value.
And that's what we want to deliveris really good value.
I've never built the cheapestthing, but I've always wanted to
know that they're getting morethan they expected.
And that's been the reaction we'vegotten from people that have seen
that when we opened our salesunit, we were over on St. Paul
Street for a while.
Then we opened our sales center
and model on site.
And that's the reaction we have
from people.
And that's what I want them to
(37:16):
feel.
We've taken the time and the care
and I've put some of the bestpeople out there.
I've got a terrific crew makingsure that all the details are
taken care of.
Well, we can't wait to come out.
Yeah, I hope you guys can come outand see it.
I've been there a few times, butnot.
Bring your clients and you get themortgages in place for them.
We'll dive into our wrap -upquestions if that's okay with you.
I hope you guys We'll dive intoour wrap -up questions if that's
(37:37):
okay with you.
I mean, this one seems obvious,
but maybe it's not.
If you could buy one property in
the Okanagan in the next 12months, what would it be?
Would it include mine?okay with it include mine?
Yeah, yeah.
You know what?
I would love to and will have acondominium in our project, even
at the end when all is said anddone and it's built.
I'd love to have one out here.
I love coming out to Kelowna.
But if I took that off of thetable, maybe I'd... want a winery
but you know what they say aboutwineries what do you call a
billionaire after they buy awinery a millionaire a millionaire
well i'm no billionaire so i can'trisk that kind of downgrade but i
think it would be a wonderful ideato buy a wine i have family that
got in the wine business here manyyears ago and i I'd like to be
able to spend more time out hereto explore some of that myself
because I know that it's so great.
(37:59):
I just love going down around the
waterfront by King Taps and CactusClub and some of those restaurants
there.
It's beautiful.
you know what they say downgradebut wine i And we found some other
great places to eat and thewineries have wonderful food.
Yeah, yeah.
And you've got some nice
microbreweries here as well.
And you've got some nice
microbreweries here as well.
Yeah, that's how I convinced my
wife Emily.
Like we were relocating back from
(38:20):
overseas to Kelowna and I waslike, you know, we could like live
on a vineyard if we moved toKelowna.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I got to plant a couple grapes inthe backyard.
I got to plant a couple grapes inthe backyard.
That's funny.
funny.
All right, Colleen, if you couldgive your 20 -year -old self any
advice, what would it be?Expect the unexpected.
I've been through it in spades.
You hear people say that, but it
is the reality.
Always hope for the best, but
(38:41):
always have a bit of a rainy daybackup plan because things can
happen that you're not expecting.
And always be in a business that
you're passionate about becauseeven when you're passionate about
it, some days will feel like work,but at least you're working in an
area that you really like.
So for anybody out there, whatever
it is they're passionate about,that's what they need to pursue.
And then they need to figure outhow to make their passion into
(39:04):
their business.
BMO has asked me to speak at their
celebrating women event for womenin business.
And I said, well, what do you wantme to talk about?
Just talk about your career, theysaid, and what inspires you.
And the truth is I've taken allthe things I enjoyed in life and
turned it into business somehow.
Like I love design.
I love.
building things even when I was a
(39:25):
little girl I loved looking atarchitecture but I also loved
animals so all our buildings arepet friendly and I've combined a
lot of things that I like to dothe things that I enjoy I've had
young people come to me and say Iwant to be an entrepreneur how do
I do that well the first thing iswhat are you passionate about you
don't just become an entrepreneurto sell widgets.
You got to want to sell thosewidgets.
(39:45):
You have to have a passion.
Like we never sell a condo that I
would not live in myself.
I don't build an apartment to rent
somebody that I would not live inmyself.
I can't do that.
I don't build boxes.
My partner and I didn't, myhusband and I don't, because I
wouldn't be inspired living in abox.
So do something, whatever it is,whatever, you know, inspires you
do that, pursue that as abusiness, follow your heart
because you've got to find a wayto pay the bills.
So you, Got to find a way to makewhat you love into a business that
(40:07):
can sustain you.
Good answer.
That is a good answer.
What's your favorite charity or
how do you get back?Well, I probably alluded to it.
I do a lot for animals.
My girlfriend and I ran an event
pre -COVID for 15 years calledPets in the Park.
We raised hundreds of thousands ofdollars for homeless animals.
I like to do a lot of work withthat.
My husband and I contribute tomedical matters where someone in
our family has been touched.
by something that matters to me.
(40:29):
And I enjoy the arts as well.
So we've done things to support
the arts, but I have to saychildren and animals are probably
my weakness.
My husband likes a lot of things
related to kids' sport.
My There's no kid that ever calls
him that needs some help withsomething that he says no to.
I probably shouldn't say thatpublicly, but he does, you know.
But we're people that kind of liketo see more tangibly what our
efforts have done, even with theanimals.
(40:51):
I love it when people come backand tell me stories of how
something that we did or gave tothem helped them with their
animals.
Even all my years, 25 years in
television, while I was doing thisat the same time, people still
come to me on the street and say,you know, Colleen, remember how
you did your segment to adoptanimals for the rescue
organization?I adopted that dog from you years
ago or that cat and that likechanged my life and it was like
the best thing that happened tome.
I love those stories.
Awesome.
Yeah.
(41:11):
That is awesome.
So Eminence is pet friendly, ofcourse.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
No, that's great.
All right.
How can Taylor or I or ourlistener get back to you?
How can we help you?Well, we'd love for all of you,
you two guys included, to come outto our sales center and see our
show home at Eminence.
Please come out.
It doesn't mean you have to buysomething.
Just please come out and see it.
Maybe you know someone who would
(41:32):
like to buy there.
We want to be part of your
community.
Go to our website, eminenceliving
.ca.
Our sales center is open five days
a week.
Spread the word.
Come see us.
If you see me on the street, stop
me.
People who knew me from TV often
do.
So just come up and introduce
yourself.
I'm always happy to talk to people
and watch social media.
We're going to share some social
(41:53):
media.
You guys are way younger than me.
So this social media thing isstill something I'm... need people
to help me to understand, but I doknow that it works.
Don't worry.
worry.
We're not good at social media.
You have people who do that,
right?You have Nikki and I have Nikki.
We have different Nikki.
Awesome.
people who Nikki.
Awesome.
Well, thank you so much for comingon today.
(42:13):
It's been a pleasure.
Enjoy your stay out here until
your condo is finished.
We always look forward to our
trips out to Kelowna and they willbe more frequent going forward.
condo is finished.
We always look forward to our
trips out to Kelowna and they willbe more frequent going forward.
And yeah, and then I'll be outthere with all of our buyers as
well.
Awesome.
Thank you very much.
Thanks so much.
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