January 21, 2024 • 35 mins
"So I started when I was 15 years old and I was really fascinated with hand lettering, pinstriping cars and I was doing some signs and I think the first actual service van that I hand lettered in my parents' backyard was for a plumbing company."
- Dan Antonelli
Growing a small business is no easy task. It takes ingenuity, resolve and setbacks before reaching success.
Dan knows this because he’s lived it.
From a one-person basement shop to an award-winning agency, Dan navigated the tumultuous small business landscape and lived to tell the tale. Moreover, he’s helped over 1,000 individual brands recognize the better side of business: all while building a best-in-class agency that’s collectively earned over 200 design awards.
Ever since he began hand-lettering trucks at 14, Dan has been chasing his passion for brand building and logo design. His expertise on small business marketing has been referenced by Entrepreneur, Inc. Magazine, Fox Business News, SiriusXM, SignCraft Magazine, Intuit Small Business Blog, The Newark Star Ledger, HVACR Magazine, Contracting Business, and Green Industry Pros, among others.
Check out another fantastic episode of The Service MVP Podcast...
If you want learn more feel free to reach out Joe and his team at Service MVP!
Here's Joe's contact information -
Contact Joe Crisara Service MVP.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:02):
Welcome to the service MVP podcast.
My name is Joe Crisara America's Service Sales Coach and we have with us,
one of my dearest friends,
Dan Antonelli from KickCharge media,
Dan.
Welcome to the show.
I appreciate you being here.
What's up Joe?
How you doing,
brother?
Well,
it's definitely long overdue and got you on this podcast today.
And uh today we're gonna talk about brand transformation.
(00:25):
How the branding,
the sales equals success.
Does that make sense?
Uh That's gonna be the name of our show.
Uh Dan,
I really,
I just want to start by saying,
you know,
how did you wind up uh where you're at right now?
How did you,
uh So I know it's not an overnight success story,
but if you can,
if you could somehow limit it to five minutes and give us the thumbnail version of how you got from where you were to where you are now,
(00:47):
could you give us a little bit and then we're gonna talk about some of the transformation you have experienced with contractors.
Go ahead and tell us first about yourself,
Dan.
It,
it's definitely been an overnight success like 28 years of overnight,
you know,
the deal,
you know how long it takes.
So I started when I was 15 years old and I was really fascinated with hand lettering pinstriping cars and I was doing some signs and I think the first actual service van that I hand lettered in my parents' backyard was for a plumbing company.
(01:24):
I have pictures of it,
believe it or not.
And that's really how I got started is I started,
I started doing lettering on trucks working with these small businesses.
And I really wanted to be a sign painter.
Uh That was my goal.
I,
I got to work in a,
in a sign shop in Staten Island,
New York.
You may hear a little bit of my accent here.
(01:45):
And I told my parents,
I wanna be a sign painter and they were like,
well,
maybe you should go to college first and then see if that's something you really want to do.
So I wind up going to college and I studied advertising and communications.
And I,
and I find found that that experience actually was really valuable.
It would,
it really taught me a lot about marketing.
(02:07):
It taught me a lot about advertising,
taught me a lot about consumer psychology.
So many great things came out of that also taught me how to write very well.
So that I think helped me when I started writing books and,
and started doing some of those things.
So I graduated I started working as a graphic designer in New York City,
but I really missed working with all these entrepreneurs.
(02:28):
I was working for a health insurance company.
If you can imagine producing brochures,
it wasn't the most exciting line of business,
but it was a good job.
And I started the company on the side,
like so many entrepreneurs did working out of my basement.
And I remember my wife saying like you need to have 50,000 in sales if you want,
(02:49):
if you want to quit your day job,
so to speak.
So I was like,
OK,
that's my goal.
I gotta just do 50,000 in sales in one year.
And then,
and then I'll be able to quit.
And so that was really a grind,
that was really hard to do while I was commuting into New York City,
you know,
five days a week.
So I literally worked,
(03:09):
you know,
I'd come home from the train,
have a little bit of dinner and then I'd work from 7 to 12 in the morning.
And I,
and I did that for about a year to get through that sales goal,
right?
So I hit that sales goal and finally I was able to leave my job and start.
And when I started,
I just had this idea that that small businesses should have a place where they could go to get everything at once.
(03:33):
So that was really my mindset is like,
I could do the logo,
I can do their lettering on their truck and then I could do their brochure and at the time two websites were starting to come in and,
and,
and it's kind of ironic as I look around here today.
We have 30 employees here today.
And that's very much what we do is we,
we,
we provide a source for them to get so much of their marketing needs.
(03:56):
But all of it drives originally from that branding and that was something from a very early point on.
I was so passionate about,
I loved working with logos,
developing logos and then integrating those onto all these different platforms.
So it's been,
it's been a crazy journey.
Um We just hired our 30th employee last week and it's I'm just surrounded by so much talent that,
(04:24):
you know,
I feel like I don't do much anymore,
like they just do everything because everything is,
I don't need to do anything because they just kill it for me.
So it's been great.
It's been a great journey.
Well,
you know,
uh we do share a quite a few clients and I,
I would say the one,
the absolute 12 punch that I know people say,
well,
how do I get my company as well?
(04:45):
First of all,
I even see people that come to us and I go well,
I think you need to look at that brand uh because it's gonna make it way harder for us to get credibility and all the rest of it.
Uh,
you know,
when,
when I would find my job is,
which is to teach people how,
you know,
provide value after the doorbell rings is way easier when you do it before the doorbell rings.
(05:06):
So,
Da Dave,
of course,
now,
uh,
you know,
you have,
uh,
turned into a,
uh,
industry icon.
Dan,
you know,
it's like,
it's like now it's like,
you know,
nobody goes anywhere without seeing Dan Antonelli speaking at a conference or all that part of it.
What's it feel like now to achieve?
Because considering the time when you're starting out trying to make that 50,000 in a year,
(05:27):
uh what,
what's it?
Can you have to pinch yourself sometimes?
What's it like right now for Dennis?
And I,
I gotta say it's a little surreal.
I spoke at Tommy Mellow's event last November.
And for me that just felt like almost like validation of decades of really a lot of work.
(05:48):
So we,
we would sometimes go to these trade shows and nobody would come to our booth like no one knew who we were and,
and suddenly we're at this event and it's not suddenly,
I mean,
over the years,
obviously,
we've,
we've gained a lot of traction,
but we were at this event and I brought seven team members with me to this event because we knew we were going to be pretty busy at the booth and things like that.
(06:09):
And we literally had all seven of us talking to people and there were lines of people waiting to talk to us.
And I was just like,
wow,
you know,
we've really gone from where not too many people really knew what we did and how we could help them to being recognized as,
you know,
one of the best or the best at what we do.
(06:30):
And that's just a lot of hard work that's taken to get there,
you know,
obsessiveness,
certainly with practicing our craft and being the best we possibly can.
And also just the mindset of the people that we have here and what we love is the ability to change lives.
And I think that that's ultimately what we focused so hard on over the last decade is knowing how critical our task is and working with the mindset that,
(06:56):
that respon is so critical and accepting that responsibility and embracing it and knowing that,
hey,
if we do our jobs,
well,
we can really change the trajectory of so many of these,
these companies.
And I think what's happened is those companies have really become our biggest cheerleaders.
(07:17):
So like,
we don't really advertise other than maybe going to some trade shows when I'm speaking at them and things like that.
But we don't really market in,
in a traditional way.
And we're just so fortunate that I feel like all our customers,
they really do our marketing for us because you know,
someone will post online.
Here's my new truck wrap.
What do you think?
Or I'm thinking about getting this truck wrap and,
(07:38):
you know,
and if it's not done well,
like we'll get tagged and,
you know,
talk to Dan before we do this or,
or even read Dan's book.
I mean,
not everyone can use us,
which is totally fine.
But the reason why I wrote the book,
um about home service branding is because I felt like,
again,
no information about it really exists.
And then I just wanted people to have a resource to learn more about it.
(08:02):
So you understand what you're buying,
regardless of who you use.
You,
you are educated on the topic.
Yeah.
Yeah,
I think,
I think a lot of times when it's very similar to my bus,
my business,
when people arrive at my door,
like they arrive at your door,
it,
it's already pretty much ready to ready to go.
Uh,
it's just a matter of,
uh,
getting all the details and how do you,
how does,
how does it work?
(08:23):
Right.
Uh Let's talk about,
let's put,
let's put the focus on where it belongs on the contractors that have made both you and I successful.
What do you think of that?
Let's tell,
let's tell some stories because those are the real stars,
right?
Those are the ones that have done it.
So let's talk about like I want to first start,
but I'm gonna put him in the front of the line because I know he'd want to be right in front if he was here with us,
(08:44):
Tommy Melo and a one garage door.
That was one of the first,
that's one of the first places that you and I really got to know each other very well.
Uh Work,
I work with his team.
You work with his team.
Uh Tell us about,
uh,
if you could tell us a story about meeting him because I know he is,
he fills up a room with his presence and I know that you probably had to pump the brakes.
Say that Tommy,
(09:04):
we're gonna do it this way.
Uh And tell me,
tell me a little bit about that and how that uh how that relationship has uh grown.
And what do you be seen in the A one team when you first met him compared to what the transformation is?
Now,
let's talk about transformation if we can.
Ok.
Well,
I think the interesting thing with working with Tommy is the idea of his mindset of being not complacent.
(09:27):
So at the time that we rebranded him,
he was like a $40 million company.
We do work for companies at that level,
but not nearly as many are willing to reinvest into branding.
And Tommy had a vision of where he wanted to go with the company and how much revenue he wanted to get and how he wanted to grow it and he knew instinctively,
(09:50):
I think that what he had wasn't going to get him there,
even though it had got him to the 40 million,
he,
he was just facing so much pressure from a marketing perspective that it was costing so much more money on marketing.
How can I basically get it to be a household name instead?
So I'm less reliant on Google,
I'm less reliant on paid advertising and I'm leveraging,
(10:14):
you know,
these 50 or 60 or 70 trucks that I have at my disposal.
How do I leverage that opportunity?
Um And so I think the interesting thing is is that he came to me from a place of,
of not basically being complacent with what he had and knowing that it wasn't gonna get him to where he wanted to go.
(10:36):
And that takes some guts that takes putting your ego aside,
that takes,
you know,
respecting the expertise of,
of another person and,
and putting their hands,
put,
you know,
in,
in,
into that person.
And I think,
I think working with him was,
was easier than you would imagine.
Like,
honestly,
(10:56):
like,
you know,
I've worked with many big companies and there were so many layers,
there was so much bureaucracy.
Let me get this person's opinion.
Let me get this person's opinion.
And basically me and Tommy through text had the entire branding done probably in a week.
Wow.
Well,
you know what I've learned about you,
Dan is that you have definite boundaries when it comes to,
(11:18):
you know,
like,
like you,
you're kind of like me where you say you'd be willing to take 100% uh,
of the accountability.
As long as you let me do it the way I need to do it.
Right.
I've,
I've heard many of my contractors I've sent to you.
It's like,
yeah,
what do you think of these?
And I'm like,
well,
all I do know is that every time he wins every time.
And so,
(11:39):
and so I remember it was the one where you had a,
a polar bear in San Diego.
And they're like,
this isn't gonna work.
It's,
as I said,
dude,
this guy knows,
so,
you know,
just go with the flow on this.
And so tell me about a little bit about that and also is like,
we have other,
other clients of scores,
but,
you know,
uh,
Tommy seems like the kind of guy and he's worked with me the same way,
Joe just do what you do best.
(12:00):
That's really,
I think one of the strengths of Tommy Bellow,
don't you think?
Yeah,
no,
100%.
And I look at some of our most successful brands ever.
And those are the ones run by owners that really trust the process and say damn,
what do you think we should do?
I'm stealing your phrase by the way,
what should we do?
What should we do?
You can take it so,
(12:22):
when that happens,
I feel like from a creative perspective,
it's usually some of the best brands we've ever done because they're not trying to fit into a preconceived notion of what the brand should be.
And I think that's a lot of times the biggest obstacle is they see kind of what other people have done,
whether it's using the stereotypical sun and snowflakes or,
(12:45):
or,
you know,
that type of fire and ice kind of look and they see people doing that and that's sort of where their mindset is,
is that it,
it should be similar to that.
So then when you're asking them to do something that feels different,
that feels contrary to what their instincts are.
I get it like that feels unnatural like that seems weird.
(13:05):
Right.
Why would we do that?
But that's sort of where it takes the guts to say we're going to do something different,
we're gonna do something more disruptive.
Um,
because if you're going to build a brand that blends in,
you certainly don't need me to do that.
Right.
And then again,
you're back to the same position that you're leaving,
relying on Google and,
and all these other paid avenues to have people remember your brand,
(13:26):
the whole mind,
the whole idea behind what we're doing.
It's not rocket science,
right?
The whole idea is how do I rent space in your head,
period?
Like you could distill it,
you could,
you could distill it to that simple fact,
how do I rent space in people's heads for free?
And the,
and the,
and the way I can do it is if I can do something that feels like something they haven't seen before and if I can do it and make them also feel something about who they're hiring,
(13:55):
then I make your job easier.
Right.
I make it so I control what they think before you ring the doorbell and that's,
that's,
that's the beauty of it.
I mean,
that's really what branding is doing is it's having people believe something about you before you even get to ring the doorbell.
And that's how you get the higher average tickets.
That's how you get the better clothes ratios.
(14:15):
Um That's how you get the better booking rates.
Like,
like I feel like this isn't rocket science,
right?
But that's ultimately what we're doing,
you know,
I do,
I do have a question,
I'm gonna say for you at the end uh because it's probably a question nobody's really,
I asked you but something I have a feeling inside that I just want to bring that up,
but let's move on to Ken Goodrich and Gel,
which is probably the most iconic brand.
(14:36):
I think I've seen everybody sees that.
It's like,
that's just beautiful.
That brand tell me about how is Ken Goodrich the same thing you would think that Ken Goodrich would be uh you know,
because he's such a huge presence that he would kind of want to take control of that.
But it looks like by everything I've seen,
you must have been given free license to create what you want there too.
Yeah,
we,
we had the idea of,
(14:58):
of the story that was going to be crafted about the boy holding the flashlight.
And so we needed to figure out how to,
how to visually tell that story right?
There was gonna be an ad campaign that would supplement that storyline,
but I needed visually to represent that idea.
So that brand story really had to be built around the boy and him holding that flashlight.
(15:23):
But you couldn't just put a boy there,
you had to have the right feeling with it,
the right emotion with it.
And so we sort of played off the idea of how Norman Rockwell used to illustrate his,
his paintings.
Um And,
and we initially believe it or not,
it's a kind of a funny story,
but I literally had a neighbor who is 10 years old,
(15:44):
which was the exact age that we wanted to be represented in the visual.
And so I bought him overalls and I bought him the,
the basically the newspaper cap kind of thing and,
and we dressed him up and we did a photoshoot and he actually was holding the,
the,
the,
the,
you know,
diagonal badge of the ghetto logo and we had him holding it because we wanted to look natural in terms of figuring out how to pose him.
(16:10):
We get all this stuff done,
right?
And send it to Ken.
Ken loves it.
It's all good.
We start the render process.
And then at the last minute,
Ken said,
what if we made the boy,
my son Duncan and I was like,
Ken,
you know,
this is,
you know,
information that might have been useful to me like 60 or 70 hours ago before we started actually rendering this guy um this little boy.
(16:37):
So um he sent us some pictures of,
of his son.
Um None of them had the right lighting,
none of them were at the right angle.
Um And we had a sort of manufacture this pose of his son Duncan um holding the sign and then we rendered it and,
and you know,
people,
you know,
forget that he wasn't huge at the time.
(16:57):
I mean,
ghetto wasn't a big company.
It was a failing company when,
when Ken acquired it and,
and he turned it around,
but that was really the most important.
First step in that turnaround was getting that brand,
getting that story out and having people understand um what that experience would be like again working with this company.
So,
so you get that warm feeling and you get the feeling that they're not gonna rip me off,
(17:19):
they're gonna treat me fairly,
they believe in old fashioned values,
honesty,
integrity,
those are all sort of the things that that brand.
Um was really communicating.
Yeah.
Yeah.
How about,
let's go on to our current uh new champion and uh and the place order our visionary icon uh at Grasshopper Services up in Albany,
(17:41):
New York.
And you got Amanda Triolo and Kelly Osterlich who runs that team and that crew.
I mean,
I was just up there and everything is,
everything is grasshopper and uh I,
I didn't really see it until I lived in the environment.
It's one of the few places I have a chance to go to and really experience,
I call the,
we do a thing called Total immersion.
(18:02):
Uh Certainly,
I think I felt like the Dan Antonelli Total immersion in the brand there for sure because they,
they do so much to uh use that.
Uh they use that brand in so many different ways.
Uh Let's what about your experience with Grasshopper Services and Amanda?
Sure,
when Amanda came to us,
you know,
it was right after COVID,
you know,
had had happened,
(18:23):
she ran primarily commercial HVAC and the governor of New York had shut them down.
So now she's trying to pivot into doing,
into doing residential and she came to me and the name of the company at the time was PP MA Comfort Services or P MA Comfort Solutions,
something like that.
And I want you to departure.
(18:44):
That's a pretty significant departure there,
you know.
So I want you to give me a brand for P MA Comfort and I'm like,
I'm like,
Amanda,
like I know what you are trying to accomplish,
but I'm not gonna help you if that's what you need to keep because it's not gonna move the needle for you.
It's not gonna accomplish what you want.
You can't break into residential with a name like that because it's just,
(19:06):
it's just gonna require so much money and so much effort to get people to understand that.
Um,
and,
and at first,
I mean,
she tells a story that she was,
um you know,
disappointed that I wouldn't work with her.
And,
you know,
I,
I of course,
gave her the reasons why and then she tried to move on and keep it going with the P MA and it just wasn't working out.
(19:27):
So then she reached back out to me,
she said,
OK,
I'm ready.
Um I'm ready to change.
And so um we came up with the name Grasshopper for her.
I actually came up with that name myself.
Interestingly enough,
I didn't know all the things about a grasshopper at the time,
but she had really a strong focus on the environmental aspect of H VAC.
And she wanted that sort of notion to be part of the,
(19:50):
the brand story as one thing.
But we,
we came to learn that grasshoppers can only move forward as a,
as an instinct,
they can't actually go backwards.
And so that became really a storyline for her culture,
you know,
forward as a way of life became their tagline.
And as a company,
we will continue to move forward,
(20:10):
we will elevate our employees,
we will help them move forward,
we will help our customers move forward.
Um And so it became really,
really central to their entire culture.
And so when you think about branding,
yes,
we created a really cool logo and a really cool truck wrap and all their wall wraps and everything like that was fine.
Um But the thing that came out of it was really from a cultural perspective.
(20:31):
Um you know,
what was built afterwards and it's just incredible.
I mean,
what she's built and what she's been able to accomplish in only three years.
She's coming up on three years in,
in two weeks.
And I think they're,
they're at almost 20 million in revenue and maybe beyond 20 million in revenue now.
But to go from 100,000 to 20 in three years is insane.
(20:51):
They're gonna have a Grasshopper Day on February 1st and uh uh my wife Julie will be joining you there.
She,
I heard you're gonna go to that event and my wife Julie,
who's the president of our company will be there as well.
So you get to meet her and uh celebrate Grasshopper Day the third anniversary.
And together,
I can't tell you a story though.
It's really interesting.
Uh I was there and I was,
(21:13):
it was a customer concern that came in,
listen to this story.
You're gonna love this.
You can tell this one at your conferences and stuff like that.
Uh She was a customer concern and the customer was upset about something and they were talking about some kind of a,
you know,
second recall or call back.
And uh the,
the customer used the brand uh statement.
(21:34):
They go,
he's like,
well,
you guys are trying to do everything you can,
I can see that that makes me happy.
So let's do what you tell us to do,
which is move forward.
That's the forwards way of life.
You,
you got the customer said,
f forward is a way of life like you guys say.
So let's move forward and get,
get this thing done.
It was funny how the customer used the brand uh statement in at the end of the whole conversation.
(21:58):
It's like,
well,
let's just do what you say we should do,
which is to move forward.
So it was interesting how uh the whole community was brain is the kind of been uh you know,
conditioned or trained on the way that grasshopper moves in that way,
right?
So it's a really interesting story and,
and really,
I see everybody there and you know,
it's funny because even when the decisions I see they make,
(22:18):
it's like,
well,
we do know we're gonna move forward,
we can let's not get stuck.
So in a way what it represents to them is that they're not stuck in certain thing.
And that's really,
I think uh you could probably speak to that to the brand,
the branding,
which is that it goes beyond just like a logo,
you know,
so people I need a logo,
right?
Uh But you can see that when I went there,
I could experience that depth of the brand uh to about that.
(22:42):
Tell me how proud you were of those type of uh those type of stories when you hear those kind of things,
I mean,
I I got to be in her space as well and walk through it and see all the wall wraps and everything that we've created there.
And you see the enthusiasm,
you see the energy of the people there.
And you know,
there's one thing that people I think that initially hire us don't understand is how the brand affects culture,
(23:07):
right?
So they hire us initially because they're like,
I,
I wanna get a really cool logo and a really cool truck wrap design.
Then we do those things and then they're like,
oh my God recruitment is so much easier because people want to work here like they think that that we've got something going on.
It also signals to the to the existing employees that we're not content with status quo.
(23:28):
Like we have a plan on where we want to take this and rebranding is,
is one step that's gonna help us get us further into um the dream that we have about growing this company.
So,
you see,
you know,
she's really the embodiment of all,
all of those aspects and she doesn't have a recruitment problem.
She doesn't have trouble finding people.
She,
if anything,
(23:49):
she's got too many people that wanna work there because you walk into that space and Joe,
you've been in 100 you know,
environments like that,
not like that,
but you've been in 100 you know,
uh offices for hr companies and,
and I bet you you've never seen anything like that.
Ken's like is like that Ken Ken's in,
in Vegas is,
is really on par with what Amanda has done there for sure.
(24:12):
But outside of those two,
I don't think you've probably been in an environment that has that same energy and that same vibe that you,
you,
you,
you see there and it's just incredible the energy that her teammates have and as a leader of what she's been able to build there,
it's just,
you know,
I'm in awe when I,
when I go there,
I just,
I just can't believe what she's been able to accomplish at.
(24:33):
Yeah,
I think the difference I've seen Dan is that I've seen contractors who have used you and fully committed to uh the branding,
not just uh on the,
on the outside of the building or on the trucks,
but when you walk in the building,
it's a grasshopper.
The,
the,
the brand colors are represented in every room.
Uh there,
there's a uh the,
the,
(24:53):
the grasshopper is hopping off the wall in one case or,
you know,
they got,
they got every single wall in every single office is representing the brand or the story or a slogan or something that uh is there.
So it's,
it's kind of like,
reminds me,
I would say the guys like ghetto over at Vegas and also at Amanda's place,
it's like a theme park of the brand in a way.
(25:15):
Does that make sense?
So I think it,
I think it goes beyond the uh the like the stage is ok,
let's get the brand for the company,
but also for the trucks for the uniforms,
for the,
for the inside of the place.
Tell me how that uh has transformed your business and uh to continue because they don't because after the initial thing,
it's like,
ok,
we got a,
we got a logo and then it's like,
(25:36):
well,
hang on,
we're not done yet,
right?
Tell us about,
tell us about how continues on or even before getting to that too.
I think the the real interesting thing with,
with Amanda is what would have happened if I said yes to her when she first came to me.
Hm.
You know what would have happened if I said sure,
Amanda,
I'll take your money and I'll do a logo for P MA comfort.
(25:58):
Like would she have gotten to build what she's built around that culture?
On P MA comfort and,
and that's the part too where,
you know,
for us,
it's really important that we are always really taking that into consideration as far as doing,
doing the right thing.
And it honestly wasn't the right thing for her and I wasn't interested in doing it because I knew it wasn't gonna help her.
(26:21):
So,
so we say no to people sometimes not because anything else other than it's not the right thing that you're asking us to do for you.
And I'd rather not cash your check,
delivering something that I know won't add value.
It's just not the way I roll here and it's not the way we roll here.
Um But going back to the other point too is sure you,
you get this logo and,
(26:42):
and now it's being infused and how do you roll it out?
How do you let the customers know about it?
How do you let the employees know why you did it?
There's a,
there's a process that you have to follow.
There's like a road map to follow,
to do it successfully.
So making sure that customers know it's the same great company,
right?
Your warranties are still in,
in place.
We didn't get bought out by private equity,
(27:04):
you know,
they,
they have all these questions and you've got to make sure you have the communication channels open to answer those questions.
Um And then yes,
it's,
it's the uniforms,
it's the business cards it's the membership brochures.
It's the wall wraps,
it's making sure that any time a customer is going to interact with your brand,
it is consistently telling that same story and delivering that same message.
(27:27):
And you could look at any single piece of marketing that Amanda puts out whether it's on social,
whether it's the brochure,
anything and you know,
right away which company is being represented by that advertisement and,
and that marketing and,
and you know,
again,
sometimes people get that wrong is they,
they don't embrace it fully and they have stuff that's the wrong font,
(27:48):
the wrong colors,
the wrong uniforms and stuff like that drives me insane.
But,
but I get it,
it takes time to,
to roll all those things in.
But certainly that has to be the goal.
But I think the one thing that we realize is that the companies that are very successful with this,
they,
the owners do a great job of protecting the integrity of the brand.
(28:10):
Uh,
and having like,
I think,
I think in a way you're,
then you go beyond just sign maker by far because the fact that you got boundaries,
I,
I always say here's a phrase you can borrow from us too.
We have a service MVP.
We say I'd rather turn you down than let you down.
Makes it make sense there.
So it's very similar to what you're talk.
(28:30):
We have the same thing here and I think that speaks to the integrity of what you're about to get.
Like,
yeah,
these are somebody who,
uh,
they're not just gonna take me out as a client,
they gotta make sure that they get able to do it their way.
But I think that the owners of the companies that work with you,
I see that and it's like,
you know what,
I'm gonna make sure that the brand is represented in a way that is the integrity of the colors,
(28:51):
the integrity of the message,
the integrity of the logo.
There's no,
there's no changing anything.
It's like this is what we got.
Uh And definitely,
I think that's what do you think about that part?
You know,
the,
you probably don't realize that the amount what people get from you by example and how that's helped them as well.
Yeah.
You know,
it's funny because I'm,
I become Facebook friends with so many owners after we do the branding and maybe they'll post something that their social media person put out and I'll screenshot it and I'll send them a message and I'm like,
(29:22):
this is the wrong font.
That's the wrong colors.
Just have them follow the brand guides that we set up for you and they're like,
oh my God,
you're right.
Like I,
I,
so like I try to do my best with that to make sure that,
you know,
little even littlest things like the wrong font that drives me because you,
your corporate brand guidelines have one or two very specific and deliberately chosen fonts that every single thing you put out on the street should be using.
(29:48):
You think that's well,
well,
why does it have to be that font?
Well,
it has to be that font because it was very deliberately chosen to match attributes of your actual logo.
Like there's a thought process behind every single thing that we're recommending that you integrate.
So sometimes you see that or it'll be the wrong shade of blue or something like that and I'll just,
you know,
friendly reminder,
hey,
(30:08):
just make sure the next time you do something like try to follow this instead and just give them some guidance.
But,
you know,
I,
I sort of want say,
you know,
if you think of Seinfeld and the Soup Nazi,
well,
maybe I'm like a brand Nazi because I really want to make sure everything is done at a service put on your business card.
But,
ok,
you know,
everything needs to be done at that standard um because it represents your company.
(30:33):
So I,
I don't care if it's the smallest thing that's going out that has your name on it,
it better be branded in the,
in the right manner.
Otherwise,
why did we invest all this money in building a brand?
So,
well,
Dan,
uh I always say a great podcast starts on time and even a better one ends on time.
So why don't we go ahead and just tell people how they get a hold of you and uh at kick charge creative and uh see how people get,
(30:56):
how can they get on the wait list if you will,
uh to see about how they can do business with you?
Sure.
Um Our waitlist right now actually isn't too bad because we've been hiring like crazy.
So we're only booked out about two months or so right now,
which is much better than the seven or eight months we used to be booked out.
So we,
we hired seven brand developers.
(31:16):
So we have seven full time brand developers on staff,
um five or six graphic design.
So we're,
we're much better space there.
But if you want to get in touch with us,
you can,
you can go to kick charge.com if you want to learn more just about branding your home service business.
You can pick up this book,
it's called Branded Not Bland and you could get it on our site at Kick charge.com/books or you could get it on Amazon.
(31:42):
Um As well,
Dan,
thank you so much for being here and thanks for so much for helping uh literally hundreds of thousands of people live the dream of uh working for brands that have a meaning and,
and that's one thing I do want to follow up with the,
the very philosophy I had a question for you,
right?
It's like,
how do you know when you look at something because here's what I can see.
(32:02):
I think everybody else sees the same thing.
It's hidden in plain sight.
Like,
as soon as they see something,
it's like,
that's Dan Antonelli like.
Uh so it's almost like a Picasso like,
you know,
it's like,
it's something,
it's like that has to be Dan Antonelli on that one.
What do you get that feel?
What's it?
What do you,
when you,
when you finally look at a brand that somebody's developed maybe one of your artists or even yourself,
(32:25):
if you happen to draw it yourself or whatnot,
how do you know to get to the point where it's like,
OK,
this is right.
What's,
what's the feeling you get or the,
the indicator that says,
yep,
this is something I,
I put my signature on.
Um Yeah,
that's a good question.
It's,
it's probably less Dan Antonelli than it is the,
the,
the amazing people that illustrate and develop these brands for me,
(32:48):
but they all know what the brand should subscribe to in terms of the attributes that it must have.
So we have a,
you know,
attributes like legibility,
um uniqueness in terms of style.
Um the manner in which the actual art is illustrated,
I think is somewhat signature to us uh very specific,
like we,
(33:08):
we have animators and illustrators that worked for us that have worked for Disney,
like it's a very,
very unique skill set,
but everything really has to be at a certain level in order for it to ever leave the leave here and be put out on the street.
And I think that that level is indicative of what we're known for.
Right.
So,
(33:28):
so,
you know,
it's really sometimes obviously it's a compliment to say,
oh my God,
that looks like kick charge.
Um because they recognize the quality and the level of detail and the,
the work that's put in to um build each of these brands.
And,
you know,
over the years,
you know,
we,
we've,
we've certainly had some things evolve in terms of styles and maybe we do things a little bit differently today than maybe we did 10 years ago.
(33:53):
But the foundations of what we do,
especially as it relates to a truck wrap were foundations of things that I learned.
Um when I was super young,
studying outdoor advertising and studying billboards especially.
So the idea of how you integrate a mark at a large scale,
how you make sure it's legible from a distance.
So the theory behind really great outdoor advertising,
(34:16):
especially billboards that really has a tremendous amount of influence in our work today because it's similar theories,
right?
I've got only one or two seconds to see and view and understand and distill what's being shown to me and remember it later on.
So,
you know,
I think that's part of our signature style is,
is really in,
(34:36):
you know,
infusing those things that were so predominant and really great billboard designs,
especially in the fifties and sixties.
You look at the way they used to be designed.
There's a lot of stuff from there that we really take into today,
Dan,
thanks so much for being here and uh thanks so much for uh taking the time to uh to ignite uh the brands and make these jump off the page.
(35:00):
So people can really,
it's a feeling,
it's a,
I think I can help people feel things and definitely I feel warm that you're here with me today.
So thank you so much.
Thank you brother.
Appreciate you Joe.
Welcome to the service MVP podcast.
My name is Joe Crisara America's Service Sales Coach and we have with us,
one of my dearest friends,
Dan Antonelli from KickCharge media,
Dan.
Welcome to the show.
I appreciate you being here.
What's up Joe?
How you doing,
brother?
Well,
it's definitely long overdue and got you on this podcast today.
And uh today we're gonna talk about brand transformation.
(00:25):
How the branding,
the sales equals success.
Does that make sense?
Uh That's gonna be the name of our show.
Uh Dan,
I really,
I just want to start by saying,
you know,
how did you wind up uh where you're at right now?
How did you,
uh So I know it's not an overnight success story,
but if you can,
if you could somehow limit it to five minutes and give us the thumbnail version of how you got from where you were to where you are now,
(00:47):
could you give us a little bit and then we're gonna talk about some of the transformation you have experienced with contractors.
Go ahead and tell us first about yourself,
Dan.
It,
it's definitely been an overnight success like 28 years of overnight,
you know,
the deal,
you know how long it takes.
So I started when I was 15 years old and I was really fascinated with hand lettering pinstriping cars and I was doing some signs and I think the first actual service van that I hand lettered in my parents' backyard was for a plumbing company.
(01:24):
I have pictures of it,
believe it or not.
And that's really how I got started is I started,
I started doing lettering on trucks working with these small businesses.
And I really wanted to be a sign painter.
Uh That was my goal.
I,
I got to work in a,
in a sign shop in Staten Island,
New York.
You may hear a little bit of my accent here.
(01:45):
And I told my parents,
I wanna be a sign painter and they were like,
well,
maybe you should go to college first and then see if that's something you really want to do.
So I wind up going to college and I studied advertising and communications.
And I,
and I find found that that experience actually was really valuable.
It would,
it really taught me a lot about marketing.
(02:07):
It taught me a lot about advertising,
taught me a lot about consumer psychology.
So many great things came out of that also taught me how to write very well.
So that I think helped me when I started writing books and,
and started doing some of those things.
So I graduated I started working as a graphic designer in New York City,
but I really missed working with all these entrepreneurs.
(02:28):
I was working for a health insurance company.
If you can imagine producing brochures,
it wasn't the most exciting line of business,
but it was a good job.
And I started the company on the side,
like so many entrepreneurs did working out of my basement.
And I remember my wife saying like you need to have 50,000 in sales if you want,
(02:49):
if you want to quit your day job,
so to speak.
So I was like,
OK,
that's my goal.
I gotta just do 50,000 in sales in one year.
And then,
and then I'll be able to quit.
And so that was really a grind,
that was really hard to do while I was commuting into New York City,
you know,
five days a week.
So I literally worked,
(03:09):
you know,
I'd come home from the train,
have a little bit of dinner and then I'd work from 7 to 12 in the morning.
And I,
and I did that for about a year to get through that sales goal,
right?
So I hit that sales goal and finally I was able to leave my job and start.
And when I started,
I just had this idea that that small businesses should have a place where they could go to get everything at once.
(03:33):
So that was really my mindset is like,
I could do the logo,
I can do their lettering on their truck and then I could do their brochure and at the time two websites were starting to come in and,
and,
and it's kind of ironic as I look around here today.
We have 30 employees here today.
And that's very much what we do is we,
we,
we provide a source for them to get so much of their marketing needs.
(03:56):
But all of it drives originally from that branding and that was something from a very early point on.
I was so passionate about,
I loved working with logos,
developing logos and then integrating those onto all these different platforms.
So it's been,
it's been a crazy journey.
Um We just hired our 30th employee last week and it's I'm just surrounded by so much talent that,
(04:24):
you know,
I feel like I don't do much anymore,
like they just do everything because everything is,
I don't need to do anything because they just kill it for me.
So it's been great.
It's been a great journey.
Well,
you know,
uh we do share a quite a few clients and I,
I would say the one,
the absolute 12 punch that I know people say,
well,
how do I get my company as well?
(04:45):
First of all,
I even see people that come to us and I go well,
I think you need to look at that brand uh because it's gonna make it way harder for us to get credibility and all the rest of it.
Uh,
you know,
when,
when I would find my job is,
which is to teach people how,
you know,
provide value after the doorbell rings is way easier when you do it before the doorbell rings.
(05:06):
So,
Da Dave,
of course,
now,
uh,
you know,
you have,
uh,
turned into a,
uh,
industry icon.
Dan,
you know,
it's like,
it's like now it's like,
you know,
nobody goes anywhere without seeing Dan Antonelli speaking at a conference or all that part of it.
What's it feel like now to achieve?
Because considering the time when you're starting out trying to make that 50,000 in a year,
(05:27):
uh what,
what's it?
Can you have to pinch yourself sometimes?
What's it like right now for Dennis?
And I,
I gotta say it's a little surreal.
I spoke at Tommy Mellow's event last November.
And for me that just felt like almost like validation of decades of really a lot of work.
(05:48):
So we,
we would sometimes go to these trade shows and nobody would come to our booth like no one knew who we were and,
and suddenly we're at this event and it's not suddenly,
I mean,
over the years,
obviously,
we've,
we've gained a lot of traction,
but we were at this event and I brought seven team members with me to this event because we knew we were going to be pretty busy at the booth and things like that.
(06:09):
And we literally had all seven of us talking to people and there were lines of people waiting to talk to us.
And I was just like,
wow,
you know,
we've really gone from where not too many people really knew what we did and how we could help them to being recognized as,
you know,
one of the best or the best at what we do.
(06:30):
And that's just a lot of hard work that's taken to get there,
you know,
obsessiveness,
certainly with practicing our craft and being the best we possibly can.
And also just the mindset of the people that we have here and what we love is the ability to change lives.
And I think that that's ultimately what we focused so hard on over the last decade is knowing how critical our task is and working with the mindset that,
(06:56):
that respon is so critical and accepting that responsibility and embracing it and knowing that,
hey,
if we do our jobs,
well,
we can really change the trajectory of so many of these,
these companies.
And I think what's happened is those companies have really become our biggest cheerleaders.
(07:17):
So like,
we don't really advertise other than maybe going to some trade shows when I'm speaking at them and things like that.
But we don't really market in,
in a traditional way.
And we're just so fortunate that I feel like all our customers,
they really do our marketing for us because you know,
someone will post online.
Here's my new truck wrap.
What do you think?
Or I'm thinking about getting this truck wrap and,
(07:38):
you know,
and if it's not done well,
like we'll get tagged and,
you know,
talk to Dan before we do this or,
or even read Dan's book.
I mean,
not everyone can use us,
which is totally fine.
But the reason why I wrote the book,
um about home service branding is because I felt like,
again,
no information about it really exists.
And then I just wanted people to have a resource to learn more about it.
(08:02):
So you understand what you're buying,
regardless of who you use.
You,
you are educated on the topic.
Yeah.
Yeah,
I think,
I think a lot of times when it's very similar to my bus,
my business,
when people arrive at my door,
like they arrive at your door,
it,
it's already pretty much ready to ready to go.
Uh,
it's just a matter of,
uh,
getting all the details and how do you,
how does,
how does it work?
(08:23):
Right.
Uh Let's talk about,
let's put,
let's put the focus on where it belongs on the contractors that have made both you and I successful.
What do you think of that?
Let's tell,
let's tell some stories because those are the real stars,
right?
Those are the ones that have done it.
So let's talk about like I want to first start,
but I'm gonna put him in the front of the line because I know he'd want to be right in front if he was here with us,
(08:44):
Tommy Melo and a one garage door.
That was one of the first,
that's one of the first places that you and I really got to know each other very well.
Uh Work,
I work with his team.
You work with his team.
Uh Tell us about,
uh,
if you could tell us a story about meeting him because I know he is,
he fills up a room with his presence and I know that you probably had to pump the brakes.
Say that Tommy,
(09:04):
we're gonna do it this way.
Uh And tell me,
tell me a little bit about that and how that uh how that relationship has uh grown.
And what do you be seen in the A one team when you first met him compared to what the transformation is?
Now,
let's talk about transformation if we can.
Ok.
Well,
I think the interesting thing with working with Tommy is the idea of his mindset of being not complacent.
(09:27):
So at the time that we rebranded him,
he was like a $40 million company.
We do work for companies at that level,
but not nearly as many are willing to reinvest into branding.
And Tommy had a vision of where he wanted to go with the company and how much revenue he wanted to get and how he wanted to grow it and he knew instinctively,
(09:50):
I think that what he had wasn't going to get him there,
even though it had got him to the 40 million,
he,
he was just facing so much pressure from a marketing perspective that it was costing so much more money on marketing.
How can I basically get it to be a household name instead?
So I'm less reliant on Google,
I'm less reliant on paid advertising and I'm leveraging,
(10:14):
you know,
these 50 or 60 or 70 trucks that I have at my disposal.
How do I leverage that opportunity?
Um And so I think the interesting thing is is that he came to me from a place of,
of not basically being complacent with what he had and knowing that it wasn't gonna get him to where he wanted to go.
(10:36):
And that takes some guts that takes putting your ego aside,
that takes,
you know,
respecting the expertise of,
of another person and,
and putting their hands,
put,
you know,
in,
in,
into that person.
And I think,
I think working with him was,
was easier than you would imagine.
Like,
honestly,
(10:56):
like,
you know,
I've worked with many big companies and there were so many layers,
there was so much bureaucracy.
Let me get this person's opinion.
Let me get this person's opinion.
And basically me and Tommy through text had the entire branding done probably in a week.
Wow.
Well,
you know what I've learned about you,
Dan is that you have definite boundaries when it comes to,
(11:18):
you know,
like,
like you,
you're kind of like me where you say you'd be willing to take 100% uh,
of the accountability.
As long as you let me do it the way I need to do it.
Right.
I've,
I've heard many of my contractors I've sent to you.
It's like,
yeah,
what do you think of these?
And I'm like,
well,
all I do know is that every time he wins every time.
And so,
(11:39):
and so I remember it was the one where you had a,
a polar bear in San Diego.
And they're like,
this isn't gonna work.
It's,
as I said,
dude,
this guy knows,
so,
you know,
just go with the flow on this.
And so tell me about a little bit about that and also is like,
we have other,
other clients of scores,
but,
you know,
uh,
Tommy seems like the kind of guy and he's worked with me the same way,
Joe just do what you do best.
(12:00):
That's really,
I think one of the strengths of Tommy Bellow,
don't you think?
Yeah,
no,
100%.
And I look at some of our most successful brands ever.
And those are the ones run by owners that really trust the process and say damn,
what do you think we should do?
I'm stealing your phrase by the way,
what should we do?
What should we do?
You can take it so,
(12:22):
when that happens,
I feel like from a creative perspective,
it's usually some of the best brands we've ever done because they're not trying to fit into a preconceived notion of what the brand should be.
And I think that's a lot of times the biggest obstacle is they see kind of what other people have done,
whether it's using the stereotypical sun and snowflakes or,
(12:45):
or,
you know,
that type of fire and ice kind of look and they see people doing that and that's sort of where their mindset is,
is that it,
it should be similar to that.
So then when you're asking them to do something that feels different,
that feels contrary to what their instincts are.
I get it like that feels unnatural like that seems weird.
(13:05):
Right.
Why would we do that?
But that's sort of where it takes the guts to say we're going to do something different,
we're gonna do something more disruptive.
Um,
because if you're going to build a brand that blends in,
you certainly don't need me to do that.
Right.
And then again,
you're back to the same position that you're leaving,
relying on Google and,
and all these other paid avenues to have people remember your brand,
(13:26):
the whole mind,
the whole idea behind what we're doing.
It's not rocket science,
right?
The whole idea is how do I rent space in your head,
period?
Like you could distill it,
you could,
you could distill it to that simple fact,
how do I rent space in people's heads for free?
And the,
and the,
and the way I can do it is if I can do something that feels like something they haven't seen before and if I can do it and make them also feel something about who they're hiring,
(13:55):
then I make your job easier.
Right.
I make it so I control what they think before you ring the doorbell and that's,
that's,
that's the beauty of it.
I mean,
that's really what branding is doing is it's having people believe something about you before you even get to ring the doorbell.
And that's how you get the higher average tickets.
That's how you get the better clothes ratios.
(14:15):
Um That's how you get the better booking rates.
Like,
like I feel like this isn't rocket science,
right?
But that's ultimately what we're doing,
you know,
I do,
I do have a question,
I'm gonna say for you at the end uh because it's probably a question nobody's really,
I asked you but something I have a feeling inside that I just want to bring that up,
but let's move on to Ken Goodrich and Gel,
which is probably the most iconic brand.
(14:36):
I think I've seen everybody sees that.
It's like,
that's just beautiful.
That brand tell me about how is Ken Goodrich the same thing you would think that Ken Goodrich would be uh you know,
because he's such a huge presence that he would kind of want to take control of that.
But it looks like by everything I've seen,
you must have been given free license to create what you want there too.
Yeah,
we,
we had the idea of,
(14:58):
of the story that was going to be crafted about the boy holding the flashlight.
And so we needed to figure out how to,
how to visually tell that story right?
There was gonna be an ad campaign that would supplement that storyline,
but I needed visually to represent that idea.
So that brand story really had to be built around the boy and him holding that flashlight.
(15:23):
But you couldn't just put a boy there,
you had to have the right feeling with it,
the right emotion with it.
And so we sort of played off the idea of how Norman Rockwell used to illustrate his,
his paintings.
Um And,
and we initially believe it or not,
it's a kind of a funny story,
but I literally had a neighbor who is 10 years old,
(15:44):
which was the exact age that we wanted to be represented in the visual.
And so I bought him overalls and I bought him the,
the basically the newspaper cap kind of thing and,
and we dressed him up and we did a photoshoot and he actually was holding the,
the,
the,
the,
you know,
diagonal badge of the ghetto logo and we had him holding it because we wanted to look natural in terms of figuring out how to pose him.
(16:10):
We get all this stuff done,
right?
And send it to Ken.
Ken loves it.
It's all good.
We start the render process.
And then at the last minute,
Ken said,
what if we made the boy,
my son Duncan and I was like,
Ken,
you know,
this is,
you know,
information that might have been useful to me like 60 or 70 hours ago before we started actually rendering this guy um this little boy.
(16:37):
So um he sent us some pictures of,
of his son.
Um None of them had the right lighting,
none of them were at the right angle.
Um And we had a sort of manufacture this pose of his son Duncan um holding the sign and then we rendered it and,
and you know,
people,
you know,
forget that he wasn't huge at the time.
(16:57):
I mean,
ghetto wasn't a big company.
It was a failing company when,
when Ken acquired it and,
and he turned it around,
but that was really the most important.
First step in that turnaround was getting that brand,
getting that story out and having people understand um what that experience would be like again working with this company.
So,
so you get that warm feeling and you get the feeling that they're not gonna rip me off,
(17:19):
they're gonna treat me fairly,
they believe in old fashioned values,
honesty,
integrity,
those are all sort of the things that that brand.
Um was really communicating.
Yeah.
Yeah.
How about,
let's go on to our current uh new champion and uh and the place order our visionary icon uh at Grasshopper Services up in Albany,
(17:41):
New York.
And you got Amanda Triolo and Kelly Osterlich who runs that team and that crew.
I mean,
I was just up there and everything is,
everything is grasshopper and uh I,
I didn't really see it until I lived in the environment.
It's one of the few places I have a chance to go to and really experience,
I call the,
we do a thing called Total immersion.
(18:02):
Uh Certainly,
I think I felt like the Dan Antonelli Total immersion in the brand there for sure because they,
they do so much to uh use that.
Uh they use that brand in so many different ways.
Uh Let's what about your experience with Grasshopper Services and Amanda?
Sure,
when Amanda came to us,
you know,
it was right after COVID,
you know,
had had happened,
(18:23):
she ran primarily commercial HVAC and the governor of New York had shut them down.
So now she's trying to pivot into doing,
into doing residential and she came to me and the name of the company at the time was PP MA Comfort Services or P MA Comfort Solutions,
something like that.
And I want you to departure.
(18:44):
That's a pretty significant departure there,
you know.
So I want you to give me a brand for P MA Comfort and I'm like,
I'm like,
Amanda,
like I know what you are trying to accomplish,
but I'm not gonna help you if that's what you need to keep because it's not gonna move the needle for you.
It's not gonna accomplish what you want.
You can't break into residential with a name like that because it's just,
(19:06):
it's just gonna require so much money and so much effort to get people to understand that.
Um,
and,
and at first,
I mean,
she tells a story that she was,
um you know,
disappointed that I wouldn't work with her.
And,
you know,
I,
I of course,
gave her the reasons why and then she tried to move on and keep it going with the P MA and it just wasn't working out.
(19:27):
So then she reached back out to me,
she said,
OK,
I'm ready.
Um I'm ready to change.
And so um we came up with the name Grasshopper for her.
I actually came up with that name myself.
Interestingly enough,
I didn't know all the things about a grasshopper at the time,
but she had really a strong focus on the environmental aspect of H VAC.
And she wanted that sort of notion to be part of the,
(19:50):
the brand story as one thing.
But we,
we came to learn that grasshoppers can only move forward as a,
as an instinct,
they can't actually go backwards.
And so that became really a storyline for her culture,
you know,
forward as a way of life became their tagline.
And as a company,
we will continue to move forward,
(20:10):
we will elevate our employees,
we will help them move forward,
we will help our customers move forward.
Um And so it became really,
really central to their entire culture.
And so when you think about branding,
yes,
we created a really cool logo and a really cool truck wrap and all their wall wraps and everything like that was fine.
Um But the thing that came out of it was really from a cultural perspective.
(20:31):
Um you know,
what was built afterwards and it's just incredible.
I mean,
what she's built and what she's been able to accomplish in only three years.
She's coming up on three years in,
in two weeks.
And I think they're,
they're at almost 20 million in revenue and maybe beyond 20 million in revenue now.
But to go from 100,000 to 20 in three years is insane.
(20:51):
They're gonna have a Grasshopper Day on February 1st and uh uh my wife Julie will be joining you there.
She,
I heard you're gonna go to that event and my wife Julie,
who's the president of our company will be there as well.
So you get to meet her and uh celebrate Grasshopper Day the third anniversary.
And together,
I can't tell you a story though.
It's really interesting.
Uh I was there and I was,
(21:13):
it was a customer concern that came in,
listen to this story.
You're gonna love this.
You can tell this one at your conferences and stuff like that.
Uh She was a customer concern and the customer was upset about something and they were talking about some kind of a,
you know,
second recall or call back.
And uh the,
the customer used the brand uh statement.
(21:34):
They go,
he's like,
well,
you guys are trying to do everything you can,
I can see that that makes me happy.
So let's do what you tell us to do,
which is move forward.
That's the forwards way of life.
You,
you got the customer said,
f forward is a way of life like you guys say.
So let's move forward and get,
get this thing done.
It was funny how the customer used the brand uh statement in at the end of the whole conversation.
(21:58):
It's like,
well,
let's just do what you say we should do,
which is to move forward.
So it was interesting how uh the whole community was brain is the kind of been uh you know,
conditioned or trained on the way that grasshopper moves in that way,
right?
So it's a really interesting story and,
and really,
I see everybody there and you know,
it's funny because even when the decisions I see they make,
(22:18):
it's like,
well,
we do know we're gonna move forward,
we can let's not get stuck.
So in a way what it represents to them is that they're not stuck in certain thing.
And that's really,
I think uh you could probably speak to that to the brand,
the branding,
which is that it goes beyond just like a logo,
you know,
so people I need a logo,
right?
Uh But you can see that when I went there,
I could experience that depth of the brand uh to about that.
(22:42):
Tell me how proud you were of those type of uh those type of stories when you hear those kind of things,
I mean,
I I got to be in her space as well and walk through it and see all the wall wraps and everything that we've created there.
And you see the enthusiasm,
you see the energy of the people there.
And you know,
there's one thing that people I think that initially hire us don't understand is how the brand affects culture,
(23:07):
right?
So they hire us initially because they're like,
I,
I wanna get a really cool logo and a really cool truck wrap design.
Then we do those things and then they're like,
oh my God recruitment is so much easier because people want to work here like they think that that we've got something going on.
It also signals to the to the existing employees that we're not content with status quo.
(23:28):
Like we have a plan on where we want to take this and rebranding is,
is one step that's gonna help us get us further into um the dream that we have about growing this company.
So,
you see,
you know,
she's really the embodiment of all,
all of those aspects and she doesn't have a recruitment problem.
She doesn't have trouble finding people.
She,
if anything,
(23:49):
she's got too many people that wanna work there because you walk into that space and Joe,
you've been in 100 you know,
environments like that,
not like that,
but you've been in 100 you know,
uh offices for hr companies and,
and I bet you you've never seen anything like that.
Ken's like is like that Ken Ken's in,
in Vegas is,
is really on par with what Amanda has done there for sure.
(24:12):
But outside of those two,
I don't think you've probably been in an environment that has that same energy and that same vibe that you,
you,
you,
you see there and it's just incredible the energy that her teammates have and as a leader of what she's been able to build there,
it's just,
you know,
I'm in awe when I,
when I go there,
I just,
I just can't believe what she's been able to accomplish at.
(24:33):
Yeah,
I think the difference I've seen Dan is that I've seen contractors who have used you and fully committed to uh the branding,
not just uh on the,
on the outside of the building or on the trucks,
but when you walk in the building,
it's a grasshopper.
The,
the,
the brand colors are represented in every room.
Uh there,
there's a uh the,
the,
(24:53):
the grasshopper is hopping off the wall in one case or,
you know,
they got,
they got every single wall in every single office is representing the brand or the story or a slogan or something that uh is there.
So it's,
it's kind of like,
reminds me,
I would say the guys like ghetto over at Vegas and also at Amanda's place,
it's like a theme park of the brand in a way.
(25:15):
Does that make sense?
So I think it,
I think it goes beyond the uh the like the stage is ok,
let's get the brand for the company,
but also for the trucks for the uniforms,
for the,
for the inside of the place.
Tell me how that uh has transformed your business and uh to continue because they don't because after the initial thing,
it's like,
ok,
we got a,
we got a logo and then it's like,
(25:36):
well,
hang on,
we're not done yet,
right?
Tell us about,
tell us about how continues on or even before getting to that too.
I think the the real interesting thing with,
with Amanda is what would have happened if I said yes to her when she first came to me.
Hm.
You know what would have happened if I said sure,
Amanda,
I'll take your money and I'll do a logo for P MA comfort.
(25:58):
Like would she have gotten to build what she's built around that culture?
On P MA comfort and,
and that's the part too where,
you know,
for us,
it's really important that we are always really taking that into consideration as far as doing,
doing the right thing.
And it honestly wasn't the right thing for her and I wasn't interested in doing it because I knew it wasn't gonna help her.
(26:21):
So,
so we say no to people sometimes not because anything else other than it's not the right thing that you're asking us to do for you.
And I'd rather not cash your check,
delivering something that I know won't add value.
It's just not the way I roll here and it's not the way we roll here.
Um But going back to the other point too is sure you,
you get this logo and,
(26:42):
and now it's being infused and how do you roll it out?
How do you let the customers know about it?
How do you let the employees know why you did it?
There's a,
there's a process that you have to follow.
There's like a road map to follow,
to do it successfully.
So making sure that customers know it's the same great company,
right?
Your warranties are still in,
in place.
We didn't get bought out by private equity,
(27:04):
you know,
they,
they have all these questions and you've got to make sure you have the communication channels open to answer those questions.
Um And then yes,
it's,
it's the uniforms,
it's the business cards it's the membership brochures.
It's the wall wraps,
it's making sure that any time a customer is going to interact with your brand,
it is consistently telling that same story and delivering that same message.
(27:27):
And you could look at any single piece of marketing that Amanda puts out whether it's on social,
whether it's the brochure,
anything and you know,
right away which company is being represented by that advertisement and,
and that marketing and,
and you know,
again,
sometimes people get that wrong is they,
they don't embrace it fully and they have stuff that's the wrong font,
(27:48):
the wrong colors,
the wrong uniforms and stuff like that drives me insane.
But,
but I get it,
it takes time to,
to roll all those things in.
But certainly that has to be the goal.
But I think the one thing that we realize is that the companies that are very successful with this,
they,
the owners do a great job of protecting the integrity of the brand.
(28:10):
Uh,
and having like,
I think,
I think in a way you're,
then you go beyond just sign maker by far because the fact that you got boundaries,
I,
I always say here's a phrase you can borrow from us too.
We have a service MVP.
We say I'd rather turn you down than let you down.
Makes it make sense there.
So it's very similar to what you're talk.
(28:30):
We have the same thing here and I think that speaks to the integrity of what you're about to get.
Like,
yeah,
these are somebody who,
uh,
they're not just gonna take me out as a client,
they gotta make sure that they get able to do it their way.
But I think that the owners of the companies that work with you,
I see that and it's like,
you know what,
I'm gonna make sure that the brand is represented in a way that is the integrity of the colors,
(28:51):
the integrity of the message,
the integrity of the logo.
There's no,
there's no changing anything.
It's like this is what we got.
Uh And definitely,
I think that's what do you think about that part?
You know,
the,
you probably don't realize that the amount what people get from you by example and how that's helped them as well.
Yeah.
You know,
it's funny because I'm,
I become Facebook friends with so many owners after we do the branding and maybe they'll post something that their social media person put out and I'll screenshot it and I'll send them a message and I'm like,
(29:22):
this is the wrong font.
That's the wrong colors.
Just have them follow the brand guides that we set up for you and they're like,
oh my God,
you're right.
Like I,
I,
so like I try to do my best with that to make sure that,
you know,
little even littlest things like the wrong font that drives me because you,
your corporate brand guidelines have one or two very specific and deliberately chosen fonts that every single thing you put out on the street should be using.
(29:48):
You think that's well,
well,
why does it have to be that font?
Well,
it has to be that font because it was very deliberately chosen to match attributes of your actual logo.
Like there's a thought process behind every single thing that we're recommending that you integrate.
So sometimes you see that or it'll be the wrong shade of blue or something like that and I'll just,
you know,
friendly reminder,
hey,
(30:08):
just make sure the next time you do something like try to follow this instead and just give them some guidance.
But,
you know,
I,
I sort of want say,
you know,
if you think of Seinfeld and the Soup Nazi,
well,
maybe I'm like a brand Nazi because I really want to make sure everything is done at a service put on your business card.
But,
ok,
you know,
everything needs to be done at that standard um because it represents your company.
(30:33):
So I,
I don't care if it's the smallest thing that's going out that has your name on it,
it better be branded in the,
in the right manner.
Otherwise,
why did we invest all this money in building a brand?
So,
well,
Dan,
uh I always say a great podcast starts on time and even a better one ends on time.
So why don't we go ahead and just tell people how they get a hold of you and uh at kick charge creative and uh see how people get,
(30:56):
how can they get on the wait list if you will,
uh to see about how they can do business with you?
Sure.
Um Our waitlist right now actually isn't too bad because we've been hiring like crazy.
So we're only booked out about two months or so right now,
which is much better than the seven or eight months we used to be booked out.
So we,
we hired seven brand developers.
(31:16):
So we have seven full time brand developers on staff,
um five or six graphic design.
So we're,
we're much better space there.
But if you want to get in touch with us,
you can,
you can go to kick charge.com if you want to learn more just about branding your home service business.
You can pick up this book,
it's called Branded Not Bland and you could get it on our site at Kick charge.com/books or you could get it on Amazon.
(31:42):
Um As well,
Dan,
thank you so much for being here and thanks for so much for helping uh literally hundreds of thousands of people live the dream of uh working for brands that have a meaning and,
and that's one thing I do want to follow up with the,
the very philosophy I had a question for you,
right?
It's like,
how do you know when you look at something because here's what I can see.
(32:02):
I think everybody else sees the same thing.
It's hidden in plain sight.
Like,
as soon as they see something,
it's like,
that's Dan Antonelli like.
Uh so it's almost like a Picasso like,
you know,
it's like,
it's something,
it's like that has to be Dan Antonelli on that one.
What do you get that feel?
What's it?
What do you,
when you,
when you finally look at a brand that somebody's developed maybe one of your artists or even yourself,
(32:25):
if you happen to draw it yourself or whatnot,
how do you know to get to the point where it's like,
OK,
this is right.
What's,
what's the feeling you get or the,
the indicator that says,
yep,
this is something I,
I put my signature on.
Um Yeah,
that's a good question.
It's,
it's probably less Dan Antonelli than it is the,
the,
the amazing people that illustrate and develop these brands for me,
(32:48):
but they all know what the brand should subscribe to in terms of the attributes that it must have.
So we have a,
you know,
attributes like legibility,
um uniqueness in terms of style.
Um the manner in which the actual art is illustrated,
I think is somewhat signature to us uh very specific,
like we,
(33:08):
we have animators and illustrators that worked for us that have worked for Disney,
like it's a very,
very unique skill set,
but everything really has to be at a certain level in order for it to ever leave the leave here and be put out on the street.
And I think that that level is indicative of what we're known for.
Right.
So,
(33:28):
so,
you know,
it's really sometimes obviously it's a compliment to say,
oh my God,
that looks like kick charge.
Um because they recognize the quality and the level of detail and the,
the work that's put in to um build each of these brands.
And,
you know,
over the years,
you know,
we,
we've,
we've certainly had some things evolve in terms of styles and maybe we do things a little bit differently today than maybe we did 10 years ago.
(33:53):
But the foundations of what we do,
especially as it relates to a truck wrap were foundations of things that I learned.
Um when I was super young,
studying outdoor advertising and studying billboards especially.
So the idea of how you integrate a mark at a large scale,
how you make sure it's legible from a distance.
So the theory behind really great outdoor advertising,
(34:16):
especially billboards that really has a tremendous amount of influence in our work today because it's similar theories,
right?
I've got only one or two seconds to see and view and understand and distill what's being shown to me and remember it later on.
So,
you know,
I think that's part of our signature style is,
is really in,
(34:36):
you know,
infusing those things that were so predominant and really great billboard designs,
especially in the fifties and sixties.
You look at the way they used to be designed.
There's a lot of stuff from there that we really take into today,
Dan,
thanks so much for being here and uh thanks so much for uh taking the time to uh to ignite uh the brands and make these jump off the page.
(35:00):
So people can really,
it's a feeling,
it's a,
I think I can help people feel things and definitely I feel warm that you're here with me today.
So thank you so much.
Thank you brother.
Appreciate you Joe.
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