September 5, 2022 • 20 mins
Monetizing TIF
Tax increment financing (TIF) is a financing tool that has been used by municipalities for redevelopment, and infrastructure, projects for over 40 years. TIF was designed to help with the unexpected additional costs of a project like an environmental issue or developing streets and storm drains. TIF can help reimburse some of the additional developer’s costs. Emily Blaylock, president of Untamed Equity explains how TIF helps both municipalities and developers with redevelopment projects. We also discuss TIF Monetization as a way to supercharge the tool to handle TIF eligible costs over time by monetizing the future cash flows through the reimbursement of property taxes paid by the developer, based on the net present cash flow stream to offer a lump sum loan amount based on a margining of the net value upfront.
More About TIF Monentization at Untamed Equity: www.untamedequity.com
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Tax increment financing, or TIFF,
has been used by municipalitiesfor more than 40 years.
It allows local governments to investin public infrastructure and other
improvements upfront then paylater for those investments.
This program not only helps
municipalities, but also helpsdevelopers with their project costs.
(00:21):
Like any financial program,there's a lot of rules and regulations
to understand before you cantake advantage of the program.
We invited Emily Blaylock,president of Untamed Equity,
to help us better understand howTIF works and how to monetize TIF.
Today on Small Business Talks.
(00:45):
Tax increment financing, or TIFF,
is a public financing method that's usedas a subsidy for redevelopment
infrastructure and othercommunity improvement projects.
It's an effective way to stimulatedevelopment in communities.
But like all programs, there'sa lot to understand about it.
To help us better understand TIFF and moreimportantly, the monetization of TIFF.
(01:09):
We have Emily Blaylock, the presidentof untained Equity, with us today.
Welcome, Emily.Hi, Neil.
Thank you for having me.
Certainly glad to have you on board.
I think we want to start off with because
a lot of people listen to thisas they hear the word TIFF.
Could you maybe just give kind of a brief
overview of what exactly is TIFFand what's the purpose of it?
(01:32):
Yeah.
So TIFF Tax Increment.
Financing is a tool that's been around
for many years that municipalities can useto kind of help with other costs that come
into play with developingthat infrastructure for a project.
(01:55):
Because Things Come Up.
Like a project can have environmental
issues, or there's an abandonedbuilding that needs to be rehabbed.
And there's a bunch of different
additional costs that come in with thatwhich fall under TIFF eligible costs.
But ideally, it's that horizontalbuild of the structure.
So it's your roads, your infrastructure,your water, your sewer.
(02:17):
Those are Tip eligible costs.
And so when that happens,there could be additional things.
That developer comes to the tableand says, well, I can definitely do this
project and build this new or fix upthat abandoned building and bring
additional value and taxrevenues to the district.
However, it doesn't quitework with the numbers.
(02:40):
And we've all been there to look atprojects and understand that can happen.
And in that case, the city can use TIFF as
a tool to reimburse back the developersome of those additional costs.
Okay, so the idea is to get that asthe program and the way it works.
(03:03):
And the goal that we're talking abouttoday is how do you monetize that?
How do you actually get the moneyout of the TIFF program?
Yeah, there are generally all sorts
of ways that manipulates,handle TIFF and using that as a tool.
But one thing that we like to think about
from untamed equity is that we canreally supercharge that TIFF as a tool.
(03:25):
And what I mean by that is that,generally speaking,
when I talked about TIFF,the city will reimburse back the developer
some portion of those costs,those TIFF eligible costs over time.
And what untamed equity can do is comein and monetize those future increment
(03:45):
cash flows that we know are coming in asa reimbursement back to the developer.
And generally those are in the form
of the reimbursement of propertytaxes that are paid by the developer.
And then we look@that.net present valuecash flow stream and offer a lump sum loan
amount based on a marginal of that netpresent value cash flow stream.
(04:10):
Okay.
Because this is something a little bitdifferent than what's out there, isn't it?
This is something a little bitunique in the marketplace.
Yeah, that's why I say it's kind of yes,the tool of TIFF has been around
to reimburse that developerback for expenses.
But what we're really doing is adding
that additional valueto those payments by offering those
(04:32):
payments to be reimbursed to the developerup front so we can fund that gap equity.
It turns out to be gap equity that comesinto the project because at the end
of the day, we all wantto get that project finished.
The city wants that project finished,
and the end user wants to usethat project or development.
(04:54):
And of course the developers arethere to get it to the finish line.
But there are ways to obviously fund
that upfront that we providerather than having the city do it.
Okay.And like I said, that's unique because
that's something that I know is kindof new to the marketplace on that.
So what do you need to getstarted on a project?
(05:16):
Yeah, for us, lookingat a project really is simple.
It's a draft or a form of developmentagreement that the developer
and the municipality has enteredinto and then
that first draft of maybe the projectionsof what that tax increment looks like.
So again, we're going off of those futureproperty taxes that are going to be
(05:39):
assessed on that project that thatdeveloper is going to get and build.
This certainly sounds like it's a great
stimulus because that seems likethat would be one of the big headaches
of doing any kind of a project,especially when you have new costs come
in and try to figure out whereis this going to come from?
So I think this is somethingthat would definitely help this one.
Obviously you've thought of that.I'm just the outsider.
(06:01):
Bring that to the table.
So what is the timeline of whereyou fit in with the deal process?
I know you mentioned it's out whenthe agreement's been done,
but maybe walk us througha little bit where you come into this.
It always varies per deal,but the best starting point is when
(06:24):
the developer is in that draft formwith the municipality because
at that point we can discuss some nuancesthat are within development agreements.
So today development agreementsaren't consistent across the US.
And so each municipality works within
their statutes and stuffto create development agreements.
(06:46):
So there's a lot of reviewing of thatdevelopment agreement that happens.
So the best stage is when that developmentagreement is in draft form
with the developerand there is particularly to make it
a more lendableproject,
(07:08):
there is an enhancement to addto the development agreement that we like
to talk about, which is the minimum Eav orminimum equalized assess value or
a minimum guaranteed tax payment languagethat goes into that development agreement.
Now that's a lot of acronyms there,but really what that's kind of saying is
(07:31):
that, hey, everybody at the table,the municipality, the developer and us as
a lender can come in and say,we all agree that this developer
and the city is going to buildthis project for a certain value.
We have the costs that go into theproject, so we know those costs.
(07:52):
Okay, we're all agreeing that the minimum
value of this project is going to be,for example, $10 million.
And then if we have that starting pointkind of assessed in that development
agreement, then we all knowfrom an underwriting standpoint where's
that increment really goingto fall on an annual basis.
And increment beingthat property tax calculation.
(08:13):
You mentioned a little bit about nuances.
Can you give me a couple of examplesof what would be some of those nuances?
Yeah, so as I mentioned, every developmentagreement kind of is different.
There are a couple of different waysthat municipalities can traditionally,
I'm not going to speak to every way,but there are many different ways
that municipalities kind of writethose development agreements.
(08:36):
And one is as a pay as you go tips,
which means that the developerin the city,
in their development agreement,they're basically stating that every year
the developer is going to get x percentof that property tax, rebate it back.
So it's a very simplified form of saying
exactly, you know, kind of whatthat developer is going to get.
(08:58):
Another form is in a TIFF note where
the city is issuing that TIFFnote for a set principal amount.
Again, that's the amount that's goingto be reimbursed back to the developer.
Then there's also revenueobligation bonds.
That a city issue.And again, these are not obligations
that the city is actually goingto report on their financial statements.
(09:23):
This is just a mechanism to be ableto pay those funds over the year.
But there are different nuances to eachone of those and how we monetize those,
but we can monetize all of those typesof incremental payments that come back.
But some of the other nuances that I'llspeak to is oftentimes TIFF is granted
(09:45):
with the caveat of job creationfor the area.
And so we all like that.
We all want to have job creation in there.
However, I will caution that it getsreally tedious if a municipality is going
to say, hey, create 100 jobs, all at thissalary for the life of that development.
(10:09):
Because at the end of the day,
the lender and the developer and the cityall have to report on those numbers.
For that action item.
So you just want to be cautious that youdon't create a more of a reporting issue
in what you really wantto accomplish of creating that job.
So that's one nuance that we've,
(10:31):
we've seen sometimeswe've also seen some caveats around
reaching an IRR for the projectby the developer, and that means internal
rate of return for the developer and sothey have to reach a certain return.
And that's okay to have that in there,again, it's just being mindful of that.
(10:53):
That is what it is.
And we all have to calculate those numbersand understand what that really means.
So it's one extra step in the development
agreement that we want to be surethat everyone understands what we're
actually accountingfor with those nuances.
Okay, thank you.
Are there any red flags that wouldstop you from monetizing TIFF?
(11:17):
And if there are, what would those be?
What are some examplesof what those would be?
Yeah, so that is kind of what I just spoke
to there, which is about ifwe have a set number of jobs.
For example, is one red flag where yeah,okay, now we're making this really
complicated where we have to upkeepand make sure because ultimately
(11:40):
us as the lender in this situationand the developer, we're both on the hook
there to adhere to thatdevelopment agreement.
We want to make sure that that developmentagreement is in line and being followed.
And so some of those certificationsthat can come across create additional
(12:00):
work and reporting from ourresponsibility as well as the developers.
Okay, so that's one.
And then the other one is if we have anyclawback clauses that once the developer
reaches a certain return on theirinvestment, that there's a clawback
from the municipality that canput some things into question.
(12:22):
Because again, we're all trying just
to predict where that incrementis going to come out so that can create
some question marks along the lendableside perspective.
Can you touch base on where you havedone some of these monetization deals?
Yeah, so currentlyover the last about a year and a half or
(12:47):
so, we've really kindof grown our portfolio.
And so today we're in nine states,and that would be Iowa, Illinois,
Minnesota, Wisconsin, Kansas,Texas, Nebraska, Ohio and Oklahoma.
I think I got them all.
But we're in nine states today
(13:08):
and just a fun number that we've beencalculating based on project costs
invested, we've helped get $450,000,000in economic development done.
Wow.
So it's fun.
That does sound like fun.
I got to ask you though, what haveyou learned from those initial deals?
Is there anything that sticks out or
(13:29):
anything you've learned along the waythat you're allowed to share?
That you're allowed to share?Yeah, right.
I think the biggest thing and again,it kind of goes back to that this is fun,
we're here to help in economicdevelopment and that is fun.
To see that is fun to geta project to completion.
And oftentimes
(13:51):
this tool is not used enough to help geta project to completion to monetize
that and provide that additionalgap equity to the table.
And so I think that what we've learned is
that TIFF in general is verysimilar across the states.
(14:11):
But as I mentioned before,every development agreement is different.
So there can be many different items.
And as we joke in the lending world,
hair on deals that come up and you gotto solve and fires you got to put out.
So you learn things allthe time about these deals.
(14:32):
But the important thing is that we can useour expertise to basically create
that consistency across the board andacross the US with this type of program.
That was one of the reasons that I washappy to have you on the podcast,
is because I think there isn't enoughpeople that actually know all about this.
They hear the word TIFF.
I think people know a basicunderstanding of it.
(14:55):
That's why it's very important to kindof bring this more forward and see what
the benefits of it, especiallythe monetization part of it.
Because I think you're right.
We're right now in timesthat what do we need?
We need financing for infrastructureand for improving neighborhoods and all
that because it just seems likeit's a tough road of ho right now.
(15:15):
So it's one of thoseto kind of go through that.
So I think you've alreadytouched base on this.
But just kind of to reiterate,
how does monetizing TIFF enhancethe return on the investment?
Yeah.
So without getting into a lot of financialhat analysis here at this point.
Really the point around that isthat instead of if you think about it as
(15:40):
when you have a deal and the developersgot to put in their own money.
Their own cash equity into the dealto create that project and build that.
Where TIFF comes in is that it candefinitely be seen as that equity piece
and that's not the developer'smoney in the project.
Then that's our partner's moneyin the project.
(16:03):
And so therefore, the return on investmentfrom the developer is enhanced because
they aren't using their ownmoney to put it in the project.
They're using our partners.
So over time, that gives them a higher
return on that initialcash flow out the door.
Okay, great.
(16:24):
I'm going to let you have the lastfew minutes to kind of summarize.
I will ask one thing before we get there.
Let me ask you this.
If somebody hears this and they're like,
okay, I want more informationon something like this.
Now we're going to put your web addressin the description on the thing.
Just a phone call and email.
What would you recommend?
How can somebody get started with this?
(16:44):
Yeah, the best way is, again,these deals are complicated.
So honestly, the best way that we like
to do business is to talkto you about the deal.
And so feel free to call us at any timeyou'll provide that as well.
But it's 563-38-8255
(17:06):
and we have a team hereready to talk you through these deals.
But that's the best way just because thereare so many different complications and.
That would probably be my only other thing
is do you see this growing beyond ninestates and how is that going to is it more
of a legality thing or justa logistics thing to go out further?
(17:26):
Yeah, no, we are open to the USfrom a footprint wide.
So it's just about making thoseconnections and getting out there to other
states and other areasof the US right now.
So we do have a couple more states pending
in our pipeline right nowthat we're bringing on board.
But yes, we are opento other states as well.
(17:50):
I just thought I'd ask that because I'msure because when I look at the viewership
or the viewership listenership,it's all across the country.
So it's one of those things that if they
see something as like, okay,let's at least give them a way to be able
to kind of contact you and beable to talk to you about that.
As promised, I'm going to let you have
the last word if you want to summarizeor just go through everything.
(18:11):
Yes, no, I think the biggest thing is this
tool already exists, four municipalitiesto use and for developers to be aware of.
I think the important thing is to notethat we are here to help and enhance
that tool and make itbetter for all parties at the table.
(18:32):
So the benefits to the municipality arethat they don't have to give grant money
ordo that obligation to the developer to try
and get those funds upfront for that developer.
That's our job.
We're taking on the risk of that projectoff the municipalities plate.
The benefits to the developerare that again.
(18:54):
Going back to my previous statementabout the return on investment.
They get a higher return on investmentbecause it's our partner's money.
Not their money in the projectfor that last bit of gap equity
that and they get the money upfrontinstead of waiting year after year after
year because many of thesetips districts do last 15.
2025 years to get your money.
(19:15):
And so we are allowing for them to get
a chunk up front to usefor any type of investment.
And then most importantly,
we are here to give our creativesolutions to these projects and here
to enhance economicdevelopment across the US.
(19:38):
So please use us as expertise experts
in our areaaround this topic and hopefully we can
keep building more and new and changingall those projects that need help
and getting all theseprojects to the finish line.
That's fantastic.Thank you very much.
Emily.For coming on and especially sharing your
(19:59):
knowledge of this, because, like I said,there's so much to it and you really
brought it and kind of explained it verywell, I think, to everybody on there.
And I thank you very much for taking some
time to meet with usand beyond the podcast.
Yeah.No, thank you, Neil.
I appreciate you reaching out as well.
And we are going to go ahead and put both
the phone number and the linkto the website in the description.
(20:20):
And again, thank you very much for being
on the podcast and thankeveryone for listening.
Tax increment financing, or TIFF,
has been used by municipalitiesfor more than 40 years.
It allows local governments to investin public infrastructure and other
improvements upfront then paylater for those investments.
This program not only helps
municipalities, but also helpsdevelopers with their project costs.
(00:21):
Like any financial program,there's a lot of rules and regulations
to understand before you cantake advantage of the program.
We invited Emily Blaylock,president of Untamed Equity,
to help us better understand howTIF works and how to monetize TIF.
Today on Small Business Talks.
(00:45):
Tax increment financing, or TIFF,
is a public financing method that's usedas a subsidy for redevelopment
infrastructure and othercommunity improvement projects.
It's an effective way to stimulatedevelopment in communities.
But like all programs, there'sa lot to understand about it.
To help us better understand TIFF and moreimportantly, the monetization of TIFF.
(01:09):
We have Emily Blaylock, the presidentof untained Equity, with us today.
Welcome, Emily.Hi, Neil.
Thank you for having me.
Certainly glad to have you on board.
I think we want to start off with because
a lot of people listen to thisas they hear the word TIFF.
Could you maybe just give kind of a brief
overview of what exactly is TIFFand what's the purpose of it?
(01:32):
Yeah.
So TIFF Tax Increment.
Financing is a tool that's been around
for many years that municipalities can useto kind of help with other costs that come
into play with developingthat infrastructure for a project.
(01:55):
Because Things Come Up.
Like a project can have environmental
issues, or there's an abandonedbuilding that needs to be rehabbed.
And there's a bunch of different
additional costs that come in with thatwhich fall under TIFF eligible costs.
But ideally, it's that horizontalbuild of the structure.
So it's your roads, your infrastructure,your water, your sewer.
(02:17):
Those are Tip eligible costs.
And so when that happens,there could be additional things.
That developer comes to the tableand says, well, I can definitely do this
project and build this new or fix upthat abandoned building and bring
additional value and taxrevenues to the district.
However, it doesn't quitework with the numbers.
(02:40):
And we've all been there to look atprojects and understand that can happen.
And in that case, the city can use TIFF as
a tool to reimburse back the developersome of those additional costs.
Okay, so the idea is to get that asthe program and the way it works.
(03:03):
And the goal that we're talking abouttoday is how do you monetize that?
How do you actually get the moneyout of the TIFF program?
Yeah, there are generally all sorts
of ways that manipulates,handle TIFF and using that as a tool.
But one thing that we like to think about
from untamed equity is that we canreally supercharge that TIFF as a tool.
(03:25):
And what I mean by that is that,generally speaking,
when I talked about TIFF,the city will reimburse back the developer
some portion of those costs,those TIFF eligible costs over time.
And what untamed equity can do is comein and monetize those future increment
(03:45):
cash flows that we know are coming in asa reimbursement back to the developer.
And generally those are in the form
of the reimbursement of propertytaxes that are paid by the developer.
And then we look@that.net present valuecash flow stream and offer a lump sum loan
amount based on a marginal of that netpresent value cash flow stream.
(04:10):
Okay.
Because this is something a little bitdifferent than what's out there, isn't it?
This is something a little bitunique in the marketplace.
Yeah, that's why I say it's kind of yes,the tool of TIFF has been around
to reimburse that developerback for expenses.
But what we're really doing is adding
that additional valueto those payments by offering those
(04:32):
payments to be reimbursed to the developerup front so we can fund that gap equity.
It turns out to be gap equity that comesinto the project because at the end
of the day, we all wantto get that project finished.
The city wants that project finished,
and the end user wants to usethat project or development.
(04:54):
And of course the developers arethere to get it to the finish line.
But there are ways to obviously fund
that upfront that we providerather than having the city do it.
Okay.And like I said, that's unique because
that's something that I know is kindof new to the marketplace on that.
So what do you need to getstarted on a project?
(05:16):
Yeah, for us, lookingat a project really is simple.
It's a draft or a form of developmentagreement that the developer
and the municipality has enteredinto and then
that first draft of maybe the projectionsof what that tax increment looks like.
So again, we're going off of those futureproperty taxes that are going to be
(05:39):
assessed on that project that thatdeveloper is going to get and build.
This certainly sounds like it's a great
stimulus because that seems likethat would be one of the big headaches
of doing any kind of a project,especially when you have new costs come
in and try to figure out whereis this going to come from?
So I think this is somethingthat would definitely help this one.
Obviously you've thought of that.I'm just the outsider.
(06:01):
Bring that to the table.
So what is the timeline of whereyou fit in with the deal process?
I know you mentioned it's out whenthe agreement's been done,
but maybe walk us througha little bit where you come into this.
It always varies per deal,but the best starting point is when
(06:24):
the developer is in that draft formwith the municipality because
at that point we can discuss some nuancesthat are within development agreements.
So today development agreementsaren't consistent across the US.
And so each municipality works within
their statutes and stuffto create development agreements.
(06:46):
So there's a lot of reviewing of thatdevelopment agreement that happens.
So the best stage is when that developmentagreement is in draft form
with the developerand there is particularly to make it
a more lendableproject,
(07:08):
there is an enhancement to addto the development agreement that we like
to talk about, which is the minimum Eav orminimum equalized assess value or
a minimum guaranteed tax payment languagethat goes into that development agreement.
Now that's a lot of acronyms there,but really what that's kind of saying is
(07:31):
that, hey, everybody at the table,the municipality, the developer and us as
a lender can come in and say,we all agree that this developer
and the city is going to buildthis project for a certain value.
We have the costs that go into theproject, so we know those costs.
(07:52):
Okay, we're all agreeing that the minimum
value of this project is going to be,for example, $10 million.
And then if we have that starting pointkind of assessed in that development
agreement, then we all knowfrom an underwriting standpoint where's
that increment really goingto fall on an annual basis.
And increment beingthat property tax calculation.
(08:13):
You mentioned a little bit about nuances.
Can you give me a couple of examplesof what would be some of those nuances?
Yeah, so as I mentioned, every developmentagreement kind of is different.
There are a couple of different waysthat municipalities can traditionally,
I'm not going to speak to every way,but there are many different ways
that municipalities kind of writethose development agreements.
(08:36):
And one is as a pay as you go tips,
which means that the developerin the city,
in their development agreement,they're basically stating that every year
the developer is going to get x percentof that property tax, rebate it back.
So it's a very simplified form of saying
exactly, you know, kind of whatthat developer is going to get.
(08:58):
Another form is in a TIFF note where
the city is issuing that TIFFnote for a set principal amount.
Again, that's the amount that's goingto be reimbursed back to the developer.
Then there's also revenueobligation bonds.
That a city issue.And again, these are not obligations
that the city is actually goingto report on their financial statements.
(09:23):
This is just a mechanism to be ableto pay those funds over the year.
But there are different nuances to eachone of those and how we monetize those,
but we can monetize all of those typesof incremental payments that come back.
But some of the other nuances that I'llspeak to is oftentimes TIFF is granted
(09:45):
with the caveat of job creationfor the area.
And so we all like that.
We all want to have job creation in there.
However, I will caution that it getsreally tedious if a municipality is going
to say, hey, create 100 jobs, all at thissalary for the life of that development.
(10:09):
Because at the end of the day,
the lender and the developer and the cityall have to report on those numbers.
For that action item.
So you just want to be cautious that youdon't create a more of a reporting issue
in what you really wantto accomplish of creating that job.
So that's one nuance that we've,
(10:31):
we've seen sometimeswe've also seen some caveats around
reaching an IRR for the projectby the developer, and that means internal
rate of return for the developer and sothey have to reach a certain return.
And that's okay to have that in there,again, it's just being mindful of that.
(10:53):
That is what it is.
And we all have to calculate those numbersand understand what that really means.
So it's one extra step in the development
agreement that we want to be surethat everyone understands what we're
actually accountingfor with those nuances.
Okay, thank you.
Are there any red flags that wouldstop you from monetizing TIFF?
(11:17):
And if there are, what would those be?
What are some examplesof what those would be?
Yeah, so that is kind of what I just spoke
to there, which is about ifwe have a set number of jobs.
For example, is one red flag where yeah,okay, now we're making this really
complicated where we have to upkeepand make sure because ultimately
(11:40):
us as the lender in this situationand the developer, we're both on the hook
there to adhere to thatdevelopment agreement.
We want to make sure that that developmentagreement is in line and being followed.
And so some of those certificationsthat can come across create additional
(12:00):
work and reporting from ourresponsibility as well as the developers.
Okay, so that's one.
And then the other one is if we have anyclawback clauses that once the developer
reaches a certain return on theirinvestment, that there's a clawback
from the municipality that canput some things into question.
(12:22):
Because again, we're all trying just
to predict where that incrementis going to come out so that can create
some question marks along the lendableside perspective.
Can you touch base on where you havedone some of these monetization deals?
Yeah, so currentlyover the last about a year and a half or
(12:47):
so, we've really kindof grown our portfolio.
And so today we're in nine states,and that would be Iowa, Illinois,
Minnesota, Wisconsin, Kansas,Texas, Nebraska, Ohio and Oklahoma.
I think I got them all.
But we're in nine states today
(13:08):
and just a fun number that we've beencalculating based on project costs
invested, we've helped get $450,000,000in economic development done.
Wow.
So it's fun.
That does sound like fun.
I got to ask you though, what haveyou learned from those initial deals?
Is there anything that sticks out or
(13:29):
anything you've learned along the waythat you're allowed to share?
That you're allowed to share?Yeah, right.
I think the biggest thing and again,it kind of goes back to that this is fun,
we're here to help in economicdevelopment and that is fun.
To see that is fun to geta project to completion.
And oftentimes
(13:51):
this tool is not used enough to help geta project to completion to monetize
that and provide that additionalgap equity to the table.
And so I think that what we've learned is
that TIFF in general is verysimilar across the states.
(14:11):
But as I mentioned before,every development agreement is different.
So there can be many different items.
And as we joke in the lending world,
hair on deals that come up and you gotto solve and fires you got to put out.
So you learn things allthe time about these deals.
(14:32):
But the important thing is that we can useour expertise to basically create
that consistency across the board andacross the US with this type of program.
That was one of the reasons that I washappy to have you on the podcast,
is because I think there isn't enoughpeople that actually know all about this.
They hear the word TIFF.
I think people know a basicunderstanding of it.
(14:55):
That's why it's very important to kindof bring this more forward and see what
the benefits of it, especiallythe monetization part of it.
Because I think you're right.
We're right now in timesthat what do we need?
We need financing for infrastructureand for improving neighborhoods and all
that because it just seems likeit's a tough road of ho right now.
(15:15):
So it's one of thoseto kind of go through that.
So I think you've alreadytouched base on this.
But just kind of to reiterate,
how does monetizing TIFF enhancethe return on the investment?
Yeah.
So without getting into a lot of financialhat analysis here at this point.
Really the point around that isthat instead of if you think about it as
(15:40):
when you have a deal and the developersgot to put in their own money.
Their own cash equity into the dealto create that project and build that.
Where TIFF comes in is that it candefinitely be seen as that equity piece
and that's not the developer'smoney in the project.
Then that's our partner's moneyin the project.
(16:03):
And so therefore, the return on investmentfrom the developer is enhanced because
they aren't using their ownmoney to put it in the project.
They're using our partners.
So over time, that gives them a higher
return on that initialcash flow out the door.
Okay, great.
(16:24):
I'm going to let you have the lastfew minutes to kind of summarize.
I will ask one thing before we get there.
Let me ask you this.
If somebody hears this and they're like,
okay, I want more informationon something like this.
Now we're going to put your web addressin the description on the thing.
Just a phone call and email.
What would you recommend?
How can somebody get started with this?
(16:44):
Yeah, the best way is, again,these deals are complicated.
So honestly, the best way that we like
to do business is to talkto you about the deal.
And so feel free to call us at any timeyou'll provide that as well.
But it's 563-38-8255
(17:06):
and we have a team hereready to talk you through these deals.
But that's the best way just because thereare so many different complications and.
That would probably be my only other thing
is do you see this growing beyond ninestates and how is that going to is it more
of a legality thing or justa logistics thing to go out further?
(17:26):
Yeah, no, we are open to the USfrom a footprint wide.
So it's just about making thoseconnections and getting out there to other
states and other areasof the US right now.
So we do have a couple more states pending
in our pipeline right nowthat we're bringing on board.
But yes, we are opento other states as well.
(17:50):
I just thought I'd ask that because I'msure because when I look at the viewership
or the viewership listenership,it's all across the country.
So it's one of those things that if they
see something as like, okay,let's at least give them a way to be able
to kind of contact you and beable to talk to you about that.
As promised, I'm going to let you have
the last word if you want to summarizeor just go through everything.
(18:11):
Yes, no, I think the biggest thing is this
tool already exists, four municipalitiesto use and for developers to be aware of.
I think the important thing is to notethat we are here to help and enhance
that tool and make itbetter for all parties at the table.
(18:32):
So the benefits to the municipality arethat they don't have to give grant money
ordo that obligation to the developer to try
and get those funds upfront for that developer.
That's our job.
We're taking on the risk of that projectoff the municipalities plate.
The benefits to the developerare that again.
(18:54):
Going back to my previous statementabout the return on investment.
They get a higher return on investmentbecause it's our partner's money.
Not their money in the projectfor that last bit of gap equity
that and they get the money upfrontinstead of waiting year after year after
year because many of thesetips districts do last 15.
2025 years to get your money.
(19:15):
And so we are allowing for them to get
a chunk up front to usefor any type of investment.
And then most importantly,
we are here to give our creativesolutions to these projects and here
to enhance economicdevelopment across the US.
(19:38):
So please use us as expertise experts
in our areaaround this topic and hopefully we can
keep building more and new and changingall those projects that need help
and getting all theseprojects to the finish line.
That's fantastic.Thank you very much.
Emily.For coming on and especially sharing your
(19:59):
knowledge of this, because, like I said,there's so much to it and you really
brought it and kind of explained it verywell, I think, to everybody on there.
And I thank you very much for taking some
time to meet with usand beyond the podcast.
Yeah.No, thank you, Neil.
I appreciate you reaching out as well.
And we are going to go ahead and put both
the phone number and the linkto the website in the description.
(20:20):
And again, thank you very much for being
on the podcast and thankeveryone for listening.
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