March 26, 2024 • 30 mins
In this episode, Wade and Shane discuss why deck building businesses may want to adopt a comprehensive backyard approach. They discuss how broadening spectrum can enhance customer experience, enlarge customer base, and increase profitability.
Tackling everything in the backyard, from decking, outdoor kitchens, pergolas, hardscaping, lighting, to decorative fences into a unified vision results in visually appealing works that resonate with homeowners. From one contract to pay, reduced coordination hassles, the sheer convenience of a single contractor handling the entire outdoor project is undeniable.
Whether you're a contractor venturing into outdoor services or a homeowner seeking inclusive backyard solutions, this episode is a treasure trove of valuable insights and learning points.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Music.
(00:23):
Jams going. It kind of feels like Friday a little bit. Doesn't it?
Yep. Like I kind of feel Friday-ish. It feels like we're going into weekend.
Because you're about to do a show tomorrow. I think that's why.
You're going to party all weekend. I believe it's like tomorrow it's like not
a, like it's a work day, but it's not like in the office day.
So today feels a little bit Friday-ish to me. Yep. Yeah. Which is real good.
Weather is like winter's hanging around. Just out there hanging around.
(00:49):
The temperature's cooled off again. Like it's a little bit cool out there.
Man, it's supposed to snow next week.
Get out of here. That's what I heard. Well, actually, sorry.
I heard that too, but then I, yeah, in Alberta.
So I looked. It comes this way. Because I heard that it was like,
it was going to get snowy in Calgary and then it was going to come this way.
And so I looked it up two nights ago when I was out with Steve from Trex,
because he said the same thing. I was like, oh, I meant to look that up and
(01:09):
see what that's all about.
And when I looked at the weather forecast for both Regina and Saskatoon,
neither of them had, like there was one day where it was like,
today actually, you might get like. like a centimeter of snow.
Okay. Well, that's fine. I can live with that. But it was nothing.
Like it probably won't even stick on the ground.
So I saw Troy, Troy, Troy, Tony, Troy from Mill Decks, Millboard on here.
(01:33):
Main Decks, those fellows are in here as well. John, boy, there are lots of
people checking in here.
Anyway, so we have two shows going on this weekend in separate markets.
I'm going to hang around the Regina Spring Home Show and you're going to hang
around the Saskatoon Gardenscape Show.
Yeah. So are you excited? excited you're like i am excited
no i'm excited because we did home styles last week
(01:54):
which is fine yeah it was really good
actually i thought it was like a good attendance yeah it
was a fairly fairly busy show there's dave from sastron deck shop yeah i talked
to and cory god we're getting a good crew in here i talked to lynn today i ran
into her at the show i was walking around and she was perusing around as well
and so yeah i asked her i was like how's the show you sold out to it and she's
(02:17):
like, oh yeah, like a long time ago. She's like, it's packed.
I actually reduced the food court area and I reduced, I got rid of the speakers stage.
Really? Just so I could put more booths in. Okay. So the speaker stage is gone.
That's okay. Nobody really went to those anyways. Right. That's what I said too. I was like, okay.
She's like, the problem is that we, or there was a guy standing there.
(02:37):
I didn't ask his name, but a guy with her who also worked for the Regina Home Builder Association.
Yeah. And he's like, the problem is there's no PA address system here.
So you can't draw anybody's attention attention to the speakers when they're
coming up. And I was like. Oh, wow.
I was like, I was flabbergasted for a moment. I was like.
That's not true. I have never noticed, but you're right. There is no PA system in here.
(02:58):
I was like, we just came from homesteads last week and there was somebody on
that PA system constantly. Every 20 minutes. Every time.
Just so you know, the PA system is still working. Yeah.
It was like, they were constantly bringing attention to a new speaker that was
coming up and I was like, I hadn't even thought about that.
It's, you never hear that at the Regina Spring Home Show. I was like,
that's. Boy, that's a bit of an oversight in that building. Why would they not
have that? And the guy's like, yeah, why wouldn't they have that?
(03:18):
You build this huge multimillion dollar facility and you don't put a bloody
PA system in here? It's ridiculous.
I was like, okay, anyway, moving on to the before you get real mad.
How do you feel about the roof on the stadium?
Yeah. Go ahead and tell me about that too. And then, so I was like,
yeah. And last year, wasn't the Speaker's Corner like outside of the main hall,
like in the hallway down at the end? They were like, yeah. Yeah.
So I didn't even know there was one. That was awful. Going to get the,
(03:41):
going to get the butter tarts.
Yeah. And then I found it beside the butter tart booth. Are they going to be there? No.
But. Did you look it up? No, but I asked Lynn and she said, no,
they're not going to be there.
But she did say that they do come to, there's some sort of craft fair thing in the fall.
I think she's like, they still register for that one all the time. Okay.
So do you think you can order those butter tarts online?
(04:04):
Listening to this show, I've got, you gotta, what was it called?
Pearson Berry Farm. Pearson's Berry Farm.
Unbelievable. I don't know if you like butter tarts. Everybody likes butter
tarts. I don't know that that's true.
I feel like somebody, some people are really grossed out by raisins and most
butter tarts have raisins in them.
(04:24):
Oh, fun fact. These ones don't have to have raisins. You could have blueberries.
Yeah. There's raisinless ones.
Saskatoon berries. There was like Saskatoon berry ones. There was apple ones.
There was all sorts of kinds, right? There was like a frigging rhubarb one or something.
There are so many kinds. And these things are, they're cakes.
They're not even tarts because they're mini cakes. They're like,
(04:45):
they're an inch and a half thick and they're just filled full of the filling,
which is incredible, the filling. Oh, they're so good.
And I'm so pissed that they don't, that they're not at the shows this year.
Corey says he bought the Sastry and Berry jam. Yeah, I think they're selling
jams too. Don't, you gotta get the butter tart, man. The jams, whatever.
(05:05):
You gotta get the tarts. Scott says he doesn't even know what a butter tart is.
Is that a Canadian thing? butter
tarts? I don't think so. I don't think so either. Until just this moment.
Right. Look at this. Main Decks is having butter tarts right now.
Just having a homemade butter tart with coffee. Love, love butter tarts.
See, so, Main Decks, you need to, like, we have to get them butter tarts somehow.
(05:30):
It turns out they call them mini pies.
Oh, yeah. Pearson Berry Farm mini pies. Six pack. They basically are.
They're sold out. They're not in a traditional, like, tart shell thing, Oh, they're so good.
Their own crust. Oh, unbelievable.
It's 4.35 AM and I haven't had breakfast. Now I want one, but we don't have
(05:50):
them here in Australia, says Milibor Doni.
Must be a Northern thing, says Scott. I didn't think it was a Canadian thing,
but maybe it is. We'll have to look that up. How fun.
Like you guys are really missing out. Yeah. It's the only reason we actually
stay up here under this current government.
Like if we could leave, we would. Yeah.
But butter tarts, you know. But butter tarts.
(06:12):
Send me some with our next online order. Will do. I better, I'll send you some
on your next decking order. Okay.
I believe that they found a local supplier for their deckers finally.
And that's, that's why they won't talk to us anymore.
But they do still order stuff online. line i like
if i try to if i find them like i
would go to that craft show just for the charts i don't care what crafts me too
(06:33):
but if the chart if somebody was like the charts are there but if i find
out you're going then i'm just gonna e-transfer you some money
yeah yeah oh man them for
me okay so the topic for this this wonderful episode of the ultimate deck podcast
we'll see what we're gonna call it later but generally it's like why you should
take on the whole backyard yard and i know that we have talked about this in
(06:54):
the past but we've always told contractors like you should really do everything
back there not just the deck do the patio and everything else,
well we've said lots of things we've told guys they should specialize and we're
about to like completely undo that right now yeah do drywall no we're about
to soften the edges of it a little bit this is right but we thought this year
(07:14):
we're like well why are we telling everybody to do that and then not doing it ourselves.
Silly. Wasn't it? So, major announcement.
The Ultimate Deck Shop is expanding product categories and we're getting into hardscapes.
No, what's the other button? Do you have a button? Just hit any one.
Not the turkey. Oh, yeah.
Music.
(07:37):
That's the one. That'll do, donkey. Got it. That was what I wanted.
Yeah, it was a good guess.
So, yeah, we've been kicking around this idea for a number of years.
We have to this point not gotten into it. However, quite a number of our contractor
customers also do hardscapes and landscaping and everything else.
And they frequently told us like, you guys should carry that stuff too.
(07:59):
So we can just get it all here.
And also our DIY market has certainly encouraged that.
And the DIY market. Yep. There's a, that gets asked from time to time.
Do you guys also carry pavers?
And to this point, the answer has been no. We knew we always would.
There was, there was some like relationship reasons why we didn't want to get there.
Didn't want to, didn't want to. Yeah. But given that we're in multiple markets
now where those relationships don't exist, it's like, well, we got to do what's
(08:21):
better for our customers.
And what's best for our customers is making sure that they can have the same
great experience they've had with this, buying their deck materials with their hardscaping as well.
And other product categories such as fencing and roof structures and like deck
railing, obviously is part of it, but sometimes railing goes in other things too.
Yeah. So we're just like, we've expanded the categories and gotten a lot more
serious about the whole backyard to the point that we're now,
(08:44):
our tagline is the backyard building center.
So that's great.
But now, I can't wait to see that KWP order land. So there's an inside joke
to that, but Hey, maybe someday.
But we kind of figured that there was two ways that you can expand our business.
This, this podcast isn't going to be all about just what we were doing,
but to preface what we're going to be talking about, we kind of looked at it
(09:07):
and said, there's two ways that we can expand our product offering.
When you're doing deck stuff, you can either go decks and then move towards
exteriors because decks are attached to the house. So it's part of the house.
There's a lot of people that do that. Like there's a lot of people that are
selling siding and decking. Right.
Or the other option is you go the other way towards the backyard.
And so you get into the hardscape, landscape fence side of the business.
(09:30):
And to me, that's a much more parallel path to decking than the house building materials is.
Certainly makes more sense to me as well, obviously, why we're doing it this way.
But it seems to me like there are soffit and siding guys, and then there are
deck and hardscape guys.
Yeah. It doesn't seem like there are many decks and exteriors.
(09:51):
Yeah, it doesn't seem like there's siding and deck guys.
Yeah. But there's certainly some, there's certainly a few. Like our friends
in Calgary at Mountain View Building Materials, that's the path they've taken, right?
They don't do hardscape stuff, but they do exteriors and decks as part of exteriors. Yeah.
To me, we've always envisioned that our company is helping people enjoy their outdoor living space.
New siding in the house doesn't align with that. Yeah. So we want things that
(10:16):
people are using and enjoying their backyard.
And so that's the direction we've gone.
That said, Main Decks, that's a great idea, guys. One-stop shop for outdoor backyard projects.
Yeah, so this is going to be a great episode for them because I think they do
some of that stuff, don't they? They go beyond just decks. Yeah,
I believe they do a little bit of hardscape as well.
So yeah, that's the direction we're going. And we've talked about it before.
(10:38):
And what we're talking about today, again, is why contractors should consider
tackling the whole backyard as well.
And also the homeowner, right? And the homeowner. It's like,
if you're a homeowner listening to this podcast, there's at least two of you.
Here's why you would, here's why you would do that. Yeah. So how do you want to kick that off?
I think one of the things that I, that I would like to speak to,
so first of all, the contractors out there that are crushing it and,
(11:00):
and making the most industry impact are the ones that are tackling the whole backyard.
It is fun, cool to build a deck and then be done with that and move on to the next deck.
Yes. But if you think about the guys who are influencing the industry,
it's guys like Premier Outdoor Living. It's guys like Deck South.
It's guys like even Keystone in Saskatoon. It's like main decks.
(11:20):
The guys who are like handling the whole vision for the backyard.
And it's not just a deck. They're also including that outdoor kitchen.
There's some sort of pergola structure on it. There's some hardscaping.
Yep. There's some landscaping.
There's potentially some decorative fence stuff. there's lighting there's
all these things that kind of bring the entire backyard
into one solidified vision and those projects are
(11:43):
the wow projects yeah and you get to mix with like a
bunch of different textures right and so you know
if the if the patio is going to be like obviously harder and colder you know
you get to then design in like a roof structure that you can hang some lights
from and it's just like it softens that space and that's okay because as over
(12:05):
here is like, that's a different feeling.
Right. Yeah. And so when you start to design that and talk about that,
now the homeowner actually gets an emotional attachment to this backyard and
they start to like really envision it.
Yeah. And that's something that as a contractor, if you're thinking about the
whole backyard, you can start to, you can really start to work that process
(12:26):
with the customers. Right. Yeah. So.
Yeah. And so from the homeowner's perspective too, there's two ways to go about,
like the The homeowner, if they need everything done in their backyard,
there's, you have the option of just working with independent contractors.
You work with the deck guy and then you work with the hardscape guy and then
you work with the landscape guy and landscape designer and then maybe like a
softscaper for the foliage and everything else.
(12:47):
And then you work with the fence guy separately and it's like,
you've just got like eight or nine different brains trying to make this all work together and mesh.
Yeah. But if you have one designer or one contractor you're working with who
can meld all that together and make sure that the,
you know, know, the bell guard paver that you've chosen for your patio works
with the wolf decking that you chose for your,
(13:09):
your deck and that the railing works well with the pergola and that the fence
style matches the railing.
So like you can make sure that it all just works together instead of you,
instead of being like, well, I did a deck with this guy and he was,
he all, he installed timber tech. So that's what he did.
Yep. And then the patio guy never even saw the deck. He just quoted this stone.
Cause we said we wanted something that was like had some warmth to it.
(13:31):
And so he picked this one, but it doesn't work perfectly. That's the wrong brand. own.
Sure. It's like, Oh yeah. So when you can, I mean, you can just work with one
brain and one vision, it all works together a lot better.
Yeah. And then they also have the ability, like what, what's going to be exciting
here is that we'll be able to show our products and we'll be able to like take
(13:52):
deck samples and hold them against, you know.
Patio samples. Right. Just be like, you're in the room, like in our showroom
looking at this stuff and the contractors that are doing both will have that ability as well.
They'll also have cutoffs of stone in their trailer and they can be like,
look at this brown is like this and it doesn't work with your siding. Yeah. Yeah.
(14:13):
MKW services says, agreed. We have, or sorry, agreed. Have multiple tools in your belt.
We have incorporated water features and now post hole services and hot tubs. Great podcast.
Yeah. So I'm curious, where are you from? and what are they kind of like,
you do tackle the whole backyard then?
And TC Deck says, lunchtime, I'm going to get in my hammock and watch some Tud's
podcast. Do you know what he's referring to there?
(14:35):
No. He put up a fricking hammock in his trailer. Oh, did he really?
So he's got his construction trailer on site and he's like, he mounted some. Oh yeah.
As you should. Some rings to hang hammock from. He can just like sneak in there and go for a snooze.
Did you see Sean the other day laid out on the grass having a snooze?
I didn't see that. Catherine was making fun of him. And he's got a van.
(14:56):
Really nice one. He should put a hammock in there. Yeah. Yeah.
So that's pretty funny. Comps the deck shop. Hey guys, I love your videos.
They've been posting more lately too. Fellow Canadians. Yeah.
Out in the Ontario region. TDOT.
What else did you want to talk about in that? So, well, I talked about the financing part of it.
Yeah. So that part's nice too. From the homeowner's perspective is to have kind of like one project.
(15:23):
Being financed or like paying for one project. Well, you're just, yeah.
Like you're working with, yeah, you're working with one contractor and you're
working with one person you're going to pay or one company you're going to pay.
So you can probably set that up in stages, right? You can do stage payments
and it's not, you're not signing like five contracts or six contracts with all
(15:46):
these different companies is one guy, one company that you're working with.
You don't have to manage the scheduling of all these people.
Like, let's not forget about that. Cause that's probably, that's almost the
worst part of this whole thing. Absolutely. Getting your own general. Yeah.
And having to worry about when the landscape guys can be done so that the deck
guys can come in, when the deck guys can be done so that the hardscape guys can come in.
(16:07):
Rains during the landscaping. Yeah. And so now the deck guys has to be held
off and you get a phone and be like, sorry, I need you to back off two days.
Yeah. Yeah. Awful. But if you're just working with one company, so much better. Yep.
Yep. And make sure you work with a designer.
So, which might be in-house for that company. Could be in-house. Could be in-house.
(16:30):
Like a shout out to Peregrine Landscapes here in Regina. They've got designer
on staff who can like, he designed their booth right now at the Regina Spring Home Show.
You'll see, like check out our stories we posted about it. It's incredible.
Like that, that kind of creativity and how it all works together doesn't just
come out of anybody's brain.
You have to be a creative person. You have to be a design focused person to
(16:51):
even come up with some of those ideas. Yeah.
So it's great to work either with a company that has a designer in house or
incorporate a landscape designer into your project as well.
So that they can create the vision and ensure that the contractor is going to
build what you think is going to get built. Yeah.
That's right. Pretty pricey to have it all done and be like,
there you are. And be like, oh boy, that's. Just missed.
Yeah. Well, you said you wanted a deck that looked like this.
(17:14):
I was like, I did, but that's not what I thought that that was going to be.
Yeah. So that's pretty expensive. Yeah, absolutely.
So. MKW says we are located in Keswick, but service everywhere around Lake Simcoe,
Durham and Kawartha Lakes.
We are an outdoor living company. We do anything in your backyard with the exception of hardscaping.
Okay, well, there you go. Guess we won't be helping him, huh?
Well, we weren't going to help him anyways. Well, you could buy all his other
(17:36):
deck stuff online from us. Tape and screws. Small stuff, sure. Why not?
So anyways, yeah. One vision, one person to finance with.
Yeah, we're kind of going back and forth between talking to homeowners and talking
to contractors. That's how you keep them engaged.
Hopefully they should be able to pick out which parts for who.
Yeah. This one too, though, higher. So this is for the contractor.
(17:59):
Doctor, the idea of taking on jobs, like higher ticket, larger jobs that take,
that carve out more of your schedule than like English is my first language.
Not right now. It's not. But sometimes. Not right now. It's not.
What I'm saying is we were talking to a landscaper yesterday at the home show
he was setting up and we were kind of shooting shit and he was talking,
(18:21):
I was like, man, to do larger jobs where you get to be on site for whatever,
a month or maybe three months, whatever, is so so much easier to manage than
having to make sure that there's all these little jobs lined up continuously
because you spend so much more time managing and scheduling and trying to make
sure there's something to go to after this one's done.
So if you're doing jobs, it's like three days in, three days out.
Like you have to have, you know, you can have, if you're a single crew even,
(18:45):
I mean, the average job is taking two to three days. Like you're going to have 15 jobs.
You got to make sure you're lined up every month, 10 to 15 jobs.
That's a lot. It's really tricky in like, so big jobs also Also have big jobs
also require a lot of management.
Yeah. But in a very different way. And they always run the risk of like cost
(19:08):
overruns and, and bigger loss. Right.
So if you're doing a job, that's a $5,000 job, it's unlikely that you lose $5,000.
Yeah. Much less risky. Yeah.
But percentage wise, it could be the same percentage, right?
You might run the risk of having a 10% loss on a $300,000 job.
(19:29):
That's a big number, right? So you need to manage that properly.
I'm not saying, like, I don't think we're saying that big jobs require less
management, but they require way less mobilization, way less getting going and
getting things on site and getting the guys lined up.
It's just like, we're all here, we're working, we're going to grind it out for
two weeks and then off to the next.
(19:51):
Yeah. Certainly I'm not saying that three-day job requires the same amount of
planning and, and logistics and communication as a three-month job.
Yeah. Obviously the three-month job is a lot more. What I'm saying is the three-day job, sorry.
You got to build that. 23-day jobs. Yeah.
Require a lot more communication and management and logistics.
(20:12):
Totally. Than one 60-day job or 30-day job. Yeah, that's right. 90-day job.
Yeah. So yeah, like a lot of guys that are doing these big backyards,
like if you can, again, look at like even Woodbully, Peregrine,
Keystone, Premier to Living, Deck South, when they get on a job site,
they're there for a bit because they're doing the whole backyard. Yeah.
Cascade. So those guys might only do like, that's why it's unfair to ask people
(20:34):
like, how many projects a year do you do? And it's like, some of these guys, four.
Right. Or eight. Yeah. Like those guys probably on average do four to eight a year. Yeah.
There's other guys who will do 60 decks. Or 200.
Yeah. Right. You get some guys in the, in the Alberta region,
they're doing like 200 decks a year. Yeah. They're 10 by 10.
So that's a lot. That's a lot. That's a lot of managing the schedule. Yeah.
(20:56):
Like there's pros and cons. Cause I know when I was building too,
I also didn't, I didn't love being on a job forever and ever and ever either.
Yeah. It's different when there's different stages of the job too though.
It's like, it's one thing to work on the same deck for ever and ever and ever.
Yeah. But it's like, if there's stages of the job where it's like,
okay, the deck's not done, then we're moving to hardscape and it's like things
change, but you can still see the progress is happening. And it's like,
(21:17):
there's like these micro completions or micro like things that are,
that's a different story. Yeah. I think that's, that's really good.
The other thing that works really well as a, as a contractor.
So we talked about how a homeowner could work with one shop or one,
the homeowner can work with one contractor who does all of this stuff.
(21:39):
And I think if you're a contractor, it might be worth looking for a store that's,
Carrying all of the stuff you're carrying. So we have talked to different contractors
that wanted us in the hardscape area.
And the reason they wanted us there is they're currently going to three or four different yards.
Yeah. And they're like, they're hemorrhaging cash as far as like actual fuel and time.
(22:03):
Yeah. Right. They're losing so much time. Big one, yeah. So if you have the
ability to go to one store and pick up a deck package or pick up some pavers,
or you're at the end of the job and you need a little bit of both, it's just one
You're like, show up, grab it, and then off you go.
What's the, what's the word? Because English.
I know. Is like sliding into my second language right now. Yeah.
(22:25):
Like live on air. What do you think is going to be your first one? Your first language?
Swahili, I figure is a pretty interesting one.
But what is the word when you take, when there's a bunch of components and you're like, you.
Amalgamate? Amalgamate. That's, that one's all right. That's a good one.
I don't know if that's the one I was looking for, but that works.
Combined? So it's funny because a lot of the, a lot of, in the world of business,
that's a big thing where it's like people are, there's so many bloody tech tools
(22:47):
out there to help you run your business.
And people are just like, I need this tool and this tool and this tool.
And all of a sudden their tech stack is 30 tools deep. And it's like, geez.
So it's like, that's a big thing in the industry right now too,
where it's like, can we find a tool that amalgamates? Not the one I was looking for, but it'll work.
Can we replace 30 tools with four?
(23:07):
And so the same thing can be said for running your
physical business too can i run my projects out
of one or two stores instead of five or
six yep because that obviously comes with a boatload
of efficiencies and cost savings certainly so yep there's an advantage to that
as well uh millboard tony says a lot of aussie deck guys are starting to incorporate
designers and landscapers in their businesses so they have the all backyard
(23:30):
so they do all the backyard works yeah i think that adding that designer is
a pretty Pretty good move.
I think that's like a smart way to do that. You know?
Yeah. It just like, it gives, it gives you an advantage over any of your other competitors.
Yeah. There's a good chance that not many people are doing design with install.
(23:54):
Yeah. Well, and as you, as you move into tackling these larger scale projects
where you're tackling the whole backyard, I think that there's probably starting
to even become an expectation that that's part of the process, the design process.
Yeah. Yeah, I would say if you get into six figures, you should be,
there should be a design.
You don't have a home built and work with a home builder and they sketch in
(24:14):
a napkin and be like, yeah, it'll be like 20 foot by 17 foot over here and then
a little jog over here and then back in the front door over here.
Yeah. And then like, and then it'll be two stories.
Yeah. Well, that's like, that's what we'll do. Put some stairs out the door
here. Ready to go. Sounds good. Yeah.
Like. Yeah. When you like doing a whole backyard can cost as much as the house
(24:36):
in some cases, you might put a quarter million dollars in your backyard. Yep.
My guess is that a quarter million backyard is not on a quarter million dollar
house, but. Probably not. But hey, buddy, let's go if it is.
Depends where you are. That's right. Could be here. There was a,
I saw a TikTok yesterday of a girl.
I was, we were joking about this the other day. It's like most of my stories start with.
(24:59):
So I saw a TikTok video. Yeah. But it was a girl who was like,
what in the hell? She was from the States.
What the hell is going on in Canada right now? Why is this house?
And it was like this little dive. This is a pretty famous story.
This little dive house in Vancouver.
And it was like, it couldn't have been more than about 800 square feet. Yeah.
And it was like old and shitty. Like it looked like something from the hood. Yeah.
(25:24):
And she's like, guess how much this house is? And I'm sitting in my head and
I was like, I know better. It's like, I know Vancouver. That's a $1.9 million house all day long.
$4.2 million or something. And so why? Because of the street it was on?
Well, it's just because of the land. Like the houses are worth nothing.
So where was it? I don't know where exactly it was. Looked out over the ocean?
(25:44):
No, no, that's the thing.
No, God, those houses there, like when we were in Vancouver there on that little
boat ride with Vista and we looked at some of those houses on the,
on the fricking cliffs over the ocean and stuff. The little boat ride.
Well, the boat ride was little. The boat was big, but the ride was little. Yeah.
No, God, no, this was not, this was not anything. It looked like it was just
(26:05):
like, I'm assuming it was in a somewhat desirable neighborhood,
But like the houses were.
That's so crazy. It was just the land. $4 million for land. Yeah,
it's terrible. Absolutely nuts. Anyways.
So yeah, the ratio of how much your backyard is going to cost in Vancouver will
be a little bit different than Saskatchewan. That's for sure. Yeah.
Yeah. Anyway, anything else to add to that?
No, not really. Like I think, I think it'll be good to, for us to start learning
(26:29):
about this space a little bit, which is going to be like fun.
I feel like when we first started, you know, I feel like there's a lot of things
going on right right now that, you know, if you're a contractor and you're talking
about getting into the outdoor space and doing whole backyards,
you probably have a lot of learning to do.
Yeah. There'll be some scary days for sure.
Even just for us, we're talking about which products to bring in.
(26:51):
And we have some contractors that are really specific about what they want and
why and the density of the stone and like all kinds of stuff. And that's new to us.
We're like, okay, well, like here we go. We got to learn.
We got to like, we got to become the experts again. Yeah. When we started,
when we started the ultimate deck shop, we started with a wealth of knowledge
(27:11):
already from our contracting past.
It's like, we weren't doing anything new. We were just sharing what we already
kind of knew about the products and the process, right?
You had a better handle on all of the products than I did. Probably.
Yeah. And so when we started talking about it and you were like trying to teach me about.
High density polyethylene caps. And I was like, what? This was all brand new to me.
(27:32):
So for me, yeah, it feels pretty familiar what's happening right now as to what happened then, right?
Not me, I'm tweaking out and I don't know how to handle this information,
but it's all like, it's very new to me.
We were talking about this the other day that like personally,
like I never as a contractor installed patios.
Yeah. Personally, I did in my own house one time, like I installed a little
(27:53):
like paver patio and And like, I didn't do it great.
Well, like I did it fine, but I didn't use the right products,
whatever. And I did it on the cheap and like, we're talking 15 plus years ago. Yeah.
But it's like, that's my learning. That's my expertise in this field.
So I have a lot of learning too, which I'm okay with. I consider myself a lifelong
learner. I'm always looking to learn everything.
Yeah. So like, I'll get there, but it's, it's certainly overwhelming.
(28:17):
It's like, and then, so all. It's a lot to take in. Yeah. And then it kind of
opened my eyes to like how much over information I provide to people sometimes.
Totally. know it's like you don't need to provide all that shit it's like
i talked to somebody to your point it's like this cap is me to this
guy and on and on and on and then you talk to hardscape
and they're like yeah you've got this and i'm just like oh does that matter yeah
it's like probably not to the average person but this is what you do to
(28:40):
people so buckle up yeah so now we're making notes about how to sell again in
the store it's like they just want it to be gray or brown yeah they just want
to know what the warranty is yeah that's it you don't have to be like oh this
one's has got ash wood in the inside and this one's hickory and like, shut up. Nobody cares.
Yeah. They don't. Whoops. So.
(29:01):
Yeah. So now we're, we're down the path of, of becoming experts in a new space.
What a fun time. I think it'll be so exciting. I think it'll be,
yeah. I think it'll be a lot of fun. Yeah.
Okay. If you're on the Instagram machine, stick around because we're going to
head right into another episode here. These will post separately,
but we're recording at the same time.
If you're heading into this weekend, any sort of home shows,
because there's stuff happening everywhere. JLC is happening right now down in the States.
(29:23):
In Rhode Island, and I'm sure there's probably spring home shows in many markets
across North America. So check them out. Go support your local small businesses.
Appreciate everybody for tuning in. We'll talk to you next week. Peace.
Hey, thank you for listening to the Ultimate Deck Podcast. Now you know what
we're about. Check the site. Come and shop.
(29:46):
UltimateDeckShops.com. Hit us right away for sponsorships. So tell us if you want to collaborate.
Music.
Music.
(00:23):
Jams going. It kind of feels like Friday a little bit. Doesn't it?
Yep. Like I kind of feel Friday-ish. It feels like we're going into weekend.
Because you're about to do a show tomorrow. I think that's why.
You're going to party all weekend. I believe it's like tomorrow it's like not
a, like it's a work day, but it's not like in the office day.
So today feels a little bit Friday-ish to me. Yep. Yeah. Which is real good.
Weather is like winter's hanging around. Just out there hanging around.
(00:49):
The temperature's cooled off again. Like it's a little bit cool out there.
Man, it's supposed to snow next week.
Get out of here. That's what I heard. Well, actually, sorry.
I heard that too, but then I, yeah, in Alberta.
So I looked. It comes this way. Because I heard that it was like,
it was going to get snowy in Calgary and then it was going to come this way.
And so I looked it up two nights ago when I was out with Steve from Trex,
because he said the same thing. I was like, oh, I meant to look that up and
(01:09):
see what that's all about.
And when I looked at the weather forecast for both Regina and Saskatoon,
neither of them had, like there was one day where it was like,
today actually, you might get like. like a centimeter of snow.
Okay. Well, that's fine. I can live with that. But it was nothing.
Like it probably won't even stick on the ground.
So I saw Troy, Troy, Troy, Tony, Troy from Mill Decks, Millboard on here.
(01:33):
Main Decks, those fellows are in here as well. John, boy, there are lots of
people checking in here.
Anyway, so we have two shows going on this weekend in separate markets.
I'm going to hang around the Regina Spring Home Show and you're going to hang
around the Saskatoon Gardenscape Show.
Yeah. So are you excited? excited you're like i am excited
no i'm excited because we did home styles last week
(01:54):
which is fine yeah it was really good
actually i thought it was like a good attendance yeah it
was a fairly fairly busy show there's dave from sastron deck shop yeah i talked
to and cory god we're getting a good crew in here i talked to lynn today i ran
into her at the show i was walking around and she was perusing around as well
and so yeah i asked her i was like how's the show you sold out to it and she's
(02:17):
like, oh yeah, like a long time ago. She's like, it's packed.
I actually reduced the food court area and I reduced, I got rid of the speakers stage.
Really? Just so I could put more booths in. Okay. So the speaker stage is gone.
That's okay. Nobody really went to those anyways. Right. That's what I said too. I was like, okay.
She's like, the problem is that we, or there was a guy standing there.
(02:37):
I didn't ask his name, but a guy with her who also worked for the Regina Home Builder Association.
Yeah. And he's like, the problem is there's no PA address system here.
So you can't draw anybody's attention attention to the speakers when they're
coming up. And I was like. Oh, wow.
I was like, I was flabbergasted for a moment. I was like.
That's not true. I have never noticed, but you're right. There is no PA system in here.
(02:58):
I was like, we just came from homesteads last week and there was somebody on
that PA system constantly. Every 20 minutes. Every time.
Just so you know, the PA system is still working. Yeah.
It was like, they were constantly bringing attention to a new speaker that was
coming up and I was like, I hadn't even thought about that.
It's, you never hear that at the Regina Spring Home Show. I was like,
that's. Boy, that's a bit of an oversight in that building. Why would they not
have that? And the guy's like, yeah, why wouldn't they have that?
(03:18):
You build this huge multimillion dollar facility and you don't put a bloody
PA system in here? It's ridiculous.
I was like, okay, anyway, moving on to the before you get real mad.
How do you feel about the roof on the stadium?
Yeah. Go ahead and tell me about that too. And then, so I was like,
yeah. And last year, wasn't the Speaker's Corner like outside of the main hall,
like in the hallway down at the end? They were like, yeah. Yeah.
So I didn't even know there was one. That was awful. Going to get the,
(03:41):
going to get the butter tarts.
Yeah. And then I found it beside the butter tart booth. Are they going to be there? No.
But. Did you look it up? No, but I asked Lynn and she said, no,
they're not going to be there.
But she did say that they do come to, there's some sort of craft fair thing in the fall.
I think she's like, they still register for that one all the time. Okay.
So do you think you can order those butter tarts online?
(04:04):
Listening to this show, I've got, you gotta, what was it called?
Pearson Berry Farm. Pearson's Berry Farm.
Unbelievable. I don't know if you like butter tarts. Everybody likes butter
tarts. I don't know that that's true.
I feel like somebody, some people are really grossed out by raisins and most
butter tarts have raisins in them.
(04:24):
Oh, fun fact. These ones don't have to have raisins. You could have blueberries.
Yeah. There's raisinless ones.
Saskatoon berries. There was like Saskatoon berry ones. There was apple ones.
There was all sorts of kinds, right? There was like a frigging rhubarb one or something.
There are so many kinds. And these things are, they're cakes.
They're not even tarts because they're mini cakes. They're like,
(04:45):
they're an inch and a half thick and they're just filled full of the filling,
which is incredible, the filling. Oh, they're so good.
And I'm so pissed that they don't, that they're not at the shows this year.
Corey says he bought the Sastry and Berry jam. Yeah, I think they're selling
jams too. Don't, you gotta get the butter tart, man. The jams, whatever.
(05:05):
You gotta get the tarts. Scott says he doesn't even know what a butter tart is.
Is that a Canadian thing? butter
tarts? I don't think so. I don't think so either. Until just this moment.
Right. Look at this. Main Decks is having butter tarts right now.
Just having a homemade butter tart with coffee. Love, love butter tarts.
See, so, Main Decks, you need to, like, we have to get them butter tarts somehow.
(05:30):
It turns out they call them mini pies.
Oh, yeah. Pearson Berry Farm mini pies. Six pack. They basically are.
They're sold out. They're not in a traditional, like, tart shell thing, Oh, they're so good.
Their own crust. Oh, unbelievable.
It's 4.35 AM and I haven't had breakfast. Now I want one, but we don't have
(05:50):
them here in Australia, says Milibor Doni.
Must be a Northern thing, says Scott. I didn't think it was a Canadian thing,
but maybe it is. We'll have to look that up. How fun.
Like you guys are really missing out. Yeah. It's the only reason we actually
stay up here under this current government.
Like if we could leave, we would. Yeah.
But butter tarts, you know. But butter tarts.
(06:12):
Send me some with our next online order. Will do. I better, I'll send you some
on your next decking order. Okay.
I believe that they found a local supplier for their deckers finally.
And that's, that's why they won't talk to us anymore.
But they do still order stuff online. line i like
if i try to if i find them like i
would go to that craft show just for the charts i don't care what crafts me too
(06:33):
but if the chart if somebody was like the charts are there but if i find
out you're going then i'm just gonna e-transfer you some money
yeah yeah oh man them for
me okay so the topic for this this wonderful episode of the ultimate deck podcast
we'll see what we're gonna call it later but generally it's like why you should
take on the whole backyard yard and i know that we have talked about this in
(06:54):
the past but we've always told contractors like you should really do everything
back there not just the deck do the patio and everything else,
well we've said lots of things we've told guys they should specialize and we're
about to like completely undo that right now yeah do drywall no we're about
to soften the edges of it a little bit this is right but we thought this year
(07:14):
we're like well why are we telling everybody to do that and then not doing it ourselves.
Silly. Wasn't it? So, major announcement.
The Ultimate Deck Shop is expanding product categories and we're getting into hardscapes.
No, what's the other button? Do you have a button? Just hit any one.
Not the turkey. Oh, yeah.
Music.
(07:37):
That's the one. That'll do, donkey. Got it. That was what I wanted.
Yeah, it was a good guess.
So, yeah, we've been kicking around this idea for a number of years.
We have to this point not gotten into it. However, quite a number of our contractor
customers also do hardscapes and landscaping and everything else.
And they frequently told us like, you guys should carry that stuff too.
(07:59):
So we can just get it all here.
And also our DIY market has certainly encouraged that.
And the DIY market. Yep. There's a, that gets asked from time to time.
Do you guys also carry pavers?
And to this point, the answer has been no. We knew we always would.
There was, there was some like relationship reasons why we didn't want to get there.
Didn't want to, didn't want to. Yeah. But given that we're in multiple markets
now where those relationships don't exist, it's like, well, we got to do what's
(08:21):
better for our customers.
And what's best for our customers is making sure that they can have the same
great experience they've had with this, buying their deck materials with their hardscaping as well.
And other product categories such as fencing and roof structures and like deck
railing, obviously is part of it, but sometimes railing goes in other things too.
Yeah. So we're just like, we've expanded the categories and gotten a lot more
serious about the whole backyard to the point that we're now,
(08:44):
our tagline is the backyard building center.
So that's great.
But now, I can't wait to see that KWP order land. So there's an inside joke
to that, but Hey, maybe someday.
But we kind of figured that there was two ways that you can expand our business.
This, this podcast isn't going to be all about just what we were doing,
but to preface what we're going to be talking about, we kind of looked at it
(09:07):
and said, there's two ways that we can expand our product offering.
When you're doing deck stuff, you can either go decks and then move towards
exteriors because decks are attached to the house. So it's part of the house.
There's a lot of people that do that. Like there's a lot of people that are
selling siding and decking. Right.
Or the other option is you go the other way towards the backyard.
And so you get into the hardscape, landscape fence side of the business.
(09:30):
And to me, that's a much more parallel path to decking than the house building materials is.
Certainly makes more sense to me as well, obviously, why we're doing it this way.
But it seems to me like there are soffit and siding guys, and then there are
deck and hardscape guys.
Yeah. It doesn't seem like there are many decks and exteriors.
(09:51):
Yeah, it doesn't seem like there's siding and deck guys.
Yeah. But there's certainly some, there's certainly a few. Like our friends
in Calgary at Mountain View Building Materials, that's the path they've taken, right?
They don't do hardscape stuff, but they do exteriors and decks as part of exteriors. Yeah.
To me, we've always envisioned that our company is helping people enjoy their outdoor living space.
New siding in the house doesn't align with that. Yeah. So we want things that
(10:16):
people are using and enjoying their backyard.
And so that's the direction we've gone.
That said, Main Decks, that's a great idea, guys. One-stop shop for outdoor backyard projects.
Yeah, so this is going to be a great episode for them because I think they do
some of that stuff, don't they? They go beyond just decks. Yeah,
I believe they do a little bit of hardscape as well.
So yeah, that's the direction we're going. And we've talked about it before.
(10:38):
And what we're talking about today, again, is why contractors should consider
tackling the whole backyard as well.
And also the homeowner, right? And the homeowner. It's like,
if you're a homeowner listening to this podcast, there's at least two of you.
Here's why you would, here's why you would do that. Yeah. So how do you want to kick that off?
I think one of the things that I, that I would like to speak to,
so first of all, the contractors out there that are crushing it and,
(11:00):
and making the most industry impact are the ones that are tackling the whole backyard.
It is fun, cool to build a deck and then be done with that and move on to the next deck.
Yes. But if you think about the guys who are influencing the industry,
it's guys like Premier Outdoor Living. It's guys like Deck South.
It's guys like even Keystone in Saskatoon. It's like main decks.
(11:20):
The guys who are like handling the whole vision for the backyard.
And it's not just a deck. They're also including that outdoor kitchen.
There's some sort of pergola structure on it. There's some hardscaping.
Yep. There's some landscaping.
There's potentially some decorative fence stuff. there's lighting there's
all these things that kind of bring the entire backyard
into one solidified vision and those projects are
(11:43):
the wow projects yeah and you get to mix with like a
bunch of different textures right and so you know
if the if the patio is going to be like obviously harder and colder you know
you get to then design in like a roof structure that you can hang some lights
from and it's just like it softens that space and that's okay because as over
(12:05):
here is like, that's a different feeling.
Right. Yeah. And so when you start to design that and talk about that,
now the homeowner actually gets an emotional attachment to this backyard and
they start to like really envision it.
Yeah. And that's something that as a contractor, if you're thinking about the
whole backyard, you can start to, you can really start to work that process
(12:26):
with the customers. Right. Yeah. So.
Yeah. And so from the homeowner's perspective too, there's two ways to go about,
like the The homeowner, if they need everything done in their backyard,
there's, you have the option of just working with independent contractors.
You work with the deck guy and then you work with the hardscape guy and then
you work with the landscape guy and landscape designer and then maybe like a
softscaper for the foliage and everything else.
(12:47):
And then you work with the fence guy separately and it's like,
you've just got like eight or nine different brains trying to make this all work together and mesh.
Yeah. But if you have one designer or one contractor you're working with who
can meld all that together and make sure that the,
you know, know, the bell guard paver that you've chosen for your patio works
with the wolf decking that you chose for your,
(13:09):
your deck and that the railing works well with the pergola and that the fence
style matches the railing.
So like you can make sure that it all just works together instead of you,
instead of being like, well, I did a deck with this guy and he was,
he all, he installed timber tech. So that's what he did.
Yep. And then the patio guy never even saw the deck. He just quoted this stone.
Cause we said we wanted something that was like had some warmth to it.
(13:31):
And so he picked this one, but it doesn't work perfectly. That's the wrong brand. own.
Sure. It's like, Oh yeah. So when you can, I mean, you can just work with one
brain and one vision, it all works together a lot better.
Yeah. And then they also have the ability, like what, what's going to be exciting
here is that we'll be able to show our products and we'll be able to like take
(13:52):
deck samples and hold them against, you know.
Patio samples. Right. Just be like, you're in the room, like in our showroom
looking at this stuff and the contractors that are doing both will have that ability as well.
They'll also have cutoffs of stone in their trailer and they can be like,
look at this brown is like this and it doesn't work with your siding. Yeah. Yeah.
(14:13):
MKW services says, agreed. We have, or sorry, agreed. Have multiple tools in your belt.
We have incorporated water features and now post hole services and hot tubs. Great podcast.
Yeah. So I'm curious, where are you from? and what are they kind of like,
you do tackle the whole backyard then?
And TC Deck says, lunchtime, I'm going to get in my hammock and watch some Tud's
podcast. Do you know what he's referring to there?
(14:35):
No. He put up a fricking hammock in his trailer. Oh, did he really?
So he's got his construction trailer on site and he's like, he mounted some. Oh yeah.
As you should. Some rings to hang hammock from. He can just like sneak in there and go for a snooze.
Did you see Sean the other day laid out on the grass having a snooze?
I didn't see that. Catherine was making fun of him. And he's got a van.
(14:56):
Really nice one. He should put a hammock in there. Yeah. Yeah.
So that's pretty funny. Comps the deck shop. Hey guys, I love your videos.
They've been posting more lately too. Fellow Canadians. Yeah.
Out in the Ontario region. TDOT.
What else did you want to talk about in that? So, well, I talked about the financing part of it.
Yeah. So that part's nice too. From the homeowner's perspective is to have kind of like one project.
(15:23):
Being financed or like paying for one project. Well, you're just, yeah.
Like you're working with, yeah, you're working with one contractor and you're
working with one person you're going to pay or one company you're going to pay.
So you can probably set that up in stages, right? You can do stage payments
and it's not, you're not signing like five contracts or six contracts with all
(15:46):
these different companies is one guy, one company that you're working with.
You don't have to manage the scheduling of all these people.
Like, let's not forget about that. Cause that's probably, that's almost the
worst part of this whole thing. Absolutely. Getting your own general. Yeah.
And having to worry about when the landscape guys can be done so that the deck
guys can come in, when the deck guys can be done so that the hardscape guys can come in.
(16:07):
Rains during the landscaping. Yeah. And so now the deck guys has to be held
off and you get a phone and be like, sorry, I need you to back off two days.
Yeah. Yeah. Awful. But if you're just working with one company, so much better. Yep.
Yep. And make sure you work with a designer.
So, which might be in-house for that company. Could be in-house. Could be in-house.
(16:30):
Like a shout out to Peregrine Landscapes here in Regina. They've got designer
on staff who can like, he designed their booth right now at the Regina Spring Home Show.
You'll see, like check out our stories we posted about it. It's incredible.
Like that, that kind of creativity and how it all works together doesn't just
come out of anybody's brain.
You have to be a creative person. You have to be a design focused person to
(16:51):
even come up with some of those ideas. Yeah.
So it's great to work either with a company that has a designer in house or
incorporate a landscape designer into your project as well.
So that they can create the vision and ensure that the contractor is going to
build what you think is going to get built. Yeah.
That's right. Pretty pricey to have it all done and be like,
there you are. And be like, oh boy, that's. Just missed.
Yeah. Well, you said you wanted a deck that looked like this.
(17:14):
I was like, I did, but that's not what I thought that that was going to be.
Yeah. So that's pretty expensive. Yeah, absolutely.
So. MKW says we are located in Keswick, but service everywhere around Lake Simcoe,
Durham and Kawartha Lakes.
We are an outdoor living company. We do anything in your backyard with the exception of hardscaping.
Okay, well, there you go. Guess we won't be helping him, huh?
Well, we weren't going to help him anyways. Well, you could buy all his other
(17:36):
deck stuff online from us. Tape and screws. Small stuff, sure. Why not?
So anyways, yeah. One vision, one person to finance with.
Yeah, we're kind of going back and forth between talking to homeowners and talking
to contractors. That's how you keep them engaged.
Hopefully they should be able to pick out which parts for who.
Yeah. This one too, though, higher. So this is for the contractor.
(17:59):
Doctor, the idea of taking on jobs, like higher ticket, larger jobs that take,
that carve out more of your schedule than like English is my first language.
Not right now. It's not. But sometimes. Not right now. It's not.
What I'm saying is we were talking to a landscaper yesterday at the home show
he was setting up and we were kind of shooting shit and he was talking,
(18:21):
I was like, man, to do larger jobs where you get to be on site for whatever,
a month or maybe three months, whatever, is so so much easier to manage than
having to make sure that there's all these little jobs lined up continuously
because you spend so much more time managing and scheduling and trying to make
sure there's something to go to after this one's done.
So if you're doing jobs, it's like three days in, three days out.
Like you have to have, you know, you can have, if you're a single crew even,
(18:45):
I mean, the average job is taking two to three days. Like you're going to have 15 jobs.
You got to make sure you're lined up every month, 10 to 15 jobs.
That's a lot. It's really tricky in like, so big jobs also Also have big jobs
also require a lot of management.
Yeah. But in a very different way. And they always run the risk of like cost
(19:08):
overruns and, and bigger loss. Right.
So if you're doing a job, that's a $5,000 job, it's unlikely that you lose $5,000.
Yeah. Much less risky. Yeah.
But percentage wise, it could be the same percentage, right?
You might run the risk of having a 10% loss on a $300,000 job.
(19:29):
That's a big number, right? So you need to manage that properly.
I'm not saying, like, I don't think we're saying that big jobs require less
management, but they require way less mobilization, way less getting going and
getting things on site and getting the guys lined up.
It's just like, we're all here, we're working, we're going to grind it out for
two weeks and then off to the next.
(19:51):
Yeah. Certainly I'm not saying that three-day job requires the same amount of
planning and, and logistics and communication as a three-month job.
Yeah. Obviously the three-month job is a lot more. What I'm saying is the three-day job, sorry.
You got to build that. 23-day jobs. Yeah.
Require a lot more communication and management and logistics.
(20:12):
Totally. Than one 60-day job or 30-day job. Yeah, that's right. 90-day job.
Yeah. So yeah, like a lot of guys that are doing these big backyards,
like if you can, again, look at like even Woodbully, Peregrine,
Keystone, Premier to Living, Deck South, when they get on a job site,
they're there for a bit because they're doing the whole backyard. Yeah.
Cascade. So those guys might only do like, that's why it's unfair to ask people
(20:34):
like, how many projects a year do you do? And it's like, some of these guys, four.
Right. Or eight. Yeah. Like those guys probably on average do four to eight a year. Yeah.
There's other guys who will do 60 decks. Or 200.
Yeah. Right. You get some guys in the, in the Alberta region,
they're doing like 200 decks a year. Yeah. They're 10 by 10.
So that's a lot. That's a lot. That's a lot of managing the schedule. Yeah.
(20:56):
Like there's pros and cons. Cause I know when I was building too,
I also didn't, I didn't love being on a job forever and ever and ever either.
Yeah. It's different when there's different stages of the job too though.
It's like, it's one thing to work on the same deck for ever and ever and ever.
Yeah. But it's like, if there's stages of the job where it's like,
okay, the deck's not done, then we're moving to hardscape and it's like things
change, but you can still see the progress is happening. And it's like,
(21:17):
there's like these micro completions or micro like things that are,
that's a different story. Yeah. I think that's, that's really good.
The other thing that works really well as a, as a contractor.
So we talked about how a homeowner could work with one shop or one,
the homeowner can work with one contractor who does all of this stuff.
(21:39):
And I think if you're a contractor, it might be worth looking for a store that's,
Carrying all of the stuff you're carrying. So we have talked to different contractors
that wanted us in the hardscape area.
And the reason they wanted us there is they're currently going to three or four different yards.
Yeah. And they're like, they're hemorrhaging cash as far as like actual fuel and time.
(22:03):
Yeah. Right. They're losing so much time. Big one, yeah. So if you have the
ability to go to one store and pick up a deck package or pick up some pavers,
or you're at the end of the job and you need a little bit of both, it's just one
You're like, show up, grab it, and then off you go.
What's the, what's the word? Because English.
I know. Is like sliding into my second language right now. Yeah.
(22:25):
Like live on air. What do you think is going to be your first one? Your first language?
Swahili, I figure is a pretty interesting one.
But what is the word when you take, when there's a bunch of components and you're like, you.
Amalgamate? Amalgamate. That's, that one's all right. That's a good one.
I don't know if that's the one I was looking for, but that works.
Combined? So it's funny because a lot of the, a lot of, in the world of business,
that's a big thing where it's like people are, there's so many bloody tech tools
(22:47):
out there to help you run your business.
And people are just like, I need this tool and this tool and this tool.
And all of a sudden their tech stack is 30 tools deep. And it's like, geez.
So it's like, that's a big thing in the industry right now too,
where it's like, can we find a tool that amalgamates? Not the one I was looking for, but it'll work.
Can we replace 30 tools with four?
(23:07):
And so the same thing can be said for running your
physical business too can i run my projects out
of one or two stores instead of five or
six yep because that obviously comes with a boatload
of efficiencies and cost savings certainly so yep there's an advantage to that
as well uh millboard tony says a lot of aussie deck guys are starting to incorporate
designers and landscapers in their businesses so they have the all backyard
(23:30):
so they do all the backyard works yeah i think that adding that designer is
a pretty Pretty good move.
I think that's like a smart way to do that. You know?
Yeah. It just like, it gives, it gives you an advantage over any of your other competitors.
Yeah. There's a good chance that not many people are doing design with install.
(23:54):
Yeah. Well, and as you, as you move into tackling these larger scale projects
where you're tackling the whole backyard, I think that there's probably starting
to even become an expectation that that's part of the process, the design process.
Yeah. Yeah, I would say if you get into six figures, you should be,
there should be a design.
You don't have a home built and work with a home builder and they sketch in
(24:14):
a napkin and be like, yeah, it'll be like 20 foot by 17 foot over here and then
a little jog over here and then back in the front door over here.
Yeah. And then like, and then it'll be two stories.
Yeah. Well, that's like, that's what we'll do. Put some stairs out the door
here. Ready to go. Sounds good. Yeah.
Like. Yeah. When you like doing a whole backyard can cost as much as the house
(24:36):
in some cases, you might put a quarter million dollars in your backyard. Yep.
My guess is that a quarter million backyard is not on a quarter million dollar
house, but. Probably not. But hey, buddy, let's go if it is.
Depends where you are. That's right. Could be here. There was a,
I saw a TikTok yesterday of a girl.
I was, we were joking about this the other day. It's like most of my stories start with.
(24:59):
So I saw a TikTok video. Yeah. But it was a girl who was like,
what in the hell? She was from the States.
What the hell is going on in Canada right now? Why is this house?
And it was like this little dive. This is a pretty famous story.
This little dive house in Vancouver.
And it was like, it couldn't have been more than about 800 square feet. Yeah.
And it was like old and shitty. Like it looked like something from the hood. Yeah.
(25:24):
And she's like, guess how much this house is? And I'm sitting in my head and
I was like, I know better. It's like, I know Vancouver. That's a $1.9 million house all day long.
$4.2 million or something. And so why? Because of the street it was on?
Well, it's just because of the land. Like the houses are worth nothing.
So where was it? I don't know where exactly it was. Looked out over the ocean?
(25:44):
No, no, that's the thing.
No, God, those houses there, like when we were in Vancouver there on that little
boat ride with Vista and we looked at some of those houses on the,
on the fricking cliffs over the ocean and stuff. The little boat ride.
Well, the boat ride was little. The boat was big, but the ride was little. Yeah.
No, God, no, this was not, this was not anything. It looked like it was just
(26:05):
like, I'm assuming it was in a somewhat desirable neighborhood,
But like the houses were.
That's so crazy. It was just the land. $4 million for land. Yeah,
it's terrible. Absolutely nuts. Anyways.
So yeah, the ratio of how much your backyard is going to cost in Vancouver will
be a little bit different than Saskatchewan. That's for sure. Yeah.
Yeah. Anyway, anything else to add to that?
No, not really. Like I think, I think it'll be good to, for us to start learning
(26:29):
about this space a little bit, which is going to be like fun.
I feel like when we first started, you know, I feel like there's a lot of things
going on right right now that, you know, if you're a contractor and you're talking
about getting into the outdoor space and doing whole backyards,
you probably have a lot of learning to do.
Yeah. There'll be some scary days for sure.
Even just for us, we're talking about which products to bring in.
(26:51):
And we have some contractors that are really specific about what they want and
why and the density of the stone and like all kinds of stuff. And that's new to us.
We're like, okay, well, like here we go. We got to learn.
We got to like, we got to become the experts again. Yeah. When we started,
when we started the ultimate deck shop, we started with a wealth of knowledge
(27:11):
already from our contracting past.
It's like, we weren't doing anything new. We were just sharing what we already
kind of knew about the products and the process, right?
You had a better handle on all of the products than I did. Probably.
Yeah. And so when we started talking about it and you were like trying to teach me about.
High density polyethylene caps. And I was like, what? This was all brand new to me.
(27:32):
So for me, yeah, it feels pretty familiar what's happening right now as to what happened then, right?
Not me, I'm tweaking out and I don't know how to handle this information,
but it's all like, it's very new to me.
We were talking about this the other day that like personally,
like I never as a contractor installed patios.
Yeah. Personally, I did in my own house one time, like I installed a little
(27:53):
like paver patio and And like, I didn't do it great.
Well, like I did it fine, but I didn't use the right products,
whatever. And I did it on the cheap and like, we're talking 15 plus years ago. Yeah.
But it's like, that's my learning. That's my expertise in this field.
So I have a lot of learning too, which I'm okay with. I consider myself a lifelong
learner. I'm always looking to learn everything.
Yeah. So like, I'll get there, but it's, it's certainly overwhelming.
(28:17):
It's like, and then, so all. It's a lot to take in. Yeah. And then it kind of
opened my eyes to like how much over information I provide to people sometimes.
Totally. know it's like you don't need to provide all that shit it's like
i talked to somebody to your point it's like this cap is me to this
guy and on and on and on and then you talk to hardscape
and they're like yeah you've got this and i'm just like oh does that matter yeah
it's like probably not to the average person but this is what you do to
(28:40):
people so buckle up yeah so now we're making notes about how to sell again in
the store it's like they just want it to be gray or brown yeah they just want
to know what the warranty is yeah that's it you don't have to be like oh this
one's has got ash wood in the inside and this one's hickory and like, shut up. Nobody cares.
Yeah. They don't. Whoops. So.
(29:01):
Yeah. So now we're, we're down the path of, of becoming experts in a new space.
What a fun time. I think it'll be so exciting. I think it'll be,
yeah. I think it'll be a lot of fun. Yeah.
Okay. If you're on the Instagram machine, stick around because we're going to
head right into another episode here. These will post separately,
but we're recording at the same time.
If you're heading into this weekend, any sort of home shows,
because there's stuff happening everywhere. JLC is happening right now down in the States.
(29:23):
In Rhode Island, and I'm sure there's probably spring home shows in many markets
across North America. So check them out. Go support your local small businesses.
Appreciate everybody for tuning in. We'll talk to you next week. Peace.
Hey, thank you for listening to the Ultimate Deck Podcast. Now you know what
we're about. Check the site. Come and shop.
(29:46):
UltimateDeckShops.com. Hit us right away for sponsorships. So tell us if you want to collaborate.
Music.
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