The Rod and Greg Show: Reaction to Judge's Redistricting Decision

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
We need to recognize right off the top, Veterans Day. Yes,
and you want to talk about all those veterans out there.
Something I'm grateful for, something that I love. My grandparents
were my greatest generation. I've learned a lot from him.
I'm here in the feedback. I'm fixing it. Hang on,
hang on, now we got it. Okay, now we're we're good.

Speaker 2 (00:20):
Yeah, we're on.

Speaker 1 (00:21):
Yep. My fault.

Speaker 3 (00:22):
If I hear my own voice that going like that,
it just freaks me out. I can't hear anything.

Speaker 4 (00:26):
But no.

Speaker 3 (00:27):
My grandma Vaccine, a Navy veteran, my grandfather, my grandfather,
her husband who I didn't get to know, but knew
my grandmother well. She helped raise me. But he served
on the USS kid during World War Two. It was
hit by a Kama kazeh you know, pilot and did
not sink and many died. But he survived that, and uh,
you know, they fought in the war. My pat McGuire

(00:48):
was in the army and he was part of building
the Burma Trail, the road and protecting it from the Japanese. Anyway,
I have a grand my uncle Denny, whose birthday I share.
He was in the Navy during Vietnam. Anyway, I just
I love our veterans. When I was a lawmaker, I
wanted to at least every single session have something I

(01:08):
did to move the needle for and on behalf of
our veterans every single year bill and try it and
did that. But it is it's something we should pause
and remember, reflect on, and certainly not take take for
granted because veterans are really lousy at pointing to themselves.

Speaker 5 (01:24):
They're never going to tell us about themselves.

Speaker 1 (01:26):
You know what. I know what's sad about this? And
well we'll play this sound by a little bit later on,
But there are some veterans and they're seeing what's going
on in this country and really around the world, Greg
and they're starting to ask themselves was it all worth it?
It's a very sad commentary.

Speaker 3 (01:41):
It's a very sad it's a very sad clip, and
it's a very sad moment to see this veteran wonder
what they fought for and all the friends and people
that have died for the cause of freedom, and look
at where he lives and what's happening and what he
fought against and what he thinks has arived it's tough,
and we'll get into that, maybe dive into that a
little later. Breaking news that's national news and the United States,

(02:03):
but it's here in the state of Utah, is that
we have got a well planned, well orchestrated, out of
state leftist effort to steal a congressional seat from the
state of Utah, and they have succeeded.

Speaker 1 (02:15):
A judge, a judge waiting until the very last minute,
makes a rule late, late, late last night. What was
it about, eleven forty, eleven fifty last night? Forty or
eleven fifty, basically telling the legislature to take a hike,
and we're going to use a map drawn by somebody else.
And that's what they've done. And we're talking about redistricting
getting set up for the twenty twenty six congressional elections.

Speaker 3 (02:37):
And I will tell you, folks that if if you're
comfortable with the world, we're a judge. By the way
these retention elections for judges, you've elected these judges as
much as senator senators have confirmed them. We don't have
enough information about these judges, but they certainly aren't elected
by the people or accountable to the people. And some
of that's by design, but having them draw your maps,
your congressional maps, or any of your maps on redistricting

(02:59):
for state cit your races or congressional races, that is
in our state constitution clearly the duty and roll of
your legislative branch that the people vote, vet and vote
for or against. They're the ones that do this. They're
the ones that are accountable to the people, not a judge.
And then, to make matters worse, not only did she
demand that the legislature bring her a better map than

(03:19):
what their work product had gone through the process of creating,
they provided a map as instructed by the judiciary, So
on bended knee they handed their map, and then she
didn't like that, so she went with a special interest
groups map that has created a dark blue congressional district
in the state of Utah. And Jeff and Jeffries is

(03:41):
celebrating today is the Democrats are celebrating today, And that
ought to be your tell that the fixes.

Speaker 1 (03:46):
Should be Well, we'll get into that, will really analyze
that today as a matter of fact. And second we'll
talk with Utah House Speaker Mike Schulz coming up later
on an organization that was hot behind all of this
Mormon Women for Ethic Government. We'll talk with the chairman
of the Utah Republican Party and a former Utah Congressman
who at one time served on the Better Boundary Commission,

(04:09):
but had enough and walked away so that I'm not
doing it anymore, so nor.

Speaker 5 (04:12):
To hear from that person as well.

Speaker 3 (04:14):
So joining us right now, Speaker of the House, Utah
State House of Representatives, Mike Schultz, joining us on the program.
Speaker Schultz, Welcome to the Rod and Greg Show. I
don't know if you just heard me lay it out,
but the judge throughout your map. You went there, you
gave him a map, a new map after you were
told to. She went and picked the special interest groups map.
This is a smack in the face for the legislature.

(04:36):
As a former member, that's how I see it. Where
does the legislature go from here?

Speaker 6 (04:41):
Speaker Yeah, well Greg, that's first off, Robin, Greg, thank
you for having me and I appreciate the opportunity to
talk about this. Yeah, this was a smack in the
face to not the legislature at all. This was a
smack in the face to Uton's and every Utah regardless
of what side of this issue you're on. You should
be outraged right now, because if it can happen under redistricting,

(05:02):
I want to just flip it around and say it
can happen under any sort of circumstance. Let's just lay
this out. What you just had happened was an unelected judge,
unaccountable to the people, throw out the legislature's map, who
is elected by the people, and pick a map that
was drawn by a far left advocacy group. And who

(05:25):
knows there was no transparency in the way this map
was drawn, but it was drawn by the legal women voters,
who is a national organization that is far left. That
is who drew this map, And it was drawn with
one purpose jerrymandering a Democrat seat. There are not enough
Democrats in the state of Utah to get a Democrat

(05:46):
seat without heavily jerrymandering a map in order for that
to happen. So you just had a judge pick a
gerrymandered map over the top of the people of the
state of Utah. That is not just a concern for redistricting.
That should be a real concern for the whole judicial
system in our current courts.

Speaker 1 (06:08):
Right now, Speakers shows. You know, and you touched on
this in your comment here, Speakers shows. But what drives
me nuts is you have this group out there who
are saying, well, this is a grassroots effort. You know,
it comes from the people, it's a grassroots effort. Well,
if that's the case, Speaker shows, why on earth was
former Attorney General Eric Holder commenting on this ruling today.
I mean, doesn't that tell people something?

Speaker 6 (06:30):
No, no, no, this was driven out of Washington, d C.
There's no doubt this was driven around out of Washington,
d C. That's where this came from. You know, that
is exactly where this came from. And you know, even
further to point to the problem with this is the
fact that you had a judge pick a map drawn

(06:53):
by by a far left organization is just absolutely incredible
to me. And this was not driven by Utahn's and
the whole prop proposition for. Okay, fine, you say you
want to follow proposition four. The judge did not follow
proposition four. It had nothing to do with proposition for.
The judge unelected. This wasn't by the people picked the

(07:16):
process outside of proposition for, outside of their legislature, outside
of what was said and prop for and picked this
map by this far left organization.

Speaker 3 (07:26):
We speaking with Speaker Michael Mike Schultz about this judge's decision.
It's really put Utah in the blue column with the
with California and other states that are redrawing districts to
advantage districts for the advantage of Democrats, and now Utah,
a red state, is in that column of blue states
doing this. My question is this and this is this

(07:47):
really is under my skin, and it's my skin. I
know I'm entitled to my own opinion, Speaker, but here's
my issue. She sat on this judge sat on this decision.
I think it's from the beginning of the year in January,
as this was, as this proceeded, there has to be
a time where the members of Congress know their districts,
know where the boundaries are that they represent. Because filing

(08:10):
for the next in the twenty twenty six starts in
January of twenty six, which is coming right up. Clerks,
county clerks need to know the information. What I understand
is the judge asked, when when is the last when's
the last date that we need that you would need
to know to be able to do your job. Told
it would be November. First, asked for an extension, was
given till November tenth, and then last night, minutes before midnight,

(08:33):
so close up business has already happened. Gives this a
ruling which has the effect of making the tenth not
practical at all. It seems to be an aggressive move,
almost a statement from this judge that she doesn't give
a whit about whether the legislative branch what they're doing,
or the executive branch and the duties they have to
perform the election.

Speaker 5 (08:54):
I think she should be impeached. I don't know.

Speaker 3 (08:56):
I think that there are grounds for this with her
conduct and what she's doing here. Are you guys considering
that at all?

Speaker 6 (09:04):
Well, I think everything's on the table at this point.
We're not focused on that right this second, but there'll
come a time when that discussion has had. Right now,
we're focused on trying to get decent maps. But you
brought up a really good point, and this, again is
what the people of Utah should not tolerate from a judge.
You pointed out that this was case. It's a four
year case, by the way, but it was the last

(09:25):
part of it that we're in discussions now is heard
in January. The judge said in that she will issue
the ruling in June.

Speaker 2 (09:33):
Okay.

Speaker 6 (09:34):
The judge then pushed that decision off and didn't issue
the ruling until the very end of August, the first
part of September. Then gave the legislature thirty days which
is unbelievable to redo the maps, and then took thirty
or forty more days on our own and draw it.
Took it out till the last minute. Eleven forty one
pm last night is when the judge issued the ruining.

(09:57):
We don't have now again. This is so terrible. Is
our recourse going to the Supreme Court at this point
in time. The deadline has came in passed. The judge
drew this out to the very last minute to where
we can't even go make a proper appeal to this
Utah Supreme Court to have them overturn this because the
deadline's passed now. The judge structured that in a way

(10:20):
to make that happen again. When I say Utons were
smacked in the face by this, this judge smacked Uton's
right upside the head and said, your voice doesn't matter anymore.

Speaker 2 (10:30):
I know better.

Speaker 6 (10:31):
I'm picking a map drawn by a far left organization
out of Washington, DC, and it's wrong.

Speaker 1 (10:38):
Yeah, it is wrong. So where do you go from here?
Speaker shoals, if you can't go to the Supreme Court,
do you hope the people raise a ruckus and say
something needs to be done here? What are you hoping for?

Speaker 6 (10:50):
The people of this state need to stand up and
see what's going on and demand something to change. Because, yes,
unfortunately we don't have a very good opportunity in front
of the Supreme Court. Why because instead of ruling, the
issuing the ruling in June or even soon, I mean,
think about that, six months to issue a ruling. I mean,
the fact that it should take to June is ridiculous,

(11:13):
especially on something so important. This was orchestrated and structured
to get a specific outcome. The people of the state
need to stand up and say enough is enough and
work together to put the voice of the people back
inside of the people and those that are elected, not
by unelected judge.

Speaker 1 (11:30):
Speakure of the Utah House. Mike Schulz joining us. We've
got a lot of coverage on this today. Coming up
a little bit later on, we'll talk with a spokesman
with the Mormon Women for Ethical Government, one of the
groups behind this. The chairman of the Utah Republican Party,
Rob Axsen, will join us, and Rob Bishop, former US
Congressman and one time member of that Boundary Commission, will
join us as well. So busy day coming up right

(11:51):
here on the Rod and Greg Show and Utah's Talk
Radio one oh five nine ky NRS. All right, we're
covering the decision announced late last night by a district
judge here in the state of Utah on the Redistrict
teen issue. If you'd like to come out on this
eight eight eight five seven oh eight zero one zero
on your cell phone dial pound two fifty and say
hey Rod, or give us a message on the talk

(12:11):
back line.

Speaker 3 (12:12):
Yeah, let's go to the Let's go to our listeners,
which is always soothing for me. I love, I love
to hear from our listeners. You've always got good input,
good good takes. Let's go to Paul, who's in West Bountiful. Paul,
thank you for holding. Welcome to the Ronn and Greg Show.
What do you make of the news that's sitting Utah today?

Speaker 7 (12:29):
Well, and that's exactly what I wanted to talk about.
And Rod how come you got such a liberal on
with you?

Speaker 5 (12:38):
Hughes me.

Speaker 1 (12:39):
He's the farthest thing ever from a liberal.

Speaker 7 (12:42):
Actually, I know him personally, and he knows me. I
went by my first name as.

Speaker 2 (12:46):
In my middle.

Speaker 8 (12:49):
Yeah, yeah, I.

Speaker 5 (12:50):
Do know you, sir. He's talking classical liberal.

Speaker 2 (12:53):
Yeah.

Speaker 7 (12:53):
The first time I saw you, when I I you
were first running, I sat down and see what we
could do to help you for your election.

Speaker 5 (13:02):
A former legislator.

Speaker 7 (13:05):
Lator before you, I think, before you came in, sir. Yes, sir,
I am frustrated. In the early eighties, and it happened
to be my study. We did a study on impeachment.
We did a very thorough study and we established rules.
One of the things we found that high crimes and

(13:26):
misdemeanors was a parliamentary term. An abrogation of the powers
of another branch of government was an impeachable offense. We
found that from some of the in depth studies. I
cannot figure out why the legislature does not impeach some
of these judges because they're stepping way beyond their judicial bounds.
They're becoming legislative. They they're violating their off of office.

(13:51):
In my opinion, yeah, those studies that we have enough
of a majority. I think we could do it in
the Utah House and Senate, and I think it would
get their attention very quick if they armoved one of
the judges I was acting the way they shouldn't be
beyond their judicial authority.

Speaker 5 (14:12):
Well, thank you for the call.

Speaker 3 (14:13):
Let me just say this, and it is an arrow
in the quiver and it's not one that you've seen
used a whole lot. I remember once said there was
a judge that was arrested for cocaine possession, did not
want to resign. We began that impeachment process and that
was enough to get the judge to resign from that position.
But this is the part this is I mean, it's
one thing for the equal and separate powers of the

(14:34):
legislative branch to be violated. The part that I think
even goes further. This is the rubicon for me that
was crossed, is how this judge has manipulated the deadlines
to force no recourse, no action from the legislature. If
you are told that November first is the time that
you need to know what congressional districts exist for the
purposes of elections that are coming in twenty six and

(14:56):
filing the beginnings in the first week of January, and
the court asks for that to be extended. It is
given ten days, and on almost midnight of the tenth
day you bring out this ruling. It reeks of gamesmanship
in the worst way. This is not a serious judge
that would take a ruling of this magnitude and slip
it in or drop it right before midnight of that

(15:18):
tenth day, which was already back against the wall for
the legislature to do have any recourse or to do
anything responsible in response to this decision.

Speaker 1 (15:27):
Very interesting timing, wouldn't you say.

Speaker 3 (15:29):
Yeah, I would love someone to give me the straight
faced reason why it's not just contempt towards the legislative
branch and executive branch. What would be the straight faced
reason at eleven forty or fifty to put this decision
out there?

Speaker 1 (15:41):
All right? Mary coming up the roder and Greg Shier
with you on this very busy Tuesday afternoon on Utah
It's Talk Radio one O five to nine. Kay Anna, Right,
all right, our story we're following today A judge hands
rejected the Utah Legislature's congressional map, creating a democratic leaning seat.
I think that's very very to say. Well, there are
a number of groups behind the effort, including the Mormon

(16:02):
Women for Ethical Government and joining us on our newsmaker
line to talk about that is a communications specialist with
that group, Laura Lewis. Ay, Laura, how are you welcome
to the Rodin Greg Show. Thanks for joining us, Laura,
thanks for having me.

Speaker 9 (16:16):
Appreciate it.

Speaker 1 (16:16):
Laura, let's talk about this. I mean I heard a
number of your people during the news conference that was
held today, and almost to everyone who spoke, they talked
about this puts an end to Jerrymanderin. You look at
the map that has now been approved by this judge,
how do you explain that it does not look like Jerrymanderin?

Speaker 9 (16:36):
Right? So, when the people of Utah voted on Proposition
for back in twenty eighteen, we established an independent criteria
for redistricting, and that included not looking at partisan data.
It included keeping communities together and trying to create the

(16:59):
process be as neutral as possible. And so the maps
that you see today are ones that were drawn without
partisan data and done in a neutral way that has
been third party tested many different times to create maps
that are most representative and keeping communities together, so Jerry

(17:21):
Mandarin would be manipulating voter data in order to break
apart communities or create districts that would favor one part
or the other. Whereas the maps that we're drawn and
that we're that we now have uh are we're not
drawn in that way and are completely neutral.

Speaker 1 (17:42):
And you don't think this map looks like it was
drawn so the Democrats could get a member of our delegation.
You don't think that.

Speaker 9 (17:50):
Yeah, And and you know it's it's interesting because that
there are many who are trying to frame this victory
through the lens of partisanship. They want to cook this
as a win for their party or others sees this
as a loss and use it as a rally and
cry for theirs and for m WEG. To be clear,

(18:11):
this has always been about opposition to Jerry Mandarin, no
matter which party initiates or benefits from it, and our
organization includes a politically diverse set of women who live
all across the state. Utahans voted on for proposition for
across party lines. This is always about having an independent

(18:33):
redistricting process and creating a neutral criteria for creating maps
and not not jerrymandering.

Speaker 3 (18:41):
The challenge with that premise is if it was there
was not any partisan data presented. First off, I think
the legislature would asked to redraw came with their methodology
and how they came to those maps they drew, and
how they followed the proposition for I don't know that
the methodology was. There was transparency in the methodology used
for the map that better boundaries and the third part

(19:04):
of your party profer to the courts. But but it
seems to be obvious to everyone. I'm looking at a
Hikeem Jefferies post that you put out early this morning
celebrating this very How does everybody in America know that
this has partisan data and it is it is a blue,
a dark blue congressional district. But for the for this judge,
and it sounds like your organization that think this is

(19:25):
a coin, we have no idea because no partisan data
was used, this could be as much a Republican district
as a Democrat district. It seems almost I don't know
that we could say you don't know it's a Democrat district.
It seems like there's partisan data there because everyone I
mean nationally. Everybody knows CNN's putting it in a Democrat
column right now. How how is that map that is

(19:45):
so clearly understood to be a partisan map argued to
be completely nonpartisan And it's it's in the way it
was made, the.

Speaker 9 (19:54):
Way that it was John was not using partisan data,
and it was used to keep communities together as closely
as possible instead of cracking them and breaking them to
manipulate one party in favor more than the other. Let
me just tell you about some Utahns and like members
in general who have been working over the past eight

(20:16):
years across ideological and partisan lines for representative government, starting
with Proposition for and it's been transformational for them. They've
been become more active in the civic spere in many areas.
They've been writing letters to the editor, op eds, making
comment at public hearings that the legislature has been putting on,

(20:39):
and even cities and advocates are are have felt the
power of this principled engagement and working alongside people who
have different opinions on other issues. This has truly been
across partisan advocacy efforts, grassroots efforts from the very beginning,
and the people of Utah want a map that is

(21:01):
drawn without partisan data, that keeps communities together as much
as possible and really reflects the will of Utah voters
and the constitutional the constitution that we have the right
to reform our government. In Article one, Section two, it
says that in the Uta State Constitution, and so this

(21:23):
is purely an exercise of constitutional rights by Utah citizens.
And we're excited today that the will of the voters
has been heard and that we have a map that
reflects that.

Speaker 3 (21:36):
Laurie, I have a good I watched the press conference too,
and I think what you said sounds intuitive, and I
think that that's something. I think we all want something
that's fair, and we don't want anyone I mean, you
look at these districts in New York. Jerry Nadler's district
looks like a praying mantis, and we don't want to
see things like that. But I also heard this grassroots
effort that you're talking about and the bipartisan nature. But
I want to point out seventy two percent of the

(21:58):
money in twenty eighteen past this proposition was came from
out of state, and there are eight donors that are
sixty nine percent of it, And I just want to
roll through these largest donors and ask you do they
sound partisan? The ACLU, the Campaign for Democracy, Gavin Newsom's pack,
the SEIU, which is the United Healthcare Workers for California,

(22:18):
the NEA, the National Education Association represent US Massachusetts which
is from Massachusetts and it's not a bipartisan group. The
Southwest Regional Council of Carpenters California, and the Election Reformers
Network which is part of the National Democrat Institute, and
Jimmy Carter Center. Those are that represents sixty nine percent
of the funding in twenty eighteen for this proposition with

(22:41):
really no money in opposition to it. Do those funders
sound like they are nonpartisan funders or do are they
partisan with an end in mind which coincidentally or not coincidentally,
the end that was in mind works perfectly if you're
a left of center.

Speaker 9 (22:59):
So I would again point to the fact that it
was the Utah voters who voted on proposition for this
reflects This reflects the will of Utah voters who voted
on this, and it's it for m WEG that I
am representing today has nothing to do with partisanships outside

(23:20):
interests it's about a grassroots efforts from women across party lines, Republicans, Democrats,
independent who want fair, representative and responsive government, and we
get that through through maps that are not jerrymandered. That
hurts democracy, that hurts it empowers the politicians, not the voters.

(23:42):
That's who gets hurt when we have jerry maundering. And
so for m WEG, this has always been There are
others who may co opt it for political purposes, but
for MG, this has always been about principal power over partisanship.

Speaker 5 (23:57):
So, Laura, you've been a good sport.

Speaker 3 (23:58):
Thank you for coming on the show and taking our
questions and having this discussion. I just want to ask
you this question here. Now that we have the receipts,
we see what fairness means, how the process worked out.
Would you be willing to reintroduce this as a statewide
ballot to the voters now that we know kind of
what that would look like. I mean, the word fair
might be innocuous, but we see how this process rolled out. Now,

(24:18):
would you be open to having this reconsidered with voters
in the twenty six on a ballid issue for twenty
twenty six.

Speaker 9 (24:26):
I believe that is what the legislature is actually doing,
and so we want to uphold the will of Utah voters,
and so we will continue to work for fair maps
and for a nonpartisan process that's not jerry manders. Sure,
and if that goes before the Utah voters, then we

(24:49):
have full state that Utah voters will again want feramounts
and want a neutral criteria just like propositions for that
is currently the law of the land that takes the
politics out out of redistricting in Utah.

Speaker 1 (25:03):
Laura, again, thank you very much for coming on and
answering some of all of our questions. We appreciate your
time today.

Speaker 9 (25:08):
Thank you, thank you so much.

Speaker 1 (25:11):
All right on our newsmaker line. That's Laura Lewis, a
e with the Mormon Women for Ethical Government or Response
to Redistricting. Boy, have I got a few things to
say about that interview and when we come back. All right,
more coming up on the Rotten Gregg Show. Rob Axton
will join us. Coming up a little bit later on,
former Congressman Rob Bishop will weigh on on this as well.
He served on that commission and then decided to call

(25:33):
it quits. He'll explain why that all's coming up. Our
number two of the Roden Gregg Show on Talk Radio one.
Oh fivene An rs.

Speaker 3 (25:49):
It's not a new concept, folks. We've talked about the
pizza pie versus a donut hole in terms of how
you draw congressional districts in Utah. For a number of
redistricting you know, sessions which have in every ten years,
the pizza pie says that that you only have four
members of Congress. Used to be three nine and it
was four. And with that limited number, should every member

(26:10):
of Congress that goes back to Washington, should they have
in front of them a constituency that represents urban, suburban
and rural interests in an economy in Utah that interconnects
all of our state with different economic factors, and those
communities are more related than people in Salt Lake City.
You want to admit, the donut hole would suggest that
you just take every Democrat you can find in the
most densest populated place possible and hand them over a

(26:33):
Democrat seat. That in and of that is gerrymandering. To me,
by definition, the pizza pie, or having a more diverse
constituency for four members of Congress, is the least partisan
approach to how you draw these districts. So I just
wanted to share with you with that, share that with
you because there has been thought on how in the
world you take four district for just four members and

(26:55):
how do you get a fair representation? And I would
argue it's you might not even if if you don't
agree with that, with that philosophy, it's a philosophy and
it is a and I think it's a it's an
approach that's defensible.

Speaker 1 (27:06):
Yeah, it is.

Speaker 2 (27:07):
Well.

Speaker 1 (27:07):
Joining us on our newsmaker line right now to talk
more about this rolling is Rob Axson, chairman of the
Utah or Utah Republican Party.

Speaker 2 (27:15):
Rob.

Speaker 1 (27:15):
How are you welcome back to the Rod and Greg show?

Speaker 6 (27:18):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (27:18):
You always going to be with you guys.

Speaker 1 (27:19):
Rob. How on earth?

Speaker 3 (27:20):
Now?

Speaker 1 (27:20):
We just had a spokesman with the group More Men
and Women for Ethical Government and I asked her, how
can you say this is not jerrymandering because you basically
have a blueberry inside of a very large bowl of
tomato soup. How is that not jerry mandering? And she
claims it isn't. I mean, explain that one to me
if you would, Rob, I don't.

Speaker 10 (27:41):
Think there's really a way to explain that I'll just
call a spade a spade, and that is, if you're
willing to go and compromise structure and fairness and constitutional
order to get a preferred outcome, then you're willing to
bend rules. That's just simply not where I'm at. Sometimes
we win, sometimes our preferred candidates win, Sometimes the issues
we care about win, and the opposite is also true.

Speaker 1 (28:01):
Sometimes we lose.

Speaker 10 (28:03):
But you have to do that in a structure that
is fair and that is understandable and defensible, and that
is our constitutional structure, which this entire ruling has thrown
out the window. And when it comes to jerrymandering, ultimately
you're trying to avoid. If you're trying to avoid jerrymandering,
you're trying to avoid put political manipulation to get an

(28:23):
outcome you couldn't get otherwise. Well, that's what they've just
gone and done. They've actually been the ones engaged in jerrymandering.

Speaker 5 (28:31):
So where does the I mean?

Speaker 3 (28:32):
This is driving me crazy? It seems like I'm reading
a pressure release from Hekeem Jeffries this morning. He's praising
this judge in Utah, very very excited that this has happened.
The Democrats seem to have known. CNN was listing this
as a big win for Democrats the state of Utah
early on before this ruling ever came out, So it

(28:53):
seems like everybody seemed to know there were partisan considerations
going on in this redraw, except for the judge and
those that are trying to explain to the public that
there are no partisan considerations taking place right here. What
does the Utah Republican Party do rob right now to
start educating voters or Utahs that this system has been

(29:14):
taken from them, that the voice of the people and
those that they elect, we're not able to draw these
districts and the independent groups actually drew these districts instead.
How do you effectively communicate that? Do you say this
has to be a consistent effort.

Speaker 10 (29:29):
We have to continue to talk about this with our
friends and family and our neighbors, and it shouldn't be
just a partisan issue. Obviously, the Republican Party and some
on the political right are standing up and talking about this,
But again I would invite people from the political left
to stand up. If you're willing to compromise the structure
of constitutionality and representative government for short, term gains, it

(29:53):
is long term going to be detrimental to our entire society.
So I'd invite folks across the political spectrum to look
at and recognize that our constitutional separation of powers, our
constitutional structure of representative government matters. We have to keep
talking about this, We have to keep talking about the
importance of that, because when you suddenly are just talking

(30:13):
about redistricting, that's easy to have Utah's issue lost in
this national issue where you're seeing things happen in California
and in Texas. But what we're dealing with here in
Utah is different. This is not an expression of political
power by Republicans in Texas or Democrats in California. This
is unelected, unaccountable, and thereby unfireable individuals from the court

(30:39):
who are unilaterally making decisions. And keep in mind, in
her ruling and selection of Map one from the plaintiffs,
she's not even going to this underlying quote unquote independent
redistricting commission for a map. She's going to a private
group that is not accountable to any of your listeners
and to any Utah's across the state. And that's inappropriate.

Speaker 1 (31:00):
This private group, the put forth this Matt that she
approved of. Did the public cover get a chance to
look at this or comment on this map? One? Do
you know, Rob? I think I know the answer to this,
but I thought i'd ask you as well.

Speaker 10 (31:11):
Sure, they probably invited people to donate to their cause
on their website and counted that as a comment. But no,
there was not a process where this was open. This
was not before any of our elected officials, and thereby
it was not before the people who were elected by
us and can be fired by us to represent us

(31:33):
through this process. We had no representation in this process.
And in this era when we like to talk about
no kings, it's amazing that the only person behaving like
a king here is Judge Gibson.

Speaker 3 (31:45):
So there are some people that might be frustrated with
the current legislature for whatever reason. Let's talk about just
there was a legislative branch before I was born here
in the state of Utah. There will be one that
hopefully continues on long after we're all gone here. How
important is it that our state constitution and its structure

(32:06):
and separate and equal powers be respected here? I mean
how I mean again, it's a little wonkish. I mean,
if you want to get into these details. Some people
live busy lives. How do we preserve our Utah State
Constitution and the powers, the separated powers that each of
these branches have. Because it's been taken it has measurably
been taken away. That's the state of play today. How

(32:29):
do you get it back?

Speaker 10 (32:31):
Yeah, you're one hundred percent right there, Greg, And this
is the core issue. We can make changes, and we
can make changes to our laws, we can make changes
to our process, but it needs to go through the
structure that we have agreed upon. Because that structure of constitutionality,
of representative government, of separation of powers, that's the only

(32:52):
structure that protects the ultimate sovereign, the people who actually
control the process, and that's all of us collectively citizens
of Utah, as voters in Utah, we are the ones
that should hold that power. The only way that that
can be expressed in a way that has a collective
protection of different ideas but also engages meaningfully in collaboration,

(33:15):
is our structure. It's not through private groups, it's not
through even political parties. It's certainly not through the courts,
because none of those people are ultimately accountable to you.
In any direct fashion consistently yet, your legislature, your elected officials,
they can stand to earn your vote, and they also
can stand and be accountable to you, where you have

(33:37):
the right to fire them if you disagree with what
they're doing.

Speaker 1 (33:40):
Rob, I no, we've this story is far from over.
I know you'll keep working at it. Thanks for joining
us this afternoon. We know you've had a very busy day.

Speaker 2 (33:48):
Well, thank you, guys. I appreciate it.

Speaker 5 (33:50):
Thank you.

Speaker 1 (33:50):
All right, Robacks and Chairman of the Utah Republican Party. Now,
we've got a lot of comments on our talk back line.
We want to open up the phones to you as
well on this whole issue of what has happened as
a result of this late, late minute ruling by a
district judge here in the state of Utah. We'll get
your calls and comments coming out right here on the
Rod and Greg Show and Talk Radio one O five

(34:10):
to nine knrs. All right, let's go to the phones.
We're talking about the ruling by a district judge here
in Utah basically saying we want a Democrat in Congress
and we're gonna make every effort to do just that.
To the phones, we go we talk with Sarah in Bluffdale. Sarah,
how are you welcome to the Rod and Greg show?

Speaker 11 (34:28):
Hey, ronin Greg. Thank you so much, so I'm just
going to get right into it, if that's okay.

Speaker 1 (34:33):
Yes, please?

Speaker 11 (34:33):
Do I think that the Church of Jesus Christ as
Latter day Saints should sue? How dare she throw the
name Mormon around like that? When she does, everybody thinks
Mormon just insinuates this as fair and benevolent when it
was anything but just throw religion into this. Well, sister,

(34:54):
by their fruit, you she'll know them. She chose the
Acou and the King Jeffrey, so good luck with that.
I will not have you, taj Astroid. We already have
talks for Heaven's sakes, and the fact that this was
the voice that the people is laughable. Well, she's get
to get a voice from hear from the voice of
the people now, and I will be fighting against you,
and this judge must be impeached.

Speaker 5 (35:17):
Thank you, Sarah.

Speaker 3 (35:18):
You know, here's here's the there's a test I used
to like to do when I was a public servant,
and now that is to to make sure I'm trying
to be fair and you want to be fair.

Speaker 1 (35:26):
You really don't want to be fair.

Speaker 5 (35:27):
I mean there's nothing. I mean that's it is.

Speaker 3 (35:29):
It is actually more if you got to know the
legislative process. People, even if you don't agree on issues,
there is a there's a respect for each other. You
try to have that. If you take an issue and
you flip the issue the opposite way, would you still
be okay with the process? And by that I mean
to Sarah's point, can you have a right a right
of center group who uses the Church of Gis Christ,

(35:50):
Latterdays Saints name, or Mormons for their political pursuits? Would
that be okay? I think people would be uncomfortable with that.
I think that if you asked, and I like the Eagle,
but if you said, ego form, will you draw our
congressional maps for us?

Speaker 5 (36:03):
Can we have you? Not the legislature, don't we elect?

Speaker 3 (36:06):
No, But we want our our you know, our rock
ribbed Conservative Utah organization to draw all the maps for
us instead of having the legislature do it.

Speaker 5 (36:15):
Would we be okay with that? I think the answer
would be no.

Speaker 3 (36:17):
I think we have a legislative branch that we would
look to to serve in that and that with that
du that can that constitutional duty. So for them to
have an organization that is not down the center, that
isn't doesn't advocate for conservative issues as well as left
of center, but they are a dependably left of center organization.
I believe UH to use the name of the predominant

(36:40):
faith in the state. I think it is a.

Speaker 1 (36:42):
Missips they have. I don't I can't recall greg now.
I'm not sure how long they've been around. They've been
around through four maybe five years now. I don't recall
one time they took it. They have taken a stand
on a conservative issue. They have attacked Donald Trump. They
have a tech almost every conservative issue in this state.
And we are not the only ones who has who

(37:02):
have concerns about this organization. Here's a comment onto our
talk back line.

Speaker 12 (37:07):
Hey, Rodin Grave, this is German from an American fork cut.
Some serious issues with Progressive Mormon for Ethical Government. They
say ethical government, but in reality what they want is
they want big progressive government. They are constantly on the
liberal progressive side of every single issue. I have never
once seen Mormon Women for Ethical Government actually supporting the

(37:30):
actual doctrinal stance of the Church of Jewis Castalatity Saints,
which is small limited government.

Speaker 1 (37:35):
Yeah, heat spot on with that comment, Greg, He is saying, hey,
I've got issues. I think a lot of people out
there do because of that title. Yes, I think that
if they want to call themselves something else and take
their stands good, But using this title, I think they're
they're basically telling people, hey, we're good Mormon women and
we hate anything conservative.

Speaker 3 (37:55):
Well and gets your head around this, Okay. This judge,
Judge Gibson, in August, said this when in one of
the cases The Great is Her. This is what she said.
This court is not drawing a map. It is the
legislature's responsibility to make sure there's a lawful congressional plan
in place for the twenty sixth election. This court recognizes
the separation of powers. I understand. It is not the

(38:16):
court's job, it's the legislature's job. She said that yesterday,
late last night, before midnight, which give me a reason
other than contempt for the legislative and executive branch. Would
you would put it out just before midnight like she did.
There's no there's no real reason for that, or straight
faced reason, I understand. But if she's saying that in

(38:36):
her decision, she gave these this group, this Mormon's for
ethical Mormon women for ethical government. Third party groups are drew.
She accepted maps from individual groups. That if she's acknowledging
that that is the role of the legislature, how did
that role? How did these maps that were drawn with
no process like the legislature has with public input, how

(38:58):
do they become memorialized now as law of the land. Yeah,
it is such a stretch. They have just gone further
and further until they contradict themselves.

Speaker 1 (39:08):
Yeah, all right, back to the phones we go. Let's
go to Jason in Saratoga Springs tonight here on the
Rodding Greg Show. Jason, how are you welcome to the show?

Speaker 2 (39:17):
Good? How are you guys?

Speaker 4 (39:18):
Thanks for taking my call.

Speaker 1 (39:19):
We're doing well. Thank you your thoughts?

Speaker 4 (39:23):
My thoughts are I'm a conservative here in the state
of Utah, young conservative, and I'm just kind of wondering,
why isn't the GOP more upset with former Governor Herbert
for appointing her to the bench and the legislature some
for backing her play putting her on the bench, you know,
And why are we not upset at our own state
party for not mobilizing voters in twenty eighteen to get

(39:43):
them out, you know, to act against this. I mean,
former armyin chairman Accent said it best. The people need
to stand up. That's why we're here because nobody stood
up and nobody educated them.

Speaker 1 (39:53):
That's a very good point.

Speaker 4 (39:54):
My biggest problem.

Speaker 1 (39:56):
That's a very good point on both counts.

Speaker 3 (39:58):
And let me give you some perspective in the and
this isn't a debate. I don't disagree with your answers
or your questions, and I am frustrated. I am highly
frustrated by the nominees that the governor has put out.
And I'm highly frustrated. And I think if you were
to ask some of these Utah State Senators on an
honesty in hindsight, they do feel that there wasn't a
strong enough vetting of these clearly, of these judicial nominees.

(40:22):
But back in this case, in this year of twenty eighteen,
there were a bunch. It was a well imacare expansion,
which I fought hard against. And we're seeing the reasons
and the consequences now why we should have never got
into this that was on the ballot. You had medical
cannabis on the ballot. The leftists know that the legislative
branch does not do state wide ballots. Well, they don't

(40:44):
know how to raise the money, they don't know how
to get they don't know how to get other people
involved to do it. They don't have a budget as
a state to do it. They run through a legislative
session bills and laws and they vet it that way.
If the left can get, if they can carpet bomb.
And I've got the list right here of the eight
donors from out of state that were sixty nine percent
of the donations given for that for that effort, all

(41:06):
from the ACLU Gavin Newsom's own campaign. They didn't they
weren't able to give the voters that information that would
counteract it. And even in the absence of that campaign,
it's still passed by fifty point thirty six percent, which
means it barely passed. It passed on the weight of
the blue votes in Salt Lake City. I will tell
you this, I think that the going forward, I think

(41:28):
the Senate has to be wholly committed to a much
much thorough venu of these judges and that has to
be part of it. And don't mistake I am. I
think for a lot of people are frustrated that we've
gotten the product that we've gotten, and I think.

Speaker 5 (41:42):
We're going to layer the show. We'll get into what
can we do about this? There's some things.

Speaker 3 (41:47):
I think we have some aras in our quiver folks
as the people that we can do proactively in response
to this. So we'll get into that, I think later
in the program as well.

Speaker 1 (41:54):
All Right, more of your talk about comments and your
phone calls coming up on the Rod and Greg show
and talk radio one of five Knaus.

Speaker 3 (42:02):
You look at this map, and I don't know how
on earth you can say that that map is not
drawn with political considerations. Even people forget that that's supposed
to be the premise. So democrats are happy, and there's
people that like the map because they want to have
a Democrat seat, and they forget that they signed up
for a process that was supposed to have no partisan consideration.
So on my social media they're saying, why can't Democrats

(42:22):
have their own seat? Sounds like you're sounds like that
sounds like a partisan consideration you're asking about. This was
supposed to be void of all of that. What really
Riles me is the intellectual dishonesty going on here where
everybody knows CNN and King Jeffries, everybody on an American
knows that this thing was Eric Holder, that this was

(42:44):
drawn four and on behalf of Democrats to have the
darkest blue seat seat they could have in Utah. And
we have people say we just wanted to be fair.
Oh we just we don't even know where this is
going to go. We'd have no idea for Republicans or
Democrats will be able to win this seat because it's
just so fair and on partisan.

Speaker 1 (43:01):
I guess the people really taw wanted a Democrat in Congress,
and that's why we have this map today. All the
people in Utah feel it just makes us feel good.
We feel more inclusive if we have a Democrat in Congress.
Show me who you know, I'll show you where you're
gonna go. I got eight sixty nine percent of their
money used in eighteen to pass this are from donors

(43:23):
that are not from Utah. They're out of state and
they're the ACLU, they're Gavin Newsom's pack, they're they're all
from the it's all leftist out of state money and
look Utah is not alone in this. I actually I
disagree with what rob Axson was saying. He's trying to
separate Utah's situation from what's going on nationally. Eric Holder
is leading this charge all around the country, across.

Speaker 3 (43:43):
This country to game up this redistricting process to get
more more congressional seats.

Speaker 5 (43:49):
Look, they're scared.

Speaker 3 (43:50):
They're terrified that all the illegals that they have allowed
in that are part of apportionment for congressional districts. If
they lose that, if they were to lose those numbers
because people self deport or they're they're not getting those numbers,
they could lose seats just on.

Speaker 5 (44:02):
That kind of math alone.

Speaker 3 (44:04):
They need efforts like this, and they've been doing it
in multiple states, and sadly, most of the Republican states
are on the right side of this. They have the
firewalls up necessary. We're the only red state I see
in the list of Democrat states that are gaming this
for their own seats. We're the only red state in
the Democrat column.

Speaker 1 (44:20):
Yeah, all right, let's go to your comments on our
talk back line. Here's a comment.

Speaker 13 (44:25):
Hey, Rod and Greg, this is Shane up in Cash Valley.
I just wanted to comment on how all the founders
of proposition for from the worst during mandarate states in
the Union and now California just made it to where
they're going to durring mander even more.

Speaker 3 (44:48):
Yeah, he's right, so right, Yeah, I'm looking at that
top eight donors again. Yeah, California's one, and so is Massachusetts.
I mean it's again as it's just a power.

Speaker 1 (44:59):
Play as a result of Prop. Fifty in California that
was approved by voters last Tuesday. Right, they have one,
I think fifty four congressional districts in that state. Right, Yes,
nine will be Republicans out of a state of what
twenty million people?

Speaker 3 (45:15):
And the yeah, and they and they. And in states
where people say, well, I have nothing to do with
rural Utah, well does Alpine Utah have something to do
with San Juan County? Because this fair map just mixed communities.
And I'm okay with that. Because our economy is interconnected.
We do need people that fight for our rural interests,
our agricultural interests, oil and gas mining, all those things

(45:37):
at the same time our suburbs at the same time
are urban issues we need.

Speaker 5 (45:41):
We only have four.

Speaker 3 (45:42):
We don't have fifty two from California, twenty eight from
you know, Florida, you know, seventeen from Pennsylvania. We don't
have those kind of numbers in Congress. We have four
and every one of them should be reflected answering to
the constituency of the state of Utah. And I think
that this economy is more connect then what the Democrats
want in their own seat. They think that somehow the

(46:03):
food only comes from the grocery store, they don't have
to worry about the rural side of life at all.

Speaker 1 (46:09):
Back to another talk back line.

Speaker 14 (46:11):
Question, I would ask, when you talk about this new
map not breaking up communities, please look at the lines
and tell me how many other communities are broken up.
Which community mattered more than the than all the others
that didn't get broken that were broken up versus the
one that wasn't broken up, And tell me that that's
not jerrymandering in and of itself itself.

Speaker 1 (46:35):
Why can't answer that the communities that mattered were heavily
blue communities.

Speaker 3 (46:39):
That's exactly right well to these and I'm glad to
hear the color say that, because it's my point is
that if you look, you have this third district map
that the that this third party proffered to the judge,
and the judge says, yeah, let's make that law. It
is Salt Lake City, it is Northern Utah County, Provo,
it is San Juan County, it is Washington County, it's garf.

(47:01):
I mean, these are not If you're going to make
the argument that these communities don't have any touch on
one another, which I would argue that our Utah economy does.
You can't make that argument for your dark blue Democrat
district and then somehow ignore the communities that you've merged
together throughout the rest of the state and not give
any consideration there. It's not intellectually honest, No, it is not.

Speaker 1 (47:21):
All right, more of your calls and comments, more of
our talkback comments coming up right here on the Rod
and Greg Show and Talk Radio one oh five nine knrs.

Speaker 3 (47:29):
So we're taking your calls talking about the news that's
across the country, that's happening in Utah, where this judge
has let this third party group draw a favorite map
that they'd like. It turns out that it's dark blue
for a congressional district out of the four. None of
this is because of partisan considerations. That's the law that
was supposed to be followed. But amazingly everybody in the
country knows it's a blue Matt a blue district, and

(47:50):
everyone is celebrating that's on the left. But it's not
supposed to be that way. Getting your calls, get taking
your calls and getting your comments. Let's go quickly before
the top of the hour to John and Sarah. John,
thank you for holding. Welcome to the Rod and Greg Show.

Speaker 15 (48:04):
Yeah, I just wanted to comment. You know, the founding
fathers set up our constitution as a representative government. They
did not set it up as an independent council government.
And imagine if everything was independent councils, we have no representation.
So I don't understand why this is so difficult to understand.

(48:25):
We are a representative government.

Speaker 5 (48:28):
Amen, love in our callers call.

Speaker 1 (48:34):
Is this representative government? I don't it's so.

Speaker 5 (48:37):
Hard to understand.

Speaker 3 (48:38):
Yes, it's a it's a it's a duly elected legislative
branch that drazy's districts or was the case.

Speaker 5 (48:44):
And so you know, I people, let's uh, do you
have a.

Speaker 1 (48:47):
Talk about because it's a good one too. Yes, I
think a lot of people are asking this question.

Speaker 16 (48:51):
Hey, Roden Greg I love listening to you guys and
the inputs you have, but there's one thing that I
wish you guys would do and give.

Speaker 5 (48:58):
Us suggestions on how to respond to this stuff.

Speaker 16 (49:01):
It's kind of difficult hearing all the crazy stuff that
people are doing in the government. I just wish there
was some input or some advice on how to go
about changing these things or how to react to them.

Speaker 1 (49:14):
Thanks by I'll answer that.

Speaker 5 (49:17):
Get involved, Yeah, solved.

Speaker 3 (49:19):
I'm going to tell you something I know how I
can tell you that most people in state government here
from lobbyists, yeah, and from special interest groups. Okay, and look,
we're busy people. Sometimes your employment aligns with a group
that will look out, you know, watch the hen House
for you those things. I cannot tell you how important
it is through social media, through outreach to these lawmakers

(49:41):
to express your concern or your opposition outrage to what
you're hearing. They need that because this is even beyond
just you know, a raw raw. Hey, we really want
you to do the right thing. They need to be responsible,
responsible to the people. They need to show that that
is what's happening. The more you're able and This is
the perfect audience that is strong enough, smart enough, and

(50:01):
able enough to do this. The more you reach out
and you demand that something be done to restore our equal,
our separate and equal powers of a legislative branch that
accounts to the people and draws these districts, that is
what we have. That is what we expect to keep.
You need to reach out and look. I'll put on
my social media site a site where you can click
on and find your representative that you can reach out,

(50:24):
but you can do it through social media. You would
be surprised how many of our public servants don't hear
from the public directly as much as as it should,
because a lot of this is left to groups that
organize and lobbyists. They need to hear from you. I'll
tell you that this legislature, the other action item isn't yours,
but it's when we should support anytime we're asked. They
need to impeach this judge, this judge putting this ruling

(50:46):
out and almost midnight.

Speaker 5 (50:48):
Someone give me a reason why that timing.

Speaker 3 (50:50):
Happened other than contempt for that legislative branch and the
executive branch. The timing was necessary. They gave them ten
extra day, gave her, the judge ten extra days. They
have to get done. They have to know these district boundaries.
And for her to put that out after close of
business on yesterday and put it out close to midnight,
I don't know what the reason would be. If it's
not aggressive and it's not done in hostility. Well, he's

(51:13):
give you the reason why she did it that way.

Speaker 1 (51:15):
Here's the state bar condemning lawmakers for even thinking about that.
This judge acted in a way that deserves scrutiny. Greg,
Like you said, ten minutes before the deadline, she issues
this early. My question is, Greg, yesterday we got word
from Better Boundaries, this is the organization behind all of this,
that they were going to have a news conference today
to react to the judge's decision that was sent out

(51:38):
at about what three four o'clock yesterday afternoon. How did
they know that decision was coming down. Yeah, well there
was a timing, but they knew it was that.

Speaker 3 (51:46):
They knew it wasn't gonna come down before they had
their press conference, and they were gonna wait for it
to happen, and they knew that. And it's a good
question to ask folks. This is why it is important.
And I'm just seeing it cocross line right now, Lindsayer.
It's reporting that the Utah State Bar is telling the
legislature to not even consider impeaching Judge Diana Gibson. The
left is actually mobilizing their voices to say, do not

(52:10):
do anything to the judge. Take what take your medicine
and like it and lump it. You need to speak
up State Bar.

Speaker 1 (52:15):
All right, more coming up. Former Utah Congressman, former Speaker
the Utah House, Rob Bishop will join us next. He'll
talk about this decision by the judge coming up.

Speaker 3 (52:25):
That's his claim, the famous far as I'm concerned. I
know he went to that, he did that whole Congressional
aid whatever that was. But you know where the real
swat comes from. Yeah, he was the presiding officer of
the Utah House Representatives.

Speaker 1 (52:36):
Well, Rob Bishop actually served on the Redistricting Commission, remember that,
I do, until a couple of years ago he kind
of left and he basically told the commission they suck.

Speaker 5 (52:47):
I think it's actually not kind of I think he
read the quote. I think that's a quote that was
a quote.

Speaker 1 (52:52):
That was a quote. Well, we thought we'd get to
Rob on the show today to talk about what's going
on with these redistricting Rob, how are you welcome to
the Greg Show.

Speaker 8 (53:01):
Thank you very much? And no, I didn't say that,
but I should have.

Speaker 3 (53:08):
You know, it sounded so like you. I thought it
was so on brand. I thought you definitely did say it.
I Rob, let me ask you this question. I know,
I remember back when you you leaned into this commission,
worried that this was the word fair was going to
somehow mean democrat, and you wanted to put your your
institutional memory, your knowledge being a you know, in this
not only just the US or the state House representatives,

(53:30):
but also the US House. Just you wanted to be
there to kind of watch the hen House be a
good voice talk about these things. You ultimately couldn't stay
with where you were seeing this was going. Maybe you
could share with our listeners what is it that prompted
you to not be a part of this this effort
and what were your concerns then and even now.

Speaker 8 (53:49):
Well, there were several things. The first is that this
was not a The Independent Commission is not a represented body.
Everyone stayed from only a certain few people from the
Watsatch front. We weren't making decisions with any kind of knowledge.
We were just making irrational decisions. There was no accountability,
and there were a lot of people who very clearly

(54:10):
had an ulterior motive that were assigned to that particular commission.

Speaker 2 (54:15):
And at the end, it.

Speaker 8 (54:16):
Was just the product that we are producing was a
product that was ridiculous and I couldn't support it, and
I was tired of fighting what I thought was the
good fight.

Speaker 1 (54:26):
Why do you think it is so important? One of
the issues you had is you thought, and we've had
for quite some time now in this state, a real
good mix of urban and rural areas in each of
the four congressional districts. You fought for that. Why was
it so important in your opinion?

Speaker 8 (54:41):
Well, and that's why the commission had no history and
they didn't care about the history. For twenty years, Utah
had an urban district only, with the other two districts
being a mix of urban and rural. And it was
twenty years of contention and chaos in which our delegation
in Washington was not united for issues that were important

(55:02):
to both the urban and the rural area. So yeah,
and then for twenty years after that we had had
a mix of urban and rural, and that was clearly
the situation that provided a better choice and a better
voice for Utah in Washington DC.

Speaker 2 (55:17):
I had been there.

Speaker 8 (55:18):
I understood what was happening when you have an urban
only district. Rural Utah gets harmed, and the delegation's ability
to have a united front to do things for Utah
is harmed as well. Having a rural district and an
urban only district is the worst thing we had the experience.

Speaker 2 (55:38):
We should have learned from it.

Speaker 8 (55:39):
Obviously, this judge that doesn't respect the Constitution didn't learn
from it either.

Speaker 3 (55:44):
I think one of the most offensive parts of this
process is that it was all done under the banner
of there can be no partisan considerations. Well, now that
the map has been announced, there's national posters that are
doing the analysis, and I'm reading from one national poster
that is saying that this newly drawn district that has
no partisan consideration at all, that King Jefferies and c

(56:06):
and nrel celebrating it, has a plus twenty four percent
for Harris election result in the boundaries of this new
district plus twenty four percent. Rob It sounds like that's
a pretty partisan to me. I think you have to
go out of your way to find a district in
the state of Utah red Utah in an election where

(56:27):
Kamala Harris lost around the country in every swing state
to have a plus twenty four percent Harris district congressional districts.

Speaker 5 (56:36):
The what do you deal with this?

Speaker 3 (56:38):
How do you call them out on the clear partisan
nature of something they did under the banner of not
being partisan.

Speaker 8 (56:44):
Well, everybody in the state that wants to respect the
state constitution from the governor on down had better do
that because Closs clearly had an ulterior moment. In fact,
the idea that they suit only on the legislative of
the congressional boundaries when this commission also made recommendations for
legislative and state school board rounders, but they didn't sue

(57:06):
on that they suited only on congressional clearly shows that
there was either hypocrisy or there was a subtle motive
in mind that it was an effort to try and
use the judiciary to change things to create a Democrat seat,
and that's exactly what has happened. So I hope the
state the state appeals this. This is a terrible decision.

(57:28):
Can I add one other thing that irks me to
please do if you have just one second. I was
elected in nineteen seventy eight, and before nineteen eighty, every
the number one seat Congression legislative seat both a House
and the Senate was always in Salt Lake City, starting
in the Avenues, and then the numbers went through Sali County,

(57:50):
Utah Weeber Davis, and then the rest of the state
got was left over. And I complained about that in eighty.
So in eighty they decided to start with one corner,
and they took the northern corner, I think to keep
me happy. So seat number one started in box elder
and two and three, and then it went down the state.

Speaker 2 (58:08):
As the judge created her.

Speaker 8 (58:10):
New map, as she did the legislative function from the
bench and created her new map, she labeled the Salt
Lake Urban District as district number one. If that's not Freudian,
at least it shows this once again, the arrogance of
saying that Salt Lake has to be the center of
the state and the rest of us spin around that,
and I find that arrogant.

Speaker 1 (58:31):
Oh yeah, absolutely, rob What do you make of the
shenanigans of this judge waiting until almost the very last
minute before she issued this ruling to me the deadline
that the state needed. What do you make of those shenanigans?

Speaker 8 (58:44):
Well, I'm not sure.

Speaker 2 (58:45):
It could have been just.

Speaker 8 (58:48):
Coincidental, or it could have been you know, you get
fewer people yelling at you at midnight.

Speaker 3 (58:56):
Yeah, I again. Finally, do you think this judged deserves
to be impeached? Especially with the AG. I think it's
an aggressive move to slow bake this as long as
she's had this case since January. Every single deadline that
she has where she has ruled has left very little
time for any kind of recourse for the legislative branch
to react. She was given ten extra days she wanted.

(59:19):
They were told they needed to know this by November first,
just to get the clerks and start the process. She
asked for an extension. She was given to the tenth.
She gave that decision after business on the tenth and
close to midnight. Is there a contempt being displayed there
to the legislati branch and even the executive branch that
merits the consideration of impeachment.

Speaker 8 (59:40):
When the state Constitution is very clear on what is
legislative authority and what legislative authority is.

Speaker 2 (59:47):
And for a judge to usurp.

Speaker 8 (59:49):
Legislative authority and do legislative action by herself without any
other kind of coordinating council around it, there is definitely
a conchamp for everything that is the very foundation of
our constitutional checks and balances to guarantee our individual liberty.
She has played rough and loose with that, and there

(01:00:11):
should be repercussions. I'm not in a position to call
for her impeachment, but there should be repercussions. And the
entire judiciary needs to realize there is a difference between
the judicial and legislative branches, and the judiciary in Utah
needs to respect that.

Speaker 1 (01:00:28):
That sure does Rob. As always, we appreciate your insight.
Thank you. We hope you're doing well, and thanks for
joining us tonight.

Speaker 2 (01:00:35):
Good to talk to you all.

Speaker 5 (01:00:35):
Thank you all right.

Speaker 1 (01:00:37):
Former you ask Congressman Rob Bishop, former Speaker of the
House three for three today on Speakers of the House
on the Rod and Greg Show. Love is insight and
he's right. You know, if you wait till the last minute,
less people can yell at you.

Speaker 3 (01:00:48):
This judge, her name is is Diana Gibson Is Diana Gibson?

Speaker 5 (01:00:54):
What is it again, Diana Gibson?

Speaker 1 (01:00:56):
Okay, I just wanted to make sure yes, and I think.

Speaker 3 (01:00:57):
We need to say that name often. I'll tell you what.
Here's another we got to go to a break, I'm sure.
But here's a point. I've been asked this question, and
I agree. I'm not thrilled with a Republican governor that
nominates leftists that are rogue and not respecting the separation
of powers. I'm offended by it. I'm frustrated with a
Senate that has a vetting process where people got clearly

(01:01:19):
have gotten through, where the vetting hasn't been close enough,
and the answers they were given were either not truthful
or who they are was not really understood. And I
think that process needs to get even stronger. But consider this, folks,
we have retention elections. Do you know how many of
these judges can say that you the voters approved of them.
They get like eighty ninety percent in these retention elections

(01:01:40):
because there's no information whatsoever about these judges to base
a decision on. It's a farce of an election. If
you have no information to ask the voters to vote
on these judges. But they can actually argue, oh no,
not only was I appointed by a Republican governor and
confirmed by a Republican Senate, but the people themselves, by
eighty to ninety percent, said stay on the bench and

(01:02:03):
do your job. I'm telling you this. This judiciary has
hidden itself, These members have hidden themselves from scrutiny in
a way that the scrutiny has to be much much brighter.
And we need to be looking long and hard at
these members of the judiciary because we're seeing it play
out across the country. This is playing out across this
country right now.

Speaker 1 (01:02:21):
I usually vote no on every one of them.

Speaker 5 (01:02:24):
I do too, I do too.

Speaker 3 (01:02:26):
But they still, I mean, they'll get elected by the
Saddam Hussein percentage numbers of eighty ninety percent, you know,
I mean it's they do. It's And so they could
even use us as the voters to say to legitimize themselves.
You voted for me, so look look at I got
for my retention election. You must love me.

Speaker 1 (01:02:41):
Yeah, yeah. More coming up on the Rod and Gregg
Show and Talk Radio one oh five nine can arrests.

Speaker 3 (01:02:46):
A lot happening today it's Veterans Day. I want to
keep mentioning that land of the free because of the brave,
and I also want to mention that if we're going
to stay free, we've got a lot of work to do,
a lot of things to discuss. We've got the national
news happening with its origin here in Utah. Democrats are
celebrating nationwide over the plus twenty four percent Kamala Harris

(01:03:06):
congressional district in the state of Utah. They somehow in
it under the banner of no partisan consideration, found a
boundary in the state of Utah where Kamala Harris received
twenty four percent more of the vote than Donald Trump.

Speaker 1 (01:03:22):
But that is representative of Utah. Don't you know that?

Speaker 2 (01:03:24):
Great?

Speaker 1 (01:03:24):
Then is representative of Utah.

Speaker 5 (01:03:26):
Oh did such a coincidence?

Speaker 1 (01:03:28):
Kamala Harris did so well here in the state of Utah.
That is just a representation. It is a fair representation
of Utah. Even though Democrats make up what thirteen percent
of the registered voters in this state, they deserve their
own district.

Speaker 3 (01:03:42):
See, you know, Kamala Harris lost every swing state in America.
Uh huh lost the popular vote was thumped. I would argue,
and but you now have in the state of Utah
again under the banner of no partisan consideration, a deep
blue plus twenty four percent Harris voting Democrat district handed

(01:04:03):
to them. And this is not lost on anyone, but
the apologist to people that are still staying with a
straight face, well, no, this was my partisan No, this
was we don't know what the partisan breakdown is fair.
This is just you know, we're so tired of things
not being fair. We want it to be no partisan consideration.
And would you just believe plus twenty four percent for

(01:04:24):
Kamala Harris didn't see that coming. No, they saw it
coming out. It's been the purpose, it's been the whole goal.

Speaker 1 (01:04:30):
Come out and say it. Just come out and say it.
It will make you feel so much.

Speaker 5 (01:04:34):
Bet, just be intellectually honestly.

Speaker 1 (01:04:37):
We tricked you, Yeah, we tricked you. We wanted a
Democratic Democrat in Congress, we wanted a heavily Democrat district,
and guess what, we now got one thanks to this
judge who, oh, by the way, waited until about ten
minutes before midnight to wish you were ruling. Yeah, and
again apparently she apparently greg she really struggled with this one.

(01:04:58):
She she she just struggled with it. She could make
up her mind until ten minutes before the deadline.

Speaker 3 (01:05:04):
And that is not a small thing in my mind,
because if you, if somebody could give me, and I've
actually been honestly trying to think, what was the rationale
I think Rob Bishop gave like, well, maybe people yell
at you less at ten minutes to midnight.

Speaker 5 (01:05:14):
Maybe that's the reason why.

Speaker 3 (01:05:16):
But I will tell you that nothing by way of
a real judicial, thoughtful process would you see a decision
like that come out in the eleventh hour, eleventh hour
and fifty minutes it's it is done, I think with
contempt for and disrespect for not just the judiciary or
the legislative branch, but also the executive branch that has
to follow the law and has to get these districts

(01:05:38):
drawn for purposes of elections. The filing deadline begins the
first week of January. They gave a ten day extension
for this judge, and she took. Diana Gibson took every
single second of that end of business on the tenth.
When you say the tenth, you kind of mean the
tenth because that's the day you need it not ten
minutes to midnight on that day, because that actually means

(01:06:00):
that may as well have been the eleventh.

Speaker 5 (01:06:01):
And I think that was when did she get this
case back in January? January?

Speaker 1 (01:06:05):
She made your decision back then?

Speaker 5 (01:06:07):
Yeah, eleven eleven months to do?

Speaker 1 (01:06:09):
Was they went judge shopping. They knew this judge would
roll in their favor. And I don't know why they
waited what ten months to make this decision. She should
have just made it in January.

Speaker 3 (01:06:18):
You know in twenty ten when I was on a
redistricting commission and committee and we traveled the state, we listed,
we have held hearings, we listened to people, we listened
to concerns. This was a very long process. This group
that got to draw the map on their own. Who
did they get to talk to twenty four percent plus
twenty four percent for Kamala Harris as a district and

(01:06:38):
who in Utah got to be part of a deliberative
process in public hearings to come up with that?

Speaker 5 (01:06:44):
I would argue none. So, folks.

Speaker 3 (01:06:47):
The definition affair right here is just it means we
get democrats get what.

Speaker 5 (01:06:52):
They want, all right?

Speaker 1 (01:06:53):
More coming up?

Speaker 3 (01:06:54):
That's as claimed the famous far as I'm concerned. I
know he went to that, he did that whole congressional
cage whatever that was. But know where the real squad
comes from. Yeah, he was the presiding officer of the
Utah House Representatives.

Speaker 1 (01:07:05):
Well, Rob Bishop actually served on the redistricting Commission, remember that,
I do, until a couple of years ago he kind
of left and he basically told the commission they suck.

Speaker 3 (01:07:16):
I think it's actually not kind of I think I
think he read the quote. I think that's a quote
that was a quote.

Speaker 1 (01:07:21):
That was a quote. Well, we thought we'd get to
Rob on the show today to talk about what's going
on with these redistricting Rob, how are you welcome to
the Rod and Greg Show.

Speaker 8 (01:07:30):
Thank you very much. And no, I didn't say that,
but I should have.

Speaker 3 (01:07:37):
You know, it sounded so like you. I thought it
was so on brand. I thought you definitely did say it.

Speaker 17 (01:07:42):
Rob.

Speaker 3 (01:07:42):
Let me ask you this question. I know, I remember
back when you you leaned into this commission, worried that
this was the word fair was going to somehow mean democrat,
and you wanted to put your your institutional memory, your
knowledge being a you know, in this not only just
the US or the state House representatives, but also the
US House. Just you want to be there to kind
of watch the hen House be a good voice talk

(01:08:03):
about these things. You ultimately couldn't stay with where you
were seeing this was going. Maybe you could share with
our listeners what is it that prompted you to not
be a part of this effort and what were your
concerns then and even now?

Speaker 8 (01:08:18):
Well, there were several things. The first is that this
was not a The independent Commission is not a representative body.
Everyone stayed from only a certain few people from the
Watsatch front. We weren't making decisions with any kind of knowledge.
We were just making irrational decisions. There was no accountability,
and there were a lot of people who very clearly

(01:08:40):
had an ulterior motive that were assigned to that particular commission.
And at the end, it was just the product that
we are producing was a product that was ridiculous and
I couldn't support it, and I was tired of fighting
what I thought was the good fight.

Speaker 1 (01:08:55):
Why do you think it is so important? One of
the issues you had is you thought, and we've had
for quite some time now in this state, a real
good mix of urban and rural areas in each of
the four congressional districts you fought for that Why was
it so important in your opinion?

Speaker 8 (01:09:10):
Well, and that's why the commission had no history and
they didn't care about the history. For twenty years, Utah
had an urban district only, with the other two districts
being a mix of urban and rural, and it was
twenty years of contention and chaos in which our delegation
in Washington was not united for issues that were important

(01:09:31):
to both the urban and the rural area. So yeah,
and then for twenty years after that, we had had
a mix of urban and rural, and that was clearly
the situation that provided a better choice and a better
voice for Utah in Washington DC.

Speaker 2 (01:09:46):
I had been there.

Speaker 8 (01:09:47):
I understood what was happening when you have an urban
only district. Rural Utah gets harmed, and the delegation's ability
to have a united front to do things for Utah
is harmed as well. Having a rural district and an
urban only district is the worst thing we had the experience.

Speaker 2 (01:10:07):
We should have learned from it.

Speaker 8 (01:10:08):
Obviously, this judge that doesn't respect the Constitution didn't learn
from it either.

Speaker 3 (01:10:13):
I think one of the most offensive parts of this
process is that it was all done under the banner
of there can be no partisan considerations. Well, now that
the map has been announced, there's national posters that are
doing the analysis, and I'm reading from one national poster
that is saying that this newly drawn district that has
no partisan consideration at all, that King Jefferies and c

(01:10:35):
and nrel celebrating it, has a plus twenty four percent
for Harris election result in the boundaries of this new
district plus twenty four percent. Rob It sounds like that's
a pretty partisan to me. I think you have to
go out of your way to find a district in
the state of Utah red Utah in an election where

(01:10:56):
Kamala Harris lost around the country in every swing state
to have a plus twenty four percent Harris District Congressional district.

Speaker 5 (01:11:05):
What do you do with this?

Speaker 3 (01:11:07):
How do you call them out on the clear partisan
nature of something they did under the banner of not
being partisan.

Speaker 8 (01:11:13):
Well, everybody in the state that wants to respect the
state constitution from the governor on down had better do that,
because Clins clearly had an ulterior motive. In fact, the
idea that they sued only on the legislative or the
congressional boundaries, when this commission also made recommendations for legislative
and state school board boundaries, but they didn't sue on

(01:11:35):
that they suit only on congressional clearly shows that there
was either hypocrisy or there was a subtle motive in
mind that it was an effort to try and use
the judiciary to change things to create a Democrat seat.
And that's exactly what has happened. So I hope the state,
the state appeals this. This is a terrible decision. Can

(01:11:57):
I add one other thing that irks me to please
do if you have just one second. I was elected
in nineteen seventy eight, and before nineteen eighty, the number
one seat Congression legislative seat both the House and the
Senate was always in Salt Lake City, starting in the Avenues,
and then the numbers went through Sala County, Utah Weeber Davis,

(01:12:20):
and then the rest of the state got was left over.

Speaker 2 (01:12:23):
And I complained about that in eighty. So in eighty they.

Speaker 8 (01:12:25):
Decided to start with one corner, and they took the
northern corner, I think to keep me happy. So seat
number one started in box elder and two and three,
and then it went down the state as the judge
created her new map, as she did the legislative function
from the bench and created her new map, she labeled

(01:12:45):
the Salt Lake Urban District as District number one.

Speaker 2 (01:12:50):
If that's not Freudian.

Speaker 8 (01:12:51):
At least it shows this once again, the arrogance of
saying that Salt Lake has to be the center of
the state and the rest of us spin around that,
and I find that arrogant.

Speaker 5 (01:13:00):
Yeah, absolutely, Rob.

Speaker 1 (01:13:02):
What do you make of the shenanigans of this judge
waiting until almost the very last minute before she issued
this ruling to me the deadline that the state needed.
What do you make of those shenanigans?

Speaker 8 (01:13:13):
Well, I'm not sure. It could have been just coincidental,
or it could have been you know, you get fewer
people yelling at you at.

Speaker 1 (01:13:21):
Midnight, so true.

Speaker 5 (01:13:25):
Yeah, I again.

Speaker 3 (01:13:27):
Finally, do you think this judge deserves to be impeached,
especially with the I think it's an aggressive move to
slow bake this as long as she's had this case
since January, every single deadline that she has where she
has ruled has left very little time for any kind
of recourse for the legislative branch to react. She was
given ten extra days she wanted. They were told they

(01:13:48):
needed to know this by by November first, just to
get the clerks and start the process. She asked for
an extension, she was given to the tenth. She gave
that decision after business on the tenth and close to midnight.
Is there a contempt at being displayed there to the
legislati branch and even the executive branch that merits the
consideration of impeachment.

Speaker 8 (01:14:10):
When the state Constitution is very clear on what is
legislative authority and what legislative authority is, and for a
judge to usurp legislative authority and do legislative action by
herself without any other kind of coordinating council around it,
there is definitely a contempt for everything that is the

(01:14:30):
very foundation of our constitutional checks and balances to guarantee
our individual liberty. She has played rough and loose with that,
and there should be repercussions. I'm not in a position
to call for horror impeachment, but there should be repercussions,
and the entire judiciary needs to realize there is a

(01:14:51):
difference between the judicial and legislative branches and the judiciary
in Utah needs to respect that.

Speaker 1 (01:14:57):
That sure does Rob. As always, we appreciate your insight.
Thank you. We hope you're doing well, and thanks for
joining us tonight.

Speaker 2 (01:15:04):
Good to talk to you all.

Speaker 1 (01:15:05):
Thank you all right. Former US Congressman Rob Bishop, former
Speaker of the House, three for three today on Speakers
of the House on the Rod and Greg show. Love
his insight and he's right. You know, if you wait
till the last minute, less people can yell at you.

Speaker 3 (01:15:17):
This judge, her name is is Diana Gibson. Is Diana
Gibson again, Diana Gibson.

Speaker 2 (01:15:25):
Okay.

Speaker 5 (01:15:25):
I just wanted to make sure yes, and I think.

Speaker 3 (01:15:26):
We need to say that name often because I'll tell
you what, here's another We got to go to a break,
I'm sure, but here's a point. I've been asked this
question and I and I agree. I'm not I'm not
thrilled with a Republican governor that nominates leftists that are
that are rogue and not respecting the separation of powers.
I'm offended by it. I'm frustrated with the Senate that
has a vetting process where people got clearly have gotten

(01:15:49):
through where the vetting hasn't been close enough, and the
answers they were given were either not truthful or they're
who they are was not really understood. And I think
that process needs to get even stronger. But consider this, folk,
we have retention elections. Do you know how many of
these judges can say that you the voters approved of them.
They get like eighty ninety percent in these retention elections

(01:16:09):
because there's no information whatsoever about these judges to base
a decision on. It's a farce of an election if
you have no information to ask the voters to vote
on these judges. But they can actually argue, oh no,
not only was I appointed by a Republican governor and
confirmed by a Republican Senate, but the people themselves, by
eighty to ninety percent, said stay on the bench and

(01:16:32):
do your job. I'm telling you this. This judiciary has
hidden itself. These members have hidden themselves from scrutiny in
a way that the scrutiny has to be much much brighter.
And we need to be looking long and hard at
these members of the judiciary because we're seeing it play
out across the country. This is playing out across this
country right now.

Speaker 1 (01:16:50):
I usually vote no on every one of them.

Speaker 3 (01:16:53):
I do too, I do too, but they still, I mean,
they'll get elected by these Saddam Hussein percentage numbers of
eight ninety percent. You know, I mean it's they do,
it's and so they could even use us as the
voters to say to legitimize themselves. You voted for me,
So look look at I got for my retention election.
You must love me.

Speaker 1 (01:17:10):
Yeah, yeah, More coming up on the Rod and Greg
Show and Talk Radio one oh five nine can arrests.

Speaker 3 (01:17:15):
A lot happening today, It's Veterans Day. I want to
keep mentioning that land of the free because of the brave,
and I also want to mention that if we're going
to stay free, we've got a lot of work to do,
a lot of things to discuss. We've got the national
news happening with its origin here in Utah. Democrats are
celebrating nationwide over the plus twenty four percent Kamala Harris

(01:17:35):
congressional district in the state of Utah. They somehow in
it under the banner of no partisan consideration, found a
boundary in the state of Utah, where Kamala Harris received
twenty four percent more of the vote than Donald Trump.

Speaker 1 (01:17:51):
That is representative of Utah. Don't you know that great
then is representative of Utah. Oh, it's such a coincidence.
Kamala Harris did so well here in the state of view.
That is just a representation. It is a fair representation
of Utah. Even though Democrats make up what thirteen percent
of the registered voters in this thing, they deserve their
own district.

Speaker 3 (01:18:11):
See, you know, Kamala Harris lost every swing state in America.
Uh huh lost the popular vote was thumped, I would argue.
And but you now have in the state of Utah
again under the banner of no partisan consideration, a deep
blue plus twenty four percent Kamala Harris voting Democrat district

(01:18:32):
handed to them. And this is not lost on anyone
but the apologist to people that are still staying with
a straight face, Well, no, this was my partisan No,
this was we don't know what the partisan breakdown is fair.
This is just you know, we're so tired of things
not being fair. We want it to be no partisan consideration.
And would you just believe plus twenty four percent for

(01:18:53):
Kamala Harris didn't see that coming. No, they saw it
coming it's been the purpose, it's been the whole goal.

Speaker 1 (01:18:58):
Let's come out and see it. She Just come out
and say it. It will make you feel so much better.

Speaker 5 (01:19:03):
Just be intellectually honestly.

Speaker 1 (01:19:06):
We tricked you, Yeah, we tricked you. We wanted a
democratic Democrat in Congress. We want a heavily democratic district.
And guess what, we've now got one thanks to this
judge who, oh, by the way, waited until about ten
minutes before midnight to wish you were ruling. Yeah, and again,
apparently she really, apparently, Greg, she really struggled with this one.

(01:19:27):
She she she just struggled with it. She could make
up her mind until ten minutes before the deadline.

Speaker 3 (01:19:33):
And that is not a small thing in my mind,
because if you, if somebody could give me and I've
actually been honestly trying to think, what was the rationale
I think Rob Bishop gave, like, well, maybe people yell
at you less at ten minutes to midnight, maybe that's
the reason why. But I will tell you that nothing
by way of a of a real judicial, thoughtful process.
Would you see a decision like that come out in

(01:19:53):
the eleventh hour, eleventh hour and fifty minutes. It's it
is done, I think with contempt for and respect for
not just the judiciary or the legislative branch, but also
the executive branch that has to follow the law and
has to get these districts drawn for the for purposes
of elections. The filing deadline begins the first week of January.
They gave a ten day extension for this judge, and

(01:20:16):
she took. Diana Gibson took every single second of that
end of business on the tenth. When you say the tenth,
you kind of mean the tenth because that's the day
you need it, not ten minutes to midnight on that day,
because that actually means nothing.

Speaker 5 (01:20:29):
That may as well have been the eleventh. And I
think that was.

Speaker 1 (01:20:32):
On When did she get this case back in January? January?
She made your decision back then?

Speaker 5 (01:20:36):
Yeah, eleven months to do this was they went judge shopping.

Speaker 1 (01:20:40):
They knew this judge would roll in their favor, and
I don't know why they waited what ten months to
make this decision. She should have just made it in January.

Speaker 3 (01:20:47):
You know, in twenty ten, when I was on a
redistricting commission and committee and we traveled the state, we
listed we have held hearings, We listened to people, We
listened to concerns. This was a very long process. This
group that got to draw them out up on their own.
Who did they get to talk to twenty four percent
plus twenty four percent for Kamala Harris as a district

(01:21:07):
and who in Utah got to be part of a
deliberative process and public hearings to come up with that?
I would argue none. So, folks, The definition affair right
here is just it means democrats.

Speaker 5 (01:21:21):
Get what they want, all right?

Speaker 1 (01:21:22):
More coming up?

Speaker 3 (01:21:23):
Yeah, you know, I didn't serve in the military, but
my family I have a family history of those that have,
and it's a proud part of my family history, one
that I appreciated. And again, my grandmother, grandparents, grandfather, they
they weren't very chatty about it all. But as a
persistent kid could I could get actually more stories I

(01:21:43):
think from about it, And again it left me humbled
and appreciative.

Speaker 1 (01:21:48):
The greatest generation had a very tough time talking about
their experiences of World War Two. I have a couple
of friends whose fathers served in World War Two. Rarely
talked about it. Matter of fact, one of them, I recall,
was a bombardier that dropped bombs on Germany and rarely,
rarely spoke about what they went through, but they went
through a lot. My grand my dad did not serve,

(01:22:11):
but my grandfather on my mother's side, my maternal grandfather
did serve. I have his dog texts nice from World
War One. Wow, and the and the flag that was
draped over his casket and a picture of him when
he served.

Speaker 2 (01:22:24):
Yep.

Speaker 3 (01:22:25):
I have my grandmother's flag from her funeral, and I
have some of the patches and from my grandfather Pat
McGuire's uniform. Yes, I have, And again I I just
and I my uncle Denny served in the Navy and
he fixing these helicopters that were getting destroyed over there
and trying to either salvage them or repair them.

Speaker 5 (01:22:44):
And tough job.

Speaker 3 (01:22:46):
And he he shares a little more now. But what
a what a nightmarish time to come back to America
as a Vietnam veteran where they were not seen as
heroes and they were not appreciated, and it was it was.

Speaker 5 (01:22:58):
It was a stigma.

Speaker 3 (01:22:59):
And for kids that were drafted, while kids that got
went to college didn't have to. And then the kids
from college are just ripping them and tearing them apart.
Tough time in America.

Speaker 1 (01:23:09):
These Vietnam vets saw their father serve in World War Two,
came home as heroes for defeating Japanese and imperialism and
Nazi in the Nazis right. So they go to serve,
they come home, they get booed. No one applauds their
return from Vietnam, and that sad part.

Speaker 3 (01:23:27):
I think of them, very sad, very Saturday. We're over
that now and we can pay the due respect they deserve.
But again, folks, if you know anyone that's a veteran,
they're not going to point it out. They're not like
there's there's there's benefits for veterans, there's tuition assistance, there's healthcare.
There's a lot of veterans that we owe a collective
debt for us. They don't look for it, they're not
asking for it. So make sure you're looking out for

(01:23:47):
our veterans, because they don't. They're not going to do
it on their own.

Speaker 1 (01:23:50):
No story of the day, of course, is the decision
by a judge late late late, late late late last
night to approve a map on the redistrict team of
the congressional disc here in the state of Utah. Four
districts won, all in Salt Lake County and Salt Lake
County North, basically Salt Lake City, in a district that
you pointed out, what whent twenty six percent in favor of.

Speaker 3 (01:24:11):
Kamala four percent Kamala Harris. You can't find twenty four
show me anywhere in America. She was crushing it outside
of like a New York City or Washington d C.
By twenty four percent, twenty of break. And they somehow,
amusing no partisan data, they came up with this, This
miraculously came up with this absolute dark blue district in

(01:24:32):
the state of Utah.

Speaker 5 (01:24:34):
This is just magic.

Speaker 1 (01:24:35):
All right. Let's go back to our talk back, Len
and see what our listeners have to say.

Speaker 2 (01:24:40):
How do we go about repealing prop for.

Speaker 14 (01:24:44):
It's not a Utah thing passed ignorantly and being shoved
it down our throats?

Speaker 1 (01:24:51):
Yeah, well, there are a couple of things that I
think people can do, and you've pointed out great this
Before this was on the ballot in twenty eighteen, there
were two very important issues on the ballot, well three really,
but this one I think got lost. There was one
on the approval of medical marijuana medical cannabis. There was
one on what the expansion of Medicaid Obamacare Obamacare expansion

(01:25:12):
terrible one, and then Prop four, which was redistricting and
passed by the slimmest of margins, which for everyone.

Speaker 3 (01:25:21):
Was saying, we'll take the medical cannabis and we'll take
the free Obamacare health care for able bodied adults at
the expense of seniors and disabled. That those passed by
larger margins than this redistricting scam. This passed by fifty
point three six percent. And if you and I can
promise you the people that voted for this, the campaign

(01:25:42):
two million dollars, sixty nine percent of which is coming
from out of state from characters like Gavin Newsom's pack,
the ACLU, the National Education Association, Teachers Union, all just
that these are not nonpartisan. These are left of center
organizations that funded this entire effort. Didn't have really a
funded campaign against it. I'm sure that they said we

(01:26:04):
want it fair, we wanted a nonpartisan considerations. Now we
have receipts, we have maps, we have people organizations that
have no touch on they're just independent organizations. They get
to draw the maps, the legal maps for our congressional
districts of the state. Is this what we signed up for?
I think a reconsideration on a state wide ballot in
twenty six for the people to reconsider their actions. You

(01:26:26):
do this in the legislature. You can have a vote
to reconsider your action. I think that the people of
Utah would like to reconsider their actions in eighteen, now
that we know what they meant by the word fair,
it meant democrat, it meant dark blue. A lot of
people probably thought, I want it to be fair. I
want it to be fair. I'll vote yes. This is
this the fair you voted for a plus twenty four

(01:26:48):
percent Kamala Harris voting district.

Speaker 5 (01:26:51):
Was that the fair you signed up for in twenty eighteen?

Speaker 3 (01:26:53):
I'm guessing no, and I think this has to be
a state wide ballot for reconsideration. We asked the woman
from the Mormon Women for Ethical Government uh in the
first hour if she appropriately by the way I know
using that, but astor would you support a reconsideration on
a state wide ballot for this issue? She evaded that question,
did not say yes or no. But what she said

(01:27:15):
as I believe that the legislature is considering that. Uh,
and they're going to engage in that in that ballot
measure too. But I do think that that's we we
are entitled to a reconsideration.

Speaker 1 (01:27:26):
Sure.

Speaker 17 (01:27:27):
Back to our talkback line, Hey, Roden greg So, I'm
not surprised that Judged Diana Gibson did what she did.

Speaker 18 (01:27:38):
Uh, you guys all day a few weeks ago when
we were last talking about this, and I think again
we need to remember that when Judged Diana Gibson is
up for reelection, that we should vote, know for Judge
Diana Gibson.

Speaker 5 (01:27:51):
See where I'm done with it.

Speaker 1 (01:27:54):
This guy is picking up Judged Diana Gibson. If you
really want to remember her name, it's simple, Judge Diana Gibson.
She'll be on the ballot next year, was she not?
What is it every five years, three years, whatever, She'll
be on the ballot, So you can reject her leads.

Speaker 3 (01:28:12):
Do And by the way, to the talkback comment, was
exactly right. We're not flat footed on this. We actually
called this shot.

Speaker 1 (01:28:19):
Yes, we knew this.

Speaker 3 (01:28:20):
Dark clouds were coming, we knew this, this gamesmanship. We
the fix was in on this thing from day one.
I knew it when you saw Rob when Rob Bishop
resigned from this years ago because it was gamed up.
He was telling everyone pay attention, this is not going
to be good. We knew it was coming, and here
we are. We're in the event.

Speaker 2 (01:28:38):
Yep.

Speaker 1 (01:28:38):
They judge shopped. They got a lot of outside money,
even though they claim to and the media, the media
in this town, hook line and singer Greg grassroots group.
What do they go stop? We're referring to this organization
is a grassroots group.

Speaker 5 (01:28:50):
Well, how about this?

Speaker 3 (01:28:51):
I mean, I'm getting text about Ben mccadams grassroots grassroots
effort to recruit Ben McAdams from a Nevada area code text.

Speaker 5 (01:28:59):
Okay, don't you this thing is? They can't.

Speaker 3 (01:29:01):
They don't even know how to hide the out of
state leftist interest in this whole thing.

Speaker 1 (01:29:05):
They do not, All right, Marr calls and comments and
a thought on Veterans Day coming up right here on
the Rowden Greg Show and Utah's Talk Radio one oh
five nine k NRS. So the day in which we
honor veterans, and they're very concerned about was it all
worth it in their fight and losing their friends and
buddies and you know, giving up what they gave up
to a fight for the freedom of this country, and

(01:29:27):
they're concerned. Greg. I mean, you've got Mam Donnie who
is elected mayor of New York City. He's an avowed
socialist or communist, whatever you want to call him. You
that may happen again, Greg, No one's paying attention to
this up in Seattle, where you've got a mom Donnie
like candidate or name I believe is Kate Wilson is
now leading in the mayor's race by one hundred and

(01:29:49):
nine votes. Very tight race up there, but she's leanning
she could win. I saw this story today. A twenty
year old communist has won a seat in an upstate
New York council's in Ithaca, New York. A twenty year
old her name is uh, let's see Hannah Chavette. She's
twenty year old Cornell student won a seat on the

(01:30:09):
Ithaca City Council and she's no avowed communist.

Speaker 5 (01:30:13):
How come communism doesn't have a stigma to it like
being a Nazi? How Come? I mean many people were
killed under communist regimes.

Speaker 1 (01:30:19):
More more so than with with good old what's his
name Stalin?

Speaker 5 (01:30:22):
Yeah? So so, what so Why is it okay to
be a communist in America? Why is that? I mean,
I'm watching this.

Speaker 3 (01:30:29):
I'm watching a show that I came out twelve years
ago the Americans.

Speaker 5 (01:30:34):
It's about It was on fex. It was yeah, yeah, yeah,
they're they're there.

Speaker 1 (01:30:38):
They are spies.

Speaker 3 (01:30:39):
Yeah, there are spies for Russia. And there they grew
up in, like, you know, in a suburb of Washington,
and they're they're doing all this clandestine stuff. Hey, I'm
watching that, and I'm thinking to myself, Man, you don't
have to be clandestine now, the Russians communists can just
come out and say it loud and proud.

Speaker 5 (01:30:56):
Yeah you don't.

Speaker 3 (01:30:57):
There's no there's no hiding it. You don't need sleeper
cell of communists anymore. They're just they're here and they're
they're unapologetic. And I'm going, when did that? When was that?
When did there? When did the stigma with communists go away?

Speaker 2 (01:31:10):
Yeah?

Speaker 5 (01:31:11):
I don't understand it.

Speaker 1 (01:31:12):
Well. And socialists. You've got the Democratic Socialists who now
run New York City. By the way, uh, he is
starting to put his staff together, every one of them
so far member of the DSA. There you go, and
did you see what Hulkel did the governor. You know
his plan, one of his one of his up pillars
of his campaign, free transit in New York City. Right,

(01:31:32):
Hkel is now saying, uh, not so fast, because the
State of New York covers the cost of New York
City's transit system, and she says they are not getting
any more money. So this idea of free transit.

Speaker 3 (01:31:47):
Yeah, I heard her press conference. She said the fair
box recovery is a revenue that they're not giving up
and so that's not going anywhere, and that goes with
promises and campaigns.

Speaker 1 (01:31:56):
Well, I want to bring this up because you know
there is concern among veterans was it all worth it?
And we got an example of that. You brought this
to our attention. I think it was earlier this week
or last week where this one hundred year old World
War two vent from the UK, his name was Alec Penstone,
stirred emotions recently as he expressed his disillusionment with modern

(01:32:17):
Britain and I think the same thing could be said
today with modern America. List of what he had to say, carefully,
what does remembrance Sunday mean for you?

Speaker 5 (01:32:27):
What is your message? My message?

Speaker 19 (01:32:30):
Is I can say in my mind's eye of rose
and rose, of white stones, of oh, the hundreds of
my friends and everybody else that gave their lives for
what the country today. No, I'm sorry, the sacrifice wasn't

(01:32:51):
worth the result that it is now.

Speaker 5 (01:32:55):
Was the freedom with father even now.

Speaker 19 (01:32:59):
Is down side well still what it was, Well, I'll
vote for it.

Speaker 1 (01:33:04):
No, he's talking about Britain, of course, but I think
his reflections I think serve as a reminder doing Juke
Greg of the sacrifice made by all these veterans. And
now we have countries. Are some of our major cities.
You look at New York City now with Mundami a socialist.
You look at Chicago led by a socialist. You look
at Los Angeles led by a socialist. Wake up, America,

(01:33:25):
this is what's going on in the urban cities.

Speaker 3 (01:33:28):
Yeah, it's it's and again, I it's why you know,
I think you know when Biden. I wasn't happy when
Biden was elected, but I thought America collectively learned how
scary the Democrats are and Biden was Yeah, And I
think it's it's one of the probably strongest reason why
you saw Trump being re elected is because in contrast,
it was a complete nightmare. Maybe that's what has to

(01:33:51):
happen in these cities where you keep vote you want
to vote for avowed communists and okay, see how that works,
I guess. I mean, there's a part of it. I've
heard from some Democrats that I know that say, look,
he said everything's going to be free, but he's already
pulling in the who is at the Deblasio camp and
they're they're they're they're serious adults, and they know they

(01:34:12):
how to pay the bills. And he's not going to
do all the things he's saw. So uh, there's some
that think that that these these candidates who have been
so extreme in their rhetoric are going to have people
that are going to help them keep the government running
because it would fail otherwise.

Speaker 5 (01:34:28):
So we'll see.

Speaker 1 (01:34:28):
Now, we'll see. Well, we just want to say, Greg
and I to all you veterans, I think the best
thing we can say is simply thank you, thank you.

Speaker 5 (01:34:35):
For yes, thank you so much, thank you.

Speaker 1 (01:34:37):
For the time away your families, what you went through.
Thank you, head up, shoulders back. May God bless you
and your family, This great country of ours and our
events on this Veteran's Day. We'll be back tomorrow at
for have a good evening.

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