August 13, 2024 • 21 mins
Tony and Austin chat with Ben Baby from ESPN about the Bengals, on ESPN 1530!
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
This is Cincy Shirts. Cincy three sixty About Cincinnati from Cincinnati,
sponsored in part by Cincy Shirts. Cincy Shirts All Cincy.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
All Day.
Speaker 1 (00:12):
This is ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station.
Speaker 3 (00:17):
Welcome back, Cincy three to sixty. ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati
Sports Station. It's Tuesday. We're a service of Sinci Shirts,
which means that the warehouse sale is still active Essex
Studios ten to four pm now through Friday. Ten dollars
ties thanks to Cinci Shirts. If you can't make it there,
simply visit Cinci shirts dot com, download their mobile app,
(00:38):
or find a way to get into any of the
retail locations. All right, we are joined now by a
man that covers the Cincinnati Bengals for ESPN dot Com
and a man I spend a lot of time with
as I'm down at each and every training camp practice,
talking to with what we're seeing, He joins us. Right now, Ben, Baby, Ben,
what's going on?
Speaker 2 (00:55):
Man? Hey, Tony good. I'm feeling I'm wearing you out
at this point with how much conversate on the in sideline.
But it's good to get a fresh beet of eyes
as you figure out what this Bengals.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
Team is going to look like, yeah, look, that's the
hardest part, right is there's so many things, Like if
they take it inside the stadium, there's one field. You
go out to practices, there's multiple fields, there's multiple drills
going on at the same time. It is it's hard
to see everything that's going on as it relates to
the Cincinnati Bengals. Let's start here, though, it's not hard
to see because he's a huge loss, both physically for
(01:28):
this team and what he means to this team. The
news yesterday with a Marius Mims who's gonna miss and again,
this is a Bengals way of selling it, saying it
more than a couple weeks, less than many. It's the
same way they described Joe Burrow's calf injury last year.
But when you think of the loss of Mems, both
what that means for him and this right tackle position
as a whole, how concerned do you become?
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Yeah, I think it depends on how long he's going
to be out. The way that Zach Taylor eventually said
he wouldn't rule out the possibility of him being back
for Week one, I thought that was good and I
think that talking to folks yesterday. You know, Frank Pollock
was really high on Trek Brown. We haven't seen a
lot of him, but even guys on that, you know,
(02:12):
on that offensive line talking to yesterday, you know, Cordell
Wolson said, you know, he's a really good football player.
And and you know in the tone that Cordell said it,
that meant he truly truly believed it. I think that
they believe that he can be a good fit in there.
I think when they drafted Marius Mims and looked at
what they brought to the table, it immediately became clear,
you know, once we started seeing how they were working
(02:33):
in the offseason, that Mims was going to be the
guy who could potentially slot in him. And he looked
really good, have looked good in camp, and I think
Brown was a nice luxury to have as a veteran reserve.
And now you're you're seeing that depth player role. So
it's still a very, very big loss, but I think
the fact that they addressed it to a degree is good.
(02:53):
Now the question is going to be how available is
Trent Brown going to be? Can he stay healthy? It's
an issue that he's had over the last.
Speaker 3 (02:59):
Few years when you look at the wide receiver position,
ben A lot is made about wide receiver number three,
and while Jermaine Burton shined in some opportunities, I thought
it was very telling when he was used and the
type of routes he was used on. Do you still
see wide receiver three as a race or do you
think wide receiver three is a done deal at this point?
Speaker 2 (03:20):
Yeah, that's hard for me. I do. I don't think
Burton's in the mix, to be honest. You know the
way that you know, like you said, when you look
at the types of routes he ran in that preseason game,
how he's been used, and the way that people talk
about him as well, I think it's going to be
between andre Yosavas or Trenton Irwin, and you know, we'll
see how that battle continues to unfold. We've seen a
ton of Yoshi Vos in that slot and so just
(03:43):
given how late he got into that mix, and yesterday
we saw a little bit communication on an interception, something
that you can't have happen quite frankly, and I think
that the learning curve that you're gonna need to play
in that slot. I think Irwin, you're gonna have a
little bit higher level of comfort with him there. You know,
we'll see if that continues to how that goes on.
But you know, I think Jermaine Burton right now, he
(04:05):
looks like an outside receiver to me, a guy who
could potentially, you know, if this is your last year
of Tea Higgins, a guy who could be that wide
receiver too next year maybe and be a really solid
outside threat. I think that's probably where he fits best,
and what we've seen right now, I think I think
it's like to say he might be a long shot
in that slot, and right now, Andre and Trenton Irwin
(04:26):
would be the two favorites in my opinion, that to
win that flought battle.
Speaker 3 (04:29):
Uh, Ben, Let's talk about this because you and I
have spent a ton of time talking about Joe Burrow
throughout training camp, and I'm not at the point where
I'm sounding an alarm about Joe Burrow. Because we saw
what he did in the preseason game again limited action,
We've seen what he's done at practice, but there have
been I think inconsistencies in watching Joe Burrow through camp.
And I think Burrow, because he's addressed it multiple times
(04:53):
that he has spoke he's addressed not being where he
needs to be yet or or there's still frustrations with
the spiral or the zip on the passes. That's evident.
We can see that at practice. Is it to a
point where you concern yourself with it or is it
still in the lines of this is just something to
pay attention to and make sure it doesn't become something more.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
Yeah, tell me. I mean you and I talk about this.
I think every day we're out there and I feel
like we're on the same page, and I really want
to see what this looks like in Chicago against the Ones.
I think that is going to be the biggest test
for Borrough so far. Didn't play against Ones on Saturday.
He didn't look very good. But then, you know, I
thought that throughout the leak last week. You know, there
(05:34):
was an inconsistencies. Yesterday, you know, I thought he looked
good at times. He had a really good ball to
Kendrick Pryor down the scene town Kendrick again in the
back in the end zone during a seven on seven drill.
But then later on throughout the day, I thought that,
you know, it just the offense was not clicking. You know,
we talk about the yoshavas, you know, the the miscommunication
(05:54):
there in the interception that was there. But even if
he had ran the route, I don't know that it
would have been the completion and it may have just
been a situation where Joe is really trying to test,
you know, his throwing the de ball against two high looks,
which is what we saw in the preseason game. I
don't think that the ball Joe ordinarrowly throws in a
too high shell and he's still trying to get it
(06:15):
to see Higgins and t believes that he should have
made the catch. But still, you know, I think it
consistency is the best way to put it. And like
you said, I think it's still very early to go
out and really be concerned. But I really want to
see how he looks against Chicago, and I think that
will tell us where he's at, especially now that he's
gotten more throws under his belt through camp.
Speaker 3 (06:37):
I think it's certainly interesting to watch. I know it's
become a moot point at this standpoint, But from your standpoint,
do you see any progression or any end in sight
with the Jamar Chase hold in right now?
Speaker 2 (06:51):
Yeah? You know, I think that's that's a big question.
Is I tell you what you know. I think it's
a great time. I think you've got to give Zach
we're in the front office, a ton of credit and
how they've handled the situation because we've seen, you know,
how it's played out in Dallas, in San Francisco, and
in Cincinnati. It has not been a major distraction. As
I told somebody the other day. I told the player
(07:13):
yet has said part of it is because we haven't
really pushed it a ton as well, because we know
where the stale mate sits. But I think it also,
you know, when you look at how involved Jamar is
and the comfort he feels and being on the field,
being around what they're saying and how they're handling it,
I think it speaks to kind of how they built
the team. And as much as I hate the word
(07:33):
culture and I think if it's just a massive cliche
that we use, and football specifically more so than any
of the sport, I do have to give the Bengals
a lot of credit for the culture that they've built,
the fact that Jamar can essentially hold in and it
not be a lot I mean a boss. It doesn't
seem to be affecting the locker room at all, has
not affecting the coaching staff at all. It seems like
(07:54):
beings have gone well. Now when that when does that change?
That's the question is that's has not answered this. Jamar
is not talking. At what point is one side going
to give and why? Frankly, is that going to be
Jamar getting what he wants or Jamar is going to
have to say, you know what, I'm gonna have to
take what I can get in play out this year
and see when you go back to the table next year.
(08:15):
I don't vote anybody for how they went about it.
When you see Charlie Jones go down, when you see
the injuries we see in a training camp, and even
the amount of money that Jamar Chase is set to
earn on a second contract, especially right now, it makes
perfect sense why he is not practicing. And if you're
the Bangals, you go, well, why would we give up
a discount right now on a receiver? Let's see what
(08:37):
we can do. They have a time clever that aspect
of it as well. But something's got to give at
some point, and I just don't know what that's going
to occur. And at some point we're going to have
to have the conversation of whether Jamar is willing to
sit out games. It's not something that really has been
talked a ton about publicly, But the deeper we get
(09:00):
the training camp, we have to start asking, at what
point is this going to you know, it's just going
to come to a resolution to receive Jamarro on the field,
because right now that remains to be seen.
Speaker 3 (09:11):
Uh, BENBABYESPN dot Com. If I had to ask you
where you're most concerned from a position group on the
offensive side of the ball going into preseason game number two,
you say, what, Well.
Speaker 2 (09:24):
That's a good question, Tony. I. I don't want to
take quarterback because again I don't want to find me along.
So I want to see how Joe looks throughout the week.
And we've seen anything really good at times. Uh, you know,
maybe maybe the offensive line. I think that depth. You
want to see what you have in the twos. You know,
what we saw the other day was not ideal, especially
now that I'm Mary Mary Spans is injured. You want
(09:45):
to see what those that topic position looks like. You
know Jackson, Uh, you know Frank Pollack was Jason up
Jackson Kirklan, I almost call poll. I don't think Frank
Payton anytime soon. So but James hyping up Jackson Kirklan.
We'll see what Cody Ford COMPUTI will look like, you know,
so maybe the offensive line and just what that depth
looks like. I think on the offense side of the ball,
(10:05):
everything else, I think the Bengals had to feel pretty
good about it. I think the running game should be improved.
We've seen them have a ton of bursts. I thought,
my god, tranking on Williams, who played football at A
and M looked really good yesterday. And Zach Boss and
Chase Brown I think are gonna have a lot better.
And you know, by and large, I don't see a
ton of issues on the offensive line or on the offense.
So the line, if I had to pick one, would
(10:27):
probably be there.
Speaker 4 (10:28):
Ben, how much of a concern do you think internally
the defensive line and primarily the defensive interior is with
this team and their ability to stop the run this year?
Speaker 2 (10:41):
Yeah, you know, I don't a lot. It's been a
big talking point after the last couple of games, after
the preseason game, but I don't know that I had
the same level of concerned and I based on how
they built this roster internally, I don't know what that
sense like even a granted the depth. We'll see what
it looks like when McKinley Jackson comes back. I think
(11:02):
when you when you went out and they looked at
how they wanted to go to the seasonsive line, it
was very intentional that they have placed to be a
greater emphasis on being able to get after the quarterback
from the inside than having guys being able to stop
to run. I think when you look at what defense
is going to do at a high level, how the
game is currently played, there's a reason they went after
(11:23):
shellingon rankings in DJ readers. They said, you know what,
we don't want not only DJ, but the guys that
they fits that bill. They made it a point to
go get shllon the ranks. There's been a lot of
conversation about Zach Carter and his role in Zach Carter,
you know, I talked in it the other day. He
actually drops twenty pounds this offseason in anticipatient of playing righter,
being being able to move a little bit better. It
(11:45):
feels like this is a better wait and that they
wait if you're dropping pounds as the interior team keeps
lie of it. That tells me that you're trying to
be more vulbile, you're trying to be more agile. That
is not a run stopping wait, that's ay. I want
to get after the passer league. If you look at
what they do in this the line and their needs
great pressure. In my opinion, that is way more important
than being able to go out and go and stop
(12:08):
the run. I think in this division we talk a
lot about being able to stop the run, and that's fine,
that's great, but if you want to win games in
December and January and into February, you're gonna have to
be able to get after the quarterback better than they
did last year. And Louis Arubos talked about this a
tont and that when they were good in twenty one,
they got a lot of passwords from the interior Warryokujobi
did it great j out getting after the quarterback, and
(12:30):
as good as DJ was, that was just not something
that he specialized in. When you talk about stopping the run,
I think it comes down to the backers being free
and being able to make plays, being able to fit
those gaps better than they did last year, and I
think having bon Bell back, I think that's going to
be an underrated part of it. The communication on the
back end should help the linebackers be free as well,
(12:52):
and they should all be able to have a good
understanding of where they're going to gap fit, especially when
they're playing with five defensive backs on norble passing down.
So for me, I don't sensive there's a ton of concern.
I think when you get a guys in the draft
happen to play what you gave. When they attack that
position group like they did over the course of the offseason,
that tells me that they are very intentional on what
(13:14):
they want this line to look like. And I think
pass rushing would be the greatest.
Speaker 3 (13:17):
Priority ben staying on the defensive side of the ball.
I thought Dax Hill had a pretty solid preseason game
number one versus what we've seen during training camp. I
talked about the battle at wide receiver three. Do you
still foresee that there is a battle going on at
number two corner for the Bengals as well?
Speaker 2 (13:37):
Yeah? You know that is probably for me the most
intriguing position group because I'm still trying to wrap my
head around what exactly they're doing when you look at
the rotations. You know, they started DJ Turner alongside Can't
Sailor Breed and I know that Dak Hill worked it
with the ones yesterday, but it seems like they've made
it a point to rotate as much as possible throughout camp.
(13:58):
We've seen them mix and match those corners. I still
think it we'll see today. I think today we'll get
a better sense of it. If Dak Stay's out there,
I would still get the edge of DJ Turner, and
quite frankly, I think Joshkas also looked really good. I
think the fact that he had the interception on Saturday,
you know, was a testament to the momentum he's built
throughout camp, and he's a guy internally they are really
(14:20):
really excited about and I think that they the more
that he continues to play well, they have to feel
good about where he's staying. And I remember we talked
about this, you know when I came on on the
first day of training camp. What exactly you do with
Dak Field remains to be seen, because if he does
play well, then you've got essentially three, maybe two and
a half guys if you want to get new you know,
(14:41):
let's say he probably needs a little bit more time.
But guys that you think could potentially go out there
and start a quarter, well, Dax's at some point has
to start getting reps. And when you look at I'm
just gonna say, if you you know, since Wren Sports trade,
you only can have some conjecture here. And I think
if you're the Bengals, why not talk about this a
you know, we just talked about defensive tackles, you know,
(15:03):
maybe the run flopping ability where that's that we see
a plethora of warterbacks. Again, I will point out there
if you decide that Dax Field can't, it isn't going
to be the starter. As good as he's looked, If
he's not going to be the starter, is it more
beneficial to potentially go out and get a defensive tackle
as a depth option, who will see the field, who
(15:24):
will rotate more. Then you're gonna rotate your dirt cornering
even on dime packickers. Because let's also remember dayson, Anthony
has looked very good and as a defensive back, he's
got a ton of reps and I feel like he
is gaining more trust from that coaching staff, and his
body type is has been a guy that is one
that fits really well in those dirt as that as
(15:45):
an extra defensive back of those time taxics. So all
of that being said, very long we can answer. But
as good as Dax has looked, I think you still
have to ask yourself where it is its value best?
And you know, would he be better shooited on your
roster this year? Will is it better as a trade asset?
And I think that the coaching staff needs to make
a decision on what they need to do at that
(16:06):
corn spot at this point, you know, when you're this
deep in the camp, you should have a pretty good
idea of where they stand. Ben.
Speaker 3 (16:12):
Let me ask you something about you said yesterday on
the sideline when we were talking pre practice. You know
we've talked a lot on the show about man, can
the defense just be top eighteen in the league? Can
they be top twenty? Give the offense a chance? You
It sounds like you're a little more bullish on the
fact that you think that this defense can be better
than maybe what people are predicting. Why is that?
Speaker 2 (16:35):
Yeah, when you look I think the fact that you
know what we've seen in practice, and you know, I
expect to, quite frankly, the offense will look worse on
Saturday against Tampa Bay, even against the twos than they
are looking. I thought that they looked they were able
to get the ball down the field well, move the
ball really well. Not always what we've seen in practice,
for being quite honest, and you know, it reminded me
(16:56):
a lot of that twenty twenty one training camp and
we were like, well, I can't be offense moved the
ball and everybody was like, listen, this defense is a
lot better than people give it credit for. And the
chippiness that we saw last week, that was the defense
essentially sending a message of the offense saying, hey, guys
like and Jermaine Pratt said it that as locker like,
these are not completions that you think that that you
think they are. These are fifty to fifty balls and
(17:18):
we're letting it'll get some of these, but when we
want to put our foot down, y'all are not getting them.
And I think that when you look at what they've done,
I think, again, Sheldon rankins massive adition. I think von
Bell is going to continue to be big. The growth
of the second year players in that secondary from Jordan
battle in Uh and DJ Turner. I think it's going
to be huge. Cam Hibler Britt I think before he
(17:38):
got injured last year was playing at a foot bowl
level and when you look at the advanced metrics, that's
what that tells us. And so I think that you
know what they're what they have the pieces in that
in that on that side of the ball. I do
think this can be a much better defense and could
potentially be, excuse me, a top fifteen, top twelve defense
if they can play well. And I think the run
(17:59):
defense going to be to the question mark. But if
you're hitting after the passer early, you're gonna put teams
in passing downs and that's going to be a much
more valuable asset.
Speaker 3 (18:07):
Ben, let me ask you this but before I let
you go here, what do you expect today? Because you know,
I feel like it's a it's an interesting time right
now because you know you travel tomorrow. Joint practice is Thursday.
You had a pretty animated practice with a lot of
team drills yesterday. How do you envision today's practice? Is
(18:30):
this maybe a build in off day where Joe Burrow
does less? Do you think they take the foot off
the gas a little bit, or do you think they say, Okay,
we essentially have three practices left together before the end
of camp. We got to make the most out of it.
Speaker 2 (18:44):
Yeah, that's a that's a great question, Tony. The way
that they have structured camp so far, it makes sense
for them to go ahead and take it easy today.
Maybe have a like you said, I have a lighter
day knowing that the ones are going to get really
really good work on on a Thursday when they go
up to Chicago, and I think that is gonna be
(19:05):
the You want to make sure that they're staying fresh.
That's been a big point of emphasis. Uh. And given
how much team we saw yesterday, I could see the
argument for them, you know, playing it back, playing you know,
have a holding the reins back a little bit. But
that being said, I also would understand if the want
of the offense looks better, because after yesterday's offensive performance,
if I'm on the offensive side of the ball, I
(19:26):
probably want to feel really good about what we do
in team because yesterday left a lot to be desired
towards the end of the day, and you want to
probably get some good momentum that's the thing going into
the Joy practice in Chicago.
Speaker 3 (19:39):
Benbaby, ESPN dot com. Ben, I can't thank you enough
for joining us today. I'll see you here and uh
in just a couple of minutes down at the practice fields.
What's the easiest way for everyone to follow along with
all your coverage of the Bengals now and going forward.
Speaker 2 (19:53):
Yeah, you know we're We're on the esp app ESPN
dot com. Make sure you got that Bengals team page.
I got the notifications off for that, and I'm also
on Instagram trying to get that out there. Time, Tony
d Baby forty one, trying to keep up with the
kids here to do.
Speaker 3 (20:08):
I do have to ask you because Austin when I
get down to practice often ask me for a weather report.
I base my weather reports on what type of hat
you're wearing for each practice. What are you looking at today?
Is there any chance of raining your forecast that would
be hesitant for you to bring out the big dogs?
Speaker 2 (20:26):
Hey, Tony, let me tell you right now. I got
the stets and sitting shotgun ready. They're ready to be worn.
It is. It is gonna be that kind of day there,
it is.
Speaker 3 (20:33):
That's our weather report. Let me tell you Ben's not
pulling the stetson out man. If there's a chance of
rain in the forecast, so you know what type of
day it is.
Speaker 2 (20:42):
And you can't be getting good Tony, you have the
no no. In my book, it's.
Speaker 3 (20:45):
Words I live by. Can't get the good straw wet, Benbaby,
ESPN dot Com. Ben see assume man, Thanks for joining us.
Speaker 2 (20:52):
All right, thanks y'all. There he is.
Speaker 3 (20:53):
That's a Ben Baby.
Speaker 4 (20:55):
Can't get the straw wet, can't hide, can't have money.
Speaker 3 (20:59):
Can't hide money. Ben's living in life.
Speaker 4 (21:01):
Nothing says Texas quite like a stetson. I'm telling you,
pub right now.
Speaker 3 (21:06):
You pull up, you pull up the practice and you
see Ben in a ball cap, rains on the way
if he's got the stetson. Clear skies plan accordingly based
on what you see Ben wearing.
Speaker 4 (21:18):
What if they say about the grass being green and
the sky being.
Speaker 3 (21:21):
Well, the grass is green, sky is blue. We still
got a lot of work to do, both at camp
and for SINCY three sixty your talkbacks when we come back.
ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station. A service of SINCI
shirts
This is Cincy Shirts. Cincy three sixty About Cincinnati from Cincinnati,
sponsored in part by Cincy Shirts. Cincy Shirts All Cincy.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
All Day.
Speaker 1 (00:12):
This is ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station.
Speaker 3 (00:17):
Welcome back, Cincy three to sixty. ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati
Sports Station. It's Tuesday. We're a service of Sinci Shirts,
which means that the warehouse sale is still active Essex
Studios ten to four pm now through Friday. Ten dollars
ties thanks to Cinci Shirts. If you can't make it there,
simply visit Cinci shirts dot com, download their mobile app,
(00:38):
or find a way to get into any of the
retail locations. All right, we are joined now by a
man that covers the Cincinnati Bengals for ESPN dot Com
and a man I spend a lot of time with
as I'm down at each and every training camp practice,
talking to with what we're seeing, He joins us. Right now, Ben, Baby, Ben,
what's going on?
Speaker 2 (00:55):
Man? Hey, Tony good. I'm feeling I'm wearing you out
at this point with how much conversate on the in sideline.
But it's good to get a fresh beet of eyes
as you figure out what this Bengals.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
Team is going to look like, yeah, look, that's the
hardest part, right is there's so many things, Like if
they take it inside the stadium, there's one field. You
go out to practices, there's multiple fields, there's multiple drills
going on at the same time. It is it's hard
to see everything that's going on as it relates to
the Cincinnati Bengals. Let's start here, though, it's not hard
to see because he's a huge loss, both physically for
(01:28):
this team and what he means to this team. The
news yesterday with a Marius Mims who's gonna miss and again,
this is a Bengals way of selling it, saying it
more than a couple weeks, less than many. It's the
same way they described Joe Burrow's calf injury last year.
But when you think of the loss of Mems, both
what that means for him and this right tackle position
as a whole, how concerned do you become?
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Yeah, I think it depends on how long he's going
to be out. The way that Zach Taylor eventually said
he wouldn't rule out the possibility of him being back
for Week one, I thought that was good and I
think that talking to folks yesterday. You know, Frank Pollock
was really high on Trek Brown. We haven't seen a
lot of him, but even guys on that, you know,
(02:12):
on that offensive line talking to yesterday, you know, Cordell
Wolson said, you know, he's a really good football player.
And and you know in the tone that Cordell said it,
that meant he truly truly believed it. I think that
they believe that he can be a good fit in there.
I think when they drafted Marius Mims and looked at
what they brought to the table, it immediately became clear,
you know, once we started seeing how they were working
(02:33):
in the offseason, that Mims was going to be the
guy who could potentially slot in him. And he looked
really good, have looked good in camp, and I think
Brown was a nice luxury to have as a veteran reserve.
And now you're you're seeing that depth player role. So
it's still a very, very big loss, but I think
the fact that they addressed it to a degree is good.
(02:53):
Now the question is going to be how available is
Trent Brown going to be? Can he stay healthy? It's
an issue that he's had over the last.
Speaker 3 (02:59):
Few years when you look at the wide receiver position,
ben A lot is made about wide receiver number three,
and while Jermaine Burton shined in some opportunities, I thought
it was very telling when he was used and the
type of routes he was used on. Do you still
see wide receiver three as a race or do you
think wide receiver three is a done deal at this point?
Speaker 2 (03:20):
Yeah, that's hard for me. I do. I don't think
Burton's in the mix, to be honest. You know the
way that you know, like you said, when you look
at the types of routes he ran in that preseason game,
how he's been used, and the way that people talk
about him as well, I think it's going to be
between andre Yosavas or Trenton Irwin, and you know, we'll
see how that battle continues to unfold. We've seen a
ton of Yoshi Vos in that slot and so just
(03:43):
given how late he got into that mix, and yesterday
we saw a little bit communication on an interception, something
that you can't have happen quite frankly, and I think
that the learning curve that you're gonna need to play
in that slot. I think Irwin, you're gonna have a
little bit higher level of comfort with him there. You know,
we'll see if that continues to how that goes on.
But you know, I think Jermaine Burton right now, he
(04:05):
looks like an outside receiver to me, a guy who
could potentially, you know, if this is your last year
of Tea Higgins, a guy who could be that wide
receiver too next year maybe and be a really solid
outside threat. I think that's probably where he fits best,
and what we've seen right now, I think I think
it's like to say he might be a long shot
in that slot, and right now, Andre and Trenton Irwin
(04:26):
would be the two favorites in my opinion, that to
win that flought battle.
Speaker 3 (04:29):
Uh, Ben, Let's talk about this because you and I
have spent a ton of time talking about Joe Burrow
throughout training camp, and I'm not at the point where
I'm sounding an alarm about Joe Burrow. Because we saw
what he did in the preseason game again limited action,
We've seen what he's done at practice, but there have
been I think inconsistencies in watching Joe Burrow through camp.
And I think Burrow, because he's addressed it multiple times
(04:53):
that he has spoke he's addressed not being where he
needs to be yet or or there's still frustrations with
the spiral or the zip on the passes. That's evident.
We can see that at practice. Is it to a
point where you concern yourself with it or is it
still in the lines of this is just something to
pay attention to and make sure it doesn't become something more.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
Yeah, tell me. I mean you and I talk about this.
I think every day we're out there and I feel
like we're on the same page, and I really want
to see what this looks like in Chicago against the Ones.
I think that is going to be the biggest test
for Borrough so far. Didn't play against Ones on Saturday.
He didn't look very good. But then, you know, I
thought that throughout the leak last week. You know, there
(05:34):
was an inconsistencies. Yesterday, you know, I thought he looked
good at times. He had a really good ball to
Kendrick Pryor down the scene town Kendrick again in the
back in the end zone during a seven on seven drill.
But then later on throughout the day, I thought that,
you know, it just the offense was not clicking. You know,
we talk about the yoshavas, you know, the the miscommunication
(05:54):
there in the interception that was there. But even if
he had ran the route, I don't know that it
would have been the completion and it may have just
been a situation where Joe is really trying to test,
you know, his throwing the de ball against two high looks,
which is what we saw in the preseason game. I
don't think that the ball Joe ordinarrowly throws in a
too high shell and he's still trying to get it
(06:15):
to see Higgins and t believes that he should have
made the catch. But still, you know, I think it
consistency is the best way to put it. And like
you said, I think it's still very early to go
out and really be concerned. But I really want to
see how he looks against Chicago, and I think that
will tell us where he's at, especially now that he's
gotten more throws under his belt through camp.
Speaker 3 (06:37):
I think it's certainly interesting to watch. I know it's
become a moot point at this standpoint, But from your standpoint,
do you see any progression or any end in sight
with the Jamar Chase hold in right now?
Speaker 2 (06:51):
Yeah? You know, I think that's that's a big question.
Is I tell you what you know. I think it's
a great time. I think you've got to give Zach
we're in the front office, a ton of credit and
how they've handled the situation because we've seen, you know,
how it's played out in Dallas, in San Francisco, and
in Cincinnati. It has not been a major distraction. As
I told somebody the other day. I told the player
(07:13):
yet has said part of it is because we haven't
really pushed it a ton as well, because we know
where the stale mate sits. But I think it also,
you know, when you look at how involved Jamar is
and the comfort he feels and being on the field,
being around what they're saying and how they're handling it,
I think it speaks to kind of how they built
the team. And as much as I hate the word
(07:33):
culture and I think if it's just a massive cliche
that we use, and football specifically more so than any
of the sport, I do have to give the Bengals
a lot of credit for the culture that they've built,
the fact that Jamar can essentially hold in and it
not be a lot I mean a boss. It doesn't
seem to be affecting the locker room at all, has
not affecting the coaching staff at all. It seems like
(07:54):
beings have gone well. Now when that when does that change?
That's the question is that's has not answered this. Jamar
is not talking. At what point is one side going
to give and why? Frankly, is that going to be
Jamar getting what he wants or Jamar is going to
have to say, you know what, I'm gonna have to
take what I can get in play out this year
and see when you go back to the table next year.
(08:15):
I don't vote anybody for how they went about it.
When you see Charlie Jones go down, when you see
the injuries we see in a training camp, and even
the amount of money that Jamar Chase is set to
earn on a second contract, especially right now, it makes
perfect sense why he is not practicing. And if you're
the Bangals, you go, well, why would we give up
a discount right now on a receiver? Let's see what
(08:37):
we can do. They have a time clever that aspect
of it as well. But something's got to give at
some point, and I just don't know what that's going
to occur. And at some point we're going to have
to have the conversation of whether Jamar is willing to
sit out games. It's not something that really has been
talked a ton about publicly, But the deeper we get
(09:00):
the training camp, we have to start asking, at what
point is this going to you know, it's just going
to come to a resolution to receive Jamarro on the field,
because right now that remains to be seen.
Speaker 3 (09:11):
Uh, BENBABYESPN dot Com. If I had to ask you
where you're most concerned from a position group on the
offensive side of the ball going into preseason game number two,
you say, what, Well.
Speaker 2 (09:24):
That's a good question, Tony. I. I don't want to
take quarterback because again I don't want to find me along.
So I want to see how Joe looks throughout the week.
And we've seen anything really good at times. Uh, you know,
maybe maybe the offensive line. I think that depth. You
want to see what you have in the twos. You know,
what we saw the other day was not ideal, especially
now that I'm Mary Mary Spans is injured. You want
(09:45):
to see what those that topic position looks like. You
know Jackson, Uh, you know Frank Pollack was Jason up
Jackson Kirklan, I almost call poll. I don't think Frank
Payton anytime soon. So but James hyping up Jackson Kirklan.
We'll see what Cody Ford COMPUTI will look like, you know,
so maybe the offensive line and just what that depth
looks like. I think on the offense side of the ball,
(10:05):
everything else, I think the Bengals had to feel pretty
good about it. I think the running game should be improved.
We've seen them have a ton of bursts. I thought,
my god, tranking on Williams, who played football at A
and M looked really good yesterday. And Zach Boss and
Chase Brown I think are gonna have a lot better.
And you know, by and large, I don't see a
ton of issues on the offensive line or on the offense.
So the line, if I had to pick one, would
(10:27):
probably be there.
Speaker 4 (10:28):
Ben, how much of a concern do you think internally
the defensive line and primarily the defensive interior is with
this team and their ability to stop the run this year?
Speaker 2 (10:41):
Yeah, you know, I don't a lot. It's been a
big talking point after the last couple of games, after
the preseason game, but I don't know that I had
the same level of concerned and I based on how
they built this roster internally, I don't know what that
sense like even a granted the depth. We'll see what
it looks like when McKinley Jackson comes back. I think
(11:02):
when you when you went out and they looked at
how they wanted to go to the seasonsive line, it
was very intentional that they have placed to be a
greater emphasis on being able to get after the quarterback
from the inside than having guys being able to stop
to run. I think when you look at what defense
is going to do at a high level, how the
game is currently played, there's a reason they went after
(11:23):
shellingon rankings in DJ readers. They said, you know what,
we don't want not only DJ, but the guys that
they fits that bill. They made it a point to
go get shllon the ranks. There's been a lot of
conversation about Zach Carter and his role in Zach Carter,
you know, I talked in it the other day. He
actually drops twenty pounds this offseason in anticipatient of playing righter,
being being able to move a little bit better. It
(11:45):
feels like this is a better wait and that they
wait if you're dropping pounds as the interior team keeps
lie of it. That tells me that you're trying to
be more vulbile, you're trying to be more agile. That
is not a run stopping wait, that's ay. I want
to get after the passer league. If you look at
what they do in this the line and their needs
great pressure. In my opinion, that is way more important
than being able to go out and go and stop
(12:08):
the run. I think in this division we talk a
lot about being able to stop the run, and that's fine,
that's great, but if you want to win games in
December and January and into February, you're gonna have to
be able to get after the quarterback better than they
did last year. And Louis Arubos talked about this a
tont and that when they were good in twenty one,
they got a lot of passwords from the interior Warryokujobi
did it great j out getting after the quarterback, and
(12:30):
as good as DJ was, that was just not something
that he specialized in. When you talk about stopping the run,
I think it comes down to the backers being free
and being able to make plays, being able to fit
those gaps better than they did last year, and I
think having bon Bell back, I think that's going to
be an underrated part of it. The communication on the
back end should help the linebackers be free as well,
(12:52):
and they should all be able to have a good
understanding of where they're going to gap fit, especially when
they're playing with five defensive backs on norble passing down.
So for me, I don't sensive there's a ton of concern.
I think when you get a guys in the draft
happen to play what you gave. When they attack that
position group like they did over the course of the offseason,
that tells me that they are very intentional on what
(13:14):
they want this line to look like. And I think
pass rushing would be the greatest.
Speaker 3 (13:17):
Priority ben staying on the defensive side of the ball.
I thought Dax Hill had a pretty solid preseason game
number one versus what we've seen during training camp. I
talked about the battle at wide receiver three. Do you
still foresee that there is a battle going on at
number two corner for the Bengals as well?
Speaker 2 (13:37):
Yeah? You know that is probably for me the most
intriguing position group because I'm still trying to wrap my
head around what exactly they're doing when you look at
the rotations. You know, they started DJ Turner alongside Can't
Sailor Breed and I know that Dak Hill worked it
with the ones yesterday, but it seems like they've made
it a point to rotate as much as possible throughout camp.
(13:58):
We've seen them mix and match those corners. I still
think it we'll see today. I think today we'll get
a better sense of it. If Dak Stay's out there,
I would still get the edge of DJ Turner, and
quite frankly, I think Joshkas also looked really good. I
think the fact that he had the interception on Saturday,
you know, was a testament to the momentum he's built
throughout camp, and he's a guy internally they are really
(14:20):
really excited about and I think that they the more
that he continues to play well, they have to feel
good about where he's staying. And I remember we talked
about this, you know when I came on on the
first day of training camp. What exactly you do with
Dak Field remains to be seen, because if he does
play well, then you've got essentially three, maybe two and
a half guys if you want to get new you know,
(14:41):
let's say he probably needs a little bit more time.
But guys that you think could potentially go out there
and start a quarter, well, Dax's at some point has
to start getting reps. And when you look at I'm
just gonna say, if you you know, since Wren Sports trade,
you only can have some conjecture here. And I think
if you're the Bengals, why not talk about this a
you know, we just talked about defensive tackles, you know,
(15:03):
maybe the run flopping ability where that's that we see
a plethora of warterbacks. Again, I will point out there
if you decide that Dax Field can't, it isn't going
to be the starter. As good as he's looked, If
he's not going to be the starter, is it more
beneficial to potentially go out and get a defensive tackle
as a depth option, who will see the field, who
(15:24):
will rotate more. Then you're gonna rotate your dirt cornering
even on dime packickers. Because let's also remember dayson, Anthony
has looked very good and as a defensive back, he's
got a ton of reps and I feel like he
is gaining more trust from that coaching staff, and his
body type is has been a guy that is one
that fits really well in those dirt as that as
(15:45):
an extra defensive back of those time taxics. So all
of that being said, very long we can answer. But
as good as Dax has looked, I think you still
have to ask yourself where it is its value best?
And you know, would he be better shooited on your
roster this year? Will is it better as a trade asset?
And I think that the coaching staff needs to make
a decision on what they need to do at that
(16:06):
corn spot at this point, you know, when you're this
deep in the camp, you should have a pretty good
idea of where they stand. Ben.
Speaker 3 (16:12):
Let me ask you something about you said yesterday on
the sideline when we were talking pre practice. You know
we've talked a lot on the show about man, can
the defense just be top eighteen in the league? Can
they be top twenty? Give the offense a chance? You
It sounds like you're a little more bullish on the
fact that you think that this defense can be better
than maybe what people are predicting. Why is that?
Speaker 2 (16:35):
Yeah, when you look I think the fact that you
know what we've seen in practice, and you know, I
expect to, quite frankly, the offense will look worse on
Saturday against Tampa Bay, even against the twos than they
are looking. I thought that they looked they were able
to get the ball down the field well, move the
ball really well. Not always what we've seen in practice,
for being quite honest, and you know, it reminded me
(16:56):
a lot of that twenty twenty one training camp and
we were like, well, I can't be offense moved the
ball and everybody was like, listen, this defense is a
lot better than people give it credit for. And the
chippiness that we saw last week, that was the defense
essentially sending a message of the offense saying, hey, guys
like and Jermaine Pratt said it that as locker like,
these are not completions that you think that that you
think they are. These are fifty to fifty balls and
(17:18):
we're letting it'll get some of these, but when we
want to put our foot down, y'all are not getting them.
And I think that when you look at what they've done,
I think, again, Sheldon rankins massive adition. I think von
Bell is going to continue to be big. The growth
of the second year players in that secondary from Jordan
battle in Uh and DJ Turner. I think it's going
to be huge. Cam Hibler Britt I think before he
(17:38):
got injured last year was playing at a foot bowl
level and when you look at the advanced metrics, that's
what that tells us. And so I think that you
know what they're what they have the pieces in that
in that on that side of the ball. I do
think this can be a much better defense and could
potentially be, excuse me, a top fifteen, top twelve defense
if they can play well. And I think the run
(17:59):
defense going to be to the question mark. But if
you're hitting after the passer early, you're gonna put teams
in passing downs and that's going to be a much
more valuable asset.
Speaker 3 (18:07):
Ben, let me ask you this but before I let
you go here, what do you expect today? Because you know,
I feel like it's a it's an interesting time right
now because you know you travel tomorrow. Joint practice is Thursday.
You had a pretty animated practice with a lot of
team drills yesterday. How do you envision today's practice? Is
(18:30):
this maybe a build in off day where Joe Burrow
does less? Do you think they take the foot off
the gas a little bit, or do you think they say, Okay,
we essentially have three practices left together before the end
of camp. We got to make the most out of it.
Speaker 2 (18:44):
Yeah, that's a that's a great question, Tony. The way
that they have structured camp so far, it makes sense
for them to go ahead and take it easy today.
Maybe have a like you said, I have a lighter
day knowing that the ones are going to get really
really good work on on a Thursday when they go
up to Chicago, and I think that is gonna be
(19:05):
the You want to make sure that they're staying fresh.
That's been a big point of emphasis. Uh. And given
how much team we saw yesterday, I could see the
argument for them, you know, playing it back, playing you know,
have a holding the reins back a little bit. But
that being said, I also would understand if the want
of the offense looks better, because after yesterday's offensive performance,
if I'm on the offensive side of the ball, I
(19:26):
probably want to feel really good about what we do
in team because yesterday left a lot to be desired
towards the end of the day, and you want to
probably get some good momentum that's the thing going into
the Joy practice in Chicago.
Speaker 3 (19:39):
Benbaby, ESPN dot com. Ben, I can't thank you enough
for joining us today. I'll see you here and uh
in just a couple of minutes down at the practice fields.
What's the easiest way for everyone to follow along with
all your coverage of the Bengals now and going forward.
Speaker 2 (19:53):
Yeah, you know we're We're on the esp app ESPN
dot com. Make sure you got that Bengals team page.
I got the notifications off for that, and I'm also
on Instagram trying to get that out there. Time, Tony
d Baby forty one, trying to keep up with the
kids here to do.
Speaker 3 (20:08):
I do have to ask you because Austin when I
get down to practice often ask me for a weather report.
I base my weather reports on what type of hat
you're wearing for each practice. What are you looking at today?
Is there any chance of raining your forecast that would
be hesitant for you to bring out the big dogs?
Speaker 2 (20:26):
Hey, Tony, let me tell you right now. I got
the stets and sitting shotgun ready. They're ready to be worn.
It is. It is gonna be that kind of day there,
it is.
Speaker 3 (20:33):
That's our weather report. Let me tell you Ben's not
pulling the stetson out man. If there's a chance of
rain in the forecast, so you know what type of
day it is.
Speaker 2 (20:42):
And you can't be getting good Tony, you have the
no no. In my book, it's.
Speaker 3 (20:45):
Words I live by. Can't get the good straw wet, Benbaby,
ESPN dot Com. Ben see assume man, Thanks for joining us.
Speaker 2 (20:52):
All right, thanks y'all. There he is.
Speaker 3 (20:53):
That's a Ben Baby.
Speaker 4 (20:55):
Can't get the straw wet, can't hide, can't have money.
Speaker 3 (20:59):
Can't hide money. Ben's living in life.
Speaker 4 (21:01):
Nothing says Texas quite like a stetson. I'm telling you,
pub right now.
Speaker 3 (21:06):
You pull up, you pull up the practice and you
see Ben in a ball cap, rains on the way
if he's got the stetson. Clear skies plan accordingly based
on what you see Ben wearing.
Speaker 4 (21:18):
What if they say about the grass being green and
the sky being.
Speaker 3 (21:21):
Well, the grass is green, sky is blue. We still
got a lot of work to do, both at camp
and for SINCY three sixty your talkbacks when we come back.
ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station. A service of SINCI
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