June 16, 2026 • 37 mins
Paul Dehner Jr. of The Athletic and The Growler Podcast joined us to discuss what Katie and Elizabeth Blackburn had to say in their meeting with select media. Plus, Brendan Sorsby's NFL prospects, a $9 million practice, and a question that Myles Murphy may have to ask himself.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Fifteen. All right, there we go. It's fine. That's Zacher
three o'clock. This is ESPN fifteen thirty. Good afternoon.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
My name is Maleger. Thank you for listening. I've you're
having an awesome Tuesday afternoon. Paul Danner Junior is here.
He covers the Bengals for The Athletic.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
Didn't cover Joe Burrow today.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
The Athletic dot com, as well as the Growler podcast,
where he and Jay Morrison broke down everything that was
said yesterday in the media availability, which was that a gaggle.
I think it was less than gaggle, less than gaggle, Yeah,
because what I mean four people's not I gaggle.
Speaker 3 (00:34):
I think of his more than four. It was a nice,
quiet little room. Didn't feel gaggling to me. Okay, yeah,
it just felt more like a little conversation, little chat,
just a chat, all right.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
Yeah, you guys broke it down in a great detail
on the Growler podcast, and Paul joins us every Tuesday,
and unfortunately no Joe Burrow to talk about today, or
we could talk about him, but no Joe Burrow to
hear from you.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
No.
Speaker 3 (00:57):
I heard you mentioned this with Tony and Austin, and
I said it myself. I said, I would just lap
up a Joe Flacco press that's right now if.
Speaker 1 (01:07):
He came in. I mean, I got to tell you,
like I have.
Speaker 3 (01:10):
I would love to just talk to Joe Flacco right
now if that's what we had to do. Sure, sure,
I mean now we could have. He was just in
the locker room like it was no, it was available.
But if he just would have walked in, I think
we all would have sat there and been like, yeah, okay,
love Joe Flacco. Press conferences the best, Yes, yeah, I'll
do it.
Speaker 1 (01:28):
Well. But that didn't happen, No, it didn't. That's okay.
Speaker 3 (01:31):
Whatever Joe was spending extra time throwing after practice, I
don't know if he was still grinding his gears a
little bit over an interception by Josh Newton early in
early in the practice, and so maybe he was out
there working on his five yard out to make sure
that that didn't happen anymore, or just it just put
him in a bad enough mood that he said, I
(01:52):
just don't want to do this. Not quite sure where
that lands, but uh punted to tomorrow.
Speaker 2 (01:58):
All right, Well, tomorrow Joe will talk today we can
psychoanalyze his unwillingness to do the press conference today.
Speaker 3 (02:03):
What would have been worse though one day of this
or he actually goes up today and he's in a
bad mood from whatever. Right, Yeah, and then we spend
the next five weeks debating his happiness again that I
don't need, I.
Speaker 1 (02:17):
Don't know, I don't need that, nobody wants.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
I mean, as much as I can lament the dearth
of hard hitting Bengals topics this summer relative to recent seasons,
I have no interest in that.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
I have no interest in that either. So this is
probably for the best.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
You had the mandatory mini camp this week, and we'll
talk about the chat you had with Elizabeth and Katy yesterday.
But has there been anything that has stood out in
the locker room or on the field this week from
your perspective?
Speaker 1 (02:42):
Not really. I mean we were there today. It was
like an hour and fifteen minutes.
Speaker 3 (02:46):
It was pretty light if you want to if you
want to get a glimpse of the type of stuff
that was going on today, big big news when we
had I believe it was called the Doomsday unit was
in there practicing field goals. It was Tanner Hudson holding,
Ryan Rico kicking and Cam Grandy snapping. This is you
(03:07):
got just in case, in case you get to a
situation where any of those pieces are hurt. They have
to know that they can execute. So they were they
were going through kicking four or five field goals. That's
where we're at with the field goals. Good three for
four for Ryan kick. You said that it was the
first time he probably kicked a field goal since his
(03:27):
freshman year in college. But he's proven that he can
do it now where he can be the guy to
get you through a game and then they go get somebody,
which is what he's looking But that's where any camp
is currently living right now.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
Has he been practicing any punting, like inside the ten
that sort of thing. Yeah, he's working onstead of just
you know hitting you know Aaron Judge Holmers through the
back of the end zone when they they're looking for
a you know, a webshot.
Speaker 3 (03:57):
I didn't get into that well today, I was really
really focused on the kicking.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
I get it.
Speaker 3 (04:03):
We'll get to that and train plenty of time to
unpack that box.
Speaker 1 (04:06):
Okay, very good.
Speaker 3 (04:08):
No, I mean outside of that, I mean they're realistically
there really hasn't been a you know, a ton all
parties that you want to see were there and accounted for.
So that was that was for the most part. Dax
was on the side for the seven on seven level
of an type stuff, but he said, he said, that's
(04:29):
no big deal. He's fine, nothing really going on there.
But outside of that, I mean, it's been just kind
of it was kind of more of the same.
Speaker 1 (04:36):
Okay, very good.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
Yesterday you had the conversation with Katie Blackburn and Elizabeth
Blackburn and I I said this after the Duke Tobin thing,
and this is no disrespect to anybody who is in
nonsports media who gets sent to cover those things. But
I like it when it's just the folks who cover
the team closely, you know, answering questions, because I think
(04:59):
you guys are most in touch with most what most
of us want to hear. So in that setting, what
stood up most about what Elizabeth and Katie had to.
Speaker 3 (05:07):
Say, you know, it's that what we've been kind of
talking about, is there The conversation sort of reflected the
themes of the off season, which is, man, there's not a.
Speaker 4 (05:19):
Whole lot to really get after here, is there in
terms of content where it could be content where we're
broaching uncomfortable topics, which we always seem to be doing
in these conversations with Katie, and there just really wasn't
a whole lot uncomfortable yesterday.
Speaker 3 (05:33):
It was like, why are things going so good here?
About how great that went? How about you know, it
was really a lot of like things seem to be
going really well. And that's the tone of it, and
that's why maybe the takeaway is a little bit of
how much it has continued.
Speaker 1 (05:50):
To do what it always does every time we have news.
Speaker 3 (05:53):
Is cycle more pressure onto this season because it just
feels in such a good place right now, where all
this pressure is now being put on this season and
then consequently really being put on Zach Taylor. And you know,
they sort of discussed that and you could feel that,
I mean, it wasn't overwhelming. They weren't going out of
their way to be like playoffs or bust or anything
(06:15):
like that. It was very you know, easy, He's treated
very easily. But I think there was a sense of
everybody here expects a really good season, and so if
that doesn't happen, there's gonna be a lot of other
questions to be answered.
Speaker 1 (06:30):
I think was the unsaid part of that.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
It was, you know, I am a fan of the
world champion New York Knicks.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
I heard that.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
Yeah, where the owner of the team, who is mostly
somebody that I've despised for the better part of the
last twenty five years. But he said publicly back in January,
we need we should make the finals and we should
win the finals. That's pretty much what he said, set
it on the radio today, which put a lot of
pressure on the world champion New York Knicks to eventually
(06:57):
get to the finals and vanquish whoever they would play
from the Western Conference. There was a part of me
that was hoping for a Cincinnati Bengals version of that.
I knew I wasn't going to get it, but I
got some implications there that they believe like, Okay, maybe
they're not going to the super Bowl, but we've we've
kind of done our thing here and so now like
it's it's kind of on Zach, it's on Joe, who
have both admitted this to go do your thing.
Speaker 1 (07:19):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (07:19):
I think they said that in their way, Yeah, I
mean it was yeah, I think in their way, there
was a like, yeah, this should be a great season.
We were expecting that. I mean, that's that's we've done
a good job. There's no glaring holes apparently, you know
that there's there's no feeling of anything's missing from this team.
(07:41):
And I think there's you know, obviously plenty of arguments
you made that that's the case. But yeah, I think
in their way, they said that this is the expectation,
this it should look like that, but there's never gonna
be you know there. It was always followed with, well,
the season's got to play out and you never know
what's going to happen, and that is fair. But I
think that's you know that that was sort of the
(08:02):
message in their way.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
This was And correct me if I'm wrong, because typically
Katie will talk at the owners meetings. You went to
the owners meetings, Katie didn't talk. This was basically in
lieu of that.
Speaker 3 (08:14):
Yeah, so that's why it was only myself, Ben Baby
from ESPN and Kelsey Comace Inquirer and Jeff Hobson because
we were the ones originally slated to talk and they
kind of changed that after we all had planned to
go out there. Yeah, and so there was okay, well
we'll have a make good for you on that. We
just want to change away the schedule went. And I'll say, like,
(08:35):
looking back on it now, I give credit to them
for the change. I liked the changes that were made
in terms of what I felt like the messages were
able to be delivered to fans by different people at
important points in time, from putting Duke Tobin out there
right after the season, which is where that needed to be,
(08:55):
to making the assistant general managers available during the draft,
which we great to hear those voices, and then having
Katie and Elizabeth here now after the promotion she got
this promotion to vice president along with Caroline, and to
have those voices here together at this point. And then
obviously the plan right now as far as we know
(09:17):
is that we'll still have Mike at Mock Turtle Soup
and everybody that's involved in that. I like that layout. Yeah,
and I would let you you know, I'm always looking
for more. I would still love to talk to people
at the league meetings if there's but there's just a
lot less news that comes out of the league meetings,
which is true, Like that used to be a real
Newsy Week. Now it's kind of the league is kind
(09:39):
of shifted away from that. It's just you talk out
there because everyone is and hopefully that will still have
something out there. But I do think that this layout
and the movement, I think it gives people the answers
that they want. They hear from different people and at
better mile posts, probably in the off season.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
So that's kind of where I was going, because it
has felt like this offsea there has been and maybe
transparency isn't the right word, but there's there's been a
little bit more information coming from the Bengals and starting
with the Duke Tobin mega press CONTI. I mean that's
the biggest one, and that needs to happen on a
on a regular basis. So is there a sense of,
(10:17):
all right, we've got to be a little bit more
forthright with information in our own way, and we have
to take a little heat off Zach Taylor, who's still
going to be the public voice of the organization or
whoever the head coach is, just because of the volume
of press conferences and availabilities that, yeah, he's going to
do his thing, but like we we kind of have to.
Speaker 3 (10:36):
Be out there as well as that. Is this going
to be the new norm? I guess I feel like
this is going to be the new norm. I mean
I think it. I haven't come across a single person
inside or outside the organization that is thought the way
things went was bad outside of obviously what that Duke
Tobin press conference turned into. Yeah, but I don't think
(10:58):
that's going to be the case going forward. Right, We've
talked about that before, Like, I just think the nature
of this season and that that had never happened for
turned that into a thing that it probably that was
way out of control. I don't think that'll be the
case when that's just a regular part of the season structure.
And so for that fact, I think that's But outside
(11:19):
of that, like I think everything has been met with like, hey,
this was all really good, and I think this is
the way that things will probably operate out. I think
it's also like at certain point you've got to reevaluate
the way you're you're talking to your fans, but also
when to talk to them and the league. The league
(11:39):
does kind of change that, like just it's constantly stretching
itself out where it's not at small like small points anymore,
and you can kind of find your own your own
lane and so I I think this is good. I
think everybody felt like it was good, and I certainly
liked hearing from the different voices at different times.
Speaker 2 (11:57):
Now one may say, well, this summer, there's no distraction,
there's no Trey Hendricks, and there's no they're obviously players
and both talked about like we've we've got some guys
we want to resign, but there's no controversial holdout, hold
in guy throwing shots like Shamar Stewart last year. When
we get back to that and those things are you know,
(12:20):
over the course of the next few years, is going
to be unavoidable. They happen around the NFL. It's nice
to not have them this year, But do you feel
like what you had yesterday sort of goes away?
Speaker 3 (12:28):
If there's no no, no, I don't think that there's
any move by anybody to have those people not out
there talking about whatever's going on. At this point in time.
There's not a ton, but I think I don't. I
think it's more about finding the time that best fits,
you know, in the new NFL calendar right now, and
(12:50):
I don't think that there's I mean, certainly you would
hear a lot from us if there was, you know,
any idea of not having.
Speaker 1 (12:57):
Something like this available still, And I don't think that's
the case.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
All are there is what you guys did yesterday, Is
that the norm around the NFL?
Speaker 3 (13:07):
No, No, not not not really, I mean, I mean
hear from all the time.
Speaker 2 (13:13):
Yeah, And I feel like there are there are teams
where I couldn't name their owner because they're never out there.
Speaker 3 (13:18):
So like a lot of markets, just by the nature
of what they are, it's there's a lot more people.
And now there would have been more people in a
normal year, but like, yeah, you know, but at the
league meetings, that's probably not a crazy site like that
in a courtyard there's like four or five media members
with a GM or with an owner because those are
the people that traveled out there. Like what happened in
(13:40):
Cincinnati is not all that far off from what happens
at the Biltmore or the Breakers or any of those
things when they go down. So but no, I think
the you know, the the access was was certainly like
that's the best case scenario for anybody on any beat
is to be able to just be able to sit
down in a room in a very conversational environment with
(14:01):
a small group of people where there doesn't feel like
there's any jumping in or it's not a super intense
it feels much more like a regular conversation with someone
at that level in this league.
Speaker 1 (14:13):
That's hard to get. I'm very appreciative that we were
able to get it.
Speaker 3 (14:17):
I wish it would have been like a year where
we had more stuff to get.
Speaker 1 (14:22):
Right now.
Speaker 3 (14:23):
It was, you know, I'll say this, and I talked
our good friend Richard Skinner. I talked about this with
him yesterday, and he was pointing out that was an
opportunity for them to take a little victory lap, and
there was none. There was no like, hey, I mean
the first my first question was basically like about how
aggressive the off season had been, and like, you know, look,
(14:45):
you guys, tod new precedent, this, this and this, it
seems like it's gone. And it was basically like, would
you like take a victory lap? And the answer was
kind of no, Like it was more of a saluting
the people around them, and they're just doing you know,
it was very matter of fact and logical, and I
guess I wouldn't have necessarily expected that from them, but
it was there with the off season that they've had
(15:08):
the decision to keep Duke and go forward with continuity
and to see that play out advantageously to them and
that personnel staff. To be sitting where they're at right now.
There was a chance for a little bit of an
off season victory lap, and they didn't.
Speaker 1 (15:22):
They didn't take it.
Speaker 3 (15:23):
Didn't like the ring of honor answer, nor did I.
I mean, but here's the thing. But here's the thing
I said, I'm not received a good answer on that
question yet, and I don't know that that I I
don't agree with that answer. I appreciated the answer. I
just answer. I didn't like it because my point is,
(15:43):
if it's about giving these guys the right moment, well
let's make sure they get a moment. Let's make alive
for the moment, right Like, if it's about giving them
them a moment, let's not make it harder for them
to actually get the moment. That was That'd be my
side of what they said. But I see what they're
saying with some of the the promotion of being on
the ballot as part of it too. But I you know,
(16:05):
I did I just disagree.
Speaker 1 (16:06):
Yeah, wholeheartily.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
But I appreciated the the relative candor with which the
answer was provided.
Speaker 1 (16:14):
And I do believe that.
Speaker 3 (16:15):
They've put a lot of thought into it, which is
what Elizabeth said. And I don't think that that's a stretch.
I just, you know, I just I don't want to
be talking about Ken Riley's and Bob Trumpy's and things
like this anymore.
Speaker 1 (16:28):
I don't want to do that.
Speaker 2 (16:29):
I have a few of the things I want to
ask you about, but that have nothing to do with
Katie and Elizabeth. And I have maybe two assignments for you, okay,
because I know there's not a lot going on. I
need I need work.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
I got two assignments for you. We'll get to that
when we come back.
Speaker 2 (16:42):
Twenty two minutes after three o'clock, Paul Danner Junior, covering
the Bengals for the Athletic dot Com has two pieces
on some of the things that were talked about yesterday,
and the Growler podcast up as well.
Speaker 1 (16:54):
He's here till four. We are here toll six.
Speaker 2 (16:57):
We have the Reds and their win last night, with
Chase Burns absolutely bodying Juan Soto. We have the Brendan
sores By issued to discuss, and a lot of other
ins and outs as well. On ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports.
Speaker 5 (17:08):
Station, Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty Traffic.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
This is ESPN fifteen thirty Moegger with Paul Danner Junior covering.
Speaker 1 (17:17):
The Bengals for the Athletic and the Growl of podcast.
I don't know. Between now and training camp.
Speaker 2 (17:24):
I'm sure you're taking some time off, but if you're
in need of something to do, I was thinking this week,
this would be pretty easy assignment for you. It's a
supplemental mock draft. Sure, why not get a big board
out for the supplemental draft?
Speaker 3 (17:37):
Can I do my supplemental mock draft? Yeah, it's just
the big X on a piece of paper. Not happening. No,
not here anyway.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
Bengals aren't taking Brendan Soresby in the supplemental draft.
Speaker 1 (17:47):
I don't see that no being a part of the equation.
I guess.
Speaker 3 (17:51):
I mean, I I never want to say never anymore,
all right with this team?
Speaker 2 (17:56):
So this team the most uncircused like off season of
all trend setting trailblazers in Cincinnati.
Speaker 3 (18:03):
How could I possibly say that it's definitely off the Okay,
I do not see that as a gift to people
like me are you kidding me?
Speaker 2 (18:11):
Look here it is. We're taking Brendan Sourcebe in the
supplemental draft. Go ahead, mo, all.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
Yours, all yours? Yeah, No, I do not do not
see that uch?
Speaker 2 (18:20):
Can I ask you from a serious perspective as somebody
who knows the league well and knows how NFL personnel
people think. And obviously every team is different, every team's
quarterback situation is different. But do you think Brendan Sorosby
will have difficulty finding teams that are really interested in him?
Speaker 3 (18:38):
Somebody's gonna take a chance. I mean there, you know,
we saw a little bit as the league, the college
game has shifted. How empty the last couple rounds felt
right as everyone just took a million tight ends because
they were the one position they feel like there were
a bunch of good ones in. It is the value
of those late round picks. While there still is some
(18:59):
that's it gets less and less. There's more and more
guys stay in school and there's less early entrants and.
Speaker 1 (19:04):
Things like that.
Speaker 3 (19:06):
For that fact, somebody's got a six round pick or
a fifth round pick, or they have comp pay, they've
got a bunch, they've stockpiles, Like, what's the matter we
got three fives next year, Let's let's start throw at
a quarterback who can sit in the background. Maybe we
can coach them up and see what we can get
out of them and whatever. Right, I mean, at that
(19:28):
position in the NFL, if you feel like he has
the tools and you can get it out of him,
somebody's somebody is going to be willing to use a
late round pick to just see what they can do.
So for me, I think that's probably where this thing,
this thing lands. There's enough, there's just too much value,
too much need to try to hit on something like
(19:49):
that that some team wouldn't take a chance.
Speaker 1 (19:51):
But there have to be teams that view the gambling
thing as a total non starter. Yeah, and I think
a lot of them would.
Speaker 3 (19:57):
I mean, I think the idea of maybe he'll be
a good quarter back with trumpet, I mean, his storyline
is going to be minimal. Wherever he goes. I think
you can put him in programs and deal with whatever
this year. You're you're not gonna be counting on him
to do anything this year. So if you're helping him
get right, you're helping him get help. He's in your system.
You got him in the whatever the NFL puts in place,
(20:20):
the NFLPA puts in place to help that stuff.
Speaker 1 (20:23):
You can feel like you can come in to the
twenty twenty seven season and see what you have for real.
Speaker 2 (20:30):
Well if when you're done with the mock supplemental.
Speaker 1 (20:33):
Tram, I'm done with that, so go ahead.
Speaker 2 (20:35):
I asked on social media last night what people enjoyed
more the Brendan Soresby era at Texas Tech the Ryan
Madson era with the Reds, which, for folks who don't remember,
in the spring of twenty twelve, Reds had made a
series of like all in moves that year, Matt Lato's,
Sean Marshall, Ryan Ludwig. They also got Ryan Madson, who
(20:56):
played one game of catch, blew out his elbow and
never pitched in a regular season game or a spring
training game for that matter for the Reds. And then
there was my favorite of all time, Antoniobrian. And this
was before I believe your full you were full time
on the beat.
Speaker 1 (21:11):
No, but I was around. I was around, Yeah, I
was there.
Speaker 2 (21:13):
So antonio'brien science with the Bengals, and it's the same
offseason they get too, but right before they get too
they started training camp in Georgetown and antonio'brien had like
a knee issue or a hamstring or something, and as
I recall, Marvin Lewis made him practice. That practice cost
the Bengals like nine million.
Speaker 1 (21:32):
Dollars did cause, no, it was the nine million dollar practices.
It is now known.
Speaker 2 (21:37):
You could do the oral history for the athletics of
the nine million dollar practice.
Speaker 3 (21:43):
I'd do a thousand words on every limping step I
saw this, dude make. I have never seen, you know
how like it was the equivalent of like, you know,
the tire drill or like the little where you're just
doing steps over the pads. I've never once doubted if
an NFL player can run over the pads in that
drill until I saw that practice where I was like, Oh,
(22:06):
I don't know that he's.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
Going to be able to do this. Why is he
out there?
Speaker 3 (22:10):
And then you come to find out all the drama
behind it of him being able to be out there
and doing that was worth nine million dollars to him
and a lot more of that makes sense. I believe
a lot some people lost their jobs over that one,
But I mean, his knee was people knew that his
knee was shot coming into it, and everybody was waiting.
(22:30):
Everybody was waiting to see Antonio. He's going to practice
today and everyone, Oh no, I was.
Speaker 2 (22:37):
There, Lindsey Patterson and I drove down to Georgetown because
like Teo was going to show up, right, And I
remember looking at her going our other new wide receiver
runs like he's got a keg of beer strapped to
his shoulders, Like this isn't I don't think this is good.
And then you came to find out like they made
him practice and so like Antonio Bryant should send Christmas
(22:58):
cards or something every year to a lot of folks, Yes,
but primarily Marvin Lewis.
Speaker 3 (23:05):
He certainly benefited. I mean it was one of the
wildest things where you just instantly knew, well, this guy's broken,
this is not there spent a lot of money on
this guy, and he is broken. And the crowds. Do
you remember the crowds that you do? Yes, I will
never forget the crowds at Georgetown during the.
Speaker 1 (23:22):
Toho Circus year. I remember that.
Speaker 3 (23:24):
I mean it was insane And the best part was
the next year. So the next year, after that disastrous
ten season, the disastrous following off season. Now in actuality
they drafted Dalton and Agent Green or whatever, but that
they were as low as they could be from a
pr perspective with their fans entering eleven because they had
(23:48):
just gotten roasted. And I remember being there at that
same place talking to Cedric Benson in one of those
little walking paths between the two fields where the previous
year was over floats with just people everywhere, and Cedric
just kind of stops me in the middle of it
and he goes, man, do we have fans anymore?
Speaker 1 (24:10):
It's like, I don't think you do.
Speaker 3 (24:12):
I mean, it was unbelievable how few people were down.
Then they ended up being, you know, a decent season
and they kind of started the track back, but it
was those two years are very.
Speaker 1 (24:23):
Vivid memories of a lot going on with the Cincinnati Bangles. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (24:28):
Yeah, and that included a nine million dollar time million dollars.
There's a little project for you. You know what I
might do it if I I'll credit you in my
my little story. If I if I can track down
Antonio O'Brien, I'm sure he's around somewhere.
Speaker 1 (24:45):
I wouldn't much money.
Speaker 2 (24:47):
I don't want to talk about the one time he
practiced and got paid nine million dollars for you.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
At this point, I would have had a book written.
Speaker 3 (24:52):
If I was him about that where sixteen years removed,
I think we can open up on it.
Speaker 2 (24:56):
Twenty four away from four o'clock Paul Danner Junior from
The Athletic and the Podcast Here till four. This is
ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station.
Speaker 1 (25:06):
Not just talk.
Speaker 5 (25:07):
This is sports with soul, sweat and swagger. Tony Pike,
Sincy three sixty Tomorrow at twelve noon on ESPN fifteen
thirty Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty Traffic on uce.
Speaker 2 (25:23):
Health TRAFFICCA see our service of a Kelsey Chevrolet Home
of lifetime power train protection and guaranteed credit approval from
their family to yours for life kelseyshev dot Com. Red's
play the Mets again tonight at gabp A for last
night's three homer blowout wins spearheaded by Chase Burns doing
Chase Burns thing. Euhaneo Suarez hit a couple of bombs
(25:44):
and the Reds took the series opener, and you know,
now they've won two out of three. Tonight they hand
the ball to Brady Singer seven to ten, first pitch,
seven hundred. Wl W Moore on that a little bit
later on Paul Danner Junior from The Athletic and the
Growler pod cast is whether US Bengals training camp begins
end of July. And I know we've talked about the
(26:07):
relative quiet nature of the off season and the things
that we're not talking about now that we were talking
about a year or so ago. Let's talk about the
extensions that could be done. Do you think that between
now in July twenty eighth, it's at the first practice.
Speaker 1 (26:23):
Yeah, that weekend. Do we believe that one of them
will get done between now and then?
Speaker 3 (26:31):
Potentially these things go a couple different ways, because it
feels like some years you get one that yeah right
before camp starts, bam, just both sides saw eye to eye,
they knocked it out. There's been a bunch of those
over the years. Logan Wilson, Tyler Boyd like I can
(26:51):
go through the line. I'm just thinking about them. This
one feels a little harder. I'm talking about DJ just
because it's more expensive and those tend to get a
little bit more into the training, into training camp and
further so, I'm not gonna say if I'm if I'm guessing,
I would say maybe it bleeds over into camp a
(27:12):
little bit. But there's a potential that it gets done.
So I mean we've you've seen around the league. I mean,
there's tons of big deals getting done right now. So
I don't think it's out of the question. But as
Katie said yesterday, you know, the quote was, we've got
our work cut out for us when you consider the
other commitments that.
Speaker 1 (27:29):
They also have.
Speaker 3 (27:30):
I mean they have five players with twenty plus million
dollars against the cap next year. It's a lot. Now,
they can do a lot of things. They can restructure
a quarterback contract. Really yeah, they can't.
Speaker 2 (27:44):
Sure.
Speaker 3 (27:45):
But that said, I think the tone used on that
suggests if you were thinking that all four of those
extension candidates were happening, you're crazy.
Speaker 1 (27:54):
Sure.
Speaker 3 (27:54):
I would say it maybe pushes the number down to
one and a half being the over under, okay, instead
of maybe two and a half.
Speaker 1 (28:01):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (28:02):
I just think that I think one gets done with somebody.
I think one of those four ends up getting a
franchise tag next year, and then I think they try
to find ways.
Speaker 1 (28:14):
Maybe that most likely Brown Chase Brown.
Speaker 3 (28:16):
It feels most likely the running back number is easiest
to handle, and so that feels like it would make
the most sense. They don't have an answer. I mean,
they'd be dependent on the draft. They don't really have
an answer for his position right now in the long run,
so it feels like a franchise tag, kick the can
(28:39):
down the road, we'll try to get a deal done
type thing. You can be surprised by that stuff, but
that's certainly what it feels like right now.
Speaker 1 (28:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (28:48):
But in if there was one, and I know I
made you do this like two weeks ago with your
your run pass or boot that you do. But if
one got done, the most likely one does feel like DJ.
Speaker 3 (28:59):
It does to me, Yeah, just because you know you're
gonna start with what feels like the most expensive the
best player. Yeah, and that's both both of those things
would be DJ.
Speaker 1 (29:10):
Now.
Speaker 3 (29:11):
I love the idea of you know, this would be
an interesting I would love to sit down and hear
Miles Murphy and his representation's.
Speaker 1 (29:18):
Reaction if they drop three years forty five on them.
Would you do it if I was them?
Speaker 3 (29:23):
You were Miles boy, I take it because think about it.
If he has we talked about this. If he has
a good year this year, he's boy mafe. Yeah, he's
the same same resume if he has a good year
this year or one that just looks like a second
half of last year, which is twenty plus million dollars
per and set right, would you take three years forty
(29:45):
five right now or bet on yourself to for it
could be twenty twenty five. Maybe he's a dafeoa and
it's even better and twenty twenty five mil per year
after this year if you have a big year or
maybe not, like you're just your rolling the dice, Yes,
what would you do?
Speaker 1 (30:01):
I take the security? Yeah, that's just me.
Speaker 2 (30:04):
Now that's from from the perspective of somebody who can't
wrap my brain around making that kind of money. But
there's there's a degree of security that the three for
forty five offers me that I'm not turning down. Yeah,
but I yeah, how well can you sleep at night
thinking about what could have been? Especially if you do
end up having this you have that year and.
Speaker 3 (30:24):
Yeah, if you go out an opening day against Tampa
and get two sacks, you are immediately a bargain. Yes, yes,
you're like already you're like, no, you know, but I
mean that's that's the game. Like, that's the kind of
an offer the Bengals are in a position right to
make to Miles, Right, make him make a decision if
he wants the security or if he wants to try
(30:45):
to bet on himself, and.
Speaker 1 (30:46):
Maybe they get a deal done then.
Speaker 3 (30:48):
But I just it's it's an he's the most He's
an interesting one in that respect because you can go
in on early on him and and and maybe save
some money on the fact that you are offering him
this because there's a good chance that he's going to
be a lot more expensive next year.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
You signed the deal, you play the season, and then
you complain about it.
Speaker 3 (31:07):
Look, he has a mentor that has blazed this path.
You can just ask out of it the moment you
sign it.
Speaker 1 (31:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (31:16):
Do you believe because the Bengals when they turned down
the opportunity to pick up the fifth year option, that
was stated publicly he's a guy we do want to
work something out with long term. Yeah, so you believe
there'll be some proactivity from the Bengals to offer him
that kind of deal that he would have to make
a tough decision about.
Speaker 3 (31:33):
I think there'd be interesting. I think there's gonna you know,
I think there would be an offer that looks like that.
Speaker 1 (31:39):
Maybe I don't know, maybe it's lower, I don't know.
Speaker 3 (31:42):
I don't know specifics on what they would offer, but
I think in more of like the philosophy of what
we're talking about here. The exact numbers, I don't know
where that would land, but like the philosophy of something that, hey,
we can offer you some security, but if you have
a big season, it'll be a bargain for us, right,
And that's an interesting decision for a lot of players.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
I mean, three for forty five would put him where
among edge rushers on an annual average annual basis, I
mean not even.
Speaker 3 (32:08):
I mean it's below what the what the you know,
the top tiers of the free agent ye that we're
getting this year. It's it's in the middle. It's a
solid for a young guy in his prime. It's a
it's an okay deal, sure, I mean it's fifty million
dot yes, But and it's also right at what his
option would have been. So maybe their offer would be
less than that or spread out differently, but doesn't matter.
(32:29):
I just think the idea of are you a bet
on yourself guy, or you are a security guy.
Speaker 1 (32:33):
I think it kind of comes down to that one. Anything.
I'm a security guy.
Speaker 3 (32:37):
When you start talking about fifteen million dollars, I'm feeling
real secure.
Speaker 2 (32:40):
I'm a security guy knowing that, you know what, maybe
I can maybe I could become Trey Hendrickson two point
zero for the latter part of the decade.
Speaker 3 (32:49):
I mean, I remember, I always vividly remember I mentioned
Tyler Boyd because I vividly remember the conversation I had
with him after he signed his deal where we all
anticipated it being I think at that time around like
twelve or thirteen mil per year and he signed for
like ten. Yeah, and I remember saying, like he could
have got He's like, man making ten million dollars, and
(33:09):
I'm just happy about that. Yeah, I'm not out here.
I didn't want to haggle over a couple of this
or that I'm making lots of money. I'm happy here.
Speaker 1 (33:18):
I like it.
Speaker 3 (33:18):
Like he was very much about the quality of life
and things like that. And you know, there's so much
beaut that a lot of guys come and that's their approach,
the one that we're talking about, and so you never know,
and I think that's why the Bengals being offers that
look like that Tigers said that the franchise tag year, yeah,
right where he signed the tag and showed up and
(33:39):
was here for everything and was like, dude, I'm making
twenty one twenty one point eight million dollars, Like I
don't know, dude, I'm pretty good.
Speaker 2 (33:45):
Yeah, And if I go and do what I do
most seasons, I'll I'll get mine here or somewhere else.
I was refreshing to hear. Yeah, the classic quote.
Speaker 3 (33:54):
In Bengals media lord from Michael Johnson when he got
the franchise tag for whatever that was, and he goes,
I'm from Selma, Alabama eleven point eight million dollars, Like
it's just like, are you kidding me? Like this is
so you know, and you know Aj Green talking about
the franchise tag and his wife would kill him if
(34:14):
he didn't go playing for that money, and.
Speaker 1 (34:16):
Right, that's yeah, that's what it is.
Speaker 3 (34:19):
But I think there's a lot of because of the
situation there and then having their quote work cut out
for them, I think there's gonna be a lot of
you know, I don't know, haggling might not be the
best word. But there's gonna be a lot of negotiation
here in terms of how can they find a way
to make all this work or what they want to
work right now?
Speaker 2 (34:37):
Well, you know what I would do if I were
any one of these guys is I would take a
page from NBA Finals MVP Jalen Brunson left a lot
of money on the table and he will recoup that
tenfold and uh will be a legend for life because
of what he did to help the NBA World Champion
New York knickt win. And if these guys could accomplish
(34:57):
something similar, and it's the result of maybe some guys
making some financial sacrifices, they will be rewarded down the
road as NBA Finals MVP, NBA Eastern Conference Finals MVP
NBA Cup MVP Jalen Brunson is being rewarded in New York.
Speaker 3 (35:15):
Look, I'm just happy that you allowed me to still
come in here and be in the presence of world
your world champion.
Speaker 2 (35:19):
I try to get James Edwards to do an hour,
and you gotta cover a parade, got a parade to cover,
so there's things to do.
Speaker 3 (35:27):
But uh, you know, congratulations to you. Thanks what a
What a run. It was awesome, What a run. It
was hard between that and Carolina the next night, and
then it was hard not to look at Katie and
Elizabeth and think like, here it is, Yes, here it is.
It's happening, Like it's the same. Like I wonder, you know,
(35:47):
it's like, what do you guys think when you see
things like that? It's like, man, what you can do
for a city? I thought it was a beautiful what
Monica McNutt said afterwards, like the the love letter that
you can pen to your city and to your fans
by bringing a championship is going to be the stuff
that can be remembered forever.
Speaker 1 (36:07):
Right now, here's the chance.
Speaker 2 (36:08):
Of somebody who loves the Knicks and Bengals, but who
lives here. I have watched the Knicks through the lens
of imagine if we had something like that here. Yeah,
And I think it can happen. So I'm hopeful.
Speaker 3 (36:23):
I mean, you know what it feels like now you honestly,
there's never been a better opportunity for you to enter
the Bengals Organization director of Common Sense and director of
How to Bring a Championships.
Speaker 1 (36:34):
That's right, you can follow follow your Knicks model.
Speaker 2 (36:38):
So I'll tell this very quickly and then I know
you gotta go. But we we had a luncheon today
for some folks that we hope partner with us in
the fall, and we had a couple of Bengals legends
with us, and I had to moderate the Q and A.
And this gentleman raised his hand to ask a question
(37:00):
and he went right after my heart where he started
to compare Joe Burrow to NBA Finals MVP Jalen Brunson.
And somebody asked me, did you plant that guy? I'm like, no,
but yeah, I yes, that's that's the comp I'm looking for.
Speaker 3 (37:15):
Yeah, and maybe Joe Burrow's restructure is kind of it's not.
It's kind but it's not quite even you know, one
hundred million.
Speaker 2 (37:27):
It's in the same canon of heroes. Yes, sure, we'll
put it that way, all right. Thank you as always.
Read the Athletic dot Com Paul Danner Junior's covers of
the Bengals and the Growler Podcast latest episode with Jay
Morrison reacting to everything that was said yesterday. It's five
away from four o'clock on Moweger. This is ESPN fifteen
thirty Cincinnati sports
Speaker 5 (37:48):
Station, Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty t
Fifteen. All right, there we go. It's fine. That's Zacher
three o'clock. This is ESPN fifteen thirty. Good afternoon.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
My name is Maleger. Thank you for listening. I've you're
having an awesome Tuesday afternoon. Paul Danner Junior is here.
He covers the Bengals for The Athletic.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
Didn't cover Joe Burrow today.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
The Athletic dot com, as well as the Growler podcast,
where he and Jay Morrison broke down everything that was
said yesterday in the media availability, which was that a gaggle.
I think it was less than gaggle, less than gaggle, Yeah,
because what I mean four people's not I gaggle.
Speaker 3 (00:34):
I think of his more than four. It was a nice,
quiet little room. Didn't feel gaggling to me. Okay, yeah,
it just felt more like a little conversation, little chat,
just a chat, all right.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
Yeah, you guys broke it down in a great detail
on the Growler podcast, and Paul joins us every Tuesday,
and unfortunately no Joe Burrow to talk about today, or
we could talk about him, but no Joe Burrow to
hear from you.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
No.
Speaker 3 (00:57):
I heard you mentioned this with Tony and Austin, and
I said it myself. I said, I would just lap
up a Joe Flacco press that's right now if.
Speaker 1 (01:07):
He came in. I mean, I got to tell you,
like I have.
Speaker 3 (01:10):
I would love to just talk to Joe Flacco right
now if that's what we had to do. Sure, sure,
I mean now we could have. He was just in
the locker room like it was no, it was available.
But if he just would have walked in, I think
we all would have sat there and been like, yeah, okay,
love Joe Flacco. Press conferences the best, Yes, yeah, I'll
do it.
Speaker 1 (01:28):
Well. But that didn't happen, No, it didn't. That's okay.
Speaker 3 (01:31):
Whatever Joe was spending extra time throwing after practice, I
don't know if he was still grinding his gears a
little bit over an interception by Josh Newton early in
early in the practice, and so maybe he was out
there working on his five yard out to make sure
that that didn't happen anymore, or just it just put
him in a bad enough mood that he said, I
(01:52):
just don't want to do this. Not quite sure where
that lands, but uh punted to tomorrow.
Speaker 2 (01:58):
All right, Well, tomorrow Joe will talk today we can
psychoanalyze his unwillingness to do the press conference today.
Speaker 3 (02:03):
What would have been worse though one day of this
or he actually goes up today and he's in a
bad mood from whatever. Right, Yeah, and then we spend
the next five weeks debating his happiness again that I
don't need, I.
Speaker 1 (02:17):
Don't know, I don't need that, nobody wants.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
I mean, as much as I can lament the dearth
of hard hitting Bengals topics this summer relative to recent seasons,
I have no interest in that.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
I have no interest in that either. So this is
probably for the best.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
You had the mandatory mini camp this week, and we'll
talk about the chat you had with Elizabeth and Katy yesterday.
But has there been anything that has stood out in
the locker room or on the field this week from
your perspective?
Speaker 1 (02:42):
Not really. I mean we were there today. It was
like an hour and fifteen minutes.
Speaker 3 (02:46):
It was pretty light if you want to if you
want to get a glimpse of the type of stuff
that was going on today, big big news when we
had I believe it was called the Doomsday unit was
in there practicing field goals. It was Tanner Hudson holding,
Ryan Rico kicking and Cam Grandy snapping. This is you
(03:07):
got just in case, in case you get to a
situation where any of those pieces are hurt. They have
to know that they can execute. So they were they
were going through kicking four or five field goals. That's
where we're at with the field goals. Good three for
four for Ryan kick. You said that it was the
first time he probably kicked a field goal since his
(03:27):
freshman year in college. But he's proven that he can
do it now where he can be the guy to
get you through a game and then they go get somebody,
which is what he's looking But that's where any camp
is currently living right now.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
Has he been practicing any punting, like inside the ten
that sort of thing. Yeah, he's working onstead of just
you know hitting you know Aaron Judge Holmers through the
back of the end zone when they they're looking for
a you know, a webshot.
Speaker 3 (03:57):
I didn't get into that well today, I was really
really focused on the kicking.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
I get it.
Speaker 3 (04:03):
We'll get to that and train plenty of time to
unpack that box.
Speaker 1 (04:06):
Okay, very good.
Speaker 3 (04:08):
No, I mean outside of that, I mean they're realistically
there really hasn't been a you know, a ton all
parties that you want to see were there and accounted for.
So that was that was for the most part. Dax
was on the side for the seven on seven level
of an type stuff, but he said, he said, that's
(04:29):
no big deal. He's fine, nothing really going on there.
But outside of that, I mean, it's been just kind
of it was kind of more of the same.
Speaker 1 (04:36):
Okay, very good.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
Yesterday you had the conversation with Katie Blackburn and Elizabeth
Blackburn and I I said this after the Duke Tobin thing,
and this is no disrespect to anybody who is in
nonsports media who gets sent to cover those things. But
I like it when it's just the folks who cover
the team closely, you know, answering questions, because I think
(04:59):
you guys are most in touch with most what most
of us want to hear. So in that setting, what
stood up most about what Elizabeth and Katie had to.
Speaker 3 (05:07):
Say, you know, it's that what we've been kind of
talking about, is there The conversation sort of reflected the
themes of the off season, which is, man, there's not a.
Speaker 4 (05:19):
Whole lot to really get after here, is there in
terms of content where it could be content where we're
broaching uncomfortable topics, which we always seem to be doing
in these conversations with Katie, and there just really wasn't
a whole lot uncomfortable yesterday.
Speaker 3 (05:33):
It was like, why are things going so good here?
About how great that went? How about you know, it
was really a lot of like things seem to be
going really well. And that's the tone of it, and
that's why maybe the takeaway is a little bit of
how much it has continued.
Speaker 1 (05:50):
To do what it always does every time we have news.
Speaker 3 (05:53):
Is cycle more pressure onto this season because it just
feels in such a good place right now, where all
this pressure is now being put on this season and
then consequently really being put on Zach Taylor. And you know,
they sort of discussed that and you could feel that,
I mean, it wasn't overwhelming. They weren't going out of
their way to be like playoffs or bust or anything
(06:15):
like that. It was very you know, easy, He's treated
very easily. But I think there was a sense of
everybody here expects a really good season, and so if
that doesn't happen, there's gonna be a lot of other
questions to be answered.
Speaker 1 (06:30):
I think was the unsaid part of that.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
It was, you know, I am a fan of the
world champion New York Knicks.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
I heard that.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
Yeah, where the owner of the team, who is mostly
somebody that I've despised for the better part of the
last twenty five years. But he said publicly back in January,
we need we should make the finals and we should
win the finals. That's pretty much what he said, set
it on the radio today, which put a lot of
pressure on the world champion New York Knicks to eventually
(06:57):
get to the finals and vanquish whoever they would play
from the Western Conference. There was a part of me
that was hoping for a Cincinnati Bengals version of that.
I knew I wasn't going to get it, but I
got some implications there that they believe like, Okay, maybe
they're not going to the super Bowl, but we've we've
kind of done our thing here and so now like
it's it's kind of on Zach, it's on Joe, who
have both admitted this to go do your thing.
Speaker 1 (07:19):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (07:19):
I think they said that in their way, Yeah, I
mean it was yeah, I think in their way, there
was a like, yeah, this should be a great season.
We were expecting that. I mean, that's that's we've done
a good job. There's no glaring holes apparently, you know
that there's there's no feeling of anything's missing from this team.
(07:41):
And I think there's you know, obviously plenty of arguments
you made that that's the case. But yeah, I think
in their way, they said that this is the expectation,
this it should look like that, but there's never gonna
be you know there. It was always followed with, well,
the season's got to play out and you never know
what's going to happen, and that is fair. But I
think that's you know that that was sort of the
(08:02):
message in their way.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
This was And correct me if I'm wrong, because typically
Katie will talk at the owners meetings. You went to
the owners meetings, Katie didn't talk. This was basically in
lieu of that.
Speaker 3 (08:14):
Yeah, so that's why it was only myself, Ben Baby
from ESPN and Kelsey Comace Inquirer and Jeff Hobson because
we were the ones originally slated to talk and they
kind of changed that after we all had planned to
go out there. Yeah, and so there was okay, well
we'll have a make good for you on that. We
just want to change away the schedule went. And I'll say, like,
(08:35):
looking back on it now, I give credit to them
for the change. I liked the changes that were made
in terms of what I felt like the messages were
able to be delivered to fans by different people at
important points in time, from putting Duke Tobin out there
right after the season, which is where that needed to be,
(08:55):
to making the assistant general managers available during the draft,
which we great to hear those voices, and then having
Katie and Elizabeth here now after the promotion she got
this promotion to vice president along with Caroline, and to
have those voices here together at this point. And then
obviously the plan right now as far as we know
(09:17):
is that we'll still have Mike at Mock Turtle Soup
and everybody that's involved in that. I like that layout. Yeah,
and I would let you you know, I'm always looking
for more. I would still love to talk to people
at the league meetings if there's but there's just a
lot less news that comes out of the league meetings,
which is true, Like that used to be a real
Newsy Week. Now it's kind of the league is kind
(09:39):
of shifted away from that. It's just you talk out
there because everyone is and hopefully that will still have
something out there. But I do think that this layout
and the movement, I think it gives people the answers
that they want. They hear from different people and at
better mile posts, probably in the off season.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
So that's kind of where I was going, because it
has felt like this offsea there has been and maybe
transparency isn't the right word, but there's there's been a
little bit more information coming from the Bengals and starting
with the Duke Tobin mega press CONTI. I mean that's
the biggest one, and that needs to happen on a
on a regular basis. So is there a sense of,
(10:17):
all right, we've got to be a little bit more
forthright with information in our own way, and we have
to take a little heat off Zach Taylor, who's still
going to be the public voice of the organization or
whoever the head coach is, just because of the volume
of press conferences and availabilities that, yeah, he's going to
do his thing, but like we we kind of have to.
Speaker 3 (10:36):
Be out there as well as that. Is this going
to be the new norm? I guess I feel like
this is going to be the new norm. I mean
I think it. I haven't come across a single person
inside or outside the organization that is thought the way
things went was bad outside of obviously what that Duke
Tobin press conference turned into. Yeah, but I don't think
(10:58):
that's going to be the case going forward. Right, We've
talked about that before, Like, I just think the nature
of this season and that that had never happened for
turned that into a thing that it probably that was
way out of control. I don't think that'll be the
case when that's just a regular part of the season structure.
And so for that fact, I think that's But outside
(11:19):
of that, like I think everything has been met with like, hey,
this was all really good, and I think this is
the way that things will probably operate out. I think
it's also like at certain point you've got to reevaluate
the way you're you're talking to your fans, but also
when to talk to them and the league. The league
(11:39):
does kind of change that, like just it's constantly stretching
itself out where it's not at small like small points anymore,
and you can kind of find your own your own
lane and so I I think this is good. I
think everybody felt like it was good, and I certainly
liked hearing from the different voices at different times.
Speaker 2 (11:57):
Now one may say, well, this summer, there's no distraction,
there's no Trey Hendricks, and there's no they're obviously players
and both talked about like we've we've got some guys
we want to resign, but there's no controversial holdout, hold
in guy throwing shots like Shamar Stewart last year. When
we get back to that and those things are you know,
(12:20):
over the course of the next few years, is going
to be unavoidable. They happen around the NFL. It's nice
to not have them this year, But do you feel
like what you had yesterday sort of goes away?
Speaker 3 (12:28):
If there's no no, no, I don't think that there's
any move by anybody to have those people not out
there talking about whatever's going on. At this point in time.
There's not a ton, but I think I don't. I
think it's more about finding the time that best fits,
you know, in the new NFL calendar right now, and
(12:50):
I don't think that there's I mean, certainly you would
hear a lot from us if there was, you know,
any idea of not having.
Speaker 1 (12:57):
Something like this available still, And I don't think that's
the case.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
All are there is what you guys did yesterday, Is
that the norm around the NFL?
Speaker 3 (13:07):
No, No, not not not really, I mean, I mean
hear from all the time.
Speaker 2 (13:13):
Yeah, And I feel like there are there are teams
where I couldn't name their owner because they're never out there.
Speaker 3 (13:18):
So like a lot of markets, just by the nature
of what they are, it's there's a lot more people.
And now there would have been more people in a
normal year, but like, yeah, you know, but at the
league meetings, that's probably not a crazy site like that
in a courtyard there's like four or five media members
with a GM or with an owner because those are
the people that traveled out there. Like what happened in
(13:40):
Cincinnati is not all that far off from what happens
at the Biltmore or the Breakers or any of those
things when they go down. So but no, I think
the you know, the the access was was certainly like
that's the best case scenario for anybody on any beat
is to be able to just be able to sit
down in a room in a very conversational environment with
(14:01):
a small group of people where there doesn't feel like
there's any jumping in or it's not a super intense
it feels much more like a regular conversation with someone
at that level in this league.
Speaker 1 (14:13):
That's hard to get. I'm very appreciative that we were
able to get it.
Speaker 3 (14:17):
I wish it would have been like a year where
we had more stuff to get.
Speaker 1 (14:22):
Right now.
Speaker 3 (14:23):
It was, you know, I'll say this, and I talked
our good friend Richard Skinner. I talked about this with
him yesterday, and he was pointing out that was an
opportunity for them to take a little victory lap, and
there was none. There was no like, hey, I mean
the first my first question was basically like about how
aggressive the off season had been, and like, you know, look,
(14:45):
you guys, tod new precedent, this, this and this, it
seems like it's gone. And it was basically like, would
you like take a victory lap? And the answer was
kind of no, Like it was more of a saluting
the people around them, and they're just doing you know,
it was very matter of fact and logical, and I
guess I wouldn't have necessarily expected that from them, but
it was there with the off season that they've had
(15:08):
the decision to keep Duke and go forward with continuity
and to see that play out advantageously to them and
that personnel staff. To be sitting where they're at right now.
There was a chance for a little bit of an
off season victory lap, and they didn't.
Speaker 1 (15:22):
They didn't take it.
Speaker 3 (15:23):
Didn't like the ring of honor answer, nor did I.
I mean, but here's the thing. But here's the thing
I said, I'm not received a good answer on that
question yet, and I don't know that that I I
don't agree with that answer. I appreciated the answer. I
just answer. I didn't like it because my point is,
(15:43):
if it's about giving these guys the right moment, well
let's make sure they get a moment. Let's make alive
for the moment, right Like, if it's about giving them
them a moment, let's not make it harder for them
to actually get the moment. That was That'd be my
side of what they said. But I see what they're
saying with some of the the promotion of being on
the ballot as part of it too. But I you know,
(16:05):
I did I just disagree.
Speaker 1 (16:06):
Yeah, wholeheartily.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
But I appreciated the the relative candor with which the
answer was provided.
Speaker 1 (16:14):
And I do believe that.
Speaker 3 (16:15):
They've put a lot of thought into it, which is
what Elizabeth said. And I don't think that that's a stretch.
I just, you know, I just I don't want to
be talking about Ken Riley's and Bob Trumpy's and things
like this anymore.
Speaker 1 (16:28):
I don't want to do that.
Speaker 2 (16:29):
I have a few of the things I want to
ask you about, but that have nothing to do with
Katie and Elizabeth. And I have maybe two assignments for you, okay,
because I know there's not a lot going on. I
need I need work.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
I got two assignments for you. We'll get to that
when we come back.
Speaker 2 (16:42):
Twenty two minutes after three o'clock, Paul Danner Junior, covering
the Bengals for the Athletic dot Com has two pieces
on some of the things that were talked about yesterday,
and the Growler podcast up as well.
Speaker 1 (16:54):
He's here till four. We are here toll six.
Speaker 2 (16:57):
We have the Reds and their win last night, with
Chase Burns absolutely bodying Juan Soto. We have the Brendan
sores By issued to discuss, and a lot of other
ins and outs as well. On ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports.
Speaker 5 (17:08):
Station, Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty Traffic.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
This is ESPN fifteen thirty Moegger with Paul Danner Junior covering.
Speaker 1 (17:17):
The Bengals for the Athletic and the Growl of podcast.
I don't know. Between now and training camp.
Speaker 2 (17:24):
I'm sure you're taking some time off, but if you're
in need of something to do, I was thinking this week,
this would be pretty easy assignment for you. It's a
supplemental mock draft. Sure, why not get a big board
out for the supplemental draft?
Speaker 3 (17:37):
Can I do my supplemental mock draft? Yeah, it's just
the big X on a piece of paper. Not happening. No,
not here anyway.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
Bengals aren't taking Brendan Soresby in the supplemental draft.
Speaker 1 (17:47):
I don't see that no being a part of the equation.
I guess.
Speaker 3 (17:51):
I mean, I I never want to say never anymore,
all right with this team?
Speaker 2 (17:56):
So this team the most uncircused like off season of
all trend setting trailblazers in Cincinnati.
Speaker 3 (18:03):
How could I possibly say that it's definitely off the Okay,
I do not see that as a gift to people
like me are you kidding me?
Speaker 2 (18:11):
Look here it is. We're taking Brendan Sourcebe in the
supplemental draft. Go ahead, mo, all.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
Yours, all yours? Yeah, No, I do not do not
see that uch?
Speaker 2 (18:20):
Can I ask you from a serious perspective as somebody
who knows the league well and knows how NFL personnel
people think. And obviously every team is different, every team's
quarterback situation is different. But do you think Brendan Sorosby
will have difficulty finding teams that are really interested in him?
Speaker 3 (18:38):
Somebody's gonna take a chance. I mean there, you know,
we saw a little bit as the league, the college
game has shifted. How empty the last couple rounds felt
right as everyone just took a million tight ends because
they were the one position they feel like there were
a bunch of good ones in. It is the value
of those late round picks. While there still is some
(18:59):
that's it gets less and less. There's more and more
guys stay in school and there's less early entrants and.
Speaker 1 (19:04):
Things like that.
Speaker 3 (19:06):
For that fact, somebody's got a six round pick or
a fifth round pick, or they have comp pay, they've
got a bunch, they've stockpiles, Like, what's the matter we
got three fives next year, Let's let's start throw at
a quarterback who can sit in the background. Maybe we
can coach them up and see what we can get
out of them and whatever. Right, I mean, at that
(19:28):
position in the NFL, if you feel like he has
the tools and you can get it out of him,
somebody's somebody is going to be willing to use a
late round pick to just see what they can do.
So for me, I think that's probably where this thing,
this thing lands. There's enough, there's just too much value,
too much need to try to hit on something like
(19:49):
that that some team wouldn't take a chance.
Speaker 1 (19:51):
But there have to be teams that view the gambling
thing as a total non starter. Yeah, and I think
a lot of them would.
Speaker 3 (19:57):
I mean, I think the idea of maybe he'll be
a good quarter back with trumpet, I mean, his storyline
is going to be minimal. Wherever he goes. I think
you can put him in programs and deal with whatever
this year. You're you're not gonna be counting on him
to do anything this year. So if you're helping him
get right, you're helping him get help. He's in your system.
You got him in the whatever the NFL puts in place,
(20:20):
the NFLPA puts in place to help that stuff.
Speaker 1 (20:23):
You can feel like you can come in to the
twenty twenty seven season and see what you have for real.
Speaker 2 (20:30):
Well if when you're done with the mock supplemental.
Speaker 1 (20:33):
Tram, I'm done with that, so go ahead.
Speaker 2 (20:35):
I asked on social media last night what people enjoyed
more the Brendan Soresby era at Texas Tech the Ryan
Madson era with the Reds, which, for folks who don't remember,
in the spring of twenty twelve, Reds had made a
series of like all in moves that year, Matt Lato's,
Sean Marshall, Ryan Ludwig. They also got Ryan Madson, who
(20:56):
played one game of catch, blew out his elbow and
never pitched in a regular season game or a spring
training game for that matter for the Reds. And then
there was my favorite of all time, Antoniobrian. And this
was before I believe your full you were full time
on the beat.
Speaker 1 (21:11):
No, but I was around. I was around, Yeah, I
was there.
Speaker 2 (21:13):
So antonio'brien science with the Bengals, and it's the same
offseason they get too, but right before they get too
they started training camp in Georgetown and antonio'brien had like
a knee issue or a hamstring or something, and as
I recall, Marvin Lewis made him practice. That practice cost
the Bengals like nine million.
Speaker 1 (21:32):
Dollars did cause, no, it was the nine million dollar practices.
It is now known.
Speaker 2 (21:37):
You could do the oral history for the athletics of
the nine million dollar practice.
Speaker 3 (21:43):
I'd do a thousand words on every limping step I
saw this, dude make. I have never seen, you know
how like it was the equivalent of like, you know,
the tire drill or like the little where you're just
doing steps over the pads. I've never once doubted if
an NFL player can run over the pads in that
drill until I saw that practice where I was like, Oh,
(22:06):
I don't know that he's.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
Going to be able to do this. Why is he
out there?
Speaker 3 (22:10):
And then you come to find out all the drama
behind it of him being able to be out there
and doing that was worth nine million dollars to him
and a lot more of that makes sense. I believe
a lot some people lost their jobs over that one,
But I mean, his knee was people knew that his
knee was shot coming into it, and everybody was waiting.
(22:30):
Everybody was waiting to see Antonio. He's going to practice
today and everyone, Oh no, I was.
Speaker 2 (22:37):
There, Lindsey Patterson and I drove down to Georgetown because
like Teo was going to show up, right, And I
remember looking at her going our other new wide receiver
runs like he's got a keg of beer strapped to
his shoulders, Like this isn't I don't think this is good.
And then you came to find out like they made
him practice and so like Antonio Bryant should send Christmas
(22:58):
cards or something every year to a lot of folks, Yes,
but primarily Marvin Lewis.
Speaker 3 (23:05):
He certainly benefited. I mean it was one of the
wildest things where you just instantly knew, well, this guy's broken,
this is not there spent a lot of money on
this guy, and he is broken. And the crowds. Do
you remember the crowds that you do? Yes, I will
never forget the crowds at Georgetown during the.
Speaker 1 (23:22):
Toho Circus year. I remember that.
Speaker 3 (23:24):
I mean it was insane And the best part was
the next year. So the next year, after that disastrous
ten season, the disastrous following off season. Now in actuality
they drafted Dalton and Agent Green or whatever, but that
they were as low as they could be from a
pr perspective with their fans entering eleven because they had
(23:48):
just gotten roasted. And I remember being there at that
same place talking to Cedric Benson in one of those
little walking paths between the two fields where the previous
year was over floats with just people everywhere, and Cedric
just kind of stops me in the middle of it
and he goes, man, do we have fans anymore?
Speaker 1 (24:10):
It's like, I don't think you do.
Speaker 3 (24:12):
I mean, it was unbelievable how few people were down.
Then they ended up being, you know, a decent season
and they kind of started the track back, but it
was those two years are very.
Speaker 1 (24:23):
Vivid memories of a lot going on with the Cincinnati Bangles. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (24:28):
Yeah, and that included a nine million dollar time million dollars.
There's a little project for you. You know what I
might do it if I I'll credit you in my
my little story. If I if I can track down
Antonio O'Brien, I'm sure he's around somewhere.
Speaker 1 (24:45):
I wouldn't much money.
Speaker 2 (24:47):
I don't want to talk about the one time he
practiced and got paid nine million dollars for you.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
At this point, I would have had a book written.
Speaker 3 (24:52):
If I was him about that where sixteen years removed,
I think we can open up on it.
Speaker 2 (24:56):
Twenty four away from four o'clock Paul Danner Junior from
The Athletic and the Podcast Here till four. This is
ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station.
Speaker 1 (25:06):
Not just talk.
Speaker 5 (25:07):
This is sports with soul, sweat and swagger. Tony Pike,
Sincy three sixty Tomorrow at twelve noon on ESPN fifteen
thirty Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty Traffic on uce.
Speaker 2 (25:23):
Health TRAFFICCA see our service of a Kelsey Chevrolet Home
of lifetime power train protection and guaranteed credit approval from
their family to yours for life kelseyshev dot Com. Red's
play the Mets again tonight at gabp A for last
night's three homer blowout wins spearheaded by Chase Burns doing
Chase Burns thing. Euhaneo Suarez hit a couple of bombs
(25:44):
and the Reds took the series opener, and you know,
now they've won two out of three. Tonight they hand
the ball to Brady Singer seven to ten, first pitch,
seven hundred. Wl W Moore on that a little bit
later on Paul Danner Junior from The Athletic and the
Growler pod cast is whether US Bengals training camp begins
end of July. And I know we've talked about the
(26:07):
relative quiet nature of the off season and the things
that we're not talking about now that we were talking
about a year or so ago. Let's talk about the
extensions that could be done. Do you think that between
now in July twenty eighth, it's at the first practice.
Speaker 1 (26:23):
Yeah, that weekend. Do we believe that one of them
will get done between now and then?
Speaker 3 (26:31):
Potentially these things go a couple different ways, because it
feels like some years you get one that yeah right
before camp starts, bam, just both sides saw eye to eye,
they knocked it out. There's been a bunch of those
over the years. Logan Wilson, Tyler Boyd like I can
(26:51):
go through the line. I'm just thinking about them. This
one feels a little harder. I'm talking about DJ just
because it's more expensive and those tend to get a
little bit more into the training, into training camp and
further so, I'm not gonna say if I'm if I'm guessing,
I would say maybe it bleeds over into camp a
(27:12):
little bit. But there's a potential that it gets done.
So I mean we've you've seen around the league. I mean,
there's tons of big deals getting done right now. So
I don't think it's out of the question. But as
Katie said yesterday, you know, the quote was, we've got
our work cut out for us when you consider the
other commitments that.
Speaker 1 (27:29):
They also have.
Speaker 3 (27:30):
I mean they have five players with twenty plus million
dollars against the cap next year. It's a lot. Now,
they can do a lot of things. They can restructure
a quarterback contract. Really yeah, they can't.
Speaker 2 (27:44):
Sure.
Speaker 3 (27:45):
But that said, I think the tone used on that
suggests if you were thinking that all four of those
extension candidates were happening, you're crazy.
Speaker 1 (27:54):
Sure.
Speaker 3 (27:54):
I would say it maybe pushes the number down to
one and a half being the over under, okay, instead
of maybe two and a half.
Speaker 1 (28:01):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (28:02):
I just think that I think one gets done with somebody.
I think one of those four ends up getting a
franchise tag next year, and then I think they try
to find ways.
Speaker 1 (28:14):
Maybe that most likely Brown Chase Brown.
Speaker 3 (28:16):
It feels most likely the running back number is easiest
to handle, and so that feels like it would make
the most sense. They don't have an answer. I mean,
they'd be dependent on the draft. They don't really have
an answer for his position right now in the long run,
so it feels like a franchise tag, kick the can
(28:39):
down the road, we'll try to get a deal done
type thing. You can be surprised by that stuff, but
that's certainly what it feels like right now.
Speaker 1 (28:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (28:48):
But in if there was one, and I know I
made you do this like two weeks ago with your
your run pass or boot that you do. But if
one got done, the most likely one does feel like DJ.
Speaker 3 (28:59):
It does to me, Yeah, just because you know you're
gonna start with what feels like the most expensive the
best player. Yeah, and that's both both of those things
would be DJ.
Speaker 1 (29:10):
Now.
Speaker 3 (29:11):
I love the idea of you know, this would be
an interesting I would love to sit down and hear
Miles Murphy and his representation's.
Speaker 1 (29:18):
Reaction if they drop three years forty five on them.
Would you do it if I was them?
Speaker 3 (29:23):
You were Miles boy, I take it because think about it.
If he has we talked about this. If he has
a good year this year, he's boy mafe. Yeah, he's
the same same resume if he has a good year
this year or one that just looks like a second
half of last year, which is twenty plus million dollars
per and set right, would you take three years forty
(29:45):
five right now or bet on yourself to for it
could be twenty twenty five. Maybe he's a dafeoa and
it's even better and twenty twenty five mil per year
after this year if you have a big year or
maybe not, like you're just your rolling the dice, Yes,
what would you do?
Speaker 1 (30:01):
I take the security? Yeah, that's just me.
Speaker 2 (30:04):
Now that's from from the perspective of somebody who can't
wrap my brain around making that kind of money. But
there's there's a degree of security that the three for
forty five offers me that I'm not turning down. Yeah,
but I yeah, how well can you sleep at night
thinking about what could have been? Especially if you do
end up having this you have that year and.
Speaker 3 (30:24):
Yeah, if you go out an opening day against Tampa
and get two sacks, you are immediately a bargain. Yes, yes,
you're like already you're like, no, you know, but I
mean that's that's the game. Like, that's the kind of
an offer the Bengals are in a position right to
make to Miles, Right, make him make a decision if
he wants the security or if he wants to try
(30:45):
to bet on himself, and.
Speaker 1 (30:46):
Maybe they get a deal done then.
Speaker 3 (30:48):
But I just it's it's an he's the most He's
an interesting one in that respect because you can go
in on early on him and and and maybe save
some money on the fact that you are offering him
this because there's a good chance that he's going to
be a lot more expensive next year.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
You signed the deal, you play the season, and then
you complain about it.
Speaker 3 (31:07):
Look, he has a mentor that has blazed this path.
You can just ask out of it the moment you
sign it.
Speaker 1 (31:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (31:16):
Do you believe because the Bengals when they turned down
the opportunity to pick up the fifth year option, that
was stated publicly he's a guy we do want to
work something out with long term. Yeah, so you believe
there'll be some proactivity from the Bengals to offer him
that kind of deal that he would have to make
a tough decision about.
Speaker 3 (31:33):
I think there'd be interesting. I think there's gonna you know,
I think there would be an offer that looks like that.
Speaker 1 (31:39):
Maybe I don't know, maybe it's lower, I don't know.
Speaker 3 (31:42):
I don't know specifics on what they would offer, but
I think in more of like the philosophy of what
we're talking about here. The exact numbers, I don't know
where that would land, but like the philosophy of something that, hey,
we can offer you some security, but if you have
a big season, it'll be a bargain for us, right,
And that's an interesting decision for a lot of players.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
I mean, three for forty five would put him where
among edge rushers on an annual average annual basis, I
mean not even.
Speaker 3 (32:08):
I mean it's below what the what the you know,
the top tiers of the free agent ye that we're
getting this year. It's it's in the middle. It's a
solid for a young guy in his prime. It's a
it's an okay deal, sure, I mean it's fifty million
dot yes, But and it's also right at what his
option would have been. So maybe their offer would be
less than that or spread out differently, but doesn't matter.
(32:29):
I just think the idea of are you a bet
on yourself guy, or you are a security guy.
Speaker 1 (32:33):
I think it kind of comes down to that one. Anything.
I'm a security guy.
Speaker 3 (32:37):
When you start talking about fifteen million dollars, I'm feeling
real secure.
Speaker 2 (32:40):
I'm a security guy knowing that, you know what, maybe
I can maybe I could become Trey Hendrickson two point
zero for the latter part of the decade.
Speaker 3 (32:49):
I mean, I remember, I always vividly remember I mentioned
Tyler Boyd because I vividly remember the conversation I had
with him after he signed his deal where we all
anticipated it being I think at that time around like
twelve or thirteen mil per year and he signed for
like ten. Yeah, and I remember saying, like he could
have got He's like, man making ten million dollars, and
(33:09):
I'm just happy about that. Yeah, I'm not out here.
I didn't want to haggle over a couple of this
or that I'm making lots of money. I'm happy here.
Speaker 1 (33:18):
I like it.
Speaker 3 (33:18):
Like he was very much about the quality of life
and things like that. And you know, there's so much
beaut that a lot of guys come and that's their approach,
the one that we're talking about, and so you never know,
and I think that's why the Bengals being offers that
look like that Tigers said that the franchise tag year, yeah,
right where he signed the tag and showed up and
(33:39):
was here for everything and was like, dude, I'm making
twenty one twenty one point eight million dollars, Like I
don't know, dude, I'm pretty good.
Speaker 2 (33:45):
Yeah, And if I go and do what I do
most seasons, I'll I'll get mine here or somewhere else.
I was refreshing to hear. Yeah, the classic quote.
Speaker 3 (33:54):
In Bengals media lord from Michael Johnson when he got
the franchise tag for whatever that was, and he goes,
I'm from Selma, Alabama eleven point eight million dollars, Like
it's just like, are you kidding me? Like this is
so you know, and you know Aj Green talking about
the franchise tag and his wife would kill him if
(34:14):
he didn't go playing for that money, and.
Speaker 1 (34:16):
Right, that's yeah, that's what it is.
Speaker 3 (34:19):
But I think there's a lot of because of the
situation there and then having their quote work cut out
for them, I think there's gonna be a lot of
you know, I don't know, haggling might not be the
best word. But there's gonna be a lot of negotiation
here in terms of how can they find a way
to make all this work or what they want to
work right now?
Speaker 2 (34:37):
Well, you know what I would do if I were
any one of these guys is I would take a
page from NBA Finals MVP Jalen Brunson left a lot
of money on the table and he will recoup that
tenfold and uh will be a legend for life because
of what he did to help the NBA World Champion
New York knickt win. And if these guys could accomplish
(34:57):
something similar, and it's the result of maybe some guys
making some financial sacrifices, they will be rewarded down the
road as NBA Finals MVP, NBA Eastern Conference Finals MVP
NBA Cup MVP Jalen Brunson is being rewarded in New York.
Speaker 3 (35:15):
Look, I'm just happy that you allowed me to still
come in here and be in the presence of world
your world champion.
Speaker 2 (35:19):
I try to get James Edwards to do an hour,
and you gotta cover a parade, got a parade to cover,
so there's things to do.
Speaker 3 (35:27):
But uh, you know, congratulations to you. Thanks what a
What a run. It was awesome, What a run. It
was hard between that and Carolina the next night, and
then it was hard not to look at Katie and
Elizabeth and think like, here it is, Yes, here it is.
It's happening, Like it's the same. Like I wonder, you know,
(35:47):
it's like, what do you guys think when you see
things like that? It's like, man, what you can do
for a city? I thought it was a beautiful what
Monica McNutt said afterwards, like the the love letter that
you can pen to your city and to your fans
by bringing a championship is going to be the stuff
that can be remembered forever.
Speaker 1 (36:07):
Right now, here's the chance.
Speaker 2 (36:08):
Of somebody who loves the Knicks and Bengals, but who
lives here. I have watched the Knicks through the lens
of imagine if we had something like that here. Yeah,
And I think it can happen. So I'm hopeful.
Speaker 3 (36:23):
I mean, you know what it feels like now you honestly,
there's never been a better opportunity for you to enter
the Bengals Organization director of Common Sense and director of
How to Bring a Championships.
Speaker 1 (36:34):
That's right, you can follow follow your Knicks model.
Speaker 2 (36:38):
So I'll tell this very quickly and then I know
you gotta go. But we we had a luncheon today
for some folks that we hope partner with us in
the fall, and we had a couple of Bengals legends
with us, and I had to moderate the Q and A.
And this gentleman raised his hand to ask a question
(37:00):
and he went right after my heart where he started
to compare Joe Burrow to NBA Finals MVP Jalen Brunson.
And somebody asked me, did you plant that guy? I'm like, no,
but yeah, I yes, that's that's the comp I'm looking for.
Speaker 3 (37:15):
Yeah, and maybe Joe Burrow's restructure is kind of it's not.
It's kind but it's not quite even you know, one
hundred million.
Speaker 2 (37:27):
It's in the same canon of heroes. Yes, sure, we'll
put it that way, all right. Thank you as always.
Read the Athletic dot Com Paul Danner Junior's covers of
the Bengals and the Growler Podcast latest episode with Jay
Morrison reacting to everything that was said yesterday. It's five
away from four o'clock on Moweger. This is ESPN fifteen
thirty Cincinnati sports
Speaker 5 (37:48):
Station, Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty t
Mo Egger News
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