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June 4, 2024 107 mins
Paul Dehner Jr returns from vacation much to discuss regarding the Bengals. Plus Elly De La Cruz continues to struggle, Caitlin Clark and the idiot who decided to bet on his on team.
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Episode Transcript

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(00:00):
Fifteen thirty. What's up, Goodafternoon on my lendar. This is ESPN
fifteen thirty. Thank you so muchfor joining us. Hopefully you're having an
unreal Tuesday afternoon. We have alot to get to today. Red's win
last night. They've now won sevenout of ten. Eli Dela Cruz hit
the ball hard. Eli Dela Cruisealso booted of all in short stop.

(00:22):
We'll spend time on both. JoeBurrow made us all freak out today.
Paul Danner Junior is here to talkabout that. I've got a bold prediction
in the five o'clock hour, abold Cincinnati sports prediction. I'm not even
sure it's that bold, but it'sa prediction, and maybe it's bold.
We'll find out in the five o'clockhour. And a Major League Baseball player
who is terrible at gambling has beenbooted from the sport permanently. We have

(00:47):
to discuss also a big WNBA topic. But first, Paul's here. It's
Tuesday. We've been apart from eachother for a couple of weeks. We
have been a while. It hasbeen a while, and we show up
and things happen. Yeah, itturns out to be very well timed,
very well timed. The old Dannerjunior covering the Bengals for the Athletic dot
Com and podcasting the Growler podcast,of which I was a part while you

(01:11):
were out of town. A goodring of honor discussion. Really good.
Yeah, No, I love thatdiscussion. I thought it was great you.
I'm not gonna say that you swayedme because I was in the same
area that you were on a fewof those topics. But I think you
cemented that some of the thoughts thatI were having were correct. Okay,
and I if you know, DaveLapham gets in and the Bengals decide to

(01:37):
do the right thing, and thatfifty years put him in. I like
to think that you should be presentinghim, you think so. I think
you're leading away. I think you'releading the way. You've led the way
here and and spearheaded the MOO andthe movement. And none of his former
teammates, No, not as notas broadcast partner, absolutely not. No.
Ju for your incredible persuasive speech onthe podcast. Okay, well,

(02:01):
I'm I'm not gonna I'm gonna I'mgonna campaign assuming that lat gets in,
So hope he does. I'm gonnacampaign. Yeah, I do have a
question about that. All right,So the news of the day is really
no news. Well yeah, Imean sort of. But is there such
a thing as no news when itcomes to number nine? So Joe Burrow

(02:24):
didn't practice. This is our life, mo I get it. This is
what it is now. But here'sthe thing. Okay, So Joe Burrow
did not practice today. I'm sureeverybody listening to us knows that. And
for about an hour there was aninternet freak out. Yeah, and really
every day there's an Internet freak outabout something. There's probably an Internet freak

(02:45):
out about something right now that I'mjust not aware of. But there was
an Internet freak out, and Ithink to a degree it was caused by
how the Bengals. And I'm notsaying they did anything wrong, but when
you read, at least from myperspective, Joe's not practicing, Zach going
to explain afterwards, that's that's notregular, that's not normal. No,
And then it turned out it wasa little bit of a misunderstandings as it

(03:06):
relates to when you guys were thereversus when they thought you were there,
and the timing of that around whenJoe took a day off. Yeah,
that's that's the point made by ZachTaylor afterwards, was they've given him this
essentially the second day off of eachweek. They've they've tried not to do
more than two days in a row. And uh they previously the first day

(03:29):
had been on Tuesdays, and theycame in a day earlier this week,
and he was claiming him not realizingthat we were going to be here today
and not yesterday was part of theconfusion. And that's that's fine. I
mean, I don't I don't know. You you take people will will stand
in the corner and say no,they're lying to you, and other people
stand in the corner say I believeeverything they say. It doesn't matter.

(03:53):
You know. This was always gonnabe about training camp. Uh huh.
This was always it's not like we'renever gonna see him again, Okay to
judge. Okay, So if Itend to take them at their word today
and guess where guess we're all benext Tuesday, I'll be there right expecting
to see Joe Burrow next week andjudging it only looks. But this was

(04:14):
always going to be about how helooks in trading camp when it's eleven on
eleven and he's showing where he's atin relation to the season, whatever is
happening. If they want to givehim days off now, fine, If
that's what happened today, fine,If they're covering up something else, fine,
it doesn't really matter. We're gonnajudge it on where it looks down
the line. I understand the theinstant reaction. Yeah, I mean,

(04:38):
there's no question because this is right, this is what this is, that
what starts right. Well, yeah, and so I said when I was
just all with Tony and Austin,I'm gonna come to the to the defense
of Bengals fans who are freaking out, who are being criticized. If you're
a Bengals fan and you're freaking outwhen you read Burrow not practicing, you
mean to tell me we're not supposedto have some sort of visceral negative,

(05:00):
Oh no, kind of reaction tothat. He is a player coming off
a significant injury. He is aplayer who has a significant injury history.
He is the foundation on top ofwhich everything is built. I saw the
same thing a lot of folks did. Burrow not practicing. My heart skipped
a beat. Now then the maybemore pragmatic side of me comes out,

(05:25):
where it's like, Okay, hedid say he was gonna take some days
off, Zach is gonna talk aboutthis. There's been nothing to suggest that
anything dramatic has happened, but sure, for forty five minutes or so,
I was holding my breath. Andif you're a Bengals fan and you have
a pulse, how could you notbe doing the same thing, No question,
I mean this is and when Isay this is the life now,

(05:46):
because this is this is not justa significant injury. This is an injury
with no precedent, right, Soyou're always worried about what does this mean
because you can't say, well,look a million people have had acls and
they take these times off this timeof year is no this could be it.
This could be the one this somethingbad happened. It's always feels like
it's possible because we're just in theseuncharted waters a little bit with the recovery

(06:11):
from this injury, and so yeah, I think it's very natural for everyone
to freak out, and you should. It matters, okay, like whatever,
the possibility of this being a thingmatters. I'm not saying it is
or isn't, but I mean,you you can't sit here and say,
oh yeah, no big deal,Okay, No, we'll see what it

(06:32):
looks like next week. We'll seeif this continues. I'm totally fine,
and I would suggest do more ofgiving him the day off. Okay,
this time of year, no needto do that. I hope, I
certainly hope that that is one hundredpercent the case for the sake of Joe
Burrow, because that's that makes themost sense out of out of anything.

(06:54):
It is weird though, like ifthat was a known thing, why why
are we waiting until the practice isover to address this? And that's and
that's what I think sent a lotof us to this place where we started
to not assume the worst, butfear the worst. It felt it felt
felt different. Yeah, you don'tlike when it when it feels like this

(07:15):
isn't how this should be going rightright. Yeah, I've I've been following
this team for a long time.There's scar tissue, Okay, I've witnessed
it. Yeah, And so youknow, there was the freak out,
and then there was the admonition ofeverybody who had been freaking out, and
I'm like, dude, if you'reif you're criticizing people for sort of losing
their minds here, like you yougot to understand what we're dealing with and

(07:38):
what we have dealt with before.Yeah, I mean zich Tayler could have
said anything there after practice, right, I mean, he could have said,
look, we've we've decided we're justwe're shutting Joe down for the rest
of the rest of the camp.He could have said that. He could
have said, oh, you know, any anything. I mean, you
expect it to be currently having hisarm amputated, right at this point with

(08:00):
what we've been through, right,what we've seen around here were appendectomies and
calves, right, and risks thatwe've never seen before. Like, is
there anything that would surprise someone?No, I'm only anticipating something that is
truly obscure at this point, right, It's the only thing that would feel
like it would fit. All right, let me make sure what we're covering
all our bases here. Has therebeen anything that you have seen or heard

(08:24):
do suggest that this was anything morethan him just taking a day off.
No, No, I mean hehas participated in everything and generally looked fine.
To this point, I have notheard anything in terms of oh,
yeah, something he's doing this orthat behind the scenes about where that is
not something that I've heard to thispoint. No, if the Bengals had

(08:48):
a game tomorrow, do you thinkhe would be cleared to play in it?
Uh? Tomorrow, probably. Imean he was trying to get cleared
for contact, you know, Idon't I don't know. I mean specifically,
And so as long as the answeris to be clear to play at

(09:09):
the beginning of training camp, Iwould think sure. So as long as
the answer to that question, forme at least, as long as the
answer to that question is I don'tknow, than when you see day off,
you're even more excused for assuming thatmaybe something bad has happened. Yeah,
I mean everyone is Cincinnati, Yes, everyone should assume, right,

(09:31):
Yes, that's what it is aroundYes, right, I mean it would
be if you were talking about somebodywho's never had a problem, or we
have total understanding of their recovery andtheir injury, then fine. The unknown
should make everyone nervous every day.Unfortunately, this is the life that we
have, This is the reality thatwe have to live. Right now,
when you're talking about what it iswith Joe braw That's just what it is,

(09:52):
all right. Uh Well, Ienjoyed the freak out, and I
enjoyed the conversation about the freak out, and I really enjoyed the sigh of
leaf that we all enjoyed when weheard it's it's so funny to send a
tweet and know like, oh,this is there's no way to word this,
to make it not elicit what's gonnahappen next? And then just and

(10:13):
then just turn it off on thelist of tweets that you have said,
because obviously you were at the practicelast year when he was carted off.
Yeah, I mean this wasn't asbad. Burrowing cart, burrowing cart.
Burrow and cart is different than burrownot here. Yeah, burrow and cart.
There's there's a lot of unknown,but there's something tangible there, there's
something substantial, there's a visual,there's hard news. Didn't look good.

(10:35):
Uh. I remember sitting here rightaround this time of afternoon when I saw
I saw the tweet, I sawthe picture, and I by the show
changed that day dramatic. You know, suddenly Tony Pike's down there training camp,
you know, just to take itin the sun and it's like,
hey, kid, you gotta work. So yeah, all right, Paul
Dana Junior is here. Joe Burrowhead today off, we have other things

(10:58):
to discuss with talk about wide receivercontracts, some more. Yes, let's
do it. Paul is a goodpiece on what the Justin Jefferson deal in
Minnesota could mean for the Bengals andJamar Chase. Read that at the Athletic
dot Com or ny Times dot com. Yeah, that's right, there you
go. It's sixteen minutes after threeo'clock. I'm Mowegar. He's Paul Danner

(11:18):
Junior. This is ESPN fifteen thirty, Cincinnati Sports Station clent ICs. Okay,
it's twenty minutes after three o'clock.This is ESPN fifteen thirty on Mowegar.
Paul Danner Junior is here from theAthletic dot Com and the Growler Podcast.
Joe Burrow didn't practice today, buteverything's fine, everything's fine, All

(11:39):
is well. Nothing to see here. Jamar Chase is gonna sign his contract
today? No? No, Idon't think so. Why not? I
don't think today's today, tomorrow?No, during Mini Caamp next week.
No, I think he's gonna showup allegedly between Minichamp and training camp.

(12:00):
I don't think so. During trainingcamp. I'm betting against it. Before
the season opener. I'm betting againstit during the season. No, why
not? When are we getting there? I mean, it's complicated. It

(12:22):
was funny, you know, justkind of as I I was planning already
on writing a story about extensions andextension candidates and stuff, and the Jefferson
thing pops up, and it's like, well, I guess it's obvious.
So I kind of just in talkingto people, you know, the Jefferson
thing didn't come as a surprise.I think the race across the league to

(12:45):
get all those receiver extensions done wasis kind of obvious in retrospect now where
the word was out like the market'sgoing to change, Okay, if you
don't get in in front of thisthing, you're not going to probably like
what it looks like on the otherside it. And so you saw seven
extensions, and particularly from players inpositions that you don't normally see them.

(13:07):
And I've we documented and talked aboutit a lot, but the fifth year
option players getting a deal before theirfourth year. First former first round picks
is not a thing like it inreceivers. It hasn't happened like almost ever.
And all of a sudden you hadtwo of them come off the board,
uh with Waddell and Devonte Smith.You' even had penn a soul thrown

(13:28):
in there as another. You're allof a sudden you're seeing this, the
spike in the cap, the pendingJefferson deal, I think, I think
push some of that stuff forward.The thing that changed things is is the
guarantee money there, the full guarantee, which was eighty nine million, which
the previous high for receiver was fiftytwo. So that's the thing, right

(13:52):
and the one hundred and ten obviouslytoo. We know that's an uncomfortable area
for the Cincinnati Bengals, right,and so that is gonna be the point
that they're gonna have to work through. The Bengals have a lot of history
and finding ways to make players happyand ways outside of guarantees, because it's
how they've done every contract except forJoe Burrows. So they'll they'll have to

(14:15):
figure that out. The thing though, is before Chase said hell yeah,
I'm waiting till after Jefferson signs.Now, the Bengals are saying, hell,
yeah, we're waiting until the lastpossible minute to sign you because the
market's not changing now. No one'sshowing up and hopping. Justin Jefferson that
money was crazy and so that's gonnabe the top, that's gonna be where

(14:37):
it's gonna be compared to. So, now, what interest do the Bengals
have in going in early? Soto speak for Jamar Chase now, which
is why we kind of always thoughtthis thing would end at next year anyway,
the same way it did for ajGreen literally getting on the bus before
going to play the opener Joe Burrowliterally the day that the Chiefs Alliance played

(15:00):
to take the season last year.These big deals, things like this that
are known that probably happen they getjust ence this DNA on this team is
this kind of you kind of knowwhat it can be Chiefs Ravens. Thursday
night, September the fin as eitherJustin Tucker or Harrison Bucker is lining up

(15:22):
for the opening kickoff, you'll breakthe story that Jamar Chase has signed his
contract extension. No, no,because it'll be next year. Okay,
I think you're looking I think you'relooking at twenty twenty five would make the
most sense. I mean, that'swhat Jefferson did. And if you're Chase
saying, you know, you kindof bet on yourself, I think I
think the takeaway from this year mightbe, Wow, Jamar earned himself more

(15:46):
money. I mean, if theycan really take some of the stuff that
Minnesota and Justin Roscotti being a partof that group was doing with Jefferson,
and they can use the versatility ofthe other players's positions all we talked about
and truly augment Jamar Moore free himup more. He could be setting up

(16:07):
to have his best season, andhe could be setting up to have a
Jefferson type season with a healthy Borrowthrowing to him. So that number,
it might not look crazy for himto get Justin Jefferson's type of contract.
Next Yer said he just watched andJustin Jefferson turned down reportedly twenty eight million

(16:27):
the year before and turn it intothirty five and all those guarantees. Why
wouldn't he look at that and say, that's cool. If they want to
go to next year, I'll probablybe more expensive next year. You eluded
that, basically breaking the rule,which for the Bengals is, with the
exception of Joe Burrow, we're notsigning guys two years out of the expiration

(16:48):
date of their contract. Excuse me, and you wrote it could open a
Pandora's box for every great Bengals playerto claim they deserve the big guaranteed money
as well. Walk me through howslippery that slope could come for them if
they were to indeed go ahead andget the deal done this offseason. You
could always play Joe Burrow as theexception to the rule. Sure, always
yeah, no matter to the endof the time, to the franchise,

(17:10):
right, like you could always saythat was different franchise quarterback is different than
everybody else. He was different thaneverybody else. That's part of it.
Once you get into other positions.Any the next the next player that comes.
If you broke the rule for Jamar, why you break the rule for
me? Why can't they have drawna line organizationally prior to Burrow that was

(17:33):
pretty clear, Like they're just notinterested in that. They don't feel like
it gives them the flexibility to winand build a roster that they desire.
Things change around here all the time. Obviously post Burrow, you never know
and perhaps Burrow. Burrow's influence iscould influence then doing something different for Chase

(17:53):
as a package. We don't knowwhether this is going to end or what
they're thinking in the like truly innercircle of these conversations, but it would
be a it would be a slipperyslope because what if Cam Taylor brit is
unbelievable this year and he's all proand he's a shutdown and he's all of
a sudden he's playing like prime Durellread now what are you doing? Are

(18:15):
you? Are you trying to tellhim? Yeah, Jamar is different.
He's boys with like you gotta haveyour exception and your They've had their line,
and so this would be sort ofthey can draw the line and say,
well it's it's Burrow is his ownthing. If you go beyond that,
then I think anybody that is justas valuable as your team can make
the same contention. If that's thearea they don't want to go, then

(18:37):
they probably have to draw that linein front of Jamar Chase. I think
they can do it. I thinkthey can throw all kinds of upfront cash
in him like they do all theother guys, and they can pay him
more than justin Jefferson an average annualvalue with less guarantees and get away with
it because that's how they they cantrade the structure. And that's fine.
I think if they wait, youwill have folks who look at the t

(18:59):
Higgins situation and then say, well, you didn't pay Tea and you put
yourself in the situation where you knowit's it's not a circus, but it's
it hovers over the team. You'veput yourself in a position where it hovers
over the team. But you werewilling to do that because you were going
to pay Jamar, and then sothe Jefferson deal got done. So then
just go ahead and pay Jamar.But I you know, I think both

(19:22):
sides would, though, would seean advantage in playing out playing out this
year. Like I said, Imean, I don't think there would be
a ton of animastics. I thinkeverybody kind of thought that it would go
to the same place that I'm talkingabout now going to next year. I
think everybody befin. I mean,because it went that way with Jefferson,
and that's how Jamar wants this thingto end. I think it's okay for

(19:44):
it to follow that path. Morethan he probably would care with it following
the tea path because I don't thinkhe thinks it's going to end at the
tea path. I think he knowswhere he stands in terms of look,
he's gonna get it. That's thething I think that's the bottom of that
really matters. I never know ifanybody gives a hoot about all of these
financials, is he gonna be herelong term? Right? Nobody? Does

(20:08):
anybody really care how much money hemakes and the and if it's the greatest
value they want Jamar Chase to playwith Joe Burrow for the duration of the
time that you're a fan of theBengals, if you're listening to this,
right, that's what matters. Andto me that I don't think the Jefferson
deal I don't think changed that.It's he's gonna it's they're gonna be expensive.
You knew it was gonna be expensive. But it's very valuable to have

(20:32):
a franchise quarterback with an unbelievable elitenumber one who he hasn't you know,
chemistry, wistness. Today they startedplaying football. One more thing on this
because you know the Bengals will takesome criticism for allowing it to get to
this point. The Jamar Chase,you know, has said on the record,
Yeah, and in a in anaffable, sort of humorous way,
I want to see Justin Jefferson gethis thing done. And you point this

(20:53):
out in your piece, but Ithink it's worth doubling down on. That
wasn't just a funny viral moment.His position all along has been I want
to see what happens in Minnesota.So there's really to this point nothing the
Bengals could have done. He knewwhat everybody knew. Justin Jefferson is gonna
have such a high number, andthere's very few people in this league that
can claim they deserve anywhere near it. And you can argue rightfully that Chase's

(21:18):
production to this point does not deserveto match Justin Jefferson. Jefferson has been
otherworldly. We've never seen anything likeit in terms of that production. But
you know, I guess him,I guess guess you're talking about ceedee lamb.
I'm not in the same breath.Chase could be the only person can
say I probably could get something closeto that. So why wouldn't he sit
and wait for that number to beestablished? And then go from there.

(21:41):
He's a year behind and didn't haveto rush, so I don't. Yeah,
I think everybody assumed it was gonnago this way. Jamar is saying
that was just his speaking the truth. I mean, I don't think that
that was him spilling anything. HeHiggins got a four part piece from you,
Jamar will get how many. Iwas tempted. I tempted. I
have a whole other I do havea second part to that story that I

(22:03):
wanted to dive more into. ButI was like, I can't go doing
the parts again, Like, yecan't. Why not? I can't?
No, why not? Put there'sthe centerpiece of the off season. There
will be more written about it.I'm not titling it as a part series.
There will be more written about JamarChase. I want to. I
want to do a lot more onhow they can they can implement him to
play justin Jefferson in this offense.I do think that's a really interesting storyline

(22:27):
for this year. I wasn't gonnacall it part two. Okay, maybe
I'll do just for you so youmean that'll be well, that'd be great,
but that'll be a piece that's actuallyabout football. And not corrap not
not all the rest of it.Yeah, and speculations on numbers and markets
and caps and bowls so much.I actually do have some questions about football,

(22:52):
yes, and we'll get to themwhen we come back. Paul Danner
Junior, The Athletic dot Com TheGrowler Podcast. It is twenty eight minutes
away from four o'clock. Follow Paulon x at Paul Danner Junior. This
is ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports StationCincy three sixty with Tony Pike. Do
we want to move on? DoctorKeith Gory and Boston Elmore. I think

(23:12):
you should continue to let me keepgoing there, Cincy three sixty Tomorrow which
twelve News on ESPN fifteen thirty,Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty. Well Lifetime power
train protection that guaranteed credit approval fromtheir family to yours for life. Kelseyshev
dot com begals had an OTA today. Sheldon Rankins was there. Yeah,

(23:33):
big news. Joe Burrow had theday off. Why was Sheldon not at
the other OTAs? Because it's voluntary, voluntary, He's older, he knows
better any any Jamar Chase News andthen the five minutes that we were away,
No, okay. I. Meanwhile, the Reds and Rockies again tonight
in Denver Cincinnati, looking for aseries win for the third time in fourth

(23:55):
series. They give the bald toFrankie montas Tyle block throws for Colorado.
No starting lineup out yet. Firstpitch tonight, eight forty on a seven
hundred WLW Blake Dunn has been calledup from Louisville and the team is optioned
down to Triple A Nick Martini PaulDander juniors. Here from the Athletic dot
Com. How many more Ellie takes? Like you have to have one a

(24:18):
new one every day? Is thatlike a thing that you have to be
doing right now? Is every day? We have to make a broad brush
statement about his future based on hisperformance from the evening. I've got a
new one later, Yeah, thatI think might be my last new one.
I don't know what's more difficult,Like if you have I talked to
soccer announcers about Lucho Acosta and Igo like, do you kind of run

(24:42):
out of superlatives? Do you runout of adjectives? We could do this
with Joe Burrow, right, likedo you just run out of things?
To say because he's just consistently great. Is that more difficult than talking about
Ellie de la Cruz and the Ellieroller coaster where for a month he looked
like the greatest baseball player of alltime and then the next month it looks

(25:03):
like he never played the sport before. I don't know what's more difficult.
No, it's it's so any ofthese young players where you're so counted on
to just pass the development stage andget no aim, get absolutely no pass
on it. You know, it'slike you're you're not allowed to have struggles

(25:27):
to develop if you just go back. I always love doing this, Like,
can we just go talk about historicallike people that have gone through the
same struggle where you're talk about baseball, football, whatever, where oh,
the first year or two there thisand then you see year three, you
typically see this jump at this point. Nobody gives time for that anymore,
Like nobody gives time for that.Like the idea of Ellie playing at the

(25:51):
level he did at that first monthand then having a bad month is something
that so many young players. That'sthe next step. Okay, now you're
seeing a month where he can doit well and then has a month off
and then and then you get theselonger streaks and then that that bad part
gets whittled down a little bit moreover time, and you either take that
jump or you don't. I mean, I always go back. Always think

(26:12):
about Todd Frasier, Right, hewas like twenty six and all of a
sudden it just clicks right, andhe's just hitting bombs and and he's this
beloved player and having these great seasons. And I'm not comparing the two,
but I'm just saying like it cantake a lot longer for some guys,
and he you, these guys wouldgo through at bat after at bat for

(26:33):
thousands of at bats, and theminers, yep, much less having to
come and go through this at thebig league level and be capable of having
a month like you at the bigleg level. It's just I hate,
now, this is the person whowas certainly accused of a lot of things
Jamar Chase's training camp as a rookie. But for that reason that experience really

(26:56):
cemented we just everyone needs to backoff in the constant analyzation of every day
and every week. As Okay,I've decided this now about a prospect,
a hot top prospect. You know, it's it's unfair. Yeah, it's
I mean, it's why I wishhe was on a better team. Because

(27:18):
the fact that they haven't been goodin quite a while, and the fact
that he is the central figure inthis large collection of dudes who are supposed
to make the Reds better, hestands out. I wish he was on
the sort of team that was sogood that he could be allowed to just
assimilate and he's going to be apiece, and he's going to be a
cog, but not everything has torevolve around him. This the way the

(27:41):
team is constructed right now, inlarge part because of the injuries it has
taken on a Ellie has to carrya larger load than he's capable of.
Dynamic, Yeah, and that justintensifies the scrutiny on him, which is
not fair to him. I wishhe was on a better team so his
struggles could not hurt the team andhis successes could only amplify it. That's

(28:03):
not the case. Last year wasso much easier to tolerate, you know,
the like questions about if he's goingto be the guy or just be
kind of a messy prospect because you'relike everyone was so excited about all the
other guys. You know, it'slike, oh, McLean and Steer and
Marte and and it's okay, andit just kind of blends. He's like,
oh, maybe that one won't panout. But now because they're out,
and because he has played levely has, it becomes so much more the

(28:26):
focal point and conversation piece every singleday. And it's just that stuff.
I mean, it can be exhausting, you can't because you take the fun
out of just enjoying watching him.I guess in a lot of ways.
Look it in the moment, itcan be frustrating, but you signed up
for that. Yeah, like yousigned up for that roller coaster. Uh,
And I'm enjoying it. And Istill feel like there have been more

(28:48):
highs than lows. But it's it'san interesting it's an interesting dynamic. And
I said this on the show yesterday. I think we're in this day and
age where people are addicted to beingright, and so I believe in our
mid are Reds fans, people whoidentify as Reds fans who want to be
right so bad they're secretly and maybeeven not so secretly rooting for him.
To fail. I hate that.I hate that, well, I mean

(29:11):
and like I love it when I'mwrong about something that can make me happy.
If Ellie de la Cruz is greatand you are out on him,
wouldn't you love to be wrong?And I think there's a you talk about
a minority, but a vocal one. I think there's a vocal minority that
is reveling in the fact that he'sstruggling now to throw it in the faces
of those of us who think he'sgoing to be great. Yeah, And

(29:34):
that's just part of that's part oftoday's day and age of the way sports
are looked at it. It's notsports every yes, he's looked at this
way. It's just how loud andabsurd can I be about my opinion and
just waiting for the first instant possibleto express it even louder if if it

(29:56):
looks like it may be right,and no account of if it was wrong
and thought and I that that whole, that whole part. It's kind of
it goes back to the Burrow conversation, like we don't have to freak out
about today. Guess what we'll findout next week. We'll watch in training
camp this whole thing is a longprocess that we should be judging when it

(30:19):
matters, and I think in whetherit's Burrow leading into week one or in
the middle of training camp, orEllie judging his whole season. And if
you see the big jump that youexpect to see by the time we get
into September, then I think thatto me is what you need. But
you're never you know, that's notwhat it is like. That's you're never

(30:41):
gonna You're gonna ever see patience.It's quarter to four Paul Danner Junior on
the Bengals at the Athletic dot comand the Growler Podcast on Twitter slash x
at Paul Danner Junior. A fewmore things to get to, including a
good piece in The Athletic about somethingthat I kind of hope doesn't happen.
Next on ESPN fifteen thirty cents atEyes Sports Station, the pickup Truck Christ

(31:02):
that's with Paul Taylor Junior from TheAthletic and the Growler Podcast. Joe Burrow
had today off. He did weleave it at that? That's it.
Nothing to see here. Next weekis a mandatory mini camp. Yeah,
what's interesting about next week? Giveme one or two things. I think
that you I you'll get the closesttaste to some of the training camp stuff,

(31:26):
a little bit more of a realseven on seven, eleven on eleven
trying to test people. Yeah,you know, not a lot, but
the little taste for which we don'tsee much of around around here this time
of year. And I think thatcan mean something for people like well for

(31:47):
Burrow, if you assuming he practicesand throws, obviously he's going to be
the centerpiece of judging every every throws. We just discussed in the last segment
whether you should or shouldn't, Butthat's part of it. People like Dax
Hill, some of the young players, Burton like a lot of it.
Where where are the rookies at?They've they've thrown a lot at these guys

(32:07):
and cycled new stuff through. Okay, let's redo the first week's stuff again
and we'll see where you're at.So when time you show up for training
camp you can truly be judged.Well, they have one chance before that
to kind of do the last kindof test on some of these rookies.
How much did they take in whereare they at with understanding everything? And
so you can get some of thatstuff next week. But I think it

(32:30):
gets this time of year, specificallywith this team, gets so overblown,
like none of this stuff is,in their eyes, truly changing much,
and it's just about setting a foundationfor what they do. In August,
a bunch of your colleagues at theAthletic Canvas people around the NFL about this

(32:53):
NFLPA proposal that would dramatically reshape theoffseason. We would basically get rid of
OTAs and then slap on to lateJune early July a ramp up to training
camp, which would effectively lengthen trainingcamp, so you'd have more time,
a longer stretch of uninterrupted time away, but you would basically be lengthening the

(33:15):
season. Is there anybody who's infavor of this. I'm yet to meet
them or talk to them. Imean, it's really hard to find somebody
that thinks this is a good idea. There's just there's so much advantage to
having that break where it currently is, for for players, for staff,

(33:42):
for anyone that works in the league, and that there's are the people are
that are affected by this, Okay, and and so the league needs the
time where everyone has summer, kidsare out of school, families. Do
players not have kids in school?Like? Is that not? Those people
don't matter? I mean that's partof this too. Ingreatied. Sure,

(34:04):
and guess what all this voluntary Guyscan choose to skip that too if they
want to and still have both.I mean, I just think there is
nobody that I've really found that thinksthat this will fly or is anything other
than some kind of a weird partof a bigger picture negotiation with this,
with the floating of the eighteenth gamething that Roger Goodell did and all that

(34:27):
off the field stuff that I knowpeople really love hearing about why you love
it's why you love sports. Yeah. Is Evan McPherson going to get a
contract extension this offseason? I thinkso he would be. He would be
a top candidate. I would thinkprobably one year left. Noah, Yeah,
he's like the one guy. AndI mean the template there's these Kicker

(34:50):
deals have been done. It's notover the top. They have money.
It would seem like an easy thingto do. Last year we saw I
want him to reset the Kicker market. Know he reset the Kicker market.
I'm obsessed with this. He deservesit. Let's put McPherson versus Tucker numbers
up on the screen. Right now, let's break it down. I want
to Kicker guarantees need to be atopic. I mean, I just come

(35:16):
on now, Yeah, Evan needsto hold out until he gets second year
kicker guarantees. Okay, I actuallyjust talked to Evan today about if he's
practicing his tackling really because of thenew role, the new rule in Kansas
City's like, look, Justin Reidmight be kicking something for us. Yeah.
I actually talked to Logan Wilson becausehe kicks every once in a while

(35:37):
in practice, like on Fridays.He he kicked in high school. I
was like, would you be theguy? Yes? And he was like,
I mean we joked about it hasn'tgotten to that point yet, but
you know you're gonna that is realthat the new kickoff is going to have
the safety valve potentially involved more often. Evan did specify he is not practicing
tackling at any point in the nearfuture. Okay, good, Okay,

(36:00):
So not counting on him, butI am really interested in the preseason,
but really, when the games begin, to see how this gets executed,
implemented, and how teams approach it. The Kansas City's got a lot of
run because of what they may dowith Justin Reid. But that's a really
fascinating storyline, and I'm excited they'redoing this because now the kickoff is an

(36:22):
actual play that I have to payattention to him. I am, I
love most fascinated with somebody like DarrenSimmons and especial teamers in general. They've
been they've been giving, they've beengiven just a blank slate. Yeah,
there's no technique, right, that'sbeen there's no history really outside of whatever
we're making of the XFL. Likethe athletes a little different here. It
can be a game changer, andso I think the way it looks in

(36:45):
the idea in these coaches heads,and the way it looks in preseason and
even in week one and two couldbe very different than what we start seeing,
where you could see by week ninethe whole league see stuff and is
changing their philosophy, you know,one hundred and eighty degrees because you're seeing
success with something that one team triedand another team had success with. So

(37:06):
it's it's a really fascinating thing.And I think the process of everyone that
you know, the people I talkto you about today are sort of like,
yeah, we're all kind of inthe brainstorming portion of the program of
like what if we did this,what if we did that? What type
of player do you need? Andit's that they need they need more bigger
players. They like smaller wiggle guysare going to be less a part of
the kickoff, the kickoff for turngame on the line because it's so much

(37:28):
more about you know, stacking andshedding one on one and stuff like that,
and the little guy isn't going tohave as much of a role.
Does that eliminate a receiver position onthe back of your roster? Does it
you keep extra tight ends? There'sthere is ramifications all over the place,
and that they're all every team iskind of weighing right now and kind of
starting for scratch. And we geta landing zone in the NFL. Love
landing zone. Love landing zone,man, the graphics landing zone could definitely

(37:52):
be a very sponsorable ground I justI mean, look, you cover the
sport as fans, we obsess over, but there are very casual fans for
whom they put the NFL away whenthe Super Bowl ends and they're gonna turn
on that first game and teams aregonna be lining up for the opening kickoff.
Oh boy, yeah, it's gonnabe it's it looks jarring, like

(38:13):
I think, like my wife,right yeah, like the first time we
sit down that first Thursday night gamethe NFL. She likes to watch football,
but she's not following rule changes,And so we turn that game on
that first Thursday. It's Ravens v. Chiefs, and she's gonna look at
me like, what on earth arethey doing? What is happening? I've
already boned up on how to explainit to her. It's gonna be terrific.

(38:35):
It's gonna take some time, itis, because it's gonna be takeings
to watching the preseason. I don'tknow. Give me, give me kickoff
returns man, Yes, give mekick off football plays. I'm all about
it. Do you think more teamswill use their good players on that play
instead of not using them like we'vehad? I think so. I think.
I think certainly early on as theytry to figure out what it is

(38:57):
and what it can be. Ithink because I think they're scared of it
too, right, Like, arewe gonna get burnt? On kickoff returns
over and over again. If wehave backups in there, they can't make
place. Yeah, it's it's there'sa lot of learning that's gonna happen.
It's gonna be a critical preseason forit, for sure. I can't wait.
I'm all about I'm excited. I'mall about it. All right,
next week you'll join us from aftermini camp. Yeah, I hope oh

(39:22):
Burrow takes a day off. Isay that note. We just we just
need him because it's I'm selfishly Yeah, looking at this, he just needs
to go out look totally normal nextweek because the worst case scenario is he
doesn't take part. And now we'vegot all summer until we get to July
twenty seventh for people to worry andspeculate, and then you'll see him in

(39:45):
the street and will be questioning didhe was he? Was he flexing his
wrist getting getting like a sandwich atthe deli? We're gonna. I don't
want to. I just can't.I can't. Paul Danner Junior, The
Athletic and The Growlar Podcast, thankyou, four o'clock, fifteen thirty.
Of course, I'm Christine Lacy,a lifetime suspension from Major League Baseball for

(40:07):
padres infielder who took a Peter marcanollfor betting on the scot plays bets on
games in twenty twenty two and twentytwenty three when he was with the Pirates
organization. While commission Rob Manfred's gotconcerns with gambling, they're not enough to
end Baseball's partnerships with gambling operations andthe money made from them. ESPN MLB
insider Jeff Passing to me, ifyou're really that concerned that this is a

(40:30):
top priority of yours, then you'regoing to do everything you can, including
getting rid of partnerships with these companies. But the league has shown no inclination
to do that, and they're happyto throw the players onto the bus.
And I understand that because the playershave free will. Jeff Passen on Freddy
and Harry. San Francisco's Christian McCaffreyhas again reset the NFL running back market.

(40:52):
Signed a two year extension. ESPN'sAdam Schefter reports, averaging nineteen million
dollars a year. Receiver Brandon Ayuxikian extension absent from the start of mandatory
Mini caamp. Today, receiver CDlamb a no show for the start of
Cowboys Mini Caamp. He's looking foran extension as well. Hey, it's
your resident Super Bowl Cheap Chris Kennedycoming on Wednesday. As Mini caamps continue,

(41:15):
I'll give you my biggest story linesthat I'm paying attention to. It's
unsports been like six am Eastern righthere on ESPN Radio, ESPN two and
ESPN You. This report is sponsoredby e Bay Motors. Weger. Thank
you so much for joining us.Hook You're having an unbelievable Tuesday afternoon.

(41:38):
Awesome stuff. Excuse me from ourguy, Paul Dayner Junior on the Bengals
Red's win last night, which we'regonna jump into. And we've had a
dude who has been banned from baseballfor gambling. I'll spend some time on
him. Plus Brendanman and Jones onbaseball. A bit of a bounce back
night for Ellie de la Cruz.I think we are we are obligated to

(41:59):
talk about Elie dela Cruz every singleday, which I'm cool with because I
like talking about Ellie de la Cruz. I also like talking about Joe Burrow,
so U Joe took today off,which he said he was going to
do when he first chatted with reportersa few weeks ago. And I am

(42:19):
going to perhaps be naive here andassume that there's nothing beyond what meets the
eye. There's nothing nefarious. They'renot hiding something. The reality is he
is a player coming off a significantinjury, an almost unprecedented injury. He
is the central figure to this franchise. He is the foundation on top of
which everything is built. But lookthere, I don't know if there's a

(42:45):
question about him starting the season healthy, but he is still not yet one
hundred percent back, And so itstands the reason that understanding that, plus
hearing what he said about taking daysoff, that he's going to skip a
day or two, and maybe theskipping of the day or two has a
connection to him dealing with discomfort orpain or something that he's not compelled to

(43:07):
disclose and not obligated to disclose.But when he said he was going to
take days off, well, Ithink we all nodded along and said,
yeah, that makes sense. Andso he took a day off today and
yeah, that makes sense. Andhow it was communicated might have been a
little bit weird, but at theend of the day. This doesn't feel
like anything worth losing your mind over. Except here's the thing. As fans,

(43:32):
well, first of all, wereemotionally invested. Secondly, we've got
history. We've got history that goesback before Joe Burrow. We've got history
with Joe Burrow. To be aBengals fan. And I know there are
a lot of fans of a lotof franchises who love to romanticize over how
they're always waiting for the other shoeto drop, or how bad news is

(43:57):
always lurking around the corner. Maybethis is something we shouldn't just limit to
the Bengals. Maybe it's something weshould extend to all of Cincinnati sports.
But if you are a weathered Bengalsfan, if you are a Bengals fan
who has been a disappointed time andagain, who has had the football pulled
out from underneath you as you goto kick it like Charlie Brown any number

(44:21):
of times, I think you couldbe completely forgiven for maybe freaking out a
little bit today. There are somefolks, including some people who work at
this radio station, who would lookdown their noses at you. See,
you shouldn't freak out, or youmight find some folks who have long forgotten

(44:43):
what it's like to actually care aboutwhether a team wins. Who thinks it's
silly that you would spend time ona Tuesday late morning or Tuesday afternoon refreshing
social media or maybe even declaring publiclythat you are fearing the worst. For
those of us who have lived throughthe ups and downs with this franchise,

(45:04):
and for those of us who understandJoe Burrow's importance, and for those of
us who understand what Joe Burrow hasin his history, if you weren't freaking
out just a little bit today,I question whether you even have a pulse
Like I did what many did thisafternoon, and I did what I'm guessing

(45:27):
if you're a Bengals fan you didtoday. Now, maybe you didn't break
into tears, maybe you didn't cry, maybe you didn't lose your mind,
maybe you weren't completely and totally incapacitated. But you mean to tell me,
knowing that Joe is coming off withsignificant injury, knowing that he does have
significant injury history, and armed withthe body of work that this franchise has,

(45:55):
which is just littered with bad luck, you mean to tell me you
saw or heard that news today andyou didn't feel at least a little unease,
a touch of anxiety. Maybe youdidn't dramatically assume the worst, but

(46:19):
you mean to tell me you didn'tentertain the possibility of the worst case scenario
unfolding. If you're a Bengals fanand you dealt with that today, not
maybe full blown panic, but perhapsjust a little unease. Unease comes with
uncertainty, And for about an hourtoday there was at least some uncertainty.

(46:44):
As it relates to Joe Burrow.Your head might have been telling you,
hey, look the injuries. It'sstill kind of lingering here. He's coming
off an injury, he had majorsurgery, he is coming back. That
process is still ongoing. He saidhe was going to take days off.

(47:06):
Logically, this is not that bigof a deal. That might have been
what your head was telling you.Oftentimes in life, the heart wins out
over the head, your heart ormaybe even your gut. We're saying other
things, Oh boy, here wego again. Hey, I've heard Hey,
this is not that big of adeal, and it turns out to
be one. And then there wasjust the uncertainty of the whole thing,

(47:29):
which is nobody's real fault. Idon't really expect Zach Taylor to know when
the media is and isn't there,And frankly, I don't think it's his
obligation to know when the media isand isn't there. But if you're a
Bengals fan and you were kind ofconcerned and maybe even on the verge of
a full blown freak out today,I can understand. Because I was doing

(47:53):
the same thing, I could totallyunderstand, And so like, if you're
gonna if you're gonna do that asa reaction to the reaction to Joe Burrow
taking today off man cut people,some slack cut fans, some slack cut
cut. If you have a coworkerwho today, maybe it was at lunch,

(48:15):
or perhaps it was in the officeor wherever you work, and they
were marginally obsessed with getting a JoeBurrow update, Like, can you blame
them? They They root for ateam that at times has felt like it's
been snake bitten. The most importantfigure on that team. As a guy

(48:37):
who has played four NFL seasons,two have ended prematurely because of injury,
He's also had some pretty freaky stuffhappened to him. Like like an appendectomy
that took place right when training campsstarted two years ago. Didn't have the
appendectomy during the spring. Didn't happenduring OTA's, It didn't happen in the

(49:00):
middle of March. Happened right whentraining camp was starting. You've got a
guy who last season, second dayof practice during training camp pulls up lame
with a non contact calf injury.Like we all love Joe Burrow and understand
his importance. Dude has either beenthe victim of bad luck or some unfortunate

(49:22):
circumstances, or he just might bea guy that bad things seem to happen
to. Until that is no longerthe case for an extended amount of time,
the natural reaction to stuff like yes, he's coming back from an injury
and he's taken a day off isgonna be a little extreme. Like,

(49:44):
I am completely with you. Ifthis morning you saw that news, maybe
we shouldn't have feared the worst,but we had to at least entertain the
possibility of the worst case scenario unfolding. How did you not freak out just
a little bit today? So youknow, my buddy Austin, I love
him the death. He was likebig time mad because Bengals fans were freaking

(50:08):
out. Uh. I don't knowhow if you're a Bengals fan with a
heartbeat and a pulse, who's drawingbreath, who's not buried six feet under,
I don't know how that didn't raiseyour antenna today, not all day
long. You know, basically,Zach Taylor, we'll play the audio later

(50:30):
on. You know when he saidwhat he said, You know, it's
just a day off, no bigdeal, bit of a miscommunication regarding you.
Knowing you guys were gonna be heretoday. We all sort of stood
down, took a deep breath andrelaxed. But I'll do a lot of
things. I'll be critical of alot of things, not gonna look down
my nose at someone who was doingsomething that I will admit to doing like

(50:54):
legitimately, man, I'll be Igot here today, I went downstairs to
get a sandwich. I looked atmy phone. There was the tweet from
Paul Burrow's not practicing. You meanto tell me your mind didn't go to
a dimly lit place Mine did?Now, Okay? Then I thought about

(51:19):
it. It's just it's just OTAs. It's probably gonna take some days off.
Nobody, nobody down there in theknow is is losing their mind.
I texted somebody who's inside I trustany reason to think this is more than
a day off. No, butyeah, man, for a few minutes

(51:40):
as that's kind of freaking out.And if you're a Bengals fan, I
gotta be honest with you. Idon't know how you weren't. And if
you weren't, that's okay. Maybeyou're a better emotionally wired than I am.
But if you know what we knowabout this quarterback and his health history,

(52:02):
and you have the history that manyof us have with this franchise,
hell yeah you freaked out even justa little bit. Your thoughts are always
welcome at five when three seven four, nine, fifteen thirty and eight six
six seven oh two three seven sevensix, And I'm just gonna give you
a piece of advice. This isreally less about the Bengals or Joe Burrow

(52:22):
or football. This is about life. There are times when you could be
having a little bit of a meltdown. You know what, you don't want
to hear. You don't want tohear Everything's Everything's gonna be fine. You
know. I'm a I'm a bigUC basketball fan. Chances are you know
that right? And I'm at thatgame in Nashville in twenty eighteen. I'm

(52:45):
in the stands and they're blowing atwenty two point lead, and when Nevada
cut it to like eight, Istarted to viscerally freak out. And by
the way, justifiably, so maybemore justifiably than anybody freaking out over Joe
Burrow today. And I'm like TaronBland's dad was sitting behind me. He

(53:05):
could tell I was like full blownpanic. I know how this is gonna
end. And this guy like grabsmy arm and I'm not like bothering anybody,
but he grabs my arm and he'slike, not even a UC fan.
He's there to watch? Was aFlorida State fan? Is there to
watch Florida State play? Xavior,dude, It's going to be okay.

(53:27):
When somebody's freaking out, what theyoften don't want is it's going to be
let them go through the process,right, let them know. I was
watching a Knicks playoff game when theywere playing the Sixers. They won that
series, but they blew Game fiveand they blow a lead and it goes
to regulation or it goes to overtime, end of regulation, and like a

(53:50):
guy who's not watching comes up tome. He's like, oh, dude,
they're fine. You're freaking out forno reason. Somebody who's having a
freak out rarely wants to be toldnot to freak out. So, you
know, come off the high horsea little bit. You know, Hey,
let's let people have their moment.And as Bengals fans from about what
eleven forty five to twelve twenty today, we had a bit of a moment.

(54:13):
Some of us talked it through witheach other but didn't need the outside
you know, admonition. Hey,you're freaking out over nothing here, you
know what, let me freak outover nothing, thank you. Twenty one
minutes like we all know that guy. You're in the middle of a moment.
Eh, Hey, it's nothing toworry about. Okay, Well I

(54:34):
feel like worrying about it right now, so leave me alone. Twenty one
minutes after four o'clock five point threeseven, four nine, fifteen thirty is
our phone number. Reds had somethingthat was quite welcome last night, not
just a victory, but a certaintype of victory. Ellie de la Cruz
and many of his teammates hit theball pretty hard last night. We'll spend
some time on that and Ellie comingup on ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports station

(55:00):
espre in the Olympics on radio inParis? Paris is what six hours ahead?
Are we getting bumped? Do weget two weeks off during the summertime
for the Olympics to carry the Olympics? Polly still get paid. I wouldn't
mind that. What Olympics sports areradio friendly? Obviously men's and women's basketball.

(55:23):
What other Olympic sports like urt soccer? Soccer's radio friendly? Track and
field meats? Swimming? How doyou call a swim meet on the radio?
I went to college with a guyand he did this very briefly.
He was the voice of the Universityof Hawaii volleyball team. You talk about

(55:46):
a good gig. He had todo like eight other things on the radio.
Volleyball on the radio. I guessyou can carry volleyball on the radio.
How do you call a swim meeton the radio? I mean like
primetime in Paris would be like,you know, eight nine o'clock, that's
when we're in our local programming window. Are we getting a two week break

(56:09):
where we don't carry shows, sowe can carry track and field, by
the way, my favorite sport.Check and make sure Tarren see of team
handball. I have one annual orI guess every four year Olympic take that
it is a travesty that the UnitedStates of America isn't better at team handball.

(56:32):
How do we not get the bestlike ten athletes in the country and
send them to wherever the Olympics areto dominate the world and team handball?
By the way, team handball radiofriendly. Team handball is radio friendly.
It's basically soccer, except you couldthrow the ball and they play it like
on a basketball court. I meanit looks like something that you would excel

(56:58):
at in like fourth grade gym.How are we not better at team handball?
We don't even need team handball players. Send Lebron James, send like
Tim Tebow would have been an awesometeam handball player. Send Travis Kelsey like
dudes like that. You need someguys who are built pretty good. How
are we not better at team handball? My daughter's moving into the second grade.

(57:22):
I think they played team handball inschool. How do we I mean,
I don't even think we qualify forthe Olympics and team handball. And
I bring this up because I broughtit up the last time we had the
Summer Olympics, which was it wastwenty one. If I'm not mistaken because
of COVID, my Olympic take findout, Taran. If we're getting two

(57:45):
weeks off to carry the Olympics,it just doesn't seem like many Olympic events
would be that radio. Like we'regonna carry weightlifting events, Oh no,
that'd be interesting, Greco Roman wrestlingon the radio, Archery, archery on
the radio, Batman, I mean, you're gonna carry like like I can
understand, like the one hundred meterdash, that would be a good radio

(58:07):
event. It lasts ten seconds.But like the four by four hundred relay,
we're gonna put that on the radio. What about the longer like track
and field events like the five thousandmeters or something like that, right,
or like the hammer toss. Yeah, I don't even really know what the
hammer toss is. I just knowit's one of the track and field events.
Right. Well, we blew thatsegment. We have to get back

(58:29):
on time, and then we'll talkabout the Reds in their win last night
Ellie de la Cruz. We spenta lot of time yesterday discussing whether or
not Ellie should be sent to Louisville. And no, he shouldn't be sent
to Louisville. I feel sorry forI feel sorry for Ellie de la Cruz.
I'll explain why coming up at fiveoh five. I also have a
bold prediction, a bold Cincinnati sportsprediction. I have yet to talk about

(58:52):
Caitlin Clark being given a hard timeby her WNBA competitors. And then we
have to spend some time on thisidiot who's been ban for baseball for being
a terrible gambler on baseball. Asyou can tell, we have a lot
to get to and we have totake your phone calls. Five point three
seven four nine, fifteen thirty,it's twenty nine away from five o'clock on
ESPN, fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station, Cincinnati's ESPN in fifteen thirty, Cincinnati's

(59:17):
Sports Station sports headline as service ofKelsey Chevalet Home up in lifetime. I
were trained, protection and guaranteed creditapproval from their family New Yours for life,
kelseyshev dot Com, Reds and Rockiesagain tonight eight forty. Your first
pitch this evening on seven hundred WLW. It'll be Frankie Montas against Ty Block.

(59:39):
Blake Dunn has been called up.At the time of his promotion to
Cincinnati was batting two twenty three withthe Louisville Bats. He hit three twelve
across a couple of different levels ofminor league baseball. Last year with twenty
three homers, had four and justunder one hundred and fifty at bats for
the Bats. Nick Martini has beensent down. I think that would be

(01:00:02):
it for excuse me, oh,I guess the big local sports headline is
Joe Burrow had today off. Dowhatever you want with that information. Bengals
going through OTAs today. Mandatory minicamp is next week twenty two away from
five o'clock. We have a pollquestion. Thanks to our friends at United

(01:00:24):
Heartland Insurance. United Heartland Insurance,They're not gonna do to you what another
insurance company has done to my mom, which is they never answer her calls,
they never return her calls, andthey leave her in a lurch when
she is trying to find out importantinsurance information. Now, my mom doesn't

(01:00:45):
live in town, but if shedid I'd send her to United Heartland Insurance,
and I still might send her toUnited Heartland Insurance because their customer service
better than the insurance company that sheis using that doesn't return her calls,
doesn't answer her calls, and doesn'treturn her emails when she has an important

(01:01:06):
insurance question. Uhins dot com UnitedHeartland Insurance. It's about Tukupita Marcado,
who has been banned for baseball forwagering. We'll get to that in just
a second. We've not really spentmuch time on last night's Reds game,
and there's a couple of reasons forthat one. We've had a bunch of
Bengal stuff too, not that muchto say. It was kind of nice,

(01:01:30):
even understanding that games at Course Fieldare never really over. It was
It was fun to watch the Redstake a lead after falling behind one zip,
give back a couple of runs inthe third, and then score three
in the fourth, one in thefifth, three and the sixth, and
put it in cruise control with thetwo more they added in the top of
the ninth inning. They've played inso many one run games, so many

(01:01:53):
close games, it was kind offun to watch them enjoy the benefits of
a laff for last night. Itwas fun to watch him get eighteen hits.
It was fun to watch Jamer Candelariogeta have a big night. It
was fun to watch Bencer Steer havea good night. It was fun to
watch Elie de la Cruz make somehard contact, unfortunately only once resulted in

(01:02:15):
a hit his run scoring double.It's fun to watch TJ Friedel do TJ
Friedel things at the top of theorder. Was fun to watch Jonathan India
get three hits. Was fun towatch Will Benson. It's fun to watch
Will Benson hit a triple with acouple of guys on and have a two
hit three RBI night. It wasfun to watch the red score thirteen runs.
It was fun to watch Andrew Abbotttake advantage of all that and armed

(01:02:35):
with a big lead in a toughballpark, to pitch in not screw around,
to give the Reds six innings.Game two of the series is tonight.
Tony Pike asked me this off airor on air during Sincy three sixty
quick hits and locks of the night. Realistic goal to get back to five
hundred by the end of June.And my response was yes, to that

(01:03:00):
point, I really hadn't considered howmany games the Reds have remaining in June
or how many games under five hundred. Last night's win put the Reds at
twenty seven and thirty three, sothey have one hundred and two games to
go. They have twenty four gamesremaining this month. To get back to
five hundred, the Reds would haveto win fifteen of their remaining twenty four

(01:03:22):
games. They'd have to go fifteenand nine the rest of the month,
which is six twenty five baseball.That's really good. So to answer the
question, hell, yes, Ifif you're signing me up for the Reds
to go fifteen and nine and therest of the month, add that to
what they've done over the last tenthat would mean the Reds will have gone

(01:03:43):
twenty two and twelve over a thirtyfour game stretch. That's really really good.
So Number one, it kind ofillustrates how much of a hole they
have dug themselves that if they gofifteen and nine the rest of the month,
which again is six twenty five baseball, they'll still just be back to

(01:04:03):
five hundred. If a team playssix to twenty five baseball over the course
of an entire year, they winone hundred and one games, so they're
gonna have to play one oh onewin baseball the rest of the month just
to get back to five hundred bythe end of June. Now, if
they're forty two and forty two atthe end of June versus I don't know

(01:04:25):
what forty one and forty three are, you gonna feel dramatically better about their
chances at forty two and forty twoversus forty one and forty three, And
probably not, but it does goto illustrate how big of a hole Day've
doug where they're gonna have to playsix to twenty five baseball for the rest
of this month after winning seven outof ten, just to get back to
even at the end of the month. That said, if they're forty two

(01:04:48):
and forty two at the end ofJune and could avoid any more major injuries,
and by then Noel ve mart tebwill be back and hopefully Christian and
Carnassi on Strand will be back,I'm never gonna even consider Matt McClain coming
back in August because I'm skeptical thatit's gonna happen. Who wouldn't sign up
for that though, forty two andforty two and those guys back for that

(01:05:11):
to happen. It's interesting this month. Next week is bracketed by a couple
of stretches where the Reds play someeasier teams. I don't think the Cubs
are very good, so i'll callthem an easier team. Right now,
they're in Colorado, They're a badteam. In the second two weeks or
the last two weeks of the month, Reds play the Pirates six times.
Pirates are not great. They playthe Cardinals four times. Cardinals, Reds

(01:05:35):
haven't played well against them this year, aren't great. They play the Red
Sox three Here the Red Sox area five hundred team. In the middle
of all that is that five gamestretch, two with Cleveland, who's really
good, three with Milwaukee, who'sreally good. You know, if they
could avoid disaster next week, youcould sell me on this team finishing the

(01:06:00):
month of June with a five hundredoverall record and being fifteen to nine starting
today through the end of the month. The rest of the way not gonna
be easy, but I think it'sdoable. I think it's doable because with

(01:06:23):
each passing start, I'm a biggerand bigger believer in the Red starting pitching.
Like again, Andrew Rabbit might nothave been lights out last night,
but six innings of three run baseballon a night like that where you're getting
plenty of offensive support could at leastkeep David Bell from having to go to
his bullpen multiple times. Like,sign me up for that. Andrew Rabbit
has been fine. He's turning intoa very He is a reliable starting pitcher.

(01:06:46):
And we've seen so much progress withHunter Green, and I love how
Nicolodolo has thrown when he has beenhealthy. They just got to keep him
healthy. Like kind of waiting forFrankie Montas to do something on a consistent
basis beyond what he has done sofar, And I'm waiting for Graham Ashcraft
to hit things into get things toanother level. But you know, Brandon

(01:07:09):
Williamson has thrown the ball well inhis rehab assignments, and there are folks
who wonder, like, is theregoing to be room for him in the
rotation? What do you do withhim? I said this yesterday. This
team is worth not bailing on.Despite all the frustration, Despite all the
disappointment, despite all the offensive lows, despite all the injuries, this team
is worth not bailing on because ofits starting pitching. The starting pitching is

(01:07:31):
still the foundation of this franchise,and it's a good foundation. And if
the guys on the mound, thestarting pitchers, stay healthy, it stands
the reason. The starting pitching isonly going to get better, and that's
really exciting. And if the offensecan catch up with it, this team

(01:07:51):
could still vault into contention. Andmaybe that sounds far fetch given how they
have played, and you know,it really does feel like still, even
though they've played better over the lastweek and a half, it feels like
they're one really awful week away frombeing totally out of it. I mean,
I hate to say that, butit sort of does. Right.

(01:08:12):
You're six hundred. You cannot afforda long losing streak. You've got to
continue to get closer to five hundred. But longer losing streaks seem unlikely as
long as the pitching holds up.Our poll question is about to Kupta Marcano,
who has been banned from baseball,and there have been others who have

(01:08:35):
been handed shorter sentences for their involvementin gambling. But the San Diego infielder
has been declared permanently ineligible for violatingMLB's sports betting rules. He made two
hundred and thirty one MLB related bets. By the way, he only won
four point three percent. He didthis while he was a member of the

(01:08:56):
Pittsburgh Pirates. You're obviously not allowedto do this. According to Major League
Baseball. He consistently wagered on parlays, some of which were the Pirates.
So the pole question I have foryou on X at Moeggar is this Thanks
to United Heartland Insurance, MLB hasa relationship with gambling companies, MLB players

(01:09:19):
are prohibited from gambling on MLB games. Do you find this hypocritical? Vote
now at Mogar, we'll talk aboutin the five o'clock hour on ESPN fifteen
thirty Cincinnati Sports station. Marty broughthim into here for trish statement. Like
me, he takes a day offin June. Occasionally run him in a

(01:09:39):
Jones on Baseball literally seconds away.Load management season, baby. Although I
am working every day this week,and it can be the case next week,
but I am here every day thisweek. Lucky you Arn and of
course, lucky you are a loyallistener. It has never been more difficult

(01:10:00):
to be an MLB rookie. Keepthat in mind when you're mad about Elie
de la Cruz and his slow progressionor his slumps, or however you want
to frame it. We'll get tothat coming up at five oh five.
And I have a somewhat bold Cincinnatisports prediction. I'm not even sure it's
that bold, but I'm gonna makeit anyway. And well, here what
Tac Taylor said about Joe Burrow's dayoff as well, but first time for

(01:10:23):
Marty and Tracy on ESPN fifteen thirtyCincinnati Sports Station Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty.
Traffic from the uc Health Traffic Center. The University of Cincinnati Cancer Center is
the region's first and only provider ofspecialized primary care services for cancer patients and
survivors. Call five one three fiveA five uc CC. Watch out for

(01:10:45):
a thirty minute slow down if youneed to travel southbound seventy one between Martin
Luther King Junior Drive and Fort WashingtonWay, and you're going to hit a
ten minute delay. If you needto travel northbound seventy five between Mitchell Avenue
and pattiad Omnicol with traffic fifteen thirty. Oh, guess what day Tuesdays?

(01:11:05):
Guess what day it is? Dudesesday? See Terren, you played that.
Last night at my house was TacoMonday. It's not Taco Tuesday at my
house word for reasons that I don'tcare to get into. Or we're eating

(01:11:25):
on the fly tonight in the Eggerhousehold. Good afternoon on my wager.
This is ESPN fifteen thirty. Thankyou so much for listening. It's the
michelob Ultra of five o'clock Happy Hour. I wish I was gonna be home
tonight and joined a nice cold mickUltra because it's hot out. There is
no better beer for what it's hotout than an ice cold mic Ultra.
Perfect for the pool, perfect formaybe sitting outside and listening to or watching

(01:11:50):
the Reds, perfect for posting upat a fire pit. There's there's nothing
better than a Miculture during hot summerweather. Grab one on your way home.
I'll get a six pack. Howabout that? How about that?
Well? Here from Zach Taylor aboutJoe Burrow's day off. We are obligated
to play that I guess I havea bold Cincinnati sports prediction, and I'm
going to answer my pole question,which is up and running right now on

(01:12:12):
social media. No, MLB isnot being hypocritical when it comes to gambling.
We talked extensively yesterday about Ellie dela Cruz. We got good and
bad Ellie. Last night. Aball at shortstop kind of ate him up.
He has eleven errors, more thananybody else. He hit the ball
hard a couple of times, oncefor a run scoring double, another time

(01:12:33):
was a flyout, but ball lefthis bat over one hundred and six miles
per hour. If you hate exitvelocity, I'm sorry. I love that
people who can play well active velocity. Like we've tracked how far how hard
the ball is coming at the hitterfor decades. It doesn't make sense to

(01:12:54):
track how hard it comes off asbat. So anyway, can't talk enough
about Ellie. And Ellie is closingin on the one year anniversary of his
call up to Cincinnati. June sixthof last year is when he made his
major league debut a memorable Tuesday nightagainst the Los Angeles Dodgers. He is

(01:13:15):
closing in on having played one hundredand sixty two games, so he has
basically played one full season of bigleague baseball. I was asked last night,
why are you so patient with him? The obvious answer is, well,

(01:13:39):
there's a lot of upside. There'sno one better who you call it
up that's better? Like what doyou got? There's a lot of upside.
The Reds are trying to develop him. He has shown tremendous flashes.
Part of gaining experience is going throughthe ups and downs that come with your
first year. Not everybody is giventhe amount of rope that a guy like

(01:14:03):
Elie Dela Cruz gets. The Redsare still very much in developmental mode.
I mean, there's a big partof me that wishes, not a big
part. Every part of me wishes. When Ellie Dela Cruz got called up,
he got called up to a readymade team that was good enough to
insulate the team and him against hisown struggles. Like wouldn't it be great

(01:14:26):
if down the road the Reds couldhave the kind of franchise that when they
call up top end prospects, allthey're asked to do is assimilate and not
stand out and fit in and justhelp continue what the team is already doing,
and then eventually maybe they become sogood that their stardom supersedes anybody else

(01:14:48):
on the team. That would beawesome. I'm also very patient. I'm
going to talk about myself for justa second, not my favorite topic.
I'm patient because I remember when Iwas given a chance to be on the
air May of two thousand and seven. At the time, I did the

(01:15:08):
show mid Days with Greg Doyle,now the Indianapolis Star, Caitlin Clark's best
friend. And Greg did the showwith me for seven months, and then
he moved on, and then Idid the show. And I had never
done radio by myself. Before.I had been a producer. I'd worked

(01:15:29):
behind the scenes. I had doneengineering, I'd been in management, I'd
co hosted, I had never doneI'd done some fill ins, did some
extra inning shows, filled in forthe angry guys. I'd be on for
a week here and beyond for anafternoon here. I never had to do
three hours a day every day.And I remember being told by the person

(01:15:51):
in charge at the time, youare going to be terrible at this,
so we're not going to go backand listen to any tapes. You're just
gonna get reps, and we're gonnahear from people in the audience who don't
want you on anymore. We're gonnahear from advertisers who don't want you on
anymore. We're gonna have a hardtime selling the show. Don't worry about

(01:16:14):
any of that. Do the show, gain experience, and then in a
year, you know what, kindof talk about where things are. Don't
worry about it. If you havea bad segment, don't worry about it.
If somebody says you have no businessbeing on, just do the show.
The best way to be good atthis is to do it every day.

(01:16:36):
I told that to Tony Pike whenhe started. I told that the
James were Pene when we launched Sincythree sixty, like, just forget doing
good shows bad. Just do shows. Get your footing, gain experience,
figure out what works, figure outwhat your personality is going to be on
the air. It should be yourpersonality off here, but figure it out.

(01:17:00):
Needis thank god, because it doesn'talways work that way. It's never
been more difficult, I think,to be the new guy in any field.
We've never been less patient, Thankfullyfor my career. Now you might
say the show still sucks, andmost days I'll agree with you, but
I know what it's like to benefitfrom people who are patient. I went
down this accidental YouTube wormhole last month. So what I was growing up.

(01:17:29):
I was a huge fan of latenight television, specifically Late Night with David
Letterman on NBC, and I sawsomething on It was May twentieth. May
twentieth was the day in twenty fifteenDave Letterman did his last show for CBS.
And I'll be honest, the lastfive or six years he was on,
I didn't really watch a ton butI saw something on YouTube and it

(01:17:51):
was like, you know, fivetwenty twenty fifteen. It was around the
twentieth of May, and it wasDave Letterman's last show, and I watched
a little bit of it, andI watched the monologue because it was a
piece of television history. And thenI thought, like, I remember when
he did his last show on NBCnineteen ninety three. I went and found
it and I remember that night likeas sixteen years old. It was or

(01:18:13):
fifteen years old. I guess BruceSpringsteen was the surprise musical guest. That
was a big deal. I lovethat show. And then you know,
how YouTube works right, based onwhat you watch, it suggests other things.
Like a night or two later,there were some early Conan O'Brien shows,
and like as a late night nerdback then, like I remember it
being really into like is this guytaking over for let him in on NBC

(01:18:36):
gonna work? His shows were terrible, and I've heard him talk about this.
They were ungodly bad, and theytried stuff that they didn't move forward
with, but there were calls forcancelation. There were people writing critical columns,
well known critical columns, and I'veheard him talk about how the people

(01:18:58):
at NBC were like, dude,stick it out. You're gonna do really
bad shows. We need you tofigure this out, but you're not gonna
figure it out overnight. Gain experience, and then once you have gained a
certain amount of experience, then we'llgo from there. It doesn't work that
way anymore, and it didn't workfor him when he moved up to the
Tonight Show. So like when arookie comes up and he's not awesome immediately,

(01:19:21):
or he goes through ups and downs, I'm really patient. And maybe
it's because of my own experience,Maybe it's because I don't know, man,
I just think it's I think nowit's even more difficult to be a
rookie than ever before, like forfor many of us. And if you're
much younger than me, maybe youcan't relate to this. I remember when

(01:19:42):
a rookie would get called up andyou knew nothing about him. You know,
Eric Davis would get called up,Barry Larkin would get called up,
and all you knew was, oh, yeah, they say this guy is
a chance to be pretty good.We weren't documenting every game the dude played
in the minor leagues. Have thatmuch mainstream press covering minor league baseball,

(01:20:05):
right, and so guys would gethere and you just you kind of you
needed to get to know them beforeyou could figure out if they were played
that they could play. By thetime Elie de la Cruz got here,
we knew everything about him, knowwhere he's from, knew his backstory,
knew what he had done, hadwatched him play, had listened to his
games the minor league's like. Sothat just that just fuels the hype,

(01:20:26):
It fuels expectation. You add thaton top of just the fact that we
have shorter attention spans than ever wereless patient than ever before. If the
dude's not good, immediately were We'reready to move on to what's next.
And like that's sort of how thenews cycle turns, right, We're just
ready for what's next. It can'twork that way with guys like this,
Like I know nobody wants to hearit. There is something about just gaining

(01:20:51):
experience. I've never played Major LeagueBaseball and never will, but man,
I've got to think there's just somethingabout gaining experience that, if you have
natural talent, has a really goodchance of eventually paying off. I don't
know if he's going to be amultiple time All Star. I don't know
if he is going to be asgood as a lot of people say.

(01:21:11):
I don't know that some of theholes in his game that are very abundantly
available are ever going to be closed. I don't know, man, but
I'm willing to be patient. AndI'm maybe more willing to be patient with
Ellie than other guys because I doknow the physical tools are there. But
I'm willing to be patient with alot of these other guys too. I

(01:21:31):
might have had more fun in likenine, even twenty ten eight with some
of those guys the Reds got broughtto the big leagues because I was willing
to be patient with Johnny Quaito.I'm willing to be patient with Jay Bruce,
and willing to be patient with evenHomer Bailey. Todd Frazier's twenty thirteen
was an absolute mess. Was willingto be patient with him. Look how

(01:21:56):
it paid off for so many ofthose guys individually. And then then there
are well, there are the exceptions. Joey Vado got to the big leagues
and could hit almost instantly, Likeyou could watch that dude and go,
yep, that guy, he's readyto go. He also played in two
thousand minor league games. Ella DaylaCruz has played in fewer than five hundred
professional baseball games. That includes thisbig league experience. Like the most ready

(01:22:19):
made player the Reds have had inmy life got to the big leagues kind
of late, played in over onethousand minor league baseball games. So I
don't know, man, I justI can't speak for you. I can't
tell you how you should feel.I could just explain myself like IM Now,

(01:22:39):
the Reds as an organization, we'vesaid this often. It's a team
that demands patients. It's a franchisethat has exhausted it and that's a tough
diconomy. Yeah, I'm looking atit right now. Joey Vada didn't play
in over two thousand minor league games. He played in seven hundred and fifty
minor league games, two hundred playedappearances. Ellie Da La Cruz has played

(01:23:02):
in fewer than five hundred professional baseballgames, as some of those minor league
games include rehab games. But youget the point. I just I'm willing
to be patient because I do believein the accumulation of experience paying off down
the road. Now, obviously thathas an expiration date. It's not one
year. Not for a guy likethis. I'm a big believer in this.

(01:23:28):
Said this about Joe Burrows rookie season. Forget how he plays, ignore
the results. Hard to do.It's really hard to do. Doesn't mean
in real time it's not frustrating.Let him gain experience. Let him gain
experience running an NFL offense, beingthe face of the franchise, going through
the weirdness of that first training camp. Lem let's just let him gain experience.
It'll pay off down the road.Boy did I'm a big believer in

(01:23:51):
that. Man, big believer init. When it comes to athletes,
I'm a big believer in that.When it comes to life, man gain
experience, ignore the short term resultssafe it pays off down the road,
and you know, it's a longerleash. If you're a natural talent.
You can't find anybody, even Ellie'sskeptics, who will tell you that,

(01:24:14):
Well, we don't think he's physicallygifted. Of course he is. He's
got holes in his game, bythe way. Also, he plays hard,
you know, I mean, it'snot an effort thing with Ellie.
He plays hard, looks like he'sgot a decent baseball like you. Is

(01:24:38):
he where he needs to be?Not by any stretch of the imagination.
I'm not saying give the guy fiveyears. I'm saying, Okay, he's
built up a year of big leaguebaseball close to one hundred and sixty two
games. Now let's see where hetakes off. It's not that dissimilar from
what a lot of us said aboutHunter Green. The first fifty starts,
ignore, ignore the results, hopethere's more highs than lows. And then

(01:25:06):
when you get to a certain point, let's see if the the performances get
better. With Hunter Green. Theyhave and maybe it's fifty starts or maybe
it's sixty. You could we're beingselective with end points here or start points
here. But still so with Ellie. Yeah, man, Like I've seen
some of the plate appearances him inChicago this week, it looked like he

(01:25:27):
had no idea what he was doingat the plate. He is a bad
two strike hitter. He has takensome pitches that I scream at the television,
Dude, swing the bat, like, man, I'm there. But
I chalked that up to he's gainingexperience. And so now let's see between
now and the end of the season. And maybe this doesn't start instantly tonight,

(01:25:54):
but between now and the end ofthe season, or now in a
year from now, or now inthe end of next year, when he'll
start to become arbitration eligible. Let'slet's see if the experience pays off,
and there will be a point whereif if it doesn't, you conclude the
answer is no, and then youfigure out what's next. Does he take

(01:26:15):
on a lesser role, does heget dropped out of the batting order,
Do they change positions, do theytrade like whatever, We're not even close
to be in there yet, andnot everybody gets his luxury. Blake Dune's
been called up. Blake Dune mightbe a fine prospect. Well, you
know, not everybody's the same.So what Blake done? Maybe the accumulation

(01:26:38):
of experience takes on a different form, But I just I know for some
it can be annoying. I getit. We want everything to happen right
now. Our attention spans are short, we have less patience than ever before.
I just I'm a big learn fromexperience guy. I'm people who have
worked on this show, I tellyou, I just get you used to

(01:27:00):
be in here, but get usedto meet, get used to running the
board, get used to my weirdnesslike it just it takes a while and
then hopefully it's going to pay offand you'll be able to contribute something.
And that's happened with every person we'vehad, including Tarin right now. So
the the Ellie de la Cruz thing, for me, I I'm dismissive when

(01:27:21):
I hear people talk about demoting him. First of all, who are you
gonna call out and look man like? To a degree, I wish Ellie
was on a better team to adegree. It's it's a shame that last
year's team was so good that itraised everybody's expectations, because I think for
many it made them kind of losesight of really what this year is still,

(01:27:45):
at least in part about, whichis developing these guys. It doesn't
mean the results can't frustrate you.They frustrate me. But I'm a big
and by the way, that hasbeen stunted with Matt McClain, it's been
stunted by his own door, WithNoel de Marte, it's been stunted with
Christian and Carnassi on strand. Itwas stunted last year with all those starting
pitchers who got hurt. It getsinterrupted by injury. But with Elie Dela

(01:28:11):
Cruz and so many of these guys, let's let's compile a body of work
that A we can sufficiently judge andB you can build on and learn from.
And we're just now starting, justnow starting to get there with Ellie
Dela Cruz. Twenty two minutes afterfive o'clock five point three seven four nine,

(01:28:32):
fifteen thirty is our phone number.We'll play the Zach Taylor audio because
Joe Burrow took a day off.Coming up in just about fifteen minutes,
A very brief, very brief,bold Cincinnati sports prediction on ESPN fifteen thirty,
Cincinnatisi, Did you get an answer? Are we carrying the Olympics?
On ESPN fifteenth Can we get sentto Paris to go cover the Olympics?

(01:28:55):
Can we broadcast them? Be kindof cool? We go broadcast from the
Rice too. They have ice chess, and I guessed I've never been to
France. They I'm sure they haveice chess in Paris. I could broadcast
from one of them. That'd bea lot of fun. As a sports
talk radio host, I think Iam obligated to spend at least a few
minutes on Caitlyn Clark's rough go ofit in the WNBA, where she was

(01:29:20):
named Rookie of the Month. Herteam is terrible, that's why they were
drafting number one overall, but she'sbeing pushed around a bit. I have
been following basketball for quite a longtime. Basketball Now, I will admit
to you that in a lifetime offollowing basketball, very little of that time
has been spent on the WNBA.But Caitlin Clark has piqued my interest enough

(01:29:44):
that I've watched a little bit more. Here's what I have come to expect
after four plus decades of watching,four decades of watching basketball, specifically professional
basketball. When there is a hotshot rookie, they get physically pushed around

(01:30:05):
intentionally. They get picked on,they get bullied. It doesn't matter their
size. I remember Shaquille O'Neill asa rookie. I watched dudes hang on
his arms. I remember David Robinsonas a rookie. I watch large centers
try to push him around. Iused to root for Patrick Ewing to do
that. I remember Kobe Bryant asa young player and the scoring that came

(01:30:29):
his way after his waving off ascreen of Karl Malone in the nineteen ninety
eight NBA All Star Game, andthe crap that came his way from outside
and inside, and how much hewas pushed around. I have no idea
if Caitlin Clark is going to bea smashing success in that league. I
hope she is, and no reasonto root against her. But in my
experience watching basketball, rookies with alot of hype, who are regarded by

(01:30:54):
their peers as having the potential tobe great usually face significant tests from their
peers to see if they can bethrown off their game, to see if
they can be rattled, to seeif they can be intimidated, to see
if they are up for the physicaltoll that playing at the highest level can

(01:31:14):
take on a player. That's beenthe truth in four decades of watching men's
professional basketball. I suspect it's thesame watching women's professional basketball across that off
my list. Speaking of Caitlin Clark, are you ready for my bold Cincinnati
prediction. I'm not saying this isgoing to happen. We're going to come

(01:31:38):
to fruition the way many will hearit. Uh, there's a movement to
get an arena built in Cincinnati.Gary Bettman mentioned the NHL back during the
All Star break. That's probably nothappening. I think Utah is getting the
team to getting the team from Phoenix. The NBA is not coming here.

(01:31:59):
They're still a movement to get anarena Builtier need a primary tenant, one
that is probably in a higher profileleague than the EHL. Someone here in
town, someone here in town whocould do something about it financially. I'm
willing to bet is going to makeovertures to the WNBA to get a franchise

(01:32:23):
here. Will it work? Ihave no remote idea. If it did
work, will it be a success? I have no idea. I bet
you that happens. There's within thenext eighteen months you'll read about that season
ticket holder you're in. You're there. I mean, someone's going to look

(01:32:45):
at the popularity of that league,which continues to grow. They're expanding by
two already. You do not needan NBA team to have a WNBA team.
There's only six franchises that are partnerfranchises. Many WNBA franchises are independently
owned, meaning that there's no directownership by the NBA team. So if
you're clinging to that, that's that'ssort of a misnomer. Somebody is going

(01:33:09):
to look at that as an entrywayinto getting an arena done here in Cincinnati.
There you go, and what willit work or not? I don't
know. I have no remote idea. Don't venture to I don't care to
venture a guess. I bet youthat happens in town. I bet you
you read that story. I'll sayin the next twelve months, there's going

(01:33:30):
to be someone who could do somethingabout getting a sports team here. Who
reaches out to the powers that bethat make decisions about expansion in that league
and try to bring one to Cincinnati. All I was just looking at it.
I think it's unlikely because they alreadygot the team in Nelson, Toronto.
I doobt they put two teams onthe East Coast. Yeah, but
you know, leagues are only howmany teams are in the NBA again they

(01:33:53):
WNBA. It may say, no, I'm not saying like we're getting a
team. Someone here is going totry. What are they at twenty two?
Now, if I'm not mistaken,how many franchises they're at twelve twelve?
There's twelve WNBA teams, Yes,the entire league. Yes. So
exploding popularity means more TV money.More TV money is going to mean more

(01:34:19):
inventory needed. The way you createinventory is you add games, and you
add teams. To add games isnot as easy as you might think to
add teams. I'm just again,I'm not saying it is going to happen.
Someone here is going to try tomake it happen. And by someone,
I'm not talking about some dude onthe radio, like somebody who's got

(01:34:40):
some deep pockets. There's my andthen that'll be. That's how they get
the arena done. Twenty six awayfrom six o'clock. I got to hear
Zach Taylor on Joe Burrow that iscoming up on ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports
Station. Both the Nadel first pitchseven hundred WLW. Who's starting to line
up to seven? Let's hope it'smade well thanks to our friends at Madewell

(01:35:02):
Restoration. Go to Madewell Restoration dotcom tonight against lefty Tye Block, Frankie
Montas throws from Cincinnati. Fairchild isleading off in right field, Dela Cruz
in short, Candelario is playing thirdbase, Spencer Steers playing first, Stevenson
is dhing and batting fifth. JonathanIndia is in the sixth pot playing second

(01:35:23):
base. TJ Friedlan center. BlakeDone is making the start tonight after being
called up from Louisville. He isin center field and he is batting eighth.
I'm sorry no, he's in leftfield in batting eighth. My l
looks like a c and Luke Mayleyis behind the plate and patting ninth.
Nick Martini has been sent to Louisville. Blake Done is twenty five years old

(01:35:47):
and interesting piece on him at cincinnadot com called up today. He is
a right handed batter. He isa guy who in Louisville. This season
didn't put up overwhelmingly big numbers,but last season had twenty three homers between

(01:36:08):
Dayton and Chattanooga. This year fourNA two to twenty three batting average for
Louisville. There you go, likedone pol question. Thanks to our friends
at United Heartland Insurance, they willdo the opposite of my mom's insurance company.
They'll actually work with you. They'llreturn your phone calls, they'll answer
the phone. I got to getmy mom hooked up with United Heartland Insurance.

(01:36:30):
It's very simple. If you're likethe folks at United Heartland Insurance,
you value the people that work withyou and you return their phone calls.
My mom's insurance company not, sowe'll get mom hooked up with United Heartland
Insurance. So I mentioned this verybriefly. MLB as partnerships with gambling companies,

(01:36:50):
MLB players are prohibited from gambling onMLB games. Do you find this
hypocritical? Fifty two point two percentof you say no, which means close
to fifty percent say yes, Imentioned this. Padres infielder to Kopta,
Marcano has been declared permanently ineligible forviolating MLB's sports betting rules. He becomes

(01:37:11):
the first Major League player since yesPete Rose in nineteen eighty nine to be
banned under the league's rules and policies. According to Major League Baseball, Marcano
plays three hundred and eighty seven baseballbets, including two hundred and thirty one
MLB related bets, as well asbets on international baseball play over the course
of a week in October of twentytwenty two, and from July twelve,

(01:37:35):
twenty twenty three, through November first, twenty twenty three. All told,
he wagered more than one hundred andfifty thousand dollars on baseball, with over
eighty seven thousand dollars of that onMLB related bets. During the time he
was with the Pirates, according tothe league, he consistently wagered on parlays,

(01:37:59):
some of which where the Pirates don'tbet barlays. Marcano lost all of
his parlays don't bet barlays involving thePirates and only won four point three percent
of all of his MLB related bets. Overall, he won four point three
percent of his bets. On topof Marcano, MLB has announced that other

(01:38:21):
players, Michael Kelly of the A'sand a handful of minor leaguers were declared
ineligible for one year for violating MLB'ssports betting rules and policies. All bets
were made through a legal sports bettingoperator. So what this is going to
do, and what it has alreadydone, is create a ground swell,

(01:38:45):
if you will, of criticism aimedat baseball and other sports leagues for in
the era of legalized sports gambling inso many places, for taking the gambling
company's money, FanDuel, DraftKings,et cetera, and wrapping its arm around
gambling and embracing gambling and getting intobed with gambling companies while at the same

(01:39:06):
time not letting their players bet onMajor League Baseball. And some will say
that this is hypocritical. I'm notone of them. Look, every job
has their rules. My job hasrules. My job requires me to follow
rules that your job might not requireyou to follow, or that some of

(01:39:26):
our advertisers might not make their employeesfollow. There's no ambiguity when it comes
to this rule, by the way, it's I mean, it's simple.
I can memorize where it is inthe book. It's Rule twenty one D.
Any player, umpire, or clubofficial, or employee who shall bet
any some whatsoever on any baseball gameand connection with which the better has no

(01:39:48):
duty to perform, shall be declaredand eligible for one year. Any player,
umpire, or club official, oremployee who shall bet any some whatsoever
on any baseball game and connection withwhich the better has a do you need
to perform, shall be declared permanentlyineligible. There's no gray area, there's
no ambiguity, and it's posted inevery clubhouse. If you're a major league

(01:40:08):
player, you walk past it multipletimes per day. It's not that hard.
There's not that much of a disconnecthere. If you want to bet
on major League baseball games, don'tbe a major league baseball player. If
you want to bet on major Leaguebaseball games, find another line of work.
If you want to be a majorLeague baseball player, understand that there

(01:40:30):
are things others are allowed to dothat you're not like. I know people
who work for the Reds and Bengalsin FC Cincinnati clubs that have openly forged
partnerships with gampling companies. They mightnot like the rule, but if they
don't like the rule that much,they can go find another line of work.

(01:40:56):
And nearly all of them understand andto at what they are or aren't
allowed to do. There's no hipocrisyhere. I'm allowed to bet in a
Major League Baseball game. I lovewagering on baseball as much as other sports,
but I dabble in it, talkabout it on locks of the night.

(01:41:17):
I'm allowed to better a Major Leaguebaseball game. Ellie Dela Cruz is
not. If Elie Dela Cruz,or in the case of our friend Tookopeta
Marcano here doesn't understand that, thenhe's subject to the punishment that is very
clearly outlined by every Major League Baseballteam in every major League clubhouse, and

(01:41:41):
that the Players Association over the lastone hundred years has or ever since the
formation of the Players Association, hasshown no inclination to getting stricken from the
record. There's no hypocrisy here.It's not that hard to understand. If
you want to be a Major Leaguebaseball player, you got to understand you
can't bet on a game. Ifyou want to work in the Red's ticket
all understand there's going to be restrictionson you too. I have a very

(01:42:05):
good friend of mine who works inthe Bengals ticket office. He knows what
he can and can't do. Ican do all those things he can't.
If he wants to do the thingsthat I'm allowed to do, has to
go find another line of work everyjob. There are employees at casinos who,
in most states can't go wager onthe floor of the casino they work

(01:42:29):
at. Want to be able todo that, don't work at that casino.
I can't enter the Moliar Laune contest. If you're exactly tearing, you
are not allowed to enter the MolurLawn contest. My sister wanted to enter
the Mow your Lawn contest. Sorry, you're an immediate family member of mine,

(01:42:50):
and there's lots of reasons why Icould say I'm sorry for that.
Trust me, but that's one ofthe many you're not allowed to ender the
contest. Would love the lawnmower andall the River Bend tickets, but if
he wants to win, he hasto quit. That's how it works,
all right. We have to playthis Joe Burrow didn't practice today, which
it's just a day off. It'sjust a day off. I am completely

(01:43:17):
completely on board if you spend alittle time today at least doing a mild
freak out. So the way thiswent down, Joe wasn't out there practicing,
and it was told to the reporters, well, Zach's going to talk
about it after practice, and hedid. Here is some of that.
They're just trying to be prembitive.You know. For me, he's he's

(01:43:38):
been feeling really good. And sowhen players usually communicate they're doing great,
you know, you push them alltoo hard. So just as the coach,
we got to pull back from someof those guys that are in situations
like that. So we've given thema day off every week. This is
a day off this week. Nothinghe's for no, no, no,
no, he's if you ask him, he's going to be out here every
day. And that's part of theproblem. You know, he's defending the
player from himself. So it isthis part of the growth that maybe you

(01:43:59):
wanted to show. Liked of figuringout where his body's at his maybe party,
He's been great. Like anytime youask for feedback from him. He's
things are always going really well.And so I've just learned, having dealing
with these players for a long timenow, that you got to defend up
from thoselves some times. So ifthings are going good, that's good.
Let's be smart, you know,and how make your time. So you
know, last week we've really nevergone more than two days in a row.

(01:44:19):
We had three days. This weekwe're practicing, so we just gave
him the middle day off. Iexpectations for him to compete next week.
I imagine yeah, yeah, yeah, all three days and many camp that's
to be determined. I haven't reallythere's some flexibility maybe with one of the
MINIICAM days in terms of what we'reactually going to do. So I don't
want to put my foot in mymouth there on how that's all going to
work out. When y'all built theplan out, when did you guys decide,

(01:44:41):
Okay, we're going to go aheadand mandate and rest day like that?
We would you know, like duringphase two when we're out here throwing,
you get more throws during the otaightdays because we're doing seven on seven,
so there's a lot of reps there. So really we made that adjustments
have got into week one and countedthe number of throws we're doing. Again,
we're not monitoring his reps in practice. We're trying to be proactive with
the day in totality, and sothat's just a decision we better. When

(01:45:02):
did you make the call that withme today that it was the off season
prog. It's been the Seconday offevery week. So again, we haven't
really had consistent days this week.So I was just assuming you guys will
be here yesterday and we get allthe tape you guys want and llow and
behold, you aren't here yesterday,and that's that's my fault, nobody else's.
And so we get into that.Right there you go. So Zach

(01:45:25):
Taylor with the explanation, Joe Burrowa day off, Taron Harrow, we
on time? We done? Uh? You just put the Bartender song in?
Does I mean we're finished? Yeah? We literally got like ninety seconds.
I don't want to get a nastyemail, Mike, We've got ninety
seconds. You can have a minute, go ahead? Thanks? Well,
sure, thanks, Eric. I'mexcited. I think it's cool that the

(01:45:49):
Guardians and the reds Hip number one, number two fits in the draft I
didn't know if you talked about Ithink it's pretty hard, pretty swim chance.
That's two teams for Saints. Asthe draft gets closer, we'll start
to focus in on some of theplayers the Reds might take with the second
overall tack. Yeah. I justthought about last night, and I just
thought it was pretty cool, youknow, both of the Ohio teams,

(01:46:12):
and you were mentioning the basketball apossible basketball arena being a built here of
the Cincinnati events, right, Iwas, yes, yeah, and it
hardens me back. I always seethis full time prep. You don't want
football. But when I was littleand my dad would take me to the
Cincinnati gardens, it was more excitingthan the Red games to me at the

(01:46:33):
time. I can understand that Iwish to God, Mike, thank you.
I wish to God there were moreCincinnati artifacts out there to be had,
because I would buy them. Wehave to go back at it tomorrow
at three oh five. Thank youfor listening. Thanks to Arran Bland for
producing. Have an awesome night.This is ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati sports station.

(01:47:03):
My heart Radio Earth is here.

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