August 1, 2024 • 32 mins
Paul Dehner Jr. of The Athletic and The Growler Podcast joined us to discuss a myriad of Bengals training camp topics, from Ja'Marr Chase's hold-in, the end of the race for The Mo Egger Award, a key camp battle on defense, the running back dynamic, the new locker room, and his excellent piece on Tee Higgins.
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Podcasts of The Mo Egger Radio Show are a service of Longnecks Sports Grill.
Listen to the show live weekday afternoons 3:00 - 6:00 on ESPN1530.
Listen Live: ESPN1530.com/listen
Get more: https://linktr.ee/MoEgger
Follow on X: @MoEgger
Instagram too: @MoEgger
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station. How about that trade deadline?
Is there anything in all of sports in this city
that gets talked about more that ends up leaving us
(00:20):
as unfulfilled emotionally as the Major League Baseball trade deadline?
Speaker 2 (00:25):
Every year?
Speaker 1 (00:26):
Every year, the entire season's a ramp up to the deadline.
What's gonna happen? What are they gonna do? And then
it's not like the Reds didn't do anything. They did
some stuff, they did some stuff that's okay. They didn't
do anything that really excites anybody. And maybe that's a problem,
maybe it's not, But we're gonna talk about it. We'll
do that in the next hour because Paul's here. Paul
Daterter Junior is here now. Obviously, typically we do this
(00:48):
on Tuesdays, but the Bengals practiced yesterday and Paul had
to be there to cover it for his job, which
is covering the Bengals Fortheathletic dot Com and the Growler Podcast.
Go read Paul's piece on t Higgins, which dropped this morning.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
It's It's terrific.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
Go get that at the Athletic dot com or ny
Times dot com. Paul's on x at Paul Danna Junior,
What is up?
Speaker 2 (01:11):
What's going on?
Speaker 3 (01:12):
It's going to be back here in the studio with you,
and you know I missed our time together.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
It was it was it was tough. It was tough
on me emotionally.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
But luckily I've had things like Jamar Chase's hat to
keep me focused and and and content. Can I ask you,
is it the same hat every day? It appears to be.
I got to say. And someone noticed this yesterday, so
I don't want to take credit for it.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
This was a follower.
Speaker 3 (01:41):
Everyone was posting their videos, of course of the new locker,
of course, Yeah, and Jay had one up that went
had T Higgins and Jamar Chase's locker, and someone very
astutely noticed that while everyone had helmets in the helmet spot,
that Jamar had his hat in there, which I thought
was I hope Jamar did that to troll everyone. We
(02:03):
need that, So I'll just go ahead and leave my
hat right in the spot where the helmet goes.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
I thought that was I thought that was a nice touch.
Well done. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
I don't even think we even I don't even think
Jay even realized it that that that that had happened,
but it was a perfect, perfect placement.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
Well, I know you're excited to be here, and I
know you're excited for us to get a chance to
kind of get back into the rhythm of chatting on
a weekly basis. Obviously covering camp might move things around.
And I know you're really excited to talk more about
Jamar Chase. Yeah, really excited. There's the one question, is
he willing to miss games? Well, let's cut for all
(02:38):
the stuff game it's the only thing that matters. Is
he willing to stare down the Bengals to the point
that he goes fine Week one against the Pats?
Speaker 2 (02:47):
You're doing it without me?
Speaker 3 (02:49):
I think his his camp would probably say that today.
M hmm, But I doubt that that would actually play
out that way. It just so rarely does, right, And
I don't. I don't and when And it's harder. It's
even harder to do when you have two years here.
You know, like there's just your fight. It's a very
(03:11):
uphill battle on that cell and with your teammates. I
think everybody's behind you getting your bag right. We've gotta
do the bag talk. You gotta, you gotta everybody's behind you.
Getting your money until it maybe starts affecting their money,
and the conversation and the looks and the peer pressure
(03:33):
should it be called.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Maybe changes a little.
Speaker 3 (03:36):
I don't you know. Only Jamar probably knows that. I
would guess no, and I think the Bengals would probably
guess know. But nobody, nobody can really say that except
for one person. And he was wearing a hat on
the sidelines these days right now. I you know, there's
(03:56):
just there's no way to say for sure. But my
guess would be the way that these things almost always go.
Speaker 2 (04:01):
And the answer is no. I don't think he will
be willing to, especially because he is around.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, how weird is that he's he's around,
He's participating in everything but practice.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
Right, He's doing meetings.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
You talked about this with me on your podcast yesterday.
He's doing more than the bare minimum. So he's around
and he's gonna continue to be around, but not playing
the game. Yeah, like that just seems it's it's one
thing if the guy is nowhere to be seen and
he's holding out and he's getting fined, and okay, I'm
gonna take this stand off as long as I can
go I it seems bizarre to me to suggest that
(04:37):
he's around and then here's a game and he's still
around wearing a hat, but he's not gonna play in it.
Speaker 2 (04:42):
Yeah, I think the.
Speaker 3 (04:44):
Fact that he is really kind of playing the good
soldier in every other respect probably tells you kind of
about the tone of things right now where it's it
doesn't feel contentious despite the fact that he's not participate
and practice, And I think that's fine. I mean, look,
the two sides are are are talk, They're they're communicating
(05:06):
about what's going on here. They're hopeful. I don't know
whether anything's going to get done or not so well
while they do that, no need to be out there
chance than anything. I get all that, But at a
certain point there's gonna be a line of like, look,
here's where are Here's where we've ended up, here's where
you've ended up. Is either are you saying yes to
this or not? And after this we're going forward with
(05:28):
the season and let's go play. And I think that's
I think that's you know, when you end up see
the person show up and say all right, time to
go play, and we'll talk about betting on themselves and
all of this other stuff and what it could cost
on the line and if people want to get into
that type of dynamic. But for now, I think it's
stuff that we see Jesse Bates, Joe Mixon a couple
(05:51):
of years ago. It's happening around the league. It's this,
it's that time of year, It's it is wear a
hat and watch season. It is like, let's see who
flinch's first season, because it really doesn't matter that much,
specifically for a guy like Jamar On one point, I'll
that I'll make on top of that. That I do
(06:12):
think is interesting is we've kind of talked about, you know,
following the Justin Jefferson model to get the Justin Jefferson
money a little bit, and oddly, this is not.
Speaker 2 (06:25):
What Justin Jefferson did in Minnesota last year.
Speaker 3 (06:27):
Justin Jefferson reported he was happy by all counts and
went out there and said, well, you know, I'd like
to get a deal now, but I understand why I
wouldn't and did all the stuff. Now we can talk
about what happened when he was hurt in season or whatever,
but at this time of year, didn't didn't really go
down this route. So maybe that suggests things are different
(06:50):
or that. I think it's a little surprise, a little
surprising in that regard because I thought you just kind
of follow Okay, gonna just keep following the Jefferson path
to end up in the same place that he ended up.
Maybe that does end up being the case, and this
is one area where it's different, but just to note
that it is a little different.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:06):
Meanwhile, I mentioned this, you wrote about T Higgins and
T Higgins' mom. Yeah, and you know, it's interesting for
a guy who I think was the most talked about
figure as it relates to the Bengals for months on end.
He's here, he's practicing, he's going to play for the
team under the franchise tag, and he's barely being acknowledged.
(07:28):
I thought it was cool that you brought him bracket
back into focus. And I would tell anybody who kind
of wonders about T Higgins and his motivation for the
season to read the piece, because say what you want
about what's happened between him and the Bengals, if you
want to take sides, I kind of understand both points.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
He just seems to get it. Yeah, Like he just
he just seems to get it and this was a
hard spot.
Speaker 3 (07:54):
And what I came away really intrigued by and kind
of wanting to dig more into. Last week when we
talk to Tea was how hard this kind of was
for him to go through. Like, we don't think about
it that way, especially when we start talking about money,
people tune out and oh god, how much money do
you need? And geez, what do we But I do
(08:15):
think for these guys, like a lot of them, and
Tea and specifically in this case, this is the first
time that they've had to go through something like this,
and he's like, Look, I'm an introvert.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
I'm a guy that keeps to myself.
Speaker 3 (08:29):
I don't want the spotlight despite the spotlight position that
I play. I'm from a small town in Tennessee. Like
this kind of who he is, and anybody that's gotten
to know him a little bit of you just knows
that's kind of who he's been. And here he is
in this like controversial spotlight, this with everyone weighing in.
Everybody's got an opinion on whether he's worth it. Who
(08:50):
is he really? I pointed out in our fan survey,
his popularity is the second favorite. Bengal went down from
ten and a half percent to three and a half percent.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
Yeah, in one.
Speaker 3 (09:00):
Offseason when nothing changed except he was the guy out
there playing, doing everything that he could and making a
number of big plays, including maybe the best one of
his entire careers in Minnesota.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
Like and so it's just that whole thing.
Speaker 3 (09:14):
It wears on a human being, man, Like, whether whatever
people want to hear that or not or care these
guys as people, it wears on him. And I thought
his decision to be like not just say, man, I
just wanted to kill all the noise and squash all
that and come in and play football and have it
be about football again. But the people around him kind
of being like, yeah, you worry about him when you
(09:37):
go through this and you see it wearing on him,
and you know. And I think it ends with a
cool message at the end a little bit, and I
would encourage people to read kind of the direction that
it goes. But you grow a little bit, man, Like,
you go through stuff for the first time and you
learn who you really are. And I thought we as
a as fans of a person, learned a little bit
(09:58):
who T Higgins was.
Speaker 2 (09:59):
While everyone was.
Speaker 3 (10:00):
Talking and everybody was saying anything me you. I wrote
a four part series. Mo we all did it and
rightfully show. So it's the point of discussion. He's he
kind of found what mattered to him and what was
important and what stances he wanted to take and what
kind of a person he wanted to be through this,
(10:20):
And I think that's where he ended up landing. Yeah,
I want to be the guy that squashes it all
and shows up and is about football and lets my
work get me paid. And I commend him for that
because he could have gone a lot of different directions
like some others are right now.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
Yeah, I mean I I read the piece and I
combined that with what I saw Week seventeen against Kansas City. Yes,
the guy willing himself back onto the field in a
game that they had to win, where I'm sure there
are players who would have said, yeah, I'm good, you know,
go do this without me. And so you know, often
during the off season when he would come up, you know,
some wondered, well is he going to make a business decision?
(10:56):
And I go, Man, all I could do is tofur
to the track record that guy in New Year's even
Kansas City hurt, put himself back into the game and
did everything he could to help his team win, and
they didn't unfortunately, but still, and so it's funny when
you wrote your piece about the fan survey and tease
popularity dropped him going, god, I don't know man, First
(11:18):
of all that I kind of catch against the Vikes,
and then what he's did on New Year's Eve when
he was hurt and all right, he asked for a trade.
But find a lot of players do that. Yeah, you know,
that's okay. The bench just put a guy in the
ring of honor who's kind of known for having done
that a few times. Right, and then he signs the
franchise thing right when OTA's end and sort of lets
(11:40):
it known like I'm gonna play, I'm gonna here, I'm
gonna sho up, I'm gonna.
Speaker 2 (11:42):
Do my thing. Like how could you not like that guy?
Speaker 3 (11:45):
Yeah, And he's out there right now, he's been out
he's out there day one, you know, trying to catch
contested balls in the end in red zone drills with
guys laying around his legs and that's what it's gonna be.
And understanding that that's what it's gonna be, and willing
to go out there and put in the work and
realize that this is a year that he's just got
to kind of be about his business and have a
(12:06):
great year and help this team win the super Bowl,
and know that for both sides, for everyone, the best
thing involved is him to have a great year, they
win the Super Bowl, and he goes to free agency. Right, yeah,
all right, We're not going to talk about Jamar Chase anymore.
Yeah until what I guess, next Tuesday. Right next Tuesday,
will of course get our time in.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
But for the purposes of what we're doing here, there
are some other things I want to ask about.
Speaker 3 (12:28):
There are so many good things to talk about, like
so many fun conversation points Beyond this stuff.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
I would I can't tell you how excited I would
be to dive in.
Speaker 1 (12:37):
Except I feel like one of the things I've been
looking forward to I can't look forward to anymore.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
Okay, I'll tell you what it is when we come back.
Speaker 1 (12:44):
He's Paul Danner Junior covering the Bengals for the Athletic
check Out. The other Growler podcast was my episode with
Dave yesterday.
Speaker 2 (12:52):
The most recent or has there been one?
Speaker 3 (12:54):
Sense We have our training camp reports there up on
the YouTube page that every couple of days, I batch
those together and put them on the feed. So technically
no gotcha. But it's it is. It is up there.
There's lots up there. It's it's firing on all cylinders
right now.
Speaker 2 (13:08):
No question.
Speaker 1 (13:08):
Eighteen minutes after three o'clock. Oh, he's Paul Gleger with us.
This is the ESPN fifteen thirty, Cincinnati.
Speaker 2 (13:14):
Sports Station, Cincinnati's East.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
It's twenty three after three o'clock. ESPN fifteen thirty. Paul
Danner Junior's here typically on Tuesdays, but it's you know,
it's training camp, so when they practice on Tuesday, he
has to be there.
Speaker 3 (13:31):
They're not practicing today, so they are not they are
not no practice today, but back at it the next
couple of days. It's nice to have the pads portion
of the program here. Feels much more legitimate.
Speaker 2 (13:41):
Yeah, feels like actual football.
Speaker 4 (13:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:43):
Well, we were sort of you know, the offseason program
didn't matter, right, were right? We were told that, And
then turns out the first week doesn't really matter either
until the pads come on. That also, apparently is just
all setting up for things to really start. So now
we've kind of been clearly told that we're allowed to
start making judgments and opinions now, okay, So it's nice
to be able to do that rather than make stuff up.
Speaker 1 (14:05):
Is it's July thirty first, we haven't even turned not
even August yet, turn the calendar to August.
Speaker 2 (14:11):
Is the race for the Moegor Award over? Yeah, it's obvious.
This is what we talked. This is what I talked about.
It's over.
Speaker 3 (14:17):
When we did the phone conversation a couple weeks ago
and you asked me about andre Yoshibash and this award,
I discussed, I think you can win it if you're
you are so blowing away the previous expectations due to
your your success in the shorts and shirts portion of
(14:38):
the program.
Speaker 2 (14:40):
And I think he's doing that again.
Speaker 3 (14:42):
I mean, look, I was talking to Troy Walters the
other day and he said it plain as day. He's
probably our third best receiver. We had to find a
way to get him on the field. Like this guy,
the sixth round flyer out of the IVY League last year,
is is the guy who's gonna be not just filling in,
(15:05):
like I think you can see a path to him
just taking all of Tyler Boyd's snaps he's gonna be
a factor, like, yeah, he's gonna be a factor, Like
I mean, you're gonna have packages with guys or whatever.
But he has blown open a path to being the
guy as the third guy here.
Speaker 2 (15:24):
That's blowing away the expectations.
Speaker 3 (15:26):
I think that even some of the most optimistic andre
Yoshibash fans have had. And I think that started with
the moment they he said, move him into the slot,
something that was as far off of our radar as
anything could have been. A dude's never done this before
in his life, and they're like, he's just so good,
and see he appears to be a guy that could
handle it. Throw him in there and he says, yeah,
(15:49):
the first time my life there I was out there
and he's there. He is running away from Mike Hilton
a couple of times, catching some passes, and you're saying, Okay,
this could be the versatile inside outside piece they're looking
for a little bit.
Speaker 1 (15:59):
So for those who don't know, the Moegger Award, yes
goes to the wide receiver that is a little bit
off the grid that generates a lot of camp buzz
that we sort of annoying as like the next Jerry
Rice or Randy Moss, someone like that, and then ends
up not really doing anything.
Speaker 2 (16:16):
I think Andre wins the award.
Speaker 1 (16:18):
But what's interesting because I sit here while practice is happening,
and you know, in years past, I'll look at the
the audentate tweets and I'll roll my eyes.
Speaker 2 (16:29):
The andre Josbah stuff. Just it feels natural.
Speaker 1 (16:32):
It just it feels like you're two for a guy
that did some really good things his rookie season. Like
it feels like this is not a novelty that this
isn't it's not even that it's not even that big
of a revelation. Andre Yoshavash might be the third wide
receiver like that that has seemed all along like a
bona fide possibility.
Speaker 2 (16:50):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (16:50):
Kind of.
Speaker 2 (16:50):
The epilogue to the Moegger Award is usually.
Speaker 3 (16:54):
That the guy gets cut or something, right, you know,
practice squad doesn't do.
Speaker 2 (16:58):
Anything we never hear from again, right, or when.
Speaker 1 (17:01):
A bunch of guys get hurt he plays week thirteen
and then you know he drops two balls and right,
and and that's you.
Speaker 3 (17:07):
But this was it wasn't the case last year when
he laid a super solid foundation that you would expect
from a guy who's who's got the arrow pointing up.
And then certainly not when you consider what he looked
like this off season and the amount of work that
he put in and kind of just the background of
who he is.
Speaker 2 (17:25):
I mean, it's it now.
Speaker 3 (17:26):
Is has moved to me, has definitely moved out of
that realm of oh, here's a guy who happens to
look good in shorts and a T shirt. No, like
he he was drafted with the lottery ticket because he's
so big and strong for how fast he is and
the athlete that he is. If he ever put it together,
it could be something. And you're seeing him do just that,
(17:49):
put it together. And it's also how Joe Burrow talks
about him. Yeah, like trust gotta have it.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
I mean, like you hear quarterbacks, we'll talk about all
the receiving options and they let times try to be
really diplomatic and include as many names as possible.
Speaker 2 (18:03):
I don't get that sense when he talks.
Speaker 1 (18:05):
I get the sense that he's like, yeah, man, like
I'm gonna throw the football to andre Yosmash and he's
gonna make plays.
Speaker 3 (18:10):
You know why, because he did make plays for him
last year I mean there's Joe Burrow chasing down his
touchdown ball to make sure that he keeps it.
Speaker 2 (18:16):
I mean, when.
Speaker 3 (18:18):
Burrow finds that he can trust you in a game.
Aaron Rodgers used to be famous for this stuff, right, essentially,
just like training with players to test them over and
over and over again, in the moment he decides he
can trust you and does so in a game, it flips.
I wrote the story I wrote about the back shoulder
(18:40):
a couple of years ago. I will never forget it.
He talked about it as he loves it. It's the
biggest trust throw in football that you have to make
if a trust the other guy. And Hayden Hurst talking
about the moment that Burrow was willing to throw him
a back shoulder in a game he knew he had
Burrow's trust. You don't know until then. You don't know
until in a game he trusts you to make a
(19:01):
play and you make it for him, and you see
that happen or the opposite happens, and then that guy's
gone right like, and you know. It's It's how Trenton
Irwin has done so well here. It's and it's why
yoshibash I think you can continue to believe in because
last year you saw Burrow having trust in Andre. Yeah,
and and because he was rewarding it, and and that
matters big time around here. And you see it out
(19:23):
there on the field when they when they play together.
He kind of believes and he can be the guy
who Burrow says what he always says.
Speaker 2 (19:31):
I was gonna let my guy go make a play.
Speaker 1 (19:33):
All right, So we are declaring the race to win
the Moeger Award over. I'm gonna see if I can
make another declaration when we come back. Okay, it's twenty
nine minutes after three o'clock. He's Paul dainn Er Junior
on Moegar. You get you get off early because we
have the Tony Pike training camp up.
Speaker 3 (19:50):
Say down there now, I just I love that. I've
always loved the idea of him standing down there by
himself right now. We gave him, We gave him a
little bit of a break today. He said that he
can do it. Studio. Just let us know, like how
that maybe the groundskeepers are out there relining the field
and he's cutting the grass.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
He's got a newborns, two other kids, so I'm like,
look and he's got the responsibility of the training camp report,
so we figured we'll do him here in studio instead
of dispatching you down to the side. Guess it's a
three thirty. I'm Moegger. This is ESPN fifteen thirty, Cincinnati
Sports Station Trimsy three.
Speaker 4 (20:24):
Sixty years there, bringing you the orangein blackli like never
before from the Kettering host practice field beginning Bunday. A
note on ESPN fifteen thirty, the official home of the Bengals.
Speaker 1 (20:36):
Sports headlines and service off Kelsey Chevrolet, home of lifetime
powertrain protection and guaranteed credit approval from their family to
yours for life kelseyshev dot Com. Bengals went off day today,
which is why Paul Jayner Junior is here Reds and
Cubs tonight at GABP Cincinnati looking for a sweep. Nick
Lidolo Kyle Hendrick Tonight's seven ten, seven hundred WLW. The
(20:58):
US men's Olympic basketball team leads South Sudan forty six
to thirty one, three point fifteen to go in the
second quarter.
Speaker 2 (21:07):
Played the long game with South Sudan. They did.
Speaker 3 (21:09):
That's what they put them on. Notice you know that
used the first game is scouting now they lay the
hammer on them, not wasting any time.
Speaker 1 (21:19):
Not screwing around. You and I were talking off air
about the TBT. I encourage you to watch as many
the TBT. It's not good basketball, they're great sporting events.
Speaker 2 (21:30):
Yeah it is.
Speaker 1 (21:31):
There's a lot of unintentional hilarity with these games. I
encourage you to enjoy it.
Speaker 3 (21:36):
Yeah, whenever you get I feel like anytime you get
guys who just aren't really quite doing it anymore, the
same level, right, but get in that arena and then
try to revert to muscles and ability that previously existed,
you end up with a lot of questionable shall we say,
(21:58):
decision making. And I love the no authority head coach. Yes,
Like that's that's the best, the dude who has no
power but is asked to stand there and do something
that typically requires decision making.
Speaker 2 (22:10):
All for that. I love just the lack of ability to.
Speaker 1 (22:15):
Tomberlin starting their game, the nasty naty game over seventeen
and they're not being anybody to be like, all right, JC,
how about how about.
Speaker 2 (22:26):
Somebody else? Yeah? Just my guy just lifting them? Fantastic.
I've seen that show before. How wide is the gap
right now?
Speaker 1 (22:35):
Between DJ Turner and Dax Hill. Uh, because you wrote
glowingly about DJ.
Speaker 3 (22:41):
I did, I did, I would I wouldn't go I
wouldn't go cavernous. I wouldn't go cavernous. We can't declare
the race over. I know, okay, No, I wouldn't declare
it over. I think that DJ has had a really
solid start and kind of picked up where you would
have liked to have seen him leave off, Whereas I
just think Dax is starting from a little different place.
(23:03):
He's you know, talking, We talked to him the other day,
and he's talking about still trying to find total comfort
out there and taking these baby steps and believe that
it will come, but you know, still trying to build
that total comfort level in that move to the outside
corner spot, whereas DJ Turner doesn't have that and has
looked like a guy invigorated by this battle, felt the
(23:25):
pressure of that battle, and doing what you expect somebody
in year two to do. Now, I think that you
need to see that continue. DJ Turner is always going
to be a shorts and T shirts looking I mean,
he's a freak athlete. He's a little smaller. You're not
really concerned in that regard because you've seen him play
in the season, but you want to see that continue.
(23:48):
And so what happens as Dax gains more comfort and
confidence and the consistency level of DJ being able to
keep this going. There's plenty of time for all of
that one padded practice. But I do think to this point,
you know, he certainly looks like the leader in the
clubhouse by it by a decent margin.
Speaker 1 (24:08):
Tony Pike and I have talked about this. One of
the themes of the latter half of the season last year,
when the Bengals found ways to still function without Joe
Burrow was how do they blend the way they're playing
offense with the quarterback under center with how Joe Burrow
wants to play? From your standpoint, how how's that playing out?
(24:29):
Are we seeing? Are we seeing it take place with
with Dan Pitcher's fingerprints on it? Now?
Speaker 2 (24:34):
Obviously?
Speaker 1 (24:36):
Is that something still being actively discussed. What's all that
look like?
Speaker 2 (24:40):
Yeah, I think.
Speaker 3 (24:41):
We've seen a decent amount of you know, under center
play action wide zone, which which you know Ted Carris
was telling the other day that's that stuff you typically
see early in camp. Is is that type of a
just like basic running scheme, and he's like, we have
a lots of different schemes. But I do think when
(25:02):
you're talking about under center and play action, the ability
to do stuff wide zone or even RPO wide zone
type stuff off of that is is going to be
part of what you wanted to look like the stuff
that we saw Jake Browning do more of last year.
And so we've seen a lot of that and now
how much of that makes its way into the season
is is up up for debate. We've seen a lot
(25:23):
of multiple tight ends, which I think we anticipated. We've
seen jumbo looks with Amarius Mims as the third you know,
tackle slash tight end that which is pretty fun. Well,
it's so it's just weird to see him out because
he ends up you know, there's a chance he could
end up there just tracking down a safety or a corner.
Speaker 2 (25:46):
You just don't recommend that, you know, you know, and
I know, you know Mims.
Speaker 3 (25:51):
Somebody that was kind of a storyline yesterday because he
just he looked really good. He looks really good and
you you see it and he didn't overwhelmed and it's
just you're reminded the Bengals tweeted this out, But like,
I found myself drawn to him every play just watching
him envelop Miles Murphy, yeah or whoever, and it was
(26:13):
across from him. It was Murphy a lot who is
not small. Oh you know, Murphy's six five two sixty
five to seventy and Mim said, he's he's currently at
three fifty. So six eight three fifty. I mean, Murphy
is just getting eclipsed. You can see all of the
outside of Amarus Mims around this man as they he's
(26:35):
trying to bowl into him. You're just you're not moving him,
you see, and you see how wide. You know, the
the arc is that you've got to try to go
around if you want to, and his ability to just extend.
And Mims said he's got tons of people giving him advice,
and Frank Poul told me that the other day too,
but he said the best device he's gotten was from
Trent Brown, who said, just said, play big, play six
(26:58):
eight three fifty. Don't worry about it, think think about
anything else. Trust what you've been learning and and and
knowing as far as the playbook goes. But go play big,
use that reach, use that side. And you see him
doing it and it's hard not to. And with every
rep that you watch, the percentage chance that it's him
instead of Trent Brown ticks a little bit.
Speaker 2 (27:18):
You just see it. He looks comfortable out there.
Speaker 3 (27:21):
Again, it's early, it's one padded practice, but it's just
so natural and the size is so intimidating and demoralizing.
You know, Miles left yesterday's practice with cramps. But I
sort of thought to myself, I don't know, I might
be tapping out too if I had, If I knew
I had to go do that a few more times,
and I might be taking And we all feel like
(27:41):
Miles Murphy can play. I mean you know that because
it's not a Miles Murphy conversation. No, this is just
about you know, you can see it and what it
can be. He's got to go do it. He's got
to do it consistently. He's got to do it in
the preseason games. Long way to go for him. But man,
it has everybody has said that. You know, to this point,
he has really looked the part, and all these reps
(28:01):
have been super beneficial for him to keep getting in
there and really looking like the starting right tackle.
Speaker 1 (28:07):
A couple of things quickly because we got to get
to Tony Pike pre camp. When you were sort of
outlining position by position, you talked about the running back
spot kind of feeling incomplete and that being a place
that you would still look for them to maybe add
a veteran.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
You still feel that way, Yeah, I still think that's possible.
Speaker 3 (28:27):
I think that's something that would play out over the
course of camp and in a battle there that hasn't
even really begun. I SI they still really like what
they have in the top two with Moss and and Brown,
and I'm and are looking forward to seeing how that
plays out. But ye, the back of the room still
feels empty. It still feels like it could use another piece,
and there's lots of time for that to occur. I
(28:49):
think that would come from final cuts, whether you're talking
about a p Ryan or a veteran like a Jerry
McKinnon or whoever that would be available that they could
pluck and put onto the back roster.
Speaker 1 (29:00):
We talked in the middle of the dead period of
time about how when training camp starts, and you wrote
about this, how they handle kickoffs is going to be
one of the central storylines. It's what I'm looking forward
to most watching preseason football starting this week, just watching
how this plays out. Has that been something that we've
(29:21):
seen a lot of. Are they even working on it?
I mean, I'm sure they're working on it, But has
there been any glimpse into how the Bengals are going
to handle the new kickoff a little bit?
Speaker 3 (29:29):
I mean we've seen them run through it some, but
I don't know that we've seen specific schemes or plays
or things like that. Yeah, I mean maybe some, but
you get more a feel for personnel. You're seeing a
lot of the tight ends and the bigger guys out there,
not as many of the smaller guys along along the line,
(29:49):
And so that can tell you a little bit more
about maybe where that would lean and could could be
the difference someone making the team or not versus keeping
an extra dB or receiver versus keep being an extra
tight end or a line whatever. And and I think
you know, the weird kicks are going to be a
part of.
Speaker 2 (30:08):
It for now.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
I mean it's gonna you're seeing the practicing of that placement,
and we know hang time doesn't mean anything anymore, so
you're seeing more of these these low cornered kicks and
Evan trying to work on placement and things like that.
So yeah, I mean it's they're out there experimenting and
working with it, and you're so you're kind of judging
more personnel right now. I think in the games, it's
it's when you'll really start to see them go to play.
(30:32):
It's gonna be very funny, a reason to watch the
whole it is though.
Speaker 1 (30:35):
I mean, like legitimately, I said that to someone yesterday
because you know, I I go to a certain establishment
on Thursdays and I'm like, Hall of Fame game, I
want to watch the opening kickoff? Yeah, like really, like dude,
it's it's the first ever kick off with the new rule.
Speaker 2 (30:50):
I want to like, that's gonna.
Speaker 3 (30:51):
Be fun just to watch people on social media react
being like what the yes, that didn't know, or like.
Speaker 1 (30:58):
God, or that's yeah, that's my in laws rule who
like watch football. But like the first they're probably not
gonna be watching the Hall of Fame game. But like
the first Bengals game when I invariably get a text
like can you just explain to me what just happened? Yeah,
It's like when the Reds were on Roku the other day,
I had the same thing, like it's roku roku, you
can do it. Yeah. Uh, what is the coolest part
(31:19):
of the new locker room?
Speaker 3 (31:21):
Uh? I, you know, for a player's perspective, I think
the the little I guess take care is called them
the toaster ovens, the little heaters in the middle that
they have that can dry out your gloves in any
of your like stuff that gets wet and nasty in
your cleats and things like that. And then but for me,
it's that the events and all the air in there
(31:42):
that does that takes the smell out, blows it out
of the locker room instead of into the locker room,
so you don't get as much, well at least to
this point, Yeah, don't appear that you'll get as much
of the stank locker room smell.
Speaker 2 (31:56):
And boy, can I tell you how appreciative we all
are of that. What's next week's schedule?
Speaker 3 (32:04):
Well, next week's schedule, you're getting closer. I mean, you
got the game on the tenth, so we're we're getting
closer to the first you be in here. I don't
care about that.
Speaker 2 (32:12):
No, I don't know. I'll be either. I am here
next Tuesday. They're off on the.
Speaker 1 (32:15):
Sixth team will meet but no practice. Yes, okay, very good.
Back on Tuesday. See you then love it. Paul Danner Jr.
Read his work The T. Higgins Pieces, Terrifictheathletic dot Com,
his daily camp updates.
Speaker 2 (32:29):
The Growler Podcast wherever you get your podcast.
Speaker 1 (32:32):
We did an episode yesterday where we talked about Jamar
Chase and Aliens and the worst documentary.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
That I've ever seen. I still think you'd be a
great person to greet the aliens. We dive into that
incredible topic.
Speaker 1 (32:45):
A Growler Podcast, Balls Don't Lie Tony Pike Next, ESPN
fifteen thirty.
Speaker 2 (32:49):
Hey it's my
ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station. How about that trade deadline?
Is there anything in all of sports in this city
that gets talked about more that ends up leaving us
(00:20):
as unfulfilled emotionally as the Major League Baseball trade deadline?
Speaker 2 (00:25):
Every year?
Speaker 1 (00:26):
Every year, the entire season's a ramp up to the deadline.
What's gonna happen? What are they gonna do? And then
it's not like the Reds didn't do anything. They did
some stuff, they did some stuff that's okay. They didn't
do anything that really excites anybody. And maybe that's a problem,
maybe it's not, But we're gonna talk about it. We'll
do that in the next hour because Paul's here. Paul
Daterter Junior is here now. Obviously, typically we do this
(00:48):
on Tuesdays, but the Bengals practiced yesterday and Paul had
to be there to cover it for his job, which
is covering the Bengals Fortheathletic dot Com and the Growler Podcast.
Go read Paul's piece on t Higgins, which dropped this morning.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
It's It's terrific.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
Go get that at the Athletic dot com or ny
Times dot com. Paul's on x at Paul Danna Junior,
What is up?
Speaker 2 (01:11):
What's going on?
Speaker 3 (01:12):
It's going to be back here in the studio with you,
and you know I missed our time together.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
It was it was it was tough. It was tough
on me emotionally.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
But luckily I've had things like Jamar Chase's hat to
keep me focused and and and content. Can I ask you,
is it the same hat every day? It appears to be.
I got to say. And someone noticed this yesterday, so
I don't want to take credit for it.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
This was a follower.
Speaker 3 (01:41):
Everyone was posting their videos, of course of the new locker,
of course, Yeah, and Jay had one up that went
had T Higgins and Jamar Chase's locker, and someone very
astutely noticed that while everyone had helmets in the helmet spot,
that Jamar had his hat in there, which I thought
was I hope Jamar did that to troll everyone. We
(02:03):
need that, So I'll just go ahead and leave my
hat right in the spot where the helmet goes.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
I thought that was I thought that was a nice touch.
Well done. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
I don't even think we even I don't even think
Jay even realized it that that that that had happened,
but it was a perfect, perfect placement.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
Well, I know you're excited to be here, and I
know you're excited for us to get a chance to
kind of get back into the rhythm of chatting on
a weekly basis. Obviously covering camp might move things around.
And I know you're really excited to talk more about
Jamar Chase. Yeah, really excited. There's the one question, is
he willing to miss games? Well, let's cut for all
(02:38):
the stuff game it's the only thing that matters. Is
he willing to stare down the Bengals to the point
that he goes fine Week one against the Pats?
Speaker 2 (02:47):
You're doing it without me?
Speaker 3 (02:49):
I think his his camp would probably say that today.
M hmm, But I doubt that that would actually play
out that way. It just so rarely does, right, And
I don't. I don't and when And it's harder. It's
even harder to do when you have two years here.
You know, like there's just your fight. It's a very
(03:11):
uphill battle on that cell and with your teammates. I
think everybody's behind you getting your bag right. We've gotta
do the bag talk. You gotta, you gotta everybody's behind you.
Getting your money until it maybe starts affecting their money,
and the conversation and the looks and the peer pressure
(03:33):
should it be called.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Maybe changes a little.
Speaker 3 (03:36):
I don't you know. Only Jamar probably knows that. I
would guess no, and I think the Bengals would probably
guess know. But nobody, nobody can really say that except
for one person. And he was wearing a hat on
the sidelines these days right now. I you know, there's
(03:56):
just there's no way to say for sure. But my
guess would be the way that these things almost always go.
Speaker 2 (04:01):
And the answer is no. I don't think he will
be willing to, especially because he is around.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, how weird is that he's he's around,
He's participating in everything but practice.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
Right, He's doing meetings.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
You talked about this with me on your podcast yesterday.
He's doing more than the bare minimum. So he's around
and he's gonna continue to be around, but not playing
the game. Yeah, like that just seems it's it's one
thing if the guy is nowhere to be seen and
he's holding out and he's getting fined, and okay, I'm
gonna take this stand off as long as I can
go I it seems bizarre to me to suggest that
(04:37):
he's around and then here's a game and he's still
around wearing a hat, but he's not gonna play in it.
Speaker 2 (04:42):
Yeah, I think the.
Speaker 3 (04:44):
Fact that he is really kind of playing the good
soldier in every other respect probably tells you kind of
about the tone of things right now where it's it
doesn't feel contentious despite the fact that he's not participate
and practice, And I think that's fine. I mean, look,
the two sides are are are talk, They're they're communicating
(05:06):
about what's going on here. They're hopeful. I don't know
whether anything's going to get done or not so well
while they do that, no need to be out there
chance than anything. I get all that, But at a
certain point there's gonna be a line of like, look,
here's where are Here's where we've ended up, here's where
you've ended up. Is either are you saying yes to
this or not? And after this we're going forward with
(05:28):
the season and let's go play. And I think that's
I think that's you know, when you end up see
the person show up and say all right, time to
go play, and we'll talk about betting on themselves and
all of this other stuff and what it could cost
on the line and if people want to get into
that type of dynamic. But for now, I think it's
stuff that we see Jesse Bates, Joe Mixon a couple
(05:51):
of years ago. It's happening around the league. It's this,
it's that time of year, It's it is wear a
hat and watch season. It is like, let's see who
flinch's first season, because it really doesn't matter that much,
specifically for a guy like Jamar On one point, I'll
that I'll make on top of that. That I do
(06:12):
think is interesting is we've kind of talked about, you know,
following the Justin Jefferson model to get the Justin Jefferson
money a little bit, and oddly, this is not.
Speaker 2 (06:25):
What Justin Jefferson did in Minnesota last year.
Speaker 3 (06:27):
Justin Jefferson reported he was happy by all counts and
went out there and said, well, you know, I'd like
to get a deal now, but I understand why I
wouldn't and did all the stuff. Now we can talk
about what happened when he was hurt in season or whatever,
but at this time of year, didn't didn't really go
down this route. So maybe that suggests things are different
(06:50):
or that. I think it's a little surprise, a little
surprising in that regard because I thought you just kind
of follow Okay, gonna just keep following the Jefferson path
to end up in the same place that he ended up.
Maybe that does end up being the case, and this
is one area where it's different, but just to note
that it is a little different.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:06):
Meanwhile, I mentioned this, you wrote about T Higgins and
T Higgins' mom. Yeah, and you know, it's interesting for
a guy who I think was the most talked about
figure as it relates to the Bengals for months on end.
He's here, he's practicing, he's going to play for the
team under the franchise tag, and he's barely being acknowledged.
(07:28):
I thought it was cool that you brought him bracket
back into focus. And I would tell anybody who kind
of wonders about T Higgins and his motivation for the
season to read the piece, because say what you want
about what's happened between him and the Bengals, if you
want to take sides, I kind of understand both points.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
He just seems to get it. Yeah, Like he just
he just seems to get it and this was a
hard spot.
Speaker 3 (07:54):
And what I came away really intrigued by and kind
of wanting to dig more into. Last week when we
talk to Tea was how hard this kind of was
for him to go through. Like, we don't think about
it that way, especially when we start talking about money,
people tune out and oh god, how much money do
you need? And geez, what do we But I do
(08:15):
think for these guys, like a lot of them, and
Tea and specifically in this case, this is the first
time that they've had to go through something like this,
and he's like, Look, I'm an introvert.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
I'm a guy that keeps to myself.
Speaker 3 (08:29):
I don't want the spotlight despite the spotlight position that
I play. I'm from a small town in Tennessee. Like
this kind of who he is, and anybody that's gotten
to know him a little bit of you just knows
that's kind of who he's been. And here he is
in this like controversial spotlight, this with everyone weighing in.
Everybody's got an opinion on whether he's worth it. Who
(08:50):
is he really? I pointed out in our fan survey,
his popularity is the second favorite. Bengal went down from
ten and a half percent to three and a half percent.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
Yeah, in one.
Speaker 3 (09:00):
Offseason when nothing changed except he was the guy out
there playing, doing everything that he could and making a
number of big plays, including maybe the best one of
his entire careers in Minnesota.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
Like and so it's just that whole thing.
Speaker 3 (09:14):
It wears on a human being, man, Like, whether whatever
people want to hear that or not or care these
guys as people, it wears on him. And I thought
his decision to be like not just say, man, I
just wanted to kill all the noise and squash all
that and come in and play football and have it
be about football again. But the people around him kind
of being like, yeah, you worry about him when you
(09:37):
go through this and you see it wearing on him,
and you know. And I think it ends with a
cool message at the end a little bit, and I
would encourage people to read kind of the direction that
it goes. But you grow a little bit, man, Like,
you go through stuff for the first time and you
learn who you really are. And I thought we as
a as fans of a person, learned a little bit
(09:58):
who T Higgins was.
Speaker 2 (09:59):
While everyone was.
Speaker 3 (10:00):
Talking and everybody was saying anything me you. I wrote
a four part series. Mo we all did it and
rightfully show. So it's the point of discussion. He's he
kind of found what mattered to him and what was
important and what stances he wanted to take and what
kind of a person he wanted to be through this,
(10:20):
And I think that's where he ended up landing. Yeah,
I want to be the guy that squashes it all
and shows up and is about football and lets my
work get me paid. And I commend him for that
because he could have gone a lot of different directions
like some others are right now.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
Yeah, I mean I I read the piece and I
combined that with what I saw Week seventeen against Kansas City. Yes,
the guy willing himself back onto the field in a
game that they had to win, where I'm sure there
are players who would have said, yeah, I'm good, you know,
go do this without me. And so you know, often
during the off season when he would come up, you know,
some wondered, well is he going to make a business decision?
(10:56):
And I go, Man, all I could do is tofur
to the track record that guy in New Year's even
Kansas City hurt, put himself back into the game and
did everything he could to help his team win, and
they didn't unfortunately, but still, and so it's funny when
you wrote your piece about the fan survey and tease
popularity dropped him going, god, I don't know man, First
(11:18):
of all that I kind of catch against the Vikes,
and then what he's did on New Year's Eve when
he was hurt and all right, he asked for a trade.
But find a lot of players do that. Yeah, you know,
that's okay. The bench just put a guy in the
ring of honor who's kind of known for having done
that a few times. Right, and then he signs the
franchise thing right when OTA's end and sort of lets
(11:40):
it known like I'm gonna play, I'm gonna here, I'm
gonna sho up, I'm gonna.
Speaker 2 (11:42):
Do my thing. Like how could you not like that guy?
Speaker 3 (11:45):
Yeah, And he's out there right now, he's been out
he's out there day one, you know, trying to catch
contested balls in the end in red zone drills with
guys laying around his legs and that's what it's gonna be.
And understanding that that's what it's gonna be, and willing
to go out there and put in the work and
realize that this is a year that he's just got
to kind of be about his business and have a
(12:06):
great year and help this team win the super Bowl,
and know that for both sides, for everyone, the best
thing involved is him to have a great year, they
win the Super Bowl, and he goes to free agency. Right, yeah,
all right, We're not going to talk about Jamar Chase anymore.
Yeah until what I guess, next Tuesday. Right next Tuesday,
will of course get our time in.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
But for the purposes of what we're doing here, there
are some other things I want to ask about.
Speaker 3 (12:28):
There are so many good things to talk about, like
so many fun conversation points Beyond this stuff.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
I would I can't tell you how excited I would
be to dive in.
Speaker 1 (12:37):
Except I feel like one of the things I've been
looking forward to I can't look forward to anymore.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
Okay, I'll tell you what it is when we come back.
Speaker 1 (12:44):
He's Paul Danner Junior covering the Bengals for the Athletic
check Out. The other Growler podcast was my episode with
Dave yesterday.
Speaker 2 (12:52):
The most recent or has there been one?
Speaker 3 (12:54):
Sense We have our training camp reports there up on
the YouTube page that every couple of days, I batch
those together and put them on the feed. So technically
no gotcha. But it's it is. It is up there.
There's lots up there. It's it's firing on all cylinders
right now.
Speaker 2 (13:08):
No question.
Speaker 1 (13:08):
Eighteen minutes after three o'clock. Oh, he's Paul Gleger with us.
This is the ESPN fifteen thirty, Cincinnati.
Speaker 2 (13:14):
Sports Station, Cincinnati's East.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
It's twenty three after three o'clock. ESPN fifteen thirty. Paul
Danner Junior's here typically on Tuesdays, but it's you know,
it's training camp, so when they practice on Tuesday, he
has to be there.
Speaker 3 (13:31):
They're not practicing today, so they are not they are
not no practice today, but back at it the next
couple of days. It's nice to have the pads portion
of the program here. Feels much more legitimate.
Speaker 2 (13:41):
Yeah, feels like actual football.
Speaker 4 (13:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:43):
Well, we were sort of you know, the offseason program
didn't matter, right, were right? We were told that, And
then turns out the first week doesn't really matter either
until the pads come on. That also, apparently is just
all setting up for things to really start. So now
we've kind of been clearly told that we're allowed to
start making judgments and opinions now, okay, So it's nice
to be able to do that rather than make stuff up.
Speaker 1 (14:05):
Is it's July thirty first, we haven't even turned not
even August yet, turn the calendar to August.
Speaker 2 (14:11):
Is the race for the Moegor Award over? Yeah, it's obvious.
This is what we talked. This is what I talked about.
It's over.
Speaker 3 (14:17):
When we did the phone conversation a couple weeks ago
and you asked me about andre Yoshibash and this award,
I discussed, I think you can win it if you're
you are so blowing away the previous expectations due to
your your success in the shorts and shirts portion of
(14:38):
the program.
Speaker 2 (14:40):
And I think he's doing that again.
Speaker 3 (14:42):
I mean, look, I was talking to Troy Walters the
other day and he said it plain as day. He's
probably our third best receiver. We had to find a
way to get him on the field. Like this guy,
the sixth round flyer out of the IVY League last year,
is is the guy who's gonna be not just filling in,
(15:05):
like I think you can see a path to him
just taking all of Tyler Boyd's snaps he's gonna be
a factor, like, yeah, he's gonna be a factor, Like
I mean, you're gonna have packages with guys or whatever.
But he has blown open a path to being the
guy as the third guy here.
Speaker 2 (15:24):
That's blowing away the expectations.
Speaker 3 (15:26):
I think that even some of the most optimistic andre
Yoshibash fans have had. And I think that started with
the moment they he said, move him into the slot,
something that was as far off of our radar as
anything could have been. A dude's never done this before
in his life, and they're like, he's just so good,
and see he appears to be a guy that could
handle it. Throw him in there and he says, yeah,
(15:49):
the first time my life there I was out there
and he's there. He is running away from Mike Hilton
a couple of times, catching some passes, and you're saying, Okay,
this could be the versatile inside outside piece they're looking
for a little bit.
Speaker 1 (15:59):
So for those who don't know, the Moegger Award, yes
goes to the wide receiver that is a little bit
off the grid that generates a lot of camp buzz
that we sort of annoying as like the next Jerry
Rice or Randy Moss, someone like that, and then ends
up not really doing anything.
Speaker 2 (16:16):
I think Andre wins the award.
Speaker 1 (16:18):
But what's interesting because I sit here while practice is happening,
and you know, in years past, I'll look at the
the audentate tweets and I'll roll my eyes.
Speaker 2 (16:29):
The andre Josbah stuff. Just it feels natural.
Speaker 1 (16:32):
It just it feels like you're two for a guy
that did some really good things his rookie season. Like
it feels like this is not a novelty that this
isn't it's not even that it's not even that big
of a revelation. Andre Yoshavash might be the third wide
receiver like that that has seemed all along like a
bona fide possibility.
Speaker 2 (16:50):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (16:50):
Kind of.
Speaker 2 (16:50):
The epilogue to the Moegger Award is usually.
Speaker 3 (16:54):
That the guy gets cut or something, right, you know,
practice squad doesn't do.
Speaker 2 (16:58):
Anything we never hear from again, right, or when.
Speaker 1 (17:01):
A bunch of guys get hurt he plays week thirteen
and then you know he drops two balls and right,
and and that's you.
Speaker 3 (17:07):
But this was it wasn't the case last year when
he laid a super solid foundation that you would expect
from a guy who's who's got the arrow pointing up.
And then certainly not when you consider what he looked
like this off season and the amount of work that
he put in and kind of just the background of
who he is.
Speaker 2 (17:25):
I mean, it's it now.
Speaker 3 (17:26):
Is has moved to me, has definitely moved out of
that realm of oh, here's a guy who happens to
look good in shorts and a T shirt. No, like
he he was drafted with the lottery ticket because he's
so big and strong for how fast he is and
the athlete that he is. If he ever put it together,
it could be something. And you're seeing him do just that,
(17:49):
put it together. And it's also how Joe Burrow talks
about him. Yeah, like trust gotta have it.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
I mean, like you hear quarterbacks, we'll talk about all
the receiving options and they let times try to be
really diplomatic and include as many names as possible.
Speaker 2 (18:03):
I don't get that sense when he talks.
Speaker 1 (18:05):
I get the sense that he's like, yeah, man, like
I'm gonna throw the football to andre Yosmash and he's
gonna make plays.
Speaker 3 (18:10):
You know why, because he did make plays for him
last year I mean there's Joe Burrow chasing down his
touchdown ball to make sure that he keeps it.
Speaker 2 (18:16):
I mean, when.
Speaker 3 (18:18):
Burrow finds that he can trust you in a game.
Aaron Rodgers used to be famous for this stuff, right, essentially,
just like training with players to test them over and
over and over again, in the moment he decides he
can trust you and does so in a game, it flips.
I wrote the story I wrote about the back shoulder
(18:40):
a couple of years ago. I will never forget it.
He talked about it as he loves it. It's the
biggest trust throw in football that you have to make
if a trust the other guy. And Hayden Hurst talking
about the moment that Burrow was willing to throw him
a back shoulder in a game he knew he had
Burrow's trust. You don't know until then. You don't know
until in a game he trusts you to make a
(19:01):
play and you make it for him, and you see
that happen or the opposite happens, and then that guy's
gone right like, and you know. It's It's how Trenton
Irwin has done so well here. It's and it's why
yoshibash I think you can continue to believe in because
last year you saw Burrow having trust in Andre. Yeah,
and and because he was rewarding it, and and that
matters big time around here. And you see it out
(19:23):
there on the field when they when they play together.
He kind of believes and he can be the guy
who Burrow says what he always says.
Speaker 2 (19:31):
I was gonna let my guy go make a play.
Speaker 1 (19:33):
All right, So we are declaring the race to win
the Moeger Award over. I'm gonna see if I can
make another declaration when we come back. Okay, it's twenty
nine minutes after three o'clock. He's Paul dainn Er Junior
on Moegar. You get you get off early because we
have the Tony Pike training camp up.
Speaker 3 (19:50):
Say down there now, I just I love that. I've
always loved the idea of him standing down there by
himself right now. We gave him, We gave him a
little bit of a break today. He said that he
can do it. Studio. Just let us know, like how
that maybe the groundskeepers are out there relining the field
and he's cutting the grass.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
He's got a newborns, two other kids, so I'm like,
look and he's got the responsibility of the training camp report,
so we figured we'll do him here in studio instead
of dispatching you down to the side. Guess it's a
three thirty. I'm Moegger. This is ESPN fifteen thirty, Cincinnati
Sports Station Trimsy three.
Speaker 4 (20:24):
Sixty years there, bringing you the orangein blackli like never
before from the Kettering host practice field beginning Bunday. A
note on ESPN fifteen thirty, the official home of the Bengals.
Speaker 1 (20:36):
Sports headlines and service off Kelsey Chevrolet, home of lifetime
powertrain protection and guaranteed credit approval from their family to
yours for life kelseyshev dot Com. Bengals went off day today,
which is why Paul Jayner Junior is here Reds and
Cubs tonight at GABP Cincinnati looking for a sweep. Nick
Lidolo Kyle Hendrick Tonight's seven ten, seven hundred WLW. The
(20:58):
US men's Olympic basketball team leads South Sudan forty six
to thirty one, three point fifteen to go in the
second quarter.
Speaker 2 (21:07):
Played the long game with South Sudan. They did.
Speaker 3 (21:09):
That's what they put them on. Notice you know that
used the first game is scouting now they lay the
hammer on them, not wasting any time.
Speaker 1 (21:19):
Not screwing around. You and I were talking off air
about the TBT. I encourage you to watch as many
the TBT. It's not good basketball, they're great sporting events.
Speaker 2 (21:30):
Yeah it is.
Speaker 1 (21:31):
There's a lot of unintentional hilarity with these games. I
encourage you to enjoy it.
Speaker 3 (21:36):
Yeah, whenever you get I feel like anytime you get
guys who just aren't really quite doing it anymore, the
same level, right, but get in that arena and then
try to revert to muscles and ability that previously existed,
you end up with a lot of questionable shall we say,
(21:58):
decision making. And I love the no authority head coach. Yes,
Like that's that's the best, the dude who has no
power but is asked to stand there and do something
that typically requires decision making.
Speaker 2 (22:10):
All for that. I love just the lack of ability to.
Speaker 1 (22:15):
Tomberlin starting their game, the nasty naty game over seventeen
and they're not being anybody to be like, all right, JC,
how about how about.
Speaker 2 (22:26):
Somebody else? Yeah? Just my guy just lifting them? Fantastic.
I've seen that show before. How wide is the gap
right now?
Speaker 1 (22:35):
Between DJ Turner and Dax Hill. Uh, because you wrote
glowingly about DJ.
Speaker 3 (22:41):
I did, I did, I would I wouldn't go I
wouldn't go cavernous. I wouldn't go cavernous. We can't declare
the race over. I know, okay, No, I wouldn't declare
it over. I think that DJ has had a really
solid start and kind of picked up where you would
have liked to have seen him leave off, Whereas I
just think Dax is starting from a little different place.
(23:03):
He's you know, talking, We talked to him the other day,
and he's talking about still trying to find total comfort
out there and taking these baby steps and believe that
it will come, but you know, still trying to build
that total comfort level in that move to the outside
corner spot, whereas DJ Turner doesn't have that and has
looked like a guy invigorated by this battle, felt the
(23:25):
pressure of that battle, and doing what you expect somebody
in year two to do. Now, I think that you
need to see that continue. DJ Turner is always going
to be a shorts and T shirts looking I mean,
he's a freak athlete. He's a little smaller. You're not
really concerned in that regard because you've seen him play
in the season, but you want to see that continue.
(23:48):
And so what happens as Dax gains more comfort and
confidence and the consistency level of DJ being able to
keep this going. There's plenty of time for all of
that one padded practice. But I do think to this point,
you know, he certainly looks like the leader in the
clubhouse by it by a decent margin.
Speaker 1 (24:08):
Tony Pike and I have talked about this. One of
the themes of the latter half of the season last year,
when the Bengals found ways to still function without Joe
Burrow was how do they blend the way they're playing
offense with the quarterback under center with how Joe Burrow
wants to play? From your standpoint, how how's that playing out?
(24:29):
Are we seeing? Are we seeing it take place with
with Dan Pitcher's fingerprints on it? Now?
Speaker 2 (24:34):
Obviously?
Speaker 1 (24:36):
Is that something still being actively discussed. What's all that
look like?
Speaker 2 (24:40):
Yeah, I think.
Speaker 3 (24:41):
We've seen a decent amount of you know, under center
play action wide zone, which which you know Ted Carris
was telling the other day that's that stuff you typically
see early in camp. Is is that type of a
just like basic running scheme, and he's like, we have
a lots of different schemes. But I do think when
(25:02):
you're talking about under center and play action, the ability
to do stuff wide zone or even RPO wide zone
type stuff off of that is is going to be
part of what you wanted to look like the stuff
that we saw Jake Browning do more of last year.
And so we've seen a lot of that and now
how much of that makes its way into the season
is is up up for debate. We've seen a lot
(25:23):
of multiple tight ends, which I think we anticipated. We've
seen jumbo looks with Amarius Mims as the third you know,
tackle slash tight end that which is pretty fun. Well,
it's so it's just weird to see him out because
he ends up you know, there's a chance he could
end up there just tracking down a safety or a corner.
Speaker 2 (25:46):
You just don't recommend that, you know, you know, and
I know, you know Mims.
Speaker 3 (25:51):
Somebody that was kind of a storyline yesterday because he
just he looked really good. He looks really good and
you you see it and he didn't overwhelmed and it's
just you're reminded the Bengals tweeted this out, But like,
I found myself drawn to him every play just watching
him envelop Miles Murphy, yeah or whoever, and it was
(26:13):
across from him. It was Murphy a lot who is
not small. Oh you know, Murphy's six five two sixty
five to seventy and Mim said, he's he's currently at
three fifty. So six eight three fifty. I mean, Murphy
is just getting eclipsed. You can see all of the
outside of Amarus Mims around this man as they he's
(26:35):
trying to bowl into him. You're just you're not moving him,
you see, and you see how wide. You know, the
the arc is that you've got to try to go
around if you want to, and his ability to just extend.
And Mims said he's got tons of people giving him advice,
and Frank Poul told me that the other day too,
but he said the best device he's gotten was from
Trent Brown, who said, just said, play big, play six
(26:58):
eight three fifty. Don't worry about it, think think about
anything else. Trust what you've been learning and and and
knowing as far as the playbook goes. But go play big,
use that reach, use that side. And you see him
doing it and it's hard not to. And with every
rep that you watch, the percentage chance that it's him
instead of Trent Brown ticks a little bit.
Speaker 2 (27:18):
You just see it. He looks comfortable out there.
Speaker 3 (27:21):
Again, it's early, it's one padded practice, but it's just
so natural and the size is so intimidating and demoralizing.
You know, Miles left yesterday's practice with cramps. But I
sort of thought to myself, I don't know, I might
be tapping out too if I had, If I knew
I had to go do that a few more times,
and I might be taking And we all feel like
(27:41):
Miles Murphy can play. I mean you know that because
it's not a Miles Murphy conversation. No, this is just
about you know, you can see it and what it
can be. He's got to go do it. He's got
to do it consistently. He's got to do it in
the preseason games. Long way to go for him. But man,
it has everybody has said that. You know, to this point,
he has really looked the part, and all these reps
(28:01):
have been super beneficial for him to keep getting in
there and really looking like the starting right tackle.
Speaker 1 (28:07):
A couple of things quickly because we got to get
to Tony Pike pre camp. When you were sort of
outlining position by position, you talked about the running back
spot kind of feeling incomplete and that being a place
that you would still look for them to maybe add
a veteran.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
You still feel that way, Yeah, I still think that's possible.
Speaker 3 (28:27):
I think that's something that would play out over the
course of camp and in a battle there that hasn't
even really begun. I SI they still really like what
they have in the top two with Moss and and Brown,
and I'm and are looking forward to seeing how that
plays out. But ye, the back of the room still
feels empty. It still feels like it could use another piece,
and there's lots of time for that to occur. I
(28:49):
think that would come from final cuts, whether you're talking
about a p Ryan or a veteran like a Jerry
McKinnon or whoever that would be available that they could
pluck and put onto the back roster.
Speaker 1 (29:00):
We talked in the middle of the dead period of
time about how when training camp starts, and you wrote
about this, how they handle kickoffs is going to be
one of the central storylines. It's what I'm looking forward
to most watching preseason football starting this week, just watching
how this plays out. Has that been something that we've
(29:21):
seen a lot of. Are they even working on it?
I mean, I'm sure they're working on it, But has
there been any glimpse into how the Bengals are going
to handle the new kickoff a little bit?
Speaker 3 (29:29):
I mean we've seen them run through it some, but
I don't know that we've seen specific schemes or plays
or things like that. Yeah, I mean maybe some, but
you get more a feel for personnel. You're seeing a
lot of the tight ends and the bigger guys out there,
not as many of the smaller guys along along the line,
(29:49):
And so that can tell you a little bit more
about maybe where that would lean and could could be
the difference someone making the team or not versus keeping
an extra dB or receiver versus keep being an extra
tight end or a line whatever. And and I think
you know, the weird kicks are going to be a
part of.
Speaker 2 (30:08):
It for now.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
I mean it's gonna you're seeing the practicing of that placement,
and we know hang time doesn't mean anything anymore, so
you're seeing more of these these low cornered kicks and
Evan trying to work on placement and things like that.
So yeah, I mean it's they're out there experimenting and
working with it, and you're so you're kind of judging
more personnel right now. I think in the games, it's
it's when you'll really start to see them go to play.
(30:32):
It's gonna be very funny, a reason to watch the
whole it is though.
Speaker 1 (30:35):
I mean, like legitimately, I said that to someone yesterday
because you know, I I go to a certain establishment
on Thursdays and I'm like, Hall of Fame game, I
want to watch the opening kickoff? Yeah, like really, like dude,
it's it's the first ever kick off with the new rule.
Speaker 2 (30:50):
I want to like, that's gonna.
Speaker 3 (30:51):
Be fun just to watch people on social media react
being like what the yes, that didn't know, or like.
Speaker 1 (30:58):
God, or that's yeah, that's my in laws rule who
like watch football. But like the first they're probably not
gonna be watching the Hall of Fame game. But like
the first Bengals game when I invariably get a text
like can you just explain to me what just happened? Yeah,
It's like when the Reds were on Roku the other day,
I had the same thing, like it's roku roku, you
can do it. Yeah. Uh, what is the coolest part
(31:19):
of the new locker room?
Speaker 3 (31:21):
Uh? I, you know, for a player's perspective, I think
the the little I guess take care is called them
the toaster ovens, the little heaters in the middle that
they have that can dry out your gloves in any
of your like stuff that gets wet and nasty in
your cleats and things like that. And then but for me,
it's that the events and all the air in there
(31:42):
that does that takes the smell out, blows it out
of the locker room instead of into the locker room,
so you don't get as much, well at least to
this point, Yeah, don't appear that you'll get as much
of the stank locker room smell.
Speaker 2 (31:56):
And boy, can I tell you how appreciative we all
are of that. What's next week's schedule?
Speaker 3 (32:04):
Well, next week's schedule, you're getting closer. I mean, you
got the game on the tenth, so we're we're getting
closer to the first you be in here. I don't
care about that.
Speaker 2 (32:12):
No, I don't know. I'll be either. I am here
next Tuesday. They're off on the.
Speaker 1 (32:15):
Sixth team will meet but no practice. Yes, okay, very good.
Back on Tuesday. See you then love it. Paul Danner Jr.
Read his work The T. Higgins Pieces, Terrifictheathletic dot Com,
his daily camp updates.
Speaker 2 (32:29):
The Growler Podcast wherever you get your podcast.
Speaker 1 (32:32):
We did an episode yesterday where we talked about Jamar
Chase and Aliens and the worst documentary.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
That I've ever seen. I still think you'd be a
great person to greet the aliens. We dive into that
incredible topic.
Speaker 1 (32:45):
A Growler Podcast, Balls Don't Lie Tony Pike Next, ESPN
fifteen thirty.
Speaker 2 (32:49):
Hey it's my
Mo Egger News
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