7/31/24 - The Mo Egger Radio Show - Mo Egger

Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station.How about that trade deadline? Is there
anything in all of sports in thiscity that gets talked about more that ends
up leaving us as unfulfilled emotionally asthe Major League Baseball trade deadline? Every

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year? Every year, the entireseason's a ramp up to the deadline.
What's gonna happen? What are theygonna do? And then it's not like
the Reds didn't do anything. Theydid some stuff, they did some stuff
that's okay. They didn't do anythingthat really excites anybody. And maybe that's
a problem, maybe it's not,But we're gonna talk about it. We'll
do that in the next hour becausePaul's here. Paul Daterter Junior is here

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now. Obviously, typically we dothis on Tuesdays, but the Bengals practiced
yesterday and Paul had to be thereto cover it for his job, which
is covering the Bengals Fortheathletic dot Comand the Growler Podcast. Go read Paul's
piece on t Higgins, which droppedthis morning. It's It's terrific. Go
get that at the Athletic dot comor ny Times dot com. Paul's on

(01:08):
x at Paul Danna Junior, Whatis up? What's going on? It's
going to be back here in thestudio with you, and you know I
missed our time together. It wasit was it was tough. It was
tough on me emotionally. But luckilyI've had things like Jamar Chase's hat to
keep me focused and and and content. Can I ask you, is it

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the same hat every day? Itappears to be. I got to say.
And someone noticed this yesterday, soI don't want to take credit for
it. This was a follower.Everyone was posting their videos, of course
of the new locker, of course, Yeah, and Jay had one up
that went had T Higgins and JamarChase's locker, and someone very astutely noticed

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that while everyone had helmets in thehelmet spot, that Jamar had his hat
in there, which I thought wasI hope Jamar did that to troll everyone.
We need that, So I'll justgo ahead and leave my hat right
in the spot where the helmet goes. I thought that was I thought that
was a nice touch. Well done. Yeah. I don't even think we
even I don't even think Jay evenrealized it that that that that had happened,

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but it was a perfect, perfectplacement. Well, I know you're
excited to be here, and Iknow you're excited for us to get a
chance to kind of get back intothe rhythm of chatting on a weekly basis.
Obviously covering camp might move things around. And I know you're really excited
to talk more about Jamar Chase.Yeah, really excited. There's the one
question, is he willing to missgames? Well, let's cut for all

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the stuff game it's the only thingthat matters. Is he willing to stare
down the Bengals to the point thathe goes fine Week one against the Pats?
You're doing it without me? Ithink his his camp would probably say
that today. M hmm, ButI doubt that that would actually play out

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that way. It just so rarelydoes, right, And I don't.
I don't and when And it's harder. It's even harder to do when you
have two years here. You know, like there's just your fight. It's
a very uphill battle on that celland with your teammates. I think everybody's
behind you getting your bag right.We've gotta do the bag talk. You

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gotta, you gotta everybody's behind you. Getting your money until it maybe starts
affecting their money, and the conversationand the looks and the peer pressure should
it be called, maybe changes alittle. I don't you know. Only
Jamar probably knows that. I wouldguess no, and I think the Bengals

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would probably guess know. But nobody, nobody can really say that except for
one person. And he was wearinga hat on the sidelines these days right
now. I you know, there'sjust there's no way to say for sure.
But my guess would be the waythat these things almost always go.
And the answer is no. Idon't think he will be willing to,
especially because he is around. Yeah, yeah, I mean, how weird

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is that he's he's around, He'sparticipating in everything but practice. Right,
He's doing meetings. You talked aboutthis with me on your podcast yesterday.
He's doing more than the bare minimum. So he's around and he's gonna continue
to be around, but not playingthe game. Yeah, like that just
seems it's it's one thing if theguy is nowhere to be seen and he's

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holding out and he's getting fined,and okay, I'm gonna take this stand
off as long as I can goI it seems bizarre to me to suggest
that he's around and then here's agame and he's still around wearing a hat,
but he's not gonna play in it. Yeah, I think the fact
that he is really kind of playingthe good soldier in every other respect probably

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tells you kind of about the toneof things right now where it's it doesn't
feel contentious despite the fact that he'snot participate and practice, And I think
that's fine. I mean, look, the two sides are are are talk,
They're they're communicating about what's going onhere. They're hopeful. I don't

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know whether anything's going to get doneor not so well while they do that,
no need to be out there chancethan anything. I get all that,
But at a certain point there's gonnabe a line of like, look,
here's where are Here's where we've endedup, here's where you've ended up.
Is either are you saying yes tothis or not? And after this
we're going forward with the season andlet's go play. And I think that's
I think that's you know, whenyou end up see the person show up

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and say all right, time togo play, and we'll talk about betting
on themselves and all of this otherstuff and what it could cost on the
line and if people want to getinto that type of dynamic. But for
now, I think it's stuff thatwe see Jesse Bates, Joe Mixon a
couple of years ago. It's happeningaround the league. It's this, it's

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that time of year, It's itis wear a hat and watch season.
It is like, let's see whoflinch's first season, because it really doesn't
matter that much, specifically for aguy like Jamar On one point, I'll
that I'll make on top of that. That I do think is interesting is
we've kind of talked about, youknow, following the Justin Jefferson model to

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get the Justin Jefferson money a littlebit, and oddly, this is not
what Justin Jefferson did in Minnesota lastyear. Justin Jefferson reported he was happy
by all counts and went out thereand said, well, you know,
I'd like to get a deal now, but I understand why I wouldn't and

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did all the stuff. Now wecan talk about what happened when he was
hurt in season or whatever, butat this time of year, didn't didn't
really go down this route. Somaybe that suggests things are different or that.
I think it's a little surprise,a little surprising in that regard because
I thought you just kind of followOkay, gonna just keep following the Jefferson
path to end up in the sameplace that he ended up. Maybe that

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does end up being the case,and this is one area where it's different,
but just to note that it isa little different. Yeah. Meanwhile,
I mentioned this, you wrote aboutT Higgins and T Higgins' mom.
Yeah, and you know, it'sinteresting for a guy who I think was
the most talked about figure as itrelates to the Bengals for months on end.
He's here, he's practicing, he'sgoing to play for the team under

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the franchise tag, and he's barelybeing acknowledged. I thought it was cool
that you brought him bracket back intofocus. And I would tell anybody who
kind of wonders about T Higgins andhis motivation for the season to read the
piece, because say what you wantabout what's happened between him and the Bengals,
if you want to take sides,I kind of understand both points.

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He just seems to get it.Yeah, Like he just he just seems
to get it and this was ahard spot. And what I came away
really intrigued by and kind of wantingto dig more into. Last week when
we talk to Tea was how hardthis kind of was for him to go
through. Like, we don't thinkabout it that way, especially when we

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start talking about money, people tuneout and oh god, how much money
do you need? And geez,what do we But I do think for
these guys, like a lot ofthem, and Tea and specifically in this
case, this is the first timethat they've had to go through something like
this, and he's like, Look, I'm an introvert. I'm a guy

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that keeps to myself. I don'twant the spotlight despite the spotlight position that
I play. I'm from a smalltown in Tennessee. Like this kind of
who he is, and anybody that'sgotten to know him a little bit of
you just knows that's kind of whohe's been. And here he is in
this like controversial spotlight, this witheveryone weighing in. Everybody's got an opinion

(08:48):
on whether he's worth it. Whois he really? I pointed out in
our fan survey, his popularity isthe second favorite. Bengal went down from
ten and a half percent to threeand a half percent. Yeah, in
one offseason when nothing changed except hewas the guy out there playing, doing
everything that he could and making anumber of big plays, including maybe the
best one of his entire careers inMinnesota. Like and so it's just that

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whole thing. It wears on ahuman being, man, Like, whether
whatever people want to hear that ornot or care these guys as people,
it wears on him. And Ithought his decision to be like not just
say, man, I just wantedto kill all the noise and squash all
that and come in and play footballand have it be about football again.
But the people around him kind ofbeing like, yeah, you worry about

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him when you go through this andyou see it wearing on him, and
you know. And I think itends with a cool message at the end
a little bit, and I wouldencourage people to read kind of the direction
that it goes. But you growa little bit, man, Like,
you go through stuff for the firsttime and you learn who you really are.
And I thought we as a asfans of a person, learned a

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little bit who T Higgins was.While everyone was talking and everybody was saying
anything me you. I wrote afour part series. Mo we all did
it and rightfully show. So it'sthe point of discussion. He's he kind
of found what mattered to him andwhat was important and what stances he wanted
to take and what kind of aperson he wanted to be through this,

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And I think that's where he endedup landing. Yeah, I want to
be the guy that squashes it alland shows up and is about football and
lets my work get me paid.And I commend him for that because he
could have gone a lot of differentdirections like some others are right now.
Yeah, I mean I I readthe piece and I combined that with what
I saw Week seventeen against Kansas City. Yes, the guy willing himself back

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onto the field in a game thatthey had to win, where I'm sure
there are players who would have said, yeah, I'm good, you know,
go do this without me. Andso you know, often during the
off season when he would come up, you know, some wondered, well
is he going to make a businessdecision? And I go, Man,
all I could do is tofur tothe track record that guy in New Year's
even Kansas City hurt, put himselfback into the game and did everything he

(11:05):
could to help his team win,and they didn't unfortunately, but still,
and so it's funny when you wroteyour piece about the fan survey and tease
popularity dropped him going, god,I don't know man, First of all
that I kind of catch against theVikes, and then what he's did on
New Year's Eve when he was hurtand all right, he asked for a
trade. But find a lot ofplayers do that. Yeah, you know,

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that's okay. The bench just puta guy in the ring of honor
who's kind of known for having donethat a few times. Right, and
then he signs the franchise thing rightwhen OTA's end and sort of lets it
known like I'm gonna play, I'mgonna here, I'm gonna sho up,
I'm gonna do my thing. Likehow could you not like that guy?
Yeah, And he's out there rightnow, he's been out he's out there

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day one, you know, tryingto catch contested balls in the end in
red zone drills with guys laying aroundhis legs and that's what it's gonna be.
And understanding that that's what it's gonnabe, and willing to go out
there and put in the work andrealize that this is a year that he's
just got to kind of be abouthis business and have a great year and
help this team win the super Bowl, and know that for both sides,

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for everyone, the best thing involvedis him to have a great year,
they win the Super Bowl, andhe goes to free agency. Right,
yeah, all right, We're notgoing to talk about Jamar Chase anymore.
Yeah until what I guess, nextTuesday. Right next Tuesday, will of
course get our time in. Butfor the purposes of what we're doing here,
there are some other things I wantto ask about. There are so
many good things to talk about,like so many fun conversation points Beyond this

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stuff. I would I can't tellyou how excited I would be to dive
in, except I feel like oneof the things I've been looking forward to
I can't look forward to anymore.Okay, I'll tell you what it is
when we come back. He's PaulDanner Junior covering the Bengals for the Athletic
check Out. The other Growler podcastwas my episode with Dave yesterday. The
most recent or has there been one? Sense We have our training camp reports

(12:56):
there up on the YouTube page thatevery couple of days, I batch those
together and put them on the feed. So technically no gotcha. But it's
it is. It is up there. There's lots up there. It's it's
firing on all cylinders right now,no question. Eighteen minutes after three o'clock.
Oh, he's Paul Gleger with us. This is the ESPN fifteen thirty,
Cincinnati Sports Station, Cincinnati's East.It's twenty three after three o'clock.

(13:20):
ESPN fifteen thirty. Paul Danner Junior'shere typically on Tuesdays, but it's you
know, it's training camp, sowhen they practice on Tuesday, he has
to be there. They're not practicingtoday, so they are not they are
not no practice today, but backat it the next couple of days.
It's nice to have the pads portionof the program here. Feels much more
legitimate. Yeah, feels like actualfootball. Yeah. Well, we were

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sort of you know, the offseasonprogram didn't matter, right, were right?
We were told that, And thenturns out the first week doesn't really
matter either until the pads come on. That also, apparently is just all
setting up for things to really start. So now we've kind of been clearly
told that we're allowed to start makingjudgments and opinions now, okay, So
it's nice to be able to dothat rather than make stuff up. Is

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it's July thirty first, we haven'teven turned not even August yet, turn
the calendar to August. Is therace for the Moegor Award over? Yeah,
it's obvious. This is what wetalked. This is what I talked
about. It's over. When wedid the phone conversation a couple weeks ago
and you asked me about andre Yoshibashand this award, I discussed, I

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think you can win it if you'reyou are so blowing away the previous expectations
due to your your success in theshorts and shirts portion of the program.
And I think he's doing that again. I mean, look, I was
talking to Troy Walters the other dayand he said it plain as day.

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He's probably our third best receiver.We had to find a way to get
him on the field. Like thisguy, the sixth round flyer out of
the IVY League last year, isis the guy who's gonna be not just
filling in, like I think youcan see a path to him just taking
all of Tyler Boyd's snaps he's gonnabe a factor, like, yeah,

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he's gonna be a factor, LikeI mean, you're gonna have packages with
guys or whatever. But he hasblown open a path to being the guy
as the third guy here. That'sblowing away the expectations. I think that
even some of the most optimistic andreYoshibash fans have had. And I think
that started with the moment they hesaid, move him into the slot,

(15:35):
something that was as far off ofour radar as anything could have been.
A dude's never done this before inhis life, and they're like, he's
just so good, and see heappears to be a guy that could handle
it. Throw him in there andhe says, yeah, the first time
my life there I was out thereand he's there. He is running away
from Mike Hilton a couple of times, catching some passes, and you're saying,
Okay, this could be the versatileinside outside piece they're looking for a

(15:58):
little bit. So for those whodon't know, the Moegger Award, yes
goes to the wide receiver that isa little bit off the grid that generates
a lot of camp buzz that wesort of annoying as like the next Jerry
Rice or Randy Moss, someone likethat, and then ends up not really
doing anything. I think Andre winsthe award. But what's interesting because I

(16:19):
sit here while practice is happening,and you know, in years past,
I'll look at the the audentate tweetsand I'll roll my eyes the andre Josbah
stuff. Just it feels natural.It just it feels like you're two for
a guy that did some really goodthings his rookie season. Like it feels
like this is not a novelty thatthis isn't it's not even that it's not

(16:41):
even that big of a revelation.Andre Yoshavash might be the third wide receiver
like that that has seemed all alonglike a bona fide possibility. Yeah.
Kind of. The epilogue to theMoegger Award is usually that the guy gets
cut or something, right, youknow, practice squad doesn't do anything we
never hear from again, right,or when a bunch of guys get hurt

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he plays week thirteen and then youknow he drops two balls and right,
and and that's you. But thiswas it wasn't the case last year when
he laid a super solid foundation thatyou would expect from a guy who's who's
got the arrow pointing up. Andthen certainly not when you consider what he
looked like this off season and theamount of work that he put in and
kind of just the background of whohe is. I mean, it's it

(17:26):
now. Is has moved to me, has definitely moved out of that realm
of oh, here's a guy whohappens to look good in shorts and a
T shirt. No, like hehe was drafted with the lottery ticket because
he's so big and strong for howfast he is and the athlete that he
is. If he ever put ittogether, it could be something. And
you're seeing him do just that,put it together. And it's also how

(17:49):
Joe Burrow talks about him. Yeah, like trust gotta have it. I
mean, like you hear quarterbacks,we'll talk about all the receiving options and
they let times try to be reallydiplomatic and include as many names as possible.
I don't get that sense when hetalks. I get the sense that
he's like, yeah, man,like I'm gonna throw the football to andre
Yosmash and he's gonna make plays.You know why, because he did make

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plays for him last year I meanthere's Joe Burrow chasing down his touchdown ball
to make sure that he keeps it. I mean, when Burrow finds that
he can trust you in a game. Aaron Rodgers used to be famous for
this stuff, right, essentially,just like training with players to test them

(18:32):
over and over and over again,in the moment he decides he can trust
you and does so in a game, it flips. I wrote the story
I wrote about the back shoulder acouple of years ago. I will never
forget it. He talked about itas he loves it. It's the biggest
trust throw in football that you haveto make if a trust the other guy.
And Hayden Hurst talking about the momentthat Burrow was willing to throw him

(18:52):
a back shoulder in a game heknew he had Burrow's trust. You don't
know until then. You don't knowuntil in a game he trusts you to
make a play and you make itfor him, and you see that happen
or the opposite happens, and thenthat guy's gone right like, and you
know. It's It's how Trenton Irwinhas done so well here. It's and
it's why yoshibash I think you cancontinue to believe in because last year you

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saw Burrow having trust in Andre.Yeah, and and because he was rewarding
it, and and that matters bigtime around here. And you see it
out there on the field when theywhen they play together. He kind of
believes and he can be the guywho Burrow says what he always says.
I was gonna let my guy gomake a play, all right, So
we are declaring the race to winthe Moeger Award over. I'm gonna see

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if I can make another declaration whenwe come back. Okay, it's twenty
nine minutes after three o'clock. He'sPaul dainn Er Junior on Moegar. You
get you get off early because wehave the Tony Pike training camp up.
Say down there now, I justI love that. I've always loved the
idea of him standing down there byhimself right now. We gave him,
We gave him a little bit ofa break today. He said that he

(19:59):
can do it. Studio. Justlet us know, like how that maybe
the groundskeepers are out there relining thefield and he's cutting the grass. He's
got a newborns, two other kids, so I'm like, look and he's
got the responsibility of the training campreport, so we figured we'll do him
here in studio instead of dispatching youdown to the side. Guess it's a
three thirty. I'm Moegger. Thisis ESPN fifteen thirty, Cincinnati Sports Station

(20:23):
Trimsy three sixty years there, bringingyou the orangein blackli like never before from
the Kettering host practice field beginning Bunday. A note on ESPN fifteen thirty,
the official home of the Bengals,sports headlines and service off Kelsey Chevrolet,
home of lifetime powertrain protection and guaranteedcredit approval from their family to yours for

(20:44):
life kelseyshev dot Com. Bengals wentoff day today, which is why Paul
Jayner Junior is here Reds and Cubstonight at GABP Cincinnati looking for a sweep.
Nick Lidolo Kyle Hendrick Tonight's seven ten, seven hundred WLW. The US
men's Olympic basketball team leads South Sudanforty six to thirty one, three point
fifteen to go in the second quarter. Played the long game with South Sudan.

(21:08):
They did. That's what they putthem on. Notice you know that
used the first game is scouting nowthey lay the hammer on them, not
wasting any time, not screwing around. You and I were talking off air
about the TBT. I encourage youto watch as many the TBT. It's
not good basketball, they're great sportingevents. Yeah it is. There's a

(21:30):
lot of unintentional hilarity with these games. I encourage you to enjoy it.
Yeah, whenever you get I feellike anytime you get guys who just aren't
really quite doing it anymore, thesame level, right, but get in
that arena and then try to revertto muscles and ability that previously existed,

(21:53):
you end up with a lot ofquestionable shall we say, decision making.
And I love the no authority headcoach. Yes, Like that's that's the
best, the dude who has nopower but is asked to stand there and
do something that typically requires decision making. All for that. I love just
the lack of ability to Tomberlin startingtheir game, the nasty naty game over

(22:18):
seventeen and they're not being anybody tobe like, all right, JC,
how about how about somebody else?Yeah? Just my guy just lifting them?
Fantastic. I've seen that show before. How wide is the gap right
now? Between DJ Turner and DaxHill. Uh, because you wrote glowingly

(22:41):
about DJ. I did, Idid, I would I wouldn't go I
wouldn't go cavernous. I wouldn't gocavernous. We can't declare the race over.
I know, okay, No,I wouldn't declare it over. I
think that DJ has had a reallysolid start and kind of picked up where
you would have liked to have seenhim leave off, Whereas I just think
Dax is starting from a little differentplace. He's you know, talking,

(23:04):
We talked to him the other day, and he's talking about still trying to
find total comfort out there and takingthese baby steps and believe that it will
come, but you know, stilltrying to build that total comfort level in
that move to the outside corner spot, whereas DJ Turner doesn't have that and
has looked like a guy invigorated bythis battle, felt the pressure of that

(23:25):
battle, and doing what you expectsomebody in year two to do. Now,
I think that you need to seethat continue. DJ Turner is always
going to be a shorts and Tshirts looking I mean, he's a freak
athlete. He's a little smaller.You're not really concerned in that regard because
you've seen him play in the season, but you want to see that continue.

(23:48):
And so what happens as Dax gainsmore comfort and confidence and the consistency
level of DJ being able to keepthis going. There's plenty of time for
all of that one padded practice.But I do think to this point,
you know, he certainly looks likethe leader in the clubhouse by it by
a decent margin. Tony Pike andI have talked about this. One of

(24:11):
the themes of the latter half ofthe season last year, when the Bengals
found ways to still function without JoeBurrow was how do they blend the way
they're playing offense with the quarterback undercenter with how Joe Burrow wants to play?
From your standpoint, how how's thatplaying out? Are we seeing?
Are we seeing it take place withwith Dan Pitcher's fingerprints on it? Now?

(24:33):
Obviously? Is that something still beingactively discussed. What's all that look
like? Yeah, I think we'veseen a decent amount of you know,
under center play action wide zone,which which you know Ted Carris was telling
the other day that's that stuff youtypically see early in camp. Is is

(24:56):
that type of a just like basicrunning scheme, and he's like, we
have a lots of different schemes.But I do think when you're talking about
under center and play action, theability to do stuff wide zone or even
RPO wide zone type stuff off ofthat is is going to be part of
what you wanted to look like thestuff that we saw Jake Browning do more
of last year. And so we'veseen a lot of that and now how
much of that makes its way intothe season is is up up for debate.

(25:22):
We've seen a lot of multiple tightends, which I think we anticipated.
We've seen jumbo looks with Amarius Mimsas the third you know, tackle
slash tight end that which is prettyfun. Well, it's so it's just
weird to see him out because heends up you know, there's a chance
he could end up there just trackingdown a safety or a corner. You

(25:45):
just don't recommend that, you know, you know, and I know,
you know Mims somebody that was kindof a storyline yesterday because he just he
looked really good. He looks reallygood and you you see it and he
didn't overwhelmed and it's just you're remindedthe Bengals tweeted this out, But like,
I found myself drawn to him everyplay just watching him envelop Miles Murphy,

(26:11):
yeah or whoever, and it wasacross from him. It was Murphy
a lot who is not small.Oh you know, Murphy's six five two
sixty five to seventy and Mim said, he's he's currently at three fifty.
So six eight three fifty. Imean, Murphy is just getting eclipsed.
You can see all of the outsideof Amarus Mims around this man as they

(26:33):
he's trying to bowl into him.You're just you're not moving him, you
see, and you see how wide. You know, the the arc is
that you've got to try to goaround if you want to, and his
ability to just extend. And Mimssaid he's got tons of people giving him
advice, and Frank Poul told methat the other day too, but he
said the best device he's gotten wasfrom Trent Brown, who said, just

(26:55):
said, play big, play sixeight three fifty. Don't worry about it,
think think about anything else. Trustwhat you've been learning and and and
knowing as far as the playbook goes. But go play big, use that
reach, use that side. Andyou see him doing it and it's hard
not to. And with every repthat you watch, the percentage chance that

(27:15):
it's him instead of Trent Brown ticksa little bit. You just see it.
He looks comfortable out there. Again, it's early, it's one padded
practice, but it's just so naturaland the size is so intimidating and demoralizing.
You know, Miles left yesterday's practicewith cramps. But I sort of
thought to myself, I don't know, I might be tapping out too if

(27:37):
I had, If I knew Ihad to go do that a few more
times, and I might be takingAnd we all feel like Miles Murphy can
play. I mean you know thatbecause it's not a Miles Murphy conversation.
No, this is just about youknow, you can see it and what
it can be. He's got togo do it. He's got to do
it consistently. He's got to doit in the preseason games. Long way
to go for him. But man, it has everybody has said that.
You know, to this point,he has really looked the part, and

(28:00):
all these reps have been super beneficialfor him to keep getting in there and
really looking like the starting right tackle. A couple of things quickly because we
got to get to Tony Pike precamp. When you were sort of outlining
position by position, you talked aboutthe running back spot kind of feeling incomplete
and that being a place that youwould still look for them to maybe add

(28:22):
a veteran. You still feel thatway, Yeah, I still think that's
possible. I think that's something thatwould play out over the course of camp
and in a battle there that hasn'teven really begun. I SI they still
really like what they have in thetop two with Moss and and Brown,
and I'm and are looking forward toseeing how that plays out. But ye,
the back of the room still feelsempty. It still feels like it

(28:44):
could use another piece, and there'slots of time for that to occur.
I think that would come from finalcuts, whether you're talking about a p
Ryan or a veteran like a JerryMcKinnon or whoever that would be available that
they could pluck and put onto theback roster. We talked in the middle
of the dead period of time abouthow when training camp starts, and you

(29:06):
wrote about this, how they handlekickoffs is going to be one of the
central storylines. It's what I'm lookingforward to most watching preseason football starting this
week, just watching how this playsout. Has that been something that we've
seen a lot of. Are theyeven working on it? I mean,
I'm sure they're working on it,But has there been any glimpse into how
the Bengals are going to handle thenew kickoff a little bit? I mean

(29:29):
we've seen them run through it some, but I don't know that we've seen
specific schemes or plays or things likethat. Yeah, I mean maybe some,
but you get more a feel forpersonnel. You're seeing a lot of
the tight ends and the bigger guysout there, not as many of the
smaller guys along along the line,And so that can tell you a little

(29:49):
bit more about maybe where that wouldlean and could could be the difference someone
making the team or not versus keepingan extra dB or receiver versus keep being
an extra tight end or a linewhatever. And and I think you know,
the weird kicks are going to bea part of it for now.
I mean it's gonna you're seeing thepracticing of that placement, and we know

(30:12):
hang time doesn't mean anything anymore,so you're seeing more of these these low
cornered kicks and Evan trying to workon placement and things like that. So
yeah, I mean it's they're outthere experimenting and working with it, and
you're so you're kind of judging morepersonnel right now. I think in the
games, it's it's when you'll reallystart to see them go to play.
It's gonna be very funny, areason to watch the whole it is though.

(30:34):
I mean, like legitimately, Isaid that to someone yesterday because you
know, I I go to acertain establishment on Thursdays and I'm like,
Hall of Fame game, I wantto watch the opening kickoff? Yeah,
like really, like dude, it'sit's the first ever kick off with the
new rule. I want to like, that's gonna be fun just to watch
people on social media react being likewhat the yes, that didn't know,

(30:56):
or like god, or that's yeah, that's my in laws rule who like
watch football. But like the firstthey're probably not gonna be watching the Hall
of Fame game. But like thefirst Bengals game when I invariably get a
text like can you just explain tome what just happened? Yeah, It's
like when the Reds were on Rokuthe other day, I had the same
thing, like it's roku roku,you can do it. Yeah. Uh,

(31:18):
what is the coolest part of thenew locker room? Uh? I,
you know, for a player's perspective, I think the the little I
guess take care is called them thetoaster ovens, the little heaters in the
middle that they have that can dryout your gloves in any of your like
stuff that gets wet and nasty inyour cleats and things like that. And
then but for me, it's thatthe events and all the air in there

(31:41):
that does that takes the smell out, blows it out of the locker room
instead of into the locker room,so you don't get as much, well
at least to this point, Yeah, don't appear that you'll get as much
of the stank locker room smell.And boy, can I tell you how
appreciative we all are of that.What's next week's schedule? Well, next

(32:04):
week's schedule, you're getting closer.I mean, you got the game on
the tenth, so we're we're gettingcloser to the first you be in here.
I don't care about that. No, I don't know. I'll be
either. I am here next Tuesday. They're off on the sixth team will
meet but no practice. Yes,okay, very good Back on Tuesday.
See you then love it. PaulDayner Jr. Read his work The T.
Higgins Pieces, Terrifictheathletic dot Com,his daily camp updates The Growler Podcast

(32:30):
wherever you get your podcast. Wedid an episode yesterday where we talked about
Jamar Chase and Aliens and the worstdocumentary that I've ever seen. I still
think you'd be a great person togreet the Aliens. We dive into that
incredible topic a Growler Podcast. BallsDon't Lie Tony Pike next to ESPN fifteen
thirty. Hey, it's my laborart. This's just a training camp report

(32:52):
brooke to you by Kimber Credit Unionunder ESPN fifteen thirty, the official home
of the Bengals. You know youhear that liner that we run that says
no one covers the Bengals like ESPNfifteen thirty. In proof of this is
we are doing live training camp reportseven though the Bengals aren't practicing today.
They're off, but we're not.Tony Pike is here. We didn't dispatch

(33:16):
you to the venue formerly known asPaul Rails Stadium, parking might have been
easier today, parking might have beena little bit easier. But since there's
no practice, we figured we woulddo a live training camp report with you
here in studio. It's good foryou to stick around. This is awesome.
Yeah, I should do this more. You should, especially with three
little kids at home, for anyreason to stick around. Yeah, good,

(33:36):
I understand that. All right,you've been at all these practices yesterday,
first padded workout. The one differentdynamic is the Bengals do have a
new offensive coordinator and Dan Pitcher.Have you seen anything that would reveal how
his fingerprints are going to be onthe offense so far? Yeah, I
think they have carried over the successthey had at the end of last year
with Jake Browning of the under centerwork, and it was talked about during

(34:00):
the end of the season last year, and that was kind of doubled down
upon in the offseason of this iskind of what we want to do more
of. We want to be moreversatile, we want to get under center.
They didn't do it a ton lastyear with Joe Burrow. So far,
and it's a smaller sample size.There's only one day of full padded
practices, but they are running aton of under center stuff, and they're
running under center with the idea toget Chase Brown and Zach Moss downhill.

(34:23):
And they're also running it with aton of play action, both play actions
setting up in the pocket and playaction where you're resetting the pocket and getting
outside the tackle box. And indoing so, I think it's really shed
a light on the upgrade in boththe running back and the tight end room.
They're utilizing both of those positions aton, but opening up what this

(34:43):
offense can be from under center,which we saw so much of from Jake
Browning. At least for now,that has translated to the early part of
camp. Yeah, you talk aboutthe running back room. It's obviously the
first training camp since twenty sixteen.The Bengals haven't had Joe Mixon, right,
and we all know what Joe coulddo to me, Like the last
couple of years, we spent alot more time talking about what he couldn't
do, and I don't think wedo that as much with Chase Brown and

(35:07):
Zach Moss. Acknowledging that Zach Mossis probably in the grand scheme of things
somewhere around the middle of the tierrunning back. But I feel like with
both him and Chase we're not immediatelycrossing off the list of things that they
can't do, which is what wedid the last couple of years with Joe
Mixon. Chase Brown has wowed acouple times at camp already with his breakaway

(35:28):
speed. Zach Moss we talked aboutit on Sincy three sixty a couple of
weeks ago the off season Hard Knockswith the New York Giants. There was
a scene where the Giants personnel wastalking about running backs and they were extremely
high on Zach Moss, and thatkind of validated, Okay, this is
why the Bengals were high on them. Other teams were also high on them.
But the main difference is is we'renot having a daily conversation of was

(35:52):
this the year that Joe Mixon isgoing to be able to pass protect?
Yeah? And if not, howmuch of the hand do you tip when
you have to run a different runningback out there on third down or on
passing situations or two minute drill somej P. Ryan For a year and
now you have, in my opinion, two running backs that have shown the
ability early through training camp to haveideas in pass protection and also to be

(36:14):
used in the passing game. Ithink I think they will be utilized,
both Chase Brown and Zach Moss waymore in the passing game than what we're
used to because teams are going tohave to vacate and get depth. There's
too much speed with Burton and Chaseand Higgins and Gasiki now stretching the field.
There's too many threats down the field. You've got to get depth.

(36:36):
And when you do, Joe Burrowis going to take those checkdowns all day
with two very capable backs. Andyou mentioned Gasiki, and you and I
talked about him specifically a little bityesterday, but it is a different type
of tight end room with him inthere. Well, it's a different type
with him. And then yesterday forthe first day, eric Al made his
appearance and made it in a bigway, multiple catches. He is that
they couldn't be different from a bodytype standpoint. If you've not been down

(37:00):
to practice or seeing you would havetrouble identifying Mike Kasiki. I've had multiple
what what numbers eighty seven is eightyFive'm like, no, it's eighty eight,
and they're like, that's a tightend because he's so thin, he's
slender. You could see why hedoesn't want to block Eric all and it's
not making it comparison to the player. He is more the body type of
like Mark Andrews right, looks likea tight end, looks like a tight

(37:22):
end. And yesterday and day oneof him being able to practice flashed with
some really good small window catches.So you got a little bit of like
the thunder and lightning at tight end. You got the prototypical big tight end
who can also show the ability togo catch the ball. And you got
a guy Mike Kasiki who, inmy opinion I mentioned with you yesterday,
I think he can make a caseto be the third leading receiver on this

(37:43):
team. All right, thank youso much, Tony Pikele. I'll be
back with us coming up at fourforty five. Bengals are not practicing today,
but to our commitment to giving youthe best possible coverage of training camp
means we still do live updates evenwhen the Bengals aren't on the field.
The trade deadline came and went.I have thoughts. I bet you do
too. We'll get to them nexton ESPN fifteen thirty This report is sponsored

(38:07):
official home for the Cincinnati Banks Today. Fifteen thirty. What's up, Mouegger,
ESPN fifteen thirty. Let's get backto the Jamar Chase thing a little
bit later on. Let's get backto Tony Pike a little bit later on.
Let's hear from Brenivan and Jones alittle bit later on, all that

(38:27):
stuff coming up in the four o'clockhour and phone calls. We started the
show by having Paul Danner Junior here, so obviously we were pretty much all
Bengals with him. Had the Redsthe Reds, had the Reds done something
earth shattering or needle moving or overlyimpactful, maybe I would have punted Paul

(38:49):
a few minutes and started the showby talking about what the Reds did.
But the reality is the Reds didn'tdo much that really moves the needle.
That's not to say they had anunproductive last couple of days. It's not
to say that the Reds took thewrong approach over the last couple of days.
But are the twenty twenty four Redsbetter right now than they were let's

(39:15):
say a week ago. Are theybetter positioned from a roster perspective right now
than they were a week ago.The answer is not yes now. The
answer maybe yes if they get somehurt guys back soon. But like I
would love to see Matt McLain playbaseball this year, it still feels like

(39:36):
him playing baseball for the Reds intwenty twenty four is something that's not gonna
happen really anytime soon, and timeis of the essence. But is this
team from a roster perspective today,forget where they are in the standings in
relation to where they were a weekago. Is this team's roster right now
better than it was a week ago? I don't know how The answer is

(40:01):
yes. Are the twenty twenty fiveReds next year's team better today than they
were a week ago? Did theydo anything over the last couple of days
that would make you feel like,you know, as much as this season

(40:21):
has been kind of disappointing and somewhatmaddening, their better positioned to really win
next year? There's no way theanswer is yes. So with the trade
deadline itself, let's be honest,nothing got accomplished, Nothing of any real

(40:43):
substance got accomplished. That doesn't meanthat Joey Weimer can't turn out to be
a useful piece, but based onhis relatively limited big league track record,
I don't know that you look athim and Joey Weimer in the lineup next
year. I mean, we we'llfind out what he can do, and
hopefully he stick and hopefully he canbe productive. So it just it feels

(41:05):
like if we just bottle this frameof time, this time frame the days
leading up to in the immediate aftermathof the trade deadline, it feels like
the Reds really just sort of drifted. They just have kind of existed.
Tony and Austin played some of thisaudio. I am leaving out the part

(41:28):
where Nick Krawl seemed completely unprepared totalk about the guy the Reds got from
the Boston Red Sox because I don'tthink it's because I don't expect Nick Krawl
to know a lot about a guywho is playing a ball. I don't.
I would like to think that hewould understand the question is coming enough
that he could talk to whoever inthe organization knows the most about the guy

(41:51):
the Reds got from Boston who isplaying a ball. That's a preparedness thing.
I don't really care that much aboutthat, to be honest with you,
it's funny. But here's the cruxof what he had to say with
reporters last night. After the tradedeadline came and went on a night where
the Reds won their second straight game, a six or three victory over the
Cups. Tarran go ahead and hitthat tarn. Hello, yes, sir,

(42:22):
can you play the net crawl audio? Different phone call? And do
you feel like you achieved them orat least a lot of them? Yeah?
I mean, look, our goalwas not to just dismantle this team.

(42:43):
You know, we did that intwenty two and when we had to
go through a full rebuild. Thisis about, hey, how can we
continue to push forward right now?But also, you know, look at
it from a long term outlook.Were there any other moves that you felt
might go down here before the deadlineand you thought you were closing in on
Yeah, there were there were oneor two that we thought we were getting
close. Did you just run outof time but you just didn't like the

(43:07):
terms and you said to walk awayor was it just amount of time?
Uh? No, it was morethat teams decided to go in a different
direction. Uh, than they likedthe offer somewhere else better. I know
you've been asked us a few timesover the last couple of weeks, but
the market for Jonathan how was it? Was it not there or you guys
just decided he's a piece you wantto keep. Yeah, I'm not going
to comment on the market. Butat the same time, he's a player

(43:28):
that's been an impactful player for thisteam, and you know he brings he
brings a lot of qualities to thisteam right now and hopefully gives us our
best chance to win this year.How big of a goal was it to
build organizational depth through the trade deadline? Did do you feel like that was
one factor that maybe yeah, Imean always send to it. I guess

(43:49):
that wasn't something Organizational depth was notsomething we were just looking towards. I
mean, obviously you want to continueto grow that, but that wasn't our
That wasn't a big goal of ours. Do you see Judas as a starter
or bull piece? He's bullpen piece? Okay, he said earlier. You
didn't want to dismantle the team andhe just got in the thought process of
even not training another reliever or aposition player. No, one probing to

(44:10):
in this direction. Finally in theselling direction. Yeah, I mean,
like if I don't I didn't wantto put a bunch of younger players on
the rosters just to put younger playerson the roster. We've got a good
group of veterans. We could havetraded three or four more relievers if we
really wanted to and go down thatroad. But look, this team's got
right now has a positive forty onerun differential. I know that we've haven't

(44:30):
won, and we haven't won thegames we should have won. We do
have a shot. We've played well. We've got guys like McClain coming back,
Pagan coming back. We've got guysthat are going to come back that
are going to help this team.And you know, we want to be
able to at least give this teama shot to you know, push towards
the postseason. Then the other side, like you know, nine yet more
and nineteen the eight dow How strongof the consideration was it to make an

(44:52):
aggressive mood with the guy with theveteran because there were some guys like that
who were adults this year. Yeah, we we made some offers and you
know, at the end of theday, we came up short. I
don't know, man, Like Idon't, I don't know. I'll be
completely honest with you. I'm kindof in the react and form an opinion

(45:14):
business. I don't. I don'tknow. I believe that if deep down
inside, Nick Krawl and the peoplewho work for him and the people that
Nick Crawl works for, felt likethis team had a legitimate chance to make
the postseason, legitimate chance to makethe postseason, that they would have done
more than what they did. Like, nobody expected a total teardown. Total

(45:37):
teardown. I mean that would haveinvolved trading away players at the Reds control
for years to come. That wasthe core of the team was. Whatever
they did, whatever the approach was, the core foundational part of the club
was was going to remain intact.I guess. I don't know, man,

(45:58):
I guess Right now, there's onlytwo questions that matter. One is
about twenty twenty four. They playtheir one hundred and eighth game tonight,
So tonight they hit the two thirdsmark of the season. Does anybody believe
that this team is currently constructed canmake a run and play in October and

(46:22):
as well as they did play thelast couple of nights, and I think
the team itself deserves a measure ofcredit for how they performed on a bullpen
night last night, with a lotof stuff going on, beat a bad
Cubs team. Is this team iscurrently constructed gonna make a run? Probably

(46:43):
not? If you believe the answeris yes, well, wouldn't you have
liked to have seen a more concertedeffort than aimed at giving this team an
even better chance at making a run. The other question that I think matters
a little bit more is we talkedabout this a little bit yesterday, how

(47:06):
are they going to improve their chancesof winning in twenty twenty five? Because
let's be honest, if we're doingthis same song and dance a year from
now, then it's gonna be fairto really wonder is the plan working.
We can give them credit if youwant. Jason Williams does it in the
Inquirer today, gives them credit forsticking to the plan. I have some
thoughts on that. But if we'redoing this in a year, if we're

(47:31):
sitting here in the run up orthe immediate aftermath of the trade deadline,
still shrugging our shoulders wondering, well, when are they actually going to be
in a position to actually win something, and are they buyers and sellers?
And does it make sense to justsort of drift in the middle, Like
then the shape and tone of theconversation is going to be a lot different.

(48:00):
I want a credit where I gotthis because they did the aggregation for
me. Doug Gray, who's awesomeredleignation dot com, put together a compilation
and in his piece on what theReds did around the deadline, and compiled
what some of the national figures aresaying. ESPN's Bradford Doolittle actually listed the

(48:22):
Reds among the trade deadlines winners,although, as Doug points out, he
begins his piece on the Reds bywriting, quote, the Reds dare the
Reds did the bare minimum? TheReds did the bare minimum. Jim Bowden

(48:43):
for the Athletic gave the Reds deadlinedeals a C. They did grading A
through F a C, writing quote, the Reds didn't get better at the
deadline, but they did save somemoney. So for those of you who
are invested in the bottom line,I guess a bit of a win for
you. Stephen jay Nesbit of theAthletic notes quote the Reds didn't do anything

(49:09):
and writes quote, they can makea run, but they're not on that
track. This week didn't change that. I think that clocks had pretty good
Doug points out over at MLB dotcom they had a lot of articles on
the deadline deals, but the Redsweren't mentioned in the winner's article nor in
the twelve most impactful deal's article.Take that for what it's worth. By
the way, again, thank youDoug for doing the work for me.

(49:34):
I guess the word that comes tomind, specifically as it relates to the
deadline is is passive. Passive?Now for me, I don't focus as
much on the deadline as I dothe approach since the season began, and
like the Matt McClain thing went downand the Reds tried to get somebody who

(49:57):
could help them. In Santiago,Espinal was the guy who had four hits
last night. It's good for him, but I hate to keep beating this
drum. I hate to keep beatingthis horse. In the spring, in
early May, it was abundantly clearinjuries were going to impact this team.

(50:21):
I think it was abundantly clear theywere going to need some help from the
outside in order to really have achance to contend. Did the Reds then
do anything bold to make their teambetter? Was there an effort? And
again, the obvious example I've usedit often is when the Marlins hit the
eject button on the season very earlyand traded Luisa Rayes. Was an attempt

(50:45):
even made to go get Jazz chishmjas Chism is not a perfect players off
to a killer start for the Yankees, but I understand the reservations that people
had about him, But like insteadit was, you know, the collection
of has beens or never will be'sthat we've gets cycled through the team this
year. I think the word thathas come to mind often has just been

(51:06):
passive, right, They're just they'repassive. And again, I don't think
anybody they were never gonna have afire sale. They didn't have enough pieces
that you would put in a firesale. And maybe this team wasn't good
enough this season to necessitate a big, bold move aimed specifically at playing in
the World Series this year, AndI think that's a fair assessment. But

(51:30):
nothing was done in the months subsequentto the trade deadline to give this team
a puncher's chance to get to thetrade deadline in a position where you then
could make the case that they shouldbe clear cut buyers. And since they
did sort of wave the white flag, and I know they acquired Ty France
and Joey Weimer, and that's fine. I have no issue with any of

(51:52):
that. But the message sent bywhat they did, specifically with Frankie Montas,
was we are punting on this season. So if you're punting on the
season, then the questions will comeabout the next season. What's gonna happen
between now and spring training next yearto make you and I believe this team
has a bona fide chance of winningin twenty twenty five. And if we

(52:15):
are doing this same song and danceas it relates to the Reds and the
deadline and where they are in thestandings and trying to figure out like at
some point they have to be good, like at some point we have to
all agree on their good and thenwe can debate what direction they should go
in. Over the last two months, we've debated NonStop whether they're good.

(52:38):
It's like debating whether you can affordsomething. If you have to ask if
you can afford something, chances areyou can't. If you have to ask
Are we good or not? Chancesare you're not the plan We'll have delivered
a payoff when in late summer,in late July, early August, we
don't have to wonder are they good. We know they're good. If a

(52:58):
year from now we're still wondering arethey good? Are we gonna say the
plans working or not? Five pointthree seven four nine, fifteen thirty,
twenty minutes after four. Uh,there's only one question as it relates to
Jamar Chase. We'll get to that. We have folks waiting. I'll get
to you next ESPN fifteen thirty.It is twenty three after four o'clock ESPN

(53:19):
fifteen thirty. I'm Oegar, Brenemanand Jones on baseball a little bit later
on plus Tony Pike another live trainingcamp UPD eight. They are headed to
the fourth quarter in Paris. TeamUSA Men's hoops leads UH South Sudan seventy
three to fifty seven. BAM outof Bayo has been terrific in this game.
UH seven of eight from the field, you have scored sixteen. South
Sudan more than holding its own onthe glass. In fact, they've out

(53:43):
rebounded the US and They've done areally good job on the offensive glass seventy
three fifty seven headed to the fourthquarter, and yet I'm now out on
the elam ending and thank god theydon't have that in US Olympic play or
an Olympic play. Not in USOlympic play. We have Pat and my
mouse here. Make it work.Good, Pat, you're on ESPN fifteen

(54:05):
thirty. Thank you for waiting.How are you? No, I'm great?
How are you never been better inmy life? I'm so glad to
hear that. I have two pointsfor you one, Paige mar Chase,
please here. There was a quote. This is from Eric Musselman, coach
of USC Southern cal he he heattributed Peyton Manning, who attributed Marvin Harris

(54:36):
saying, they pay you to practicethe games we pay we play for free
rather and I think that maybe thatcould be the difference between the mindset of
a great and a good player.Marvin Harrison obviously a Hall of Fame receiver.

(54:57):
Peyton Manning obviously I don't have totell you this. You know T
Higgins right now is on the fieldplaying for the franchise tag. Why,
well, he was paid and he'sgoing to practice and I feel that that
same sentiment would carry over to JamarChase, who you know, statistically probably

(55:21):
the better receiver. Second point,something that you said before you took your
own personal All Star break the Wednesdaybefore you left, in reaction to Hunter
Green's appearance in the All Star Game, you decided that you weren't gonna produce

(55:43):
a hot take. And I thinkthat that is what separates you and Tony
and Audi and the Cincinnati sports mediafrom a lot of the nation. You're
you're you're not about hot takes,and that goes a long way with your
listeners. Thank you, absolutely,absolutely. Unfortunately, on Tuesday, the

(56:05):
day before, the day prior,you made the comment, however, off
handed on the locks of the daywith Tony and Aughty and yeah, I
know, I'm sorry you you saidyou included Hunter Green in a comment saying
Hunter Green is a generational pitcher.You included him with that dude in Pittsburgh

(56:29):
who is, without question a generationaltalent. I do not think that Hunter
Green is a generational talent. Ithink he is a really good picture.
I think we have three really goodstarting pitchers when Lodola was healthy. Obviously,
I think that this is a pitchingstaff that can carry a really good

(56:52):
team to you know, playoff success. I do not. However, you
know you said yesterday that you werelooking for debates, healthy debate. Yeah.
Yeah, Hunter Green is not agenerational pitcher. That's my point of
contention with you. Well, Iwill admit this. I'm not sure what

(57:15):
the precise definition of generational talent is, but I know that when you're coming
out of high school and folks aretalking about you perhaps being the number one
overall pick, which obviously Hunter wasn'the was number two, and ultimately being
the face of a team or oneof the faces of the sport, that

(57:37):
doesn't get attached to you if you'renot viewed as uber special. You know,
the Reds took a picture with thesecond pick in the draft this year,
a lot of debates about whether ornot they should. I don't hear
anybody calling him a generational talent,right, Guy's got a lot of upside,
could be in a big league rotationand have a terrific career, but
viewed differently than a guy like HunterGreen. I think any of us who

(57:58):
have watched the two would admit paulsis better. Paul Skeenes might be the
best pitcher in the sport right now, but to me, is a generational
talent. Is a guy that canhave almost instant success, which you know
Hunter hasn't had. But the successhas been pretty damn quick relatively speaking.
He continues to get better and he'sthe kind of guy that you want to
invest in moving forward. And Idon't think anybody believes the Reds are gonna

(58:21):
lock in Hunter Green for the remainderof his career, but they get him
for a huge chunk of his prime. If that's not generational, then I
think we're debating semantics, you know. I mean, at the end of
the day, if you're a Redsfan, you thrilled that Hunter Green is
a part of what they're doing movingforward. How is the answer? No,
would you rather have Paul Skeanes Ifyou said, okay at Paul Skins

(58:43):
or Hunter Green? To take PaulSkeenes. But I mean, are you
thrilled with Hunter Green? I am? And is that enough? It should
be? Well? His growth thisseason has certainly been more than enough for
me to be convinced that he isis the top the type of guy that
this organization needs at the top ofthe rotation having those other guys behind them

(59:07):
obviously, that's you know, that'sthat's excellent as well. You won't hear
me complain about Hunter or about anyof any of those those top three pitchers
on their staff. No, Andthat's I mean. And that is the
one thing that I think to adegree mutes whatever anger there is about the

(59:28):
deadline or how the season is unfolded, is when the dust settles on twenty
twenty four and we start to lookahead to next year, We're gonna feel
pretty good about that. We're gonnafeel like, you know what, no
matter what they do, they'll havea chance, assuming you know, and
Nick Ldolo has to establish a trackrecord of health. But if if you
have those three guys and you're you'rebuilding twenty twenty five on the on that

(59:50):
foundation, that's pretty good. Thereare a lot of teams with an eye
toward twenty twenty five that can't saythat. And you have to acknowledge that
even if you are frustrated with everythingthat's taken place over the last couple of
months, well, I promise youthat I'm not frustrated with the Reds.
This is kind of exactly where Iexpected them to be at this point.

(01:00:10):
You know, I thought, whengoing back to when Ellie threw that ball
away against the Scillies back in Mayor April whenever it was, and people
were calling for him to be sentdown or moved to the outfield or whatever
the case was. This is aextremely young team. You know, maybe
they're not going to get to thatcontingent for the division this season. Maybe

(01:00:35):
they're not. Do they have thetalent to do so? Fully healthy?
Sure? You know we missed eightygames of Noelvie Marte. Is is he
the answer? I don't know.I don't know, but he has shown
the talent in his very short,you know, very short career at the

(01:00:57):
major league level that he's got thetalent to be that guy. And I'm
very optimistic with the Reds moving forward. And somebody else said this earlier today
with Tony and Austin, and Idon't remember who it was, and I
apologize for that, but you know, they were talking about pumping the brakes,
like, hey, this is kindof where the Reds were supposed to
be. And I could not agreemore with that statement, with that sentiment.

(01:01:23):
No, I think there's I thinkthere's something too, the unfortunate dynamic
that's in play here. And Iremember saying often back in April, and
may like the team, the teamitself might deserve more patients than you're willing
to give because of the failures ofthe past, which this current team isn't
responsible for. The team deserves patients. The franchise has exhausted it, and

(01:01:45):
I think that dynamic is in playhere. I also think what weighs on
what's happened this year is the reluctanceto be a little bit more aggressive at
the deadline last season and take aand take a bigger stab at winning.
And they were in a better positionto win a year ago at this time
than they are right now, andI think unfortunately that looms over it.

(01:02:06):
I think the lack of track recordthat everybody involved has. I mean,
you'll you will have people who say, look, I trust Nick Crawl and
I trust the direction they're taking theteam, and you may, but you're
gonna have a hard time convincing othersbecause trust is based on track record,
and this franchise and these baseball opspeople, for all of the I think
really good work they've done, don'thave that much of a track record,

(01:02:29):
and when you don't have one,it's hard to put a lot of trust
in them. But I mean,I think there's something to be said about
the injuries. That's a factor.I think there's something to be said about
you know again, when we siftthrough what happened in twenty four look ahead
at twenty five, it's not likethey're gonna be starting from scratch right now.
There are still too many unknowns.Is they gonna run the Will Benson

(01:02:51):
thing back next year? How goodis Cees? How slowed has the development
of a guy like him and McClainbeen because of the injuries? What are
we going to know about Noelve Marteby the end of the season. Uh,
there are still a lot of unknowns, and way too many for my
liking. But you have to acknowledgethat they're they're not start whatever direction they're

(01:03:13):
going to go in next year.However they're going to build the team.
They're not starting from zero. PatI enjoyed the phone call, man,
Thanks so much, Hi, thankyou for having them anytime twenty seven away
from five o'clock. Uh, wewill get to Mike and Bob and hopefully
five one, three, seven,four, nine, fifteen, thirty,
we will have our weekly chat withone of the experts from Orthos Cinci about
uh Sam Hubbard, the return ofEric All from injury, and two Reds

(01:03:37):
dealing with a similar injury. Nexton ESPN fifteen thirty, Cincinnati's es a
Kelsey Chevrolet home of lifetime powertrain protectionand guarantee credit approval from their family to
yours for live kelseyshev dot com,Reds and Cubs. Tonight at GABP Cincinnati
will send to the Hill Nick LadoloKyle Hendricks will throw for chicag Go seven

(01:04:00):
ten tonight, seven hundred WLW redstarting lineup hopefully made well thanks to a
Madewell restoration. Anything your home sixteriorneeds go to Madwell Restoration dot com India.
Second Elliott short steer at first,Friedol's batting cleanup in center field,
Tyler Stevenson catching Candelario dhing Frelian right, Santiago Espinal Coming off a four hit

(01:04:21):
night, nursing a ten game hittingstreak, he is playing third base.
Tonight. He is batting eighth.Will Benson in the ninth spot seven to
ten this evening seven hundred WLW.Bengal's not practicing today US men's Olympic basketball
team up eighty seven to seventy onSouth Sudan, five twenty three to go
in the game. We do thison Wednesdays. We talk injuries, mainly

(01:04:43):
NFL injuries, but a lot ofbaseball obviously this year as well with one
of the experts from Orthos since whatwe love about Orthos since he is they
have specialists of locations all over theTri State and they also offer walkin orthopedic
urgent care during the week nine am. To nine pm Saturday's nine am
to one pm and Edgewood and Andersonlearn more at Orthosinc dot com. That's

(01:05:05):
Ortho ci Ncy dot com. DoctorAmelia Wiggins from Orthosincy is with us.
It feels like the Bengals dodged abullet when it comes to Sam Hubbard taking
off on a cart Sunday, didn'tgo through yesterday's practice and pads no practice
today. They're calling what he hasa knee injury. They insist they don't
believe it's serious. Let's run throughthe gamut of possibilities here. What sort

(01:05:28):
of things are being considered? Soa knee injury, you know, a
sprain, we could be talking abouta sprain of an MCL, the ligament
on the inside of the knee.A lot of times when guys get tangled
up, that can get stretched aGrade one MCL sprain and you're looking at
four to six weeks at the most, So that would be one option up

(01:05:49):
to tell us subluxation or dislocation.Sometimes the kneecapped shifts in the groove there
and that can cause some pain inthe front of the knee, and certainly
that would cause an athlete to stop. And that could you know, very
minor. You can cause a subluxationand the patient would would have some discomfort,
but that would resolve quickly, soyou know, hopefully that's what's happening.

(01:06:12):
He could also have a bone bruise. You know, the same way
you bruise a muscle or anything elsein your body, you can actually bruise
your bone, which can cause pain, can cause swelling, but it doesn't
require surgery. So that could besomething that's going on as well, just
from an impact. We hear allthe time about how wee they're going to
perform an MRI, and I've neverhad an MRI done yet. We's it's

(01:06:35):
become kind of part of our basiceveryday conversation, and yet so many of
us really don't know what an MRIis, how it works, how it's
applied, So how is it used, especially in a case like this where
you're trying to figure out exactly whatthe issue might be. Yeah, MRIs
are so helpful. We use themall the time to assist with our diagnosis.

(01:06:57):
You know, we do a physicalexam, we have great physical exam
skills. We generally know what isgoing on, but the MRI adds a
little extra information. So something likean ACL that's generally easy for me to
diagnose with my physical exam, Butthat bone bruise, that's not something that
I can see on exam. There'snot a test for that. It's just
a clinical suspicion. And so theMRI shows us that closer look. What's

(01:07:21):
happening with the meniscus, what's happeningwith the cartilage, what's happening There's fat
pads and synovium in the knee,and those can get aggravated and cause inflammation.
The MRI gives you that closer lookthat an X ray and a physical
exam don't give. For those ofus in the real world, you know,
we would probably wait four to sixweeks to see, you know,

(01:07:43):
did the pain get better on itsown. If it doesn't, then we
get an MRI. You know,that's when you or I would get one.
But per professional athlete, you gotto move quick because we don't have
four to six weeks to see ifthey're going to get better. And there
are treatments that they can do.You know, if an MRI shows a
low raid MCL sprain, they cando a PRP injection to improve the healing

(01:08:04):
on that. You know, ifit shows the bone bruise, he can
start getting back into light activity ashis symptoms allow. You know, if
it shows a meniscus contusion, wecan progress him through that a little bit
faster than you know, some otherscenarios. So the MRI is so helpful
for our professional athletes because it reallygives us a baseline and then we can

(01:08:25):
talk to them more about their prognosis. What really are the risks if we
move too quickly or too slowly ona specific injury. You mentioned ACL injuries
and that's what one of the newerBengals dealt with in college, Eric All,
And the good news is was clearto return to the practice field this
week, and so he suffered thisinjury back in October, back on the
field in late July. Does thatfit within the typical timeline for an injury

(01:08:50):
like this absolutely. I tell myathletes nine months to a year, and
professional versus high school, it's allthe same. We can't rush bioli and
the biology takes nine months to ayear to heal an ACL reconstruction. His
graft is now in its final stagesof healing, so now he's ready to

(01:09:10):
start playing. And he's been doingthe functional rehab all along, so his
muscles have been ready for a while. It's just a matter of letting that
graft mature. And usually nine monthsto a year that's when we see that
happening. So now it's appropriate forhim to get back out there to start
taking some hits. And this isthe perfect time for him to get back
because he can go a little bitlighter during this preseason lighter for professional athlete,

(01:09:33):
of course, but you know,lighter, and then as they progress
the intensity of their practice, he'llget more confident in his knee as well.
I would much rather him come backnow, go through the preseason and
the training and then be ready togo one hundred percent day one. Then
to start practice at game one,you can't. You can't just go in

(01:09:56):
at one hundred percent. He's goingto ramp up, right, So when
an athlete is are there, Imean, obviously you're watching him a little
bit more closely than an athlete who'snot dealt with any injury. But are
there extra precautions that they may betaking with him as opposed to other guys
who have been healthy all along?Yeah? Absolutely, Like his first feod
weeks, even even up to amonth back at practice, what he's been

(01:10:18):
doing, probably for a few monthsis fifty percent speed, fifty percent you
know, with who with his agilities, he'll go fifty percent power. Then
as that's feeling good, he's feelingconfident, then they'll add a little bit
more intensity, more duration to hisworkouts. He would still be non contact
until about that nine or tenth monthpoint, and then even when he starts

(01:10:42):
contact with drills, he'll start lightcontact. You know, they'll tell his
teammates don't hit him as far asyou hit somebody first time out. You
know, let him get his feedunder and lett him get his confidence back.
Mentally, recovering from an ACL injury, and an injury in general is
often a part of it too,So they've got to build a confidence fact
that they can take a hit andthey can give a hit. And so

(01:11:04):
gradually over the next few months he'llhe'll take harder hits, he'll and he'll
progress back to full strength. DoctorAmilia Wiggins from ORTHO, since he is
with us, I want to askyou about two Reds dealing with a similar
injury that I don't think I hadever heard of. Brent suit Or,
the lefty pitcher, went on theinjured list a week and a half ago

(01:11:26):
with what they call a partial tearof the left terrace major muscle, and
then the Reds had a catcher,Austin Wins. He was placed on the
injured list after this weekend with apartial tear of the right terrace major muscle.
I don't know that I've ever heardof the terrace major muscle. What
is it? I know, yes, it's not one commonly talked about.

(01:11:49):
I was excited to see on here. So but you've heard of the latisimus
door side, You've heard of thelats, go and do a LATS day
at the gym. Okay, thethe Terry's major runs right along the lat.
The LAT starts at the spine andgoes to the humorous right where the
inside of your arm. That Terry'smajor goes from the scapula to that same

(01:12:15):
insertion spot on the humorous. Sopeople tear their lat, it would feel
the same. And I think oneof the guys said that he felt tightness
in his lat. Well, thatTerry's major is running right along with it.
So just like your lat ad deckthat brings your arm across your body
and it internally rotates, which isobviously very important for a pictures by mechanics

(01:12:39):
the pictures are and throwers are usingtheir terries major as well with their lats
to get that job done. Arewe talking about an injury here that usually
requires surgery? No? Not typicallywith a Terry's major injury, those are
typically treated conservatively, especially if it'sa tear within them. That's it's time,

(01:13:01):
it's rest, you know, antiinflammatories, and then a progression back
to throwing a LAT tear. Now, they often will happen together. You'll
get a lat latisimus dorseye injury,you know, and the terries major can
be injured as well. If thelatisimus dorsie pulled off the bone same way
you could pull your peck major off. You're going to have a peck tear.

(01:13:24):
Those that is one that would requiresurgery. But typically with the with
the terries major tears, those areusually more muscular and there's no surgery indicated
for that. All right, somethingI never heard of. Now I know
a lot more. Always awesome tohave you with us. Thank you so
much. Awesome, thank you alwaysgoing to talk. It is awesome to

(01:13:44):
have doctor Amelia Wiggins with us fromOrthos Sincy. I say this every week.
The great thing about the people atOrtho Sincy is they have specialists and
locations across the tri State offers walkin orthopedic urgent care during the week nine
eight to nine p Saturday's nine toone pm. Edgewin and Anderson. Better
than going to an er, Cheaperthan going to an er, more convenient

(01:14:05):
than going to an er. Wheneveryou have an urgent orthopedic injury. Orthossinc.
Dot com, Ortho ci Ncy dotcom. We are insanely late tearing
my bad Tony Pike than Brendanman andJones on baseball coming up on ESPN fifteen
thirty, When Employers likes Brook toyou Boys, Hollywood Casino, Lawrenceburg of

(01:14:26):
ESPN fifteen thirty, The official homeof the Bengals. Yes, Tony Pike
is with me Live. Bengals trainingcamp report. Even though the Bengals aren't
practicing today, they're back tomorrow.Tony will be back at practice tomorrow giving
us live reports. The Bengals workedout yesterday in pads. Yesterday mark the
return of a guy who twenty twentyfour is a huge year for in Cam

(01:14:46):
Taylor Britt. And you know,look, Chaudobey Woozy is no longer here.
We have seen flashes of I think, I don't want to say brilliance,
but we have seen flashes from CamTaylor Brit that would make you th
he is capable of moving into thatclear cut number one corner roll. But
he hasn't done it necessarily on aconsistent basis to the degree that maybe we

(01:15:09):
would like heading into year three,it's got to start to show now.
Yeah, you know, it's it'salmost a similar situation to the linebacker room,
where every we haven't had much conversationabout the linebacker room, and every
conversation that's been had about the corneris well, Cam Taylor BRIT's one,
who's number two. Well that meansthat Cam Taylor Britt takes the next step

(01:15:32):
and as a cornerback number one.He mentioned yesterday just about the matchup.
He went against t Higgins a coupleof times, and and he mentioned in
the the open part of locker roomafter practice that t Higgins got me today
and he came back and say he'snot gonna give me the next day.
So he's got the mentality because corner, to me is the hardest mentality because

(01:15:56):
you're gonna get beat. Yeah,you know, it's like a quarterback Peyton
say, you know I throw fouror five interceptions in the game. You
gotta have short term memory. Well, it's even got to be shorter for
corners because more often than not,when you're on an island, other guys
are gonna win. You can getbeat because of a throw, you can
because of a great route. Andto have that mentality is a big part
of it. But the Bengals,it's not, it's not need. They

(01:16:18):
must they must get cornerback one materialfrom Cam Taylor Brent or else. We're
talking about a whole different type ofdefense because the question has been Okay,
is it Dax Hill is a DJTurner who's going to be corner two?
You gotta have corner one. Isit a good thing or a bad thing?
That the name you just mentioned,Dax Hill. That's the first time
I've heard it since since camp started. Yeah, if you follow along with

(01:16:40):
a lot of videos from camp ofoffensive players making plays, unfortunately it's been
on Dax Hill. And you know, I get it because he's changing positions
and it changes technique. And wetalked a little bit about technique with Marius
Mims yesterday. You see the positivesof Dax Hill because of the athleticism and
the speed. It's a tough positionand you don't have long time in training

(01:17:00):
camp to get it right. Andmake make no mistake about it, not
getting to go up against Jamar Chaseis a big part of that. That
was my next question, Like oneon ones, Yeah, Cam Taylor Britt,
DJ Turner, Dax Hill. Itbenefits you to go up against Jamar
Chase. And that's not a knockon any of the other receivers, but
Cam Taylor Britt talked about going oneon one with t Higgins wouldn't that be

(01:17:23):
the same thing with some other guysgetting to go against Jamar Chase to help
their craft. But wasn't that thething with DJ Turner in camp last year
was he was going against those guysand holding his own. Yes, like
man, he's holding his own againstsome of the best receivers in football.
Now it's look pretty good against Trentnerwhen they're on it's different, and it's
just it's it's again. It's anotherone of those branches where no Jamar Chase

(01:17:45):
affects things all right, Tony backat it with me and five forty five,
Brenneman and Jones on baseball next Cincinnati'sESPN fifteen thirty. Traffic from the
UC Health Traffic Center. No matterthe injury, U see health orthopedic in
sports medicine, RITA fines recovery toget you back to doing what you love
call five one, three, four, seven, five eighty six nine zero

(01:18:06):
stop and go traffic is causing afive minute hold up if you need to
use southbound seventy one from Martin LutherKing Junior Drive to Fort Washington Way and
expect a twenty five minute delay.If you're on eastbound two seventy five between
Mastella Road and Loveland Madaro Road,and there's a five minute delay on southbound
seventy five at the Western Hills Viaduct. I'm Nicole with traffic. This report

(01:18:27):
is sponsored by ESPN fifteen thirty.So it's the five o'clock mikelo Ultra Happy
Hour, thanks to michelow Ultra Moegger. This is ESPN in fifteen thirty.
You might need hey, michelob Ultraafter I read something to you here,
So I'm just gonna warn you now. I mean, you know, not

(01:18:50):
if you're driving, obviously, butMC culture sounds really good right now.
We thank them for sponsoring the fiveo'clock Happy We have to do the Applicator.
We haven't talked. We got aphone call about Jamar Chase. We
haven't talked as much about Jamar Chasetoday as I had originally intended because there's
really only one question that matters,and we're gonna get to that a little

(01:19:11):
bit later. On the reds.Let's if we were to take the current
temperature of the fan base as awhole, and we're painting with a very
broad brush. You and I bothknow that there are reds fans among us

(01:19:32):
who are really really really really reallyreally really really really really bullish on what
the Reds are doing. And thereare Reds fans who are bullish but not
quite as bullish. And there areReds fans who are bullish but maybe not
to the degree that they were perhapsa year ago at this time. And
then there are Reds fans who areskeptical, and there are Reds fans who
are angry, and there are Redsfans who are turning to apathy. It

(01:19:57):
runs the gamut, right. Butif if we were to for a second
paint with a broad brush, oruse a broad brush, or broadly try
to take the current temperature of thefan base based on the performance of the
team this season, the performance ofthe front office around the deadline, the

(01:20:19):
performance of the front office around thedeadline last year, and some of the
built in resentment or distrust of ownership, the temperature is probably less than favorable.
Like in politics, they do thoseapproval ratings. Maybe that'll be today's

(01:20:39):
poll question, because I haven't pullone out there, do We'll do some
sort of goofy approval approval ratings wouldprobably be not in favor of approving the
overwhelming. If I did approve,disprove, we'll make that a pole question.
Well, I would be willing tobet the approval rate for the Cincinnati

(01:21:00):
Reds right now would not be great. Could be dead wrong about that,
but I feel like I feel likethe current temperature isn't good, So I
say that. Almost exactly an hourago, the Reds sent out a press

(01:21:25):
release announcing title changes in business operations. I'll read it to you. Cincinnati
Reds Principal owner and managing partner BobCastellini has announced two organizational changes, effective
August first, twenty twenty four tomorrow, President and chief operating Officer Phil Castellini

(01:21:50):
has been promoted to president and chiefexecutive officer. So Phil Castellini gets a
promotion. Executive Vice president and chieffinancial Officer Doug Healey has been promoted to
Chief operating Officer slash chief financial officer. Okay, Now I read those two

(01:22:13):
sentences and thought, this must meanthat there's going to be some sort of
shakeup in terms of ultimately who's runningthings. Except the very next sentence reads,
Bob Castellini retains control and managerial responsibilityover all business and baseball operations.

(01:22:38):
Phil Castellini, Doug Healey, andPresident of Baseball Operations Nick Crawl will continue
to report to mister Castellini. There'sa quote from I'm not calling him mister
Castellini. He's not my sixth grademath teacher. There's a quote here from
Bob quote. These changes in ourorganization recognized the excellent work being done by

(01:22:59):
Phil and Doug and leading our business. They are in lockstep with Knick's vision
for the Reds baseball model to producesustainable winning and are committed to advancing all
aspects of our operations towards that goal. So I guess I mean this is
fine. I have whatever We've knownwhat the structure of the Reds is and

(01:23:23):
has been for a while. Thepublic face of the business part of the
Reds for a long time now hasbeen Phil Castellini, and he's had the
title of Chief operating Officer for awhile, and so one would assume it
was a matter of time before hewould have the title of chief executive officer.

(01:23:44):
But and I'm asking this part notso much out of criticism, but
just sort of out of curiosity.If you're going to announce or make it
known that Bob retains can what's thepoint of making this announcement, Like,

(01:24:06):
if you're going to announce Phil's gettinga promotion, Doug Healy is getting a
promotion, these guys have new jobtitles. It would seem to me that
it would make sense to do thatwith the accompanying announcement being fills in charge
of everything, Like don't I don'tunderstand the point of that, and I

(01:24:30):
understand it less and Lance has atweet about this that you should go read.
I guess I don't understand the timingof it from that perspective, but
also, like, let's be honest, whether it's right or wrong, Phil
and Bob don't have a very highapproval rating right now, especially Phil.

(01:24:55):
I mean, I think that's that'sa fair way of putting it. And
maybe that approval rating is higher thanit was two years ago. Maybe that
approval rating is an unfair reflection ofwhat he has done since ownership change in
two thousand late in two thousand andfive. But I think if you were

(01:25:15):
to go and ask a thousand Redsfans at the ballpark tonight, do you
approve or disapprove of the job PhilCastellini is doing. My guess is the
majority would say disapprove. So youhave a relatively unpopular figure, You've announced
he's getting a promotion amid a climatewhere because of how things have unfolded around

(01:25:42):
the deadline. I've gotten phone callsabout it the last two days. Folks
want to renew the whole sell theteam thing. There's some dissatisfaction with how
the season is unfolded. There's somedissatisfaction with how the trade deadline unfolded.
You know, I mean, justthere's disapproval in that environment. You announce

(01:26:08):
this. I'm I'm I'm asking criticallybut also out of curiosity, and I'm
I'm gonna get an answer. Whywhy do that? Now? That's like
the ultimate lead balloon. Fans areangry or frustrated or impatient or exasperated and

(01:26:34):
in some cases done. You've gota an unpopular person in place, and
you announced that he's getting a promotion. Oh and by the way, the
guy in charge, Bob is stillin charge. Now we could all discuss

(01:26:59):
how much Bob is really in charge. I think that's a pretty sensitive topic,
to be honest with you, Butthis is just it's tone deaf.
I mean, I think that's afair and legitimate way of putting it,
right, Like you, I don'tit's tone deaf and like I read it,

(01:27:21):
and I'm like, well, ifyou're announcing I don't know, any
sort of structural change in your organization, regardless of what the organization is,
and we're talking about like at theupper top level, I guess I would
anticipate that the likelihood would be thataccompanying the announcement of different promotions would be

(01:27:45):
that, hey, this person whohas been in charge is no longer in
charge, and that's not happening here. Very bizarre, very bizarre. And
I just, you know, lessthan twenty four hours. And again,
like the red trade deadline, youknow, they're not better now. They're
probably not better for next year.The team is probably decent enough to hang

(01:28:08):
in the periphery of contention. Hell, they may sweep the cobs They've got
all off season to make the teambetter this year. Like, but it
just it doesn't feel like there's areal climate of positivity right now. And
in that climate of not positivity,you announce that a rather unpopular figure is

(01:28:29):
now gonna get a job title thatmany would say he hasn't earned. But
the person who's been in charge allalong is still in charge. Okay.
Seventeen minutes after five o'clock, phonecalls are coming up. Another check in

(01:28:50):
with Tony Pike. I just Ihave one question about Jamar Chase, and
I'm gonna ask it today and I'mgonna keep asking it until things change.
And I'm I have no issue reallywith what Jamar Chase is doing, but
we have to talk about it,so we will. Eighteen o five ESPN,
fifteen thirty Cincinnatis Es After five Ithrew the Paul question up there on

(01:29:14):
X Thanks to United Heartland Insurance,they will save you more money on your
insurance because that's what they do ifthey're an insurance company. But it can
be your car, home boat,family, life, business, you name
the insurance need, they will takecare of it. At a uagiants dot
com, we decided to go approvalrating. Do you approve or disapprove of

(01:29:38):
the job that people running the redsare doing? Eighty five point ones and
it's early small sample size, eightyfive point one percent say disapprove. In
that climate, the REDS announced changes, but the actually everything's still the same.
We did not have a chance toget to him yesterday and I felt

(01:29:58):
awful about it. Mike, goahead, You're on ESPN fifteen thirty.
How are you, Mike? Ithink Mike, Mike is Mike is off
talking to somebody. Mike. Areyou hopfully does anything bad? Yeah,
let's let's do the last time wedid that, Mike. Mike said something
somewhat objectionable, Bob, and Bob'shaving Maybe Bob's talking to Mike. Bob.

(01:30:25):
You're on ESPN fifteen thirty. Hey, moll, what's up. Uh,
I'm just sitting here waiting to hearwhat you have to say. Well,
well, I can't help but talkabout the deals that we made yesterday
or actually the day before. Lastnight we got a fan slam, yes,

(01:30:48):
and today he was three for fourwith three RBIs. And you know
what the perfect thing is. We'vegot Tommy for only half a season,
which is just about how long peoplecan standing, and you get him for
fantasy football season. Yeah exactly.Yeah. But you know what I think,

(01:31:15):
and I've heard a lot of peoplesay this, that he's for probably
a limited lifespan, is just thekind of guy you need to get some
guys up and going. I thinkthe Arizona Diamondbacks would would testify to that.
I mean we think they would.They acquired him for the push toward

(01:31:40):
the postseason last year and he endedup starting I believe, every World Series
game for them and was quite productive. And if you read dispatches from Phoenix,
I mean with Tommy fan was hereand we made fun of him because
I think he's kind of a weirdcat. But I think in a small
dose in a in a small ona on a small dosage level, for

(01:32:02):
a team that's trying to do somethingin a compact amount of time, I
think he can be impactful. Andhe certainly, I guess for for for
those first two days back in SaintLouis has been for the Cardinals. Hey,
you know what the thing is.The guy hates to lose. Yeah,
competitive, you know, some guyslove to win. He hates to

(01:32:23):
lose. And I I think,really and I don't know much about the
picture, although from what I hear, that guy kind of read him reinvented
himself in Korea and turned out tobe a pretty good pitcher at least for
this first half the year. Yeah, I think they made a pretty good

(01:32:45):
move by getting rid of Tommy EdmundWho's who's a really good player. I
like Tommy a lot, but hehadn't played a game this year for the
Cards, so I think it wasa great move. Yeah, you're talking
about Eric Fetti, but Dylant wouldThe thing about the the Carlson excuse me
think about the Carlson thing is Ithink for a lot of folks it brought

(01:33:06):
up. It brought up names likeRandy or Rosarina and guys like that that
they have given up on. Somemight argue prematurely in the past, but
I think in terms of what theygot back. As a Cardinals fan,
I think you have to feel prettygood. Yeah, And you know what,
Dylan Carlson, I tend to agreewith you every bit. And he

(01:33:27):
may be the next guy that goesout and hits twenty home runs next year
and plays great defense. And youknow what, Lane Thomas turned out to
be a good outfielder, Garcia withTexas to be a great player. And
yeah, have they given up onsome guys, Sure, no doubt about

(01:33:47):
it. They've made some mistakes.But the thing is, if if you
can get something out of this year, and I'll tell you what, Alec
Burloson has turned out to be justmagnificent. I mean since June first in
Baseball and rbhis now as as aReds fan, it's it's frustrating the Cardinals

(01:34:12):
lose ninety games for the first timein over three decades last year and now
here they are. I you know, the Pittsburgh made some some pretty interesting
moves as well. I still feellike the Milwaukee pitching is such a house
of cards that someone can challenge them, and it feels like that team is
most likely the Cardinals. Bob,I got a run man, Thank you,

(01:34:34):
Okay, I appreciate it. Fivepoint thirty. The one thing on
Jamar Chase that we've talked a lotabout him not practicing. I don't have
a major issue with Look, inan ideal world, he practices, right,
and I in an ideal world,well, because all we care about
is the football part. He practicesbecause well, there's there's value to practice.

(01:35:00):
But I do have a hard timegetting upset on anybody for using whatever
leverage they feel they have or doingsomething that within the framework of the very
well established rules he's allowed to do. He is not breaching his contract.
This has been talked about extensively,and you know. Admittedly this is still

(01:35:21):
a little bit new to me becauseI wasn't here last week. There's really
only one question that matters. Jamaris not going to give anybody the answer
to it because unless he has achange of heart, he's not talking publicly.
The season starts on September the eighth, so five and a half weeks

(01:35:42):
away. Is it interesting that he'snot practicing. Sure? Could there be
an impact on the season him notpracticing, Yeah, sure, absolutely,
But the only question that really mattersis is he willing to miss games once
the season begins. That's it.I don't know that the answer is yes.

(01:36:11):
I don't know that the answer isno. But it's really the only
question that that really matters, reallymatters for him because that's when he could
suffer a financial cost. And forthe Bengals, yes, they would like
for him to practice, but theywant for him to play even more,

(01:36:33):
and yes they I'm sure believe himpracticing. Number one would eliminate any questions
about whether or not he's going toplay in games. Number two could make
it more likely that he's able toplay really well in games early in the
season. But at the end ofthe days, that's the question that's,
as they say, the sixty fourthousand dollars question, that's the question I

(01:36:55):
want the answer to that we're notgoing to get. You can set out
a practice in July. You couldset out the first six to seven practices.
You could set out preseason games.You could set out all of August.
Are you gonna be on the fieldon Sunday, September the eighth at
one o'clock? Are you willing?I mean, like in any negotiation,
any negotiation, there has to bea party, maybe even both, but

(01:37:23):
there has to be a party that'sthat's willing to do something drastic. Maybe
it's as simple as walking away froma place that you've worked at for decades.
But in any negotiation, there's gonnabe somebody willing to do something kind
of drastic. In this day andage, missing practice is not drastic.

(01:37:43):
It's not different, less than ideal, not drastic. The drastic thing is,
Look, I'm not gonna play,and I'm gonna sacrifice the money that
would come with me playing. Ishe willing to do that? Now?
If the answer is yes, wellthen this shifts a little bit. If

(01:38:08):
the answer is no, then it'stwo sides. Just staring at each other.
That's the only question. Is hewilling to miss games? I don't
know. I think you have toat least allow for the possibility just because
he's not practicing right like the firsttime he shows up and practices, which

(01:38:30):
who knows when that's gonna be.Maybe it's tomorrow, maybe it's next week,
maybe it's a month from now,maybe it's on the Wednesday before the
first game. But the minute hedoes that, you're eliminating entirely the possibility
that he's not going to play ina game. Until then, you at
least have to allow for it.The Bengals have a well established track record,

(01:38:56):
whether you admire them for it,whether you hate them for it.
Of they don't buckle, you canput a gun to their head metaphorically.
They don't buckle. They don't cave. They don't cave to public pressure.
They don't cave to agent pressure,they don't cave to social media pressure.
They don't. They may decide thatJamar Chase is an exception to the rule

(01:39:18):
like Joe Burrow was, and we'regonna go ahead and get the deal done
before he has only one year lefton his contract. Maybe in order to
compel the Bengals to do that.Chances are Jamar Chase is gonna have to
do something dramatic. Is he willingto do that? And by the way,

(01:39:41):
you might argue, as a Bengalsfan, well, fine, he
misses the first game they play thePatriots, they should roll them no matter
what. Okay, if he's willingto miss one, is he willing to
miss two because that second game isgonna be a little bit more difficult.
It's really the only question right nowthat matters. Everybody believes Mike Brown has

(01:40:05):
said to us what the outcome isgonna be. The Bengals are gonna sign
Jamar Chase. I don't think anybody'sarguing whether or not that's gonna happen.
I don't think anybody's really that concernedas to whether or not that's gonna happen.
The point was made by many peoplelast week when Mike Brown said what
he said, like, he doesn'tdo that. Mike Brown doesn't say that.
So if Mike Brown says we're goingto get the deal done, I

(01:40:28):
believe it. And they do havea track record of getting deals done with
players like Jamar going into their secondcontract. So we all understand that the
likely outcome is a contract. Thequestion is about the timing to put the
timeframe where he wants it. IsJamar Chase willing to do something beyond wearing

(01:40:54):
a hat to practice signing autographs whilehis teammates work out. I don't know.
I am okay with allowing for thepossibility, because how do you not?
But that's the only question that mattershere. I'm Wayley twenty three from

(01:41:15):
six ESPN fifteen thirty, Cincinnati,Cincinnati's sports station. Sports headlines are a
service of Kelsey Chevrolet, home oflifetime power train protection and guaranteed credit approval
from their family, Yours for life, Kelsey chev dot Com. Red's play
tonight against the Cubs. They're lookingfor a sweep. She played two really

(01:41:40):
good games the last couple of nights. Seven ten this evening on a seven
hundred WL. The whole like baseballslate today has been dad. I play
a lot of day games today,Niiclodolo, Kyle Hendricks who was good at
one point in his life and isterrible now. Seven ten this evening.
You want to starting lineup, I'llgive it to you. Thanks to Madewell
Restoration not sure what your home needs. Madewell Restoration can answer all your question.

(01:42:02):
Madewell Restoration dot Com India. LE and Spencer Steer one through three.
Steers playing first base, freedom andcenter. Stevenson catching Candelario is dhing,
Jake Frelian, right, Espinal SantiagoEspinal during his current ten game hitting
streak has an ops of fifteen toeleven. He is at third base,

(01:42:26):
batting eighth, Will Benson and leftfield bat's ninth. Jacob Junas reports to
the twenty six player roster acquired fromthe Brewers the other night, and Lion
Richardson sent to Louisville. There yougo, what else do we have?
Bengal's not practicing today. It's aday off of the players. You see
football started fall camp, first ofthree workouts on campus before they move to

(01:42:46):
higher ground. You see, seasonopens one month from today. It is
the Bearcat's host Howson Nippert Stadium andthe United States Olympic Basketball Team men's basketball
team beats South Sudan. Bam autof Bio bam aut of Bio came off

(01:43:08):
the bench to score eighteen. JoeLMB didn't play. That'd be the big
talking point. For the next fortyeight hours. Uh, the US wins
one three to eighty six. Theydidn't win by a thousand points, they
didn't shoot one hundred percent from thefield, and they didn't hold the opponent
scoreless. So there will be criticismfrom somewhere somehow. All right, all

(01:43:30):
right, we don't have a lotof time. I'll try it again,
Mike, go ahead, Hey,Mike, what's up here? What's going
on? How you doing? Ihad a blood transfusion today. That's never
had that before. That doesn't soundfun. No, no, it's not
fun. Well, I think LucasSimms is probably smiling and happy to go

(01:43:55):
to the Red Sox because they gota better chance to get to their playoffs
than our team does. So goodfor you, Lucas. Have fun in
Boston. The uh they were too, you know they keep Tony keeps talking
about going in pads, right,yeah, putting the pads on. Well,
my my relation to pads is adultpad, if you know what I

(01:44:15):
mean. I understand that's well putI totally understand that they're very important to
me too. And another important ofthe thing goals and they're important to me
as well. Well, I canI can understand I can. I hope
your pads, I hope they workwell. They do, they're They're a

(01:44:36):
godsend and I'm thankful for it.Did you see the perfect ride that my
dude from Brazil gave Been Medina hadlast night from Tahiti and the Surfing Championships.
Dude, that was the perfect ridein in uh in surfing, and
that's a dangerous reef in Tahiti becausethe coral is per invasive and if you

(01:45:00):
go over the falls, for instance, if you go over the front top
of your board straight down, ifyou don't get killed, you'll get cut
up because that corals like razor blades. But that kid, did you happen
to see that last night where hecame flying out of the air after he
got through that curl. I sawthe social media clip of the dude.

(01:45:21):
Yeah. Oh, those guys gotbig kohunas mo. Yeah, because that's
some dangerous stuff. That's the mostdangerous event they haven't any of us,
including that ski jump or that highski jump. Those guys are poetry in
motion. Then they when they dotheir thing, it's very physical. What
I love about the fact with thesurfing competition is they didn't set up like

(01:45:44):
some fake beach in the south ofFrance. They just shipped everybody to Tahiti.
That doesn't suck. And Tahiti's stilla French colony basically, yes,
I mean it's still predominantly controlled bythe French. I thought that that was
so real too. I thought thatwas I mean, they went to a
lot of trouble to do that,so that's pretty cool. I love it.

(01:46:05):
I mean it's like in the theabsolute opposite end of the globe.
It's incredible. Yeah, ten thousandmiles. Yeah, I love it.
I love it. I would liketo be I would like I think it
was Colin Joe's from SNL is coveringit. That's the gig that I want.
We're going to send you to Tahitito cover Olympic surfering. I can

(01:46:28):
see you sitting now on the beach, which it'd be much better than sitting
down in Santa Monica on the concrete, which their cooler and stuff. But
yeah, I can see you sittingon the beach in Tahiti doing your saying.
That would be beautiful. I wouldlike that. We're short on time.
What else is on your mind?One more quickie the Reds. I
don't know what to say. Ijust don't, but I do have an

(01:46:53):
analogy to make it okay. Betweenthe red actually heard great Cosel real quick
today and he said he is sobullish on the Bengal. He said,
Joe Burrow is so well equipped thisyear, not not just with Jamar and
Higgins, but he loves the othercast. He loves Koseki, he loves
Trent Irvin. He who was thattight end that played off and on last

(01:47:15):
year that was so good. MoTanner Hudson did a nice job last year.
Yeah, and he's bullets on him. He couldn't say enough good things,
but he said, Joe's got allhe needs to stay healthy and You're
going. He said, You're goingto super Bowl. That's what song.
I respect him more than any ofthe analysts. I arede. I'm with
you on that one. Go ahead, Mike quickly. Uh the uh uh

(01:47:41):
it's just uh, I know,go ahead, yeah, yeah, sure.
Laying on me. Between the Redsand the sixty three Dodgers like not
a big home run hitting team.Three great starters, Drysio, Copek,
Padres, great bullpen closer Panowski,and then the infield fairly light, light
hitting guy Ken McMullen, Maury Will'sprolific based steeler and Johnny Roseboro behind a

(01:48:08):
plate very Willie Davis, light hittingoutfielder Wally Moonlight. Very similar team to
this Reds team. Well, thatteam won ninety nine games, yeah,
right, and they swept the Yankeesin the World Series, correct, all
right. I don't know. Idon't know that there's anybody else who's going

(01:48:30):
to make a comparison between the twentytwenty four Reds and the team that won
ninety nine games and swept the WorldSeries over the Yankees. But that's why
we have you. Mike. Takecare of yourself. Okay, thanks,
Bell, appreciate it, all right, Tony Pike Training camp Report. Next,
this is the training camp report broketo you by Skylight Chilie feeling good.

(01:48:51):
It's Skylight on the ESPN fifteen thirty, the official home of the Bengals.
Yes, you know you hear thatline that we run that says no
one covers the Bengals like ESPN fifteenthirty. In proof of this is we
are doing live training camp reports eventhough the Bengals aren't practicing today. They're
off, but we're not Tony Pikeis here. We didn't dispatch you to

(01:49:15):
the venue formerly known as Paul RailsStadium. Parking might have been easier today.
Parking might have been a little biteasier. But since there's no practice,
we figured we would do a livetraining camp report with you here in
studio. It's good of you tostick around. This is awesome. Yeah,
I should do this more, especiallywith three little kids at home.
For any reason to stick around.Yeah, good, I understand that.
All right, you've been at allthese practices. Yesterday first padded workout.

(01:49:39):
The one different dynamic is the Bengalsdo have a new offensive coordinator and Dan
Pitcher. Have you seen anything thatwould reveal how his fingerprints are going to
be on the offense so far?Yeah. I think they have carried over
the success they had at the endof last year with Jake Browning of the
under center work, and it wasit was talked about during the end of
the season last year, and thenit was kind of doubled down upon in

(01:50:01):
the offseason of this is kind ofwhat we want to do more of.
We want to be more versatile,we want to get under center. They
didn't do it a ton last yearwith Joe Burrow. So far, and
it's a smaller sample size, there'sonly one day of full padded practices,
but they are running a ton ofunder center stuff, and they're running under
center with the idea to get ChaseBrown and Zach Moss downhill. And they're
also running it with a ton ofplay action, both play actions setting up

(01:50:25):
in the pocket and play action whereyou're resetting the pocket and getting outside the
tackle box. And in doing so, I think it's really shed a light
on the upgrade in both the runningback and the tight end room. They're
utilizing both of those positions a ton, but opening up what this offense can
be from under center, which wesaw so much of from Jake Browning.
At least for now, that hastranslated to the early part of camp.

(01:50:47):
Yeah, you talk about the runningback room. It's obviously the first training
camp since twenty sixteen. The Bengalshaven't had Joe Mixon right, and we
all know what Joe could do,but it felt to me like the last
couple of years we spent a lotmore time talking about what he couldn't do,
and I don't think we do thatas much with Chase Brown and Zach
Moss. Acknowledging that Zach Moss isprobably in the grand scheme of things somewhere

(01:51:10):
around the middle of the tier runningback. But I feel like with both
him and Chase, we're not immediatelycrossing off the list of things that they
can't do, which is what wedid the last couple of years with Joe
Mixon. Chase Brown has wowed acouple times at camp already with his breakaway
speed. Zach Moss we talked aboutit on Sincy three sixty a couple weeks
ago the off season Hard Knocks withthe New York Giants. There was a

(01:51:33):
scene where the Giants personnel was talkingabout running backs and they were extremely high
on Zach Moss, and that kindof validated, Okay, this is why
the Bengals were high on them.Other teams were also high on them.
But the main difference is is we'renot having a daily conversation of was this
the year that Joe Mixon is goingto be able to pass protect? Yeah?
And if not, how much ofthe hand do you tip when you

(01:51:55):
have to run a different running backout there on third down or on passing
situations or two minutes you know it'ssome I j p Ryan for a year,
and now you have, in myopinion, two running backs that have
shown the ability early through training campto have ideas in pass protection and also
to be used in the passing game. I think I think they will be

(01:52:16):
utilized, both Chase Brown and ZachMoss way more in the passing game than
what we're used to because teams aregonna have to vacate and get depth.
There's too much speed with Burton andChase and Higgins and GETSICKI now stretching the
field. There's too many threats downthe field. You've got to get depth.
And when you do, Joe Burrowis gonna take those checkdowns all day

(01:52:36):
with two very capable backs. Rightthere, you go. Tony Pike,
he will be at Bengals practice tomorrowjoins. This is again three forty five,
four forty five and five forty five. And of course Austin have since
he three to sixty at noon tomorrowand since he three sixty broadcasts from Bengals
training camp next week, we aredone back out of tomorrow at three zero
five. Chad Brindle's gonna join us. I don't think we've told him yet.

(01:52:59):
But he's gonna join us to atalk UC fall camp because we talked
to Chad on Thursdays during football andbasketball season, and guess what, it's
football season. Also, Alex Eganis calling FC Cincinnati's league's Cup match.
He'll join us tomorrow too. Havean awesome night, Thank you for listening,
Thanks to Taran for producing, andhopefully he enjoys his next couple of
days off. Back at it tomorrow. Talk to you then. This is

(01:53:21):
ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports station

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