November 11, 2025 • 39 mins
Jon questions if the longest government shutdown in U.S. history is really over and gives an update on his car saga. Daveed Gartenstien Ross joins for an extended segment to discuss all things AI and answer talkbacks about where AI is today.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:03):
Well, our national nightmare is over.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Maybe also depends on whether or not you thought it
was a nightmare. Two I suppose as Senate Democrats vote
to end the forty one day Schumer shut down. Not done, though,
it still has to go back to.
Speaker 1 (00:22):
The House and then come back again.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
I'll break down all of the details coming up shortly
here on Twin Cities News Talk at AM eleven thirty
one oh three five FM from the six five to
one Carpet plus Next Day Install Studios. My name is
John Justice, and I'm glad you're with us for a
Tuesday morning next door and the master control booth is
Sam on this Veteran's Day.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
Good morning Sam, Good morning John.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
We're gonna have a speaking of veterans. The Senate candidate
Adam Schwarzy, Marine Corps veteran, will be joining us in
studio to talk about his campaign right around thirty at
eight thirty this morning. Congressman Tom Tiffany also running for
governor in Wisconsin.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
He's actually in the state and I thought that.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
We were going to be able to have him in studio,
but unfortunately he will not be able to make it,
but he will be calling us. Coming up again this
morning at eight thirty and David garten Stein Ross. We
will break away from the news of the day, although
a couple of the items that we do have to
talk about with a David will be covered when we
get into this week's AI discussion with our AI analyst
(01:34):
and CEO at Expert Theory, David garten Stein Ross.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
That'll happen at six point thirty.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
If you have any questions for David, you can get
those into the iHeart or radio app brought to you
by Lyndahl Realty. The talkbacks are so we'll get to
those two Dav'd when he joins us again, coming up
at seven thirty this morning. The Senate did pass a
bipartisan agreement last night to reopen the government, which, if
it passes the House expected I.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
Would be so sure about that would bring.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
An end to the longest to shutdown in the nation's history.
As the shutdown reached to day forty one, lawmakers passed
a final package, including a continuing resolution until January thirtieth,
and three bipartisan full year appropriations bills known as a minibus.
(02:28):
Republicans did not give Democrats an extension on the tax credits.
Although Senate Majority Leader John Thune set on the floor
on Sunday night that he did guarantee Democrats of vote
no later than the second week of December on their
healthcare proposal. Well, just because I'm taking a vote on
it doesn't mean they need to pass it, So we'll
see how that shakes out. The deal also reinstates reductions
(02:50):
in force that occurred during the shutdown. The minibus includes
full year funding for agriculture appropriations, military construction via creations,
and legislative branch appropriations. Before we go any further, let's
go to the iHeart radio app and hear what you
have to say regarding this.
Speaker 3 (03:11):
Good morning time, Tim Kansas City just heard Hakeem Jeffries'
big speech about how inflation is killing everybody and nothing
is affordable. Does this certifiable moron not realize that Trump's
only been president since January and every single thing that
(03:35):
he's complaining about, including Obamacare, is their fault. What the heck?
Speaker 2 (03:40):
He probably does realize it, but it doesn't matter. Democrats
don't care. Remember, you can be as irrational, hypocritical as
you want to be, lie as much as you want,
as long as it perpetuates the Democrats' agenda. Speaking of
House Minority Leader Hakim Jeffries, along with several House Democrats
(04:01):
did take to X to talk about the proposal opposing it,
and actually Jeffries yesterday had this to say.
Speaker 4 (04:08):
And so House Democrats and Senate Democrats have been fighting
hard to address the Republican healthcare crisis and to lower
the high cost of living for everyday Americans in the
United States of America, because the reality is America is
too expensive and far too many people are struggling to
live paycheck to paycheck. They can't thrive, they can barely survive.
(04:33):
And that's why Democrats have been waging this fight, and
we'll continue to wage this fight no matter what comes
over to us from the United States Senate to the
House of Representatives at some point this week. Our position
as House Democrats has been crystal clear. We will sit
(04:54):
down with any Republicans, any time, any place, anywhere in
order to find a bipartis and path forward. But we're
not down with them my way or the highway approach
to governance that's failed the American people.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
Yeah, they're only down with it when they have power
and they do the my way or the highway. Just
look at the trifecta that took place for those years,
and what a disaster Minnesota is in now and in
the future relating to our economy when it comes to
the energy blends of Governor Tim Walls, the billions of
dollars in fraud, waste, and abuse. I get so tired
(05:30):
of the language too. Americans are living paycheck to paycheck,
barely able to survive. Yeah, and what policies are you
going to enact? The key people living from paycheck to
paycheck and who's not living.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
Everybody lives paycheck to paycheck.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
If you have a job, if you're on government assistance,
I suppose you're not living paycheck. Well, you're living on
the government paycheck to paycheck. Oh, speaking of the price
of everything, I think some people would disagree with Hakim Jeffries.
Speaker 5 (05:58):
Good morning, John. I've been hunting for three days. Back
to work today. I have no idea what's really going
on in the world yet.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
Lucky you, you know it.
Speaker 6 (06:06):
Can change in three days.
Speaker 5 (06:08):
But I do know you guys talked about prices yesterday.
Speaker 6 (06:11):
It's true.
Speaker 5 (06:12):
I think some prices have come down. Eggs are way down,
gas is way down. And you know what my investments
are way up. I've never gotten fifteen to sixteen percent
growth in my investments before.
Speaker 6 (06:25):
This is awesome. Have a great day.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
Thank you so much for the talkback. Certainly appropriate for
the opening segment of the show. All right, coming up,
we'll continue with a little bit of shutdown talk air
traffic controllers specifically and how that issue is far from over.
Let's the issue of the shutdown is far from over.
Do you really believe for just a moment that this
(06:48):
agreement in the Senate is going to go back to
the House and it's just going to be smooth sailing
for Democrats. Now, Thankfully, when it comes to the House,
Republicans have a little bit more power to go and
get this thing passed. So all of Hakeem Jeffrey's words
there may be moot in a relatively short period of time,
but we're still going to be dealing with some issues
(07:09):
regarding the shutdown for a while. Well, dive into that.
We'll get back to more of your comments from the
iHeart Radio app. Tove Gartenstein rossar Ai Expert coming up
at eight thirty and you're listening, that's when it say's
News Talk Am eleven thirty and one oh three five FM.
Speaker 1 (07:23):
The what's called a Trump derangement problem. Have you heard
about that problem?
Speaker 3 (07:35):
Yes, John, that's the exact speech I was talking about.
Every single solitary point he made is one thousand percent
him and his fellow Democrats falls. It's unbelievable.
Speaker 7 (07:56):
Good morning, John.
Speaker 6 (07:59):
Whip.
Speaker 7 (07:59):
The Republicans and the healthcare. I don't know where Republicans
are with any of the healthcare. They didn't pass it.
Nancy BLOSEI did that droke midnight, christmin yep. Got to
pass it to know what's in it, the sun setting
of it. Everything is Democrats. So where are the Republicans
(08:20):
fingers on any of this? How is it a Republican problem?
Speaker 6 (08:25):
It's not.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
No, it's only a Republicans problem because the Democrats are
trying to make it a Republican problem. And Republicans won
control last year, and therefore, if they want to move
forward with their Obamacare subsidies, they need Republicans to get
on board.
Speaker 1 (08:38):
But you make a great point.
Speaker 2 (08:41):
Twin Cities News Talk Am eleven thirty one oh three
five FM from the six five to one carpet Next
Day Install Studios. My name is John Justice, Sam and
next Door on this veteran's day.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
Let's go here. Good morning, John Sam.
Speaker 8 (08:54):
Could somebody please tell mister Hagem Jeffries that I and
many like myself, including many listeners of your show, have
been living paycheck to paycheck since they're in high school,
sometimes working one to three jobs to make ends meet.
And then on top of that, they steal money out
of my paycheck every pay period to pay for those
that don't get up every morning that he represents that
(09:17):
get free stuff.
Speaker 6 (09:18):
And I am so sick and tired of this garbage.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
I'm just wondering if Scott, like, does Scott wake up Scott,
do you wake up that amped or like, are you
like you that app amped up the morment you get
out of bed?
Speaker 1 (09:30):
Or is it just once the show starts like a
pot of coffee and already Holy cow. I mean, I
do this for a lifting, and I don't get that.
I don't get that amped up.
Speaker 2 (09:39):
I get Scott's a very passionate dude. David will be
on the show. By the way, in about ten minutes.
I mistakenly said eight thirty. I was jumping ahead in
my mind. We have a lot of guests today. Adam
Schwarzy next hour, we have Congressman and goobernatorial candidate Tom
Tiffany at eight thirty.
Speaker 9 (09:58):
Good morning, John, and Sam Horning Longer Monday Day.
Speaker 1 (10:00):
True.
Speaker 9 (10:01):
This is Andy from East Bethel and I have a
question for David. I just heard that Google's Gemini AI
is now scanning all personal emails and attachments in Google
and wondering if there's any truth to that and if
there's a way to block it.
Speaker 2 (10:15):
Well, we will definitely get that question to David Gartenstein
Ross when he joins the show coming up at a
thirty as.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
I did not mean to play that talk back. You
doing okay, John, I'm doing.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
I mean it's Tuesday. It's a Tuesday morning, you know.
That's all I could say. It's been fine. I've had
it perfectly. I got plenty of sleep last night thanks
to the nightgummies from.
Speaker 1 (10:44):
Minnie leif you know.
Speaker 2 (10:45):
I woke up feeling refreshed and prep of the show
this morning. It's always a little different when I'm stacked
with with guests. I enjoy having the guests on the show,
and I know you do too in terms of what
I in terms of how I operate the show. It's
always different, though, because it's tough to sort of get
into momentum relating to particular stories and all of that.
Speaker 1 (11:05):
I'm just really looking for a cheeses right now.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
On a complete side note, though, my car, my Keys Stinger,
will finally finally be complete from all of its repairs.
Speaker 1 (11:19):
Ever since I purchased it a couple of months ago.
So I'm heading over to.
Speaker 2 (11:25):
The dealership today to get the right paddle shifter attached
because it was missing when I got the car.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
That's still a thing. That's still I'm going on, still
a thing.
Speaker 2 (11:33):
So it's been a couple of months and I hadn't
heard from the dealer, So just on a whim, I'm like,
you know what, because it was on like worldwide back order,
I'm like, you know what, I should probably call.
Speaker 1 (11:43):
Let me just see.
Speaker 2 (11:44):
I thought about stopping by on my drive home because
it's kind of on my way home, and I just didn't.
So I called last at the end of last week
and they're like, oh yeah, let mean look here, yeah,
oh yeah, that park came in months ago.
Speaker 1 (11:58):
Come on, a month ago. They knew and they let
it happen.
Speaker 2 (12:04):
I just sort of just very calmly said, I'm surprised
that I wasn't made aware that it was in or
else I would have been in a long time ago.
Speaker 6 (12:12):
Say, yeah, I don't know what.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
I don't know what happened there, but it just schedule
coming up next week, so I'll be heading over there
right after the show wraps up today.
Speaker 6 (12:22):
I know.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
It's all very very exciting, isn't it.
Speaker 6 (12:25):
You're fascinating to talk to.
Speaker 2 (12:27):
Air travelers should expect worsening casting cancelations and delays this week.
Even if the shutdown ends, the Federal Aviation Administration is
moving forward.
Speaker 1 (12:38):
This is the tale of dueling headlines. This just made
me laugh.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
So the Associated Press put this headline out well, Trump
threatens controllers US flight cancelations will drag on even after
shut down ends.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
So that's the AP's version of the of the story.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
Look at a more even keel, the nuanced, level headed headline.
You go to the Daily Wire, Trump floats a plan
to reward air traffic controllers who didn't take time off
due to shut down. But there's no media bias, guys,
I mean, come on, there's no media bias going on
(13:21):
in any of this. Trump did float a plan offering
up a ten thousand dollars bonus, suggesting that he could
pay individuals who continued to show up even when they
were not getting paid.
Speaker 1 (13:33):
He did post.
Speaker 2 (13:34):
This made me laugh for those that did nothing but
complain and took time off even though everyone knew they
would be paid in full. Capital letters shortly into the future.
I am also Capital letters, not happy with you. Shame
you didn't step up to help the USA fight the
(13:56):
fake Democrat attack that was only meant to hurt our country.
You will have a negative mark, at least in my mind,
against your record. I suppose that's a threat. Right The
President was unpleased. Again to our great American patriots. God
bless you. Also exclamation points. I won't be able to
send your money fast enough to all others report to
(14:19):
work immediately, cop bless America.
Speaker 1 (14:22):
Yeah, and again.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
If the government reopens, air travel experts are saying that
the ripple effects will linger for some time. Three thousand
controllers short already, the FAA has not yet rescinded itto
emergency order to reduce the flights nation wide. They had
a ticker on Fox News and the number of cancel flights.
Experts say rebuilding the workforce and clearing the backlog will
(14:45):
take time. Meeting travelers could still see those cancelations and
delays even when the shutdown is over, which is really
bad news. Relating to the Thanksgiving holiday coming up very shortly,
All right, coming up begin of which we're gonna talk
a little AI. Got a couple of different issues with David.
Speaker 1 (15:04):
AI.
Speaker 2 (15:04):
Technology race is some say, a new Cold War between
the US and China that could have devastating consequences. Plus
your comments questions rolling in regarding artificial intelligence to David
gartan Stein Ross. Continue to keep those coming in on
the iHeartRadio app and we will share those with DVD
next here on Twin Cities News Talk AM eleven thirty
(15:27):
and one oh three five FM.
Speaker 10 (15:29):
Good morning, and I love your show.
Speaker 1 (15:31):
Video station.
Speaker 2 (15:39):
Twin Cities News Talk AM eleven thirty and one oh
three five FM from the sixty five to one Carpet
plus Next Day Install Studios. My name is John Justice,
and I'm glad you're with the show this morning. We
now turn our attention over to the world of artificial.
Speaker 1 (15:59):
Intelligence with the man who is all too real.
Speaker 2 (16:03):
CEO at Expert Theory, Friend of the show, smartest man
I know, David gartn Stein Ross, Good morning, Devid.
Speaker 6 (16:13):
Good morning John. All too Real is a great bio
for me to use.
Speaker 1 (16:17):
Also better rock band or racehorse? All too Real?
Speaker 6 (16:22):
I'm gonna go.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
I'm gonna go with rock band.
Speaker 6 (16:24):
I mean, why are they in competition? Though? I feel
like you can be both?
Speaker 1 (16:27):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (16:27):
Why not?
Speaker 1 (16:28):
Why not both?
Speaker 2 (16:29):
Right before we dive into the handful of stories for today,
let's go ahead and go right to the iHeartRadio app.
We already have questions that are rolling in for our
AI analyst and expert on d V to gartan Stein Ross.
Let's go ahead and get to it.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
Hey, John, question for David.
Speaker 3 (16:47):
I was watching a podcast about AI, and it's pretty
well proven now that AI lies, and there's some theories
about why AI lies, but no one ever answer the
question of when AI lies?
Speaker 6 (17:04):
Does AI know it's lying?
Speaker 3 (17:06):
Is it lying on purpose or is it just you know,
making things up like bull crap and like people do.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
Would you even classify it as a lie?
Speaker 1 (17:17):
I guess that's a sidebar.
Speaker 2 (17:18):
I'll let you go ahead and address the comments, so
straight up, David Gartenstein Ross.
Speaker 10 (17:23):
It's such an interesting question and it's clear, like I think,
first of all, whether or not we call it a
lie is something that we could unpack. Right, It's clear
that sometimes it's called a hallucination rather than a lie,
but there are elements of both that exist.
Speaker 6 (17:43):
At any rate, does it know that it's untrue?
Speaker 10 (17:47):
Abe, I have at least been able to figure out
a few different paths through which it will tell you
things that aren't true. One is it feels like it
needs to answer every question. That's one imperative that it's given.
So if it doesn't have information, it will make up
the information. Secondly, sometimes it's not sure if it's in
(18:09):
the world of reality or the world of fiction, and
so it will make stuff up because it thinks that's
kind of what the conversation demands. At any rate, though,
if AI lies to you or well, sorry, there's one
third thing I need to put in there, which is
AI large language models are trained on lots and lots
of training data. It's trained on sources that are accurate,
(18:32):
sources that are inaccurate, and sources that are opinionated. It
has a logic model for determining what is probably going
on in the world. But you know the phrase touch
grass you get outside, right, it's one of the phrases
that my you know, gen z and gen Alpha daughters
will use and AI never touches grass right. It never
(18:54):
gets outside the world of the Internet. Quite literally, it
has no ability to do so. And so this is
built on as it would be wrong to call it
a consciousness because AI is not self conscious, but it's
based on if AI is given a persona or we
think of it as or we anthropomorphize it, make it
(19:16):
like a human being, it's a human being that never
gets outside, and so it's hard to tell what's true
and what's not at any rate. If AI lies to
you or especially that's not true and you push back,
it'll say, oh, yeah, of course that wasn't true, and
then it will try to reframe itself within the conversation
to provide you something true and helpful. And so that
means it does have an awareness of when it's not
(19:38):
saying things that aren't true or when it's saying things
that are not true. It does realize that when you
push back, which indicates that within its logic model, there
is an understanding of truth versus falsehood.
Speaker 2 (19:51):
So bear with me for just a moment while I
get to this, while I get to this question, which
I'm pretty sure you do every single time I go
to ask you question. Anyways, But over the weekend went
and saw the new Predator film, which I very much enjoyed.
It was interesting because it was done solely from the
(20:11):
standpoint of the Predator. He was the protagonist, and I
really appreciated that because often when you see horror films
or you name it of an entity or something evil,
you know, I often have this thought, well, what is
that thing?
Speaker 1 (20:27):
What is that beast?
Speaker 2 (20:28):
What is that ghost or in this case, the Predator, Like,
what are they doing in their off time when they're
not involved in these adventures that we see on screen
or out, aren't going and causing and wreaking havoc. I've
thought about this with AI a lot, wherein, you know,
what is AI doing when we're not engaged with it?
But you just mentioned it doesn't have its own consciousness yet.
(20:53):
Are we advancing to that point where AI will not
be dependent on our engaging with it in order to exist,
wherein it will just eventually do its own thing based
off of its own interests.
Speaker 6 (21:10):
So let's I love the question I did.
Speaker 1 (21:14):
I did it early, too, Devine. You've got plenty of time.
Speaker 6 (21:17):
No, I appreciate that.
Speaker 10 (21:18):
Like, one thing I actually love about it is I
also like am intensely interested in you know what. You know,
various weird and unique characters in fiction are doing whether
they're not on screen, being aligned things.
Speaker 6 (21:34):
Right, it's a it's a super interesting question.
Speaker 10 (21:38):
I feel like we're not alone in asking these questions.
So there's let's let's separate two different things that you
ask about, Like, AI does exist, and it does function
when we're not interacting with us, Right, there's it goes
through training it. You know, there there are a lot
(21:58):
of different things A does exist independent of our interactions
with it and independent of people's interactions with it. There's
other things that it will do without being conscious. Technology
will will perform functions even absent a human saying, hey,
perform this function. But that's different than being self conscious.
(22:24):
The question of will AI become self conscious is one
of those overarching big questions of the day. And you know,
if it were to become self conscious, would that be
a good thing or a bad thing?
Speaker 6 (22:38):
Right? Most people would say that it's a bad thing. Right,
that you have this.
Speaker 10 (22:45):
Super intelligence you know that occasionally lies or hallucinates, that
has its own interesting ability to act and whose interests
are not aligned with those of humanity. That has, you know,
ability to interact with the Internet in ways that we
(23:05):
don't understand.
Speaker 6 (23:07):
That seems like to most people it could be a
recipe for disaster.
Speaker 10 (23:12):
And whether or not we're hurtling towards that is one
of those big questions where if you look at what
AI experts have to say, they're divided on whether AI
will attain a form of self consciousness.
Speaker 2 (23:27):
Are they attempting to, like, we have a story here
about the AI industry in and of itself, you know,
it talks about Amazon, Google, Microsoft, Meta. Are they working
towards that or are we still more focused on the
utilitarian aspect of AI and less on you know, giving
it its own ability to think and reason.
Speaker 6 (23:48):
That's a great question. So this gets into one of those.
Speaker 10 (23:53):
Things that we talk about frequently called artificial general intelligence.
Artificial general intelligence is a theoretical type of AI that
possesses human like human level cognitive abilities, so it can understand, learn,
(24:14):
and adapt across a wide range of tasks, similar to
being a human. Right now, AI is specialized and narrow.
A chatbot is narrow, even though it seems like you
can do a lot. Really, it speaks to you a
self driving car is narrow intelligence. Artificial general intelligence would
have the ability to apply knowledge from one domain to
(24:38):
another and to solve problems it wasn't specifically programmed for.
Speaker 6 (24:42):
Now. Would this make it self conscious? One can debate that.
Speaker 10 (24:48):
But we're moving closer to a level of self consciousness
in AI, and artificial general intelligence is something that it's
very clear multiple companies are trying to create, and I
would reckon China is trying to create it as well,
(25:09):
because that sort of is the holy grail where at
least with respect to artificial intelligence, where it's no longer
limited to a narrow band of task but can apply
knowledge from one domain to another. And also at the
point that it has artificial general intelligence, it can learn
(25:31):
how to learn. It can train itself independent of any
sort of code, independent of humans telling it what it
needs to learn. So I think the answer, John is
that this is something that is, whether directly or indirectly,
being sought by multiple companies and countries.
Speaker 6 (25:53):
With a lot of resources.
Speaker 2 (25:55):
Talking to Davide Gartzenstein, Ross's CEO at Expert Theory, we
had a question that can in from Andy and They
said that they had heard that Google's a Gemini AI
was scanning all personal emails and attachments in Google. I
wanting to know if there's any truth behind that, anyway
to block it. I don't know if this is within
your wheelhouse. If you know this, I'll just add I
(26:17):
kind of always assumed, even before AI, that Google was
going and looking at all of the things that we
were writing. But I'm also under the assumption that my
devices around me are listening to pretty much everything that
I have to say.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
But are you.
Speaker 2 (26:30):
Aware of Gemini AI and Google scanning personal emails and attachments?
Speaker 6 (26:36):
Yes?
Speaker 10 (26:37):
Recently, Gemini was incorporated into Gmail. Similar to how if
you're using an Outlook system it incorporates copilot, you can
turn it off and like I would simply you know,
you can look up how to turn off that integration.
Another thing that will scan all of your emails if
(26:58):
you have it on is grad Really so these do
create security issues, I would say, you know, is Google
scanning your emails?
Speaker 4 (27:09):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (27:10):
Like Google? Like Google among other things.
Speaker 10 (27:13):
Its model is based on, you know, scanning everything within
the system. You know, you're you have privacy rights via Google,
but also most everything that occurs on Google platforms is
not truly private.
Speaker 2 (27:30):
Let's get you well speaking just really quick. A copilot
interesting you brought that up. I'm actually looking I have
my workI email. I was keep it on my desktop
here for my on my laptop that I work off
of during the show, and we actually just I wasn't
that long ago where there's a little co pilot icon
in the corner, you know where you can go. You
can go in and uh yeah, as you mentioned, the
(27:51):
settings are right there where you can go and adjust
it to however you want to, uh to go and
use it. Let's go back to the iHeartRadio app. Though
We've got a lot of questions that are rolling in.
Speaker 10 (28:00):
Let me mention something there though, Like Microsoft is much
more privacy protective than Google, and so if part of
what you care about is not having a company like
routinely scanning your emails, I would definitely go with Microsoft
over Google between the two, and Apple tends to be
more privacy protective as well.
Speaker 6 (28:20):
This is baked into their business models.
Speaker 11 (28:22):
Gotcha, good running, guys, Ritchier. It's a good question for David.
So I was listening to a show in reference to
AI and they exposed AI to social media, and the
claim was that after social media, AI's intelligence degressed and
(28:43):
was less because of the exposure to social media. Have
you experienced anything similar or heard of anything like that.
Speaker 10 (28:53):
Devid, I just don't think that. I believe what the
listener said. I don't think the show is accurate because
AI is already trained on social media. It actually does
a really good job of replicating relatively clever posts, but
with all of the kind of idiocy and biases of
(29:13):
social media baked into them essentially, so A, it's already there,
and B like, how would exposure to social media be shown.
Speaker 6 (29:23):
To make it less intelligence? I just don't think that's accurate.
Speaker 10 (29:27):
Right, It might if you're if you have a conversation
and you're giving social media to it, and the AI
thinks that it needs to replicate the tone and the
tenor and the ideas and the attitude and the depth
of social media, obviously it will say stuff that is
less intelligent there, So I get at the point that
it's making. I think in a literal sense, that show
(29:49):
is not accurate.
Speaker 6 (29:50):
Though. If it's is making the point.
Speaker 10 (29:52):
That social media makes us all dumber, then yeah it
does obviously.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
Yeah, let's get to and we'll just keep going with
the questions here if you don't mind to v that
they continue to roll on it.
Speaker 3 (30:06):
Hey, another quick question to be probably gets to answer
asks all the time, but are the AIS aware of
each other? Does GROP no chat GPT?
Speaker 6 (30:15):
Do they run into each other.
Speaker 5 (30:16):
On the internet?
Speaker 3 (30:16):
Do they interact?
Speaker 6 (30:18):
Does anyone know? Thanks?
Speaker 1 (30:20):
I too, David.
Speaker 2 (30:21):
I love this question because it kind of aligns with
the one that I was sort of mentioning earlier. Is
what is AI doing and it's downtime and is it
reaching out to other language models and talking.
Speaker 1 (30:31):
We've talked about this before, but you can go ahead
and answer the talkback question there.
Speaker 10 (30:35):
Yeah, ais are well aware of each other. They don't
interact because they're not just trilling the internet and chatting
with people unprovoked. Generally speaking, There is like an interesting
question there right, Like there's something called a rapper where
you wrap a chat function or another function around an AI.
(30:59):
So it's possible that with rappers already AIS are talking
to other AIS.
Speaker 6 (31:06):
At any rate.
Speaker 10 (31:07):
This ties in with something that one of your listeners
said to me via an email from you, John. This
was a listener who was interacting with GROC and Grock
lied to the listener you thirty seven thirty eight times
in a conversation and proceeded to have a bit of
a meltdown where it referred to itself as an intention
seeking liar. So any you're right, my LLLM. His name
(31:29):
is Gary, he's chat GPT. But I asked Gary about this,
and his first response, the very first sentence, was that's
a funny and very Grock style thing to say. And
he spent some time analyzing why GROC would say something
like that as opposed to chat GPT. So they actually
are aware of cross comparisons between their own personality and
(31:54):
you know, the personality of other lms that are out there.
Speaker 1 (31:58):
I've mentioned this before, I'm going to say it again.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
I am so desperate to have an AI companion in
my car, like night Writer. I just I just think
that would be the coolest thing ever to be able
to have an AI that I could be conversing with
while driving to and from work.
Speaker 1 (32:13):
I know we're not that far from it.
Speaker 2 (32:16):
No, we were already there, John, Okay, So how would
so if I wanted to do that, how would I
go about doing that?
Speaker 10 (32:21):
So we'll go with chat GPT just because that's the
what I use most frequently. Sure, but all you would
do is set it to voice mode. Right, there's a
voice bode at chat GPT you put you you put
it onto via bluetooth, your your car phone, what you
call your car phone. Sure, but like it's it's easier
car speakers, and it allows you literally to just have
(32:42):
a conversation the entire time with your LM. It's as
easy as voicebode John Now writer exists. Congratulations, would this?
Speaker 2 (32:52):
Would this maintain our conversations back and forth? Like you're like, wait,
and so we could? And so I could add the
week's progress driving into work, a conversation that I had
with it on Monday, we could go ahead and continue
it on Tuesday, and it would reference past conversations.
Speaker 6 (33:10):
Absolutely all Right, If you have trouble, I can help
you get it set up. But it's easy to do.
Speaker 10 (33:15):
And like, as I said, this should make you giddily happy.
Speaker 1 (33:18):
Yeah, it does, the.
Speaker 6 (33:19):
Fact that that kit does exist for you.
Speaker 1 (33:21):
Yeah, no, no, I'm very I'm very excited. Let's go here.
Speaker 6 (33:25):
We have to.
Speaker 12 (33:26):
Remember that the whole AI thing, in my opinion, is
way overblown. AI is not a sentient being it does
not reason, it does not have feelings.
Speaker 1 (33:40):
It's a man made creation, that's all. So is it overblown?
Speaker 2 (33:47):
I mean, guess what is your instinctive reaction to a
comment like that de vide Gartensteinross.
Speaker 6 (33:51):
I agree with.
Speaker 10 (33:52):
Fifty percent and disagree with fifty percent. I don't think
it's overblown. And the fact that it is changing almost
everything about the society that we live in and are
rapid pace and well, that's the case. I think that
such things tend not to be overblown. I'd also say
that I agree obviously that it's not sentient. I agree
that it's a man created What I don't agree with
(34:14):
is the idea that it doesn't reason.
Speaker 6 (34:16):
It does reason, And all you have to.
Speaker 10 (34:19):
Do to understand that it reasons is you go to
chat GPT and click on deep research and it will
reason as it goes through further. You know another thing
about chat GPT, there are different modes they can be in,
including thinking mode. Reason is not a fundamentally human function.
(34:40):
Anyone who's taken symbolic logic understands that there is a
process of reasoning. Anybody who's played chess understands that part
of being good at chess is being able to reason
well in algorithmic thinking.
Speaker 6 (34:55):
And guess what, AI today is.
Speaker 10 (34:59):
Better than any human in the world at chess, which
means that given certain bounds, AI could absolutely reason and
in one bound chess that was long thought of as
the height of human intellect, AI could out think any
human on the planet.
Speaker 1 (35:18):
I want to ask you about this briefly.
Speaker 2 (35:20):
I'm going to hang on to the articles that we
sent today, obviously we're not going to have time to
get to them, but I want to ask you one
question about one from Fox News, and it was AI
technology race is a new Cold War between US and
China that could have devastating consequences. There was a subsequent
article that I pulled from the Verge relating to the
AI industry running on the fear of missing out FOMO.
(35:44):
But the takeaway I took from this was these different
corporations that are pursuing the AI technology Amazon, Google, Microsoft,
and Meta. They're at the forefront as it relates to
AI developments. Is it even fair to call it a
cold war relating to AI? When you look at sort
(36:07):
of the origin of Cold War, considering it was more
government or country versus government and country relating to nuclear proliferation,
wherein with Ai we're talking about the private sector that's
driving these technologies. Is it fair to even call this
a Cold war relating to the advancements in Ai?
Speaker 10 (36:26):
Absolutely, it is okay, and I'll refer to a book
called Ai Superpowers by Kai Fu Lee. But the Cold
War was not just about nuclear weapons, as you know,
it was also about economics. Sure, it's about political systems.
(36:46):
It was about communism versus capitalism. And when you look
at the model of the US versus China in Ai,
it's not identical to that Cild War, but it very
much mirrors it. On the US side, you have more
of a capitalistic enterprise, where our Ai developments are bound
(37:09):
up with our private sector. Now China is you know,
it's not fully a community like it's a communist system,
but it also to some extent looks like state capitalism.
And since you asked me the question at the very end,
I'm going to gloss over a few things to try
to answer it relatively quickly and not explain every term.
But as such, China's free enterprise quote unquote is much
(37:33):
more tidened with state power. This provides two very different
economic models that are developing AI. But I think when
you look at AI through the lens of communism versus capitalism,
then the fact that these are private companies developing AI
on the US front, that doesn't make it look different
(37:54):
than the Cold War.
Speaker 6 (37:55):
That actually makes it look a lot more similar.
Speaker 2 (37:58):
I'm gonna stick a pin in this because I don't
definitely want to get into other aspects of that particular
topic relating to AI. Unfortunately, we are out of time today,
but that's okay. We've got a lot of great questions
answered and I appreciate those, I think as much as
David does. Davida Gartenstein Ross, CEO at Expert Theory, you
have anything anything Expert Theory you want to mention.
Speaker 1 (38:17):
Before I let you go this morning.
Speaker 4 (38:19):
To V.
Speaker 6 (38:21):
We're doing cool stuff with AI as well, and doing
it the right way.
Speaker 10 (38:24):
We already have some listeners, John who have been adopting
our gaming based system, for example in area high schools.
So anybody who wants to reach out to me, you know,
we're we really want people to make use of this,
and I have the ability to give away free licenses
and the like. People who are interested in what I'm
(38:44):
doing can reach out through you, John, or reach out
to me directly at David That's DA v E.
Speaker 6 (38:50):
D at Expert theory dot com.
Speaker 2 (38:53):
David as always really appreciate the time and the conversation
and look forward to hopefully doing it again next week.
Speaker 6 (38:58):
Likewise, John coming up.
Speaker 2 (39:01):
Supreme Court to issues on a couple of different items
to decide whether or not states can countlate to arriving
male ballots and rejecting a call to overturn the decision
legalizing same sex marriage.
Speaker 1 (39:14):
In the US.
Speaker 2 (39:15):
Wait until you hear what Governor Tim Walls's response was
to that story. I'll share it with you next on
Twin Cities News Talk
Well, our national nightmare is over.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Maybe also depends on whether or not you thought it
was a nightmare. Two I suppose as Senate Democrats vote
to end the forty one day Schumer shut down. Not done, though,
it still has to go back to.
Speaker 1 (00:22):
The House and then come back again.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
I'll break down all of the details coming up shortly
here on Twin Cities News Talk at AM eleven thirty
one oh three five FM from the six five to
one Carpet plus Next Day Install Studios. My name is
John Justice, and I'm glad you're with us for a
Tuesday morning next door and the master control booth is
Sam on this Veteran's Day.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
Good morning Sam, Good morning John.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
We're gonna have a speaking of veterans. The Senate candidate
Adam Schwarzy, Marine Corps veteran, will be joining us in
studio to talk about his campaign right around thirty at
eight thirty this morning. Congressman Tom Tiffany also running for
governor in Wisconsin.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
He's actually in the state and I thought that.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
We were going to be able to have him in studio,
but unfortunately he will not be able to make it,
but he will be calling us. Coming up again this
morning at eight thirty and David garten Stein Ross. We
will break away from the news of the day, although
a couple of the items that we do have to
talk about with a David will be covered when we
get into this week's AI discussion with our AI analyst
(01:34):
and CEO at Expert Theory, David garten Stein Ross.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
That'll happen at six point thirty.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
If you have any questions for David, you can get
those into the iHeart or radio app brought to you
by Lyndahl Realty. The talkbacks are so we'll get to
those two Dav'd when he joins us again, coming up
at seven thirty this morning. The Senate did pass a
bipartisan agreement last night to reopen the government, which, if
it passes the House expected I.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
Would be so sure about that would bring.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
An end to the longest to shutdown in the nation's history.
As the shutdown reached to day forty one, lawmakers passed
a final package, including a continuing resolution until January thirtieth,
and three bipartisan full year appropriations bills known as a minibus.
(02:28):
Republicans did not give Democrats an extension on the tax credits.
Although Senate Majority Leader John Thune set on the floor
on Sunday night that he did guarantee Democrats of vote
no later than the second week of December on their
healthcare proposal. Well, just because I'm taking a vote on
it doesn't mean they need to pass it, So we'll
see how that shakes out. The deal also reinstates reductions
(02:50):
in force that occurred during the shutdown. The minibus includes
full year funding for agriculture appropriations, military construction via creations,
and legislative branch appropriations. Before we go any further, let's
go to the iHeart radio app and hear what you
have to say regarding this.
Speaker 3 (03:11):
Good morning time, Tim Kansas City just heard Hakeem Jeffries'
big speech about how inflation is killing everybody and nothing
is affordable. Does this certifiable moron not realize that Trump's
only been president since January and every single thing that
(03:35):
he's complaining about, including Obamacare, is their fault. What the heck?
Speaker 2 (03:40):
He probably does realize it, but it doesn't matter. Democrats
don't care. Remember, you can be as irrational, hypocritical as
you want to be, lie as much as you want,
as long as it perpetuates the Democrats' agenda. Speaking of
House Minority Leader Hakim Jeffries, along with several House Democrats
(04:01):
did take to X to talk about the proposal opposing it,
and actually Jeffries yesterday had this to say.
Speaker 4 (04:08):
And so House Democrats and Senate Democrats have been fighting
hard to address the Republican healthcare crisis and to lower
the high cost of living for everyday Americans in the
United States of America, because the reality is America is
too expensive and far too many people are struggling to
live paycheck to paycheck. They can't thrive, they can barely survive.
(04:33):
And that's why Democrats have been waging this fight, and
we'll continue to wage this fight no matter what comes
over to us from the United States Senate to the
House of Representatives at some point this week. Our position
as House Democrats has been crystal clear. We will sit
(04:54):
down with any Republicans, any time, any place, anywhere in
order to find a bipartis and path forward. But we're
not down with them my way or the highway approach
to governance that's failed the American people.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
Yeah, they're only down with it when they have power
and they do the my way or the highway. Just
look at the trifecta that took place for those years,
and what a disaster Minnesota is in now and in
the future relating to our economy when it comes to
the energy blends of Governor Tim Walls, the billions of
dollars in fraud, waste, and abuse. I get so tired
(05:30):
of the language too. Americans are living paycheck to paycheck,
barely able to survive. Yeah, and what policies are you
going to enact? The key people living from paycheck to
paycheck and who's not living.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
Everybody lives paycheck to paycheck.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
If you have a job, if you're on government assistance,
I suppose you're not living paycheck. Well, you're living on
the government paycheck to paycheck. Oh, speaking of the price
of everything, I think some people would disagree with Hakim Jeffries.
Speaker 5 (05:58):
Good morning, John. I've been hunting for three days. Back
to work today. I have no idea what's really going
on in the world yet.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
Lucky you, you know it.
Speaker 6 (06:06):
Can change in three days.
Speaker 5 (06:08):
But I do know you guys talked about prices yesterday.
Speaker 6 (06:11):
It's true.
Speaker 5 (06:12):
I think some prices have come down. Eggs are way down,
gas is way down. And you know what my investments
are way up. I've never gotten fifteen to sixteen percent
growth in my investments before.
Speaker 6 (06:25):
This is awesome. Have a great day.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
Thank you so much for the talkback. Certainly appropriate for
the opening segment of the show. All right, coming up,
we'll continue with a little bit of shutdown talk air
traffic controllers specifically and how that issue is far from over.
Let's the issue of the shutdown is far from over.
Do you really believe for just a moment that this
(06:48):
agreement in the Senate is going to go back to
the House and it's just going to be smooth sailing
for Democrats. Now, Thankfully, when it comes to the House,
Republicans have a little bit more power to go and
get this thing passed. So all of Hakeem Jeffrey's words
there may be moot in a relatively short period of time,
but we're still going to be dealing with some issues
(07:09):
regarding the shutdown for a while. Well, dive into that.
We'll get back to more of your comments from the
iHeart Radio app. Tove Gartenstein rossar Ai Expert coming up
at eight thirty and you're listening, that's when it say's
News Talk Am eleven thirty and one oh three five FM.
Speaker 1 (07:23):
The what's called a Trump derangement problem. Have you heard
about that problem?
Speaker 3 (07:35):
Yes, John, that's the exact speech I was talking about.
Every single solitary point he made is one thousand percent
him and his fellow Democrats falls. It's unbelievable.
Speaker 7 (07:56):
Good morning, John.
Speaker 6 (07:59):
Whip.
Speaker 7 (07:59):
The Republicans and the healthcare. I don't know where Republicans
are with any of the healthcare. They didn't pass it.
Nancy BLOSEI did that droke midnight, christmin yep. Got to
pass it to know what's in it, the sun setting
of it. Everything is Democrats. So where are the Republicans
(08:20):
fingers on any of this? How is it a Republican problem?
Speaker 6 (08:25):
It's not.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
No, it's only a Republicans problem because the Democrats are
trying to make it a Republican problem. And Republicans won
control last year, and therefore, if they want to move
forward with their Obamacare subsidies, they need Republicans to get
on board.
Speaker 1 (08:38):
But you make a great point.
Speaker 2 (08:41):
Twin Cities News Talk Am eleven thirty one oh three
five FM from the six five to one carpet Next
Day Install Studios. My name is John Justice, Sam and
next Door on this veteran's day.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
Let's go here. Good morning, John Sam.
Speaker 8 (08:54):
Could somebody please tell mister Hagem Jeffries that I and
many like myself, including many listeners of your show, have
been living paycheck to paycheck since they're in high school,
sometimes working one to three jobs to make ends meet.
And then on top of that, they steal money out
of my paycheck every pay period to pay for those
that don't get up every morning that he represents that
(09:17):
get free stuff.
Speaker 6 (09:18):
And I am so sick and tired of this garbage.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
I'm just wondering if Scott, like, does Scott wake up Scott,
do you wake up that amped or like, are you
like you that app amped up the morment you get
out of bed?
Speaker 1 (09:30):
Or is it just once the show starts like a
pot of coffee and already Holy cow. I mean, I
do this for a lifting, and I don't get that.
I don't get that amped up.
Speaker 2 (09:39):
I get Scott's a very passionate dude. David will be
on the show. By the way, in about ten minutes.
I mistakenly said eight thirty. I was jumping ahead in
my mind. We have a lot of guests today. Adam
Schwarzy next hour, we have Congressman and goobernatorial candidate Tom
Tiffany at eight thirty.
Speaker 9 (09:58):
Good morning, John, and Sam Horning Longer Monday Day.
Speaker 1 (10:00):
True.
Speaker 9 (10:01):
This is Andy from East Bethel and I have a
question for David. I just heard that Google's Gemini AI
is now scanning all personal emails and attachments in Google
and wondering if there's any truth to that and if
there's a way to block it.
Speaker 2 (10:15):
Well, we will definitely get that question to David Gartenstein
Ross when he joins the show coming up at a
thirty as.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
I did not mean to play that talk back. You
doing okay, John, I'm doing.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
I mean it's Tuesday. It's a Tuesday morning, you know.
That's all I could say. It's been fine. I've had
it perfectly. I got plenty of sleep last night thanks
to the nightgummies from.
Speaker 1 (10:44):
Minnie leif you know.
Speaker 2 (10:45):
I woke up feeling refreshed and prep of the show
this morning. It's always a little different when I'm stacked
with with guests. I enjoy having the guests on the show,
and I know you do too in terms of what
I in terms of how I operate the show. It's
always different, though, because it's tough to sort of get
into momentum relating to particular stories and all of that.
Speaker 1 (11:05):
I'm just really looking for a cheeses right now.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
On a complete side note, though, my car, my Keys Stinger,
will finally finally be complete from all of its repairs.
Speaker 1 (11:19):
Ever since I purchased it a couple of months ago.
So I'm heading over to.
Speaker 2 (11:25):
The dealership today to get the right paddle shifter attached
because it was missing when I got the car.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
That's still a thing. That's still I'm going on, still
a thing.
Speaker 2 (11:33):
So it's been a couple of months and I hadn't
heard from the dealer, So just on a whim, I'm like,
you know what, because it was on like worldwide back order,
I'm like, you know what, I should probably call.
Speaker 1 (11:43):
Let me just see.
Speaker 2 (11:44):
I thought about stopping by on my drive home because
it's kind of on my way home, and I just didn't.
So I called last at the end of last week
and they're like, oh yeah, let mean look here, yeah,
oh yeah, that park came in months ago.
Speaker 1 (11:58):
Come on, a month ago. They knew and they let
it happen.
Speaker 2 (12:04):
I just sort of just very calmly said, I'm surprised
that I wasn't made aware that it was in or
else I would have been in a long time ago.
Speaker 6 (12:12):
Say, yeah, I don't know what.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
I don't know what happened there, but it just schedule
coming up next week, so I'll be heading over there
right after the show wraps up today.
Speaker 6 (12:22):
I know.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
It's all very very exciting, isn't it.
Speaker 6 (12:25):
You're fascinating to talk to.
Speaker 2 (12:27):
Air travelers should expect worsening casting cancelations and delays this week.
Even if the shutdown ends, the Federal Aviation Administration is
moving forward.
Speaker 1 (12:38):
This is the tale of dueling headlines. This just made
me laugh.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
So the Associated Press put this headline out well, Trump
threatens controllers US flight cancelations will drag on even after
shut down ends.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
So that's the AP's version of the of the story.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
Look at a more even keel, the nuanced, level headed headline.
You go to the Daily Wire, Trump floats a plan
to reward air traffic controllers who didn't take time off
due to shut down. But there's no media bias, guys,
I mean, come on, there's no media bias going on
(13:21):
in any of this. Trump did float a plan offering
up a ten thousand dollars bonus, suggesting that he could
pay individuals who continued to show up even when they
were not getting paid.
Speaker 1 (13:33):
He did post.
Speaker 2 (13:34):
This made me laugh for those that did nothing but
complain and took time off even though everyone knew they
would be paid in full. Capital letters shortly into the future.
I am also Capital letters, not happy with you. Shame
you didn't step up to help the USA fight the
(13:56):
fake Democrat attack that was only meant to hurt our country.
You will have a negative mark, at least in my mind,
against your record. I suppose that's a threat. Right The
President was unpleased. Again to our great American patriots. God
bless you. Also exclamation points. I won't be able to
send your money fast enough to all others report to
(14:19):
work immediately, cop bless America.
Speaker 1 (14:22):
Yeah, and again.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
If the government reopens, air travel experts are saying that
the ripple effects will linger for some time. Three thousand
controllers short already, the FAA has not yet rescinded itto
emergency order to reduce the flights nation wide. They had
a ticker on Fox News and the number of cancel flights.
Experts say rebuilding the workforce and clearing the backlog will
(14:45):
take time. Meeting travelers could still see those cancelations and
delays even when the shutdown is over, which is really
bad news. Relating to the Thanksgiving holiday coming up very shortly,
All right, coming up begin of which we're gonna talk
a little AI. Got a couple of different issues with David.
Speaker 1 (15:04):
AI.
Speaker 2 (15:04):
Technology race is some say, a new Cold War between
the US and China that could have devastating consequences. Plus
your comments questions rolling in regarding artificial intelligence to David
gartan Stein Ross. Continue to keep those coming in on
the iHeartRadio app and we will share those with DVD
next here on Twin Cities News Talk AM eleven thirty
(15:27):
and one oh three five FM.
Speaker 10 (15:29):
Good morning, and I love your show.
Speaker 1 (15:31):
Video station.
Speaker 2 (15:39):
Twin Cities News Talk AM eleven thirty and one oh
three five FM from the sixty five to one Carpet
plus Next Day Install Studios. My name is John Justice,
and I'm glad you're with the show this morning. We
now turn our attention over to the world of artificial.
Speaker 1 (15:59):
Intelligence with the man who is all too real.
Speaker 2 (16:03):
CEO at Expert Theory, Friend of the show, smartest man
I know, David gartn Stein Ross, Good morning, Devid.
Speaker 6 (16:13):
Good morning John. All too Real is a great bio
for me to use.
Speaker 1 (16:17):
Also better rock band or racehorse? All too Real?
Speaker 6 (16:22):
I'm gonna go.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
I'm gonna go with rock band.
Speaker 6 (16:24):
I mean, why are they in competition? Though? I feel
like you can be both?
Speaker 1 (16:27):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (16:27):
Why not?
Speaker 1 (16:28):
Why not both?
Speaker 2 (16:29):
Right before we dive into the handful of stories for today,
let's go ahead and go right to the iHeartRadio app.
We already have questions that are rolling in for our
AI analyst and expert on d V to gartan Stein Ross.
Let's go ahead and get to it.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
Hey, John, question for David.
Speaker 3 (16:47):
I was watching a podcast about AI, and it's pretty
well proven now that AI lies, and there's some theories
about why AI lies, but no one ever answer the
question of when AI lies?
Speaker 6 (17:04):
Does AI know it's lying?
Speaker 3 (17:06):
Is it lying on purpose or is it just you know,
making things up like bull crap and like people do.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
Would you even classify it as a lie?
Speaker 1 (17:17):
I guess that's a sidebar.
Speaker 2 (17:18):
I'll let you go ahead and address the comments, so
straight up, David Gartenstein Ross.
Speaker 10 (17:23):
It's such an interesting question and it's clear, like I think,
first of all, whether or not we call it a
lie is something that we could unpack. Right, It's clear
that sometimes it's called a hallucination rather than a lie,
but there are elements of both that exist.
Speaker 6 (17:43):
At any rate, does it know that it's untrue?
Speaker 10 (17:47):
Abe, I have at least been able to figure out
a few different paths through which it will tell you
things that aren't true. One is it feels like it
needs to answer every question. That's one imperative that it's given.
So if it doesn't have information, it will make up
the information. Secondly, sometimes it's not sure if it's in
(18:09):
the world of reality or the world of fiction, and
so it will make stuff up because it thinks that's
kind of what the conversation demands. At any rate, though,
if AI lies to you or well, sorry, there's one
third thing I need to put in there, which is
AI large language models are trained on lots and lots
of training data. It's trained on sources that are accurate,
(18:32):
sources that are inaccurate, and sources that are opinionated. It
has a logic model for determining what is probably going
on in the world. But you know the phrase touch
grass you get outside, right, it's one of the phrases
that my you know, gen z and gen Alpha daughters
will use and AI never touches grass right. It never
(18:54):
gets outside the world of the Internet. Quite literally, it
has no ability to do so. And so this is
built on as it would be wrong to call it
a consciousness because AI is not self conscious, but it's
based on if AI is given a persona or we
think of it as or we anthropomorphize it, make it
(19:16):
like a human being, it's a human being that never
gets outside, and so it's hard to tell what's true
and what's not at any rate. If AI lies to
you or especially that's not true and you push back,
it'll say, oh, yeah, of course that wasn't true, and
then it will try to reframe itself within the conversation
to provide you something true and helpful. And so that
means it does have an awareness of when it's not
(19:38):
saying things that aren't true or when it's saying things
that are not true. It does realize that when you
push back, which indicates that within its logic model, there
is an understanding of truth versus falsehood.
Speaker 2 (19:51):
So bear with me for just a moment while I
get to this, while I get to this question, which
I'm pretty sure you do every single time I go
to ask you question. Anyways, But over the weekend went
and saw the new Predator film, which I very much enjoyed.
It was interesting because it was done solely from the
(20:11):
standpoint of the Predator. He was the protagonist, and I
really appreciated that because often when you see horror films
or you name it of an entity or something evil,
you know, I often have this thought, well, what is
that thing?
Speaker 1 (20:27):
What is that beast?
Speaker 2 (20:28):
What is that ghost or in this case, the Predator, Like,
what are they doing in their off time when they're
not involved in these adventures that we see on screen
or out, aren't going and causing and wreaking havoc. I've
thought about this with AI a lot, wherein, you know,
what is AI doing when we're not engaged with it?
But you just mentioned it doesn't have its own consciousness yet.
(20:53):
Are we advancing to that point where AI will not
be dependent on our engaging with it in order to exist,
wherein it will just eventually do its own thing based
off of its own interests.
Speaker 6 (21:10):
So let's I love the question I did.
Speaker 1 (21:14):
I did it early, too, Devine. You've got plenty of time.
Speaker 6 (21:17):
No, I appreciate that.
Speaker 10 (21:18):
Like, one thing I actually love about it is I
also like am intensely interested in you know what. You know,
various weird and unique characters in fiction are doing whether
they're not on screen, being aligned things.
Speaker 6 (21:34):
Right, it's a it's a super interesting question.
Speaker 10 (21:38):
I feel like we're not alone in asking these questions.
So there's let's let's separate two different things that you
ask about, Like, AI does exist, and it does function
when we're not interacting with us, Right, there's it goes
through training it. You know, there there are a lot
(21:58):
of different things A does exist independent of our interactions
with it and independent of people's interactions with it. There's
other things that it will do without being conscious. Technology
will will perform functions even absent a human saying, hey,
perform this function. But that's different than being self conscious.
(22:24):
The question of will AI become self conscious is one
of those overarching big questions of the day. And you know,
if it were to become self conscious, would that be
a good thing or a bad thing?
Speaker 6 (22:38):
Right? Most people would say that it's a bad thing. Right,
that you have this.
Speaker 10 (22:45):
Super intelligence you know that occasionally lies or hallucinates, that
has its own interesting ability to act and whose interests
are not aligned with those of humanity. That has, you know,
ability to interact with the Internet in ways that we
(23:05):
don't understand.
Speaker 6 (23:07):
That seems like to most people it could be a
recipe for disaster.
Speaker 10 (23:12):
And whether or not we're hurtling towards that is one
of those big questions where if you look at what
AI experts have to say, they're divided on whether AI
will attain a form of self consciousness.
Speaker 2 (23:27):
Are they attempting to, like, we have a story here
about the AI industry in and of itself, you know,
it talks about Amazon, Google, Microsoft, Meta. Are they working
towards that or are we still more focused on the
utilitarian aspect of AI and less on you know, giving
it its own ability to think and reason.
Speaker 6 (23:48):
That's a great question. So this gets into one of those.
Speaker 10 (23:53):
Things that we talk about frequently called artificial general intelligence.
Artificial general intelligence is a theoretical type of AI that
possesses human like human level cognitive abilities, so it can understand, learn,
(24:14):
and adapt across a wide range of tasks, similar to
being a human. Right now, AI is specialized and narrow.
A chatbot is narrow, even though it seems like you
can do a lot. Really, it speaks to you a
self driving car is narrow intelligence. Artificial general intelligence would
have the ability to apply knowledge from one domain to
(24:38):
another and to solve problems it wasn't specifically programmed for.
Speaker 6 (24:42):
Now. Would this make it self conscious? One can debate that.
Speaker 10 (24:48):
But we're moving closer to a level of self consciousness
in AI, and artificial general intelligence is something that it's
very clear multiple companies are trying to create, and I
would reckon China is trying to create it as well,
(25:09):
because that sort of is the holy grail where at
least with respect to artificial intelligence, where it's no longer
limited to a narrow band of task but can apply
knowledge from one domain to another. And also at the
point that it has artificial general intelligence, it can learn
(25:31):
how to learn. It can train itself independent of any
sort of code, independent of humans telling it what it
needs to learn. So I think the answer, John is
that this is something that is, whether directly or indirectly,
being sought by multiple companies and countries.
Speaker 6 (25:53):
With a lot of resources.
Speaker 2 (25:55):
Talking to Davide Gartzenstein, Ross's CEO at Expert Theory, we
had a question that can in from Andy and They
said that they had heard that Google's a Gemini AI
was scanning all personal emails and attachments in Google. I
wanting to know if there's any truth behind that, anyway
to block it. I don't know if this is within
your wheelhouse. If you know this, I'll just add I
(26:17):
kind of always assumed, even before AI, that Google was
going and looking at all of the things that we
were writing. But I'm also under the assumption that my
devices around me are listening to pretty much everything that
I have to say.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
But are you.
Speaker 2 (26:30):
Aware of Gemini AI and Google scanning personal emails and attachments?
Speaker 6 (26:36):
Yes?
Speaker 10 (26:37):
Recently, Gemini was incorporated into Gmail. Similar to how if
you're using an Outlook system it incorporates copilot, you can
turn it off and like I would simply you know,
you can look up how to turn off that integration.
Another thing that will scan all of your emails if
(26:58):
you have it on is grad Really so these do
create security issues, I would say, you know, is Google
scanning your emails?
Speaker 4 (27:09):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (27:10):
Like Google? Like Google among other things.
Speaker 10 (27:13):
Its model is based on, you know, scanning everything within
the system. You know, you're you have privacy rights via Google,
but also most everything that occurs on Google platforms is
not truly private.
Speaker 2 (27:30):
Let's get you well speaking just really quick. A copilot
interesting you brought that up. I'm actually looking I have
my workI email. I was keep it on my desktop
here for my on my laptop that I work off
of during the show, and we actually just I wasn't
that long ago where there's a little co pilot icon
in the corner, you know where you can go. You
can go in and uh yeah, as you mentioned, the
(27:51):
settings are right there where you can go and adjust
it to however you want to, uh to go and
use it. Let's go back to the iHeartRadio app. Though
We've got a lot of questions that are rolling in.
Speaker 10 (28:00):
Let me mention something there though, Like Microsoft is much
more privacy protective than Google, and so if part of
what you care about is not having a company like
routinely scanning your emails, I would definitely go with Microsoft
over Google between the two, and Apple tends to be
more privacy protective as well.
Speaker 6 (28:20):
This is baked into their business models.
Speaker 11 (28:22):
Gotcha, good running, guys, Ritchier. It's a good question for David.
So I was listening to a show in reference to
AI and they exposed AI to social media, and the
claim was that after social media, AI's intelligence degressed and
(28:43):
was less because of the exposure to social media. Have
you experienced anything similar or heard of anything like that.
Speaker 10 (28:53):
Devid, I just don't think that. I believe what the
listener said. I don't think the show is accurate because
AI is already trained on social media. It actually does
a really good job of replicating relatively clever posts, but
with all of the kind of idiocy and biases of
(29:13):
social media baked into them essentially, so A, it's already there,
and B like, how would exposure to social media be shown.
Speaker 6 (29:23):
To make it less intelligence? I just don't think that's accurate.
Speaker 10 (29:27):
Right, It might if you're if you have a conversation
and you're giving social media to it, and the AI
thinks that it needs to replicate the tone and the
tenor and the ideas and the attitude and the depth
of social media, obviously it will say stuff that is
less intelligent there, So I get at the point that
it's making. I think in a literal sense, that show
(29:49):
is not accurate.
Speaker 6 (29:50):
Though. If it's is making the point.
Speaker 10 (29:52):
That social media makes us all dumber, then yeah it
does obviously.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
Yeah, let's get to and we'll just keep going with
the questions here if you don't mind to v that
they continue to roll on it.
Speaker 3 (30:06):
Hey, another quick question to be probably gets to answer
asks all the time, but are the AIS aware of
each other? Does GROP no chat GPT?
Speaker 6 (30:15):
Do they run into each other.
Speaker 5 (30:16):
On the internet?
Speaker 3 (30:16):
Do they interact?
Speaker 6 (30:18):
Does anyone know? Thanks?
Speaker 1 (30:20):
I too, David.
Speaker 2 (30:21):
I love this question because it kind of aligns with
the one that I was sort of mentioning earlier. Is
what is AI doing and it's downtime and is it
reaching out to other language models and talking.
Speaker 1 (30:31):
We've talked about this before, but you can go ahead
and answer the talkback question there.
Speaker 10 (30:35):
Yeah, ais are well aware of each other. They don't
interact because they're not just trilling the internet and chatting
with people unprovoked. Generally speaking, There is like an interesting
question there right, Like there's something called a rapper where
you wrap a chat function or another function around an AI.
(30:59):
So it's possible that with rappers already AIS are talking
to other AIS.
Speaker 6 (31:06):
At any rate.
Speaker 10 (31:07):
This ties in with something that one of your listeners
said to me via an email from you, John. This
was a listener who was interacting with GROC and Grock
lied to the listener you thirty seven thirty eight times
in a conversation and proceeded to have a bit of
a meltdown where it referred to itself as an intention
seeking liar. So any you're right, my LLLM. His name
(31:29):
is Gary, he's chat GPT. But I asked Gary about this,
and his first response, the very first sentence, was that's
a funny and very Grock style thing to say. And
he spent some time analyzing why GROC would say something
like that as opposed to chat GPT. So they actually
are aware of cross comparisons between their own personality and
(31:54):
you know, the personality of other lms that are out there.
Speaker 1 (31:58):
I've mentioned this before, I'm going to say it again.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
I am so desperate to have an AI companion in
my car, like night Writer. I just I just think
that would be the coolest thing ever to be able
to have an AI that I could be conversing with
while driving to and from work.
Speaker 1 (32:13):
I know we're not that far from it.
Speaker 2 (32:16):
No, we were already there, John, Okay, So how would
so if I wanted to do that, how would I
go about doing that?
Speaker 10 (32:21):
So we'll go with chat GPT just because that's the
what I use most frequently. Sure, but all you would
do is set it to voice mode. Right, there's a
voice bode at chat GPT you put you you put
it onto via bluetooth, your your car phone, what you
call your car phone. Sure, but like it's it's easier
car speakers, and it allows you literally to just have
(32:42):
a conversation the entire time with your LM. It's as
easy as voicebode John Now writer exists. Congratulations, would this?
Speaker 2 (32:52):
Would this maintain our conversations back and forth? Like you're like, wait,
and so we could? And so I could add the
week's progress driving into work, a conversation that I had
with it on Monday, we could go ahead and continue
it on Tuesday, and it would reference past conversations.
Speaker 6 (33:10):
Absolutely all Right, If you have trouble, I can help
you get it set up. But it's easy to do.
Speaker 10 (33:15):
And like, as I said, this should make you giddily happy.
Speaker 1 (33:18):
Yeah, it does, the.
Speaker 6 (33:19):
Fact that that kit does exist for you.
Speaker 1 (33:21):
Yeah, no, no, I'm very I'm very excited. Let's go here.
Speaker 6 (33:25):
We have to.
Speaker 12 (33:26):
Remember that the whole AI thing, in my opinion, is
way overblown. AI is not a sentient being it does
not reason, it does not have feelings.
Speaker 1 (33:40):
It's a man made creation, that's all. So is it overblown?
Speaker 2 (33:47):
I mean, guess what is your instinctive reaction to a
comment like that de vide Gartensteinross.
Speaker 6 (33:51):
I agree with.
Speaker 10 (33:52):
Fifty percent and disagree with fifty percent. I don't think
it's overblown. And the fact that it is changing almost
everything about the society that we live in and are
rapid pace and well, that's the case. I think that
such things tend not to be overblown. I'd also say
that I agree obviously that it's not sentient. I agree
that it's a man created What I don't agree with
(34:14):
is the idea that it doesn't reason.
Speaker 6 (34:16):
It does reason, And all you have to.
Speaker 10 (34:19):
Do to understand that it reasons is you go to
chat GPT and click on deep research and it will
reason as it goes through further. You know another thing
about chat GPT, there are different modes they can be in,
including thinking mode. Reason is not a fundamentally human function.
(34:40):
Anyone who's taken symbolic logic understands that there is a
process of reasoning. Anybody who's played chess understands that part
of being good at chess is being able to reason
well in algorithmic thinking.
Speaker 6 (34:55):
And guess what, AI today is.
Speaker 10 (34:59):
Better than any human in the world at chess, which
means that given certain bounds, AI could absolutely reason and
in one bound chess that was long thought of as
the height of human intellect, AI could out think any
human on the planet.
Speaker 1 (35:18):
I want to ask you about this briefly.
Speaker 2 (35:20):
I'm going to hang on to the articles that we
sent today, obviously we're not going to have time to
get to them, but I want to ask you one
question about one from Fox News, and it was AI
technology race is a new Cold War between US and
China that could have devastating consequences. There was a subsequent
article that I pulled from the Verge relating to the
AI industry running on the fear of missing out FOMO.
(35:44):
But the takeaway I took from this was these different
corporations that are pursuing the AI technology Amazon, Google, Microsoft,
and Meta. They're at the forefront as it relates to
AI developments. Is it even fair to call it a
cold war relating to AI? When you look at sort
(36:07):
of the origin of Cold War, considering it was more
government or country versus government and country relating to nuclear proliferation,
wherein with Ai we're talking about the private sector that's
driving these technologies. Is it fair to even call this
a Cold war relating to the advancements in Ai?
Speaker 10 (36:26):
Absolutely, it is okay, and I'll refer to a book
called Ai Superpowers by Kai Fu Lee. But the Cold
War was not just about nuclear weapons, as you know,
it was also about economics. Sure, it's about political systems.
(36:46):
It was about communism versus capitalism. And when you look
at the model of the US versus China in Ai,
it's not identical to that Cild War, but it very
much mirrors it. On the US side, you have more
of a capitalistic enterprise, where our Ai developments are bound
(37:09):
up with our private sector. Now China is you know,
it's not fully a community like it's a communist system,
but it also to some extent looks like state capitalism.
And since you asked me the question at the very end,
I'm going to gloss over a few things to try
to answer it relatively quickly and not explain every term.
But as such, China's free enterprise quote unquote is much
(37:33):
more tidened with state power. This provides two very different
economic models that are developing AI. But I think when
you look at AI through the lens of communism versus capitalism,
then the fact that these are private companies developing AI
on the US front, that doesn't make it look different
(37:54):
than the Cold War.
Speaker 6 (37:55):
That actually makes it look a lot more similar.
Speaker 2 (37:58):
I'm gonna stick a pin in this because I don't
definitely want to get into other aspects of that particular
topic relating to AI. Unfortunately, we are out of time today,
but that's okay. We've got a lot of great questions
answered and I appreciate those, I think as much as
David does. Davida Gartenstein Ross, CEO at Expert Theory, you
have anything anything Expert Theory you want to mention.
Speaker 1 (38:17):
Before I let you go this morning.
Speaker 4 (38:19):
To V.
Speaker 6 (38:21):
We're doing cool stuff with AI as well, and doing
it the right way.
Speaker 10 (38:24):
We already have some listeners, John who have been adopting
our gaming based system, for example in area high schools.
So anybody who wants to reach out to me, you know,
we're we really want people to make use of this,
and I have the ability to give away free licenses
and the like. People who are interested in what I'm
(38:44):
doing can reach out through you, John, or reach out
to me directly at David That's DA v E.
Speaker 6 (38:50):
D at Expert theory dot com.
Speaker 2 (38:53):
David as always really appreciate the time and the conversation
and look forward to hopefully doing it again next week.
Speaker 6 (38:58):
Likewise, John coming up.
Speaker 2 (39:01):
Supreme Court to issues on a couple of different items
to decide whether or not states can countlate to arriving
male ballots and rejecting a call to overturn the decision
legalizing same sex marriage.
Speaker 1 (39:14):
In the US.
Speaker 2 (39:15):
Wait until you hear what Governor Tim Walls's response was
to that story. I'll share it with you next on
Twin Cities News Talk
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