November 10, 2025 • 33 mins
Jonny Athletic makes his weekly appearance on the show with his thoughts on the Vikings loss including some troubling things he thought he saw from Justin Jefferson. Jonny also gives his opinion on the Ja Morant trade speculation we've seen in the last week.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:24):
It's time Johnny Johnny Johnny fla headache I didn't be
talking about right now.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
RBC Wealth Management helps bring us Johnny athletic to you.
Speaker 3 (00:42):
Were you in Sacramento?
Speaker 2 (00:43):
No, you couldn't have been a Sacramento last night because
you were at the UH at the People Stadium Downtow, Minneapolis,
weren't you.
Speaker 4 (00:49):
That is correct.
Speaker 5 (00:50):
I didn't have the private jet to get me to
stack right after fortunate least, so we watched it from home.
Speaker 3 (00:56):
That's a matter of the time, all right.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
So something moved you in the JJ body language, and
it's created a lot of polarizing thought here because regarding
his response on the interceptions, there's some people were saying, well,
he knew on one of them that the player was down,
(01:21):
and ultimately he was going to the play was going
to be brought back there, and that there's too much
hyperventilation on it. You stand by your position because it's
certainly appeared, based on what I read of your piece,
to disturb you greatly.
Speaker 6 (01:37):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (01:38):
I do stand by it, Dan, I mean yeah, And
I did point out in the piece about the first
interception that he did know that he hit the guy down,
and so there wasn't as much of a reason to
run after him, but the second interception, there's no excuse
at all, and he literally walked toward the defender, Marlon
(01:58):
Humphrey as he was having up the field. And it
wasn't just that, but it was the way that he
was running routes. It was, you know, kind of not
holding onto the ball like he usually does.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
And this all.
Speaker 5 (02:12):
Stems dan from Jefferson's brilliance for the first five and
a half years of his career, and how much of
that is based on his energy, his infectious attitude, his
constant positivity, and as I said in the piece, there
are actually some good reasons for him to be frustrated,
(02:33):
but we also have never seen him lay with that lifelessness.
I don't think, I mean it was glaring because you're
just not used to seeing it. And so there were
certainly many other reasons they lost the game, the penalties,
McCarthy's erratic throat, accuracy and all those things. But I
(02:55):
just was taken aback by the lack of energy that
we saw from Justin Jefferson because we are just so
used to seeing so much more of it.
Speaker 3 (03:05):
You know, it's fairly predictable.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
I'm not necessarily at all surprised despite the warnings that
I tried to lay out last August and even into September.
Speaker 3 (03:17):
In fact, I think you and I talked about this
at the time.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
And the new game that's being played by Vikings apologists
and by the mcbulbos is the obvious. Well, I'm gonna
you know what I'm gonna do. I'm gonna do some research.
I'm gonna check to see. I'm going to compare what
JJ McCarthy did in his first four starts to every quarterback,
every young quarterback in the history to football, and what
(03:41):
they did in their first four starts. And of course, conveniently,
they often leave out a couple of things, not the
least of which is what was the relative condition of
the team that the new young quarterback inherited.
Speaker 3 (03:55):
They conveniently leave that out, that many of.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
Those quarterbacks were were joining teams that only got them
because they were among the worst teams in football. But
I digress beyond that. We said, there's going in my opinion,
and I stand by this, an inherent unfairness to the
way JJ is going to be evaluated immediately, but that
(04:20):
the Vikings themselves set this up, and you know, I mean,
if you make the decision they made when they had
other quarterback options that they could have considered, they could
have worked through, and say we're going with him, and
we're still going to make all these other moves because
we think that's going to give him the best chance
(04:42):
to succeed immediately, and yeah, we intend to be a
team going for the playoffs immediately, then that's the way
I think the.
Speaker 3 (04:51):
Team needs to be graded.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
Ultimately, JJ is going to have obviously plenty of time
to prove whether he can be the long term ance
or not. This was set up by the Vikings to
where I believe it was absolutely fair degrade on what
if you want to classify it as an unfair curve
on the basis of the infrastructure around him, the team
that he was inheriting, compared to many of these other
(05:15):
situations going starting with Caleb Williams, Michael Pennix, a number
of others of those as well.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
I just.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
We still should be allowed to evaluate in real time
the way he looks. That's very different than saying cut him.
It's very different from saying give up on him. But
you can if it makes you people feel better to
play this game go ahead, but that has nothing to
do with the reality that the Vikings themselves set up.
Speaker 5 (05:45):
Breck Dan and I'll say this yesterday, there's nothing that
was surprising to me about that performance from JJ McCarthy,
just given the context of he is making his fourth start,
he is still trying to figure this out. This is
(06:07):
what you signed up for when you decided to put
a young quarterback out there on a team with playoffs aspirations.
And what we have talked about the whole time is
there's two things that really stood out about the Vikings
plan and their beliefs that, hey, we can be a
(06:28):
team that does go into the plaffs, that does have
success in the playoffs with this quarterback, because of the
well coached infrastructure, because of the guys we are going
to sign with the extra money that we would have
given Sam Darnold or someone else, and that is what
is going to allow us to expedite the growth curve
(06:50):
for JJ McCarthy and get into a position where we're
winning at a high level fairly quickly. And what happened
yesterday was you got a performance that you should expect
from a young quarterback. Some really nice plays sometimes where
he's breaking the pocket, where he's making throws down the
field really accurate, and some plays that are like whoa,
this is not nowhere close to where it needed to be.
(07:12):
This is erratic, he's making the wrong decision, he's missing
guys that are open, those types of things. But the
safety net was always supposed to be we're going to
be very well coached, very well schemed. We're not going
to beat ourselves, and we're going to have Ryan Kelly,
Will Fries, Javon Hargrave, Jonathan Allen, all these guys that
(07:32):
you know, Isaiah Rodgers that we're going to sign that
are going to make such a big difference around JJ
McCarthy that this is going to be really, really good.
And what we saw yesterday was a ton of penalties
pre snap, all of those mistakes that were happening. We
saw JJ, Justin Jefferson be a little bit lethargic for
whatever reason. Hargrave and Allen have not really been living
(07:56):
up to the deals that they signed. Rogers had a
really good game and that's it. You know, Ryan Kelly's
been injured, has been okay, But like all of the
things that we're supposed to be rock solid around him.
Have been hits and misses so far this season, and
that's kind of where they are why they are where
they are right now.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
In the old fashioned quarterback ratings, okay, not the new QBR,
but the old fashioned quarterback ratings, JJ McCarthy ranks dead
last in the National Football League through four games.
Speaker 3 (08:31):
He's forty fourth.
Speaker 2 (08:33):
Now, I'll I'll say, even by the standards you laid out, well,
young quarterback going to take some time whatever. That's hideous
that that's to me, given the infrastructure, that's worse than
it should be, even for a young quarterback who's trying
to figure it out. He's literally in last place behind
(08:53):
Jake Browning.
Speaker 3 (08:54):
He is forty fourth in the league.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
You want to go to the new newfangle QBR, I
can't even him. He would be listed, I think, just
ahead of cam Ward and behind Dylan Gabriel who is
thirty second.
Speaker 3 (09:09):
His QBR is in the twenties.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
So again, we're keeping score, right, I mean, we're still
have to keep score and in it because, believe me,
if his quarterback rating numbers were through the roof are
surprisingly good, we would be hearing about it, right, We
would be hearing, hey, look at this, this is unbelievable.
So in a sense, what the mc bobos have set
(09:31):
up is he's tough on. He can't be ripped. If
he does well, we have to praise him, which many
of us did as recently as as a week ago
for some very nice stretches. But if he's bad, look
at look at well, remember what John Elway did in
his first couple of games, et cetera. So's it's fine
(09:52):
if it makes you feel better, but it doesn't change
the fact that they keep score at an astro fooball league,
and they keep stats. There is anything in the stats
that says, well, let's not even keep the stats QBR
and an old fashioned quarterback rating of first year quarterbacks
or quarterbacks who are playing in their first season, even
though this is the second year of his career.
Speaker 3 (10:11):
That's just not that's just not realistic. That's not the
way it works.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
So we're going to watch, and we're going to see,
and I'll add I'll go one step further, you know,
and I know the number one reason they had eight
false starts. It's the quarterback's cadence that there's there's let's
just again be clear about this. There may have been
individual ones that had something to do with something else,
but there's a disconnect in terms of what they're asking
(10:36):
him to do, or how they're asking him to do it,
or how he is trying to execute whatever they're asking
him to do. Is it another example of the head
coach as quarterback whisper trying to be too cute and
expecting too much from him. Hey, let's see if we
can draw people off sides when he can't even do
the basics right now, I don't know the answer to that,
but let's let's be clear. That's why his cadence is
(11:00):
throwing off people who ordinarily do not fall start as
often as they did.
Speaker 5 (11:04):
Yeah, Brian O'Neil three times. I mean, that's just like
that never happens. The other thing that this brings up, Dan,
and I will preface this by saying, I remain a
believer that JJ McCarthy can be a good quarterback in
this league. I'm not hitting the alarm bellany yet, but yeah,
but I remember and I was playing as day, Dan
(11:25):
sitting in a conference room at the old Winter Park
headquarters with Rick Spielman and a bunch of our scribes
sitting around the table and Rick Spielman reciting Eli manning
early stacks to us as justification to that we were
panicking or that we were jumping the gun on Christian Ponder,
(11:46):
and you know, hey, I've just seen all this happen,
and look at what Eli did early, look at what
a few of these other young guys did early, and
ponders even better than that, And so he's going to
be just fine. So history like that is very so,
and you can find if you dig back far enough
and deep enough, you can find any numbers to support
whatever you believe, whether McCarthy is going to be totally
(12:07):
fine or going to he's a disaster. And so that's
a game that is very dangerous to play, especially when
you're saying, well, el way did this, al is one
of the very very best of all time. Let's just
slow your role on on some of those as well. So, yeah,
you know, McCarthy does have to be better. You can't
complete forty six percent of his passes be airmail and
(12:31):
Jefferson a few times like that, and but again like
that's these are the things that they signed up for,
and making the decision to do things the way that
they did.
Speaker 2 (12:40):
Let's do some bonus bucks and then we'll get a
little more Johnny on the other side.
Speaker 4 (12:44):
Fan and two men and a junk truck want to
give you a shot to win bonus bucks with our
National Cash Contest. The keyword is credit. Go to cafe
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Speaker 3 (12:53):
No curamous moments.
Speaker 7 (12:56):
Get up offense, JJ McCarthy is you have to throw
a touchdown passing this building. He's under center, first down,
first and ten from the twenty. Oh my Gara saw
and Hawkinson jumped. There's something with this cadence here that's
getting them.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
I mean file offense nine and seventy one personal fasts,
a five grad penalty of first down and.
Speaker 6 (13:18):
Go ahead Freudian slide there by the official No, he
McCarthy tried to check to a different play and I
don't know, you know, sometimes you're allowed that in the play.
Sometimes it's a play it, you know what I mean,
where you can't check it.
Speaker 3 (13:31):
And they were ready.
Speaker 6 (13:33):
The whole entire offensive line was ready for the snap,
and they were a lot of them were moving. So
to me from the from from this angle, it looked
to me like it was a mistake.
Speaker 3 (13:42):
Made by McCarthy.
Speaker 8 (13:43):
Join us again for another famous moments in kid Gas offense.
Speaker 3 (13:49):
It's a play.
Speaker 8 (14:02):
Fall stars by the offense number seventy five, five yard
penalty second down.
Speaker 3 (14:23):
Its go'll be a long year.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
I can see that it might even be a long
three or four years. This is from five to one eight. Guy,
he won two games already. He's going to be elite.
How you people can't see it? You're clueless. To come
from behind factor is more important than putting up a
lot of yardish Who said anything about yardagh qbr. Stats
aren't just about yardage.
Speaker 3 (14:48):
And so is I. This is the beauty of being
JJ McCarthy.
Speaker 2 (14:53):
He gets all the credit for the victories, but apparently
he'll he'll receive no blame whatsoever for the losses. Johnny,
let me ask you about something else. Let me find
the talking point here and see if we can get
to it. This one I classify as why doesn't KOC
(15:18):
like success? J. J.
Speaker 7 (15:20):
McCarthy in his second home regular season start, goes under
center first and ten from his own twenty one Jones
the tail back, and he gets the call nice hole
to the right side.
Speaker 3 (15:30):
He hits the.
Speaker 7 (15:30):
Twenty yard line and Roekwan Smith and another raven or,
Able Koyer, to bring him down after a game of
six two tight ends off to the right hand off Jones.
He goes that way past the line of scrimmage, gets
to the thirty steps to the thirty five, No, the
forty and that's where he stopped at the forty one.
Aaron Jones speedy with that seventeen yard run.
Speaker 6 (15:55):
Hey Paul, what a shot in the arm. Come out
of halftime. You hand the football off one time, you
get the first down. That's what Aaron Jones has been
given this offense the last couple of weeks. And despite
the shoulder being nicked up, he's out there just beautiful
cutback running.
Speaker 3 (16:12):
It's three of seven on third down.
Speaker 7 (16:14):
This is third and short, two tight ends, they're balanced
offset I right McCarthy on third and one is gonna
pass from under center. He's gonna go deep. Jefferson him
now and Marlon Humphrey picked it up, picked it off
at the five yard line. The veteran Marlon Humphrey heads
up the field lazily to the fifteen. Now he sprints
twenty twenty five and JJ McCarthy has thrown two interceptions
(16:37):
he's sprinting over to the sideline.
Speaker 3 (16:41):
Marthy's under center.
Speaker 7 (16:42):
Straight eye hand off to Jordan Mason. Good block by c. J.
Hamm Mason plows to the right across the forty and
he's finally stopped at the forty five. It's a twelve
yard run by Jordan Mason.
Speaker 6 (16:55):
A little bit of a counterpower and that's that's kind
of the cool thing with the.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
Running now is with Aaron Jones.
Speaker 6 (17:01):
You get in one style and there is that right
sit back there you're getting another and you know the
Ravens at their front has not been all that stout
against the run, and we can't we can't just abandon it.
Speaker 3 (17:13):
No O Candell attempting as it is.
Speaker 6 (17:15):
Well, I think to throw the football in this case
because the Ravens, after putting Kyle Hamilton in the box
and doing a number of different things trying to get
pressure on the quarterback, they've they've settled in too, just
playing some softer underneath zones. You still need to run
the football.
Speaker 7 (17:32):
They feel an in motion to the left, two receivers right,
Jefferson and Addison.
Speaker 3 (17:36):
Now Jordan's in motion to the left.
Speaker 7 (17:37):
Third and three McCarthy back to pass attempts to throw
over the middle, but the balls batted at the line
of scrimmage.
Speaker 3 (17:43):
I think by Kyle Hamilton, Johnny, you know the numbers.
Speaker 2 (17:48):
The Vikings averaged six point seven yards per carry. They
only ran eighteen times. They never ran I don't believe
even once on third or fourth down. Now, I don't
expect him to run on third and nine or there
are actually there are some teams who do run when
it's third and five, or third and six or third
(18:10):
and seven.
Speaker 3 (18:10):
But we're back to.
Speaker 2 (18:13):
Helping out the kid quarterback get on his feet. And
I'll say again, there's no one with a straight face
who's going to tell me that this head coach, with
his stubbornness on wanting to look like the cool quarterback coach,
is doing that.
Speaker 3 (18:30):
I don't believe that he is.
Speaker 2 (18:33):
And I thought we saw it again with not one
but two running backs who are running very effectively. Now,
I get it, when you're down fourteen or you're down fifteen,
obviously everything kind of changes at that point.
Speaker 3 (18:46):
Or But the truth is, there are a lot of.
Speaker 2 (18:49):
Teams that will still insist on we're still going to
run the ball.
Speaker 3 (18:52):
Some we may not run.
Speaker 2 (18:53):
At four straight plays but we're going to continue to
mix that in and that that's just not anything that
he's interested in doing.
Speaker 3 (19:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (19:01):
No, I mean, the one caveat I will give him
is that when you do have as many pre snap
penalties as they did, it's a lot of first and fifteens,
and and that makes it more difficult. But the kind
of one of the hallmarks of Kevin O'Connell's tenure so
far as head coach, which has been successful. He's winning
(19:23):
games doing things, but he does he runs the ball begrudgingly,
like that's what it is. I mean, we remember his
first season where it was Alexander Madison basically like a
complete dismissal of the running game entirely. And and I
think that if he had a perfect day, they would
(19:44):
run twice and throw it sixty times and win the
game that way. That's just the way that he's wired,
the way that he has built. But you know, it
is going. It is damaging the Vikings chances of winning,
especially when you look at in the context of a game.
I mean, Aaron Jones looks great right now, he really
(20:07):
has come off of that injury, is moving well, he's explosive,
he is making a difference in the running game when
the ball is in his hands. And I think that
JJ McCarthy is very erratic, and so it is kind
of confusing to me why you would put so much
pressure on McCarthy's shoulders to carry the load offensive when
(20:31):
you don't have to. If it was Alexander Madison it
was two yards in a cloud of dust, I would
understand it. But they are having real success in the
running game when they commit to it, and yet they
just go away from it time and time again.
Speaker 2 (20:44):
So there's a lot of discussion about the third and one.
This is in the first drive the second half. I
think that Guarzie had much of that drive covered the
runs early because that drive indeed started with a seventeen
yard run by Jones, then a five yard run by Jones,
then a four yard pass to Addison. So it's now
(21:07):
third and one at the fifty. And I ordinarily, if
you take the head coach at his word, I ordinarily
would say, I got no problem trying a pass play
on third and one as long as I'm certain that
you are going for it on fourth down. And by
the way, and this is the thing, I don't know
(21:28):
that he owned up to you're going to run the
ball on the fourth one, because knowing him, he was
going to pass it on both plays. But I will
add this caveat to your point about the position that
the team is in at this point. The game is
getting shaky, right, the lead has been cut to one,
it's now ten to nine. They have a significant decent
(21:48):
amount of momentum. So as much as after the game
you heard the head coach say what we got to
you know, we got to balance this out. We still
got to let him learn and we got to try
to make some plays. I will continue to say, if
you want to do your quarterback in that situation a favor,
that's not the time you pick for that play. You
run it again, and I get it. It feels like
(22:10):
it's a wasted opportunity the way you like to run offense.
But I think you got to take pay attention to
time and place, and to me, the best favor you
do for your quarterback there is get another first down
and start the whole process over again. And that's why
I I didn't even like that call, even if I
generally say yeah, if you know you're gonna have two
(22:30):
downs to get the yard.
Speaker 3 (22:32):
Go ahead fling it on one of those.
Speaker 2 (22:34):
But in that circumstance, I'm not sure that I even
would have done that then. And I ultimately he doesn't
know that the player that JJ's gonna trip, right, Jefferson's
gonna gonna stumble. But to me, it's a it's another
great illustration of where I just don't trust his desire
or enjoyment in just letting somebody pound the ball for
(22:55):
seven yards.
Speaker 5 (22:58):
Yeah, I think that when you look at that play,
so much of it was right right. I mean, you
got Jefferson one on one, you all going down the field,
you have that fourth down, And I do think today
Kevin O'Connell did clarify that he at least he said
that he had a run in the chamber basically down
(23:19):
And of course, yeah, of course you're going to say that.
But you know, I'm with you on that point of
reading the game, reading your quarterback, and reading the defense,
all of those things to just say, not to mention
Dan that this has not been a good short yardage
team all season long. So you may need two cracks
(23:41):
at it to get the first down on third and one,
and if you're just running it, and so even if
you go for it on fourth and one, where the
defense would presumably load up a little bit more against
the run that might be hard to pick up.
Speaker 3 (23:55):
So I think that at.
Speaker 5 (23:57):
This stage of JJ mccarr these career, what you want
is to build successes throughout the game. Just get them
feeling comfortable and confident and keeping things simple. And if
that means, well, we don't want a baby him, sometimes
you got you might have to baby him early on,
like and just not give him too much to chew
(24:20):
on and let him find some success and some rhythm.
The first drive was really good, really impressive, but you
still got to build on that. And he has a
a knack so far for kind of going dormant through
the second and third quarters. And so when you have
an opportunity to extend the drive and when you're running
the ball as well as you are, you know, kind
(24:41):
of leaning into that I think is important just right now.
There will be times, hopefully in the future, where McCarthy
has much more command where everything is hitting on all cylinders,
and then you can get you know, you can get
loose with it and you can let him, let him
let it fly. But just right now, if this stage
of his development I don't know that he's ready for that.
Speaker 3 (25:02):
What is seventy two divided by thirteen. I'm gonna do it.
I got a calculator.
Speaker 2 (25:07):
I'm ready because I don't trust my I don't trust myself.
Speaker 3 (25:10):
I have that one.
Speaker 2 (25:11):
Seventy two divided by thirteen equals five point five yards
of carry. Those are the numbers related to Jones and Mason,
because McCarthy had five carries for forty eight and a
couple of people saying, well, the numbers not as gaudy
as you're making it sound. On the ground game. By
the way, I don't mind including McCarthy in the ground game.
I don't mind using his legs on even on a
(25:33):
on a third and one or a third and three,
because we had a bunch of downs like that where
we never even considered, we don't even consider running the ball.
But that's those are good numbers for the two running backs.
Speaker 3 (25:46):
Five point five and again.
Speaker 2 (25:48):
It's I think it's almost criminal that the two running
backs totaled thirteen carries.
Speaker 3 (25:54):
It just you mean, you look at the way.
Speaker 7 (25:56):
Now.
Speaker 3 (25:56):
I know Baltimore is built different, but.
Speaker 2 (25:58):
Look what they did once they got ahead in that game.
They almost refused to throw the ball until Actually they
I thought did throw the ball too much late to
help give the Vikings that last chance. But they just
kept pounding is what they did. And here's another thing.
If you have third and four or third and three,
you can run, and even if you get two that
(26:20):
it's fourth down, you have something to think about. But
maybe that fourth and one is I think we're afraid
he has no interest in even throwing it on a
running the ball on third and four. That's not illegal
in this league. You don't want to do it all
the time, but there are teams who do it actually
quite effectively.
Speaker 5 (26:37):
There is no one who can have a serious conversation
about that football game and say, well, you know, actually
Aaron Jones and Jordan Mason only averaged five point five,
so it's not that big. You watched that game and
the way that it was going, they were getting whatever
they wanted in the run game, and the way the
(26:58):
juice with which Aaron Joe Oones was playing was palpable.
You could just see it. He was fast, he was explosive,
he was quick, he was ready. And if you want
to limit his pitches, if you're worried a little bit
about his injury. Jordan Mason is going to be fine,
especially in the third and one situations. So you know,
(27:18):
we can have debates about play calling and all those things,
but I really don't have a whole lot of time
for someone who said, well, actually Aaron Jones and Mason
weren't all that good. It was mostly JJ McCarthy Patty
in that stat That's not what was happening.
Speaker 2 (27:32):
In that game, no question about that. We're very late.
Thanks as always for the time.
Speaker 3 (27:37):
Wolves.
Speaker 2 (27:37):
We're going to get to next time we have you on,
I'll throw in one question for a thirty second answer.
There are Wolves fans who want to know if there's
any reason to think that there might be some John
Morant steam in the Minnesota Timberwol's future.
Speaker 5 (27:52):
Yeah, not right now, Dan. I mean, I do think
that Tim Connelly's really aggressive. So if they are flailing around,
you know, late Decemner, early January, they could revisit it.
They they are monitoring it, as stam Atic reported with
us with the athletic and I do think that they've
had some cursory stuff just thinking about it, but they're
(28:12):
starting to come.
Speaker 3 (28:13):
Around a little bit.
Speaker 5 (28:13):
They got to play a good team but I don't
think they're ready to pull a trigger like that. And lastly,
a deal with for John Morant with all that money,
with the second aprons and stuff, is just very hard
to pull off if you don't have a ton of picks,
and the Wolves do not. So I wouldn't hold my
breath if I were Wolves fans. But we'll see if
it gets real, if things go off the table, you know,
(28:34):
late in December and they're and they're desperate for something.
Speaker 3 (28:37):
Thank you, Johnny.
Speaker 2 (28:38):
We'll chat soon, all right, John Krazinski, Johnny Athletic quick
pause labor later this hour.
Speaker 3 (28:44):
And a thrifty traveler guy in the.
Speaker 8 (28:45):
Five oh No Fimus Moments up Offense.
Speaker 3 (28:51):
We've barely seen him since.
Speaker 7 (28:52):
All right, First down, first and ten from the forty
one flag, All star Vikings come.
Speaker 3 (28:58):
That's what I'm talking about.
Speaker 8 (29:00):
Join us again with another famous moments.
Speaker 1 (29:05):
Offense.
Speaker 2 (29:21):
All right, Ben Leaver coming up in just a few minutes.
And thirty traveler guys. I said in the five Lots
of Vikings talking points yet to comel that we've already
offered up.
Speaker 3 (29:32):
Several of them.
Speaker 2 (29:33):
Like I said, I wish I could trust him more
because ordinarily, like I said on a third and one,
if you've already decided we're going forward on fourth down,
I have no problem with trying to throw.
Speaker 3 (29:47):
You know, it's like, okay, because.
Speaker 2 (29:49):
It's not doesn't have to be the If it doesn't work,
you're not assuming there's gonna be an I t obviously
it's not gonna be the end of the series. Now
you do, I guess run the risk of a sack
where there's suddenly then you're gonna do from position. But
you can't play that way the whole game. I just
and you know, I'd like to believe him when he
says I had a run dialed up for fourth than
one if we didn't get the first down. That's why
(30:11):
I felt like we got, you know, two downs to
get this. Let's say, let's let's try something. This is
where you try to give any quarterback a chance to
sort of make a play.
Speaker 3 (30:19):
I just don't trust him enough to do that.
Speaker 2 (30:23):
Somebody had texted Shanahan and San Francisco developed the seventh
round QB and brock perty by allowing him to manage
the game, including short throws in a running game. O'Connor
last with Justice lenses. He does not have Matt Stafford
under center. It's well put, I think, and eventually he
might I'm not kirk Cousins, right, Yeah. In the interim though,
I don't understand why it's that difficult to I mean,
(30:47):
accept four yards here, another first down, because in the end,
you're gonna there's gonna be time for McCarthy to to
prove he can fling. Right, There's always going to be
time for that. But there's no rush on that. So
in the meantime, because what is the head coach told us,
He has said, we're trying to do both. We're trying
(31:08):
to develop this quarterback. We want to win right now, right,
So to me, the best way you thread that particular
needle is you are willing to go a little bit
even more conservative than you'd otherwise intended. Now, again, when
you're down fifteen or to where we down fourteen, whatever
it was at that point, obviously you're going to have
to start flinging it.
Speaker 3 (31:28):
That's just sort of the nature of the beast.
Speaker 4 (31:29):
But they even ran the ball a couple of times
on one of those drives when they were down fourteen
to kind of get him back.
Speaker 3 (31:35):
That's true. Sure, you're right, I mean it's not illegal.
Speaker 4 (31:38):
What you guys have made the point that Aaron Jones
looked really good yesterday, because he does look really good
at times, and he looks great yesterday. What's always funny
to me is they have and I was thinking of
this yesterday, they have really cool inventive running plays like
they do.
Speaker 3 (31:54):
Yeah, they get him the ball and it's the one.
Speaker 4 (31:56):
Cut thing that Mercers was talking about, and it just
looks effortless.
Speaker 3 (31:59):
I forget us.
Speaker 2 (31:59):
You heard it from Yeah a couple of times before
the outcome was known, saying don't we can't forget about
the run, Paul. Last week they gave Adis in a carry, yeah, right,
and a huge play on third down and he picked
it up. There's so many different ways to move it.
It is crazy, though, how this has become such a thing,
just the refusal. Somebody had the numbers, you know, the
(32:20):
you know, it's like seven of twenty passing and like
four times they've run the ball in those situations.
Speaker 3 (32:25):
It's not that dramatic. But I'm not that far off. No,
not that far off. Are you losing your voice? By
the way, I might be a little bit of a
little raspy. I mean it's you know, it's cold in
the air. Yeah, that's true. It's that time of year.
Speaker 2 (32:35):
Load management. Ben Lieber will get his reaction to yesterday's festivities.
Maybe he'll help us prepare for an interesting Monday night
encounter involving an NFC North opponent as well.
Speaker 8 (32:47):
Oh no Furmus moments up kicks offense.
Speaker 3 (32:51):
We'vepparently seen him since.
Speaker 7 (32:53):
All right, first down, first intent from the forty one flag,
All start vikings come.
Speaker 3 (32:59):
That is what I'm talking about.
Speaker 8 (33:00):
Join us again for another famous moment in a gas offense.
It's time Johnny Johnny Johnny fla headache I didn't be
talking about right now.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
RBC Wealth Management helps bring us Johnny athletic to you.
Speaker 3 (00:42):
Were you in Sacramento?
Speaker 2 (00:43):
No, you couldn't have been a Sacramento last night because
you were at the UH at the People Stadium Downtow, Minneapolis,
weren't you.
Speaker 4 (00:49):
That is correct.
Speaker 5 (00:50):
I didn't have the private jet to get me to
stack right after fortunate least, so we watched it from home.
Speaker 3 (00:56):
That's a matter of the time, all right.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
So something moved you in the JJ body language, and
it's created a lot of polarizing thought here because regarding
his response on the interceptions, there's some people were saying, well,
he knew on one of them that the player was down,
(01:21):
and ultimately he was going to the play was going
to be brought back there, and that there's too much
hyperventilation on it. You stand by your position because it's
certainly appeared, based on what I read of your piece,
to disturb you greatly.
Speaker 6 (01:37):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (01:38):
I do stand by it, Dan, I mean yeah, And
I did point out in the piece about the first
interception that he did know that he hit the guy down,
and so there wasn't as much of a reason to
run after him, but the second interception, there's no excuse
at all, and he literally walked toward the defender, Marlon
(01:58):
Humphrey as he was having up the field. And it
wasn't just that, but it was the way that he
was running routes. It was, you know, kind of not
holding onto the ball like he usually does.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
And this all.
Speaker 5 (02:12):
Stems dan from Jefferson's brilliance for the first five and
a half years of his career, and how much of
that is based on his energy, his infectious attitude, his
constant positivity, and as I said in the piece, there
are actually some good reasons for him to be frustrated,
(02:33):
but we also have never seen him lay with that lifelessness.
I don't think, I mean it was glaring because you're
just not used to seeing it. And so there were
certainly many other reasons they lost the game, the penalties,
McCarthy's erratic throat, accuracy and all those things. But I
(02:55):
just was taken aback by the lack of energy that
we saw from Justin Jefferson because we are just so
used to seeing so much more of it.
Speaker 3 (03:05):
You know, it's fairly predictable.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
I'm not necessarily at all surprised despite the warnings that
I tried to lay out last August and even into September.
Speaker 3 (03:17):
In fact, I think you and I talked about this
at the time.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
And the new game that's being played by Vikings apologists
and by the mcbulbos is the obvious. Well, I'm gonna
you know what I'm gonna do. I'm gonna do some research.
I'm gonna check to see. I'm going to compare what
JJ McCarthy did in his first four starts to every quarterback,
every young quarterback in the history to football, and what
(03:41):
they did in their first four starts. And of course, conveniently,
they often leave out a couple of things, not the
least of which is what was the relative condition of
the team that the new young quarterback inherited.
Speaker 3 (03:55):
They conveniently leave that out, that many of.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
Those quarterbacks were were joining teams that only got them
because they were among the worst teams in football. But
I digress beyond that. We said, there's going in my opinion,
and I stand by this, an inherent unfairness to the
way JJ is going to be evaluated immediately, but that
(04:20):
the Vikings themselves set this up, and you know, I mean,
if you make the decision they made when they had
other quarterback options that they could have considered, they could
have worked through, and say we're going with him, and
we're still going to make all these other moves because
we think that's going to give him the best chance
(04:42):
to succeed immediately, and yeah, we intend to be a
team going for the playoffs immediately, then that's the way
I think the.
Speaker 3 (04:51):
Team needs to be graded.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
Ultimately, JJ is going to have obviously plenty of time
to prove whether he can be the long term ance
or not. This was set up by the Vikings to
where I believe it was absolutely fair degrade on what
if you want to classify it as an unfair curve
on the basis of the infrastructure around him, the team
that he was inheriting, compared to many of these other
(05:15):
situations going starting with Caleb Williams, Michael Pennix, a number
of others of those as well.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
I just.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
We still should be allowed to evaluate in real time
the way he looks. That's very different than saying cut him.
It's very different from saying give up on him. But
you can if it makes you people feel better to
play this game go ahead, but that has nothing to
do with the reality that the Vikings themselves set up.
Speaker 5 (05:45):
Breck Dan and I'll say this yesterday, there's nothing that
was surprising to me about that performance from JJ McCarthy,
just given the context of he is making his fourth start,
he is still trying to figure this out. This is
(06:07):
what you signed up for when you decided to put
a young quarterback out there on a team with playoffs aspirations.
And what we have talked about the whole time is
there's two things that really stood out about the Vikings
plan and their beliefs that, hey, we can be a
(06:28):
team that does go into the plaffs, that does have
success in the playoffs with this quarterback, because of the
well coached infrastructure, because of the guys we are going
to sign with the extra money that we would have
given Sam Darnold or someone else, and that is what
is going to allow us to expedite the growth curve
(06:50):
for JJ McCarthy and get into a position where we're
winning at a high level fairly quickly. And what happened
yesterday was you got a performance that you should expect
from a young quarterback. Some really nice plays sometimes where
he's breaking the pocket, where he's making throws down the
field really accurate, and some plays that are like whoa,
this is not nowhere close to where it needed to be.
(07:12):
This is erratic, he's making the wrong decision, he's missing
guys that are open, those types of things. But the
safety net was always supposed to be we're going to
be very well coached, very well schemed. We're not going
to beat ourselves, and we're going to have Ryan Kelly,
Will Fries, Javon Hargrave, Jonathan Allen, all these guys that
(07:32):
you know, Isaiah Rodgers that we're going to sign that
are going to make such a big difference around JJ
McCarthy that this is going to be really, really good.
And what we saw yesterday was a ton of penalties
pre snap, all of those mistakes that were happening. We
saw JJ, Justin Jefferson be a little bit lethargic for
whatever reason. Hargrave and Allen have not really been living
(07:56):
up to the deals that they signed. Rogers had a
really good game and that's it. You know, Ryan Kelly's
been injured, has been okay, But like all of the
things that we're supposed to be rock solid around him.
Have been hits and misses so far this season, and
that's kind of where they are why they are where
they are right now.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
In the old fashioned quarterback ratings, okay, not the new QBR,
but the old fashioned quarterback ratings, JJ McCarthy ranks dead
last in the National Football League through four games.
Speaker 3 (08:31):
He's forty fourth.
Speaker 2 (08:33):
Now, I'll I'll say, even by the standards you laid out, well,
young quarterback going to take some time whatever. That's hideous
that that's to me, given the infrastructure, that's worse than
it should be, even for a young quarterback who's trying
to figure it out. He's literally in last place behind
(08:53):
Jake Browning.
Speaker 3 (08:54):
He is forty fourth in the league.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
You want to go to the new newfangle QBR, I
can't even him. He would be listed, I think, just
ahead of cam Ward and behind Dylan Gabriel who is
thirty second.
Speaker 3 (09:09):
His QBR is in the twenties.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
So again, we're keeping score, right, I mean, we're still
have to keep score and in it because, believe me,
if his quarterback rating numbers were through the roof are
surprisingly good, we would be hearing about it, right, We
would be hearing, hey, look at this, this is unbelievable.
So in a sense, what the mc bobos have set
(09:31):
up is he's tough on. He can't be ripped. If
he does well, we have to praise him, which many
of us did as recently as as a week ago
for some very nice stretches. But if he's bad, look
at look at well, remember what John Elway did in
his first couple of games, et cetera. So's it's fine
(09:52):
if it makes you feel better, but it doesn't change
the fact that they keep score at an astro fooball league,
and they keep stats. There is anything in the stats
that says, well, let's not even keep the stats QBR
and an old fashioned quarterback rating of first year quarterbacks
or quarterbacks who are playing in their first season, even
though this is the second year of his career.
Speaker 3 (10:11):
That's just not that's just not realistic. That's not the
way it works.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
So we're going to watch, and we're going to see,
and I'll add I'll go one step further, you know,
and I know the number one reason they had eight
false starts. It's the quarterback's cadence that there's there's let's
just again be clear about this. There may have been
individual ones that had something to do with something else,
but there's a disconnect in terms of what they're asking
(10:36):
him to do, or how they're asking him to do it,
or how he is trying to execute whatever they're asking
him to do. Is it another example of the head
coach as quarterback whisper trying to be too cute and
expecting too much from him. Hey, let's see if we
can draw people off sides when he can't even do
the basics right now, I don't know the answer to that,
but let's let's be clear. That's why his cadence is
(11:00):
throwing off people who ordinarily do not fall start as
often as they did.
Speaker 5 (11:04):
Yeah, Brian O'Neil three times. I mean, that's just like
that never happens. The other thing that this brings up, Dan,
and I will preface this by saying, I remain a
believer that JJ McCarthy can be a good quarterback in
this league. I'm not hitting the alarm bellany yet, but yeah,
but I remember and I was playing as day, Dan
(11:25):
sitting in a conference room at the old Winter Park
headquarters with Rick Spielman and a bunch of our scribes
sitting around the table and Rick Spielman reciting Eli manning
early stacks to us as justification to that we were
panicking or that we were jumping the gun on Christian Ponder,
(11:46):
and you know, hey, I've just seen all this happen,
and look at what Eli did early, look at what
a few of these other young guys did early, and
ponders even better than that, And so he's going to
be just fine. So history like that is very so,
and you can find if you dig back far enough
and deep enough, you can find any numbers to support
whatever you believe, whether McCarthy is going to be totally
(12:07):
fine or going to he's a disaster. And so that's
a game that is very dangerous to play, especially when
you're saying, well, el way did this, al is one
of the very very best of all time. Let's just
slow your role on on some of those as well. So, yeah,
you know, McCarthy does have to be better. You can't
complete forty six percent of his passes be airmail and
(12:31):
Jefferson a few times like that, and but again like
that's these are the things that they signed up for,
and making the decision to do things the way that
they did.
Speaker 2 (12:40):
Let's do some bonus bucks and then we'll get a
little more Johnny on the other side.
Speaker 4 (12:44):
Fan and two men and a junk truck want to
give you a shot to win bonus bucks with our
National Cash Contest. The keyword is credit. Go to cafe
in dot com and enter the keyword credit.
Speaker 3 (12:53):
No curamous moments.
Speaker 7 (12:56):
Get up offense, JJ McCarthy is you have to throw
a touchdown passing this building. He's under center, first down,
first and ten from the twenty. Oh my Gara saw
and Hawkinson jumped. There's something with this cadence here that's
getting them.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
I mean file offense nine and seventy one personal fasts,
a five grad penalty of first down and.
Speaker 6 (13:18):
Go ahead Freudian slide there by the official No, he
McCarthy tried to check to a different play and I
don't know, you know, sometimes you're allowed that in the play.
Sometimes it's a play it, you know what I mean,
where you can't check it.
Speaker 3 (13:31):
And they were ready.
Speaker 6 (13:33):
The whole entire offensive line was ready for the snap,
and they were a lot of them were moving. So
to me from the from from this angle, it looked
to me like it was a mistake.
Speaker 3 (13:42):
Made by McCarthy.
Speaker 8 (13:43):
Join us again for another famous moments in kid Gas offense.
Speaker 3 (13:49):
It's a play.
Speaker 8 (14:02):
Fall stars by the offense number seventy five, five yard
penalty second down.
Speaker 3 (14:23):
Its go'll be a long year.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
I can see that it might even be a long
three or four years. This is from five to one eight. Guy,
he won two games already. He's going to be elite.
How you people can't see it? You're clueless. To come
from behind factor is more important than putting up a
lot of yardish Who said anything about yardagh qbr. Stats
aren't just about yardage.
Speaker 3 (14:48):
And so is I. This is the beauty of being
JJ McCarthy.
Speaker 2 (14:53):
He gets all the credit for the victories, but apparently
he'll he'll receive no blame whatsoever for the losses. Johnny,
let me ask you about something else. Let me find
the talking point here and see if we can get
to it. This one I classify as why doesn't KOC
(15:18):
like success? J. J.
Speaker 7 (15:20):
McCarthy in his second home regular season start, goes under
center first and ten from his own twenty one Jones
the tail back, and he gets the call nice hole
to the right side.
Speaker 3 (15:30):
He hits the.
Speaker 7 (15:30):
Twenty yard line and Roekwan Smith and another raven or,
Able Koyer, to bring him down after a game of
six two tight ends off to the right hand off Jones.
He goes that way past the line of scrimmage, gets
to the thirty steps to the thirty five, No, the
forty and that's where he stopped at the forty one.
Aaron Jones speedy with that seventeen yard run.
Speaker 6 (15:55):
Hey Paul, what a shot in the arm. Come out
of halftime. You hand the football off one time, you
get the first down. That's what Aaron Jones has been
given this offense the last couple of weeks. And despite
the shoulder being nicked up, he's out there just beautiful
cutback running.
Speaker 3 (16:12):
It's three of seven on third down.
Speaker 7 (16:14):
This is third and short, two tight ends, they're balanced
offset I right McCarthy on third and one is gonna
pass from under center. He's gonna go deep. Jefferson him
now and Marlon Humphrey picked it up, picked it off
at the five yard line. The veteran Marlon Humphrey heads
up the field lazily to the fifteen. Now he sprints
twenty twenty five and JJ McCarthy has thrown two interceptions
(16:37):
he's sprinting over to the sideline.
Speaker 3 (16:41):
Marthy's under center.
Speaker 7 (16:42):
Straight eye hand off to Jordan Mason. Good block by c. J.
Hamm Mason plows to the right across the forty and
he's finally stopped at the forty five. It's a twelve
yard run by Jordan Mason.
Speaker 6 (16:55):
A little bit of a counterpower and that's that's kind
of the cool thing with the.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
Running now is with Aaron Jones.
Speaker 6 (17:01):
You get in one style and there is that right
sit back there you're getting another and you know the
Ravens at their front has not been all that stout
against the run, and we can't we can't just abandon it.
Speaker 3 (17:13):
No O Candell attempting as it is.
Speaker 6 (17:15):
Well, I think to throw the football in this case
because the Ravens, after putting Kyle Hamilton in the box
and doing a number of different things trying to get
pressure on the quarterback, they've they've settled in too, just
playing some softer underneath zones. You still need to run
the football.
Speaker 7 (17:32):
They feel an in motion to the left, two receivers right,
Jefferson and Addison.
Speaker 3 (17:36):
Now Jordan's in motion to the left.
Speaker 7 (17:37):
Third and three McCarthy back to pass attempts to throw
over the middle, but the balls batted at the line
of scrimmage.
Speaker 3 (17:43):
I think by Kyle Hamilton, Johnny, you know the numbers.
Speaker 2 (17:48):
The Vikings averaged six point seven yards per carry. They
only ran eighteen times. They never ran I don't believe
even once on third or fourth down. Now, I don't
expect him to run on third and nine or there
are actually there are some teams who do run when
it's third and five, or third and six or third
(18:10):
and seven.
Speaker 3 (18:10):
But we're back to.
Speaker 2 (18:13):
Helping out the kid quarterback get on his feet. And
I'll say again, there's no one with a straight face
who's going to tell me that this head coach, with
his stubbornness on wanting to look like the cool quarterback coach,
is doing that.
Speaker 3 (18:30):
I don't believe that he is.
Speaker 2 (18:33):
And I thought we saw it again with not one
but two running backs who are running very effectively. Now,
I get it, when you're down fourteen or you're down fifteen,
obviously everything kind of changes at that point.
Speaker 3 (18:46):
Or But the truth is, there are a lot of.
Speaker 2 (18:49):
Teams that will still insist on we're still going to
run the ball.
Speaker 3 (18:52):
Some we may not run.
Speaker 2 (18:53):
At four straight plays but we're going to continue to
mix that in and that that's just not anything that
he's interested in doing.
Speaker 3 (19:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (19:01):
No, I mean, the one caveat I will give him
is that when you do have as many pre snap
penalties as they did, it's a lot of first and fifteens,
and and that makes it more difficult. But the kind
of one of the hallmarks of Kevin O'Connell's tenure so
far as head coach, which has been successful. He's winning
(19:23):
games doing things, but he does he runs the ball begrudgingly,
like that's what it is. I mean, we remember his
first season where it was Alexander Madison basically like a
complete dismissal of the running game entirely. And and I
think that if he had a perfect day, they would
(19:44):
run twice and throw it sixty times and win the
game that way. That's just the way that he's wired,
the way that he has built. But you know, it
is going. It is damaging the Vikings chances of winning,
especially when you look at in the context of a game.
I mean, Aaron Jones looks great right now, he really
(20:07):
has come off of that injury, is moving well, he's explosive,
he is making a difference in the running game when
the ball is in his hands. And I think that
JJ McCarthy is very erratic, and so it is kind
of confusing to me why you would put so much
pressure on McCarthy's shoulders to carry the load offensive when
(20:31):
you don't have to. If it was Alexander Madison it
was two yards in a cloud of dust, I would
understand it. But they are having real success in the
running game when they commit to it, and yet they
just go away from it time and time again.
Speaker 2 (20:44):
So there's a lot of discussion about the third and one.
This is in the first drive the second half. I
think that Guarzie had much of that drive covered the
runs early because that drive indeed started with a seventeen
yard run by Jones, then a five yard run by Jones,
then a four yard pass to Addison. So it's now
(21:07):
third and one at the fifty. And I ordinarily, if
you take the head coach at his word, I ordinarily
would say, I got no problem trying a pass play
on third and one as long as I'm certain that
you are going for it on fourth down. And by
the way, and this is the thing, I don't know
(21:28):
that he owned up to you're going to run the
ball on the fourth one, because knowing him, he was
going to pass it on both plays. But I will
add this caveat to your point about the position that
the team is in at this point. The game is
getting shaky, right, the lead has been cut to one,
it's now ten to nine. They have a significant decent
(21:48):
amount of momentum. So as much as after the game
you heard the head coach say what we got to
you know, we got to balance this out. We still
got to let him learn and we got to try
to make some plays. I will continue to say, if
you want to do your quarterback in that situation a favor,
that's not the time you pick for that play. You
run it again, and I get it. It feels like
(22:10):
it's a wasted opportunity the way you like to run offense.
But I think you got to take pay attention to
time and place, and to me, the best favor you
do for your quarterback there is get another first down
and start the whole process over again. And that's why
I I didn't even like that call, even if I
generally say yeah, if you know you're gonna have two
(22:30):
downs to get the yard.
Speaker 3 (22:32):
Go ahead fling it on one of those.
Speaker 2 (22:34):
But in that circumstance, I'm not sure that I even
would have done that then. And I ultimately he doesn't
know that the player that JJ's gonna trip, right, Jefferson's
gonna gonna stumble. But to me, it's a it's another
great illustration of where I just don't trust his desire
or enjoyment in just letting somebody pound the ball for
(22:55):
seven yards.
Speaker 5 (22:58):
Yeah, I think that when you look at that play,
so much of it was right right. I mean, you
got Jefferson one on one, you all going down the field,
you have that fourth down, And I do think today
Kevin O'Connell did clarify that he at least he said
that he had a run in the chamber basically down
(23:19):
And of course, yeah, of course you're going to say that.
But you know, I'm with you on that point of
reading the game, reading your quarterback, and reading the defense,
all of those things to just say, not to mention
Dan that this has not been a good short yardage
team all season long. So you may need two cracks
(23:41):
at it to get the first down on third and one,
and if you're just running it, and so even if
you go for it on fourth and one, where the
defense would presumably load up a little bit more against
the run that might be hard to pick up.
Speaker 3 (23:55):
So I think that at.
Speaker 5 (23:57):
This stage of JJ mccarr these career, what you want
is to build successes throughout the game. Just get them
feeling comfortable and confident and keeping things simple. And if
that means, well, we don't want a baby him, sometimes
you got you might have to baby him early on,
like and just not give him too much to chew
(24:20):
on and let him find some success and some rhythm.
The first drive was really good, really impressive, but you
still got to build on that. And he has a
a knack so far for kind of going dormant through
the second and third quarters. And so when you have
an opportunity to extend the drive and when you're running
the ball as well as you are, you know, kind
(24:41):
of leaning into that I think is important just right now.
There will be times, hopefully in the future, where McCarthy
has much more command where everything is hitting on all cylinders,
and then you can get you know, you can get
loose with it and you can let him, let him
let it fly. But just right now, if this stage
of his development I don't know that he's ready for that.
Speaker 3 (25:02):
What is seventy two divided by thirteen. I'm gonna do it.
I got a calculator.
Speaker 2 (25:07):
I'm ready because I don't trust my I don't trust myself.
Speaker 3 (25:10):
I have that one.
Speaker 2 (25:11):
Seventy two divided by thirteen equals five point five yards
of carry. Those are the numbers related to Jones and Mason,
because McCarthy had five carries for forty eight and a
couple of people saying, well, the numbers not as gaudy
as you're making it sound. On the ground game. By
the way, I don't mind including McCarthy in the ground game.
I don't mind using his legs on even on a
(25:33):
on a third and one or a third and three,
because we had a bunch of downs like that where
we never even considered, we don't even consider running the ball.
But that's those are good numbers for the two running backs.
Speaker 3 (25:46):
Five point five and again.
Speaker 2 (25:48):
It's I think it's almost criminal that the two running
backs totaled thirteen carries.
Speaker 3 (25:54):
It just you mean, you look at the way.
Speaker 7 (25:56):
Now.
Speaker 3 (25:56):
I know Baltimore is built different, but.
Speaker 2 (25:58):
Look what they did once they got ahead in that game.
They almost refused to throw the ball until Actually they
I thought did throw the ball too much late to
help give the Vikings that last chance. But they just
kept pounding is what they did. And here's another thing.
If you have third and four or third and three,
you can run, and even if you get two that
(26:20):
it's fourth down, you have something to think about. But
maybe that fourth and one is I think we're afraid
he has no interest in even throwing it on a
running the ball on third and four. That's not illegal
in this league. You don't want to do it all
the time, but there are teams who do it actually
quite effectively.
Speaker 5 (26:37):
There is no one who can have a serious conversation
about that football game and say, well, you know, actually
Aaron Jones and Jordan Mason only averaged five point five,
so it's not that big. You watched that game and
the way that it was going, they were getting whatever
they wanted in the run game, and the way the
(26:58):
juice with which Aaron Joe Oones was playing was palpable.
You could just see it. He was fast, he was explosive,
he was quick, he was ready. And if you want
to limit his pitches, if you're worried a little bit
about his injury. Jordan Mason is going to be fine,
especially in the third and one situations. So you know,
(27:18):
we can have debates about play calling and all those things,
but I really don't have a whole lot of time
for someone who said, well, actually Aaron Jones and Mason
weren't all that good. It was mostly JJ McCarthy Patty
in that stat That's not what was happening.
Speaker 2 (27:32):
In that game, no question about that. We're very late.
Thanks as always for the time.
Speaker 3 (27:37):
Wolves.
Speaker 2 (27:37):
We're going to get to next time we have you on,
I'll throw in one question for a thirty second answer.
There are Wolves fans who want to know if there's
any reason to think that there might be some John
Morant steam in the Minnesota Timberwol's future.
Speaker 5 (27:52):
Yeah, not right now, Dan. I mean, I do think
that Tim Connelly's really aggressive. So if they are flailing around,
you know, late Decemner, early January, they could revisit it.
They they are monitoring it, as stam Atic reported with
us with the athletic and I do think that they've
had some cursory stuff just thinking about it, but they're
(28:12):
starting to come.
Speaker 3 (28:13):
Around a little bit.
Speaker 5 (28:13):
They got to play a good team but I don't
think they're ready to pull a trigger like that. And lastly,
a deal with for John Morant with all that money,
with the second aprons and stuff, is just very hard
to pull off if you don't have a ton of picks,
and the Wolves do not. So I wouldn't hold my
breath if I were Wolves fans. But we'll see if
it gets real, if things go off the table, you know,
(28:34):
late in December and they're and they're desperate for something.
Speaker 3 (28:37):
Thank you, Johnny.
Speaker 2 (28:38):
We'll chat soon, all right, John Krazinski, Johnny Athletic quick
pause labor later this hour.
Speaker 3 (28:44):
And a thrifty traveler guy in the.
Speaker 8 (28:45):
Five oh No Fimus Moments up Offense.
Speaker 3 (28:51):
We've barely seen him since.
Speaker 7 (28:52):
All right, First down, first and ten from the forty
one flag, All star Vikings come.
Speaker 3 (28:58):
That's what I'm talking about.
Speaker 8 (29:00):
Join us again with another famous moments.
Speaker 1 (29:05):
Offense.
Speaker 2 (29:21):
All right, Ben Leaver coming up in just a few minutes.
And thirty traveler guys. I said in the five Lots
of Vikings talking points yet to comel that we've already
offered up.
Speaker 3 (29:32):
Several of them.
Speaker 2 (29:33):
Like I said, I wish I could trust him more
because ordinarily, like I said on a third and one,
if you've already decided we're going forward on fourth down,
I have no problem with trying to throw.
Speaker 3 (29:47):
You know, it's like, okay, because.
Speaker 2 (29:49):
It's not doesn't have to be the If it doesn't work,
you're not assuming there's gonna be an I t obviously
it's not gonna be the end of the series. Now
you do, I guess run the risk of a sack
where there's suddenly then you're gonna do from position. But
you can't play that way the whole game. I just
and you know, I'd like to believe him when he
says I had a run dialed up for fourth than
one if we didn't get the first down. That's why
(30:11):
I felt like we got, you know, two downs to
get this. Let's say, let's let's try something. This is
where you try to give any quarterback a chance to
sort of make a play.
Speaker 3 (30:19):
I just don't trust him enough to do that.
Speaker 2 (30:23):
Somebody had texted Shanahan and San Francisco developed the seventh
round QB and brock perty by allowing him to manage
the game, including short throws in a running game. O'Connor
last with Justice lenses. He does not have Matt Stafford
under center. It's well put, I think, and eventually he
might I'm not kirk Cousins, right, Yeah. In the interim though,
I don't understand why it's that difficult to I mean,
(30:47):
accept four yards here, another first down, because in the end,
you're gonna there's gonna be time for McCarthy to to
prove he can fling. Right, There's always going to be
time for that. But there's no rush on that. So
in the meantime, because what is the head coach told us,
He has said, we're trying to do both. We're trying
(31:08):
to develop this quarterback. We want to win right now, right,
So to me, the best way you thread that particular
needle is you are willing to go a little bit
even more conservative than you'd otherwise intended. Now, again, when
you're down fifteen or to where we down fourteen, whatever
it was at that point, obviously you're going to have
to start flinging it.
Speaker 3 (31:28):
That's just sort of the nature of the beast.
Speaker 4 (31:29):
But they even ran the ball a couple of times
on one of those drives when they were down fourteen
to kind of get him back.
Speaker 3 (31:35):
That's true. Sure, you're right, I mean it's not illegal.
Speaker 4 (31:38):
What you guys have made the point that Aaron Jones
looked really good yesterday, because he does look really good
at times, and he looks great yesterday. What's always funny
to me is they have and I was thinking of
this yesterday, they have really cool inventive running plays like
they do.
Speaker 3 (31:54):
Yeah, they get him the ball and it's the one.
Speaker 4 (31:56):
Cut thing that Mercers was talking about, and it just
looks effortless.
Speaker 3 (31:59):
I forget us.
Speaker 2 (31:59):
You heard it from Yeah a couple of times before
the outcome was known, saying don't we can't forget about
the run, Paul. Last week they gave Adis in a carry, yeah, right,
and a huge play on third down and he picked
it up. There's so many different ways to move it.
It is crazy, though, how this has become such a thing,
just the refusal. Somebody had the numbers, you know, the
(32:20):
you know, it's like seven of twenty passing and like
four times they've run the ball in those situations.
Speaker 3 (32:25):
It's not that dramatic. But I'm not that far off. No,
not that far off. Are you losing your voice? By
the way, I might be a little bit of a
little raspy. I mean it's you know, it's cold in
the air. Yeah, that's true. It's that time of year.
Speaker 2 (32:35):
Load management. Ben Lieber will get his reaction to yesterday's festivities.
Maybe he'll help us prepare for an interesting Monday night
encounter involving an NFC North opponent as well.
Speaker 8 (32:47):
Oh no Furmus moments up kicks offense.
Speaker 3 (32:51):
We'vepparently seen him since.
Speaker 7 (32:53):
All right, first down, first intent from the forty one flag,
All start vikings come.
Speaker 3 (32:59):
That is what I'm talking about.
Speaker 8 (33:00):
Join us again for another famous moment in a gas offense.
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