Sean Salisbury! - Bumper to Bumper 11/13/25 Hour One

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:02):
Yore.

Speaker 2 (00:03):
What's past is prologue leader fan Fan Radio Network, and
that's a fact. And k f AN dot Com. Two
minutes and two seconds past the hour of three o'clock
Central Standard time, we welcome you to another edition of
the not all that highly acclaimed Afternoon Ardvark on a

(00:28):
beautiful November mid November day here in the twin cities
of Minneapolis and Saint Paul. My name is Dan Barrero,
the host of the program. Guardsy is jetting as we
speak to the Pacific Northwest, where your Golden Gophers will
be taking on the Oregon Ducks right here on the
fan tomorrow night. That's a Friday night national game, a

(00:51):
national affair. We may check in with Guardsy tomorrow actually
to get a little bit of a preview. Gophers. Brett
Blake Moore is in the chair today and we'll be
in the chair tomorrow as we as well. We welcome
you back to the broadcast. We have a good array
of guests. No Doctor Dan's inbox today. We think we've

(01:14):
got Sean Salisbury at three thirty. We'll find out in uh,
not that many minutes. We have confirmed that Mike Conley
is going to join the program. The Wolves Guard at
four oh two and we got some bonus Russo today
Russo Radio scheduled for five oh two. We are out
as is customary on Thursdays. I think we're out every

(01:35):
day at six, because tomorrow we're out at six four
Golden Gover free pregame show. But we're out at six
again today, correct, not five forty five six o'clock. So
that is the the formerly known as Borton Volvo guest
lineup the Bradshawn Brian Cafe in text line that's more current.
It's six four six eighty six. We would love to
hear from you, and we generally do so whatever is

(01:59):
on your mind, hit the six four six eighty six
deal and speak up on whatever might be tickling your
fancy yet today. Are you familiar with the expression what's
past is prologue? Have you ever heard it before? I haven't.
I can take a guess. It's it's awful heavy. You know,

(02:23):
it sounds really profound and dramatic. I like it because
it's got a little alliteration. What's past is prologue? And
I like you know, AI is dangerous to count on
when it comes to definitions, but I think this is
a pretty good one. It certainly fits the theme early

(02:46):
in today's program, Today's Afternoon, Hardvork, What's Past is prologue,
AI suggests means that the past has led to the
present moment that would I guess you say, well yeah,
alert the media, Limberg baby, and that our history sets

(03:08):
the context for the future. It suggests that past events, experiences,
and decisions are the foundation for what is happening now
and what will happen next. A related idea is that
a person's past is not necessarily predictive. The future can
be a guy for making better choices. That's from AI

(03:31):
What's Past is Prologue, and it fits today because I'm
often accused of living in the past. There's a danger
of living in the past. But part of the reason
I am stubborn about spending a lot of time on

(03:52):
this show over the decades on history could be World history,
could be American history, could be Minnesota history, could be
Minnesota sports history, right, could be any number of things
that are historic. In nature is there's value and context
to what has come before, and that to a certain extent,

(04:14):
it deepens one's appreciation potentially for how we got here
and what might be happening now, how it's all linked. Example,
you've heard me say a couple times in this program,
I love the fact that the NBA is back on NBC.

(04:36):
Some of that is just sentiment. Some of that is
because I remember, well the you know, the theme, the
NBC theme song for the NBA. Kind of nice to
have that back. But the bigger piece of it now
that NBC is back tied up married to the NBA,

(04:57):
is the effort that's been made aid by NBC to
not always just simply make the game they're about to
telecast about those teams that day. The present counts and
the presence important. But NBC has clearly much more than

(05:20):
ESPN ever did, and even TNT to a certain extent,
to try to link the present of the NBA to
its past, to salute the richness in that past, giving

(05:41):
people a sense of in doing so. I think in
any sport, the texture of the sport part of the
We're part of the continuum, as we like to say.
Let me give you an example. This was just the
other day, I think it was Sixers. This is a
Sixers Celtics preview that ran at the top of the

(06:05):
NBC and maybe Peacock or both, or one of the
other broadcasts involving one of the most hallowed names in
all of sports broadcast history. I think it's only about
a minute two minutes long. Let's go ahead and and listen,
and maybe you'll have a better idea of what I'm
when I'm where I'm headed here.

Speaker 3 (06:28):
If you're a basketball fan of a certain vintage, or
if you appreciate the legends of this game, then you,
like me, are excited for tonight. Yes, Boston and Philadelphia,
no teams have met more often of the NBA playoffs.

Speaker 4 (06:53):
Bill Russell and with Tremblin, Arrivo and Ductors, two last
sick franchises with even more or spectacular plays. Believe it
or not, I'm not here just to look back tonight.
I'm more interested in the present. Tyrese Max is off

(07:14):
to one of the greatest starts we've ever seen, and
his new running made DJ edgecob is making a holy
statement for.

Speaker 5 (07:23):
Rookie of the Year.

Speaker 4 (07:25):
Meanwhile, Jaylen Brown is trying to make his mark as
the newest leader in the story task of the Celtics,
two teams which in history with big hopes for the future.
It's the Celtics and the seventy six ers the NBA

(07:46):
on NBC.

Speaker 2 (07:48):
Next, I got goosebumps. I believe every sport should do
more of that. I really do. I think it does
nothing but class up the broadcast. It enhances the broadcast.
And guess what, if you're a kid, maybe you say, man,

(08:09):
I guess I forgot about that, or maybe I never
knew it, or maybe i'd like to see I've heard
about it, but I'd like to see it come to life.
And as you meant, and as I mentioned, the key
part is Marv Albert says in the middle of it,
I ain't just talking about the past, though, I'm interested

(08:29):
in the present. So I'm not here to say that
you don't make it about the matchup, you don't make
it about the teams is currently constituted. But I believe
every sport should do more of that. Now, the part
of that is good writing. You got to have people
who can write, and some broadcast entities emphasize that put
more of a premium on that than others, because those

(08:50):
things you know they're gonna have. That's not off the cuff,
you know. And Bob Costas offers up some of his
you know largely on baseball, though he's done a couple
of basketball ones too. He's written it out, he's thought
about it, and I'm here to tell you whether this

(09:11):
isn't about loving basketball. This to me is about connecting
this early or emotionally with any sport that you is
your favorite sport. I think most people. If I don't
think the average roub today gets enough credit, I think
if you give the average Roub, dave O tem any

(09:32):
sport a more of this, they'd love it. I think
they absolutely enjoy it. It's just as I said, it
deepens the broadcast to give some kind of what and look,
you can't manufacture history. Some teams haven't been around long
enough for there to be much of a history. But
where it's it's it's applicable. I say it's a lesson.

(09:56):
I think more networks, more TV producers should steal from
what NBC, in bringing back the NBA to that network
has attempted to do. Lord knows, there's enough hockey history
to do it right. There's plenty. There's always angles, but again,

(10:17):
you got to have somebody who can write it. You
got to have somebody who's thinking that way as opposed
to all right, let's get to the analytics. Let's break
down this particular matchup. You have plenty of time to
get to the matchup, right, There's always time to get
to the matchup. I doubt you'd be offended if more
hockey broadcasts occasionally, especially when it involves maybe historic teams

(10:41):
going head to head, they offered up some of that,
maybe a bit of a taste of that history. I
don't think you'd be offended by that, would you two
original six clubs going out?

Speaker 1 (10:49):
Sure?

Speaker 5 (10:49):
Why not?

Speaker 4 (10:50):
Yes?

Speaker 2 (10:50):
But here's the key fleshing it out more than just that,
because that's easy. You'll hear that. I'll to the original six,
Give me a piece of that rivalry, give me some names,
give me some film. If there's not video, if it's
old enough, it'll be film instead of it. Whatever it is,
I think it's outstanding, and just hearing Marv Albert's voice,

(11:16):
I think is a guy was prolific obviously in his
in his prime. Is rather in its own way, it's
kind of I think the whole thing is great comfort
food and it would enhance any broadcasts. So I don't
know if this will start a revolution, but I'd love
to see it and I know you can't, like I said,

(11:38):
do it with every matchup. You can't do it with
every game, because there's sometimes you're just then you feel
like you're manufacturing the damn thing. But it's I mean,
part of the reason. There's a few webs a few
X handles that I follow. There's a guy, his name
will come to me later, who's an NFL archivist who

(12:02):
just does a wonderful job. Every once in a while,
you'll you'll forget a given day, it'll be hey, let's go,
let's watch the CBS NFL pregame show from back when
Brent Mussburger and the late great our guy Herv Cross
used to be a regular on the chadn. Burrero Show.
We're hosting along with Phyllis George and Jimmy the Greek

(12:26):
Snyder who was on that show before a fall from
Grace whatever. And it'll feel like you're in a time
cap so it'll feel a little weird, but it is
a reminder that, yeah, a lot of times the past
is prologue, and this stuff that is, in one way
or another all connected doesn't mean it was always better then,
but it's part of the history. I for one would

(12:47):
like to see it, and you know when we've brought
this kind of stuff up before. The most comforting part
via the text line is when we hear from kids,
When I see kids listeners in their twenties who say,
I love this. I love when you go down history lane.
I love when you give a little bit of context,
a little bit of texture, whether it's sports history, whatever

(13:09):
the case may be. Now in this case, we're talking sports. Obviously,
that's the whole bit right now. And I trust the
audience enough that I think there's more people out there.
I don't always believe the players do. I worry sometimes
that the players in most sports have become less and
less dedicated to what came before them, because I sure

(13:31):
as hell know KG cared, and I know he's not
played for a while, but he was in a generation
that debt didn't do the old I don't care. I
don't care what came before me. What do I care.
I'm just playing now, making money now. I don't need to.
I don't worry about all that stuff. Garnett was among
those who got it. So no, no, no, no, we're part

(13:51):
of the continuum. I want to learn. I want to
know about all that we owed in Lenny Wilkins, the
who just passed away a few days ago at the
age of eighty eight years old. Hall of Fame NBA coach,
Hall of Fame NBA player, he was a player coach.

(14:12):
And there's a story that was going around. I don't
know how true it was that Shack ran into Lenny
Wilkins at one point somewhere in recent years and Lenny
must have been talking about a game he played in
and Shaq said, some of the effect of you played.
Had no idea that Lenny Wilkins even had even played.

(14:33):
So all of this, I think is to the good.
All of this, I think, regardless of the sport, is
a good trend that I hope NBC is setting that
other broadcasts in other sports can also adopt. And just
hire yourself a couple of riders. Man, I'd do it
on the side if they let me, I'd be I
would love to write some of those intros any of

(14:57):
the sports. Hockey, I'm a hockey, the ambassador, Basketball, foot
but whatever. It's not that difficult to do if you
pay attention to anything. And I just think it adds
a level of class to even a regular season broadcast.
We soa it's one of eighty two games, or in
baseball it's one of one hundred and sixty two game.
Doesn't matter. Anything that enriches a broadcast, I think is

(15:17):
a good thing. Bonus Bucks.

Speaker 6 (15:19):
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Speaker 2 (16:05):
Are you a great prep football mind locally?

Speaker 5 (16:09):
No?

Speaker 2 (16:10):
Oh, then you're probably the wrong person to ask prep
semifinals going on tonight? I think at the People Stadium,
are those games televised. I assume they're streamed in a
way that you can get them, but I know we
put the title games on, but are the Are those

(16:30):
games televised tonight? Somebody will know via the Branshaw on
Bryant Cafe in text line a number of texts coming
in on the subject at the start of the program.
I think NBC is the best when it comes to
broadcasting sports. They can be. I mean, if you go back,
if you're old enough. ABC was outstanding on the Olympics

(16:52):
back in the day. In fact, they won. They used
to have NBA stuff with an announcer named Chris Shankel
outstanding voice. A lot of the kids will not recognize
that name, and I'm not surprised. I'm right with you, Dan.
Local fans love hearing about past stars. It's like oxygen
for the sport. And honestly, they could take some notes

(17:14):
from professional wrestling. Wrestling was downright brilliant at using its
own history to hype in an event. Not so much today,
but historically masterclass in marketing. That's right, Dan. We need
more Kevin Garnett's and fewer Caitlin Clarks kid. We kid, Dan,
I too love when you go down memory lane. When

(17:35):
you mentioned Brent Mussburger, IRV Cross Phyllis George brings back
lots of memories. I saw a clip on YouTube not
long ago when that crew is live and met stadium
for an NFC playoff game, light snow falling, great memories.
And again, let's say you're not old enough to have
those memories. That's okay too. Then I think it's just
an interesting bit of information that adds a layer to

(18:00):
the broadcast. It doesn't have to be that you recollect it,
but it can be interesting to you. Of huh else,
this goes back that far. Huh man, those are those
are some pretty good matchups. Then it's just I think,
what's the appetite to what you then hope will be
a game that can perhaps match that couldn't agree more.

(18:23):
It's about giving back to the viewers who keep the
show going in the first place. We already love the media.
That's obvious. When the media does this, the viewers win,
sports wins, sports win, everybody wins, hundred percent true. I'm
twenty and I love hearing about the old history of
sports and watching old videos and getting to learn more
about the history of sports. That can be painful in
the case of the calendar calamity. We know that, but

(18:46):
it's all kind of part of the bit. Doc Emrick
was the best at tying in history for hockey games.
Misses broadcasts a great example of that. It's no question
I love that the NBA is back on NBC, but
it makes me realize how great Dick m was. I
miss his voice. Not as iconic as Vin Scully, but close.
That's nine to five to two guy dick Enberg as

(19:07):
an Indiana University grand I think he went to grad
school there, if I'm not mistaken. I became an NFL
fan from watching the old NFL films, reading about old games.
For I ever remember watching a game live. Good point
recruding NBC in their broadcast. It's a great way to
actually build it up to something, to be something epic,

(19:29):
similar to how ABC would present Monday Night Football. Now
all ESPN cares about is plugging betting lines. I would submit.
I get why they do it. They're making a lot
of money doing it, and it's about money. But I
think there's room for both, I really do. I think
ESPN has tended to utterly and completely miss the boat
and it's showing up even more now that you have

(19:49):
another network that seems committed to that part of the story.
I did not know NBA on NBC in the old
days as you did. But I've enjoyed these past couple
weeks we've talked about. Even the commentary I think is
is just more adult. It's just they're still ranting that
occasionally goes on there, but there it just feels like

(20:11):
it's got a little bit more depth to it. For sure.
A Sunday timber Rols game is going to have a
rocking atmosphere. Well, we may get to that a little
bit later as well. Let's try to stay on schedule.
We hope when we come back Sean Salisbury, we'll check
in and we'll get his reaction to a disappointing performance
of the Vikings last week in a preview of Vikings Bears?

(20:32):
Does he think the Bears are for real? And much more?
Our guy, Sean Salisbury is scheduled next. Questions for Sean
Salisbury hit the Bradshaw and Brian k f a n

(20:53):
text line six for six eighty six as we welcome
him back into the broad Sean, how are you?

Speaker 5 (21:01):
I'm doing great? Dan, how are you.

Speaker 2 (21:03):
We're doing very well, Thank you very much. I'm going
to give you a couple stats, and then I want
you to do your best deep quarterback deep dive related
to them. I've got JJ McCarthy. If you believe in
the old fashioned quarterback ratings forty fourth in the league currently.

(21:23):
If you believe in the new fangled ESPN QBR, i've
got him. Well he cam Ward is rated thirty third
at twenty four point two QBR. He's I think JJ's
got a twenty six, so he he'd be behind everybody
but cam Ward if he registered in these stats. So
what did you see last week? What do you see?

(21:45):
In general? We know he's going to play, we know
you have to keep playing him obviously, but what what
does do your trained quarterbacks? I see so far?

Speaker 1 (21:55):
Well, hopefully they're communicating with each other on the sideline,
unlike the Atlanta foulcon, which is the most barren, which
is unbelievable. But I uh, you know, the just with
the naked Eyron watching you know what he's doing. Listen,
he's a bit overwhelmed and he is, which is I
get because in essence, he's been there a couple of

(22:16):
years and it's one thing to sit back and watch,
and it's a unique situation when you're a backup to
have to do that, but when you know you're going
to be the starter, he just not.

Speaker 5 (22:23):
He hasn't got a lot of work.

Speaker 4 (22:24):
Now.

Speaker 5 (22:24):
I know he's played some games this year, but you know.

Speaker 1 (22:26):
He's he's still a rookie in essence because this he's
getting under center and dood if you think about illegal
procedure penalties at home. The Ravens defense is playing better
the last three weeks. They look like a team that
will is going to going to make the playoffs. We
had Hi left for dead, but him, I think that
there are times and it almost feels like he's trying

(22:47):
to prove the world that he can make big plays.
You know you can't, and throwing it forty plus times
is not where they want to live. You know, they
ran the ball effectively, but you get down and play chase.
Yeah no, that's exactly right. And you saw Baltimore started
to lean on that as the game went on and
it paid dividends for them. I think that they won't

(23:09):
say this, or he may not, but when you're that young,
you are swimming because the game moves man, and it
moves different than Michigan and Ohio State just does.

Speaker 5 (23:16):
And he is I think that he's probably a little
bit overwhelmed at times.

Speaker 1 (23:21):
I think that, you know, he's an energetic guy and
he feeds off that, which has led to some streaky football.
As I said when he was in college, the best
of JJ McCarthy's passing is going to be in front
of him, and it's going to take a while because
they didn't throw that much there, I mean eighteen times,
sixteen times, twenty two times, so he is not a

(23:42):
polished passer.

Speaker 5 (23:43):
And the numbers, so I try to stay away, but
there are some glaring numbers that you can't stay away from.
And this team should not be an under five hundred
team talentlese. They're better than that.

Speaker 1 (23:54):
So whether it's coaching, whether it's performance, both obviously execution,
but you got to get reps. And that's I know
that's a cliche thing, but just to me, I can
just see. I love the urgency a player. When a
player's feeling good, your feet are urgent, the rest of
your quiet upper body and your mind slows down. Right now,

(24:16):
it's the opposite for him, I mean everything's one hundred
miles an hour and trying to make big plays and
you see the turnovers and illegal procedure penalties, and they're
not real.

Speaker 5 (24:26):
Efficient on the offensive side of the ball.

Speaker 1 (24:27):
And I know and anytime you look and a receiver's
got double digits targets twelve or thirteen to Jefferson last
week and only four we're complete. There's something missing from
all of it right now. And they are a they're
a non looking playoff team offensively right now.

Speaker 2 (24:44):
Eight fallse starts at home, which is excusable. Yeah, it's excusable.
It's got to be. And everybody's trying to cover for
everybody and say, it's a number of different things, but
to me, at the top of the list, it's got
to be this quarterback's cadence, right there's something about his
cadence that's confusing some members of the rest of his

(25:04):
offense because the right tackle doesn't do that on a
regular basis. So how does that work? How can is
it a different voice? Is it the way he emphasizes
the hot hot? What what do you think causes the
possibility of of that kind of disaster as it took
place last week?

Speaker 5 (25:21):
Well, first thing. You know, everybody's going to be paying
attention to. This.

Speaker 1 (25:25):
First thing that comes down to my mind is he's
your starting quarterback if he is using a different cadence
than Wentz did for a while, as far as you know,
down set white.

Speaker 5 (25:34):
Eighty white, ady, hot, hot hot or whatever, that.

Speaker 1 (25:38):
The cadence of the cadence is, you know, the whether
it's the decibel level, whether it's the emphasis. And you're
going on three, yell, but that those weren't all hard
count long counts. You're just normal counts, right, and it's
at home. So voice inflection obviously has something to do
with it. But you know, I can remember when I
first got to Minnesota that rich and Wade's cadence were

(25:58):
a little different than mine because how I've learned it,
we just did it different. And so like a lot
of times when I when a hat sc our hardcat
like to get people off, it was hot, hot hot.
We would hesitate sometimes between one and two and where
I've been previously, instead of a lot of times now
if you're going on three, you'll roll one.

Speaker 5 (26:17):
And two together.

Speaker 1 (26:18):
It'll be hot hot hot like that instead of hut,
so a slight hesitation those guys were white. Nothing that
they're leaning and so I literally and so this is great.
The asses is listening to him. It was down set
like black kidway hot hot. I mean you're like rolling
into it. So the center should be rolling, you know,
doing this stuff, and you're getting used to stamping it.
When we were there, milk, just a loud of milk,

(26:41):
just it was like he'd be on two, he'd be
stamping it on one because we had we'd roll one
into two so quickly you do it and go good.

Speaker 5 (26:48):
If you listen to Cadence now, like when Marino was
calling her, when Aaron Rodge points Mike right, five eighty
five minutes hot.

Speaker 1 (26:54):
I mean, you really don't hear them all until it's
if it's on the third one it's not hot, and
then hesitation, then the third one and you hope somebody
jumps and get them off side. And if you can't
get the cadence down right, as grown adults coaches players
tackle quarterback the starting quarterball, then you know what now
that he's the starter, they got to adjust to him,
which is a bummer, I know that, but he's also

(27:16):
got to make it to where knowing how hard the
job is for the guys up front. You want them
to get off. It's only to your advantage. So you
can't always go on one. But you got to talk
to them and go in their meeting room and say
what cans do you like when we're going on three D?
You like roll the first two together hesitation or do
you like had? I mean you want to ask them.
And if that fails and you're not practicing a hell,

(27:38):
if something's not working, got to practice it, then you
better go to the old college high school days and
the gun where you're clapping, or if you're under center
you're going on a silent count, or you're and get
your have to do this at home. Another thing, this
is elementary school stuff, Dan, This should not be happening.
One is you shouldn't get eight.

Speaker 5 (27:57):
I don't care if there's four hundred thousand people that
have led Zepp when Coner.

Speaker 1 (28:01):
You can't jump off side eight times, let alone eight
times in your own b building.

Speaker 5 (28:07):
So yeah, you just can't.

Speaker 1 (28:08):
So he's got to either adjust his cadence. They have
to learn to get back to hearing his voice, you know.
And I'll guarant asked he that he and Carson Wentz
had something a little different in there, whether it's a
deeper voice, a higher voice, or the timing of it.

Speaker 5 (28:21):
But if that's not working by about the fourth one.

Speaker 1 (28:24):
You know what I would have done, honest to God,
if I was Kevin or that, I have said, listen,
we're going on on silent count. Quarterback, the guard's going
to touch him, he's going to look back to one
thousand and one.

Speaker 5 (28:36):
Hesitate, well, going on movement.

Speaker 1 (28:38):
That's what you do when it's a hostile environment and
postseason or something.

Speaker 5 (28:41):
So you got to learn to adjust.

Speaker 1 (28:42):
You can't have seventh graders understanding cadence better than that,
and that you know, like like Penalley's on on a
nice return or backseat up and then they were just
it felt like they were chasing swimming upstream the whole time.

Speaker 5 (28:56):
And then the quarterback is young.

Speaker 1 (28:57):
You're trying to be a hero, and next thing you know,
you're also playing against a team who is on fire
right now. And Lamar just didn't. Lamar look bored, and
I like that kind of look like, you know what,
this is easy. Just hit the ball to the check down.
I'll get out of bounds. Not going to take the hit.
Oh there's that dig route.

Speaker 5 (29:13):
Let me hit that.

Speaker 1 (29:14):
He he looked bored, which goes back to everything's moving urgently,
but from the waist up and like this guy's like
smoking a cigar in the pocket. It's just it's just
it's pretty easy for us. But that's because the mind
he already has a pretty good idea what you're trying
to do. And that's against a a defense that is
changes a lot of fronts.

Speaker 5 (29:35):
Yes, you know me, minnes it gives you a lot
of looks.

Speaker 1 (29:37):
So you've got to you've got to silence that by
just playing calm football. They looked frantic last week, and
even though it was close and they were within a
score late, I mean, they just looked a little frantic.
The other one looked like, we got this the whole time.
Don't you worry. We're going to take care of business.
And and they felt like the vikings were flowing upstream
that that you know, in a in a nice fishing,

(29:58):
nice fishing river there in Minnesota.

Speaker 2 (30:00):
It's a bit of a broken record, but because of
the circumstances of this game, I want to go back
over it. I'm looking at the box score, Aaron. If
you take McCarthy's rushes out because he had five carries
for forty eight. Leave those aside, though, because quarterback is
always kind of in a different category because often those
are not planned runs. Aaron Jones nine carries forty seven yards,

(30:22):
Jordan Mason four for twenty five. So the two running
backs together ran thirteen times and averaged five and a
half yards of carry. That just doesn't make sense to me. Now,
I get it in the fourth quarter, when you get
down fourteen or fifteen, at some point you got to
let it loose a little bit. But it just keeps going. Seohan,

(30:43):
I don't get why he's the one Shanahan disciple who
doesn't seem to get it. All the other ones never
forget about running the ball, and he still hasn't figured
it out. It's bizarre to me.

Speaker 1 (31:00):
And you know what, like getting under center in the gun,
and I know he did that in college. But to
the point, I was talking on my show about this,
and then my co host decided, I'm going to look
something up because a couple of days before, I said,
you know, getting under center and in the gun, mixing
both in YEP are really important because the run game
and you can do more bandwidth, right you know that
four of the five teams are all Super Bowl contenders,

(31:21):
and mcveigh's one of those guys.

Speaker 5 (31:23):
We know Shanahan's background. They're not in the county.

Speaker 1 (31:25):
But for the top five of almost like a forty
seven fifty three split under center in the gun, that
leads to you can do both.

Speaker 5 (31:34):
You're more versatile. Right, four of those teams.

Speaker 1 (31:36):
The only one that's not the admerration of like four
of the best teams in the league is the Kansas
City Chiefs. Now, they played more sideways screen football than
anybody in the league. They're near the top, so they
use that as an extension of the run. So you're
one hundred percent right. Kevin's a smart guy and every
every Shanahan slash McVay guy, they want to run it
just like Mike Shanahan the dad did and dominates.

Speaker 5 (31:58):
You didn't matter who the back was. We're committed to it.

Speaker 1 (32:00):
And when you're averaging five yards of carry, you don't
abandon that. And I would even make the argument, I
know when you get late, like inside three minutes to go,
you got to drop back and throw it. Every time
I get that, But to me, in the fourth quarter
in this league, or in any league being down by
a score or two, there's no panic needed.

Speaker 5 (32:17):
It's one, three and out. You go score it. You
can still.

Speaker 1 (32:20):
You don't have to abandon it now, now do Baltimore,
If I'm not mistaken, they ran.

Speaker 2 (32:24):
Close to forty times, that's correct.

Speaker 1 (32:26):
Almost close to thirty six thirty eight rushers. I can't
as I'm watching the game and thirty.

Speaker 2 (32:31):
One carries one hundred and fifty two yards.

Speaker 5 (32:33):
There you go.

Speaker 1 (32:33):
And that's that's the And in dire times or even
on third and five before, they had no problem running it.
And that's I'm not even just talking about with the quarterback.
I'm talking about with their run game, because it's not
like Lamar ran it seventeen times or for one hundred
and sixty yards. So I know the thread of him
always is a problem, but I just I don't understand.
You're not going to win football games in this league

(32:57):
if you're lucky one out of twenty. But unless you
have one of those days where it's like, you know,
all your backs are hurt, you've got Dan Marino throwing
it fifty times and he's used to it, You're not
winning in the league running it less than half the
amount of times as the other team. And you know
my affinity for this stat. It's a yempt yes every time.
I say it all the time. No matter what, if

(33:18):
you average three yards of carry and had twenty eight attempts,
you'd be closer to a victory than if you ran
it eighteen times for one hundred and sixty yards. I'm
just telling you you would yeap just because of the club,
and you're also limiting possessions. And it just to me
for the other team. If you're doing it right and
at five yards of carry, you would have gotten three

(33:39):
or four more first downs, which is what eight to
ten to twelve more plays, depending on.

Speaker 5 (33:43):
How you do with those series. So I don't get the.

Speaker 1 (33:45):
Math, and I don't know why, and all you're doing
by not running it is putting more burden on a
quarterback who's still under a rookie amount of games and
he's not ready for that. I know he can throw it,
he'll get better because he was accurate at Michigan. He
is not ready to get into a passing fancy for
the most part. The game he won when they came

(34:06):
back early in the year. Dam is you know what
is the first one when he came. Yeah, he didn't
throw up very well. I mean they would at that
point in time. You programmed your mind and say, okay,
let me go out now I know I'm throwing Now,
let's just go play street yard football.

Speaker 5 (34:22):
Let it rip.

Speaker 1 (34:22):
You're now you're not squeezing the ball hard and brings
them back in and has that great you know, into
the game, fourth quarter and there they go. You can't
live there. Mahomes ain't living there anymore. Alan's not living there.
Look at Buffalo trying to explain them losing to Miami,
Like I said, that couldn't beat anybody in a pillow fight,
let alone a fist fight. So and but the Minnesota
Vikings are their lack of commitment to the run game,

(34:47):
even when it's successful, is one of the league's more
baffling situations.

Speaker 2 (34:51):
Well, you know, I got and I get this text
every time we talk about this, the comeback, and I
think even O'Connell talked about a little bit after the game. Well,
if you're if you got a false start and first
and ten becomes first and fifteen, it's harder to run.
And I grant it's a little harder to do anything
at first and fifteen. But you know what, I know

(35:11):
that there are teams committed enough to the run that
they'll even run on second and ten and they don't
expect to get the ten, but they said, let's get six, right,
let's get it to that place where we have enough
confidence and then we have a chance to make a play.
So I don't even I don't even buy the premise,
especially in a day runs going again.

Speaker 5 (35:31):
And I can tell you this if you get if
you start showing up these analytics, which.

Speaker 1 (35:35):
Is evidence, that's all analytics are, and these tenancies in
football that on first and fifteen you have to throw
every time they're going to play some kind of coverage
right prevens you from throwing it even underneath, and then
you're going to take a shot.

Speaker 5 (35:51):
Now it's second fifteen.

Speaker 1 (35:52):
Yes, so I know from in my world, second elevens
easier than second fifteen. And I know this third and
six is a lot easier to third and ten. So
for me, as a matter of fact, I'll bet you
there's a fairly I'll bet you there's a pretty I
don't want to say alarming, but if we went over
every second down.

Speaker 5 (36:10):
And ten plus and I'm saying.

Speaker 1 (36:13):
Any ball that's thrown behind the line of scrimmage or
a ball handed off, I'll bet you it's a higher
percentage than we would think of teams who throw it
behind the line of scrimmage or run it on second
and ten plus.

Speaker 5 (36:27):
So you're first and fifteen, okay.

Speaker 1 (36:29):
So by throwing it all the time and getting away
from it, aren't you basically telling your team I don't
trust you to get me four yards back. And if
you're trying to get fifteen yards on one run on
first and fifteen, you probably need to take two weeks
off and quit, because that doesn't usually happen either. Very
Barry Sander's name Eric Dickerson aren't on the field right now,
so and even they wouldn't do it then.

Speaker 5 (36:49):
But I can tell you this.

Speaker 1 (36:50):
My math tells me four and six gets me to
third and five, which is manageable.

Speaker 5 (36:56):
And now I can still run it.

Speaker 1 (36:57):
I can throw it, or I can get to four
four than one on their side of the field, and
it's a four down.

Speaker 5 (37:03):
So to me.

Speaker 1 (37:05):
And that's a coming from a quarterback who'd like to
throw it ninety times games play because I want to
throw it, But if you want to win eighteen attempts
minus the quarterbacks five to thirteen attempts will not beat
the New Orleans Saints in an NFL game.

Speaker 5 (37:20):
Oh, by the way, the Saints beat Carolina. There you go.
There it is ext the quarterback right.

Speaker 2 (37:25):
Let me ask you about there was a third and
one play where my inclination generally is to defend the
call that O'Connell made. This was at the start of
the second half, third and one around the fifty might
have been a little bit further into Baltimore territory, and

(37:46):
that's the play that ends up. JJ stumbles, it ends
up being an interception, and his The O'Connell point after
the game was, I'm going forward on fourth down. In
other words, if it's an incomplete pass on third and one,
if the play we have where they did actually single
up JJ, which was unusual, if it, you know, if

(38:08):
it doesn't work it's incomplete, we're going for it. I
got a good run play called on fourth and one.
I usually defend that. As long as I know you're
gonna run it on fourth, you're gonna keep going on fourth.
It can be a good passing down. On the other hand,
I say Baltimore's gotten back in the game and you're
starting to lose control of it a little bit. Are
you better off getting another damn first down? I don't know,

(38:29):
how do you feel about that?

Speaker 1 (38:30):
I would have ran it twice and if I can't
get and I would have, I would have flipped it.
I would have because on fourth and one, I.

Speaker 5 (38:39):
Think teams, oh, yeah, pretty much know you're gonna run it.

Speaker 1 (38:43):
I think on third and one they're looking at you
at times and saying, this could be bootleg naked boot
play action, you know, try to get one out there.
And I don't ever now, I don't want a quarterback
to play scared. You've got to have some guts. But
I've never understood, like on a fourth and one at
midfield and you're you're buck thirty to go and us
to see it on Saturdays, to see it on Sundays,

(39:03):
a guy will throw a fade route, a low percentage
fade route that lands out of bounds on fourth and one,
and I know this was third now, but I'm talking
about a four or push the ball down the field
in tight coverage, man, because it's man, you take a shot.
I get it, But that goes back into the IQ
of the football iqu of understand the situation of a
game down two touchdowns, Jefferson man coverage.

Speaker 5 (39:25):
I'm backed up at Mount on twenty five. It's third
and one.

Speaker 1 (39:27):
Hell, I don't have problem taking a shot or like
that in a buff going anyway, do it. But I
cross midfield, we'll get the first out of I'll get
another shot to take a fade, they'll play man again,
or a ball that's pushed down the field, even a
comeback or a dig run. It's just not on a
high percentage. That doesn't mean to play scared. Just don't
play stupid, which was a great Tom Moore suggestioned all
of us. Don't play scared, just don't play stupid. How

(39:49):
stupid is, in my opinion, putting your quarterback and where
you see it and automatically you pre snap read it
and you say, you know what, I'm throwing it, regardless
of the coverage, because now all we got same. Now,
while JJ makes it a higher percentage because he's so good,
but let me secure the first down first, especially in
that situation of the game. And I know circumstances called

(40:10):
I would have flipped it. If I was gonna, I
would have ran it on third down. And if I didn't,
if they were everybody's pinsioning it, and then I would
have naked booted and given my guy or pushed him
to the edge. Given my guy run past option, I
would have flooded it. I would have given McCarthy the ball,
chance to get the edge, dive at the pylon, or
throw the football or make something happen. But on third down,

(40:33):
now you're forced, man, oh no, game, that's fourth in
the yard. Now, well, I guess I could punt and
try to back them up, or what if it goes
to the inland? So I know I'm going for so
in this league, and I know what happens weekly. But
if I can't move the pile two plays for a yard,
then I'm probably not good enough to win much. That's

(40:53):
what and that's that's the craziness.

Speaker 5 (40:55):
But I also know this.

Speaker 1 (40:58):
If if I'm going to throw it and I get Jeffers,
well let me put the ball on Jefferson's hand some
other one I don't know. Can we jet sweep them
like we used to do with Mac? I don't you
know the edge? If they're pinching in and all the
quarterbacks sneak, that's for you know, I didn't watch their
game plan or all the cutups going into the week,
so knowing what they're doing on their six two short
yardage and goal line as you prepare what you're going

(41:20):
to put in. But I've always believed that that if
we can't get if I can't get two yards with
Zimmerman and McDaniel, then we then we're not very good. Secondly,
i'm talking about when we play now with those second
and also on the other side of it, is okay,
if you're using a waist down, there's a time for
a waist down.

Speaker 5 (41:36):
You're going to go four downs. You're at their thirty
five or forty got three. But I can't.

Speaker 1 (41:41):
I can't waste it down on third and one and
fourth and one.

Speaker 5 (41:46):
And it was hugely fut I hope you know what
I'm saying.

Speaker 1 (41:49):
I'd prefer to secure the first down other than take
a low percentage or take a shot and a chance.
Now we get the first down, the first and ten,
take a shot, that's okay, just be smart with the ball,
take a shot.

Speaker 5 (42:03):
Second.

Speaker 1 (42:04):
But man, then you know the struggle. You know they
haven't run the ball a ton. You know it's Baltimore
starting to get hot man. Let me just take the
ball out of that other dude's hands on the other side,
and let me push a pile and get my jumbo
people in and let's let's let's at least or run
some play action and let JJ have the two way
go on an option, even if it's two plays in

(42:24):
a row. And I know we see it all the time,
but then it comes down to how physical are you?
I just and Kevin's a smart guy, but there are
head scratching moments that I think, what are we trying
to get done here? Especially when you've averaged at the
end of the game. You're putting up half a first
down for Carrie on thirteen of them.

Speaker 2 (42:42):
All Right, we only have about a minute left because
I've got Mike Conley here at the top of the hour.
But I want to get this in this These are
comments from Justin Jefferson today. I'm quoting Kevin Seaffert, who's
a regular on our show Covers the Bitings for ESPN.
Really interesting media session today with Justin Jefferson said he
wants to get back to his quote savage and bleep

(43:02):
it Mode. Admitted his frustration on Sunday and addressed not
chasing players who intercepted passes. Quote, I'm not really mad
at the situation that I'm in, or I'm not mad
at the players that we have or the plays that
are being called. Of course i'm mad after an interception.
You want me to be happy and go chase them down.
That's not really something that I want to happen. So,

(43:24):
you know, even among media members, there's a bit of
a debate on whether too much is being made of
his reaction after the picks, especially because one of them
get called back anyway and he probably knew it was
down by contact, and others saying no, that's a bad vibe.

Speaker 5 (43:39):
Man.

Speaker 2 (43:39):
You got to you gotta go and make gotta go
ahead and make sure you're making the play. As a
former player watching this stuff closely, did any of that
bother you? What do you think is any of this
should almost be concerning on JJ.

Speaker 1 (43:52):
Listen, it does one thing you got to take into account.
Receivers are built different. Yes, I mean take a look
at aj Brown on Hey, you had fantasy, don't pick
you know, drop me from your league. I mean, receivers
want to get there, and they when they get there,
sometimes even when you don't win, I'm not saying him specifically,
but receivers sometimes when they get eight catches for one
hundred and forty yards or two touchdowns and lose, they'll

(44:15):
get over it a little quicker. Then if they get
three catches for twenty two yards and win. That's and
you want that because they crave the ball. And Jefferson's
one of the five best offensive players in the world.

Speaker 5 (44:25):
I get it. And as good as there is I
just the optics, man, Yeah, it doesn't matter.

Speaker 1 (44:30):
You just got He's a great player, and we're not
taking that away. But great players and the special.

Speaker 5 (44:34):
Ones, the unique and elite ones, which he is. But
there's also I always compare hines Ward.

Speaker 1 (44:40):
Heines Ward made a difference in games even when he
wasn't catching the ball he'd blocked it, he'd hustle after
and go make a tackle.

Speaker 5 (44:45):
That's your job.

Speaker 1 (44:46):
And I know the interceptions are a bummer and they suck,
but you know, just the optics to younger guys, and
do your teammates, because when you go in and watch
film the next day, the urgent part of it, you're like, oh,
it's just that player two plays. But the hard part
is when you go and watch your teammates and eleve
ten dudes are chasing it down and you're not.

Speaker 5 (45:03):
It just reeks up. Oh, so this is the way
it is.

Speaker 1 (45:06):
And I know he's better than that, and I would
imagine he'll chase that next time.

Speaker 5 (45:10):
And you never know when you're going to be the
guy that.

Speaker 1 (45:12):
Prevents a big play on an interception from a touchdown,
especially with his skill set and speed.

Speaker 5 (45:17):
You have to go even if you don't want to,
and the frustration kicks in.

Speaker 2 (45:21):
Got it, quick answer, without needing any explanation on why
bears Vikings, who wins?

Speaker 1 (45:28):
Give me the Vikings. But Caleb Williams is improving and
he's keeping it close. He's a playmaker and he's getting
better in the pocket. You better force him off his
mark and make him go left not right.

Speaker 2 (45:39):
Outstanding work again, my friend. We appreciate you. We'll talk
next week.

Speaker 5 (45:43):
Thank you, buddy, appreciation.

Speaker 2 (45:44):
Outstanding stuff man, really good analysis from Sean Salisbury. Let's break.
We are a little bit late and we expect to
visit with Timberwolves. Point guard Mike Conley will get caught
up on the Wolves next