August 12, 2023 • 35 mins
Ron starts this episode with a call on an 07 Prius with misfire codes : takes a call on a 94 F150 where the odometer and speedometer aren’t working : talks with Drew Conkling, Sr. Director, Global Product Line of Gates : answers an email about replacing an O2 sensor in an almost 20 year old car : and talks about a 17 GMC Acadia with a stutter.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Ron An Inian, How old are you? Good?
Speaker 2 (00:02):
Waite sixty nine?
Speaker 3 (00:04):
I'm sixty seven.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
At this point in the game, can you afford a
twenty hell cat? Go buy it, brother, and just enjoy it.
Rolling down the road at eight miles Get the Car Doctor.
Did you ever watch the Tonight Show as a kid? Boys, Well,
then again, you were probably old enough to step and
watch it because you're old, that's true. Listen to be
selling apple dog food next. Remember that.
Speaker 4 (00:21):
Welcome to the radio home of ron An Aian, The
Car Doctor. Since nineteen ninety one. This is where car
owners the world overturned to for their definitive opinion on
automotive repair. If your mechanics giving you a busy signal,
pick up.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
The phone and call in. The garage doors are open,
but I am here to take your calls at eight
five five five six ninety nine hundred and now pee.
Speaker 4 (00:47):
Running.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
Wow, not a lot of time and a whole lot
to do in it. We've got to get going. We've
got an interview down the bottom of the hour Drew
Conklin from gate to stopping. Buy the phones are lit up.
We got a lot of calls to take, so let's
get started and go to Eric in Virginia, OH seven
Toyota Prius and some engine miss fire falls.
Speaker 5 (01:03):
Eric.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
Welcome to the car doctor, sir, how can I help?
Speaker 3 (01:06):
Hey? Thanks for having me. Yeah, card has been racking
a little rough obviously low speed load. Disle started to
shake a little bit full codes I was getting I
think it was the P three hundred. I wasn't all
those P three hundred, which is multiple, and then I
think was hitting in one three and four. Changed out
the plugs and coils on it, and I didn't seem
(01:28):
to help anything on it, even though I think one
of the misfires switched the last time I ran the
skiing on it.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
Okay, So if we were diagnosing this from the from
the start, you know, one of the things we would
do is we'd we'd we'd move coils around or plugs
around and so forth. But you've kind of passed that step,
right because you did plugs and coils, and we'll assume
everything you did is right and you know, no slight,
just just you know, being being certain. So what else
(01:56):
can what else can cause a misfire?
Speaker 2 (01:58):
You know?
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Is it mechanical? Yeah, it's possible, you know, mechanical out
of a Prius. They're pretty rock solid. You know, do
you have a scan tool? Can you look at fuel trim?
You know, what do you see in fuel trim? Does
fuel trim look correct or close? Is it excessive one
way or the other? Just for conversation's sake, I haven't.
Speaker 3 (02:18):
Hooked one up to it. I mean it's possible. I
mean that was kind of my next idea, is uh
fuel injectors, Well it wasn't getting enough fuel?
Speaker 1 (02:27):
Yeah, it's it's or is it? Is it?
Speaker 5 (02:29):
You know?
Speaker 1 (02:30):
Is it a case of are we seeing a mechanical
fault which will be indicated by a fuel condition, by
a lean or rich fuel condition and complete combustion, that
sort of thing. I'll tell you what's not uncommon with
a lot of the Priuses. As they get older, they
get a lot of miles on them. How many miles
are on this car? One hundred and fifty two hundred?
How much?
Speaker 3 (02:48):
Yeah? Thirty two yeah, thirty two thousand.
Speaker 1 (02:50):
I would do a fuel system cleaning, and I don't
mean I would, I mean a tank additive, but I
also mean hooking up you know. I would go out
to the Berriman website Berryman Products dot com read up
about their fuel system cleaners. They've got a four step
kit works really well. We use it in the shop
all the time, and what it'll do is it'll clean
the rail and it'll also decarbonize the inside of the engine.
But before I did that, I would look at fuel
(03:13):
trim before and then look at fuel trim after, and
you'll if you if you see an improvement, you may
not see it fixed, but you may see a change
in fuel trim where it's more consistent or closer to zero,
and that that tells you you're going in the right direction,
you know, rather than just let's just do a fuel
system cleaning and not test anything. So what sort of
(03:35):
what's what sort of skin tool do you have?
Speaker 5 (03:38):
Eric?
Speaker 3 (03:40):
And honestly, I'm not sure the brand. It's pretty generic.
It just runs I mainly for the OBD two code specifically,
and I just kind of research from there.
Speaker 1 (03:47):
Can you if you can see if you can just
bring up fuel trim PIDs by themselves? All right? The
reason I say that is because you know, like like
a computer, like your phone, right you've got you know,
you ever have it with your phone when you've got
seven eight apps opening, you see the phone slow down? Well,
the scan tool does the same thing. So the less
(04:07):
PIDs are, the less pieces of data that you have
up on the screen. The faster that tool is, the
more responsive it is. So if you can just you know,
bring up select PIDs. I usually bring up engine speed, temperature,
cool INTEMP and you know long term, short term fuel trim.
There's a four cylinder, so you know you can have
four PIDs up there. You want to put up mass airflow,
(04:30):
look at calculated load. Sure, go ahead, you know, just
to get an idea. But the idea is then at
least you know you're fairly accurate. You're not, You're not.
The computer's not slowing down in terms of how it's reporting.
But I would do that graph it or or just
you know, take a screenshot of it. And then after
you do the fuel system cleaning, do the same thing again.
Do you see any improvement in the way the vehicle
(04:51):
runs into you see any improvement in fuel trim? So
at least you know if you're going in the right direction.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
All right. I do have one kind of stucond there.
Everything I had just kind of more curious about. Sure
at an issue I've been having for honestly the last
few years, it seems to be more of a nuisance
than others. But as far as my gap think, in
particular in the summertime, I always have trouble getting fuel
in it. I mean there's days where I could barely
even put a gallon in it without like really playing
(05:17):
with it. But then usually when it gets a little
bit cooler out, you know, I can put you know,
pretty close to the full mount still not giving me
the full capacity, but I can get up to like
eleven or twelve eleven or twelve gallons and then go
from there. Any idea of anything, but that would be well.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
I think you've probably got an issue with the vent.
Uh Do you know what I mean when I say
the vent valve or right? Yep, I would I would
go down when you're having that particular problem and disconnect
the vent at the canister to see, you know, do
we have do we have excess pressure? Are we able
(05:55):
to as the vent stuck open, as the event stuck closed?
Do we have a spider web in there? You know?
Speaker 3 (06:01):
It's such a pain to get you because that's my thought.
But the weird part is, it's just it seems like
it's seasonal. It's always in the summertime, I have problems,
and I at least from what I was reading, I
think the particular pre it's almost have like a bladder,
says something. And originally my thought is, you know, something
in there got twisted and it wasn't giving me the
full capacity. But yeah, I don't know. It seemed to
be a nuisance. I didn't know if that's something where
(06:22):
it's possibly be connected or not.
Speaker 1 (06:24):
Well, it could be. It could be related to the
bladder in terms of the tank too, and it could
be a problem in the tank. But starting with disconnecting
the vent will at least give you a direction. I
know it's I know it's not always easy.
Speaker 3 (06:38):
I never they don't make it easy with you.
Speaker 1 (06:41):
No, I never said it was going to be easy.
I just you know, I can just give you the
you know, here's where you start kind of a thing,
you know, absolutely so.
Speaker 3 (06:49):
All right, I appreciate the target to shootout at least,
and I can kind of work from there.
Speaker 1 (06:53):
You're welcome, sir, you'd be well and let us know
how it makes up. All right, all right, thank you,
You're very welcome. Bye, buye. Yeah, listen, I never promised
anybody a rose garden here. I just this is what
it takes sometimes. Listen I go through it. You know,
there's a lot of things I'll run into on the
job that you know, I don't want to do, or
I have to do, or makes the job harder.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
You know.
Speaker 1 (07:14):
We see cars like this all the time in the shop.
We had an eight Honda a Cord this week that
was four months overdue. Four months now. We hadn't seen it.
We've extended the royal change interval anyway, we haven't seen
the car since well, let's see, it was it was
October of last year. Start doing the math, you know,
all of a sudden, it's ten months since the last
(07:36):
time anybody looked at this vehicle. So it came in
because it, you know, had a tire pressure warning light on.
It was two months overdue inspection, It needed an oil change,
and it was it was handling funny. The concern was
that the car was skitterish was the word. You'd accelerate
and the around a corner, the car would just kind
of take off and start to pull to the left
or the right, and like something was seriously wrong with it.
(07:58):
There was there was fifteen pounds of air in the
right rear tire, there was seventy five pounds of air
in the left front tire, there was sixty pounds of
air in the right front tire, and there was fifty
pounds of air in the left rear tire. They were
over inflating tires trying to compensate to get the TPMs
light to go out, not realizing what they were doing
(08:18):
was dangerous and making the car unstable.
Speaker 6 (08:21):
You know, we go through it.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
We have to see things that are painful too, you know.
And I explained to the person, look, this car is
now unsafe. They've been doing it so long. The left
front tire actually had cracks in the sidewall. It was
starting to bulge, and the tire, I'm not going to
say it was gonna blow, but I wouldn't want to
be standing near it any length of time, for any
length of time, you know, to be there it just
(08:44):
didn't make you feel good. So I feel for you, Eric,
I know what you're going through. But trust me, order
repair is just it's just, it is what it is.
It's just it's just not easy like that. So we
got them back on track. It was amazing how well
this car rode with four good tires. Oh in the
right front sway bar link was broken. It was missing,
so you know, put an alignment in it. Four tires
(09:04):
or right front sway bar link, and all of a sudden,
this car road like it was on rails again like
an O eight Honda the cord's supposed to. So you know,
I just got to go through the process. Brother, you
just got to go through the process. Eight five five
five six zero nine nine zero zero. The car Doctor's
coming back right after this little gto you need advice
(09:34):
on how to maintain that classic gt O.
Speaker 3 (09:36):
Ron is the guy eight five five five six zero
nine nine zero zero.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
Here's Ron. Hey, let's go over to Paul and Virginia. Paul,
welcome to the Car Doctor, sir, how can I help? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (09:47):
Hello, Ron, Yes, thank you, you're welcome. I've got a
ninety four Step one fifty and I bought it last year.
It wasn't running. I got it running, uh, but the
speedometer and the doometer, and I was told it didn't work,
and it doesn't uh. And I've come to realize that
(10:10):
the fuse in the block under the hood.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
Fuse number there, fuse number eight. But again, okay, all right.
Speaker 2 (10:25):
And Uh, I'll look in there and there's there are
any contact.
Speaker 3 (10:31):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (10:32):
But anyway, it looks like that, Uh, there are a
few modules within the huge block, and that you can
just pop out those individual modules and then they took
care that's true.
Speaker 1 (10:48):
Say that again.
Speaker 2 (10:51):
It looks like there are modules within the huge block.
Speaker 1 (10:57):
It looks like you just pop.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
On that out. I didn't try that because I don't
want to mess something up. Uh, but it looks like
individual modules pop out and then you can get access
to behind to put the contact in or replace that body.
Speaker 1 (11:15):
Well, wait a minute, are we sure we're on the
right fuse number eight? Is there not a fuse block
inside the passenger compartment?
Speaker 3 (11:25):
Oh?
Speaker 2 (11:25):
Yeah, there is, but this is this is the one
on the hood?
Speaker 3 (11:30):
Right?
Speaker 2 (11:31):
Really did right?
Speaker 1 (11:32):
But is the fuse supposed to be there? Where's the fuse?
Where's fuse number eight located? Which fuse block? The one
under the hood or the one in the passenger compartment?
You're sure about that? Wow?
Speaker 2 (11:46):
Yeah, I'm I actually have to being the truck you
got multiple owners, but it does have the owner's manual
and the the FEUs for the phenometer. All that is
on in one and get that information off the modulates
(12:12):
on the were active.
Speaker 1 (12:14):
Right, there's a speed sensor. There's a speed sensor on
the differential that puts out a signal that provides all that, right. So,
but what I'm asking you is you're positive that because
unless somebody modified this fuse block, I know of no
scenario where the tabs are missing in the fuse block itself.
(12:37):
So I'm questioning. I'm questioning fuse number eight. There there
could be two fuse number eights. And I don't recall
back in the day seeing the large fuse. I know
the fuse you're talking of being the controlling fusee for
the DSS, it was usually a smaller a medium sized
ATC fuze. If I'm not mistaken, a fifteen amp or
(13:00):
right located in the passenger fuse compartment. I've have you
been through the passenger fuse block fuse compartment?
Speaker 2 (13:08):
Okay, we'll check that. You know what, according to the manual,
it's the one under the hood, okay. And and uh
they're indicating.
Speaker 1 (13:22):
Number eight now it is number eight. I remember it
as number eight. I just don't remember it being under
the hood, all right, And if it is, and if
it is the one under the hood, and it's missing.
You're either you're either looking at it wrong, somebody put
in a different fuse block, or somebody's modified the wiring.
And now you got to ask yourself why, because, as
(13:43):
you said, it's been through a couple of owners. Let's
face it, nineteen ninety four was more than a few
days ago.
Speaker 2 (13:51):
Yeah, And I was I was wondering, Ron, if you
know this, it's had multiple owners and born and recall
on these for the cutoff twitch on the massis owner,
and that sort of ninety two grew ninety seven, I
(14:13):
believe right. And the point on the massis owner, the
cut off with the grease control, they would have a
preventive to catch fire. So I thought somety might picking
the keys out just to take care of that problem
is not actually picking the problem.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
Does this truck run? Paul? Does this truck run? Can
you drive this truck?
Speaker 3 (14:39):
Oh?
Speaker 2 (14:40):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (14:40):
How does it? Automatic? Transmissioner?
Speaker 6 (14:42):
Stick?
Speaker 1 (14:44):
No, it's a stick, that's why. Well, that's why because
if this was an automatic and that fuses missing, blown broken,
if the spinometer doesn't work on the automatic version of
this truck, the trans shifts herds and it's said a
P zero four fifty two flashing over drive fault. Is
this a V eight five liter?
Speaker 2 (15:06):
So it's a it's a four point Okay, that's another
reason why I bought it, Right.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
I would look hard. I would look hard at that.
Think of it like this. Let's go with your let's
go with your theory.
Speaker 6 (15:22):
All right.
Speaker 1 (15:23):
You know somebody pulled out fuse number eight to keep
the truck from burning, right, Well, why would they? Why
would they take the contacts out? Why would they make
extra work for themselves?
Speaker 2 (15:35):
Yeah, let's unless the contact came out with the pews.
Speaker 1 (15:39):
No, then you should be able to lift the powder. Yeah,
they could, But you should be able to lift the
power distribution center and see two broken wires underneath. It's
easy enough to do.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
Yeah, it's just I said. It kind of looked to
me like the way that he'signed is that there are modules,
A couple of them are even red the black, and
then the fuse is going to the model.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
Oh I would I would one out. Then, well, you're
gonna end up taking You're gonna end up taking the
power distribution center apart anyway, because now you've got to
find out are there broken wires down there? But before
I did that I would go look in the passenger compartment,
is there refuse? Number eight? I would go look up
(16:32):
fuse ID for the one for the passenger compartment and say, hey,
is there a fuse in here? The controls, the A
B s, the DSS, the sphenometer cluster and so on.
And if you find out that's huge. Number eight, guess
what the owner's manual is wrong or the shop manual
is wrong. It's happened before.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
Yeah, uh yeah, I've seen plenty of times where things
are printed.
Speaker 1 (16:53):
Yeah, so you know, you know, Paul, I got to
tell you anytime I run into the ridiculous US or
something that makes me scratch my head, or a scenario
where I'm missing wires, connectors, et cetera. And if I
have to sit there and come up with a theory
that says somewhere over the last thirty five years one
of the owners pulled the fuse out and the two
(17:14):
broken tabs came out with it, that's an extreme theory.
I'd start looking further just to be sure, just to
be sure.
Speaker 2 (17:22):
And I know Tom flying spaces because it doesn't have
a certain equipment bog lambs.
Speaker 1 (17:30):
So sure, right, absolutely, absolutely, absolutely, But like I said,
before we go too far, before we get too deep
into this, and we passed the point of uh oh oh,
it was no fun. Let's uh, let's attack it from
Let's go look at the passenger side confusement, passenger side
fuse block and see if there's a fuse number eight
(17:50):
in there, and be certain of what we're looking at.
And if that doesn't pan out, before I pulled that
fuse block apart, I would go reference a different source
of information other than that shot manual to be sure
you're ideing the correct number eight fuse.
Speaker 3 (18:06):
All right?
Speaker 1 (18:06):
If you need more, shoot me an email Ron at
cardoctorshow dot com. Hey, coming up next, Drew Conklin from Gates.
Let's talk all about it. I'm running ding in the
car Doctor will be back right after this. Welcome back, listeners.
(18:36):
Run on Ani in the car doctor. You know we
always talk about belts and hoses and how things have
changed and evolved over the years. It used to be
that you could look at a belt and decide whether
it was good or bad by its appearance. Is it cracking?
Is it starting to fail? Is it turning color? But
that's not the key to look at anymore. It's it's
(18:56):
there's more to it, and there's a lot more to it.
EPDM rubber is around and it's been around about Oh,
I'm going to guess and say twelve years, now, fifteen years,
and you check that belt differently than you do the
old style belt and hose as well. That's a whole
other animal altogether. Well, we've reached out to an industry expert.
He's Drew Conkling. He's the director of Global Product line
Management for the folks over at Gates Gates Rubber, and
(19:20):
he's here with us today to talk about Drew. Welcome
to the Car Doctor, sir, Happy to be happy to
have you.
Speaker 5 (19:24):
Hey, Thanks Ron, good morning and happy to be here.
Speaker 1 (19:26):
Thank you. Talk about you know, belts and hoses sure
have changed in just twenty years, in just ten years, right,
we don't check belts and hoses the same way anymore,
do we.
Speaker 5 (19:39):
No, that's a spot on on and you're exactly right.
The big change was with the transition from kind of
a neoprene rubber and actual real rubber material over to
what we call EPDM, which is a synthetic rubber material,
and that happened almost two decades ago now to your
point earlier. And so with the belt side of it, yeah,
(20:00):
the you know long gone or the days of the
belts cracking, the belts chunking out, you just being able
to look at it and saying, oh, yeah, this this
belt is worn out. It's actually much more like a tire.
Speaker 3 (20:11):
Now.
Speaker 5 (20:11):
What happens is that actually loses material along the rib surface,
and that material loss happens over time, and eventually, once
that material is gone, that's when the belt starts to fail,
make noise on cold startups, you know, tight turns in
parking lots, et cetera, et cetera. And so now you
actually have to measure that material loss with what we
call a beltwear gauge. And then on the hose side
(20:34):
of things, we've seen the same transition around the materials,
going from neoprene rubber over to EPDM rubber and then
more recently, you know, if you pop the hood. Obviously
everyone knows car engines are getting a lot more complex,
and so the big shift we've seen there is away
from what we call like simple curved hoses. You know,
think of an upper radiator hose on a sixty eight
(20:55):
four Mustang for example, pretty simple curved hose maybe had
an s shape to it. Now we get these really
complex what we call branched or modular designs, where they've
got the quick connect connectors, they've got t's, they've got
four or five different hoses branching off of that actually
main arm. And so there's been quite the evolution and
(21:16):
certainly a lot of technological advancements over the years here
specifically most recently.
Speaker 1 (21:21):
Yeah, the hoses just you know it is it used
to be that it was as simple, here's a hose.
Now it's here's a hose assembly. It's got like an
octopus thing going on. It used to be too. You're
out there and you're trying to service your vehicle and
do belts and hoses a lot of little hoses now
you know, heater hoses and elbows and twists and turns.
(21:44):
There's a solution though. Right Gates has something on their
website that allows us to look them up by size.
I think that I read it somewhere.
Speaker 5 (21:52):
You absolutely did, And yeah, it's making it harder than
ever to kind of identify some of those hoses just
due to the sheer number that can be on a
vehicle these days. So we've kind of implemented two ways
to try and help people find the right hoses for
their vehicle. Of course, the easiest way is still doing
an application. Look up right, here's my year make model engine.
(22:12):
But if for whatever reason they don't have that, the
car has been modified, it's been changed, whatever it may be,
we have kind of two solutions to help try and
identify a close copy, if you will, And so the
first one would be going on our website Gates dot com,
and we actually create a digital version of what we
call a molded hose ID guide and that basically lifts
(22:33):
every single hose that we have. It gives the dimensions
and it also gives a picture of it. And that's
just the PDF that you can download. But then also
on our catalog website, which is navigates dot gates dot com,
we actually implemented a dimensional search feature so you can
input a range of inner diameters on the hoses ID one,
(22:55):
ID two, set a range for each of them, set
a range around the overall link to the hose, and
it'll actually bring you back a list of results of
all of our hoses with pictures as well as the
attributes of anything that falls within those ranges. So trying
to make it as easy as possible on people out there,
because there are more hoses than ever on vehicles today.
Speaker 1 (23:16):
Kates has been around one hundred years Drew. You guys
actually invented the v ribbed belt way back when you know,
from a repair perspective, you know, we know parts of
change and things have evolved, but you know now it's
not just change the belt. There's other components that go
with that, right. Can you touch on that a little
bit for the listeners.
Speaker 5 (23:37):
Absolutely?
Speaker 3 (23:37):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (23:37):
So the kind of biggest change there over the last
you know, fifty years or so is obviously the implementation
of a belt drive tensioner.
Speaker 3 (23:45):
Right.
Speaker 5 (23:45):
No longer are are we just using the alternator, the
power steering pump, whatever component it may be, as a
fixed unit to kind of set the tension on the belt.
Now you actually have this automatic belt drive tensioner that
does it for it. And when you look at those
from the outset, it's just kind of a forged case
with a pulley on the end of it and it
rotates back and forth. So a lot of people don't
(24:08):
think that those are actually were components, but there are
actually a lot of moving components inside of the tensioners
that do wear, and so as a result, Yeah, basically,
anytime that you want to touch that system, take the
belt off to do whatever sort of work, whether it's
replaced the belt or replace something behind the belt, We
really recommend servicing the entire system, replacing the entire system
(24:29):
really to restore that system back to the OEM quality.
And so that's really replacing the belt, the tension or
the pulley and any other associated components with it.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
Because it is system repair, it is component repair. We
had a Toyota Tacoma Tundra in the shop the other
week and it needed a belt, but you could see
all the pulleys were weathered. The truck had one hundred
and sixty eight thousand miles on it. Why wouldn't you
change the idler pulleys, Why wouldn't you change the tensioner pulley,
Because they're only going to beat up the new belt
and at that point you're just going to put a
belt on again in every short period of time. So
(25:02):
system repair was clearly the way to go, without a doubt.
Now that applies to timing belts too, correct drew if
for those of you, for those the listeners out there
that might have a timing belt vehicle. When you do
a timing belt, it's not just a belt.
Speaker 5 (25:14):
There's more to it also, right, absolutely, right, Ron, And
it's a very similar message and even more obviously catastrophic
with the timing belt. Right If if your serpentine belt
breaks or snaps or one of those components fails, it's bad.
It's putting you on the side of the road. The
battery's not going to charge, you're going to lose power, steering,
water pump may stop pumping coolant. But of course with
(25:35):
the timing belt, then you're talking about ben valves and
you know, destroying engines, catastrophic engine damage. So it's absolutely
just as critical, if not maybe even a little more
critical when it comes to the timing system to replace
that tension or replace the pulleys, replace the water pump.
If it's timing belt driven. The last thing you want
to do, to your point is do a repair and
then that vehicle breaks down, you know, twenty one hundred
(25:58):
miles later because you replace one of the other components
in that.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
System, right, and you're stuck on the side of the road. Hey, Drew,
sit tight, We're gonna pull over and take a pause.
When we come back, I want to talk a little
bit about well, the engineering that goes into making products
such as belts and hoses. Intentioners today. So if you
have the time, take a seat and I'm running any
of the car doctor, I'll be back right after this.
Don't go away, trans and we're back. We're here with
(26:30):
Drew Conklin. Those Gates Gates products, Gates, belts and hoses, Gates, Rober.
I guess the list would go on, right, Drew, It's
not just belts and hoses. When it comes to Gates's
it would be a long title. We took when we
pulled over and took you know, took the pause. We're
talking about engineering. You know, this stuff doesn't fall out
of the tree. How does a company like Gates come
(26:52):
to engineer what you've created and brought to the market.
Speaker 5 (26:56):
Yeah, no, it's a great question, Robbie. You know, it
really all kind of starts with our with our DNA.
I mean, innovation is at the heart of everything the
Gates does, material science. We have a whole army of
engineers behind us making all these great products, and it
really starts with the relationships that we have with the OEMs.
You know, we're working with almost every single one of
them designing their next generation of platforms products, and so
(27:19):
that really feeds into everything that we do on the
aftermarket side, also all of the technology and innovative materials
as well as advancements that we put into our aftermarket products.
Speaker 1 (27:32):
You know, years ago, real quick, do you still make
the garden hoses?
Speaker 3 (27:39):
We do? We do?
Speaker 1 (27:40):
You know, you guys, you guys make the best garden hoses.
I remember thirty five, it's got to be forty years
ago when I was working at the Odol part store
as a kid, and you know, Gates, the gates salesman
came in and show these sys and these will last
a lifetime. I still have my gates hoses from the
late seventies, you know, and they do last a lifetime.
There may well, they hold up well, you leave them
(28:01):
out in the winter, they don't correct, they don't fail.
It's amazing. You know you still make those garden hoses.
Speaker 5 (28:08):
Yeah, no, we do. Yeah, that's the funny story. You know,
oftentimes with products these days, lifetime means different things to
different people. But that is definitely a great example of
a truly lifetime product. We still make them today. We've
of course made some advancements on them. We make them
a little more king free than they ever were before,
but definitely still have the tried and true garden hose
(28:29):
in our portfolio.
Speaker 1 (28:31):
And suffice it to say, if there's a problem out
in the industry, right, and because you guys are OEM
on a lot of manufacturers correct, correct, so if any
one of them has an issue, they're going to come
to you and say, hey, we've got a problem with
this belt. We're noticing this belt failure, or we're noticing
a tension or failure, or we're noticing any one of
(28:52):
a hundred possible problems. They come to you to solve it, right,
And that's a testimony to the prowess of Gates of
what you guys can do.
Speaker 5 (28:59):
Yeah, no, it's definitely a good point. And for sure,
sometimes the OEM design is not as robust in real
life as it is in testing, and so they'll certainly
come back and say, hey, this doesn't work and we're
getting complaints or whatever it may be field issues, and
we'll certainly work with them on providing a solution. We've
been doing it for over one hundred years, as you mentioned,
and we'll keep doing it for hopefully at least another
(29:21):
one hundred more.
Speaker 1 (29:22):
I've planned to be here for another hundred more so
I can continue to use your products. Where can the
listeners get more information, Drew, Go slow, because there's a
couple of websites here, right, Yeah.
Speaker 5 (29:32):
Sure, So the main one would just be Gates dot
com g A T E s dot com, and then
the best one to direct customers to would be Gates
dot com slash protect. That's where we've got most of
our information. And then our cataloging website for anything about
parts for a specific vehicle that is navit Gates N
(29:53):
A v I, G A T E S dot Gate
dot com.
Speaker 1 (29:58):
Cool beans. Drew, thank you and thank you for taking
the time, and thanks for everything you guys do.
Speaker 6 (30:02):
You make.
Speaker 1 (30:02):
You make this this, this tired Hold Mechanics life a
whole lot easier in a lot of ways.
Speaker 5 (30:07):
I'll be love to hear Ron. Thanks for the time.
Speaker 1 (30:09):
You're very welcome, sir. You take good Caraman and any
and the car doctor. We'll be back right after this.
Speaker 6 (30:13):
Don't go away.
Speaker 1 (30:24):
Welcome back, Welcome back, Hey, listen. I want to thank
Drew Conklin for taking the time today. I appreciated, Drew.
We're all busy and uh, you know, good solid information.
Let's do a quick piece of email as we close out. Hey, Ron,
this is from Doug in the Bronx, the Bronx, New York.
The Bronx, the Bronx. You ever noticed it's the Bronx Anyway,
It's never the Bronx. It's the Bronx. So tom Rail
could test to that with that with one hundred percent certainty.
(30:46):
So let's talk about Doug. Doug Rohade and he said, Hey, Ron,
I've got an older Toyota Camry two thousand and five.
I'm interested in two centsor health. I'm more concerned about
changing it. I have no fault codes, but I know
things we're out over time. What do you think about
replacing the two without having a problem? Am I jumping
the gun?
Speaker 2 (31:03):
No?
Speaker 1 (31:03):
You know what, Doug, You're not. And as a matter
of fact, the vehicle is approaching what nineteen years old?
You know you should be aware that. Yeah, sensors do
slow down, things do go bad. As a matter of fact,
I was reading online. If you go out to carmd
dot com right CARMD dot com. They've got a list
what they call their car MD twenty twenty three Vehicle
(31:23):
Health Index, and it shows you things that fail, approximate
age when they fail, and approximate costs to repair. It's
kind of neat, and they make a case for changing
things based on well, you know, general health and it's
it's important. Now you need a scan tool to check
on some of these things. You can also visit a
Nova I double n Ova. I was out there looking
at their website as well, a Nova dot com and
(31:46):
they've got a great assortment of scan tools and you'll
find the one that's right for you. Between a Nova
and CARMD. Some good solid information, Doug, and for everybody else.
But yeah, I think looking at O two sensor activity,
looking at O two sensor longevity, you know, one of
the things that you have to be concerned about is
letting things to me an O two censor, an oxygen sensor,
or an air fuel sensor. You know, they become maintenance
(32:07):
items after a certain amount of time. You don't tell
me how many miles are on this car, Doug, but
I'm assuming you know it's hired. It's probably in the
one fifty to two hudred thousand mile range. It's an
older Camry. You know, we'll actually come out of the
out of the component, will come out of the exhaust manifold,
will look come out of the exhaust pipe. And you know,
we always get into that too. We always have that conversation,
so sometimes being preemptive listen, you know, and I looked
(32:28):
at this right on car MD's website, they point out
that the average O two censor replacement is about two
hundred and fifty bucks, and I agree with that, right,
it's typically an hour's labor, maybe forty five minutes labor
plus the part. And you know, when you compare maintenance
such as a critical sensor such as an oxygen sensor
replacement versus replacing the car, you know, I read an
(32:51):
article research. Kathy sent us a story the other day
that the average used car in America today is Tom,
you want to jump in here, Tom, what do you
think the app average? What would you pay for? What
do you think the average used car is nowadays? Cost
was I was watching the news the other day and
they said it was around forty eight thousand, five hundred.
Well that's new I'm talking used. Oh, used used I'm
(33:13):
going to say about twenty eight or thirty. Well, you
can actually buy a They say the entry level for
a used car. Entry level is twenty grand. Twenty grand.
That's crazy, you know. I remember when you know, you
buy a three hundred dollars car and you drive it
for two years and sell it for three hundred dollars
and go on to the next three hundred dollars car.
I'm kidding, yeah, jeez, yeah, So twenty grand. So you
(33:37):
stuff to think now that twenty thousand dollars car probably
needs an oxygen sensor, okay, and it needs a bunch
of maintenance and a bunch of repairs. So it's more
difficult to buy a car now, I think than ever
before in terms of cost. It's tough to afford. So
you know what doug for you and everybody else out there,
Get out the car md dot com, read all about their
(33:57):
vehicle health index, get out to a nova, buy yourself
a skin to start fixing and repairing cars, because that's
what you want to do. You want to keep that
car going longer. It really is an important piece of
the puzzle. I can't recommend it enough. I want to
talk to you real quick about this twenty seventeen GM Acadia.
I'm going to close the show with this today. I've
been trying to talk about this all day. Today. We
(34:19):
had a twenty seventeen Akadia that came in had been
twenty thousand miles since we'd last seen the car. A
lot of happened in that twenty thousand miles in one year.
One of the things that happened was that developed a
stutter that it would just violently go into this misfire
and shake. But when you drove around with it and
you had your scan tool hooked up, you were looking
at a completely different car. It was like you were
(34:41):
driving one car and looking at scanned ata from another.
Looked at the transmission there were no faults. Look at
transmission operation, no issues. Looked at the engine operation. All
the vitals were there. Turns out, and had bad fuel
in it. So sometimes having a scan tool will tell
you what you need to know that sometimes you need
to go look elsewhere, because it's not what's in front
(35:02):
of you, it's what's around you. I'm not an ady
in the car doctor, reminding you till the next time.
Good mechanics aren't expensive. They're priceless, See you
Ron An Inian, How old are you? Good?
Speaker 2 (00:02):
Waite sixty nine?
Speaker 3 (00:04):
I'm sixty seven.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
At this point in the game, can you afford a
twenty hell cat? Go buy it, brother, and just enjoy it.
Rolling down the road at eight miles Get the Car Doctor.
Did you ever watch the Tonight Show as a kid? Boys, Well,
then again, you were probably old enough to step and
watch it because you're old, that's true. Listen to be
selling apple dog food next. Remember that.
Speaker 4 (00:21):
Welcome to the radio home of ron An Aian, The
Car Doctor. Since nineteen ninety one. This is where car
owners the world overturned to for their definitive opinion on
automotive repair. If your mechanics giving you a busy signal,
pick up.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
The phone and call in. The garage doors are open,
but I am here to take your calls at eight
five five five six ninety nine hundred and now pee.
Speaker 4 (00:47):
Running.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
Wow, not a lot of time and a whole lot
to do in it. We've got to get going. We've
got an interview down the bottom of the hour Drew
Conklin from gate to stopping. Buy the phones are lit up.
We got a lot of calls to take, so let's
get started and go to Eric in Virginia, OH seven
Toyota Prius and some engine miss fire falls.
Speaker 5 (01:03):
Eric.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
Welcome to the car doctor, sir, how can I help?
Speaker 3 (01:06):
Hey? Thanks for having me. Yeah, card has been racking
a little rough obviously low speed load. Disle started to
shake a little bit full codes I was getting I
think it was the P three hundred. I wasn't all
those P three hundred, which is multiple, and then I
think was hitting in one three and four. Changed out
the plugs and coils on it, and I didn't seem
(01:28):
to help anything on it, even though I think one
of the misfires switched the last time I ran the
skiing on it.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
Okay, So if we were diagnosing this from the from
the start, you know, one of the things we would
do is we'd we'd we'd move coils around or plugs
around and so forth. But you've kind of passed that step,
right because you did plugs and coils, and we'll assume
everything you did is right and you know, no slight,
just just you know, being being certain. So what else
(01:56):
can what else can cause a misfire?
Speaker 2 (01:58):
You know?
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Is it mechanical? Yeah, it's possible, you know, mechanical out
of a Prius. They're pretty rock solid. You know, do
you have a scan tool? Can you look at fuel trim?
You know, what do you see in fuel trim? Does
fuel trim look correct or close? Is it excessive one
way or the other? Just for conversation's sake, I haven't.
Speaker 3 (02:18):
Hooked one up to it. I mean it's possible. I
mean that was kind of my next idea, is uh
fuel injectors, Well it wasn't getting enough fuel?
Speaker 1 (02:27):
Yeah, it's it's or is it? Is it?
Speaker 5 (02:29):
You know?
Speaker 1 (02:30):
Is it a case of are we seeing a mechanical
fault which will be indicated by a fuel condition, by
a lean or rich fuel condition and complete combustion, that
sort of thing. I'll tell you what's not uncommon with
a lot of the Priuses. As they get older, they
get a lot of miles on them. How many miles
are on this car? One hundred and fifty two hundred?
How much?
Speaker 3 (02:48):
Yeah? Thirty two yeah, thirty two thousand.
Speaker 1 (02:50):
I would do a fuel system cleaning, and I don't
mean I would, I mean a tank additive, but I
also mean hooking up you know. I would go out
to the Berriman website Berryman Products dot com read up
about their fuel system cleaners. They've got a four step
kit works really well. We use it in the shop
all the time, and what it'll do is it'll clean
the rail and it'll also decarbonize the inside of the engine.
But before I did that, I would look at fuel
(03:13):
trim before and then look at fuel trim after, and
you'll if you if you see an improvement, you may
not see it fixed, but you may see a change
in fuel trim where it's more consistent or closer to zero,
and that that tells you you're going in the right direction,
you know, rather than just let's just do a fuel
system cleaning and not test anything. So what sort of
(03:35):
what's what sort of skin tool do you have?
Speaker 5 (03:38):
Eric?
Speaker 3 (03:40):
And honestly, I'm not sure the brand. It's pretty generic.
It just runs I mainly for the OBD two code specifically,
and I just kind of research from there.
Speaker 1 (03:47):
Can you if you can see if you can just
bring up fuel trim PIDs by themselves? All right? The
reason I say that is because you know, like like
a computer, like your phone, right you've got you know,
you ever have it with your phone when you've got
seven eight apps opening, you see the phone slow down? Well,
the scan tool does the same thing. So the less
(04:07):
PIDs are, the less pieces of data that you have
up on the screen. The faster that tool is, the
more responsive it is. So if you can just you know,
bring up select PIDs. I usually bring up engine speed, temperature,
cool INTEMP and you know long term, short term fuel trim.
There's a four cylinder, so you know you can have
four PIDs up there. You want to put up mass airflow,
(04:30):
look at calculated load. Sure, go ahead, you know, just
to get an idea. But the idea is then at
least you know you're fairly accurate. You're not, You're not.
The computer's not slowing down in terms of how it's reporting.
But I would do that graph it or or just
you know, take a screenshot of it. And then after
you do the fuel system cleaning, do the same thing again.
Do you see any improvement in the way the vehicle
(04:51):
runs into you see any improvement in fuel trim? So
at least you know if you're going in the right direction.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
All right. I do have one kind of stucond there.
Everything I had just kind of more curious about. Sure
at an issue I've been having for honestly the last
few years, it seems to be more of a nuisance
than others. But as far as my gap think, in
particular in the summertime, I always have trouble getting fuel
in it. I mean there's days where I could barely
even put a gallon in it without like really playing
(05:17):
with it. But then usually when it gets a little
bit cooler out, you know, I can put you know,
pretty close to the full mount still not giving me
the full capacity, but I can get up to like
eleven or twelve eleven or twelve gallons and then go
from there. Any idea of anything, but that would be well.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
I think you've probably got an issue with the vent.
Uh Do you know what I mean when I say
the vent valve or right? Yep, I would I would
go down when you're having that particular problem and disconnect
the vent at the canister to see, you know, do
we have do we have excess pressure? Are we able
(05:55):
to as the vent stuck open, as the event stuck closed?
Do we have a spider web in there? You know?
Speaker 3 (06:01):
It's such a pain to get you because that's my thought.
But the weird part is, it's just it seems like
it's seasonal. It's always in the summertime, I have problems,
and I at least from what I was reading, I
think the particular pre it's almost have like a bladder,
says something. And originally my thought is, you know, something
in there got twisted and it wasn't giving me the
full capacity. But yeah, I don't know. It seemed to
be a nuisance. I didn't know if that's something where
(06:22):
it's possibly be connected or not.
Speaker 1 (06:24):
Well, it could be. It could be related to the
bladder in terms of the tank too, and it could
be a problem in the tank. But starting with disconnecting
the vent will at least give you a direction. I
know it's I know it's not always easy.
Speaker 3 (06:38):
I never they don't make it easy with you.
Speaker 1 (06:41):
No, I never said it was going to be easy.
I just you know, I can just give you the
you know, here's where you start kind of a thing,
you know, absolutely so.
Speaker 3 (06:49):
All right, I appreciate the target to shootout at least,
and I can kind of work from there.
Speaker 1 (06:53):
You're welcome, sir, you'd be well and let us know
how it makes up. All right, all right, thank you,
You're very welcome. Bye, buye. Yeah, listen, I never promised
anybody a rose garden here. I just this is what
it takes sometimes. Listen I go through it. You know,
there's a lot of things I'll run into on the
job that you know, I don't want to do, or
I have to do, or makes the job harder.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
You know.
Speaker 1 (07:14):
We see cars like this all the time in the shop.
We had an eight Honda a Cord this week that
was four months overdue. Four months now. We hadn't seen it.
We've extended the royal change interval anyway, we haven't seen
the car since well, let's see, it was it was
October of last year. Start doing the math, you know,
all of a sudden, it's ten months since the last
(07:36):
time anybody looked at this vehicle. So it came in
because it, you know, had a tire pressure warning light on.
It was two months overdue inspection, It needed an oil change,
and it was it was handling funny. The concern was
that the car was skitterish was the word. You'd accelerate
and the around a corner, the car would just kind
of take off and start to pull to the left
or the right, and like something was seriously wrong with it.
(07:58):
There was there was fifteen pounds of air in the
right rear tire, there was seventy five pounds of air
in the left front tire, there was sixty pounds of
air in the right front tire, and there was fifty
pounds of air in the left rear tire. They were
over inflating tires trying to compensate to get the TPMs
light to go out, not realizing what they were doing
(08:18):
was dangerous and making the car unstable.
Speaker 6 (08:21):
You know, we go through it.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
We have to see things that are painful too, you know.
And I explained to the person, look, this car is
now unsafe. They've been doing it so long. The left
front tire actually had cracks in the sidewall. It was
starting to bulge, and the tire, I'm not going to
say it was gonna blow, but I wouldn't want to
be standing near it any length of time, for any
length of time, you know, to be there it just
(08:44):
didn't make you feel good. So I feel for you, Eric,
I know what you're going through. But trust me, order
repair is just it's just, it is what it is.
It's just it's just not easy like that. So we
got them back on track. It was amazing how well
this car rode with four good tires. Oh in the
right front sway bar link was broken. It was missing,
so you know, put an alignment in it. Four tires
(09:04):
or right front sway bar link, and all of a sudden,
this car road like it was on rails again like
an O eight Honda the cord's supposed to. So you know,
I just got to go through the process. Brother, you
just got to go through the process. Eight five five
five six zero nine nine zero zero. The car Doctor's
coming back right after this little gto you need advice
(09:34):
on how to maintain that classic gt O.
Speaker 3 (09:36):
Ron is the guy eight five five five six zero
nine nine zero zero.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
Here's Ron. Hey, let's go over to Paul and Virginia. Paul,
welcome to the Car Doctor, sir, how can I help? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (09:47):
Hello, Ron, Yes, thank you, you're welcome. I've got a
ninety four Step one fifty and I bought it last year.
It wasn't running. I got it running, uh, but the
speedometer and the doometer, and I was told it didn't work,
and it doesn't uh. And I've come to realize that
(10:10):
the fuse in the block under the hood.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
Fuse number there, fuse number eight. But again, okay, all right.
Speaker 2 (10:25):
And Uh, I'll look in there and there's there are
any contact.
Speaker 3 (10:31):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (10:32):
But anyway, it looks like that, Uh, there are a
few modules within the huge block, and that you can
just pop out those individual modules and then they took
care that's true.
Speaker 1 (10:48):
Say that again.
Speaker 2 (10:51):
It looks like there are modules within the huge block.
Speaker 1 (10:57):
It looks like you just pop.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
On that out. I didn't try that because I don't
want to mess something up. Uh, but it looks like
individual modules pop out and then you can get access
to behind to put the contact in or replace that body.
Speaker 1 (11:15):
Well, wait a minute, are we sure we're on the
right fuse number eight? Is there not a fuse block
inside the passenger compartment?
Speaker 3 (11:25):
Oh?
Speaker 2 (11:25):
Yeah, there is, but this is this is the one
on the hood?
Speaker 3 (11:30):
Right?
Speaker 2 (11:31):
Really did right?
Speaker 1 (11:32):
But is the fuse supposed to be there? Where's the fuse?
Where's fuse number eight located? Which fuse block? The one
under the hood or the one in the passenger compartment?
You're sure about that? Wow?
Speaker 2 (11:46):
Yeah, I'm I actually have to being the truck you
got multiple owners, but it does have the owner's manual
and the the FEUs for the phenometer. All that is
on in one and get that information off the modulates
(12:12):
on the were active.
Speaker 1 (12:14):
Right, there's a speed sensor. There's a speed sensor on
the differential that puts out a signal that provides all that, right. So,
but what I'm asking you is you're positive that because
unless somebody modified this fuse block, I know of no
scenario where the tabs are missing in the fuse block itself.
(12:37):
So I'm questioning. I'm questioning fuse number eight. There there
could be two fuse number eights. And I don't recall
back in the day seeing the large fuse. I know
the fuse you're talking of being the controlling fusee for
the DSS, it was usually a smaller a medium sized
ATC fuze. If I'm not mistaken, a fifteen amp or
(13:00):
right located in the passenger fuse compartment. I've have you
been through the passenger fuse block fuse compartment?
Speaker 2 (13:08):
Okay, we'll check that. You know what, according to the manual,
it's the one under the hood, okay. And and uh
they're indicating.
Speaker 1 (13:22):
Number eight now it is number eight. I remember it
as number eight. I just don't remember it being under
the hood, all right, And if it is, and if
it is the one under the hood, and it's missing.
You're either you're either looking at it wrong, somebody put
in a different fuse block, or somebody's modified the wiring.
And now you got to ask yourself why, because, as
(13:43):
you said, it's been through a couple of owners. Let's
face it, nineteen ninety four was more than a few
days ago.
Speaker 2 (13:51):
Yeah, And I was I was wondering, Ron, if you
know this, it's had multiple owners and born and recall
on these for the cutoff twitch on the massis owner,
and that sort of ninety two grew ninety seven, I
(14:13):
believe right. And the point on the massis owner, the
cut off with the grease control, they would have a
preventive to catch fire. So I thought somety might picking
the keys out just to take care of that problem
is not actually picking the problem.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
Does this truck run? Paul? Does this truck run? Can
you drive this truck?
Speaker 3 (14:39):
Oh?
Speaker 2 (14:40):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (14:40):
How does it? Automatic? Transmissioner?
Speaker 6 (14:42):
Stick?
Speaker 1 (14:44):
No, it's a stick, that's why. Well, that's why because
if this was an automatic and that fuses missing, blown broken,
if the spinometer doesn't work on the automatic version of
this truck, the trans shifts herds and it's said a
P zero four fifty two flashing over drive fault. Is
this a V eight five liter?
Speaker 2 (15:06):
So it's a it's a four point Okay, that's another
reason why I bought it, Right.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
I would look hard. I would look hard at that.
Think of it like this. Let's go with your let's
go with your theory.
Speaker 6 (15:22):
All right.
Speaker 1 (15:23):
You know somebody pulled out fuse number eight to keep
the truck from burning, right, Well, why would they? Why
would they take the contacts out? Why would they make
extra work for themselves?
Speaker 2 (15:35):
Yeah, let's unless the contact came out with the pews.
Speaker 1 (15:39):
No, then you should be able to lift the powder. Yeah,
they could, But you should be able to lift the
power distribution center and see two broken wires underneath. It's
easy enough to do.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
Yeah, it's just I said. It kind of looked to
me like the way that he'signed is that there are modules,
A couple of them are even red the black, and
then the fuse is going to the model.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
Oh I would I would one out. Then, well, you're
gonna end up taking You're gonna end up taking the
power distribution center apart anyway, because now you've got to
find out are there broken wires down there? But before
I did that I would go look in the passenger compartment,
is there refuse? Number eight? I would go look up
(16:32):
fuse ID for the one for the passenger compartment and say, hey,
is there a fuse in here? The controls, the A
B s, the DSS, the sphenometer cluster and so on.
And if you find out that's huge. Number eight, guess
what the owner's manual is wrong or the shop manual
is wrong. It's happened before.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
Yeah, uh yeah, I've seen plenty of times where things
are printed.
Speaker 1 (16:53):
Yeah, so you know, you know, Paul, I got to
tell you anytime I run into the ridiculous US or
something that makes me scratch my head, or a scenario
where I'm missing wires, connectors, et cetera. And if I
have to sit there and come up with a theory
that says somewhere over the last thirty five years one
of the owners pulled the fuse out and the two
(17:14):
broken tabs came out with it, that's an extreme theory.
I'd start looking further just to be sure, just to
be sure.
Speaker 2 (17:22):
And I know Tom flying spaces because it doesn't have
a certain equipment bog lambs.
Speaker 1 (17:30):
So sure, right, absolutely, absolutely, absolutely, But like I said,
before we go too far, before we get too deep
into this, and we passed the point of uh oh oh,
it was no fun. Let's uh, let's attack it from
Let's go look at the passenger side confusement, passenger side
fuse block and see if there's a fuse number eight
(17:50):
in there, and be certain of what we're looking at.
And if that doesn't pan out, before I pulled that
fuse block apart, I would go reference a different source
of information other than that shot manual to be sure
you're ideing the correct number eight fuse.
Speaker 3 (18:06):
All right?
Speaker 1 (18:06):
If you need more, shoot me an email Ron at
cardoctorshow dot com. Hey, coming up next, Drew Conklin from Gates.
Let's talk all about it. I'm running ding in the
car Doctor will be back right after this. Welcome back, listeners.
(18:36):
Run on Ani in the car doctor. You know we
always talk about belts and hoses and how things have
changed and evolved over the years. It used to be
that you could look at a belt and decide whether
it was good or bad by its appearance. Is it cracking?
Is it starting to fail? Is it turning color? But
that's not the key to look at anymore. It's it's
(18:56):
there's more to it, and there's a lot more to it.
EPDM rubber is around and it's been around about Oh,
I'm going to guess and say twelve years, now, fifteen years,
and you check that belt differently than you do the
old style belt and hose as well. That's a whole
other animal altogether. Well, we've reached out to an industry expert.
He's Drew Conkling. He's the director of Global Product line
Management for the folks over at Gates Gates Rubber, and
(19:20):
he's here with us today to talk about Drew. Welcome
to the Car Doctor, sir, Happy to be happy to
have you.
Speaker 5 (19:24):
Hey, Thanks Ron, good morning and happy to be here.
Speaker 1 (19:26):
Thank you. Talk about you know, belts and hoses sure
have changed in just twenty years, in just ten years, right,
we don't check belts and hoses the same way anymore,
do we.
Speaker 5 (19:39):
No, that's a spot on on and you're exactly right.
The big change was with the transition from kind of
a neoprene rubber and actual real rubber material over to
what we call EPDM, which is a synthetic rubber material,
and that happened almost two decades ago now to your
point earlier. And so with the belt side of it, yeah,
(20:00):
the you know long gone or the days of the
belts cracking, the belts chunking out, you just being able
to look at it and saying, oh, yeah, this this
belt is worn out. It's actually much more like a tire.
Speaker 3 (20:11):
Now.
Speaker 5 (20:11):
What happens is that actually loses material along the rib surface,
and that material loss happens over time, and eventually, once
that material is gone, that's when the belt starts to fail,
make noise on cold startups, you know, tight turns in
parking lots, et cetera, et cetera. And so now you
actually have to measure that material loss with what we
call a beltwear gauge. And then on the hose side
(20:34):
of things, we've seen the same transition around the materials,
going from neoprene rubber over to EPDM rubber and then
more recently, you know, if you pop the hood. Obviously
everyone knows car engines are getting a lot more complex,
and so the big shift we've seen there is away
from what we call like simple curved hoses. You know,
think of an upper radiator hose on a sixty eight
(20:55):
four Mustang for example, pretty simple curved hose maybe had
an s shape to it. Now we get these really
complex what we call branched or modular designs, where they've
got the quick connect connectors, they've got t's, they've got
four or five different hoses branching off of that actually
main arm. And so there's been quite the evolution and
(21:16):
certainly a lot of technological advancements over the years here
specifically most recently.
Speaker 1 (21:21):
Yeah, the hoses just you know it is it used
to be that it was as simple, here's a hose.
Now it's here's a hose assembly. It's got like an
octopus thing going on. It used to be too. You're
out there and you're trying to service your vehicle and
do belts and hoses a lot of little hoses now
you know, heater hoses and elbows and twists and turns.
(21:44):
There's a solution though. Right Gates has something on their
website that allows us to look them up by size.
I think that I read it somewhere.
Speaker 5 (21:52):
You absolutely did, And yeah, it's making it harder than
ever to kind of identify some of those hoses just
due to the sheer number that can be on a
vehicle these days. So we've kind of implemented two ways
to try and help people find the right hoses for
their vehicle. Of course, the easiest way is still doing
an application. Look up right, here's my year make model engine.
(22:12):
But if for whatever reason they don't have that, the
car has been modified, it's been changed, whatever it may be,
we have kind of two solutions to help try and
identify a close copy, if you will, And so the
first one would be going on our website Gates dot com,
and we actually create a digital version of what we
call a molded hose ID guide and that basically lifts
(22:33):
every single hose that we have. It gives the dimensions
and it also gives a picture of it. And that's
just the PDF that you can download. But then also
on our catalog website, which is navigates dot gates dot com,
we actually implemented a dimensional search feature so you can
input a range of inner diameters on the hoses ID one,
(22:55):
ID two, set a range for each of them, set
a range around the overall link to the hose, and
it'll actually bring you back a list of results of
all of our hoses with pictures as well as the
attributes of anything that falls within those ranges. So trying
to make it as easy as possible on people out there,
because there are more hoses than ever on vehicles today.
Speaker 1 (23:16):
Kates has been around one hundred years Drew. You guys
actually invented the v ribbed belt way back when you know,
from a repair perspective, you know, we know parts of
change and things have evolved, but you know now it's
not just change the belt. There's other components that go
with that, right. Can you touch on that a little
bit for the listeners.
Speaker 5 (23:37):
Absolutely?
Speaker 3 (23:37):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (23:37):
So the kind of biggest change there over the last
you know, fifty years or so is obviously the implementation
of a belt drive tensioner.
Speaker 3 (23:45):
Right.
Speaker 5 (23:45):
No longer are are we just using the alternator, the
power steering pump, whatever component it may be, as a
fixed unit to kind of set the tension on the belt.
Now you actually have this automatic belt drive tensioner that
does it for it. And when you look at those
from the outset, it's just kind of a forged case
with a pulley on the end of it and it
rotates back and forth. So a lot of people don't
(24:08):
think that those are actually were components, but there are
actually a lot of moving components inside of the tensioners
that do wear, and so as a result, Yeah, basically,
anytime that you want to touch that system, take the
belt off to do whatever sort of work, whether it's
replaced the belt or replace something behind the belt, We
really recommend servicing the entire system, replacing the entire system
(24:29):
really to restore that system back to the OEM quality.
And so that's really replacing the belt, the tension or
the pulley and any other associated components with it.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
Because it is system repair, it is component repair. We
had a Toyota Tacoma Tundra in the shop the other
week and it needed a belt, but you could see
all the pulleys were weathered. The truck had one hundred
and sixty eight thousand miles on it. Why wouldn't you
change the idler pulleys, Why wouldn't you change the tensioner pulley,
Because they're only going to beat up the new belt
and at that point you're just going to put a
belt on again in every short period of time. So
(25:02):
system repair was clearly the way to go, without a doubt.
Now that applies to timing belts too, correct drew if
for those of you, for those the listeners out there
that might have a timing belt vehicle. When you do
a timing belt, it's not just a belt.
Speaker 5 (25:14):
There's more to it also, right, absolutely, right, Ron, And
it's a very similar message and even more obviously catastrophic
with the timing belt. Right If if your serpentine belt
breaks or snaps or one of those components fails, it's bad.
It's putting you on the side of the road. The
battery's not going to charge, you're going to lose power, steering,
water pump may stop pumping coolant. But of course with
(25:35):
the timing belt, then you're talking about ben valves and
you know, destroying engines, catastrophic engine damage. So it's absolutely
just as critical, if not maybe even a little more
critical when it comes to the timing system to replace
that tension or replace the pulleys, replace the water pump.
If it's timing belt driven. The last thing you want
to do, to your point is do a repair and
then that vehicle breaks down, you know, twenty one hundred
(25:58):
miles later because you replace one of the other components
in that.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
System, right, and you're stuck on the side of the road. Hey, Drew,
sit tight, We're gonna pull over and take a pause.
When we come back, I want to talk a little
bit about well, the engineering that goes into making products
such as belts and hoses. Intentioners today. So if you
have the time, take a seat and I'm running any
of the car doctor, I'll be back right after this.
Don't go away, trans and we're back. We're here with
(26:30):
Drew Conklin. Those Gates Gates products, Gates, belts and hoses, Gates, Rober.
I guess the list would go on, right, Drew, It's
not just belts and hoses. When it comes to Gates's
it would be a long title. We took when we
pulled over and took you know, took the pause. We're
talking about engineering. You know, this stuff doesn't fall out
of the tree. How does a company like Gates come
(26:52):
to engineer what you've created and brought to the market.
Speaker 5 (26:56):
Yeah, no, it's a great question, Robbie. You know, it
really all kind of starts with our with our DNA.
I mean, innovation is at the heart of everything the
Gates does, material science. We have a whole army of
engineers behind us making all these great products, and it
really starts with the relationships that we have with the OEMs.
You know, we're working with almost every single one of
them designing their next generation of platforms products, and so
(27:19):
that really feeds into everything that we do on the
aftermarket side, also all of the technology and innovative materials
as well as advancements that we put into our aftermarket products.
Speaker 1 (27:32):
You know, years ago, real quick, do you still make
the garden hoses?
Speaker 3 (27:39):
We do? We do?
Speaker 1 (27:40):
You know, you guys, you guys make the best garden hoses.
I remember thirty five, it's got to be forty years
ago when I was working at the Odol part store
as a kid, and you know, Gates, the gates salesman
came in and show these sys and these will last
a lifetime. I still have my gates hoses from the
late seventies, you know, and they do last a lifetime.
There may well, they hold up well, you leave them
(28:01):
out in the winter, they don't correct, they don't fail.
It's amazing. You know you still make those garden hoses.
Speaker 5 (28:08):
Yeah, no, we do. Yeah, that's the funny story. You know,
oftentimes with products these days, lifetime means different things to
different people. But that is definitely a great example of
a truly lifetime product. We still make them today. We've
of course made some advancements on them. We make them
a little more king free than they ever were before,
but definitely still have the tried and true garden hose
(28:29):
in our portfolio.
Speaker 1 (28:31):
And suffice it to say, if there's a problem out
in the industry, right, and because you guys are OEM
on a lot of manufacturers correct, correct, so if any
one of them has an issue, they're going to come
to you and say, hey, we've got a problem with
this belt. We're noticing this belt failure, or we're noticing
a tension or failure, or we're noticing any one of
(28:52):
a hundred possible problems. They come to you to solve it, right,
And that's a testimony to the prowess of Gates of
what you guys can do.
Speaker 5 (28:59):
Yeah, no, it's definitely a good point. And for sure,
sometimes the OEM design is not as robust in real
life as it is in testing, and so they'll certainly
come back and say, hey, this doesn't work and we're
getting complaints or whatever it may be field issues, and
we'll certainly work with them on providing a solution. We've
been doing it for over one hundred years, as you mentioned,
and we'll keep doing it for hopefully at least another
(29:21):
one hundred more.
Speaker 1 (29:22):
I've planned to be here for another hundred more so
I can continue to use your products. Where can the
listeners get more information, Drew, Go slow, because there's a
couple of websites here, right, Yeah.
Speaker 5 (29:32):
Sure, So the main one would just be Gates dot
com g A T E s dot com, and then
the best one to direct customers to would be Gates
dot com slash protect. That's where we've got most of
our information. And then our cataloging website for anything about
parts for a specific vehicle that is navit Gates N
(29:53):
A v I, G A T E S dot Gate
dot com.
Speaker 1 (29:58):
Cool beans. Drew, thank you and thank you for taking
the time, and thanks for everything you guys do.
Speaker 6 (30:02):
You make.
Speaker 1 (30:02):
You make this this, this tired Hold Mechanics life a
whole lot easier in a lot of ways.
Speaker 5 (30:07):
I'll be love to hear Ron. Thanks for the time.
Speaker 1 (30:09):
You're very welcome, sir. You take good Caraman and any
and the car doctor. We'll be back right after this.
Speaker 6 (30:13):
Don't go away.
Speaker 1 (30:24):
Welcome back, Welcome back, Hey, listen. I want to thank
Drew Conklin for taking the time today. I appreciated, Drew.
We're all busy and uh, you know, good solid information.
Let's do a quick piece of email as we close out. Hey, Ron,
this is from Doug in the Bronx, the Bronx, New York.
The Bronx, the Bronx. You ever noticed it's the Bronx Anyway,
It's never the Bronx. It's the Bronx. So tom Rail
could test to that with that with one hundred percent certainty.
(30:46):
So let's talk about Doug. Doug Rohade and he said, Hey, Ron,
I've got an older Toyota Camry two thousand and five.
I'm interested in two centsor health. I'm more concerned about
changing it. I have no fault codes, but I know
things we're out over time. What do you think about
replacing the two without having a problem? Am I jumping
the gun?
Speaker 2 (31:03):
No?
Speaker 1 (31:03):
You know what, Doug, You're not. And as a matter
of fact, the vehicle is approaching what nineteen years old?
You know you should be aware that. Yeah, sensors do
slow down, things do go bad. As a matter of fact,
I was reading online. If you go out to carmd
dot com right CARMD dot com. They've got a list
what they call their car MD twenty twenty three Vehicle
(31:23):
Health Index, and it shows you things that fail, approximate
age when they fail, and approximate costs to repair. It's
kind of neat, and they make a case for changing
things based on well, you know, general health and it's
it's important. Now you need a scan tool to check
on some of these things. You can also visit a
Nova I double n Ova. I was out there looking
at their website as well, a Nova dot com and
(31:46):
they've got a great assortment of scan tools and you'll
find the one that's right for you. Between a Nova
and CARMD. Some good solid information, Doug, and for everybody else.
But yeah, I think looking at O two sensor activity,
looking at O two sensor longevity, you know, one of
the things that you have to be concerned about is
letting things to me an O two censor, an oxygen sensor,
or an air fuel sensor. You know, they become maintenance
(32:07):
items after a certain amount of time. You don't tell
me how many miles are on this car, Doug, but
I'm assuming you know it's hired. It's probably in the
one fifty to two hudred thousand mile range. It's an
older Camry. You know, we'll actually come out of the
out of the component, will come out of the exhaust manifold,
will look come out of the exhaust pipe. And you know,
we always get into that too. We always have that conversation,
so sometimes being preemptive listen, you know, and I looked
(32:28):
at this right on car MD's website, they point out
that the average O two censor replacement is about two
hundred and fifty bucks, and I agree with that, right,
it's typically an hour's labor, maybe forty five minutes labor
plus the part. And you know, when you compare maintenance
such as a critical sensor such as an oxygen sensor
replacement versus replacing the car, you know, I read an
(32:51):
article research. Kathy sent us a story the other day
that the average used car in America today is Tom,
you want to jump in here, Tom, what do you
think the app average? What would you pay for? What
do you think the average used car is nowadays? Cost
was I was watching the news the other day and
they said it was around forty eight thousand, five hundred.
Well that's new I'm talking used. Oh, used used I'm
(33:13):
going to say about twenty eight or thirty. Well, you
can actually buy a They say the entry level for
a used car. Entry level is twenty grand. Twenty grand.
That's crazy, you know. I remember when you know, you
buy a three hundred dollars car and you drive it
for two years and sell it for three hundred dollars
and go on to the next three hundred dollars car.
I'm kidding, yeah, jeez, yeah, So twenty grand. So you
(33:37):
stuff to think now that twenty thousand dollars car probably
needs an oxygen sensor, okay, and it needs a bunch
of maintenance and a bunch of repairs. So it's more
difficult to buy a car now, I think than ever
before in terms of cost. It's tough to afford. So
you know what doug for you and everybody else out there,
Get out the car md dot com, read all about their
(33:57):
vehicle health index, get out to a nova, buy yourself
a skin to start fixing and repairing cars, because that's
what you want to do. You want to keep that
car going longer. It really is an important piece of
the puzzle. I can't recommend it enough. I want to
talk to you real quick about this twenty seventeen GM Acadia.
I'm going to close the show with this today. I've
been trying to talk about this all day. Today. We
(34:19):
had a twenty seventeen Akadia that came in had been
twenty thousand miles since we'd last seen the car. A
lot of happened in that twenty thousand miles in one year.
One of the things that happened was that developed a
stutter that it would just violently go into this misfire
and shake. But when you drove around with it and
you had your scan tool hooked up, you were looking
at a completely different car. It was like you were
(34:41):
driving one car and looking at scanned ata from another.
Looked at the transmission there were no faults. Look at
transmission operation, no issues. Looked at the engine operation. All
the vitals were there. Turns out, and had bad fuel
in it. So sometimes having a scan tool will tell
you what you need to know that sometimes you need
to go look elsewhere, because it's not what's in front
(35:02):
of you, it's what's around you. I'm not an ady
in the car doctor, reminding you till the next time.
Good mechanics aren't expensive. They're priceless, See you
Host
Ron Ananian
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