INTERVIEW: Chris Gotti Talks Irv, Jay-Z, Ashanti, Fat Joe, Diddy, Hip-Hop Now Vs.Then, 'Clash Pro League' +More

Today on The Breakfast Club, Chris Gotti Talks Irv, Jay-Z, Ashanti, Fat Joe, Diddy, Hip-Hop Now Vs.Then, 'Clash Pro League'. Listen For More!

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
Every day clicks.

Speaker 2 (00:03):
Up the Breakfast Club.

Speaker 3 (00:05):
You're finish for y'all done?

Speaker 4 (00:07):
Good morning, everybody's DJ Envy Jess Hilarious, Charlamagne the God.
We are the Breakfast Club. Lawla Roses here as well.
We got a special guest.

Speaker 1 (00:14):
In the bounty.

Speaker 2 (00:15):
Indeed, Chris Gotty, Man, you're doing everything.

Speaker 3 (00:21):
Man, I'm blessed, you know, just taking it one day
at a time from everything, you know. But everything's going great. Uh,
got a lot of positive stuff happening, and that's why
I'm here.

Speaker 5 (00:32):
You don't mind.

Speaker 4 (00:32):
I want to go back a little bit for people
that you don't know who Chris Gotty is. Of course
IRV Gotty's brother, every Goty's big brother. Yes for Queens
New York kilas have you guys been in the industry
for a while, and you guys, both.

Speaker 5 (00:44):
Of y'all founded murder Inc.

Speaker 4 (00:46):
YEA, most people only hear IRV one thing about murder Ink,
but you were kind of the silent guy behind everything.
So so talk about how murder ink or the ink
was founded.

Speaker 3 (00:56):
It's murdered Ink. We hated that we had to change
that name. That was a rough Simmons and Leo that
and it came to us and being chavised and said
put Murder to bed because we was down with the
Feds and everything. So Murder Inc. Was founded because IRV
wanted to be the biggest producer in the world. I
helped make him that, finding producers and we built out

(01:20):
his production company called Top Dog Productions, and we just
started making hit after hit after hit for multiple artists.
IRV didn't say I'm gonna start Murder Inc. See this
is the misconception of most people don't realize that. They
thought Earth came up, were like, I'm gonna start a
record label. He didn't start a label. He just wanted
to be the biggest producer in the game. And that's
what happened. And because that happened, Tom Matola, Dave nk

(01:44):
Fist and over his Sony said we want to give
you a record deal. They told us they wanted to
buy four beats. At the time were selling beats for
two hundred and fifty thousand tracks. But that's a million dollars.
I'm like, let's go get that. We met up at
Justice the restaurant, you know, did he you know? And
we go to go to Justin's and meet Dave mc
fiston and we talk and he's like, you know, Tommy

(02:06):
wants to give you a deal, not he don't want
to buy beats. And to our surprise, he pulls a
contract out and look at it, or if you looked
at it and you threw it right back at him,
so you serious sent it to our lawyer. So that's
really the bird for Murder Inc. And then we didn't
have a name. We just came up with a bunch
of things. Uh, DJ clues doing the mixtape, job's doing

(02:26):
the feature, and inside of that feature, we had a
bunch of names we had thought of, like Lockdown Records.
He says it in the in the his verses on
the features on the mixtape, and that's kind of where
we was at. And then ARV was watching Arts and
Entertainment one day gangst the Week and he sees Murder Inc.
On the screen and it's the Notorious Murder Inc. Which

(02:49):
was the Italian guys that was actually making hits.

Speaker 5 (02:52):
Yeah, that was doing hits on people in Brooklyn.

Speaker 3 (02:54):
Yeah, it's Luckily Ciano outfred Anastasia and those guys. And
the narrator of that show was like the Notorious murder
Rank and they made hits. I went crazy. He went crazy.
He called everybody. I got the name. But that's why
if when you ask that question, how to just start
and if the co founders, that's the co founder. I

(03:17):
helped make all of the music with them, with all
of the producers, and I just took care of the
business and I took care of my little brother, and
Joe was always the first artist. Another misconception. Joe was
already signed a Murder Death Jam. So his first album
Vineveda Vicci it's on Death Jam. We just get the deal,
but he already signed his deal. Oh wow, Yeah, people
don't know that. So we had to go basically back

(03:38):
to Le York and say that's our artists, and then
we had to pay for it to get him back
to Murder Inc. To pay a couple of million dollars.

Speaker 1 (03:47):
Damn okay. That was after the first album, after.

Speaker 3 (03:52):
And then they took some extra points on his next two,
but a couple million dollars. Look, we had to pay
for a shanty. She was signed the AJ Records, which
is a shout out Mario Bay. Mary was like an
uncle and he has a shanty. He wanted us to
do records for a shanty on his label. We had
a little independent label and uh a shanty. He was

(04:14):
there with him and IRV didn't really think about doing anything.
Would hit me with the tunnel vision like stay focused, Yo,
we get money with John Rohad, I'm like, yo, she
could write she's dope and we'll break that broke that
ice was fat Joe. He called me up because he's
doing a big pun album and he says, I need

(04:35):
that pun. I need an artist to an R and
B artist on the hook. I said I got one.

Speaker 2 (04:42):
He said you do.

Speaker 3 (04:43):
I was like yeah. I called her up. She drove
right to the studio pendit. Joe's like, yo, she's dope.
I said, I tell her and he told IRV and
said what artists? And then he called me up right
after what at she talking about? Like my R and
B artist? And it was a shanty. He's like what artists?
And IRV called me right after that. I said, bring

(05:06):
it to bring it back up. I would bring it
to the office and Earth we wouldn't even want to
talk to Like he's so focused. IRV is turnal focused,
like when he's locked in you. He's no, I don't
see no one like this. Dude man, and he would
be there and he wouldn't even I would have to
force him to just say hi and lie to them like, yeah,
I listened to your music. Yeah yeah, I'll get back
to you. So he would walk in and say what's

(05:27):
up and right back in his office and they be
like did he like my music? Say?

Speaker 2 (05:31):
Oh, yeah, he loved it.

Speaker 3 (05:34):
You know what I'm saying. And that's really how we
got a shanty. But Joe the cosign like when like
Irv is an artist, it's very difficult to make artists
listen to you if they don't. Irv is my little brother.
I raised him. He listened to me up to a
certain point. After that point, I had to get someone
else to so I would send messages through all types

(05:55):
of people to tell him do something, to get it done.
And that's what Joe did for me.

Speaker 6 (06:01):
How do you balance family and business in moments like
that though, like you said, especially when y'all got disagreement,
so when he don't want to listen to you no more.

Speaker 3 (06:07):
I never had a disagreement with my brother. I never
put my hands on my little brother. You know, big
brothers they always talk about that. It was different. I
always seen something in Erv from little he was just
different in a different way. And again, when you talk music,
it's like IRV did anything I did. That's when he
followed anything. I would never tell him anything bad I

(06:29):
was doing because I didn't want him to do it.
But the reality is Earth was playing basketball. I used
to play basketball. Then Earth started really playing basketball and it
was really good, and he had dreams of going somewhere.
For a split second, BJ Carter from Hill Chris High
School was so fast Earth's quit after that, he was like,

(06:51):
if I can't keep up with him, my kid, That's
what kind of ruined his hope dream. But I was DJing,
and people don't know that I started dj because I
had got some equipment. I won't say how I got it,
but I got some equipment and next thing you know,
Earth started DJing and but he got really good and
that's what started the music. And then I was managing

(07:12):
him in a group called with a DF Crew, which
was Romeo and Roselle. Shut out Roselle, you know what
I'm saying. The godfather of noise, he's a beat box. Yeah,
he was the route. So we had him early days.
He was from Hollys one hundred ninety nine in Hollis,
So he was right there. I did not know that.

Speaker 1 (07:27):
I don't know why I thought Rose was from Philly.

Speaker 4 (07:28):
With I do want to ask you talk about he
doesn't listen. When he got to his later life, they
said he was having health problems. Yeah, they said nobody
could talk.

Speaker 3 (07:39):
To Earth about talking to him constantly.

Speaker 4 (07:40):
They said he wouldn't change his diet, he wouldn't change
his thing, and they said nobody could get through to him.

Speaker 5 (07:45):
Why do you think that that was for Earth?

Speaker 3 (07:46):
Partially because my pops was hard headed. He got it
for my dad. So same exact thing, going through diabetes,
health problems, and my dad was like, you can't tell
me God didn't make this orange and I can't eat it.
You can't you know, this was really our problem. And
then it's the ignorance of just health. And was the same.

(08:12):
He would be like, there's no way you could tell
me I can't eat this food it's good, and he
would tell you it's healthy and it was trash, you know,
And it was just hard headed. Now, when he had
his first stroke, he had two strokes. The first stroke
basically he was man. I didn't think he was gonna
be here for after that one he was. I went

(08:34):
to the hospital as soon as I heard, I flew
right to l a shout out. Bj BJ found him, Yeah,
you know, bjus picked him up, got him to the hospital.
When he came around, he was like, I don't want
to go to the hospital and take me to the hospital.
I'm gonna take my mads now. Again, it's probably just
how we are, believe it, very hard headed. I got

(08:56):
a little bit of that too, so I'm not acting
like I don't and BJS no, he said, so stand
up and he couldn't. He stood up and fell back down,
and see, I know you're going to the hospital. Took
him to the hospital and I didn't know he's going
to get past that one. He flew out there and
he was there for I was there for a month

(09:17):
and a half in the hospital, staying with him when
he took about two weeks before he actually came back
and was conscious. But those first two weeks, I didn't
think it was gonna make it. And I always credit
I said, BJ gave us another year basically before the
next one.

Speaker 1 (09:32):
You know, so somebody told me, I'm sorry.

Speaker 6 (09:35):
Somebody told me that was a sense of acceptance that
he had, and he would say he would say things
like I'm going I'm going to see popping.

Speaker 1 (09:41):
I'm gonna be a poppy.

Speaker 3 (09:42):
Yeah, yeah, he wrote. If you've seen his gram he
and I would always when I seen it, I would
call him like, you stop talking like that. I don't
believe in calling on for death like that unless you
really have a death wish. And I was like, you know,
stop talking, You'll see him when it's your time. And
you know, IRV was very you know, sess. I pretty

(10:03):
much see this in every successful person that very particular
how they take information from people, which one or who
you know, and IRV is no difference. It's no exception
to the rule. He's right there, you know. So say,
with success and money and your damn it, probably feel invincible.
I used to say, IRV used to feel like he's God.

(10:23):
Probably at one point when we was at the height
of murdering, he probably felt like he was the alpha
an omega at one point. And you think he.

Speaker 4 (10:33):
Knew when he sold part of his catalog, right, yeah, no,
he sold it all.

Speaker 3 (10:37):
Well, heerve on fifty percent of the masters. We had
a fifty to fifty fifty percent he sold it did it?
It was a three hundred million dollars deal, A hundred
in cash, two hundred for movies and TV products projects.

Speaker 4 (10:48):
Do you think he knew at that time to set
his kids up to be like, if something does happen,
every kid to have that.

Speaker 5 (10:53):
Do you think that was the mentality.

Speaker 3 (10:56):
Irvs one hundred percent family. So yeah, that's definitely part
of it, and it's also part of health and just
not you know, just want to make sure, like you said,
things is there for somebody no matter what. Because IRV
accepted death, he always he would always accept death if

(11:17):
that was a consequence of whatever it is. We both
do like I don't ever look at the consequence of
whatever it is, right, the preciousness of life, think about
that like we're here for such a short amount of time,
but we never thought or thought about anything like that.
Irv's no different. And that's why when he got sick
and he would tell me like if this is what

(11:38):
it is, this is what it is. But he didn't
try to prevent it. And that first stroke he did
for his kids because he fought back. His left side
was paralyzed. He got it all back, and I would
be right there. You could get it all back. I
did it with my dad at eighty two. I made
him vegan. He no longer was diabetic. But what took

(11:59):
my dad cancer The causes of that sugar creates the
cancer in your body, and he died from lung cancer.
He beat cancer in his thigh, shoulder, spine, but didn't
beat through lung cancer. He finished. He passed at eighty six.
But look, I'll sign off right now. So one said
eighty six, that's your date done. I'm fifty eight, let's go.

(12:23):
It's just the reality of your life. Like we all know,
this is. You know, no one talks mortality, especially when
you're young. But it's coming. And we don't know when.
That's the reality too. We don't have it. No one
knows that expiration day. So what is?

Speaker 7 (12:37):
How is your health? You said you earlier you're hardheaded
as well.

Speaker 3 (12:42):
Yeah, no, I'm fast now. I've been doing this for years.
I credit phil Ovey. I don't know if you guys
know who feel Out is. The poker player I managed
feel Out in twenty four years now. Still currently I
know that.

Speaker 5 (12:54):
Yeah, yeah, I think you've been up at one.

Speaker 3 (12:56):
I think I don't think so maybe he might have
been early on early. You know, we shot out Phil.
He's having another baby, man, and that's something I fought
with him to have. You know, some kids got to
keep them going, man. But yeah, Phil changed my life
since COVID. I'm going to go back to COVID. I

(13:17):
mean I was out in Vegas. I ran a record
label called super Nova Forum. You know, he had some
incredible artists. Man, it's crazy. He's not the best of
understanding of how to not give these artists everything they want.
He gave them too much and when you didn't succeed yet,

(13:38):
that's not a good formula for success. Got to have
that hunger.

Speaker 8 (13:42):
I saw that you and jan Rule are figuring out
like some sort of organization to help educate people and
using So you're leaning into holistic medicine.

Speaker 3 (13:50):
Yeah, I've been. I've been holistic for years. The only
thing I would go to a doctor for today would
be like a broken bone or something. Holistically, I've fix
everything and any ills. But you know, if you, if
you take care of yourself, those will be very far
and few between. If I really believe that. You know,
I was looking reading something with a Farakhan or the

(14:13):
Honorable Elijah Muhamed. They will listen as I live. And
he said, if you don't eat, if you eat one
meal a day, he said, you might not get sick
for every three years. If you don't eat in three days.
You know, a fast in a three day time, he said,
you probably will get sick once every ten years. And
you know, if you go longer in a fast, it's

(14:35):
like you won't even get sick. The food is what
kills us. It's just the reality. The body God designed
is perfect. Think about it like that and then you
understand the only thing impure is what you're putting inside
your body. So if you don't understand that or that
concept of floating, it's what it is. But I do
do you deal with a holistic doctor? Sandy? That's my girl,

(14:57):
She's amazing.

Speaker 6 (14:58):
I want to go back to the murder any days
for a second. Yeah, what do you think the culture
underestimates about that era?

Speaker 3 (15:08):
The culture in that era again when I I love
these kids today, I promise you. But the business is
all messed up because of the Internet. I have a
distribution company Average Music. I'm fully engulfed inside of music
from the how to help or empower independent artists. But
today versus then, it's again the competition. Today's again, it's

(15:31):
a needle in a haystack for real today, like you
could be the dopest artist and no one could even
hear you. I always talked about this years ago, like
how come we don't have another Whitney Houston? How can
we don't have another luth Evangelis? These are like iconic,
you know, classical, you know, I need a Baker's because
it's too hard to find them. And then the labels,
when they stop pumping the money in to actually create

(15:53):
that star and market that artist, there's no way. There's
not a chance in hell today the artists, that's the challenge.
You have to actually become that on your own, and
that is a huge challenge. And they're doing great jobs
as far as the marketing and building social media's and
all that influence. But there's so much options, you know,
think of it. Let's use food. We was just talking food.

(16:15):
I always talk to artists like food. If you're artists
delivering music, you're feeding you're feeding your fan. Stop putting
out music and the fan is gonna eat somewhere else.
They're not waiting on you. Today where they would wait
on man, that next job Rule album, that next DMX album,
that next job jay Z album. They was waiting on
that light. I don't see that anticipation for the most artists.

(16:37):
There's still some legacy artists that are still today. Or
Drake I'll use him, or Kendrick, they have that power
of future. You know, they still have that power. But
I promise you they better, they better keep it going.
The longer they go dormant, the harder it is to
get that audience back.

Speaker 1 (16:54):
So what was the biggest mistake you see labels making
the day?

Speaker 3 (16:57):
The biggest mistake for labels is not investing artists. We
have to find a way to invest in the artist,
you know, to expect the artists to walk in the
door and be a star. It's like, that's not real, ridiculous,
that's not real. Michael Jackson's five years old, groomed to
be the king of pop for all those years. It's
a reason. It's not just by chance. And of course
quality music and talent it has to be there. So

(17:19):
again it's what it is. You gotta groom, you gotta groom,
and you gotta understand it. And there's so many outlets
now that reached so many people. It's not just here, right,
there's so many different places. So that makes marketing easier
for the artists, and they still can't hone in.

Speaker 6 (17:35):
The artists don't even like the market. They don't even
like to do the you know, the the person.

Speaker 3 (17:40):
The amount of time an artist has with a hit record,
today's is another problem. In our day three we make
an album. We knew we had three four singles. We
knew we dominated for a year, like we locked in.
We have this year. This is our year, not a month.
This is our year. Because we knew we had the
first single, the second single, the third, we locked and

(18:01):
that's how we built out our business. You can't do
that today you'll be dead. You have to you have
to feed them. You know, think about how much music
like your Drake puts out. It's a massive number and
all the content he does and all the man it's
night and day.

Speaker 4 (18:20):
I always want to know how did you navigate with
IRV having problems with all of y'all friends, Like one
time IRV was not messed with whole.

Speaker 5 (18:29):
Then it was Fat Joe, then.

Speaker 4 (18:31):
It was DMX, then it was nas Like, how did
you navigate that part of it.

Speaker 3 (18:35):
Because families fight. If we didn't, if we're not close
in the beginning, then it doesn't matter. Then you know,
it's really like whatever then, but it's not. And that's
just the facts. And you make mistakes. IRV made a
ton of mistakes. If he was here, like here or not,
I'm going to always speak the reality of what it was.
IRV made a lot of mistakes. For instance, with jay

(19:00):
Z Nas, they beefing. IRV made super ugly. You know,
he produced that record to go after that and talk
to jay Z and say, I'm yo, I'm gonna sign
Nas what you think of course wearing Baseline studios? What
did whole before IRV spoke, I said, will I'll give

(19:23):
you the PG version, But I told him whatever you
want to do, I'm with you. And then IRV was like, yo,
it's good business. And he's telling him it's like, Yo,
are you crazy? You can't tell your man you want
to work with his enemy like that? Like and I's like, nah,
it's just on. Jay was like, you know, he was
asking him, does he have real beef with w He said, Noah,

(19:46):
it's just like music. But Jay's keeping it cordial like
to see where ERV is going with j plays chess,
he's not playing like he wants to see what you're
going to say and and IRV as soon as Jay
said it's not beef like that, he turned to me
he said, I told you, I told you, And Jay
looking at me like, yo, is he serious? And I

(20:07):
was like, wow, he's crazy. But you can again when
you asked something earlier, you asked about like I was
always in a back IRV. This is all about IRV.
Businesses are business, right, the way we conduct our business,
that's all business. But it was all about earth. I
never wanted to be in front of the camera behind him,

(20:27):
and never I was forced into that. Everyone you know,
everybody I was forcing into. But that's the reality with
murder Rink. I was always my job from IRV was
what do you need? Keep everyone away from him so
he could stay focused. Only you know what I mean,
because I mean the amount of O RINGU tains I

(20:49):
had to deal with is unreal. And not just New York.
Every city we went into they all wanted in. That's
the ror we was in. They all wanted a piece
of a goose that laid the golden egg. And I
had to deal with them and keep them away. Nah,
Steve stouton, Oh, Steve Stout, shout out Steve Man. But

(21:09):
the commissioner is he's in that day. He was a
real hands on guy. He's the one that brought the
deal to us. And I was like, you seriously, we
could get nas Like we didn't think we could get that,
And he was like, yeah, we made the record the
pledge not pledging allegiance to murder ring. Think about that.

(21:31):
He's on the record pledging allegiance to murder ring and
the Stout seeing the future in my opinion and again
to his credit, again, I'm not knocking Stout. This dude
is brilling in the book of Hip Hop. He has
to be one of the most iconic people in that book.
You know what I'm saying, shout out Steve again. The

(21:54):
end of the day, he's seen the future. What's the future?
Come on, murder ring, we're murdering. What's the future? Fifty cent?
He's saying it. He knew it, he knew it. Joe
had a sneaker deal with not with Steve Reebok. We're
on a private plane flying the designing everything in the
in the you know, in the plane and then he's
seen the future and pulled everything and switch it. Now

(22:17):
Ge only got his sneaker deal. Jay z got his
sneaker deal. You understand what reebok And again he knew
he he seen something and understood and made the pivot.
As a businessman, I respected of Why was Jay as
a friend, It's a little questionable.

Speaker 6 (22:35):
That's what I'm saying. Why was Jay upset with herv
but not Steve? And Steve presented the deal.

Speaker 3 (22:40):
Well, Steve was also remembering Steve was also part of
a lot of it. That's why Damon always has obief
with Steve's because of that. Steve was funneling a lot
of deals with Jay and then seeing Jay again pulled
that way instead of going through Dame and dealing with
the you know that side of it. I understand that.
I understand why he's upset about that. As a you
know iv I used Phil. I'm gonna use Phil Ivy

(23:03):
for this story because Phil had a deal. I brought
him this lawyer. I won't say his name, but I
brought him a lawyer. He didn't know who Phil was,
and I brought him lawyer. They ended up doing some
business and the lawyer didn't tell me, and I didn't
get mad at the lawyer. I got mad at Phil said,
you can't do something and then expect me to not.

(23:25):
You didn't let me know about it. That's on you, bro,
That's not on me. And that's the same way I
look at with Jay and Steve that you know what
I'm saying, If he don't go back to Dame, if
he doesn't go back to Dame and say something, I
feel you had to come and talk to me. I'm
here to protect you. That's how Dame felt, and I
get it like as a partner, as a day would

(23:46):
have took a bullet for Jay. You're kidding me in
that day that you're kidding me. It's not even close.
That's what makes me mad with that situation. I'm gonna say,
do you feel like I spoke to Jay about that before?
One time? I told him and I just left it
alone after that.

Speaker 4 (24:02):
How do you feel it when you see it play out?
Because you see how close they were, You were on tours,
you were in studio.

Speaker 3 (24:06):
There's a lot of stuff that's personal again inside of
a family that we wouldn't know that I don't know,
you know, that's I'll leave it there, and then you
gotta let families be what they are because of what
it is. I respect both of them to the highest level.
You know. At the end of the day, I leave
it alone.

Speaker 1 (24:24):
And didn't Jay get back? Didn't Uh?

Speaker 3 (24:26):
I think?

Speaker 6 (24:27):
I think I heard you tell a story about how
when jus same line again.

Speaker 3 (24:31):
Oh yeah, yeah, the same line, because it was like
when when Jay told him that it wasn't really more.
It wasn't like physical beef. It was more lyrical. And
IRV went crazy like I told you and any but
Jay's looking at him like you more, man, you can't
be like serious, like, but left it alone. Chest he's
playing chess. And then right after that, Jay went and
did a tour with fifty cent. They got the g

(24:54):
unit sneaker. He has his remember he had his like Gucci, Yes,
that's cauc and they went out on the tour and
then IRV RV sat there and he's like, yeah, I
just went out and he said, yeah, it was good
business because IRV told Jay it would be good business
to do this. It is gonna be good business. I
had not but when he's not realizing and IRV knew

(25:14):
it after the fact, you know, hindsight is twenty twenty.
He realized that was one of his biggest mistakes, which
it took a lot to fix.

Speaker 5 (25:24):
That, but they finally did fix it.

Speaker 3 (25:25):
Oh yeah, we had multiple conversations, but you know it
wasn't never the same, right, it was never the same, Like,
what's that record? And Jay says, got to consult Earth,
got of y'all heads.

Speaker 5 (25:36):
Got to roll, right, That's a fact.

Speaker 3 (25:39):
Jay took that off every forward record. Think about how
serious that is that he said, no, I don't want
to hear that no more. You can't get that unless
you have the old original. It's bleeded out. It's bleeded out.
I don't know that it's called remastering Baby's yeah on,

(26:00):
that does not exist. Go get that. Go get that
reckon and see if you could hear it. Go to
Apple Music and see if you hear it. I'm bad
with titles as much as I I'm terrible with titles
and names and stuff. I don't remember the title of
records on the streets is watching, but it's.

Speaker 5 (26:16):
Us the customer.

Speaker 3 (26:18):
Jay used to sit in my office literally to wait
to talk to Earth. That's how deep that was. You know,
again again he's at the heights of unbelievable heights. People
may not like to hear that, but if it's true,
it's true. You know what I'm saying. And it's not
one time, it's multiple times. Yo, it's Earth coming. I

(26:40):
was like, Yo, you understand my office, go ahead, I
locked the door whatever. He's like, no, it's all good.
He just sit there and just be waiting and Earth
when he come in, they go in there. But Earth
would help him with all types of business. I did
thoughts every he respected HER's brain. I'll leave it there now.
The fat Jo't thing you can never I'm sorry. The
fat Joe thing ya could because fat Joe and Earth

(27:00):
was like, we fixed that. Y'all fixed that with Joe
and Earth again, never the same. He was at my
man Jaw's funeral, and you know, I told Joe again,
I'm my brother's keeper. I told Joe, you messed up,
Broy and I went at Joe and told him, and
he's like he understood. We was at say Let's actually,

(27:24):
and uh, I was having a meeting with my niece
and saint from in this coat records, and I didn't
want to go and deal with this right now. And
my other dude, Big Joe kept coming said, yo, fat
Joe's over come on, come on. I said, I don't
want to talk right now. He forced me to talk,
so I said, all right, let me go tell it.
And when I went back there, he's with Rich. Of course,

(27:45):
I got Rich and Joe and and Uncle Dan, the
usual suspects. And I told him, I said, you can't
shout out my brother is a sucker and then whisper,
I'm sorry, that's a sucker move. And I told him
that that's a suckle play. You can't do that, especially
if we're like this. You can't yell it at the

(28:07):
top of the mountain and then come down here and
say I'm sorry.

Speaker 2 (28:11):
I shouldn't have did that.

Speaker 3 (28:13):
You know. I asked them all kind of crazy questions
because that's just me. It's like, was you messing with Ashanti?
Is that your girl? You found her because of us?
What are you doing interfering they had a relationship? What
are you doing? Like I said, and listen, I promise
you go listen to anything. And all Earth did was
yell how much he loved her, and the way he's

(28:33):
talking about everything you could tell as a man, he
loved that woman. He was heartbroken, But I said, how
do you tell me you love this girl and you
out with everybody else?

Speaker 2 (28:44):
That don't make no sense. He kept getting caught with like, yo,
what are you doing?

Speaker 3 (28:48):
Bro? But that's her, that is her. He wanted his
cake and eat it too again. You know him. That's
who he is, and that's the reality of that whole thing.
But it's crazy, Like every time I say, just listen,
everyone talks all crazy. Just listen to what he's saying.
Listen to the words. Don't just hear his he's speaking loud.
Will Lorenzos, we speak loud. That's you know what I mean,

(29:09):
That's what we do. But at the end of the day,
you listen to what he's really saying. And IRV is
not a liar. He is telling you the truth about her,
about him. I was their counselor, meaning when they would fight.
I'm over the four Seasons with IRV and I'm at
the Rich Carlton with a Shane talking about what did
he say? What did she say? Trying to keep them
cool and keep the business. You know what I'm saying,

(29:34):
keeping the business man, you gotta be that's the that's
the facts. Shotti wanted me to play a part in
one of her videos again. I wish I remember the
name of this video, oh man, where she's singing and
she killed. She's got the dude her her boyfriend in
the tub. She wanted me to play that part because
I'm not doing that. She's gonna kill. Yeah, but I'm

(29:56):
really supposed to be IRV again. It's like crazy. And
I told her, I said, the only thing I won't
do is lie. But I never took her. I never
took Earth's side while Earth was here. Never, So all
I said is I'm not gonna lie. Now. I'm not
gonna talk about nothing, but I'm not gonna lie either. Like,
you can't ask me to do that. He's not here
no more. He can't even say that. If I hear

(30:18):
something wrong, I will correct it. But that's just for
respect for my brother. But I never hated that. I
never took his side with her. Hated it like that
was something I had to deal with him. And I'm like, yo,
that's your relationship. You know, that's your business. This is
over here. He was like, she didn't come to the trial.
I said she was at the tild Yeah, because Darcell

(30:41):
called her. I said, I called her. I called her
and said you should be there and she showed up.
What more do you want? You guys all fight? And
what else I always say is I say, let me
talk to your ex and let me see what she's
gonna say. Let me talk. You know what I'm saying.
That's just what it is. That's the fact.

Speaker 8 (31:00):
Have you and a chance been able to talk since everything?
Because I saw that you were upset with her when
she sat down with Angie Martinez and she.

Speaker 3 (31:05):
Said that, yeah, I was upset because we haven't spoke
in person after ERR's passing. Imagine that, and I promise
you I'm the reason she was murdering more. IRV made
the records, but Earth would have never got to that point.
If I don't do what I did. I used to
fly up to Jersey giving her music to make record

(31:28):
after record. If I don't put her on the punt,
it never happens. And I did that. She knows it
for her not to call me after ERR's passion. She
texts me that that don't feel right. Her mother Tina,
that don't feel right. You understand like I did everything

(31:50):
for them, never did I did one thing in return?
Don't count tickets because I could get that myself. You
know what I'm saying to a show. That's just the
fact I'm not gonna sit here with sugar coat nothing.
And that's why I felt the way. And then when
I see it, I'm like, nah, that's not cool. Ever.
But again, she's thinking career, but she's a legacy artist.

(32:14):
She has no new music. Her career is solidified. She's fine,
stay in shape. This is the reality and delivering them.
You'll be able to do that until you're gone and
make a living. She's fine. That's what we did. We
gave them hit records. That's the reality. Joe rules the same,

(32:35):
gave him, gave him them h and John again, he's amazing.
And yes, it's a marriage. When I say we gave him,
it's a marriage. Lyric can beat and I know there
was a point she was like she wants her masters,
and that's why IRV was like, I'm not like Leor
meaning Leo wasn't in the studio making those records with you,
meaning when you wrote those songs and I corrected it.

(32:57):
I'm part of that too. When I put that record
out and I did the beat, and then I have
to go market promoted physically to get it off the ground.
You know, there's so much details of the murdering history
that we don't know or the public doesn't know. Ashanti,
we didn't have her signed and we put Foolish out. Yeah,

(33:18):
number one record in the country and she's not signed.
You know how much it costs us to get her
from that little AJM Records five million dollars out of
our pife five because we gotta hit record. We gotta
hit record on her. So now he's the numbers up
five million.

Speaker 1 (33:35):
What made y'all put the record out before she.

Speaker 3 (33:36):
Was nerv IRV moves with his heart. Leo said, I'm
not gonna pay for nothing. It was like we going.
It's timing. You know, success is number one reason for success.
Is timing number one reason for all success, any business,
whatever it is, is the timing. IRV understood timing at

(33:58):
the highest level. We have to go. Now. He knew
what the world was looking for. That's why she's still
That's all it is. It's the timing and she put boom.
It worked, but now we gotta pay and he did.
She knows we had to pay that money. But look,
IRV said, loyalty. He figured that's what hurt him. See,

(34:19):
this is the plot that heard him. He's thinking, she's
gonna be loyal with me on just business things and stuff.
And again then it turned into relationship too, because in
that moment he wasn't messing with her yet. He just
seen a talented young girl and that's it, and that's

(34:39):
what she was. That's what she is like. She's she's
an amazing writer. She's an incredible artist, and she always
wanted to sing. She could sing pitch perfect. People don't
know about her if you think about her career, they
always like, she can't really sing. But that's what Earth created.
She hated she wasn't singing. But remember she had three
deals before Earth, so she lost three times time. Fourth

(35:01):
time was the jump. So when you think about it
from a business standpoint, I'm a business guy. When I
think the business of it, that's what happened. You know
what I'm saying. She was with NOONI and those guys
in noontime and all of that. No records, but you're singing.
You're making a record that no one wants to hear
because the timing is not right. Not saying they want
good records. It's the timing of it. It's the average

(35:21):
changing the culture. Irv's part of the culture. That's he
created this culture, this sound that was coming out of
us and all these other artists. He put his hands
on pause.

Speaker 6 (35:33):
Y'all probably didn't make a lot of money off fools either,
because that was a bad boy sample.

Speaker 3 (35:37):
No, yes, it's a sample. Wasn't bad we did. We
didn't give it to Puff Earth kind of. He went
to him and told him, I'm using Biggie, but I
ain't using your biggie because Puffy wanted him to use that,
so he get it. He went to the original.

Speaker 8 (35:53):
Earth sold them the catalog for his part of the
catalog was Ashanti's Master's a part of that.

Speaker 3 (35:58):
Every song he made, every song he made, every song,
he produced everything. Because it's when you sell the masters,
not just masters. Publishing goes along with it because whatever
is paying that kind of money, they don't want to
go fight for the now with the publisher and say
you can't use it. They won it all and you
know they had to get a clue, you know that,
and that's what they did. They did that with Universal.

(36:19):
So in our contract we had full control of the
master of one hundred percent, but we had to share
fifty to fifty. So basically wherever that music was gonna
get put anywhere, we could say yes or no to.
Does that make sense? Okay? So that's how we had
to set up. So when he sold it, they inherited
that writer. So universal can't stop iconoclass. Who has the masters? Now?

Speaker 8 (36:41):
I was asking because right when he sold something previously,
like with Jarrol, did he give y roll cut?

Speaker 3 (36:48):
Yeah, he gave joll But you know again that's family business.

Speaker 8 (36:50):
Got you, so there's nothing like that. But that was
going down with Ashanti's situation.

Speaker 1 (36:53):
For the part that he.

Speaker 3 (36:55):
Y'all was supposed to be, it's a different business.

Speaker 5 (36:58):
Was yoah a owner of.

Speaker 3 (37:00):
That's what y'all was supposed to be? Officially? Never happened.
Never happened?

Speaker 5 (37:06):
Why not?

Speaker 3 (37:07):
Just timing? IRV IRV was gonna sign to Joe Ruse's
label as the first artist for JOAB.

Speaker 1 (37:14):
I heard that before. That was like, I have this legend.

Speaker 3 (37:17):
Let me tell you something. I have the napkin I
wrote the contract on and they both signed it. I
have it somewhere, but that's what the contract was. Because
RV was like if okay. We would be in the
studio and RV would rewrap everyone's song for them to
show him how to deliver the song. Not so much Joe,

(37:38):
but like the other artists. And then he understood how
to deliver as a producer, he understood how to deliver
vocals on music. You know what I'm saying, and that
is what man. When Joe said, Nah, you can't go
out like that, then he was like, He's gonna write
his song because E wasn't a writer. Joe was like,
I'll write all your music. You're gonna be my artist

(37:59):
on my label, and they signed a deal. It just
never came to fruition, just like Josh getting his piece
of Murdering.

Speaker 5 (38:07):
So that was his piece when he sold the thing,
that was his piece.

Speaker 6 (38:09):
For one question, my fools it was at the Bard
sample right, but she had Biggie's voice and foolish.

Speaker 1 (38:16):
It was another one that was a remix, the remix
we did, the remix.

Speaker 3 (38:20):
That we didn't have it, the rision doesn't have it.

Speaker 1 (38:26):
What was the most underrated part of your role in
building murder.

Speaker 3 (38:31):
I don't. I don't you know. I'm very humble. I
like I said, I did everything I had to do
for my brother. I'm my brother's keeper. And that's the crazy.
Everything I had to do on anything you could think
that needs to be done, I did it. I faced
twenty years. It's something that wasn't for me. That's the
that's the ultimate. If you understand the truth of the

(38:52):
everything HERV and again shot up prame, go get go
see the supreme truth. He got a documentary out this
for crazy. So but IRV and Prem forged relation. I'm
from Hollys Queens. I'll give you that dynamic because Hollice
in south Side don't work. Preim is the king in
south Side, your Queens. You understand that, you understand King

(39:15):
of south Side. My whole adolescent years, all I do
is fight dudes from south Side. Shout out monkey Dave.
I just he's someone that I fought all the time.
He don't know me, but now we're just kind of
gonna connect on some good stuff now, So shout out
monkey Dave. A monkey Dave used to be there waiting
for anyone going to Hollee with like twenty thirty dudes
every day at the Q two. The only bus that
runs through hollis so but IRV again with all of this.

(39:40):
He was just different, man. I can't explain it. He
was different. I seen something in my job, aside from
my mom and my dad always telling me to take
care of your brother, make sure he's good, you know,
And I had to take care of my brother, so
it never stopped. I only got of argument with IRV

(40:02):
during the trial one time because he acted like he
didn't remember and anything I did. The reason I'm sitting
is because I my accounting was I got a great
a bill of health from the Feds for the accounting
of murdering. We gambled a ton. They had me gambling
at one point eight a week. And that's not just me.

(40:24):
It was me John nerv All gambling with a bookie,
and I had a book who keeps track of their
I do because I want to see profit and loss
and we could claim profit and loss in business. But
I had every check I signed unless it was to me.
So anything we did to anybody, if I had to

(40:46):
pay envy of a check, IRV, I'm gonna sign this
for envy. Anything outside of payroll right that which I'm signing.
But anything outside of payroll, IRV, I gotta give Charlomagne.
You know just I gotta give just everybody he's seen
it and it's okay to and and I go. So

(41:07):
I never made one check without doing that. See again,
everyone say families don't can't do business together. I'm showing
you how you have to do it as family. If
you don't do it this way, you will have problems.
So he can never look at anything and say a word.
But when we're in the trial and they say, what's
this talk my checks and he's saying, ask Chris, I'm like, who, like, man, nigga,

(41:34):
you told me to pay this. You told me to
pay this, dude, you told like, don't get at me
Asia now, And I like the lawyers had kind of
got us separated. I wasn't playing with him. And then
I said, you better start remembering now, and he did.
He started IRV didn't do the trial. I always say
this to everybody. Eth didn't do the trial. I did
the trial. I did every motion hearing, every you know, motionaries.

(41:57):
You usually don't go. It's just your lawyers in there, prosecutor.
They're deciding on what evidence gets submitted in the trial.
That's where you win and lose cases. My judge the
first day said why are we here? We know these
guys are guilty. My judge, I couldn't believe it. I

(42:19):
turned to shot YAlO, which is my lawyer. He's not
here no more's Jerry chat YAlO, best lawyer in the game.
And I turned to chat Yell and I'm looking at him,
and then I just start staring at the lawyer and
I write down this grounds for an appeal and I
slide shot yo shaq Yel says we'll talk afterwards. So
we go in the hallway and the judge sees me
staring at him, and he realizes I'm not like a paralegal. Oh,

(42:41):
this is really the client. This is because they never
show clients and never go to motionaries. So they're like,
oh man, oh well, and he changes everything up after
it saw over the prosecutors smirking and laughing like yeah,
got him, we got this one right. Yeah. So we
go out in the hallway and he said, Chris, I

(43:02):
know the judge. We went to school together. He says,
he's probably gonna be the most fearish judge you're gonna
get in the Southern day Street.

Speaker 2 (43:10):
I said what.

Speaker 3 (43:13):
I said? What he said? I proudly he said, I
wouldn't we could make emotion to change because what he said.
He said, but I wouldn't do that. I'm going to
tell you trust me. And I said, oh my god.
I was like, this is who you want the judge
to be for my case, and I'll keep it a hunted.
You know, when we first started, we had like twenty

(43:34):
four charges. It wasn't just two. Every they put everything
on it on it, just threw everything anything previous dealing
with they threw on us. And we get we get
to the next day for the motion hearing, and that
judge blocked everything because he knew he messed up the
day before. I really believe that he blocked everything. I mean,

(43:59):
I keep it on it. I had a lot of
guns and things, and I never sold drugs in my life.
I might have robbed the drug dealer. I never sold
the drugs except for when I sold what I robbed.
But that's different.

Speaker 2 (44:12):
That's a different that's a different.

Speaker 4 (44:14):
Say selling to customers he sold they have a drug.

Speaker 3 (44:17):
He said, yes, yes, at a discount too. They love that.
They love me, these guys. So at the end of
the day, end of the day, I feel that guilt.
He had that next day he blocked everything. And that
is the defining moments of why there's no way those jurors,
twelve jermors of not your peers, that it is not

(44:39):
your peers, is going to find you innocent with twenty
four chargers and you understand there's no way. You know.
The most chilling moment for me, again I was very
ignorant to a lot of this stuff, was the first
day of court. You get in there, all rise judge
and they read Christopher Lorenzo Verse is the United.

Speaker 2 (45:00):
States of America.

Speaker 3 (45:01):
I'm like, what did I do to the government? What
did I do to this country that I'm fighting them?

Speaker 8 (45:07):
Like?

Speaker 3 (45:07):
That was the surreal moment, even though you see it
in the doc. But when they read it, I was like,
oh man, it's crazy, But I didn't do it. Like
everything money on the case, it's all earns money. It's
not my money. Why am I sitting here? But I
signed every check and that's my partner and we there,
my brother and you heard it down though, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 6 (45:29):
I didn't want to ask you about the funeral because
because Hole came to the funeral.

Speaker 3 (45:33):
Yes, didn't, I thought came to She did not. She
sent some flowers Okay, what about Joe that Joe did
not his father. His father passed the same time. Okay,
got you got you got Joe came late. Actually, Joe
was there late. He left his father's and got to
us late. I seen him after at the end when
it was almost over. He did get there. Sorry, Joe. Yeah,

(45:55):
he's in the beginning though, got.

Speaker 8 (45:57):
You Yeah, I was my Actually he mentioned the flowers,
and I know she posted a statement online.

Speaker 7 (46:02):
Did that.

Speaker 8 (46:03):
I know you said that you want a talk in person,
but like, did that provide any sort of comfort for
you guys in that moment? Just having things show up
there from her?

Speaker 3 (46:15):
I don't know how to answer that. Really, it's like,
it's a terrible it's a terrible it's my dad was
the worst in her past that you know. This is
the connection between her sibling and the way me and
Earth grew up. I mean, I raised her. That's not

(46:36):
my father, my you know my mother. See my dad,
My dad was an alcoholic. I had a listen years
he's he's crazy, you know what I'm saying. But then
when he got older, I understood why he was drunk
every day. He had eight kids with no money, you
know what I'm saying, I understand as a man, he
never left, stayed with mom, and I asked him that question,

(46:58):
why didn't you leave? I could never do that to
y'all heard you. You know what I'm saying. He's my hero,
but my brother. I tried. I had to explain this
to his kids. I said, I know that's your dad.
I know what it is to lose your dad. I said,
you'll feel that the day you have to lose your brother.

(47:19):
Whenever that day comes, and it's different to this day,
I can't. I mean, I got sick over earth Man.
I got sick physically after he literally in the hospital,
Like and they what is it? Stress? What's the stress?
It's my brother, he's here right now. Like, but I
got through it. I have to. Like I said, so

(47:42):
when you say that with the flowers, it's a good gesture.
It's a good gesture. I won't go further than that.
And I don't want to be disrespectful to her because
she probably thinks it's good. But she should know better
that she had to talk to me physically. Actually, she
should come see me. I love Ashanti. You know what

(48:03):
I'm saying. That's little that's like little sister, for real,
for real. We took care of her in every sense
of your imagination. She confessed me one day afterwards, and
she thanked me for everything we did for because now
she's out there by herself and she's getting all types
of indecent proposals. Let's leave it to that, right, because

(48:25):
that's what this industry is. Let's not make any sugar
coating about it. It's an attractive young lady. She wants
to make music. What could you do with this? You
want that beat? Okay, let's go over here. And she
told me. She told me, and she was like, thank you.
She thanked me for always taking care of it. On versus,

(48:46):
you know, and she's waiting, he shout out, Nelly. I
have no problem with these nothing I fuck with Nelly.
But on versus. The day of versus, he pulls up
and I said, what do you want to do? You
ask her like she come up and you ask her,
what do you want to do? I roll this off
the stage. She said, no, I'll give you the sign

(49:07):
if there's a problem. But that's the day they got
back together. That's why you don't get in the middle
of relationships. It's different. That's why I never got any
and herd together. I never did. I just tried to
keep it cool with them and keep the business moving.
I could have swell.

Speaker 7 (49:22):
It was reported that she went to the funeral.

Speaker 3 (49:24):
Okay, so she they lied. They did put a report
that she was They lied again. She probably got a
good publish or something.

Speaker 5 (49:33):
I want to ask you.

Speaker 3 (49:33):
You know, you know she came and stay to my mother.
That's the part that's deeper than just what it is.
She knows that she knows. Ninnie, come on, this is
all that is off. When it's death, it's over nothing
Earth could say nothing, no more, it's over. Why can't

(49:53):
you And again, if it's because of your husband, you
could come to see me and talk to me. I
can see you at a show. What's the difference. That's
how I look at it me personally.

Speaker 8 (50:07):
She had said that she tried to there was an
olive branch or whatever that she tried to extend or
was extended, but it wasn't received well. So you think
that that's why she kind of text me.

Speaker 3 (50:16):
I wasn't in the mood for texting. You understand. She
got to understand that too. You can't only have your view.
It's two sides. She text me and she didn't text me.
If I show you the date she text me, slate,
you understand he's gone already, So just put this in
there without me going deep. He's gone. And then I

(50:39):
get a text after he's gone a couple of days. No,
nothing else. She got my number.

Speaker 1 (50:48):
She could like, you'd appreciated the call.

Speaker 3 (50:50):
I would appreciate you a visit.

Speaker 1 (50:52):
I get what I'm saying.

Speaker 3 (50:53):
It's like I said, we did a lot, you know.
And she could say whatever she wants about a relationship whatever,
But you can't lie about her career. Who can? Who
can sit there and say she did something more than
what it is? Like, Yeah, she wrote the records with him.
She hated every hit record. How about that? So what

(51:14):
if we listen to her? Did she become a shanty?
That's the facts? For baby Baby? She hated? That was
too many babies. It's one of my favorite records.

Speaker 2 (51:25):
Irv Winne Booth and Soda.

Speaker 3 (51:26):
You gotta sing like this, he said, you gotta feel like.

Speaker 1 (51:28):
You you high.

Speaker 2 (51:30):
You don't get high.

Speaker 3 (51:31):
That's why you don't know what it is.

Speaker 2 (51:32):
It's what he told her.

Speaker 3 (51:33):
And he said, you gotta be strung out on a
man that way, and he's so I don't want to
hear it pitch perfect. I say, I'm stupid gotty sing
it like that, and she did, see I give credit
for the listening. A producer has to be able to
produce or else you just the beat maker, right, and

(51:57):
you're leaving it in the hands of an artist. And
that's the reality. If you trust that producer, which they
trusted her, they was able to get through and make
those changes. She compromised her own belief for his, which
is to her credit, you know. And that's the reality, y'all.
Is the favorite time with y'all was Holla, holla, I

(52:18):
get that beat, I run to the studio, or puts
it up. Jo y'all did two hooks? Write the hook? First?
We playing cards in the other room. He comes out
with a hook. That's not it, Go write another hook?
What if? Joall said, NAHRV, that's it. That's what these
artists do today. It's like they can't be wrong. Nah,
that's it. IRV said, No, that's not it. Came out

(52:39):
with another one that's not it. The third one, Yo,
I'm gonna double it up. I'm gonna do with the beat.
Halla Halla, room, go crazy, go write it.

Speaker 2 (52:49):
He wrote the hook.

Speaker 3 (52:50):
And the verses, it's like they was written already, that's
how fast it was. And we tall about sixteen bars,
three times three sixteen bars. It was like it was
as soon as he got the hook, the verses was
like done. Good record. But that's the that's the beauty
of a producer. And that's to me. IRV is a producer,
for real, for real. And then when I look in

(53:12):
the industry, doctor Dre, who is Irv's idol, He idolized
like he's the best. I don't even know how he
made this or how he did that, But doctor Dre
is a real producer, you know. And you have a
lot of them, you know. I remember Tim and IRV Timboll, you.

Speaker 5 (53:29):
Know, they they used to have.

Speaker 3 (53:30):
Little competitions, you know, and he would tell her because
Tim's on huge records, and IRV say, did you tell
him what to do? He said, how come you didn't
make magoua hit? You know, yes, this is this was
Irving Timm's conversations. But when you think about it, it's real.
I get it. I'm just in the back listening, you know,

(53:53):
I'm that and I'm like, man, that's real stuff. Though.

Speaker 4 (53:57):
How many people did you have to fight for? Because
IRV had a crazy he's my fause.

Speaker 3 (54:05):
Listen, meanf would go out, I would get the call
over and that's like a constant. All of his friends.
Everyone will tell you, like they would call me and
they would be like, Yo, your brother's here. But you
know I really don't fuck with them. I said, well,
then don't call me. You can't not fuck with my
brother and tell me you fuck with me. That's impossible. Nah,

(54:27):
you know what I mean, Chris, You know what I mean.
I well, didn't make sure he's good, and that's what
would happen. So I didn't really fight a lot. I'm blessed.
I was blessed in the sense of I got a
lot of respect. You know, the people I fought wasn't
really for Earth. I fought a lot, but it wasn't
for Earth. There was a respect and when I everyone

(54:51):
knew if you didn't mess with Earth, you can't fuck
with me. Don't come over here. You know, I'll give
you the Jimmy Henchman shout out Jimmy again. But this
is how we actually got cool. He kept coming to
meet me at different clubs. Y'all want to talk to
your brother. I said, okay, what you want to talk about, Jimmy,
talk to me. I said, I want to talk to
your brother. I said, Jimmy, I'm telling you, I'm gonna

(55:13):
get it to like I don't lie. If you're gonna
tell me, I'm gonna get it to Irving, just talk
to me. And then he said it again and I said,
I am IRV nigga. What's up? And then oh yeah,
And then it was tension, a lot of tension with Jimmy.
Now we didn't get into any conflict. We resolved it.
But when you deal with predators, and I dealt with

(55:35):
a lot of predators, you have to deal with them.
They only respect power strength. So if I didn't show
Jimmy's strength, it would have been probably a whole nother situation.

Speaker 4 (55:45):
Do you think the industry is messed up? Because now
it's gonna sound crazy. Back in the day, when hip
hop was prevalent and everybody was running.

Speaker 2 (55:54):
There were predators or they were street.

Speaker 4 (55:57):
Than today, it seems like it's not as bad as
seemed like people are just doing whatever they want to do.

Speaker 3 (56:02):
I think got times worse back in our era. Versus today.

Speaker 5 (56:05):
But you think there was more control.

Speaker 4 (56:07):
There was somebody on the West, there was somebody in Houston,
there was somebody in Brooklyn, there was somebody in Queys.
There was somebody in Bronx. That kept the artists being
artists and the street guys.

Speaker 1 (56:17):
There was a cold.

Speaker 5 (56:18):
It doesn't seem like that cold is there now.

Speaker 3 (56:21):
It is. It is, let's say lawless, but the cold
back then most people didn't have the right person they
was dealing with. I mean, I don't want to, but
I had tons of people's jury in my hand that
I shouldn't have had in my hand. And I'm like,
and the reason they come to me. They was coming

(56:42):
to me, these guys was they would tell me, do
you know them? I'll get it back to them. But
then they want me to pay for them, or want
them to pay for it, and I'm like, nah, I
don't want to get into the middle of that business. Now.
If you was my man and it was that, I
call you up and I would ask you, hey, something happened,
I wouldn't say anything. I would you good is everything?
And I want them to confess and they would. Ninety

(57:03):
nine times out of one hundred they did not confess.
They would act like it was cool, like nah, no
one wants to act like they got robbed or anything.
They want to always act like okay, Well then if
you don't, you said nothing even cool?

Speaker 1 (57:16):
You know I saw that. Sorry to cut you off.

Speaker 8 (57:20):
Just speaking of this made me think that they're doing
the Supreme Team docutaries or documentary.

Speaker 3 (57:25):
Well, the documentary is documentary on Supreme. It is called
The Supreme Truth. And yeah, shot out Luke. He made
an incredible film, him and Michael J. Payton, and it's
again just backed on with facts like it was fact checked.
There was no this is my opinion. You know. That's

(57:47):
one of the things Preme insisted on. He wanted to
get all of the facts where people lied or this
is impossible because this is what it is. Because the
reality is he's in on the wrong charges and I'll
leave it at that. What he's convicted of is not
what he did. But when you go in front of
twelve people with a history like he has, oh man,

(58:11):
good luck and getting them to say not guilty. And
that's just the fact. Because I was there for that
whole trial and it's all it's all lies. It's based
on lies. It's all snitches. But they're gonna the twelve
were gonna believe that because you have a history. They're
not gonna sit there and say, oh, he couldn't have
done that. That part of your brain is not happening.

(58:33):
It's not happening. So did He trial must have drove
you crazy. You know, the did He trial? I was
just with Christian out in LA not too long ago.
Shout o Christian and whole family. You know, I'm just
because I can't imagine what they're dealing with. My biggest
problem with the trial is when it first started, you know,
the way they promoted it, I thought something was gonna
come out. It's like some real we're gonna hear about

(58:54):
all types of crazy shit. You know, you don't hear nothing.
We heard the girl he enjoyed having a freak off,
you know, with dudes with large members spouse.

Speaker 2 (59:09):
At the end of the day, and she was paying them.

Speaker 3 (59:12):
My biggest problem is this, he's a If he's not
a billionaire's right there, let's call him a billionaire. How
does this black billionaire with this lack of evidence, which
they had to The prosecutor had to remove chargers in
the middle of the trial said, oh, we're not going
to go after these, we're taking these off because they
didn't have no evidence for it. Not get home, not

(59:33):
be able to fight this from home. That's all I'm saying.
Nothing else. Why couldn't he fight this from home? You
know the Abercrimeian fish people, they five million dollar bail
on their home and they got all the boys. They
was messing with them, little boys and girls, like come on,
enough is enough, man. But as people, if we don't
get together, we will never get anywhere. And that's the

(59:54):
biggest problem. They know we could never get together.

Speaker 8 (59:56):
You think he gonna get to get to come home
and get the time served on.

Speaker 3 (01:00:00):
He's definitely getting time served, and it's just a question
of what they charging with. How much is the judge
going to give them, how much amount of time. I'm
afraid for him, really, yeah, only because they didn't let
him go. He should have been home.

Speaker 2 (01:00:14):
He's not. He's almost in a year. We all watched
the case.

Speaker 1 (01:00:20):
Fourteen months.

Speaker 3 (01:00:21):
Yeah that's a little longer year, yes, yellow education.

Speaker 8 (01:00:28):
But when you say more than a year, I'm thinking,
like you're hitting it, like two years, we got you.

Speaker 3 (01:00:35):
But but he's for being in that long. It's crazy
for not for the charges that I mean, for the
case that I heard, it's not a domestic violence case.
I don't condone. I'm a protector of women, so at
the end of the day, if I see a female
in duress, I will be in the middle of that problem. Now,
if it's a relationship, like I said, I don't do that.

(01:00:58):
I got five sisters, I got a month, I got
a ton of nieces, I got a daughter. You're not
playing with no women as a man. So when I
heard the domestic violence, I don't condone that. But that's
not a domestic violence case in the facts. He'sa a
MGC right now, that's a real place. Nah, that's not cool, man.
And that And I was early on it because I

(01:01:19):
was waiting to hear something and a prosecutor will always
come out with the smoking gun the first thing they're
going to talk about it. And I didn't hear nothing.
And right after that, I was like, leave, Let did
he go? Man? This is terrible? You know, hold your head,
bro again, you're what someone's sexual preferences is nothing. If

(01:01:42):
he involved kids, then they would have been a problem.
I'm a game women. Kids, You can't play with that shit,
not around me. No.

Speaker 1 (01:01:50):
Afric.

Speaker 6 (01:01:50):
Fifth thing was interesting too because they was always saying
that he got a bell because of his age, and
then they said he was unfit to stand dry because
he had dementia.

Speaker 3 (01:01:58):
Yeah, yeah, I don't know. Puffy gotta go crazy too.

Speaker 2 (01:02:03):
It should have make me crazy.

Speaker 6 (01:02:06):
I wanted to ask you something else about you know,
Dame Dashes doing the Supreme Team.

Speaker 3 (01:02:11):
Yeah, yeah, Kyle Kyle Sho, Kyle Preme's son. He got
Dame and he talking to Prince and uh preim he
was on the phone. Yeah, we was on the phone.
Like the reality is something anyone could tell. Pream's story
from the eighties once you get into the nineties and
that's murder ring. He's attached to the hip. I went

(01:02:32):
through the whole trial for these You know, that's really
what the public.

Speaker 1 (01:02:37):
Wants to hear about doing the Supreme Team.

Speaker 3 (01:02:40):
Yes, it was. We had man Jamie Fox, Michael j
Michael bat Jordan, Michael beat Jordan's Michael B. Jordan to
play Prince his nephew, and Jamie Fox was gonna play Preme.
We had was talking to leon Leonardo DiCaprio for the
Detective like the lead detective ro No, it's Powerhouse.

Speaker 1 (01:03:03):
A movie TV show.

Speaker 3 (01:03:04):
It was a movie. But here's what happened. Here's what happened, Earth,
Earth happened. We was irthed. He cursed out the president
of BT oh and told him he's like not black.
He didn't really curse him out. He's not black. Yeah,
I didn't want to say his name, but yeah, Scott,

(01:03:25):
I'm trying to do business over there. Scott, you heard me.
We'll get onto that next. But uh, he tells me
he's not black. You don't know this coachre uncle, all
types of stuff like that. IRV was very close with
Bob Backish. Bob Backish was the CEO of Viacom who
owns and controls BT Paramount Film, so we was getting

(01:03:46):
to deal with Paramount for this movie. The Prime Team
through Bob and Bob Earth thought he was gonna protect
him with Scott, and then Earth went there and said, IRV,
I hired him. I can't do that, and then IRV
ended up losing tails were the number one slot TV
slot on BT for our time slot for tales, and

(01:04:06):
we lose it again. We got IRVD and he lost
it because Scott took a stand, I can't work with him,
and that was the end of tails.

Speaker 1 (01:04:17):
Why do end up calling Scott White?

Speaker 3 (01:04:20):
Because IRV Okay, I'm gonna get IRV irv's visionary again.
And he had ideas about tales in different genres of music,
and he wanted to I'm gonna give Mona Scott this credit.
Shout out Mona. He wanted to love and hip hop
it what did What do I mean by loving hip hop?

(01:04:40):
Love and hip hop? New York love and hip hop,
Atlanta love and hip hop, Miami loveing hip hop? La? No,
but it's from his programming. See we're talking programming now.
So love and hip hop never stops. It's twenty it's
every day, three sixty five. When you do TV shows,
you got your hiatus, you're shooting this little bit of time,
ten ten episodes, and you're off then you come back.

Speaker 2 (01:05:00):
No, now, if I do that, I never stopped working.

Speaker 3 (01:05:04):
But then you know that's a lot of money too.
HERV was what was getting twenty five million dollars for
ten episodes, so two point five f so if you
did that times for he's talking about a hundred million
dollars deal. And that's why he's you might call someone
out of their name and if they don't see the vision.

(01:05:26):
We got a show that's working when you already proved
it out. Let's do R and B. Now, let's do
rock and roll, let's do country, let's do Latin. You know,
the concept is there, so it's like, but you know
Mona Scott, she did that with she did that with
him hip hop. Shout out mon again.

Speaker 5 (01:05:46):
She did not the reason you hear the Clash Pro League? Yes,
what is the Clash Pro League?

Speaker 3 (01:05:51):
Man? The Clash Pro League is again. I'm four decades
inside the street basketball. You know, I did so many
things in my career. When I look back, I'm like, man,
I did all of this. I can't believe it. But yeah,
for decades inside street I helped Greg Marius who ran
Ruttle Park, helped build do deals with him and build
Rutle Park to the height. You know BBC, right, that's

(01:06:11):
what they call it EBC now Entertainment Entertainer's Basketball Classic,
that's what it's called now. But yeah, I did that,
and then all these years in the middle of that,
I would always think of I dealt with I also
have a managing a sports business, so I manage athletes.
I have NBA players that I was managing football players,

(01:06:33):
managing or co asinging, managing or co aging. I would
get an agent and be his partner, bring them to
the athlete. And through all of that is what made
me start the league because I understood the again business
principal Number one, supplying demand, the supply of athletes that
are not getting jobs, that are really talented play D

(01:06:55):
one but have nowhere to go. They're playing the streetball
and they some of them do get to go over
But when you think of overseas, it's only two jobs
an American can get on each team overseas. The rest
has to be from the country that you're playing it.
So most of those jobs are taken, just like the NBA.
NBA is a four hundred and fifty players in the NBA,
and guess what, most of them are not leaving. And

(01:07:17):
then you get a new recruit. Two drafts, two rounds
every year. That's only thirty two teams, sixty four players.
Think of the March, think of March Madness, and you
understand supply every year all them teams D one talented
players but can't get a job. And I was like
we need a team in a league in New York

(01:07:39):
just started. I want to start it in New York,
but I want to franchise leagues in every city, you know,
and then really have a stronghold on that. So that's
what I did last year and went incredible. He sold
out every week short season for the attention span of disease. Right,
So I did a shortened season, only a seven game season,

(01:08:00):
agame with money. I'm paying all the players, they all
get paid, the coaches, everyone's getting paid. So it's a
real league. I based it on leagues like the Dominican
Republic or Puerto Rico. And if you look at the
Puerto Rico League, like Bad Bunny owns a team over there,
like they're pumping now the influence of a big star
and money into these teams, Puerto Rico will end up

(01:08:23):
having a very big league. The problem is they need
to accept more American players. They have to make an
adjustment from their own business because only having two Puerto
Rico's not big enough to have really that good of
players everywhere. It's just what it is. You need more
from outside to make the league more dynamic. But that's
where they're right. And then I looked at all this.
I studied this, and I said, let's start a league.

(01:08:45):
And I did it at a very cost deficient. Man
and I base the pay all of those games and
we only have a seven game series is eight teams.
Eight teams, they all play each other once once that's over, playoffs, championship,
We're done. I did a full combine. I had over
five hundred players show up and you had to fill

(01:09:05):
out a questionnaire to make sure that I know you
know how to play ball, you have a career somewhere.
I'm not just taking someone off the street.

Speaker 1 (01:09:12):
That's all nice.

Speaker 3 (01:09:13):
I killed the YMCA yesterday. No, you have to be
a real athlete. So all of these are real athletes
that played somewhere, and man, it was a huge success.
My next goal is now season two. We're starting in
March this year. I moved the date. I don't want
to do it in the summer, which is probably in

(01:09:33):
New York is the ideal time because I don't want
to cannibalize the street ball. I also helped build like
a Dytming park. Like me and King Stephen shotout Ken
stevens Man, I helped build out Dytman and now you know,
I helped them out with that indictment's out of his height,
so I understand. But I get all the players from
the high school up, so I have the farming system
basically everything right in my fingertips with clash, and then

(01:09:55):
that's what the league's about. And then it really is
about expanding. I've had meetings just now, shout out Jay,
Will you know, Kevin Durant, Carmelo Anthony, you know, Kendrick Perkins,
Fat Joe, you know, and then I got French Montana
are you. I'm using influences now for each team. Smart

(01:10:17):
you know, you guys could come in whenever you want me. No, no, seriously,
like this is business. And when I show you the
business side of it, this is multi billions of dollars.
Once I expand into multiple cities, the real part of
it would be marketing because I'm using these social media
influencers or celebrities. You know, I'm talking to Nli Chopper,

(01:10:37):
Chris Brown, Jay Cole, Yeah, because these I wanted. I
want someone with a basketball offinity.

Speaker 7 (01:10:44):
And he got it.

Speaker 3 (01:10:45):
I know, Chris Brown used to come to New York
and play with me. I used to get a basketball
city and he would come. That's how I know Chris Brown.
Before he got big, I was playing basketball. He would
come to. I would play at night with all my
guys and Chris Brown, a guy named Tam would bring
them with me and we gonna play ball everywhere.

Speaker 1 (01:11:03):
Same.

Speaker 7 (01:11:03):
That's how we meant to way back before you he
used to play with my cousins.

Speaker 3 (01:11:08):
No, but he can play ball. So someone like him.
So see, b if you listen and you see what
I'm doing, like, come holler at me because it's a
huge potential will own all of this. I mean, I know,
look Gilly and Wallow. I'm trying to get these guys
to come up. They were supposed to come last year,
but now I want to talk to him about being
owners of teams and then I could show them the

(01:11:31):
business side of that and how well they get the money.
And I'm not asking for a dollar, right, I'm giving
the teams. I'm picking the right influencers to make my league.
You know, I'm a shout out Robin from Ball Alert.
Shout out Robin. That's my girl. She's she's gonna be
one of my robbers. Yeah, so it doesn't have to
be an artist. That could be an influencer as well.

(01:11:52):
I reached out to Constaninade, all of them, jew Sky,
I reached out to everyone to see but you know,
sometimes you gotta shown. But when you see that what
I did last year, I mean the gym. We're in
a small gym. It's in Harlem, one hundred nineteenth Street
in Manhattan. It's a small gym because I want it
like the street, like you know, you go to Dykeman

(01:12:13):
and everyone's on top. I want my gym. So when
I get to where I need to, because this is
first round, I'm raising three more million dollars and it's
you know, a safe So people don't know what safes are.
I'm like, man, it's the best thing for an investor.
So if the evaluation comes in higher or lower, use
that's safe adjust for you so you never get a chance.

(01:12:33):
That's what all of the hedge, not hedge from Silicon
Valley guys, they use safe notes when they raise money
for that reason, because you don't know, I'm starting the
tech company it's worth one hundred billion. You know, what
happens he comes in is only worth for a million dollars.
It is just so your money's value more valuable than
thinking it is just for you. So that's the reason
we did the safe but three million my first round,

(01:12:55):
the first year, it was just all money, me and
a couple of investors. We paid it. But this next
one three million and the right after that, that'll cover
me for two years. I'll killed this New York area.
And then I looked to go into Baltimore, Chicago, Atlanta
with different leagues and raising another fifty two hundred million dollars.

Speaker 7 (01:13:12):
Congratulations in the league. I think that's dope.

Speaker 5 (01:13:14):
Thank you, thank you well, thank you for joining us
this morning.

Speaker 1 (01:13:17):
Good conversation.

Speaker 3 (01:13:18):
That's right. I got to talk about one more thing
before we get off. I got a movie. I'm a filmmaker, now, okay,
nice bawling. I got Lance Stephenson is my lead. Safari
Trey Cheney. Shout out to Chaney. He's the lead. He's
the lead. Not only is the lead, but he made
an incredible soundtrack. Lan Stephens the Black Drake. He's a

(01:13:44):
black drake, I promise you. He's singing and rapping on
the songs. And I couldn't believe I was gonna just
make one or two songs for the movie.

Speaker 1 (01:13:53):
Why why.

Speaker 3 (01:13:57):
Again, I asked, but you gotta come in, right, they
say he was in the movie. He's in the movie,
but he didn't come to the studio.

Speaker 1 (01:14:04):
Got you got you, you gotta come. That's probably the.

Speaker 3 (01:14:07):
Best you know, I'm gonna since you said shout out
to Fari. Sofari is not like you might think as
a person. If you get to know it. His perception
of him is really different than what he really is. No,
he's very good. He's very cool, dude, you know what
I'm saying. But yeah, we did well. He was number

(01:14:28):
one five weeks in the row on tob Go Ship
Go watch it. This out on what is it called
balling No, it's it's it's based off of an Alfred
Hitchcock movie called Diland for Murder. The way the plot
twist is, we just put the culture for today with
people like us.

Speaker 7 (01:14:48):
Know what I'm saying, Are you related?

Speaker 3 (01:14:53):
You know how many people tell me like, yeah, I
used to get that. I used to get that younger.
I used to get it young I don't get as
much then. And we just finished shooting another movie, so
Arc Films with I got two partners Andy and try
to shout out Andy Man and Dwight Rich Black Walker
you know who wrote the who wrote it with me? There?

(01:15:15):
And uh man, we're just moving in with ARC Films.
I got it. I got so many films with it.
Next year, I'll have at least seven movies out. Damn
that's twenty six. Not me.

Speaker 7 (01:15:25):
I'm not going to have seven movies. Oh are you casting?

Speaker 3 (01:15:29):
Always? We got a movie. We got one of that
where we already casted, uh right now called Raffle. We're
shooting in Miami. That's gonna be fired too, crazy, great
great cast of people already. And then ever, the director,
I mean boy wanted to you know, the producer, boy
wanted that. He's part of the part of that movie

(01:15:51):
as well.

Speaker 7 (01:15:51):
I'm always down audition man, So.

Speaker 3 (01:15:54):
I'll get your number for sure, for sure, thank you.
We have a lot of stuff coming out, you know,
and we're doing it for the black and brown. So
I'm not Latin, but I do Latin with my partner
Don de narrow Man. We just finished Spanish Fly, a
crazy movie, a comedy, you know what I'm saying. So
we got we got it all.

Speaker 4 (01:16:12):
I'm not Spanish man either, he said, he not, but
I'm not Spanish.

Speaker 3 (01:16:17):
I got a partner as Cuban and he's my partner.
He does all the Latin side for me, but I
you know, support him with everything he's doing. You know,
it's funny because on my wikipedi and someone put down
there because people could add stuff I never did. My
wicked people.

Speaker 5 (01:16:29):
He said, he does mine too all the time. He
caught me a gardener, credal minded.

Speaker 3 (01:16:33):
I'm a Dominican, so I'm christ.

Speaker 5 (01:16:41):
It's the Breakfast Club. Good morning every day.

Speaker 2 (01:16:45):
Click your ass up the Breakfast Club.

Speaker 3 (01:16:48):
Finish, y'all done