Today on The Breakfast Club, Ex-DNC Chair Jaime Harrison On Civilian Life, Biden's Decline, Toxic Democrats, New Podcast. Listen For More!
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
Every day clicks up the Breakfast Club.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Finish for y'all done morning.
Speaker 3 (00:07):
Everybody is DJ Envy just hilarious. Charlamagne the guy we
are the breakfast Club. La La Rosa is here as well.
We got a special guest in the building.
Speaker 4 (00:15):
He's at our table.
Speaker 5 (00:18):
He's an attorney.
Speaker 3 (00:19):
He's a politician and is the former chair of the
d n C Y d n C.
Speaker 5 (00:24):
Ladies and gentlemen, we have Jamie Harrison.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
Well, thank you, thank you, thank you all so much
for how are you, my Caroline bread Man. I'm good.
I'm good. You know, I'm not traveling as much like
shuddling the kids back and forth from uh soccer practice
and swimming lessons and violin lessons and all that other stuff.
Now I can just be a dad. And then I
(00:46):
got my podcast stuff, so you know, it's it's it's different,
but it's good to be able to be at home
with my kids and my wife and and you know,
of course, my blood pressure still goes up when all
those I see all this crazy shit it's happening.
Speaker 6 (01:00):
How do politicians adjust when you that transition, Like, do
you ever fully just relax?
Speaker 2 (01:05):
It's a hard adjustment. It really is, because you when
you are in the mix all the time and in
the storm, like all you know is how to deal
with like buckling down for that. And so when you
get a time where it's sort of peaceful, you don't
know what to do with yourself, right, And so you
get online and you start seeing things and it starts
(01:26):
stirring you up, and you just get a little unhinged.
And so I'm just happy that I got this, you know,
podcast and all this other stuff that I'm doing. Is
it gives me an outlet to get some of that out,
because otherwise, I mean, I just I'll be bouncing off
the walls.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
And what you saw yourself doing after being formed of
danc ship.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
You know what, Charlete, I didn't know what the hell
I wanted to do. I mean, I had hoped that
Kamala Harris would have won. And she say, Jamie, why'd
you go be ambassador over there? I don't know, there's
some you know, Yeah, so somewhere, you know, my wife
and I can relax and invit y'all over, you know,
come down to the ambassador's residence in the Bahamas and
we But I don't know, I am I didn't know
(02:07):
what I wanted to do, and I think I'm at
one of those I'll be fifty next year. I'm at
one of those midlife not a crisis, but a crossroads,
and you know, you're just trying to figure out what
I'm going to do with the next phase of my life.
And the one thing I like a Democrat.
Speaker 4 (02:23):
Oh, I've the whole party.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
Yeah, you're You're right, it is a whole party. But
you know, the one thing I do know is and
and this is the you know, it's like ten toes
down on it. I see where the country is going,
and I see so many reflections of what we grew
up in in South Carolina, and I just know that
I'm not going to allow my sons to grow up
(02:47):
in a world like my grandparents grew up in. So
I got to figure out what it is that I
have to do in order to prevent that from happening.
Because more a little by little, every day we see
something new. But that's that's my one commitment that I
know that I am definitely set on. You know, we've
got to figure out ways for this to be better,
(03:08):
because right now it's scary to.
Speaker 5 (03:10):
The chair of the DNC. What was your position? What
was your job?
Speaker 2 (03:13):
Well, you know, the chair of the DNC is very
different when you have the White House and when you
don't have the White housees break it down. So the
Democratic National Committee is, in essence, it's the organization, a
national organization for the Democratic Party. We've got fifty seven
states and territories that all have state Democratic parties and
they all work with me. Now I'm not their boss.
(03:34):
It's sort of a partnership but collaboration. And what we
really do is we're the infrastructure for the party. So
the people who knock on doors, the people who make
phone calls, the volunteers making sure that resources are on
the ground to do those type of things. And when
you have the White House, what you become is in
essence an extension of the White House political team, your boss.
(03:56):
Like instead of people say, well, you're the chair of
the Democratic Party, No, I'm a conduit in this system, right,
I get my instructions from the White House on what
to do. Now, Kim Martin, who's a new DNC chair,
he doesn't have a boss, right, because there's nobody in
the white House. When you have the White House, the
president is the head of the party. When you don't
(04:17):
have the White House, it is very diffuse, is broken down.
And so what you do at the DNC is you
build the infrastructure for the next campaigns, the next elections
that take place, like the door knockers, whether they're going
to do the party hasn't done registration really the way
that needs to. But all of those things that you
(04:37):
see on campaigns, that's what the DNC does. And it
works with his other sister committees, the d Triple C,
which is the Congressional Campaign Committee, the d SEC, which
is a Senate campaign committee. So you don't control the
whole thing. You just get a slice of the ply
and you just try to focus your energy on building
up that infrastructure.
Speaker 3 (04:56):
So there was always rumored that the DNC were the
ones that you know, quote unquote picked who they wanted.
Speaker 2 (05:03):
To be and that's that's a bunch of belonging to
stop it, Jamie Man.
Speaker 5 (05:07):
But that's what they say, that they picked somebody who president.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
I am telling you truth, tell me the power I
have to pick if I'm the DNC chair, what what
power do I have the pick? Like people say, well,
you could have told Joe Biden to not run like seriously.
Speaker 3 (05:24):
Yeah, yeah, said I could have.
Speaker 2 (05:29):
I could have. And do you think he would have listened?
This is the most powerful No? No, what about to
your point, he didn't listen. Somebody did listen to him.
He did listen to somebody. Finally, No, I think everybody
should have told him earlier. I think ultimately what the
president saw was that this fight is actually tearing the
party apart. And I don't want that to be on me.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
Stop it.
Speaker 4 (05:53):
I'm not You're not beholding to them.
Speaker 2 (05:56):
No, it's not about being beholden to too old.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
Everybody knew he was too old, But Charlotte, he should
have been a transitional president from the beginning.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
Charlotte, Man, I get all of that. I get all
of that, But you know what, somebody should have stepped up.
If people thought that Joe Biden was too old, then
some real people should have stepped up and said, you
know what, I'm gonna run.
Speaker 4 (06:15):
But.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
Y'all kick him out.
Speaker 2 (06:19):
Look is Dean feeling serious? It don't matter?
Speaker 1 (06:22):
No, No, honest, Jamie, you're acting like that is you're
acting like that is the normal process of things. Yes,
just challenge the sitting president. You know, y'all you know
y'all crucified people for that.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
But well you're telling me, you're saying, well, that's not
the normal, And you're saying, is it normal for the
DNC chair to say, mister President, you need to sit down?
Speaker 1 (06:40):
Yes, nor no, No, If George Clooney can say it,
if Charlamage can say it, if all the people who
are not in politics can say it. But y'all, Jake
taple book I read the book said everybody walked up
and you shook your hand.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
That's a bunch of you were That's a bunch of bullshit.
Speaker 1 (06:55):
I don't believe that, jameis but why don't you believe me?
Speaker 5 (06:59):
Tell people that don't know what happened.
Speaker 1 (07:01):
He said that Jake tapping. Alex Thompson wrote in that book,
Original Sitting that Biden shook the d n C chair
at the time, Jamie Harrison's and and didn't recognize who
he was.
Speaker 2 (07:11):
Jam I said that it's bullshit, because it was bullshit
every time that Joe Biden, see Joe Biden always related
me to Jim Claburn, right, So every no, but every time,
(07:32):
because you know, Joe and Jim have a really close relationship.
Now they trust each other in all, and so every
time he's gonna be like, how's Jim doing? And you
know every single time that's the that's his lead all
question how's Jim doing? And tell Jim he needs to
give me a call every single time. And so it's
what's present. By no, yes, I mean he was damn old.
(07:54):
But when you take a look at it, Charlet Mane,
when you look at what this man was trying to do,
I'd rather take an old Joe Biden on a respirator
right now than a goddamn Donald Trump right now, who's
destroying this country.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
Rhetoric, that type of rhetoric is exactly why y'all lost.
And what I mean by that is America shouldn't have
to choose between Donald Trump. Well, then people, I should
have to choose between authoritarian regime, authoritarian strategy, and an
old man on a respirator.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
Charlotte man you you you can't. You can't win something
if you don't have somebody to get into the contest
to run against.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
And if Joe Biden would have said, hey, I'm gonna
be a transitional president, I'm only gonna be here for
four years, that would have gave you as then been
a party a whole lot of time.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
But he didn't, right, That's right. We could have. If
you know, if I was six foot five or six ten,
i'd be playing basketball right now and you know, a
million dollar house. But I don't, right, So that did
not happen. So when when that did not happen, then
what you got to do is play with the cards.
It's like you're playing spade, right man. If that would
(08:57):
have gotten deuce here and this and that, then I
could have won that hand. No, you play without you
play with a hand that you dealt with, right. And
so in the end of the day, Joe Biden decided
to run. Nobody decided of significance decided to challenge him.
So therefore that is the horse that you have to ride.
Speaker 1 (09:16):
Do you put any blame on the Democratic Party because
there clearly was a lot of people who saw decline
and decided not to say anything. But if they would
have maybe ringing the alarmed and maybe other people would
have been like, you know what, I am gonna run.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
I don't know about that, to be quite honest, Charlotte Mane.
I mean, the reason why you elect the president is
to get shit done, right, that's the reason, not because
they look good in the suit, not because they're young
or old or whatever. It's to get stuff done. And
if you take a look objectively speaking, you take a
look at all that Joe Biden got done legislatively, and
(09:47):
you compare it, compare it to Ronald Reagan, you can
compare it to George W. Bush, Barack Obama, Bill Clinton.
There has not been a president that got more done
legislative than any president since Lyndon Bainshahnson.
Speaker 1 (10:00):
I agree, right, but getting things done don't win campaign sadlling, but.
Speaker 2 (10:03):
But that's why you send somebody to Washington, d C.
To get stuff done for you, to do stuff for
your community, to move things forward. And we see the
contrast now of somebody who doesn't get things done or
gets things done that actually hurts people, like like, why
send a young person? You know Jim Corbray, I remember
once when I was a young stabber staffer in his
(10:25):
office and he said, I was, I was bitching about
you know, some of these older people just need to
sit down and let some of these young folks stand up.
And he said to me, he was very quiet, he
listened to me, just rant and read and he pushed
back in the chair and he said, Jim, let me
ask you a question, which would you prefer an old,
third good marshal or a young Clarence Thomas? And I
(10:49):
sat there and I thought about it, and I said, Okay,
I see what he said. You know, yes, age is important,
but it's also about your values. It's about who you are,
what you will fight for, who you will fight for,
and so that's a part of the package. Yes, Joe
Biden was old. I get that, but we also know
that this man was committed to certain things to make
(11:10):
things better for folks. Did he do it perfectly? No,
we don't. None of us do anything perfectly right. There's
nobody that has walked with us earth that is perfect
but the Son of God and he and hopefully he'll
come back again sometime soon.
Speaker 4 (11:23):
I wouldn't waste my time.
Speaker 3 (11:26):
Well, I hate I hate the old conversation because it
just wasn't he just wasn't just affected.
Speaker 2 (11:32):
Yeah, it just wasn't affected.
Speaker 3 (11:34):
Because we know a lot of people at an eighty
year old on point. He just felt like he wasn't
on point. It felt like my recipece of my mother
in law feel like he had early signs of dementia.
She had, So the signs that I seen with her
were the signs that I was seeing with him. Forgetting names,
shaking people's hands that weren't there. It just seemed a
little bit. And it had nothing to do with old
had had to do with the fact.
Speaker 5 (11:54):
That I just didn't think he was one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (11:56):
I mean, listen, it's somebody, I agree, but you took it. No, no, no,
it's somebody who interacted with the president a lot in
twenty twenty four a lot. I mean I flew on
Air Force one to Eddie Bernice Johnson's funeral with him
from Charleston to Dallas, and we spent an hour and
a half and he basically was giving me a history
lesson of what's going on all across the world. No notes,
(12:16):
and it's just a very casual conversation. But yes, I
knew he was old, right, and he did some of
the mannerisms that old people do, but in terms of
his mental acuity and his sharpness, he knew it all.
And you better if you ask you a question, you
better know the answer to it, right. And so like
seeing the frame that was built around and then seeing
(12:39):
the reality of my interactions, my personal interactions with him.
It was not always the same, right, it wasn't. And
so that's part of my frustration is like, guys, I
understand that this guy in perfect, but you know what,
we also have a vice president. So in the end
of the day, if he can't, if he can't perform,
you got a vice president that is there who can't.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
To me, it wasn't anything his age has definitely played
a part in it, but it's the fact that Democrats
suck at messages and all the good things that somebody
like the Biden administration did, y'all didn't know how to message.
And y'all just suck at campaigning. And I think that
y'all about to make the same mistake because you're still
on some.
Speaker 4 (13:15):
We good they bad stuff.
Speaker 1 (13:17):
Clearly America don't care about that.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
Well, listen what I think we have to do on
the messaging side. One of the things the problem that
Democrats have and I say this as a party and
I said this as a party chair, is that we
send people to Washington, DC who want to get stuff done,
who are policy wonks. Many of them are really policy nerves, right.
All they want to do is they want to go
to DC. They want to write their bills, They want
(13:39):
to get something passed and solving the issue that people
in their communities are dealing with. The Republicans are reversed.
They want to go to Washington, DC to have power right,
either power to block something or power or power to
move things forward. And they know that, you know, they
don't need to be versed in all of the these
(14:00):
policies and all that, and so they just focused on
the politics of it, whereas Democrats don't like to focus
on the politics. They just like to focus on the policy.
But that's not always good because you also need the
politics part, Like you got to be able to sell
what you've been able to do. One of the things
I tried to get the president, well people in the
(14:20):
administration do is yeah, I said, miss President, And I
said this on this flight that we took. We were
down in Charleston, visited Mother Manual and then flew to Dallas.
Speaker 1 (14:29):
Is that when his pants allegedly.
Speaker 2 (14:31):
Right, Man, I don't know what the hell you're talking about.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
I'm I'm serious. They said that last time he visited
Mother Manue and meet he pooped his.
Speaker 2 (14:37):
Pan Charles Mayne you you saying something that literally, that's
that's crazy, that's crazy. That's some crazy talk. Because I
was again with the President all day. We even went
to what's the soul food restaurant that we went. Yeah, yeah,
sometimes I'm not even joke.
Speaker 1 (14:55):
I heard that they said last time you did is
that he pooped his band man. He said he was
taking so long to come out. So local law enforcement
was asking to seek the service, what's going on? And
somebody's secret service said, look, President just.
Speaker 5 (15:06):
Shot it.
Speaker 6 (15:09):
Headlines asking they're trying to figure out that he poop
his pan.
Speaker 2 (15:12):
That's crazy.
Speaker 1 (15:13):
I just I'm not. I'm not, No, guys, it's not
a secret.
Speaker 2 (15:17):
I never heard exactly yelling crazy. Absolutely crazy as hell.
It's just crazy.
Speaker 5 (15:28):
Let's let me get to my story.
Speaker 2 (15:31):
Hell, what was I trying to say? Anyway, before sharlow
Man and the pooping the paint learn.
Speaker 4 (15:35):
About something, man, so the administration to do something on.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
The flight so so, because part of it is about
selling what you do. And I told the President because
as I went across the country, people weren't connected. We
passed all the stuff, but people weren't connected to the
stuff that we actually passed, like the student loan stuff.
There are a lot of people who qualified for all
of the student loan relief, but they didn't know how
(16:02):
to get it right. And so I said, well, Miss President,
why don't And I said, the DNC can actually do this.
We can open up we can call them Biden Empowerment
Centers all across the country, basically where people could come
in and say, I'm trying to get some of that
Biden student loan money. I'm trying to figure out how
to do a small business twenty thousand dollars at small
(16:24):
business grants, but I don't know how to get that money.
I'm trying to do something on in terms of the
broadband and all of the other stuff. And I said,
you can have these all across the country so that
people are now then connected to the resources that you
were actually bringing bringing into the community, because part of
the problem is that people didn't know how to get
it right. You had the money there, but can't people
(16:47):
can't access it. And he was like, Oh, that's a
great idea. That's a great idea. I thought it was
going to move forward. I thought that we would do
something about it. But the one thing that I'm writing
about this now, in my book, the one problem that
you have is like, if these ideas don't come from
certain people that are in the sort of universes around
the president or the vice president, then they never see
(17:09):
the light of day. They never they never crystallize. And
that is part of the fundamental problems that we have
right now within our party is that we got to
break through some of these things. You've got these gatekeepers
who want all of the power, all of the control,
all of the influence, and don't want other voices to
come break in to say, you know, we're not doing
(17:29):
this right. We need to talk to these people, We
need to bring these people into the room. And so
that's part of my big frustration as DNC chair. It
was that, you know, there are a lot of things
that we want to do a lot of bells that
we were ringing very early on about this group, this group,
that group, but the president or the vice president never
actually really heard them because the gatekeepers kept that information
(17:50):
from them.
Speaker 1 (17:51):
You know, did you start your podcast at our table
because you wanted to kind of counter I guess the manisphere? Yes.
Speaker 2 (17:58):
No, No, what I wanted to do is I wanted
to build our own frame, right I get so tired of.
Speaker 1 (18:05):
Our fast I love how that South Carolina came out
of you and you told the truth initially. Now you're
giving us no, yes, and then you're like, well, actually no.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
But what I want to do is build our own frame,
because what I got tired of is, you know, we
would have our Democratic candidates who were going to seeing
in on MSNBC. They get five minutes to talk about whatever,
and then the media itself would build a frame to
define who that person was, right. And it's the same
reason why I had Hunter Biden on my on my podcast,
who was one of the first interviews, because you could
(18:34):
say Hunter Biden, and all you know about Hunter Biden
is what you heard on Fox News from people who
oppose them, or maybe something that you may have read
from somebody in from the administration. But you never heard
the man talk in his own words. You never heard
him go out and defend what he did or to
accept blame for what he did. You never heard him
(18:55):
talk about his father and defend his father and all
that stuff. And I don't always feel like people of a
vehicle so that they can put in their own words
where they are and then and then you can make
a decision based off of that. But but what you
see right now and politics really is that the media
will build a frame. Like when I launched my podcast,
they said Jamie Harrison, uh uh, gonna be the Joe
(19:18):
Rogan of the left. I never uttered Joe Rogan's name, right,
But the media wants to create these dynamics and this
and that, Like I've never watched Joe Rogan show other
than little clips online. I don't want to be anybody
but Jamie Harrison, and I want to have my show
to talk about the things that I think are important
(19:38):
that I think people in the community want to talk about.
Speaker 1 (19:41):
As a person who you know, have to focus on
campaigns and stuff. How much influence do you think that
those podcasts are even celebrity has on you know, candidates, Well,
you know, everybody says he won the election because he
went on all these different you know, the theovonnes, the
flagrants and show.
Speaker 2 (19:59):
I think those things we have an influence on the margins.
Speaker 1 (20:01):
Right.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
There are a lot of people, know who now get
their media and their news from social media and podcasts
and clips that they see on TikTok and Instagram and
all those different things, and so understanding that. You know,
most people these days, they get the bit of information
that they do consume either through a little headline or
(20:22):
they see a little clip for fifteen or twenty seconds.
And so knowing that that means then the party has
to adapt itself to understanding that's where the electorate is,
that's how they're getting their information. And it is hard
as hell. It's like, you know, trying to turn a
battleship to get the party to understand like where things
are going and what you got to do. And so
(20:44):
you know, I wanted to start when I was DNC chair.
I wanted to start a YouTube channel called DTV where
we could have had shows at the DNC. We had
this beautiful studio in the basement of the DNC where
we could have shows and we can bring in the
Jasmine Crocketts of the AOCS and all that, and different
voices in the party that reflected the diversity of party
and talk about our stuff in our own words. But
(21:08):
I got from some of the folks in the White House, well,
we shouldn't spend resources on.
Speaker 4 (21:11):
That, right.
Speaker 1 (21:13):
How come Merrick Garland doesn't get any smoke.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
He should get plenty of smoke. I wish, I wish
Doug Jones would have. I thought that was the biggest
mistake of the Biden administration, appointing Merrick Garland. And it's
because we always want to be like the above the fray.
We always want to be like, well, let's do it
by the book, let's do it academic. But sometimes shit,
(21:36):
you got to fight, right, yeah, you just you just
got to fight. And I wish Doug Jones or somebody
of that ILK would have been the attorney general because
Mary Garland was awful. He was abysmally awful.
Speaker 1 (21:48):
He didn't investigate the Epstein FI dropped the ball and
indicted Trump too late on January sixth, because he didn't
want to seem.
Speaker 2 (21:54):
Too get political.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
Meanwhile, Trump and Trump's out here like I'm locking all
y'all up, like in all my political.
Speaker 2 (22:01):
Chris Christy Bolton, everybody, Obama dog.
Speaker 1 (22:05):
I mean, why weren't y'all saying things like that?
Speaker 2 (22:07):
Though?
Speaker 1 (22:07):
Like why when at the head and I'm not saying
you even got to say it publicly?
Speaker 2 (22:11):
No, no, no, Well then listen, there were times in
which you know, I said to the prison or said
to the Vice president, or said to the staff certain
things like, you know, I remember having conversation with Anita
Donne on the TikTok stuff. I was like, that is
dumb as hell for us in an election cycle to
be going after TikTok. I was like, y'all, wait until
if you're gonna do something like that, do it after
(22:32):
elect Like sometimes politically stuff when you know that young people,
that's where they're getting their information, you know, that's what
they want. Like why are we doing that? Like why
are we trying to do these things that make it
even more difficult for us to win?
Speaker 4 (22:46):
Yeah, but that's frivolous stuff.
Speaker 1 (22:47):
I'm talking about things like, hey, why isn't Merrick Garland
going after this person that y'all told us is an
extensive threat who we saw leading attempt to cool this
country on January sixth, President Biden, why are you saying
things like you don't want, you know, to investigate that matter. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (23:01):
Well, because you know, Biden also again being eighty years old,
coming from a different time in terms of our government,
he was old school in terms of looking at you know,
the difference or the line between the White House and
the Justice Department. I mean, that's the way that things
used to operate, but we now know that we're in
a different era, like there's a different frame, and we
(23:22):
see that Trump has turned all of that on his head,
and that sometimes you got to lean in and lean
in heavily on some of these things, and you got
to get somebody over there who is not just who
sees justice as being blind, but also is not politically
naive as well. And that's part of the part of
(23:42):
the problem with Mary Garland. I mean, I had problems
with Mary Garland, and Barack Obama nominated him to go
to the Supreme Court instead of nominating the black woman
that time around, Right, I thought that was a perfect
opportunity for us to get a black woman on the
Supreme Court. But again we wanted we we always are
as a party. We're always thinking ourselves out of things, Right,
(24:05):
So the calculus was, well, let's find some middle of
the road guy that the Republicans are not going to oppose.
And guess what they did. They opposed him.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
In hindsight, you admitted it already, you said Mary Garland
was ter he was terrible. Why can't you say that
in regards to Biden not being a one term president?
Speaker 2 (24:24):
Well, because because I listen, those two things are the
reason Trump is back in the White House. I I
really listen, man, if folks would have And this is
the amazing difference between Democrats and Republicans. Trump got convicted
thirty four times, convicted, felon, thirty four times, convicted fela.
Did you hear a peep from the Republican Party the
(24:46):
next day saying that Donald Trump should not be our nominee.
Speaker 1 (24:49):
No, because they knew he could win. That's the difference.
There were so many of us who knew Biden no.
Speaker 2 (24:54):
No, But that's no, no, no, How how did they
know that he couldn't that he could win when he
lost in twenty twenty?
Speaker 1 (25:00):
Who Trump? Because you could clearly see the momentum between
the two candles. You know, we all had this combination.
Speaker 2 (25:06):
Momentum in politics schools, just like it goes just like that.
Speaker 3 (25:10):
But you could see that they was messing with by the.
Speaker 6 (25:15):
Reason people thought Kamala was gonna, you know, make this
breakfast because of the moment on.
Speaker 2 (25:21):
At the same time, at the same time as trump conviction.
That was around the same period that Joe Biden gave
that State of the Union speech when everybody was like,
oh god damn, that was a good State of Union speech.
I have not heard a better State of Union speech
than that time.
Speaker 4 (25:36):
No, I never thought he could win well.
Speaker 2 (25:39):
Regardless of whether you thought or not his numbers were good.
It was.
Speaker 1 (25:45):
Him getting through it.
Speaker 6 (25:46):
I'm from Delaware, number yeah, it was the original man.
Speaker 2 (25:53):
The original sin is a bunch of ship. I mean
that's talking about keep going. Come on, I mean, like
Alex Thompson and Jake Tapper.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
Seriously, I'm just telling you what I Seriously, I don't know.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
Why a bunch of anonymous sources because nobody wants to
go on record to say anything anonymous sources. I can't
tell you. In my book there won't be anonymous sources.
It is straight for me. I'm listening.
Speaker 1 (26:17):
Whoever the future of the party is, whoever's going to
lead the Democratic Party.
Speaker 2 (26:21):
And the DNC won't pick them?
Speaker 1 (26:22):
You American people, will you have to be able to
throw that old regime under the bus. The You're gonna
have to You're gonna have to be willing to throw
that old regime under the bus and talk about all
the things that they got wrong.
Speaker 2 (26:34):
Yep, But why don't we talk about this is the
thing let's talk about the stuff that we're getting right.
Part of the reason that the brand for the party
is there are a lot of reasons the brand for
the party is suffering, but part of the reason is
that we are always like if you look at the
Republican side on the flip side, they are not talking about, well, well,
we're getting this, we got this wrong the last time,
and we get this wrong. Man, they get ship run
(26:56):
all the time, but no, but they don't talk about it.
Part of reason why they win is because they're not
talking about It's like you got a brand new car
and every day you throw mud on it, and then
after three months you'd be like, why is my car
not shining anymore? It's because you damn you throw mud
on it every every month. Like Republicans don't throw mud
on their car, but Democrats, man, we will. We will
(27:16):
hand and ring and be like, oh, I wish we
would have done us, and I wish we'd done that. Lean,
lean into what you do and that you are doing well,
and have that.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
Be your lead instead of being the party of purity.
Well I don't know about the walk around and act
like you the party and y'all don't get anything wrong.
You don't lie about nothing, then people are going to
hold you to it.
Speaker 2 (27:37):
We can't be the party of purity on one side,
and then you then whine and complain about all the
stuff that we get wrong the next time. That's those
two things can't coexist in the same space.
Speaker 5 (27:47):
So what do you like in twenty twenty eight? What
candidate is? Do you like in twenty twenty eight?
Speaker 2 (27:53):
To be honest, I don't know yet. I really don't
know yet. I mean, there's gonna be so many people
who come through South Caro. No, I mean.
Speaker 1 (28:05):
Person people love that US Democrats don't know whether they're
coming and going. This is terrible.
Speaker 2 (28:11):
Well, come on, man, this is the same stuff that
happening happened in twenty twenty. This is the same stuff
that happened in two thousand and eight. It's the same
stuff that happened, I mean right after Yeah, in two
thousand and eight when the brock Abam you had like
twelve people run. Then you had twenty people run in
twenty twenty.
Speaker 1 (28:28):
There's a lot of formidable candidates out there. The problem
is the Democratic brand is so toxic and disgusting and bad.
Speaker 2 (28:35):
It's because we sit here and talk about how toxic
and bad it is instead of talking about the good
stuff that we actually do. Man, that's part of the
problem again, Like your brand is going to be bad
if every day all you do is talk about how bad.
Speaker 4 (28:48):
Things got it wrong on the border.
Speaker 2 (28:50):
Oh yeah, there are things that we should have done
batter on the border. Yes, I agree with.
Speaker 1 (28:53):
Do you think they got it wrong talking about bidernomics
when they know that people weren't feeling that in their pockets,
and they know that people weren't feeling that, you know.
Speaker 2 (29:00):
I think what they should have done is what I
said earlier, which is connecting the economics people to the
economic stuff that they got done. Then I think people
would have felt better about it, right because they know
that this stuff was going on, Like you know, all
these stimulus checks, like the Biden stimulus checks were far
bigger than the stimulus checks coming to Donald Trump. He
should have and that's one of the things he regrets.
(29:22):
He said, I wish I would have left. And this
is a lesson we should have learned in Obama because
you all remember when Obama was president, we passed that
big stimulus bill and then all this money was flowing
into all this other stuff, and Obama did not put
didn't take credit for it. He did not take credit
for it. So you had thought then Democrats would have
learned from eight and twenty to do better. But we don't.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
One thing. We know.
Speaker 4 (29:47):
Democrats don't learn, no, be.
Speaker 2 (29:51):
We can be a bit hard headed in that, but
I'm hoping and I think this new generation of Democrats
that we have, who are scrappy, who are willing to fight,
willing to do what is necessary, will learn the lessons
from It's just hard.
Speaker 1 (30:06):
To believe y'all, Jamie now, simply because we know what
y'all watched the last four years. Even when I see
somebody like Karen John Pierre come out with her book
and I'm like, you sat up there and lied for
him all of this time, and now you want to
be honest and say you were an independent And it's
to say all of y'all did that for the last
four years.
Speaker 2 (30:22):
Man and Charlot Mane, I ain't lied about I ain't
live about damn thing.
Speaker 1 (30:26):
Well, you ain't tell the truth. We just kept quiet.
Speaker 5 (30:28):
Okay, don't let him talk to you like that.
Speaker 6 (30:31):
Come on, man, did you try to tell the truth
and they just didn't listen because I also saw that
you said you were taking for granted you were a
rubber stamp.
Speaker 2 (30:38):
So were you.
Speaker 6 (30:38):
Telling the truth and him?
Speaker 4 (30:39):
So what were you telling the truth about?
Speaker 2 (30:40):
Well, telling the truth about where we are, where the
electric was, things that we needed to do. I mean
when I tell you, this job in many ways great
opportunity to connect with folks, but also extremely frustrating because
you can see the things. It's almost like you see
a car wreck that's happening, and you're yelling and screaming,
(31:02):
and it's like nobody's listening, right because only again the
select few. There's people in the bubble who thought they
know better. I give you a perfect example. I have
here Ernie, who's helping me write my book. And I
remember you all remember the January sixth and all, So
the anniversary of January sixth was in twenty twenty two,
(31:25):
and I wanted this ad and after the show, I'll
play it for you guys, this ad that really goes
after the Republicans on January sixth. And I wanted the
DNC to play this ad because you know, I told
the folks at the White House, I said, I want
you all to know that black folks are watching how
we handle this situation, because we know if all those
(31:46):
people who broke into the Capitol beat the shit out
of the police officers, defecated all over the walls and
the floors, and did all this stuff, if those folks
were black, it would have been the bloodiest day in
the history of this absolutely. And I told the folks
at the White House my conduit, I said, black folks
are watching, and how we Democrats handle the situation. Are
(32:09):
we going to be forceful in terms of pushing back
against it and making sure that we hold people accountable
for it, or are we gonna brush it on the
on the rug? And I was told when I had
this ad, and the ad was it wasn't as hard.
I knew that they wouldn't go for the real hard
ad that I wanted, so it was sort of a
mid level but it went in a little bit, but
a mid level ad. And they were like, well, we
(32:31):
don't think the DNC needs to do that. We don't
need to focus on that right now. And my pushback
to them is, folks, I want you to understand this,
like we are trying. We need to send a signal
to our folks that we see you, we hear you.
We're gonna fight for you, and just as hard as
the Republicans are fighting against you, we're gonna be fighting
(32:52):
for you. Like this, by brushing that under the rug
and saying, well, we shouldn't talk about that right now,
let's talk about bidonomics or something to that extent, I
mean that is sending the signal to our folks, is that, Yo.
Speaker 5 (33:05):
You know you really don't give it damn a perceptions question?
What do you feel he's not being truthful about? But
he said you don't feel like he's being truthful?
Speaker 1 (33:12):
What do you think he's not being truthful about the
condition that they know President Biden was in?
Speaker 2 (33:16):
No man, I just I just fund you can ask
anybody he asked my wife. I just fundamentally disagree with that.
Like it just.
Speaker 1 (33:23):
Pisses hard for me to believe that it just like
us who've I've never met Joe Biden just watching him
on television, cancel. It's just crazy that all of us
can come to this conclusion. But y'all, I was calling
for him to step down in twenty twenty three for
no other reason other than you will not win the
election in November.
Speaker 2 (33:43):
Charlotte mane like, of course, Like I've been on record,
he's old. I get it. He is old. He walks.
You know he's old.
Speaker 1 (33:53):
It wasn't just about that.
Speaker 5 (33:54):
It's not just about it.
Speaker 1 (33:55):
No, But there's a lot of things right, Like there's
a perception that the DNC is too tied, the corporate
donors specially.
Speaker 2 (34:00):
Man, that's bullshit too. Okay, tell me pull the records,
pull the receipts. If we're tired. If we're tired the
corporate donors, pull the receipts.
Speaker 4 (34:10):
How much money do we get from democratic book?
Speaker 2 (34:13):
I don't know because I never talked to a packing
my four years as DNC chair.
Speaker 1 (34:17):
Wow, okay, the party claim for working people while taking
so much money from Wall Street in Silicon Valley?
Speaker 4 (34:24):
Where where do we tell me that?
Speaker 1 (34:26):
You're right?
Speaker 2 (34:28):
Now? I am telling because exitly you're giving me a
talking point, Charlottage, But give me the receipt Show me
the amount of money that we have gotten from from
corporate donors. Show show the.
Speaker 1 (34:39):
Hold on, hold on. I can't believe you.
Speaker 2 (34:42):
No, show show me.
Speaker 1 (34:43):
That hold on.
Speaker 2 (34:44):
Hold on now, mind you, the DNC raised h the
d n C couple with campaign raise over billion dollars.
Tell me how much of that billion dollars that we
got from corporate donors?
Speaker 1 (34:55):
Hold on one second, Hold on one second, you're holding,
we're holding.
Speaker 6 (35:02):
I feel like you're playing space and somebody just trying
to find.
Speaker 4 (35:06):
Trying to find I have I have it up.
Speaker 1 (35:14):
Now combined spending on just congressional races in two thousand.
Speaker 2 (35:21):
I'm saying the d n C. I'm not saying congressional races.
Speaker 4 (35:24):
I'm like you d democrat.
Speaker 2 (35:26):
No, you said the d n C. What you said
is democrats. You said the d n C.
Speaker 1 (35:30):
No, I didn't.
Speaker 4 (35:31):
I think the DNC roll the tape.
Speaker 1 (35:33):
I don't know what he said.
Speaker 4 (35:35):
You said the Democrats.
Speaker 2 (35:36):
Okay, democrats, because you're saying that the.
Speaker 4 (35:42):
So let me ask ask the question.
Speaker 1 (35:43):
There's a perception that Democrat politicians are too tied the
corporate donors and special interests. So how can the party
claim to fight for working people while taking so much money?
Speaker 2 (35:52):
Well, there there are some Democrats in Congress who do
take corporate pat dollars like they do, and in part
of their fundraising that happens. But when it like, I
can't control what individual members do, right, But in the
end of the day, you know, if these people are
still passing health care and passing that they're not fighting
(36:16):
for tax cuts for these wealthy corporations and all that
they're actually trying to increase the taxes on some of
these folks. It's kind of hard to say that these
people aren't fighting for their constituents. Man, Right, So again,
like I can only control what I can control within
my sphere, right. I know what the DNC did and
what I tried to push the DNC to do in
(36:38):
my time, which is focus on working people, focusing on
people like my grandparents, focusing on people like my aunts
and my uncles and my cousins and nieces and nephews
in South Carolina, trying to make life better for them.
That's the party that I was happy and proud to
be the chair of.
Speaker 1 (36:57):
Yeah, was there a private deal between the DNC and
the Harris campaign that you would cover twenty million dollars
in her buildings?
Speaker 2 (37:05):
Knowledge so so basically, and I saw Shane's the newspaper article.
So looking at the finances for there are some joint
finances between the DNC and a presidential campaign. When they
come together, they create what it's called a joint fundraising committee.
So there's things bills that they share, right, so some polling,
(37:26):
some advertising, some some things, so that they can jointly
fundraise money. And that's I know that your your folks
are going to get a little eyes gleazed. That is
because they form a joint feund reason committee because that
allows them to raise more money collectively than they could
as individuals.
Speaker 1 (37:44):
Right.
Speaker 2 (37:45):
It allows them, the DNC to go to some of
its the donors who can write a million dollar chat, right,
and then they send that money to the DNC. It's discovered, No,
they're individuals, folks, that individual can write a million Yes,
individuals can write million dollar checks. Because the way that
the finance laws and that's something that we really need
(38:06):
to take a look at. But the way that finance
laws work is there's a certain amount that they can
give to the DNC, there's a certain amount they can
give to every state party, and all of that money
is collective and then we can use that money on
behalf of the presidential cannon. So it's a joint fundraising committee.
So that means and sometimes there are joint fundraising expenses
that come out of it, So expenses that we share.
(38:28):
So coming off of Kammalos Race, there were some things,
some outstanding bills that we still had that were joint
bills together between the DNC and the Commalas Race, and
our agreement was to pay the remaining of some of
those bills.
Speaker 1 (38:44):
Was it twenty million?
Speaker 2 (38:45):
No, When I left, it was about five So now
I can't speak to about any other whatever. But when
I left, it was about five million dollars, which in
the grand scheme of things, five million dollars is a
lot for us as individuals. But in this campaign, universe,
do you think.
Speaker 1 (39:02):
We need to drop hundred dollars?
Speaker 2 (39:04):
Yes, okay, I do believe. I do believe that we
need massive and we would have done that had we
passed the John Lewis and all the other bills that
Democrats voted unanimously for in the House, but we couldn't
get it past the Senate because of filibuster, because of
Mansion in Cinema. So I do believe that, Listen, I
(39:24):
raised one hundred and thirty two million dollars when I
ran for USENT. I mean, when I think about how
much money that is and what that could have done
in South Carolina, that's sinful that amount of money one
hundred and thirty two million dollars. I think we need
to cap them out that we use in our election.
No other country on the face of this planet spends
as much money in campaigns as we do.
Speaker 1 (39:43):
Is the DNC beholding to billionaires too much? Are just
wealthy people in general? No, I mean, because there's no
there's no working class person writing a million dollars.
Speaker 2 (39:50):
No, No, But the bulk of the money that the
DNC raises is from folks who have given five to
ten dollars, like the sheer volume about probably about thirty
percent of the d's money that it gets. It comes
from major dollar donors, right, people who can write twenty
five thousand above the number of people who can write
a million dollar check. Maybe it's one hundred to two
(40:13):
hundred people like, it's not it's not a lot. And
those people basically, you know, I've met with many of
our large donors. They're not asking for anything policy wise,
because the DNC is not a policy arm Like we
don't write policy of the DNC. The money that we
use goes into the infrastructure of the party, and so
many of those folks don't have any type of ask
(40:35):
other than when and we don't want to see Republicans
take over.
Speaker 1 (40:39):
Why am I getting your subset?
Speaker 4 (40:41):
I didn't sign up for.
Speaker 1 (40:43):
What did you give money to the DNC?
Speaker 2 (40:46):
Were you on my Were you on my email list
from my campaign? Yeah? I mean listen, Yeah, we have
a cap No, no, well listen, we work with substack
on my list right, Basically, what I use was my
campaign list. If you if you subscribe to my campaign
(41:06):
or you help my campaign out, remember I mean I
have an email list of over seven million people coming
off of my campaign. That's because again, we raised one
hundred and thirty two million dollars and a lot of
people wanted to send lends a Graham home. And so
now since I'm on Substack now, since I got my
at and we haven't talked about at our table the podcast,
(41:26):
make sure you go with Yeah, wherever you get your podcasts,
make sure you subscribe. But so basically, and I'm writing
every week. Every week I'm writing a piece about Last
week I wrote one about identity the quote unquote identity politics.
This week I have one on how the two thousand
and six elections in the twenty twenty six elections May
(41:47):
mirror each other, so we're doing that on a weekly basis.
So do you think if folks don't want it just unsubscribed?
Speaker 1 (41:53):
I mentioned a PAK earliert, I want to bring it
up again. Do you think APAK and like other powerful
lobbies like that have too much influence over Democrat leaders?
Speaker 2 (42:00):
I think there's no I think APAC has a lot
of power over both parties, right, or people in both
parties Because I don't want to use the party as
a whole as a label, there are people in the
parties in which APAC is very influential on, in both
(42:22):
the Democratic Party and the Republican Party, and so you know,
organizations like that probably do have a little too much influence.
And the only way that we curved at is to
change the campaign finance laws in this country so that
is more grassroots focus and oriented and less about these
(42:42):
big packs that have come up. I think one of
the worst things was a Citizen's United decision because they
made it into a wild wild West and allowed folks
with who could raise these money, this money unlimited influence
to impact elections, to impact campaigns, to influence our members
of So I mean, I think if Democrats can take
(43:03):
back the House and the Senate, but also get past
the filibuster because a big problem that we have right
now is a lot of bills that we wanted to
pass to curb some of the stuff. You can't because
it gets filibuster in the US Senate.
Speaker 1 (43:16):
If Democrats lose again in twenty twenty six or twenty
twenty eight, should the party completely rethink it's leadership structure,
even the role of the DNC itself.
Speaker 2 (43:26):
I mean, I Charlamagne, I mean, in the history's country,
you went to the DNC's I think it's one hundred
and seventy years old. You're gonna win elections, You're gonna
lose elections. I mean, winning elections and losing an election
didn't something new that happened?
Speaker 4 (43:41):
Right? Different though, So you got some you gotta admit
this is different.
Speaker 2 (43:46):
I mean Donald Trump is different.
Speaker 1 (43:48):
Right.
Speaker 2 (43:49):
The question is, once Trump's gone, does it go back
to the way that it has gone to pass? I don't.
I mean, that's a big question. I don't know that.
But one of the things I tell folks is, yes,
there's an urgency of the moment, but like you can't
freak out about like all you know, all hell's gone
(44:10):
loose in terms of like the parties and how they operate. Right,
I do think there's some fundamental changes that need to happen.
I think, you know, when I go back to the DNC,
part of what I want to do is put some
reforms in to separate out, to give the DNC a
wall between a presidential campaign and the DNC, or a
president and the DNC, because I think the DNC has
(44:32):
to focus more, not just on the White House, but
on the entirety of the party. And I don't think
we do that when we have the White House.
Speaker 1 (44:39):
And I just want to ask you to be clear.
So you said the DNC has never taken corporate dollars
in the past.
Speaker 2 (44:43):
No, the DNC. I mean, I don't know if there
is some no corporate Pac money. There may be some
corporate Pac money. Said no, no, no, no, You said
that the d n C was controlled by corporate Pac money.
If there is corporate Pac money, it's probably less than
five percent cent of the money.
Speaker 4 (45:01):
Uh that the money influence.
Speaker 2 (45:05):
But what what do you mean? Like you throwing out buzzwords,
but I don't know what you how you mean?
Speaker 1 (45:11):
Question?
Speaker 4 (45:11):
No, they have never taken any Corporate PA money.
Speaker 2 (45:14):
DNC has taken Corporate pac money in the past. I mean,
all of the parties have taken money.
Speaker 4 (45:19):
But when you look at me that they're not controlled.
Speaker 2 (45:21):
They're not They're not controlled by that, right because if
it's a small percentage, I mean, and like, yeah, I
can give you a dollar, that doesn't mean you're going
to do what I told you for if for that dollar,
because I know you're getting paid a whole lot more, right. Yeah.
Speaker 5 (45:34):
Well, if you want more of this, you can check
out his new podcast.
Speaker 4 (45:37):
At Our Table At Our Table, and.
Speaker 1 (45:40):
Also check out Jamie Harrison's documentary In the Bubble that
I executive produced.
Speaker 2 (45:43):
Yes, Emily in the Buildings Emily Harrald.
Speaker 3 (45:47):
Clearly she didn't want to be on camera, Okay, I
shot it her rout put it on camera right.
Speaker 4 (45:52):
Well, sorry, it was a pleasure, Jamie.
Speaker 1 (45:53):
Don't be arange.
Speaker 2 (45:54):
No, I would love to come back and when the
book comes out, but in Charlemagne, I do. I would
love to have you, you know, as my South Carolina homeboy,
be a guest on at our Table. Let me ask
you a question.
Speaker 1 (46:05):
I'd love to do it. I enjoyed your conversation with Hunter, but.
Speaker 2 (46:09):
No, it was good. It was really good. And it
was good to get Hunter unfiltered. And uh, he had
a lot to say. I had a lot to say.
And and I think he's a you know, he's a
good guy. He just yeah, and and maybe I don't
I don't know, if it's just look I had I
(46:30):
have family members who had drug addiction issues and problems, right,
and and very honest. And they're very honest. They're very honest.
And what just say it, Jamie, No, No, I'm just saying,
like honest, man, Jesus Christ, dude, you just say it, dude.
(46:52):
Come on, It's okay, it's okay.
Speaker 1 (46:54):
What honest some of the most honestly. But I've learned
some of the best advice ever.
Speaker 2 (46:59):
Yeah. But but but we don't need to be like derogatory.
You're saying in a fashion to be derogator or you know,
sometimes folks just fall down, No, man, come on, man,
sometimes people just fall down, right, and it's it's about
all of us to help them get back up, absolutely right.
But I'm not going to go around and be like
derogatory to people.
Speaker 1 (47:19):
I don't know, I don't know, derogatory, crack cracket, what else?
Speaker 5 (47:23):
We call them crackit.
Speaker 2 (47:26):
You can call them addicts.
Speaker 1 (47:27):
Right Political did an article saying there's a new memo
that identifies forty five words and phrases for Democrats to avoid.
Speaker 4 (47:34):
What are your thoughts on this?
Speaker 1 (47:36):
You don't speak plain.
Speaker 2 (47:37):
No, but but come on now?
Speaker 5 (47:40):
Are these some of the words that they tell you
can't use?
Speaker 2 (47:42):
Yep, yeah, this gender, Man, I don't know what. I
don't know what. Half of that stuff is exactly neoliberal.
I mean, they come up with all kinds of stuff,
but it's the academic part.
Speaker 4 (47:56):
Of the atics.
Speaker 1 (47:59):
I'm trying to figure it out. I want to I
want to learn the right thing to say.
Speaker 5 (48:03):
User.
Speaker 2 (48:05):
I don't know you you know how we use crackheaded home,
I use crackheads.
Speaker 1 (48:13):
I use come on now, man, get a crackhead a
couple of dollars to come FI cut the grass. But
that's not a bad thing, I said, I learned a
lot from people who used to How about this, I've
learned a lot from people who used to use crack.
I have used crack, just used drugs. Jamie was Jamie
when she never came here.
Speaker 5 (48:31):
It's the breakfast Club. Good morning every day.
Speaker 4 (48:35):
Up, Wake click your ass up. The breakfast club you
don't finish for y'all done.
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
Every day clicks up the Breakfast Club.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Finish for y'all done morning.
Speaker 3 (00:07):
Everybody is DJ Envy just hilarious. Charlamagne the guy we
are the breakfast Club. La La Rosa is here as well.
We got a special guest in the building.
Speaker 4 (00:15):
He's at our table.
Speaker 5 (00:18):
He's an attorney.
Speaker 3 (00:19):
He's a politician and is the former chair of the
d n C Y d n C.
Speaker 5 (00:24):
Ladies and gentlemen, we have Jamie Harrison.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
Well, thank you, thank you, thank you all so much
for how are you, my Caroline bread Man. I'm good.
I'm good. You know, I'm not traveling as much like
shuddling the kids back and forth from uh soccer practice
and swimming lessons and violin lessons and all that other stuff.
Now I can just be a dad. And then I
(00:46):
got my podcast stuff, so you know, it's it's it's different,
but it's good to be able to be at home
with my kids and my wife and and you know,
of course, my blood pressure still goes up when all
those I see all this crazy shit it's happening.
Speaker 6 (01:00):
How do politicians adjust when you that transition, Like, do
you ever fully just relax?
Speaker 2 (01:05):
It's a hard adjustment. It really is, because you when
you are in the mix all the time and in
the storm, like all you know is how to deal
with like buckling down for that. And so when you
get a time where it's sort of peaceful, you don't
know what to do with yourself, right, And so you
get online and you start seeing things and it starts
(01:26):
stirring you up, and you just get a little unhinged.
And so I'm just happy that I got this, you know,
podcast and all this other stuff that I'm doing. Is
it gives me an outlet to get some of that out,
because otherwise, I mean, I just I'll be bouncing off
the walls.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
And what you saw yourself doing after being formed of
danc ship.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
You know what, Charlete, I didn't know what the hell
I wanted to do. I mean, I had hoped that
Kamala Harris would have won. And she say, Jamie, why'd
you go be ambassador over there? I don't know, there's
some you know, Yeah, so somewhere, you know, my wife
and I can relax and invit y'all over, you know,
come down to the ambassador's residence in the Bahamas and
we But I don't know, I am I didn't know
(02:07):
what I wanted to do, and I think I'm at
one of those I'll be fifty next year. I'm at
one of those midlife not a crisis, but a crossroads,
and you know, you're just trying to figure out what
I'm going to do with the next phase of my life.
And the one thing I like a Democrat.
Speaker 4 (02:23):
Oh, I've the whole party.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
Yeah, you're You're right, it is a whole party. But
you know, the one thing I do know is and
and this is the you know, it's like ten toes
down on it. I see where the country is going,
and I see so many reflections of what we grew
up in in South Carolina, and I just know that
I'm not going to allow my sons to grow up
(02:47):
in a world like my grandparents grew up in. So
I got to figure out what it is that I
have to do in order to prevent that from happening.
Because more a little by little, every day we see
something new. But that's that's my one commitment that I
know that I am definitely set on. You know, we've
got to figure out ways for this to be better,
(03:08):
because right now it's scary to.
Speaker 5 (03:10):
The chair of the DNC. What was your position? What
was your job?
Speaker 2 (03:13):
Well, you know, the chair of the DNC is very
different when you have the White House and when you
don't have the White housees break it down. So the
Democratic National Committee is, in essence, it's the organization, a
national organization for the Democratic Party. We've got fifty seven
states and territories that all have state Democratic parties and
they all work with me. Now I'm not their boss.
(03:34):
It's sort of a partnership but collaboration. And what we
really do is we're the infrastructure for the party. So
the people who knock on doors, the people who make
phone calls, the volunteers making sure that resources are on
the ground to do those type of things. And when
you have the White House, what you become is in
essence an extension of the White House political team, your boss.
(03:56):
Like instead of people say, well, you're the chair of
the Democratic Party, No, I'm a conduit in this system, right,
I get my instructions from the White House on what
to do. Now, Kim Martin, who's a new DNC chair,
he doesn't have a boss, right, because there's nobody in
the white House. When you have the White House, the
president is the head of the party. When you don't
(04:17):
have the White House, it is very diffuse, is broken down.
And so what you do at the DNC is you
build the infrastructure for the next campaigns, the next elections
that take place, like the door knockers, whether they're going
to do the party hasn't done registration really the way
that needs to. But all of those things that you
(04:37):
see on campaigns, that's what the DNC does. And it
works with his other sister committees, the d Triple C,
which is the Congressional Campaign Committee, the d SEC, which
is a Senate campaign committee. So you don't control the
whole thing. You just get a slice of the ply
and you just try to focus your energy on building
up that infrastructure.
Speaker 3 (04:56):
So there was always rumored that the DNC were the
ones that you know, quote unquote picked who they wanted.
Speaker 2 (05:03):
To be and that's that's a bunch of belonging to
stop it, Jamie Man.
Speaker 5 (05:07):
But that's what they say, that they picked somebody who president.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
I am telling you truth, tell me the power I
have to pick if I'm the DNC chair, what what
power do I have the pick? Like people say, well,
you could have told Joe Biden to not run like seriously.
Speaker 3 (05:24):
Yeah, yeah, said I could have.
Speaker 2 (05:29):
I could have. And do you think he would have listened?
This is the most powerful No? No, what about to
your point, he didn't listen. Somebody did listen to him.
He did listen to somebody. Finally, No, I think everybody
should have told him earlier. I think ultimately what the
president saw was that this fight is actually tearing the
party apart. And I don't want that to be on me.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
Stop it.
Speaker 4 (05:53):
I'm not You're not beholding to them.
Speaker 2 (05:56):
No, it's not about being beholden to too old.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
Everybody knew he was too old, But Charlotte, he should
have been a transitional president from the beginning.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
Charlotte, Man, I get all of that. I get all
of that, But you know what, somebody should have stepped up.
If people thought that Joe Biden was too old, then
some real people should have stepped up and said, you
know what, I'm gonna run.
Speaker 4 (06:15):
But.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
Y'all kick him out.
Speaker 2 (06:19):
Look is Dean feeling serious? It don't matter?
Speaker 1 (06:22):
No, No, honest, Jamie, you're acting like that is you're
acting like that is the normal process of things. Yes,
just challenge the sitting president. You know, y'all you know
y'all crucified people for that.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
But well you're telling me, you're saying, well, that's not
the normal, And you're saying, is it normal for the
DNC chair to say, mister President, you need to sit down?
Speaker 1 (06:40):
Yes, nor no, No, If George Clooney can say it,
if Charlamage can say it, if all the people who
are not in politics can say it. But y'all, Jake
taple book I read the book said everybody walked up
and you shook your hand.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
That's a bunch of you were That's a bunch of bullshit.
Speaker 1 (06:55):
I don't believe that, jameis but why don't you believe me?
Speaker 5 (06:59):
Tell people that don't know what happened.
Speaker 1 (07:01):
He said that Jake tapping. Alex Thompson wrote in that book,
Original Sitting that Biden shook the d n C chair
at the time, Jamie Harrison's and and didn't recognize who
he was.
Speaker 2 (07:11):
Jam I said that it's bullshit, because it was bullshit
every time that Joe Biden, see Joe Biden always related
me to Jim Claburn, right, So every no, but every time,
(07:32):
because you know, Joe and Jim have a really close relationship.
Now they trust each other in all, and so every
time he's gonna be like, how's Jim doing? And you
know every single time that's the that's his lead all
question how's Jim doing? And tell Jim he needs to
give me a call every single time. And so it's
what's present. By no, yes, I mean he was damn old.
(07:54):
But when you take a look at it, Charlet Mane,
when you look at what this man was trying to do,
I'd rather take an old Joe Biden on a respirator
right now than a goddamn Donald Trump right now, who's
destroying this country.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
Rhetoric, that type of rhetoric is exactly why y'all lost.
And what I mean by that is America shouldn't have
to choose between Donald Trump. Well, then people, I should
have to choose between authoritarian regime, authoritarian strategy, and an
old man on a respirator.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
Charlotte man you you you can't. You can't win something
if you don't have somebody to get into the contest
to run against.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
And if Joe Biden would have said, hey, I'm gonna
be a transitional president, I'm only gonna be here for
four years, that would have gave you as then been
a party a whole lot of time.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
But he didn't, right, That's right. We could have. If
you know, if I was six foot five or six ten,
i'd be playing basketball right now and you know, a
million dollar house. But I don't, right, So that did
not happen. So when when that did not happen, then
what you got to do is play with the cards.
It's like you're playing spade, right man. If that would
(08:57):
have gotten deuce here and this and that, then I
could have won that hand. No, you play without you
play with a hand that you dealt with, right. And
so in the end of the day, Joe Biden decided
to run. Nobody decided of significance decided to challenge him.
So therefore that is the horse that you have to ride.
Speaker 1 (09:16):
Do you put any blame on the Democratic Party because
there clearly was a lot of people who saw decline
and decided not to say anything. But if they would
have maybe ringing the alarmed and maybe other people would
have been like, you know what, I am gonna run.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
I don't know about that, to be quite honest, Charlotte Mane.
I mean, the reason why you elect the president is
to get shit done, right, that's the reason, not because
they look good in the suit, not because they're young
or old or whatever. It's to get stuff done. And
if you take a look objectively speaking, you take a
look at all that Joe Biden got done legislatively, and
(09:47):
you compare it, compare it to Ronald Reagan, you can
compare it to George W. Bush, Barack Obama, Bill Clinton.
There has not been a president that got more done
legislative than any president since Lyndon Bainshahnson.
Speaker 1 (10:00):
I agree, right, but getting things done don't win campaign sadlling, but.
Speaker 2 (10:03):
But that's why you send somebody to Washington, d C.
To get stuff done for you, to do stuff for
your community, to move things forward. And we see the
contrast now of somebody who doesn't get things done or
gets things done that actually hurts people, like like, why
send a young person? You know Jim Corbray, I remember
once when I was a young stabber staffer in his
(10:25):
office and he said, I was, I was bitching about
you know, some of these older people just need to
sit down and let some of these young folks stand up.
And he said to me, he was very quiet, he
listened to me, just rant and read and he pushed
back in the chair and he said, Jim, let me
ask you a question, which would you prefer an old,
third good marshal or a young Clarence Thomas? And I
(10:49):
sat there and I thought about it, and I said, Okay,
I see what he said. You know, yes, age is important,
but it's also about your values. It's about who you are,
what you will fight for, who you will fight for,
and so that's a part of the package. Yes, Joe
Biden was old. I get that, but we also know
that this man was committed to certain things to make
(11:10):
things better for folks. Did he do it perfectly? No,
we don't. None of us do anything perfectly right. There's
nobody that has walked with us earth that is perfect
but the Son of God and he and hopefully he'll
come back again sometime soon.
Speaker 4 (11:23):
I wouldn't waste my time.
Speaker 3 (11:26):
Well, I hate I hate the old conversation because it
just wasn't he just wasn't just affected.
Speaker 2 (11:32):
Yeah, it just wasn't affected.
Speaker 3 (11:34):
Because we know a lot of people at an eighty
year old on point. He just felt like he wasn't
on point. It felt like my recipece of my mother
in law feel like he had early signs of dementia.
She had, So the signs that I seen with her
were the signs that I was seeing with him. Forgetting names,
shaking people's hands that weren't there. It just seemed a
little bit. And it had nothing to do with old
had had to do with the fact.
Speaker 5 (11:54):
That I just didn't think he was one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (11:56):
I mean, listen, it's somebody, I agree, but you took it. No, no, no,
it's somebody who interacted with the president a lot in
twenty twenty four a lot. I mean I flew on
Air Force one to Eddie Bernice Johnson's funeral with him
from Charleston to Dallas, and we spent an hour and
a half and he basically was giving me a history
lesson of what's going on all across the world. No notes,
(12:16):
and it's just a very casual conversation. But yes, I
knew he was old, right, and he did some of
the mannerisms that old people do, but in terms of
his mental acuity and his sharpness, he knew it all.
And you better if you ask you a question, you
better know the answer to it, right. And so like
seeing the frame that was built around and then seeing
(12:39):
the reality of my interactions, my personal interactions with him.
It was not always the same, right, it wasn't. And
so that's part of my frustration is like, guys, I
understand that this guy in perfect, but you know what,
we also have a vice president. So in the end
of the day, if he can't, if he can't perform,
you got a vice president that is there who can't.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
To me, it wasn't anything his age has definitely played
a part in it, but it's the fact that Democrats
suck at messages and all the good things that somebody
like the Biden administration did, y'all didn't know how to message.
And y'all just suck at campaigning. And I think that
y'all about to make the same mistake because you're still
on some.
Speaker 4 (13:15):
We good they bad stuff.
Speaker 1 (13:17):
Clearly America don't care about that.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
Well, listen what I think we have to do on
the messaging side. One of the things the problem that
Democrats have and I say this as a party and
I said this as a party chair, is that we
send people to Washington, DC who want to get stuff done,
who are policy wonks. Many of them are really policy nerves, right.
All they want to do is they want to go
to DC. They want to write their bills, They want
(13:39):
to get something passed and solving the issue that people
in their communities are dealing with. The Republicans are reversed.
They want to go to Washington, DC to have power right,
either power to block something or power or power to
move things forward. And they know that, you know, they
don't need to be versed in all of the these
(14:00):
policies and all that, and so they just focused on
the politics of it, whereas Democrats don't like to focus
on the politics. They just like to focus on the policy.
But that's not always good because you also need the
politics part, Like you got to be able to sell
what you've been able to do. One of the things
I tried to get the president, well people in the
(14:20):
administration do is yeah, I said, miss President, And I
said this on this flight that we took. We were
down in Charleston, visited Mother Manual and then flew to Dallas.
Speaker 1 (14:29):
Is that when his pants allegedly.
Speaker 2 (14:31):
Right, Man, I don't know what the hell you're talking about.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
I'm I'm serious. They said that last time he visited
Mother Manue and meet he pooped his.
Speaker 2 (14:37):
Pan Charles Mayne you you saying something that literally, that's
that's crazy, that's crazy. That's some crazy talk. Because I
was again with the President all day. We even went
to what's the soul food restaurant that we went. Yeah, yeah,
sometimes I'm not even joke.
Speaker 1 (14:55):
I heard that they said last time you did is
that he pooped his band man. He said he was
taking so long to come out. So local law enforcement
was asking to seek the service, what's going on? And
somebody's secret service said, look, President just.
Speaker 5 (15:06):
Shot it.
Speaker 6 (15:09):
Headlines asking they're trying to figure out that he poop
his pan.
Speaker 2 (15:12):
That's crazy.
Speaker 1 (15:13):
I just I'm not. I'm not, No, guys, it's not
a secret.
Speaker 2 (15:17):
I never heard exactly yelling crazy. Absolutely crazy as hell.
It's just crazy.
Speaker 5 (15:28):
Let's let me get to my story.
Speaker 2 (15:31):
Hell, what was I trying to say? Anyway, before sharlow
Man and the pooping the paint learn.
Speaker 4 (15:35):
About something, man, so the administration to do something on.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
The flight so so, because part of it is about
selling what you do. And I told the President because
as I went across the country, people weren't connected. We
passed all the stuff, but people weren't connected to the
stuff that we actually passed, like the student loan stuff.
There are a lot of people who qualified for all
of the student loan relief, but they didn't know how
(16:02):
to get it right. And so I said, well, Miss President,
why don't And I said, the DNC can actually do this.
We can open up we can call them Biden Empowerment
Centers all across the country, basically where people could come
in and say, I'm trying to get some of that
Biden student loan money. I'm trying to figure out how
to do a small business twenty thousand dollars at small
(16:24):
business grants, but I don't know how to get that money.
I'm trying to do something on in terms of the
broadband and all of the other stuff. And I said,
you can have these all across the country so that
people are now then connected to the resources that you
were actually bringing bringing into the community, because part of
the problem is that people didn't know how to get
it right. You had the money there, but can't people
(16:47):
can't access it. And he was like, Oh, that's a
great idea. That's a great idea. I thought it was
going to move forward. I thought that we would do
something about it. But the one thing that I'm writing
about this now, in my book, the one problem that
you have is like, if these ideas don't come from
certain people that are in the sort of universes around
the president or the vice president, then they never see
(17:09):
the light of day. They never they never crystallize. And
that is part of the fundamental problems that we have
right now within our party is that we got to
break through some of these things. You've got these gatekeepers
who want all of the power, all of the control,
all of the influence, and don't want other voices to
come break in to say, you know, we're not doing
(17:29):
this right. We need to talk to these people, We
need to bring these people into the room. And so
that's part of my big frustration as DNC chair. It
was that, you know, there are a lot of things
that we want to do a lot of bells that
we were ringing very early on about this group, this group,
that group, but the president or the vice president never
actually really heard them because the gatekeepers kept that information
(17:50):
from them.
Speaker 1 (17:51):
You know, did you start your podcast at our table
because you wanted to kind of counter I guess the manisphere? Yes.
Speaker 2 (17:58):
No, No, what I wanted to do is I wanted
to build our own frame, right I get so tired of.
Speaker 1 (18:05):
Our fast I love how that South Carolina came out
of you and you told the truth initially. Now you're
giving us no, yes, and then you're like, well, actually no.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
But what I want to do is build our own frame,
because what I got tired of is, you know, we
would have our Democratic candidates who were going to seeing
in on MSNBC. They get five minutes to talk about whatever,
and then the media itself would build a frame to
define who that person was, right. And it's the same
reason why I had Hunter Biden on my on my podcast,
who was one of the first interviews, because you could
(18:34):
say Hunter Biden, and all you know about Hunter Biden
is what you heard on Fox News from people who
oppose them, or maybe something that you may have read
from somebody in from the administration. But you never heard
the man talk in his own words. You never heard
him go out and defend what he did or to
accept blame for what he did. You never heard him
(18:55):
talk about his father and defend his father and all
that stuff. And I don't always feel like people of a
vehicle so that they can put in their own words
where they are and then and then you can make
a decision based off of that. But but what you
see right now and politics really is that the media
will build a frame. Like when I launched my podcast,
they said Jamie Harrison, uh uh, gonna be the Joe
(19:18):
Rogan of the left. I never uttered Joe Rogan's name, right,
But the media wants to create these dynamics and this
and that, Like I've never watched Joe Rogan show other
than little clips online. I don't want to be anybody
but Jamie Harrison, and I want to have my show
to talk about the things that I think are important
(19:38):
that I think people in the community want to talk about.
Speaker 1 (19:41):
As a person who you know, have to focus on
campaigns and stuff. How much influence do you think that
those podcasts are even celebrity has on you know, candidates, Well,
you know, everybody says he won the election because he
went on all these different you know, the theovonnes, the
flagrants and show.
Speaker 2 (19:59):
I think those things we have an influence on the margins.
Speaker 1 (20:01):
Right.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
There are a lot of people, know who now get
their media and their news from social media and podcasts
and clips that they see on TikTok and Instagram and
all those different things, and so understanding that. You know,
most people these days, they get the bit of information
that they do consume either through a little headline or
(20:22):
they see a little clip for fifteen or twenty seconds.
And so knowing that that means then the party has
to adapt itself to understanding that's where the electorate is,
that's how they're getting their information. And it is hard
as hell. It's like, you know, trying to turn a
battleship to get the party to understand like where things
are going and what you got to do. And so
(20:44):
you know, I wanted to start when I was DNC chair.
I wanted to start a YouTube channel called DTV where
we could have had shows at the DNC. We had
this beautiful studio in the basement of the DNC where
we could have shows and we can bring in the
Jasmine Crocketts of the AOCS and all that, and different
voices in the party that reflected the diversity of party
and talk about our stuff in our own words. But
(21:08):
I got from some of the folks in the White House, well,
we shouldn't spend resources on.
Speaker 4 (21:11):
That, right.
Speaker 1 (21:13):
How come Merrick Garland doesn't get any smoke.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
He should get plenty of smoke. I wish, I wish
Doug Jones would have. I thought that was the biggest
mistake of the Biden administration, appointing Merrick Garland. And it's
because we always want to be like the above the fray.
We always want to be like, well, let's do it
by the book, let's do it academic. But sometimes shit,
(21:36):
you got to fight, right, yeah, you just you just
got to fight. And I wish Doug Jones or somebody
of that ILK would have been the attorney general because
Mary Garland was awful. He was abysmally awful.
Speaker 1 (21:48):
He didn't investigate the Epstein FI dropped the ball and
indicted Trump too late on January sixth, because he didn't
want to seem.
Speaker 2 (21:54):
Too get political.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
Meanwhile, Trump and Trump's out here like I'm locking all
y'all up, like in all my political.
Speaker 2 (22:01):
Chris Christy Bolton, everybody, Obama dog.
Speaker 1 (22:05):
I mean, why weren't y'all saying things like that?
Speaker 2 (22:07):
Though?
Speaker 1 (22:07):
Like why when at the head and I'm not saying
you even got to say it publicly?
Speaker 2 (22:11):
No, no, no, Well then listen, there were times in
which you know, I said to the prison or said
to the Vice president, or said to the staff certain
things like, you know, I remember having conversation with Anita
Donne on the TikTok stuff. I was like, that is
dumb as hell for us in an election cycle to
be going after TikTok. I was like, y'all, wait until
if you're gonna do something like that, do it after
(22:32):
elect Like sometimes politically stuff when you know that young people,
that's where they're getting their information, you know, that's what
they want. Like why are we doing that? Like why
are we trying to do these things that make it
even more difficult for us to win?
Speaker 4 (22:46):
Yeah, but that's frivolous stuff.
Speaker 1 (22:47):
I'm talking about things like, hey, why isn't Merrick Garland
going after this person that y'all told us is an
extensive threat who we saw leading attempt to cool this
country on January sixth, President Biden, why are you saying
things like you don't want, you know, to investigate that matter. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (23:01):
Well, because you know, Biden also again being eighty years old,
coming from a different time in terms of our government,
he was old school in terms of looking at you know,
the difference or the line between the White House and
the Justice Department. I mean, that's the way that things
used to operate, but we now know that we're in
a different era, like there's a different frame, and we
(23:22):
see that Trump has turned all of that on his head,
and that sometimes you got to lean in and lean
in heavily on some of these things, and you got
to get somebody over there who is not just who
sees justice as being blind, but also is not politically
naive as well. And that's part of the part of
(23:42):
the problem with Mary Garland. I mean, I had problems
with Mary Garland, and Barack Obama nominated him to go
to the Supreme Court instead of nominating the black woman
that time around, Right, I thought that was a perfect
opportunity for us to get a black woman on the
Supreme Court. But again we wanted we we always are
as a party. We're always thinking ourselves out of things, Right,
(24:05):
So the calculus was, well, let's find some middle of
the road guy that the Republicans are not going to oppose.
And guess what they did. They opposed him.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
In hindsight, you admitted it already, you said Mary Garland
was ter he was terrible. Why can't you say that
in regards to Biden not being a one term president?
Speaker 2 (24:24):
Well, because because I listen, those two things are the
reason Trump is back in the White House. I I
really listen, man, if folks would have And this is
the amazing difference between Democrats and Republicans. Trump got convicted
thirty four times, convicted, felon, thirty four times, convicted fela.
Did you hear a peep from the Republican Party the
(24:46):
next day saying that Donald Trump should not be our nominee.
Speaker 1 (24:49):
No, because they knew he could win. That's the difference.
There were so many of us who knew Biden no.
Speaker 2 (24:54):
No, But that's no, no, no, How how did they
know that he couldn't that he could win when he
lost in twenty twenty?
Speaker 1 (25:00):
Who Trump? Because you could clearly see the momentum between
the two candles. You know, we all had this combination.
Speaker 2 (25:06):
Momentum in politics schools, just like it goes just like that.
Speaker 3 (25:10):
But you could see that they was messing with by the.
Speaker 6 (25:15):
Reason people thought Kamala was gonna, you know, make this
breakfast because of the moment on.
Speaker 2 (25:21):
At the same time, at the same time as trump conviction.
That was around the same period that Joe Biden gave
that State of the Union speech when everybody was like,
oh god damn, that was a good State of Union speech.
I have not heard a better State of Union speech
than that time.
Speaker 4 (25:36):
No, I never thought he could win well.
Speaker 2 (25:39):
Regardless of whether you thought or not his numbers were good.
It was.
Speaker 1 (25:45):
Him getting through it.
Speaker 6 (25:46):
I'm from Delaware, number yeah, it was the original man.
Speaker 2 (25:53):
The original sin is a bunch of ship. I mean
that's talking about keep going. Come on, I mean, like
Alex Thompson and Jake Tapper.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
Seriously, I'm just telling you what I Seriously, I don't know.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
Why a bunch of anonymous sources because nobody wants to
go on record to say anything anonymous sources. I can't
tell you. In my book there won't be anonymous sources.
It is straight for me. I'm listening.
Speaker 1 (26:17):
Whoever the future of the party is, whoever's going to
lead the Democratic Party.
Speaker 2 (26:21):
And the DNC won't pick them?
Speaker 1 (26:22):
You American people, will you have to be able to
throw that old regime under the bus. The You're gonna
have to You're gonna have to be willing to throw
that old regime under the bus and talk about all
the things that they got wrong.
Speaker 2 (26:34):
Yep, But why don't we talk about this is the
thing let's talk about the stuff that we're getting right.
Part of the reason that the brand for the party
is there are a lot of reasons the brand for
the party is suffering, but part of the reason is
that we are always like if you look at the
Republican side on the flip side, they are not talking about, well, well,
we're getting this, we got this wrong the last time,
and we get this wrong. Man, they get ship run
(26:56):
all the time, but no, but they don't talk about it.
Part of reason why they win is because they're not
talking about It's like you got a brand new car
and every day you throw mud on it, and then
after three months you'd be like, why is my car
not shining anymore? It's because you damn you throw mud
on it every every month. Like Republicans don't throw mud
on their car, but Democrats, man, we will. We will
(27:16):
hand and ring and be like, oh, I wish we
would have done us, and I wish we'd done that. Lean,
lean into what you do and that you are doing well,
and have that.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
Be your lead instead of being the party of purity.
Well I don't know about the walk around and act
like you the party and y'all don't get anything wrong.
You don't lie about nothing, then people are going to
hold you to it.
Speaker 2 (27:37):
We can't be the party of purity on one side,
and then you then whine and complain about all the
stuff that we get wrong the next time. That's those
two things can't coexist in the same space.
Speaker 5 (27:47):
So what do you like in twenty twenty eight? What
candidate is? Do you like in twenty twenty eight?
Speaker 2 (27:53):
To be honest, I don't know yet. I really don't
know yet. I mean, there's gonna be so many people
who come through South Caro. No, I mean.
Speaker 1 (28:05):
Person people love that US Democrats don't know whether they're
coming and going. This is terrible.
Speaker 2 (28:11):
Well, come on, man, this is the same stuff that
happening happened in twenty twenty. This is the same stuff
that happened in two thousand and eight. It's the same
stuff that happened, I mean right after Yeah, in two
thousand and eight when the brock Abam you had like
twelve people run. Then you had twenty people run in
twenty twenty.
Speaker 1 (28:28):
There's a lot of formidable candidates out there. The problem
is the Democratic brand is so toxic and disgusting and bad.
Speaker 2 (28:35):
It's because we sit here and talk about how toxic
and bad it is instead of talking about the good
stuff that we actually do. Man, that's part of the
problem again, Like your brand is going to be bad
if every day all you do is talk about how bad.
Speaker 4 (28:48):
Things got it wrong on the border.
Speaker 2 (28:50):
Oh yeah, there are things that we should have done
batter on the border. Yes, I agree with.
Speaker 1 (28:53):
Do you think they got it wrong talking about bidernomics
when they know that people weren't feeling that in their pockets,
and they know that people weren't feeling that, you know.
Speaker 2 (29:00):
I think what they should have done is what I
said earlier, which is connecting the economics people to the
economic stuff that they got done. Then I think people
would have felt better about it, right because they know
that this stuff was going on, Like you know, all
these stimulus checks, like the Biden stimulus checks were far
bigger than the stimulus checks coming to Donald Trump. He
should have and that's one of the things he regrets.
(29:22):
He said, I wish I would have left. And this
is a lesson we should have learned in Obama because
you all remember when Obama was president, we passed that
big stimulus bill and then all this money was flowing
into all this other stuff, and Obama did not put
didn't take credit for it. He did not take credit
for it. So you had thought then Democrats would have
learned from eight and twenty to do better. But we don't.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
One thing. We know.
Speaker 4 (29:47):
Democrats don't learn, no, be.
Speaker 2 (29:51):
We can be a bit hard headed in that, but
I'm hoping and I think this new generation of Democrats
that we have, who are scrappy, who are willing to fight,
willing to do what is necessary, will learn the lessons
from It's just hard.
Speaker 1 (30:06):
To believe y'all, Jamie now, simply because we know what
y'all watched the last four years. Even when I see
somebody like Karen John Pierre come out with her book
and I'm like, you sat up there and lied for
him all of this time, and now you want to
be honest and say you were an independent And it's
to say all of y'all did that for the last
four years.
Speaker 2 (30:22):
Man and Charlot Mane, I ain't lied about I ain't
live about damn thing.
Speaker 1 (30:26):
Well, you ain't tell the truth. We just kept quiet.
Speaker 5 (30:28):
Okay, don't let him talk to you like that.
Speaker 6 (30:31):
Come on, man, did you try to tell the truth
and they just didn't listen because I also saw that
you said you were taking for granted you were a
rubber stamp.
Speaker 2 (30:38):
So were you.
Speaker 6 (30:38):
Telling the truth and him?
Speaker 4 (30:39):
So what were you telling the truth about?
Speaker 2 (30:40):
Well, telling the truth about where we are, where the
electric was, things that we needed to do. I mean
when I tell you, this job in many ways great
opportunity to connect with folks, but also extremely frustrating because
you can see the things. It's almost like you see
a car wreck that's happening, and you're yelling and screaming,
(31:02):
and it's like nobody's listening, right because only again the
select few. There's people in the bubble who thought they
know better. I give you a perfect example. I have
here Ernie, who's helping me write my book. And I
remember you all remember the January sixth and all, So
the anniversary of January sixth was in twenty twenty two,
(31:25):
and I wanted this ad and after the show, I'll
play it for you guys, this ad that really goes
after the Republicans on January sixth. And I wanted the
DNC to play this ad because you know, I told
the folks at the White House, I said, I want
you all to know that black folks are watching how
we handle this situation, because we know if all those
(31:46):
people who broke into the Capitol beat the shit out
of the police officers, defecated all over the walls and
the floors, and did all this stuff, if those folks
were black, it would have been the bloodiest day in
the history of this absolutely. And I told the folks
at the White House my conduit, I said, black folks
are watching, and how we Democrats handle the situation. Are
(32:09):
we going to be forceful in terms of pushing back
against it and making sure that we hold people accountable
for it, or are we gonna brush it on the
on the rug? And I was told when I had
this ad, and the ad was it wasn't as hard.
I knew that they wouldn't go for the real hard
ad that I wanted, so it was sort of a
mid level but it went in a little bit, but
a mid level ad. And they were like, well, we
(32:31):
don't think the DNC needs to do that. We don't
need to focus on that right now. And my pushback
to them is, folks, I want you to understand this,
like we are trying. We need to send a signal
to our folks that we see you, we hear you.
We're gonna fight for you, and just as hard as
the Republicans are fighting against you, we're gonna be fighting
(32:52):
for you. Like this, by brushing that under the rug
and saying, well, we shouldn't talk about that right now,
let's talk about bidonomics or something to that extent, I
mean that is sending the signal to our folks, is that, Yo.
Speaker 5 (33:05):
You know you really don't give it damn a perceptions question?
What do you feel he's not being truthful about? But
he said you don't feel like he's being truthful?
Speaker 1 (33:12):
What do you think he's not being truthful about the
condition that they know President Biden was in?
Speaker 2 (33:16):
No man, I just I just fund you can ask
anybody he asked my wife. I just fundamentally disagree with that.
Like it just.
Speaker 1 (33:23):
Pisses hard for me to believe that it just like
us who've I've never met Joe Biden just watching him
on television, cancel. It's just crazy that all of us
can come to this conclusion. But y'all, I was calling
for him to step down in twenty twenty three for
no other reason other than you will not win the
election in November.
Speaker 2 (33:43):
Charlotte mane like, of course, Like I've been on record,
he's old. I get it. He is old. He walks.
You know he's old.
Speaker 1 (33:53):
It wasn't just about that.
Speaker 5 (33:54):
It's not just about it.
Speaker 1 (33:55):
No, But there's a lot of things right, Like there's
a perception that the DNC is too tied, the corporate
donors specially.
Speaker 2 (34:00):
Man, that's bullshit too. Okay, tell me pull the records,
pull the receipts. If we're tired. If we're tired the
corporate donors, pull the receipts.
Speaker 4 (34:10):
How much money do we get from democratic book?
Speaker 2 (34:13):
I don't know because I never talked to a packing
my four years as DNC chair.
Speaker 1 (34:17):
Wow, okay, the party claim for working people while taking
so much money from Wall Street in Silicon Valley?
Speaker 4 (34:24):
Where where do we tell me that?
Speaker 1 (34:26):
You're right?
Speaker 2 (34:28):
Now? I am telling because exitly you're giving me a
talking point, Charlottage, But give me the receipt Show me
the amount of money that we have gotten from from
corporate donors. Show show the.
Speaker 1 (34:39):
Hold on, hold on. I can't believe you.
Speaker 2 (34:42):
No, show show me.
Speaker 1 (34:43):
That hold on.
Speaker 2 (34:44):
Hold on now, mind you, the DNC raised h the
d n C couple with campaign raise over billion dollars.
Tell me how much of that billion dollars that we
got from corporate donors?
Speaker 1 (34:55):
Hold on one second, Hold on one second, you're holding,
we're holding.
Speaker 6 (35:02):
I feel like you're playing space and somebody just trying
to find.
Speaker 4 (35:06):
Trying to find I have I have it up.
Speaker 1 (35:14):
Now combined spending on just congressional races in two thousand.
Speaker 2 (35:21):
I'm saying the d n C. I'm not saying congressional races.
Speaker 4 (35:24):
I'm like you d democrat.
Speaker 2 (35:26):
No, you said the d n C. What you said
is democrats. You said the d n C.
Speaker 1 (35:30):
No, I didn't.
Speaker 4 (35:31):
I think the DNC roll the tape.
Speaker 1 (35:33):
I don't know what he said.
Speaker 4 (35:35):
You said the Democrats.
Speaker 2 (35:36):
Okay, democrats, because you're saying that the.
Speaker 4 (35:42):
So let me ask ask the question.
Speaker 1 (35:43):
There's a perception that Democrat politicians are too tied the
corporate donors and special interests. So how can the party
claim to fight for working people while taking so much money?
Speaker 2 (35:52):
Well, there there are some Democrats in Congress who do
take corporate pat dollars like they do, and in part
of their fundraising that happens. But when it like, I
can't control what individual members do, right, But in the
end of the day, you know, if these people are
still passing health care and passing that they're not fighting
(36:16):
for tax cuts for these wealthy corporations and all that
they're actually trying to increase the taxes on some of
these folks. It's kind of hard to say that these
people aren't fighting for their constituents. Man, Right, So again,
like I can only control what I can control within
my sphere, right. I know what the DNC did and
what I tried to push the DNC to do in
(36:38):
my time, which is focus on working people, focusing on
people like my grandparents, focusing on people like my aunts
and my uncles and my cousins and nieces and nephews
in South Carolina, trying to make life better for them.
That's the party that I was happy and proud to
be the chair of.
Speaker 1 (36:57):
Yeah, was there a private deal between the DNC and
the Harris campaign that you would cover twenty million dollars
in her buildings?
Speaker 2 (37:05):
Knowledge so so basically, and I saw Shane's the newspaper article.
So looking at the finances for there are some joint
finances between the DNC and a presidential campaign. When they
come together, they create what it's called a joint fundraising committee.
So there's things bills that they share, right, so some polling,
(37:26):
some advertising, some some things, so that they can jointly
fundraise money. And that's I know that your your folks
are going to get a little eyes gleazed. That is
because they form a joint feund reason committee because that
allows them to raise more money collectively than they could
as individuals.
Speaker 1 (37:44):
Right.
Speaker 2 (37:45):
It allows them, the DNC to go to some of
its the donors who can write a million dollar chat, right,
and then they send that money to the DNC. It's discovered, No,
they're individuals, folks, that individual can write a million Yes,
individuals can write million dollar checks. Because the way that
the finance laws and that's something that we really need
(38:06):
to take a look at. But the way that finance
laws work is there's a certain amount that they can
give to the DNC, there's a certain amount they can
give to every state party, and all of that money
is collective and then we can use that money on
behalf of the presidential cannon. So it's a joint fundraising committee.
So that means and sometimes there are joint fundraising expenses
that come out of it, So expenses that we share.
(38:28):
So coming off of Kammalos Race, there were some things,
some outstanding bills that we still had that were joint
bills together between the DNC and the Commalas Race, and
our agreement was to pay the remaining of some of
those bills.
Speaker 1 (38:44):
Was it twenty million?
Speaker 2 (38:45):
No, When I left, it was about five So now
I can't speak to about any other whatever. But when
I left, it was about five million dollars, which in
the grand scheme of things, five million dollars is a
lot for us as individuals. But in this campaign, universe,
do you think.
Speaker 1 (39:02):
We need to drop hundred dollars?
Speaker 2 (39:04):
Yes, okay, I do believe. I do believe that we
need massive and we would have done that had we
passed the John Lewis and all the other bills that
Democrats voted unanimously for in the House, but we couldn't
get it past the Senate because of filibuster, because of
Mansion in Cinema. So I do believe that, Listen, I
(39:24):
raised one hundred and thirty two million dollars when I
ran for USENT. I mean, when I think about how
much money that is and what that could have done
in South Carolina, that's sinful that amount of money one
hundred and thirty two million dollars. I think we need
to cap them out that we use in our election.
No other country on the face of this planet spends
as much money in campaigns as we do.
Speaker 1 (39:43):
Is the DNC beholding to billionaires too much? Are just
wealthy people in general? No, I mean, because there's no
there's no working class person writing a million dollars.
Speaker 2 (39:50):
No, No, But the bulk of the money that the
DNC raises is from folks who have given five to
ten dollars, like the sheer volume about probably about thirty
percent of the d's money that it gets. It comes
from major dollar donors, right, people who can write twenty
five thousand above the number of people who can write
a million dollar check. Maybe it's one hundred to two
(40:13):
hundred people like, it's not it's not a lot. And
those people basically, you know, I've met with many of
our large donors. They're not asking for anything policy wise,
because the DNC is not a policy arm Like we
don't write policy of the DNC. The money that we
use goes into the infrastructure of the party, and so
many of those folks don't have any type of ask
(40:35):
other than when and we don't want to see Republicans
take over.
Speaker 1 (40:39):
Why am I getting your subset?
Speaker 4 (40:41):
I didn't sign up for.
Speaker 1 (40:43):
What did you give money to the DNC?
Speaker 2 (40:46):
Were you on my Were you on my email list
from my campaign? Yeah? I mean listen, Yeah, we have
a cap No, no, well listen, we work with substack
on my list right, Basically, what I use was my
campaign list. If you if you subscribe to my campaign
(41:06):
or you help my campaign out, remember I mean I
have an email list of over seven million people coming
off of my campaign. That's because again, we raised one
hundred and thirty two million dollars and a lot of
people wanted to send lends a Graham home. And so
now since I'm on Substack now, since I got my
at and we haven't talked about at our table the podcast,
(41:26):
make sure you go with Yeah, wherever you get your podcasts,
make sure you subscribe. But so basically, and I'm writing
every week. Every week I'm writing a piece about Last
week I wrote one about identity the quote unquote identity politics.
This week I have one on how the two thousand
and six elections in the twenty twenty six elections May
(41:47):
mirror each other, so we're doing that on a weekly basis.
So do you think if folks don't want it just unsubscribed?
Speaker 1 (41:53):
I mentioned a PAK earliert, I want to bring it
up again. Do you think APAK and like other powerful
lobbies like that have too much influence over Democrat leaders?
Speaker 2 (42:00):
I think there's no I think APAC has a lot
of power over both parties, right, or people in both
parties Because I don't want to use the party as
a whole as a label, there are people in the
parties in which APAC is very influential on, in both
(42:22):
the Democratic Party and the Republican Party, and so you know,
organizations like that probably do have a little too much influence.
And the only way that we curved at is to
change the campaign finance laws in this country so that
is more grassroots focus and oriented and less about these
(42:42):
big packs that have come up. I think one of
the worst things was a Citizen's United decision because they
made it into a wild wild West and allowed folks
with who could raise these money, this money unlimited influence
to impact elections, to impact campaigns, to influence our members
of So I mean, I think if Democrats can take
(43:03):
back the House and the Senate, but also get past
the filibuster because a big problem that we have right
now is a lot of bills that we wanted to
pass to curb some of the stuff. You can't because
it gets filibuster in the US Senate.
Speaker 1 (43:16):
If Democrats lose again in twenty twenty six or twenty
twenty eight, should the party completely rethink it's leadership structure,
even the role of the DNC itself.
Speaker 2 (43:26):
I mean, I Charlamagne, I mean, in the history's country,
you went to the DNC's I think it's one hundred
and seventy years old. You're gonna win elections, You're gonna
lose elections. I mean, winning elections and losing an election
didn't something new that happened?
Speaker 4 (43:41):
Right? Different though, So you got some you gotta admit
this is different.
Speaker 2 (43:46):
I mean Donald Trump is different.
Speaker 1 (43:48):
Right.
Speaker 2 (43:49):
The question is, once Trump's gone, does it go back
to the way that it has gone to pass? I don't.
I mean, that's a big question. I don't know that.
But one of the things I tell folks is, yes,
there's an urgency of the moment, but like you can't
freak out about like all you know, all hell's gone
(44:10):
loose in terms of like the parties and how they operate. Right,
I do think there's some fundamental changes that need to happen.
I think, you know, when I go back to the DNC,
part of what I want to do is put some
reforms in to separate out, to give the DNC a
wall between a presidential campaign and the DNC, or a
president and the DNC, because I think the DNC has
(44:32):
to focus more, not just on the White House, but
on the entirety of the party. And I don't think
we do that when we have the White House.
Speaker 1 (44:39):
And I just want to ask you to be clear.
So you said the DNC has never taken corporate dollars
in the past.
Speaker 2 (44:43):
No, the DNC. I mean, I don't know if there
is some no corporate Pac money. There may be some
corporate Pac money. Said no, no, no, no, You said
that the d n C was controlled by corporate Pac money.
If there is corporate Pac money, it's probably less than
five percent cent of the money.
Speaker 4 (45:01):
Uh that the money influence.
Speaker 2 (45:05):
But what what do you mean? Like you throwing out buzzwords,
but I don't know what you how you mean?
Speaker 1 (45:11):
Question?
Speaker 4 (45:11):
No, they have never taken any Corporate PA money.
Speaker 2 (45:14):
DNC has taken Corporate pac money in the past. I mean,
all of the parties have taken money.
Speaker 4 (45:19):
But when you look at me that they're not controlled.
Speaker 2 (45:21):
They're not They're not controlled by that, right because if
it's a small percentage, I mean, and like, yeah, I
can give you a dollar, that doesn't mean you're going
to do what I told you for if for that dollar,
because I know you're getting paid a whole lot more, right. Yeah.
Speaker 5 (45:34):
Well, if you want more of this, you can check
out his new podcast.
Speaker 4 (45:37):
At Our Table At Our Table, and.
Speaker 1 (45:40):
Also check out Jamie Harrison's documentary In the Bubble that
I executive produced.
Speaker 2 (45:43):
Yes, Emily in the Buildings Emily Harrald.
Speaker 3 (45:47):
Clearly she didn't want to be on camera, Okay, I
shot it her rout put it on camera right.
Speaker 4 (45:52):
Well, sorry, it was a pleasure, Jamie.
Speaker 1 (45:53):
Don't be arange.
Speaker 2 (45:54):
No, I would love to come back and when the
book comes out, but in Charlemagne, I do. I would
love to have you, you know, as my South Carolina homeboy,
be a guest on at our Table. Let me ask
you a question.
Speaker 1 (46:05):
I'd love to do it. I enjoyed your conversation with Hunter, but.
Speaker 2 (46:09):
No, it was good. It was really good. And it
was good to get Hunter unfiltered. And uh, he had
a lot to say. I had a lot to say.
And and I think he's a you know, he's a
good guy. He just yeah, and and maybe I don't
I don't know, if it's just look I had I
(46:30):
have family members who had drug addiction issues and problems, right,
and and very honest. And they're very honest. They're very honest.
And what just say it, Jamie, No, No, I'm just saying,
like honest, man, Jesus Christ, dude, you just say it, dude.
(46:52):
Come on, It's okay, it's okay.
Speaker 1 (46:54):
What honest some of the most honestly. But I've learned
some of the best advice ever.
Speaker 2 (46:59):
Yeah. But but but we don't need to be like derogatory.
You're saying in a fashion to be derogator or you know,
sometimes folks just fall down, No, man, come on, man,
sometimes people just fall down, right, and it's it's about
all of us to help them get back up, absolutely right.
But I'm not going to go around and be like
derogatory to people.
Speaker 1 (47:19):
I don't know, I don't know, derogatory, crack cracket, what else?
Speaker 5 (47:23):
We call them crackit.
Speaker 2 (47:26):
You can call them addicts.
Speaker 1 (47:27):
Right Political did an article saying there's a new memo
that identifies forty five words and phrases for Democrats to avoid.
Speaker 4 (47:34):
What are your thoughts on this?
Speaker 1 (47:36):
You don't speak plain.
Speaker 2 (47:37):
No, but but come on now?
Speaker 5 (47:40):
Are these some of the words that they tell you
can't use?
Speaker 2 (47:42):
Yep, yeah, this gender, Man, I don't know what. I
don't know what. Half of that stuff is exactly neoliberal.
I mean, they come up with all kinds of stuff,
but it's the academic part.
Speaker 4 (47:56):
Of the atics.
Speaker 1 (47:59):
I'm trying to figure it out. I want to I
want to learn the right thing to say.
Speaker 5 (48:03):
User.
Speaker 2 (48:05):
I don't know you you know how we use crackheaded home,
I use crackheads.
Speaker 1 (48:13):
I use come on now, man, get a crackhead a
couple of dollars to come FI cut the grass. But
that's not a bad thing, I said, I learned a
lot from people who used to How about this, I've
learned a lot from people who used to use crack.
I have used crack, just used drugs. Jamie was Jamie
when she never came here.
Speaker 5 (48:31):
It's the breakfast Club. Good morning every day.
Speaker 4 (48:35):
Up, Wake click your ass up. The breakfast club you
don't finish for y'all done.
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