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October 17, 2025 62 mins

Today on The Breakfast Club, Governor Josh Shapiro On Public Service, Pushing Back On Lobbyists, Kamala Harris. Listen For More!

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Episode Transcript

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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Wake that ass up in the morning.

Speaker 2 (00:02):
The Breakfast Club morning, everybody is DJ Envy just hilarious.
Charlamagne the guy. We are the Breakfast Club. We got
a special guest in the building.

Speaker 3 (00:11):
That's right, I call him Barack Obama, bar Obama, lail
me God.

Speaker 2 (00:21):
Right in front of them, we have the governor of Pennsylvania,
Governor Josh.

Speaker 1 (00:25):
Is that sa Quon's old helmet because you know he's
over on the birds.

Speaker 3 (00:29):
Now you know what is it's signed by s. Let
me put it the fact that you recognize you for.

Speaker 1 (00:35):
That's crazy the morning. How you feeling, Hey, I'm feeling great.
Thanks for having me back. It's good to be with you, guys.

Speaker 4 (00:40):
Seeing you again.

Speaker 3 (00:40):
You asked me how my family was before the interview.
I want to ask you how your family is now
because I saw this week that code balmer who was
accused of an arson attack on your house. He played
guilty and will send us to twenty five to fifty years.
How does that make you know you in the family field?

Speaker 1 (00:55):
Yeah, I mean, look, I'll be honest, it's been hard
dealing with this as a governor, right knowing that you're
a target, knowing that in this world of politics we're
in today. You got people who want to do you harm.
And I'm sure we'll talk about political violence. We're seeing
way too much of that across the country. But the

(01:16):
hardest part of this whole thing for me has been
knowing that the job I love, right being governor of Pennsylvania,
serving the good people of Pennsylvania, put my family's lives
at risk. I mean, this guy, Charlman, he came in
with miletov cocktails, he fire bombed our home.

Speaker 3 (01:36):
How did he get so close?

Speaker 4 (01:37):
How did he get in?

Speaker 1 (01:39):
But I just want to be clear. He was wielding
a metal hammer that he said he was going to
use to try to kill me. And he not only
pled guilty to arson, he played guilty to attempted murder.

Speaker 3 (01:51):
Damn.

Speaker 1 (01:52):
And So I think the thing for me that I'm
I'm just being really honest, that I'm working through is
how to keep my family safe doing the job I
love that by the way, I feel real purpose in
right serving people, and the notion that people now need
to choose between their family safety and well being and

(02:15):
doing public service. That's a hard thing for me to
work through, just as a dad, you know, beyond being
a governor but look, I mean to your point or
to your question. So you know, there were tremendous failures
from a security standpoint. Pennsylvani State Police, who I do
have confidence in, have changed a whole bunch of procedures.

(02:36):
The home, which really hadn't been this was the governor's residence,
really hadn't had any kind of overhaul from a security
perspective for decades, has gone through that. I do feel
safe there now. I do feel safe when I'm going around.
I worry about my family obviously all the time. But
it was a failure and they learned from it, and
I've got confidence that they're going to do better. If

(02:57):
God forbid, something like that, you know, happens another time.

Speaker 3 (03:00):
You got to tell me how you have that kind
of count?

Speaker 1 (03:01):
Yeah, how do you feel safe?

Speaker 3 (03:03):
Because how do you know? It wasn't an inside job?
How do you know? You know? You don't.

Speaker 2 (03:07):
You don't know whocause they got pretty close. It wasn't
like it was they threw it from the street, like
they got.

Speaker 5 (03:11):
He caund doors in your house, which wasn't successful to
get through those doors, and it was fifteen people in
your house.

Speaker 1 (03:17):
Yeah, oh, there were about twenty. We had me and
my family. There's six of us, Yeah, our two dogs,
and then we also had my brother, sister and their kids,
so my nieces and nephews. Yeah, it was scary. I mean,
you know, knowing that there's a fire and you've got
these brave firefighters rushing in to put out the firefight
and put out the fire. Pardon me as they're ushering
you out. I mean it's scary. Look, there are some

(03:40):
things that they have done. They're going to make what
happened there impossible. Again. They built a wall around the residence.
We really didn't have something like that. There's now a
dedicated crew of state troopers to patrolling the grounds. We
didn't have that before. There's all kinds of new technology.
I'm not going to get into it here. That that is,
you know, going to make us safe, and they're taking
steps at our home as well. Look, I think you

(04:02):
gotta in this job. You gotta have faith in the
people around you to keep you safe. Otherwise you become
paralyzed by fear. And I'm unwilling to be a victim
the rest of my life. I'm unwilling to be paralyzed
by fear. And I'm not going to be deterred in
doing this work. I'm not going to be deterred in
practicing my faith. I'm not going to be deterred and
being who I am. I'm not going to be deterredent
just being able to go outside and catch with my kids.

(04:23):
You can't live in fear, and that is kind of
how I've I've worked through this, and my family and
I have worked through this so that we can we
can go forward and do this job we love and
try and do it in a safe way.

Speaker 3 (04:33):
Well, you don't believe that building a wall is a
proper way, man.

Speaker 1 (04:37):
I've always been for securing our border. If that's where
you're going.

Speaker 3 (04:41):
Yeah, I was, as you know.

Speaker 4 (04:42):
So what startled him? That was my question. Because he
was in the house, he had a hammer. What made
him flee? What made him run?

Speaker 1 (04:48):
I don't know if you saw the video, but he
used this metal hammer to to break a window to
throw them all tough cocktail, which ignited the explosion. Then
he went to another window, used the metal hammer to
break a window so he could climb in. What's really scary,
which I don't think folks understood when they looked at
the video, is he then tried to kick down a

(05:08):
set of doors that literally lead to our private living quarters.
That's where we all were, So he was a door
away while that was going on. You know, we've later
learned this. The state police opted not to go after him,
but to get us out and get us to safety,
which was the right thing to do, and so we
were able to be safe and secure while you know,

(05:30):
he was able to get away.

Speaker 3 (05:32):
And I saw you say that you had an enormous
guilt about that based off what you just said, you
know earlier about being a public servant, being in governor,
but it's still being a father. Is it worth it?

Speaker 1 (05:44):
I think it is, Charlemagne, And I mean that's a
tough question. You're asking me, right, Is it worth putting
your kids' lives at risk? Right? I mean that's a
hard thing to ask to answer. I think what I
love public service, and I'm not trying to sound but like,
I really feel like I get to make a difference
every day, and I'm sure we'll talk about some issues.

(06:05):
I think we are making a difference, and so I
want to help other people, and obviously the most important
thing is keeping my family safe. I think if you
can have confidence in the people who are keeping you safe.
You can't walk away now with everything that's on the line,
with all the challenges we face as a country, with
my responsibility to frankly push back on what we're seeing

(06:26):
in Washington, protect our freedoms in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania.
And now it's not the time to walk away. So
I think we're in a good place from a safety perspective.
I am mentally strong and prepared to continue on with
this work knowing that my family is being cared for
and protected, and this is not a time to quit.
So yeah, it's worth it. It's worth it to put

(06:46):
yourself out there and try and do good for others.

Speaker 5 (06:49):
How well you say that the conversations with your kids
have been hard, right because of all of this? Have
your kids asked you to not do this job anymore?
After everything?

Speaker 1 (07:00):
I want to be respectful to my kids privacy. But
you know, I'll tell you what it was like in
the days after and kind of where we are today.
We're blessed with four kids twenty three twenty sixteen fourteen.
What was really interesting to Laurie and I and twenty
three is a daughter and then the rest of boys
They each asked different kinds of questions, and they asked

(07:22):
them in a different way, and you know, sometimes they
were concerned about my well being. Sometimes they were understandably
concerned about their own well being. My fourteen year old
asked a lot of questions that were super factual. How
did he get here, how.

Speaker 3 (07:36):
Did he do that?

Speaker 1 (07:37):
What was he doing? What does the video look like?
You know, stuff like that. And I remember early on
in this I just answered everything I knew. I told
him everything I knew with as much granularity as I had.
I remember my wife said to me, are we doing this?
Like is this what we're supposed to do? Or are
we supposed to like tell our kids this? And I
was like, I think so. I mean, there's no playbook

(07:58):
for this. And so we were just brutally honest with
our kids about both the facts of what happened and
then the emotional questions that they asked. And I think
that helped them get through it too. My kids haven't
asked me to quit. My kids haven't asked me the
real question you asked me before. I think they want

(08:20):
me to keep doing this work. I mean, I think,
like any job that a parent has, it pulls you
away from a game, or it pulls you away from
something they want like that annoys kids, rightfully so, but overall,
the idea that I would quit this job because I'm afraid,
I think that would set the wrong example for my kids.

(08:40):
I want my kids to grow up strong and confident.
I want my kids to grow up in a world
where they feel like they could do whatever they want
to do and they can make a difference in the world.
And I can be deterred by bullies, They're not going
to be deterred by people who want to come after them. Instead,
they're going to stand up to that. I want to
show that example.

Speaker 3 (08:56):
That would be a tough conversation if your wife and
kids came to you and was like, we love you,
but we want you to step down. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (09:05):
Look, you know, when we talk about politics, every decision
I made ever run for an office or or decided
not to run for an office or do something, it's
always been kind of like, you know, one percent political
and ninety nine percent personal and family. Because when you
do these jobs, you've got to be all in. I mean,
you gotta be willing to, you know, miss the games
and the routine stuff which which you guys all, I'm

(09:26):
sure go through every para cose through that, but you
also have to be you got to have your family
all in to deal with the public pressures that come
along with this. And my kids have been amazing. My
wife has been unbelievable. I mean, we've we've been together
since the ninth grade. She's not that we knew this
was gonna be our lives back then, but she's just

(09:47):
been with me through everything, and she's like the most
amazing support system and just you know, my best friend
in the whole world.

Speaker 3 (09:53):
I would go tell them it's gonna be way less
security if I'm not governing no more.

Speaker 2 (09:57):
So I wanted to talk about some of the things
that's going on in Washington and how it's affecting you
as a governor. You see so many people can't pay
their rent, can't pay for food, can't pay.

Speaker 4 (10:10):
A lot of it, right, and then the tariffs are
adding to it.

Speaker 2 (10:13):
Right. The other day we were talking about the average
price of car, A car, just a vehicle, something to drive.
They said, I think like six years ago it was
like thirty something thousand, Now it's fifty two thousand dollars.
So people can't afford things anymore. It's getting very difficult
out there. They can't afford rent, they can't afford to
go to school, they're taking extra jobs. So what are
you telling, especially the governor of Pennsylvania, what are you

(10:33):
telling people in Pennsylvania about that?

Speaker 4 (10:35):
Or how are you helping?

Speaker 1 (10:36):
Yeah? If any so, we're just having a conversation about this.
I was in Lebanon County, Pennsylvania, on a farm yesterday,
by the way, announcing that Pennsylvania has now protected more
farmland than any other state in the entire country. I'm
sure not super interesting to the breakfast club listeners, but
a really important thing Forensylvania. Why do I bring that up?

(10:58):
Because I was asked, Hey, what what's going on? Like,
what's on the minds of farmers and people you meet
here in rural Pennsylvania, And in many ways it's the
same thing that's on the mind of people in urban Pennsylvania,
in Philly or Pittsburgh or something like that. Affordability for farmers.
Affordability is a problem because of the present's tariffs. I mean,
that is the dumbest policy. It has caused prices to rise.

(11:21):
It is shut down markets for farmers. It is shut
down markets for Pennsylvania manufacturers, and you go to the
grocery store, things cost more. You order something on Amazon.
Now they got rid of that so called deminimus rule.
Everything you're buying costs more, and everything costs more because
Donald Trump pushed a button and started a tariff for
a trade war with our allies with Canada, with countries

(11:47):
that we do business with to the benefit of Americans.
I'm not saying that some targeted tariff you're there protect
the steel industry or something like that, isn't helpful. But
these blanket tariffs that he pulls out of his ass
and doesn't really have a number that makes a whole
lot of sense, is having a singular effect in my
state and across the country. That is to make everything

(12:10):
cost more, whether you're running a business, whether you're operating
a farm, or whether you're just trying to buy your groceries.
What am I doing about in Pennsylvania in the face
of the federal government working against us. I've cut taxes
six times in our comma. I've cut taxes for seniors,
cut taxes for small businesses multiple times. I've cut taxes
for families who are trying to afford childcare. We tripled

(12:32):
what we call our childcare tax credit. In addition to that,
we're investing more in housing to try and bring down
the cost of housing. We've developed more affordable housing great Eagles,
Shady McCoy and I actually just work together in a
big housing project in the Harrisburg area which is now
built and open. So we have a lot more work to

(12:52):
do on that front, but that's certainly important. We are
doing everything we can to reduce costs for people, to
try and bring down the cost of things. And Donald
Trump is just working against us every single day, and
these tariffs are exhibit A.

Speaker 3 (13:06):
Who's faulted the government shut down. It doesn't matter because
right now the polls are saying that most Americans are
starting to blame Democrats.

Speaker 1 (13:14):
Yeah, but look, I don't know about the polls, and
I'm not a political pundit. Here's what I know. I
have to deal with the real effects of it every
day as a governor of Pennsylvania, by the way, as
do other governors. Right. So, I've got a workforce of
about eighty thousand people who work for me in the state.
Roughly ten thousand of them work for the state. But
they're funded by the Feds to support our veterans, provide

(13:38):
health care you know, you name it. They're not getting
paid right now, right and if I pay them in
lieu of the federal government paying them, that's a budget
hit to me. I got veterans. We're one of the
top states for number of veterans, about eight hundred thousand
veterans in our state who aren't going to the benefits
that they need. I got kids with unique you know,
health challenges, who aren't atting the services they need because

(14:01):
the federal government is shut down. Look, the Republicans control
everything in DC. They control the Senate, the control the House,
they control the Presidency. Because of the unique rules that
they have. They need whatever it is, seven or eight
Democratic votes in the US Senate, Why the hell should
the Democrats give up their vote for nothing? They've said,
we want one thing. We want to make sure healthcare

(14:23):
is more affordable. We want these so called Obamacare subsidies extended,
because when they go away at the end of this year.
You want to talk about costs, envy, Your healthcare costs
are going to spike because of it. And so Democrats, rightfully,
you said in the Senate, you want our seven votes,
you got to give us what we need on healthcare,
which by the way, makes a lot of sense. You
got to use the leverage when you have it. So

(14:45):
I'm kind of less focused on who's to blame and
more focused on two things. One managing our state through
this and number two, hopefully seeing the Democrats be successful
in the US Senate in driving home a conclusion that's
going to result in better health care for Americas.

Speaker 3 (15:02):
From a strategy perspective, do you think it would have
been smarter to say, you know what, let the Republicans
have their way, let them drive a healthcare So that's
the one issue we can point to and say this
is Republican's fault, as opposed to now the water is
being so muddy because the government is shut down and
so many other people aren't getting paid. So now they're
starting to blame Democrats.

Speaker 1 (15:21):
I'm less focused in my day to day life of
letting something bad happen so I can point a finger
at somebody else then actually solving the damn problem and
then go take credit for it. I mean, you know,
obviously you're in the business of getting stuff done, and
then you got to go tell the voters what you did.
I hope that Chuck Schruman the Democrats are successful here

(15:41):
and then, rather than try and prove that the bad
thing that happened was the Republican's fault, go and take
credit for doing something good for the American people and
helping them, you know, get their health care. I will
tell you this fight is playing out at a really
critical time when it comes to healthcare. If I can
get maybe just a little though, you can extrapolate this
out to every other state. My state, thirteen million people,

(16:05):
you know, big state. As a result of Trump and
the Republicans passing what they call the Beautiful Bill, which
you know, silly name, but just follow me on this,
five hundred and ten thousand Pennsylvanians are about to lose
healthcare coverage. You're about to lose Medicaid, and one hundred
and forty thousand more Pennsylvanians are losing food assistants. That's

(16:28):
that actually started back in September, right, so.

Speaker 3 (16:32):
We snap and wick and exact sta.

Speaker 1 (16:34):
Yeah, so we got this moment right now where I've
got you know, six hundred plus thousand Pennsylvanians who are
either losing healthcare or food assistance. And then at the
end of this year, I got over a million who
rely on these subsidies to afford Obamacare. And by the way,
these are people working, they're doing what we want them
to do, and we're giving them a little bit extra

(16:55):
help so they can afford a healthcare for them and
their families that goes away. So we're facing a dire
situation of Donald Trump's making where I've got about a
million and a half people who in some former fashion
and lose healthcare, be kicked off of it, or lose
food assystem. There's a real problem. And by the way,
the states can't make that up, like we can't backfill that.

(17:17):
I can't speak for every governor, but I don't think
any state's budget can backfill the billions of dollars in
healthcare and food assistants that they're cutting. So the fact remains,
if these senators want to go fight to protect healthcare,
I'm all in for that. They should use their leverage
to be able to do that.

Speaker 5 (17:32):
Is that why in Pennsylvania right now there's such a
back and forth about you guys, budget and trying to
figure out what can be improved and what can't because
of a trickle down for a big Yeah.

Speaker 1 (17:40):
Look, the Feds make this way harder, right, And you
know I got I'm a governor with a divided legislature.
I'm one of the only ones in the country. I've
got a State House led by Democrats by the way,
by one seat, the State Senate led by Republicans literally
by two seats. So out of two hundred and fifty
three lawmakers, three seats separate the whole thing. I've managed
to bring them all together to big things, cutting taxes,

(18:01):
investing in education, by the way, investing in public safety.
I made a commitment to hire two thousand cops and
put a few hundred million dollars into violence prevention. It's working.
Crime is down forty two percent in Pennsylvania. So we've
shown an ability to come together and get stuff done,
and certainly we're going to do that here.

Speaker 3 (18:17):
The thing I like about you, Governor Shapiro, is that
you aren't busy pointing fingers. You're always doing the work.
And it's interesting because you're one of the people whose
names comes up to run for president all the time,
but you don't seem to be actively campaigning for that
like some of the other governors do. So how do
you stay Pennsylvania?

Speaker 1 (18:35):
First, that's my job, man. I took an oath of
office to thirteen million people to work my ass off
for them every single day, and I'm busy every day
doing that. And look, I think the most important thing
when people trust you to do these jobs is do
the job, show your work. And I've always believed that
the best politics is really good policy, and good policy

(18:56):
means lives get get better. So that's the way I do.
I don't want to in any way have that answer
be viewed as, you know, a dis of any other governor.

Speaker 3 (19:03):
Man.

Speaker 1 (19:03):
I've got a great relationship with my fellow governors. We've
got some amazing governors doing great work across the country,
and I really applaud them.

Speaker 2 (19:11):
I wanted to ask about, you know what, the government
shut down? How bad is that affecting the regular person
in Pennsylvania, Because it's it's what this is the third
week now going on the fourth, inga sixteen days of
sixteen days, and it's and it's getting to the point
where it seems like a lot of.

Speaker 4 (19:25):
People are going to be fired, a lot of people
are not going to get paid.

Speaker 3 (19:28):
They working without pay.

Speaker 2 (19:29):
They're working with people to get So how difficult is
that for you? For your people in Pennsylvania? And what
do you tell them? Right, It's like, how do you
tell somebody to keep working and don't get paid? You know,
how do you tell somebody to work but then they
can't pay their mortgage or they can't pay for this?

Speaker 4 (19:44):
Like, so what do you say?

Speaker 1 (19:46):
You know, largest employer in Pennsylvania is the federal government.
Second largest is the state government. And you know, I'm
proud to be colleagues with eighty thousand people that work
for our state government. I work with them every single
damn proud of them, Proud of the work that they do,
from the folks who clean our buildings to the people
that go out and you know, test for public health

(20:06):
issues out in our rural communities. I value the work
that they do. The idea that some of them are
being asked to go to work without pay, that the
largest employer in our state is not paying their employees,
that has a real negative impact to the point you're making.
I mean, these are folks who still need to go
to the grocery store, they still need to pay for

(20:27):
their kids' childcare, they still need to get their kid
the baseball bat they need for littally whatever, and they're not.
I think what's different about this shutdown than past. In
the past, they were kind of guaranteed they were going
to get their money back at the end of it,
and so it sucks, but they probably thought, Okay, I
can get through a week or two or three, but
I'm going to get all that money back. The way

(20:48):
Donald Trump is doing things, the way these people around
them are doing things, I don't think they know they're
going to get their money back. And so it's not
just about kind of floating through three weeks, right, maybe
dip in the savings, put the money back at extent
that you have the savings. This is really serious stuff
because they don't know that they're going to get that
back pay. I think the way Trump has treated the
federal work for us, it's just so disrespectful from a

(21:11):
human standpoint. In fact, he's laid off a ton of
federal workers. We've hired them in the state. They got
great skills, great expertise, and they want to do good
by their you know, their fellow Americans, and so we've
hired them and they're doing really important work. For us.
I think you got to treat people with respect when
they're doing these jobs, and clearly the president isn't.

Speaker 3 (21:28):
Now I read a. Kamala Harris's book one hundred and
seven Days Just Switching gave a little bit sure, and
I saw your comments on her book. And for those
who don't know the form of VP, wrote that Governor
Shapiro seemed overly ambitious because you were, you know, up
with a VP role. She said, you seemed overly ambitious,
and you pushed for two large a role for a
vice president and seemed unwilling to accept a number two position.

(21:48):
How did you feel when you heard that?

Speaker 1 (21:50):
I mean, like, I haven't read her book. I'm busy
every day, frankly, dealing with the effects of the fact
that we lost the twenty twenty four election, dealing with
Donald Trump wanting to send troops into our street, dealing
with Donald Trump, by the way, just a week or
two ago, demanding that I turn over the entire voter roles,
including Pennsylvane's social Security number, driver's license, some of all

(22:13):
this stuff. I don't know what the hell he wants
that for, but I know it's not for any good purpose,
and he sued me when I wouldn't turn it over.
I'm dealing with the real effects of governing in the world,
you know, after Donald Trump won the election. So haven't
read the book having really focused on it.

Speaker 3 (22:27):
But even what's wrong with the vice president being overly ambitious?
If you're the number two to the number one, Yeah,
shouldn't you be ready to be number one?

Speaker 1 (22:35):
I guess that's a question for her. She clearly thought it.

Speaker 3 (22:38):
And you also criticized her, which I thought was fair,
for not speaking out publicly earlier about concerns over President
Biden's fitness to run in twenty twenty four. To me,
that's not just the criticism for the VP as a
criticism for a whole democratic point.

Speaker 1 (22:52):
You and I have talked about that issue.

Speaker 3 (22:53):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (22:53):
Look, I don't want to get into it with the
former vice president, but I mean, if you're in the room,
you're seeing things nobody else is seeing, you had a
responsibility to speak up, and she didn't.

Speaker 4 (23:04):
Do you think?

Speaker 3 (23:04):
Hold on, I think about it and we can move on.
But the book the book also mentioned because you didn't
read it, but it mentioned that some of your comments
on pro Palestinian protests were flagged by her campaign, but
that wasn't a deciding factor, do you think.

Speaker 1 (23:17):
Look, I wasn't in her head. I don't know what
she was thinking. I'll just say to you, I think
I said this to you before, just to keep it real, man,
when I was going through that process. First off, it's
an honor to go through that process. I said throughout
it that she had a deeply personal decision to make.
In the end, Charlemagne, so did I and I love

(23:38):
being governor of Pennsylvania and calling the shots.

Speaker 2 (23:40):
Now, it seems like you two don't rock with each
other too much, right And from the comments that Charlemagne
said in the book and things that you said.

Speaker 3 (23:47):
About who a couple of hors, no, I don't get that.

Speaker 2 (23:50):
No.

Speaker 1 (23:51):
And by the way, Shit and I have done each
other twenty years. I mean, we've worked together for a
long time.

Speaker 2 (23:56):
It doesn't seem like it's a united front, right, But
sometimes you look at Republicans per se, it seems like
it's more of affront.

Speaker 4 (24:03):
It just seems like that front wasn't.

Speaker 1 (24:04):
I don't think so envy. I worked my butt off
to help her get elected. I mean I did every
I traveled with Gretchen Whitmer and Tony Evers to all
three swing states Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, Michigan. I did dozens of events. Hell,
I even cutting add for I don't think her campaign
ever ran it, but cuttingand for her in Pennsylvania where
you know I'm doing okay there. So yeah, I got

(24:28):
no ill will and I don't think she does toward me.

Speaker 5 (24:31):
What about because I know you had a conversation with
Biden one on one where you told him that you
didn't think that he was like fit to run, right,
you had conversations with the VP leading up to her
announcing and all the things. Did you ever say to
her you should say something now like people are relying
on you.

Speaker 1 (24:48):
Well, I never had a conversation with her. I went
directly to the President and spoke to him about what
I saw were, you know, his challenges in Pennsylvania. I
was really honest with him. We got together at a
coffee shop in Harrisburg. I think there's been reported. I mean,
I'll just share with you. He said, how's it going.
I was very clear, it's not going well. The polls

(25:10):
are showing it's not going well. I don't think you're
handling the cost question back to what we talked about
before with rising costs. It was a big theme in
the campaign, big issue in Pennsylvania. I didn't think they
were handling that well. I expressed that I thought people
thought he wasn't up to the job, not so much
the job doing it at that moment, but the job

(25:31):
doing it for another four years, which I think there's
a real difference there. And I was very honest with
him about that. Look, I'm maybe it's old school, but
I believe that if you got something to say, you
say it directly that person's face. And these President of
the United States. I respected him, still respect him, and
I respect him enough to say it directly to his face.

Speaker 3 (25:49):
I was received.

Speaker 1 (25:50):
Yeah, I think he heard it. He told me that
their poll numbers were different, and he seemed committed to
continuing forward and listen, that's his call, of course, I mean,
it's the President of the United States, and so to me,

(26:10):
I thought I had a responsibility, as the governor from
arguably the most important swing state in the entire country,
to be very honest about what I was seeing on
the ground, and to be very honest about the fact
that I saw real challenges for him to get or
for him to win Pennsylvania. And I was also really
honest with him that I had shared a lot of

(26:32):
this with his team, and I didn't think that they
were being direct with him, And so I felt the
need to take what is, you know, a fairly extraordinary
step and go directly to the president and say this.

Speaker 3 (26:43):
You can't, you should. That stuff should be amplified. Like
I knew that story, right. But the reason I say
that stuff should be amplified it because that's what's going
to help you in the future if you do decide
to run for president. Because I keep telling folks like, look, man,
anybody that wants to lead his party in the future
has to throw that old regime under the and it
has to be people that told that old regime the
truth about where they were at. It wasn't a lot

(27:05):
of y'all that did that.

Speaker 1 (27:06):
Can I disagree with you slightly on this. I don't
believe that you get ahead in life by throwing people
under the bus. I don't believe that I got to
kick somebody in order to get ahead. I think you
got to show your work. I think you got to
show a vision. I think you got to tell people
what you're all about, and That's how you know you
can be successful as a governor, as senator, whatever it

(27:26):
is that you do. I made my point clear to
the president and the former president, and you know, I'm
glad I did that.

Speaker 3 (27:35):
Okay, how about being known as a truth teller and
a party that lied to the whole country?

Speaker 1 (27:39):
I think speaking truth is really important.

Speaker 3 (27:41):
Yeah, and I did that.

Speaker 1 (27:42):
I think people believing that even if they disagree with
you on an issue, or they disagree with your viewpoint
on something, at least they walk away knowing, Hey, you
know what, that guy was straight with me. I mean, hell,
I think we started the conversation. I was at a
farm in Lebanon County, Pennsylvania yesterday. This is not an
area that Democrats go to. And I was there talking
for real about tariffs and other things, and I kind

(28:05):
of made a joke. I said, look, I know where
I am. I know I'm in Lebanon County. I know
this isn't exactly, you know, an area where I'm getting
a majority of the vote or however I said it.
But I wanted to be here today and I wanted
to be clear with you about what I think, how
I feel, and how I see things. I think what
the American people really want. Certainly people of Pennsylvania want
again swingy estate in the whole country, I think it's

(28:26):
a pretty good indicator of where others are. They just
want to be real, they want to be authentic, and
they don't need to agree with you on everything like
this isn't about everybody agreeing on a purity test. They
want to know what's in your heart. They want to
know what motivates you to serve, and they want to
know what you really think.

Speaker 4 (28:42):
Were you surprised when when Trump won Pennsylvania?

Speaker 1 (28:45):
No, I mean I saw when Biden dropped out, he
had been consistently down and by the way I shared
this with the former president, he'd been consistently down five
six seven points. When the vice president jumped in, you
saw the numbers close, but they never She never overtook him,

(29:08):
and any of the data that we saw, and look,
I think beyond the data, I got a pretty good
feel for my state and in my state, you know,
you get a sense of sort of where different areas
are going and how they're moving, and she just never
was able to close that gap. Now, look, if she

(29:28):
would have one Pennsylvania by fifty thousand votes. Would I
have been shocked?

Speaker 2 (29:32):
No?

Speaker 1 (29:32):
But you asked me, was I surprised or shocked that
he won? No? Because basically by the end, when we
were in that final couple weeks, you know, she's kind
of minus one, even minus two, something like that. I mean,
it wasn't that she had overcome where he was.

Speaker 5 (29:50):
If she had separated herself more from Biden, do you
think she could have won the state? What do you
think was the reason why she didn't?

Speaker 1 (29:57):
I don't know. I mean, look, what's the title the
book one hundred and I mean she didn't. She didn't
have a lot of time, right and fairness to her.
But it kind of goes back to what I was
just saying a moment ago. People want to know who
you are. They want genuineness, they want authenticity, they want
to feel like they know who you are. And you
know clearly that that was not accomplished.

Speaker 3 (30:20):
How much credit do you think President Trump should get
for the Israel and Gaza?

Speaker 1 (30:24):
He deserves credit. I gave him credit. I gave him
credit for getting the hostages home. I think what I
also said is he's got a hell of a lot
of work to do on what I think is being
called Phase two, and Phase two is arguably the most
important piece of this. Now that the hostages are home
and the war has stopped, the violence has stopped, you

(30:45):
got to feed these folks in Gaza. You got to
make sure that they get the humanitarian aid that they
so desperately need. And you've got to get these other
Arab nations to actually pony up and begin to rebuild
those neighborhoos, rebuild that area. At the same time, Hamas
has to be disarmed. They cannot continue to be in power.

(31:08):
Look at what they've been doing just over the last
forty eight hours. They're murdering they're fellow citizens there because
they don't like that they're supporting a rival political party
or they believe that they collaborated with the Israelis. So
you cannot allow Hamas to remain in power. And you've
got to get aid in there, and you've got to
get the rebuilding process started. So yeah, I get President

(31:30):
Trump credit for what he did. By the same token,
he's got a hell of a lot more work to do,
and I hope he sees this through.

Speaker 3 (31:36):
There's a lot of people who feel like the deal
isn't complete though, because of a lot of the dead bodies, haven't.
They're still digging a dead bat of yeah, retireing, and
you know when it comes when you're dead hostage. When
you say peace like Hamas doesn't believe in is right,
they exist. The current Israeli government doesn't believe in a
two state solutions, So how are they ever going to
be peace?

Speaker 1 (31:56):
Look, I'll just tell you my views on this, And
again you asked me about the president before. I was
trying to give you an honest answer on that. We
got to figure out how to get to phase two.
We got to disarm Hamas, get them out of power,
and invest in Godsen. Now what does a future look like?
And this is where I just have profound differences from Natanyahu,
and I've been really outspoken about this even prior to

(32:16):
October seventh. The only way you're going to have peace
and stability in the region for a long time is
if you're a kid growing up in the Palestinian areas
and you believe you've got a future. You got a
future because of the job you want, because the education
you're getting, you know, whatever name is. By the way,
the way our kids feel like they've got a future

(32:36):
here in this country. When people have hope and they
believe that they can have a brighter future, they don't
turn to terrorism, they don't turn to hate. Instead, they
focus on loving and they focus on how to create
a better future for themselves and their families. So to me,
if you can stabilize the region, get Hamas out of power,

(33:00):
the our world, come together and invest, then you have
to go onto the next phase of the conversation, which
is a two state solution, something I have supported for
quite some time. Hamas doesn't recognize Israel's right to exist.
That's why they cannot be empower. Their whole charter calls
for the destruction of Israel and destruction the killing of
Jews and on the same tongue and hamasaid terrorist group.

(33:23):
Natanyahu on the other side, the leader of Israel doesn't
believe in a two state solution, so he can't. He
either can't be empower right if you're going to get
to a two state solution, or the President needs to
get him to change his views on that issue. Look,
I'm not naive you're not going to get to a
two state solution in the next few months or probably

(33:43):
even year, But we've got to get on a path
where Palestinians can live their lives with dignity, where Israelis
can live their lives with dignity and safety, and where
everybody in the region feels like they have an opportunity
for success and prosperity and promise in the future.

Speaker 3 (33:59):
I feel agree with you about him, Maaz. I feel
like Natanyahu should be removed from power to it. And
you you've called him one of the worst leaders I
have of all time. And you, you know, defend Israel
clearly because you do it right.

Speaker 1 (34:10):
No, not because I'm just because I think, first off,
I love Israel. I think it is a wonderful country
with a rich heritage. I think it is an incredible
melting pot of people, Jewish and non Jewish. I also
think it is vitally important to our national security. It
is important to having stability in the region. You look
around at these other Arab nations that have created relationships

(34:35):
with Israel where there's now commerce and other activities through
what's known as the Abraham Accords and in other agreements.
They view Israel as critical for their future and vice versa.
So I think for all those reasons, I support it.
I don't like Nita Yah who, I don't think that
he's led Israel down a good path. I think he's
been a destructive leader. I don't get a vote there,

(34:56):
but I sure as heck hope that as we go
forward here, either the President gets him to change his
views or the Israelis make a different choice and in
their election that's their right to pick, not mine. But
I think this is not just important because I'm a
proud American Jew. This is important I think for America's
you know, national security interests.

Speaker 3 (35:17):
Where is the line between criticizing Israeli policy and endorsing
actions you believe cross moral or even legal boundaries?

Speaker 1 (35:25):
Explain what you're asking me.

Speaker 3 (35:26):
I don't feel like with net and Yahoo right, like
you know, you say he's one of the worst leaders
of all time. Clearly he's some people have said he's
crossed a lot of moral and legal boundaries. So where
is the line between you know, criticizing him, but in
I guess, in endorsing yeah actions, Because if.

Speaker 1 (35:43):
You're kind of understanding, do you love this country absolutely yeah?
And do you think Donald Trump does a lot of
mass up ship?

Speaker 3 (35:50):
Absolutely yeah?

Speaker 1 (35:51):
That's the line. I mean, I think I think we
are obviously free in this country and freedom in Israel.
To be able to criticize leaders, to be able to say,
I disagree with this policy, I don't like the way
you did this, I don't like the way you prosecuted
the war. Whatever the case is. That's fair game, by
the way, and it's fair game here in America to
be able to call that out if you disagree. Now,

(36:12):
when some people use that as a way to promote
anti Semitism and bigotry and hatred and Islamophobia, that's not okay.
So I think criticizing policy, criticizing leaders fair game. When
you use that as an excuse to, you know, to
criticize someone because of their faith or how they look
or the way they're raising their kids, I think that

(36:33):
crosses the line.

Speaker 3 (36:34):
I agree. Let's stay here for a second. Right, Because
I said Israeli policy, I probably say Net and Yahoo policy, right,
all right? Or when you say America, do you say
Trump policy?

Speaker 1 (36:44):
Right?

Speaker 3 (36:44):
Right? But those are the leaders at the time, So
should we generalize Should they reflect the whole country? No?

Speaker 1 (36:53):
I think it should reflect the leaders who are in power. Yeah, yeah,
I mean I'm critical of President Trump and I love
this country. I mean, I serve this country. I believe
in the values of this country. I believe that we're
working progress and that we're always perfecting our union. I
believe that we're a country that in every chapter of
our American story, we grow stronger, we grow more tolerant,

(37:15):
we grow more just. And I also believe in this
American story that we have chapters where we take two
steps forward and one step back. And right now we're
in the midst of taking a step back. Maybe you
could even argue two or three, or four or five
steps back. It doesn't make me love this country any less.
It actually makes me want to fight even harder to
strengthen what I believe is the best of this nation.

Speaker 3 (37:34):
And only reason I'm asking these questions is because you know,
a lot of people feel like APAC and pro Israel
lobbyists have a lot of influence on elected officials here
in America. Why do they have so much influence?

Speaker 1 (37:49):
You know, I don't know. I mean, I don't really
deal with a pack. They're more dealing at the federal level.
And look, I think you can broaden that out and
say every lobbying group has too much power. And I
think we all can agree there's way too much money
in politics, and oftentimes that money brings with it under influence.
My focus every day is trying to get out and

(38:12):
be with regular folk and hear what's on their minds,
and talk to parents about what they're worried about for
their kids' future, and you know, sort of trying and
get out of that echo chamber that oftentimes surround you
when you're in the Capitol or when you're just in
those circles and talk to real people every day. I
think that's how I've been able to kind of keep
my feel for where things are. I think it's why
we're doing so well in Pennsylvania is you focus on

(38:34):
regular people, not just the inside voices.

Speaker 3 (38:36):
Because I read an article in the New York Times
about Democrats pulling away from APEC, so clearly it's having
some impact on them politically if they feel like they
got to.

Speaker 1 (38:45):
I mean, I think it's become a political issue. You've
used it as a political issue. You've questioned federal representatives
when they're on here on that. I mean, I think
if I can say this to you, you know, not
trying to offend you here, but I think it's a
little bit of a shortcut and a little bit of
a lazy question. I think the better question is how
do you really feel about Israel? How you feel about

(39:06):
a two state solution, how do you feel about the war,
how do you feel about you know, the hostages or
hungry kids, or what have you. I think demanding answers
on those questions is more important than Hey, what about
this lobbying group or that lobbying group.

Speaker 3 (39:22):
Well, what do you say to the critics who argue
that US foreign policy on Israel is often shaped not
by a national interest, well by the lobbying screenp of these.

Speaker 1 (39:31):
I think that's a fair conversation to have, and I
think it should be on any elected official at the
federal level to say, hey, I'm listening to this group, right,
but by the way, there's groups on other sides too.
I'm listening to that group. But at the end of
the day, we want our federal representatives to be able
to sit here in the chair and answer the questions
about why they voted A, or why they voted B,
or why they feel a certain way. And I think

(39:54):
it's just a little lazy to say, oh, it's got
to be because of that interest group. Maybe someone actually
believes those views, maybe someone feels strongly about that particular way.

Speaker 3 (40:03):
How do you push back on the lobbyists who have
so much influence.

Speaker 1 (40:05):
I kind of do it the way I do it,
which is in my state, I focus on the needs
of the people. I focus on what I hear from folks.
You know. I kind of have an informal rule that
I work about seven days a week. I try and
only be in my physical office in the capital about
three days a week, and so I'm physically out and
about listening to folks. I was on that farm in
Lebanon County yesterday. Tomorrow morning, I'll be in Erie, Pennsylvania.

(40:28):
I think the more I am out and not in
scripted moments, but actually just talking to real folk, hearing
what's on their minds, that allows me to keep fighting
for them. I'll tell you something else I do. You're
gonna laugh. But I spend a lot of time in
the Pennsylvanian Turnpike going different places. I will make a
point to have the guys stop at a rest stop,

(40:49):
even if I don't really need anything, just to wander
through and chat with folks and see what's on their mind.
Like I am always trying to find those moments where
I can have the unscripted dialogue when I'm at my
kids baseball game on the you know, on the sideline
or at one of their games, you know, rather than
just let people kind of come over to you and say, oh, hey,

(41:09):
you know Gov, it's nice to meet her, whatever, Can
you take a selfie? It's hey, tell me what's on
your mind? What's going on? Like, I'm happy to do
the selfie with you, But but it changed that I
want to know what you're thinking about I am. I
am always craving those moments where I can have those conversations.
And when I can have those conversations, then quite frankly,
the powerful folks in the fancy suits that wander around

(41:30):
the Capitol become less important to how you form your
views on things.

Speaker 3 (41:33):
Yeah, I see, I loved that because you're out there
connecting with people. That that's that shows real power to
the people. To your point, folks in DC is connecting
with the lobbyists, so they're given the power to the lobbyist.
So I wonder if it's just a psychological thing, like yo,
step out of DC, step out of that bubble and
go show and I'm not.

Speaker 1 (41:50):
Look, I'm not trying to be disrespectful the people that
serve in Congress. I'm sure a lot of them do
what I do and and do a great job representing
their their communities. I'm just telling you how I do it.

Speaker 2 (41:58):
Now, you eliminated for you to requirements for most state
jobs I did. Why was that important? And does that
kind of tell a young student I don't have to
get my degree anymore?

Speaker 4 (42:08):
Yeah, it seems college is getting less and less and
less important.

Speaker 1 (42:10):
Well, look, this is something I'm super passionate about. And
what you didn't mention the question. It was literally the
first thing I did as governor. So as soon as
I got the power as governor and got the pen,
I signed in executive order doing away with the college
requirement to work for state government. And by the way,
it's basically every job other than the doctors and the
nurses and you know people that we require to have

(42:30):
those those advanced degrees. That opened up nearly seventy thousand
jobs to people without a college degree, And sixty one
percent of the people we've hired over the last two
and a half years i've been governor do not have
a college degree. And We didn't stop there. We went
and tripled funding in our state budget for more votech
They got a fancy word for it now, they call

(42:52):
it CTE and our high schools and funding for more
apprenticeship programs and pre apprenticeship programs. So now what we're
saying to folks is, you're in the ninth grade, you're
in the tenth grade. We want to help prepare you
for your future. You want to go work on a farm,
you can get CTE training in dairy herd management. You

(43:12):
want to be a welder and work on a big
construction project, because God knows we need a whole lot
more of that in this country. We'll show you in tenth, eleven,
twelfth grade how to do it, and then we'll have
a pipeline right into an apprenticeship program that the state
is helping fund, and then you'll be out in a job,
by the way, making over one hundred thousand dollars a year.
We want people to see avenues to success and opportunity,

(43:34):
where they choose to go to college, they choose to
go to the military, they choose to go into the
workforce in a union hall, whatever. And the most important
thing here in view is I want to treat all
of those pathways with respect. And you treat those pathways
with respect by how you speak about them. But also
your budgets show your values, and so we are investing

(43:55):
in those things. And as a result, I've got thirty
five thousand new Pennsylvanians who are going through an apprenticeship.
I got young people who are now getting jobs that
they never knew existed because they were exposed to it
in high school. When we did away with the college
degear requirement for our state police, we saw two hundred
and forty percent increase in the number of applications to

(44:18):
be a state trooper, and by the way, far more
diverse applications than we've ever had before. If you look
at this from the standpoint of right or wrong, man,
I know we're doing what's right to give more people opportunity.
I think you know every single Americans have the freedom
to chart their own course, the opportunity to succeed. But
you want to come back to politics. We've talked a

(44:39):
lot about politics today. Do you know how freaking dumb
it is to not do this politically? Let me explain.
Sixty two percent of Pennsylvania adults don't have a college degree.
So you think about where our party has been over
the last twenty years. Everything's been about get a college.
You're you can do this, yout college are gonna do that.
And by the way, I'm not dissing on college, right,

(45:00):
I went to college. But if you talk like that,
you are now saying to sixty two percent of people,
we disrespect you. And what you're really doing is you're
developing plans only for thirty eight percent of folks. We
last I checked, you need fifty percent plus one to
win elections. And so to me, it was dumb politically,

(45:21):
but it was also just wrong to treat people with
a lack of respect if they chose to go work
at a construction site or work on a farm, or
decide to take the skills they have and not go
to college but go directly in the workforce or go
to the military. We have changed that in Pennsylvania, not
just with that executive order, but with all of the
funding decisions we've made from there to give more people

(45:42):
an opportunity.

Speaker 3 (45:43):
That's crazy, because those are people that really make the
world go around. Yeah, people that are on those construction site. Yeah,
people that are in the trade industry. Yeah, those people
that really make the world go around. Let me let me.

Speaker 1 (45:52):
Put an exclamation point on that. They are the ones
who make the world gorount. America used to have an
amazing history of shipbuilding, right. Building is big ships for
the Navy and stuff like that. Do you know We've
got the oldest shipyard in America in Philadelphia. It's actually
where the US Navy began. We just celebrated the two
hundred and fiftieth anniversary of the Navy and the Marines
as well. This shipyard currently produces one and a half

(46:18):
of these massive ships a year. They build one and
a half ships a year. We just worked out a
deal with the Korean government and a company called Hanwa
where at that site they're going to now make eleven
or twelve ships a year. By the way, in China
they're making that each month. They're making more than that

(46:40):
each month. So America's got a long way to go.
Why am I bringing this up because to get to
that eleven or twelve we don't have enough welders right
now to be able to do that work. America stopped
training the people that were building the stuff that we
need for this country too many years ago, and we've
got to get back to developing those talents so we
can build these ships, we can build buildings, we can

(47:02):
do big things again in America. And the way we
do that is by having folks who have those skills,
and we're investing in those skills in Pennsylvania.

Speaker 5 (47:09):
That's old you guys are doing with the PA Sites
program to the thirty nine million. Yeah, yeah, that's why.
So that will help with a lot of the jobs
that you're talking about. There will be more jobs for
those people who didn't be Yeah.

Speaker 1 (47:19):
Absolutely, So we put a half a billion dollars aside
to take these old abandoned coal mines and these old
industrial sites where nothing's been going on for forty or
fifty years. I was just standing on one of those
sites in Archbald, Pennsylvania, which is like near Scranton in
northeastern Pennsylvania, and for a few tens of millions of dollars,
we're going to turn that into a place that's going

(47:39):
to thousands of construction jobs and over one thousand permanent jobs.
When I was having CEOs come and say, hey, we
want to come to Pennsylvania, show us the sites where
we can build our box our building, like we don't
have any now we have them. And so when you
do that, you really turn this dirt into freedom and
opportunity and you build these sites that are going to

(48:01):
employ thousands of people. This is a big deal, especially
in communities that have been hollowed out and left behind,
primarily in rural parts of my state that have just
been ignored for so long. And I think is really
important that these people growing up in these communities see
opportunity for their kids, and I'm working really hard to
do that in this sites program. So developing these grounds

(48:22):
for companies that want to come in and do business
is a really critical part of that.

Speaker 3 (48:26):
It's got a few more questions for you. Thank you
for your time, but sure, what's your message to people
future voters in particular, who feel like every politician Democrat
are Republican is bought.

Speaker 1 (48:38):
Look at my record and focus on the three letters
that I focus on every day, GSD, get shit done.
That is my motto every day. Look, I can't please
all the people all the time. I can't say that
every single pennsylvani is going to have the same worldview
I have agreed with me on every issue. But if
I can put points on the board for them every day.
If I can show them that their kid got help

(49:00):
health care, that the building got built, that the job
was available to them, like real things, that is what
we need more of in government, where people see tangible results. Look,
I think one of the reasons why poll after poll
after poll shows across this country people are down. They
think we're heading in the wrong direction. They're pessimistic. I

(49:20):
think in part it's because they view government is actually
not solving problems anymore. One of the things I thought
was amazing was after we fixed nine ninety five, Member
I ninety five collapsed and the experts said it was
going to take months to rebuild. We got it rebuilt
with the amazing Philadelphia building trades in just twelve days.

Speaker 3 (49:37):
The number of.

Speaker 1 (49:38):
People came over to me and said, man, I don't
drive on nine ninety five, but that was amazing that
government can still do something like that. I think people
have grown so hopeless and so down, and so to
me is someone who actually believes government can be a
force for good in people's lives. If I can show
my work, put points on the board, get shit done

(49:59):
for them every day, even if they disagree with me
on some issue here there, They're at least going to
know I'm fighting for them, getting stuff done for them,
and that is what I think we need more of
in government.

Speaker 3 (50:09):
Is it possible for an elected official to get a
million of dollars from you know, corporate donors or even
lobbying interested and still really work for the people over
those Yeah.

Speaker 1 (50:21):
Look, I mean you've asked me a few questions on that,
and clearly I know you're bothered by that. I think
we're all bothered by the amount of money in politics,
particularly the dark money that nobody kind of knows where
it's coming from. But I think you know, largely the voters.
I'll just speak to Pennsylvania. They're smart, they know who's
on their side. They see it. I got voters who

(50:44):
sometimes show up and vote for Republicans, sometimes vote for Democrats.
They get it. I think that dark money can pollute,
it sometimes can crowd out the voices sometimes, but overall,
I think voters are a lot smarter and they could
see through that when the.

Speaker 3 (50:58):
Last time you told a donor no, even though it
costs you politically.

Speaker 1 (51:02):
That's happened many times in my career, and I'm not
suggesting anything unethical or illegal, or the donor was trying
to do anything unethical or illegal. But yeah, I've had them,
you know, sometimes say to me, well, I would I
believe in this and that and the other thing, And
I'll say, look, you know what, keep your money. I'm
happy to be your friend, but I don't believe in that,
and I'm not going to do that. And again, nothing

(51:23):
wrong or unethical or illegal. But they've got a different
view on things than I do. And frankly, I'm not
interested in, you know, having their support if you know,
we're going to look at things differently on those fronts.

Speaker 3 (51:35):
Yeah, I mean, honestly, I don't have a problem with
people taking the money. It's just that when you take
the money and you're beholden to them' That's what I
would tell elected officials. You don't have to be beholden
to them.

Speaker 1 (51:45):
Look, I feel blessed. I've got a whole lot of
people who have invested in my campaigns over time. By
the way, I'm sure some of them don't agree with
some of the things that I stand for, but they
believe in in my approach to governing and the work
I'm trying to do to help other people, and I
feel has to have their support. But I can tell
you there's there's not one donor or one group or
whatever that I go Oh man, I got to please them.

(52:06):
So I'm going to do something that I disagree with.
I mean, I wouldn't be able to live with myself.
I wouldn't be able to sleep at night.

Speaker 3 (52:12):
People are going to people will always assume it's APEC
though APAK is the boogeyman in all.

Speaker 1 (52:17):
Of It's code for a lot. Yeah, and it's what
I said to you before and again, you know, I
mean this with respect. I think in some ways it's
a lazy shortcut. I think it's more important that folks
are being forced to answer questions about what they see
as necessary for that region or on that topic, or
on that that issue.

Speaker 3 (52:38):
Yeah, I just wonder if it's something that politicians are
going to have to continue to explain in the future.

Speaker 1 (52:43):
Okay, So that is that is fair. I think if
you're a politician and you take a dollar from someone,
you need to be able to justify taking that dollar.
And the justification could be, hey, look, they invested in
my campaign. Doesn't mean I agree with them on every issue.
A lot of people invest in the campaign, right, I mean,
I think that the burden is on the elected official

(53:03):
or the candidate running for office on that front, for sure,
I think that's fair. But I think to just kind
of presuppose, well, took a dollar from Charlie Mane, you
must agree with everything Charla Maine thinks. I don't think
that's fair, And that's.

Speaker 3 (53:15):
What people want. People want to make sure that they
want you to ensure them that just because you took
money from these lobby groups, that these lobby groups don't
have the influence over your decision making. I think.

Speaker 1 (53:26):
Look, one of the things that I appreciate so much
about how the people Pennsylvania view me, and we see
this in elections and polls after polls, that they see
me as being an independent voice and being someone on
their side. And I'm proud of that.

Speaker 3 (53:38):
That's what it is. I know.

Speaker 4 (53:39):
You have one last question.

Speaker 5 (53:40):
Yeah, yeah, I just saw that they made an arrest
yesterday in the Cada Scott, the missing girl in Philadelphia.
Are you familiar with the story. I just wanted to
know because it seems like they're the police that are
having issues with locate I mean, she's still missing, but
they don't have anything that they're tracing, like no cell phone,
no anything. Do you guys bring in additional resources there,
because I'm so so Kaida Scott as a young woman.

(54:01):
She's twenty three. She went young black women went missing
in Philadelphia from work. She was being a harassed via
phone by someone. Prior to that, she told her parents.
Now she's missing. She's been missing for some time. They
just made an arrest in the case, a young man,
but they haven't told us what the tie to him
is in the case. But it seems like though they're
having issues with finding like her footsteps leading up to that,

(54:25):
like cell phone, anything, or just whereabouts whatsoever.

Speaker 1 (54:28):
I don't want to get ahead of the police on this.
It is an awful, awful case and just my prayers
go out to her family. I can tell you that
the Pennsylvania State Police, which I ever see through through
our State Police Commissioner, we work very closely with local authorities,

(54:49):
including the Philadelphia Police and the Philadelfia Police, are outstanding
in these cases and I've confidence that they'll get to
the bottom of it. Our technology, our unique know how,
the tool we have to solve these kinds of cases
are always brought to bear to work with our municipal
partners to make sure that we address crime in our communities.
I mean, this is an awful case, and hopefully they'll

(55:11):
get to the bottom of it. I would also just
caution you, you know, I mean disrespectful to you and
anyone in the media. There are lots of cases where
we can't share all the information with the media as
we're working them, because sometimes you don't want something to
come out at first. Ultimately, you know, you provide that

(55:32):
transparency when the case is sort of closed. But we're
kind of still in the midst of this one right now,
and so I think, you know, not everything is being shared.
But I got a lot of faith in the Philadelphia Police,
and I can tell you that the Pennsylvania State Police
is always get They're ready to support them in every
other municipal department.

Speaker 3 (55:49):
I got one last question. You got a sixty two
percent approval rate, right? How do you measure success by
polling numbers? Are lives changed? Oh?

Speaker 1 (55:58):
Lives changed? And look for as for as wonderful it
is to have a sixty two percent approval rating in
the toughest state in the country to run in, I
still rely not on the data that you cite, but
the feel I get from people, whether on their farms
and you know, downtown in you know, Pittsburgh, Center City, Philly,
walking down the street, having someone stop me and go

(56:21):
yogav and talk to me about something. That's where I
get my feel from. And you know, I measure it
in terms of what people tell me they want done
and going out and doing it and the people's lives
I touch along the way. I gotta tell you, I mean,
for me, the motivation is not seeing a poll like that.
It's when someone says, hey, Gov, five years ago, I

(56:42):
reached out to you, and you know you were Returney
General back then, but you took on my case and
you helped me get you know, get back my money
after someone tried to scam me. That's the stuff that
fills up my cup. And you know, it kind of
goes back to the first question, or one of the
first questions you asked, you know, why do you do this?
And what happens if your kids told you not to
do it. I'm one of these people that is motivated
by helping others, and I do. I do get fulfillment

(57:05):
from people telling me I made their lives better, and
and there's there's just an extraordinary feeling that you get
from that. It's it's how I was raised, It's what
my faith has taught me, and and that is what
motivates me. Not you know, numbers in a poll. I'm
grateful for that support, but knowing I changed someone's life,
knowing I made it better, and and and pursuing the

(57:27):
next thing and the next thing and the next thing.
That's gonna help my communities out.

Speaker 3 (57:30):
You know, a life that h that that governor shaperial
change that he doesn't talk about is Wallow. He's the
one who pardoned Wallow. What made you want to pardon Wallow?

Speaker 1 (57:41):
I think there are people out there who had one
bad day, or in Wallow's case, had a few bad days.
Let's let's be real, and there are those that don't
learn from that, and they end up living sad and
tragic lives, oftentimes in jail or in places that are

(58:02):
dangerous for them. And then there are other people. And
while it's a great example that he happens to be famous,
so you know about him, but there's a whole lot
of people who aren't famous who do this, who learn
from that bad day who learn from those bad decisions,
and they not only turn their lives around for themselves,
but they then make a difference for others. And those

(58:23):
are the people that I try to find. Those are
the people whose cases I want to come across my
desk so I can fix my signature to a pardon
for them. That is an enormous power that a governor
has to be able to sign your name and wipe
away someone's bad deeds and give them an opportunity in

(58:48):
life again. And I will tell you I take that
power really, really seriously. Wallow Earn that he earned the
right to have his case come across my desk, and
he earned my signature because of the way in which
he's lived his life and help make other lives better.
The way he's helped other people get back on the
right track, the way he's helped other people achieve prosperity

(59:09):
for them and their families. The way he's I think,
in many ways changed an industry, whether it's music or
the kind of influencer industry or what have you. I mean,
he's done extraordinary things, and I'm proud of him. And
I'll tell you what else I told him. I don't
think he'd mind me sharing this. And I've said this
to others who we've given second chances to, including those
who have granted clemency to, which means letting them out

(59:31):
of jail even though they're facing a life sentence. I
tell them, don't screw up, because you are now an
example to others. I said that to Meek. I've said
that to a number of folks. You now have an
enormous power to do good in the world, but you're
also an example, and you've got an awesome amount of
pressure and responsibility on you, and so live your life

(59:52):
in a way where you acknowledge that pressure, you acknowledge
that responsibility. And man, while I has done that, and
I'm really really proud of them, and I try and
check in on him every so often, and checking on
others who I've issued pardons to or clemency's too, just
to see how they're doing.

Speaker 3 (01:00:07):
Help me too. Yeah, yeah, but he didn't want to
be on the helicopter. He didn't want to do no
photo ops or anything.

Speaker 1 (01:00:13):
He's like, Nope, no, because that's not what it's about.
This isn't about me being able to stand next to
Meek or Wallow and you know some press thing. This
is about knowing that they did the hard work to
get their lives back together. And I've got this unique
power for this moment in time as governor where I
can give them some extra help. But with that comes
a responsibility and they've got to own up to their

(01:00:35):
end of the bargain. And they are.

Speaker 5 (01:00:37):
The way you are is how the spirit of so
many other people in government should be. Like just the
spirit I get from you in this conversation, like you
absolutely there's a genuine care for people to end up well.
I agree, and that you don't feel that all the time.

Speaker 3 (01:00:49):
Hopefully, Thank you. I hope we've got free and fair
elections in twenty twenty eight. Now you can be in
the mix.

Speaker 5 (01:00:56):
They hope they get it right.

Speaker 1 (01:00:56):
We're going to work to make sure we got free
and fair elections.

Speaker 4 (01:01:00):
His governant, jos Shapperio. Thank you so much.

Speaker 1 (01:01:02):
Thanks guys always, and we'll see we're out. We're out.

Speaker 4 (01:01:09):
We'll see you in another week to too.

Speaker 1 (01:01:11):
I look forward to Thank you, Philly. Is that we're
just gonna leave it there. Listen, you want to do this,
we can do this, Okay. I think you guys are
exciting Jackson Dart is seemingly pretty good. Scataboo is pretty
pretty good. You lost you lost U neighbor, Milik neighbors unfortunately. Uh.

(01:01:32):
But you cannot over a long season hang with the Eagles.
You just can't. You just can't. I can pray, you
can pray all you want, but you ain't gonna be
able to do it over a long season. But they
are a team now seemingly on the upswing, which I
think is uh is a good thing. And and look,
the Birds have stumbled a little bit over the last
couple of weeks, but we'll get it back together, all right.

(01:01:53):
Championship team right there.

Speaker 4 (01:01:54):
Governor Josh Appio is the Breakfast Club. Good morning, wake
that ass up in the morning.

Speaker 3 (01:01:59):
The Breakfast three

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