September 5, 2024 • 28 mins
The Breakfast Club sits down with Simone Amelia Jordan to discuss her new book "She's Dreamin", Hip-Hop, Iggy Azelia, and Gaza. Listen for more!
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Wake that answer up in the morning, The Breakfast Club.
Morning everybody.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
It's DJ n V, Jess Hilarius, Charlamagne the guy. We
are the Breakfast Club. Laura la Ross is filling in
for Jess, and we got a special guest in the building.
We have Simon Amelia Jordan. Welcome back.
Speaker 3 (00:17):
Oh, thank you so much. I'm so excited to be here.
I haven't been here in eight years.
Speaker 1 (00:21):
Years long time.
Speaker 4 (00:22):
I did The Breakfast Club's first photo.
Speaker 5 (00:24):
Shoot one of our think that was our first official
photo shoot for a big brand.
Speaker 4 (00:30):
It was Doctor j J and you dressed as the
movie The Breakfast That was a long time ago.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
What made you feel like we were right for that? Like,
what was the vision for Doctor Jay's just in the moment?
Speaker 4 (00:42):
Oh, you know, well, I remember Angela.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
When you just started the show twenty eleven. That's a
lot over a decade ago now. It was so exciting.
The show was so exciting, and we wanted to work
with you guys to model for the website. I mean,
you're obviously natural models. So and I forget the characters
that you took from the movie.
Speaker 4 (01:05):
You were Judd Nelson. I felt, Yeah, I can't remember
the photos I.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
Was looking for them online, but like that was a
time when everything wasn't online, so I think they've kind
of disappeared into the ether somewhere.
Speaker 4 (01:18):
But it was a great photo.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
Shoo you had on somewhere. I can't remember where did
they go in.
Speaker 3 (01:22):
The sauce or something. I think they went somewhere those photos,
but it was a.
Speaker 4 (01:26):
Great photo shoot. It was very cute.
Speaker 6 (01:28):
How did you know early on though, that like the
show was going to be oh, you know what I mean,
like you came to get them, like, yeah, it was magic.
Speaker 3 (01:34):
I mean they all were such individuals and had their
own flavor and brought something special to the mix.
Speaker 4 (01:39):
New York was so excited at the time about the.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
Show, so we knew that, like we wanted to get involved,
and for me as the content director Doctor Jay's, it
was a no brainer to get the brands that we
sold onto these guys.
Speaker 4 (01:52):
Because they were about to be everywhere And.
Speaker 2 (01:54):
Look at them now, you know, what is your thought
process or what do you think about these of stores
now because there's so many closing down since you were
with Doctor Jast, Like I said, they're closing a bunch
of stores. I think foot Action the athlete's foot is
about of here. There's so many stores now that are
not doing well, So what are your thoughts on that?
Speaker 3 (02:13):
Well, everything's changed, right. I was at Doctorj's dot com
kind of at the height of like the quote unquote
urban fashion wave and being a kid from the other
side of the world, we used to wear fake versions
of the brands because they weren't available in Australia, and
that's why I reached out to doctor Jay's in the
(02:33):
first place, because everyone was rocking fake baby fat and
fake apple bottoms and I was like, no, I think
we need to step our game up. So I reached
out to doctor Jay's to advertise in my magazine that
I had in Australia, which was the first on sale
hip hop and R and B magazine inspired by the
Source and inspired by Vibe, and so.
Speaker 4 (02:51):
We developed a relationship that way.
Speaker 3 (02:53):
Then they hired me to come to New York and
work for them, and I saw the wave of those
brands crashing and burning and now into a point where fashion.
Speaker 4 (03:03):
Is all over the place. Right in terms of the
style that we wear.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
Anything goes now there's no there's no and the style
used to reflect the streets.
Speaker 4 (03:12):
Right and so that has all changed.
Speaker 3 (03:14):
But it is a it's a it's a tough day,
everything shutting down, whether it's fashion.
Speaker 4 (03:19):
Or even coming back to New York.
Speaker 3 (03:21):
You used to be able to grab a bike at
any time of the night. But I think it was
like after ten pm and the restaurants I used to
go to it all shut down. So I think COVID
had a lot to do with that too.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Perhaps if you warn some most.
Speaker 3 (03:36):
Photographer, I'm an immigrant. We get the job done. What
can I say?
Speaker 4 (03:42):
Author, Yes, like you, I'm trying to get on your level.
Speaker 3 (03:47):
Yeah, I've always I think I've got undiagnosed ADHD as
they say. I've always been driven by hip hop in
everything that I do, which hasn't been easy coming from
a country where hip hop isn't respect Did that much?
Speaker 4 (04:01):
Tell us about that?
Speaker 2 (04:02):
Tell us about growing up in Australia with hip hop?
Speaker 1 (04:04):
How big was it easy?
Speaker 4 (04:08):
It started way before Iggy? She says she wasn't a
part of the problem. Well, you know, it's funny. When
I met Iggy.
Speaker 3 (04:16):
I did Iggy's first on camera interview for Doctor J's
dot com, and I initially thought, I'm not gonna like
this girl because she kind of represents everything that I
have fought against my whole career.
Speaker 4 (04:27):
Yeah, a pretty white girl.
Speaker 3 (04:29):
Coming in and like I wanted to know how genuine
she was and authentic to the roots of the art
form and paying respect towards black and brown founders. But
I felt very I've got this like Mama vibe, and
I felt very protective over her when I met her,
and then obviously her career skyrocketed and we didn't keep
in touch.
Speaker 7 (04:47):
But I was about to say, like she was, she
she loved what she did, she loved and whatever the
feedback and response to that was is out of her control, right,
But she genuinely loved what she doing.
Speaker 4 (05:01):
So growing up in Australia with hip hop is it's tough.
Speaker 3 (05:05):
We have our incredible First Nations Aboriginal community who embraced
it from very early on. I'm Lebanese background, like a
lot of Arab Australians embraced it very early on, but
we never got the respect. It was very similar to
the States, but our minorities are even smaller. We're like
smaller minorities in a majority white country and so it
(05:28):
never got the respect that it deserves. It still doesn't
to this day get the respect that it deserves.
Speaker 1 (05:33):
Even there, like they don't have their own scene there.
Speaker 3 (05:36):
Well, funnily enough, it has a very small scene, but
it's run.
Speaker 4 (05:40):
By white people still.
Speaker 3 (05:42):
And coming back after living in New York for a
decade and achieving what I did and ended up at
the Source magazine becoming the content director when I came
home because I.
Speaker 4 (05:51):
Got very sick.
Speaker 3 (05:52):
I got Crohn's disease and got really sick trying to
keep up with the Joneses in New York for ten years.
So came home and everyone was like, Oh, you're going
to be the top of it when you get home.
You're gonna get every job. You'll beat the radio stations.
I still don't get. The doors are still closed to
me because the only hip hop and R and B
radio station in Australia has only two live shows and
(06:12):
both are hosted by blonde white women.
Speaker 4 (06:15):
Wow. Yeah, so then you see it. No, that's up
to opinion.
Speaker 3 (06:21):
But I will say, like, you know, not throwing affirmative
action or anything like that.
Speaker 4 (06:28):
In the mix. Are they deserving is the question? Are
they deserving?
Speaker 3 (06:32):
Because like I said, our Aboriginal community, we have so
many talents that really should be. We've got a really
multicultural community there that isn't represented in the art form,
which is pretty insane.
Speaker 4 (06:45):
So yeah, I felt more accepted here.
Speaker 3 (06:49):
I felt more accepted when I got to New York.
I was like, these are my people. This is home
because I'm a hustler obviously, like you.
Speaker 4 (06:54):
Said, I've got a million a million gigs. And that's
what the story of the book is about.
Speaker 3 (06:58):
It's about like ch seeing your dreams even though you
get all these doors closed in your face. It's my
love letter to this music genre that I think a
lot of people forget has changed the world, and it's
changed the world in so many ways.
Speaker 4 (07:12):
And I've always been.
Speaker 3 (07:16):
Very vocal about paying tribute to its black founders, and
a lot of people don't do that enough, I think.
Speaker 4 (07:23):
So that book is the love letter to.
Speaker 1 (07:25):
That fearest form hip hop brings people together.
Speaker 4 (07:28):
Oh, in its purest form.
Speaker 3 (07:30):
It has taught me and so many other kids around
the world to be proud of myself too. Like I
recognized the pro black consciousness when I was a kid
in the late eighties, and I'm like their self empowerment
made me feel pride in being Middle Eastern at a
time when stereotypes were rampant, and I was really being
(07:52):
taught by the movies I was watching in the media.
I was saying to hate myself and to think of
myself in a negative way. And I'm like, no, no, no, public,
you're telling me fight the power, you know. So I
can't even begin to describe what black people in the
United States have done for marginalized kids around the world
in terms of our own pride.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
What did your family think about when you when you
found out this love for hip hop? Because even in
the States here when hip hop first came around, everybody
thought it was gonna.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
Be fatty, They thought it was gonna be quick. They
thought it was just some hippie hopper.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
What was your family like?
Speaker 3 (08:23):
My family loved it like I was raised by a
single mother and she and by my grandmother too, so
very matriarchal family. And my mom loves hip hop like
my mom, I think reckon. My mom's a rebel, so
she recognized that kind of rebellious fight the power instinct
that it has. And I started rapping at nine. That's
(08:44):
the first chapter in the book. But I very quickly
realized that was not my role, and so.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
Do you think he was. I was as.
Speaker 5 (08:56):
Sure, I think I.
Speaker 4 (08:56):
Should drop a mixtape.
Speaker 3 (08:57):
Well, that's another thing, Like women's empowerment has been in
a really big theme in my career. I did an
all female mixtape back around those days twenty eleven called
Woman on Top with really early verses from Iggy. Rhapsody
was on there, really early. I had a rebox sneaker
come out in twenty twelve where we did this freestyle
thing and it's on YouTube, and like it's a really
(09:18):
young Rhapsody and who else was on their typ Phoenix
like all these female rappers Brianna Perry at the time.
Speaker 4 (09:26):
And yeah remember Brianna, Yeah, and.
Speaker 3 (09:28):
Like so many because to me, like and especially championing
black women for me was very important too. Like I'm
very respectful of the culture, and I know that I'm
a guest in the culture, but I also know that
I have something to contribute as an international kind of
representative of it too.
Speaker 5 (09:45):
Yeah, what inspired you to go from doing like I
guess hip hop journalism and writing a whole memoir.
Speaker 3 (09:52):
Well, I've always been very careful about telling the stories
that I feel black journalists should tell. So I'm like
I can tell memoir because it's my story, right, So
I thought that would be a good place to start
on a book journey. And I had always thought about
writing my memoir, but I thought my story was so
singular and very rare that it might not connect to
(10:15):
a lot of people. But as I was writing it,
I'm like, oh my god, there are a lot of
themes here that, especially for young women. I'm talking about
like racism, classism, sexism, being groomed as a teenager because
I wanted to be on radio and I wanted to
be a journalist so badly, getting taken advantage of by
an older guy in the industry who was dangling carrots.
(10:35):
Like these things happened to.
Speaker 4 (10:36):
Women in the industry. They're very prevalent.
Speaker 3 (10:40):
And so as I'm telling this story, I'm like, wait
a minute, these themes are going to resonate. So I
kept forging ahead. I entered a contest actually during COVID.
It's called the Ritual Prize for Writers, and I thought
I'm not going to win this because publishing, again, like
every other industry in Australia, is very white. They're not
going to understand the story. I ended up beating like
(11:01):
almost a thousand entries and I won the ritual prize
and then they offered me the book. Deal has shared Australia,
and the book came out in Australia about a year
ago and it's just come out just this week in
the States. So I think there's a lot in there
for fans of hip hop and people that are living
between cultures to.
Speaker 6 (11:22):
Relate to a lot of you mentioned the grooming. Yeah,
when did you realize that that wasn't what was supposed
to be happening. I think there's that moment where you're like,
this is not I don't have to do this.
Speaker 4 (11:34):
Absolutely.
Speaker 3 (11:35):
I got myself in a very sticky situation as a
teenage girl with an older man who I didn't pick
up on the signals, and I thought he was just
encouraging me to work in radio and train me. But
I narrowly avoided a very serious situation there. I think
that's why I was able to write about it.
Speaker 4 (11:51):
In the book.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
There was another situation when I was working at another
radio station here in New York and we had mystical
come in and it's funny, this is pre me too.
So this is a time when as women in hip hop,
we had so few opportunities to be on radio to
be the male's sidekick and shout out to DJ Green Lantern,
who I was on the show with him, and he
(12:14):
said to me.
Speaker 4 (12:15):
Like I don't want to talk. He's like, I want
to play the music. I'm going to let you host
the show. And I was like Invasion Radio, yeah, thank you.
Speaker 3 (12:23):
I needs to put people on the spot and like yeah,
it was a great show, thank you. And so we
had this situation where you know, this guy at that point, mister.
Speaker 4 (12:32):
Wold had like a rap sheet literally of.
Speaker 3 (12:34):
Offenses, but in hip hop in those days, we didn't
really we knew, but we didn't know. It was like
if you go back to people that were probably in
media during the Aliah R. Kelly days, they knew, but
they didn't want to talk about it. And so he
made some very vulgar comments to me when I was
just sitting like this at the desk, and I felt
(12:55):
extremely uncomfortable, but I didn't want to make a scene.
I didn't want to be difficult. I didn't want to
throw him under the bus anymore. I felt very protective
of the talent that I interviewed to So you're grappling
with all of that. But then when I wrote the
book years later and I reflected on it, I thought,
I'm so proud of the young women today who, for
(13:16):
the most part, call things out straight away, and that's
because other women have paved the way for that. And
I felt in that time I wasn't as vocal about
a situation that I should have been. So I think
we've come a long way from that, but these things
still happen. Right, women are being more vocal, but it
still happens. So I hope through the book, without being preachy,
(13:40):
young women can learn some lessons as they move ahead
in their careers.
Speaker 5 (13:44):
Why the title tell her she's And then also every
chapter has a dream.
Speaker 4 (13:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:49):
I realized when I was writing the book that dreaming
was a very prevalent theme in my life. Like I
even went through my old magazines that I had issues
that I had edited, and I was speaking in the
editor's letter about chase this dream, that feel that felt
impossible as a kid from the other side of the
world to come to New York and work in hip hop. Yeah,
dreams have been really prevalent in my life. My mother
(14:10):
was a dreamer, is a dreamer. She wanted to be
in the circus. God bless her her whole life. But
my grandmother was very salt of the earth, you know.
She raised seven kids on her own.
Speaker 4 (14:20):
Basically and worked three jobs.
Speaker 3 (14:24):
And so I had the really kind of down to
earthness of my grandmother mixed with the dreaming of my mom,
and I think that made me able to achieve those dreams, right,
because you can't have dreams without work ethic. And also
in Australia, there's a very famous.
Speaker 4 (14:38):
Movie called The Castle.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
It's a very Australian movie, and there's a very famous
Australian saying, and it's tell him he's dreaming, which is like,
you know, tell him his dream and it's very it's
very awker Australian, which is like you're having yourself on right,
Like you can't be serious, It'll.
Speaker 4 (14:52):
Never you're bugging. That's exactly what it is. That's right,
Thank you for the translation, you're bugging. And so female life,
I made it feminine.
Speaker 3 (15:03):
So I made it tell her she's dreaming because my
whole career I've been told this will never happen, you know, like,
who are you to think that you're gonna get there?
And I grew up reading the source and I ended
up being the content director of my favorite magazine ever.
Speaker 4 (15:17):
So I achieved those dreams and I'm very proud of that.
Speaker 1 (15:19):
What's left?
Speaker 2 (15:20):
What are you still dreaming about? What do you still
want to accomplish? If anything at.
Speaker 3 (15:24):
All, I am dreaming of moving into. I've shifted into
more of a mental role, so that's very important to me.
As we can see with the book. Ah, my heart
is kind of still in New York, which is tough.
I feel like I'm living in two places.
Speaker 4 (15:42):
I feel like I.
Speaker 3 (15:43):
Belong here career wise, but now I'm married and I
have a six year old, beautiful daughter. Shout out to
my beautiful family. I think they're listening online from Sydney.
Speaker 4 (15:51):
I don't know what time it is right now the Australia. No,
my husband's from New York, but I met him in Australia. Wow. Yeah,
life is crazy.
Speaker 3 (16:00):
I lived in Harlem for ten years. He's from Harlem,
and I met him when I moved back to Australia.
Speaker 2 (16:04):
What the hell was he doing in Australia.
Speaker 3 (16:06):
He had jobs there, like he used to play basketball.
But he lived in Australia for a long time. He'd
lived there like fifteen years when I met him, and
so yeah, life is you never know what's around the corner.
But for me, next, I'm kind of open to whatever
happens next. Like I'm consulting and mentoring and I'm writing more.
(16:27):
Actually have an essay coming out soon. Yeah, I'm writing
about hip hop and Palestine.
Speaker 4 (16:33):
Yeah yeah, so.
Speaker 3 (16:36):
Yeah, I know we talk about it, Charlemagne and I,
which I appreciate how open minded you are about everything.
And I just want to give you a special shout
out on air for even allowing me to come up
because I disappeared from the scene for so many years.
And you know a lot of people forget people. They
leave the messages on read and you did it.
Speaker 5 (16:54):
Yeah, thank you said, and your photos in the book man,
so like, yeah, your photos.
Speaker 4 (17:01):
In the book.
Speaker 3 (17:02):
So yeah, I'm writing an essay and I'm very passionate
about hip hop started as an art form to be
the voice of the voiceless, right, the voice of the oppressed.
And I feel like there are a number of artists
that are speaking out and you've had them up on
this show, but I feel like we could be doing
a lot more. And hip hop's biggest stars are very
(17:25):
loudly silent.
Speaker 4 (17:26):
So I'm trying to unpack that.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
Yes, that's a conversation. We've had a lot of pay
that some of the biggest celebrities haven't said anything. Yes,
And you know, for some people, they don't get into politics,
they don't know, they don't understand it. What's your thoughts
on it?
Speaker 3 (17:38):
I think art is political, and I think that when
we're watching a live stream genocide that it's not hard
to say I just want innocent people to stop being killed.
Speaker 4 (17:49):
It's deeper than that, but on a very basic level.
Speaker 3 (17:53):
As an Arab woman, I feel like we're not humanized
enough and I would like to see my people be humanized.
And I'm inspired by natur like Nat Turner's rebellion. Like
when I say I learned about black history through hip hop,
I learned about black history. So I think that more people,
(18:13):
it wouldn't be happening if more people stood up and
said something.
Speaker 4 (18:16):
And really, they're asking us to use our voices. That's
all they're asking for. Please use your platform, Please use
your voice.
Speaker 3 (18:21):
So this essay it might ruffle a little feathers, but
you know, I feel like we get one life on
this earth, and if I don't use that to kind
of I'm privileged, and I feel like I should use
that privilege for the greater good.
Speaker 1 (18:35):
What do you think about the language surrounding it?
Speaker 5 (18:37):
Right, because you hear politicians they all say the same thing,
acknowledge what happened on October seventh, which we all can
agree with, traversy, and then they say the hostages have
to come home and then it can be a ceasefire.
Speaker 1 (18:50):
What do you think of that language.
Speaker 3 (18:52):
I think that we have to acknowledge that before October seven,
there are thousands of Palestinian hostages that are in jail
under no charges at all, men, women, and children. Yes,
and that never gets spoken about. I think we have
to acknowledge that Gaza has no control by land, air
or sea. I think there are many factors that have
(19:17):
dehumanized this population for decades that we're not taking into.
Speaker 4 (19:22):
Account prior to that operation on October seven.
Speaker 3 (19:28):
And so I think when we speak about this issue,
and again I'm not Palestinian, I am Lebanese and Israel
is constantly at war with Southern Lebanon two, so I
do have a vested interest in this, but it's a
human issue and I just think that if you keep
sending bombs to a population.
Speaker 4 (19:50):
How is it going to stop?
Speaker 3 (19:52):
Like, I just think the narrative doesn't make sense, and
we're being gas lit very much at the moment, and
I think people need to understand there are a lot
of peop people in pain right now.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
So what do you think about what the US is
doing As far as saying, like Charlamage said, we want peace,
we despert sending millions and Surians to die.
Speaker 3 (20:10):
I think it's I think it's I was really nervous
coming back to the States. But it's not just the US.
Australia is complicit to Europe is complicit. It's not just
the US, but the US is funding the arms that
are committing a genocide and so but I also say
on the flip side of that, I have to be
(20:30):
really clear. It's happening in Sudan at the hands of
Arabs to black people, right, So it's not just Israel
that are committing an atrocity. They have the eyes because,
as black poet June Jordan said, Palestine is the moral
litmus test of the world. And that's why I think
our eyes are on it. This is the Holy Land, right,
But it is happening in Sudan as well. We all
(20:51):
know it's happening in the Congo. If you do your
research for different they're like, it's supremacy in all its forms,
it's racism in all its forms. And I think that
sometimes Charlemagne and I have talked about the Lesser of
the evils as well, and a lot of people are
hurting and they don't want to hear that lesser of
the evils talk, right, So to me, I don't have
(21:13):
the answers, but I would just like my people to
be humanized at the moment so we can take a
step back and really look at what's happening. Because Palestine
was a land and it's getting smaller and smaller illegally
more of that land is being taken, and so to me,
that that is the issue of our time.
Speaker 1 (21:32):
One question, last question, Yes, you have a picture here
with Kalen.
Speaker 2 (21:35):
Have your Kalent had a conversation because I know he's
been a big topic of people feel like he should
be speaking up more so have you had a comversation.
Speaker 4 (21:41):
I'm writing about color It in the essay. That was
my question.
Speaker 3 (21:44):
Yeah, exactly, Yeah, I'm writing about Colet in the essay.
I'm writing about a couple others that go to the
Middle East to party, make money from other countries in
the Middle East. But when it's time to talk about
our pain, radio silence. And I think that that's happened
with black people for decades now, right, they want our
(22:05):
rhythm and not our blues. That's the same, and now
we're feeling it. And so I acknowledge all that in
the essay, right, And I see Black people say to
each other, why should we give a damn about them?
They've never given the damn about us? And I acknowledge
that too, And I think we have to be very
honest and have these honest conversations about everything, and we
can't move forward until that. But to your point, yeah,
(22:28):
I have reached out to colored people and we've spoken
very briefly.
Speaker 4 (22:32):
I've been told that I'll put that.
Speaker 3 (22:35):
In the essay and you can read about it. But no,
we haven't directly spoken. Everyone has their own journey. I
understand that. But as a Middle Eastern person, I know
our community are heartbroken at his silence.
Speaker 5 (22:46):
It's gonna be interesting to see what happens, you know,
especially in November with the election, especially in places like Michigan,
because yes, the reality is America is always going to
fund military. So it's just gonna be interesting to see
what happened.
Speaker 4 (23:01):
What do you think will happen in Michigan.
Speaker 1 (23:06):
I really truly don't know. I really don't know. I
really have no idea.
Speaker 5 (23:10):
Because even when I think about all the people who voted,
you know, uncommitted in the primary, it's a part of
me that's like, but if Trump, you're saying it's gonna
be worse.
Speaker 4 (23:19):
I don't know what's worse than genocide.
Speaker 3 (23:21):
I do know what's worst, And I understand what you're
saying because I do understand that there are other there
are other issues, right, LGBTQ I rights, abortion, like, there
are huge issues on the table.
Speaker 1 (23:32):
Well that's what I mean when I say it worse,
I mean worse for Gaza.
Speaker 4 (23:34):
Yeah, like, oh, there's no worse for Gaza right now.
They can't be. They can't be, they can't be. Like
you said, if if what you said is true.
Speaker 3 (23:42):
Then America unequivocally stands with Israel, which is what Kamala
Harris has said unequivocally, then how can they be worse?
That change of power will be the exact same thing,
so it's just done in different ways.
Speaker 4 (23:52):
Probably, so I don't know what's gonna happen. I'm not American.
Speaker 3 (23:55):
I'm married to an American, my daughter is a Jeal citizen,
and I'm very vested in I have a you know,
I love this country. It's given me so many opportunities.
But like it does break my heart. The foreign policy
of America obviously affects the world. America is still a superpower.
I don't know if it always will be, and I
don't know if Americans realize the shift in the view
(24:18):
of this country around globally, there has.
Speaker 4 (24:21):
Been a huge shift.
Speaker 3 (24:23):
And so but people always say to me, oh, Americans,
they only care about America. They don't care about the
rest of the world. And I say, as someone who
lived here for a decade, until you live here, you
don't understand what they're dealing with on a day to
day basis. You have to give Americans some grace because
there's so much that goes on here that to take on,
I mean, I've had conversations with friends to take on
(24:44):
some other tragedy is a lot mentally, because dealing with
things day to day here is crazy enough. So I
get that, but it's good to kind of be aware
of what's happening that affects because it's your tax dollars, right.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
Absolutely. Yeah. The last chapter is don't you it's over
break that death.
Speaker 3 (25:02):
Oh, the last chapters don't dream, It's over. It's basically
about like you said, every chapter had the word dream
in it. It's about never giving up. Like I said,
my heart is still here in New York. I'm trying
to bring New York to Australia in a lot of
ways in what I do. And it's it's easy to
say never give up when when you feel like the
(25:23):
light is never coming into the darkness. I got very
sick with the Crone's disease. I almost died when I
got home to Australia. My doctor was like, you are
literally life or death. You are killing yourself to like
survive in the music industry. Yeah, that's how much I
wanted to chase this dream and make it real. But
then I realized, like, your dreams can change as you change.
(25:43):
And I think that's the lesson of the book, Like
you have these dreams that ignite your fire, but as
life changes, the dreams change too.
Speaker 4 (25:50):
Yeah, and you love.
Speaker 1 (25:52):
That your dreams can change, your dream can change as
you change.
Speaker 3 (25:56):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (25:57):
Yeah, And so now I feel like a new burst
of energy with the book.
Speaker 3 (26:02):
And you never know, like I'm up on the breakfast
club like it's all come full circle. And I met
you guys when this was just starting. Life is crazy
and it's so inspiring.
Speaker 6 (26:12):
How did you do it? Because nowadays, like people are
so like it's our culture. Yes, you can't come in,
and there's all these think pieces on Twitter. Yeah, how
do you like, did you even deal with that when
you were first Night in Australia but just here in
New York being a hip hop journalist but not being
of the culture, right.
Speaker 3 (26:29):
I didn't really feel that until I got to the
Source magazine because that's obviously a venerated hip hop institution.
And I had the conversation with the publisher, Londo McMillan
when he hired me, and we spoke about that, and
he said, I'm actually hiring you because you are aware
of your place.
Speaker 4 (26:45):
And who you are.
Speaker 3 (26:47):
And he said, some of the staff have said, like,
who is this girl, what's her pedigree? We don't know
her background. They didn't know all the years that I
put into working within the art form, and so for
a little minute I felt imposter syndrome, but then I realized, Look,
I've never tried to be anybody but myself, and I've
always encouraged like I said, like especially young black women
(27:11):
like Nihila Simone was my intern at the Source right now,
That's what I'm saying. She's on tour with Rhapsody, who
I put in the freestyle session.
Speaker 4 (27:22):
So like, I've always known.
Speaker 3 (27:24):
My place, and I've always known that I really felt
like this culture was not and it is not respected
on the level that it should be globally and even
within the States probably, but like especially globally.
Speaker 4 (27:37):
People will go to.
Speaker 3 (27:37):
The concerts, they love the music, but when it's time
to show up at a protest, you know, they don't
want to get their hands dirty. And I'm like, no, no, no, no, no, Like,
we can't let black people give us their gifts and
not pay that back in every way, and I've tried
to do that. So yeah, things have shifted a little bit,
and I think rightfully, so I think that conversation is
(27:59):
very needed.
Speaker 4 (28:02):
But I have always tried to be as respectful as possible.
Speaker 3 (28:05):
In what I do and just contribute because it's a
global art form now. I mean it was unleashed into
the world from the seventies and I'm a child of that.
So I think my duty is to learn the culture,
learn the roots, and just stand as much as I can.
Speaker 2 (28:20):
Yeah, all right, well down under up to our music
helped one woman make big dreams come true.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
Make sure right now.
Speaker 4 (28:30):
Thank you guys, thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (28:31):
We appreciate you for joining us.
Speaker 4 (28:33):
Thank you, Virgo. It was my birthday last week. Thank
you and Emelia Jordan. It's the Breakfast Club.
Speaker 1 (28:40):
Good morning, wake that answer up in the morning. Breakfast
Club
Wake that answer up in the morning, The Breakfast Club.
Morning everybody.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
It's DJ n V, Jess Hilarius, Charlamagne the guy. We
are the Breakfast Club. Laura la Ross is filling in
for Jess, and we got a special guest in the building.
We have Simon Amelia Jordan. Welcome back.
Speaker 3 (00:17):
Oh, thank you so much. I'm so excited to be here.
I haven't been here in eight years.
Speaker 1 (00:21):
Years long time.
Speaker 4 (00:22):
I did The Breakfast Club's first photo.
Speaker 5 (00:24):
Shoot one of our think that was our first official
photo shoot for a big brand.
Speaker 4 (00:30):
It was Doctor j J and you dressed as the
movie The Breakfast That was a long time ago.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
What made you feel like we were right for that? Like,
what was the vision for Doctor Jay's just in the moment?
Speaker 4 (00:42):
Oh, you know, well, I remember Angela.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
When you just started the show twenty eleven. That's a
lot over a decade ago now. It was so exciting.
The show was so exciting, and we wanted to work
with you guys to model for the website. I mean,
you're obviously natural models. So and I forget the characters
that you took from the movie.
Speaker 4 (01:05):
You were Judd Nelson. I felt, Yeah, I can't remember
the photos I.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
Was looking for them online, but like that was a
time when everything wasn't online, so I think they've kind
of disappeared into the ether somewhere.
Speaker 4 (01:18):
But it was a great photo.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
Shoo you had on somewhere. I can't remember where did
they go in.
Speaker 3 (01:22):
The sauce or something. I think they went somewhere those photos,
but it was a.
Speaker 4 (01:26):
Great photo shoot. It was very cute.
Speaker 6 (01:28):
How did you know early on though, that like the
show was going to be oh, you know what I mean,
like you came to get them, like, yeah, it was magic.
Speaker 3 (01:34):
I mean they all were such individuals and had their
own flavor and brought something special to the mix.
Speaker 4 (01:39):
New York was so excited at the time about the.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
Show, so we knew that, like we wanted to get involved,
and for me as the content director Doctor Jay's, it
was a no brainer to get the brands that we
sold onto these guys.
Speaker 4 (01:52):
Because they were about to be everywhere And.
Speaker 2 (01:54):
Look at them now, you know, what is your thought
process or what do you think about these of stores
now because there's so many closing down since you were
with Doctor Jast, Like I said, they're closing a bunch
of stores. I think foot Action the athlete's foot is
about of here. There's so many stores now that are
not doing well, So what are your thoughts on that?
Speaker 3 (02:13):
Well, everything's changed, right. I was at Doctorj's dot com
kind of at the height of like the quote unquote
urban fashion wave and being a kid from the other
side of the world, we used to wear fake versions
of the brands because they weren't available in Australia, and
that's why I reached out to doctor Jay's in the
(02:33):
first place, because everyone was rocking fake baby fat and
fake apple bottoms and I was like, no, I think
we need to step our game up. So I reached
out to doctor Jay's to advertise in my magazine that
I had in Australia, which was the first on sale
hip hop and R and B magazine inspired by the
Source and inspired by Vibe, and so.
Speaker 4 (02:51):
We developed a relationship that way.
Speaker 3 (02:53):
Then they hired me to come to New York and
work for them, and I saw the wave of those
brands crashing and burning and now into a point where fashion.
Speaker 4 (03:03):
Is all over the place. Right in terms of the
style that we wear.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
Anything goes now there's no there's no and the style
used to reflect the streets.
Speaker 4 (03:12):
Right and so that has all changed.
Speaker 3 (03:14):
But it is a it's a it's a tough day,
everything shutting down, whether it's fashion.
Speaker 4 (03:19):
Or even coming back to New York.
Speaker 3 (03:21):
You used to be able to grab a bike at
any time of the night. But I think it was
like after ten pm and the restaurants I used to
go to it all shut down. So I think COVID
had a lot to do with that too.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Perhaps if you warn some most.
Speaker 3 (03:36):
Photographer, I'm an immigrant. We get the job done. What
can I say?
Speaker 4 (03:42):
Author, Yes, like you, I'm trying to get on your level.
Speaker 3 (03:47):
Yeah, I've always I think I've got undiagnosed ADHD as
they say. I've always been driven by hip hop in
everything that I do, which hasn't been easy coming from
a country where hip hop isn't respect Did that much?
Speaker 4 (04:01):
Tell us about that?
Speaker 2 (04:02):
Tell us about growing up in Australia with hip hop?
Speaker 1 (04:04):
How big was it easy?
Speaker 4 (04:08):
It started way before Iggy? She says she wasn't a
part of the problem. Well, you know, it's funny. When
I met Iggy.
Speaker 3 (04:16):
I did Iggy's first on camera interview for Doctor J's
dot com, and I initially thought, I'm not gonna like
this girl because she kind of represents everything that I
have fought against my whole career.
Speaker 4 (04:27):
Yeah, a pretty white girl.
Speaker 3 (04:29):
Coming in and like I wanted to know how genuine
she was and authentic to the roots of the art
form and paying respect towards black and brown founders. But
I felt very I've got this like Mama vibe, and
I felt very protective over her when I met her,
and then obviously her career skyrocketed and we didn't keep
in touch.
Speaker 7 (04:47):
But I was about to say, like she was, she
she loved what she did, she loved and whatever the
feedback and response to that was is out of her control, right,
But she genuinely loved what she doing.
Speaker 4 (05:01):
So growing up in Australia with hip hop is it's tough.
Speaker 3 (05:05):
We have our incredible First Nations Aboriginal community who embraced
it from very early on. I'm Lebanese background, like a
lot of Arab Australians embraced it very early on, but
we never got the respect. It was very similar to
the States, but our minorities are even smaller. We're like
smaller minorities in a majority white country and so it
(05:28):
never got the respect that it deserves. It still doesn't
to this day get the respect that it deserves.
Speaker 1 (05:33):
Even there, like they don't have their own scene there.
Speaker 3 (05:36):
Well, funnily enough, it has a very small scene, but
it's run.
Speaker 4 (05:40):
By white people still.
Speaker 3 (05:42):
And coming back after living in New York for a
decade and achieving what I did and ended up at
the Source magazine becoming the content director when I came
home because I.
Speaker 4 (05:51):
Got very sick.
Speaker 3 (05:52):
I got Crohn's disease and got really sick trying to
keep up with the Joneses in New York for ten years.
So came home and everyone was like, Oh, you're going
to be the top of it when you get home.
You're gonna get every job. You'll beat the radio stations.
I still don't get. The doors are still closed to
me because the only hip hop and R and B
radio station in Australia has only two live shows and
(06:12):
both are hosted by blonde white women.
Speaker 4 (06:15):
Wow. Yeah, so then you see it. No, that's up
to opinion.
Speaker 3 (06:21):
But I will say, like, you know, not throwing affirmative
action or anything like that.
Speaker 4 (06:28):
In the mix. Are they deserving is the question? Are
they deserving?
Speaker 3 (06:32):
Because like I said, our Aboriginal community, we have so
many talents that really should be. We've got a really
multicultural community there that isn't represented in the art form,
which is pretty insane.
Speaker 4 (06:45):
So yeah, I felt more accepted here.
Speaker 3 (06:49):
I felt more accepted when I got to New York.
I was like, these are my people. This is home
because I'm a hustler obviously, like you.
Speaker 4 (06:54):
Said, I've got a million a million gigs. And that's
what the story of the book is about.
Speaker 3 (06:58):
It's about like ch seeing your dreams even though you
get all these doors closed in your face. It's my
love letter to this music genre that I think a
lot of people forget has changed the world, and it's
changed the world in so many ways.
Speaker 4 (07:12):
And I've always been.
Speaker 3 (07:16):
Very vocal about paying tribute to its black founders, and
a lot of people don't do that enough, I think.
Speaker 4 (07:23):
So that book is the love letter to.
Speaker 1 (07:25):
That fearest form hip hop brings people together.
Speaker 4 (07:28):
Oh, in its purest form.
Speaker 3 (07:30):
It has taught me and so many other kids around
the world to be proud of myself too. Like I
recognized the pro black consciousness when I was a kid
in the late eighties, and I'm like their self empowerment
made me feel pride in being Middle Eastern at a
time when stereotypes were rampant, and I was really being
(07:52):
taught by the movies I was watching in the media.
I was saying to hate myself and to think of
myself in a negative way. And I'm like, no, no, no, public,
you're telling me fight the power, you know. So I
can't even begin to describe what black people in the
United States have done for marginalized kids around the world
in terms of our own pride.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
What did your family think about when you when you
found out this love for hip hop? Because even in
the States here when hip hop first came around, everybody
thought it was gonna.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
Be fatty, They thought it was gonna be quick. They
thought it was just some hippie hopper.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
What was your family like?
Speaker 3 (08:23):
My family loved it like I was raised by a
single mother and she and by my grandmother too, so
very matriarchal family. And my mom loves hip hop like
my mom, I think reckon. My mom's a rebel, so
she recognized that kind of rebellious fight the power instinct
that it has. And I started rapping at nine. That's
(08:44):
the first chapter in the book. But I very quickly
realized that was not my role, and so.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
Do you think he was. I was as.
Speaker 5 (08:56):
Sure, I think I.
Speaker 4 (08:56):
Should drop a mixtape.
Speaker 3 (08:57):
Well, that's another thing, Like women's empowerment has been in
a really big theme in my career. I did an
all female mixtape back around those days twenty eleven called
Woman on Top with really early verses from Iggy. Rhapsody
was on there, really early. I had a rebox sneaker
come out in twenty twelve where we did this freestyle
thing and it's on YouTube, and like it's a really
(09:18):
young Rhapsody and who else was on their typ Phoenix
like all these female rappers Brianna Perry at the time.
Speaker 4 (09:26):
And yeah remember Brianna, Yeah, and.
Speaker 3 (09:28):
Like so many because to me, like and especially championing
black women for me was very important too. Like I'm
very respectful of the culture, and I know that I'm
a guest in the culture, but I also know that
I have something to contribute as an international kind of
representative of it too.
Speaker 5 (09:45):
Yeah, what inspired you to go from doing like I
guess hip hop journalism and writing a whole memoir.
Speaker 3 (09:52):
Well, I've always been very careful about telling the stories
that I feel black journalists should tell. So I'm like
I can tell memoir because it's my story, right, So
I thought that would be a good place to start
on a book journey. And I had always thought about
writing my memoir, but I thought my story was so
singular and very rare that it might not connect to
(10:15):
a lot of people. But as I was writing it,
I'm like, oh my god, there are a lot of
themes here that, especially for young women. I'm talking about
like racism, classism, sexism, being groomed as a teenager because
I wanted to be on radio and I wanted to
be a journalist so badly, getting taken advantage of by
an older guy in the industry who was dangling carrots.
(10:35):
Like these things happened to.
Speaker 4 (10:36):
Women in the industry. They're very prevalent.
Speaker 3 (10:40):
And so as I'm telling this story, I'm like, wait
a minute, these themes are going to resonate. So I
kept forging ahead. I entered a contest actually during COVID.
It's called the Ritual Prize for Writers, and I thought
I'm not going to win this because publishing, again, like
every other industry in Australia, is very white. They're not
going to understand the story. I ended up beating like
(11:01):
almost a thousand entries and I won the ritual prize
and then they offered me the book. Deal has shared Australia,
and the book came out in Australia about a year
ago and it's just come out just this week in
the States. So I think there's a lot in there
for fans of hip hop and people that are living
between cultures to.
Speaker 6 (11:22):
Relate to a lot of you mentioned the grooming. Yeah,
when did you realize that that wasn't what was supposed
to be happening. I think there's that moment where you're like,
this is not I don't have to do this.
Speaker 4 (11:34):
Absolutely.
Speaker 3 (11:35):
I got myself in a very sticky situation as a
teenage girl with an older man who I didn't pick
up on the signals, and I thought he was just
encouraging me to work in radio and train me. But
I narrowly avoided a very serious situation there. I think
that's why I was able to write about it.
Speaker 4 (11:51):
In the book.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
There was another situation when I was working at another
radio station here in New York and we had mystical
come in and it's funny, this is pre me too.
So this is a time when as women in hip hop,
we had so few opportunities to be on radio to
be the male's sidekick and shout out to DJ Green Lantern,
who I was on the show with him, and he
(12:14):
said to me.
Speaker 4 (12:15):
Like I don't want to talk. He's like, I want
to play the music. I'm going to let you host
the show. And I was like Invasion Radio, yeah, thank you.
Speaker 3 (12:23):
I needs to put people on the spot and like yeah,
it was a great show, thank you. And so we
had this situation where you know, this guy at that point, mister.
Speaker 4 (12:32):
Wold had like a rap sheet literally of.
Speaker 3 (12:34):
Offenses, but in hip hop in those days, we didn't
really we knew, but we didn't know. It was like
if you go back to people that were probably in
media during the Aliah R. Kelly days, they knew, but
they didn't want to talk about it. And so he
made some very vulgar comments to me when I was
just sitting like this at the desk, and I felt
(12:55):
extremely uncomfortable, but I didn't want to make a scene.
I didn't want to be difficult. I didn't want to
throw him under the bus anymore. I felt very protective
of the talent that I interviewed to So you're grappling
with all of that. But then when I wrote the
book years later and I reflected on it, I thought,
I'm so proud of the young women today who, for
(13:16):
the most part, call things out straight away, and that's
because other women have paved the way for that. And
I felt in that time I wasn't as vocal about
a situation that I should have been. So I think
we've come a long way from that, but these things
still happen. Right, women are being more vocal, but it
still happens. So I hope through the book, without being preachy,
(13:40):
young women can learn some lessons as they move ahead
in their careers.
Speaker 5 (13:44):
Why the title tell her she's And then also every
chapter has a dream.
Speaker 4 (13:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:49):
I realized when I was writing the book that dreaming
was a very prevalent theme in my life. Like I
even went through my old magazines that I had issues
that I had edited, and I was speaking in the
editor's letter about chase this dream, that feel that felt
impossible as a kid from the other side of the
world to come to New York and work in hip hop. Yeah,
dreams have been really prevalent in my life. My mother
(14:10):
was a dreamer, is a dreamer. She wanted to be
in the circus. God bless her her whole life. But
my grandmother was very salt of the earth, you know.
She raised seven kids on her own.
Speaker 4 (14:20):
Basically and worked three jobs.
Speaker 3 (14:24):
And so I had the really kind of down to
earthness of my grandmother mixed with the dreaming of my mom,
and I think that made me able to achieve those dreams, right,
because you can't have dreams without work ethic. And also
in Australia, there's a very famous.
Speaker 4 (14:38):
Movie called The Castle.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
It's a very Australian movie, and there's a very famous
Australian saying, and it's tell him he's dreaming, which is like,
you know, tell him his dream and it's very it's
very awker Australian, which is like you're having yourself on right,
Like you can't be serious, It'll.
Speaker 4 (14:52):
Never you're bugging. That's exactly what it is. That's right,
Thank you for the translation, you're bugging. And so female life,
I made it feminine.
Speaker 3 (15:03):
So I made it tell her she's dreaming because my
whole career I've been told this will never happen, you know, like,
who are you to think that you're gonna get there?
And I grew up reading the source and I ended
up being the content director of my favorite magazine ever.
Speaker 4 (15:17):
So I achieved those dreams and I'm very proud of that.
Speaker 1 (15:19):
What's left?
Speaker 2 (15:20):
What are you still dreaming about? What do you still
want to accomplish? If anything at.
Speaker 3 (15:24):
All, I am dreaming of moving into. I've shifted into
more of a mental role, so that's very important to me.
As we can see with the book. Ah, my heart
is kind of still in New York, which is tough.
I feel like I'm living in two places.
Speaker 4 (15:42):
I feel like I.
Speaker 3 (15:43):
Belong here career wise, but now I'm married and I
have a six year old, beautiful daughter. Shout out to
my beautiful family. I think they're listening online from Sydney.
Speaker 4 (15:51):
I don't know what time it is right now the Australia. No,
my husband's from New York, but I met him in Australia. Wow. Yeah,
life is crazy.
Speaker 3 (16:00):
I lived in Harlem for ten years. He's from Harlem,
and I met him when I moved back to Australia.
Speaker 2 (16:04):
What the hell was he doing in Australia.
Speaker 3 (16:06):
He had jobs there, like he used to play basketball.
But he lived in Australia for a long time. He'd
lived there like fifteen years when I met him, and
so yeah, life is you never know what's around the corner.
But for me, next, I'm kind of open to whatever
happens next. Like I'm consulting and mentoring and I'm writing more.
(16:27):
Actually have an essay coming out soon. Yeah, I'm writing
about hip hop and Palestine.
Speaker 4 (16:33):
Yeah yeah, so.
Speaker 3 (16:36):
Yeah, I know we talk about it, Charlemagne and I,
which I appreciate how open minded you are about everything.
And I just want to give you a special shout
out on air for even allowing me to come up
because I disappeared from the scene for so many years.
And you know a lot of people forget people. They
leave the messages on read and you did it.
Speaker 5 (16:54):
Yeah, thank you said, and your photos in the book man,
so like, yeah, your photos.
Speaker 4 (17:01):
In the book.
Speaker 3 (17:02):
So yeah, I'm writing an essay and I'm very passionate
about hip hop started as an art form to be
the voice of the voiceless, right, the voice of the oppressed.
And I feel like there are a number of artists
that are speaking out and you've had them up on
this show, but I feel like we could be doing
a lot more. And hip hop's biggest stars are very
(17:25):
loudly silent.
Speaker 4 (17:26):
So I'm trying to unpack that.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
Yes, that's a conversation. We've had a lot of pay
that some of the biggest celebrities haven't said anything. Yes,
And you know, for some people, they don't get into politics,
they don't know, they don't understand it. What's your thoughts
on it?
Speaker 3 (17:38):
I think art is political, and I think that when
we're watching a live stream genocide that it's not hard
to say I just want innocent people to stop being killed.
Speaker 4 (17:49):
It's deeper than that, but on a very basic level.
Speaker 3 (17:53):
As an Arab woman, I feel like we're not humanized
enough and I would like to see my people be humanized.
And I'm inspired by natur like Nat Turner's rebellion. Like
when I say I learned about black history through hip hop,
I learned about black history. So I think that more people,
(18:13):
it wouldn't be happening if more people stood up and
said something.
Speaker 4 (18:16):
And really, they're asking us to use our voices. That's
all they're asking for. Please use your platform, Please use
your voice.
Speaker 3 (18:21):
So this essay it might ruffle a little feathers, but
you know, I feel like we get one life on
this earth, and if I don't use that to kind
of I'm privileged, and I feel like I should use
that privilege for the greater good.
Speaker 1 (18:35):
What do you think about the language surrounding it?
Speaker 5 (18:37):
Right, because you hear politicians they all say the same thing,
acknowledge what happened on October seventh, which we all can
agree with, traversy, and then they say the hostages have
to come home and then it can be a ceasefire.
Speaker 1 (18:50):
What do you think of that language.
Speaker 3 (18:52):
I think that we have to acknowledge that before October seven,
there are thousands of Palestinian hostages that are in jail
under no charges at all, men, women, and children. Yes,
and that never gets spoken about. I think we have
to acknowledge that Gaza has no control by land, air
or sea. I think there are many factors that have
(19:17):
dehumanized this population for decades that we're not taking into.
Speaker 4 (19:22):
Account prior to that operation on October seven.
Speaker 3 (19:28):
And so I think when we speak about this issue,
and again I'm not Palestinian, I am Lebanese and Israel
is constantly at war with Southern Lebanon two, so I
do have a vested interest in this, but it's a
human issue and I just think that if you keep
sending bombs to a population.
Speaker 4 (19:50):
How is it going to stop?
Speaker 3 (19:52):
Like, I just think the narrative doesn't make sense, and
we're being gas lit very much at the moment, and
I think people need to understand there are a lot
of peop people in pain right now.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
So what do you think about what the US is
doing As far as saying, like Charlamage said, we want peace,
we despert sending millions and Surians to die.
Speaker 3 (20:10):
I think it's I think it's I was really nervous
coming back to the States. But it's not just the US.
Australia is complicit to Europe is complicit. It's not just
the US, but the US is funding the arms that
are committing a genocide and so but I also say
on the flip side of that, I have to be
(20:30):
really clear. It's happening in Sudan at the hands of
Arabs to black people, right, So it's not just Israel
that are committing an atrocity. They have the eyes because,
as black poet June Jordan said, Palestine is the moral
litmus test of the world. And that's why I think
our eyes are on it. This is the Holy Land, right,
But it is happening in Sudan as well. We all
(20:51):
know it's happening in the Congo. If you do your
research for different they're like, it's supremacy in all its forms,
it's racism in all its forms. And I think that
sometimes Charlemagne and I have talked about the Lesser of
the evils as well, and a lot of people are
hurting and they don't want to hear that lesser of
the evils talk, right, So to me, I don't have
(21:13):
the answers, but I would just like my people to
be humanized at the moment so we can take a
step back and really look at what's happening. Because Palestine
was a land and it's getting smaller and smaller illegally
more of that land is being taken, and so to me,
that that is the issue of our time.
Speaker 1 (21:32):
One question, last question, Yes, you have a picture here
with Kalen.
Speaker 2 (21:35):
Have your Kalent had a conversation because I know he's
been a big topic of people feel like he should
be speaking up more so have you had a comversation.
Speaker 4 (21:41):
I'm writing about color It in the essay. That was
my question.
Speaker 3 (21:44):
Yeah, exactly, Yeah, I'm writing about Colet in the essay.
I'm writing about a couple others that go to the
Middle East to party, make money from other countries in
the Middle East. But when it's time to talk about
our pain, radio silence. And I think that that's happened
with black people for decades now, right, they want our
(22:05):
rhythm and not our blues. That's the same, and now
we're feeling it. And so I acknowledge all that in
the essay, right, And I see Black people say to
each other, why should we give a damn about them?
They've never given the damn about us? And I acknowledge
that too, And I think we have to be very
honest and have these honest conversations about everything, and we
can't move forward until that. But to your point, yeah,
(22:28):
I have reached out to colored people and we've spoken
very briefly.
Speaker 4 (22:32):
I've been told that I'll put that.
Speaker 3 (22:35):
In the essay and you can read about it. But no,
we haven't directly spoken. Everyone has their own journey. I
understand that. But as a Middle Eastern person, I know
our community are heartbroken at his silence.
Speaker 5 (22:46):
It's gonna be interesting to see what happens, you know,
especially in November with the election, especially in places like Michigan,
because yes, the reality is America is always going to
fund military. So it's just gonna be interesting to see
what happened.
Speaker 4 (23:01):
What do you think will happen in Michigan.
Speaker 1 (23:06):
I really truly don't know. I really don't know. I
really have no idea.
Speaker 5 (23:10):
Because even when I think about all the people who voted,
you know, uncommitted in the primary, it's a part of
me that's like, but if Trump, you're saying it's gonna
be worse.
Speaker 4 (23:19):
I don't know what's worse than genocide.
Speaker 3 (23:21):
I do know what's worst, And I understand what you're
saying because I do understand that there are other there
are other issues, right, LGBTQ I rights, abortion, like, there
are huge issues on the table.
Speaker 1 (23:32):
Well that's what I mean when I say it worse,
I mean worse for Gaza.
Speaker 4 (23:34):
Yeah, like, oh, there's no worse for Gaza right now.
They can't be. They can't be, they can't be. Like
you said, if if what you said is true.
Speaker 3 (23:42):
Then America unequivocally stands with Israel, which is what Kamala
Harris has said unequivocally, then how can they be worse?
That change of power will be the exact same thing,
so it's just done in different ways.
Speaker 4 (23:52):
Probably, so I don't know what's gonna happen. I'm not American.
Speaker 3 (23:55):
I'm married to an American, my daughter is a Jeal citizen,
and I'm very vested in I have a you know,
I love this country. It's given me so many opportunities.
But like it does break my heart. The foreign policy
of America obviously affects the world. America is still a superpower.
I don't know if it always will be, and I
don't know if Americans realize the shift in the view
(24:18):
of this country around globally, there has.
Speaker 4 (24:21):
Been a huge shift.
Speaker 3 (24:23):
And so but people always say to me, oh, Americans,
they only care about America. They don't care about the
rest of the world. And I say, as someone who
lived here for a decade, until you live here, you
don't understand what they're dealing with on a day to
day basis. You have to give Americans some grace because
there's so much that goes on here that to take on,
I mean, I've had conversations with friends to take on
(24:44):
some other tragedy is a lot mentally, because dealing with
things day to day here is crazy enough. So I
get that, but it's good to kind of be aware
of what's happening that affects because it's your tax dollars, right.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
Absolutely. Yeah. The last chapter is don't you it's over
break that death.
Speaker 3 (25:02):
Oh, the last chapters don't dream, It's over. It's basically
about like you said, every chapter had the word dream
in it. It's about never giving up. Like I said,
my heart is still here in New York. I'm trying
to bring New York to Australia in a lot of
ways in what I do. And it's it's easy to
say never give up when when you feel like the
(25:23):
light is never coming into the darkness. I got very
sick with the Crone's disease. I almost died when I
got home to Australia. My doctor was like, you are
literally life or death. You are killing yourself to like
survive in the music industry. Yeah, that's how much I
wanted to chase this dream and make it real. But
then I realized, like, your dreams can change as you change.
(25:43):
And I think that's the lesson of the book, Like
you have these dreams that ignite your fire, but as
life changes, the dreams change too.
Speaker 4 (25:50):
Yeah, and you love.
Speaker 1 (25:52):
That your dreams can change, your dream can change as
you change.
Speaker 3 (25:56):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (25:57):
Yeah, And so now I feel like a new burst
of energy with the book.
Speaker 3 (26:02):
And you never know, like I'm up on the breakfast
club like it's all come full circle. And I met
you guys when this was just starting. Life is crazy
and it's so inspiring.
Speaker 6 (26:12):
How did you do it? Because nowadays, like people are
so like it's our culture. Yes, you can't come in,
and there's all these think pieces on Twitter. Yeah, how
do you like, did you even deal with that when
you were first Night in Australia but just here in
New York being a hip hop journalist but not being
of the culture, right.
Speaker 3 (26:29):
I didn't really feel that until I got to the
Source magazine because that's obviously a venerated hip hop institution.
And I had the conversation with the publisher, Londo McMillan
when he hired me, and we spoke about that, and
he said, I'm actually hiring you because you are aware
of your place.
Speaker 4 (26:45):
And who you are.
Speaker 3 (26:47):
And he said, some of the staff have said, like,
who is this girl, what's her pedigree? We don't know
her background. They didn't know all the years that I
put into working within the art form, and so for
a little minute I felt imposter syndrome, but then I realized, Look,
I've never tried to be anybody but myself, and I've
always encouraged like I said, like especially young black women
(27:11):
like Nihila Simone was my intern at the Source right now,
That's what I'm saying. She's on tour with Rhapsody, who
I put in the freestyle session.
Speaker 4 (27:22):
So like, I've always known.
Speaker 3 (27:24):
My place, and I've always known that I really felt
like this culture was not and it is not respected
on the level that it should be globally and even
within the States probably, but like especially globally.
Speaker 4 (27:37):
People will go to.
Speaker 3 (27:37):
The concerts, they love the music, but when it's time
to show up at a protest, you know, they don't
want to get their hands dirty. And I'm like, no, no, no, no, no, Like,
we can't let black people give us their gifts and
not pay that back in every way, and I've tried
to do that. So yeah, things have shifted a little bit,
and I think rightfully, so I think that conversation is
(27:59):
very needed.
Speaker 4 (28:02):
But I have always tried to be as respectful as possible.
Speaker 3 (28:05):
In what I do and just contribute because it's a
global art form now. I mean it was unleashed into
the world from the seventies and I'm a child of that.
So I think my duty is to learn the culture,
learn the roots, and just stand as much as I can.
Speaker 2 (28:20):
Yeah, all right, well down under up to our music
helped one woman make big dreams come true.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
Make sure right now.
Speaker 4 (28:30):
Thank you guys, thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (28:31):
We appreciate you for joining us.
Speaker 4 (28:33):
Thank you, Virgo. It was my birthday last week. Thank
you and Emelia Jordan. It's the Breakfast Club.
Speaker 1 (28:40):
Good morning, wake that answer up in the morning. Breakfast
Club
The Breakfast Club News
Hosts And Creators
Charlamagne Tha God
DJ Envy
Jess Hilarious
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