We honor the life and legacy of the late, great Malcolm-Jamal Warner. A visionary whose artistry transcended the screen and touched the soul. Actor. Producer. Writer. Poet. His creative spirit was boundless, his impact immeasurable. Thank you for your brilliance, your voice, and your love for the culture. Rest in Power, Malcolm-Jamal Warner 🕊️
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Wake that ass up in the morning, The Breakfast Club Morning.
Everybody is the j n V. Just Hilaris Charlamage the guy.
We are the Breakfast Club. We got some special guests
in the building from the Not All Hood podcast. We
have Malcolm Jamore Warner where you see Baraka and Candice Kelly.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Welcome, Thank you, Hey, good to see you.
Speaker 3 (00:21):
How the brothers and sister feeling good?
Speaker 4 (00:24):
Life is good?
Speaker 2 (00:25):
Yeah, good morning.
Speaker 5 (00:27):
Yeah, that's about here, y'all just moved into.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
It was the first interview in our new studio. That's right. Wow, man,
I love the name Not All Hood?
Speaker 5 (00:35):
Nah.
Speaker 3 (00:36):
Who came up with that?
Speaker 5 (00:37):
That was what you'll see?
Speaker 4 (00:39):
Yeah, I don't even remember for real, for real, Like
I was just like, uh nah, Like Malcolm and I
have been talking about just the concept of the podcast
and how the diversity and who we are and also
who we're not, right, So I was like, nah.
Speaker 6 (00:57):
Nah, Yeah, it feels like that was some I say,
all black people from the hood.
Speaker 4 (01:02):
Nah exactly?
Speaker 6 (01:05):
Is it that where a lot of people come from
poor and disenfranchised environments, but we are not our environment?
Speaker 4 (01:11):
Like it's just that we come from a bunch of
different environments, you know, and I feel like, you know,
a lot of media to portraying us either like your
hip hop, you're your hip hop or pop culture right,
you know, and now we're more than that.
Speaker 7 (01:27):
It's funny that you actually said that, Charlotmane, because I
grew up in I grew up in La in the
jungle wow. And my mother used to say to me, Malcolm,
we live in the jungle, We're not of the jungle.
So she was very clear on me having my sights
(01:48):
further than just my neighborhood, which is why she put
me in theater. And it was always trying to find
things for me to do to keep me, you know,
from just going to school and just hanging out, you know.
But it was that it was a certain mindset that
you know, she instilled in me, like Okay, yeah, we're here,
but you know, this doesn't have to define us.
Speaker 8 (02:09):
And you know what, we are often recognized before we
enter into any room and judge right, and sometimes you
get the question that you know means you really don't
belong here.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
So when that comes in.
Speaker 5 (02:21):
Can help you?
Speaker 3 (02:22):
Yeah?
Speaker 5 (02:22):
Yeah?
Speaker 8 (02:22):
Right?
Speaker 2 (02:22):
Can I help you?
Speaker 5 (02:23):
Right?
Speaker 8 (02:23):
Right?
Speaker 2 (02:24):
Can I help you? Or have I seen you be
here here before? Or what are you doing in this neighborhood?
Speaker 3 (02:29):
Yes, that's right. One, that's the one.
Speaker 2 (02:30):
Right, What are you doing this neighbor This is my neighborhood.
Speaker 3 (02:33):
Why are you here?
Speaker 6 (02:34):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (02:34):
Why are you jogging here?
Speaker 8 (02:35):
Right?
Speaker 2 (02:36):
That you know that you just happened to my father.
Speaker 8 (02:37):
He would jog in the neighborhood and all the white
neighbors would stop him when we first moved in, and
they would keep on stopping him. This back in the seventies.
So he finally just went to the police station and said,
I just need to introduce myself so that when you
guys stopped me, you know who you are, and it stopped.
But that's kind of an example of what it means
when people perceive you beforehand, and what you have to
do to go outside of the box to keep improving
(03:00):
who you are over and over again. So this really
is just an ongoing conversation that we have, Malcolm, let's
call a safe space, which it is just to say
really what we want about anything about our experiences in America.
And that's really kind of key to it too. We
have people that are from diverse backgrounds, whether they're from
the Caribbean or whether they're from all you know, Africa,
(03:22):
but you come to America and there's kind of a
thread And those are the types of stories that we're
sharing to really change this mass narrative that's already out
there about us.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
Creator shift is.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
A term hood negative though when people say hood sometimes
it comes off as negative. I don't take it as
a negative term. Is it a negative term?
Speaker 5 (03:39):
No?
Speaker 7 (03:39):
And I think, you know, part of the you know,
the idea of not all hood is hood is not
a negative term. Hood is part of the community. Like
when we speak of the black community, we always tend
to refer to it as if it's a monolist that's right,
but they are all these different lanes to the black community,
all these levels, all these different lanes, and oftentimes we
(04:02):
don't have a space where we can actually, you know, discuss,
acknowledge and deal with with all of those levels, all
those lanes. So the hood is not a bad thing.
We're not all you know, we're not Yes, we are hood,
but we're not all hood. And the media, and I
think part of it is the media tends to put
more focus on one aspect of the black community. Thus
(04:24):
we get all the stereotypes and preconceived ideas.
Speaker 4 (04:27):
And hood comes from like neighborhood, neigh right, and Dayla
said it. You know, they called the hood because we're
not neighbors anymore, you know what I mean, a lot
of times we're not communicating with each other, right, but
we we're trying to change that.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
I did get that question a lot though you have
been a podcast. Isn't hood negative?
Speaker 8 (04:46):
So I understand where you're coming from. But just like
they said, it's a neighborhood. I mean, I live in
a place where I'm next to a lot of Indian neighborhood,
Indian neighborhood, Jewish neighborhood.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
You can still call it the hood. People also associate
the word.
Speaker 8 (05:00):
Hood we're just us, which really, yeah, we're black.
Speaker 2 (05:04):
So it's just one of those things.
Speaker 8 (05:05):
It's kind of some damage that the media, the pop culture,
the news has done and really trying to define who
we are.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
Yeah, I never took it as negative. It was always
going back to the hood, to mean, I'm going back
home to my neighborhood, right exactly wherever it was. I'm
going to play basketball in the hood, which was my neighborhood.
You know, I mean, I never took it as oh
my gosh, it's a place. No, I never took it
at that. I know a lot of people do, but
that was always just like going home, you know.
Speaker 8 (05:28):
Yeah, yeah, And you know, we were talking about this yesterday.
That also when we talk about being African American, we
talk about the trauma that's associated, like that's really all.
Speaker 6 (05:37):
You know.
Speaker 8 (05:37):
We have diabetes and high blood pressure and we're dying
and the infomortality rate. But we're happy people too. But
we make it to the news when it's bad. You know,
we may often make it to the news when it's bad.
And so that's another thing that I think this podcast does,
I think for the three of us, is just show
the joy and what it's like being black and because
(06:01):
of the things that are going out there in this
twenty twenty.
Speaker 3 (06:04):
Four Lord, every yeah, how did the three of you
all come together? How did y'all get together? We will
do the left yo, everything on you.
Speaker 5 (06:16):
Right?
Speaker 7 (06:16):
What you SA and I have been friends for she's
for a minute, a long minute.
Speaker 5 (06:21):
Twenty plus years.
Speaker 7 (06:23):
We used to both be at the National Back Theater
Festival in Winstern, Salem and where you and I met
in nineteen ninety nine and we had put on the
first poetry jam there and that turned out to be
one of the biggest attractions at the theater. We used
to call the midnight Poetry Jam. So after you know,
(06:45):
all day of theater, you know, in every imaginable performance
space in the city, then people would come back to
the to our venue and we would pack out at
midnight poetry Jam. It would just be open mic starting
at midnight and we'd go to like two two thirty.
Speaker 4 (07:03):
And it was a big attraction, Yeah festival, and then
we just kept hanging out yeah Yeah. And then I
know link with Cannis from I was doing sort of
community organizing and sort of it was a a event with.
Speaker 2 (07:24):
Ye Yeah.
Speaker 4 (07:26):
In Morris Town, New Jersey, and we connected there just
sort of yeah linked And when macol I decided we
were going to do this podcast, we're like, yeah, we
need some different voices.
Speaker 8 (07:39):
In yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
Yeah.
Speaker 8 (07:41):
And I do a lot of work, a lot of
commentating on various mostly legal cases. I feel in for
Roland Martin to Roland Martin unfiltered, and so I'm always
running my mouth and when I got on with them,
I think I ran my mouth for them to say.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
You know what, you want to keep talking with us.
I was like, I actually do.
Speaker 8 (07:58):
So, you know, really in that first conversation, we talked
about anything from and word to talking to music. I mean,
we were just on for a long time and it's
just a nice everybody was testifying, you know what I.
Speaker 2 (08:09):
Mean, it really was.
Speaker 8 (08:10):
It was just a good way to connect and get
to know each other. And the conversation has been going
on ever since.
Speaker 7 (08:15):
But the dope things. When Way and I first started talking,
we're both older fathers. So the initial idea was to
do a podcast from the perspective of older black fathers.
So when we first met with Candis, it was as
a producer.
Speaker 2 (08:31):
Yeah, to produce this show, that's right.
Speaker 5 (08:33):
And then we had that meeting, was like, you know,
ninety minutes, this is the show.
Speaker 7 (08:37):
Yeah, We're like, we need to add candas as a
host and expand the concept from just you know, the
black father perspective.
Speaker 5 (08:45):
And it turned into yeah, and.
Speaker 8 (08:46):
I think your wife because your wife is in the
background like that.
Speaker 3 (08:51):
Yeah, what are some of the topics you guys will
be discussing.
Speaker 4 (08:55):
Black fatherhood an older fathers with younger children?
Speaker 5 (09:03):
Yeah, how you guys handling that?
Speaker 4 (09:06):
Yo? What did yours old your youngest so youngest. Only
we only have one because I got.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
A two year old Sol, and then I got a twenty.
Speaker 3 (09:15):
Two year old.
Speaker 4 (09:20):
Fifty three, I got a nine year old.
Speaker 5 (09:22):
I got six, he got four.
Speaker 6 (09:24):
I'll be forty six and a couple of weeks my
youngest two.
Speaker 3 (09:27):
I got a two year old, five year old, eight
year old, and fifteen.
Speaker 5 (09:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (09:30):
Yeah, so y'all started around when we started.
Speaker 5 (09:33):
Yeah, I'm fifty three and my daughter just turned seven.
Speaker 3 (09:36):
Okay, okay, so.
Speaker 4 (09:37):
You'll have a conversation we're talking about, you know what
I mean, those those days where they be on, on,
go go, you know what I mean, and you gotta
just wrap your energy up and and make it happen,
you know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (09:50):
Crazy you say that.
Speaker 6 (09:51):
My homeboy told me that a long time ago, beause
you know, all my homeboys had kids way younger.
Speaker 3 (09:55):
Than I did, right, And they was like, man, you
wait till you thirty plus forty to have kids. You're
gonna be running around you need he's gonna be hurting, Like, no,
he won't. Yes, they are exactly, but that.
Speaker 2 (10:04):
Doesn't some good come with that?
Speaker 8 (10:06):
You being older, so speak yeah, you know, being a
father and not being twenty one I've been having growth
yourself that you have to go through.
Speaker 6 (10:13):
Oh yeah, my last my two youngest get a version
of me that did not exist ten years ago.
Speaker 5 (10:20):
Ten years ago.
Speaker 7 (10:21):
You know, I spent more of my adult life in
long term relationship, more years of my adult life in
long term relationships than not. And my wife and I
have been together eight and a half years and not
more than two days go by that I don't give
thanks to the universe forgiving me the wisdom and fortitude
(10:43):
to have waited as long as they did. A lot
of people are like, he's never gonna get married, And
I think at some point I probably thought.
Speaker 4 (10:48):
Like we said, have these conversations like yo, they looking
at us like we you know, damnage goods like to mean,
you thirty done and you don't got no kids? Not married?
He got a problem?
Speaker 5 (10:58):
Yeah, I mean, it's the best thing, and for me,
it's the best thing I could have been.
Speaker 7 (11:01):
I would not have I definitely would not have been
as effective a husband and father had I done this
any earlier with anybody else.
Speaker 6 (11:10):
That is such a great conversation you never hear men
have Like that's a conversation you always hear, you know,
women have, but so you actually waited like you were
actually waiting for the right.
Speaker 7 (11:19):
Know how many bullets.
Speaker 9 (11:26):
I've been since thirteen on TV, since thirteen, you know,
I neoled my way out of a lot.
Speaker 6 (11:37):
At your circumstance was different, though, because you didn't know
if people wanted to be with you all they wanted
to be with you.
Speaker 5 (11:43):
Know what I mean?
Speaker 7 (11:43):
There was that because I've been doing it for so long,
I've been really blessed with a great sense of discerning,
So that was never my issue.
Speaker 5 (11:53):
To be completely transparent.
Speaker 7 (11:55):
My thing about marriage was like, yo, I'm not getting
married and then given a chick half of my stuff
because I messed up. So I was very clear that
even though there were situations that you know, we're really
you know, pressuring if you will, you know, like that
kind of marriage, I was like nah, because I knew me.
(12:16):
I knew that I wasn't going to because I wasn't
I wasn't given half of my trap because because I messed.
Speaker 3 (12:21):
Up about you.
Speaker 4 (12:23):
It was about just being patient, like I know me,
and I know that, like everybody's gonna be able to
deal with me. As a community organizer who like really
understands that the people around me that are close to
me are gonna be okay. My work in life is
to make sure that other people are gonna be okay.
So sometimes I'm I'm a little hard on them people
(12:45):
that are close. Right, I'm gonna get out and like
they're gonna have to take a back seat sometimes. Right,
That was part of it. And the big part is
like raising my child, the idea of like me getting
married and having a child.
Speaker 5 (12:57):
You gotta be.
Speaker 4 (12:57):
Special, man, where you gots to be special? So I
love you, Shelley.
Speaker 8 (13:05):
With one show where we have these two and Lamar
Rutcker and I just sit back and I listen. It's
like there could be some people that are taking notes,
some women that are taking notes because they really I
was like, this is some good, Like you said, I
don't hear that a lot, just talking about fatherhood and
just the humility and how proud they are and then
all the rules and lessons that they learned in a.
Speaker 2 (13:27):
Long way when they were dating.
Speaker 5 (13:29):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:30):
Yeah, it really was no taking moment.
Speaker 3 (13:32):
It was good.
Speaker 4 (13:32):
You guys have boys or girls? Girls?
Speaker 3 (13:34):
Oh yeah, yeah, girl.
Speaker 2 (13:36):
I said that was kind of suspect.
Speaker 6 (13:38):
Girls different different, it's way different.
Speaker 4 (13:41):
He has four girls I got four girls.
Speaker 3 (13:45):
You know, I love it. Yeah yeah, I love it,
and I deserve it.
Speaker 4 (13:49):
You know, they say, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 5 (13:52):
All of it. How does that change you? Having girls?
Speaker 1 (13:56):
I got four girls, Charlamagne's four girls, How does that
change you as a father?
Speaker 5 (13:59):
I got two off, but some girls changing.
Speaker 7 (14:02):
So I asked the universe for a girl first. So
even before, even before conception, we were very clear we
were having a girl. And I know that I needed
a girl first to kind of ease me into it
because I've you know, I'm I have a pretty good
idea of what kind of father I would be. So
I needed a girl to kind of you know, slow
(14:24):
me down and and and warm and softs me up,
if you will. So for me raising my daughter, I
came into fatherhood already with a certain maturity and uh,
you know, certain understanding of male female dynamics, you know,
(14:48):
and with a girl, all of that starts with the father.
So I've always since she came, since I literally pulled
her out of my wife, I've been focused on, you know,
instilling in her the kind of love that she is
not going to have to go out in the world
(15:08):
and try to find, treating her with a level of
respect at nine months old, that she will that that
that kind of loves normalized.
Speaker 5 (15:23):
Right.
Speaker 7 (15:24):
That's always been my biggest thing. Like we see these
girls out here who don't have a great relationships with
the fathers, and you know, through our lifetimes we've been
with a lot of them, Right, So I knew that
the for me, the biggest gift that I can give
my daughter is a sense of self so when she
(15:46):
goes out into the world, she is not easily influenced
by her surroundings. So since she was like two years old,
you know, someone says to her, Oh, you're so pretty,
you're so cute, You're so beautiful, She'll say thank you.
Speaker 5 (16:00):
When I'm smart too.
Speaker 4 (16:01):
That's how we run it.
Speaker 7 (16:02):
That's the normalization I want her to have.
Speaker 5 (16:05):
In terms of how she sees herself in characters.
Speaker 4 (16:07):
Absolutely, you see, yeah, same thing, Like you know, it's
a it's a humbling space. Giving my daughter like a
different kind of vocabulary that's empowering to her so that
when she interacts, she knows she she walks and talks
from posician power.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
Absolutely, you know, yet, hold on, can you speak of
that candid?
Speaker 8 (16:31):
Yeah, Yeah, I come from a family of three girls.
And my father, I mean really just the king of
all things. They know all about my father. I told
a story already today about my father, you know what
I mean. So that is very infused in me and
my mother too, don't get me wrong, but since we're
talking about fathers, all everything that he poured into me,
and you know, sometimes you're doing something and you're like, oh,
(16:52):
that's my dad, what I did right there, that's my mom.
Like you can you know when they've poured into it,
when you see you doing things that are just like
what they did, and you don't even realize it. So
you don't even realize what the kids see and don't see.
But really, my parents really allowed me to see all
of the right things they really did, and parents generally
are always right, I mean really like it might be
(17:15):
twenty years down the line we.
Speaker 4 (17:17):
Try and my daughter reminds me that bye bye.
Speaker 2 (17:24):
Maybe not Yeah.
Speaker 5 (17:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 8 (17:27):
It really is powerful to have a powerful father, to
have a presence all the time, even when they're gone,
still there.
Speaker 1 (17:35):
I think the funniest thing for girl dads is humbling, right,
meaning I was never in the cheerleading, a dance or
any of those sports. But now when I take my
daughters today, better get out, not be doing a dance mood.
Speaker 4 (17:55):
Right.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
It takes you out of that that ego place where
it's like now I'm gonna talk that now, right, I'm safty.
Speaker 3 (18:00):
Yeah yeah.
Speaker 5 (18:01):
I think when my daughter was born, I found myself.
Speaker 7 (18:03):
Like crying all the time, went over like just simple
ship be like I had that touches me.
Speaker 4 (18:13):
Like baby feet and baby dimples.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
I was like, what is Oh, they're so cute?
Speaker 4 (18:23):
Man, opened up a whole other world.
Speaker 6 (18:26):
It's probably a stupid question. Way, but you hate poetry,
you laugh thing baracca?
Speaker 3 (18:30):
You related?
Speaker 5 (18:31):
No relation? No wow, no relation.
Speaker 4 (18:34):
Okay, that's a loute to the arc. I mean all
the great things you know and to know the l
o g absolutely know Mary.
Speaker 1 (18:46):
Now Father's Day is around the corner, do you, guys?
As Father's Day important to you guys as much?
Speaker 5 (18:50):
And for you? Is it important as you?
Speaker 1 (18:53):
Because for myself I just just want to chill fall
that don't need too much. This is a little barbecue
the kids around. That's all I care about this day?
Speaker 5 (19:00):
What is it for you guys? This?
Speaker 8 (19:06):
Well, So my father is passed a couple of years ago.
He died during COVID but you know, thank you so
much and so but you know my husband, so you know,
I was, you know this morning, all right, we're doing dinner, right,
We're doing the house?
Speaker 2 (19:20):
Are we doing that? We're going out?
Speaker 6 (19:22):
You know.
Speaker 8 (19:22):
It's one of those things where I just like, as
I tell my husband all the time, you know what,
it's not the it's not the birthdays of the Christmas
or there or the holidays that society has said. Just
be good to me on a regular Tuesday will be good.
But I do remember as my father and he got older,
it was really important because everybody was all over the place.
Everybody goes in their own lives. So it was good
(19:45):
to come back and give him that gift of time
because at some point, you know, you don't need.
Speaker 2 (19:51):
Socks or clothes or TV or car. You don't need that.
Speaker 8 (19:55):
What you want is stuff that's really free. Time, respect, love,
your energy, your opinion, all of that. So it's good
to come together for all of those things that cost
no money, especially as people get older.
Speaker 5 (20:08):
But that wants to scratch off ticket you.
Speaker 8 (20:13):
But you know what he wants to see you when
you give it to him, you know what I mean,
it's not the ticket, Yeah, but if.
Speaker 2 (20:20):
He wins, you know, you don't want that out.
Speaker 6 (20:23):
I'm talking about you afraid of being too honest or
too vulnerable on these podcasts because in this era people
get very loose. As you've seen, if people have a
certain image of you, you even care about that.
Speaker 5 (20:36):
That's so it's interesting.
Speaker 7 (20:36):
So you know, I've said that in interviews that this is,
you know, the most vulnerable and I've always been pretty
transparent in my art and my poetry and music.
Speaker 5 (20:46):
But I don't I don't worry about it.
Speaker 7 (20:49):
I got a good taste of it just this week
because we had our you know, first episode on Monday,
and we were having conversation about the N word and
I had a you know, I made it's really interesting
how many people we're not listening to what I was
saying and took my comments as I was, you know,
(21:09):
I was hating on j Cole. So it's things like that.
And then the way the Instagram, the art of dialogue.
Speaker 5 (21:19):
And other Yeah, the way they worded that's the where
were in right, Like, So I was.
Speaker 7 (21:24):
Like, ah, right, this is the reason why I stopped
commenting on i G first thing in the morning.
Speaker 3 (21:30):
Malcolm mo say he stopped listening to J Cole.
Speaker 1 (21:33):
Yeah, let's play the listen certain the clip here, so
people undertake.
Speaker 5 (21:38):
What what are you talking about?
Speaker 3 (21:39):
Are you playing it in context?
Speaker 5 (21:40):
Context?
Speaker 1 (21:40):
Because I'm sure we don't have the clip off the
other clip.
Speaker 5 (21:43):
No, so we're in context.
Speaker 7 (21:44):
Okay, okay, dig it, dig it. So so many people,
you know, they just ignore the fact that I said,
I love J Cole and I said that most of
my favorite mcs you know, are guilty of the same
thing we're talking about, you know, perpetuating, perpetuating anti black
(22:04):
messaging in our black music.
Speaker 6 (22:06):
So that was really my point. I don't understand. That's
when they lose me. How is that anti black? How
is that N word? Saying you don't like the N
word anti black messaging? Isn't the N word anti black?
That's what I'm saying. My perspective is so much of
our black music.
Speaker 7 (22:23):
Today, like you take the Dope Beats Away and you
just listen to the lyrics lyrically, it's anti black message,
you know what I'm saying. And we talk about you know,
so much of you know, hip hop today that's trash
and whatnot. But you know, as I said, before they
grew up listening to what we were listening to. Right,
(22:44):
So we are complicit in, you know, the parts of
hip hop today that we don't like because they grew
up listening to us listening listening to the content is
the same. The scale set is just whack, right, which
is what makes it stand.
Speaker 4 (22:58):
Out, as they didn't listen to what we were listening to,
you know what I'm saying. But I think that we
also had a broader We listened to music when there
was more than just hip hop. Hip Hop was not
the the juggernaut of music that it is now, right, Okay,
(23:19):
we like, yeah, jazz like like you would, you know,
like we was rocking the salt hall notes, you know
what I mean, and all these other things, right, you
know what I mean? Yeah, Like we had these a
lot of other influences that I think the youth of
today don't necessarily have aren't necessarily being uh promoted in
(23:41):
terms of yeah, in terms of balance.
Speaker 6 (23:43):
Yeah, I get exactly what you're saying, because even the
other genres now are hip hop.
Speaker 4 (23:47):
Right what I'm saying, Like, you know, it's countries, a
little bit of hip hop, you know what I mean.
Speaker 7 (23:52):
And so much of it, so much of the hip
hop that gets the shine. You know, it's it's the
anti black message, but that's it's very rarely. There are
not many hip hop songs that are speaking love to
our people. Most of it is very threatening.
Speaker 4 (24:08):
But is that the artists or is that the industry?
Both okay, and.
Speaker 5 (24:14):
The end the result is the same.
Speaker 7 (24:15):
The the the psyche on young black boys and girls,
there's the same whether it's the weather, but.
Speaker 4 (24:25):
If it's young black boys and girl that's on the parents.
Speaker 5 (24:28):
Yeah, sure, but all parents don't. All parents.
Speaker 7 (24:32):
There's a certain luxury that you and I have in
terms of the time that.
Speaker 5 (24:37):
We and our wives can spend with our daughters, right, but.
Speaker 7 (24:40):
Everybody, everybody in all families don't have that. So we're
not talking about, uh, the psyche of young black kids
who have their parents very involved in their lives and
showing them balance. We're talking about the ones who.
Speaker 4 (24:53):
Were Let's hold them accountable to the messages. My fault
this is that this is like.
Speaker 3 (25:04):
I don't think you would you say J Cole had
the anti black message.
Speaker 7 (25:07):
No, so so for me because Nigga has become you know,
it's become the staple in hip hop, like it's got
to be a nigga bitch. That's why I said in
that clip, I think there should be a moratorium on
both of those words in hip hop because it's it's
at this point, it's corny, it's lazy.
Speaker 5 (25:24):
Everybody is using it.
Speaker 7 (25:26):
So let's like, you know, you know, there are so
many brilliant writers and lyricists out there that it's like,
come on, let's let's let's stop our game. We don't
have to keep doing if everybody's doing it, then come
on do something different, you know. So my thing with
with with J Cole, it just I just got to
a point where I got tired of, you know, hearing
(25:47):
inward and being called inWORD in every hip.
Speaker 5 (25:49):
Hop song I'm listening to.
Speaker 7 (25:52):
And I mentioned J Cole because I love J Cole
and he's such an and an incredible lyrics that when
I hear him just gratuitously use either those words, I'm like, ah,
I mean kind of you know that I have to
tune out. Yeah, doesn't mean doesn't mean I like J
Cole or respect his artistry, his his pen game any less.
(26:17):
I just go all right, I'm d I gotta tune
out because it's not it's not doing it's not bringing me,
it's not feeding me.
Speaker 6 (26:24):
So what about the album, like because and this is
the album that I say in the future is gonna
be two of the most important albums of all time.
Miss Kendrick Lamar, Mister Moralean in the Big Steps jay
Z four four four. The things that they're discussing on
this album, black men going to therapy, black men doing
right by the women. You know, uh, issues with our
father daddy, issues that we fix. Like, to me, those
(26:46):
themes are bigger than the language that they using. Even
you look at somebody like Tupac. To me, Tupac's themes
were bigger than the language he was using.
Speaker 7 (26:56):
People keep saying that about Tupac, but like, and I
don't want to get into a whole thing about about
but yeah, I listened to his I mean listen to
his There's there's dear Mama, Brenda's got a baby, keep
your head up.
Speaker 5 (27:12):
And then everything else is.
Speaker 1 (27:15):
Not everything this changes this You got me got a
bunch of but you know, you know what this conversation
sounds like. It sounds like you know where you're younger
and your father said, oh you listen to that, hippiie
hoppity rap. There's a lot of positivity, all the positive
artists out there that are spitting right but right people
listening to music. Those same artists had the same problem.
If you think about ty lib Quality never.
Speaker 5 (27:37):
Got on radio.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
Most Death never got on radio. Tribe called Quest hardly
got on radio. We talked about a lot of those
positive rappers. It was the same thing back then.
Speaker 4 (27:45):
Those artists might have a record or too.
Speaker 1 (27:48):
Tell him did get on radio too. He did a
record to jay z Hot on the single just to
get by record, that's but it took him a long
time to get on record. Most definim didn't get really
on radio, to what miss fab fabulty. So a lot
of the things that we're talking about was the same thing.
Coming rarely got on the world, you know what I mean.
But it's the same thing. It's the same thing as
(28:10):
what we push Like back then, who's on radio?
Speaker 6 (28:12):
Biggie t I, you know that name had social records
with socially redeeming.
Speaker 5 (28:19):
Value, but the records on radio.
Speaker 6 (28:22):
Like my dad used to always try to get me
to listen to the Honorable Minutes to Lewis Farrakon and
I would sorta reluctantly. When I heard Biggie say deep
like the mind of Farrakhn, I'm like, oh, that's the
brother my daddy's always trying to get me.
Speaker 5 (28:35):
So now I really like he was speaking to you.
Speaker 6 (28:38):
Yeah, d farra CON's a prophet. I think you ought
to listen to it, like, oh, let me pay attention.
So even with the language of a Biggie or whoever,
they can still deliver messaging that makes you get in
the right direction.
Speaker 4 (28:51):
Lauren says, what's the line?
Speaker 7 (28:53):
Right, So you're ignorant, I'm trying to get to say. Also,
what what what I have to be mindful of as
well is respect politics, not even not not even that,
because that's a whole nother relation, right, But it's more.
(29:16):
I realized that it's way more productive across the board
and for my my own energy and space is instead
of spending time talking about the trash, talking about the
things that I don't like and I think we're all
guilty of, we talked about the negative. But I'm trying
(29:37):
to be more mindful, like even in my in my
conversations with hip hop, be mindful of well instead of
talking about the same thing, which is the negative let
me spend time highlighting.
Speaker 5 (29:47):
What I like or like what I love about hip hop?
Speaker 7 (29:52):
That right, Mum, I'll write hard for Mumbo Fresh all day,
but even just that, like yeah, thinking about you know,
Norman Sonist got I finally reposted on on Instagram like
seeing these cats I believe really need to have shine?
What stuff complaining that they don't have shine? I got
social media, Like, now I can actually, you know, give
(30:15):
shine to those And I've got I got a following,
I've got a voice, you know, I've got integrity, uh,
a reputation for integrity going for me, So like why
not just use that and spend more time, you know,
speaking about the giving love to the things that make
me feel good.
Speaker 1 (30:34):
But I also think I have evolution to right, you know,
because I went to Hampton. When I used to drive
to Hampton, I'm listening to noise because it's keeping me up.
Speaker 5 (30:40):
What what what? And I'm thinking I'm the biggest what.
But then when you get a little older, you'd be like,
that's a little noise, right, let me tell about.
Speaker 3 (30:50):
I feel like listening to it when I'm working up
from the South workout. Yeah, but I also grew up
on goodie mob.
Speaker 4 (30:58):
You know, and I think, you know, it's we've got
more of a balance, right as we get older than one,
we've got we've been exposed to more music, right, So
it's it's a little different now, you know. I mean,
like they still in the in the throes of what's hot,
you know what I mean. The how we access music
is different now because they're just like yo, you know,
point click right, and it's not necessarily about what's on
(31:19):
the radio. It's about what they want to listen to,
which is they've got direct access to that.
Speaker 6 (31:24):
You know, can don't wan to as from a woman's perspective,
you know what I find interesting, right, you know, we
have these conversations, but I will never forget Snoop Dogg
and DMX's versus. Right when they did their versus, I
think it was during COVID, and I remember thinking, oh,
this is going to night that boy they finally listened
to Snoop and DMX and it's gonna be a woke
cancel fest on Twitter. But there was people in the comments,
(31:46):
the same people I usually see trying to cancel.
Speaker 5 (31:49):
People loving it.
Speaker 6 (31:51):
Right, Yeah, but how does that make you feel knowing
you came up in that era of the nineties.
Speaker 3 (31:54):
Is it conflicting that you.
Speaker 2 (31:56):
Know, not at all?
Speaker 8 (31:57):
And I'm right in the middle with them in terms
of number I won, the N word and just this
whole idea of music and what it represents because I
know so I love Wu Tang and when I listen
to them, I get like a good energy out, not
just work out, but when something goes wrong sometimes that
music allows you to let stuff out, you know that
you just couldn't get out in the day when you
(32:18):
were with your peers, or when you're on the streets,
you just in the car loud with it. And then
I also think it's how were we brought up and
what do we bring to the table? So the N word,
for example, I mean, I don't know how you were
introduced to itever, but that's shaped probably what the word
means to you, and same with me probably saying to you.
And we all have different things that we bring to
(32:39):
the table, just culturally, and I think that just shifts.
And I'm a firm believer in the First Amendment, like
all the way, because once you start saying no here
and no here, then I'm giving somebody else the authority
to say no to me one day too, and I
don't want that precedent. I don't want them saying, well,
you can't say this and you can't say that just
because of the content of it or the context of it.
Speaker 2 (33:01):
We don't like it at all.
Speaker 8 (33:02):
It's like when they try to bring up brack lyrics
when they go to jail in court. Right, I mean,
that doesn't make any sense. We all have the same
equal First Amendment rights and you should fight for them
and use them equally.
Speaker 1 (33:13):
Let me ask you a question. Yeah, TikToker yesterday, I
seen it online. She said the N word, right, she
got fired from her regular job.
Speaker 2 (33:20):
Oh, this was the girl who was cooking that young lady.
Speaker 5 (33:24):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (33:24):
And then in her comments she was.
Speaker 3 (33:25):
Also white by the way, Yes, critical, But this is.
Speaker 5 (33:31):
Where I'm gonna close it.
Speaker 1 (33:33):
She said on her TikTok that she didn't apologize because
it was her first right amendment to say what she
wanted to say, and she shouldn't have got fired. What's
your thoughts on somebody like that it is her first
right amendment?
Speaker 2 (33:42):
Yeah, but then there are three different rules.
Speaker 8 (33:44):
There's First Amendment rules on TikTok, there's First Amendment rules
at her work, and then that's her own rules of
what she believes about the N word, and all of
them conflicted, and she got exactly what she deserves. She did,
But then that's what happened. That's why you do have
to be careful with it, right. You can't be on
TikTok saying it. I mean, this is a good example.
Person person, No, no, you can't. So you just have
(34:05):
to really understand how to use the First Amendment to
So for example, if you're the KKK, you can walk
march anywhere in America, you just have to get the permit.
Speaker 2 (34:14):
You can't walk on your own. You have to follow
the rules. She didn't follow the rules. She she she
didn't follow her own hr rules at work, and that
was her problem.
Speaker 5 (34:25):
She did.
Speaker 1 (34:25):
That's right, Like you said, it's also where you came from, right,
because the N word was a sign of endearment, sure something.
It was that you know, you really didn't hear the
extremes of it until I went to Hampton in the South,
and you'll be like, oh, no, they're not saying it.
Speaker 4 (34:44):
As right, right, And that's right rightferent ways, and that's
sort of been part, you know, part of my argument
for a lot of people. It's a term of endearment
like it's love. There are more interactions that are using
the word that are about love and that are about disrespect.
So you know, and yes, we know the history of it.
We also know that that's mine.
Speaker 6 (35:06):
But I also grew up reading stuff like I grew up,
you know, Message to the Black Man by Elijah Muhammad
Bier Malcolm Max, a great book called From Niggas to God.
I think every black man in America should read that.
It's always been I've always been conflicted about using the work.
Speaker 3 (35:21):
Be cause I don't use it as a term. If
it did, right, I use it. I use when Chris
Rock showed me the difference, I use it for that,
right Right.
Speaker 7 (35:31):
There's a I think last time I was here, I
quoted doctor Daniel Black, and I'm gonna quote him again.
Speaker 5 (35:39):
He says, why should I borrow a word.
Speaker 7 (35:42):
From people who hate me when I'm trying to speak
love to my brothers and sisters. Right, So I go
back to uh to comrade, you know the term black
panther Party used Reggie Mason, you know, brought it back
up to me.
Speaker 5 (35:56):
So I've been on this this.
Speaker 7 (35:58):
Comrade campaign, like you know, if I'm trying to speak
love to my brother, will comrade, I get the idea
of you know, the N words, the term of endearment,
but it's a colonizer's word, so.
Speaker 4 (36:08):
Language colonized, so like like it's not our language. English
is not our language.
Speaker 5 (36:14):
Sure, but I'm not but I'm not going to use it.
Speaker 7 (36:16):
I I'm at the point in my life where I question,
what's the what's the sense in using a colonizer's word was,
which was a uh, intentionally derogatory word to describe us?
Why do I want to borrow that particular word and
go through the the hoops of Oh it's it's positive
so for me and just so just for me personally,
(36:37):
I'm I'm comrade, you know, and and I use it
in both scenarios.
Speaker 5 (36:42):
That's my comrade.
Speaker 3 (36:55):
Anytime you also said, we showed our coach out hip hop.
Speaker 4 (37:04):
And it's uh industry wise, it's sort of the bigger picture,
right because they did it the jazz like they co
opted it and used it for their own purposes.
Speaker 7 (37:17):
But there wasn't messages and jazz that were going to
have an effect. I mean, ye, black people see them.
Speaker 4 (37:23):
I mean yeah, I mean we sort ourself out. But
I also feel like, from a macro perspective, this is
going to be The civil rights movement created a lot
of opportunities and it shifted the mentality that made many
(37:43):
of us very passive. You know.
Speaker 3 (37:49):
Yeah, I feel like I integrated my people into a
burning house.
Speaker 4 (37:53):
Into a burning house, right, Yeah, we had it was.
Speaker 3 (37:55):
More of a sentive independence. Yeah, I get what you're saying.
Speaker 5 (37:59):
Mhm, people's.
Speaker 4 (38:07):
Man, my godfather, don't call me and be like young man.
I'm like, you know, yeah, like it's it's heavy, it's
a lot, and I'm like, ah, you got me a
pinch right now.
Speaker 2 (38:22):
I know what you originally said. You said that we
sold ourselves out.
Speaker 5 (38:25):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (38:26):
In terms of music on the podcast, yeah yeah.
Speaker 7 (38:29):
I mean even I mean, you know, there was a
term and hip hop artists talk about it when the
record labels say to them, this is what you have
to rap about, and this is what we're paying for
you to write.
Speaker 5 (38:39):
Right.
Speaker 7 (38:39):
So it's you know, and again I say, in a
lot of ways, we are generation. You know, we are
complicit in what we see, you know, the state of
hip hop.
Speaker 5 (38:52):
Uh in the younger generation. That's you know, we allowed
that for the dollars. I'm gonna get a T shirt
that says right.
Speaker 6 (39:04):
You know, we had when Snoop was here, This was
a few years ago. We had a conversation about that
because that's always been on my mind as I got noted,
like damn, see the Lord stuck it was actually right,
and Snoop said she was, but it was the way
she was coming at us.
Speaker 4 (39:21):
And again it's back to that First Amendment thing too,
you know what I mean, Like it's a layered conversation,
like you can't tell me I can, Like, where are
you gonna control my tongue like that? You know, I'm
an artist, Yeah, let me.
Speaker 8 (39:34):
Do what I do and so and telling yourself out
means such a different thing years ago than you know.
A lot of it had to do with people not
even being informed, right educated on what they could could
not do, their rights, whether it was publishing, whether there
was First Amendment rights, whether it was their right to
(39:56):
own a certain right. You know that they should have
owned advances. Now these days, people are smarter. So when
we say that people sell themselves out, I mean it's negative.
But along the way, you should be selling something right,
You should be you know, in the marketplace. You should
be the monopoly that you want to be in the process.
So I'm glad the times have changed, right, but it's
(40:18):
definitely different when we talk about who we are today.
We are more informed in terms of and so we're
making more decisions, which is which is a good takeaway
when we're looking back at what was happening in the nineties.
Speaker 1 (40:29):
But some of the times have you understand, Like we
had an artist up pit the other day. His name
was Rob four nineties from Louisiana, and he said he
signed a deal so he could get out.
Speaker 4 (40:39):
Of the hood.
Speaker 5 (40:40):
He knew that if he was still there it.
Speaker 1 (40:41):
Would be problems for him, his family's mother and all that.
So I had to do the deal to get out it.
Speaker 3 (40:46):
And I know even with.
Speaker 1 (40:46):
Hip hop back then, a lot of artists that's the same, right,
that was their only way out right. Their music was
great and they didn't know anything out of it, that's right.
So people consider that selling, selling their soul, selling themselves
out for them, they look like, look, I'm just trying
to get out the hoods on that's.
Speaker 2 (41:00):
Right, And if they had more information that would have
been better off. That's all.
Speaker 4 (41:03):
Access.
Speaker 2 (41:04):
Yeah, Access.
Speaker 3 (41:07):
Had a couple of questions.
Speaker 6 (41:08):
I want people to describe to the podcast, but when
it comes to TV and movies, do you have the
same discretion with the N word and the bware?
Speaker 5 (41:17):
Yeah?
Speaker 7 (41:17):
I mean I feel like if it's if it's you
mean in terms of using it, in terms of my
use of it or the industry's use of it both.
So I think I am I'm against the gratuitous use
of the words. Like, I understand all of the arguments
and all of the defending, but I think what's getting
(41:38):
lost is I'm referring to the gratuitous use of it. Sure,
we can talk all day about there are some circumstances
where that word is the only thing that really you know,
So I'm aware of all of that. But my my
issue was, I said, it's the gratuitous use.
Speaker 8 (41:57):
Of it, because I would imagine, right that if you
get a tight script that takes place in the nineteen sixties,
what else scripts don't have the word?
Speaker 5 (42:06):
Right?
Speaker 2 (42:06):
So right, that's that's different.
Speaker 8 (42:08):
And that's what we talk about a lot amongst the
three of us, is that it does have a place.
We can't just erase that of history, right, It has
a place you cannot do certain things without the word
coming up. It's just where you place it in your
own life, and that's where you play.
Speaker 5 (42:25):
But I can't go do an August Wilson play period, you.
Speaker 10 (42:32):
Know what I'm saying.
Speaker 5 (42:33):
So I get all of that.
Speaker 7 (42:34):
I think my issue is along with the I go
back to anti black messaging and our music, the gratuitous use.
Speaker 3 (42:42):
Of the N word.
Speaker 7 (42:43):
It's just you know, it's just for me. I'm just like,
you know, enough already, And again I said enough already.
But then I also go back to, you know, there's
so many incredible lyricists who have proven their pin game
is top notch, and I go, well, just like, elevate
the shit if all these corny motherfuckers are using nigg
(43:03):
and bitch in all of their.
Speaker 5 (43:04):
Lyrics and then don't elevate the shit like show them.
Speaker 10 (43:07):
And also when we're in our forties and fifties still
rapping the same shit we were wrapping in our twenties,
it's like that's not even you know, like like show
me some growth, right, like if you're not even giving
me any integrity in your art.
Speaker 4 (43:22):
An evolution evolution, yeah, and growth, And I like I
just can't and it's not feeding my soul.
Speaker 5 (43:27):
Can't do it.
Speaker 3 (43:28):
I get you.
Speaker 6 (43:29):
I want to ask you one question about respectability politics,
because you brought it up. The thing about respectability politics,
what if the person you're respecting is just truly yourself.
Speaker 3 (43:39):
You're just policing yourself.
Speaker 5 (43:41):
You're saying about respecting the white man.
Speaker 3 (43:43):
And the system, but trying to make the system comfortable.
I'm just respecting myself. Is that still respectability politics?
Speaker 7 (43:48):
So I bring it up all the time because whenever
we're talking about that, people go to, well, it doesn't
matter what people think about us, Like, I'm not even
talking about white people.
Speaker 5 (43:57):
I'm talking about our own level of self respect. So
that's all it is. That's always the take that I
bring up.
Speaker 7 (44:02):
But then it goes it always the conversation always leads
back to claiming respectability.
Speaker 2 (44:07):
Bok No agreed.
Speaker 8 (44:10):
You know, we have this conversation often where you know,
you go out, you're not even worrying about any other
race until somebody reminds you. So most of the things
you're doing, I'm just doing inside of myself. I'm not
really concerned about that. Echo what he says.
Speaker 4 (44:25):
I mean, those are very specific and nuanced situations. Each
its situational right. I think that we've got to center
ourselves first. I think it's time that, you know, we
put black folks at the front and really center how
(44:46):
we move and making our movements based around, uh, the
greater good, the respectability politics. It happens. It's a it's
a reality of American culture. And some people choose to
engage and some people don't.
Speaker 3 (45:07):
You don't seem like the type that's gonna have.
Speaker 5 (45:08):
To engage with.
Speaker 4 (45:13):
I love my people. I love my people.
Speaker 1 (45:16):
And well, the podcast Not All Hood is streaming everywhere,
and I appreciate you guys for joining us. Malcolm, Jamal Warner,
where you see Baraka and kandas Kelly. Thank you guys
so much.
Speaker 5 (45:32):
Morning.
Speaker 4 (45:32):
Wake that ass up in the morning.
Speaker 5 (45:34):
The Breakfast Club
Wake that ass up in the morning, The Breakfast Club Morning.
Everybody is the j n V. Just Hilaris Charlamage the guy.
We are the Breakfast Club. We got some special guests
in the building from the Not All Hood podcast. We
have Malcolm Jamore Warner where you see Baraka and Candice Kelly.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Welcome, Thank you, Hey, good to see you.
Speaker 3 (00:21):
How the brothers and sister feeling good?
Speaker 4 (00:24):
Life is good?
Speaker 2 (00:25):
Yeah, good morning.
Speaker 5 (00:27):
Yeah, that's about here, y'all just moved into.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
It was the first interview in our new studio. That's right. Wow, man,
I love the name Not All Hood?
Speaker 5 (00:35):
Nah.
Speaker 3 (00:36):
Who came up with that?
Speaker 5 (00:37):
That was what you'll see?
Speaker 4 (00:39):
Yeah, I don't even remember for real, for real, Like
I was just like, uh nah, Like Malcolm and I
have been talking about just the concept of the podcast
and how the diversity and who we are and also
who we're not, right, So I was like, nah.
Speaker 6 (00:57):
Nah, Yeah, it feels like that was some I say,
all black people from the hood.
Speaker 4 (01:02):
Nah exactly?
Speaker 6 (01:05):
Is it that where a lot of people come from
poor and disenfranchised environments, but we are not our environment?
Speaker 4 (01:11):
Like it's just that we come from a bunch of
different environments, you know, and I feel like, you know,
a lot of media to portraying us either like your
hip hop, you're your hip hop or pop culture right,
you know, and now we're more than that.
Speaker 7 (01:27):
It's funny that you actually said that, Charlotmane, because I
grew up in I grew up in La in the
jungle wow. And my mother used to say to me, Malcolm,
we live in the jungle, We're not of the jungle.
So she was very clear on me having my sights
(01:48):
further than just my neighborhood, which is why she put
me in theater. And it was always trying to find
things for me to do to keep me, you know,
from just going to school and just hanging out, you know.
But it was that it was a certain mindset that
you know, she instilled in me, like Okay, yeah, we're here,
but you know, this doesn't have to define us.
Speaker 8 (02:09):
And you know what, we are often recognized before we
enter into any room and judge right, and sometimes you
get the question that you know means you really don't
belong here.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
So when that comes in.
Speaker 5 (02:21):
Can help you?
Speaker 3 (02:22):
Yeah?
Speaker 5 (02:22):
Yeah?
Speaker 8 (02:22):
Right?
Speaker 2 (02:22):
Can I help you?
Speaker 5 (02:23):
Right?
Speaker 8 (02:23):
Right?
Speaker 2 (02:24):
Can I help you? Or have I seen you be
here here before? Or what are you doing in this neighborhood?
Speaker 3 (02:29):
Yes, that's right. One, that's the one.
Speaker 2 (02:30):
Right, What are you doing this neighbor This is my neighborhood.
Speaker 3 (02:33):
Why are you here?
Speaker 6 (02:34):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (02:34):
Why are you jogging here?
Speaker 8 (02:35):
Right?
Speaker 2 (02:36):
That you know that you just happened to my father.
Speaker 8 (02:37):
He would jog in the neighborhood and all the white
neighbors would stop him when we first moved in, and
they would keep on stopping him. This back in the seventies.
So he finally just went to the police station and said,
I just need to introduce myself so that when you
guys stopped me, you know who you are, and it stopped.
But that's kind of an example of what it means
when people perceive you beforehand, and what you have to
do to go outside of the box to keep improving
(03:00):
who you are over and over again. So this really
is just an ongoing conversation that we have, Malcolm, let's
call a safe space, which it is just to say
really what we want about anything about our experiences in America.
And that's really kind of key to it too. We
have people that are from diverse backgrounds, whether they're from
the Caribbean or whether they're from all you know, Africa,
(03:22):
but you come to America and there's kind of a
thread And those are the types of stories that we're
sharing to really change this mass narrative that's already out
there about us.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
Creator shift is.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
A term hood negative though when people say hood sometimes
it comes off as negative. I don't take it as
a negative term. Is it a negative term?
Speaker 5 (03:39):
No?
Speaker 7 (03:39):
And I think, you know, part of the you know,
the idea of not all hood is hood is not
a negative term. Hood is part of the community. Like
when we speak of the black community, we always tend
to refer to it as if it's a monolist that's right,
but they are all these different lanes to the black community,
all these levels, all these different lanes, and oftentimes we
(04:02):
don't have a space where we can actually, you know, discuss,
acknowledge and deal with with all of those levels, all
those lanes. So the hood is not a bad thing.
We're not all you know, we're not Yes, we are hood,
but we're not all hood. And the media, and I
think part of it is the media tends to put
more focus on one aspect of the black community. Thus
(04:24):
we get all the stereotypes and preconceived ideas.
Speaker 4 (04:27):
And hood comes from like neighborhood, neigh right, and Dayla
said it. You know, they called the hood because we're
not neighbors anymore, you know what I mean, a lot
of times we're not communicating with each other, right, but
we we're trying to change that.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
I did get that question a lot though you have
been a podcast. Isn't hood negative?
Speaker 8 (04:46):
So I understand where you're coming from. But just like
they said, it's a neighborhood. I mean, I live in
a place where I'm next to a lot of Indian neighborhood,
Indian neighborhood, Jewish neighborhood.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
You can still call it the hood. People also associate
the word.
Speaker 8 (05:00):
Hood we're just us, which really, yeah, we're black.
Speaker 2 (05:04):
So it's just one of those things.
Speaker 8 (05:05):
It's kind of some damage that the media, the pop culture,
the news has done and really trying to define who
we are.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
Yeah, I never took it as negative. It was always
going back to the hood, to mean, I'm going back
home to my neighborhood, right exactly wherever it was. I'm
going to play basketball in the hood, which was my neighborhood.
You know, I mean, I never took it as oh
my gosh, it's a place. No, I never took it
at that. I know a lot of people do, but
that was always just like going home, you know.
Speaker 8 (05:28):
Yeah, yeah, And you know, we were talking about this yesterday.
That also when we talk about being African American, we
talk about the trauma that's associated, like that's really all.
Speaker 6 (05:37):
You know.
Speaker 8 (05:37):
We have diabetes and high blood pressure and we're dying
and the infomortality rate. But we're happy people too. But
we make it to the news when it's bad. You know,
we may often make it to the news when it's bad.
And so that's another thing that I think this podcast does,
I think for the three of us, is just show
the joy and what it's like being black and because
(06:01):
of the things that are going out there in this
twenty twenty.
Speaker 3 (06:04):
Four Lord, every yeah, how did the three of you
all come together? How did y'all get together? We will
do the left yo, everything on you.
Speaker 5 (06:16):
Right?
Speaker 7 (06:16):
What you SA and I have been friends for she's
for a minute, a long minute.
Speaker 5 (06:21):
Twenty plus years.
Speaker 7 (06:23):
We used to both be at the National Back Theater
Festival in Winstern, Salem and where you and I met
in nineteen ninety nine and we had put on the
first poetry jam there and that turned out to be
one of the biggest attractions at the theater. We used
to call the midnight Poetry Jam. So after you know,
(06:45):
all day of theater, you know, in every imaginable performance
space in the city, then people would come back to
the to our venue and we would pack out at
midnight poetry Jam. It would just be open mic starting
at midnight and we'd go to like two two thirty.
Speaker 4 (07:03):
And it was a big attraction, Yeah festival, and then
we just kept hanging out yeah Yeah. And then I
know link with Cannis from I was doing sort of
community organizing and sort of it was a a event with.
Speaker 2 (07:24):
Ye Yeah.
Speaker 4 (07:26):
In Morris Town, New Jersey, and we connected there just
sort of yeah linked And when macol I decided we
were going to do this podcast, we're like, yeah, we
need some different voices.
Speaker 8 (07:39):
In yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
Yeah.
Speaker 8 (07:41):
And I do a lot of work, a lot of
commentating on various mostly legal cases. I feel in for
Roland Martin to Roland Martin unfiltered, and so I'm always
running my mouth and when I got on with them,
I think I ran my mouth for them to say.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
You know what, you want to keep talking with us.
I was like, I actually do.
Speaker 8 (07:58):
So, you know, really in that first conversation, we talked
about anything from and word to talking to music. I mean,
we were just on for a long time and it's
just a nice everybody was testifying, you know what I.
Speaker 2 (08:09):
Mean, it really was.
Speaker 8 (08:10):
It was just a good way to connect and get
to know each other. And the conversation has been going
on ever since.
Speaker 7 (08:15):
But the dope things. When Way and I first started talking,
we're both older fathers. So the initial idea was to
do a podcast from the perspective of older black fathers.
So when we first met with Candis, it was as
a producer.
Speaker 2 (08:31):
Yeah, to produce this show, that's right.
Speaker 5 (08:33):
And then we had that meeting, was like, you know,
ninety minutes, this is the show.
Speaker 7 (08:37):
Yeah, We're like, we need to add candas as a
host and expand the concept from just you know, the
black father perspective.
Speaker 5 (08:45):
And it turned into yeah, and.
Speaker 8 (08:46):
I think your wife because your wife is in the
background like that.
Speaker 3 (08:51):
Yeah, what are some of the topics you guys will
be discussing.
Speaker 4 (08:55):
Black fatherhood an older fathers with younger children?
Speaker 5 (09:03):
Yeah, how you guys handling that?
Speaker 4 (09:06):
Yo? What did yours old your youngest so youngest. Only
we only have one because I got.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
A two year old Sol, and then I got a twenty.
Speaker 3 (09:15):
Two year old.
Speaker 4 (09:20):
Fifty three, I got a nine year old.
Speaker 5 (09:22):
I got six, he got four.
Speaker 6 (09:24):
I'll be forty six and a couple of weeks my
youngest two.
Speaker 3 (09:27):
I got a two year old, five year old, eight
year old, and fifteen.
Speaker 5 (09:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (09:30):
Yeah, so y'all started around when we started.
Speaker 5 (09:33):
Yeah, I'm fifty three and my daughter just turned seven.
Speaker 3 (09:36):
Okay, okay, so.
Speaker 4 (09:37):
You'll have a conversation we're talking about, you know what
I mean, those those days where they be on, on,
go go, you know what I mean, and you gotta
just wrap your energy up and and make it happen,
you know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (09:50):
Crazy you say that.
Speaker 6 (09:51):
My homeboy told me that a long time ago, beause
you know, all my homeboys had kids way younger.
Speaker 3 (09:55):
Than I did, right, And they was like, man, you
wait till you thirty plus forty to have kids. You're
gonna be running around you need he's gonna be hurting, Like, no,
he won't. Yes, they are exactly, but that.
Speaker 2 (10:04):
Doesn't some good come with that?
Speaker 8 (10:06):
You being older, so speak yeah, you know, being a
father and not being twenty one I've been having growth
yourself that you have to go through.
Speaker 6 (10:13):
Oh yeah, my last my two youngest get a version
of me that did not exist ten years ago.
Speaker 5 (10:20):
Ten years ago.
Speaker 7 (10:21):
You know, I spent more of my adult life in
long term relationship, more years of my adult life in
long term relationships than not. And my wife and I
have been together eight and a half years and not
more than two days go by that I don't give
thanks to the universe forgiving me the wisdom and fortitude
(10:43):
to have waited as long as they did. A lot
of people are like, he's never gonna get married, And
I think at some point I probably thought.
Speaker 4 (10:48):
Like we said, have these conversations like yo, they looking
at us like we you know, damnage goods like to mean,
you thirty done and you don't got no kids? Not married?
He got a problem?
Speaker 5 (10:58):
Yeah, I mean, it's the best thing, and for me,
it's the best thing I could have been.
Speaker 7 (11:01):
I would not have I definitely would not have been
as effective a husband and father had I done this
any earlier with anybody else.
Speaker 6 (11:10):
That is such a great conversation you never hear men
have Like that's a conversation you always hear, you know,
women have, but so you actually waited like you were
actually waiting for the right.
Speaker 7 (11:19):
Know how many bullets.
Speaker 9 (11:26):
I've been since thirteen on TV, since thirteen, you know,
I neoled my way out of a lot.
Speaker 6 (11:37):
At your circumstance was different, though, because you didn't know
if people wanted to be with you all they wanted
to be with you.
Speaker 5 (11:43):
Know what I mean?
Speaker 7 (11:43):
There was that because I've been doing it for so long,
I've been really blessed with a great sense of discerning,
So that was never my issue.
Speaker 5 (11:53):
To be completely transparent.
Speaker 7 (11:55):
My thing about marriage was like, yo, I'm not getting
married and then given a chick half of my stuff
because I messed up. So I was very clear that
even though there were situations that you know, we're really
you know, pressuring if you will, you know, like that
kind of marriage, I was like nah, because I knew me.
(12:16):
I knew that I wasn't going to because I wasn't
I wasn't given half of my trap because because I messed.
Speaker 3 (12:21):
Up about you.
Speaker 4 (12:23):
It was about just being patient, like I know me,
and I know that, like everybody's gonna be able to
deal with me. As a community organizer who like really
understands that the people around me that are close to
me are gonna be okay. My work in life is
to make sure that other people are gonna be okay.
So sometimes I'm I'm a little hard on them people
(12:45):
that are close. Right, I'm gonna get out and like
they're gonna have to take a back seat sometimes. Right,
That was part of it. And the big part is
like raising my child, the idea of like me getting
married and having a child.
Speaker 5 (12:57):
You gotta be.
Speaker 4 (12:57):
Special, man, where you gots to be special? So I
love you, Shelley.
Speaker 8 (13:05):
With one show where we have these two and Lamar
Rutcker and I just sit back and I listen. It's
like there could be some people that are taking notes,
some women that are taking notes because they really I
was like, this is some good, Like you said, I
don't hear that a lot, just talking about fatherhood and
just the humility and how proud they are and then
all the rules and lessons that they learned in a.
Speaker 2 (13:27):
Long way when they were dating.
Speaker 5 (13:29):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:30):
Yeah, it really was no taking moment.
Speaker 3 (13:32):
It was good.
Speaker 4 (13:32):
You guys have boys or girls? Girls?
Speaker 3 (13:34):
Oh yeah, yeah, girl.
Speaker 2 (13:36):
I said that was kind of suspect.
Speaker 6 (13:38):
Girls different different, it's way different.
Speaker 4 (13:41):
He has four girls I got four girls.
Speaker 3 (13:45):
You know, I love it. Yeah yeah, I love it,
and I deserve it.
Speaker 4 (13:49):
You know, they say, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 5 (13:52):
All of it. How does that change you? Having girls?
Speaker 1 (13:56):
I got four girls, Charlamagne's four girls, How does that
change you as a father?
Speaker 5 (13:59):
I got two off, but some girls changing.
Speaker 7 (14:02):
So I asked the universe for a girl first. So
even before, even before conception, we were very clear we
were having a girl. And I know that I needed
a girl first to kind of ease me into it
because I've you know, I'm I have a pretty good
idea of what kind of father I would be. So
I needed a girl to kind of you know, slow
(14:24):
me down and and and warm and softs me up,
if you will. So for me raising my daughter, I
came into fatherhood already with a certain maturity and uh,
you know, certain understanding of male female dynamics, you know,
(14:48):
and with a girl, all of that starts with the father.
So I've always since she came, since I literally pulled
her out of my wife, I've been focused on, you know,
instilling in her the kind of love that she is
not going to have to go out in the world
(15:08):
and try to find, treating her with a level of
respect at nine months old, that she will that that
that kind of loves normalized.
Speaker 5 (15:23):
Right.
Speaker 7 (15:24):
That's always been my biggest thing. Like we see these
girls out here who don't have a great relationships with
the fathers, and you know, through our lifetimes we've been
with a lot of them, Right, So I knew that
the for me, the biggest gift that I can give
my daughter is a sense of self so when she
(15:46):
goes out into the world, she is not easily influenced
by her surroundings. So since she was like two years old,
you know, someone says to her, Oh, you're so pretty,
you're so cute, You're so beautiful, She'll say thank you.
Speaker 5 (16:00):
When I'm smart too.
Speaker 4 (16:01):
That's how we run it.
Speaker 7 (16:02):
That's the normalization I want her to have.
Speaker 5 (16:05):
In terms of how she sees herself in characters.
Speaker 4 (16:07):
Absolutely, you see, yeah, same thing, Like you know, it's
a it's a humbling space. Giving my daughter like a
different kind of vocabulary that's empowering to her so that
when she interacts, she knows she she walks and talks
from posician power.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
Absolutely, you know, yet, hold on, can you speak of
that candid?
Speaker 8 (16:31):
Yeah, Yeah, I come from a family of three girls.
And my father, I mean really just the king of
all things. They know all about my father. I told
a story already today about my father, you know what
I mean. So that is very infused in me and
my mother too, don't get me wrong, but since we're
talking about fathers, all everything that he poured into me,
and you know, sometimes you're doing something and you're like, oh,
(16:52):
that's my dad, what I did right there, that's my mom.
Like you can you know when they've poured into it,
when you see you doing things that are just like
what they did, and you don't even realize it. So
you don't even realize what the kids see and don't see.
But really, my parents really allowed me to see all
of the right things they really did, and parents generally
are always right, I mean really like it might be
(17:15):
twenty years down the line we.
Speaker 4 (17:17):
Try and my daughter reminds me that bye bye.
Speaker 2 (17:24):
Maybe not Yeah.
Speaker 5 (17:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 8 (17:27):
It really is powerful to have a powerful father, to
have a presence all the time, even when they're gone,
still there.
Speaker 1 (17:35):
I think the funniest thing for girl dads is humbling, right,
meaning I was never in the cheerleading, a dance or
any of those sports. But now when I take my
daughters today, better get out, not be doing a dance mood.
Speaker 4 (17:55):
Right.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
It takes you out of that that ego place where
it's like now I'm gonna talk that now, right, I'm safty.
Speaker 3 (18:00):
Yeah yeah.
Speaker 5 (18:01):
I think when my daughter was born, I found myself.
Speaker 7 (18:03):
Like crying all the time, went over like just simple
ship be like I had that touches me.
Speaker 4 (18:13):
Like baby feet and baby dimples.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
I was like, what is Oh, they're so cute?
Speaker 4 (18:23):
Man, opened up a whole other world.
Speaker 6 (18:26):
It's probably a stupid question. Way, but you hate poetry,
you laugh thing baracca?
Speaker 3 (18:30):
You related?
Speaker 5 (18:31):
No relation? No wow, no relation.
Speaker 4 (18:34):
Okay, that's a loute to the arc. I mean all
the great things you know and to know the l
o g absolutely know Mary.
Speaker 1 (18:46):
Now Father's Day is around the corner, do you, guys?
As Father's Day important to you guys as much?
Speaker 5 (18:50):
And for you? Is it important as you?
Speaker 1 (18:53):
Because for myself I just just want to chill fall
that don't need too much. This is a little barbecue
the kids around. That's all I care about this day?
Speaker 5 (19:00):
What is it for you guys? This?
Speaker 8 (19:06):
Well, So my father is passed a couple of years ago.
He died during COVID but you know, thank you so
much and so but you know my husband, so you know,
I was, you know this morning, all right, we're doing dinner, right,
We're doing the house?
Speaker 2 (19:20):
Are we doing that? We're going out?
Speaker 6 (19:22):
You know.
Speaker 8 (19:22):
It's one of those things where I just like, as
I tell my husband all the time, you know what,
it's not the it's not the birthdays of the Christmas
or there or the holidays that society has said. Just
be good to me on a regular Tuesday will be good.
But I do remember as my father and he got older,
it was really important because everybody was all over the place.
Everybody goes in their own lives. So it was good
(19:45):
to come back and give him that gift of time
because at some point, you know, you don't need.
Speaker 2 (19:51):
Socks or clothes or TV or car. You don't need that.
Speaker 8 (19:55):
What you want is stuff that's really free. Time, respect, love,
your energy, your opinion, all of that. So it's good
to come together for all of those things that cost
no money, especially as people get older.
Speaker 5 (20:08):
But that wants to scratch off ticket you.
Speaker 8 (20:13):
But you know what he wants to see you when
you give it to him, you know what I mean,
it's not the ticket, Yeah, but if.
Speaker 2 (20:20):
He wins, you know, you don't want that out.
Speaker 6 (20:23):
I'm talking about you afraid of being too honest or
too vulnerable on these podcasts because in this era people
get very loose. As you've seen, if people have a
certain image of you, you even care about that.
Speaker 5 (20:36):
That's so it's interesting.
Speaker 7 (20:36):
So you know, I've said that in interviews that this is,
you know, the most vulnerable and I've always been pretty
transparent in my art and my poetry and music.
Speaker 5 (20:46):
But I don't I don't worry about it.
Speaker 7 (20:49):
I got a good taste of it just this week
because we had our you know, first episode on Monday,
and we were having conversation about the N word and
I had a you know, I made it's really interesting
how many people we're not listening to what I was
saying and took my comments as I was, you know,
(21:09):
I was hating on j Cole. So it's things like that.
And then the way the Instagram, the art of dialogue.
Speaker 5 (21:19):
And other Yeah, the way they worded that's the where
were in right, Like, So I was.
Speaker 7 (21:24):
Like, ah, right, this is the reason why I stopped
commenting on i G first thing in the morning.
Speaker 3 (21:30):
Malcolm mo say he stopped listening to J Cole.
Speaker 1 (21:33):
Yeah, let's play the listen certain the clip here, so
people undertake.
Speaker 5 (21:38):
What what are you talking about?
Speaker 3 (21:39):
Are you playing it in context?
Speaker 5 (21:40):
Context?
Speaker 1 (21:40):
Because I'm sure we don't have the clip off the
other clip.
Speaker 5 (21:43):
No, so we're in context.
Speaker 7 (21:44):
Okay, okay, dig it, dig it. So so many people,
you know, they just ignore the fact that I said,
I love J Cole and I said that most of
my favorite mcs you know, are guilty of the same
thing we're talking about, you know, perpetuating, perpetuating anti black
(22:04):
messaging in our black music.
Speaker 6 (22:06):
So that was really my point. I don't understand. That's
when they lose me. How is that anti black? How
is that N word? Saying you don't like the N
word anti black messaging? Isn't the N word anti black?
That's what I'm saying. My perspective is so much of
our black music.
Speaker 7 (22:23):
Today, like you take the Dope Beats Away and you
just listen to the lyrics lyrically, it's anti black message,
you know what I'm saying. And we talk about you know,
so much of you know, hip hop today that's trash
and whatnot. But you know, as I said, before they
grew up listening to what we were listening to. Right,
(22:44):
So we are complicit in, you know, the parts of
hip hop today that we don't like because they grew
up listening to us listening listening to the content is
the same. The scale set is just whack, right, which
is what makes it stand.
Speaker 4 (22:58):
Out, as they didn't listen to what we were listening to,
you know what I'm saying. But I think that we
also had a broader We listened to music when there
was more than just hip hop. Hip Hop was not
the the juggernaut of music that it is now, right, Okay,
(23:19):
we like, yeah, jazz like like you would, you know,
like we was rocking the salt hall notes, you know
what I mean, and all these other things, right, you
know what I mean? Yeah, Like we had these a
lot of other influences that I think the youth of
today don't necessarily have aren't necessarily being uh promoted in
(23:41):
terms of yeah, in terms of balance.
Speaker 6 (23:43):
Yeah, I get exactly what you're saying, because even the
other genres now are hip hop.
Speaker 4 (23:47):
Right what I'm saying, Like, you know, it's countries, a
little bit of hip hop, you know what I mean.
Speaker 7 (23:52):
And so much of it, so much of the hip
hop that gets the shine. You know, it's it's the
anti black message, but that's it's very rarely. There are
not many hip hop songs that are speaking love to
our people. Most of it is very threatening.
Speaker 4 (24:08):
But is that the artists or is that the industry?
Both okay, and.
Speaker 5 (24:14):
The end the result is the same.
Speaker 7 (24:15):
The the the psyche on young black boys and girls,
there's the same whether it's the weather, but.
Speaker 4 (24:25):
If it's young black boys and girl that's on the parents.
Speaker 5 (24:28):
Yeah, sure, but all parents don't. All parents.
Speaker 7 (24:32):
There's a certain luxury that you and I have in
terms of the time that.
Speaker 5 (24:37):
We and our wives can spend with our daughters, right, but.
Speaker 7 (24:40):
Everybody, everybody in all families don't have that. So we're
not talking about, uh, the psyche of young black kids
who have their parents very involved in their lives and
showing them balance. We're talking about the ones who.
Speaker 4 (24:53):
Were Let's hold them accountable to the messages. My fault
this is that this is like.
Speaker 3 (25:04):
I don't think you would you say J Cole had
the anti black message.
Speaker 7 (25:07):
No, so so for me because Nigga has become you know,
it's become the staple in hip hop, like it's got
to be a nigga bitch. That's why I said in
that clip, I think there should be a moratorium on
both of those words in hip hop because it's it's
at this point, it's corny, it's lazy.
Speaker 5 (25:24):
Everybody is using it.
Speaker 7 (25:26):
So let's like, you know, you know, there are so
many brilliant writers and lyricists out there that it's like,
come on, let's let's let's stop our game. We don't
have to keep doing if everybody's doing it, then come
on do something different, you know. So my thing with
with with J Cole, it just I just got to
a point where I got tired of, you know, hearing
(25:47):
inward and being called inWORD in every hip.
Speaker 5 (25:49):
Hop song I'm listening to.
Speaker 7 (25:52):
And I mentioned J Cole because I love J Cole
and he's such an and an incredible lyrics that when
I hear him just gratuitously use either those words, I'm like, ah,
I mean kind of you know that I have to
tune out. Yeah, doesn't mean doesn't mean I like J
Cole or respect his artistry, his his pen game any less.
(26:17):
I just go all right, I'm d I gotta tune
out because it's not it's not doing it's not bringing me,
it's not feeding me.
Speaker 6 (26:24):
So what about the album, like because and this is
the album that I say in the future is gonna
be two of the most important albums of all time.
Miss Kendrick Lamar, Mister Moralean in the Big Steps jay
Z four four four. The things that they're discussing on
this album, black men going to therapy, black men doing
right by the women. You know, uh, issues with our
father daddy, issues that we fix. Like, to me, those
(26:46):
themes are bigger than the language that they using. Even
you look at somebody like Tupac. To me, Tupac's themes
were bigger than the language he was using.
Speaker 7 (26:56):
People keep saying that about Tupac, but like, and I
don't want to get into a whole thing about about
but yeah, I listened to his I mean listen to
his There's there's dear Mama, Brenda's got a baby, keep
your head up.
Speaker 5 (27:12):
And then everything else is.
Speaker 1 (27:15):
Not everything this changes this You got me got a
bunch of but you know, you know what this conversation
sounds like. It sounds like you know where you're younger
and your father said, oh you listen to that, hippiie
hoppity rap. There's a lot of positivity, all the positive
artists out there that are spitting right but right people
listening to music. Those same artists had the same problem.
If you think about ty lib Quality never.
Speaker 5 (27:37):
Got on radio.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
Most Death never got on radio. Tribe called Quest hardly
got on radio. We talked about a lot of those
positive rappers. It was the same thing back then.
Speaker 4 (27:45):
Those artists might have a record or too.
Speaker 1 (27:48):
Tell him did get on radio too. He did a
record to jay z Hot on the single just to
get by record, that's but it took him a long
time to get on record. Most definim didn't get really
on radio, to what miss fab fabulty. So a lot
of the things that we're talking about was the same thing.
Coming rarely got on the world, you know what I mean.
But it's the same thing. It's the same thing as
(28:10):
what we push Like back then, who's on radio?
Speaker 6 (28:12):
Biggie t I, you know that name had social records
with socially redeeming.
Speaker 5 (28:19):
Value, but the records on radio.
Speaker 6 (28:22):
Like my dad used to always try to get me
to listen to the Honorable Minutes to Lewis Farrakon and
I would sorta reluctantly. When I heard Biggie say deep
like the mind of Farrakhn, I'm like, oh, that's the
brother my daddy's always trying to get me.
Speaker 5 (28:35):
So now I really like he was speaking to you.
Speaker 6 (28:38):
Yeah, d farra CON's a prophet. I think you ought
to listen to it, like, oh, let me pay attention.
So even with the language of a Biggie or whoever,
they can still deliver messaging that makes you get in
the right direction.
Speaker 4 (28:51):
Lauren says, what's the line?
Speaker 7 (28:53):
Right, So you're ignorant, I'm trying to get to say. Also,
what what what I have to be mindful of as
well is respect politics, not even not not even that,
because that's a whole nother relation, right, But it's more.
(29:16):
I realized that it's way more productive across the board
and for my my own energy and space is instead
of spending time talking about the trash, talking about the
things that I don't like and I think we're all
guilty of, we talked about the negative. But I'm trying
(29:37):
to be more mindful, like even in my in my
conversations with hip hop, be mindful of well instead of
talking about the same thing, which is the negative let
me spend time highlighting.
Speaker 5 (29:47):
What I like or like what I love about hip hop?
Speaker 7 (29:52):
That right, Mum, I'll write hard for Mumbo Fresh all day,
but even just that, like yeah, thinking about you know,
Norman Sonist got I finally reposted on on Instagram like
seeing these cats I believe really need to have shine?
What stuff complaining that they don't have shine? I got
social media, Like, now I can actually, you know, give
(30:15):
shine to those And I've got I got a following,
I've got a voice, you know, I've got integrity, uh,
a reputation for integrity going for me, So like why
not just use that and spend more time, you know,
speaking about the giving love to the things that make
me feel good.
Speaker 1 (30:34):
But I also think I have evolution to right, you know,
because I went to Hampton. When I used to drive
to Hampton, I'm listening to noise because it's keeping me up.
Speaker 5 (30:40):
What what what? And I'm thinking I'm the biggest what.
But then when you get a little older, you'd be like,
that's a little noise, right, let me tell about.
Speaker 3 (30:50):
I feel like listening to it when I'm working up
from the South workout. Yeah, but I also grew up
on goodie mob.
Speaker 4 (30:58):
You know, and I think, you know, it's we've got
more of a balance, right as we get older than one,
we've got we've been exposed to more music, right, So
it's it's a little different now, you know. I mean,
like they still in the in the throes of what's hot,
you know what I mean. The how we access music
is different now because they're just like yo, you know,
point click right, and it's not necessarily about what's on
(31:19):
the radio. It's about what they want to listen to,
which is they've got direct access to that.
Speaker 6 (31:24):
You know, can don't wan to as from a woman's perspective,
you know what I find interesting, right, you know, we
have these conversations, but I will never forget Snoop Dogg
and DMX's versus. Right when they did their versus, I
think it was during COVID, and I remember thinking, oh,
this is going to night that boy they finally listened
to Snoop and DMX and it's gonna be a woke
cancel fest on Twitter. But there was people in the comments,
(31:46):
the same people I usually see trying to cancel.
Speaker 5 (31:49):
People loving it.
Speaker 6 (31:51):
Right, Yeah, but how does that make you feel knowing
you came up in that era of the nineties.
Speaker 3 (31:54):
Is it conflicting that you.
Speaker 2 (31:56):
Know, not at all?
Speaker 8 (31:57):
And I'm right in the middle with them in terms
of number I won, the N word and just this
whole idea of music and what it represents because I
know so I love Wu Tang and when I listen
to them, I get like a good energy out, not
just work out, but when something goes wrong sometimes that
music allows you to let stuff out, you know that
you just couldn't get out in the day when you
(32:18):
were with your peers, or when you're on the streets,
you just in the car loud with it. And then
I also think it's how were we brought up and
what do we bring to the table? So the N word,
for example, I mean, I don't know how you were
introduced to itever, but that's shaped probably what the word
means to you, and same with me probably saying to you.
And we all have different things that we bring to
(32:39):
the table, just culturally, and I think that just shifts.
And I'm a firm believer in the First Amendment, like
all the way, because once you start saying no here
and no here, then I'm giving somebody else the authority
to say no to me one day too, and I
don't want that precedent. I don't want them saying, well,
you can't say this and you can't say that just
because of the content of it or the context of it.
Speaker 2 (33:01):
We don't like it at all.
Speaker 8 (33:02):
It's like when they try to bring up brack lyrics
when they go to jail in court. Right, I mean,
that doesn't make any sense. We all have the same
equal First Amendment rights and you should fight for them
and use them equally.
Speaker 1 (33:13):
Let me ask you a question. Yeah, TikToker yesterday, I
seen it online. She said the N word, right, she
got fired from her regular job.
Speaker 2 (33:20):
Oh, this was the girl who was cooking that young lady.
Speaker 5 (33:24):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (33:24):
And then in her comments she was.
Speaker 3 (33:25):
Also white by the way, Yes, critical, But this is.
Speaker 5 (33:31):
Where I'm gonna close it.
Speaker 1 (33:33):
She said on her TikTok that she didn't apologize because
it was her first right amendment to say what she
wanted to say, and she shouldn't have got fired. What's
your thoughts on somebody like that it is her first
right amendment?
Speaker 2 (33:42):
Yeah, but then there are three different rules.
Speaker 8 (33:44):
There's First Amendment rules on TikTok, there's First Amendment rules
at her work, and then that's her own rules of
what she believes about the N word, and all of
them conflicted, and she got exactly what she deserves. She did,
But then that's what happened. That's why you do have
to be careful with it, right. You can't be on
TikTok saying it. I mean, this is a good example.
Person person, No, no, you can't. So you just have
(34:05):
to really understand how to use the First Amendment to
So for example, if you're the KKK, you can walk
march anywhere in America, you just have to get the permit.
Speaker 2 (34:14):
You can't walk on your own. You have to follow
the rules. She didn't follow the rules. She she she
didn't follow her own hr rules at work, and that
was her problem.
Speaker 5 (34:25):
She did.
Speaker 1 (34:25):
That's right, Like you said, it's also where you came from, right,
because the N word was a sign of endearment, sure something.
It was that you know, you really didn't hear the
extremes of it until I went to Hampton in the South,
and you'll be like, oh, no, they're not saying it.
Speaker 4 (34:44):
As right, right, And that's right rightferent ways, and that's
sort of been part, you know, part of my argument
for a lot of people. It's a term of endearment
like it's love. There are more interactions that are using
the word that are about love and that are about disrespect.
So you know, and yes, we know the history of it.
We also know that that's mine.
Speaker 6 (35:06):
But I also grew up reading stuff like I grew up,
you know, Message to the Black Man by Elijah Muhammad
Bier Malcolm Max, a great book called From Niggas to God.
I think every black man in America should read that.
It's always been I've always been conflicted about using the work.
Speaker 3 (35:21):
Be cause I don't use it as a term. If
it did, right, I use it. I use when Chris
Rock showed me the difference, I use it for that,
right Right.
Speaker 7 (35:31):
There's a I think last time I was here, I
quoted doctor Daniel Black, and I'm gonna quote him again.
Speaker 5 (35:39):
He says, why should I borrow a word.
Speaker 7 (35:42):
From people who hate me when I'm trying to speak
love to my brothers and sisters. Right, So I go
back to uh to comrade, you know the term black
panther Party used Reggie Mason, you know, brought it back
up to me.
Speaker 5 (35:56):
So I've been on this this.
Speaker 7 (35:58):
Comrade campaign, like you know, if I'm trying to speak
love to my brother, will comrade, I get the idea
of you know, the N words, the term of endearment,
but it's a colonizer's word, so.
Speaker 4 (36:08):
Language colonized, so like like it's not our language. English
is not our language.
Speaker 5 (36:14):
Sure, but I'm not but I'm not going to use it.
Speaker 7 (36:16):
I I'm at the point in my life where I question,
what's the what's the sense in using a colonizer's word was,
which was a uh, intentionally derogatory word to describe us?
Why do I want to borrow that particular word and
go through the the hoops of Oh it's it's positive
so for me and just so just for me personally,
(36:37):
I'm I'm comrade, you know, and and I use it
in both scenarios.
Speaker 5 (36:42):
That's my comrade.
Speaker 3 (36:55):
Anytime you also said, we showed our coach out hip hop.
Speaker 4 (37:04):
And it's uh industry wise, it's sort of the bigger picture,
right because they did it the jazz like they co
opted it and used it for their own purposes.
Speaker 7 (37:17):
But there wasn't messages and jazz that were going to
have an effect. I mean, ye, black people see them.
Speaker 4 (37:23):
I mean yeah, I mean we sort ourself out. But
I also feel like, from a macro perspective, this is
going to be The civil rights movement created a lot
of opportunities and it shifted the mentality that made many
(37:43):
of us very passive. You know.
Speaker 3 (37:49):
Yeah, I feel like I integrated my people into a
burning house.
Speaker 4 (37:53):
Into a burning house, right, Yeah, we had it was.
Speaker 3 (37:55):
More of a sentive independence. Yeah, I get what you're saying.
Speaker 5 (37:59):
Mhm, people's.
Speaker 4 (38:07):
Man, my godfather, don't call me and be like young man.
I'm like, you know, yeah, like it's it's heavy, it's
a lot, and I'm like, ah, you got me a
pinch right now.
Speaker 2 (38:22):
I know what you originally said. You said that we
sold ourselves out.
Speaker 5 (38:25):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (38:26):
In terms of music on the podcast, yeah yeah.
Speaker 7 (38:29):
I mean even I mean, you know, there was a
term and hip hop artists talk about it when the
record labels say to them, this is what you have
to rap about, and this is what we're paying for
you to write.
Speaker 5 (38:39):
Right.
Speaker 7 (38:39):
So it's you know, and again I say, in a
lot of ways, we are generation. You know, we are
complicit in what we see, you know, the state of
hip hop.
Speaker 5 (38:52):
Uh in the younger generation. That's you know, we allowed
that for the dollars. I'm gonna get a T shirt
that says right.
Speaker 6 (39:04):
You know, we had when Snoop was here, This was
a few years ago. We had a conversation about that
because that's always been on my mind as I got noted,
like damn, see the Lord stuck it was actually right,
and Snoop said she was, but it was the way
she was coming at us.
Speaker 4 (39:21):
And again it's back to that First Amendment thing too,
you know what I mean, Like it's a layered conversation,
like you can't tell me I can, Like, where are
you gonna control my tongue like that? You know, I'm
an artist, Yeah, let me.
Speaker 8 (39:34):
Do what I do and so and telling yourself out
means such a different thing years ago than you know.
A lot of it had to do with people not
even being informed, right educated on what they could could
not do, their rights, whether it was publishing, whether there
was First Amendment rights, whether it was their right to
(39:56):
own a certain right. You know that they should have
owned advances. Now these days, people are smarter. So when
we say that people sell themselves out, I mean it's negative.
But along the way, you should be selling something right,
You should be you know, in the marketplace. You should
be the monopoly that you want to be in the process.
So I'm glad the times have changed, right, but it's
(40:18):
definitely different when we talk about who we are today.
We are more informed in terms of and so we're
making more decisions, which is which is a good takeaway
when we're looking back at what was happening in the nineties.
Speaker 1 (40:29):
But some of the times have you understand, Like we
had an artist up pit the other day. His name
was Rob four nineties from Louisiana, and he said he
signed a deal so he could get out.
Speaker 4 (40:39):
Of the hood.
Speaker 5 (40:40):
He knew that if he was still there it.
Speaker 1 (40:41):
Would be problems for him, his family's mother and all that.
So I had to do the deal to get out it.
Speaker 3 (40:46):
And I know even with.
Speaker 1 (40:46):
Hip hop back then, a lot of artists that's the same, right,
that was their only way out right. Their music was
great and they didn't know anything out of it, that's right.
So people consider that selling, selling their soul, selling themselves
out for them, they look like, look, I'm just trying
to get out the hoods on that's.
Speaker 2 (41:00):
Right, And if they had more information that would have
been better off. That's all.
Speaker 4 (41:03):
Access.
Speaker 2 (41:04):
Yeah, Access.
Speaker 3 (41:07):
Had a couple of questions.
Speaker 6 (41:08):
I want people to describe to the podcast, but when
it comes to TV and movies, do you have the
same discretion with the N word and the bware?
Speaker 5 (41:17):
Yeah?
Speaker 7 (41:17):
I mean I feel like if it's if it's you
mean in terms of using it, in terms of my
use of it or the industry's use of it both.
So I think I am I'm against the gratuitous use
of the words. Like, I understand all of the arguments
and all of the defending, but I think what's getting
(41:38):
lost is I'm referring to the gratuitous use of it. Sure,
we can talk all day about there are some circumstances
where that word is the only thing that really you know,
So I'm aware of all of that. But my my
issue was, I said, it's the gratuitous use.
Speaker 8 (41:57):
Of it, because I would imagine, right that if you
get a tight script that takes place in the nineteen sixties,
what else scripts don't have the word?
Speaker 5 (42:06):
Right?
Speaker 2 (42:06):
So right, that's that's different.
Speaker 8 (42:08):
And that's what we talk about a lot amongst the
three of us, is that it does have a place.
We can't just erase that of history, right, It has
a place you cannot do certain things without the word
coming up. It's just where you place it in your
own life, and that's where you play.
Speaker 5 (42:25):
But I can't go do an August Wilson play period, you.
Speaker 10 (42:32):
Know what I'm saying.
Speaker 5 (42:33):
So I get all of that.
Speaker 7 (42:34):
I think my issue is along with the I go
back to anti black messaging and our music, the gratuitous use.
Speaker 3 (42:42):
Of the N word.
Speaker 7 (42:43):
It's just you know, it's just for me. I'm just like,
you know, enough already, And again I said enough already.
But then I also go back to, you know, there's
so many incredible lyricists who have proven their pin game
is top notch, and I go, well, just like, elevate
the shit if all these corny motherfuckers are using nigg
(43:03):
and bitch in all of their.
Speaker 5 (43:04):
Lyrics and then don't elevate the shit like show them.
Speaker 10 (43:07):
And also when we're in our forties and fifties still
rapping the same shit we were wrapping in our twenties,
it's like that's not even you know, like like show
me some growth, right, like if you're not even giving
me any integrity in your art.
Speaker 4 (43:22):
An evolution evolution, yeah, and growth, And I like I
just can't and it's not feeding my soul.
Speaker 5 (43:27):
Can't do it.
Speaker 3 (43:28):
I get you.
Speaker 6 (43:29):
I want to ask you one question about respectability politics,
because you brought it up. The thing about respectability politics,
what if the person you're respecting is just truly yourself.
Speaker 3 (43:39):
You're just policing yourself.
Speaker 5 (43:41):
You're saying about respecting the white man.
Speaker 3 (43:43):
And the system, but trying to make the system comfortable.
I'm just respecting myself. Is that still respectability politics?
Speaker 7 (43:48):
So I bring it up all the time because whenever
we're talking about that, people go to, well, it doesn't
matter what people think about us, Like, I'm not even
talking about white people.
Speaker 5 (43:57):
I'm talking about our own level of self respect. So
that's all it is. That's always the take that I
bring up.
Speaker 7 (44:02):
But then it goes it always the conversation always leads
back to claiming respectability.
Speaker 2 (44:07):
Bok No agreed.
Speaker 8 (44:10):
You know, we have this conversation often where you know,
you go out, you're not even worrying about any other
race until somebody reminds you. So most of the things
you're doing, I'm just doing inside of myself. I'm not
really concerned about that. Echo what he says.
Speaker 4 (44:25):
I mean, those are very specific and nuanced situations. Each
its situational right. I think that we've got to center
ourselves first. I think it's time that, you know, we
put black folks at the front and really center how
(44:46):
we move and making our movements based around, uh, the
greater good, the respectability politics. It happens. It's a it's
a reality of American culture. And some people choose to
engage and some people don't.
Speaker 3 (45:07):
You don't seem like the type that's gonna have.
Speaker 5 (45:08):
To engage with.
Speaker 4 (45:13):
I love my people. I love my people.
Speaker 1 (45:16):
And well, the podcast Not All Hood is streaming everywhere,
and I appreciate you guys for joining us. Malcolm, Jamal Warner,
where you see Baraka and kandas Kelly. Thank you guys
so much.
Speaker 5 (45:32):
Morning.
Speaker 4 (45:32):
Wake that ass up in the morning.
Speaker 5 (45:34):
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