July 7, 2025 • 47 mins
In this episode of The 3 Parallels Podcast, Dr. Jason Branch sits down with Dr. Julie Cosenza to explore who they were, who they are, and who they are becoming. Julie reflects on pivotal moments from their undergraduate years to present day, sharing personal insights that shaped their understanding of identity, race, and culture.They discuss early experiences with race relations, unpacking the impact of white privilege, white fragility, and the myth of white civility. As a non-binary, queer person, Julie also opens up about navigating gender identity, embracing queer theory, and the freedom that comes with choosing authenticity over external validation.Through the lens of lived experience, Julie touches on their learning disability, colonial history, and the role of diversity, equity, and inclusion in both personal and professional spaces. With a deep sense of empathy formed by living on the margins, they offer space for others to grow, learn, and unlearn.This episode is a reminder that truth can be personal, and transformation begins with the courage to face it.
🎯 3 Listener Challenges:
Think About a Shift
Reflect on a moment that changed how you see race, identity, or culture.
Ask and Listen
Ask someone how they identify and what pronouns they use. Just listen and respect their answer.
Notice Your Privilege
Pay attention to a time when things felt easier for you than others. Ask yourself why.
This episode is brought to you by our amazing sponsor:
J Branch & Associates: Schedule your free 15 minute consultation by going to www.drjbranch.com; call or text (404) 436-2540
Connect with The 3 Parallels Podcast:
Instagram: www.instagram.com/3parallelspodcast
Download the 3 Parallels Music
Playlist: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/2DCvaDp1wWypO59l1kearH?si=sy0X9tMcSNumk4ym-VZ9LQ
Don't forget to subscribe, rate, and review the show on Spotify, IHeart, Apple Podcast, and YouTube. Your feedback helps us inspire more listeners like you!
Get your copy of the Gator Scales Journal on Amazonhttps://www.amazon.com/Gator-Scales-Journal-Jason-Branch/dp/B0DPXLXZWC
Gator Talk: Every Friday via Zoom at 9am PST/12pm EST Join the conversation every Friday starting today on The 3 Parallels Podcast Post Show Q&A Session called Gator Talk.
When: Every Friday Where: Battlecat Studios (Zoom)
Zoom Link: https://alliant.zoom.us/j/4044362540
Meeting ID:404-436-2540
Time: 9:00am PST/ 12:00pm EST
🎯 3 Listener Challenges:
Think About a Shift
Reflect on a moment that changed how you see race, identity, or culture.
Ask and Listen
Ask someone how they identify and what pronouns they use. Just listen and respect their answer.
Notice Your Privilege
Pay attention to a time when things felt easier for you than others. Ask yourself why.
This episode is brought to you by our amazing sponsor:
J Branch & Associates: Schedule your free 15 minute consultation by going to www.drjbranch.com; call or text (404) 436-2540
Connect with The 3 Parallels Podcast:
Instagram: www.instagram.com/3parallelspodcast
Download the 3 Parallels Music
Playlist: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/2DCvaDp1wWypO59l1kearH?si=sy0X9tMcSNumk4ym-VZ9LQ
Don't forget to subscribe, rate, and review the show on Spotify, IHeart, Apple Podcast, and YouTube. Your feedback helps us inspire more listeners like you!
Get your copy of the Gator Scales Journal on Amazonhttps://www.amazon.com/Gator-Scales-Journal-Jason-Branch/dp/B0DPXLXZWC
Gator Talk: Every Friday via Zoom at 9am PST/12pm EST Join the conversation every Friday starting today on The 3 Parallels Podcast Post Show Q&A Session called Gator Talk.
When: Every Friday Where: Battlecat Studios (Zoom)
Zoom Link: https://alliant.zoom.us/j/4044362540
Meeting ID:404-436-2540
Time: 9:00am PST/ 12:00pm EST
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Welcome back to the Three Pair of Leves podcast. What's
your hosts the Doctor Jason Branch, Well, we'd rediscover who
we once were, we embrace who we actually are, and
we make room for the better versions of ourselves. So today,
as y'all know, whenever I bring family on, we have
us a ball. So I'm bringing in family and the
reality is we have these conversations anyway. I'm just choosing
(00:23):
to allow y'all in. In today's guests. I got somebody
for y'all. Listen, grab your Gator Skills journal if you can.
If you can't understood, you might be driving, cooking, doing
other things, and that's fine.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
Take mental notes.
Speaker 1 (00:38):
Okay, you can do that. You always got access. So
today's guest is Julie Consenza. Now let me tell you
about Julie before we jump in. Julie and I met
at Alliance International University some time ago, and we were
actually giving keys to a mentor program.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
That we decide we're fin to ride this thing the
way we want.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
And it was just this or organic connection and we
just saw each other, we saw felt understood each other
in different ways different parts of the globe, and we
work really well together.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
Because we see us in what we do and what
we do.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
We're passionate about to help other people, and we just
found a way to be who we are. So I
decided I gotta let Julie in on the entire world
and whoever's willing to listen. So, ladies and gentlemen, I
present to you today the most illustrious doctor. Julie consids of,
welcome to the show, baby.
Speaker 3 (01:32):
Thank you, thank you. It's good to be here. Yes, indeed,
it's a great introduction.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
Listen, we ain't playing.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
We ain't playing. I had to let him know. I
had to let him know. So I need you all
to be mindful. Y'all gonna get hitting the head with
a honeybunb throughout the show. I just need you to know.
Julie's gonna drop some gems, gonna drop some jewels, gonna
hit you in the mouth with the most loving way possible.
So much knowledge and lived experience, and this is part
of the reason that I was able to bring her
(02:01):
on the show, bring them onto the show because the
knowledge base, the expertise related to the lived experience of
who they once were, who they are, who they are becoming.
So with that said, what's your story, what's your journey?
What would you like to share with the listeners related
to just an introduction of you. I gave a piece
of an introduction. But who would you like to say
you are to the listeners?
Speaker 3 (02:22):
Who would I like to say? I am? So? I
am a person who identifies as white, gender queer, sex queer,
a person with a disability. I have a learning disability,
and I have a good story about that too, because
we were talking about another story my first one of
my first classes in undergrad So, and I was born
(02:45):
and raised in California, and I have a wonderful, beautiful
partner and a cat. So that's pretty much min me
in a nutshell. So in when I went to undergraduate school. So,
I grew up in Lafayette, California, which is very, very
affluent and white. And so I went to Chico State.
(03:08):
And I really wanted to study theater at first, so
first theater arts, and then I went into multicultural and
gender studies. So I did two degrees. And we were
talking about you, who was I in an undergrad It
(03:28):
was a very different person than who I am today.
And so one of the things that you and I
were talking about the other day was how did I
kind of get to where I am around consciousness, around race, sexuality, gender, class,
socioeconomic status, religion, citizenship, all of those wonderful disability Like,
(03:52):
how did I kind of develop, you know, who I
am today and where I'm going to go in the future.
So I think I think starting with some of the
paradigm shifts that I will admit that I, you know,
didn't know. And I think one of the things that
really helps people move from one phase to the other
(04:12):
in their lives and their developmental paths is these paradigm shifts.
And paradigm shifts are not comfortable. They're not you know,
like a hot tub and some bubbly champagne.
Speaker 2 (04:26):
That's not paradigm shift.
Speaker 3 (04:28):
That's privilege. That's sitting in your privilege.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
Yeah, so you've already opened the door. You've already opened
the door. So let's go to the basement.
Speaker 1 (04:36):
And for the listeners, for the movies with listeners, the
basement is where our heart lives. That's where the emotions are,
That's where the darkness and the secrets and the things
that we don't talk about is usually locked in the basement.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
Julie has already opened the door.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
For us to go down here and have some conversations
about their lived experience and upbringing in paradigm shifts. So
I would love to dive into the parallels the paradigm
from where you were to where you were able to
develop into from a class an undergrad if you could
share with us that story, and please feel free to
share as much detail as you like to help people
(05:10):
understand shifts and change and you being able to experience
a shift and change from that class, tell us about it.
Speaker 3 (05:17):
Yeah, thank you. So I think the conversation started with, well,
why I enjoy talking to white people about race and
what kind of strategies do I use? So I use
strategies to kind of help, not help, but support people
white people to see outside of that of their privilege,
(05:39):
outside of the white bubble. And I grew up in
the white bubble, so I can I have that space?
So so you asked, like, what would what was something
that you would use in these conversations. So when I
took my first sociology class, and it was sociology of
you know, I think of I don't even know a
sociology class, we were talking about people of color and
(06:02):
I had never heard the term people of color before.
I think it was I went to high school and
or I went to college in nineteen ninety seven. It's
when I started. So just to give you a sense
of when we were talking, so I in class, I
was like trying to be engaged. I said colored people
in class, and I had no idea like, so then
(06:27):
the teacher stopped the class and you know, said, you know, hey,
there's a difference between saying people of color and colored people.
And it was such a moment because I didn't even
realize I said it, but she was looking at me
and I'm like, I must have said that. So that
was a moment of I feel very uncomfortable right now.
(06:50):
And so it was it was a place where you know,
I had to really kind of sit back and say, like,
I don't know anything. I don't know if you could
swear on.
Speaker 1 (06:59):
This, I.
Speaker 3 (07:01):
Don't know, but I don't. I just don't know. Like
it was a really humbling moment of Man, I got
a lot to learn. And then an interesting story about
that class too is that I grew up in special
education and when I went to college, I was like,
I'm this new person. I don't have to go to
special ed classes anymore. And I'm in college, and so
(07:23):
somebody in the class asked for a note taker, and I,
with dyslexia learning disabilities, that is the accommodation that I
usually get as a student I could get. I didn't
do it in college because I was like, I'm in college.
I don't have to do any of these accommodations. I
got it all over and so I volunteered to do
(07:43):
note taking. And it was just two classes, and they
came back and said, we can't read your notes. We're
asking for somebody else to be a note taker. Like
this makes no sense. You have basically have no business
taking notes. That's kind of how I heard it, but
like that's really really what happened. And I was like, oh,
another kind of like there's a shift. I kind of
(08:07):
like remember your place. So those two things were like
a little humbling for me.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
Wow.
Speaker 3 (08:13):
And that was like the first bang right off. The
first class in undergrad was was that experience.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
So it sounds like you were you got two huge
living or lived experiences related to race, race relations and
just not knowing, just just not aware, not aware at all,
even though you've gone through life as long as you
did as far as you did, even in the state
of California, which can be, you know, considered a liberal state.
Speaker 2 (08:41):
You just weren't aware.
Speaker 1 (08:43):
And fortunately you had a professor that didn't mind, you know,
helping you become more aware by sharing truth. And then
the other side related to a learning disability or just
this was your norm. I can write notes, I can
read my own writing, I know my own stuff, but
how other people perceive it. It sounds like these were
real eye opening experiences that shifted your perspective about yourself. Yeah,
(09:06):
so I'm curious because a lot of times, a lot
of us, whenever we're challenged with something that goes against
our beliefs, rules of engagement, or lived experience, we are
defensive to it because somebody calls us out what we
don't know. We're defensive and sometimes we retreat or we
attack back. And it sounds like for you, it sounds
like you weren't defensive at all, but you were introspective
(09:29):
and reconsidered your perspective. That's what it sounds like happens.
So if you don't mind sharing, how did you do that,
like not take it personal, not get your feelings hurt
in it and go in a different direction, but you actually.
Speaker 2 (09:41):
Leaned in of Hey, this is something I don't know.
Speaker 1 (09:44):
I want to become more aware so I don't hurt
anyone or be disrespectful with the things that I say
that I may not know could be offensive to people.
Speaker 2 (09:50):
Could you tell us more about that?
Speaker 3 (09:52):
Yeah, I think that what you're kind of getting at
is white fragility, which I didn't know of at the time.
Speaker 2 (09:58):
Real quick, ooh, we already here.
Speaker 1 (10:01):
So if you could talk about white fragility and white privilege,
because there's a lot of listeners who aren't aware of
these terms, who've never heard of them before until this episode.
So if you don't mind, Okay, there's some definition behind
that too that would be helpful.
Speaker 3 (10:13):
So I'm not this is just Julie's definition. This isn't
like the definition of all definitions. It's not a capital
T truth.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
It's just from my perspective, I love the disclaimer. I
love it.
Speaker 3 (10:25):
I don't want to have to define thing. That's a
lot of responsibility I think for me kind of in
the context of basically, white privilege is unearned benefits. It's like,
because of the color of your skin, you're going to
have privilege. And it also is a legacy in our country.
So our country was founded on stolen land and enslaved
(10:49):
people to progress, you know, rather quickly through the industrial Revolution.
Because if you think about it now, like what if
I if somebody gave me and a free labor, of
course I would be wealthy. And so historically only white
people could have wealth, you know, vote have wealth, all
that kind of stuff. So there's a long legacy, systemic
(11:11):
legacy of privileging whiteness. And then you see that not
only in the US, but colorism also privileges lighter skin.
So there's and those two things are separate. But that's
how I kind of see white privileges just looking at
a white person. There's certain assumptions that a lot of
(11:32):
people make, like you can do the job, like you're
white person, Like what? And I fall into those too.
I had an employee or a person I was managing,
who was this white man and he wore suit and
I was like, all right, he's got his job, and
I'm pretty sure he's doing his job. And then I realized, like, well,
I just assumed that he was doing his job when
he wasn't. So there's like these moments of like we
(11:56):
all make these assumptions. So that's what I would say,
white privileges under earn benefits based on race. Yeah, And
then I would say white fragility is a response to
like what you were talking about, is that defensive response.
And this isn't to say I mean I know white
fragility because I've been there. You know, I've definitely had
a defensive response at some point, you know, and have
(12:17):
a lot of points. So it's the defensive response. It's
the like sometimes you have like white women tears, you know,
sometimes when you're like they're faced with questions about you know,
like that. I found that to be racist. Though you know,
there'll be this fragileness and I think a lot of
(12:37):
especially for white women, but a lot of people have
felt like, you know, now they have to take care
of this fragile white person when the attention is really
should be on the racist comment or on the harm
that was done, but those get marginalized. So the idea
of fragility, it's actually Robin DiAngelo wrote the book on it,
(12:58):
and I was privily enough for fortunate enough to take
a workshop with her, and so she really looks at
feminism and kind of whiteness and how they're actually like
male privileged and patriarchy and whiteness and how they're intertwined.
But that's basically the gist of like falling apart when called,
like not having that response like you're talking about of like, oh,
(13:20):
let's be introspective and I said something wrong, I could
have possibly have, you know, offended someone, So now I
will move forward on repair. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
So so just curious and I want to be mindful
of the listeners.
Speaker 1 (13:33):
It's it sounds like the right for this is my assumption,
the white fragility connects to the Karen mentality. You know
that we are all familiar or some of us may
be familiar with the Karen mentality. White women being addressed
of their privilege or acknowledge of what they're doing is
hurtful or mean.
Speaker 2 (13:51):
And it's been this.
Speaker 1 (13:53):
Community of white women who who have a hard time
with people of color being they are doing whatever it
is that they do. So it sounds like that's the
definition of white fragility. And for you, being a white
woman and choosing, because it's it's choice based, you chose
not to go in that direction, but to go in
(14:15):
a different direction that's more connected to the human experience.
Where did that come from for you to decide? Because
you don't have to, you know, having privileged, you don't
have to, But you decided I care more about me
knowing more, knowing differently to help versus what I know
is the only thing I need to know. I'm not
really worried about anything else. How did you make that
(14:36):
decision to choose to be Julie instead of Karen.
Speaker 3 (14:42):
Well, so let's unpack that a little bit. So let's
do it, Karen. The Karen concept isn't necessarily so white fragility.
I just use white women tears as an example. But
white fragility can happen to you know, any white person
now gender you know, gender binary, like it can happen
(15:03):
to anyone.
Speaker 2 (15:06):
There is.
Speaker 3 (15:06):
I think that white women have the savior complex, so
I think that there is more of of that, more
white fragility with white women. And I also don't identify
as a woman. I identify as sex queer, gender queer,
so non binary is a better kind of description for
my gender. So but I am a fab so I
(15:28):
was assigned female at birth and I'm often read as
a woman. So I'm in this place where I don't
really identify as a woman, but I'm read as a woman,
and I was socially conditioned as a woman. So yeah,
so I don't necessarily identify as a woman, which is
very interesting because I did so many years of women's studies,
(15:48):
women and gender studies that I, like now don't identify
as a woman. And then so what was the question?
Speaker 1 (15:58):
Yeah, like, we can just we can just take a
ride here, because where we're going, you're talking about being
non binary, and even with me giving you the title
of being a woman, like that's you know, that's my
ignorance as well, because I'm still learning about the LGBTQ
plus community. So you're teaching me as well as the
(16:18):
listeners at the same time, because a lot of times
we don't know, and what you just shared is an
opportunity for us to know, for us to learn that
we're not the same. It's not this you know, traditional
or to go back in time of it's just men, women,
black and white.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
It's way more than that.
Speaker 1 (16:35):
There's a lot of layers to it, and I really
appreciate you giving me space to be me and also
offer some knowledge that I didn't know about, you know,
and not allowing us to just talk over it like nah,
no woman, bro, we listen.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
I ain't your girl no more, you know.
Speaker 1 (16:55):
So I appreciate that because I'm here to learn as well.
This is just me, you know, providing the space for listeners.
Speaker 2 (17:02):
But I want to learn.
Speaker 1 (17:02):
I want to be better too, and there's so much
that we don't know. And I love having people on
with this knowledge base, especially their own lived experience, to
share this truth to help people see people differently. So
I appreciate you for that, and I, you know, because
because of our relationship, I know that I'm going to
continue to learn more because we you and I specifically,
(17:25):
can have conversations that we may not be able to
have publicly. And this podcast also serves as that place
that we can have conversations that we're just not able
to have publicly. Like there's a lot of people that
never heard about white fragility until today. There's people that
never heard about white privilege until today. Because these are
conversations that we may not have at the dinner table
some people have never had in their entire lives. And
(17:46):
they happen to be white, and they happen to be
non binary, and they happen to be this or that.
So that's why these conversations are so important. And I
appreciate you so much for being exactly who you are
and letting us know who the hell you are.
Speaker 2 (17:59):
And who you are not taught that shit, Julie.
Speaker 3 (18:06):
Yeah, I think that, you know, living on the margins
a little bit really helps with empathy. And I think
the question is kind of what made me want to change,
you know. It's like I want to change myself, I
want to change the world. And I think that, you know,
I struggled, and I I see other people, you know,
(18:27):
struggling even worse than I struggle, you know, So I
think I have empathy for that, and I think that
I've looked at enough of history. I think history is
really important of the of our country and of other
countries as well, and kind of looking at colonialism and
the ideological legacies of colonialism. So even though we don't
(18:49):
have maybe a specific colonial structure in our country, now,
we have had one, and there's lots of ideas and
legacies that are passed down. So kind of being able
to see that and having my own experience has really
helped me to kind of think like we've got to
make change, and it can't just be in the classroom.
(19:09):
It can't just be on a podcast or walking down
the street like it's everywhere. Especially with the new regime,
we have empower, we definitely need to be more active
all the time.
Speaker 1 (19:24):
And yeah, yeah, equity, this is just so powerful. Everything
you're saying is so powerful and you don't have to
and you chose this for the greater good because I'm
hearing the humanism, I'm hearing the care, the heart for people,
And I want to switch gears a moment because this
was really heavy on race. But now let's move to
(19:46):
this other level of gender where you were talking about,
you know, you were studying women's studies and feminism and
gender studies and to transition from that personally and professionally.
If you could share with us a story, because there's
a lot of listeners who have been where you once were,
or in a space where they don't know and it's like,
you know, society says I need to be this way,
(20:07):
but I feel something different. So if you could share,
you know, whatever you're willing to relate it to that
transition of this is how you used to live life
and then you saw things differently and you decided I
want to live life on my own terms. How did
you make that transition?
Speaker 3 (20:23):
Well, lots of factors. I think that I was fortunate to,
you know, take a lot of women's studies classes. My
master's is Women in Gender Studies, and then I have
a certificate in the doctorate level, so I got exposed
to a lot of gender analysis. So gender is a
(20:45):
lens that you can apply to anything. So you whenever
doing an analysis of a TV show, you could do
a RaSE analysis, you could do a gender analysis, you
could do a disability analysis. Like you can look through
a lens and hopefully you're doing all of them at
the same time, but you could look through a lens
and you know, make an analysis. So if you I
(21:07):
was trained to look through the world through a gender lens,
and I think that also having a partner who has
been very fluid to in their gender they also use
them pronouns, was very helpful. And I think that you know,
in some ways, you know, I will I'm I question
(21:30):
like I who is the like the authentic self? Like
am I really living an of is their one? I
challenge and question that all the time. I think it's
the queer theory in me. But was I, you know,
not happy like living as a woman, And like, am
I really not living as a woman now? Like everybody
(21:52):
recognized me as a woman, Like my parents will always
say favous little girl, she heard. They'll never use them pronouns,
and I'm okay with that, Like that's fine. They can, yeah,
like that's way too hard for them. And if they
want to like hang on to the favoritist little girl
(22:13):
in the whole world, then that's okay with me. You know,
I'm okay with that kind of part of me. But
like in my friends in work, people who know me,
I use they them pronouns, and I use positive reinforcement,
which I think you'll really appreciate to the best of
my ability. So I am flawed in so many ways.
(22:35):
But if like somebody says, like, for example, you use
she and then they in this podcast, so I would
say like, thank you. You know, I can see you're trying.
We're all gonna make mistakes, so I would like send
a little message and say like hey, thanks for being
conscious of pronouns. So that's like a way of using
that positive reinforcement because a lot of folks really like
(23:00):
they they they you know, will jump on people in
the moment, not to say that I haven't done that
and very frustrating times, but I try. So That's like
I say, I try to practice positive reinforcement, and I
think that that not only helps me be more positive,
but I think it helps other people who use they
than pronouns have an easier route in this world, it
(23:24):
easier path. But yeah, I don't know if I answer
the question. But I don't really have an authentic self,
Like I just like I don't. I didn't wake up
one day, but I just felt like I'm not really
identifying with women anymore. I don't like because when we
think of identifying, right, you read a book, like let's
pretend like we're reading a nonfiction and you know there's
(23:49):
a character that doesn't that is a Let's say I'm
reading about this woman character and like I could identify
with them, you know, in a certain way, so like
I could see myself with this as this woman character.
I've had similar experiences or you know, it's like, oh,
I really love this character. I so identify with him.
(24:09):
But I would read the book and be like, I
don't really identify with it, especially if it's a heterosexual woman.
I do not identify with any of that. I am
not caught up in this racking. I don't want to
be pregnant, like none of the things that I worry
about a heterosexual woman worry about, and like pantyholes. Like
so if I'm reading a book about a heterosexual woman,
(24:30):
I don't see myself there, even with a woman, you know,
I don't really see myself as a woman. So it's
a great way to kind of think. So then I
think that the more I read and the more I,
you know, started to look at the world through a
gender lens, I just didn't see myself like as a
woman analyzed as a woman, and I like, I prefer
(24:53):
gay man gay male energy is probably my favorite. I
say that kind of tongue in cheek.
Speaker 2 (25:01):
Gay Okay, just put it that way. I'm here for
all of it.
Speaker 1 (25:07):
And I appreciate your perspective and that positive reinforcement because
as a student of life myself, I'm still learning too,
and you set a precedent where you give space for
people to learn and grow. You know, now you may
have done things a little different in the past, but
where you are now it gives people a chance to connect.
(25:27):
So for me, with everything that you're sharing, it's allowing
me to be even more mindful and intentional about what
I do and what I say because I'm learning in
real time and you're providing me space to do that.
And to me, that's so powerful because oftentimes we don't
provide that space. And part of the reason we don't
provide that space because we feel some kind of way.
I feel disrespected or you know, you said my name wrong,
(25:49):
or you said my pronouns wrong, not recognizing that this
person may not know, they may not have done.
Speaker 2 (25:54):
It, they may not do it.
Speaker 1 (25:55):
I'm still learning it even with students that I'm working with.
So it's like, you have this perspective that's just about connection.
It's connectivity. Let's bring you in, come here, come on in,
let's have a conversation. And to me, that is so
powerful because that's how change can occur versus let me
(26:16):
bush upside the head with this truth real quick.
Speaker 2 (26:18):
So it's just change in doing it a different way,
jump in.
Speaker 3 (26:22):
You know, it's really fascinating. I think it takes both.
Like if I didn't have one of the other stories
that I shared with you as an undergrad is I
had a African American black woman who was a sociology teacher.
Another sociology teacher, I wrote this horrific paper that said,
you know, women have have it like worse off than
(26:45):
black people because there's more like women support systems, Like
was measuring like how many like things are for women
and how many things are like are for people of color,
bipop folk community, so like, because there's more resource for women,
I wrote this paper that said that women have it
like worse off, that we need to like focus more
(27:05):
on women, which is totally what I do not believe now,
by the way, the compolete opposite. But my teacher wrote
on that paper, this is an elitist argument and these
are all the things that are wrong, and that was
like whoa, Like she hit me over the head, but
I needed to be hit over the head. So it's
like these paradigm shifts. It's not in the hot tub
(27:28):
with bubbles, you know, with champagne. This is like outside
like bam bam bam with your head. And those are painful,
but they're so important, and I feel like I was
I had that space in my undergrad to kind of
ask these questions and be gently hit over the head,
(27:50):
you know, and be corrected in front of the class.
And like I had these moments where you were kind
of talking about it was like, you know, people held
a space for me, even if I deserved it or not,
they did. They help the space for me to grow.
So I think that I want to do the same thing,
but if necessary, I will do a paradigm shift, you know,
(28:12):
I will get out the.
Speaker 2 (28:16):
I love it.
Speaker 1 (28:17):
You are defining what it means to get hit in
the head with a honeybut that's what you're defining right now.
So I want to go back to something because we
already in the basement. We ain't left the basement yet.
We are deep, and I want to go a little
bit deeper. Back to a comment that you mentioned about
your parents, like they still have a hard time and
you feel as though they would never acknowledge your new
(28:37):
identity or different identity.
Speaker 2 (28:39):
So I'm assuming for you to be okay with.
Speaker 1 (28:42):
It, as in, they don't never have to call me
who I actually am or identify you're.
Speaker 2 (28:47):
Okay with it.
Speaker 1 (28:48):
And to me, that sounds like someone who's very self aware,
very authentic, and has done some work. It sounds like
You've done a lot of work on you. I'm curious
to learn more about this work because it sounds like
you've been in therapy, but I don't know, So just curious,
like where did you get this confidence and authenticity within
yourself of I identify the way I choose, whether you
(29:10):
choose to or not, I'm still okay.
Speaker 2 (29:12):
Even if it's my parents.
Speaker 3 (29:14):
Yeah, I think, you know, we really just have to
accept people where they are and what is it what's
more important for me? So my mom's had like major
surgeries all over her body. She had a stroke, which
impacts her memory. And so for my mom, I think
(29:36):
when not So Danny and I, my partner and I,
we use them pronouns in front of my parents. My
brother uses them, my you know, sister in law, my cousins,
it's pretty much everybody except for my parents and maybe
my aunt and uncle. So it's it's not like I
don't live, you know, it's like I'm out to them. Like,
but my mom when I when we had like our
(29:59):
first conversation around pronouns, she went the opposite direction. She's like,
I sent me pictures of myself and dresses as a kid.
She really like went heavy on this favoritous little girl
in the whole world, like he'll always be like she
just went to the opposite direction of like wanting so
bad and there's so many changes in her life. It's
(30:23):
like is that like what's And she's seventy so so
it's like what what do I want to get? Is
it's more important for her to try to use day
them and like humble around. I mean she can she
can barely remember my name.
Speaker 4 (30:42):
And also it's like if she wants to hold onto that,
I think that that's beautiful and that's how she loves
me and that's that's okay, And I've made peace with that.
Speaker 3 (30:52):
And my dad's not very My dad and I are
both super dyslexic, so he's never it's just like he's
never gonna be able.
Speaker 1 (30:58):
To do that, you know, a part of like so
you said the dyslexia prevents him from being.
Speaker 3 (31:05):
I think it's just like an unrealistic expectation. Why put
myself up for that? Like why I set myself up
for something that's like, yeah, I just want to enjoy
the time we have together.
Speaker 1 (31:16):
That is so powerful, that is so mature, Like you
are on a home and I'm so thankful to share
you with everyone, because for anyone listening, I need you
to hear what was just shared, like, well, we do
things that our parents are not okay with or have
a problem with or can't change a ship, like that's
their problem, it's not ours.
Speaker 2 (31:33):
And you said it so eloquently.
Speaker 3 (31:35):
Yeah, And I speak for myself. There's a lot of
trans people. There's a lot of you know, people who
there's more at stake for their existence than me, you know,
So I want to point out like I I'm okay,
it's it's not but I mean for people who are trans,
like actually, you know transgender, I think that there's a
(31:58):
lot more at steak with family and so I for me,
it's like yeah, they then pronouns like I can live
with that.
Speaker 2 (32:06):
I can.
Speaker 3 (32:08):
I love it, And it's been really beautiful to see
my cousins and my brother and my brother's on board
now and they struggle, but they're they're pretty good at it.
So there's some beautiful aspects and it's really nice. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:22):
I love it.
Speaker 1 (32:22):
I love it, And I love seeing you light up
talking about it, like you just lit up. I just
feel that just being proud, like man, they did it.
They see me, they accept me, they're acknowledging me, and
that's a beautiful thing. And I see it and I
feel that energy. So I really appreciate you sharing it.
I appreciate you allowing us in the basement. So let's
go back upstairs to the living room. So the living
room is where we live. This is where we are
(32:44):
in our most authentic space. So I want to ask
if you structured questions related to the living room. So
out of all these years of life, because you just
celebrated birthday, Happy birthday, thank you yesterday.
Speaker 2 (32:56):
Yes, yes, yesterday birthday.
Speaker 1 (32:58):
So out of all these years of life, I'm curious
to know what would you say you've learned about yourself
in all these years.
Speaker 3 (33:11):
I would say, there's the more you know, the more
there's so much you don't know.
Speaker 2 (33:20):
You drop in bar.
Speaker 3 (33:22):
I mean, I would just say, my goodness, like, I've
learned a lot, but there is so much I don't know. Yeah,
And it's it's so good to keep in mind that
even when I think I know something like I know it,
I probably don't really because time will change, you know,
(33:46):
more information will be discovered. And so I'm in a
space where I'm open to kind of thinking differently, like, well,
that didn't work, let's try something else.
Speaker 1 (34:00):
I love it all right, same question because what you're
talking about, this has been coming up often.
Speaker 2 (34:06):
What you're sharing, you know, even when you are.
Speaker 1 (34:10):
Certain, you just know for sure, then life has a
way of showing us different And what I consider that
a great friend of mine who's actually will be on
the podcast a little later, curiosity over certainty, not holding
on to what I truly believe that this is the
way it's going to be. This is way it always is.
He's like, no, that's a closed fist. But curiosity allows
(34:32):
you to open your hand to receive, and that's exactly
what you're sharing.
Speaker 2 (34:35):
You're so wise. Oh I just love it. I just
love it.
Speaker 1 (34:38):
Same question instead of related to you, what have you
learned about people in all these years? Yes?
Speaker 3 (34:49):
So I have always been kind of the rose colored glasses,
like people are going to be truthful, they're going to
be honest. And I think that because I have such
an honest close family that you know, we were. My
dad's like, never tell a lie. I'm like, okay, yeah, yeah,
I never tell a lie. And so I started discovering
the people tell lies. People have a dark side, people
(35:11):
have a shadow. I kind of a and that people
are not necessarily always going to do the right thing
or be as careful with what I've said, you know,
like with a conversation they can like mix it and
and so so I have a I think that for
(35:36):
other people, I'm a little less trusting, I think than
I was, and that that is actually a good lesson.
Speaker 2 (35:45):
You know.
Speaker 3 (35:46):
I think that that's probably like I was a little naive,
and I think that people have kind of showed me,
you know, don't don't trust, like, don't trust exactly what
they say all the time?
Speaker 2 (35:59):
Powerful? Powerful. What would you say is your proudest moment
or proudest accomplishment.
Speaker 3 (36:05):
It used to be being the most outstanding female athlete
in junior high I got the John d RC Award.
That was always my go to. But I think my
most prouder moment maybe I'll just have to stick with
that one. I can't think of a recent one.
Speaker 2 (36:26):
Okay, that works, whatever you say, go that works.
Speaker 1 (36:30):
So what's a word phrase, memory, or moment that has
stuck with you personally or professional?
Speaker 3 (36:37):
Personally a professional word phrase moment, Well, the more you know,
I learned the more.
Speaker 2 (36:42):
I don't know, that's my one that's quotable. That is quotable, Yeah,
for sure, though.
Speaker 3 (36:51):
I for professionally it's kind of the never email angry,
you know, always sit and be very careful about what
you write in your emails. I think personally is like
I was kind of talking about it with my dad,
like just don't tell I like live ethically, live with integrity,
and sometimes I think like I should call in sick
today when I'm not sick, and then I'm like, no,
(37:12):
I'm I want to do that. I'm gonna just take
a personal day. And so it's like little things like this.
Speaker 4 (37:18):
And thanks living honestly, it would probably be you know,
don't tell I, okay where it's okay.
Speaker 2 (37:27):
I love it. I love it.
Speaker 1 (37:28):
So three parallels, that's the name of the show. So
I want to ask your three parallels. How would you
describe who you were, who you are, who you're becoming.
Speaker 3 (37:38):
That's pretty easy. It was pretty naive. Didn't know a
whole lot, you know, didn't have I don't know if
it was street smarts, but just didn't have a lot
of like sense of the like a strong sense of
the world. And then just thinking back to my undergraduate years,
and then who I am now is a little bit
(37:58):
more streets smart, a little less trusting, but a little
bit more forgiving maybe than I was. And then where
am I going? I hope that I'm going to a
place where maybe I have a little bit more confidence
in my judgment of people and my judgment of myself
(38:22):
to really kind of hit my stride because I'm in
I'm in those years you know, where I'm supposed to be.
We're not supposed to be and I shouldn't say that,
but I'm in the years where I can be I
can you know, best career. You know that that's not
careers and money wise, but like fits with who I
am and value aligned and a really great career. And
(38:46):
I'm going to tie the knot maybe in January actually
because we're going to go to the courthouse sooner rather
than later due to the Supreme Court and the administry.
So we're going to try to do that before November twentieth,
All right, January twentieth. I mean, so I think in
(39:07):
my future I will have a wonderful, you know, life partner,
and I'm looking forward to sharing my life with them
in an honest and real, real way love it.
Speaker 2 (39:21):
I love it. Congratulations, congratulations to the both of you.
Job well done.
Speaker 1 (39:25):
Also, I have to bring this up because for a
lot of the listeners these moments are really important. They're
small and I consider them bread crones because they're so small,
but they're so big because of what they can develop into.
And you shared something earlier about you know, career and
what you should do, and then you corrected yourself or
you shifted perspective of it's not should it's what I
(39:49):
can do, what I could do, and that small change
in your wordplay change the whole ripple effect of whatever's
about to happen. It's going to happen now because it's
not a rule, it's not a law. It's what you're
attracting based off of who you're becoming. And it's going
to happen. And guess what, I get to watch.
Speaker 2 (40:05):
It, so I cannot.
Speaker 1 (40:07):
I cannot wait until it happens, because it's going to
happen because you said it. And for the listeners, these
are moments that you have to I will challenge you
to pay attention to because it's small, but it's big.
There is so much power in our words. And if
we're not careful, if we're not mindful, we can speak
on or speak about the things that we don't want
instead of speaking about the things that we we actually want.
(40:30):
That we get to a track. So can could versus
should changes everything. And I really appreciate you saying that,
so I had to point it out.
Speaker 3 (40:38):
It's funny because I learned that from you. Wow, conversation,
take shit out of that, Yes, indeed, and yeah you
tell me that.
Speaker 2 (40:54):
Wow, Julie Man, listen, listen. I can't handle all this.
I can't handle a lot of this. Thank you for
sharing that. This small, but it's so big. And I
saw it. I just saw it happen. I didn't know
all was responsible for that. I had nothing to do
with that. You did. I love it. I love it,
and thank you again, listeners. This is happening in a
(41:15):
real time. Okay, this is organic. It's come.
Speaker 1 (41:17):
You can put a chaquita banana or dolstickle on our
forehead because we are organic. All right, last question. Love
it So for the listeners, because you shared a lot.
We's in the basement, so you shared a lot about yourself.
I'm curious. We're curious to learn more, what's an interesting
fact about you or something that people wouldn't believe about you.
Speaker 3 (41:40):
I was trained as a mime and I love min
it's my favorite art form. I am not as good
as it I said I used to be because I
haven't practiced a whole lot. But I did theater and
I did physical theater, so I did dance, mime, choreography,
and I worked in a cabaret when I lived in
car Brbondale when I was doing my doctorate, and I
(42:03):
got to create all these fun mind shows. And I
think as a person who is dyslexic, I think a
lot of like the traditional ways of communication like words
and stuff and reading and writing and words, they've all
kind of failed me in some ways. But I've really
found a true kind of self expression in a physical theater.
(42:24):
So that's kind of a little known fact. That's unknown.
Speaker 1 (42:28):
Yeah, and I didn't even know that. Like, man, I
just want to, you know, paint my face and get
some gloves and get to work.
Speaker 3 (42:33):
Like what.
Speaker 2 (42:36):
Am I missing around? Get me out of this box?
You know what I mean? We have so much fun.
Speaker 1 (42:44):
We do this with anyway, rather y'all listening or not,
this is what me and Julie do anyway. So last
thing on this show we offer life work. Life work
is a little bit different than homework. Homework you take
it home, you do it, you turn it in, you
never remember it again. Life work, you take it home,
you do it. Your life can possibly change, and a
lot of things, majority of the things that you shared
on the show can be life changing if you're willing
(43:05):
to take in the information there. You drop a lot
of bread of crimes, you drop a lot of loaves
of bread or witding crimes. It was just straight up loads.
So if you can offer a keepsake to the listeners
some life workings, something that they could do, or things
that you want to share to help people shift or
change or reconsider, what would that be what comes to
(43:26):
mind for you?
Speaker 3 (43:32):
I would say that time really helps. So what feels
very intense in the moment. My partner would ask me
to do this Every once in a while they'll ask
will this matter in five minutes? Will this matter in
five hours, will this matter in five days? Will this
(43:53):
matter in five weeks? And will this matter in five months?
And so it's a really great way to say, you know,
this might feel like really intense, right now, but time,
time will will provide more answers. Time will you know,
heal kind of time will time will dissipate the kind
(44:16):
of intensity of the moment. So I think after making
a lot of mistakes and after like living all these
things and like, hey, guys survived that and like, oh man,
that was horrible, but I survived that. So just thinking,
like you know, like the more you make mistakes, the
more you have intense situations, the better you are at
handling them. And just kind of trust in time. That's
(44:39):
that's the best thing I could say.
Speaker 1 (44:41):
I think powerful, powerful, Yes, yes, because it's you, it's yours.
Also I appreciate you sharing all that is powerful. Also
on this show when we do shout outs, because you
shouted out Danny a couple times, I like to bring
the person that you shout out on the show. So
if you would like to invite Danny, and they are
more than welcome to be here to share their story,
(45:03):
their lived experience, whatever they want to share that five minutes,
five seconds, five moments already I'm I'm already interested. So
if Danny is interested, they are welcome to join the show.
And for the listeners, for people that want to connect
with you for whatever reason. Give you your flowers, get
your suggestions, take your mind course.
Speaker 2 (45:23):
Whatever it is that they want to do. How can
people get in contact with you?
Speaker 3 (45:28):
Well, I have a Gmail account. That's probably the best way.
I'm also on LinkedIn, but JS Cosenza C O. S E.
N Z A at gmail dot com. It's my email account.
If you want to email me, that's probably a good way.
(45:49):
I don't check it as much as I.
Speaker 2 (45:50):
Should, as you should, or you can as I could.
Speaker 3 (45:55):
There is as I maybe could, yes, check it a
little more.
Speaker 1 (46:02):
So if any of you reach out, like put something
in the subject line to make yourself stand out. Could
be something we talked about on the show, but something
to catch Julie's attention. If you catch the attention, you
might get a response. If you don't, you might get.
Speaker 2 (46:15):
Lost in the shuffle. So there is that.
Speaker 1 (46:18):
Any final thoughts, any final things you want to share,
you want to say for the listeners.
Speaker 3 (46:24):
I really enjoyed this conversation. Thanks for doing this. This
is a great podcast, and I really appreciate your time.
And I will definitely ask Danny if they're interested. I
think they would really enjoy this conversation.
Speaker 2 (46:36):
As well, yes, indeed, yes, indeed, we got another one.
We got another one. And I would love to.
Speaker 1 (46:40):
Meet Danny anyway, Like who's the lucky person to get
connected to you? And then y'all finna get married? Like
what Like, yeah, let's go, let's let's go Danny. So
this is a big shout out to Danny for all
of you listening to this episode. This has been another
phenomenal episode of the Three Parallels podcast with your hosts,
the Doctor Jason brand Be. We discover who we were,
(47:01):
we embrace who we are, we make room for who
we're trying to become. If this episode has been impactful
for you in any way, shape, form, or fashion, give
it away, share it. Don't keep this knowledge to yourself,
don't keep these bread crumbs or honey bonds.
Speaker 2 (47:14):
Give it away.
Speaker 1 (47:15):
Find ways to take care of you by doing things new,
different and uncomfortable, and challenging yourself to look at yourself
in a new and different way. Julie shared so much
information about change, about transition, about acceptance, about people, places
and things that allowed them to be exactly who they
are at this time, at the best, in the top
of their level, and going further. So if this has
(47:38):
been a blessing, bless somebody else by giving it away.
Much love, Have a great day, morning, good evening, good weekend,
good whatever, good life, Peace,
Welcome back to the Three Pair of Leves podcast. What's
your hosts the Doctor Jason Branch, Well, we'd rediscover who
we once were, we embrace who we actually are, and
we make room for the better versions of ourselves. So today,
as y'all know, whenever I bring family on, we have
us a ball. So I'm bringing in family and the
reality is we have these conversations anyway. I'm just choosing
(00:23):
to allow y'all in. In today's guests. I got somebody
for y'all. Listen, grab your Gator Skills journal if you can.
If you can't understood, you might be driving, cooking, doing
other things, and that's fine.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
Take mental notes.
Speaker 1 (00:38):
Okay, you can do that. You always got access. So
today's guest is Julie Consenza. Now let me tell you
about Julie before we jump in. Julie and I met
at Alliance International University some time ago, and we were
actually giving keys to a mentor program.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
That we decide we're fin to ride this thing the
way we want.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
And it was just this or organic connection and we
just saw each other, we saw felt understood each other
in different ways different parts of the globe, and we
work really well together.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
Because we see us in what we do and what
we do.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
We're passionate about to help other people, and we just
found a way to be who we are. So I
decided I gotta let Julie in on the entire world
and whoever's willing to listen. So, ladies and gentlemen, I
present to you today the most illustrious doctor. Julie consids of,
welcome to the show, baby.
Speaker 3 (01:32):
Thank you, thank you. It's good to be here. Yes, indeed,
it's a great introduction.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
Listen, we ain't playing.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
We ain't playing. I had to let him know. I
had to let him know. So I need you all
to be mindful. Y'all gonna get hitting the head with
a honeybunb throughout the show. I just need you to know.
Julie's gonna drop some gems, gonna drop some jewels, gonna
hit you in the mouth with the most loving way possible.
So much knowledge and lived experience, and this is part
of the reason that I was able to bring her
(02:01):
on the show, bring them onto the show because the
knowledge base, the expertise related to the lived experience of
who they once were, who they are, who they are becoming.
So with that said, what's your story, what's your journey?
What would you like to share with the listeners related
to just an introduction of you. I gave a piece
of an introduction. But who would you like to say
you are to the listeners?
Speaker 3 (02:22):
Who would I like to say? I am? So? I
am a person who identifies as white, gender queer, sex queer,
a person with a disability. I have a learning disability,
and I have a good story about that too, because
we were talking about another story my first one of
my first classes in undergrad So, and I was born
(02:45):
and raised in California, and I have a wonderful, beautiful
partner and a cat. So that's pretty much min me
in a nutshell. So in when I went to undergraduate school. So,
I grew up in Lafayette, California, which is very, very
affluent and white. And so I went to Chico State.
(03:08):
And I really wanted to study theater at first, so
first theater arts, and then I went into multicultural and
gender studies. So I did two degrees. And we were
talking about you, who was I in an undergrad It
(03:28):
was a very different person than who I am today.
And so one of the things that you and I
were talking about the other day was how did I
kind of get to where I am around consciousness, around race, sexuality, gender, class,
socioeconomic status, religion, citizenship, all of those wonderful disability Like,
(03:52):
how did I kind of develop, you know, who I
am today and where I'm going to go in the future.
So I think I think starting with some of the
paradigm shifts that I will admit that I, you know,
didn't know. And I think one of the things that
really helps people move from one phase to the other
(04:12):
in their lives and their developmental paths is these paradigm shifts.
And paradigm shifts are not comfortable. They're not you know,
like a hot tub and some bubbly champagne.
Speaker 2 (04:26):
That's not paradigm shift.
Speaker 3 (04:28):
That's privilege. That's sitting in your privilege.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
Yeah, so you've already opened the door. You've already opened
the door. So let's go to the basement.
Speaker 1 (04:36):
And for the listeners, for the movies with listeners, the
basement is where our heart lives. That's where the emotions are,
That's where the darkness and the secrets and the things
that we don't talk about is usually locked in the basement.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
Julie has already opened the door.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
For us to go down here and have some conversations
about their lived experience and upbringing in paradigm shifts. So
I would love to dive into the parallels the paradigm
from where you were to where you were able to
develop into from a class an undergrad if you could
share with us that story, and please feel free to
share as much detail as you like to help people
(05:10):
understand shifts and change and you being able to experience
a shift and change from that class, tell us about it.
Speaker 3 (05:17):
Yeah, thank you. So I think the conversation started with, well,
why I enjoy talking to white people about race and
what kind of strategies do I use? So I use
strategies to kind of help, not help, but support people
white people to see outside of that of their privilege,
(05:39):
outside of the white bubble. And I grew up in
the white bubble, so I can I have that space?
So so you asked, like, what would what was something
that you would use in these conversations. So when I
took my first sociology class, and it was sociology of
you know, I think of I don't even know a
sociology class, we were talking about people of color and
(06:02):
I had never heard the term people of color before.
I think it was I went to high school and
or I went to college in nineteen ninety seven. It's
when I started. So just to give you a sense
of when we were talking, so I in class, I
was like trying to be engaged. I said colored people
in class, and I had no idea like, so then
(06:27):
the teacher stopped the class and you know, said, you know, hey,
there's a difference between saying people of color and colored people.
And it was such a moment because I didn't even
realize I said it, but she was looking at me
and I'm like, I must have said that. So that
was a moment of I feel very uncomfortable right now.
(06:50):
And so it was it was a place where you know,
I had to really kind of sit back and say, like,
I don't know anything. I don't know if you could
swear on.
Speaker 1 (06:59):
This, I.
Speaker 3 (07:01):
Don't know, but I don't. I just don't know. Like
it was a really humbling moment of Man, I got
a lot to learn. And then an interesting story about
that class too is that I grew up in special
education and when I went to college, I was like,
I'm this new person. I don't have to go to
special ed classes anymore. And I'm in college, and so
(07:23):
somebody in the class asked for a note taker, and I,
with dyslexia learning disabilities, that is the accommodation that I
usually get as a student I could get. I didn't
do it in college because I was like, I'm in college.
I don't have to do any of these accommodations. I
got it all over and so I volunteered to do
(07:43):
note taking. And it was just two classes, and they
came back and said, we can't read your notes. We're
asking for somebody else to be a note taker. Like
this makes no sense. You have basically have no business
taking notes. That's kind of how I heard it, but
like that's really really what happened. And I was like, oh,
another kind of like there's a shift. I kind of
(08:07):
like remember your place. So those two things were like
a little humbling for me.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
Wow.
Speaker 3 (08:13):
And that was like the first bang right off. The
first class in undergrad was was that experience.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
So it sounds like you were you got two huge
living or lived experiences related to race, race relations and
just not knowing, just just not aware, not aware at all,
even though you've gone through life as long as you
did as far as you did, even in the state
of California, which can be, you know, considered a liberal state.
Speaker 2 (08:41):
You just weren't aware.
Speaker 1 (08:43):
And fortunately you had a professor that didn't mind, you know,
helping you become more aware by sharing truth. And then
the other side related to a learning disability or just
this was your norm. I can write notes, I can
read my own writing, I know my own stuff, but
how other people perceive it. It sounds like these were
real eye opening experiences that shifted your perspective about yourself. Yeah,
(09:06):
so I'm curious because a lot of times, a lot
of us, whenever we're challenged with something that goes against
our beliefs, rules of engagement, or lived experience, we are
defensive to it because somebody calls us out what we
don't know. We're defensive and sometimes we retreat or we
attack back. And it sounds like for you, it sounds
like you weren't defensive at all, but you were introspective
(09:29):
and reconsidered your perspective. That's what it sounds like happens.
So if you don't mind sharing, how did you do that,
like not take it personal, not get your feelings hurt
in it and go in a different direction, but you actually.
Speaker 2 (09:41):
Leaned in of Hey, this is something I don't know.
Speaker 1 (09:44):
I want to become more aware so I don't hurt
anyone or be disrespectful with the things that I say
that I may not know could be offensive to people.
Speaker 2 (09:50):
Could you tell us more about that?
Speaker 3 (09:52):
Yeah, I think that what you're kind of getting at
is white fragility, which I didn't know of at the time.
Speaker 2 (09:58):
Real quick, ooh, we already here.
Speaker 1 (10:01):
So if you could talk about white fragility and white privilege,
because there's a lot of listeners who aren't aware of
these terms, who've never heard of them before until this episode.
So if you don't mind, Okay, there's some definition behind
that too that would be helpful.
Speaker 3 (10:13):
So I'm not this is just Julie's definition. This isn't
like the definition of all definitions. It's not a capital
T truth.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
It's just from my perspective, I love the disclaimer. I
love it.
Speaker 3 (10:25):
I don't want to have to define thing. That's a
lot of responsibility I think for me kind of in
the context of basically, white privilege is unearned benefits. It's like,
because of the color of your skin, you're going to
have privilege. And it also is a legacy in our country.
So our country was founded on stolen land and enslaved
(10:49):
people to progress, you know, rather quickly through the industrial Revolution.
Because if you think about it now, like what if
I if somebody gave me and a free labor, of
course I would be wealthy. And so historically only white
people could have wealth, you know, vote have wealth, all
that kind of stuff. So there's a long legacy, systemic
(11:11):
legacy of privileging whiteness. And then you see that not
only in the US, but colorism also privileges lighter skin.
So there's and those two things are separate. But that's
how I kind of see white privileges just looking at
a white person. There's certain assumptions that a lot of
(11:32):
people make, like you can do the job, like you're
white person, Like what? And I fall into those too.
I had an employee or a person I was managing,
who was this white man and he wore suit and
I was like, all right, he's got his job, and
I'm pretty sure he's doing his job. And then I realized, like, well,
I just assumed that he was doing his job when
he wasn't. So there's like these moments of like we
(11:56):
all make these assumptions. So that's what I would say,
white privileges under earn benefits based on race. Yeah, And
then I would say white fragility is a response to
like what you were talking about, is that defensive response.
And this isn't to say I mean I know white
fragility because I've been there. You know, I've definitely had
a defensive response at some point, you know, and have
(12:17):
a lot of points. So it's the defensive response. It's
the like sometimes you have like white women tears, you know,
sometimes when you're like they're faced with questions about you know,
like that. I found that to be racist. Though you know,
there'll be this fragileness and I think a lot of
(12:37):
especially for white women, but a lot of people have
felt like, you know, now they have to take care
of this fragile white person when the attention is really
should be on the racist comment or on the harm
that was done, but those get marginalized. So the idea
of fragility, it's actually Robin DiAngelo wrote the book on it,
(12:58):
and I was privily enough for fortunate enough to take
a workshop with her, and so she really looks at
feminism and kind of whiteness and how they're actually like
male privileged and patriarchy and whiteness and how they're intertwined.
But that's basically the gist of like falling apart when called,
like not having that response like you're talking about of like, oh,
(13:20):
let's be introspective and I said something wrong, I could
have possibly have, you know, offended someone, So now I
will move forward on repair. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
So so just curious and I want to be mindful
of the listeners.
Speaker 1 (13:33):
It's it sounds like the right for this is my assumption,
the white fragility connects to the Karen mentality. You know
that we are all familiar or some of us may
be familiar with the Karen mentality. White women being addressed
of their privilege or acknowledge of what they're doing is
hurtful or mean.
Speaker 2 (13:51):
And it's been this.
Speaker 1 (13:53):
Community of white women who who have a hard time
with people of color being they are doing whatever it
is that they do. So it sounds like that's the
definition of white fragility. And for you, being a white
woman and choosing, because it's it's choice based, you chose
not to go in that direction, but to go in
(14:15):
a different direction that's more connected to the human experience.
Where did that come from for you to decide? Because
you don't have to, you know, having privileged, you don't
have to, But you decided I care more about me
knowing more, knowing differently to help versus what I know
is the only thing I need to know. I'm not
really worried about anything else. How did you make that
(14:36):
decision to choose to be Julie instead of Karen.
Speaker 3 (14:42):
Well, so let's unpack that a little bit. So let's
do it, Karen. The Karen concept isn't necessarily so white fragility.
I just use white women tears as an example. But
white fragility can happen to you know, any white person
now gender you know, gender binary, like it can happen
(15:03):
to anyone.
Speaker 2 (15:06):
There is.
Speaker 3 (15:06):
I think that white women have the savior complex, so
I think that there is more of of that, more
white fragility with white women. And I also don't identify
as a woman. I identify as sex queer, gender queer,
so non binary is a better kind of description for
my gender. So but I am a fab so I
(15:28):
was assigned female at birth and I'm often read as
a woman. So I'm in this place where I don't
really identify as a woman, but I'm read as a woman,
and I was socially conditioned as a woman. So yeah,
so I don't necessarily identify as a woman, which is
very interesting because I did so many years of women's studies,
(15:48):
women and gender studies that I, like now don't identify
as a woman. And then so what was the question?
Speaker 1 (15:58):
Yeah, like, we can just we can just take a
ride here, because where we're going, you're talking about being
non binary, and even with me giving you the title
of being a woman, like that's you know, that's my
ignorance as well, because I'm still learning about the LGBTQ
plus community. So you're teaching me as well as the
(16:18):
listeners at the same time, because a lot of times
we don't know, and what you just shared is an
opportunity for us to know, for us to learn that
we're not the same. It's not this you know, traditional
or to go back in time of it's just men, women,
black and white.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
It's way more than that.
Speaker 1 (16:35):
There's a lot of layers to it, and I really
appreciate you giving me space to be me and also
offer some knowledge that I didn't know about, you know,
and not allowing us to just talk over it like nah,
no woman, bro, we listen.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
I ain't your girl no more, you know.
Speaker 1 (16:55):
So I appreciate that because I'm here to learn as well.
This is just me, you know, providing the space for listeners.
Speaker 2 (17:02):
But I want to learn.
Speaker 1 (17:02):
I want to be better too, and there's so much
that we don't know. And I love having people on
with this knowledge base, especially their own lived experience, to
share this truth to help people see people differently. So
I appreciate you for that, and I, you know, because
because of our relationship, I know that I'm going to
continue to learn more because we you and I specifically,
(17:25):
can have conversations that we may not be able to
have publicly. And this podcast also serves as that place
that we can have conversations that we're just not able
to have publicly. Like there's a lot of people that
never heard about white fragility until today. There's people that
never heard about white privilege until today. Because these are
conversations that we may not have at the dinner table
some people have never had in their entire lives. And
(17:46):
they happen to be white, and they happen to be
non binary, and they happen to be this or that.
So that's why these conversations are so important. And I
appreciate you so much for being exactly who you are
and letting us know who the hell you are.
Speaker 2 (17:59):
And who you are not taught that shit, Julie.
Speaker 3 (18:06):
Yeah, I think that, you know, living on the margins
a little bit really helps with empathy. And I think
the question is kind of what made me want to change,
you know. It's like I want to change myself, I
want to change the world. And I think that, you know,
I struggled, and I I see other people, you know,
(18:27):
struggling even worse than I struggle, you know, So I
think I have empathy for that, and I think that
I've looked at enough of history. I think history is
really important of the of our country and of other
countries as well, and kind of looking at colonialism and
the ideological legacies of colonialism. So even though we don't
(18:49):
have maybe a specific colonial structure in our country, now,
we have had one, and there's lots of ideas and
legacies that are passed down. So kind of being able
to see that and having my own experience has really
helped me to kind of think like we've got to
make change, and it can't just be in the classroom.
(19:09):
It can't just be on a podcast or walking down
the street like it's everywhere. Especially with the new regime,
we have empower, we definitely need to be more active
all the time.
Speaker 1 (19:24):
And yeah, yeah, equity, this is just so powerful. Everything
you're saying is so powerful and you don't have to
and you chose this for the greater good because I'm
hearing the humanism, I'm hearing the care, the heart for people,
And I want to switch gears a moment because this
was really heavy on race. But now let's move to
(19:46):
this other level of gender where you were talking about,
you know, you were studying women's studies and feminism and
gender studies and to transition from that personally and professionally.
If you could share with us a story, because there's
a lot of listeners who have been where you once were,
or in a space where they don't know and it's like,
you know, society says I need to be this way,
(20:07):
but I feel something different. So if you could share,
you know, whatever you're willing to relate it to that
transition of this is how you used to live life
and then you saw things differently and you decided I
want to live life on my own terms. How did
you make that transition?
Speaker 3 (20:23):
Well, lots of factors. I think that I was fortunate to,
you know, take a lot of women's studies classes. My
master's is Women in Gender Studies, and then I have
a certificate in the doctorate level, so I got exposed
to a lot of gender analysis. So gender is a
(20:45):
lens that you can apply to anything. So you whenever
doing an analysis of a TV show, you could do
a RaSE analysis, you could do a gender analysis, you
could do a disability analysis. Like you can look through
a lens and hopefully you're doing all of them at
the same time, but you could look through a lens
and you know, make an analysis. So if you I
(21:07):
was trained to look through the world through a gender lens,
and I think that also having a partner who has
been very fluid to in their gender they also use
them pronouns, was very helpful. And I think that you know,
in some ways, you know, I will I'm I question
(21:30):
like I who is the like the authentic self? Like
am I really living an of is their one? I
challenge and question that all the time. I think it's
the queer theory in me. But was I, you know,
not happy like living as a woman, And like, am
I really not living as a woman now? Like everybody
(21:52):
recognized me as a woman, Like my parents will always
say favous little girl, she heard. They'll never use them pronouns,
and I'm okay with that, Like that's fine. They can, yeah,
like that's way too hard for them. And if they
want to like hang on to the favoritist little girl
(22:13):
in the whole world, then that's okay with me. You know,
I'm okay with that kind of part of me. But
like in my friends in work, people who know me,
I use they them pronouns, and I use positive reinforcement,
which I think you'll really appreciate to the best of
my ability. So I am flawed in so many ways.
(22:35):
But if like somebody says, like, for example, you use
she and then they in this podcast, so I would
say like, thank you. You know, I can see you're trying.
We're all gonna make mistakes, so I would like send
a little message and say like hey, thanks for being
conscious of pronouns. So that's like a way of using
that positive reinforcement because a lot of folks really like
(23:00):
they they they you know, will jump on people in
the moment, not to say that I haven't done that
and very frustrating times, but I try. So That's like
I say, I try to practice positive reinforcement, and I
think that that not only helps me be more positive,
but I think it helps other people who use they
than pronouns have an easier route in this world, it
(23:24):
easier path. But yeah, I don't know if I answer
the question. But I don't really have an authentic self,
Like I just like I don't. I didn't wake up
one day, but I just felt like I'm not really
identifying with women anymore. I don't like because when we
think of identifying, right, you read a book, like let's
pretend like we're reading a nonfiction and you know there's
(23:49):
a character that doesn't that is a Let's say I'm
reading about this woman character and like I could identify
with them, you know, in a certain way, so like
I could see myself with this as this woman character.
I've had similar experiences or you know, it's like, oh,
I really love this character. I so identify with him.
(24:09):
But I would read the book and be like, I
don't really identify with it, especially if it's a heterosexual woman.
I do not identify with any of that. I am
not caught up in this racking. I don't want to
be pregnant, like none of the things that I worry
about a heterosexual woman worry about, and like pantyholes. Like
so if I'm reading a book about a heterosexual woman,
(24:30):
I don't see myself there, even with a woman, you know,
I don't really see myself as a woman. So it's
a great way to kind of think. So then I
think that the more I read and the more I,
you know, started to look at the world through a
gender lens, I just didn't see myself like as a
woman analyzed as a woman, and I like, I prefer
(24:53):
gay man gay male energy is probably my favorite. I
say that kind of tongue in cheek.
Speaker 2 (25:01):
Gay Okay, just put it that way. I'm here for
all of it.
Speaker 1 (25:07):
And I appreciate your perspective and that positive reinforcement because
as a student of life myself, I'm still learning too,
and you set a precedent where you give space for
people to learn and grow. You know, now you may
have done things a little different in the past, but
where you are now it gives people a chance to connect.
(25:27):
So for me, with everything that you're sharing, it's allowing
me to be even more mindful and intentional about what
I do and what I say because I'm learning in
real time and you're providing me space to do that.
And to me, that's so powerful because oftentimes we don't
provide that space. And part of the reason we don't
provide that space because we feel some kind of way.
I feel disrespected or you know, you said my name wrong,
(25:49):
or you said my pronouns wrong, not recognizing that this
person may not know, they may not have done.
Speaker 2 (25:54):
It, they may not do it.
Speaker 1 (25:55):
I'm still learning it even with students that I'm working with.
So it's like, you have this perspective that's just about connection.
It's connectivity. Let's bring you in, come here, come on in,
let's have a conversation. And to me, that is so
powerful because that's how change can occur versus let me
(26:16):
bush upside the head with this truth real quick.
Speaker 2 (26:18):
So it's just change in doing it a different way,
jump in.
Speaker 3 (26:22):
You know, it's really fascinating. I think it takes both.
Like if I didn't have one of the other stories
that I shared with you as an undergrad is I
had a African American black woman who was a sociology teacher.
Another sociology teacher, I wrote this horrific paper that said,
you know, women have have it like worse off than
(26:45):
black people because there's more like women support systems, Like
was measuring like how many like things are for women
and how many things are like are for people of color,
bipop folk community, so like, because there's more resource for women,
I wrote this paper that said that women have it
like worse off, that we need to like focus more
(27:05):
on women, which is totally what I do not believe now,
by the way, the compolete opposite. But my teacher wrote
on that paper, this is an elitist argument and these
are all the things that are wrong, and that was
like whoa, Like she hit me over the head, but
I needed to be hit over the head. So it's
like these paradigm shifts. It's not in the hot tub
(27:28):
with bubbles, you know, with champagne. This is like outside
like bam bam bam with your head. And those are painful,
but they're so important, and I feel like I was
I had that space in my undergrad to kind of
ask these questions and be gently hit over the head,
(27:50):
you know, and be corrected in front of the class.
And like I had these moments where you were kind
of talking about it was like, you know, people held
a space for me, even if I deserved it or not,
they did. They help the space for me to grow.
So I think that I want to do the same thing,
but if necessary, I will do a paradigm shift, you know,
(28:12):
I will get out the.
Speaker 2 (28:16):
I love it.
Speaker 1 (28:17):
You are defining what it means to get hit in
the head with a honeybut that's what you're defining right now.
So I want to go back to something because we
already in the basement. We ain't left the basement yet.
We are deep, and I want to go a little
bit deeper. Back to a comment that you mentioned about
your parents, like they still have a hard time and
you feel as though they would never acknowledge your new
(28:37):
identity or different identity.
Speaker 2 (28:39):
So I'm assuming for you to be okay with.
Speaker 1 (28:42):
It, as in, they don't never have to call me
who I actually am or identify you're.
Speaker 2 (28:47):
Okay with it.
Speaker 1 (28:48):
And to me, that sounds like someone who's very self aware,
very authentic, and has done some work. It sounds like
You've done a lot of work on you. I'm curious
to learn more about this work because it sounds like
you've been in therapy, but I don't know, So just curious,
like where did you get this confidence and authenticity within
yourself of I identify the way I choose, whether you
(29:10):
choose to or not, I'm still okay.
Speaker 2 (29:12):
Even if it's my parents.
Speaker 3 (29:14):
Yeah, I think, you know, we really just have to
accept people where they are and what is it what's
more important for me? So my mom's had like major
surgeries all over her body. She had a stroke, which
impacts her memory. And so for my mom, I think
(29:36):
when not So Danny and I, my partner and I,
we use them pronouns in front of my parents. My
brother uses them, my you know, sister in law, my cousins,
it's pretty much everybody except for my parents and maybe
my aunt and uncle. So it's it's not like I
don't live, you know, it's like I'm out to them. Like,
but my mom when I when we had like our
(29:59):
first conversation around pronouns, she went the opposite direction. She's like,
I sent me pictures of myself and dresses as a kid.
She really like went heavy on this favoritous little girl
in the whole world, like he'll always be like she
just went to the opposite direction of like wanting so
bad and there's so many changes in her life. It's
(30:23):
like is that like what's And she's seventy so so
it's like what what do I want to get? Is
it's more important for her to try to use day
them and like humble around. I mean she can she
can barely remember my name.
Speaker 4 (30:42):
And also it's like if she wants to hold onto that,
I think that that's beautiful and that's how she loves
me and that's that's okay, And I've made peace with that.
Speaker 3 (30:52):
And my dad's not very My dad and I are
both super dyslexic, so he's never it's just like he's
never gonna be able.
Speaker 1 (30:58):
To do that, you know, a part of like so
you said the dyslexia prevents him from being.
Speaker 3 (31:05):
I think it's just like an unrealistic expectation. Why put
myself up for that? Like why I set myself up
for something that's like, yeah, I just want to enjoy
the time we have together.
Speaker 1 (31:16):
That is so powerful, that is so mature, Like you
are on a home and I'm so thankful to share
you with everyone, because for anyone listening, I need you
to hear what was just shared, like, well, we do
things that our parents are not okay with or have
a problem with or can't change a ship, like that's
their problem, it's not ours.
Speaker 2 (31:33):
And you said it so eloquently.
Speaker 3 (31:35):
Yeah, And I speak for myself. There's a lot of
trans people. There's a lot of you know, people who
there's more at stake for their existence than me, you know,
So I want to point out like I I'm okay,
it's it's not but I mean for people who are trans,
like actually, you know transgender, I think that there's a
(31:58):
lot more at steak with family and so I for me,
it's like yeah, they then pronouns like I can live
with that.
Speaker 2 (32:06):
I can.
Speaker 3 (32:08):
I love it, And it's been really beautiful to see
my cousins and my brother and my brother's on board
now and they struggle, but they're they're pretty good at it.
So there's some beautiful aspects and it's really nice. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:22):
I love it.
Speaker 1 (32:22):
I love it, And I love seeing you light up
talking about it, like you just lit up. I just
feel that just being proud, like man, they did it.
They see me, they accept me, they're acknowledging me, and
that's a beautiful thing. And I see it and I
feel that energy. So I really appreciate you sharing it.
I appreciate you allowing us in the basement. So let's
go back upstairs to the living room. So the living
room is where we live. This is where we are
(32:44):
in our most authentic space. So I want to ask
if you structured questions related to the living room. So
out of all these years of life, because you just
celebrated birthday, Happy birthday, thank you yesterday.
Speaker 2 (32:56):
Yes, yes, yesterday birthday.
Speaker 1 (32:58):
So out of all these years of life, I'm curious
to know what would you say you've learned about yourself
in all these years.
Speaker 3 (33:11):
I would say, there's the more you know, the more
there's so much you don't know.
Speaker 2 (33:20):
You drop in bar.
Speaker 3 (33:22):
I mean, I would just say, my goodness, like, I've
learned a lot, but there is so much I don't know. Yeah,
And it's it's so good to keep in mind that
even when I think I know something like I know it,
I probably don't really because time will change, you know,
(33:46):
more information will be discovered. And so I'm in a
space where I'm open to kind of thinking differently, like, well,
that didn't work, let's try something else.
Speaker 1 (34:00):
I love it all right, same question because what you're
talking about, this has been coming up often.
Speaker 2 (34:06):
What you're sharing, you know, even when you are.
Speaker 1 (34:10):
Certain, you just know for sure, then life has a
way of showing us different And what I consider that
a great friend of mine who's actually will be on
the podcast a little later, curiosity over certainty, not holding
on to what I truly believe that this is the
way it's going to be. This is way it always is.
He's like, no, that's a closed fist. But curiosity allows
(34:32):
you to open your hand to receive, and that's exactly
what you're sharing.
Speaker 2 (34:35):
You're so wise. Oh I just love it. I just
love it.
Speaker 1 (34:38):
Same question instead of related to you, what have you
learned about people in all these years? Yes?
Speaker 3 (34:49):
So I have always been kind of the rose colored glasses,
like people are going to be truthful, they're going to
be honest. And I think that because I have such
an honest close family that you know, we were. My
dad's like, never tell a lie. I'm like, okay, yeah, yeah,
I never tell a lie. And so I started discovering
the people tell lies. People have a dark side, people
(35:11):
have a shadow. I kind of a and that people
are not necessarily always going to do the right thing
or be as careful with what I've said, you know,
like with a conversation they can like mix it and
and so so I have a I think that for
(35:36):
other people, I'm a little less trusting, I think than
I was, and that that is actually a good lesson.
Speaker 2 (35:45):
You know.
Speaker 3 (35:46):
I think that that's probably like I was a little naive,
and I think that people have kind of showed me,
you know, don't don't trust, like, don't trust exactly what
they say all the time?
Speaker 2 (35:59):
Powerful? Powerful. What would you say is your proudest moment
or proudest accomplishment.
Speaker 3 (36:05):
It used to be being the most outstanding female athlete
in junior high I got the John d RC Award.
That was always my go to. But I think my
most prouder moment maybe I'll just have to stick with
that one. I can't think of a recent one.
Speaker 2 (36:26):
Okay, that works, whatever you say, go that works.
Speaker 1 (36:30):
So what's a word phrase, memory, or moment that has
stuck with you personally or professional?
Speaker 3 (36:37):
Personally a professional word phrase moment, Well, the more you know,
I learned the more.
Speaker 2 (36:42):
I don't know, that's my one that's quotable. That is quotable, Yeah,
for sure, though.
Speaker 3 (36:51):
I for professionally it's kind of the never email angry,
you know, always sit and be very careful about what
you write in your emails. I think personally is like
I was kind of talking about it with my dad,
like just don't tell I like live ethically, live with integrity,
and sometimes I think like I should call in sick
today when I'm not sick, and then I'm like, no,
(37:12):
I'm I want to do that. I'm gonna just take
a personal day. And so it's like little things like this.
Speaker 4 (37:18):
And thanks living honestly, it would probably be you know,
don't tell I, okay where it's okay.
Speaker 2 (37:27):
I love it. I love it.
Speaker 1 (37:28):
So three parallels, that's the name of the show. So
I want to ask your three parallels. How would you
describe who you were, who you are, who you're becoming.
Speaker 3 (37:38):
That's pretty easy. It was pretty naive. Didn't know a
whole lot, you know, didn't have I don't know if
it was street smarts, but just didn't have a lot
of like sense of the like a strong sense of
the world. And then just thinking back to my undergraduate years,
and then who I am now is a little bit
(37:58):
more streets smart, a little less trusting, but a little
bit more forgiving maybe than I was. And then where
am I going? I hope that I'm going to a
place where maybe I have a little bit more confidence
in my judgment of people and my judgment of myself
(38:22):
to really kind of hit my stride because I'm in
I'm in those years you know, where I'm supposed to be.
We're not supposed to be and I shouldn't say that,
but I'm in the years where I can be I
can you know, best career. You know that that's not
careers and money wise, but like fits with who I
am and value aligned and a really great career. And
(38:46):
I'm going to tie the knot maybe in January actually
because we're going to go to the courthouse sooner rather
than later due to the Supreme Court and the administry.
So we're going to try to do that before November twentieth,
All right, January twentieth. I mean, so I think in
(39:07):
my future I will have a wonderful, you know, life partner,
and I'm looking forward to sharing my life with them
in an honest and real, real way love it.
Speaker 2 (39:21):
I love it. Congratulations, congratulations to the both of you.
Job well done.
Speaker 1 (39:25):
Also, I have to bring this up because for a
lot of the listeners these moments are really important. They're
small and I consider them bread crones because they're so small,
but they're so big because of what they can develop into.
And you shared something earlier about you know, career and
what you should do, and then you corrected yourself or
you shifted perspective of it's not should it's what I
(39:49):
can do, what I could do, and that small change
in your wordplay change the whole ripple effect of whatever's
about to happen. It's going to happen now because it's
not a rule, it's not a law. It's what you're
attracting based off of who you're becoming. And it's going
to happen. And guess what, I get to watch.
Speaker 2 (40:05):
It, so I cannot.
Speaker 1 (40:07):
I cannot wait until it happens, because it's going to
happen because you said it. And for the listeners, these
are moments that you have to I will challenge you
to pay attention to because it's small, but it's big.
There is so much power in our words. And if
we're not careful, if we're not mindful, we can speak
on or speak about the things that we don't want
instead of speaking about the things that we we actually want.
(40:30):
That we get to a track. So can could versus
should changes everything. And I really appreciate you saying that,
so I had to point it out.
Speaker 3 (40:38):
It's funny because I learned that from you. Wow, conversation,
take shit out of that, Yes, indeed, and yeah you
tell me that.
Speaker 2 (40:54):
Wow, Julie Man, listen, listen. I can't handle all this.
I can't handle a lot of this. Thank you for
sharing that. This small, but it's so big. And I
saw it. I just saw it happen. I didn't know
all was responsible for that. I had nothing to do
with that. You did. I love it. I love it,
and thank you again, listeners. This is happening in a
(41:15):
real time. Okay, this is organic. It's come.
Speaker 1 (41:17):
You can put a chaquita banana or dolstickle on our
forehead because we are organic. All right, last question. Love
it So for the listeners, because you shared a lot.
We's in the basement, so you shared a lot about yourself.
I'm curious. We're curious to learn more, what's an interesting
fact about you or something that people wouldn't believe about you.
Speaker 3 (41:40):
I was trained as a mime and I love min
it's my favorite art form. I am not as good
as it I said I used to be because I
haven't practiced a whole lot. But I did theater and
I did physical theater, so I did dance, mime, choreography,
and I worked in a cabaret when I lived in
car Brbondale when I was doing my doctorate, and I
(42:03):
got to create all these fun mind shows. And I
think as a person who is dyslexic, I think a
lot of like the traditional ways of communication like words
and stuff and reading and writing and words, they've all
kind of failed me in some ways. But I've really
found a true kind of self expression in a physical theater.
(42:24):
So that's kind of a little known fact. That's unknown.
Speaker 1 (42:28):
Yeah, and I didn't even know that. Like, man, I
just want to, you know, paint my face and get
some gloves and get to work.
Speaker 3 (42:33):
Like what.
Speaker 2 (42:36):
Am I missing around? Get me out of this box?
You know what I mean? We have so much fun.
Speaker 1 (42:44):
We do this with anyway, rather y'all listening or not,
this is what me and Julie do anyway. So last
thing on this show we offer life work. Life work
is a little bit different than homework. Homework you take
it home, you do it, you turn it in, you
never remember it again. Life work, you take it home,
you do it. Your life can possibly change, and a
lot of things, majority of the things that you shared
on the show can be life changing if you're willing
(43:05):
to take in the information there. You drop a lot
of bread of crimes, you drop a lot of loaves
of bread or witding crimes. It was just straight up loads.
So if you can offer a keepsake to the listeners
some life workings, something that they could do, or things
that you want to share to help people shift or
change or reconsider, what would that be what comes to
(43:26):
mind for you?
Speaker 3 (43:32):
I would say that time really helps. So what feels
very intense in the moment. My partner would ask me
to do this Every once in a while they'll ask
will this matter in five minutes? Will this matter in
five hours, will this matter in five days? Will this
(43:53):
matter in five weeks? And will this matter in five months?
And so it's a really great way to say, you know,
this might feel like really intense, right now, but time,
time will will provide more answers. Time will you know,
heal kind of time will time will dissipate the kind
(44:16):
of intensity of the moment. So I think after making
a lot of mistakes and after like living all these
things and like, hey, guys survived that and like, oh man,
that was horrible, but I survived that. So just thinking,
like you know, like the more you make mistakes, the
more you have intense situations, the better you are at
handling them. And just kind of trust in time. That's
(44:39):
that's the best thing I could say.
Speaker 1 (44:41):
I think powerful, powerful, Yes, yes, because it's you, it's yours.
Also I appreciate you sharing all that is powerful. Also
on this show when we do shout outs, because you
shouted out Danny a couple times, I like to bring
the person that you shout out on the show. So
if you would like to invite Danny, and they are
more than welcome to be here to share their story,
(45:03):
their lived experience, whatever they want to share that five minutes,
five seconds, five moments already I'm I'm already interested. So
if Danny is interested, they are welcome to join the show.
And for the listeners, for people that want to connect
with you for whatever reason. Give you your flowers, get
your suggestions, take your mind course.
Speaker 2 (45:23):
Whatever it is that they want to do. How can
people get in contact with you?
Speaker 3 (45:28):
Well, I have a Gmail account. That's probably the best way.
I'm also on LinkedIn, but JS Cosenza C O. S E.
N Z A at gmail dot com. It's my email account.
If you want to email me, that's probably a good way.
(45:49):
I don't check it as much as I.
Speaker 2 (45:50):
Should, as you should, or you can as I could.
Speaker 3 (45:55):
There is as I maybe could, yes, check it a
little more.
Speaker 1 (46:02):
So if any of you reach out, like put something
in the subject line to make yourself stand out. Could
be something we talked about on the show, but something
to catch Julie's attention. If you catch the attention, you
might get a response. If you don't, you might get.
Speaker 2 (46:15):
Lost in the shuffle. So there is that.
Speaker 1 (46:18):
Any final thoughts, any final things you want to share,
you want to say for the listeners.
Speaker 3 (46:24):
I really enjoyed this conversation. Thanks for doing this. This
is a great podcast, and I really appreciate your time.
And I will definitely ask Danny if they're interested. I
think they would really enjoy this conversation.
Speaker 2 (46:36):
As well, yes, indeed, yes, indeed, we got another one.
We got another one. And I would love to.
Speaker 1 (46:40):
Meet Danny anyway, Like who's the lucky person to get
connected to you? And then y'all finna get married? Like
what Like, yeah, let's go, let's let's go Danny. So
this is a big shout out to Danny for all
of you listening to this episode. This has been another
phenomenal episode of the Three Parallels podcast with your hosts,
the Doctor Jason brand Be. We discover who we were,
(47:01):
we embrace who we are, we make room for who
we're trying to become. If this episode has been impactful
for you in any way, shape, form, or fashion, give
it away, share it. Don't keep this knowledge to yourself,
don't keep these bread crumbs or honey bonds.
Speaker 2 (47:14):
Give it away.
Speaker 1 (47:15):
Find ways to take care of you by doing things new,
different and uncomfortable, and challenging yourself to look at yourself
in a new and different way. Julie shared so much
information about change, about transition, about acceptance, about people, places
and things that allowed them to be exactly who they
are at this time, at the best, in the top
of their level, and going further. So if this has
(47:38):
been a blessing, bless somebody else by giving it away.
Much love, Have a great day, morning, good evening, good weekend,
good whatever, good life, Peace,
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