The Arenas Do Not Change…We Do! | Ft Nan Wang - 3 Parallels Podcast

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the Three Parallels podcast, which are hosts the
Doctor Branch, where we rediscover who we were, embrace who
we are, and make room for who we're trying to become.
The content of this podcast is for informational, educational, and
entertainment purposes only. The information shared, including any materials linked
to this podcast, is not a substitute for professional advice, therapy, diagnosis,

(00:21):
treatment from a physician, therapist, coach, or other qualified professional.
The views, thoughts, and opinions expressed are my own and
do not reflect any of those organizations or affiliations that
I may be connected with. This podcast is designed for
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Viewer and listener discretion is advised. Gator Talk Geter Talk

(00:42):
is the post show Q and a session for the podcast.
Every Friday. Let's get ready to take the Three par
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(01:06):
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Speaker 2 (01:19):
See you Friday. The Gator Scales Journal. It's game time.

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The Three Parallels podcast just leveled up with a powerful
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Speaker 2 (01:27):
For your journey and transformation.

Speaker 1 (01:29):
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(01:51):
Let's get the work, baby, Gators. Are you stuck in
a trunk with your own car watching life pass you by.
It's time to slide into the driver's seat with a
license therapist as your copilot. Rather, it's your first time
in therapy. You need a push for growth, or you
finally ready to invest in your mental wellness. I got
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move from who they were to embrace who they are

(02:13):
and make room for who they're trying to become. Therapy
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Let's break some cycles together, shift your mindset and unlock
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(02:34):
at four O four four three six two five four zero,
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Check us out on the web at www dot doctor
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Speaker 2 (02:45):
Look forward to connecting with you. Have a great day.

Speaker 1 (02:50):
Three Parallel three Parallel Podcas.

Speaker 2 (02:55):
Welcome back, Welcome back.

Speaker 1 (02:56):
We got another hot episode fresh off the press, and
I'm telling you this, guests who prepare yourself, brace yourself
because I don't know what she's gonna say, I don't
know where we're gonna go, I don't know what we're
gonna do, and I'm okay with it because this person
happens to be or used to be a student of mine.
She's in the counseling program, working on getting her master's
in clinic from a health counseling wants to become an

(03:17):
entrepreneur I'm sorry, already an entrepreneur and wants to develop
and grow in new and different ways related to this
help and profession. This woman has a kind soul, a
genuine heart, authentic, transparent, smart, is all get out, just
knows a lot about a lot of stuff. Now there's
some people that know a little bit about a lot.
She knows a lot about a lot. So I who

(03:38):
to give you an opportunity to meet who I've been
blessed to connect with over the years, and just so
you can get an idea and sense of this being
ladies and gentlemen, friends, family, dogs, cats, chickens, elderly people
and twerkers. Whoever you are listening right now, I would
like to introduce to you today, miss Wang.

Speaker 2 (04:01):
Welcome to the show.

Speaker 3 (04:04):
Thank you so much, Doctor Brinch. That's quite an introduction.
I'm not sure if I can live up to the title,
but it's very kind of you to say that.

Speaker 1 (04:11):
Absolutely you're living up to it. You don't have to
live up to anything you already live in too, So
I want to dive in, and we can't waste no
time because before the show we just started a conversation.
I just want to continue a conversation wherever you were
about to go. Let's just go there and then we'll
go where we're supposed to go from there. But the
question or the comment thought that came up was about

(04:32):
what goes on.

Speaker 2 (04:33):
Behind closed doors. So tell us what's coming.

Speaker 3 (04:37):
Up for you. Yeah. No, it's really interesting that we
were talking about that because I was just about to
say that what you're doing, in terms of having a
podcast having people talk about their life stories, is you know,
something that I've always been interested in, kind of understanding
how people think what they do when you don't see it,
because you can never really live in anybody else's shoes, unfortunately,

(05:00):
and so even kind of small situations like I remember
being at a hotel once and it's very very interesting place,
and lots of servers there and the staff, you know,
they were talking among themselves and they were seeing they
were having a great conversation. I just I wish I
could be a fly on the wall just to listen

(05:22):
to what it is that they were talking, because you know,
they're talking about the gut like, you know, their guess
they don't like it, I get it, but I want
to know kind of how they think about things, What
is their operation like, what is their life like?

Speaker 4 (05:37):
Where do they go.

Speaker 3 (05:38):
After their jobs? Yeah, it just kind of more and
just maybe why on YouTube, you know those daya life videos,
especially if chefs, it's kind of the content that I
always get are so popular because you do kind of
just go through a day ina life somebody else.

Speaker 4 (05:56):
And I feel like the.

Speaker 3 (05:57):
More we can see that of other professions or just
people's lives in general, of how they do house keeping, well,
a firefighter's life, like it, whatever it might be, I
personally find that really interesting and I feel like as
a society, maybe we can develop a little bit more
empathy and understanding.

Speaker 4 (06:18):
Uh, just through that exposure.

Speaker 3 (06:22):
So I'm blessed to be asked, I guess.

Speaker 1 (06:26):
Yeah, so let me ask you. Let's go a little further.
Where did this curiosity come from? Because a lot of
people never think about somebody else in their lived experience
and what's behind the scenes and job Like, you're a
deep thinker. I told y'all, I told you all listeners,
it's the top who we was dealing with.

Speaker 2 (06:43):
So you're a deep thinker. How did you develop this
sense of curiosity to even consider other people in their lives?

Speaker 3 (06:53):
I maybe I'm just very ignorant. I think everyone thinks
like me. Okay, I feel like I don't know. I
think everybody has a naturals of curiosity about other people.
I would imagine that's part of human nature. Otherwise, how
do we socialize or how do socialization? In the process

(07:13):
of socialization, you can get to where it is now.
But I would also imagine that life tends to get
in the way of a lot of those ideas and thoughts,
and we get smacked down along the way to have
to focus on ourselves more because survival also is quite

(07:37):
tough in many countries and many societies. And so yeah,
I don't know, but I would imagine that we have
more that's similar than different.

Speaker 2 (07:48):
I would agree with you one hundred percent.

Speaker 1 (07:51):
And what I'm agreeing with is our innate ability natural
desire of curiosity.

Speaker 2 (07:58):
And that's I mean.

Speaker 1 (08:00):
I have two small children, they're very curious. So I
agree with you one hundred percent. And the reason we
stop becoming curious is life. You know, it could be
our upbringing, our background, parents, guarding whomever told us not
to be curious or not to ask questions or don't
talk back, or whatever the case, and then life and
jobs and people and family and friends and partnerships. You're

(08:21):
absolutely right, and I'm thankful that you haven't lost your curiosity.

Speaker 2 (08:25):
So how have you lived through all of this life
in so many different ways instill this curious.

Speaker 3 (08:32):
I think maybe this profession is really helpful in that respect,
which is part of the reason why I wanted to
change professions and go into mental health in general, because
it's kind of a carte blanche to think about people
and think about the lives that they lead and the
steps that they've taken to get to where they are.
It's similar to what you're doing. And I'm lucky in

(08:55):
a lot of ways to be able to do that,
you know, to have an interest in some thing and
actually pursue it without a lot of constraints. And I imagine,
you know, I was just talking to a client the
other day and he's only oh my gosh, he's only
fifteen years old. You're thinking about becoming a lawyer. He
knows what law schools he wants to go to. And

(09:16):
I was like, oh, you know, so you're really interested
in this profession, And he's like, yeah, but you know,
if I could, I would be an artist, but you
know that doesn't pay the bill. So I'm going to
be I'm going to be a lawyer because you know,
it's at least within the realm of humanities, and therefore,
you know it, it's a nice in between. And I
admire some a young man who is practical and who

(09:37):
you know, knows his responsibilities and is willing to make
those sacrifices to get there. But I acknowledge that it's
a very privileged position to do something that you are
interested in, to get paid hopefully at a certain point
for it, and they have this support around you and
have it be something that society needs. You know, all

(10:00):
those things aligning. I think there's a Japanese term for it,
that all of those things are lining is really hard.
You know, we would all be very lucky to have
maybe one or two of those things. And so I
consider you and I sitting here to be very lucky individuals.

Speaker 2 (10:14):
I would agree. I'll agree one hundred percent.

Speaker 1 (10:17):
So you mentioned, you know, second career, this is another
career going into this profession. So what's the story Who
was na before this version of you. If you don't
mind sharing our with the listeners, what's your story and
how did you get here?

Speaker 3 (10:31):
Yeah? I guess I kind of resonated with that client
a lot in choosing career paths that were more practical
than anything else without being too long wounded. I start,
I went into a business school when I was in
for my bachelor's main reasons because my best friend wanted
to go into that program.

Speaker 4 (10:48):
So I was like, let's go together.

Speaker 2 (10:50):
That was it.

Speaker 3 (10:50):
Never thought twice about it, didn't know what it was really,
what is business?

Speaker 4 (10:54):
I still don't know. I don't think uh.

Speaker 3 (10:58):
And then after I graduated, I did professional services for
most of my career, so I did market research for
a while.

Speaker 4 (11:05):
And then I've always had an interest in.

Speaker 3 (11:11):
Working in the development field, so I went to live
in Ol Salvador for a year to do a development project,
came back sorry, I'm from Canada. And then afterwards I
went to the UK to do my masters in economic policy.
I was the master's in public administration, but I focused
on economic policy. I had dreams branch I had. I

(11:33):
had very different dreams about what I wanted to do.
I wanted to make more systemic changes, more macro changes.
It was really hard to think about my life and
my the you know, the tiny amount of difference of
those making when there were so many issues going on
in the world. And so that was the ambition at

(11:55):
that time. And then I graduated from it, you know,
from London in the UK, and then realized I could
not survive working for an entry out. So I ended
up going into consulting, which I mean I was quite
lucky as well in that in that job, because I
don't think I was ever really all that qualified, but

(12:15):
they had a lot of clients. The firm I was
working at, I had a lot of clients in the
education field, so we worked with the Department of Education.
We actually had quite a close connection with the government,
and so that you know, the public arena.

Speaker 4 (12:29):
I was able to do.

Speaker 3 (12:30):
A little bit of work with the government, which I
appreciated compared to all private sector works. You will. So
in that job, you know, we worked with a lot
of private equity firms, helping them buy and sell companies,
which you know, we can get into that, but as
a whole whole separate conversation for a few years, and

(12:52):
then I burned out really badly in that environment. It
just I never felt like it clicked. I don't think
I was as effective as I could have been. And
then that's when I really started looking at my mental
health because at that time I was also drinking a lot.

Speaker 4 (13:07):
It's part of the culture to drink a lot, but.

Speaker 3 (13:09):
I think it was way over what was a healthy
recommended amount, and it was a main kind of way
that I coped. And then from there I just kind
of never really looked back. It was the field that
I felt the most comfortable in and a place where
I felt like I could make kind of micro and

(13:31):
macro change. I love the flexibility of it, and I
love the breadth of it. You know, mental health and
well being is such a big field, and it keeps
evolving and it keeps growing. And at the time, I
started a startup that was really focused on helping employees

(13:53):
of corporations find their footing. You know, I was the
use case, especially with at you know, two or three am,
You're at the company. You don't have htr with you,
you don't have support with you, but you still have
a lot of work to do, and you're just really
really stressed and devastated in that moment, what do you do?
Where do you go? You know, And so we built

(14:15):
a kind of a line post tool that's supposed to
sit on your desktop and direct you to resources and
support that at that moment. So it's very much kind
of on demand support. And that was a long time ago.
I think the technology today actually suits that type of
use case a lot better. But at the time we

(14:36):
didn't have It was just me and a developer. She
was wonderful, but we were, you know, trying to train
our chatbot with a certain you know. It's the technology
is just so much better now than it was, and
so I think but that process, you know, I learned
a lot through that process, and it also made me
realize this is the field that I'm supposed to be in.

Speaker 4 (15:01):
Yeah I'll pause.

Speaker 2 (15:01):
There, Okay, So yeah, you're such a therapist. I love it.

Speaker 1 (15:07):
So so I'm curious. It's a couple of things that
stood out I wanted to dive into. First, you mentioned
I had big goals and dreams related to this business world,
and then there seemed to be a shift that happened,
and it sounds like you had an idea of what
the business world was that didn't align with the reality
of what it was. That's the first piece. Second piece

(15:27):
relates to it sounds like because of your experience in
the business world and competitive fatigue and burnout. Sounds like,
you know, you just was doing a lot and just
ran out, and once you ran out, you started to
learn about your mental health mental wellness, and that sounds
like it led you into this profession.

Speaker 2 (15:48):
Is that accurate and we'll love to hear your thoughts
about it.

Speaker 3 (15:51):
Yeah, I guess once through line about my life is
a lot maybe a lack of clarity. I've never fit
into any particular archetypes. You know. I was someone who
had dreams about making positive changes in our society, especially
for the less fortunate, because I didn't come from money.
I came from a communist country where everybody was equal,

(16:14):
and so I brought those values with me actually to
everywhere else I lived in. And I you know, when
something isn't fair, or something isn't working right, and when
people are not supported the way that they're supposed to be,
especially given the wealth of certain nations. I won't mention, which.

Speaker 5 (16:37):
It makes me very It makes me very angry, and
so I've had those dreams at the same time, though
on the other side, I wanted to provide for my family.

Speaker 3 (16:48):
I wanted to be self sufficient financially, and so all
those it's constant. It was a constant battle in my
head about what I should be doing. And so that's
why I oscillated that from fourth so often, between going
from private sector to public sector and private and always
trying to see if I can.

Speaker 4 (17:08):
Get both, you know.

Speaker 3 (17:10):
And that's why I said, at a consulting firm where
I was at, I was lucky because I was able
to do projects for both vectors. Yeah, but ultimately, you know,
at a certain time, I think I just let it
all go and to say it's not possible to fulfill
every aspect of what you want for yourself for your family.

(17:34):
You just make the best of what makes sense in
that moment. And at this period in my life, I
think this profession makes the most sense. Now. Ask me
a decade from now.

Speaker 4 (17:44):
It could be a different profession.

Speaker 3 (17:46):
But I also don't necessarily think that's a terrible thing.
You know, we come from the previous generation. I believe
it's all about one career, one path your whole life,
and this is what you do. And there's something really
before and that. We were just in Japan recently and
you see these kind of old let's say, you know,

(18:07):
sushi KapS or nagiche that have been doing the same
thing for decades and decades and decades, and they have
not changed, they have not veered from their original ambition
and dreams. There's something really beautiful and admirable in that
level of dedication and commitment to a craft. On the
flip side, though, I also think that life is really big,

(18:29):
you know, and we are so incredibly lucky to have
so many opportunities and to the ability to pursue different opportunities.
And this goes back to what I was telling you
about before, the curiosity. I am curious about different professions.
I am curious about what people do, and so why
wouldn't I try that if I had the chance to

(18:50):
try all of those things. And so if I switched
careers three or four times, it just kind of matched
the moment and match the time of life. It imatged
kind of things that were happening and how I feel then.
But also keeping in mind that that is an incredibly
privileged position to be in and not necessarily great for

(19:13):
my career, you know, having an expertise is always better
than being a generalist. But that's kind of how I've
made decisions for better or worse.

Speaker 1 (19:24):
Yeah, so it sounds like there's a lot of fluidity,
a lot of balance and trial and error and being
okay in the gray and just not being stuck in
one thing or the other. Like everyone doesn't have that,
you know, or everyone doesn't massage that or like invest
in that because it's a different way of being, it's
a different way of living. And you said it so

(19:46):
eloquently about people who do you know, our previous generations
who do one job thirty years however long retire, get
go watch or be an expert, whatever case may be.
Like you didn't allow that history perspective to taint your
view of how you choose to live your life, which
sounds very independent, independent thinker filler liver like you live

(20:12):
based on your own rules, is what it sounds like.
And how did you get here? How did you go from?
You know, I'm this person or this student being surrounded
by these things and I'm choosing to do things in
a new and different way and I'm okay with it.

Speaker 4 (20:33):
Well, thanks for asking the question.

Speaker 3 (20:34):
I don't think I've really again thought about that specifically.

Speaker 4 (20:40):
I will say my mom, I don't know.

Speaker 3 (20:42):
How people remember their childhood, you know, whether they actually
have those memories, or whether it's informed by pictures or
stories that are told to you by others, and it's
actually not their own narrative but by somebody else's. Well,
had a lot of stories about me when I was younger,
and I don't remember this, but she always said that
my grandfather when I was about like four, three or

(21:02):
four years old, my grandfather used to tell her so sorry.
The backstory of my parents lived in Japan for a
couple of years when I was I think four to six,
and so I lived with my grandparents at the time,
and when they came back, my grandfather told my mom,
you know, she's she has a lot of her own ideas.

(21:24):
Don't kill it. Wow, wow, which is really hard. I
think it's a very it's quite rare from what I understand,
especially of that generation, to respect children's and random thoughts, feelings,
ideas that well, and in our households there are so

(21:45):
many debates all the time, you know, we were always debating,
we were always talking about and they take the smallest
thing that I would just make a debate out of it.
I don't think it was contentious. It might sound contentious
other people, but for us there was always such an
open space for us our ideas, and so I feel
like the you know, certain people maybe within the familieset

(22:10):
the tone for allowing that to happen.

Speaker 4 (22:13):
And therefore it's.

Speaker 3 (22:15):
Not that I don't question the question, is all the time,
constantly dumb myself, but yeah, I do have strong ideas
as well.

Speaker 1 (22:25):
Yeah, so it sounds like, you know, the old version
who you once were, you were provided with an environment
to think, to ask questions, to debate, to discuss. It
wasn't you know, your child stay in a child's place.
What if you If you have an opinion, I'll give
you one, which is very That's that was my upbringing.
But for you, it sounds like it was just open

(22:46):
to be who you are and to get different perspectives.

Speaker 2 (22:50):
And talk about them. That's definitely a privilege, that's right.
That's definitely a privilege. That's huge.

Speaker 3 (22:57):
Yeah, and especially for our culture too. I don't know,
when you think about your upbringing, whether it was a
cultural thing or whether it's specific or your family culture
or you know, socvital culture are, but you know, being
Asian that that was kind of unheard of. You know,
even our education system was very authoritative. It's very top down,

(23:22):
it's very do as you're told, and you really can't
question authority in any real way.

Speaker 4 (23:28):
So I feel like my.

Speaker 3 (23:29):
Family is quite I got I won the lottery and
kind of being born in that family. Not to say
that this is the right way of being. I just
think it worked for me.

Speaker 2 (23:41):
That's huge.

Speaker 1 (23:42):
Oh man, I'm enjoying all of this right now. I
hope you all are listeners paying attention. Are you seeing
the signs, are you seeing the parallels, are you seeing
the themes? Are you seeing or hearing rather what's coming up?
And I hope you're paying attention to what's said and
what's unsaid because there's a lot of dynamics here and
I really appreciate you and open and willing to talk
about it. So switching gears a moment, going from one

(24:05):
particular world of business into the help and profession. These
are two different worlds in so many different ways. How
do you how did you navigate both? And how are
you now compared to the previous environment that you in?
Because you mentioned the drinking culture, that's also a culture
on helping professional side, but in different ways than on

(24:28):
the business side. So I'll love to hear your perspective
on navigating two different worlds.

Speaker 3 (24:34):
Honesty, I still struggle with it. I all about you
to hear your perspective on this too, because I can't
make sense of a lot of things, and this was
maybe just a lack of experience and.

Speaker 4 (24:46):
Not having.

Speaker 3 (24:48):
You know, too many years practicing. But in business there's
a lot of certainty, and if full certainty, let's.

Speaker 4 (24:56):
Be clear, you know, the.

Speaker 3 (24:59):
Elon must cons there and tell you he the succession.
He doesn't know, I don't think. I don't think anybody
really knows. Most people write books about what success is
looking backwards, right, and that has a lot of biases
in that. Yeah, but there, but working day to day
in those environments, I like there was a path. Therely

(25:23):
a question and then there was an answer, and there
was a way to get to the answer, and that
process is quite formulated, depending obviously on what you do.
I think as an entrepreneur, those are very different things.
But if you work in the corporation, you know, marketing,
there's a certain job description associated with that.

Speaker 4 (25:40):
You know, in finance.

Speaker 3 (25:41):
There's definitely a lot of certainty in the numbers in
our profession. It is, like you say, Gray, there is
a huge variance in style, in personality, in approach, and
I don't know, I struggle. I struggle with it because

(26:04):
there I don't know what the benchmark is and you
and I have talked about this. I don't know what
is the a gold standard. I don't know what is
best practice and those are those are words that you
know you would you would use the jobs and living
with that type of uh, you know, uncertain a certainty

(26:25):
can be a little bit stressful because it's also hard
to know whether it's something you're doing or it's just
part of the profession. Yeah, it's it's difficult.

Speaker 4 (26:37):
I don't know.

Speaker 3 (26:37):
I'd love to hear your thoughts on it.

Speaker 2 (26:39):
Okay, well, I don't mind sharing.

Speaker 1 (26:40):
So for me, I started in the helping profession first,
and then I desire then transition to corporate and then
from corporate back into the helping profession. And what I've
learned about navigating the navigating the two is there are
two different cultures, there are two different entities, two different aspects.

Speaker 2 (27:00):
So therefore I'm the same. But I'm going.

Speaker 1 (27:03):
Into two different environments. So how I viewed it is,
you know, the best way I can describe it. Say,
for instance, if I'm preparing to go to a golf
match versus a NCAA college football game, two different worlds.
How I dress, what I say, what I do, the
whole is different. So I'm still me authentically, but I

(27:26):
had to cater, or I chose to cater to the
event or environment that I was in. Just like it's
not likely you're gonna wear the same thing to a
college football game that you would wear to a golf match.

Speaker 2 (27:38):
It's just not likely.

Speaker 1 (27:39):
You can if you want some attention, but for the
most part, it's not likely to do that. So for me,
how I navigated I had to understand the environment that
I was in, and because of my lived experience and background,
I knew this wasn't the help and profession. I knew
people really didn't give a shit about me personally professionally.
It was more of a trend actional relationship that I

(28:01):
experienced corporate versus a relational experience where people in the
health and profession I've learned more often than not, people
really care more about the person than just the job
position or title.

Speaker 2 (28:16):
So that was my experience.

Speaker 1 (28:17):
I understood the two worlds and I found a way
to infiltrate both because it's me. You know, I can
be in any environment because I have to determine what
the environment is and how do I fit in it. Now,
over time, I can only wear the mask so long
if I enjoyed college football games, I'm not finna spend

(28:38):
a lot of time at the golf course. So I recognize. Listen,
I'm a football fan. Y'all can chase this little white
ball all day, but I'm a football fan. That's why
I belong with Beard. There's liquor there, There's plenty to
drink and eat. I can make a lot of noise
because I'm loud. This is my arena. So I had
to decide. Because the arenas do not change, we do.

(29:00):
So I had to decide, Hey, this is a better
fit for me. Fortunately for me, I've already been there before.
So now that I'm coming back, I'm going to come
back better different because I had the experience of corporate.
So that's how I've navigated both for us, and I
can mix and mingle in both.

Speaker 2 (29:17):
I prefer this. I prefer this over corporate any day. Now.

Speaker 1 (29:21):
I'm still connected to corporate in a lot of different ways,
but because academia is corporate, whether we want to admit
to it or not. So I'm still working in academia,
which is corporate, but it's a different level of corporate
or capitalism just depends on who you ask. So for me,
it's being able to identify with who I am at
the time and one environment that I choose to be

(29:42):
in which you ty you touched on a bit where
this rollercoaster of life, you've been different people doing different things,
and now in this new environment, it's.

Speaker 2 (29:51):
Like, Okay, what what am I supposed to do? Now?

Speaker 1 (29:54):
There is no you know, org structure because it doesn't
exist until I create it. And that's really difficult to
be in the world of living in when you come
from a different structure that.

Speaker 2 (30:04):
Has everything like outlined.

Speaker 1 (30:07):
In addition, I do want to put an asterisk in there,
even though it may seem black and white. Corporate, you know,
climb the ladder, you do all these different things. Corporate
is ran by people that have their own personalities, their
own crap, their own stuff. So a lot of times
you can follow the yellow big road and follow this
criteria and still don't get to where you're trying to

(30:28):
go because of people peopling. And one thing I learned
about people, you cannot stop people from peopling. And in
the corporate environment, I saw a lot of people peopling
and I had a hard time with it.

Speaker 2 (30:40):
So that's my take on it. I hope that kind
of helps.

Speaker 3 (30:44):
It's so interesting as you were talking, I was thinking
about kind of your presence in class as well. When
you talk, it's this idea of fitting into the environment,
adjusting yourself to fit to the environment, to the arena,
which is such an I feel like it's also quite

(31:06):
an important skill. Now at a certain point it becomes
your choice to walk away from that because, like you said,
there wasn't for you, but you now have the confidence
to say I was able to do it. I you know,
you developed the confidence that I was able to adapt
to that, which is you know, I feel like that's

(31:27):
kind of how you.

Speaker 4 (31:28):
Build resilience as well.

Speaker 3 (31:29):
Is too. It might not be super comfortable, but you
learn to fit into the environment, and it's the responsibility
is incumbent on you to fit to the environment rather
than to expect it to happen the other way around
for you.

Speaker 2 (31:43):
That's huge. Yes, absolutely, and I would agree on hundred percent.

Speaker 1 (31:48):
It did give me confidence because for me and just
my experience, a lot of people have this desire to
go corporate, to do corporate. You know, I don't want
to work on Wall Street, and I want to do
this and that, And it's all great based off of
how it sounds and what you think about it until
you're in it, and I don't know anything in life

(32:09):
that's exactly how you imagine it to be a parent,
being married, being divorced, being seen, all these different things,
being in a doc program, master's program, all these things.
Before we got into it, we had ideas about it,
and those ideas are just that an idea, it's not fact.
And those ideas come from so much information that we're

(32:30):
inundated with from birth to where we are now related
to these ideas of things and not the reality. So
I feel as though for me, I got to a
place when I saw reality and I didn't like what
I saw. I just didn't and I never got comfortable
with it ever. So I was in this uncomfortable environment,

(32:51):
constantly growing and building and changing, but I never got
comfortable in this environment. I'm uncomfortable as well, but for
different reasons because I'm I'm still trying to get better.
That's the uncomfortable. On this side, I'm trying to get better.
I'm comfortable.

Speaker 2 (33:04):
On the other side, I'm trying to fit a square
peg in a round hole.

Speaker 1 (33:08):
Doesn't work, doesn't work. So there's different levels of comfort.
And for me, that just wasn't the most uncomfortable environment
for me. And I'm thankful going back to that confidence
piece that I had a chance to experience it, because
some people never do. So if I never experienced corporate
life and I'm working this stuff the job, doing these other things,
I always have that desire, that wish, that want, that

(33:30):
idea and never can fulfill it. I had a desire, wish,
want an idea, and I was able to fulfill it.

Speaker 2 (33:37):
I ain't never got to go back, but I'm glad
I went.

Speaker 3 (33:42):
Yeah. I think this idea concept is really is really
important too, you know. I think about the pressure that
we put on teams to make decisions about their careers
based on what either based on their experience with the
people are around them and what they do, or based
on an idea of what it is and how are

(34:04):
ideas shaped. Oftentimes with media, you know, let's say the
Instagram and TikTok is all part of the you know
what is being are exposed to their ideas of what
jobs look like. But it's not tangible and it's not real,
and I wish we could offer something better than that,
Like that is not enough to make kids go. You know,

(34:27):
I don't want to say waste, because I don't think
any experience of a waste, but I spend years of
their life doing something that maybe isn't right for them.
Now again, I'm watching walking contradiction because of course it's
also good to do, you know, have these experiences and
then build character, et cetera, et cetera. But you know,
wouldn't it be better if we offered just better information

(34:49):
about what professions look like, what jobs look like, what
the day to day is. Going back to the day
in the life thing. I always felt like that has
a lot of value, and we just don't have enough
information or the information that we give them is wild,
wildly off from the reality.

Speaker 2 (35:07):
Yes, a couple of things we working today. We are
working today.

Speaker 1 (35:10):
I hope y'all listening, all right, So what you share
is really big, is really powerful, because I don't know
anybody who didn't have the same lived experience that we
had of you know, this is the career, this is
where you go, this is what you do, but not
knowing the details around it. For example, for me, growing up,
I was always taught and told that, you know, if

(35:31):
you want to be successful, you go to college. And
for me, I was in college material at the time.
I didn't even realize that I wasn't.

Speaker 3 (35:39):
Well.

Speaker 1 (35:40):
I knew I wasn't, but that wasn't a desire for mine.
So for me, in my environment, culture, community background, our
biggest level of success was graduating from high school.

Speaker 2 (35:51):
That was it. And after high school you.

Speaker 1 (35:53):
Get a job meaning burg King, Taco, bell Arby's, you
go to military, or you work at a factory. So
that was the big three for me. College wasn't even
a conversation until later. In the conversation that came later
about college was yo, you're in because I was going
to go to the military at first. So me wanting
to go to the military is because most of my
family was in the military, and most of the family

(36:14):
that was in the military encouraged me, Hey, before you
go to the military. Just try college first, That's what
they told me.

Speaker 2 (36:22):
Try it.

Speaker 1 (36:22):
I said, I'm gonna try it out. If I flunk out,
guess what, I'm going to the military. That was my
whole agenda. So I went to college and found out, Man,
I really like it here.

Speaker 2 (36:32):
This is cool.

Speaker 1 (36:34):
And my thought was once I graduate, then I made
it because of my ignorance, which for many of us,
we go and go into these professions, at these jobs
and we find out that it doesn't fulfill us, and
it also doesn't sustain us. And some people don't have
the privilege, the courage, the awareness to shift or change.

(36:56):
So I think we all may deal with that, and
I agree with you, I wish there was a better
system in place. And because it's not my opinion, my
perspective and this is for all of you listening, is
we have to create it. And that's what the helping
profession taught me. Corporate doesn't teach you about creating anything
you follow suit. Helping profession gives you permission to create

(37:21):
whatever doesn't exist, and if it does, then you can
do it. So those are different worlds that we're navigating,
and again I'm able to pull from each one and
it enhances who I am as a person. Last thing,
I'm a hush I promise life work. So this is
life work for the listeners. As you all know, I
don't give homework. I'm believing homework because you do homework,

(37:45):
you take it home, you do it, you turnity, never forget,
you never remember it again.

Speaker 2 (37:48):
So it's a waste.

Speaker 1 (37:48):
It's part of our educational system, or backwards educational system.
We ain't gotta go that far. But life work is
things that you do. When you take it home, you
do it, you change, you become a different person. So
and just share gives us anybody listening the opportunity to
choose to do different And what is said to me
is if I don't have a chance to see behind

(38:10):
the scenes of what's going on, I get the ins
and outs of it. Then I can begin asking people
who do it, what is your life like? What is
this career like? What's the thing nobody talks about? And
I guarantee you you interview up to ten people doing
whatever job you can imagine, you're going to get ten
different perspective, ten different ideas, ten different options to choose

(38:32):
from versus just one. Go to college, you'll be successful,
which was a lie. Ah, just my three cents? All right,
what's you got name?

Speaker 3 (38:44):
Yeah, I completely agree with you. And I think this
perspective of if it doesn't exist, make it happen for yourself,
you know, and give yourself permission to be bold and
to fail and to you know, give it a go,
is a really good one. And I'll say too, it's
something that I've learned because in one of my jobs,

(39:06):
we used to do a lot of interviewing people. People
in different professions too. People love talking about themselves, Yes,
they really do. You know. It's such no one ever
asks yes, And so when someone does feel like, oh
you want to hear my story? If you don't know,
you try, like interviewing a member of your family. You know,
they're just so happy that you ask the question about

(39:28):
their life. You know, we all, I think, want to
be seen in some ways. So I don't think anyone ever,
I don't think that, Yeah, a reasonable person ever turns
anybody down for asking the question of what does your
profession look like? What does it feel like? And then
I guess it's a secondary thought to that. I really
like Alan de Bouton and he in one of his thoughts.

(39:50):
He is saying that. I think it was at Google
actually when he did this talk. The idea that we
always feel like what we're currently doing at the job
is really really important, right, and it is in a
lot of ways. You know, you have a team, you
don't want to let your team down, You're moving towards
a goal. Those are all important things. Another perspective of

(40:14):
how to make yourself useful in its life is just
to go through the day and look at all times
where those moments could be improved, like certain moments could
be improved, and dedicate your life to improving one of
those moments. You know, you go into the grocery store
and you see an old person with who might be

(40:35):
who might be in a wheelchair and can't get up.
So do something about that, Innovate about that, create something
you know, rather than just being upset potentially at the world.
Find and if you write them down, I think you'll
find lots of moments and life and you're not happy.
There are so many opportunities for improvements and find one

(40:58):
of those. To dedicate your time too is quite worthwhile
as well.

Speaker 2 (41:03):
That's you. Oh man, this is so good, all right?

Speaker 1 (41:06):
So I got a few rapid fire questions as we
get ready to close out, And I'm curious to hear
your perspective because you have such a diverse perspective.

Speaker 2 (41:16):
I would say, because it's not limited. It's not one
thing or the other. It's just fluid. And you're so curious,
like you still want to know more.

Speaker 1 (41:25):
Although you've done all these amazing things, it's still like, yeah,
I did that, but what else is out here?

Speaker 2 (41:31):
What else can I do? What else can I experience
it or explore?

Speaker 1 (41:34):
So I'm curious to know what would you say to
be your biggest life lesson from who you were to
who you are to who you're becoming. What's one of
those big life lessons that you've got from your experiences.

Speaker 4 (41:47):
It's really hard.

Speaker 3 (41:48):
Because I don't think I had one life lesson. I
would say the thing that held me back the most
throughout my professional career is that I was maybe too
self critical. And this is why I said the word
bold too. I don't think I was bold enough. Maybe
from the outside looking in is different, but from the

(42:09):
inside when I when I look at my I don't
have a lot of regrets. I can I'm lucky enough
to say that but I could have been a lot
more grave to try different things and do different things
and say the things that shouldn't be said without fear
that I was going to get shut down or that
was going to look fully, you know, shame and humiliation

(42:30):
is something that I've lived with for a really long time.
You know. The literature says that it's cultural. I'm not sure.
I think it could be, but there could be other
influences too. I wish I didn't have to carry that.
I didn't have to carry all of that with me.
I think my life would be a lot more free
and comfortable if I were just able to say what's on.

Speaker 4 (42:52):
My mind and.

Speaker 3 (42:55):
Explore the idea that I wanted to explore. If that
makes any.

Speaker 2 (42:59):
Sense, it does.

Speaker 1 (43:00):
So that's an example of who you were? So who
are you now? If that's what you you know, I
could have done these things differently? Are you doing those
things now? Who are you now? How would you describe
the version of you now based off of who you
just described yourself, who you used to be?

Speaker 4 (43:16):
I guess I can articulate that now.

Speaker 3 (43:19):
I have enough awareness that that was something and I
can reconcile it. You know, I'm not caring that it's
because the narrative is a little bit more clear in
my head. I don't have to carry it with me
so much. And there are still moments where I feel
very anxious, and if I say the wrong things in

(43:42):
a social setting or in an interview, you know, I
could be really hard on myself for many days afterwards.
That still happened. But I can contain it a little
bit better now because I know what it is. I
can pinpoint it. But you know, this is the other
thing too, especially in mental health. I feel like we
have a lot of awareness, but translating the awareness into

(44:02):
emotions and into behavior, I think it's that we're still
missing as a group. It is just so much harder,
And so I'm getting off tangent again. But the idea
of maybe having too much awareness is real well, because
if you just know all these things about yourself but

(44:23):
you don't know what to do with it, that can
be very debilitating. So I think where I am now
is trying to find that balance between knowing myself but
not knowing too much, and then taking enough actions to
at least create some kind of mental peace with where
I am at this moment, and knowing that it will change,

(44:44):
knowing that things could get better, things could get worse,
that there's no kind of perfect version of myself even
in the end state. I don't know what that will
look like.

Speaker 1 (44:55):
And be okay with that powerful powerful And it sounds
like you know, to to summarize a bit, it's self
awareness and implementation, So you have to have both. So yes,
this profession is really big on self awareness. But what's
the implementation?

Speaker 2 (45:11):
So huge? Huge?

Speaker 1 (45:13):
I see you, I see you, all right. So next question,
curious a word, phrase, memory, or moment that has stuck
with you personally or professionally that you want to share
with the listeners.

Speaker 3 (45:25):
H also really hard. You asked the hard question.

Speaker 2 (45:31):
Like that's what That's what I'm here for.

Speaker 3 (45:35):
I you know, just because we were talking about Alan
de Buton, I think he also said, you know, make
sure that our ideas are of success, are our own,
and that we are the authors of our own ambition
because oftentimes I don't know if people have experienced this,

(45:56):
but you know, like you said, the ideas of what
things are and what it could look like and what
it could be, that's what we strive for so often
and from a mental health perspective. You know, when we fail,
we think of failures are ours. Yeah, you know, and
both of those things aren't true. The idea of success

(46:18):
wasn't quite real because we don't really know what it's like,
and our failures are never all of ours either, because
there are so many other things that are part of
the equation that led us to where we are. So
you know, we're always working with imperfect information, but like
you said, gather as much information as possible so that
we can design our own path and design our own

(46:42):
day to day life. Not the idea of where our
life is, but the designer day to day life that
I think is a much stronger a contributor to our
well being and a happiness. Then what is happening I
guess cognitive flatters the thinking about.

Speaker 2 (47:01):
Absolutely.

Speaker 1 (47:02):
Listeners, Listen, you'are gonna keep getting hit in the head
with this honeymoon because Nan, it's dropping gems, Okay, dropping gems.
I love all of it, and it gives perspective. It
gives a perspective of how we can choose to live
life differently. And it sounds like your lived experience's background, culture,
upbringing has given you all of this to get here,
and I can't imagine where you're gonna be. I'm thinking

(47:24):
third career may be in philosophy or something. You know,
I can see you doing that. I wish in being
a chef and being so many other things because we can,
we can if we choose to. So I'm curious interesting
fact about Nan that people don't know.

Speaker 3 (47:43):
I guess nobody really knows me, So I guess various
things could be interesting. I'm really I guess I'm a
I'm a critic, but I'm an optimist at the same time.
So it's the difference there that I'm not cynical, can
be critical without being cynical, if that makes sense.

Speaker 2 (48:02):
Okay, could you give us an example.

Speaker 3 (48:07):
You know, throughout the day, I get really angry about
a lot of things. My partner knows this. He is
really tired of listening to me. If I'm glad I
can share this with you and alleviate some of his burden.
But I always think that there's a way through it.
I always think that there is a fix for this,
and it shouldn't be this hard. If I say that
all the time, it shouldn't be this hard, Like there

(48:27):
should be lots of fixes that we could that we
can implement even though there are a lot of issues
in our lives with our society, but they're all fixable.
We can get a little bit better. We can get
ten percent better at each of those things. And I
never lose hope of that.

Speaker 2 (48:47):
Yeah, so, yeah, I agree with that one hundred percent.

Speaker 3 (48:50):
I have one percent.

Speaker 1 (48:53):
And I feel as though this is me processing in
real time that the problems and the solutions often the
solutions to the problems are often missed, very similarly to
why people stop being curious.

Speaker 2 (49:10):
Very I feel like there's a parallel there.

Speaker 1 (49:12):
Well, but there's I feel like there's a parallel, Like
you know, curiosity is covered by so many other layers
of stuff, just like solutions to problems are covered by
so many different levels areas of stuff. It prevents us
from being able to do the simple things. Curiosity is
the simple things problems and solutions to the problem is

(49:33):
simple things. But it's everything else around it that prevents
it from happening.

Speaker 2 (49:38):
Just my three.

Speaker 4 (49:39):
There's a lot of noise.

Speaker 1 (49:40):
Yeah, yes, yes, and we can't do the small things.
Oh okay, last question, keepsake life work. If you were
to give some life work to the listeners. If you
were to give a keep type something that you use,
something you've heard, something that works for you that you
want to share it to the audience, maybe to help them.

(50:00):
What would that life work be that you want to offer.

Speaker 3 (50:07):
I guess along thet theme lines would may be told
in a different way. Just make some calls. I know
it sounds strange. It was an piece of advice that
my manager gave me when I was working. She was like,
just make some calls. Now. I was really I had
a really hard time putting my stamp on certain things,
you know, coming to an absolute conclusion, being certain of

(50:32):
a number, of a decision, of a outcome, of an outcome,
Just make some calls. You know, you're not going to
be a hundred percent right, you're not going to be
a hundred percent wrong. Just make a call and then
we'll go from there. And I feel like not making
decisions is much worse than making the wrong one. I

(50:54):
think in everything, in all the decisions that people make
in their life, especially when it comes to their career,
I think you kind of just to make a calls
of times when it could go either way. But even
these are also really good at making sense out of things,
so we can't really go wrong.

Speaker 1 (51:10):
That's huge, And I hope you are paying attention to
the nuggets, the gems, because how you ended this conversation
is exactly how you are not connected. It wasn't a
phone call. It was a conversation. Hey, I need to
pick your brain. That's how our relationship developed. I need
to talk to you. I got I got some things
going on. I could use some whatever you got, I

(51:32):
could use it. So you're ending exactly how our connection began.
By asking questions, by picking up the phone, by making time,
by making yourself available to get someone's perspective or lived
experience or idea to help you navigate how you want
to move in life. It's huge, full circle, full circle.
I don't think I don't believe in coincidences. I don't

(51:54):
think anything is a coincidence. Everything happens for a reason,
rather I'm paying attention to it or not. There's a
reason that you're here now. There's a reason that we're
talking now. There's a reason to all of you that's listening,
that you're right here, right now in real time, listening
to this episode and getting things to help you at
least make a phone call, because that's your life work

(52:15):
for this week. So man, if people want to reach out,
they want to talk to you, they want to connect
with you, they want to pick your brain, they want
to take you to lunch, gie, some coffee, whatever, if
they want to be on your team.

Speaker 2 (52:24):
How can anybody get in touch with you.

Speaker 3 (52:28):
I'm not big on social media, so it's actually kind
of hard. And then if you search nan When on LinkedIn,
you'll find some ping pong players, You'll see lots of
a lot of Chinese people, So that's probably not easy
to find me either. But I work with a private
practice right now called Connection k I N N E
c t I O N DOT feel. We work a

(52:50):
lot with children and making sure that children are supported
not just from a mental health perspective, but their entire
well being, you know, covering all the ranges of the
different the different aspects of children actually and teams life
that need to be covered, and taking the holistic approach
because I do think that that part is missing. But

(53:10):
that's probably the easiest way to get in touch with me.
Any of those emails on the site will be fine.

Speaker 1 (53:16):
Thank you for sharing, Thank you for sharing. This is
another amazing episode of the Three Parallels podcast with your
hosts me the One and Only Doctor Jason Branch, where
we discuss who we were, who we are, and who
we are becoming. I hope this podcast episode has been
helpful for you to help you dive in to figure
out who you are instead of living in the world

(53:36):
of who you once were. That version of you is
dead and gone and only thing left is a ghost. Hastag,
Patrick Swayze hashtag, Casper hashtag any of the ghost you
can think of, so it needs to be present in
who you actually are to make room for your better
self Who's on the way when you get out the way,
have a great day, Much love, peace,

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The Arenas Do Not Change…We Do! | Ft Nan Wang

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}The Arenas Do Not Change…We Do! | Ft Nan Wang