EP62 - CAR CON CARNE

Get ready for an epic crossover episode as Barguments the Podcast and Car Con Carne join forces at the iconic Gene and Jude's in Chicago!

Hosts Dan "Bass" Levy and James Van Osdol bring you a mouth-watering, laugh-filled adventure as they dive into delicious debates and tasty discussions.

In this special episode, Dan and James talk about all things food, radio, and more. From arguing about the best sandwich to debating the greatest bands named after food, no topic is off the table. 

Once again, please continue to share the Barguments the Podcast with neighbors and friends, and make sure you subscribe so you never miss an episode of the show. And while you are at it, please give us a 5-star rating and share your feelings about Bargumentst by leaving a review on whatever platform you listen to the show.

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Arguments is recorded in front of alive studio audience. What's up, everybody,
Yeah, Welcome, ladies and gentlemento a very special episode of Arguments
to Podcasts where we dive into fun, debatable topics they get everyone talking.
I'm your host, Dan Levy.Today we got something truly exciting in store.

(00:20):
That's right, we are teaming upwith my buddy James van Osdel and
we are actually doing a collab episodewith his podcast, Carcomb Carne, where
he drives around Chicago interviewing foodie people, artists and all kinds of different guests.
We decided this will be a funone. I've never been to Geena
and June's, the hot Dogs dandin Chicago before, so we decided to

(00:41):
make a collab podcast out of thisone. So we're about in the road
and tackle some of the most entertainingtopics we can think of. So buggle
up, get ready for a ridefulof laughs, heated debates, and maybe
even a few surprises on this one. This is Barguments meets Carcombe Carne.
It's carcn co Let's Mee car carcon Cone Now show show. I tell

(01:23):
you I'm proud of you for beingable to record your voice step at home.
I never want to do any recordingat home ever again. Ever since
COVID and doing like two hundred episodesof this, I don't want. I
have PTSD from Zoom recordings all that. I don't. I just want to
be in my car eating hot dogsin perpetuity. I'm down with that too.
Yeah, I'm down with that too. But there is something that just
going in and nobody's bothering. Igot my YouTube videos. If I need

(01:48):
to take a chill out for asecond, I just crushed my work.
I get that, all right.This is a collaborative podcast. Can I
still read my sponsor if it's aquestion, please? Carcon Karne is sponsored
by easy Automation, easy Dash Automationdot net. Transform your living space with
cutting edge home automation, experienced seamlesscontrol of audio, video, lighting,
climate, security, and more.Embrace the future of smart living, your

(02:10):
home your rules, motherfucker. Geta quote by visiting easy Dash Automation dot
net. Or give my guy Dan, not the guy Dan sitting next to
me right now, but the otherDan, the Easy Automation Dan. Give
him a call at six three zeroseven three zero three seven two eight six
three zero seven three zero three seventwo eight. He says he kind of
likes when I do that. Incase you're wondering, I like it.
I like it. I wish moreadvertisers were on board with that, you

(02:34):
would think in this realm, thepodcasting space, it would be more open
to that. Well, the nameof the game is being memorable, right,
that's right. Don't you want tobe the motherfucker? I want to
be. I want to be themotherfucker a guy who gets the biggest prize
out of that. So, yes, that's right. Carklon Karne is a
Q and A one podcast. I'mJames van ossel I mentioned this is a
collaborative podcast. So what is happeningright now is I'm recording this for Carklon

(02:55):
Karne. Is happening for Bargaments.Yes, welcome to those fans as well,
all three of them. This ismy wife and my son. This
exact podcast will be shared out totwo different fan bases. Nothing but fame
awaits us after this. Dan Levyis the architect, the host, the
man his spearheading arguments. What isarguments? Bargaments is a podcasts where we

(03:20):
argue topics that are very silly thatdon't have a real answer, and it's
something you do with your buddies ata bar, a barbecue, barber shop,
hot hot in this case iconic Chicagohot dog restaurants. So here's a
little insider information. I'm recording atGene and Judes. If ever you listen
to carkon Carney or watching it onvideo with some dude and you see or

(03:40):
hear that I'm at Gene and Juds, it means I don't have a restaurant
sponsor, and this is the cheapestthing I could do, actually the chiefest
thing, because it's my pleasure.Yes, this one was my pleasure,
the one that brought the idea toyou, and you are the reason twenty
plus years i've lived in Chicago everhad Gene and Judes until today. I'm

(04:01):
so glad you're well. We shouldstart eating as we're talking. There you
go. So for those pargument fanswho have never heard or seen Carko and
Karne, I've been doing this forgoing on eleven years. The general premise,
not always said here to general premiseis I meet my guest at a
local restaurant, group pub, placeof note, and we eat and chat
in my parked car, and Iswear to god I was doing this before

(04:21):
James Cordon and a lot of thoseother Well, first of all, I
don't even know which want I gota double, but I don't care which
one is rich And Judes, thisfeels way more substanti. That's a big
guy. Yeah, this is asingle dog. As I said to Dan
when we walked in Gena and Judes, your choices are hot dogs are hot
dogs? Yeah, all the differenthot dog places that people always tell me

(04:43):
to go to, the super dogs. Portillo's hot Dogs is like the third
thing on the list. Well,this way, it's only hot dogs,
only fries and Tomali's that's it.Yeah, and why would you get it
toimellysed? Yeah, so the DepressionDog. It's a hot dog couched in
a better French price which they cutand make make a house amazing. Their

(05:04):
fries are great, are absolutely great. Now, Dan Levy astute Carkloncarney listener
slash watchers. I have been alistener and a watcher of this podcast.
Well, I was gonna see theexception when you and Mike Bratton were getting
barbecued. And you've also been aguest. You were my guest at Chicago
Culinary Kitchen. You were my guestat Ricabenny's. That was a really good

(05:26):
those both were really good. Well, my first time soloing it with you,
and I've honored long overdue yes,and we lasted this pre pandemic.
I will say, James, youare one of the few people in radio
that your I would say your reputation. I knew who you were before I
met you, and that's because youwere a Columbia graduate. And I remember

(05:47):
a boss what are your bosses?His name was Bill Gamble, we'll drop
the name. He came into aclass and his famous story to our class
was that you came in one dayyou weren't on the air, and you
just said, I think I'm betterthan everybody here. I want to be
on the air. Okay, one, I've asked you that before. I
don't think that's the truth. Youknow me well enough to know that I
would never say that. Now thatI've gotten to know you, I can't

(06:10):
imagine you're doing that. I believeI said something along the lines of here's
the situation. I was working asa programming assistant. It was my first
job out of an internship. Thewoman who is hosting the local show then
called the Local Music Showcase Leonardo Carlo. Leonardo took a job on the East
Coast, so that position was vacated. The other disc jockeys at the radio

(06:30):
station weren't terribly interested in hosting andcurating thirty minutes or an hour worth of
independent local music, which during thenineties, they're fucking crazy not to have
wanted to do that. Yes,but I think I probably said something to
Bill at the time, because Iwas working for him. I said,
I think I can do this show. I would like to audition fort He's
like, hey, you got toput together a tape. I'd never done
that before. So what I didto get an audition together. I went

(06:54):
out and did three interviews with localman's never did that before, interviewed Wesley
Willis and Lounge Jack's, interviewed LoudLucy at Fireside Bowl and a band called
the Newbile Things at Martyrs Wow.And I grabbed actualities sound bites from each
of those interviews and spliced them intoa demo show using real local bands at

(07:16):
the time, and I got thejob. I think was it a great
audition? Probably not, but Iwas the only one who raised his hand.
I don't know if anybody who's someof some first audition double on our
business is ever really that good,right, But I know yours is being
exceptionally well because of how much yourknowledge is. But I never went and
said I'm better than everyone else,like James went in and said, I

(07:41):
mean, ste what's on the air? I think I can do it better.
Steve Fisher, I'm kidding, Okay, let me Steve, miss you.
I've heard that name a lot oftime. I love that guy.
Steve is one of those smart dudesin radio. Steve Fisher did afternoon Drive
on Q and A one during itsheyday, later replaced by Tim Version,
later replaced by Sledge. Sledge wasin real life replaced by Brian, his

(08:05):
other name. But Steve was oneof those smart dudes who saw the writing
on the wall for the industry andhe started building another career for himself.
And so he's been a super successfulreal estate And there's a lot of people
that have gone that I've known,have gone from radio to super successful in
real estate. And I know you'vekind of dipped your toes out of the
radio water. I tried. I'mdone. I'm during the pan, during

(08:28):
the pandemic, I got my insurancelicense. I did well. I just
can't leave it yet. There's there'sgoals I want to accomplish first. You
can't leave it before I can sayno more. I feel like there's like
three or four more bites of anapple that I want to accomplish before I
can say I've done what I want. No. Rare is the person who
leaves by choice. Yes, you'llbe done with radio when they tell you

(08:50):
you're done with radio. Oh,they've been telling me that for quite some
time. I mean, I hateto say it, but I would venture
to guess that's seventy five percent thepeople currently working in radio are currently working
their last ever radio jobs. Yes, which is a very scary thing.
And to be honest, when Iwent to Columbia College, we had Alan
Stagg, and the first day ofclass he crushed the entire class. And

(09:13):
everything you said was true. Everything'sgonna be automated in twenty years. You'll
all be either replaced by syndicated voicesor somebody from some other town. The
jobs will be swallowed up and visionary. There'll be very little work for anybody
to do. And then the nextday, the next class, I think
I was one of three people thatcame in and he said, you're probably

(09:33):
gonna make it, and now it'sit. But I would say out of
everybody went to Columbia with and allmy friends that are in radio, maybe
six are still doing it now.Since the inventions of podcasts and since this
whole medium has taken over, I'vebeen involved with podcasts since like two thousand
and seven. So I was doinga podcast out of my apartment in Ukrainian

(09:56):
village. I had chat copig,I had basketball players and NFL players coming
over, and I was doing podcastsfor that before anybody even knew how to
make money off of it. Andat the time I thought it was a
no go there. That's such ahipster thing to say I was doing podcasts
before it really is, but Iwould say there's there was no glory to
it until I told abe An,Abe Cannon, and Ryan Man. We

(10:18):
were all well, Abe and Iwere both kind of out of jobs.
Ryan was still working at Q oneon one and I just said it,
as long as we're not really doingmuch, let's do a podcast. And
then that podcast led to us beingthe Howard Stern channel, and then I
went, oh, okay, there'sa there's a way to make another life
out of this. And during thepandemic I was able to kind of curate

(10:39):
more clients and do more stuff likethis. So to be honest, as
long as I have like my handkind of in radio and in podcasting and
in voiceover, I feel like there'senough for me to not leave yet.
Yeah, I mean I tell peopleI do radio in my car now.
But it's awesome. This is thisis better than any studio I've ever been
in because they are hot. Yeah, I'm telling you. These fries they're

(11:01):
like perfectly salted. I yes,I think the fries are the unsung MVP.
I mean, your choices are hot, talk of their fries, but
the unsung MVP on the menu hereat Gin and Juds. It's an interesting
touch on Chicago has that when yougo to these upper echelon hot dog places,
the fries on the hot dog datingback to the Depression doesn't depress me
the least bit. No, Infact, I feel great about it.

(11:24):
And what's awesome the sport Peppers arekind of mingling with the fries at the
bottom I haven't even gotten there yet. Delight Mountain, delightful. All right,
So bargument started. When arguments starteda year ago, about a year,
almost a year and a half ago. I feel like it's been going
on forever. But you also workit really hard. Well. I try
my hardest because during the pandemic wewere all working from home. So the

(11:48):
job that I have is a withTotal Travel Network in Chicago, and for
the pandemic, they gave pretty muchI already had a home studio, but
they gave everybody else a home studio. So I thought that was going to
be what I was going to bedoing for the rest of this job.
But then, like everybody else,when all the restrictions came off, they
started making everybody come back, andthen they started telling us to come back

(12:09):
two to three days a week,and I was just like, you know
what, if I got to comehere and do traffic, I'm gonna spend
one hour come early, and I'llstart a podcast right and I'll try to
keep it up consistently, and likeeverything else, you and I both know
this. The part I hate aboutit the most is Boogey the guests.
But you do what. It's alabor I love because the hardest what do

(12:30):
you snag one like a white whale? You're like, this is amazing.
See, I mixed feelings. AndI've talked about this before about the guest
booking process. First of all,when Carcone Carne makes its first million dollars,
first thing I do is hiring.I'm going to hire a producer.
First thing. Yeah, Second thingI do, I'm going to get a
Coca Cola freestyle machine like you getat the AMC movie where you can get
like raspberry cocaine. Yeah, yeah, I love that. But it is

(12:52):
the hardest thing. What I've noticedwith my podcast, and it may be
different for arguments. White whales aregreat for branding and to get people's attention
to get more guests. They don'tnecessarily translate to listening. No no,
no no. And in fact,I've always been the one where comedians.
I've had comedians come on the podcast. Some are really good at this whole

(13:16):
format of podcasting and some are awful. And I've had either some guests where
I'm like, oh, I gotan athlete. That was what they get
on and you give them two questionsand they talk for forty five minutes and
you're like, uh, do youwant to like talk about what's the worst
way to put the Twilveth paper rollfor a argument? And then you feel

(13:39):
really awkward like breaking that up.So it's been up and it's the paper
test, it's the paper under yougot to go over. Yes, that's
what the most people say. Butto be honest every now and then,
but I want to change my luckin life. I'll switch it interesting as
lot since the pandemic. As longas there's something on the role, James,
I don't care which way it's comingout. I remember being so scared

(14:01):
the front and the top of thebottom. Yeah, do you have any
more whales? In terms of gotto what we're doing? Well, I'll
tell you I I'm approaching episode onethousand. That's gonna happen. I'm thinking
end of September. In fact,I'm building four live events to celebrate details
coming later this month. As I'mapproaching episode episode one thousand, I have

(14:22):
left a vacant spot. Wait,hang on, I got I saw you.
I saw you guys. What's yourname? Great to me? James,
Like you know, I was likeI saw them. Interview Uh Ethan
from Mossa. Yeah, that isunable. Guys. I saw the microphones.

(14:48):
I was like, I know theseguys. I'm just gonna I'm just
gonna triple check. But then youguys for your podcast. Yeah, that's
awesome. And eighth Ethan is likehe's a masterful chef. Yeah, he
is. The interview with him wasamazing. Thank you. This is Dan.
He does a podcast called Bargaments Nice. Nice. I really appreciate you
saying hi. Oh. Likewise,guys can get selfie. Yeah, you
can take a selfie. We're recordingwith this is perfect. Okay, great

(15:09):
selvy mid podcast. This is lighton the collaboration. Nice you guys so
much. Thank you guys, makeit nice. That's hilarious. Okay,
So he came up to the windowwith a speaking of famous I think that
was he came up to the windowwith my wife there with my podcast on
his cell phone to show that herecognized us. That's awesome. That was

(15:33):
what a cool dude. Thank youfor watching Joaquin? Right, yeah,
yeah, thank you Joaquin. Thatwas that was totally great. That was
awesome. Okay, That's what I'venever experienced before. So I lost my
train of thoughts. Oh, no, So as I'm approaching episode one thousand,
I have left a vacancy. Aswe're talking about white whales guests that

(15:54):
we would love to land, Idid not record an episode six hundred and
sixty six. I have left thatopen for either Alice Cooper, whoa Rob
Zombie, or John Carpenter. Thoseare my three white whales and three guests
who would be appropriate for episode sixsixty six. That was awesome. So

(16:15):
if you go back through the AliceCooper is someone gettable and I will try
to help you with that one.I've been trying for years. I've gotten
I've had his daughter on the podcast, and I've had his bass guitarist.
This is close, okay, soyou've definitely gone the distance of it.
Rob Zombie is definitely one. Ithink it would be everybody's white whale.
The music and the movie and especiallyof the horror movies. Oh yeah,

(16:36):
I for sure. So those aremy white whales. Who do you want
to barga you with? You knowwhat, It's funny. I wanted to
do a thing where I would kindof theme it out a little bit,
and during Halloween, I was like, you know what, during the summer,
during the spring, I'm gonna tryto get Freddy Krueger, I'm gonna
try to get Alvira, I'm gonnatry to get a Jason. And every
time I reach out to these people, they're all like they only want to

(17:00):
do their genres of podcasts. LikeI didn't realize there were genres. I
was like, it's the summertime.I was like, Okay, I guess
I won't. I guess I'll justhave exhibit. He's clearly gonna come on,
not a wrapping genre podcast, andhe'll come on instead. I do
one of guy I wanted to,I think for me, the uh White

(17:23):
Whales, having Freddy Krueger as FreddyKrueger Robert England specifically, yeah, and
just asking him questions and what wouldyou rather in terms of murder stuff,
And that's kind of what I wantedto throw at him. That might just
be a dream that may never everget lived. But so I did Candy

(17:44):
Corn Carne last October, and Idid all Halloween themed. Well that's what
I wanted to do. So Idid the oohs and o o z I
n a h. They're a monsterband. They dressed like monsters. Professional
awesome. I don't know how you'vegotten bands eat here. This car is
barely able to fit me. SoI had along those lines, I had
white Rabbit objects. I love thisband. Awesome independent Chicago band. Had

(18:06):
them on the podcast maybe three orfour weeks ago. Lead singer Mallory in
the front seat, three musicians inthe back seat, two guitarists and a
percussionist. It was bananas. Itcame out great, but the percussionist had
to had to bail the second theywere done recordings like I'm out. He
was so uncomfortable. I do rememberbeing in this car with the Rigo Betty's

(18:32):
we went too and Tim Virgie wassitting up here, and Am and I
were in the back seat, andAm and I are bigger people in real
life. I remember being like,my legs may never come actually out of
this car. Yeah, dude,good to leave it here. Dude,
are you really not eating this hotdog? You're insulting Gene and Jude's walk
up to the counter and flip themoff. That's basically what you're doing right

(18:52):
now, Dude, I have somany fries on here, I don't even
though there was a hotdog inside ofit. Hmm. Let me get to
the actual dog. The dog ismustard, it's relish sport pepper. That's
a Chicago hot dog. It's nota Chicago hot dog, but it's a
damn good Are you a no ketjamguy? You know, sorry, I

(19:15):
gotta get close to the mic.Are you no ketchum guy? I'm a
no ketchup guy and that I wouldnever put it on a hot dog.
But I'm not a militant asshole aboutit. I've never understood why there are
so many rules in Chicago about youknow. It's it's not that you can't
have deep dish if you live here. It's gotta be thin crossed. No,
it's an identity thing and people wantto be part of something and then

(19:38):
you know, that's the Chicago way. It helps define who they are.
I've never been Milton about it.I mean, for those of us who
had children, you know that ketchupon dogs is something that's going to happen
at some point. I love deepdish. People who say it I do,
Oh my god, that's my favorite. I love deep Dish. I
will eat it lose or peak.I live by both lose and peakwise,

(19:59):
I'll eat there all the time.But I also live thin crust. I
mean, I'm perfectly happy doing thetavern style. I am good editing.
Anytime somebody calls something pizza, I'mdown pizza puff, they grass deep dish.
I'm not even shitty. Pizza isgreat because it because it has cheese
and crust and the sauce. Andthe sauce that's all you need. And

(20:23):
also, for those of us whohad children, we've all had the Little
Caesar's birthday party. Dominoes is myson's favorite. Dominoes works too, But
those Little Caesars pizzas, the genericones, the sausage, pepperoni, and
cheese, they're all five bucks apiece. You get a bunch of them,
and then you get a bonus pizzafor the parents. Yes, and even
Jets is good. The Detroit styleis amazing. Little greasy, little greasy.

(20:47):
Most of the good ones are mostof the good ones are. I've
you had to have a Costco sliceof pizza not wear it on the way
home. Yeah, yeah, same. You know what I really you said,
You've never been here, never beenhere. I have never been down
the street to Hallakahiki, the tikilounge. I've never been either. I've
been dying. I can't believe I'velived in this area my whole life.
I've never been there. There areso many North Side places I haven't been

(21:11):
to. That's the other thing.I've always kind of lived, like in
the city. In the now,I'm in the Southwest suburbs. So they'll
be doing knicks and that kind ofstuff. I go to a lot,
but I love it. That's areally tasty place. But in these North
Side places, I've always wanted todo this one excellent. Well here we
are, so do we need tostart barguing? Like what's the format?

(21:33):
Do you kind of warm up ordo you just go into it? Like
you know what? It depends witheverybody else? Are cats cats? I'm
a gay guy, are you really? You know what? I grow with
cats? Get out. I grovewith cats. And they're easy if you're
a radio guy. The shift inthat house, what's easy about that?
And they have their own box.They leave you alone. They walk very

(21:53):
quietly. If I'm recording, They'renot going to start barging for no reason
at all. In fact, sometimeseveryone see you or talk to you.
It's lovely dogs. They want tobe all over you. They want to
be in your grill. They wantyou to take them. You gotta walk
in the middle of the winter,negative of sixty degrees. You gotta grab
a leash. Then you gotta getYou gotta give them a bath. Cats
give themselves a bath. They're automatic. Who will say with dogs? My

(22:17):
dog who is just now over ayear. I made a point of getting
the dog as a puppy when hewas a puppy in summertime, because you
do not want to have a puppyin Chicago in the winter. Reason no
running outside of two in the morning. And puppies are like babies. Number
one, kids are not. Kidsare pretty automatic. Show them where a
litter box is, where the foodis. They kind of just go in

(22:40):
that direction. Puppies, it isaround the clock. You gotta you gotta
take care of those things. Yeah, you're a helicopter parenting those puppies.
Yes, and even some dogs youcan't leave on their own. Cats,
you probably leave them in your housethree days. Is not really any supervision.
Give them enough food to the bowl, make sure the litter box is
clean. You can go out fora weekend. Dogs. You gotta board
those things or know somebody or paya that's true. Pay an app to

(23:03):
feed them and walk them and justbe with them. That's an expensive kid
right there. At least Gid'll moveout one day. I am wearing this,
by the way, I gave purposelyfor it. That's why I'm wearing
a T shirt that says I'm avoiceover talent. I say this with all
due respect. Dan, you walkedup with his T shirt. It looks
like the kind of T shirt you'dfind a good will. Oh yeah,

(23:26):
this is the kind of T shirtthat you would wear at any street fair,
knowing that I'm gonna get barbecue sauce, catch up, and someone's gonna
spill a beer on me. Andthis was the nineties, early two thousands.
If I went to a bar,there'll be a couple of cigarette burns
in it. Yeah, for sure, for sure, that's what I do.
So do you have like predetermined questionsfor arguments based on who your guest
is. I try to tailor itto that person. And I've also tried

(23:48):
to, like at least a lessonI've learned is letting the guests know what
the arguments are, because every nowand then I would just try to throw
it at them and it takes longerfor the people to do it. But
if I prep somebody, I tryto tell her to whatever it is that
they're into or what. That prepwas literally thirty seconds before I hit record.
Yeah pretty much, so vertty much. But to be honest, it
makes you feel better. The questionswere developed about an hour before I got

(24:11):
in the car. Okay, So, yeah, you and I were texting
each other. I was like,I think he's a working I'm not gonna
call him yet. I think i'dgive it to him beforehand, but you
should be Okay. So I haven'thad a lot of time to finess where
this is going, so we'll seewhere it goes. Okay, do you
do you play like a music betor something? The argument like, how
do you get into this? It'sa natural segue? Okay, natural doesn't

(24:32):
need to be overproduced. Arguments.Arguments a bunch of beard beard bunks clinging
together. Huh cheers. Oh god, all right, here's the one I
miss any of that. Here's theone that it's a generic What I was
gonna give you a bargament number one? James, yep, what is more
annoying to lose your cell phone orto lose a remote? Control. I

(24:53):
think it goes without saying it's acell phone. You would think that.
But the minute you lose that remotecontrol in your house. But the minute
you're evall by yourself and you're like, I'm going to watch a TV show,
there's nobody home. Everyone. Aperson asked this, I don't ever
watch TV. I almost never wantedyou a giant movie guy. I remember
at one point you were spending likeall your nights watching a new horror movie.

(25:14):
I'm not doing it on TV.I'm doing it on a computer.
You watch movies on computers. Yeah, I've got a nice monitor size.
Are you just sitting and watching it? Yeah, sitting like in a desk
chair, watching the desk chair.But I've got a chair in an ottoman
and I'll watch it. Oh,I can't do that. I can't do
the computer. I just I don'tknow. That's it that it goes differently

(25:37):
for you. Yeah, gotcha,all right. So again someone would be
more annoying. I can see that, all right. Since it is car
called Carney, you're a music guy. I am Carney. Best music podcast
according to the readers of The ChicagoReader for twenty twenty three twenty twenty two.
I voted for that, Thank you. Best band named after a food,

(26:00):
so options would be meat loaf yep, the cranberry's actually part of the
same meal, Smashing pumpkins yep,blind melon, blind melon, sure,
limp biscuit, but we said that'sa no go. And the spelling,
even though it's a homophone, thespelling is a little suspect. I don't
know if that counts. Got it, got it, that's fine, eminem,

(26:22):
I'm not gonna put in there,even though it isn't candy, but
that's name at Pterckham. I'm notgonna get it. That feels like a
stretch as well. Yes, I'llgive you that one as well. So
pearl Jam. I don't even knowif that's a food, but that was
in a category I saw too whenI was looking at Jim Jam. Oh
oh no, yeah, it's whatdo you have? I would say it
for me. Number one, it'sgonna be the Red Hot Chili Peppers,

(26:44):
or, to be honest, theband that travels the most fish. You're
a fish fan, I'm not abig fish fan, but that's probably one
of the better bands. If yougot to think of a band that's food
for me. The Red Hot ChiliPeppers are number one. I just want
to make them number one for anything. I don't want to give them that
recognition. I do like the rightHot Julli Peppers. But I've seen them

(27:07):
live twice. The first time theywere amazing. Second time I saw them
in All State Arena and they weredoing a jam session for forty five minutes.
It was the first concert I everleft. It was that bad.
So I'm just straight not a fan. Not a fan, really, up
and down, up and down,no, uh, none of it,
even the cover songs of Stevie Wonder, which is under the Bridge, the

(27:32):
cover song from Stevie Wonder Higher Ground, off the album Mother's Milk nineteen eighty
nine, one of the most poorlyproduced major label records of that era.
If you go back and listen toMother's Milk, it sounds tinny and thin
and hollow, like they just didn'tgive a shit in the studio. I
think the recording of Higher Ground itsounds like garbage. Okay, okay,
when I worked out, I putit on. I don't listen to that

(27:53):
in Telly, but I'll uh,you don't need to put I'll put it
on. I will put it on, Put it on next to another song,
put it on to nine Nails Closer, and you will hear the disparity
between the production quality of those twosongs. I love it because I presented
another bargent to you. You're gonnasay, I don't want to do anything
negative, and the way you justlit up the Red Chili Members is amazing.
Well, the Chili Peppers are theworst. I mean now, the

(28:15):
worst. I'm gay. Don't giveit to me. I like it.
They're a band for people who thinkthey like music. That's fair. That's
fair, that's fair. I'm not. I will say this. I am
not the music some vant that youare. I just either Well, let
me ask you this, then,who's the number one for you? I
don't have a number one food foodname band, but two they came to

(28:37):
mind The Meat Puppets. M lovethe Meat Puppets who During the eighties,
At the same time the Redhet ChiliPeppers were recording songs like Catholic Schoolgirls Rule
and whatever other actions, they wererecording seminal independent records on the SST label.
Well, I get why is thatword funny? You know, it's

(29:00):
just it really paints the picture also, I'm gonna go with the Sugar Cubes.
One love the Sugar Cubes. Thatis what I didn't think about.
That's a good one. Their firsttwo albums, especially Life's Too Good and
then Here Today, Tomorrow, nextweek. I love them, And there's
scattered songs in the third album arelike two hit was a great hit.

(29:22):
But yeah, I love the SugarCubes. Love York, You Love York.
That's the one I never got into. Well, I love the Sugar
Cubes. I mean that's how Icame to know her, So that's why
I like them. But I've withher for some reason in the style I
never never done it. I totallyget that, because those albums can be
tough listens. I think it's asong by song thing with her solo career.

(29:44):
Now, you and I were talkingearlier because I've had a argument before
of the mount Rushmore of the fourbest alternative rock female voices of all time,
and I did this one with Grantrandom from a serious XM, and
you didn't like any of them.Well, I saw people responding online and
they were saying, I'm going topull it out of thin air because I

(30:07):
don't have this written down or plant, but I would see people contribute to
this, like Alanis Morris set,Really are we doing that? No?
Liz Fair, who I love Liz, But Liz Fair is a one album
artist and that album is Exile andGuyville in nineteen ninety three. After that,
good luck getting through a full album. I love is Fair, but

(30:30):
people were kind of enraging with thethings they were suggesting. So if I
to pull it out of thin air, if you're doing a mount rushing,
I also feel kind of weird.It feels reductive to say this one is
all about the women like it?Just are we in twenty twenty four?
Are we defining artists by their gender? I don't know, But if I
were not only giving them like anod, like hey, there's a spot

(30:51):
for you, because if you haven'tmade an impact too. No, if
you're a female artist, there's noreason you shouldn't be thought of in the
same breath as the male art.You're just an artist. You're not interesting.
Is there a female artist in thealternative rock genre that you would put
up there in a mount rushmore ofall time? You just glanced past the

(31:15):
entire Yeah, But if it's ifshe's if a girl could be up there
with the rest of the guys's justas a rock Mount Rushmore. If you
if you're gonna isolate by gender,I would put Debbie Harry Blondie up there
without question. From a more modernperspective, I would put PJ. Harvey,
who's done some of the most groundbreakinginnovative music of the past twenty five

(31:37):
years. I would put Chrissy Hindof the Pretenders up there. That was
really good, especially those those firsttwo Pretenders albums are great. But Learning
to Crawl, that big commercial breakthroughfor the band still. I mean,
all those songs still matter today.People still play two thousand Miles every Christmas.
I mean great, that's true.That's true. I would say Patty

(31:57):
Smith, but I think it's justthis. I think Patty Smith is great.
I still't listen to her enough.I want agree with you. What
about Pat Benattar, who did namelyone album that you would listen to all
the way through by Pat Benatar?It don't, I can't do it.
That was my issue with Like AlanisMorris said, Okay, maybe it bought

(32:19):
into Jagged Little Pill. Are youreally spending time with those other records for
somebody in the Mount Rushmore. Theyhave to have had a lasting impact,
which is my list. Fair argument, excellent. Guyville probably the most essential
album of nineteen ninety three for avariety of reasons, but the subsequent albums
took her farther away from that point. Where do you stay with Gwen Stefani.

(32:39):
She's a great pop artist, soshe's more popped than as a solo
artist. He has no doubt,no doubts pop punkish Okay, because I
remember her doing someself with Sublime anddoing some for me, I still see
as her as an alternative popish yeah, I mean sure, not fully trying

(33:00):
tansition of the podcast. As asolo artist, she is one hundred percent,
no question about it, a popartist, Okay. I would agree
with you. I would definitely agreewith you. Last bargument for you,
what's the greatest sandwich of all time? James? And I know that even
includes the one that at Big Delihas made for you as well. I

(33:20):
will always say the Ruben. Ithink the Ruben is the most classic.
Yes, the Ruben is the perfectsandwich. The ripe bread, the sour
kraut, the Swiss cheese and thecorn beef. And I like the Ruben
variations. I like it with pistramior turkey pistrami in the Thousand Island.
I just it's a wonderful combination offlavors. Is what we're eating right now?

(33:42):
Considered a sandwich, I think ithas a hot dog. I said
it is. It's bread and meat. I agree. I mean it's an
orthodox bread, agreed, But Imean the bine size hand hel it has
two sides with something in the middleof it. Yes, I mean to
say, I go the same waywith you. I've had a lot of
people argue and say it's not thatsandwiches or you know, its own entity

(34:06):
like a PB and J would haveno meat to it. But I agree
with you. Going back to theMount Rushmore, did you ever say yours?
I did say it was Gwen Sevanniwas one for me. I know
you hate it. Courtney Love forMe is number two. Courtey Love is
iconic Again. I go back tothe lasting artistic contributions live through. This
is a great album. Celebrity skinis not Courtney loved solo album not so

(34:30):
much, I think, But asfar as what the pop culture of her
for, what she for, whoshe was with Kirk co Maade for what
she attributed to during that era.For me, I don't think you could
leave her off because to me,that alternative, that nineties rock. I
know, we're gonna go some eighties, some seventies. People would say Janet

(34:51):
Shoplin. Some people would say allthe ones you did and Morse and I
would not. But in terms ofthat voice, that sound, that look,
and just the fact that I thoughtshe was talented. I think she
was a talented singer, but maybenot the work that other people have had.
But to me, I can't thinkof a nineties alternative female without thinking
of her. First. She wasthe most present, she was the most

(35:14):
covered by the press and the media. But if you're going pound for pound
artistic talents, creative output, andfrom that era, for me, it's
Polygene Harvey ten times out of ten, awesome, Awesome. It's hard to
argue with you because you're so muchmore polished when it comes to this,
and you can bring facts to atable like I can't. You bring it

(35:37):
up like you know, years made, who was in the studio, what
was on the dashboard, what kindof cigarettes they smoked? I can't hang
like that. I'm just a guyat a bar, drink it with you
and just going down. That soundsabout right, cheers, bargaments. Is
that how we get out of it? Get it? Where we get your
podcasts? Do you have to saythat in a podcast? I see soon

(36:00):
people doing that, like you getthis podcast? Where you don't? We
know where to find a podcast atthis point. At this point we do.
But to be honest, I'll havemy mom go where do I get
it? I don't listen to podcasts. I want to hear it all right.
In fairness to that end, podcastsmay not be at the tipping point
yet. I mean, there's stillsome adoption that needs to happen. I

(36:22):
think that once the generation that youand I are in becomes older, older,
it will then have taken it overUntil that happens, and the older
generation that prefers an AM radio intheir car might not going to be going
to a platform or do they canhear us all the time? You know?
It surprises me, and I've saidthis before, it probably said it
to you before, Nan, Itsurprises me that more people in radio have

(36:45):
not moved over to podcasting, iffor no other reason than a self preservation
career forwarding brand forwarding move. Iwould say maybe you give this too.
You have to three times a year, especially like when kids are graduating high
school are about to I will havesomebody on Facebook reach out to me and

(37:05):
say, my son, my daughteris interested in sports broadcasting. Can you
give them some advice? And thefirst words out of my mouth are start
a podcast. Sure. I mean, if you can do it weekly,
show that you know how to usethe audio, show that you know how
to move a brand, showing thatyou can talk about this at length.

(37:25):
And if you can start to dothat weekly and start to bring actual content
to wherever it is that you wantto start interning for or working for,
then you may have a shot atdoing this. But if you're not doing
a podcast right now, there's thena lot of people are going to quit
the business and they're not gonna feelit. I feel like podcasts and radio

(37:45):
are gonna kind of orbit each otherfor a while. As long as there's
a guy named Joe Rogan making thatmuch money off a podcast, not saying
I'm him or I'm not famous todo it, but there's money to be
made. There are sponsors out therethat are to look in to get involved
in things like that, so Ijust got to try it. When I

(38:05):
started talking seriously about monetizing this podcast, I remember talking to people in radio
and they'd say, well, howdo you sell You know you're not doing
cost per thousand, which is no, why would you like? This is
long tail stuff like you were sellingthe concept more than anything. Yes,
you're selling that small group of highlyinterested people as opposed to a numbing amount

(38:30):
of masses. And if you startanything from a grassroots and you're not a
celebrity, it takes time to build. I started. It takes time to
build it if you are like aZ lister. Yeah, that's true.
But I mean I've done a Facebookgroup where only have like three or maybe
four hundred members that are on there. I would say three to four times
a week, I'm throwing barguments inthere for people to start chewing on and

(38:50):
arguing, and they'll send me stuff. I'll try to use it on episodes.
But it is a process, andit's it's all so full time job
with the hobby of trying to makeit a full time job. Yeah,
I certainly this is my creative pursuit. People say, oh, is that
your side hustle. No, thisis that doesn't seem right. This is

(39:10):
really this is how I scratch thatitch. It's the outlet, It's the
olet. And like I told youwhen we were in line at Chene and
Judes, uh, this is kindof my social life at this point.
You know what it is. Theolder I've gotten, the more hit this
podcast. That just means I getan hour to chat with you, right,
Like, I'm gonna hang out withsomeone interesting tonight. We're gonna eat
food and it's gonna be awesome.I was looking forward to this since the

(39:32):
minute I said you want to collaband you sell, let's do gen and
Judes, I was like, thisis my week. When you say collab,
is that to embrace the youth population? Because are you like, hey,
hey kids, what's another word forit? If you collaborate, collaboration,
partnership, team up? Yeah,if you can, if you can

(39:52):
get it down to like one ortwo syllables, I think it's okay.
Sick dude. I don't know whatthe jarget they were using in nineteen eighty
nine a collab was, but I'llget to that one. But to be
honest, like I said, it'sjust fun to hang out with you.
I saw you get out of thecar and I was like, you see
it, old Fred. And Idon't even think ut podcasting. I'm just

(40:13):
talking to you, right, Wejust have to well. And that's the
thing too about this format, AndI mentioned I have PTSD from doing zoom
interviews. It changes the way theconversation spools out when you do it in
a situation like this. We're sittingin a car. We're not in a
sterile studio, We're not in frontof audio like, no Christine audio equipment.
We're just we're in a car eatingFrench fries and a parking lot where

(40:35):
people are coming up and taking selfies. That was hilarious. That made my
night me too. That was awesome. Mission accomplished, like going back to
site. Hustle versus creative outlet.That's what I do it for. I'm
not making a mint doing this.I was gonna say, has anything that
you've ever done in radio ever feltbetter than when someone says I was listening
to you. Whenever I've gone tolike an event, a family event,

(40:59):
or someone goes, hey, Iactually I heard you on the radio.
You sounded good For some reason thatlike it just makes me feel good.
I don't know what it is.It's see uh, it's a rushed like
every time I hear someone saying it. It's never gotten old. It's interesting.
I do have people who might haveheard me on Q and A one
or even XRT back in the day. I find, especially depending on someone's
age, a lot of people willknow me from the podcast but have no

(41:22):
idea that I did radio. Now. That's interesting. It blows my mind
that because you've been on the radiofor like thirty years, even though the
podcast from what six no going oneleven it's been eleven. Wow, I
mean yeah, right, because whenI was at WGN is when you started
it. Yeah, episode one thousandscoming up. Wow. But you know
I stopped doing radio full time along time ago. There's got to be

(41:45):
that it's still now. No.I know you said it's not there,
but there's gotta be. No.I know what radio is like now.
There is nothing I could do inradio that I haven't already done. There
is no new terrain for me tocover. It's all been done. The
opportunities don't exist for growth. I'mgood. I'm happy being radio adjacent with

(42:06):
you know, the one partnership withthis podcast. But I don't ever need
to go back to that industry.I would just say, with the knowledge
that you have, the way youpresent, and just because you are tied
to this city so much, it'sgotta be like that. No, well,
it's also there. I just feelthat we've come this far, We've
worked this hard. Well, thisis those who you built up. Markeeam

(42:28):
coming up to my car. That'sthat's that was very awesome. I won't
disagree with that. I was prettysweet. Yeah, that's that's mission accomplished
for me. I'm good. Gotcha, gotcha? Gotcha? Well consider me
to do this once a month ofthe Human Scratches a month. We need,
we need, we need different topics. We need topics you feel more
comfortable and conversing. I can getverse with you about all of them.

(42:51):
I just served you one. Wecan talk sports. You said no sports
or TV, Like, all right, the greatest sanwich that should have been.
That should have been a clue aboutthe remote control. When I said
no TV, I've figured movie movieas you're watching movies. Okay, that's
fair. Like the idea of aHulu subscription, like I can't I understand

(43:13):
I'm still paying for cable because Ihave a kid, but I don't want
it anymore. Yeah, I don'twant the cable anymore. Someone needs to
explain to me the benefit of DisneyPlus kid. Well, if you're doing
the subscriptions, and if you area sports person, there's a ESPN.
Oh it's bundled and his bundle andeverything else. So now I can watch
the Bear because I have Disney Plus. Do you like the Bear? You

(43:35):
know what. I've only seen thefirst episode. I know what they say.
The first couple are slow and thenit gets into it. I just
can't do. I can't do.You gotta go three episodes until you can
say you like it. That's notme. I can't get past the first
episode. I just realized, andI get what they're doing, it just
wasn't for me. And I've watchedthe first episode one and a half times
for that exact reason, Like,I know, I need to get over

(43:57):
the hump. And the reason whyI think I should try is because I
had the same feeling when I firstwatched Sopranos. I did not like the
find right There with You, theepisode where he is upset about the ducks
adest pool. I was like,the baddest mobster is going to therapy for
the ducks at his pool. Ican't watch this. Then it was nothing
but pay off after that. That'strue. But I know when I watched
Breaking Bad, I was hooked forthe first episode. Yeah, when I

(44:20):
watched Dexter for the first time,I was hooked. When I watched you
know, Lost for the first episode, Like, all right, I'm in.
But if it's gonna take me threeto four episodes to go, I
think I'm into it. I can'tcommit to that. Yeah, we don't
live in a slow burned lifestyle anymore. Slow burn lifestyle. That's actually that's
that's a proper way to put iton. Don't bury the lead. Just

(44:43):
get it all out there. Justgive me it, Just get me in
like music these days, right withinseven seconds, give me the hook.
I don't want to have bridges anymore. Just give me go right right to
the good stuff. Do you listento Vinyl? Am I the only one.
I don't have vinyl, But whenit's on and somebody's got it,
I will. Here's here's a argumentfor you. Here's what you should have
brought to the table. Not beingcritical, but here's what you should brought

(45:05):
to you. Is it a recordor a vinyl? There's only one answer.
It's a record. Interesting. Ithink it's a generational thing. You'll
hear people of a certain generation say, oh, I bought a vinyl.
Vinyl is the format. It's likesaying I got an oxide for a cassette.
It's not called vinyl store day.It's record store day. That's true.

(45:25):
So you would say, do theyhave this on record not vinyl?
Yeah, well no, you cansay on vinyl because it literally is on
vinyl, is pressed onto vinyl.But it's not a vinyl. Vinyl is
a plural word. It's a genre. Almost yes, gotcha. You know
for a guy who sits in hiscar eating hot dogs and podcasting, well,

(45:46):
I like it. I have atouchy podcaster and I love that.
This is why I wanted to arguewith you. I like it. You
are. I'm not angry. I'mI'm America's sweetheart. The business doesn't love
me. I'm out of it.I was sitting here like Cary hot dogs

(46:06):
for the rest of my life becauseit's creches. I like it, man,
I like it. I like getout with you. I like you.
I will say this. I domiss when I when you and I
used to work in the same buildingtogether and I had a studio for about
you would walk into my studio likeKramer, close the door and just go
it's just does girls talking, andyou would just vent for about ten minutes

(46:29):
ago, Okay, I'm good,and just walk out. I was like
that was that made my day?I was like, that just made me
feel so much better about life andlove with James would just come in and
just saddle his way in, andthat just give it to me. Who
was that mass man who just likeanybody else, all right, thank you.
I'd just take a piece of candyand walk out. It was awesome.

(46:50):
Oh yeah, I had the candyjars. You introduced me late in
life to cherry sowers, which areoutstanding. Well, yes, but you're
may vary depending on what brand youget. I've only really gotten the ones
from Walgreens, to be honest,Walgreens are They're the top. Yeah,
I didn't realize there were different flavorThere are different companies that make them,

(47:10):
and I've experimented and some are someare a little too sugary, gotcha,
gotcha. I've only really because wehad the Walgreens. I was across the
street. Also seven eleven cherry soursnot so bad. Okay. You know,
since I had that job, Ihaven't touched the cherry's hour because it
reminds me of that time. There'scertain things I want. Ooh, that's

(47:32):
a yeah, you's an experience thatI'm not living anymore. I like that.
Yeah, you should get back intoradio. I can't eat a certain
food because it reminds me of radio. By the way, this is what
I want a radio question. Iwant to ask you, when you have
left the job or a job,let you go, how long does it
take your can you listen to thatradio station ever? Again? Interesting?

(47:52):
It's a really good question because whenI got fired from Q and A one
in two thousand and six, twothousand and six, I didn't want to
listen to that radio station, alternativemusic anything for years, I believe it.
I was so disgusted with the wayit went down. I couldn't I

(48:15):
even have I'll go to another levellike whenever I'm not there, And it's
not a good thing on me tosay. It's like I root for them
to lose. I root for themto like, you know, see bad
ratings and it's not the way tobe but you and when we lost the
gig at Alard Stertin, it wasone of the best radio jobs I've ever
had. It was one of thecoolest opportunities. He actually wrote me a

(48:37):
personal email saying, Hey, youknow what, this sucks, but you
and Abe are awesome guys. Youlove radio. I love radio. Thanks
for even you know coming on andblah blah blah. But then when I
got serious, I turned it offbecause it feels like a party that I'm
not invited to it. Yeah,that's it, and I think that's true
beyond radio. I remember being unemployedin general, pardon me, and remember

(49:00):
walking the streets of downtown Chicago.I was meeting someone for lunch, and
I would see people walking through theloop at lunchtime in groups from their office
buildings, and it felt yes.And I was aware that it was an
immature, petty way to feel,but when you were out of work,
it really does. After that firstweek when everyone calls and chicks in and

(49:22):
you really feel a drift, youstart to almost go through the stages of
when someone died. I tell mywife, like whenever one of us lost
a gig or someone I know inradio that loses the gig. I'm like,
you're gonna go through anger, sadness, laughter, anger is gonna come
a lot, and it just wellthere's denial in there. Yes, all

(49:43):
of it. You experience all ofit because it's not what you were anymore
and you're just like, what amI doing? And I slept in today
or I should be you know,doing this or that, and it's a
weird feeling. And it's like,you know, after that first week,
people check on and you're like,that's it. The only time I'll hear
and see from them again. It'son social media and that's really about it.

(50:05):
Yeah, it is very lonely becauseand I get it. People are
busy and it's not your well beingis not their job to maintain. No,
they have their own and they're andthey're also sitting there, you know,
worrying about their jobs. There's aton of people that are like,
did you hear if I'm getting laidoff? Like I have no idea.
I just know that I did,right, But that clock is ticking once
you get laid off, Like,yes, the calls and emails are going

(50:28):
to hit. They're just going togo off a cliff yep, But it
did have a PD and a guywho actually said to me because I remember
when I late, when I gotlaid off with the last one and I
reached out to a bunch of people. I was meeting with a bunch of
pds, and I remember the oneguy saying, I know who you are,
I know what you do. You'rereally talented. We're not hiring for

(50:50):
anything. But when it's time foryou to come back, you'll know what
it's time to come back. Maybetry doing something different in the meantime,
just for now. And I remembergoing like, just gave me a good
Like I didn't feel that feeling ofsurvival mode anymore. It was actually a
better way to put what he said, like that, like, you don't
have to be so desperate you giveme anything, Well, just take a

(51:12):
time out when it's time to comegrab you. We know where you are.
And I was like, okay that, actually I'm gonna go do something
else. Then. I think it'sreally important to have things. This is
my creative pursuit. I think,no matter what you do professionally, having
some sort of outlets, yes,that that helps define you to yourself at
least outside of work is so important. Yes, And to be honest,

(51:34):
even when I was in when Ihave full time radio gigs like I do
now, I always have side gigs. I do have the side hustles.
I did the voiceover stuff. Isaw the T shirt in case you're hiring,
But I mean the podcast stuff.I help clients. I have clients
I do stuff for like that.So I mean I'm constantly case one job
goes away. Man, I'm alwaysscared. I need like five more again.
I can land. I need toland on a pillow when the rug

(51:57):
comes out. Yeah, I don'tknow why. I don't want to go
back to radio. You make itsound really glamorous, the podcast where we
kill all the dreams, but wemade it. I'll this is probably the
best. I'm not going to ride. It's really good. Did the double
that that was the smart move.We're gonna wrap this up because we're recording
this on Monday, July fifteenth,and as we're recording this, I think

(52:21):
we are minutes, if not anhour or so, away from some horrible,
horrible, cataclysmic tornado like storm Dorothy. I just saw lightning in the
sky. Doesn't bode well. Imean, all the all the radar looked
like as green bad. Oh,I've seen red. Redd is not a
goe. It's not looking good.And I know we we both have this

(52:43):
is kind of like halfway between thetwo of us. But we should probably
haul ask to our respective homes,have fun and get in the basement.
It's on the radio for coverage,right, Brandon Miller always says, you
know, go somewhere, go somewherelow no glass, oh glass. All
right, this has been a collab, a fire collab, good word between

(53:07):
Carcoon Carney and arguments. So thisis gonna be Your audience is going to
hear this and think I never wantto hear men eating a microphone ever again.
No, you know what, thisis great. I mean this has
kind of like why you do thesethese You introduced audiences to different people,
and your audience is like, thisguy doesn't know any about music. I'm
never listening to heavy. Yeah,well my podcast isn't exclusively music. I

(53:28):
mean I'll talk true, I'll talkto restaurant owners, authors, whatever,
the food. I've been it forthe food. I've been it for the
hot dogs. The hot dog.The hot dog is just a vessel to
allow for conversation. I'm in it. I'm in but yeah, that is
that is the secret to Carcoon Carney. If I'm at Gene and Juds,
it's because I wanted to have foodfor the podcast, didn't have a sponsor,

(53:49):
and two people can walk out forless than fifteen bucks. Dude,
you're right and full, Yeah andstopped. I wily have the hot dog.
I'm stopped. Like, if youhad done a single dog, it
probably would have been two dollars cheaper. It would have been just over ten
ten dollars. I need, Ineed, I need to engulf myself on
what this is. The other protip for Gene and juwds. As we're
wrapping up, never get the largesoda because it doesn't fit in any cup

(54:10):
holder. I noticed that they've gotthe giant styrophone. Yes, it's gonna
be balanced on my lap. Yeah. Never do the large at Gene and
Juds. It's it's not worth it. Don't be a hero. You can't
do it at the medium is thesize of a large. That's that's America,
my friend. I'm always big enough. Dan Levy of Arguments, thank

(54:31):
you so much for doing this.Thank you for letting me do it with
you. This is great. Aquick programming note for Carkun Karne Episode one
thousand is coming up. Listen andwatch for announcements of what I think will
end up being four separate live eventsfor separate free live events that you can
attend and be part of. Sothank it in Thank you, James,