Dylan O'Brien (sorta) with Billy Ray Brewton: The Maze Runner, Ponyboi, and... Happiness?!?!

On this week's episode of Film Foundations, Billy Ray Brewton joins us to discuss the films of Dylan O'Brien... and then sorta changes the game completely. You will see! Dylan O'Brien was new for us (for the most part), but this conversation helped SO MUCH. So what is his foundational film? Do you agree with our picks? Let us know in the comments!

Billy Ray Brewton: https://x.com/BillyRayBrewton

Film Foundations links: https://linktr.ee/filmfoundations 

Film Foundations is a show co-produced by Weirding Way Media and Someone's Favorite Productions! 

Weirding Way Media: weirdingwaymedia.com 

Someone's Favorite Productions: https://linktr.ee/someonesfavoriteproductions 

Links above may be affiliate/promotional links that provide us a tiny commission to support the show and do not charge the consumer anything extra. 

Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/film-foundations--6058746/support .

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:08):
There and welcome back to Film Foundations, the collaborative show
between Someone's Favorite Productions and weirding Way Media. I am
one of your co hosts, Ryan Vrel from The Disconnected
and Someone's Favorite Productions, and.

Speaker 2 (00:19):
I am Christashu, your other co host from weirding Way Media,
the Culture Cast and other terrible opinions about movies on
the Internet.

Speaker 1 (00:26):
On this show, we always ask an answer for questions
about a given topic that is surrounding either a director
of franchise, micro genre, or like our topic today, an actor.
And this one is an interesting one because I love
these types of episodes where it is the job of
our guest today to entice us to broaden our horizons
on film, to encourage all of us to travel down

(00:48):
film tangents and side roads that we may have never
traveled down before, because I I've never even seen a
single movie with the actor we're discussing today. We're discussing
Dylan O'Brien. But my favorite part is I get to
introduce my dear friend Billy Ray Bruton, who is a
founder of the Make Believe Film Festival in Seattle. He
was the host of the Incinerator podcast of the movie

(01:10):
Mixshapes podcast. He is a frequent guest on screen Drafts
and Filmmaker and all kinds of other stuff that I
could just completely go on and on about. He'd probably
love that. But Billy Ray, thanks for doing this.

Speaker 3 (01:22):
Thanks Brian, Brian is it?

Speaker 2 (01:25):
Yes?

Speaker 3 (01:25):
Thank you Brian for having me. It's a pleasure.

Speaker 2 (01:28):
Brian. And Chris right, is that you remember my name?
But you just forgot his name? You've known him for
how long? Now?

Speaker 3 (01:35):
How long has it been? Eight? Nine, twenty years?

Speaker 1 (01:39):
I guess the other part that I should have led
with to Billy Ray is a collaborative partner in someone's
favorite productions. He's done some special features on some of
our discs with us and eager for many more. He's
currently working on one right now. I can't wait to see.
And yeah, Billy Ray's amazing.

Speaker 3 (01:55):
Oh, I don't know about amazing. Let's go with sufficient.

Speaker 1 (02:00):
Well, it looks like you're dabbling in finger painting, as
I can see in that.

Speaker 3 (02:04):
I don't know who created this piece of art behind me.
It was inherited. I was grandfathered into this artwork when
I took this job. And every time I walk and
I'm like, can we do better? Do better than this.

Speaker 2 (02:18):
Someone is trying their handed calligraphy, is what it looks like.
They're just you know, zeros seven.

Speaker 3 (02:25):
Like I raise money for an organization that like supports
children and stuff, and so I was like, is this
just like a piece? I was literally, is this just
a piece of artwork a child did? But I was like,
they were like, no, we bought this artwork.

Speaker 2 (02:37):
I'm like, and I still have the job right.

Speaker 3 (02:43):
Every time I walk in and I sit down, I
kind of hit it with my chair, hoping one day
it's just gonna fall and I have an excuse to
like not have it behind me anymore.

Speaker 1 (02:51):
Oh no, look what happened on accident.

Speaker 2 (02:53):
Oh I'm like Steve Wynn and I put my foot
through it. What a shame.

Speaker 3 (02:57):
Be careful there. Steve Winn donates a lot of money
to my organization. Well, a lot of our stuff is
funded by the Win Foundation. Thank you, Steve and all
of your family for the wonderful work that you do.

Speaker 2 (03:10):
What a name to mention out of nowhere for you
to go hold on? I know now I can only
think of one rich person who put their foot through
an a million dollar painting, and it's Steve Winn, so.

Speaker 3 (03:20):
I can throw a rock and hit the wind building.
It's literally right down the way.

Speaker 2 (03:26):
Amazing.

Speaker 3 (03:28):
But yes, glad we got off on that with that.
Steve Winn tangent.

Speaker 1 (03:34):
Speaking of Tangents, Dylan O'Brien, I know nothing about Dylan O'Brien.
Why do you love Dylan O'Brien, Billy Ray?

Speaker 3 (03:40):
You know, that's a fascinating question, and it's a question
that I have waxed poetically on on our Friends at
the b Side podcast and which I was on there
to also discuss Dylan O'Brien, albeit in a different sort
of way. So maybe the best way is to start
with sort of my history with mister O'Brien, and that
kind of goes back to Team Wolf. I am a sucker,

(04:05):
Let's be clear, so everybody can know how sad it is.
I am a forty two year old man who is
still moderately obsessed with like teen shows, like teen dramas
super like for me, it started all the way back
with Beverly Hills nine of two, one zero, and then
that segue into Dawson's Creek, and then that said way
into like Gossip Girl and Friday Night Lights and the
OC and so Teen Wolf was one of those for me,

(04:28):
and I think just out of the gate, he just
kind of stood out as like the cream of the
crop of that show. And it was quite clear that
like it was a show of a lot of like
quote unquote sort of soap opera esque actors, and then
you had the one actor who was like legitimately like
giving a performance and giving like a full performance. And

(04:51):
so that's kind of where I first became familiar with
him as a performer and honestly just kind of followed
him ever since. And it's been interesting to see where
his career has gone, how he's kind of slowly been
building up this kind of resume as like a leading
man in an interesting way, but also doing these interesting
character roles. And I just think he's a really great actor.

(05:12):
Like whether it's comedy or drama, he always finds that
right balance. I mean, look, it doesn't hurt that he's
easy on the eyes. That's never a hurtful thing, but
it just yeah, just making really interesting career choices. And
I think someone that in another ten years is going
to be like headlining a lot of movies.

Speaker 1 (05:33):
So I may want to get caught up then, speaking
of him being easy on the eyes. I had somebody
describe his newest movie, pony Boy to me, Have you
seen that one yet?

Speaker 3 (05:43):
I had seen pony Boy so on a sundance this year.

Speaker 1 (05:46):
That's what I thought. I'm sure we'll get into that
one a little bit later before we dive super deep
onto Dylan O'Brien. Why don't you just explain to the
audience a little more about yourself. Things you do, things
that you might want to hype up or give some
I didn't even bring up, like scriptsk on wild. You
do kind of everything.

Speaker 3 (06:04):
I do a lot of different things, too many things,
and I've had to scale back lately, which is why
you were not going to hear me sort of podcasting
anymore on my own, because it just became too much
to have to wrangle unfortunately. But yeah, I've got a
lot of other stuff. So I run a film festival
in Seattle called Make Believe Seattle, which is a sort
of a redivised idea what a genre festival should be,

(06:28):
and we just ran in March. Our second year was
very successful and we're already starting to plan for year three.
So if you live in the Seattle area or you
want to make a trip to Seattle. We got a
fun few days in March with some really batshit stuff
that you'll I'm sure we'll enjoy. I also run an
event series here in Los Angeles called Scripts Gone Wild,

(06:50):
where we basically assemble a bunch of celebrities together we
read a popular film script, but it's also a drinking game,
and so anytime they flub the line miss a cue
their lies, they have to take a drink. Everybody gets
wonderfully wasted for charity. And we're working on a pretty
big read for July with some pretty heavy hitters that

(07:12):
we can't quite announce yet, but we're working on some
fun stuff there. You know, We've had everybody from like
Joel McHale at Perez Hilton and like a lot of
random people. It's just a really fun excuse to get
friends and new friends together, drink and raise money for
a good cause. And again, I am the eternal heel
on the Screen Drafts podcast, where I realized recently that

(07:33):
I'm going to be on five times for and the
rest of the year, which is overwhelming me. At the
moment when I realized just how much people are going
to be hearing my voice So if you were worried
about me dropping my podcast, rest a short, You're gonna
get at least forty hours of Billy Ray content on
screen Drafts for the rest of the year.

Speaker 1 (07:50):
Screen Drafts is amazing, And yeah, the history that you've
built with them. I love that there's this sanction of
the fan base that will either go to bat and
defend every single thing you do or the other one
will go LiAZ he here.

Speaker 3 (08:05):
Well and so people, and this is an exclusion. So
if people want to know what's coming up, you could
hear me on the Gena Davis draft that I'm doing
with Drea Clark for the Bittonville Film Festival. We are
hoping Gina is going to stop by for that. I'd
be doing the Michael Crichton Super Draft with Clay and
Darren Navarro. I will be doing my annual Halloween draft

(08:28):
with Kyle Anderson, which I'm not sure what we're going
to be drafting yet with that one. But then I'm
also going to be doing a couple of Patreon drafts.
We're doing a Legends draft on TV shows and then
we are also doing a nineteen ninety four draft as
well on there, so a lot of random stuff coming up,

(08:49):
which and not a lot of horror, which I like,
I tend to get. I feel like pigeonholed a bit
in the horror genre, which I adore but is far
from my only area of enjoyment. So yeah, and and
some other podcast appearances too, like I'm gonna be on
the king Cast podcast coming up. I'm gonna be on
a couple others, so I think the Almost Major podcast

(09:11):
that's coming up as well. So a few other things
you'll hear me. I ain't going anywhere.

Speaker 1 (09:16):
I'm recording with Almost Major soon myself.

Speaker 3 (09:18):
Actually, yeah, I remember what I'm doing. I think critters
and critters too nice.

Speaker 2 (09:24):
Yeah, all the creators, all them little.

Speaker 3 (09:26):
Critters, critters, all the critters especially.

Speaker 2 (09:29):
All them critters all the time, all critters, all Critter
network ac all creatters all the time.

Speaker 3 (09:34):
From Alabama, I'm not unfamiliar with that word. It's more
Texas in origin, but we use it in the South.

Speaker 2 (09:39):
That's right. That's where that's where I was raised, was
was North Texas, where all them critters are running around.

Speaker 3 (09:46):
Uh We in the South we refer to critters as
genital awards.

Speaker 2 (09:50):
I just like critters spelled U r Z at the
end twice.

Speaker 3 (09:54):
Critters like, like, what's going on there? I got some
critters rustling around my drawers, all.

Speaker 2 (09:59):
The little creators. Oh, you got creators.

Speaker 3 (10:01):
Up in the head. We needed to go on see
which one of.

Speaker 2 (10:05):
Us can get more Southern was saying, Critters.

Speaker 3 (10:07):
I don't know why it took us to pubic lice.
I'll never know that.

Speaker 2 (10:11):
So yeah, I was about to say, like, you just
destroyed the idea of going to Texas Roadhouse and ordering
the chicken critters. That is now a thing that I
will never do because all I can think of is
chicken critter lice on my pubic region. That's on you.
That's on you, Billy ray Bruton.

Speaker 1 (10:27):
That's pretty foul.

Speaker 2 (10:30):
Yeah, it makes me crack up when I hear.

Speaker 3 (10:31):
It, though, Oh god, this is gonna haunt me in
ten years from public office.

Speaker 2 (10:39):
Oh please, ladies and gentlemen. I have just found out
that Billy ray Bruton, who's running for mayor of the city,
talked about critter's genital lice.

Speaker 3 (10:49):
Oh and you know what I will, you know, speaking
of genital lice, no great trans especially the other thing
I will prow since I'm not podcasting anymore. Really myself,
I've decided, you know, to start writing more and things
like that, so I do still have If folks do
or like, I like what you're doing, Billy Ray, and

(11:11):
I want to support you, don't feel like you have to.
I'm fine, I don't need your money. But if you
want to come and support and check out some exclusive
writings and things like that, you can't go to Billy
Ray is right on the Patreon, which is something that
of course sprung from the screen Draft podcast. Someone even
made a limited run of buttons. That's say, Billy Ray

(11:33):
is right. I still have mine, and Billy Ray is
right on Patreon. I'll be dropping probably one or two
little reviews and stuff a week. Nothing huge. There's one
level to sign up at. It's not expensive. It's really
again like I don't need your money. It's just if
I've got to. I can't create for nothing anymore. I'm
too old.

Speaker 1 (11:56):
Let's go from that straight into Dylan O'Brien. You talked
about your history with the the Teen Wolf.

Speaker 3 (12:00):
There were that I would have loved to have gone
straight into Dylan O'Brien times of past.

Speaker 1 (12:06):
Was gonna see your past?

Speaker 3 (12:07):
That now? Oh no, I am. It's like with everybody,
it's segued from like a movie crash and then just like, oh,
I just appreciate you as a talent, So my tastes
have change. What can I say?

Speaker 1 (12:18):
Ryan, Well, speaking of Dylan O'Brien, come on in, No,
I'm just wouldn't that be something?

Speaker 2 (12:24):
Wouldn't that have been something?

Speaker 3 (12:29):
Never mind, I'm about to say his name three.

Speaker 2 (12:31):
Times and he appears like beetlejuice? Is that what you're saying?

Speaker 3 (12:34):
Oh my god? Can we let's give it a notebook.

Speaker 2 (12:38):
Let's see if that happens.

Speaker 1 (12:39):
You talked about teen Wolf. Anything you'd like to share
on his history in film before we start diving into
our questions.

Speaker 3 (12:46):
Yeah, I mean, and this is more just I guess
observations than anything else, because I mean, Teenwolf started in
twenty eleven, so that's really when he comes on the mat.
Before that, he was primarily known I believe, for like
YouTube videos. Done a few like comedic YouTube videos, which
weren't like huge by today's standards, but by like twenty

(13:06):
eleven standards, did pretty well. They were cute, fun little
things that any teenager would probably do. But teen Wolf
was certainly the first break and you know what really
kind of thrust him into the mainstream was the maze
Runner franchise. You know, that was back when we were
getting these YA adaptations NonStop, like Twilight and Hunger Games,
and this was one of them, and honestly, for my money,

(13:30):
probably the most consistent of all of them. Like, I
have a fondness for all three of these films. I
think they're all directed by Wes Ball, who's a Florida
State filmmaker, is actually directing the new Kingdom of the
Planet of the Apes movie that's coming out pretty soon,
and so this was his kind of feature film debut.
I mean, he jumped out of the gate doing a
fucking mazer Runner movie. And so these are what kind

(13:52):
of put him on the map. And what's been interesting
since then is just watching how he's like he's consciously
trying to not get pigeonholed, right, like, because if you
saw him from Teen Wolf, you saw him as this
kind of like lanky, geeky sort of guy who sort
of blossomed into this like you know, pseudo hunk on

(14:13):
the show, right, And so his career has kind of
taken an interesting route too, because you know, he follows
those films up with like he does the action lead
and American Assassin, he goes for like he does like
the sci fi, quirky side by lead in Love and Monsters.
Like he's doing all these like really fun bit parts
of what we'll get to later and talking about him

(14:33):
is worth these trajectories. And now he's playing dan Ackroyd
in the SNL movie, so it's like he's he's really
making interesting choices. He's clearly kind of like pushing for
that leading man status and he's done it a few
times already, I think successfully. But yeah, No, it's just
it's an interesting career. I always like it when younger

(14:55):
actors who maybe you think they're headed for this certain
thing kind of just flip the script you and are like, no,
I'm gonna do for this other thing too, Like I'm
gonna make these other choices, and yeah, that's yeah, that's it,
that's it the nutshell.

Speaker 1 (15:09):
Uh, Chris, we didn't ask you have you seen many
or any of his films.

Speaker 2 (15:14):
I have seen one, and that will be my answer
when you ask me, because that's the only thing I
can answer.

Speaker 1 (15:22):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (15:23):
We were joking about this before we started recording that
I thought that dilo'd O'Brien was Dylan Baker, which is
not the case. If it had been Dylan Baker, there
would be theoretically more movies to answer too, because Dylan
Baker's been working for a much longer time. What's interesting
about Dylan O'Brien, I mean, other than the one movie
that I've seen of his. That will be my answer

(15:44):
for one of the questions. I guess the other thing
that I knew about Dylan O'Brien. Again, you already know
this Billiary Bruton, but our audience may not. Dylan O'Brien
almost died while making the Maze Runners movies, to the
point of getting essentially the you know, essentially almost Mark
Hamill of it all. He had to have his face reconstructed,
which is the exact same thing that happened to Mark
Hamill in what the mid early eighties with Mark Hamill

(16:08):
and then with Dylan O'Brien. It was on what the
second to last, if not the last Maze Runner movie.

Speaker 3 (16:13):
It was the last Maze Runner. They ended up having
to pause shooting for like a year, right even get
back into ability to Yeah, it was a pretty it
was a pretty bad accident, like it was. It was
one of those where like clearly was just like inches
away from being gone. Yeah, absolutely absolutely did. And you

(16:34):
can tell, and I don't want to get into this
because I hate talking about these sorts of things, that
you can certainly tell that there's been a a slight
change to get a should structure, like not in like
that big like Zach Effron way where it's like you're like, oh,
you look very different now, it can. What's great about
whoever did that work on Dylan O'Brien is that it

(16:54):
could also just be easily be someone being like, oh,
you just aged into it right, right, and but yeah, yeah,
very happy that the death cure did not turn out
to be that for him.

Speaker 2 (17:06):
Yeah that was I mean, that's the thing I remember
about him, is like hearing about that, and again like
that that is such an anomaly because those kinds of
things tend to not happen for good reason on set.
But again like that, that's just one of those high
profile cases of like holy shit, like one of the
main actor in your franchise just almost eight shit and
died like that's absolutely insane. Yeah, that's those that, like

(17:30):
I said, the movie I saw of his and that
that kind of piece of information is all I know
about Dylan O'Brien. And yeah, the thing about SNL in
nineteen seventy five, which sounds crazy, but yeah, it beens on.

Speaker 3 (17:41):
Here, Its on here. Yeah, he was in a harness
on top of a moving vehicle when he was unexpectedly
pulled off the vehicle and hit by another vehicle.

Speaker 1 (17:50):
Good guy.

Speaker 3 (17:51):
And yeah, so like I mean, it's like it's one
of those Jeremy Rinter things like I know how.

Speaker 2 (17:56):
You're alive, but thank goodness you are right, Yeah, because
he got hit in the face like which.

Speaker 3 (18:02):
Is destroyed the entire right side of the.

Speaker 2 (18:04):
Space, which is just yees. I mean again, like if
you're an actor, that's like, that's the thing you're so
concerned about, is you know the money makers? They would say, so.

Speaker 3 (18:14):
They whoever did it did a great job, because yeah.

Speaker 2 (18:17):
It's hard to tell. It is like to even mention
Mark Hamill, like Mark Hamill's more noticeable than Dylan O'Brien
is in terms of like the reconstructive surgery. But I'm
just I'm interested to see what and excited to see
what movies you're gonna pick and kind of giving us
an idea of where to go because the one movie
of his that I've seen, you know, again, like, I
don't know if it's a good or bad starting place.

(18:39):
So I'm excited to see what your answers to the
questions are.

Speaker 1 (18:42):
Sure, let's dive right in. Then, Billy Ray, what is
the foundational title for Dylan O'Brien that you think everybody
they'd never seen a single one, like myself? What do
you think is the one that would introduce them best
to his ouvra.

Speaker 3 (18:59):
That's the hardest question, right, I will say, and I'm
going to answer these for every question. If we were
talking about Dylan Baker, Yeah, please give me the Dylan
Baker episode at the same time, thank you, I am
I already decoided I was going to do that. If
we are talking about Dylan Baker, thank you. It would
be Todd Sollinson's Happiness as the foundational title. I think

(19:21):
that is the title of all of Dylan Baker's works,
where it sums up who he is an actor, Like
it shows you what he can do, but it also
shows you the types of projects he chooses and how
he really does not give a fuck about like what
is his way as long as it's a good script.
And for folks who don't know, he does play a
pedophile in that movie, and an ardent pedophile that they

(19:42):
don't try to like shy away from. But we're not
here to talk about Dylan Baker until the next question.
So happiness is the answered for Dylan Baker. For Dylan O'Brien,
I'm gonna go with what I think is my favorite
Dylan O'Brien film. It just happens to be my favorite film.
It's not one of his first films, but it is
Love and Monsters from twenty twenty and this film came

(20:05):
out during the pandemic when we were only seeing movies
at drive ends. It suffered because of that. Like had
it had it been released in a normal time in life,
I think it would have done really, really well. But
it's about this Dylan O'Brien plays a character named Joel. Basically,
what has happened is there's been this apocalyptic thing where

(20:29):
all of the I think it's a meteor thing, a
meteor hits or it's something to do with an asteroid
or something it's and all of these like reptiles and
amphibians become enormous and so these monsters have taken over
the planet. People are now living underground and Joel, this character,

(20:49):
decides that he's going to leave the underground bunker where
he's at and go on this trip to find the
girl that he was in love with and that he
was obsessed with before this before the World went to
Shit was kind of about his journey. There are some
just staggeringly beautiful images in this film and some really

(21:09):
emotional stuff. It's a great blend of like drama and
comedy and romance, and there's some like you know, crazy,
you know, sci fi stuff. Michael Rooker is in this
in a great supporting role. It's just a really well
thought out movie. Now it's like it's written by a
buddy of mine, Brian Duffield, directed by a guy named

(21:30):
Michael Matthews. And yeah, I just I'm a big, big
fan of this movie. I wish it would have gotten better,
more attention and better traction when it did come out
in twenty twenty. But it's one that people are discovering
as the years go by, and I would love to
see it become a cult classic.

Speaker 2 (21:48):
Speaking of Brian Duffield, Ryan, you and I talked about it.
Brian Duffield movie last year we did.

Speaker 3 (21:54):
Yeah, well it had to have been underwater or Spontaneous
or one of the bank.

Speaker 2 (22:01):
No One Will Save You. So Brian definitely that.

Speaker 3 (22:03):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, sorry, oh that, oh.

Speaker 2 (22:05):
Yeah, that movie that came out on Hulu.

Speaker 3 (22:09):
That Hulu movie.

Speaker 1 (22:11):
I love Spontaneous. That's that's my favorite for him.

Speaker 3 (22:14):
Yeah, it's it's it's really it's really good. But yeah, no,
I think this is a great gateway film for him
because I think it showcases his evolution into sort of
like leading man, but also a lot of this role
harkens back to his Teenwol stuff, right, Like the energy
that he's bringing to this is very much like he

(22:35):
brought to the Styles character in Teenwool, Because Dylan O'Brien's
really good at the whole, like, you know, charming, dorky,
a little awkward thing while also looking like he looks
and so like he's able to pull that off, and
this is a good example of that. It kind of
shows you it's a good bld of early Dylan O'Brien
and later Dylan O'Brien.

Speaker 1 (22:55):
I think, yeah, this one, I swear it had like
a pretty big response from the people that saw it,
but The hard part is not many saw it.

Speaker 3 (23:06):
Oh no, look, it made one point one million dollars
at the box office. Jesus, we made one point one
million dollars because it literally came out. It was released
October of twenty twenty, so we're talking like less than
a year into the pandemic. No one was going to
movies except at the drive through, and like, this was
the period of time when like you had movies being

(23:27):
number one at the box office that were like fucking
independent ISC movies like The Wretched that was number one
at the box office because it made like one hundred
thousand dollars, right, But what an interesting time to be
alive that was. And this movie just completely fell victim
to that. And it's so deserved better. I mean, I
don't know that it would have been a hit when

(23:47):
it came out, but it certainly would have done better
than one point one million dollars, probably would have at
least made its thirty million dollar budget back. And it's
also a bummer it didn't do better because you know,
regardless of where or it's fair or not, you know,
if you're the lead of a film that does that badly,
you get attached to that sort of stigma, right, like, oh,
this person can't carry a movie, even though clearly he

(24:10):
can because he carried American Assassin, which did better than
this film and did pretty well. So clearly that's not accurate.
But you know that's the business.

Speaker 2 (24:19):
Well, I was about to say, we're still living in
a time where Shrek two was rescreened this past weekend
in theaters it was like the third highest movie. So
then the film industry in a lot of ways has
never recovered. It may never recover, you know what.

Speaker 3 (24:32):
I look at it a little bit differently, Like I
love the fact that we're getting all of these theatrical
re releases right now.

Speaker 2 (24:38):
Now, I'm with you, I'm with you.

Speaker 3 (24:40):
I think that, like the film industry is finally discovering
the value of their bault titles, right and like because
before you might get one or two substantive re releases
in a year. Now we're getting them like every weekend. Right,
you got the money re release coming up, which I'm
gonna fucking go to. I haven't seen that movie, so
it's ninety nine.

Speaker 2 (25:00):
When I saw it, I didn't even know that this
was a fucking thing. Now I have to go watch
them theaters, which I did see in theaters originally, which
would be even fucking stranger.

Speaker 3 (25:09):
But what's great about him is they're doing decent business,
like they're they're they're showing up in the top ten,
in the top five, and so like, I think that's
actually a path forward to get out of this whole
like movie industries, dit. Like, I think that's a good
path forward. Is like rely on your vault titles for like,
they're there for a reason. You put all that work
into them, give them a life, give them an added light.

(25:30):
And so that's exciting and I would love to see,
you know, I would love to see some of these
films that got lost during the pandemic still trying to
find a home in theaters.

Speaker 2 (25:40):
I agree, and I agree totally.

Speaker 1 (25:43):
And the filmmakers like not to not to harp on
Duffield too much, but because of all the delays and everything,
he had two movies come out in one year in
twenty twenty, and unfortunately, like neither one of them did
as good as they should have. I feel like, finally
people are discovering Underwater is actually a good movie. But
it's amazing.

Speaker 3 (26:03):
Yeah, no, I mean that is that's the truth, right,
and it's the same. You know, Spontaneous suffered a similar
fate too, because it came out in October of twenty twenty,
so we're talking about like a month or two apart
from Love and Monsters.

Speaker 1 (26:16):
Is when oh, Dan, so he had three movies that year.

Speaker 3 (26:18):
She's oh yeah, and like and Spontaneous is such a
great film, yea. And I don't know anybody who sees
that movie it doesn't fall in love with it, right,
And I don't know that that was going to be
a big commercial hit, but again, it certainly would have
done better than what it ended up doing. And so like, yeah,
I think Brian is a perfect example of a lot
of people who really got shafted. I think in another

(26:39):
friend of my, Briat Grant, who like she had her
two big films, first film as a director, first film
is a big screenwriter. They both came out the year
that south By, They both premiered at south By the
year that south By had to go virtual, and so
it was like completely robbed at that whole like first
film experience, and like such a bummer because you can't
get that back.

Speaker 2 (27:00):
Can I say I'd be more inclined actually to go
see a re release of a movie I already love
than going and seeing a new movie in theaters at
this point, Like I hearing you say, like the Mummies
coming out are Aliens forty years is just coming out
like in like next week as well. I think even
I'm more excited for that because those are movies I've

(27:20):
never been able to I mean, I saw The Mummy
on the screen when I was nine years old. But
to your point, like the idea of like even though
it came out during the pandemic, hopefully the tale of
the movie extends much longer into the future, and you
know it's you can never say or know what will
or won't, but it does. It does as someone who's
a fan of wrestling, like wrestling in the film industry

(27:43):
had the same problem, which is you have people who
are making movies that then they're being thrown into a camp,
which is your movie was not successful because people just
couldn't go see it because of the pandemic. And the
same thing happened in wrestling. There were wrestlers that were
booked as the champion that it was then viewed poorly
that there was not they weren't making enough money. That's
only because the pandemic was happening. Like you know that

(28:05):
the pandemic is such a weird thing that we're still
so close to it, we're gonna have to continue to
like make apologies for it. But like a movie like
Love and Monsters really took a hit because of it, because,
I mean most movies that came out in twenty twenty,
I don't know how many people were really engaging with
movies the way they wanted to in twenty twenty.

Speaker 3 (28:24):
Oh sure. And I will say one actor who did
not have that issue though, was Dylan Baker, because Dylan
Baker did not have any films come out during the pandemic,
was just doing television. Did that great Amazon series Hunters, well,
it was good for the first season, and then did
the series Evil, which not near enough people are love
and appreciate the way they should. And it is only

(28:46):
now starting to have more, you know, films come out
post pandemic. But yeah, just to tie it back to
our other Dylan.

Speaker 2 (28:53):
To the original Violin.

Speaker 3 (28:55):
If you haven't seen Love and Monsters, boy and boy,
I really recommend you see it. I think it's a
really special I think it's got something for everybody. It
is a what it is what I call it complete entertainment.

Speaker 1 (29:07):
Chris, you've seen one Dylan O'Brien, ha me mess up
the name now, but just we're doing two in one episode.
You seen one Dylan O'Brien film. So what do you
think is the foundational title the one you've seen?

Speaker 2 (29:17):
Well, and that's the thing Billy Ray already mentioned it.
I actually found American Assassin to be a fun movie.
I went and saw it in theaters. I didn't even
do an episode on it. I just went and saw
it because, oh well, I can tell you why I
went and saw it. I went and saw because I
did Michael Keaton in it. That's why you know Michael
Keaton who I mean this. What's even funnier is like

(29:38):
twenty seventeen is around the time where Michael Keaton's having
like his resurgence as an actor too, because if memory serves,
twenty seventeen is either the year of or the year
before or after Birdman. Yeah, I think we're like we're
right in there. Which I think American Assassin. Him being
cast at American Assassin was because of Birdman. But actually
I actually think American Assassins a really fun, interesting movie.

(30:03):
And I think Dylan O'Brien is actually really good in it.
He can actually stand up to Michael Keaton, who I mean,
obviously is like a you know, Michael Keaton is Michael
Keaton and he's a tour to force. But Dylan O'Brien's great. Actually,
I actually rewatched American Assassin this week and I was like, huh,
this is the fact that this movie doesn't get talked about.
I understand because it does feel a little Jason Bourne adjacent,

(30:27):
but I don't know, I feel like there's enough going
on within the movie to be like, oh, you should
check this out if you're into like spy spy movies. Again,
like it's such a weird it's hard to describe what
the movie is without saying like it's just kind of
like a lot of these other movies that were coming
out in the mid tens. But if you're into like

(30:48):
well made action movies from the mid tens to teens,
like this movie right up your alley. And Dylan O'Brien's great,
and as Taylor Kitsch too, who I'm kind of low
key a fan of because.

Speaker 3 (30:59):
For the I love Taylor Kitch. I'm like Friday Night
Lion Stand Friday Night, Lights Stand all day long and
big yeah, big Tim Riggans fan over here.

Speaker 2 (31:09):
I like Taylor Kitch as a David Koresh. I thought
that that was inspired casting. But American Assassin's worth checking
out for sure.

Speaker 3 (31:18):
Oh no, I love American Assassin, like straight up. I
think I think, uh, it's interesting because like, originally they
were like it was gonna be like Gerard Butler or
Colin Farrell in this role, and then they decided to
go back to the very beginning of the book series
and start out when he was younger, which I think
was a really good decision, and yeat, dlda Brad's great here,
like he this was his first role after the accident,

(31:40):
right like, this was his first time doing something after
the accident, and you can tell, right like, he has
this like world weariness to him in this movie that
he has not add in previous films. Is a little
more haggard looking at times, and it's like clearly that
was a choice to have him looked like that. But
also like, dude just almost died, so like he's pulling
on some Basically this is about his his girlfriend is

(32:03):
killed in this this shooting and then so he kind
of goes on the war path trying to go after
these people. Michael Keaton plays his CIA handler and a
great son al Athan is also in this, who does
not get near enough leading roles. She's really great in this.
The CIA director. Yeah, like it equips himself of like

(32:23):
the action lead really really well and to the point
where I'm like, why have we not seen more of
this since then? Because it felt like it would have
been Maybe it's just because he doesn't play a pigeonhole,
but yeah, I'm a big fat this woe And this
film did decently and you had a similar budget to
Love and Monsters, made like almost seventy million at the
box office, Like did decent? Did decent for a film

(32:44):
like this, for a film that most people don't remember.

Speaker 2 (32:47):
Yeah, I would assume most most people didn't see this movie,
which is a shame because we didn't get a sequel,
even though they said it. They set it up at
the end of the movie for more stuff because this
is again based off of a book series as well. Yeah,
I can't recommend this movie enough. And to your point,
I think if we're talking just holistically about Dylan O'Brien,
it's a good vehicle for him as an actor as well.

Speaker 3 (33:10):
Oh and you also, let's be clerk, you also get
Scott Atkins in a small role. So when do you
not let a good Scott Atkins appearance.

Speaker 1 (33:19):
Absolutely Well, now that we've been talking about American Assassin
for a little while, our second question, Bill Ray, could
you recommend a lesser known title from his filmography which
somebody if they watched it as their first entry into
his filmography, maybe it would potentially turn them off. But
it's actually a pretty damn good movie.

Speaker 3 (33:39):
Yeah. That's another interesting one too, because I'll be honest, like,
I don't think he has a lot of movies that
would turn someone off. Like, for the most part, he
makes pretty populist movies, Like they're movies that are gonna
be generally appealing to those yep. So I'm gonna I'm
gonna highlight a movie. And this is not a movie,

(34:00):
by the way, that I think is one of his best,
So I don't want that to be what I'm asserting here,
but it is a unique project in his homography. It
is a film called Flashback, and this is a film
from twenty twenty. It also came out during the Pandemic.
It was originally called I Believe the Education of Frederick

(34:23):
Fitzel was the original title, but they changed it to
Flashback and it's a weird like time hoppy. He meets
this guy that he knew when he was younger, but
then there's this whole question of does this person really
exist and what is reality? And it's like this journey

(34:45):
through time and memory and like it's it's a really
bizarre film and it doesn't all work, and it doesn't
all you see what they're going for. You understand what
they're going for. They just don't quite know how to
put a all the pieces together. But it also it's
got Hannah Gross. Micah Monroe is the female lead of

(35:07):
the film. And it just kind of came and went
right like it didn't even get at the ashcre release.
It went straight to I think it went straight to
VOD and physical media just immediately is what it went to.
And I see why, Like it doesn't have the appeal,
but it's different. In his filmography, he doesn't do a

(35:29):
lot of these like weird. He does indie movies, but
he doesn't do a lot of these like weird, like
really out there indie movies, right, Like, this is a
different sort of thing because he's playing the elite guy.
It's clearly like a Jacob's Ladder. It inspired sort of
psychological thriller. You don't see him doing a lot of

(35:50):
that stuff. And so and maybe for good reason, I
don't think Flashback necessarily works in a lot of ways.
But it's the only film in his filmography that I'm like,
I think there's Maria there, and it might turn some people.

Speaker 2 (36:02):
Off, and it's a Christopher McBride movie. I enjoy the
Conspiracy a whole lot. That's a that's fair. Yeah, yeah,
that's a weird that's a weird movie. Like, that's a
weird fun movie. So I would actually be curious to
check this movie out because that Conspiracies found footage. This
movie is clearly not a found footage film.

Speaker 3 (36:21):
No, no, it's not. And it's and look it's like
it's got all the things right, it's shot well, it's
well acted, like it's just the story where things get
a little muddy, and and yeah, I don't think it's
certainly it's certainly not a film without merit. It's certainly
a film that has interesting ideas and is doing some
things well, but not is never gonna be like, it's

(36:45):
never going to become a cult classic. It's not got
that vibe to it.

Speaker 1 (36:50):
I am very intrigued by this one. You say it
doesn't work. That sounds rather it doesn't work.

Speaker 3 (36:56):
That said, Like, you know, is it a movie that
I'll watch again? Sure? Like it's like it's not like
it maybe doesn't work all the way, but it's got
enough value to it. I mean, it's got like fifty
on Rotten Tomatoes, so it's not at the bottom. It's
not the Drex.

Speaker 1 (37:16):
Yeah and Mike come and row. I mean that's a
big selling point too, especially for fans of it follows.

Speaker 3 (37:22):
Yeah, absolutely, and Yeah it's good. It makes me want
to see him in more horror. It's not a straight
up horror film, but it's got horror elements. I would
love to see Dylan O'Brien because he's never really done
it a straight up horror film, so it'd be interesting
to see that. He's got a movie coming out that
m By Shamalin produced, which I think might be horror,

(37:45):
but it also might just be more of a mystery thriller.

Speaker 1 (37:48):
So it's oh got it. I thought it was that
one that the trailer just came out for and that
not to date the episode necessarily, but then.

Speaker 3 (37:57):
Another daughter's movie or trap. But it's just something that
he's producing. It's been it's been on the development for
or it's been shot for a while, so it just
hasn't been released yet. But we'll see. I'm not sure
exactly what that's gonna be, but maybe maybe staying away
from more. Additionally, he did start out doing a horror series,
so maybe he just wanted to stay away from the

(38:18):
genre for a while, makes sense. That's a good call,
matild sense. Now on the other the other side of
that or other dyl inside, when we're talking about titles
that I think pribe to me the parameters again.

Speaker 1 (38:37):
Uh, basically something we covered, a good entry point, something
that's not necessarily a great entry point for the actor
that we're talking about, but still one that's a great film.

Speaker 3 (38:47):
I want to go cat Fight. I'm gonna go cap Actually,
you know, I'm not gonna go cat Fight. I'm gonna
go Apple Sauce. I'm gonna go the movie Apple Sauce.
I think that is the movie that Oh wow, has
anybody here seen Apple Sauce? I have not okay. So
Apple Sauce is a wild movie. It's from director Owner

(39:11):
to Kel, who has done a lot of it. He's
like a he's like a weird, wild, crazy New York filmmaker,
very Woody Allen esque but very like heightened genre stuff.
We actually world premiered his new film pound Cake at
make Believe last year. But Dylan O'Brien, uh, basically plays
this DJ. The whole plot is about a man who

(39:32):
calls into this talk show hosted by Dylan O'Brien.

Speaker 1 (39:35):
He conte Dylan Baker, you're doing it now.

Speaker 3 (39:37):
Yeah, Dylan Baker, and then body part starts showing up
at his house. Someone starts to see you random body parts.
So he's like his life's und rambling, he's trying to
figure it out. Dylan O'Brien is this, Uh is this
radio host who kind of is almost like the narrator
but also sort of playing like the Dylan Baker. This
is the dominant presence. And so it's just an odd movie.

(40:00):
It's a weird movie.

Speaker 1 (40:01):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (40:02):
Not everybody is gonna get down with it. It is
out there, it goes for but Dylan Baker is really good,
and this was Dylan Baker's introduction to the world of
Oder to kill. He's done other films with him, and
uh yeah, it's it's a it's a it's a it's
a Baker's dozen.

Speaker 2 (40:20):
It's a Baker's delight, one might say.

Speaker 3 (40:22):
One might say it's a Baker's delight. Uh so I
would say for Dylan O'Brien, it's splashback. For Dylan Baker,
it is Apple sauce.

Speaker 2 (40:31):
I don't have an answer for Dylan O'Brien, but for
Dylan Baker. I actually put a movie that I really
resonate with a lot which is revolutionary road Sure, Sam men,
I mean Sam Mendez, great movie. I mean Dylan Baker's
in it, but he's not a main character, but I
mean he's I don't know. I still think it's funny
that Dylan Baker almost was if there had been a
fourth Spider Man movie, he would have been the Lizard, which,

(40:54):
you know, what a weird universe that we have Dylan
Baker playing a massive movie villain in a massive film
franchise directed by Sam Raimie. We never got it, which
is a shame. But maybe Dylan O'Brien could play doctor
Kirk Connors and the New Spider Man movies. Wouldn't that be.

Speaker 3 (41:10):
Something I have no doubt Dylan O'Brien like anything he
wants absolutely good.

Speaker 1 (41:19):
I'm just now thinking, like, what do we even title.

Speaker 2 (41:21):
This episode hilarious? That's when we timel it double Dylan,
Double Dylan all the way, Double D's.

Speaker 3 (41:28):
All the way baby.

Speaker 1 (41:30):
All right, let's get into some of the bigger impact
of the Dylan's of Gosh, what is the biggest impact
that Dylan O'Brien has had on pop culture as a whole?
And again, this doesn't have to be like a film specifically.
It can be anything philosophical, it can be like inspiring
a generation, or it genuinely could be a film, Like
what do you think his impact has had the biggest

(41:53):
hand in?

Speaker 3 (41:55):
Well, it's interesting because I don't know that Dylan O'Brien
has a lot of culture impact honestly, Like he's got
a huge fan base and so and that's super important,
but like cultural impact, I don't know. What I will
say is is what I think he has perfected is
the art of the himbo. He's a phenomenal hymbo. And

(42:18):
I think back to his early work in like the
first time or The Internship, but mostly he did this
film in twenty twenty two called Not Okay, which starred
Zoey Deutsch, and he started it as well, and it
is it is the beginning of that where he's basically
playing this very like you know, what's the right word,

(42:42):
like the culturally appropriating white guy. And then he followed
that up with a film which really went under the
rate arts, a mockumentary called Maximum Truth, which stars Ike
Baron Holtz about this sort of like political campaign dealer
in his own mind, and Dylan O'Brien plays just like

(43:04):
social media guy who helps him out where he in
that movie. You will never see a better hymbo in
your life. You will never see a better hymbo than
Dylan O'Brien and Maximum Trury. And so for me, that's
the big thing is I think he really has just
perfected that particular type of role in those three films
to the point where I don't think he ever needs
to even do it again. But like he's done such

(43:26):
a great job with it so far. And Maximum Truth,
I will say, like Not Okay, I think is a
really solid film. It's got some interesting things to say.
Maximal Truth is kind of a disaster and is only
saved by the fact that he and Ike Baron Holtz
are working overtime to make that script work. But you
might still get some you know, if you're Dilan O'Brien
complete us, certainly check it out. If you're not, you

(43:47):
can skip it. But I would say yeah, for Dylan
O'Brien hasn't been changing the world, but in terms of himbos,
is really been getting the word out.

Speaker 1 (43:57):
Ike barn Olds says not get enough love. Definitely wanted
to show that.

Speaker 3 (44:01):
Yeah, no, for sure, for sure, no, no, I was
just gonna say so. Dylan Baker is different, right like
in the sense of I credit Dylan Baker alongside folks
like Philip Seymour Hoffman, right the people who are around
the same time who sort of made it okay to

(44:21):
be unlikable and despicable in movies. And obviously Philip Seymore
Hoffman had a bigger career and a bigger place than that.
But it goes back to happiness, right like. Happiness is
the example, because that is a film where you are
not supposed to like anyone. There is no one in

(44:44):
that film that is even remotely likable, and yet you're
still interested in them, you're still following them, like you're
still captivated by them. And Dylan Baker is that perfect example.
Like I said earlier, he plays an unremorseful, unrelenting file
and they don't shy away from it. They're not excusing it,

(45:06):
but they're also not They're just painting it as it is.
And there's this really uncomfortable scene in that movie where
he is a conversation having a conversation with his son,
and his son asks him, if I weren't your son,
would you have tried something like that with me? And
he says yes. I'm like, that's horrifying and harrowing, and

(45:27):
that is really what set Dylan Baker up as this
very particular type of character actor. And we see it,
you know, and it's not all he's done right, like
we said earlier, like he was in the Spider Man franchise.
He's clearly not type cast as those things. But I
think he gave a lot of actors' permission and the
same way a lot of these Todd Solins actors did
to just like you can go for the crazy shit,

(45:49):
you can go for the hard to watch shit and
still make it work. And I think he's been doing
that his whole career as a character actor. I think
he's one of the most reliable character actor there is.
I think about his work Kid Hunters, that Amazon series
where he plays an unrelenting Nazi, and that opening scene
of that series is like, what so amazing and only

(46:12):
Dylan Baker can do I feel like only Dylan Baker
can get away with that, Like who else would have
done that? I don't know, Like Dylan Baker is the
is my first thought, but like yeah, shows it does
throughout his career. But I think Iak has really elevated
the character actor game. I would say that is something
and not just him. We've got a lot of other
great character actors who've done it, but I would certainly

(46:34):
put him in the mount rushmore of those.

Speaker 2 (46:37):
His something about the way he smiles, it's it always
kind of it could either be sinister or not. I
think of Trick or Treat, a movie that I'm not
really a huge fan of, but he's great. He's great
in it. Wow. Well, I have a long and storied
history with that director, So we'll just leave it at that.
If you want to hear more about that story, I
forget which episode I tell the story on.

Speaker 3 (46:57):
But I don't know that I need to hear that.

Speaker 2 (47:01):
It's funny. It's funny listen to horror anthology.

Speaker 3 (47:05):
So I don't know if that's but yeah, I just yeah,
it's interesting. Like just looking at his filmography and what
you said is so she're like, he can play He
can go from playing like the worst most republic pedophile
in the world to playing like a normal suburban dad

(47:27):
and give the exact same kind of performance in both,
but he'd be completely different, like just with like he's
just really good at absorbing the story and the writing
of whatever he's given and then just like putting it
out and like and we're just subtle changes. He can
go from one to the other, which is subtle changes,

(47:47):
and he knows exactly what he's doing at this point,
and he plays into it sometimes, Like sometimes he'll be
playing the role and you're like, Okay, you're really just
buying into this caricature of yourself. But then sometimes he'll
come out with something like totally totally entirely different. Like
he's got a new movie out right now. It's called Leroy, Texas,
which stars Steve Soon, and he plays a hit man,

(48:09):
and it's a very interesting take on a hit man role,
like very different than any kind of hit man you've
seen before, and like he's just really great at that.
He's really great at taking those those roles and just
injecting something slightly different into it.

Speaker 1 (48:24):
Well said, character actors are always fun to talk about,
and the amount of like great ones we've had that
still don't get respect is always infuriating.

Speaker 3 (48:34):
Yeah, he's He's I've always said that Dylan Baker is
like William H. Macy with no fucks to give. Yeah,
they're similar, They're similar actor types. They probably each one's
lost out to the other on countless roles over the years.
I would guarantee you William H. Macy gets more of
the prestige and more like, oh it's William H. Macy.

(48:56):
But we're talking about very tiny differences. And then as performers, right,
I feel like the types of roles that Dylan Baker
will play, William H. Macy would never play.

Speaker 2 (49:08):
I would agree with that. And William H. Macy also
the Cohen Brothers guy too, there's a little bit.

Speaker 3 (49:13):
Of that, right, But yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (49:17):
So I'm curious after what you just said, looking at
the William H. Macy filmography, which of his films would
would rather seen Dylan Baker play the.

Speaker 3 (49:28):
Role Ooh that is a really interesting question. Okay, I'll
play this game. I'll play this game. I would say,
I'm just scrolling through here right now and looking at
sort of oh interesting, interesting. I will say for me, God,

(49:56):
there's so many, there are so many, There's so many
options where I could see him doing it. It's like,
which one do I want him to do?

Speaker 1 (50:04):
Though? Right?

Speaker 3 (50:04):
Because like, clearly not Fargo, Like clearly Fargo was William H.
Macy wants to see Dylan Baker in that. Okay, I'll
give it. I'll give an answer. And this is a
really outside their answer. Jurassic Park three.

Speaker 2 (50:20):
I figured he was gonna say that. I was like,
please say Jurassic Park three. Please say Jurassic Park three.

Speaker 3 (50:25):
I don't dislike William H. Macy and Jurassic Park three.
I just think Dylan O'Brien would have been by or
Dylan Baker would have been an interesting choice for that.
I think you would have been an interesting choice for that.
I can also say maybe, I mean there's some later
stuff that I don't really feel like, like he's in

(50:45):
Ricky Stanicky like, that would have been fun to see
Dylan Baker play that role, but it's William H. Macy.
Once I say Kingdom of the Planet of the Apes,
I'll tell you if that's one that we could that
we could do. But uh yeah, that'd be the answer
that the.

Speaker 1 (51:00):
Jurassic Park's a good pool. It's Part three is not great,
and I think it would have been more interesting with
Dylan Baker.

Speaker 2 (51:06):
Part three has one of the funniest scenes in all
the Jurassic Park movies, where a velociraptor literally goes allen.
It's the funniest part of all of those movies. It
was for the trailer and nothing else because it makes
no sense in the movie. But I love that they
got a trailer shot of a velociraptor in a airplane
and there was like, whoa, what is this? Oh, it's
just a dream sequence. Okay, never mind.

Speaker 3 (51:28):
I have a fondness for Jurassic Park three. It's certainly
not look I mean, it's certainly not as bad as
I would say any of the Jurassic World films. Person
agreed Greek garbage, but it's got I think it's got
its qualities. I don't think Joe Johnston knows how to
make a bad movie, Like they don't all work. I mean,
I would argue wolf Man is kind of a bad movie,

(51:50):
but he say he kind of came in to save
that movie, so I don't blame him as much as
I blame I don't even blame Mark Robinock. I just
blame the whole system. But but like olean, it is
gonna make a bad movie. So it's like Jurassic Park three.
I think it's got its charms. I think it's a
fun adventure movie. I don't think it does anything new,
but I do think, like I think Telioni and Williamitch

(52:11):
may see your interesting characters. I think having Sam Neil
back in this movie is way better than having it
back in Jurassic World Dominion, which is wasted.

Speaker 2 (52:22):
No, they're all wasted in Dominion, everybody, including the original
series actors and then the actors from Jurassic World as well.
Everybody's and then it's about Locus. Guys, snipe about dinosaurs
is about Locus.

Speaker 3 (52:34):
And I don't want to make this the Jurassic Park episode, clearly,
but what I will say is like I almost walked
out of Jurassic World. The first time I saw it,
me and my buddy went. We almost walked out because
I'm a huge fan of that original film and so
and it just felt like it was the cheapest, worst

(52:56):
form of lip service, and it just it bothered me
so bad. We stayed. We watched it. Did not care
for the movie, I'll be honest. Washing it a few
years later, didn't hate it as much, but still was
not a fan. Then came Fallen Kingdom, which is from
one of my absolute favorite filmmakers. I'm a massive Ja Bay,
I'm a fan, and I think the first half of

(53:18):
that film is borderline and watchable, and I think the
second half, when it turns into ostensibly a haunted house movie,
is really effective. And if that whole movie had been
a haunted house movie, maybe the second best Jurassic movie
ever made. Jurassic World Dominion, I think is one of
the worst films I've ever seen in there.

Speaker 2 (53:36):
I think Fallen Kingdom is the third best Jurassic Park movie.

Speaker 3 (53:39):
It is just for that last half.

Speaker 2 (53:42):
Yeah, Yeah, Drastic.

Speaker 3 (53:43):
World Dominion is absolute garbage. Colin Trevorrow does not need
to be allowed to direct movies anymore. I had your chance,
you fucked up too many times, go produce television and
leave movies alone. And the fact that they're working on
a new fucking Jurassic Park movie already ain to me.

(54:03):
I wanted I read something like Scarlett Johansson. Is that?
Did I read bullshit?

Speaker 1 (54:07):
Or is like no, you Hanson, dev Patil, that's it?

Speaker 3 (54:10):
And I'm like Gareth Edwards directing Like I like Gareth Edwards.
Don't get me wrong. I don't have a problem with
Gareth Edwards directing it. And I think there's stuff to
like about the creator, but like, why do we need
this right now? Like stop, give it a break, Like
take a fucking break.

Speaker 2 (54:28):
It's becoming the Spider Man of the franchise world all
of a sudden, Like, really another Jurassic work?

Speaker 3 (54:33):
Really want this? I guess? So these movies keep making
an obscene amount of money, so like maybe there is
a market for me. I am not that market. I
do not want another fucking Jurassic anything. Give it ten
years and then maybe we can talk.

Speaker 2 (54:49):
But I only hope it's the it's the rumored human
dinosaur hybrid storyline, because if that's what it is, I'm game.
Give me something fucking weird. Well, that was always the
rumor for like decades.

Speaker 3 (55:00):
To Gareth Edwards, that could be really interesting, right, who
plays a lot in his films about human hybrids and
like that would be an interesting director to have that
off too. I wouldn't be as anti that as possible.
That said, they gave a movie to j Boyona. They
tied his hands behind his back every step of the way,
and what we got was Falling Kingdom and so you know,

(55:21):
they didn't have the courage to let him make his movie,
and so he compromised. And it's like, don't that's done.
My biggest thing with anything in general, don't bring in
these like really creative visionary guys and then not let
them do their thing. Otherwise, why do you want them.
You could get any fucking music video director in the
planet to do exactly what you want them to do,

(55:42):
and don't get somebody like him and be like, okay,
but by the way, you can't do this, this, this, this, this,
It's like no, like, don't do that, don't do that.
Don't do that to my boy ja.

Speaker 2 (55:52):
And to bring it all the way back to Jurassic
Park and Dylan Baker and William H. Macy speaking of
a director whose hands were tied behind his back. He
made a Marvel film Joe Johnston, which I still concede
The Rocketeer was the framework for First Avenger, and Marvel
did not let him do his own thing on that
movie either.

Speaker 3 (56:11):
That said, I still think it's a pretty damn successful movie.
Like First Avenger. I still think is one of the
better Marvel movies.

Speaker 2 (56:18):
Better than the First Store movie, that's for sure.

Speaker 3 (56:21):
And it's like, so I like, I have a soft
spot for that film. I do. And it feels like
a Joe Johnston movie, even with everything that happened, Like
it feels like a Joe Johnston movie. And like, I
know it's weird to say that, and people might fight
back on but like you think about Rockets Here, you
think about Jurassic World three, you think about think about
all these other Joe Johnston, Mighty Joe Young stuff like that,
they all feel like a Joe Johnston movie. And and

(56:44):
not a lot of filmmakers because he's not someone who
is considered an not tour He's not someone who's considered
like you wouldn't have Joe Johnson listed as one of
like the top, you know, But like they all feel
like Honey, I Shuck the Kids and Jumanji, like they
all feel like Joe Johnston movies. He does not get
enough credit for, like what he has done for philm

(57:05):
in terms of like adventure films. Like when I think
of adventure films, the first person I think of is
Joe Johnson.

Speaker 2 (57:11):
Every Sin sam Or's my favorite, Stephens speaking of the Mummy,
Stephen Summers.

Speaker 3 (57:17):
That's a great that's a great adventure film. Top five
adventure films. I would say, it's really good. Yeah, but yeah, yeah,
So those those would be my responses to the questions
on the Dylans.

Speaker 1 (57:29):
Well, then let's build a cinematic bridge to the Dylons.
What do you think is something that somebody else could
see that they're a fan of already if they've never
seen a Dylan O'Brien movie, that would indicate that they
might like to jump into that filmography.

Speaker 3 (57:44):
Well, clearly teen Wolf, right, like if you are, but
I'll go on a little broader since there if you're
a fan, because this is this was my route to him,
so right, so I would say follow my exact roo
if you're a fan of like the teen dramas, the
teen super and after shows like Riverdale and shit like that,
like oc anything like that. Give Teen Wolf a shot.

(58:05):
I guarantee you it is because people think teen Will
they think, oh, it's an MTV show and it's this
and it's that, and it's like I understand, but it
is so much better that it has any right to be.
And this so much better that you would ever think
it would be because of all the things you come
in with. So you're going to be pleasantly surprised. You're
just going to be. And I've rewatched this series like

(58:27):
four times at this point, and like I rewatched it
for the last time leading up to when they did
the teen movie, which is frankly not great. But don't
let that take you out in the series. The series
really really well done. It is it's all about the
guiding hand, right, It's all about the people who are
behind it, and basically it's Russell will Ka He is
the driving force behind that series. And Russell wilkahee people

(58:50):
might know from like directed Pitch Black and directed Highlander
two and like it's been a filmmaking force for a
while and he is really the guiding hand teen Wolf,
and it's so necessary. So if you're a fan of that.
If you're a fan of like these kind of shows
and it takes you to Team Woolf, I can't imagine
you're not going to be interested in seeing what else
Dylan O'Brien's doing, because he is the standout from that show,

(59:13):
like clearly the standout, not only in the fact that
he's gone on to have the biggest career by far
of everybody in that show, but it's just obvious. It's
just obvious when you watch it that, like you know,
there are a lot of really good actors, that he's
the star. And so I would say that that for
Dylan O'Brien, I would say, you know, Dylan, Dylan Baker

(59:33):
is a little more difficult to say, like what would
be like the thing that would get you into him?
I would I would honestly say, oh boy, it's so hard,
but I want to go back to a TV show
as well, because I think TV is good gateway to
like to like film stuff for a lot of people

(59:55):
and more people you know, and people start out on TV.
So I would say The Good Wie. I was a
huge fan of the Good Wife, and he plays a
really interesting character on that show. Over think about ten
episodes where he plays this like obvious killer that everybody
knows is the killer. He knows he's the killer, he
knows everybody knows he's the killer, but he always finds

(01:00:17):
a way to get off. And so it's this very
interesting kind of like eight to ten episode arc that
he plays on that show. I would also point out
he has a really great arc similar number of episodes
on The Americans, And if you're a fan of those
shows or any of those shows, like that's a good
gateway for Dylan Baker, I think, because he's bringing the

(01:00:37):
same stuff to it whether it's a TV show or
a film, just different medium. But part of the problem
with trying to pinpoint him that way is his filmogrape
is so diverse, Like he's done everything, Like he does
character roles in like crime movies and dramas, but he
does Marvel and he does comedies and he does everything right.
And so or maybe on J Juste Bros. Just a

(01:01:00):
fan of like weird character actors, like there's no one better,
There's no one better, like you know, he's you know,
the Mount Rushmore for me of character actors. He's definitely
on there. J. T. Walsh is on there? You know
who else? Who else is a who are some great
character actors, Like I've got weird ones like out lowers,

(01:01:21):
like James Rebhorn and things like that that I would
probably put on there, But like he's for sure on there,
Like he's just there's no one like him. There's no
character actor like Dylan Baker.

Speaker 1 (01:01:31):
You brought up some of his TV stuff and I
was thinking about this the other day when Chris and
I were talking about the Dylan Baker Dylan O'Brien misunderstanding.
I am kind of shocked that we never got Dylan
Baker as like a white collar criminal on an episode
of The Shield. I feel like he would have fit
in there perfectly well.

Speaker 3 (01:01:49):
And the other show that I didn't mention was because
his big break was really Murder One, the series in
the mid nineties, and and he played he was on
he was on that series, and he was on there.
I think he was a I think he was a
series regular if he wasn't a credited person. But that's
where he did his crime procedural work was in that
shows Detective Poulson. But like you know, he shows up

(01:02:13):
like he's one of those actors, like he showed up
for five episodes of Law and Order, he showed up
for twelve episodes of Kings and he's all said the
good Wife. He's on Damages for a season, like he
shows up for these like huge arts on these TV
shows and and he's great. He's always great, He's never
not great. You're never gonna find a bad Dylan Baker performance.

(01:02:34):
It's literally not possible.

Speaker 2 (01:02:39):
I have an answer for the Dylan Baker side, but
not for the Dylan O'Brien side. And it's someone that
I think in a lot of ways, like he as
an actor has that same feel to him where he
could play sinister or caring and it's very much like
riding the razor's edge John Lithgow. Oh, and to go

(01:03:01):
even further, I'm actually surprised Dexter never had Dylan Baker
on the show because he would have been a perfect
like he actually would have been if you had taken
John Lithgow out of the fourth season of the show
and replaced him with Dylan Baker, I think it would
have worked still as well, because again, he has that
family man vibe to him, but there could be a

(01:03:21):
secret underneath the surface. And John lifgo does that great
because he's very menacing but also can be very charming,
save with Dylan Baker. So I would say, if you're
a fan of John Lithgow's stuff, definitely check out Dylan
Baker's kind of body of work.

Speaker 3 (01:03:34):
Yeah, I think that's a good comparison for sure. I
think that definitely works.

Speaker 1 (01:03:39):
Well. We did it. We answered all the questions about everything.
We're definitely we did the Dylan's We did the double
Dylan thing. This first off maybe the funniest episode did.

Speaker 3 (01:03:53):
It just felt right. It felt right since we had
already established and Dylan Baker was looming over episode. It
was brilliant all right. And now that I've been talking
about it more and more, I'm like, cast Dylan Baker
is Dylan O'Brien's dad and something, let's get some double
Dylan action going. It works. They look enough alike. It
was totally feasible and also like and let me just

(01:04:17):
thought it would be clear. I want to I want
to I want another Dylan Baker and a Todd solid
soil like that's what I want. And Todd Warren had
not made a movie in a while. I know, got
one coming. Cow been working well, maybe it worked because I.

Speaker 4 (01:04:34):
Don't even have like that Lett made a deal with
like eight twenty four something, but like an build I
think being long. Oh wait though, okay, I'm not wrong. Yeah,
it's that It's love Child at the name of the movie.
An eleven year old boy seems to reshape the mother's
love life and their actress consequence, and it is Elizabeth Oulton.

Speaker 3 (01:04:52):
And Charleton Melton. So far h which is interesting. But yeah,
I want to see another Dylan Baker in a Salon's
movie because I just love Todd Salons. He's one of
my absolute favorite films. Yeah, eight Years, which is a
fucking travesty. Dude should be getting I get it. His
stuff is out there. It's weird. It's hard to it's

(01:05:14):
not palatable for everyone.

Speaker 1 (01:05:15):
But I mean we're in the period of weird. Look,
I mean, look at you know, I know four things.
There's so many things that are coming out that are
finally pushing some of those boundaries of what was expected.
And I would be all about a Salon's aissance. Like
I mean, the first off, the big thing is all
the classics, get those out on physical media that people
have been begging for that for years and supposedly Happiness

(01:05:38):
was coming to Criterion like five years ago, come on,
do something about it already.

Speaker 3 (01:05:42):
Well, his four film streak there, it was Welcome to
the Dollhouse, Happiness, Storytelling, and Palindrones. It's such a wild
series of filmmaking adventures. Like Palindromes is a hard movie
to watch, like to the fact that you watch it
and you're like when you've got a scene where you've

(01:06:03):
got a woman walking through all of these like aborted
fetuses that have been dropped in a landfill, like we're
talking about like hard shit, and like like nobody's doing that.
Nobody does shit like that, and like and yeah, I
just love Totslons. I wish he was getting I wish
he was. He's very similar to somebody like a like
a Terry's wig off to me right, like they to

(01:06:26):
me share a lot of DNA, even Harmony kurn I
would throw in there to a bit, to a degree,
all filmmakers. I would love to see more stuff from.
I did well her friend's new movie Agro Drift, and
it is wild, right works, but it's wild.

Speaker 1 (01:06:44):
My friend went to that whole strip club premiere thing.
Did you go to that?

Speaker 3 (01:06:48):
Uh? No, I did not go to the strip club.
I got a screener for the festival, so I watched
it on my screen at home. But uh, I ninety
nine percent of people who see they are gonna hate it. Yeah,
but the one percent are gonna go ape shit for it,
like I was the one percent of Beach Bomb, so
I get it.

Speaker 1 (01:07:09):
Oh man, this has been really fun on an episode
that we can talk about from Beach Bomb to Twilight
to Jurassic World, Dominion to Happiness.

Speaker 3 (01:07:18):
And now we have Now we have protocol sets, so
we know that every time I come on, we're going
to talk about two actors with the same name.

Speaker 1 (01:07:25):
Maybe maybe next time it'll be directors or two very
opposite micro genres or something like that.

Speaker 3 (01:07:34):
Or we could do something what's oh, what's his name?
We can do like Alfred Hitchcock, Alfred Molina double feature
Molena and Hitchcock.

Speaker 1 (01:07:48):
I love it, Billy Ray. And if somebody wanted to
go hear more of you, you already mentioned a lot
of it. What's the one thing that you would say
people should go check out first?

Speaker 3 (01:07:57):
Oh goodness, that's hard. I would say, Well, look, I
would say, obviously, screen drafts, like if you're not a
screen Drafts listener, I would I would encourage you to
become one and join the patreon, because I promise you
there is no more active patreon around than on the
screen Drafts Patreon. So I would say, definitely go support

(01:08:19):
those guys and therefore support me in the process because
you're gonna be hearing a lot of me on that
podcast coming up, and you know. Other than that, I
would just direct people to like I don't even know,
like I have stuff that people can go check out,
but it's like, eh, like, just go listen to all
my old shit if you like. If you like, go
listen to the Incinerator, go listen to movie mixtapes, like

(01:08:42):
you know, go listen to that stuff, but mostly go
listen to screen drafts.

Speaker 2 (01:08:46):
Chris, what about yourself Readingwaymedia dot com is where you
can find everything that I work on, except for one thing,
which can be found over at my patreon or Mike
White's patreon. That is Projection Booth and culture Cast, respectively,
And that's ranking on Bond where we talk about James
Bond once a month with our dear friend mister Richard
HadAM Fro Richard Adam's paranormal bookshelf. So if that's something
that you're into and you want to hear, which if

(01:09:07):
you're listening to this, you might go on over to
weirdingwaymedia dot com.

Speaker 1 (01:09:11):
What about you, right, I would say check out someone's
favorite productions. With Billy Ray being here, I got to
highlight the fact that the one that has been currently released,
Billy Ray wrote a really great piece with me on
a film that was called what Happens Next will Scare You?
It is a horror anthology. We covered underappreciated segments from
horror anthology films and I really appreciate it and it's

(01:09:34):
a superstellar release. So terror Vision put that out back
and I think November of twenty twenty three or January
or something like that, and yeah, I think people would
love it. It's a fun one, but yeah, Someone's favorite
Productions dot com. Billy Ray, thanks again for doing this now.

Speaker 3 (01:09:52):
It was my pleasure have me back anytime.

Speaker 1 (01:09:54):
Of course, as usual with today, specifically with so many
films agents, we hope that it's inspired you to check
out something new, you look at our next episode, and
that you continue to push the boundaries