Evil Dead!! Film Foundations Franchise: An Intro to Sam Raimi's classic through Evil Dead Rise!!

Ryan and Chris are back to discuss the groovy world of Necornomicons and deadeyes with Evil Dead. A consistent franchise that we both have fairly strong feelings for. Which one is the biggest impact on pop culture? Have you seen the musical? Share your answers with us!

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:08):
Hello everyone, and welcome back to Film Foundations, the collaborative
show between weirding Way Media and Someone's Favorite Productions. I
am your co host, Ryan Verrel from Someone's Favorite Productions,
and I'm.

Speaker 2 (00:19):
Your other host, Christashu from the Culture Cast. And because
this is the visual medium for once, however, you will
not be able to see the thing I have underneath
my name. I will, in fact so high you sell
Hia saw. That's pretty good, right.

Speaker 1 (00:34):
Not terrible, not terrible at all. As usual on this show,
we ask and answer four questions about a given topic
that is surrounding either an actor, director, micro genre, or,
like today's possible topic, a franchise. And it's been a
while since we've done a franchise, so I'm excited about
this one. Today we are talking about Evil Dead, and
as usual, our job is to entice you to broaden

(00:55):
your horizons on film, to encourage you to travel down
at film tangents, inside roads that you may never have
traveled down before. But be careful because the bridge is
out and you may not be able to make it back.
Evil Dead is a big one for me, I know,
a big one for you. I am very curious to
hear your history with the franchise, So how'd you first
get into it?

Speaker 2 (01:15):
Chris, good question. I remember seeing the first one sometime
in high school, and then I'm sure I saw the
first one and the second one more or less back
to back. And then do you remember this service. This
is a weird thing to bring up, but I always
intrinsically associated with the Evil Dead franchise. Do you remember

(01:36):
this thing that allowed you to trade DVDs with people
through the mail? It was like a I don't remember,
but like you would be like, oh, I see that
you have this, so I'll send you this, and I
put my collection on there and if somebody wants my thing,
so it's like you can get the things that you want,

(01:56):
and you can also like trade away things. I don't
remember what it was called, but I remember I did it,
and I again it's, you know, to get to the
point of the story. I remember getting. I think at
the time, however, many versions of Evil Dead three, which
is Army of Darkness. I got like two or three
versions of that through that, because that movie has god

(02:17):
knows how many versions. I think, what is it? Three
three different cuts, right, three different cuts, three different endings,
and one of them was harder to come by for
a while than the other two were, and so I
remember that again, like Army of Darkness has a special
place in my heart because of that. And then you know,
we come to the more recent times and we've got

(02:38):
all kinds of Evil Dead stuff because Evil Dead is
now a brand, not the way it used to be.
Evil Dead used to be a brand, but it's like
now it's like a merchandising thing. And you know, they
have Ash and everything. I mean, Ash isn't Dead by Daylight,
which is a computer game that you can play as
either a killer or a survivor. They don't have any
of the characters from Ash Versus Evil Dead in that game. However,

(03:00):
they have an Ash Versus Evil Dead game as well,
and that is more or less an entire thing unto itself,
based off the TV show that was wildly successful for
the couple seasons it was on. It's I don't know,
it's weird to be living in this kind of time
and place where something like Evil Dead, which is you know,

(03:21):
I mean again, the first movie was you know, a
student film effectively, and was made in nineteen eighty one
and we're still talking about it in twenty twenty four,
and oh yeah, not only that, but a new one
came out literally last year in twenty twenty three. It's
I don't know. This is in a lot of ways
like and we haven't. We haven't, like you said, done

(03:42):
a lot of franchises, but the ones that we have
done are more horror focused because we've done this, We've
done Scream as well. I'm not surprised that Scream is
still kicking around, but I am surprised that Evil Dead
is because for me, Evil Dead it never succeeded or
failed because there was another one coming out. It was

(04:05):
because those first three movies are so great. And I
mean again, I would say that two of them are amazing,
and we'll get to them. We get to it. But
that's my history with Evil Dead. I will also mention
that I know you're going to bring it up as well.
Evil Dead the musical is fucking amazing. Saw it in
Las Vegas when I went there a couple of years ago,

(04:25):
and uh, that's a thing that does not get enough love.
But it's also a thing that I think if you're
a fan of Evil Dead and you've never heard of it,
seen it, or watched it, it's on YouTube and the
entire soundtrack is on Spotify, and there are some real
bangers on that soundtrack. So that's my little Evil Dead aside.
What about you, mister verel Man with the Evil Dead

(04:48):
two thing right over his left shoulder.

Speaker 1 (04:52):
Yeah, I've got multiple Evil Dead things around the room
right now. The funny thing for me is I came
to Evil Dead very very late, compared to some other
people that were around my age that loved this growing up.
I have a really unique story about this actually because
it was an odd time in my life because I
was pretty embroiled in the music industry. I was hosting

(05:14):
bands to come stay at my house when they needed it.
I was helping with music videos. I've been in a
couple of music videos. I've done locations scouting for a
couple of videos. I did promotions for a radio station
for a couple of years. I did all kinds of
stuff surrounding this. And one of my favorite bands at
the time is a very odd band to try to

(05:39):
recommend to people nowadays, but it's a very Christian band
called Showbread and they had a song on their big
breakout album that was called Dead by Don and I
heard the song, and I had never seen Evil Dead
and the guys it was an eight piece band. They
have eight dudes in this band, and we're all sitting
in the house and we were talking about random things,

(05:59):
and they wanted to watch a movie, and we started
talking about some stuff that they were referring to their things,
and they're like, so, Evil Dead, where's that one? Maybe
we can watch that one. I was like, what's Evil Dead?
And they were like, what's Evil Dead? And they started
going on this random rant and tried to teach me, like,
you love the song, but you don't even know what
the references are. So I went and rectified that pretty

(06:20):
much immediately. This will date it. I went to Circuit
City and bought the DVD for Evil Dead, and I
immediately went to capture them all of course, got the
first three, injected them straight into my eyeballs, and fell
in love pretty quickly with the franchise as a whole.
Just like you said, I don't love all of them equally.

(06:40):
I think that I don't have the nostalgia for them
that a lot of other people do, so I've got
maybe some hot takes, but then growing from there. Yeah,
I paid attention through everything that Bruce was doing at
the time. Sam had kind of slowed down starting after
the Spider Man stuff, of course, and then you know
when all the talks about, hey, let's rekindle some of

(07:02):
this came up. I was super stoked the reboot, slash, remake, slash,
pseudo sequel, whatever came out, and then the series came out,
And of course the series came out right when my
wife and I started having kids, and I've just never
gotten around to watching it. Unfortunately. Saw Evil Dead rise
in the theater last year. Needless say, big fan of

(07:22):
the franchise, I think it's great. I do agree that
it's very different from Scream, where Scream continued because it
made a shit ton of money. Evil Dead continued because
it had a lot of outcries from fans that wanted
it to continue. And on top of that, it did
very well on home video. I mean, if you were
into DVDs back in two thousand and five two thousand
and six, Anchor Bay put out countless editions of Evil

(07:45):
Dead just to let's put you know, eighteen different cover
variants on Evil Dead and make people feel like they
want them all and they were everywhere. Of course, some
of the more famous editions for these movies were The
Book of the Dead, four textured silicone crap that would
disintegrate within like six months and sit on.

Speaker 2 (08:05):
My shelf right here, baby, it's still in good condition.

Speaker 1 (08:08):
Yep. Unless you somehow kept them perfect, they would they
would start to just crumble in your hands. And unfortunately
mine were some of the crumbling ones. So they are
now gone from my home.

Speaker 2 (08:21):
That's too bad. I do want to mention something, and
you kind of unlocked a core memory. And it's really funny.
I watched Evil Dead one for the same reason that
you did, except the band wasn't in my house. I
like heard their song randomly and I knew what it
was in reference to, and I went and watched Evil
Dead one and two, which is a very weird thing

(08:43):
to have you bring up, but I had to make
sure it was the same song. I went and looked
and I recognized the album artwork, like the guy being
fed into the meat grinder.

Speaker 1 (08:51):
Right you. I'm a shock. I'm shocked right now that
we're talking about Showbread that you knew them, not only
that I have a Showbread tattoo. I was very close
to this band. I've got I mean, I don't know
how much of a tangent we want to go off
on real quick, but I will say the band stayed
with me in my house in the middle of the
desert in California. Years later, I moved to Kansas City

(09:14):
in twenty thirteen, and when we found out that my
wife was pregnant for the first time, I started looking
for a new job. And I had been working in
sales on the side. I was working for the government
at the time. And one of these companies that I
went to try to sell life insurance to was a
plumbing company. And this guy was like, you know, we
don't want your insurance, but you're a damn good salesman.

(09:36):
You want to come try to work for us. I
was like, I mean, maybe show me what you got.
So he took me on like a ride along with
this plumbing company for five hours one day, and we're
going back at the end of the day and he goes, so,
everything's like, we're happy with you, we could bring you
on board, but tell us more about yourself, Like what
do you like to do on the side. It's like, well,
I'm super into music. He goes, Oh yeah, my house

(09:57):
is real big on music. What do you like? And
I was like, well, I've got a couple tattoos from
some bands I love, like this one here's called Showbread.
And he goes, uh, is this a joke? And i'ment,
what do you mean? He goes, my son's the guitar
player in show Bred. Random. Wow, what the fuck? Yeah?
That's wild insane. Yeah, Showbred is amazing one of my

(10:20):
favorite bands. I still listen to them all the damn time.
Love that we just had that organic moment that came
out of nowhere.

Speaker 2 (10:26):
And here's the even funnier part. That is the only
song of theirs that I have heard.

Speaker 1 (10:31):
That's it amazing, that's it.

Speaker 2 (10:32):
It's that Evil Dead song. That's it. And actually there
was another thing. So it was it was actually two
musical things. And here's the other one, the fucking music
video for ever Long Yeah by Foo Fighters is is
evil Dead adjacent? If not evil Dead? Essentially, those were
the two things. The Showbred thing was the first one,

(10:54):
and then I saw ever I saw the music video
for ever Long, which is really funny because I have
not thought about this in the law youngest time, but
that put me kind of on the path to liking
the kind of stuff I like now because for the
longest time I didn't. Really is it weird to say,
Like in my household, we didn't listen to music, but
we kind of I don't know, I don't know how
to explain it. Like my mom played certain kinds of

(11:16):
music for me growing up. Like I remember being a
baby in the bathtub and my mom playing the Thriller
cassette while I was in the bathtub on like a
little like kids cassette player thing. I remember that for
whatever reason, but I didn't. My like music choices didn't
form until my teens. But like Foo Fighters was a
very big part of that. And it was literally because
of the random evil Dead of ever Long, which came

(11:39):
from Yeah, this random band that you love that I've
only heard one of their songs, but you apparently have
a tattoo on your body of that's wild, that's that's
that's a bit much, man.

Speaker 1 (11:51):
Yeah, I've got a tattoos for two different bands on
my body.

Speaker 2 (11:55):
Actually, it's wild. It's crazy. So Lara, I know, I
know I can't believe it in a way, but I
totally can because again, like when you were mentioning it,
I was like, wait, a second here, like this sounds
eerily familiar. God, I liked that the band was at
your house and you were like, I've never seen Evil Dead.

Speaker 1 (12:16):
That's crazy, it's kind of embarrassing.

Speaker 2 (12:19):
I mean, that's just fun. It's funny, it's fucking hilarious.

Speaker 1 (12:23):
That is like my origin story for film in general, though,
is I've had multiple bands just straight teach me about
movies that they love to watch when they're on tour.
And I grew up in a small town in the
middle of the desert, so we had we had a Blockbuster,
and we had like a little mom and pop video store.
But even the mom and pop video store wouldn't survive
if they were mostly renting out like the indies or

(12:45):
the stuff that was underground, right, So the only movies
that we ever really had access to were the super
mainstream things we didn't have, like come watch Evil Dead
too by this unknown filmmaker named Sam Ray, Like that
wasn't a thing for us.

Speaker 2 (13:00):
Hmm, that's fair. I mean my parents were very militant
about not letting me watch rated R movies until I
got ways to just be like I'm just gonna get
DVDs in the mail, like I'll just get DVDs in
the mail. That's what I did, and I was like,
I will just get these movies unbeknownst to them and
watch rated R movies. Like I remember getting into a
huge fight with my parents because I want to go

(13:20):
see of All Things Kill Bill, and like they got
all bent out of shape and I was like, it's
just a fucking movie. Like, it's not gonna turn me
into some sort of sex pest.

Speaker 1 (13:30):
I mean, what.

Speaker 2 (13:32):
Right, I mean it didn't. But my point being like
I've always been one of those people that's like, just
watch whatever the fuck you want, whenever the fuck you want,
and you need to be the better judge, not the
fucking NPAA, Thank you very much, off of my soapbox.
I look, I hate the NPAA, and I think like
Evil Dead is a franchise that has kind of had

(13:55):
battles with the MPAA to the point of, you know,
one of the movies rated X that being the second one,
and then they were like you gotta cut, make cuts,
and it's like this is stupid, this is fucking stupid.
And the NPAA has always been stupid. Why because someone
telling you what they think is just an opinion and
when opinions are being made into facts and uh, I

(14:18):
guess not even facts but a rubric with which to
grade something by. I have lost all interest in having
any conversation with that person, because if you're trying to
force movies into boxes, that's what we're actively trying to undo,
which is the compartmentalization of genres that people can't. People
can watch movies and go, oh, this is just a movie.

(14:38):
It's not a horror comedy, and it by it being
that genre, it automatically succeeds or fails based off of
certain things like I'm sorry no. And Evil Dead, I
think is also a very good example of that, because
I don't really know how to classify Evil Dead in
a lot of ways as a franchise because it kind
of lives within several spaces kind of all at once.

Speaker 1 (15:00):
Yeah, well, let's get into some of the actual history then,
since we started dabbling a little bit there. All of
this started with a short film that Sam Reimi did
way back in nineteen seventy eight with Bruce Campbell involved.
It sort of was the inspiration that led into The
Evil Dead, which was released in October of nineteen eighty one,

(15:21):
and again, like Chris said, this was a pretty much
a student film, and watching it now, it's pretty obvious.

Speaker 2 (15:28):
Yeah, man, but hey, it's a hell of a student film.
It's like Dark Star, you know, like hell of a
student film. But if you guys had a budget, you'd
be doing something real crazy. Q. Evil Dead two an
alien right.

Speaker 1 (15:41):
Right, exactly? So yeah, the evil then comes out. It
makes a splash with a lot of pretty important people
who over the next five years start to explore it
and discover it and share it, and some names that
you will recognize start to be influenced by it. Q
Samaimi going, oh, suddenly people offering me money. I kind

(16:02):
of want to do Evil Dead the right way of
what I had seen from the beginning. And that's where
he comes in and makes Evil Dead two, which releases
in nineteen eighty seven in March of all times, a
really weird place to drop this film. But they go
away far away from that first film, and man, the
second film is set up in such an odd way.

(16:22):
We basically get a recap of the first movie and
then it turns into a mad cap comedy horror.

Speaker 2 (16:29):
I don't know what to call it. It's Evil Dead too. Otherwise,
known as just Evil Dead.

Speaker 1 (16:34):
Again or like that Dead by Dawn also.

Speaker 2 (16:38):
Yeah, or but like but that's the thing, like in
my mind, like in my mind, I don't want to
answer the question already. But but this is a hard
franchise to talk about because of the first two movies. Yeah,
and and and everything subsequent to that is hard to
talk about because, as we've kind of alluded to, Army

(16:59):
of Darkness is not anything like the first two movies at.

Speaker 1 (17:03):
All, and the second one the rest of the franchise.

Speaker 2 (17:07):
No, it's well, it's like Ash versus Evil Dead.

Speaker 1 (17:11):
Okay, well that is.

Speaker 2 (17:14):
I will tell you that the show's tone is closer
to Army of Darkness than it is even Evil Dead too.
But the thing is, the first movie is a straight
horror movie. The second movie is a like you've mentioned,
I think, would you say horror comedy or comedy horror?
I would say horror. Really see, I would say the

(17:37):
third one is comedy horror Army of Darkness. I would
say that the second one is still horror comedy, it
still leans heavy on the horror more than the third
one does. The third one is like, yeah, third one
is something else entirely. What's weird is when Evil Dead
comes back as a reboot. It is straight horror. Yep,

(18:00):
straight like in a way that even the first movie
wasn't like. The first movie is straight horror in a
very seventy late seventies early eighties way. Evil Dead the
reboot is. I mean there, it's a lot. It's a lot,
a lot, and it's it's a lot. It being a
lot is the reason it resonates so much with people.
That's the choices that are made are such big, broad,

(18:24):
interesting choices that I think that's why it succeeds in
a way that most of the things that we've seen
that are reboots of big ten pole horror franchises aren't,
because it realized you can just retread old ground. You
have to do something new, even if you just set
it in a cabin, that is not enough to say
I'm doing something different. And the new ones just it

(18:46):
does something different in a big way.

Speaker 1 (18:48):
And not only does it do it different. I love
bringing this one up in the conversation about the NPAA,
primarily because Evil Dead two got cut and all kinds
of attention for the NPAA and then the reboot. There's
a literal rainstorm of Blood like it is so far
past any of the lines that they were remotely near

(19:11):
in Evil Dead two, that times have changed so much
in the what twenty six years in between. That's God,
I love the reboot. We're gonna be talking about all
that later, of course, but so after that we get
the we were talking about evil and Evil Dead too again,
nice healthy block of time between Evil Dead to and

(19:32):
Army of Darkness. Army of Darkness comes out in nineteen
ninety three a completely different world compared to what they
had been releasing stuff in prior, and so Sam Raimi
and Bruce Campbell create a completely different film. This one
is wild, set in mostly medieval times. There are skeleton

(19:54):
dead eyes made with stop motion. There is Minnie Bruce
Campbell's there is a lot of Hillary already happening in
this film. And it's again it's a pretty big movie
that was made to really like excite the fans and
keep this going because without all of the the groundswell
of support coming after the first two films, they I

(20:16):
highly doubt that they would have been able to get
to the point where they make a third film that
it's It's about a cabin in the middle of the Woods,
like getting Haunted, how do you go to a third film?
And then he said, well, let's travel back in time,
obviously continuing what we see at the very end of
Evil Dead two, and it brings some excitement to the franchise,

(20:36):
but then it stops dead in its tracks for the
longest time. Army of Darkness, though, how do you feel
about that one? Overall?

Speaker 2 (20:44):
I think it's just it's a it's a weird entry
in the series. I mean, it's it's more of an
action movie, like and like it's more of a comedy
than it is anything else. But it is also kind
of more of action horror as opposed to a horror movie.
I mean, I don't think that there's anything in the
movie that's disturbing or upsetting in a way that like,

(21:06):
I don't know if I watched it recently, and it
doesn't feel pedestrian, but it kind of does like that
the movie's not scary. It's not a horror movie per se.
It's more of like a action comedy or a comedy
action movie. Again, there's a lot of comedy in the
third one, and it being set in medieval times, I

(21:28):
don't know, it kind of makes it seem.

Speaker 1 (21:31):
It may.

Speaker 2 (21:32):
I don't know what it's just it's a weird movie.
I don't know how to explain the third one because
the third movie is such its own thing and the
way the third movie ends ends up leading into Ash
versus Evil Dead. But I think for me, the third
one is it's one that I think of fondly, but
I don't return to very often.

Speaker 1 (21:55):
Hmmm, yeah, I feel the same. I think this is
the one I've probably seen the least out of all
of them.

Speaker 2 (22:01):
I think it's one I've seen the most. Maybe that's why, like,
maybe that's why I'm not so keen to revisit it,
because I've watched it a lot. It was the one
that resonated with me very early on, but I watched
it too much at this point to be like, I've
seen it a million times. What can I glean from
it that's different.

Speaker 1 (22:20):
Yeah. So after this, we, like I said, we go
through a long period of nothing happening. Sam remi out,
you know, basically saying the world is my oyster. I'm
going to make some major changes to cinema. He goes
and makes some huge films. Obviously, he creates the standard
for comic book movies during this time and then helps

(22:41):
to produce the reboots in April of twenty thirteen that
comes out, directed by Fetti Alvarez, and it's pretty great.
Amongst Evil Dead fans, it's a little bit divisive. A
lot of them miss the comedy aspect, a lot of
them also love the direction that it went in. And
then again another long break and a decade later, literally

(23:03):
in April again we get our fifth installment of the franchise.
Lee Cronin releases Evil Dead Rise. In between those two films,
of course, we get the Ash Versus Evil Dead series,
which ran for three seasons over on Stars, which I
think if it was on any other network that people
had better access to, it would have done a lot better.

Speaker 2 (23:22):
For that that is the real problem is That is
the real problem. Stars is like such a strange place
to release things. But there's again, there are good shows
on Stars. Ash Versus Evil Dead is one of them.

Speaker 1 (23:37):
Fully agreed, and that's where we are at the moment.
There is another Evil Dead film that has been announced
that they're working on. We don't have a date for
that one, but gosh, by the time this comes out,
it might already have an announcement, so we'll see they
are working on another spin off and there's hopefully gonna
be something cool for Evil Dead fans soon. Because Evil

(23:58):
Dead Rise played like people loved it it. I know
that you've not seen it yet, but it was something
that made a lot of people happy, which is funny
because it did continue down the dark and very like
horror centric reboot that we got. But also there's quite
a bit of like random funny happenstances and it's not

(24:20):
as comedy focused as the Evil Dead two or Army
of Darkness, but it's it's got a little bit of
comedy in it. But we'll be talking about that one
a little bit, I'm sure. But man, I think that's
probably a good primer before we jump into our question.
Anything else you want to highlight before we go out there.

Speaker 2 (24:39):
I mean, the fact that Bruce Campbell is a well
known actor is because of Evil Dead. We have Spider
Man because of Evil Dead, which is like a fucking
bonkers statement to make, and you know what I think,
And again talk about hot take speaking of Marvel because
we always do for for no good reason. Essentially, it's

(25:02):
the running gag at this point that it comes up
on nearly every episode. Those first three Spider Man movies
are pretty great, even the third one, which is a
protest piece by mister raymie H. Even the third one
has some fun moments, and I still love Toby maguire
Spider Man. But those movies are made by a horror director,

(25:22):
and they are Sam Raimi movies, which I can't really
say of a lot of the MCU stuff, like, oh,
that's a Joe Johnston film. No one says that about
that first Avengers movie or you know, first Avenger Captain
America movie, because that was my biggest complaint with that
movie came out. I was like, this should just been
The Rocketeer with Chris Evans. It wasn't, though, because Marvel

(25:44):
wasn't letting directors do their thing, and Sony allowed Sam
Raimi to do his thing. I mean, there's a lot
of Sam Raimi isms in Spider Man that if you
are a fan of his, you will catch if you
are not, you will not catch them. One of those
things being the constant inclusion of Bruce Campbell including and
here's the other thing. To put a cap on the

(26:06):
MCU stuff, Sam Raimi then directs a goddamn mcu movie
anyways in twenty twenty two, which, to be fair, the
less said about it the better. Pretty Much anything from
this phase of Marvel has not been great. Doctor Strange
in the Multiverse of Madness is one of those things
over promises under delivers. But it has Bruce Campbell in
it as Pizza Papa, which is literally like the weirdest

(26:29):
character in that movie selling pizza balls, which, if you're
a fan of Eric Andre, has to be an intentional
gag in terms of the people. But all of that
to say, Sam Raimi is the director he is now
because of The Evil Dead, the original movie, and you
can trace a lot of the stuff in his other
movies back to it. Because he is one of those

(26:49):
directors he always tries to include his isms in the
movie that we expect. So I love Sam Raimie I'm
kind of disappointed we're not talking about Sam Raimi's the
whole thing. But to be fair, if you're going to
talk about anything involving Sam Raimi, this is probably the
most important thing to talk about.

Speaker 1 (27:07):
We are eventually going to talk about Sam Raimi. I
guarantee we're gonna have to discuss Drag Me to Hell
at some point, because man, is that movie damn near perfect. Really.
The last thing about Multiverse of Manness to say is
one thing that I find hilarious is they they went
in that route seemingly because taikaway Ted had such an

(27:28):
impact as a quote a tour in what he did
with his entries into the MCU. But then Sam Raimi
comes back and delivers a very sam Raimi entry into
the MCU, especially that that third act, and it's it's
not a wonderful movie. I will say that, however, I'm
really glad that they actually allowed him to put some

(27:49):
horror aspects in that final act, and not only Bruce Campbell.
We get to see the oldsmall bile that's been in
every single film as well from Sam Raimi. So it's true,
it's all there, all there, tons of reference. But now
let's get to it with our first question. So, Chris,
what is the foundational film that everybody could should watch? First?

(28:09):
What is the best entry point for the Evil Dead?

Speaker 2 (28:13):
So this is this is where the hot takes start, Folks.
For me, it's Evil Dead two. The answer I mean,
so it's your answer to Yeah, Look, it's not that
I don't like the Evil Dead the original film, It's
just what's the point in a lot of ways, like
it is, it's an important movie, but movies being important

(28:38):
doesn't let me refer how do I how do I
put this without making it sound like I'm being dismissive
of the original film. We can applaud the original film
for what it did in terms of getting Sam Raimi's
ideas out into the world, getting his name out into
the world, getting his vision of horror out into the world.
But Evil Dead two is the movie the Evil Dead

(28:58):
wanted to be. You can that when you watch the movie.
It's fairly obvious that all Evil Dead Too is is
just the first movie with a budget. And you know what,
if that were just all. If that's all Sam Raimi
did was just do the original movie but with a budget,
I don't think I would be picking it as my
second as the second movie being picked first, as opposed

(29:21):
to the first movie being picked first. I don't think
it would have been the case if he hadn't just
remade the first movie. I think that that was really
a smart move on his part to requill the first movie,
because I think the first movie's essentially been recalled out
of existence, right the first movie doesn't exist because the
second movie exists, I know, and like, what's weird is

(29:43):
like the beginning of the second movie has them talking
about the first movie, and it's like, no, no, just
get to the goddamn new stuff. And the way the
second movie ends, I mean, look, we don't have to
worry about it now, in twenty twenty four or in
the future whenever you hear this. But the second movie
also ends on a pretty big cliffhanger too, which I

(30:03):
really appreciate because when I watched it the first time,
I was like, Wow, that did not do what I
thought it was going to do at all. And also,
in comparison to the original film, the original film's ending
makes effectively no sense on top of everything else. It
was just a decision made at the end to kind
of put a button on it. But I as much
as I appreciate, and I will concede that the original

(30:24):
movie is obviously a very important movie. I believe it's
part of Is it not part of the film archives?
Has it not been set aside? I believe it has.

Speaker 1 (30:38):
I think so.

Speaker 2 (30:38):
Yeah. I mean that in and of itself should say
all you need to know about the level of importance
of the movie is that it is now enshrined in
an archive in the National Archives so that it will
be available in the future period in its physical form.
That is a level of importance that they don't just
give to everything. But for me, the second movie just

(31:01):
hits all the notes that the first movie hits. But
it's it's the mastered version, to use a music term,
it's remastered even frankly, and you know, I'm not saying
people shouldn't listen to the pre mastered versions of things,
but is there a point really if you can just
listen to it remastered that. Look, you watch the first movie,

(31:22):
you understand what Sam Raimi could do without a budget.
You watch the second movie, you see what he wanted
to do if he had a budget. And so that's
that's where I come down on it. Like I said,
you're in an agreement with me. I'm sure that there
are some people that are probably kicking their feet and
stomping and saying, no, you're wrong. It's the first movie
entitled to your opinion, but we all know that the
second movie really is just the first movie all over again.

Speaker 1 (31:46):
So I agree with you. Like I said, my choice
is evil. Did too, but I'm actually choosing this one
for a slightly different reason. I think to get a
grasp of the entire franchise, you have to have both
the horror and Kammie aspects. And that's where Evil Dead
two shows the film foundation for the entire franchise because

(32:07):
it has both parts and equals like in spades. It
does it very well. And one thing that we haven't
said yet. If you're listening to this and you've never
watched an Evil Dead movie, which is far more common
than people think, we probably should state that this is
literally just a cabin in the wood story. There's a
group of friends led by Ash Williams, who is going

(32:28):
to take his group of friends, including his girlfriend, on
vacation in this cabin he's rented it. He's driving there.
They go over a bridge to get to this cabin.
They're in the middle of nowhere. While they're in the cabin,
they discover this random book. They open it up they
start reading the words from it. Turns out they've awakened
some dead individuals because this is awaken the spirits, because

(32:51):
this is the book of the dead called the Necronomicon.
And as they do that, they discover that they're in
for a pretty rough time at this cabin, and Hi,
Jens and Sue, some of their friends start to die,
some of their friends start to come back. There's stop
motion in the first one. There's some hilarious blood gags.

(33:11):
On the second one, there's Ash Williams losing his absolute
mind and seeing things come to life that aren't alive.
It's a wild ride. So I chose the second one,
like I said, because it has the horror aspect and
the comedy aspect. Now, unlike you, I will say, I
do think there's a reason to watch the first movie,

(33:33):
but we will talk about that when we get to
the second question. But I do think that this is
the best way to enter into the franchise and explore
that if you like this, you'll probably like the rest
of the Evil Dead franchise. And it's the best way
to gauge that because it has everything. It's got Bruce
Campbell at his most Bruce Campbell. It's got Sam Raimi

(33:55):
with money, It's got the best cabin setting or maybe
all the movies, but at least for that original trilogy,
and it's it really is the one that got huge
with like the cult fandom, obviously on the underground side.
A lot of people love that first movie, but the
second one is where it really grabbed a hold of everybody,

(34:16):
because the second one feels more like an eighties horror
movie than the first one. The first one it feels
like a bit of a student film. Unfortunately.

Speaker 2 (34:25):
Well, and that's the other thing, you know, the first
movie is also technically a requel of Within the Woods.
Within the Woods's plot is the original Evil Dead, which
is Evil Dead too, So on top of everything else,
it's you maybe even should watch Within the Woods too
as well, technically given that the first movie is just

(34:46):
a retelling of that student film, which is the reason
they made the next movie because the interest they got
showing that alongside what rocky horror. I think it's like
thirty minutes and it's essentially the pla. It's a sense
of the plot of Evil Dead, and then Evil Dead
two is the center of the plot of Evil Dead one,
so it's it's all kind of being re treaded. But

(35:09):
every time he's going a little further and going a
little further because he has more gas in his tank,
as you know, financial gas in his tank, as it were.
But I mean, I agree with you, obviously, but I
think there will be people that are disappointed at us
not picking the first one, and I completely understand why
you would be, But the second one is just I

(35:31):
don't know. Like you said, there's an element of comedy
in the series that the first movie does not have
at all, And the first movie is played very straight,
and the student film is played even straighter. Frankly, uh.
And it's not that I don't like that, but I
don't think that that's really indicative of the kinds of

(35:51):
things Sam Raimi ends up bringing to what he does
in the future, because the original Spider Man is a
fairly funny movie in a lot of ways, and look,
Sam Raimi had a hand in writing that script. So
there you go. And Evil Dead two, I think is
closer in tone, like you mentioned, to everything that will
come after than the first one. Is the first one
in the prequel film kind of stand alone with one

(36:15):
other movie as like straight up horror movies, which is weird.
Why the fourth movie is so divisive?

Speaker 1 (36:23):
I yeah, fully agree there, And to speak on some
of that divisiveness, let's go straight to the second question,
which is what is something that's not a great entry
point for this franchise, one that if somebody were to
watch it first might be a bit of a turn off.
And so we've alluded to the whole you know, differences
between the first two. I'm gonna throw out my answers

(36:44):
actually army of darkness, and I would do want to
throw out a caveat with that is I understand why
some people would say the first one is the great
entry point, but the reason why, you know, I already
explained why the second one was better, But it's not
my answer here either, because I think it's a great
entry point if you just want horror, and it really

(37:06):
does serve that purpose. It's like many of the other
great franchises that are out there, where the first film
and the second film are almost like polar opposite genres.
This one it blends it a little bit better. But
you know, we've talked about Alien and Aliens before. Alien
is a slasher film and Aliens is a full blown
action epic. When you look at something more modern, even

(37:29):
to go with the reboot of Evil Dead, Happy Death
Day is a slasher film. Happy Death Day to you
is like this weird sci fi, random horror elements. It's
thrown in sometimes of film, but it's great. They're both great,
just done in a very very different way. And I
think the one that I like in this one too

(37:49):
the most is very similar timeframe to these films. Actually
is the Terminator franchise. The first one, just like Alien,
is a slasher and the sequel is an action epic.
But it takes a lot of the ideas from that
first one and evolves them. And when you look at
Evil Dead, it does a lot of the same things
I love that first movie. It shows some of the

(38:10):
innovative things that he did, like literally putting somebody on
essentially a dolly and dragging them through the woods to
get this random shot that he speeds up and it
looks great. It's it's fantastic. But Army of Darkness it
is the outlier in this franchise, and I think if

(38:30):
you watch this and either you love it or hate it,
that doesn't indicate what you're gonna feel about the rest
of the franchise at all, because it is so so different.

Speaker 2 (38:40):
I think there's a high chance you wouldn't like the
TV show. That's all I would say is if you
don't like Army of Darkness, you're not gonna like the
TV show because the TV show has I want to say,
in the first episode of the TV show, they do
a little like Minnie Bruce Campbell thing again like from
Army of Darkness, So like it's it's d at the
d A Army of Darkness is really present in the

(39:02):
TV show.

Speaker 1 (39:05):
Interesting. That's yeah, I need to watch the show.

Speaker 2 (39:10):
I mean the show is good, but again, like the
show is really kind of it's like you said about
the idea of Army of Darkness being an evolution of
the ideas Asher's Evil Dead is an evolution of the
Army of Darkness. Is stuff remixed kind of with some
some Evil Dead too, but also some like original stuff,
some kind of even further isms of what Sam Raimi

(39:30):
is doing. I'm I'm not surprised that this is your pick.
I think that this is I think that this is
one of two right answers here, and I think that
I fill in the second answer. I think maybe what
you would think the second answer is. I think it's
the second answer. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (39:47):
Again, I don't I don't hate Army of Darkness. It's
just the one that I don't go back to as
much as the others. I think it's really good. But
also if if this is the first one that you
watch and you know two different scenarios. One you love
it and you're like, oh, this movie is I want
more of this. Let me throw on the movie that
came on prior to this. Evil Dead two is not
going to scritch that itch. If you watch this and

(40:07):
hate it and be like, man, I've heard Evil Dead
is so scary. Why is this movie just a bunch
of tiny Bruce Campbell's attacking somebody like in Goal Verse Travels.
I hate this And your response to that is going
to be probably to not watch another Evil Dead film.
And if that's the case, you're gonna be missing out.

(40:27):
So I love this movie. I do think it's great.
I think it's surprisingly well made for when it was
made and for who was involved. And you know, obviously
it's indicative of what he could do in the rest
of that decade with stuff like The Quick and the
Dead and such. But yeah, to me, this is just
this is the one that could turn people away specifically

(40:49):
to this franchise.

Speaker 2 (40:51):
I like your choice, so I'm curious what you will
think of my choice. So my choice is and again,
maybe this is just me and maybe this is me
kind of being a little bit of a cheeky piece
of shit, But I actually go with the because, again,
like you said, theoretically should be saying the original Evil Dead,

(41:12):
I'm actually gonna say the twenty thirteen film is my
choice here. If you enjoy Evil Dead, the original movie,
the second one. If you enjoy the original Evil Dead,
you will probably like the twenty thirteen remake, And if
you like Evil Dead too, you will also like the remake.
But I think for me, it's it's a little bit
of a expectation readjustment with the twenty thirteen one. Twenty

(41:37):
thirteen one is a very black horror film, black comedy
horror film. It's it is not funny the way the
second Evil Dead is, and it's the first Evil Dead
is kind of funny the same way the twenty thirteen
film is. But the twenty thirteen film, yeah, it for
the most part is a horror movie straight through. I

(41:58):
mean then there's a lot of great imagery too that
they really utilize. And Fetti Alvarez, I mean, this is
the movie, in my opinion, that is like his calling
card for anything else he's worked on. I know some
people will say Don't Breathe. I get it. I'm not
as big of a fan of Don't Breathe as I
am Evil Dead, But for me, the twenty thirteen film
is a reimagining of the original film but done in

(42:21):
a way that is more modern. And Evil Dead too,
is essentially just a reimagining of the first film, but
more modern for when it came out. So Evil Dead
as a franchise really has been about retreading old ground,
but with new material, with new equipment, as it were,
And I think Evil Dead twenty thirteen is a good
example of that because for the most part it does

(42:42):
follow the plot of the first movie and the setup
is pretty much the same. But I think Jane Levy
is amazing. Obviously, she was perfectly cast, and there are
some great kills. There's some great kind of disdirections that
they go with some things you wouldn't expect, like making
her a recovering drug addict, which is I think a

(43:03):
very interesting way to have that character be situated in
this story, because again it makes it. It gives the
characters in the film a level of ambiguity as to
is this actually happening or is she just having a
hard time quitting Cold Turkey. And I like that about
the movie, that the movie gives even you the audience,

(43:23):
a little moment of like, what is actually going on here?
And then the movie shows its hand, thankfully, and the
hand is it is literally Evil Dead but with a
female Ash is what it is. And you know what,
I don't have any problem with gender swapping with Cass
or any of that. I never have because what's the

(43:44):
point of getting upset about that those kinds of things,
especially when they're done well. And this is a very
good example of gender swapping your main character. And I
think Jane Levy makes a case for her character being
as I wouldn't say, as iconic as Ash, but icon
in a different way, because they had talked about for
the longest time bringing Ash and her character together in

(44:05):
a sequel, and I still kind of think that they should.
I'm still waiting for that movie to come out, the
movie that has Bruce Campbell and Jane Levy and then
whoever survives Evil Dead rise and like, I'm waiting for that.
But this is a very good kind of stop gap,
which is the original movie done with modern conventions by
a director who clearly loves the original. And also this

(44:29):
is signed off on by Sam Raimie. And here's the thing,
Sam Raimi signing off on stuff actually matters. He's not
like James Cameron, who Oh, the New Terminator movie's great,
don't lie please? Or Dan Ackroyd Oh, Ghostbusters twenty sixteen
is amazing. Don't lie, Dan, please, don't do it. And then,
on top of everything else, then just turning around and
shitting on the movie once you're no longer contractually obligated

(44:52):
to speak positively about it is a hell of.

Speaker 1 (44:54):
A thing to do.

Speaker 2 (44:55):
But I don't know. Evil Dead twenty thirteen, for me,
is a movie that really Dan's alone for a lot
of reasons, and one of those reasons is it's a
remake of an original film that's pretty good in its
own right that I think makes a case for being
as good, if not better than the original, which is
not something we really have a lot of examples of

(45:16):
in cinema. Most of the time, sequels and third movies
and fourth movies are seen as derivative. It's because for
the most part they have been. So that's my choice.
How controversial is that is that a hot take?

Speaker 1 (45:30):
I don't think it's a hot take, because again, this
film is divisive, so I think about half the people
would probably agree with you. I will say I think
we should correct some minor language because Fetti Alvarez has
come out and said over and over and over again,
this is technically not a remake. This is a continuation
of the nineteen eighty one storyline. But it's important because
if it was a remake, Ash and Mia being in

(45:52):
the same film wouldn't make much sense, right, But it's
because it continues the storyline. I think that proved. And
first off, their adamant that it is the same storyline.
They've said it over and over and over again. So
based on that, make the movie, you cowards, Like we
really want to see what the hell you could come
up with to put these put these two not even
against each other, like how what happens? Like that's just

(46:15):
an intriguing idea. I want to see the movie.

Speaker 2 (46:18):
Yeah, And to your point, like you said, like I
was speaking of it as a remake, in terms of
the story it is it. Yeah, like you mentioned, it
is in the same universe, which is why that could happen.
He Ash shows up in the end of the movie
in a post credit scene for no reason, and then
Ash shows up. Best I can tell an Evil Dead
rise again as a version of himself time displaced. Okay, fine,

(46:41):
that's fine to your point, like, make the fucking movie, guys,
because Bruce Campbell's not gonna be around for much longer,
in neither of Sam Raimie. You only have a certain
amount of time to do these kinds of things, So
do it. I know we're getting another Evil Dead movie,
but it's probably not gonna be that. It's gonna be
something to answer the question as to where the third
next Granomicon is or what it has going on with it.

(47:04):
And so for me, the fact that, like you said,
these are all connected is impressive. It's tenuous at best
how they're connected, and it's never really been explained because
how does Ash versus Evil Dead factor into any of this?

Speaker 1 (47:18):
Right? Right?

Speaker 2 (47:20):
And I know that show goes in back on itself
after a while, best I can remember. So yeah, it's
weird that this is all in the same universe because again,
the original movie is from like eighty one. You tell
that nobody had that idea, then come on.

Speaker 1 (47:36):
It's true. Before we jump into our third question, I
think we should cover a couple things. The first we've
hardly talked about Evil Dead Rise. There's a reason Chris
hasn't seen it yet. But on top of that, I
really want to throw a couple of plot points that
are really great with this and not not really spoil
anything because I know quite a few people haven't seen
it yet. But first off, this is the first movie

(47:58):
that is not technically like. There's no mention of a
cabin at all. You're nowhere near a cabin. It is
literally in an apartment building in a big city that
feels like LA. I don't remember if they refer to
it as LA, but it's really well made, like this
movie had a lot of money behind it. Clearly. The
way they handle that and tied into the Evil Dead

(48:21):
universe I didn't like at first, but I've come around
on it and I think it's much better than I
felt on day one. At least, the way that the
Ecronomicon just randomly shows up in an apartment building makes
a lot of sense. I think the way that they
handle the lower slash mythology from this franchise is pretty

(48:43):
well done. But once again, I really have to highlight
one main thing, which is what we can highlight on
literally every single one of these films, and that is
in the entire Evil Dead franchise. No matter who you
were looking at, every single film needs a lead actor
that is nearly flawless. Bruce Campbell's handled it for most

(49:07):
of the films. Jane Levy was incredible in the remake
She Is or reboot whatever. She is literally like the
high point in every single scene that she's in. And
then we get to Evil Dead Rise. Now, this movie,
it seemed to be for a lot of people doomed
from Jump Street because it was supposed to only go

(49:28):
to streaming on Max, and then it got some really
positive reception and so they said, well, let's try to
put it in theaters. And so already it feels a
little less than like the creators, we're looking at it
as less than. And this movie starts brutally. It is
a pretty incredibly beginning on this and then you have
I got to mention it because people that watch this movie,

(49:49):
this is one thing they will always bring up, probably
the best title revealed screen in the last thirty years
in any film. And then you get an incredible performance
of our main care character ish and that is Alyssa
Sutherland as Ellie and she is somebody that she dives in,
just like Jane Levy. She is fully embodying this character

(50:12):
like Bruce Campbell did. She is going there in weird
body movements and over the top acting, which is needed
when you're supposed to be this type of a character.
She's remarkable in this and I really hope that she
gets more work simply because of that role. So it
deserves to be at least stated and explained. The Evil
Dead Rise is a good movie and people should see it.

Speaker 2 (50:35):
I haven't not watched it for any specific reason. I
just haven't gotten around to it.

Speaker 1 (50:41):
That makes sense, same thing with the TV show for me.
But now the other fun thing I want to do,
and I'm gonna have you go first, since you haven't
seen Evil Dead Rise, I would love to hear just
your personal rankings, not like what is better or worse?
What is favorite? So start with the fourth like quote
least favorite, even though you may still think it's a
great movie, and make your way to the top.

Speaker 2 (51:03):
I would say the Evil Dead then interesting because now
I kind of contradict myself, but I think if you're
asking me to rank them, I think I would probably
go again, leaving Evil Dead Rise off the original Evil

(51:23):
Dead four Army of Darkness third only because I've seen
it so many times, and then two is Betty's Evil Dead,
and then one is Evil Dead two. It is a
pretty fair ranking. How close is yours to mine? What's
your five? Because you can do five?

Speaker 1 (51:42):
So my number five is Evil Dead Rise, And okay,
don't I don't think it's awful. I think it's just
first off, it's very new, and so I don't have
the time was spent with it. It could potentially bump
number four, which is a Army of Darkness for me,
and thennumber three I have that as the Evil Dead

(52:02):
in nineteen eighty one. Number two, I have Evil Dead two.
And my favorite in this franchise by far As FEddi
Alvarez is I think it's I think it's the best
by a long shot.

Speaker 2 (52:15):
WHOA boy, that's the hot fucking take we're waiting for here,
fresh out of they sure is?

Speaker 1 (52:21):
That's that's a.

Speaker 2 (52:23):
I don't think it is a hot take though, really,
because to your point, like me saying it as my
number two, you saying it as your number one, Like,
I don't think it's a hot take as much as
just like fifty percent of people agree with you, fifty
percent of people don't. Is that a hot take?

Speaker 1 (52:39):
It's I think it's a hot take because so many
millions of people worship Evil Dead two as like literally
the pinnacle of eighties horror, and I don't have the
nostalgia for that, and I don't have the nostalgia for
Fetti Alvarez is either. Really, I just like it more
as a movie, and I think that the storyline is
a little more interesting, and it's a better script. And

(53:01):
you know, Feedti wrote it with his writing partner on this,
and then Diablo Cody stepped in and revised a lot
of the dialogue. So there's some really interesting people attached
to this film. I just love the way they went
and I'm a big fan of the gore in that movie.
I love that they went there. I mean the fact
that there's literal raining blood that's awesome, Like that's just

(53:24):
fun to watch period.

Speaker 2 (53:26):
Yeah, Like I said, I love that movie a lot.
I get it. I think that's I think it's a
fair choice. I could understand someone being kind of disappointed
that neither one of us picked the original, but that's
the reason we didn't pick the original. Because there's not
really a reason too right now, not with Feddi's film,
not with Evil Dead too. I would like to mention

(53:47):
something we didn't also talk about. They're a fair amount
of Evil Dead video games, which is also kind of
a thing, and one of them features I know one
of them features Sam Raimi and and or Ted Raimy
as the voice of like a diminutive character that you
like throw around, you know what I'm talking. Yeah, I

(54:07):
think that's Hail to the King or fist full of Boomstick.
But like I mentioned, there was an Evil Dead game
that came out two years ago that's literally just the
show in game form. So yeah, it's weird. Evil Dead
is a brand, and that is a weird thing, right, Like,
it's weird to me that Evil Dead is like a
brand and people be like, oh, I'm playing the Evil

(54:28):
Dead video gamee or you know, I know it's so
where you go buy Evil Dead toys at Target. Like,
it's just kind of weird. I will never get over
how weird it is.

Speaker 1 (54:39):
Well, and one thing we probably should point out with
buying this as a brand, Evil Dead is known for
being on home video one of the most exploited franchises ever,
Like there have been callous releases of the first two
movies for sure, and then Army of Darkness has gotten
up there now at this point as well. But now
beyond that, like you can get all five of these

(55:00):
movies on four K UHD on Blu Ray, on DVD,
the ones that came out of the VHS era, there
are plenty of those releases. There is a box set
called the Groovy Collection, which has the first two films
and all three seasons of ash forst Evil Dead, and
I think Fetti Alvarez is I may be wrong about

(55:20):
Vetti Alvarez's film, but it's licensing for Army of Darkness
has always been with a different companies, So it's you
won't really get a box set of all of those
because they're money wise, they're unwilling to work together. But
like Screen Factory, the boutique Blu Ray company, they've put
out the Fetti Alvarez one on four K, they put
out Army of Darkness on four K. All the cuts

(55:42):
are available on these releases. It's it's crazy, like this
franchise itself has gotten so many worldwide releases of their
films that you could literally have a full wall dedicated
just to Evil Dead physical media releases.

Speaker 2 (55:57):
Which is nuts. I mean, again, that's just to speak
on the third question apparently already. I mean, I mean
really like it's let's do the third question, because I
think my answer to what you're about, what you just said,
I think kind of fits into that third question.

Speaker 1 (56:14):
Well, let's do it as usual. Third question, what is
the biggest impact that the Evil Dead has had on
pop culture?

Speaker 2 (56:20):
I think existing as the Evil Dead is one of
the answers, because again it has it has such a
long tale of things. Because again video games, there's comic
book There's a whole comic book things. Let's not forget
that Ash fights fucking Freddy Krueger and Jason in the
comics for real, Like that's a thing that you could

(56:41):
go read and should because oh yeah, by the way,
not only does Ash show up, but so does Nancy
from Nightmare on Elm Street and then Tommy from Friday
the thirteenth, and they have to go and kill the
President who has become a dead eite or something. It's like,
it is insane, But that, for me is I think
the thing that look I saying it introduced the brand

(57:03):
of Evil Dead into the world. I think is kind
of an unfair answer because duh. But I think for me,
the actual answer is getting the world to acknowledge Sam
Raimi and Bruce Campbell because so many things that I
love are inspired by the two of them, and people's
love for the original Evil Dead one and two. Like

(57:23):
you've mentioned Showbread Foo Fighters. Those are bands, let alone
all the other filmmakers and other content creators who are
inspired by the Evil Dead. But I think for me,
it's just giving Sam Raimi and Bruce Campbell their entry
point into the world of cinema and giving us two
very distinct and unique talents in a way that they've

(57:46):
always been themselves, maybe to a fault, especially with Sam
Raimi kind of always doing his thing, which I think
after a while people are like, can you do anything else?
And I'm not saying he can't, but again, like Sam
Raimi kind of got pigeonholed by what he meant, similar
to Bruce Campbell. But I think they've been able to
navigate outside of it, and they've taken Evil Dead as
a franchise back and they're doing a good job at

(58:09):
being I think stewards of Evil Dead because they're producing
the new films, they're helping writing Bruce Campbell. They always
want to know what Bruce Campbell's doing with the new
films or how he's involved. So I don't know. I
think it's the introduction of Sam Ramy and Bruce Campbell
into the world of cinema because they've made a rather
big impact on a lot of people. And these are
two guys who, by the way, the funniest thing about

(58:31):
all of that they grew up together. Like, give me
a fucking break, Like, I wish my childhood friend was
Bruce Campbell. That would be weird, like, and that's the
thing we're talking about it now, Like in ten years
they won't be like, oh, those guys were friends for
ten years. But it's crazy to think that Sam Ramy
and Bruce Campbell grew up together, made a movie together,
made another movie together, and now are intrinsically linked to

(58:53):
one another forever. So that, for me is my answer.
I'm very curious kind of your thoughts on it, and
then what your answer is.

Speaker 1 (59:01):
Well, first I want to say I've always thought of
Bruce Campbell and uh Sam Raimi as the horror version
of Scorsese and Bobby Dederro. They all grew up together,
made a bunch of movies and lived their entire lives
just kind of hanging out, and that's like, that's the dream.
That's amazing. Sure is so? So my answer is inherently

(59:22):
the same as yours to this third question, but I
want to I want to get a little silly with it,
and I gotta say, like, the biggest impact on pop
culture literally is the fact that the MCU exists because
of Evil Dead. Without Evil Dead, we don't get Sam
Raimi making Spider Man, and we don't get modern comic
book movies that are made the way that they are now.

(59:43):
And it's hilarious to draw that line. I know we've
already talked about the MCU in this episode, but the
truth of the matter is like without without his first
couple of movies getting bigger and evolving with each one
and seeing what he could do, and then eventually leading
to what is the bridge in between Evil Dead and

(01:00:05):
the MCU, which is literally the Quick and the Dead.
For Sam Raimi, I don't see I don't see another
filmmaker that steps in when these are made and does
it the way that he does to revolutionize those types
of movies. I feel like we could have got there eventually,
but he perfected it, which is such an interesting way

(01:00:26):
to look at the guy that made fucking Evil dead.
I know it is insane to think that without him,
like we wouldn't have Black Panther, we wouldn't have you know,
the massive Avengers team up in twenty nineteen, that was
such a huge hit for so many people.

Speaker 2 (01:00:43):
Spider Man No Way Home literally as the character from
Sam Rami Spider Man in it, and that was the
thing that people were excited for with that movie was, Oh, look,
Toby Maguire's coming back. I mean, we're really all excited
for Willham to fote. That's how fucking lie here, That's
what I'm getting Spider and come out to play like
I mean, Willem Dafoe, let's just keep going with this.

(01:01:04):
It introduced the world to Willem Dafoe as Green Goblin,
and I would even go as far as to say
he introduced me to Willem Dafoe at the right age
to be like, man, I like this actor, but you're right,
like in a lot of ways, Sam Raimi kind of
to thank for the MCU thank or to ride and
then he ends up actually being part of it, which
is in and of itself kind of fucking nuts.

Speaker 1 (01:01:27):
Yeah, it's when you're looking at like objective lists of
the best comic book movies, it's crazy how many of
them still list Spider Man two as not like near
the top, but literally the top, the pinnacle of comic
book movies. People view Spider Man two as the best one,
and I like the first one more.

Speaker 2 (01:01:46):
Still, sorry, I get how much I get why people
like the second one so much, but the first one
has the better villain. The first one has a villain villain.
The second movie is like, oh, he's you know, is
a reluctant villain or he's been controlled by the arms.
Like I had a problem with that because it kind
of removes the stakes of the movie. It puts the
emotional stakes on a different character, which is fine. But

(01:02:07):
that first movie just everything about that first movie has
fucking James Franco in it, which is crazy, Like that
movie has James Franco, a very young James Franco, and
a very young Willem Dafoe. Because you know that movie
came out in what two thousand and one, two thousand
and one or two thousand and two, because I was
in sixth grade when that movie came out. I remember

(01:02:27):
having a book that was talking. It was like one
of those like from Phil from screen to film, or
like from book to screen or whatever.

Speaker 1 (01:02:35):
Spider Man one was two thousand and two, Spider Man
two was two thousand and four.

Speaker 2 (01:02:38):
It's wild, absolutely well, yeah, we're still talking about the
you put it best. Those movies still show up on
the top in the top fifteen movies for superhero characters
ever made. You will undoubtedly have at least one Sam
Reimi movie, if not two, not gonna be three, but
you'll have at least two.

Speaker 1 (01:02:58):
In twenty twenty four, after literally the last sixteen years
of the MCU coming into play. It's crazy that we
still get those near the top, and it says a
lot about the actual quality of those movies because they
held on to a little bit more of that ninety
style of filmmaking where the set pieces felt like set pieces.
It didn't feel like everything was green screen, even though

(01:03:20):
yes there was some, but everything wasn't and the special
effects were a little bit better. There was more practical effects.
Because Sam Raimi grew up in that he pioneered some
of that. He is somebody that could make a movie
about a comic book character that you actually watch and feel,
I don't know the textures of there's something about it
that's more realistic. And when you compare it, literally one

(01:03:42):
to one with something like Multiverse a Madness, which is
also Sam Raimi, it feels so much more fake when
everything is digital and you can tell it. It definitely
hurts for those style of films. Sam Raimi is just
incredible at filmmaking. And that's like the easiest way to
say this.

Speaker 2 (01:04:00):
Yeah, I there is few American filmmakers who have done
more without doing a lot than Sam Raimi. He has
affected a lot. By really, I mean like, I'm not
saying he's not prolific, but if you ask someone named
ten American filmmakers of note, his name would not come up.
And that is a shame because he deserves to be

(01:04:22):
in the top top five American filmmakers in terms of
their impact on filmmaking in this country as a whole,
especially genre filmmaking of a certain kind. But yeah, then
to pivot into superhero movies, which are not what they
used to be now, but for a while they were
the biggest fucking thing. And one of those reasons is because,

(01:04:42):
like you said, Sam Raimi paved the way, which is
weird because he's not a superhero director. He's the director
of horror movies for the most part, genre filmmaking.

Speaker 1 (01:04:51):
I would say broadly, well let's get into our last question. Then,
well maybe before we do that one last thing. I
know you mentioned it, Earl, but I cannot stress enough
to everybody out there listening. If you have not had
the opportunity and it somehow comes around to your city again,
please go see Evil Dead the musical. I have had
the chance to see it twice here in Kansas City.

(01:05:14):
My wife and I got to sit in the splash
zone both times. It is a lot of fun. The
music is genuinely great. The comedy hits hard. It is
very very funny. It's very adult too. That's one of
the funniest parts of it. The set pieces that they
use on stage for it are always really well done,
lots of gags in it, and it's just it's so
fun and if you like the franchise, there are so

(01:05:36):
many running jokes that they do with everything just to
make the audience in on it. It's so absolutely worth it,
but like I said, you can watch it on YouTube.
I think it was up at least a couple of
years ago when I watched it. You can get the
soundtrack on all of your digital music services. It's it's
so so good.

Speaker 2 (01:05:55):
Yeah, I saw, like I mentioned once in Vegas and
it's great. It's also one of the original ones of
that kind of thing, a adaptation of a movie, a
contemporary movie into a musical. I mean, you know, we
have Beatlejuice the Musical now and everything's a musical now.
But Evil Dead the Musical was kind of early on
it was pretty off Broadway, but it was kind of

(01:06:18):
known for being off Broadway. It was one of those
like very popular underground things. But yeah, having the name
Evil Dead, just the visibility goes up a couple notches.

Speaker 1 (01:06:28):
So it's super fun. Question number four, then, what is
the cinematic bridge to the Evil Dead? Chris the Maybe
another franchise, maybe another movie, maybe another director that people,
if they're already a fan of, might clue them into
watching a film from the Evil Dead franchise.

Speaker 2 (01:06:46):
Yeah, so we've actually done an episode on this person already,
so maybe there's a little bit of a cheat. But
I would say, if you're a fan of Peter Jackson's
early stuff, you're going to be a fan of most
of the Evil Dead franchise, if not all of it,
And maybe Evil Dead doesn't go far enough for you,
because Dead Alive, Dead Alive, I think, is like the

(01:07:07):
Dead Alive is the third Evil Dead movie that never
got made, right, like Army of Darkness is its own thing.
But imagine if Dead Alive was just you know what
I mean, like Ash goes home and it's Ash goes home, right,
and then it's like, I mean, if you think about
the story of Dead Alive right, like just it kind
of is like what would happen if Ash got back
to town and the evil followed him there? And I mean,

(01:07:31):
Peter Jackson clearly inspired by Sam Raimi. I would also say, again,
if you're a fan of Giermo del Toro films, you'll
probably be a fan of the Evil Dead franchise. But
I mean, again, that's two filmmakers. So I'm curious what
your answer is. I hope it's a little bit more
esoteric than mine, because mine is a little like duh.
I guess I could have said the films of Fetti
Alvarez even but like that's a little unfair. But Toro

(01:07:55):
del Toro and Peter Jackson are very good fact similes.
I mean, I wouldn't say Edgar Wright because he's really
never done genre filmmaking of the horror variety. I guess
he did with One Night and soho, but that wasn't
sustained like Del Toro has done, like Peter Jackson has done.
Because Peter Jackson did like three horror movies in a row,
Del Toro did a bunch both Spanish language and.

Speaker 1 (01:08:17):
English produced a bunch too. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:08:19):
Yeah, So that's my answer. What do you think and
what's yours?

Speaker 1 (01:08:24):
I think those are good choices. I think Edgar Wright
is I wish you would just make a straight horror
movie that would be like what we all want and
Last Night and so it was marketed as that. It
never was that, unfortunately, and now he's remaking a Running
Man weird right, Yeah, what is this world? Anyways? My answer,

(01:08:46):
I tried to really go one to one with this
and come up with another franchise that would work, and
so a lot of people won't agree because it's nowhere
near as consistent as the Evil Dead franchise. But I'm
gonna throw out there, if you were a fan of
the high points of the Texas Chainsaw Masker franchise, you'll
probably like a lot of the stuff from the Evil
Dead because Sam Raimi and Toby Hooper both making very

(01:09:10):
important movies in you know, obviously text Chainsaws in the
earlier part of the seventies, and then Sam Raimi started
getting this idea near the end of the seventies and
didn't come out until eighty one. There's so much like
baked in with the Vietnam War and the sensibility of
coming out of like the Hippy Age and into the seventies,

(01:09:31):
which was this time of freedom and liberation for a
lot of people. And so they come out with this
very like horrifying first film, and then the second film
comes in and it's this wild genre change, and for
both of these movies there's something that still have a
lot of horror elements but are also funniest fuck And then,
unfortunately there's quite a few missteps in the Texas Chainsaw

(01:09:54):
Masker franchise. Then the remake comes in and it's a
brutal retelling that is very much like the first. It
is a really well done remake.

Speaker 2 (01:10:02):
And thank you, thank you for defending that movie because
I know it takes a lot of shit. I love
the text Chainsaw Massacre.

Speaker 1 (01:10:08):
It's incredible. Jessica Biel is amazing, yes.

Speaker 2 (01:10:11):
Arlee Ermie, holy shit. And the guy who plays Leatherface,
he's great. And he's physically imposing too, which like really
physically imposing.

Speaker 1 (01:10:23):
And then of course with Texas Chainsaw, that also leads
up to the streaming age Netflix film that came out
that a lot of people hate, but I think that
it add a lot of really good elements into it.
I don't think it's it's you know, it's far from
a perfect film, but.

Speaker 2 (01:10:36):
I a itting produced by and it's produced by Fattie Alba, Yes, so.

Speaker 1 (01:10:44):
He's got a hand in it. And beyond that, it
ties so much in with that first film that it's
just a modern take on continuing that original story. You
get a character that comes back, which is the big,
hot new thing to do. But beyond all that, it's
it's very almost like one to one with the Evil
Dead franchise. It just fails to live up to the

(01:11:05):
quality as often as Evil Dead does. I'm a big
fan of many of the Texas Chainsaw films, and especially
big fan of Toby Ooper and the way that he
you know, kind of like Sam Raimi. He made that
first movie and then came back for a sequel because
it was so important, and he went a slightly different route,
but it was more of like a fuck you if

(01:11:26):
you love that first one, man, you're gonna think this
is weird, and just goes all out for that second film,
and it's one that if you've not, you know, I can't.
That's maybe what I should say here is I can't
wait until we can do an episode on the Texas Chainsaw.
I'm asking franchise.

Speaker 2 (01:11:41):
Yeah, I would do that in a heartbeat, motherfucker, as
Bill Mosley would say, Bill Moseley, second Texas chain So yeah,
so good. And I think I would agree that's a
very apt comparison. The high points in Evil Dead are
way higher and way more consistent too, to your point,
and I would actually say, I think across the board

(01:12:02):
with Evil Dead all the way down, Evil Dead is
a consistent franchise. Extremely first one's consistent, second one is,
third one is, fourth one is from all accounts, the
fifth one is as well. So that I mean, look,
we're not gonna compare it to Hell Raiser. Let's just
put it that way. But you were just not going
to for all those reasons. Hell Rasor is one of

(01:12:23):
those franchises that, speaking of things, I can't wait to
talk about, because that is a franchise that is disjointed,
to say the least to And that's an under that's
the underest of understatements being made on this podcast is
hell Razor is an inconsistent franchise. Hell Raiser is a
franchise that effectively has two good movies three if you're
a fan of path Yeah, okay, I like that third movie,

(01:12:45):
but I'm not gonna sit I'm not gonna sit her
and call it, you know, a peak cinema moment. But
it is pretty funny when that guy has a camera
jammed in his face. The guy with the CDs in
his head is just as eighties and nineties as it gets.

Speaker 1 (01:12:59):
But I I love it, man, Hell Raiser. If we
ever do an episode on Hell Raiser, that's gonna be
a wild one.

Speaker 2 (01:13:05):
Yeah, because there will literally be like, we can't in
good content suggest half of these movies.

Speaker 1 (01:13:10):
Let's discuss Dead Or for the next forty minutes. Yeah, right. Anyways,
that is the Evil Dead, five films, three TV seasons,
a bunch of video games, a musical, and a lasting
impact on horror, on comedy, on comic book movies, and
on the world. I mean, you see at horror conventions

(01:13:33):
every year, Sam Raimi and Bruce Campbell still going out
and shaking hands with fans, with some of the longest
lines at any of these conventions, just to make people happy.
I went to Texas Freightmare in twenty nineteen and the
Evil Dead car was there to take the picture with, Like,
it's still that big of a deal.

Speaker 2 (01:13:49):
I'm glad that you brought this up because my button
on this is I got to meet Bruce Campbell at
one of those things and I took my picture with him,
and it is a very funny picture. I don't think
I've ever showed you the picture, but he was wearing
a pink dress shirt and a white jacket. It was
just like what in God's name? And he was like,

(01:14:10):
what do you want to do with your life? And
I was like, why are you asking me this, Bruce
Campbell of all the people. But it was the weirdest thing.
And my reaction is pretty good too. But he is. Well,
I mean again, he was as nice as I assumed.

Speaker 1 (01:14:23):
He would be. It says like he was there on
a weekend during filming burn notice.

Speaker 2 (01:14:28):
Yeah right exactly, boy forgot about that right, like he
was on that show for what ten seasons or whatever? Nonsense?

Speaker 1 (01:14:35):
It was.

Speaker 2 (01:14:36):
Yeah, Bruce Campbell is He's the man for a reason.
Bubba ho tep baby, like, come on, I mean, Bruce
Campbell's amazing. That's that's the big takeaway here, Like everybody
involved with this franchise pretty amazing.

Speaker 1 (01:14:49):
Maybe my hottest take as we signed out here. I
can't stand Bubba ho test I get it.

Speaker 2 (01:14:53):
The last time I watched it, it was just fine.
It didn't hold up as well as I remembered. But
you know, was that a Don Costcarelli movie? There is, yeah,
there's some. Yeah, not all Don Costcarelly movies are created equal.

Speaker 1 (01:15:09):
That is accurate. Now, all right, Chris, let's go out
with a bang. Anything you want to clue people.

Speaker 2 (01:15:16):
In on before we leave, just head on over to
weirdingwaymedia dot com to pick up and listen to anything
that I work on and things that I don't like.
Twisted and Uncorked the award winning eighties TV Ladies, the
projection Booth Fromentaries. I could keep going, but you should
just go on over to weirdingwaymedia dot com. Find something
you like in all those twenty podcasts, give it a listen,

(01:15:36):
and if you like it, like, rate and review whatever
show that is, be it this one or some other
one on iTunes, because that's where it helps us out
the most. What about you, Ryan Verel, the busiest man
in physical media.

Speaker 1 (01:15:49):
I will highlight a show that's on my podcast network,
Unsung Horrors, and if you like Evil Dead or like
listening to this episode, I'm gonna tell you to give
a shot to Unsung Horrors because they have one of
the greatest premises in podcast history, which is they they
take a horror film that has less than a thousand
views on letterboxed and break it down, watch it, go

(01:16:10):
over it. They get you hyped up on it, and
usually they do it with a fun guest or just
the two hosts, Lance and Erica, who are really great
at what they do. Every October they have something called
Horror Gives Back where they run a charity drive to
be able to donate to some animal little meet. I

(01:16:34):
don't even remember what it's called I will I think
it's called best Friends. It's an organization that helps with,
you know, maintaining shelters and doing what they can to
help donate for animals. And they're just great people and
they put on a good show. But other than that,
I will say, we hope you come back for the
next episode. We hope that you continue to push the batteries,

(01:16:57):
your interest in film and in a light of the
evil it steak roomy