The 2025 WNBA Season Through the All-Star Break With Desmond Powell

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
And now Damage Infringe Man.

Speaker 2 (00:10):
Welcome to the Gimmick Infringement Podcast. I am one of
your hosts, Tyler McDowell Blanken. I am, of course, joined
by my co host, the incomparable Brad Winchester. And we
are joined by one of our favorite people in this space,
the one the only his face looks familiar if you're
on YouTube with us in a moment. His voice will

(00:33):
sound familiar if you're tapping in with us on audio.
He is the host and creator of Hip to the Games.
Our fellow nineteen Media Group teammate Desmond Pale is back days.
Welcome back to the show. How you've been well, what's.

Speaker 1 (00:47):
Up, guys?

Speaker 3 (00:48):
I know we talked pre show. This is long overdue.
I am so geeked to be with both of y'all
for this episode and talking to WNBA and a lot
of other things.

Speaker 1 (00:57):
I'm sure. I'm excited, man, I'm excited. I can't.

Speaker 2 (01:01):
We've been looking forward to this for a while.

Speaker 4 (01:03):
Brad.

Speaker 2 (01:03):
How you feeling. We're talking, we're talking, w We're talking
Drake's come back. We're talking sneakers in twenty twenty five.

Speaker 4 (01:09):
I feel really good. Drake's come back. Huh uh yeah,
I feel like, uh, yeah, well, I can't wait to
get into that. I've been thinking about it a lot.
This is this is going to be a memorable episode.
It's this is gonna be interesting. Yeah, I can't We
have not talked about this previously. I can't wait to
hear your thoughts. I'm excited, we've been. I have been
waiting to do something with Dez for a really long

(01:31):
time nineteen Zone and ever since Des also a musician,
and I want to give you props for that, ever
since I got to scoop up your song I believe
on Apple Music you can go check that out. Really
really really cool stuff. So I've been looking forward to
this for a long time.

Speaker 1 (01:49):
No, that's love, Brad. I appreciate that.

Speaker 3 (01:51):
And you know, I'll even say this now. I don't
even know, Brad, if you heard me tell the story,
but I think Tyler might have heard me tell before.
But to finally be on, I have to tell it.
When I joined nineteen and it was like the early stages.
I hadn't made a show officially yet or nothing like that,
and I was like, let me check out the network,
let me see, you know, make sure I'm tapped in

(02:12):
before I step in and I'm like, man, all these
shows are like forty five minutes, fifty minutes, Like, are
they ready for somebody that can that is crazy enough
to talk for an hour and forty five by themselves,
let alone in a team show by themselves. And I
saw this show called Gimmick Infringement. I'm like, okay, fifty minutes,
they do the fifty minute thing. But then I kept

(02:34):
scrolling it. I see like hour thirty, hour, twenty five,
and I'm.

Speaker 1 (02:37):
Like, these are my people.

Speaker 3 (02:39):
Who is Brad and Tyler? Like I need to get
with them quickly because they are my type of crazy
If they can talk this long about a topic and
I can't, Like, yeah, I made the right decisions. This
is a full circle kind of big for me.

Speaker 1 (02:53):
Yeah, very full circle.

Speaker 2 (02:55):
I'm glad we found each other well, Das, you are
prolific my friend again. Of course you have the podcast.
You've contributed to our website get Mikeafringement pod dot com.

Speaker 1 (03:06):
Multiple articles there before.

Speaker 2 (03:07):
We get into w talk. Now that we're at the
All Star break, we'd love for our audience to hear
how things are going at hip to the games and
with all your amazing content discussing summer league, recapping the draft.
How's everything over over there on H two DG, going,
oh yeah.

Speaker 3 (03:23):
I appreciate that question. Everything everything is good, I would say,
always trying to grow. You guys know the podcast game.
My recent episode at the time of this recording was
a off season awards special kind of thing. So I
made some custom awards and I got a little help
from chat GPT.

Speaker 1 (03:42):
I won't lie, but I made I've.

Speaker 3 (03:45):
Made some custom awards kind of in the form of
like a hip hop Grammy kind of thing, but translated
it to the off season like best acquisition, you know,
the Vito Award like.

Speaker 2 (03:57):
Former Phoenix Sun.

Speaker 1 (03:58):
We love that of course.

Speaker 3 (04:00):
Of course, yeah, one of my favorite off season acquisitions.
I have been saying it all summer, but yeah, you know,
everything everything is rolling pretty good on the HG DG side.
Definitely want to get into another album review this summer.
That's my big goal to do that something from Kendrick
Lamar so listeners can look forward to that. I still
got to pick the album and whatnot, but that's something
that I definitely want to do. Obviously coming up this summer,

(04:22):
I'd like to do my U had to be there episodes,
So wink wink.

Speaker 1 (04:25):
Nudge, nudge.

Speaker 3 (04:26):
I would like both of you, you know, to to
come on and show love to a player of the past.

Speaker 2 (04:31):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (04:32):
You know, I think again with with Hit to the
Games being about celebrating and being positive about basketball and
hip hop.

Speaker 1 (04:39):
Uh, those are some of.

Speaker 3 (04:40):
The ways I'm able to do that. So it's been
going pretty good.

Speaker 4 (04:44):
We'd love that's amazing, amazing.

Speaker 2 (04:46):
Well, be sure to follow Dez to support his work
at Desmond Pale Underscore across social des Brad, I think
it's time that we talked w So I am at
the stage of my fandom where I think part of
it is the brilliance of the wn it's athletes, and
then also the schedule. Being half of the NBA, I
am way more locked into the w regular season than

(05:09):
I am the NBA. So I have a lot of
thoughts and questions for you guys, and I think the
best place to start is to discuss the surprises of
the first half of this twenty twenty five WNBA season.
So our Phoenix Mercury Brad Winchester. As of this recording,

(05:30):
the Mercury have the second best record in the league.
Brad on gi here, I'll often say I'm right ten
percent of the time, which means the other ninety percent
I'm wrong. The Mercury are in that ninety percent. I
did not expect the team to not only be in
playoff contention, but to have one of the best records
across the w So I first wanted to acknowledge that

(05:53):
I'm glad I was wrong, and it's amazing to see that.
You know, the trio of Satusa, Beli Thomas and Khalia
Copper having returned from injury, has just been amazing. The
role players have been fantastic, Dez. The Golden State Valkyries
in our notes, our pot outline, what about the Valkyries everything,

(06:14):
They've been a stellar surprise, probably a playoff team we
shall see in the coming weeks. And then also you
have a team like the Las Vegas Aces, who were
once feared and seemed unstoppable. They've fallen back to Earth
with their new roster. So want to start here, Dez,
will lop it up to you first. What has surprised
you most about the first half of the WNBA season

(06:36):
in twenty twenty five.

Speaker 1 (06:38):
So I'm definitely with you on the Phoenix Mercury.

Speaker 3 (06:40):
I know I spoke to you before of like, I
just I just found it weird that with the team
of Brittany Grinder, Diana cod Copper, Natasha Cloud, how they
couldn't do just as well as the team that we're
seeing today. But I think, quite honestly, I think the
biggest part of that is Alyssa Thomas. I think because

(07:02):
in basketball, I think Swiss army knives are everything everything.
I mean, you look at Scotty Pippen, how he helped
put the Bulls over the edge. You look at one
of my personal favorites, Andre Goodala. I mean we all
look at the Warriors because he won on those teams,
but before that, he played nine seasons and made the
playoffs six times. He was an Olympic gold medalist in

(07:24):
twenty twelve, Like he was a winner, and that helped
the Warriors. I think even Draymond Green is in that
similar category, and they.

Speaker 1 (07:31):
Have both of those guys. You look at I.

Speaker 3 (07:33):
Think Ben Simmons, even with the Sixers. I know his
career has kind of fallen off, but every season he
was a Sixer, they made the playoffs. Unfortunately, he couldn't
play in the bubble but all four of those seasons
they made the playoffs. I think Alyssa Thomas has that
exact same effect. So when they got her this summer,
I did kind of have an inkling that like, Okay,
you know the Mercury are not ready to tank or

(07:55):
what have you. They're really trying to stay afloat even
when they lose somebody like BG and obviously Diana's retirement,
I thought, I thought that was a great pickup, and
even Satu was amazing. I think she can be even better.
I think her shooting thirty nine percent at six four
isn't ideal, but I think if I'm her, I know
they're close in age, but if I'm Satu Soabi, I'm

(08:16):
looking at Nafisa Kyllier and I'm like, that's my ceiling,
that's my sealing. I think, similar makeup, similar similar structure,
similar game. I think if she can get into some
of the go to move that Nefisa does on a
nightly basis, she can be even better.

Speaker 2 (08:32):
Last music to my Ears day, I love that No
Sau was a great pickup, and this roster being before
he take it to Brad, this roster being constructed to
be more of a Nate Tibbets team. You know, I
think with with head coach Nate Tibbets, there was still
this worry that, you know, the Phoenix fan base hadn't
fully acclimated to him yet. His hiring was really in

(08:53):
the news. It was very polarizing. And then last year
lots of ups and downs, like you pointed out, des
Uh by the end of the season, kind of a
mediocre season for bg DT and company, and for this
year to really lean into Okay, they want to play
an up tempo style of ball again. They want to
kind of design this team around a big three, which

(09:14):
feels like a bit of a relic. I couldn't have
been more wrong. It's worked out well, and to your point,
as a lot of that is due to at the
very forefront of this organization Alyssa Thomas, the proverbio Swiss
army knife as you mentioned, and then an emerging Satu
Savoli coming from Dallas, not having a great year last
year and then coming to Phoenix and really embracing being

(09:35):
one of the one of the faces of the franchise.
It's when it's worked out so.

Speaker 1 (09:38):
Well, absolutely well.

Speaker 4 (09:40):
I wonder if that's a cultural shift too. Because coming
out of Dallas, we see what Dallas is doing right
now right wing, the Wings are not They're not having
a great season, and I think that they don't have
bad players, they just have there's just something missing there
where it just feels like this has to be an
organizational thing. But Copper was ka last year is all
I could think of was you have you have beg

(10:00):
and you have the goat. You forget Copper is there
and and she had kind of a breakout year last year,
so coming into this year, it was like, she's probably
gonna be the team's MVP. And it turns out like
they didn't need her to be the MVP because they're
they're just really well rounded now and balanced. Yeah, you
have that big three, but it's like it's spread out
more so you're not putting it at all on your

(10:21):
one superstar. You're you're building a team up from like
with within, and all I can think of as an
absolute Detroit Homer here, all I can think about is
that team where it's like, no, no, no, you don't
have a superstar on this team, but you're you're spreading
everything out enough where you can take down the Lakers,
right like that's that's that's kind of the vibe that
I was getting with this team. There's nobody I can
point to you and be like, this person was the

(10:43):
greatest college player I've ever seen, or this person was.
There's not a Caitlin Clark sitting out there. There's there's
not Becker's sitting there. There's not there's not Sabrina sitting there.
There's this team that's really good, really good together with
a with a really good chemistry and a really good balance.
So I think I wasn't sure how it was gonna
go this year because you lose those giant pieces that

(11:04):
have been there for a long time, and all I
think is a rebuild year. And now it's this.

Speaker 2 (11:09):
Which I wouldn't be which we wouldn't I think we
the Phoenix Smurkree fan base, Brad, I don't know that
we would have been mad at that, of course, And
and Dez, I know you feel the same way about
your beloved Chicago Sky. We like the teams you root
for to be competitive. But given that BG's no longer here,
Diana Turossi is no longer here, I mean bases of
Arizona Sports, we would have been okay, with their rebuild year.

(11:31):
But I think as a fan base, this has just
been such an incredible surprise.

Speaker 1 (11:36):
Yeah, for sure, for sure.

Speaker 3 (11:38):
But even then, speaking of surprises like the Vakriys, I
mean another team where I was like, I'm sure you
watched that expansion draft and when they laid out all
the picks, it was like, I, all right, it's not
gonna be that. It's not gonna be you know, it's
gonna be nice. We'll enjoy the logo, respect the Golden State. Yeah,
the Golden State. You know they're they're gonna get there.

Speaker 1 (12:00):
Fan base.

Speaker 3 (12:01):
It's nice to see them have a team when the
Warriors aren't playing right, like they're taking everything out of Oakland.
So it's nice to have a WNBA franchise.

Speaker 1 (12:09):
But it's like.

Speaker 3 (12:11):
All of a sudden, this team is competitive and then
it's like not just one game, but now they're actually
competitive for consecutive games, and you blink and it's like, oh, shoot,
they can make the playoffs. I think I definitely didn't
have that on my beingo Car.

Speaker 2 (12:27):
Yeah, and as you mentioned it here, the fan base
support has been critical. Obviously, they chose the right head
coach in Natalie Nicasse you and I have spoken off
here about how much we just really love her as
the HC for this team. You get the fan buying
Brad my expert on Viking lore, this idea of Okay,

(12:47):
it's Valhalla. You know, we sold ten thousand season tickets.
That's a record for the w There's so much momentum
around this organization. And like you said this, and this
is from your days of playing ball as well, mister Powell.
The chemistry component of all this. You know, all three
of us you know, played youth basketball back in the day.
Sometimes it really isn't just the team that's most talented.

(13:10):
Y'all have that team that has some ballers but has
that chemistry. And I think that's made a world of
a difference for Golden State. They just they've adopted this
team identity led by Natalie Nicasse and having this rabid
fan base in the Bay and it's led them to
possibly a playoff berth in their inaugural season. I did

(13:32):
not expect that, and I thought I was pretty optimistic
heading into the year for Golden State.

Speaker 4 (13:38):
I love the Yeah, everything you guys just said was
was great in Valkyries, by the way, great because Valkyries.
By the way, Valkyrie is guided the souls of the
dead to Valhalla, So it's the only one that makes
sense to me where everybody's like at Valhalla. Tyler and
I were talking about Valhalla before we recorded GI earlier
and a name important to your school that you're headed

(13:58):
to used incorrect. I kind of feel like it works here.
They have surprised all of us and they're carrying their
victims out with them, and uh, nobody really saw tough. Uh.

Speaker 2 (14:12):
Any thoughts, guys before we move on to expansion and
Kathy Engelbert, talk any thoughts on where we're at with
the Las Vegas Aces. If this is part of a
prediction or question for you later, tell me yo, chill
and we'll get to it and I'll respect that. Uh,
But any thoughts on the Aces, because it was not
long ago when uh, they were seen as the most
feared team in the league and we were talking about
you know, dynasties, and you had Asia Wilson are to

(14:34):
be the best player in the world still on the Aces.
You had Chelsea Gray still on the Aces, but you
also had Kelsey Plumb obviously Jackie Young still there, so
you have a lot of those foundational pieces still on
the team, still led by head coach Becky Hammond, but
this season they by all accounts, are a lot more
mortal than they were in previous years past. As you

(14:54):
want to kick us off there before we move on
thoughts on the state of the Aces and if they
can h right the shit?

Speaker 1 (15:01):
Uh yeah, man.

Speaker 3 (15:02):
So I think that's been the critique with the Aces though, right,
like you said, on paper and even sometimes off the
eye test, it's like, Okay, the offense, the offensive pieces
for the most part, are still there, so what's the
deal here? And I think that's been the thing. It's
the other side of the floor and looking at the stats,
it's like you realize they've had six straight seasons of
deep playoff runs and let alone playoff runs and deep

(15:24):
playoff runs. And I think it was kind of catching
up to Asia, how she's been battling with some of
the injuries, still playing great basketball, but crazy enough, not
even nearly what she was doing the past couple of seasons.
But I think that's catching up a little bit. But
I think defensively, you know, as we know, there are
thirteen teams in the W right now, the Aces are
ninth in defensive rating. The last time they were ninth

(15:46):
in defensive rating was twenty eighteen, the year they also
didn't make the playoffs. Every other season outside of that
has been the top five defense. So I think if
the eye test didn't show it enough the stats, certainly
that defense is the issue with the Las Vegas Aces.
And I think even losing somebody like Alisia Clark, for example,

(16:07):
great defender, and you don't have that. And I thought,
and the crazy thing was with the Aces, I thought
that they they lost so many.

Speaker 1 (16:14):
Locker room pieces.

Speaker 3 (16:15):
You know, we talked about chemistry just a little bit ago.
They lost so many locker room pieces, Alisia Clark, Kelsey Plumb,
Sid Colson. I think even that plays a role in
just the overall morale of the team. So maybe it's
kind of going towards their energy too, Like you have
these people that put a battery in your back and
they're not in the locker room anymore. I think it's

(16:36):
a lot of that going on with the Aces.

Speaker 2 (16:39):
Yeah, well said that is the defense has clearly been
the the uh. I think the first sign to point
to with this team that I love what you mentioned
about the chemistry piece and some of those players who
you know, maybe aren't necessarily a top three or top
four player on the roster, but contributed so much in
the locker room. That's that's fantastic. Okay, Fellas, we got
to talkin I think Brad even may have teased this

(17:03):
a moment ago. We are I had to Yeah, I'm
so excy you as you should. I love this for you.
As you pointed out, we have thirteen teams currently in
the association. That is going to change very soon because
in case our viewers are just tapping into the w
there is an incredible period of growth right now for
the league. These cities are all getting teams in the

(17:25):
next several years. Next season, we're going to get Toronto,
Cleveland is getting a team, Detroit's getting a team, Philly
is also getting a team. And at the same time,
you have a lot of critique around WNBA fandom regarding
commissioner Kathy Engelbert and how Okay, the league is expanding,
which is very exciting for numerous reasons. But at the

(17:47):
same time, there are many franchises currently in this group
of thirteen that don't necessarily have the same resources as others.
For example, one thing I will give Matt Ishbie a
credit about is invest in the Mercury building, the practice facility,
making sure that the players have facilities that are you know,
kind of not even adequate, but comparable to their male counterparts.

(18:11):
Really nice facility at the PHX Arena, not asking a ton,
But when we think about the Los Angeles Sparks, the
Connecticut Sun, I mean, there are several teams around the league.
I think even the Chicago Sky Does at the moment
as of this recording, don't necessarily have that infrastructure yet
in place. So we're bringing in franchises, we're adding cities,
but what about the pre existing you know, players, enfranchises.

(18:35):
So I want to hear your will start with Brad.
I want to hear your guys' thoughts on expansion and Brad,
if we're fully back with the Detroit Shock in a
few years. But then also this potential and maybe we're
already here potential Kathy Engelbert villain arc because it seems
like in the next couple seasons there's going to be something,

(18:55):
There's going to be a story here really to follow
with regard to Engelbert, and you know how she's satisfies
the needs and concerns of everything that's happening with regard
to this exciting time in the W. So that preamble aside,
Brad Winchester Detroit Shock, How excited are you?

Speaker 4 (19:13):
I'm very excited. I hope assuming I hope they changed
the name. I like the Shock has always been a
confusing name to me because it's a car town. You
have the pistons there, it's not it's not anything else.
It's not like the Detroit seat covers. So maybe not
even naming it after the shocks on your car, right,
it's shock. It's just one. It's just one wheel gets

(19:35):
gets a spring. I've always thought it was weird, but
the logo was also electric, so I always thought it
doesn't make sense for Detroit. There has to be something
new there if they go back to the Shock. THO,
I'm not going to be mad. I mean, I'm here.
I had Tucson Roadrunners UH season tickets for hockey when
they first came back to a nod to the Phoenix
Roadrunners instead of going to something original and UH and new.

(19:57):
People like comfort and familiarity, and I'm sure there's still
a lot of good vibes around around that team and
the nostalgia around that team. Where did they play? Where
did they go? Are they going to shove them in
the PiZZ arena? Like where are they gonna? I just
hope they do them right now that they're going back
to Detroit. They had talked about moving them outside, and
so I wanted to say Rochester Heights was one of

(20:18):
the places they were looking at for the Little Teesers
Arena obviously Little Teazers, the Red Wings, the arena downtown.
That family has has had money and investments in those
sports forever. And then you have the Fords with the Lions,
who fronts the money? Where does it go? Where did
they play? And are they going to have a good facility.

(20:39):
It's all I really want for them, you know, Like
I have nostalgia about the Joe Louis Arena because the
Red Wings won there and played there forever, I don't
want them to end up in a place like the
Joe because that place was falling apart and smelled terrible.
Just because it has nostalgia doesn't mean it's good. So
I'm hoping they treat them well and get them in there.
But I'm super stoked for Michigan to get a w

(20:59):
NBA team back in the state. I kind of imagine
that that SuperSonics fans in Seattle right now are tearing
their head out, hair out, like looking at all these
expansion teams going to the WNBA and going like, we
can't get an NBA team back here, Like why can't
we have nice things? It's just it's hilarious to me

(21:19):
that they still don't have a SuperSonics team back in
there in the NBA. But I digress. Here's what I
think is cool about this. More than anything else. We
know that signed the new media rights deal last year
for was a two point two billion I think over
eleven years. It's two hundred million a year for the WNBA,
which you know, when I saw the billion number, I

(21:39):
was like, wow, that's incredible. What is it like a
five year, six year deal. Now it's an eleven year deal. Okay,
that's two hundred mili. Adding expansion teams doesn't necessarily mean
that money is going to increase to the teams and
to all all the different states that have invested in
these teams. I don't think it's a bad thing. Though.
They're gonna get spawned, They're going to do all these

(22:01):
things And what's really cool is we're even having this
conversation if you go back a couple of years, are
we talking about this like at all, you know, to
go back four years, five years, the product is still
really good, but people weren't invested in it. Now they're
selling places out consistently. There's the possibility that, you know,
what's really cool is like everybody was like, oh, Kitlyn Clark,

(22:22):
Kitlyn Clark, Kitton Clark. And now they're like, well, no,
but this player's coming. It's it's Becker's, it's Angel Reees,
it's I'm finally acknowledging Sabrina. Like all of these different
players are showing up and they're selling out arenas. It's
so great because I was looking it up, Alissa, let
me see was it? I think it was Thomas. Yeah,
I think it was Elisa Thomas. She's the highest she's

(22:42):
the highest player paid player on the Mercury and she's
at two hundred and fifteen thousand dollars, right.

Speaker 2 (22:49):
Some of these rookie contracts for Tom rookie seventy thousand dollars.

Speaker 4 (22:53):
Yeah, So it's just it's you go, you go down,
It's it's it's Thomas Witcombe locks of Bonner Bonner at
seventy eight thousand. Yeah, yeah, yeah, there's a lot of movement.
There's a lot of movement arizonas own McDonald now moving around.
She's Fever now.

Speaker 2 (23:13):
Right on the Fever has found a home and yeah.

Speaker 4 (23:15):
Really really cool. So so I think I think that
overall this is an incredible move because more teams, more
means more revenue, means more jobs, means more eyeballs on
the product, which means more local investment. Because like, if
you're in Michigan, who's your team, who you're rooting for,
It's it's Chicago's right next door. But there's not a

(23:36):
lot of people in Detroit that are like, yeah, I
love me some Chicago teams. And then if you go
into like Wisconsin, you got you got nothing but hate
in your heart up there for like Chicago teams. So uh,
it's it's it's just a it's just a strange place.
The Midwest is a strange place in general. So I'm
excited that they're getting more teams. You're getting Cleveland the team,
Detroit a team possible, like and all of these are

(23:56):
like possibilities that are on the docket right we don't.
We don't know for sure for sure, but it sounds
like this is where they're going to land and then
Philly Toronto on top of that a candidate team. So
I don't. I don't want to keep monopolizing time. I'm
so excited for Detroit. I'm so excited for Michigan in general,
but mostly I'm excited for the women and I'm excited
that the product continues to grow. And will you know,

(24:19):
I don't. I don't want to say it's going to
surpass anything. I just wanted to compete with everything else
because women's basketball is a ton of fun.

Speaker 2 (24:26):
Yeah, before we go to des Brad to your point,
just to add on, we also have an alternative to
the W in unrivaled right the Startup League founded by
Brihanna Stewart and the FISA Collier. And again there are
some feelings about, well, you know, shit, Kathy engelbird in
the league, like promote that and help that grow because
you know that's a very different style than the W.

(24:46):
So yeah, like you said, right now, only is is
the league on fire right now, But we also have
an alternative that is fun and that is making waves.
It's a great time to be a fan of women's
hoops and and really hoops in general. That being said,
Desmond Pale thoughts on expansion, thoughts on potential villain arc
for Kathy Engelbert. Where are you at with this exciting

(25:07):
time of growth for the league?

Speaker 3 (25:09):
Yeah, so just real quick, you know, I think Brad
the thing about the Detroit Shock, you guys won. You know,
if you just you know, if you lost a few
of those, maybe we would be the seat covers. Yeah,
you have swing cash out there. She was hungry to win,
so you know, I think that's just why that happened.
But joked aside though, I think as far as like

(25:31):
the Kathy thing, I think Brad mentioned this too, Like
at the end of the day, I remember when the
TL was in shambles. Every time somebody got cut, whether
they were a star or a role player or a
college star, whatever it was, it was just in shambles
because we just knew there were not enough teams. And
I think now she's working to bring these teams in

(25:52):
and at a pretty good rate. But now, again, like
to Tyler's point, you still think about, Okay, well we're
getting these teams, but what are the facilities gonna look
like what how where are the team's gonna play?

Speaker 1 (26:04):
I think it is. It is a little bit tough.

Speaker 3 (26:07):
I know, I joked in our group chat, like I
think Kathy's just like, well, you know, don't don't complain
when I'm giving you what you were complaining for before,
Like you know, I'm giving you you guys asked for expansion,
and now you're complaining about the money. So now I
if I switch to the money, You're still gonna talk
about expansion Like I gotta do one thing out of
time here. So I think, as funny as it is,

(26:28):
I think to be honest, especially with this CBA coming
up too, I think the villain arc Is is definitely ascending.
But if she if she handles it the best way
she can, uh, she could probably avoid it. But it's
it's tough right now. I'm not gonna lie and.

Speaker 2 (26:45):
Sad to your point even how to market the league
as well. Shout out to the great folks who are
covering the w I know close to home for US
brad Erica Day of phn X, Mercury, pH and X Sports.
There's been a lot of criticism days of even just
how the league is more marketing it's players, you know,
I think that's also a potential villain arc as well.
Is okay, we have these stars, we're building these new stars,

(27:07):
But is it because they're doing it on their own
on social or do they have the backing of the
w and not just Caitlin Clark, but John Quell Jones
and you know named the player who who has the
bona fides but maybe hasn't necessarily received that backing from
the league in years past. But you're cooking police, please.

Speaker 3 (27:23):
And dare I say it? I think sometimes even Asia
doesn't still doesn't get as much, you know, I'm sometimes
it's a little weird, like and even for me, I
get guilty of it, where like I was just on
Mike' step show and I didn't even think of her
as like top five, I guess because I was trying
to show love to everybody else. But at the same time,
at the end of the day, when you think the WNBA,

(27:46):
we should be thinking about Asia Wilson the same way
we used to think about Lisa Leslie, point blank period.
And sometimes that just doesn't happen. And even like when
you look at Nike, right, they had to literally they
had to really get in the lab and be like, Okay,
we're gonna make sure her shoe rollout is like this
clips album right now, because we went a long time

(28:06):
without her getting a shoe, like fans already think it's
been long overdue, things of that nature. I think even
a couple of seasons before that, they had the commercial
to market the new season, and like it felt like
that was like a finally moment for Asia where she
was featured a lot throughout that commercial. I felt like
even then that was like, oh, finally, So yeah, I

(28:26):
think that's a that's a great point tie. As far
as like the marketing of the players, I think there's
still so much they can do across for a lot
of the teams and the players.

Speaker 2 (28:36):
Yeah, well, I think this is a great moment to
transition into sneaker corner. What do you think about the
current sneaker releases? And this is really expanding down across
the w but also in the NBA. So you mentioned
we have the release, the long awaited release of the
A one, Asia Wilson's debut signature sneaker with Nike. Sounds
like you were very pro the A one. I thought

(28:58):
it was a fantastic roll up personally, but this isn't
about me. This is about what does things you. Also
in the NBA have the Dame tens being released. Former
Milwaukee Buck star Damian Lillard releasing his tenth sneaker with Adidas,
and part of what I loved about that rollout is
he made it a point to tell Adidas, hey, I
want this signature sneaker to be under one hundred dollars,

(29:19):
which I thought was was incredibly cool. Reminded me of
my days with the Starberry sneakers by Stephanfarberry, those fifteen
dollars joints. I don't think we give him enough flowers
for that. That to me was was just fantastic. And
although ninety five dollars is different than fifteen dollars, I
thought it was incredibly dope that Dame made it a
point as part of the campaign to say, hey, folks

(29:42):
are going to spend their harder money on this for
themselves or their children or whomever. The days of my
shoes being one twenty or one forty or you know
whatever other competitor sneakers are going for, I want to
make sure this is priced at you know, ninety five
dollars or less so sneaker corner, Desmond pal We got
the A one, we got the Dame ten. Of course
we've got the Sabrinas. What say you, which sneakers are

(30:03):
you liking this year?

Speaker 4 (30:04):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (30:05):
Great point about the Dames, I think, and even the
Starberries Allegedly they're coming back. I did see that on Instagram.
Allegedly they're trying to come back. I don't yeah, I
don't know how legit that was, but I did see that.

Speaker 1 (30:16):
All they're trying to come back.

Speaker 2 (30:17):
So okay, we got a monitor that.

Speaker 1 (30:22):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (30:22):
But I think as far as the Dames specifically, again,
I think you said it Ti, it's just like that era.
He's thinking about the kids who have to wear those
shoes for everything where they're multipurpose, right, Like I remember
growing up, I had tons of shoes, like I had
shack shoes, everything.

Speaker 1 (30:38):
It was everything.

Speaker 3 (30:39):
It was gym class, it was throughout the whole school day.
My brother had Carmelo's gym class and the school day,
you know, like it was never how you see nowadays
you have your hoop shoes and then your casual shoes,
Like we wore those things everywhere and everything baseball, not
even basketball, right, baseball, kickball, you wore them for everything,
So I think multi, Yeah, I think Dame was definitely

(31:02):
thinking about those kids. So I love that move. The
a ones, Uh, they look great in person, like I
think obviously, Ty, you know you have some pairs if
I'm not mistaken.

Speaker 1 (31:13):
But when I went when I.

Speaker 3 (31:14):
Was in the city for the Kendric concert, we went
to one of the Nike stores or whatever, and just
seeing her huge poster, you know with the flex and
the grill, you know, with the with the shoe and everything,
and just getting that kind of fanfare, I was like, Wow, Like,
what a time is it for the w NBA. Really
like that we can see that, because Maya Moore should
have got that, you know what I mean, there are

(31:35):
a lot of players that could have got that. Obviously,
going going further back, Cheryl Swoops, I know hers was
a big deal too, but like it was really dope
to see her get in just that that attention for
for a seniort to shoe where she's like front and
center of the minute you walk in the store.

Speaker 1 (31:49):
I love that.

Speaker 3 (31:51):
But yeah, her shoe looks really good. She's she's got
some good colorways out right now.

Speaker 1 (31:55):
I like those.

Speaker 3 (31:55):
I think even the dames are are looking good. Uh.
I like the I like the Devin Bookers. He had
a great roll out because he didn't rush his second shoe.
He let that thing ride out for most of the year.

Speaker 2 (32:08):
Can I tell you just read my mind about ten
seconds ago, I thought, but we need to discuss. We
need to get your take on the book once. This
has been a point of contention in the friendship of
Brad Winchester and I the.

Speaker 1 (32:19):
Most hated shoe, the shoe over hated shoe.

Speaker 3 (32:23):
Right now, when I've now obviously those first few colorways,
it was like a little boring. That's how they start anyway,
You gotta start boring it to build up the hype.
But I was like, that fits exactly who Devin Booker is.
He drives these old school cars. He's a pretty mellow,
chill dude. So he wanted a mellow chill shoe where
you couldn't even tell the difference from afar if it

(32:44):
was a casual shoe or.

Speaker 1 (32:45):
A basketball shoe. I thought that looked that was right
up his alley.

Speaker 3 (32:49):
And then he eventually came out with more colorways, and
he made it a point. He said an interview was
like I don't want my second one out yet, Like
I really want to get the kids more colorways. I
want them to I want to tell more stories through
the shoes. So I think he had the most underrated
rollout of a signature shoe we've seen in quite some time.
So yeah, I think there's a lot of shoes out there,

(33:09):
but as far as signature, off the top of my head,
those are those are ones that come to mind.

Speaker 4 (33:16):
I'm I'm sitting in the silence right now, Tyler's waiting
for me to say something here, none of them, I don't.
I don't disagree with anything you said. I just said
like when I look at him and I say like, oh,
those are basketball shoes, No they're not. That's that's my
first thought. I see him and I go, no, they're
casuals and and and that's the whole point. And I
get it. That's only that's been My only point of
contention is like it looks real weird with the basketball

(33:36):
uniform on. They look great. They look great otherwise, right,
Like that's that's that's the difference. And that's all I
was saying.

Speaker 2 (33:43):
And some of the color ways are some of the
color waves were bad. Some of the color ways are ambitious.
They're the ones on Arizona cities and towns. Okay, I see,
I see what the vision was here, but not not
my favorite.

Speaker 4 (34:00):
I would love to get a pair and just wear
them at school, and just I've been thinking, legitimately been
thinking about it. If the Asian ones were ever in
my size, I would have picked them up, but they
were out right away, and I went back on on
Nike's site for this because I wanted to check it
out and see what was available. The great news is
is basically anything over a men's six for most of

(34:21):
the color ways, you cannot get them until you get
to like the thirteen fourteen territory because men and women
have been gobbling these things up. It goes from a
men's eight and a half on the kind of the pink,
golden purple ones, a women's ten, men's eight and a half,
and then nothing until you get to a men's sixteen
women's seventeen and a half, like just nothing so small

(34:46):
feet down and like average size feet, they're just all gone.
And I just think that's really really cool to go
on the website and see this kind of first thing
if you go back at time and think about like
what people were making even then, forget, forget how little
women are comparatively making. Now, imagine if Sheeryl Miller would
have had a shoe deal back in the day. Arguably,

(35:08):
like she might be one of the greatest players. She
is one of the greatest players. She might be the
greatest player ever. You take her out of that Aaron
plunker in here. Now, I still think she's super successful,
Like I still think she's balling out, but like she
should have had a signature shoe a long time ago.
I still think they should do it, get her to
sponsor that. I think that would be dope as hell.
I would be so fire, yeah right right, So seeing

(35:29):
this makes me super hopeful because I've been wanting to
get a pair and they're always out, so and I'm
not spending two fifty three hundred, four hundred dollars on
the aftermarket for a pair of shoes what fifteen, I'm
already going like, how mad? How mad? It's the family gonna.

Speaker 3 (35:44):
Be at mecause that's a lot of bread, a lot
of way and you know, oh yeah, does you well
you go ahead, Tyler, because I was gonna flip back
to something we said about Devin Booker, but.

Speaker 2 (35:54):
No, well, well I have she covered Devin Booker and
Asia with this comment.

Speaker 4 (35:57):
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (35:58):
We don't know yet about the the A ones as
a sneaker because, like you said, Brad, they've they've just
been on fire this year, which makes me so happy
with the books. They were very hard to come across
when they were first released, but then as more colorways
were introduced and the kind of conversation continued to twirl
the ground. Are these hot? Are these not? You saw
the prices start to go down. I think right now

(36:20):
is this recording on the Dicks Sporting Goods app that
some of the colorways can be purchased for sixty or
seventy dollars. This is the Sedona, the flag Staff and
some of the other ones. But it's kind of that
game as a sneaker consumer. Okay, it's it's popping right
now during the first few months of the launch. But
if I wait long enough, not only will there be
additional colorways that maybe I like more, but maybe some

(36:41):
of the previous releases will go down in price, rather than,
like you said, Brad, rushing to you know, the aftermarket
or stock x or what have you, and dropping pythons
on eBay, Yeah, dropping grocery money on, you know, on
on a pair of kicks. But as you were going
to say, and then we'll move on to Kevin Clark
and jewlry.

Speaker 3 (37:01):
Yeah, another thing, did you did you guys see that
the Booker two's leaked? No, at least the mock up picture.
It's like the like on paper you saw it, Brad.
If you said what you said about the book ones,
You're gonna look at these and probably be like, Okay,
are we going to like Sunday dinner or church or
something like like Todd, let me know, cause it's like
it looks like a brownish with a light blue swoosh. Yeah,

(37:25):
like it's given meet the parents Sunday dinner. I want
to be comfortable when I meet her father.

Speaker 2 (37:32):
You know that.

Speaker 3 (37:33):
It's like one of those things you know, almost to
be nervous, you.

Speaker 1 (37:37):
Know, is it?

Speaker 4 (37:37):
Are they tan with like a turquoise trim?

Speaker 1 (37:39):
I think that's what it is.

Speaker 4 (37:40):
Yeah, I'm looking at it. I'm looking at him right now,
and they have like almost like an epoxy garage floor
coating outsoul. It's yeah, it's yeah, I don't know how
it's described us.

Speaker 3 (37:51):
That's really Yeah, it looks like he took after the
book ones a lot. I think we're seeing that a
lot in the sneaker game too.

Speaker 4 (37:57):
Oh I see them now, Yeah, that's it's I was
definitely looking at it now. I almost thought they were adet.
It's because there's the stripes on the side under the
turquoise soush. Yeah, are you gonna case with the Nike
you know?

Speaker 3 (38:08):
Like you know, I was like, I don't know, man,
some British Knights.

Speaker 2 (38:16):
Well, that would be something to keep an eye on. Yeah,
like you said, Dez, the rollout of book one was interesting.
I would say well done by most accounts, But just
this point in Devin Booker's career has also been you know,
it's interesting that he was supposed to really be on
this ascension after the twenty one finals. You know, he
gets his own signature sneaker. He really is a household

(38:36):
name in basketball now, but the Suns and his trajectory
haven't quite played out I think the way a lot
of us, particularly in Arizona, anticipated, So we'll see what
becomes of the book too in that release. But love
to have you back on des around that time to
get your thoughts, but something we definitely want your thoughts
on as we transition here. Okay, so new stars in

(38:58):
the w This is year two of Caitlyn Clark and
Angel Reese. This also happens to be the first year
of Dallas Wings star Paige Beckers. Guys, we want to
start here. What are your thoughts on these three players
and more specifically, we have these storylines of the Indiana
Fever winning the Commissioner's Cup without Caitlin Clark. Shout out

(39:19):
to Brad for mentioning the Arizona Wildcat Aery McDonald. So, Okay,
Indiana about a five hundred team right now, but maybe
they gain some momentum with Kitlyn Clark back, and maybe
they make a run for the postseason. In terms of Dallas, again,
we have Paige Beckers, but that team is not very good.
I'm curious who's going to be the first to leave
the Wings. Chris co Klanis first year head coach Dje Carrington,

(39:43):
maybe Rique a Goombawale not really the best fit with
Page in the backcourt gains. We also want to know
your thoughts on Angel Reese's popularity in your home state
of Illinois. So wherever you'd like to take this. We
got three star players to discuss, and we would love
to hear where you're at with each of them.

Speaker 3 (40:01):
Okay, yeah, so all right in my brain, let's go.
Let's go Angel, Paige Caitlin.

Speaker 4 (40:06):
Okay.

Speaker 3 (40:07):
So as far as Angel, Yeah, what I loved about
us drafting her is that, like the excitement was there
from the jump, like, and the thing about Chicago sports,
especially in the recent years, I can't I can't speak
on hockey too much or baseball, but as far as
like basketball, we haven't gotten a lot of the bigger names,

(40:28):
Like even Mats Buzzellis on the Bulls. That was somebody
who was projected to be a higher pick but slid
a little bit. So even then, I feel like a
lot of people were iffy on him. But to get
somebody like Angel Reis, who already had that off court
kind of fanfare was really great, and I think a
lot of people hopped on the bandwagon pretty quickly, you know,
And I think it helps when the player wants to

(40:51):
come to that city. I think Angel was very vocal
that she wanted to come to the Chicago Sky after
she was drafted.

Speaker 1 (40:56):
So it worked out.

Speaker 3 (40:57):
I think for her to come from that, you know,
coming from Baltimore, Baltimore is like New York's cousin to
a certain degree. So it's a lot of blue collar mentality.
And I think being in the Midwest, I always say,
we kinda we just fall in the middle. A lot
of times. We're not as flashy as a California, We're
not as loud as in New York, but we do

(41:17):
have a lot of the similar, similar grit. So I
think that's why I was a matchmate in Heaven.

Speaker 1 (41:22):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (41:22):
So I think for Angel, she knew she wanted to
come to a city like Chicago, where I always say,
when every rebound, every loose ball, it's like the fans
take they do it with you, you know. So I
love that for her. I love the situation as well.
I think she's grown tremendously this year. I think they
finally realized that you're not Zach Randolph per se, you

(41:46):
are Kandace Parker like, we gotta let you bring the
ball up, we gotta let you operate a little bit
more off the dribble. She's been great in the dribble,
handoff actions with Ariel Atkins, so that way you have
somebody like Ariel who can shoot the mid range, or
you can have somebody like Angel who can keep the
ball and drive. It's a lot going on. I think
they've done really well with high low actions. So obviously

(42:06):
you'll have Angel rees in the high post or maybe
behind the three point line. They'll run a play for
Camilla to be down in the low post. They'll get
her the rock sometimes vice versa. I think for them
to be the centers that they are, they are some
really good passers, so a lot of that works. Again
similar to what we saw with Mark Gasol and Zach
Randolph back in the day. You have one of the

(42:27):
big men is a really good passer and the other
one is a good post presence. And the good thing
about the Chicago Sky is that both of those players
can do both of those things. It's not like an
either or a situation. So I love what they're doing
this year, even though the season hasn't went as well
as we hope. But I'm so proud of the way
she's bounced back from that rough start. You could tell
that her joy wasn't there, her spark wasn't there. She

(42:49):
got it the minute they started incorporating her in the
offense in a different way, in a way that's more
suitable for her play style. So I love what I'm
seeing from angel Rees. I think she's really stepping into that,
like okay, like I figured it out.

Speaker 4 (43:03):
I think being much more aggressive she had. It was
at the end of the game the other night. It
was just like she just took that ball and just
took over, got followed and won. And I was like,
that was I texted Tyler immediately again, dude, that was crazy.
That was It was one of the most And that
was I had just listened to a podcast and it
was a lot of talk about Angel beeves hate and

(43:24):
you know, like is it deserved? Is it not? Is
she falling off as she And then I turned that
on and it was like this is yeah, I think
she just I think she just answered everybody's question about that.
But but go ahead, back to back to you. I
just had to say it. Oh no, it's all good, amazing,
it's all good.

Speaker 2 (43:37):
No.

Speaker 1 (43:37):
I I was done.

Speaker 3 (43:38):
Man.

Speaker 1 (43:38):
I just think I love what I'm seeing from her.

Speaker 3 (43:40):
I love the growth, like and I'll even add like
like I know I told you this time, Like I
I had a post last year for Angel and that
was me looking ahead, like I'm seeing the glimpses of this,
like she reminds me a lot of Candace Parker.

Speaker 1 (43:54):
They killed me for it.

Speaker 3 (43:55):
It was it was it was peak Caitlin Clark Angel
Revees conversations on and it got some noise on Twitter,
and I knew I should have known off rip that
that was a red flag because that never happens, but
it was. But now I look back on that and
I'm like, you know that kind of is agent kind
of well now because you know, they finally realized what's

(44:15):
what suits her best.

Speaker 1 (44:16):
So yeah, I love what I'm saying.

Speaker 4 (44:18):
I found some stats before we got on. I just
wanted to cap this on my angel Resa and Tyler.
I want to hear your thoughts here too. Most rebounds
this season ready, Angel Reese two fifty five. Most without
me bounds Angel Reese two twenty eight through three quarters,
Angel Reese one hundred and eighty two. This is from
at Polymarket Hoops. I saw Sarah Spain retweet it and

(44:41):
I was like, this is yeah, this is this is it.
So people that are hating on her for not like
getting involved in the game enough are are paying attention
to the right things, because yes, they're not looking at
the offense the same way. But like, you can't dispute
she has the most rebounds in the WNBA right now
in multiple categories. I didn't even go through the whole
So it's yeah, it's wild to me that that people

(45:03):
were hating on her so much when it's like, first
of all, it's your first year. Not everybody's gonna come
out of the gates super hot, and it's a totally
different position than what you're looking at from Caitlin Clarker
or anybody else really, so they're playing. It's not you
can't just be like, oh, yeah, Isaiah Thomas, I'm gonna
I'm going to compare eras here, Isaiah Thomas and Robert Parrish.

(45:24):
Like you can't just point at two different people play
two different positions and be like, oh, they're not They're
not the same. This is wild. It's like, yeah, they're
not the same, different roles. Like it's you can't compare
a few different things like that. It's crazy. It is different.

Speaker 2 (45:37):
Well, at first, I love that reebok Is is positioning
Angel to be a centerpiece of their you know, basketball
division Resurgence. I saw a Shack has that new show.
Basically it's propaganda for Rebok about how he's bringing it back.
I was really disappointed. I tuned it in the first like,
oh man, this is right up my alley, and then
it just it was good until it wasn't.

Speaker 1 (45:56):
I knew, I knew, I knew.

Speaker 3 (45:57):
When they got Allen Iverson on camera again, I'm I'm like,
it's not what I think it is.

Speaker 2 (46:02):
It's yeah, it's just rebuck propaganda, which not mad at.
I just did not tune in for episodes too through However,
long that that that series is so shout out to
Angel getting her first signature sneaker, which I believe is
in the works as of this recording. Yeah, I'm intrigued
by the Chicago sky I I am. I would say,
probably less confident than des that long term it's going

(46:25):
to be Camilla Cardoso and Angel Reese you know, uh
playing for this franchise. I could definitely see cardos So
being moved at some point within the next few years
because Angel of Reese is the face of the franchise.
I would love to see the guy, you know, Tyler
marsh Head coach and company Lean into Angel playing more
that point forward type role, because she'll have some passes

(46:48):
during some games where I'm like, oh man, that's right,
Angel Rees can get busy with with that that that
uh you know, setting up her teammates. She'll do the
goggles celebration. I'll be like, you know what, I think
we need. I think we need more of that instead
of just putting her, you know, on the low block
every single time. So I'm optimistic. I certainly don't think
they're gonna make any noise during the second half of

(47:10):
the postseason. Sorry, Dees, I'm sorry. Just the second half
of this regular season, I thought they'd be more of
a playoff contender, But I don't necessarily see that moving forward.
But a team that is a playoff contender, the Indiana Fever, Dees,
how is year two of Caitlyn Clark Again, She's been
battling injuries, but she's back. Now where you at with

(47:30):
year two of Clark and moreover, do you see in
the Indiana Fever being the Commissioner Cup winning Indiana Fever
being a legit postseason threat?

Speaker 4 (47:41):
Uh?

Speaker 1 (47:41):
Yeah, I do.

Speaker 3 (47:42):
I think, and I said this before, I think that
the Indiana Fever are a lot of people kind of
wrote them off early, and I didn't really know why,
like and these are like respectable names, and you know,
it's not like I felt no type of way about it,
but I'm like, I just I had this feeling where
I was like, I just think the Indiana Fever, if
they get the opportunity, they.

Speaker 1 (48:03):
Can do something special.

Speaker 3 (48:04):
Because I just feel like, because of Caitlin Clark's rookie year,
we all saw that, Okay, on even on surface level, Okay,
she can have the same impact she had in college, Like,
you want to build your team around a talent like her.

Speaker 1 (48:17):
So they got those pieces.

Speaker 3 (48:18):
They brought in Sophie Cunningham, they brought in you know,
Lexi Hall has developed, Leah Boston has developed her chemistry
with Kaitlyn Clark. The pieces are making sense, and even
watching their game today versus the Dallas Wings, like, I
think they can do a very similar thing to their
NBA counterpart in Indiana Pacers, Like, yeah, don't be fooled
by our regular season record. Kaitlin Clark was in and

(48:41):
out the lineup. We had some chemistry things that we
had to balance out early in the season, which always
comes with new acquisitions. Just wait until we get to win.

Speaker 1 (48:48):
This thing really matters.

Speaker 3 (48:50):
I wouldn't be surprised at all if the Indiana Fever
were able to pull off something like that. And as
for Kaitlin Clark individually, I mean, again, I think she is.
She is a tremendous talent and and I know there's
been a lot of talk of how she's guarded and
that was something that I did want to get into
a little bit. But I think she she she is.

(49:13):
She absolutely has the talent to be, when it's all
said and done, one of the top w NBA players ever. Like,
she has that kind of talent, and I think a
lot of times, especially on social media, we get too
wrapped up in some of the other conversations that we
kind of forget what we're watching. And you know, you know,
y'all know me, Like I just refuse to miss the
moment because of some pettiness, like you know, like I

(49:35):
I want to enjoy her career and the growth that
we're seeing. So yeah, that's just my my brief thoughts
on that.

Speaker 2 (49:43):
Well.

Speaker 4 (49:43):
Well, also releases for the Fever too, right, we were
talking about the Mercury earlier in the show, and because
of releases from the Fever. We got DV in Phoenix,
So there's there's a lot of things that happened and
that I remember the when people were like, oh my gosh, day,
I can't believe they made this move. But it's like, well, yeah,
but now look look what they've done with it there,

(50:04):
So so uh there, there's probably a lot of questions
still about how they can do in the in the postseason,
and and uh, Kitlin Clark's been fascinating. I don't want
to talk about it. I want to hear what you
guys think though, and Tyler, I want to know your
thoughts about the Fever, but I really want to hear
what your thoughts are about how Kitlin Clark has guarded.
I can't wait to hear you guys talk about this.

(50:24):
I'm really excited about this. It's one of my favorite things.
One of my favorite moments from this year was the
previously you mentioned, Mike Steph when we did a recording together,
I asked, I asked if that foul was was a
deserving of a flagrant fowl?

Speaker 2 (50:39):
The Kaitlin Clark on Angel Clark on Angel.

Speaker 4 (50:42):
Rees fowl and simultaneously, Tyler yes, Mike no at the
same time, and it was just like I sat back
and it was just like I just wanted to throw
the grenade in the room and see what happens. It
was amazing. So I can't wait to hear what you
guys have to say about this. Wow.

Speaker 2 (50:59):
Yeah, I'm totally I'm totally pro Kaitlyn Clark, the electricity
that she brings. As you pointed out, the skill set.
I've always been attracted to players who have that passing gene.
To me, what can separate the good players from the
great because all these players are, But what separates you
from being good to great in my personal fandom is

(51:19):
do you make the people around you better. Kaitlin Clark
did that at Iowa, She's done that with Indiana and
will continue to do so. So I love watching her.
I love the style of play. Obviously, it's exciting. It's
been a total boon for the w It's also brought
on a lot of toxicity, uh, you know at certain
arenas uh as you pointed out on the timeline. So

(51:39):
to me, that's all kind of chang chant tangential to her.
I don't view thats necessarily being something that she eggs
on necessarily in any real way. She's just a hooper, right,
She's a stone cold killer and wants to rip your
heart out and impose and keep the you know, the
wrist up while doing it. So I'm totally here for that.
I actually exactly exactly this. I actually picked the Indiana

(52:03):
Fever before the season to win it all this year.
I'm still gonna stand on that. Obviously, they have a
lot of ground to make them to make up, right,
and we got okay. So so I thought Dewanna Bonnard
would play a pivotal role in making that prediction happen.
As you pointed out, Brad, we benefited because now as
a fan base here in Phoenix, we have dB returning
to the organization, but Aery McDonald finding a home in

(52:25):
Indiana and fitting like a glove. Obviously, you brought it
to Steph, right, It's crazy for real, you brought in
Steph White as your head coach, knowing that she she
has that pedigree of you know, being able to get
a team, you know, to the to the mountaintop. So
I'm still very optimistic on the Fever. Of course, this
is assuming health for their key players, namely Caitlin Clark,

(52:48):
bringing in Sophie Cunningham from Phoenix was a great choice
her her being the enforcer. Talk about leaning into a
villain arc, Sophie being the enforcer on the team, and
you know, way yo, if you if I haven't you
commit that flagrant on CC on twenty two, I'm gonna
be coming for you on the next place. She had
that dust up with Jason Sheldon earlier in the year.

(53:10):
I think Indiana really needed that. And I'm still gonna
stand on on them winning the title this year. I
know it's a bold prediction, but I'm optimistic, particularly with
the Commissioner's Cup. I don't know that we've seen a
big track record of Commissioner's Cup Victor's going on actually
win it all. But I think that was a really
promising sign that they were able to do that without
Kitlyn Clark and they beat Minnesota, who will talk about

(53:32):
momentarily to make.

Speaker 1 (53:33):
That as a statement game right there.

Speaker 2 (53:35):
Statement game desk. So I love Kitlin Clark's game. I
totally co sign what you guys said. And Indiana will
definitely be a team to watch. And again, they're about
five hundred, just under five hundred right now, so they
got some work to do. But I think they're gonna
be in the conversation.

Speaker 4 (53:50):
Do you guys, do you guys feel like that this
that that kind of fire and that kind of I
don't want to call it hate because I don't think
it's hate, but like that, no, I hate that team.
I hate the Rivals. I'm gonna dig into that and
commit to that is something that has helped the w
NBA draw draw eyeballs because that's been one of the
complaints from from old heads that that watch the NBA.

(54:13):
Like I'm thinking about it, I like keep referencing early
nineties basketball players. Is that rivalry, that spirit that's kind
of baked into it that we don't like that team
because it's that team that exists a little bit in
the NFL still where lady, you know, Green Bay Chicago
get together. You know there's there's still gonna be that thing.
But I think it's mostly the fans. But when you
see it on the court, because it's only it's it's

(54:34):
five on five. It's not like that eleven lineup, that
eleven line up and then we have we switch in
a different to eleven squad come out. No, it's it's
this five on five thing with people rotating on the bench,
and when you see a player just jump in there
as an enforcer, like you said, Tyler, you suddenly like, well,
that's kind of like getting hit with the pitch and
then the pitcher retaliating. But it's yes, yeah, but it's

(54:55):
been basketball. It's just different because it's so you're not
throwing a ball at somebody. You're throwing at you at
somebody like you are getting in there, and it's just
like the crowd gets invested and suddenly it's like, yeah, nah,
now we're in this because this is personal, you know
what I mean anymore?

Speaker 2 (55:12):
And the Sophie corner of this all and I know
dear friends of mine who are diehard Phoenix Mercury fans
who have a bit of a contentious relationship with the
Sophie Cunningham experience in Phoenix, But to me, this was
best case scenario for Sophie Cunningham is her being her
being this enforcer on Kitlyn Clark's team. I think Sophie

(55:33):
Cunningham could be in Indiana for for years to come
and fit that role that was really needed for Indiana,
and not only with the head coaching change. I kind
of think Christy Sad's got a raw deal. But along
with the head coaching, some would say maybe upgrade, you know,
really positioning the roster around Kitlyn Clark and figuring out
what she needs and what can help propel her to

(55:53):
title contention because she's ready. I mean we saw last
year like she just arrived and said no, like I
don't just want to put up points. I'm coming. I'm
coming for the throne, which again I love that that's
part of her personality.

Speaker 3 (56:06):
Yeah, and you know, Brad, I'm thinking about what you
said too. You are absolutely right because even even when
I watch games, like after you watch most of the
NBA season and then you transition to the WNBA, you
watch some of the games and you're like, wait a minute,
this is scratching an itch that I had as a kid,
Like these girls are cussing each other out. Yeah, they're
fighting for loose balls. Like, wait a minute. This is

(56:28):
different than the NBA. As much as I would love
to see it in the NBA, it's in the WNBA
and it's.

Speaker 1 (56:34):
All year round.

Speaker 3 (56:35):
It is regular season and playoffs, and I think that's
what it is, Brad. Yeah, I think that's what it is.
I think that's what it is. But you know, when
I think about Caitlyn Clark, and with that in mind too,
I think this is a solid segue when we think
about the playoffs because my thing with Kaitlyn Clark, if
I had to pick something out, and again, I want
to preface this by saying, like I understand the whole

(56:59):
thing over the years right where it Unfortunately it's been
projected on women athletes that they can't be passionate, they
can't show emotion. Right, So when when I say what
I'm gonna say, I don't mean it in that lens.
I mean it from more so a leadership standpoint. So
like when I watch Caitlyn Clark, I immediately think of
something that my mom always told me and my siblings,

(57:21):
never let them see you sweat. And sometimes I think
Caitlyn lets these opponents and whoever see her sweat. Sometimes
she she for when I when I watched her rookie year,
I was like, she's and even in college she is
a lot more Luka Doncic James Harden than she is
Stephen Curry, because of her gravity, because of her playmaking ability,

(57:45):
because of her being the primary ball handler. I think
she shares a lot of those same attributes. And the
thing is with with a lot of those players is
that they give a They gave their defenders a reason
to not be physical. So when you watch James Harden,
it's the size up, it's the tween cross, tween cross.
He's putting you to sleep. So the minute you react,

(58:07):
he's gonna dictate his move. If you step just a
smidgen back, he's gonna go into his step back jumper.
If you come to four, come too close, he's gonna
blow by or even take you with your arm and
draw that file. He's gonna take you with him. He
gives you a reason to not play physical. Same thing
with Luka Dancic. He's a bigger body, of course, but

(58:27):
very similar attributes. He lulls you to sleep with his
dribble moves, tween step back tween. He's just waiting for
either the step back jumper or the layup inside. And Caitlyn,
while she does have a good handle, I feel like
she doesn't give a reason to say like back up,
off me, So it shows up in her emotions. She
has to talk to the referees. She you know, her
teammates have to step in things of that nature. And

(58:49):
my thing with Caitlyn, especially as we approach the playoffs,
I fear that the Indiana Fever are not gonna learn
to truly win in this league until she understand like, okay, nah,
let me lock in up here. They're yes, they're gonna
hit me. We notice they're gonna hit me. It's gonna
be unfortunate things of that nature. But I gotta stay
locked in up here because if I'm a defender and

(59:10):
I'm garden Caitlyn Clark, I know she can pull up
from the Gainsbridge field House logo, So I have to
guard her ninety four feet. I can't give her any space,
right and then even and as a defender, you have
to think of the moral victories, right, Like when you're
guarding somebody as great as Kaitlyn Clark, it's not even
just let me get a steal, let me get a

(59:31):
get a block, not even a shot contest and make
her miss. It's literally every step, Okay, I got over
that screen. Oh this time, she didn't touch the basketball
for the whole position, Like these are the ones, these
are the things you have to track as a defender.
So I think That's why you see a lot of
that physicality. And I think even the the Valkyri's coach
coach not She said, like, we were able to win
because we did the things that Caitlyn Clark doesn't like.

Speaker 1 (59:53):
We forced her left and we were physical with her.

Speaker 3 (59:55):
And the more she shows that she doesn't like it,
you're gonna eat that up as a you're gonna eat
that up, like, oh, she don't she don't like like
like Shack always says, she don't like that funk. All right,
I'm on that every trip down. I'm on that every
trip down. So so I think that's my thing with
Kaitlyn Clark, like on some Big Brother type stuff. I
want to see her like growing that way, like Okay,

(01:00:15):
we're used to you and how you're reacting, that's cool,
show emotion, that's awesome. But now we're gonna make them
pay on the court. We're gonna make them pay with
the with the rock. So that that's what I want
to see her do.

Speaker 2 (01:00:27):
Mhm. In terms of the Dallas Wings, I just want
to have this on record page. Beckers is a total star.
She's been awesome so far this season, even though the
team record doesn't reflect a lot of success. I want
this on record that I think those three people I
mentioned in Dallas will find new homes next season. I
think this offseason a Rique Djona are playing somewhere else

(01:00:51):
heading in the next season. And I think Chris coklanis
I think this it was good until it wasn't, but
it was never really good.

Speaker 3 (01:00:59):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (01:00:59):
I think they're going to tell him to kick rocks
and he's going to be gone. As I shared with
you that I'm not very high on.

Speaker 4 (01:01:06):
That's an understatement.

Speaker 2 (01:01:07):
Yeah, yeah, I just don't. I just think he will
be happier and more successful elsewhere. I'm not saying he
wasn't ready to be an HC, but I think Dallas's
roster and infrastructure is going to look different next year.
But the uncertainty is they're building the entire franchise around Pagebackers,
which makes all the sense because she's already proven she's legit. Okay,

(01:01:28):
my next question for you guys, this is going to
be my most straightforward so far. We're thinking about the
second half of the WNBA regular season. We're thinking about
the postseason and eventually crowning a WNBA champion. My question
for you and Brad, I would love for you to
get us kicked off here. This year's champion, the Minnesota Lynx,
the New York Liberty, or the field for are you taking?

Speaker 4 (01:01:52):
Oh Man, I don't think it's going to be the Liberty.
I think it's it's I kind of want to say
the field. I want to see somebody else step up.
I'm I'm hopeful for for Phoenix. And there's just a
lot of teams that just seemed to be on the rise.
There's in the W right now, it just feels like

(01:02:12):
there's a like the lows are low. They're low, and
the highs are high, but there's a lot of parody
otherwise where it just feels like any team could sort
of like and and and we're off on a stretch
where we're unstoppable against anybody as long as people stay healthy.
Right like you mentioned, you mentioned Paige like she wasn't
healthy to start and you did a while to get

(01:02:34):
to get going. But that team, I don't think that
team had a shot to begin with. Again, I think
it's a cultural issue. But if I had to pick
either either Minnesota or New York, I'm gonna go Minnesota
out of those two. But I still think that the
field has a chance here, and I would love to
see the field will I I don't, I don't know,
I kind of I kind of feel like maybe not,
but just playoff experience and everything else. But I would

(01:02:57):
love to see the field here. And I don't know
of that who I would pick right now. It just
feels the second half there's a lot there's a lot
of ball left to be played here, So I don't
I don't know who's gonna come out on top.

Speaker 1 (01:03:08):
Yeah like that answer though.

Speaker 4 (01:03:10):
I like that.

Speaker 1 (01:03:11):
Yeah, I like that answer.

Speaker 3 (01:03:13):
I like even though I was leaning more towards the liberty,
I actually I think they can and and I think
what it really is is just my bias towards Natasha Cloud.
I think when you get a player like her, when
you get a player like her, it's just winning, you know,
like to know that they don't have a Beniga Lany
for the season, but you get Natasha Cloud who can

(01:03:35):
give the same energy, if not more, the same defensive intensity,
if not more. Like I love that in a playoff environment.
But I do feel what you're saying, like it in
some ways you don't necessarily want to say the phrase,
but it's like it is a little bit wide open
because you just never know. It's a lot of sleeper
teams uh in the field. So yeah, I think I

(01:03:55):
would pick the Liberty.

Speaker 2 (01:03:57):
Uh.

Speaker 4 (01:03:57):
But I'm with that too well.

Speaker 2 (01:04:00):
In guys, the past few years, it's felt like a
foregone conclusion that the winner was either going to be
the New York Liberty or the Las Vegas Pieces. So
this is such a different time to be a w
fan for for lots of reasons, but I think particularly now, Brad,
as you pointed out, because it does feel like Okay, obviously,
the Minnesota Links, you know, top record in the league,
their heavy favorites, New York Liberty defending champs. As you

(01:04:21):
mentioned the incredible acquisition of Tosh Cloud. I know she's
one of, if not your favorite player in the entire
league with good reason. But then, Brad, as you pointed out,
we got teams heavy hitters like the Seattle Storm, the
Atlanta Dream, Brittany Grinder's new Home. They're they're nothing to
mess around with. The Mercury, the Valkyries are going.

Speaker 4 (01:04:42):
To be a team.

Speaker 2 (01:04:42):
I don't think anyone wants to play.

Speaker 3 (01:04:44):
So guys think, do you guys think the Storm. Do
you guys think the Storm and the would the Dream
are Are they in the same boat. I feel like
they are because they have tier Okay, yeah they have
they have good stretches, but then they'll lose to a
team like like yeah, yeah, yeah, you know what I mean,
Like I.

Speaker 2 (01:05:03):
Seattle got Seattle got blown out by I forget the
team the other day.

Speaker 4 (01:05:06):
But it was it.

Speaker 1 (01:05:06):
Was it was Connecticut, it.

Speaker 2 (01:05:08):
May have been I mean it was a double DIGI
it forcefull.

Speaker 4 (01:05:12):
I'm checking it out right now.

Speaker 1 (01:05:14):
And the Dream was it was drawing.

Speaker 3 (01:05:16):
The Dream just lost to the Fever, Like you know,
you could argue that they should have won that game,
like you know, I yeah, I think. I think both
of those teams are just on the Like when I
watch the Storm, you can pretty much tell whether whether
or not they're going to win if they play defense,
like they again another team, another team that's so good offensively,
but when their defense isn't a line, they usually lose it.

Speaker 2 (01:05:39):
Right, I trust in their veterans. Though. If your team
is centered around sky Dig, I know one of your
favorites as well, the uh check out for great content.
You got sky Dig, you got Nekak, you got Gabby Williams,
who I want to bring up here in a moment.
You know, I have a lot of trust in that team,
just having that veteran, that veteran know how come postseason.

(01:06:00):
So I'm more inclined to have Seattle kind of creeping
up into that tier. But I actually have Minnesota and
New York being on a tier all to themselves, and
I would say under that we have Phoenix, we have Seattle.
I suppose that Lanta is ready to creep in. I
need to see a little bit more, obviously first year
head coach carls Mesco, but I'm not ready to put

(01:06:20):
them in the same tier as New York and Minnesota.
To me, those two teams are kind of in a
league of their own, and I have Minnesota if we
were to If I'm to answer this question, Brad, you're
leaning the field as you're leaning New York. I'm actually
leaning Minnesota on this again, I'm stick with my original
prediction of Indiana. But of this group, I just think

(01:06:42):
compost season time, Minnesota is going to be so motivated,
assuming they're healthy and they know that they had the
finals stolen from them last year. Yeah, I love the
w the fact I think it's actually pretty despisable. I
think it's pretty despicable when folks aim the refs, whether
it's high school, college or the pros, like that's such

(01:07:03):
an easy out blame the Zebras. I'm not really here
for that, but for this conversation, I am because it
was clear that Minnesota got fleeced last year by the reps,
and I just don't think we talked about it enough.
But Alas, I think they're going to have that extra
motivation of, yo, we feel like we got this stolen
from us last year. Sure are even company even alluded
to that in the postgame presser. I think they're just

(01:07:26):
going to be out for alpha blood come come to
the playoffs and if not Indiana. Based on this question,
I'm kind of convincing myself that Minnesota is going to
get it done come this postseason with you know your
pista CALLI you're being on a tear and the like.

Speaker 4 (01:07:40):
I'm looking at some of these scores here and it's
it's On June twenty ninth, the Valkyries beat the Storm
eighty four to fifty seven, but then they they lost
to the Sun on July ninth, ninety three to eighty
three and then beat them on the eleventh seventy nine
to sixty five. So total total one to eighty right there.
But they beat the Liberty on July sixth by nine

(01:08:02):
seventy nine to seventy. So it's it's one of those
teams where this is why I'm saying it could be
the field, because on any given day, if you don't
want to stretch, and the Liberty don't feel as good
as they did a year ago, two years ago. So
that's why I don't want to pick them over Minnesota
or somebody else from the field. That's why I'm kind
of leaning I wanted to be Fieled. I'm leaning Minnesota,

(01:08:23):
but I want it to be Fieled. But I also
have a lot of people that in my life that
that are are Minnesota fans in general of sports, that
have had some some Timberwolves sadness and then last year
what happened. So I kind of wanted for them, but
also I kind of want it for Tyler. I kind
of need Tyler to get another Phoenix championship in his

(01:08:45):
life here because because it's been in you know, no
plut intended living in the desert, it's been a drought.

Speaker 2 (01:08:51):
It's been a sure I sure hope so, Brad. That
would be incredible and interesting to know here. Wedn't even
bring up the Las Vegas Aces in this conversation, which
again is just I think, very fitting of where we're
at with that team. And as Ajia Wilson hits free
agency in a couple of years, I believe that'll be
a situation. I believe to keep an eye on, Okay,

(01:09:12):
our final two. I guess we'll call it categories at
this point, gentlemen, we have to each select one player
who we want to give their flowers to this season.
I would love to kick it off. This was really
tough for me. I want to give an honorable mention
to Seattle Storm star Gabby Williams. She is a first
time All Star. She tore it up overseas and then

(01:09:36):
during the Olympics really reminded folks. Yo. I was a
top five pick drafted to Chicago back in the day.
It was it twenty twenty one, not too long ago.
Things didn't work out in Chicago, nor La. But now
she's back and just really so happy for her success.
That being said, I would like to give my flowers
to big al Alisha Gray of the Atlanta Dream to me,

(01:09:58):
her star has a sent over the last year. Not
only was she the biggest winner of All Star Weekend
twenty twenty four three point contest All Star game itself,
but now she's just not a cool story or a
really great role player in Atlanta. Yep, she's the face
of the franchise. I would even argue ahead of Ryan
Howard to me the same way, and that was that

(01:10:20):
was not a thing a year ago, but now it is.
The team needs to be structured around her. So big
al is getting my flowers. Yah's what you got?

Speaker 1 (01:10:28):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:10:28):
So I actually had Alicia Gray as a as an
honorable mention online. You you just said it. Everything you
just said is pretty much what I had. I also
had another one, and I also went with a Storm player,
but I went to a Neko Gumaka. I feel like
she is another one. As her longevity, I feel like
still just isn't appreciated. I think, going back to what
we talked about earlier about the overall marketability of the

(01:10:51):
individual players, for her to be, you know, still an
All Star caliber player, sometimes even MVP caliber player, you know,
this into her career, I think just doesn't get talked
about enough because she's not the loudest superstar or anything
like that. She doesn't have the flashiest game, but she
still does a lot of the things that we've seen
the majority of her career. So I wanted to shout
her out with The big one that I picked was

(01:11:14):
Kayler Thornton off the Valkyries, for her to be a
role player her entire career. I mean, at thirty two
years old, like she no individual accolades. She's got the
championship with the Liberty, and I think a Commissioner's Cup
with them as well, if I'm not mistaken. But that's
it if you look at her her resume and for

(01:11:35):
her to be thirty two and now has this opportunity
with the Valkyries to where all of a sudden she's
got this greater role, you know, fifteen points, seven rebounds,
I think like one and a half steals, Like she's
really showing a player that we hadn't seen before. And
I think it's a bigger example of why I'm so
big on growth, especially in today's era of basketball, because

(01:11:57):
we're seeing a lot of longevity now and I just
really try to get people to understand, you know, I
get it. A lot of times we watch these players
and it can be easy to just be like, Okay,
that's who they're always gonna be. But I just think
there's a lot more room for growth and you never
know how the situation can change nowadays with all the
player movement and like I said, just new opportunities individually.

(01:12:18):
So I love what she's doing with the Valkyries and
first time All Star another one. So yeah, I had
to give a shout out to Kayla Thornton.

Speaker 4 (01:12:26):
Awesome. Awesome. So I didn't want to go to super
generic here and just be like I'm picking I'm picking
Angel Reese, I'm picking Caitlyn Clark, I am picking somebody
along those lines, though, because the comparisons kept happening in
their first matchup, I'm gonna go Paige Becker's page. Becker
is coming off of coming off injury and into the
w and really being an exciting player, and the comparisons

(01:12:48):
between her and Caitlyn Clark kind of unfairly. I know
they played against each other, and every time they play
against each other it's a lot of fun, but a
lot of people talking about her, and you know who's
better in this play and who has the wins against her.
They're not on the same kind of team. They're Page
is not playing on the fever, and I think she

(01:13:09):
had twenty one points against Caitlyn. Caitlyn I think is
probably probably a right now a better defender, and Page
is maybe maybe better on offense. I don't know what's
gonna happen long term here, but it's super exciting to
see her. I want to give her flowers because she's
on a terrible team, just a really bad team, and

(01:13:30):
she can continues to show up, to work hard, to grind,
to try to win, and you know a lot of
people being faced with that, especially early on. I think
about NFL quarterbacks who get drafted and then don't get
that year or two to sit behind a veteran to
learn it. It's just like, no, you just get in
there and go. She has not nearly the same level

(01:13:51):
of pressure that Caitlyn Clark had on her, but she
has a huge amount of pressure on that team, being
the star that's supposed to sort of save the team,
and then putting her on the team and then not
having this success to continue to show up and to
continue to grind I just am really impressed with her
composure in press conferences, on the court. It's it's been

(01:14:11):
awesome to watch, super excited for what next year looks like.
I don't want to write them off already because it's like,
you know, anything can happen. It's not a super duper
long season so as we head into the All Star break,
but it's it's man, she's so super fun to watch.
I just very high hopes for her. I don't think
anybody could dispute that she's a star, but she's going

(01:14:31):
to continue to grow. To your point, as I think
her growth is going to be astronomical. She could end
up being one of the greats all time by the
time her career is over. So I'm excited to see
her continue to grow. So not enough people were talking
about her, but I don't feel like enough because the
team isn't winning, so I wanted to give her flowers.

Speaker 3 (01:14:50):
No, that's well said Brad, because I feel the same
way like and I think there was the graphic ESPN
put out. It was like a couple of weeks ago
during one of her games, but her first few games
it was like fourteen points, six assists.

Speaker 1 (01:15:02):
Then it eventually evolved.

Speaker 3 (01:15:03):
To like twenty four and four, And I think that
is a testament of coming up in Yukon, Like she
plays the game the right way. She got the respect
of her peers, like at the snap of a finger.
So it's like, I think you see a lot of that,
Like most rookies come in and they try to do
everything really fast, but she was really patient, and I
think it showed in her assist numbers, like all right,

(01:15:24):
I'm chilling, I'm gonna, I'm gonna. I want to fit
in with the team. But after a while it's like, Okay,
I think I can be a little more aggressive. I
think I can show more of my game. And it's
been really cool to see that progression in just her
rookie season.

Speaker 2 (01:15:36):
Yeah, well said, no doubt. All right, guys, we have
the final category here. Very excited to hear what you think,
biggest question and boldest prediction. So dev we're gonna start
with you. We'll start how about this, We'll start with
each of our biggest questions, and then we'll conclude the
conversation with bulldest prediction. Desmond Pal, what is the biggest

(01:15:58):
question you have for the second half of the w
NBA season.

Speaker 1 (01:16:02):
Oh my gosh.

Speaker 3 (01:16:04):
So if you notice, I was trying not to smile
so big when you were talking about the Links, because
all I could think about was my big question, And
like you went in and I fully agree with what
you said. But my big question is are the Links
who we think they are? Because the way I look
at it is as great as they as great as

(01:16:24):
they play. So again, they had the tough defeat in
the finals. They go to unrivaled and the FISA Collier
and Courtney Williams are on the same team, the Lunar Owls,
and they go crazy.

Speaker 1 (01:16:36):
They lose in the playoffs.

Speaker 3 (01:16:38):
They are the best team in the regular season this
year they losing the Commissioner's Cup. And so sometimes I'm like,
there's a little, while very short, there is a little
bit of a pattern there, and I'm like, I hope
the Links do not turn into one of those teams
that are so amazing in the regular season, but for

(01:16:58):
some reason, something happens in the playoffs that makes all
of that go out the window. And so my thing
is is like, are they are they who we think
they are?

Speaker 1 (01:17:09):
And I want to say yes. I want to say yes.

Speaker 3 (01:17:11):
I think I think they are that dominant, But I
don't know, I'm just having I got weird energy when
I think about the Lynx and like I said, I
coming off the offseason, I felt like they should have
been doing whatever they could.

Speaker 1 (01:17:24):
To get Jewe Lloyd.

Speaker 3 (01:17:25):
And I'm like, and granted that has worked out tremendously
because Drew Loyd has not had the greatest season, but
I'm like, when you look at the way the Liberty
adjusted to the links, they Caleb McBride had a great
first half in that in that finals game, quiet that
whole second half, Courtney Williams couldn't buy a bucket.

Speaker 1 (01:17:46):
No Fisa.

Speaker 3 (01:17:46):
It got to a point where she was doing so
much by herself, it was it was taxing on her.
And I'm like, they just need one extra girl that
can get to a shot. I was hoping that was
gonna be Alyssa Peelee comes today that she's she's waved.
So it's like, I'm like, if they find themselves in
that situation again, you know, again, experience is the greatest teacher.

(01:18:06):
But like, I'm anxious to see how they respond.

Speaker 4 (01:18:09):
I really am.

Speaker 2 (01:18:11):
That's a great point.

Speaker 4 (01:18:13):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, to your point, I actually agree with you.
Because I wanted. My biggest question is can they rebound? Nope,
no pun intended here, can they rebound from from last year?
Because you know, you see it with teams all the time,
and it's a lot of the times it's you lose,
you gotta what's the what's the old saint? It's like,
you got to lose in order to win. You get
there and then you lose and then you can go

(01:18:33):
back and that's the thing that motivates you to win,
or it's the thing that causes you to miss the
playoffs or lose in the first round or whatever else happens.
We see that in sports all the time, usually in
you know one lost sports. But I want to know
can they get back there have that pressure again and
still maintain composure and win, especially if they're confronted with

(01:18:54):
a if they get confronted with another team that feels like,
oh they're getting the calls and whoever that may be.
But are they going to be able to like not
lose control in those situations pop off at a rerap
and get teed up or or at another player or
or what happens. So that should be really really interesting.
My boldest prediction I don't, man, I don't know Nancy

(01:19:19):
Lieberman steps down as head coach and makes a comeback.
I don't know, I got I got nothing. I'm just kidding.
She she absolutely should not do that, although I bet
she could still ball. I bet she's still really good.
She's like, what's about sixty years old now, But I
bet she could go in there and maybe that, maybe
that's what the links need to get over the hop thing.
She can finally get a paycheck deserving never talent.

Speaker 1 (01:19:40):
Yeah, that will be an amazing story. I would be.

Speaker 4 (01:19:42):
I would be, I'd be tuned in, I'd be I
would be seated.

Speaker 1 (01:19:45):
Yeah, I would you better pass it to Nancy.

Speaker 4 (01:19:50):
She's still coming. She's still running down the car.

Speaker 2 (01:19:54):
Yeah too much. Okay, this was actually the toughest part
of our conversation for me hearing my answer for this
biggest question. I have three obviously two will be honorable mentions. First,
I want to know will Hailey Jones find a home
in Dallas. I see she's with the Wings. She was

(01:20:15):
released from Atlanta, des You and I have talked, I
think definitely offer and maybe on air about the Hailey
Jones experience in Atlanta and just how that didn't necessarily
go the way that she had hoped. She spent some
time with the Phoenix Mercury this season. She's on Dallas currently.
So she's still so young and had such an incredible
career at Stanford that I can't see a world in

(01:20:35):
which she doesn't find a home in the W So
thinking about Haley Jones, I also want to know how
Mike Kelsey is feeling. Kelsey Plumb the Los Angeles Sparks
are not having a good year as of this recording.
They're five and twelve and nowhere close to sniffing the playoffs.
So I wonder how she's feeling. And I thought she
would be a great fit for the Golden State Valkyries

(01:20:57):
heading into this season. I wonder if there's there's any
thought in her mind of man, like my former assistant
coach Nat with Golden State is killing it and I'm
with LA and we battled injuries and she just she
has the green light certainly now being the vocal point
of LA's offense, but this hit, I would imagine it
has not been the season that she had hoped for.

(01:21:18):
So thinking about how she's doing, the question I'm going
to ask you guys, though, as we prepare for the
Toronto Tempo to enter the league next season in twenty
twenty six, I hope the timeline doesn't come for me
with this question. I want to know is Drake going
to be included in the rollout in the marketing efforts
of the Toronto Tempo. I would imagine this probably won't

(01:21:41):
take full force until after the season, but I'm curious
to Daz and I want to make sure we cover
this because we tease it in the opener the attempted
Drake come back here. I cannot go anywhere Desmond pal
and not hear Nokia who's calling my phone? Or now
what did I'm mean from Drake? So, particularly the conversation

(01:22:04):
around Drake during during the summer of not like us
thinking about what he means to Toronto, but thinking about
shitty be included in the rollout of the first women's
professional basketball team in Toronto. I feel like there are
gonna be some important questions to answer. So I'm really
putting this as my number one to ensure we get
Desi's thoughts on it's timeline. Don't don't fully come from

(01:22:25):
me like that? Uh, Dez, First, do you think Drake
will be included in this rollout of the Toronto Tempo.
And moreover, what have you thought about his attempt to
come back now that we've surpassed a year since the
beef with him and Kendrick effectively concluded with him losing.

Speaker 3 (01:22:44):
Okay, yeah, so I'll do so I'll answer the Toronto
Tempo one and then do my bold prediction. Then I'll
then we'll get back on the the other part. But
I think I think even more now he has to
be a part of the Toronto Tempo rollout because he's
gonna be looking for things to revive his spirit and

(01:23:05):
his career. You could say, after the whole Kendrick thing, Right,
Kendrick just went on tour, even though those songs are
about a year old now, he just went on tour.
So Drake is actively going to be looking for opportunities
to get back in good standing, if you will. And
you know, he'll probably drop a song you know, all
my girls move with Toronto Temple. You know, he'll have
a bar about it, you know what I mean, like, and.

Speaker 1 (01:23:24):
It'll be it'll be nice, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:23:26):
But I think he is going to be I don't
think as big as like what he's doing with the Raptors,
but I think they will incorporate him in some way,
shape or form. And then as far as my bold prediction,
I think you kind of alluded to this too. My
bold prediction is that because of what they've done this season,
the Golden State Vocris are going to be rewarded with
a big free agent this summer, and that, to me,

(01:23:47):
is either going to be a rique on gooble wile
as she looks for a fresh start. I think I'm
right with you, Ty, I think this, to me looks
like the last straw of her time in Dallas. So
I think she's gonna look at a team with a
bunch of hungry role players and be like, Okay, yes
they need my scoring, but I need their energy.

Speaker 1 (01:24:05):
So I think they could get her.

Speaker 3 (01:24:06):
But I wouldn't sleep on cock Copper as much as
I would love for her to stay in Phoenix after
what they did this year, Like, I don't see how
you how you leave after that? But yeah, I think
even one of those two women are gonna be Golden
State vakyries.

Speaker 1 (01:24:20):
That's my ball prediction.

Speaker 2 (01:24:22):
I loved it. I'm actually glad you didn't take mine.
I'll just throw my name brand and then we'll conclude
with you. Here my ball prediction. We're gonna stick in
the bay. I say the Golden State Valkyries win their
first playoff series.

Speaker 4 (01:24:34):
I'm fully lost.

Speaker 1 (01:24:35):
I almost went with that.

Speaker 4 (01:24:36):
Listen.

Speaker 1 (01:24:38):
Yes, I looked at the standings and I was like,
I'll wait a minute. I think it's gonna be like tricky.
I think the dream I forget who was third, but
I was like, I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:24:48):
And obviously I'm still a little UC committed. Okay, I
go in Indianam go on Minnesota for my actual pick
for the finals, which I guess clearly through this conversation
I'm still working through. But I am certain that Golden
State not only again makes the playoffs in their inaugural season,
but will actually win a playoff series.

Speaker 4 (01:25:07):
Well, my I already made my bold pick about Nancy.
Now I don't really I I legitimately couldn't figure out
a gold bold pick for this. So I had a
really hard time with this one. So I guess I'll
just say it because because I'm a homerk again, I'm
gonna say that the the Mercury make it. We'll just
say we'll make it out of the first round for sure,

(01:25:29):
and we'll we'll see where we end here for the
first round. Yeah, okay here now so so so Toronto,
we're we're not. I'm not gonna talk about Drake here.

Speaker 1 (01:25:40):
You don't.

Speaker 4 (01:25:40):
You don't think that that. Here's why, here's why. I
have a different question.

Speaker 2 (01:25:46):
He's back top ten on Apple Music.

Speaker 4 (01:25:50):
I believe you don't get me don't get me wrong.
Like we we we we were voting for people for
after nefarious things happened, like of course you can. You
can do stuff with allegations. It's easy in America or Canada.
Now Toronto also has another has another talent there. You
don't you don't see the tempo coming out to blinding
lights by the weekend, you don't. So the weekend and

(01:26:14):
I was thinking of I had to go. I had
to go through, like what are the Toronto artists and
there's a bunch on there. I was like, yeah, none
of these And then I got to I got to
the weekend and I went, hey, that's it's not a
bad because like Drake, for sure, the the the roster
is probably like yeah, yeah, of course, why wouldn't you
want Drake to be involved? In this, of course, right
the team itself. I don't know how pr feels. I

(01:26:35):
don't know what the temperature is in Canada about this.
I don't know if Canada was Team Kendrick or team Drake.
I have no idea, you know what I mean? Like,
what what was what was Canada's temperature? Check here?

Speaker 2 (01:26:46):
I have yeah, what what was the Toronto tour stop
like for the GenX concert? As you attended the concert Illinois,
what was it like up north in Toronto? It's it's
a great point Brat.

Speaker 4 (01:26:56):
It was a polite applause, just a bay bit.

Speaker 2 (01:26:59):
And as de said, Drake has been so intertwined with
the Toronto Raptors. He's courts eyed, he's heckling the opposition.
They're doing fashion releases with Ovo, exactly what you're saying, Brad.
I wonder, you know, in the next six months, in
the next year, has Drake built up enough goodwill? Are
the songs that pop in where he's going to be

(01:27:20):
a part.

Speaker 4 (01:27:20):
Of that rollout.

Speaker 2 (01:27:21):
I find it very, very fascinating.

Speaker 4 (01:27:24):
I think I think it would be good. I don't
don't get me wrong. I think it would be good
business for everybody involved. I just think that. You know,
I wouldn't want to be the decision makers for the
ownership group here, and it might end up coming down
to a w NBA decision or even the marketing for
whoever has the TV rights and contracts. Does Disney want

(01:27:44):
Drake on their property if it's going to be on
Hulu or if it's going to be on somewhere else.
Amazon probably doesn't care. But if Drake is the face
on there. And then we had everything happen with Kendrick
and what Kendrick said about Drake, do you really want
to take the risk if something comes out that like
becomes a problematic thing. Uh, suddenly you have a real

(01:28:06):
problem on your hands and you promoted it and then
it makes you look terrible from a pr standpoint, especially
in a women's basketball league women empowerment. Yes, so now
now now they're all allegations and they're not legal ones, right,
Like it's.

Speaker 2 (01:28:20):
Correct beef, everyone was singing.

Speaker 4 (01:28:26):
The problem is because everybody is singing it, and it
became of the w NBA games. It's part of the
cultural consciousness now that Drake is a pedophile because they
performed that song at the super Bowl, Like it's it's
not just as simple as oh, because because people that
are casuals, like people people living in the Midwest a
little bit north of you, DEAs that look more like me,

(01:28:49):
are are going to see that and go like, isn't
that the guy that was that that other that other
guy was talking about at the halftime show, like that
like that probably isn't gonna be a thing that happens.
But I could see my dad asking questions, and that's
absolutely one of the things I thought about, is like, oh, man,
from a PR standpoint, you have Drake's cachet and fan

(01:29:10):
base and his his catalog, and wouldn't you want that
as part of this specific culture to represent what you're
trying to roll out? But over here you have this
other question mark, And I don't know what the answer
is to that, because the weekend would be safe, but
it's not Drake and Toronto based, right, and a local

(01:29:30):
thing I think is be important. But if I think
Toronto music, the first thought is Drake and there's not
even a close second.

Speaker 2 (01:29:36):
And Brad starting to interrupt. I try to take as
many informal polls as I can with women in my
life periodically, especially now about where are we at with Drake,
and I find that a lot of them just want
the music to be to be hot. And if the
music is good, I'm gonna add it to my Instagram post,
I'm gonna play it, I'm gonna add it to my playlist.
And then you know, people just want Drake to make

(01:29:57):
good music. And now that he's rolling out Kia and
what did I miss? And a big part of this
two days I think is Drake is capitalizing on making
music and music videos that can turn into memes. Right,
So there are so many memes now on Instagram of
what did I miss? Like you come back from a
two hour lunch to work and what.

Speaker 4 (01:30:17):
Did I miss?

Speaker 2 (01:30:17):
And it's just like, I think that's part of the
calculus now when artists are making music, is is this
going to get traction from a social media standpoint? Is
it going to be on memes? And then again, perhaps
that's softening Drake's image of oh there's memes. He's kind
of getting back into the consciousness of us all and again,
if the music's good. I find that people in my life,

(01:30:38):
but particularly women, have been more accommodating to Okay, we
were laughing at him last year. We were all about
Kendrick bannout like us. But if he's back and if
the music makes me want to dance, I'm okay with that.
But one point I wanted to add to what you said, Brad.
You made me think of this. I think what's so
awesome about where we're at is that the Toronto Tempo
don't need Drake. Right, there's so much fervor around the league,

(01:31:02):
I'm sure fans and let us know if you're on
YouTube or for our Canada folks who are tapping in,
I would imagine there's going to be a lot of fervor,
maybe not unlike what we saw with Golden State and
the Valkyries. So how great is it that the Toronto
Tempo don't need him? And I would imagine that, as
you pointed out, Brad, pr the shot callers, they'll be

(01:31:23):
able to dictate whether this is business they want to
do with this particular artist. They don't need him necessarily
to move the needle anymore because we're all in for
women's hoops.

Speaker 1 (01:31:36):
That No, that's a great point.

Speaker 3 (01:31:38):
And even as I'm thinking about it, like I would
much rather them, and kind of to what Brad was saying,
I would much rather them deal with the consequences of
tampering and put a big billboard of Juju Watkins in
a tempo jersey as opposed to a billboard with Drake
Sam you know, like.

Speaker 2 (01:31:55):
I see it. Yeah, that was that was great, guys.
We covered a lot. This was fantastic. I'm so excited
for the w second half. I'm so excited that we
could get together for this dek before we officially wrap.
I know you mentioned H two DG and all that
you're doing over there. Please let us know, Please remind

(01:32:17):
our audience how we can connect with you and support
all that you're doing.

Speaker 3 (01:32:22):
Yes, of course, as always, I appreciate you guys having
me on today.

Speaker 1 (01:32:26):
It's awesome.

Speaker 3 (01:32:27):
I mean, you know, I could do this all day.
To be honest, man, I could do this all day,
especially with you guys.

Speaker 1 (01:32:32):
Man like this. This was awesome. But yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:32:34):
You could follow all things Hip to the Games at
Hip the Number two D A G A M E
S on all platforms TikTok, Instagram, Twitter, that's where you
can get updates on the show. A lot of the
social media teases that I post on there. You can
get all that there if you want to. You can
follow the personal at desmon Pile underscore that you get

(01:32:56):
a lot of the same stuff, a lot of H
two DG stuff in and out of my personal life,
whether that's music, basketball, faith, whatever. I'm always tweeting during
the NBA WNBA season, so you know, if you get
if you get overwhelmed, or if you get you know
or maybe you know all dees didn't have an episode today,

(01:33:16):
Well this is probably tweeting, so you know it makes
up for it.

Speaker 1 (01:33:21):
But yeah, that's that's where.

Speaker 3 (01:33:22):
You could find everything with the podcast and follow that.

Speaker 2 (01:33:26):
Fantastic support does we love him over here and again
he does fantastic work and you all should check him out.
Please be sure also to follow us if you're not
already at gipod nineteen for exclusive show updates and more.
We thank you for tuning in. Let's enjoy some great
hoops the second half of the season. Yeah, and we
will see you next time. Give me a fridgement is

(01:33:46):
a part of nineteen Media Group. You can listen to
us on Apple, Spotify, iHeartRadio, or wherever you find podcasts.
You can also find us on YouTube via the nineteen
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Speaker 1 (01:34:15):
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