Union Soccer Podcast Ep. 22: Meh-jor League Soccer -- 9/13/23

Jon Jansen and Joe Tansey discuss where the Philadelphia Union stand among MLS' best teams heading into the closing stretch of the regular season.

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Welcome into another edition of the UnionSoccer Podcast. My name is John Jansity.
You can follow me at j Jansonat thirty four. The star of
the program, Joe Tanzi adds atJay Tanzi ninety Union Soccer Blog dot substack
dot com. Plenty of injury updatesto give you, as well as a
big match coming up this weekend forthe Philadelphia Union against Cincinnati. Joe,

(00:24):
it's been it's been an up anddown season, though I will I don't
want to go too much into becausewe are far removed a little bit from
the Red Bulls and also Toronto game. But it's just kind of the same
ebbs and flows of the season sofar which we've seen with the Union.
Some of it looks really great,then some of it doesn't, and then
we're left wondering what this Union team, you know, what they really are

(00:45):
this season? We have we gottena clear answer to that, yet I
feel like we're still searching for that, aren't we. I feel like in
a way we are, but ina way we are right Well, I
guess right. It's it's answered bythe way that they're playing in September and
the end of August, and that'sthe question I asked, right, So,
I think that the one question Igot a lot after the Toronto game

(01:07):
was have they have they reached theirceiling? Like? Have they peeked?
I honestly I could see the casefor that because last year was so incredible.
They're not gonna win hardware this yearunless it's MLS Cup, So it's

(01:27):
yeah, you can obviously say they'veregressed. I don't think that's like a
big secret. But in terms oflike what regression could have looked like,
I still think the standards pretty highand the quality of play is pretty high.
And I think if you take aout, take us outside the union
bubble and go to like a nationalperson, which yeah, there's always there's

(01:52):
still the expectations that the union willbe there towards the end, and I
think that to open up the broaderperspective too. There's still aren't any good
teams in MLS. We've talked aboutthis for months now, like look at
look at the supporters Shield table.There are a lot of like very average

(02:17):
teams still plotting their way through MajorLeague Soccer that are going to get high
seeds. I honestly think this isand it's shrouded by Messy obviously, but
I think this is probably one ofthe more down years in Major League Soccer.
Okay, like none of these teams. Why do you think that is?

(02:42):
Because usually by this point in anMLS season you can point out,
Okay, these these are the teamsthat are on the collision course for MLS
Cup. These are the elite teams. Like in previous season it was.
It is probably going back a decadeBruce Arina's, Galli's Team, Galaxy teams
are making that push and moving upwhere the Sounders used to do it.

(03:06):
Every summer it's July and August,here come the Sounders. And if you
look across this this group here,I don't know who stands out to you.
The top two teams are Cincinnati,who have been elite at home,

(03:27):
but they're unproven in a long postseasonand by the way, the signs are
pointing to them playing Leno Messi inthe best of three series to open the
postseason. You don't want that.So that that why That's why I kind
of like and hesitant to be Cincinnati'sdominant because MLS's playoff format's gonna end up

(03:49):
screwing them. Sat Louis. Verygood story, very good story. But
would they be would they be wherethey are right now? Up the West
was at its usual high standard,I don't know. And then the next
five teams from the Eastern Conference inthe supporter shield New England, who's napsolute

(04:10):
disaster dumpster fire right now, nobodyhas figured out what exactly Bruce Arena said
to essentially get fired. Every everybodyon that staff is gone. Nobody actually
knows what happened, or at leastis saying what happened, which is incredibly
sketchy, and God knows how that'sgonna reflect on the actual product on the

(04:32):
field. I think the play inColorado this week, which is a the
interim to the Interim to the InterimBowl, because Colorado just fired Robin Fraser,
like Orlando, doesn't resonate on anational level. They're kind of flying
out of the radar. So isColumbus, Atlanta is Atlanta. Thiago Amada
is great and he's the marketable superstar, but their defense is the worst among

(04:55):
these top eight teams. And thenyou have the Union, who have been
consistently good, just hanging around,and then it's then it's Seattle. Then
it's LAFC, then it's Nashville.Like it's September thirteenth. H we're recording
this. You would have expected Seattle, LAFC, Nashville. The elites of

(05:15):
the elite, or at least whowe think are the elite of the elite
in Major League Soccer along with theUnion, along with Cincinnati at this point,
you would expect that to be likerelatively close to the top five.
But all of these teams have laws. Yeah, I mean, just looking
at it because the Eastern Conference,I could I mean Nashville, I really

(05:38):
like, you know, Atlanta youmentioned with Almada and outside of that,
you know, some questionable things,but I don't know. It's just is
how wacky of a year are wein for the Eastern Conference? And does
that wackiness prove to be maybe agood thing for the Union as they're having
you know, they're quote unquote hadto say it down seasons. Just guys
having a bit of a down seasoncompared to last year. I think I

(06:00):
think it's actually gonna be a reverseof what we usually see. So usually
the MLS postseason just makes absolutely nosense and is wacky. But that's when
we usually have like a few eliteteams and got in teams pin themselves underdogs
and all that. I think we'rein for a reverse of anything we were
used to seeing in MLS, Likeyes, the Union and LAFC got to

(06:24):
MLS. Cuff, Oh yeah thatwas I know that was an anomaly,
but exactly exactly so. And usuallythe path to get to that point is
is complicated, there's upsets all ofthat. I look at this and say
MLS in twenty twenty three and awhole if leon O Messi doesn't show up,

(06:44):
this is a really crap year forMajor League Soccer, like and I
think it has to do with Wow, everyone was right. MLS just not
good. That's a joke, ajoke, but maybe not really. And
here I don't know, I don'tknow. Maybe that's just me being a
pessimist here, but I look atthe standings and no one outside of Cincinnati

(07:10):
looks intimidate. Maybe there's just alot of good teams. Now you know
that there's a lot of parody inthe in the Eastern Conference, especially uh
huh, but it is too muchparody a bad thing. That's a good
question, because there's parody for sure. I mean, I know, I
know for something, like I knowwhen I've watched right, right, I
know when I watched something. Ithink like the NFL has has been that

(07:33):
way recently where it's just like Ithink the NFC is a good example of
that, where like we kind ofknow it's going to be the Eagles and
forty nine ers in the NFC.It's just like, how else is everything
else going to work? And youknow all that stuff. Yeah, So
I don't know, parody parody isa weird thing because I feel like there
is I mean, there's a tome there, there is a lot of
parody this year, and it isgoing to be it's gonna be quite the

(07:55):
playoffs, I think, and obviouslythe final stretch of the season two.
But I don't know is that abad thing? That's a good question,
especially in this year when you knowall eyes are on MLS and then you
know maybe you're not getting at leastthe I had to say the best things
because these teams are good, likeCincinnati is good and New England and Orlando

(08:16):
City in Philly. But still you'reright, it's it's not like the highest
level of soccer we've seen from MLSlike now now What would be the reason
for that though, is that theschedule, is that the amount of games,
the you know, everything to happenthis year, I think so there's
just a lot going on. There'sbeen a lot of there's been a lot
of injuries, and look, we'rewe get a little immune to things up

(08:41):
here because of how things go withthe Union and yep, sometimes we stay
inside our little soccer bubble, whichis fine, like there's MLS. Because
of how the Apple deal is now, it's very hard to keep track of.
Yeah, it's it's like baseball,you know, I I like,
but it's it's hard for me evento why the rest of baseball because I
just watch I watch a lot ofthe Phillies and you with the Braves.

(09:03):
You know, we we stick withinour own bubbles understanding what's going on out
there. But yes, we stickin our own bubbles. I think that's
that's even more this year because it'sjust there's I mean, it's so ridiculously
difficult to even watch an extra gameif if you're in Chester on a Saturday
night in a multi view function onan Apple TV. That's what I'm That's

(09:24):
what I'm That's what I'm thinking MLS. It's a multiviews. They need a
multi game window. Yeah, that'stoo that that would also help. That's
already mentioned, like man like everygame at one time. I don't know.
I think it's I think it's abunch of things because at this point
in the season, normally or whatfive six weeks left, very few midweek

(09:46):
games, like the midweek games areusually taking care of by now that's not
the case. It's just it's avery bloss MLS season to me, because
is if you take the Leonel Messiout of MLS, what what is the
pavilage all of that? Who wasn'tduring MLS play by the way, right,

(10:09):
it was during League's car So like, if you take if you take
Leonel Messi out of MLS twenty twentythree, what's the what's the most intriguing
storyline? I guess Cincinnati's turnaround,but Cincinnati's turnaround, but Saint Louis as
an expansion team St. Louis.Yeah, that's St. Louis Is.
But like definitely, if you ifyou blow it up even further and go

(10:33):
to a casual fan and say here'swhy you should watch MLS in twenty twenty
yeah this year or not much thisyear. I can't. I can't point
because who are you pointing to?On St. Louis? That's this?
This and this is a credit toSaint Louis building the roster the way they
did and the way the Union havedone it. In a way, it's
Cincinnati but with more money has doneit. But who's who's drawing casual fans

(10:58):
in to Major League Soccer? Thatthat's not lean On Messi. Right now,
it's very hard to like because there'sno there's no team to hate.
Like at least last year with LAFC, you could hate them because, okay,
they're being accused of bending the rosterrules. They're really good. They're
like the elite of the elite.With Miami, you can't hate them yet

(11:20):
because they're they're in what tenth place? They're hate them once they get into
the playoffs, right exactly, everybodywill hate them once they get into like
a winning position. But they're stillon the ascension to that that hate ability.
And even then it's hard because leonOn Messi is probably the most likable

(11:41):
superstar I've seen in my lifetime.Yeah, like, find somebody who hates
lean On Messi. And it's veryhard. So that that's kind of right.
I was it was easy to hateGareth Bell, It's going to be
easy to hate MESSI It's okay.I appreciate you bumping them in them in
there to get away. I willhate Yeah when when those guys are coming

(12:07):
off as substitutes and the Union havelike a seventeen year old player doing it,
Yeah, I'm gonna I'm gonna feela little different. Well, here's
here. The prevailing topic of theMLS right now is like is messy Which
is good, it's great, it'sfantastic. But I mean that's a bright
it's a gigantic topic. But ifyou but you just kind of wish there
was right like, it's you know, MLS has to me, you know,

(12:28):
since especially since we've been doing theUnion coverage, you didn't have been
great, so it's helped out.But I just feel like the rest of
the last year it was awesome tosee LAFC and Union almost the entire way,
like on this collision course and evenhave great games in the playoffs leading
up to that MLS Cup and thenthis amazing MLS Cup game. Now I
feel like there have been some reallygood years, and it's just a shame

(12:48):
that you have this probably you know, the best most expensive state dinner that
you've ever had with Lionel Messi comingin, but it's being housed in like
a shack and your grandmother's backyard orsomething like that, or it's been it's
being served on like a paper plate. Yeah, right, with tasting sneak
you've ever had. And right,it's just like on a picnic table in

(13:11):
your backyard and a paper plate.There's been no there's been no drama supporter
shield race, absolutely not. LikeCincinnati has been ahead for quite some time.
And again it's a full credit towhat they've been doing. But from
a league's perspective and from what you'rekind of from how you're viewing it,
it seems like and how you talkabout Cincinnati, it's like, okay,

(13:33):
they're they're at the top of thesupporter shield, but it's not like they
are. You don't look at them, I guess say, okay, well,
yeah, that is definitely the bestteam in the MLS. They're not
they're not building the depth star inCincinnati, right like Elliott c was like
on the way to building the deathNo Darth Vader on that roster, right,
and you could there's probably a DarthVader in the calling like Pat Noonton

(13:56):
Emperor Palpatine or something. Right,it's hard to also be like Jim Curtain
today being like, oh yeah,Chris Albright's Sporting Executive of the year and
Pat Noonan is head coach of theyear. Like when you're when the likability
is there and you feel good becauseCincinnati was really really awful for a really
can Union fans on that. Canwe be like, hey, those are

(14:18):
our guys over there. You knowwe did that, We did that?
You can and Curtain touched on today. It's like a very We've joked about
it as them being like the UnionMidwest Bureau. They kind of are.
They are, but they've they've builtit with more money though, with more
backing. I think that's the justbut it shouldn't hurt me like that.

(14:45):
But Cincinnati was in such a dumpsterfire with with the way their roster was
where it was just the fact thatthey've they've pulled all these moves off and
are in first place and thriving itReally he speaks to how quickly all Bright
and Newton have turned things around.It it's a full credit to them,
and Jim was very complimentary, andthen at the end it's like, well,

(15:09):
we still want to beat them thisweek, which rightfully so. And
and the first time they played eachother this year, the Union throughout their
their B team basically because it wasin the middle of Champions League. So
yeah, it really is the firsttime the Union are getting a shot at
Cincinnati. You know, by theway, Lucho Acosta isn't playing, Alavadoya

(15:31):
is not playing for the Union becauseit's both because of suspension. So it's
a very weird. It's a veryweird situation. We've had two weeks off
and now it's we're going back rightinto the absolute full sprint of I think
it's what there's two midweek games todo. The math, there's six six

(15:54):
games in the next three weeks,and then you have two weeks off until
the season finale, which is stupidin its own right as well. But
that's conversation for another day. Butyeah, it's really just it's just this
is how an MLS season goes.It's just I don't see when I when

(16:14):
I scan over everywhere, it feelswide open. But then it also feels
like black luster, you know,and to do the college basketball comparison and
Gonzaga and Baylor were one two afew years ago, and it felt like,
Okay, they're just on a collisioncourse and everybody else's crap. It
feels like, not to that extentwhere there's two specific teams, but it

(16:38):
feels like whoever is on the topat the end really is gonna cruise because
it there really is no There reallyis no depth within MLS in terms of
teams this year. Maybe, yeah, I honestly player level, there is,
but not not with full roster.Yeah, and you're exacerbating that depth

(17:03):
with a bunch of games and youknow, League's Cup and Champions League for
some teams and Open Cup like that. I don't know, is there should
there be a conversation about was thiswas this too much? You know,
was this something that was way toomuch for every team in the league.
And then look a lot of theseguys too, I mean the union dealing
with it international breaks and stuff,you know, do do does MLS need

(17:25):
to figure out their schedule, especiallyyou know, now adding another competition to
it? Is there maybe I haveto be a conversation I had to say,
shortening it, but scheduling it ina different way. I don't even
know how. I don't think.I don't think everyone, but should those
conversations be had after this year?Like is that the correlation? You can
think? Absolutely? I don't thinkevery team should play in League's Cup,

(17:47):
Okay, I think you have tomake that special because if you're if you're
pinning this as MLS's best for LeagueMX's best, make it their best,
yeah, make actually make it,make it like a mini version of your
own Champions League and you just gotyou know, into disguise of League's Cup
in some way shape or form.Make it that maybe it's your your sixteen

(18:12):
best team, maybe it's your tenbest teams, whatever it may be.
Make it feel like it's significant.Make it feel like these teams should be
playing a continental competition. Because ifif you finish last in MLS and you're
like, oh, well, youknow, we do get to play three

(18:33):
extra games in League's Cup, nomatter what, like there's no reward attached
to it. Make it performance based. Make it. I don't know what
the exact number is, because look, you want to play games in Mexico.
I think the Mexican teams were ata complete disadvantage. I mean,

(18:55):
look at how Monterey traveled and endedup just like waving the white flag on
the third place game because of howmuch travel and how much wear and tear
they put on their guys. Maybeyou make it like the NBA in season
tournament, where there's specific days forspecific games, maybe Wednesday nights in June

(19:15):
and July, these are your games. I don't know. And you can't
really use the European competitions as anexample because the travel is much different there
than is in the United States andMexico, so that you can't you can't
just model based off of that.You can't just be like, oh,

(19:36):
well, Manchester United played in theCarabou Cup on Tuesday, the Premier League
on Saturday, the Champions League onWednesday, and then back in the Premier
League on Saturday. No, thatthat comparison doesn't work a because of travel
even across Europe is much easier,and then be those squads are much deeper.

(19:56):
Like you have to find something thatthat suits your league and the competition.
I don't know. I don't thinkanyone has the perfect answer on what
to do with Lease Cup. Ithink no but it's it's something that does
need to be Do you think itwill be talked about scheduling and things like
that around Lease Cup? Here's thething, all of all of us,

(20:18):
I feel like it has to atleast be mentioned and discussed and like this
this has to be in the offseason a topic of conversation. Right,
So here's the thing. All ofus have these fancy cool ideas that are
make all sorts does is just tryand piece it all together and you know,
and you know what, you knowwhat Don Garber sees money, money

(20:42):
and the contract with Apple. Yeahright, so like that's that's why it's
so flawed? Is Yes? Froma personal perspective, I would much rather
see say, the twelve best teamsfigured out in the twenty fourteen terms.
I don't't care what the numbers arelike, just eliminate the bom of it
and then figure out the schedule thatway. Or if you're MLS who tried

(21:06):
to commit to fewer midweek games,well you just shoved all the midweek games
back in with League's Cup and mademade your teams play a congested schedule.
So which one is it? Areyou looking out for player safety? Are
you looking out for the competitive balanceof your league or are you looking for

(21:27):
the money? If it's the moneypart, just be honest about it.
Like, I know this is awild comparison, but like why do we
hate all these like people that takeall these deals in Saudi Arabia. Just
admit you're taking the money. Justtell me you're taking the money. I'm
not gonna like be proud of it, but like, just be honest with

(21:48):
me that you want the money.Again, completely different comparison, but you
know what I mean, like,oh yeah, you know, it's it
makes sense, yes, Like justtell me you're doing this for the money,
for the TV revenue, for whateveryou have to fill the requirement with
with THEMLS season pass. And thenit's like, okay, well now you've
said that you can at least andthey'll never do that. They will never

(22:11):
do that in person. But likethat's something that's a huge factor and why
the playoff format is what it isand why Cincinnati is going to be at
such a disadvantage of Lionel Messi singlehandedly wins the eight nine game, which
I think everyone who has watched leonOn Messi withinn in Miami is going to

(22:32):
agree that's going to happen. Sohow is it fair to EC Cincinnati to
be like, hey, you justwon the Supporter Shield, now you have
to play against Lionel Messi in abest of three? Isn't it bad?
Though? That there there was somuch even just put on the plate of
one player who, by the way, made his debut in you know,
Vlast Sword with his team at League'sCup, and that team was already saying,

(22:52):
hey, you know, we kindof have to watch what we're doing
with him and rest him and takehim on the bench because he's played in
too many games, and also he'sgoing to be on the international duties and
things like that. That South America, Yeah, we aren't they This guy
that's you know, we're making thisbig investment into can't be on the field
for some games because there's too manyof them. There's too many games for

(23:14):
him to be on the field for. Yeah, like that. It wasn't
It wasn't a surprise when you know, to go back a few weeks,
not at all. When he wason the bench for the game at Red
Bull Arena. Everybody was pissed offabout it, But he just played the
entire League's Cup Slate played in theOpen Cup and then had to play in
MLS play. It's just it's toomuch. Yeah, even on the world's

(23:37):
greatest player. Like the amount oftravel in the US and Mexico is completely
different from you know, playing inBarcelona or PSG. And that's the one
thing that everybody says when they comeover, like I've when Danny Higg about
them is around in the broadcast booth, I usually swing about to talk with

(24:00):
him. And that's the one thinghe now with dannygoa the name dropped Dave
Leno too, Yeah, go ahead, given Dave Leno, I love him,
but would have a thirty minute conversationwith the wall and oh no,
we'll have it. I'll talk withhim about tennis. Let's talk US Open

(24:23):
and I love Dave that living vicariouslythrough Dave's US Open tweets. No,
but I'll talk like talking with Dannybecause he's been traveling all across the country
doing these Apple games and I thinkand to him it was like, yeah,
if you don't realize, like howmuch I think that's just the most
recent example. I mean, youname it with people who've come over in
MLS and it used to be muchworse when they flew commercial before the pandemic.

(24:48):
Imagine imagine doing that. So yeah, it it's imperfect. I don't
know if there is a perfect solutionto all of our issues here, but
maybe you can find somewhere in themiddle. That way, you know,
we're not sitting in September and thisall comes back to fatigue. Yeah,
I'll be honest that two weeks ithas to play a part in what's happening.

(25:10):
And even I mean to bring itback exclusively to the union because we
are unions acropod and we're talking bigleague questions, but even just bring it
back to the union. The unionaren't even dealing with this. Well,
you know, they're dealing with abunch of injuries and you know, guys
that they've done, they've done withthat as good as they could, right
exactly. But you're, as you'resaying, with the schedule, like you

(25:30):
can only deal with it so muchbefore it just overwhelms you. And I
think it's overwhelming. And that's whythe two week break was like needed,
like even I needed, Like Isaw a game like I was praying and
praying that the FC Dallas game wasn'tgoing to be scheduling for the national break
because I'm like, I just needa break. We need to just clean,
clean break. And I do thiswith every sport deep into I just

(25:52):
need to cleanse my brain of soccerfor a few days. That way I
can I can recharge and be ready. And I'm sure most of these guys
think the same way, and theseguys who play. Yeah, I think
the first thing that was mentioned afterthe Red Bulls game is how many days
off these guys got, because theyall deserve it. Like the amount that

(26:12):
was I think that was game forty. So yeah, it's tough. The
good news is when you when youlook at the injuries throughout the league and
compare him to the Union, Unionhave been pretty lucky. Daniel Gozdek is
one hundred percent. He's ready togo. Him being taken out of the
Hungary squad during the international break wasessentially load management. We'll call it that

(26:37):
because that's probably the best term touse. With his knee, it planted
a little weird during the Red Bullsgame. Krans Is fun Hays's bueno came
back from Venezuela early, but heis good to go. Everything on his
knee is all intact and good andhe's been training the last few days for

(26:59):
Jim Curtin. The rest of thegroup Tiberabo, Andre Blake, Damian Low,
Olivier Bizo, who is making iswe'll be back Thursday. Can we
can we talk about Barrabo? Imean we haven't seen like a lot a
lot, but have you, likeanything you've seen think of ways that he
could be used? Anything with Barrabo? Yet, I think very very small,

(27:22):
small sample size. I think it'sincomplete. M I mean, how
much are you gonna judge when aplayer like that comes over, Like that's
the first time we're seeing him,and so like we we can at least
get some picture of like what kindof player he is? Right, But
yeah, it's still probably gonna behard to figure out fit And concerning that,

(27:45):
Jim Curtain said he was still inpreseason. I don't know if that
was his fitness level or Curtain protectinghim and saying, you know, he's
not just figuring things out. Idon't know right that that's we're trying to
look into. To me, thatsounds like, you know, preseason of
you know, figuring out what theydo, how they do it. Yeah,

(28:07):
it fell also like a little bitof curtain being like, well he's
not yeah, like he's not gonnahe's not gonna take over for Carranza,
right, but like what is hislevel compared to what the Union expect out
of a striker? And you know, there's nothing you can take from the
Red Bulls game, at least inmy mind because of the situation to say,

(28:33):
Okay, this is how he's gonnafit all this, like he likes
playing with two strikers. Told methat when I talk with him a few
weeks ago. He seems like aguy who's gonna put all his his all
into it. Perfect Union player.But as to how he actually fits still
TVD because it's it's just too smallof the sample side. So hopefully we

(28:57):
see that over the next few weekweeks. Another bit of good news the
un flock might not be done forthe season. Jim Curtin said at during
his press conference today that he's gothe got a second opinion in Germany and
he's not gonna have a full sporttoorneous surgery, and they're gonna try and

(29:17):
and get some treatment from that secondopinion and maybe have him back in a
few weeks. Which would be apositive. Obviously, you want to make
sure he's one hundred percent fit andokay, and and the union will do
that. But some optimistic news onhim and then that that's really it.
I mean, you survived the transferwindow. I know that the Julian Kranza
news was uh, you know,Olympiacos was the one team that was named.

(29:44):
Jim Curtin said today that there weremany more than the one that was
actually named. I don't think that'sany bit of a surprise. And then
the kai Wagner thing, it iswhat it is at this point, right
like how many times are we goingto do the whole the run around it?
Just I think it may be comingto a head because he's got the

(30:07):
free agent status at the end ofthe year. But here's what I'll say
to everything in recent comments and everythingwith that is how much time did the
fan base spend in May and Juneworrying about Jim Kurtin and Ernst Tanner being
extended and then boom they've both beenextended, which, by the way,

(30:30):
I know Tanner hasn't officially been announced, but he's been in Europe for a
while that there's nothing wrong with thatit's just the timing of a release of
that significance has not worked out yet, So I I know one or two
people probably worried about that that's stillofficially official, just hasn't been officially announced.

(30:52):
But yeah, I mean it's notgoing to affect this play. Obviously,
it's not a hat trick of assistsagainst the Red Bulls. So is
that something where everybody's just playing hardballwith each other at this point? I
think that's what it is. Yeah, I wrote about it last week.
It just it feels like typical hardballin negotiation. It's just this time around

(31:15):
there's a free agent status looming.Where's he going? That's the biggest question.
What what where is he going?That's gonna significantly increase what he's making
now if the union, you know, there's wiggle room for the union to

(31:40):
offer him a couple extra hundred thousandper year and be on like the Glesness
level, not be a designated player, and he could still be here.
So I think the only thing that'sreally changed is I think he's changed agents
and they've gotten better at negotiation.A lot of the reports in previous years

(32:06):
were from agents just willing and eagerto boost Kai stock overseas, and the
Union said there was no significant offersand if there haven't been any, actually
any offers in general, not forgetthe significant qualifier there. So if there's
no offers for him, like he'skind of stuck in in a hard place

(32:30):
too, because is he over negotiatinghimself? So, I mean, I
would love to look more into it, but it just feels like the Kai
Wagner is valuing himself as say,a designated player level. You know,
let's use this example. I don'thave specific details. There is a plan

(32:52):
to talk with Ernest Tanner later inthe week though, so please subscribe to
the Union Soccer blog because a lotof topics are going to be covered in
that conversation. But that's what itfeels like. It feels like Kai probably
values himself as a designated player theorganization. If you go off anything in

(33:13):
MLS in history, left backs aren'tdesignated players. So is this all just
a negotiation? And maybe Kai beingmore public with it maybe that, I
don't know, does that help uscase? I don't think so. Again,
where where's he going? Where's theactual threat of him going somewhere?

(33:37):
I know A lot of people mentionedCincinnati because that's the easy place to link,
But Cincinnati would still have to payhim, you know, he he's
still demanding X amount of money withinMLS. Is an MLS team going to
pay him that? I don't knowand I don't know what, if,
what the specific demands are, butthey're obviously higher than what he's getting paid

(34:00):
now. So who's taking him inEurope? Legitimate question? Who is taking
him in Europe? This isn't aThis is more of a slight on how
the European teams handle a player ofKais stature because he came from the third

(34:23):
division in Germany. So it's notlike he went to, say like in
a mid tier Bundesligua club left andnow is set up to come back and
if leads with all the American connectionslast year opted for I think it was
Max Bober above him, Like youwant be playing in the championship at that

(34:49):
level, you want to be fightingfor relegation somewhere in Europe instead of fighting
for championships in MLS. That's apersonal decision, you know it. Well,
what I'm saying is basically the samestuff we went over in March with
with ka Wagner. The only differenceis there's that free agent status at the

(35:12):
end of the season, and whoknows if that even if he even makes
it to that point as a freeagent, you know, the Union could
step in and be like, hey, this is let's get to a number.
It will obviously that's one of thepressing country questions for Tanner in the
coming days. But honestly, like, what what are the options are?

(35:32):
Is Kai just overplaying his card?Who knows? Like, if it's a
couple hundred thousand dollars, I thinkboth sides should probably come to an agreement.
Right, We're not talking We're nottalking millions. We're probably talking like
trillions. Yeah, we'll probably jSugerman doesn't know what that is. We're

(36:00):
probably talking about what two hundred fiftyk three in an increase, And the
Union have shown a willingness to increasethe pay of all their best players and
extend them on longer term deals.And if you're concerned about money, I
mean they're gonna get They're gonna beflushed with cash from the Coranza deal on

(36:21):
the winner whoever, like he's goneon the winner. We all know that
it's just a matter of how muchmoney they get in that sale and what
they can reinvest in. No,it's an interesting it's an interesting predicament because
it's not there's no there's no obviousanswer. If you're Kai Wagner, I

(36:43):
don't want to talk about this anymore. I don't want to lose Wagner.
Can we just talk about them beatingCincinnati this weekend? I think that's reasonable.
That it Wait, that's reasonable.Keep there's still reasonable too. I
know everybody the second they hear onething about one potential transfer or departure,

(37:05):
nuts we all go insane. Yes, I can't sleep for days. I
got massive anxiety about it. Yes, I know insane, And we don't.
We don't. I mean just Imean you better, you better be
checking up on me. If likeDaniel Goaz, dag ever becomes like available,
you know you're okay with him.I'm just saying, if it does,

(37:25):
if we ever get to that point, we ever get to that point,
God forbid. I'm I'm just I'mnot gonna be good. I'm not
gonna be okay. I think DanielGoz thinks okay, he's playing for his
national team. Still, is hegonna be a Philly life, or you
think he's just gonna stay here.I could see that. Well, I
mean the long term plan is himand U. I mean, well,

(37:45):
he does like basketball, so aslong as there's decent enough basketball, you
know, well, maybe he'll movewherever James Harden goes. Maybe he'll ask
to go to LAFC if he movesto the Clippers. Now you're just projecting
things into the future front. Imean, you can't watch bad basketball.
The Sixers are going through process parttoo. I don't think God's Dad wants
to watch that, you know,like I think too your best recruiter to

(38:08):
keep doing God's Dad here. MaybeJoel em Bee can recruit some you know,
Griesman or somebody. There we go, there we go. The only
time Joel embiid show showing up toUH Super Park is when Didier Drogba was
here. So I don't know,maybe you get drop the FedEx field though.

(38:30):
For the Washington football team. Imean, talk about things people got
upset about, talk about things Igot upset about, probably for no reason.
That yeah, that is under thingsI could give less of a damn
about. I know, I don'twant to. I don't know it does
it. I don't know, wouldit bother you if? Like, I

(38:51):
don't know, I don't know whatthe Union equivalent to that is. Would
it bother Like? What if AndreBlake was just going to Uh, I'm
the who's the if he's going tolike a Giant's game, he's in there
hanging out. Good for him.What if he grew up as a Giants
fan in Jamaica? That could happen? Could happen? Like, I don't
give a crap all that stuff.I mean, it is what it is.

(39:15):
Where were we Union? I thinkthis is the Union's soccer podcast.
I don't know, is it?We're at our best when we when we
ramble and go on tangents. Wegot wont We did get a really nice
comment a few weeks ago on likeyou're passionate about MLS thing. Yeah,
so I guess. And then wejust talked about this podcast how shitty it

(39:37):
is. So we're hitting all sidesof the But I like that. I
will watch that. Okay, that'swhat I like MLS. I am ride
or die, all right, Rideor die. I'm allowed to call it
bad because it's my own. I'vebeen a part of this nonsense. There's

(39:59):
not many people watching more molest thanyou so as as some as some would
say, I've been all in onMLS for quite some time, so you
don't have to worry about me leaving. But it's just like, Wow,
I was really worried about that.I wasn't sure if you were leaving or
not. I think I wasn't sureif you were in the in the transfer

(40:22):
market. I mean, look,no, you're you're a Philly lifer.
You're you're here for the long haul. No, yeah, I would just
leave it that. I don't wantto trash outlets. That's not my thing.
Oh, don't do that. Don'tdo that. No, I'm playing
that. I've I've made a commitmentto myself to just not Yeah, we

(40:43):
gotta play nice. You've been No, it's mostly you. You've been very
mean. You've been very mean.I've been I've been civil. I've been
mean for a reason though, Likehashtag ad, but that's that's they fixed
it. Though they fixed it.I'm on leaving a compliment. They fixed
it. There's no hashtag ads anymore. We'll see what happens this week.

(41:04):
But that's all I say. Yeah, I don't know then, just is
what it is I gotta we gottaworry about it? What? What?
What should we expect this weekend againstCincinnati to get to actual on the on
the pitch stuff, for the Unionto go all in for the three points?
Oh, come on, man,Jesus, leave them alone. Leave
leave you know what. Sorry,you gotta go and time out. Yeah,

(41:29):
you gotta go to time You're gonnago and time out. You're terrible.
You're gonna get me in trouble now, I mean, just unbelievable.
I'm gonna get caught in the crosshairsof this. But I not enough people
listen to this podcast to get uscaught and cross hairs. Hey, the
five people to listen to this,you know we greatly could be could be
snitching on us. We got anysnitches among us who we greatly appreciate,

(41:51):
the five of you. Thank youlisten. I know I really do.
Thank you for listening and subscribing toour nonsense and waiting about forty minutes for
Joe to find talk about this bleepingCincinnati Union game and wait us wait for
us four weeks to put a newpodcast out. I think it's gonna be
I think it's gonna be an elitegame. Look, a cost of being

(42:13):
out is big for Cincinnati. TheDoya being out for the Union, I
think is huge in this type ofgame. Like I know we talk about
the Doya rotation and who should bein the midfield and who shouldn't and all
that jazz. This is a gamewhere you want Bedoya at least on for
sixty to just man the right side, do all the little things right,

(42:35):
potentially contribute to a goal like thisis this is the game, the LAFC
game next week, also against Charlotte. You don't need Bedoya, like you
can manage his minutes that way andbe like, Okay, hey, sus
Bueno, Jose Martinez, Jack Niklyn, go play on turf. Like you
don't want to put alive Bedoya onturf at this point, especially when you

(42:57):
can rotate it. So I thinkyou'll see the reg their characters out there.
I think you go Bizo over overHarrial. Harry's been really good defensively
and on set pieces, but Bizobrings you so much more when you're building
an attack through the right side.Yes, he comes with his defensive flaws,

(43:22):
but if you're in a game whereyou're at home, you want to
be on the on the front footthroughout. I think Bizo is your guy
on the right side, and thenmaybe bringing Harroyal for defensive reinforcements later in
the game. I think we theeleven kind of picks itself, like,
let's be honest, and if thefour fourteen no no injuries said, they're

(43:44):
they're for the most part, otherthan obviously flock there, they're right.
If the four four two is whatwe're sticking with here, which they should,
in the they should you go.You know who the back four is
and Damian Lowe is probably the oddman out, which it is what it
is because you got a Brazilian gamescoming up, Ego Martinez, yougo,

(44:07):
Bueno McGlenn, gosdag Boom. There'syour strikers, you know who they are,
Cornza and you win the game athome like that's you're the high level
of union player that you saw againstthe Red Bulls outside of that early concession,
which is a little bit unlucky onDamian low because he was in the

(44:29):
right spot, just the ball deflectedright off of him and back into the
path the attacker. If you playat that high level, you can win
the game. But that goes backto way back to the start when we
say what is the ceiling for thisteam? They can for sure prove this
on Saturday, but the errors andthe mistakes that we've seen leaves that those

(44:52):
ounces of doubt in your head.But if they come out get three points
against Cincinnati, I mean where there'sthe national the national hype train kind of
go from here, it's like,oh, Philly's back, they can still
do this, They've proven they cando it. YadA, YadA, YadA.
It builds up more to the LAFCgame. And look, if we're

(45:12):
having a realistic conversation about the twoseed right now, which is what we
should do. Who knows what thehell is going on in New England.
You have to think that affects themin some capacity. Yeah, it's just
it's getting worked. Like I'm seeingas we're recording, just Bogert still putting
out things of guys who have partedways and all that stuff. I think

(45:34):
just lives in that new lighthouse.By God, I think Tom. I
think Tom's gone to like every outletstore in Foxboro this week just to waste
his time on you, Orlando,like all these teams like you play Columbus,
so you can take care that.You play Atlanta, you can take
care of that, like you playNew England at the end of the season,

(45:59):
you take care of that. Itvery much feels like it's in the
Union's hands, this two seed,and we've harped about it on previous podcasts
and earlier in this one. Youwant the two seed. If leet on
Messi in Miami somehow make up twelvepoints on Nashville with a game in hand,

(46:22):
credit to them, all power tothem. But the top seven seem
pretty secure in the East, andyou think they're going to trade positions.
It's Montreal and DC who are thevulnerable ones. And if you have that,
it looks pretty straightforward. If youthe Union, get the two seed,
get as many home games as possible, and throughout that process prove you

(46:45):
can beat and compete with the bestthat we have this year in MLS,
and it's extinc Natti Elliott. It'dbe nice to see that, you know,
it'd be nice, It would bevery We're just we're looking for that
validation. Like I even saw oneof the questions you know, you posted
on Twitter, you know, questionsfor the show, and it was kind
of that, you know why,you know, almost a question like convinced
me that the Union can actually youknow, get it together to make it

(47:07):
right, Like this is the kindof game to do it. You know,
do it against Cincinnati and give ussome validation because even if they were,
you know, a couple of gameslater and let's just say they do
a great job against Cincinnati, theywin the game two one, however they
win it whatever, look great doingit. I don't even care if they
drop a stupid one and a coupleof weeks, whatever the case, I

(47:28):
don't care. Just show me validationthat that team is there, Like,
you can compete with the top teamin MLS right now, then Cincinnati,
you know, none to say thatthat's you know, the team you're going
to have to beat to get toMLS Cup, but that you are still
that right. It might be,but you are still part of that upper
echelon. You know that you cancompete and beat those teams if you look
situations that you should, if youlook at the remaining schedule, and if

(47:52):
you say, the Union need toprove it to me against X team to
show that they can do anything inthe postseason. The two teams on that
list are the next two teams thatcome into super Park AC Cincinnati and lafc
If you can beat both of thoseteams inside super Park, what if they

(48:14):
got both done? They can verymuch get both done. I think.
I think there's a bunch of peopleout that they believe both can get done.
I still think they can do it. It's stuff like this team,
it just completely dropped off. It'sjust the inconsistencies have been there more this
season than they were last season.So if those inconsistencies get fixed and they

(48:37):
go away, and if you canplay elite soccer inside your home stadium,
which Jim Curtin mentions every single pressconference, and rightfully so they play elite
soccer inside super Park over the lastfew years, improve it should everybody.
You can beat these two teams andget a point in Charlotte, maybe three,
you know, depending on what thelineup is. Boom, there you

(49:00):
go. Things are fixed. Loveit. I think that's a good way.
Then. Is that a good wayto end the pod? Right there?
I think it is. I thinkthat was it. I feel that's
what I was looking for. That'sthe sound bite, as they say,
baby, that's the sound bite.It took us about fifty minutes to get
there, Joe, but we gotthe sound bite. So that is it
for the Union Soccer Pod. Findit wherever you get your podcasts. That

(49:20):
can be Google play Store, AppleApp Store, wherever you get your podcasts,
go get them and download the UnionSoccer Podcast. I even just googled
Union Soccer Pod. I saw allof our stuff up there, so you
can do that as well. Alsosubscribe, subscribe subscribe to the Union Soccer
Blog Union soccer Blog dot substack dotcom. Joe Tanzy writes all things going

(49:42):
over there, and Joe obviously plugwhatever you have coming up for this week
and obviously for this weekend. Yeah, I know I kind of dropped hint
about midway through there, but yeah, there's there's plans to hopefully sit down
with her and Tender this week,and so I would very much, very
very much suggest sub hitting that subscribebutton over at Union Soccer Blog. A

(50:04):
lot of topics hopefully covered in thatone as well, plus the normal of
the game breakdowns, the previews,all the all the fun stuff that comes
with a normal match week. Butyeah, that's the big one, and
I know there's a lot of questionsthat need to be answered. I've seen
a few ones out there that I'msaving for that interview because that's a Those
are ones that can be answered byone person and one putter s only.

(50:27):
So yeah, hit that subscribe.We're definitely not gonna answer them. We'll
talk fifty minutes about everything else,but answering those questions. Yeah, we're
gonna talking. We're good at talking. We are damn we are good at
that. We're very good at that. I hope you're talking about any substance,
but we're talking at Jay Tanzy ninetyfor Joe Tanzy at j j answ
At thirty four, for me onTwitter at Union Soccer Pod on Twitter at

(50:50):
Fox Pachil Gambler, thank you fortuning in for the Union Soccer Pod.
We'll be back next week with moreright here on The Union Soccer Podcast