January 21, 2025 • 63 mins
With Matt Sandoval from FreeArts AZ and Kagan Goh producer/director of Common Law
Matt Sandoval, is the new Executive Director for FreeArts in Arizona. FreeArts AZ provides traumatized children and their families with a means of creative expression and as means of establishing resilience and offering mentorship.
And Kagan Goh talks with ReThreading Madness about his new film, Common Law, a biographical account of his experience of learning he had BiPolar and how this impacted on his relationships with his long-time girlfriend and family. Through this we learn how individuals who receive Persons With Disability in BC, are unable to keep this benefit if they enter into a common-law relationship and how that changes the relationship and their own sense of self. Kagan also talks about his preference for the term manic/depressive instead of BiPolar.
Matt Sandoval, is the new Executive Director for FreeArts in Arizona. FreeArts AZ provides traumatized children and their families with a means of creative expression and as means of establishing resilience and offering mentorship.
And Kagan Goh talks with ReThreading Madness about his new film, Common Law, a biographical account of his experience of learning he had BiPolar and how this impacted on his relationships with his long-time girlfriend and family. Through this we learn how individuals who receive Persons With Disability in BC, are unable to keep this benefit if they enter into a common-law relationship and how that changes the relationship and their own sense of self. Kagan also talks about his preference for the term manic/depressive instead of BiPolar.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
You're listening to Vancouver co Op Radio cfr OH one
hundred point five FM. We're coming to you from the
unseated traditional territories of the Squamish, Muscream and Slighway tooth
nations around Vancouver be seen. I'm your host, Bernardine Fox,
and this is this show that dares to change how
we think about mental health. Welcome to Rethreading Madness.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
We have ever been fir No, what the hell I'm
gonna do when I can't sing a fine.
Speaker 3 (00:39):
Way under over.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
You're listening to Rethreading Madness on Vancouver co Op Radio
cfr OH one hundred point five FM. I'm Bernardine Fox,
and today I have a pleasure of speaking to somebody
who's coming to us from Arizona. His name is Matt
Sandobal and he's created a service for children and their
families that is art based to deal with trauma and
(01:06):
other issues. But I'm gonna let Matt tell you who
he is. So welcome Matt, Thank you, Erdave.
Speaker 4 (01:11):
It's a pleasure to be here. And yes, I am
Matt Sandoval. I am based in Arizona in an organization
called Free Arts, and Free Arts exists to provide the
transforming part of the arts to an audience of vulnerable people, children, teens,
and families who have experienced foster care and the foster
(01:32):
care system, have experienced homelessness, or may have had experience
with domestic violence or intimate partner violence. So our audience
itself is a vulnerable population. And what we do we believe,
in a very simple recipe that if the arts plus
mentors equals resilience, So in essence, our core beliefs are
(01:53):
things that we believe that art is healing. By healing,
we mean it's a process for which we turn to
return to well being, and we believe that art heals.
We believe that relationships heal, and these are growth and
healthy and healing types of influences that we access through
(02:13):
our services and through volunteer mentors. So we are adjacent
to mental health clinical spaces, but we are not practicing clinicians.
We're ordinary people who are trained to do extraordinary relationships
to an audience of children and teens and families that
have been through significant adversity and trauma.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
You're speaking about something that's near and dear to my heart,
which is the combination of art and mental health. I
did do a little bit of research around that at
one point, and you know art and nobody quote me
on these stats because I may get them wrong. But basically,
art has an incredible way of improving not just our
(02:54):
emotional health, and I think that's the thing people get most,
but it can also improve our physical health. So the
research was done with seniors, I think it was done
in the UK and in two places in the United States,
and they found that people who are seniors have a
sixty percent chance of living longer than their counterpart if
(03:16):
they even just walk through a gallery. They don't have
to actually do art. They found that they saw their
doctor less often, they took pain medications less often, their
blood pressure went down, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.
So it's really important for me recognizing that art and
our health are intricately.
Speaker 5 (03:40):
Bound to each other.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
And it makes me sad that on so many levels,
in so many areas, organizations and schools, you know, art
is the first thing to go because they tend to
see it as frivolous.
Speaker 4 (03:56):
Yeah, I agree that that is a challenge out there
where the understanding of the power of it is kind
of lost. In an interesting area like Arizona, where we
are essentially split in a kind of partisan philosophical way
fifty to fifty with just the general viewpoint on politics
in the US. So I don't mean to dip into
that too much, but to say that because of the
(04:18):
art and the way it presents, it's an interesting and
very powerful way to bind people that have been finding
a lot of other ways to be polarized. So if
we can come around relationship and we can come around
experiences with the arts, you know, even if one side
is a little bit more known to support the arts
and the other. In Arizona we have the annual governors
(04:44):
Are Award, which is a statewide thing, and depending on
who's an office, one party comes and one party doesn't.
Speaker 6 (04:50):
It's really kind of silly. But in the end, I
think that.
Speaker 4 (04:53):
We are here because there is a real specific benefit
that creative expression brings. And you know it because when
people take part in it, very natural things that our
core experiences for us become really present.
Speaker 7 (05:09):
Right.
Speaker 4 (05:09):
You see people smiling, enjoying, and there are moments where
art can be challenging, But how many times do we
accept a challenge from something that we care about, something
that's important to us right, getting a new degree, taking
a new job, taking a risk to ask someone out
on a day. All these things have uncertain futures might
(05:30):
take a little bit of work. But art is another
way to demonstrate our ability to go after things that
are important to us, but also notice what's here and
present as we're doing the activity. And so art has
unique way of both honoring the process and the effort
in an activity and also admiring and enjoying the product.
Speaker 1 (05:55):
And I will talk about it in a bit in
terms of product and process and all that stuff.
Speaker 5 (06:01):
But how many kids come through your door every year?
Speaker 6 (06:04):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (06:04):
And a we could say through the door of the
agency and say five thousand participants with over ten thousand interactions,
meaning repeated activities they're involved in. But it is an
important part of our story to say that we take
our programming whenever possible to where children live. So that
means we deliver our base programming in a foster care
(06:27):
group home. So there might be half a dozen to
ten young people living in a group home in our
structure here for child welfare, and we'll take the program
to them. We'll take the program to the shelter that
does two things for us one, it builds on an
established sense of safety and familiarity for a group that's
already been through some significant adversity and trauma and might
(06:49):
have had prior experiences of being very quickly relocated reassigned
within the system for their care. So we're taking one
less space they have to go to that's unfamiliar. And
then also all youth facing nonprofits or social service agencies
have a challenge around transportation, and so we train our
mentors to serve wherever is close to their work or
(07:12):
home and find these locations. So if we were to
show a map here, I know we're discussing this, but
we have over one hundred and twenty locations that we
have served in the last year.
Speaker 6 (07:23):
And that's I think what.
Speaker 4 (07:24):
Makes us unique is that, yes, we have a building
with an address, and you can sure come visit us
in downtown Phoenix, but you could also know that free
arts is happening where children live by.
Speaker 1 (07:33):
Design, Right, that makes sense. Can you kind of let
us know how did it start? How did you start
doing this process of providing free arts to kids.
Speaker 4 (07:48):
Yeah, we are thirty one years in the making and
I am at the tail end of that legacy right
now helping lead it go forward. But our origin story
is by a at the time, an art Board certified
art therapist named Margaret Beresford, who saw a space for subclinical,
not clinical art therapy. There are other roots for that,
(08:12):
and other people do that, and that's wonderful and great,
but she really saw an opportunity to have ordinary mentors
do group interactions with children, mostly in child welfare. And
so in nineteen ninety three that began as a series
of yard cells and rummage cells and serving fifty young people.
(08:33):
And fast forward thirty one years later, it's one hundred
and sixty five thousand plus in the one hundred and
twenty plus locations now including parts of southern Arizona and
a little bit of Prescott which is in northern Arizona.
And Free Arts itself in Arizona is one of a
few free arts concepts that are not connected in any
legal or operational way, but they have inspired one another.
(08:55):
And in our case, Margaret saw the Free Arts in
Los Angeles and that as a model and replicated that
here and we are going strong in year thirty one.
Speaker 1 (09:08):
So I just want to understand a little bit about
the process for the kids they come into the process.
Is there any expectation about what they do or how
they do it or what they gain from it.
Speaker 4 (09:21):
No, and we intentionally remove any type of grading comparison system.
This is not school. We're also not highly punitive, right.
We begin where people are ready to serve and or
get involved in a way. That can be a challenge
for some of our audience because they've been through difficult things,
sometimes very recently, and so perhaps coming into this setting
(09:45):
with new strangers, both peer and older than them, it
might be a little intimidating. So we give people a
lot of space, and we meet the young people we
serve through our partner agencies. So we partner with high welfare,
with shelters across the state, and those collective pools of
people are into twenty to thirty thousand. You're thinking individuals
(10:07):
and families impacted by either child welfare, foster care, kinship care,
and or the shelter services field. Those are all the
types of people that would qualify as our target audience,
and we begin where they are. We begin with very
accessible programming that can be done in the day up
(10:27):
to someone's ability. We also give space and also alternatives
we believe in the choice that great we came with
a visual arts design, but you really like coloring, or
you really enjoyed the sewing, and that's what you want
to do. From last week, We'll kind of get you
set up for what feels good now and helps you
(10:48):
feel comfortable enough to eventually join the group. And so
in that way, there's no grading system. One of our
significant mantras is that there are no mistakes in art,
and what we mean by that is that we can
in the arts experience the present moment, our own creation
and notice important things, which is, can we build that
(11:11):
capacity to see when I'm being self critical, when I'm
comparing myself to others.
Speaker 6 (11:17):
And I'm case in point. So even though I'm CEO
of Free.
Speaker 4 (11:20):
Arts, I'm never going to hold a gallery exhibit for
my paintings, right, I'm not at that caliber of skill. However,
there are people who serve as volunteers, some on staff
that do this. Is there, this is something they've dedicated
a lot of time and training to and guess what,
there's room for all of us. And so I'm case
and point, I am creative. I think what we're doing
(11:42):
here in this conversation creating information, creating what we hope
is entertaining, inspiring. This is an art forum, right, So
we believe that art is anything that we create, and
we believe that because there are no mistakes in art.
It's a gateway to self excit aceptance, to noticing these
feelings of comparison, of self judgment, which we hope is
(12:07):
a pathway to greater self compassion, which sounds great. And
I'm sure with your audience they've all thought about this,
maybe even heard it shared with them that this is
something they should develop. But you know, we really know
how hard it actually is to turn down some of
those self critical voices, often because they've been programmed into
(12:27):
us by other voices in our life, by important relationships.
So art is an important pathway to allowing the present
moment to accept what's in front of us and to
have even a fun and relaxing moment that's enough from
the art itself.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
As I mentioned to you before, I am a visual artist,
and one of the things that I find fascinating about
making art and putting art up and having people look
at my art, there is a whole idea of nonverbal language.
I feel that when I'm creating art, there is a
nonverbal conversation happening between me and that painting as it's
(13:09):
being created. And sometimes things are in the painting that
I never really saw. It sometimes takes me ten years
of going back and looking at a painting and go,
oh my god, I painted that, you know, back then,
not realizing I was doing it. But there's also a
nonverbal language that happens with the audience who's looking at it,
you know, because they stand in front of your painting
(13:31):
and they interpret it using their own language and their
own world and their life experiences, and so they end
up with a conversation. And I really like being able
to create something that allows people to have that conversation.
I don't even need to know what it is. And
so as you're talking, I'm realizing that, you know, very
(13:54):
you know, for kids who may not have language skills
in the same way an adults, being able to process
things even if they don't know what they're doing at
the time through art can be a very healing thing
as well, even if it's something they don't want to
talk about.
Speaker 4 (14:13):
Absolutely, And to be fair as a disclaimer, because we
are not clinically focused, because we do not do diagnosis
treatment plans. We are not directly engaging in the tough experiences.
Some of them do surface on their own because that's
what's present for the person. We have some art that
actually had neutral prompts on display that kind of tell
(14:36):
this story because that was a real important learning part
for our emerging agency, you know ten plus years ago
that we needed to be trauma response to trauma informed,
meaning we don't want to re enter spaces for people
where they're not willingly wanting to go. And that's an
important part of what we hope and what we wish
(14:58):
to do. But what you said as you started this
last segment is really powerful because the arts help us
tap into spaces beyond words. And when I think about
my own life and I've earned all my wrinkles the
old fashioned way, the reality is I look backwards and
(15:19):
I think about how I have experienced things that a
I am proud to have survived in a way, and
then also I am sad for the part of me
that was going through that that felt isolated and alone.
Speaker 6 (15:36):
And these feelings are mixed.
Speaker 4 (15:38):
So what is this So Sometimes, and maybe some of
your audience is familiar with this kind of combination feeling
of I am simultaneously bearing witness to my own suffering while.
Speaker 6 (15:48):
Also joyful about my growth through it, not wishing.
Speaker 4 (15:51):
For it to have happened, but also thankful that I'm
here to tell the story.
Speaker 6 (15:55):
That's what emotion is. That there's not necessarily.
Speaker 4 (15:59):
One word for it, because all of our experiences are
bundled in these tight spaces inside of us that are
beyond words. Yeah, and you know, I had a colleague
once who had a well they still have an Instagram
account for this, but they were a painter that was
not their primary work. But their Instagram account said, I
paint what songs look like, and if you don't understand that,
(16:20):
we can't be friends. And I get that because I'm
not saying I could paint a song, but I know
what you're getting at, which is like in someone's art,
often music and the lyrics of it. And you listen
to this in the way artists talk about their own work,
like I know what I meant, or maybe I didn't
know what I meant.
Speaker 6 (16:38):
I mean, but what did you mean? And these could
both exist and be real.
Speaker 4 (16:43):
And I think that's a really powerful way to say
there are the experiences of the creative open up for
us spaces that are difficult to access in narrative or
in words. But the expression of this and the change
over time, and who knows is the art change or
weader changing or both? And in the end does it
really matter except can I notice right now what's happening
(17:05):
as I'm being affected by my own creation or the
work that I'm enjoying. All of those blend into a
concept of where we are as a person, Our willingness
to accept our growth, and an opportunity I think on
a deep level to enjoy a little brother or sisterhood,
commonhood experience of humanity that we all you know, we
(17:29):
all go through these sufferings, some external and some self imposed.
But I think that being able to connect at a
deep level that is essentially what makes us human.
Speaker 1 (17:39):
Absolutely, And that's I couldn't have said it better. I mean,
that was beautiful. Thank you, Matt. Two of any stories
about you know, a child, I certainly don't want you
to break any confidentiality, but maybe a child who created
something that that did in fact help them move through.
Speaker 5 (18:00):
Negative material for them.
Speaker 4 (18:01):
Yeah, if we were showing video and I was doing
this in my office, there'd be a picture behind it
says free arts, and it would look like a building
with cranes. And the painting is actually the second of two.
And what had happened is the young person I think
as a teenager painted the first. And we have an
evaluation research group that works with us around our programming
and outcomes, and they were using some of our information
(18:23):
to write a chapter they were submitting for anthology about art,
and they wanted to see if there might be someone
who was now an adult who was willing to share
some of the art that they had created in the program.
So we contacted this person thinking they might be interested, and.
Speaker 6 (18:39):
They said yes.
Speaker 4 (18:41):
Ultimately, the chapter didn't get published, but this story exists,
so maybe that was the purpose of it. The book
didn't happen, but the art discussion led this person to say, yes,
you could use it, but only if I can come
in and redo it as an adult. And so in
our office are in different spaces, is the the teenage
(19:02):
version of this piece and the adult version. And I
think their insight to say, let me just measure my
own growth and change as a person by doing this
thing again for myself, but a little bit for you.
And I think That's a big part of understanding what
it means to heal, to return to well being is
(19:22):
that as we age, as we gain more experience, hopefully
we have developed a new set of skills and attitudes
and openness that we can appreciate earlier versions of.
Speaker 6 (19:36):
Ourselves in new ways.
Speaker 4 (19:37):
And I think that story of the two paintings is
symbolic of that.
Speaker 1 (19:43):
Yes, yeah, thank you Matt for coming and chatting with me.
This has been very informative, and I know that even
if people aren't in Arizona, they're going to get a
lot out of it. So I appreciate you coming and
chatting with us.
Speaker 6 (19:59):
My pleasure.
Speaker 5 (20:00):
Sure, and we'll be right back, folks.
Speaker 8 (20:02):
Tanny up Qui ge euons Queen Sna Hi, everybody. My
name is Quigate Ywon's. I'm a member of the Squamish
nation and the Yaglanis Klan of the Hyda Nation. You're
listening to co Op Radio CFRO one hundred point five FM.
We live work play and broadcast from the traditional ancestral
and unseeded territories of the Musquiam, Squamish, and slave Tooth nations.
Speaker 1 (20:26):
You're listening to Rethreading Madness on Vancouver co Op Radio
CFRO one hundred point five FM. I'm Bernadine Fox and
today I'm speaking with Gagango, who is a Actually, I
think you are one of my most interviewed people at
this point.
Speaker 5 (20:44):
You've been there.
Speaker 1 (20:45):
Since the day one, practically five years ago, so and
you've come back on for a variety of reasons and
I always look forward to having you come on. And
today we're going to talk about your film Common Law.
You're the director of producer, and it's a film about
a charismatic young poet who is finding his voice as
(21:06):
an artist when he's hit with a bipolar diagnosis which
disrupts his dreams of becoming a writer. And this life
altering diagnosis kind of upends his life, straining his relationship
with his girlfriend Daniella and his parents. He faces societal
stigma and the daunting process of applying for disability benefits.
(21:28):
Agan is faced with a gon meaning the character in
the film, but it is a film based on you,
and you're faced with the stark reality of what it
means to be human in a world not built for
disabled people. That last sentence was really striking to me
because I feel like, you know, we are living in
(21:49):
a world that is meant for basically able bodied, cisgendered.
Speaker 5 (21:55):
Men who are white.
Speaker 1 (21:57):
And if you're not that, then your job is to
somehow try and emulate that so that you can be
perceived as normal and Okay, So that last sentence was
very powerful to me.
Speaker 5 (22:12):
Again, tell people who you are.
Speaker 9 (22:15):
Well.
Speaker 7 (22:16):
I'm an Asian Canadian filmmaker, published author, spoken with poet
and mentalth advocate and activists and essentially with this film
Common Law. It's based on a true story that happened
to me when I was initially diagnosed by polar moon disorder,
which I prefer to call manic depression because it more
(22:39):
accurately describes when they're the experience of the condition. And yeah,
basically over the years, I cultivated and multi fascinated the
career and this diverse background informs my perspective as a director,
allowing me to bring depth and authenticity to my filmmaking storytelling.
(23:03):
And yeah, you know, Common Law is biographical, I mean
slightly fictionalized for dramatic purposes, but it's quite accurate to
deler the experience of what I had, what happened to
me when I was initially diagnosed with bipolar mood disorder.
In nineteen ninety three and basically after receiving a devastating,
(23:29):
devastating diagnosis of an incuble mental illness, I was applying
for disability benefits to Social Assertions for the very first time,
and I was denied the benefits because I was in
a common law relationship of three years with my then girlfriend,
and they said, she's just spouse, you can support you,
(23:51):
You're not eligible for disability benefits. And the denial of
the benefits, coupled with the double wheremme of an incurable
mental illness, led to the breakup of that relationship and
the unraveling of my family. M HM.
Speaker 1 (24:08):
When you say family, you're talking about your relationship with
Danielle or are you talking about the rest of your
family as well?
Speaker 7 (24:14):
I think all of the about both my I changed
the real name of the character from to Daniella to
hide the identity of the real person, but also to
my parents. You know, it affected everybody's not just mental
health but emotional health. It was quite traumatic, you know.
Speaker 5 (24:37):
So were you? I'm sorry?
Speaker 10 (24:39):
Go ahead, Yeah, I think this film there there's kind
of like a story money impact campaign like campaign, which
is usually done to documentary films.
Speaker 7 (24:53):
When we're doing it.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
For this.
Speaker 7 (24:57):
Dramatic film that's basically about a half hour dramatic film,
we've got a questionnaire and a QR code which you
can scan on a postcard which has a post screening
questionnaire asking questions whether you've ever been on disability or
whether you know somebody who has been on disability, How
did this film impact you in different questions because part
(25:21):
of it, too is we're trying to legislate or change
policy regarding disability benefits and how it impacts people with
disability in common law relationships. You know, it's quite common
and it's quite widespread how this impacts people with disability
that oftentimes we live in isolation, loneliness because of these
(25:45):
legislations that prevent people from you know, basically assign them
to becoming financial burdens upon their partner and oftentimes lead
to the breakup, so divorce of relationships and marriages or
common law relationships. So it's quite draconian and quite inhumane,
(26:05):
and I think it is somewhat of human rights issue,
you know, I think in society, you know, it's a
privilege to be in a relationship, but oftentimes people with disabilities.
I denied that privilege because of the position they're put
in with this legislation and policy.
Speaker 1 (26:26):
You know, So what you're saying is that to get
a person's with disability pench, which is what it's called NBC,
you cannot be in a common law relationship with somebody
else who is working. Or what if you were both
people with disabilities, what would happen?
Speaker 7 (26:48):
Then basically you're not in the past, you weren't allowed
to even be in a common law relationship or that
person would have to support you. Or if you are
in a common law relationship collectively as a couple, you're
only allowed to earn up to twenty three thousand, four
(27:10):
hundred and anything above that will be clawed back by
the government. So we'll be taken away. And how can
two people living in an expensive city like Vancouver or
British Columbia or this country Canada survive on twenty four thousand,
three hundred, You know, it's pretty much living below the
(27:32):
poverty line, and that kind of financial strain oftentimes leads
to breakups, you know, of that relationship, or.
Speaker 1 (27:42):
If somebody is working, then the person with PWG would
be disqualified for that pension. Yeah, even though they get
that pension because they are a person with the disability.
So basically they're saying, if you want to be with
this person, then you will need to support them. And
I can see that, you know, for some relationships. Certainly
(28:04):
there are relationships where people, you know, one person is working,
the other person isn't, but they want to be together
and they say, come live with me, I will support you,
and that happens. I mean, certainly it happens that one
person supports them as a couple.
Speaker 5 (28:21):
But with you, when.
Speaker 1 (28:23):
You're a person with a disability, it's not like you
have the option of going and working, right, I mean,
that's the whole point of being somebody with a disability
is It means that you cannot function in the same
way out there in the world. And although you can
make some money, but you cannot don't necessarily survive on that.
(28:44):
So it does mean that, And correct me if I'm
wrong that if you're a person with a disability, you
have to kind of be alone and get your pension
and make whatever money you can on top of that.
However much you can work, but you can't, it's kind
of hard. It would be hard to entertain a relationship
(29:06):
knowing that if you become serious in that relationship, that
you will become that person's financial burden.
Speaker 7 (29:16):
Yeah, I mean, there's the the tagline of the film
is I'm not going to support an invalid for the
rest of my life. That's what my partner and my
common law partner at the time. That was her reaction to,
you know, when she heard the bad news of what
this policy would pertain. You know that she would be
(29:38):
responsible for me financially for the rest of my life.
And she said, I'm not going to support an invalid
for the rest of my life. And those are very
hurtful words, but they were also very honest words. You know,
she wanted to that that that's a huge responsibility and
not everybody's willing to take that on.
Speaker 1 (29:56):
Yes, now, if you were living at home with your
parents and getting PWG, that wouldn't impact on your pension
with it. No, so it only impacts if you are
in a common law relationship or get married.
Speaker 5 (30:13):
Yeah, yes, okay, So tell me more about who are
the characters in the film.
Speaker 7 (30:20):
Well, the part of my character played by Australian born actor,
but then Lou plays me in my early twenties. Kegan
Go is the main character who's a charismatic young poet
who's finding his voices spoke as as an artist when
you know, this bipolar mood disorder, this rucks his trajectory
(30:45):
of realizing his dreams of becoming a writer. And then
there's his partner, common law partner Daniella, who's you know,
applying for med school and is part of this family
household for the last three years, living in a common
law relationship with Corgan, and she loves Kagan dearly, but
(31:08):
has misgivings about the prospect of being financially responsible for
him for the rest of his life. And the lynch
print of it is she's the fullcon of the film.
You know, she's really torn between supporting Kagan, loving Hergan dearly,
but being caught between a rock and hard place, and
it's a very hard decision that eventually breaks them. And
(31:30):
then there's the parents Gopos saying, who is my father?
Who kind of enables Kagan by his generous financial donations
to him, trying to support him and kind of enables
his Kagan's core dependency on him, and which causes a
strain on the relationship with his wife, Margaret, you know,
(31:54):
who holds the purse strings and is you know, uh,
oftentimes fears appearing stringent because she's in charge of the
finance family's finances. So a lot of it's this financial
pressures and stuff like that. But beyond that, it's a
very loving family that's kind of being torn apart it
(32:16):
the seams. It's a really for a half hour drama.
Berlin Lou, the lead actor, went to an incredible transformation
that was so complete that I was absolutely convinced that
he had bipolar mood disorder, which wasn't true once I
got to know him better. He basically embodied the characters
(32:38):
so completely that for a short half hour film, he
went from hypomania to mania, to psychosis to depression on
the space of thirty minutes. Absolutely powerful, moving and compelling performance.
Speaker 6 (32:57):
You know.
Speaker 7 (32:59):
And Henry J. Marr plays go posting my father who
was a Singapore literary pioneer and point novelist and playwright,
and he struggles with Parkinson's disease and major depression, and
he's he inspires Kagun to pursue writing and acts as
a role model and mentors to Kagun and Margaret Joyce Wog.
(33:23):
My mother is the lone care taker of the family
of both go post Sing and Kagan, and she feels
the burden of being the lone caregiver and oftentimes feels
resented by and resentful towards a family for that reason,
(33:43):
you know. So it's a it's a very heavy drama,
but it's essentially common law. Was made as kind of
an example of a potential pilot episode for a threeas
in television series Entitle. The Delicate Imbalance is basically like
(34:05):
a pilot episode and a calling cord film. So I'm
hoping to interest producers and broadcasters and the powers that
be that this film hopefully will open up those two
opportunities to developing this TV series.
Speaker 5 (34:23):
You know, that's a wonderful.
Speaker 1 (34:26):
We just need to take a little break here again,
but we're going to come right back, and I want
to talk a little bit more about the film and
manic Depressive as you've described it, So we'll be right back.
Speaker 9 (34:37):
Books.
Speaker 1 (34:42):
There's a whole crowd of people out there who need
to learn how to do the scar nice question.
Speaker 9 (34:49):
You don't know, my listen way too to be talking
to you. Should it take them? I'm not a look,
very comet's take what I want when I want to,
and I want you bad news. One of us has
done and lose on the powdery or confuse. Just add
(35:14):
some friction. Sure mystreames addiction, Sure my Stream's addiction. My
God can't explain the symptoms on my pay and a
strange addiction.
Speaker 7 (35:35):
I'm really really sorry. I think I was just relieved
to see that. Michael backl The movie is amazing.
Speaker 6 (35:41):
It's like one of the best movies I've ever seen
in my life.
Speaker 9 (35:45):
Favor please don't break be my really because I don't
sup medicaid and it burns like a chin and I
like it because you live some much sin and you
might igniteded hearts, but I know how to hide it
and I like it bad than nesse. One of us
(36:06):
is done and lose something like crowdy or the fuse.
Just add some friction, my Stern's addiction, my Stern's addiction.
But I just can't explain my symptoms all my plain
(36:27):
which Mysterns deddiction by my glass, set myself on fire,
catch it toe the craps, catch it toe word, tell
me less than last like I don't you could kiss
(36:52):
my skill.
Speaker 7 (36:57):
You should enter at festivals or colons.
Speaker 11 (37:01):
What pretty good reaction?
Speaker 9 (37:03):
Pretty cool.
Speaker 7 (37:05):
Right question?
Speaker 9 (37:09):
Mus dediction us addiction is trans That's simply that Paine
the street musication.
Speaker 1 (37:29):
Hi everyone, This is Bernardine Fox from Rethreading Madness that
airs on Vancouver call Out Radio every Tuesday at five pm.
Vancouver call Up Radio CFR one hundred point five FM
is a unique nonprofit community radio station and podcast recording
studio that provides a voice for those underrepresented in the
mainstream media. They provide the airwaves for Rethreading Madness to
(37:52):
examine mental health from individual and important perspectives. They do
so with donations from folks like you. If you have
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Speaker 5 (38:05):
With a credit card.
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Co Op Radio all one word dot org and hit
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every Tuesday at five pm until then.
Speaker 5 (38:51):
Stay safe out there.
Speaker 1 (38:54):
You're listening to Rethreading Madness on Vancouver. Call up Radio
cfr O one hundred point five f M. I'm Burney
and Fox and I'm speaking with director producer again go
about his film, his docu drama. Is it a docu
drama or is it just considered a drama drama? A drama,
but it is based on a true story, in fact,
your true story called common Law. Yeah again, you talked
(39:18):
about manic depressive challenges and talked about how you didn't
like the term bipolar. Can you talk a little bit
more about that.
Speaker 6 (39:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 7 (39:31):
I know it's somewhat antiquated to use the old manic
depression and people have misgivings about it, but personally, speaking
from my own lived experience, is more accurately describes my
personal live experience of both the high zarmania, the terrors
of psychosis, and the loads of depression. You know, just
(39:52):
a terminal. It's just a preference, you know, to each
of their old women. That's just my own personal preference.
Speaker 1 (39:58):
I'm i applaud you for sticking to your own personal preference.
Speaker 5 (40:04):
I think we have a right to define who we
are and what we live with.
Speaker 1 (40:09):
You also talk about in the press release that you
talk about dealing with mental health challenges that are different
in the Asian Canadian community. Can you talk a little
bit about how they're different or how you see them
as being different.
Speaker 12 (40:23):
Yeah, Basically an Asian Canadian community, there's a huge stigma
about mental illness, and it's the monster and the closet
that nobody wants to talk about.
Speaker 7 (40:34):
Literally, they I don't know if they still do it,
but you know, it's almost like you're sequested away in
an attic and hidden from sight. Nobody talks about it,
nobody deals with it, and as a result, Asian men
in particular really languish from mental health challenges and rarely
seek help because of fear of us appearing weak and vulnerable,
(40:58):
you know, because it's supposed to be wrong and the
head of the family and red winners, et cetera. So
it's a real problem the Asian Canadian community, it's not
being addressed. That's why. That's one of the primary reasons
that I made the film to show an empathetic and
sensitive and frank and honest portrayal of a Chinese Canadian
(41:22):
male struggling through the challenges of navigating the mental health system,
a psychiatric system, the welfare system, you know, and hopefully
people can learn vacaviously through the trials and errors how
to navigate those systems. And you know, my book Surviving
Some Sara, which part of this story is based on,
(41:45):
which was shortlisted for the Simple Literature Prize in the
Creative Nonfiction and English category, was called by some of
the readers of the book a life saver. And I'm
hoping this TV series will be that kind of force,
you know, a positive.
Speaker 1 (42:03):
Change around people dealing with mental health challenges or families,
I suppose even families dealing with mental health challenges.
Speaker 7 (42:16):
Yeah, I mean basically the film and TV series developed,
especially this film delves into the impact of government policies
and societal stigma and cultural expectations, especially from the Asian
community and those living and mental illness. You know. But
I think it's an incredibly relevant story and I think
(42:37):
I'm hoping that this film will opened up those to
develop this TV series concept. I have a show bible,
I have, you know, three seasons of twenty seven episodes
mapped out, and I'm really hoping that this project will
take off because I think it especially mental health. People
(42:59):
pay lip service the mental health saying you know, it's
a tight geist at the times, but it really is.
And I think a series like this is timely, meaningful
and also highly original in terms of the protagonists finding
his voice as a spoken word artists and find healing
(43:20):
and transformation from being a victim or a survivor of
the mental health care system to ultimately self actualized mental
health advocate and then becomes a self proclaimed artist. You know,
So there's a transformation and a journey in a bit
of an arc.
Speaker 1 (43:40):
Yes.
Speaker 5 (43:41):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (43:42):
You talk about government policies, is that the policies that
require people who have PWD and enter a common law
relationship that they lose that pension yep. And have you
been able to talk with people within government about those
have you had conversations with them about how this is unfair?
Speaker 9 (44:05):
Uh?
Speaker 7 (44:06):
That's what I'm hoping to bring this to Victoria and
screen it. You know, if there's a way to even
get some politicians or policy makers to watch this film
on a humanistic level as opposed to just a policy
or political film. I don't want it to just be
seen as a message film or as a political film,
(44:27):
because it's not. It's primarily a fire family drama or
a mental health drama. But I think it transcends even
those definitions and those narrow definitions, and I'm hoping, you know, basically,
I've been told by the powers that be it's not
just a provincial legislation or a federal legislation, but you
(44:50):
have to go all the way to the Supreme Court
and even further than that in terms of the policy
being dictated by legislation and policy done by the United Nations.
So I feel that someone's like a mister Smith goes
to Washington, kind of like I'm Jimmy Stewart having to
march out to the United Nations. It's a bit daunting
(45:16):
that it's such an arduous and difficult process. But now
you have to start somewhere, and I don't even know
if it's possible, but at least get the conversation going, you.
Speaker 1 (45:27):
Know, absolutely, conversation, absolutely, you talk about how the mental
health getting the diagnosis impacted on your family. Can you
talk a little bit about how that happened?
Speaker 5 (45:42):
Yeah, it happened.
Speaker 7 (45:44):
Basically when I received I was told that I had
an incurble mental illness that would lost the rest of
my life.
Speaker 5 (45:51):
And let me just stop you there.
Speaker 1 (45:53):
Let me ask you what does that feel like to
be told you have an incurable disease which I hate
to talk about mental health in those terms at all,
but that it's incurable and you'll never work. Like when
you walk out of an office and that is what
you've been told, what are you left with? What does
(46:13):
that do to you?
Speaker 7 (46:15):
It's like receiving a life sentence as a prisoner for
a crime that you did not commit, right, you know,
a life sentence with no parole. Okay, that that was
the impact that it had on me, and not quite
a death sentence because I'm still alive. You know, your
life does an end, but a part of your life
(46:38):
ends and a new normal happens and suddenly, all of
a sudden, become a professional mental patient. You're seeing in
a different light as a disabled person, you know M.
Speaker 5 (46:49):
And not just disabled, I e.
Speaker 1 (46:51):
With a wheelchair because I think we live in a
society that handles the wheelchair much better than they handle
a diagnosis like bipolar, which just confuses them. Most people
don't know what that means, and they're not sure if
it's scary, and you know, I'm not sure what that
will mean. Yet you will do you know, maybe you'll
act erratically or you know.
Speaker 5 (47:12):
It's that whole.
Speaker 1 (47:12):
Social stigma stuff that happens around mental health challenges, you know,
so it impacts you on a double whammy. It's not
just what the psychiatry said, it's what you take out
and what the rest of the world deals with you.
Have you dealt with social stigma in that capacity, it continues.
Speaker 7 (47:31):
To baffle me. But yes, it's challenging day by day,
moment by moment, and you know, it used to cripple
me to certain extent that I used to really suffer
from those self esteem and shame about it. You know,
I felt that almost like I was fighting an invisible enemy.
(47:53):
The stigma of prejudicial discrimination was so prevalent and so
invisible that it was like fighting a fandom and invisible
ghosts and an invisible enemy. And then all this pent
up anger and rage and frustration but nowhere to direct
it because it's insinuated and the way you are treated
(48:13):
by family, friends, social workers, doctors, nurses, psychiatrists, welfare workers,
you know, but you can't locate it. It's so subtle
and it's supposed to be done. It's the people are
doing it are well meaning but misguided. And the way
(48:34):
I turned it that frustration and anger it became self hate.
And basically this TV series chronicles the journey from self
hate to the eight They say there are seven stages
of grief, and I returned it seven eight stages of
grief of mental illness, and from anger to bargaining to
(48:56):
you know whatever, shame, to guilt and then eventually, hopefully
towards acceptance and to finally, you know, towards unconditional self love.
If that's if that's a goal that's or a state
that's team unachievable, that's the journey that the protagonist takes,
(49:18):
and I'm hoping it will be a healing journey. That's
why I changed the title of the TV series from
Surviving some Sava. First of all, not many people know
what some sava means, which is a Buddhish Sanskrit term
for the word then round the rebirth and suffering, death
(49:40):
and rebirth, and I didn't want to have a term
that was so arsoteric and religious that nobody would understand it.
And I also didn't want to focus on the terms survival,
because you think of survival as fight, flight and hide
and the survival instincts. And I didn't want it to
focus on the making drama, the trauma, suffering puffed out
(50:03):
of pain. I wanted to focus on the transformative journey
of healing, and yeah, basically healing and recovery. You know
that it is possible, not in some kind of inspiration
one kind of way, but in the very down to earth,
every man, everyday pedestrian kind of journey of a mental
(50:28):
health patient to becoming a mental health advocate and activist
and mental health looker at the end, you know.
Speaker 1 (50:35):
Yeah, And I find that that your story is fascinating
and that you were told that it's incurable and you
will never work again, But here you are having, you know,
climbed that mountain out of these ideas and these expectations,
these non expectations put on you, and you've found a
(50:57):
way to to in fact use that diagnosis to find
a way to give back to the community and into
society and to work.
Speaker 5 (51:06):
And I just applaud you for that.
Speaker 1 (51:08):
Where can people see those film? It's if there's a
premiere coming up, the world premiere. Where is that happening
and when can people come and see it?
Speaker 7 (51:15):
Yeah, come see the world premiere of my film at
the Vancouver Asian Film Festival twenty twenty four and check
out the other great Asian films from November seventh to
the seventeenth. Let me give you some information about it.
The world premiere of Common Law schedules for Saturday, November ninth,
(51:35):
twenty twenty four, at four pm at International Village Cinemas
as part of the Reality Check West Coast Narrative Shorts
program at the twenty eighth annual Vancouver Asian Film Festival. Myself,
director and Go produces Andy Wong and Yun Joe Chen
(51:59):
and lead the Berlin who will be in attendance, offering
audience as a unique opportunity to engage with this important conversation.
Speaker 5 (52:10):
That's wonderful. Go again, Thank you. So that's again.
Speaker 1 (52:13):
That's on September ninth, which is in a few days
at four pm. Common Law scheduled at the Internationvillage Cinema
and Vancouver Asian Film Festival after November ninth. Where will
people be able to find this film.
Speaker 7 (52:29):
Hopefully on television.
Speaker 13 (52:31):
If I managed to get it picked up in green
lit by a production company, it's a long process that
might take years, but after Yeah, that's the word I'm
been taking this film.
Speaker 7 (52:45):
It's going to be it at the film festivals oh
by the way, next year in twenty twenty five. Early
in twenty twenty five, the Cattle Friendship Society is sponsoring
a community screening and fundraise of this film at the
Real Theater.
Speaker 5 (53:01):
Oh cool.
Speaker 7 (53:02):
I will keep you into when that will be happening.
It's solo film screening as opposed to a multiple squeening
of other films, and there will be the Ketl Choir
and different speakers and panels and Q and A discussions,
and it should be in some ways. I'm looking forward
to the head even more than the world premiere because
(53:25):
the whole of the Kel Friendship Society, which is a
mental health organization that I work for, will be there
and staff, the members, my spoken work community, my film
making community, and my friends, my family and my co workers.
It's really gonna be an incredible celebration. You're going to
reach out to all the mental health organizations from the
(53:47):
Coast Foundation MPa, Motivation, Power and Achievement and.
Speaker 1 (53:53):
Yeah good, that sounds great. Yeah, do come back and
let us know when that's happening. So where can people
find out more information about you again.
Speaker 7 (54:03):
Basically through my Instagram. I've got a handle common Law Film.
Speaker 1 (54:09):
Thank you.
Speaker 5 (54:10):
Okay, bye bye, and we'll be right back.
Speaker 7 (54:12):
Folks.
Speaker 11 (54:12):
Hi, folks, this is Steve ferguson your twenty first century
schizoid Man, and I'm the host of prog Rock Alley,
inviting you to come down and listen to our show
every week at Monday one am the very end of
the weekend. We will be looking at all forms of
progressive rock. I'm talking about space rock, art rock, math, rock, fusion, jazz.
(54:33):
You want it, I got it. Just name it, I'll
play it. We'll see you again. That's here on CFRORO
one hundred point five co Op Radio Monday mornings one am.
Speaker 14 (54:46):
CFRORO has the most reggae and Caribbean music of any
station in the Vancouver area. Start your week off with
some reggae oldies on Tuesdays from ten thirty am to
noon with a level of vibes. Roots Reggae is on
Fridays from midnight to seven eight The Reggae Show from
six to eight thirty pm every Saturday, followed by Caribbean
Sounds from eight thirty to eleven pm. On the first
(55:07):
and second Saturday of every month. It's a Reggae Extended
Mix from eleven pm to seven am, and then super
Mix on the third, fourth and fifth Saturday on CFRO
one hundred point five FM, Vancouver Cooperative Radio.
Speaker 5 (55:23):
And that's our show.
Speaker 1 (55:24):
My thanks to Matt Sandoval from Free Arts Arizona for
telling us about providing free art to traumatized children, and
to Gegango for chatting with us about his new film
Common Law. Music Today was by Billie Eilish and Sherry Allred.
You've just listened to Rethreading Madness, where we dare to
change how we think about mental health. We air live
on Vancouver co Op Radio CFRO one hundred point five
(55:46):
FM every Tuesday at five pm or online at co
opradio dot org. If you have questions or feedback about
this program, I want to share your story or have
something to say to us.
Speaker 5 (55:57):
We want to hear from you.
Speaker 1 (55:59):
You can reach us by email rethreading Madness at corp
Radio dot org. This is Bernardine Fox.
Speaker 5 (56:05):
We'll be back next week.
Speaker 2 (56:06):
Until now, when I've ever been further going, what the
hell I'm gonna do when I can't see him to
find my way under over to.
Speaker 3 (56:28):
Just when I'm ready to give up the fight, they
are when we turn out the lights in it's all right, it's.
Speaker 2 (56:40):
All right, go, you'll be alright.
Speaker 3 (56:47):
Why I always believe when you're telling me everything it's
gonna be our right?
Speaker 9 (56:57):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (57:03):
Why don't I wonder how you know? Surely you don't
have all of the facts. You could be just making it.
Speaker 2 (57:18):
Why don't I ever think of that? It's some god
imagin in the words that you read.
Speaker 3 (57:29):
Saying, baby, take it from me, it's all right, it's
all right. Don't too all really be alright? Why do alwaisbelieve?
Speaker 15 (57:45):
But when he tells me everything's gonna be off right,
everything's gonna be off.
Speaker 3 (57:56):
Right any one else? It's such a cliche, just words
people say to be nice somehow, and ny fall from you.
I'm convinced your when I'm weary and so tired, when
(58:45):
I'm worn out and when I fall off the why again,
no more strength they get back on. You are with
that voice in my saying the words, and neither he
(59:09):
it's all right, it's all right.
Speaker 9 (59:13):
Don't.
Speaker 3 (59:15):
Really alright.
Speaker 1 (59:19):
But a while.
Speaker 3 (59:21):
But when they tell me everything's gonna be.
Speaker 15 (59:26):
Alright, Oh everything, it's gonna be all right. Everything's gonna
be alrightkay.
Speaker 1 (01:03:46):
And as always our things goes out to you for
joining us today.
Speaker 5 (01:03:49):
Stay safe out there.
You're listening to Vancouver co Op Radio cfr OH one
hundred point five FM. We're coming to you from the
unseated traditional territories of the Squamish, Muscream and Slighway tooth
nations around Vancouver be seen. I'm your host, Bernardine Fox,
and this is this show that dares to change how
we think about mental health. Welcome to Rethreading Madness.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
We have ever been fir No, what the hell I'm
gonna do when I can't sing a fine.
Speaker 3 (00:39):
Way under over.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
You're listening to Rethreading Madness on Vancouver co Op Radio
cfr OH one hundred point five FM. I'm Bernardine Fox,
and today I have a pleasure of speaking to somebody
who's coming to us from Arizona. His name is Matt
Sandobal and he's created a service for children and their
families that is art based to deal with trauma and
(01:06):
other issues. But I'm gonna let Matt tell you who
he is. So welcome Matt, Thank you, Erdave.
Speaker 4 (01:11):
It's a pleasure to be here. And yes, I am
Matt Sandoval. I am based in Arizona in an organization
called Free Arts, and Free Arts exists to provide the
transforming part of the arts to an audience of vulnerable people, children, teens,
and families who have experienced foster care and the foster
(01:32):
care system, have experienced homelessness, or may have had experience
with domestic violence or intimate partner violence. So our audience
itself is a vulnerable population. And what we do we believe,
in a very simple recipe that if the arts plus
mentors equals resilience, So in essence, our core beliefs are
(01:53):
things that we believe that art is healing. By healing,
we mean it's a process for which we turn to
return to well being, and we believe that art heals.
We believe that relationships heal, and these are growth and
healthy and healing types of influences that we access through
(02:13):
our services and through volunteer mentors. So we are adjacent
to mental health clinical spaces, but we are not practicing clinicians.
We're ordinary people who are trained to do extraordinary relationships
to an audience of children and teens and families that
have been through significant adversity and trauma.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
You're speaking about something that's near and dear to my heart,
which is the combination of art and mental health. I
did do a little bit of research around that at
one point, and you know art and nobody quote me
on these stats because I may get them wrong. But basically,
art has an incredible way of improving not just our
(02:54):
emotional health, and I think that's the thing people get most,
but it can also improve our physical health. So the
research was done with seniors, I think it was done
in the UK and in two places in the United States,
and they found that people who are seniors have a
sixty percent chance of living longer than their counterpart if
(03:16):
they even just walk through a gallery. They don't have
to actually do art. They found that they saw their
doctor less often, they took pain medications less often, their
blood pressure went down, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.
So it's really important for me recognizing that art and
our health are intricately.
Speaker 5 (03:40):
Bound to each other.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
And it makes me sad that on so many levels,
in so many areas, organizations and schools, you know, art
is the first thing to go because they tend to
see it as frivolous.
Speaker 4 (03:56):
Yeah, I agree that that is a challenge out there
where the understanding of the power of it is kind
of lost. In an interesting area like Arizona, where we
are essentially split in a kind of partisan philosophical way
fifty to fifty with just the general viewpoint on politics
in the US. So I don't mean to dip into
that too much, but to say that because of the
(04:18):
art and the way it presents, it's an interesting and
very powerful way to bind people that have been finding
a lot of other ways to be polarized. So if
we can come around relationship and we can come around
experiences with the arts, you know, even if one side
is a little bit more known to support the arts
and the other. In Arizona we have the annual governors
(04:44):
Are Award, which is a statewide thing, and depending on
who's an office, one party comes and one party doesn't.
Speaker 6 (04:50):
It's really kind of silly. But in the end, I
think that.
Speaker 4 (04:53):
We are here because there is a real specific benefit
that creative expression brings. And you know it because when
people take part in it, very natural things that our
core experiences for us become really present.
Speaker 7 (05:09):
Right.
Speaker 4 (05:09):
You see people smiling, enjoying, and there are moments where
art can be challenging, But how many times do we
accept a challenge from something that we care about, something
that's important to us right, getting a new degree, taking
a new job, taking a risk to ask someone out
on a day. All these things have uncertain futures might
(05:30):
take a little bit of work. But art is another
way to demonstrate our ability to go after things that
are important to us, but also notice what's here and
present as we're doing the activity. And so art has
unique way of both honoring the process and the effort
in an activity and also admiring and enjoying the product.
Speaker 1 (05:55):
And I will talk about it in a bit in
terms of product and process and all that stuff.
Speaker 5 (06:01):
But how many kids come through your door every year?
Speaker 6 (06:04):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (06:04):
And a we could say through the door of the
agency and say five thousand participants with over ten thousand interactions,
meaning repeated activities they're involved in. But it is an
important part of our story to say that we take
our programming whenever possible to where children live. So that
means we deliver our base programming in a foster care
(06:27):
group home. So there might be half a dozen to
ten young people living in a group home in our
structure here for child welfare, and we'll take the program
to them. We'll take the program to the shelter that
does two things for us one, it builds on an
established sense of safety and familiarity for a group that's
already been through some significant adversity and trauma and might
(06:49):
have had prior experiences of being very quickly relocated reassigned
within the system for their care. So we're taking one
less space they have to go to that's unfamiliar. And
then also all youth facing nonprofits or social service agencies
have a challenge around transportation, and so we train our
mentors to serve wherever is close to their work or
(07:12):
home and find these locations. So if we were to
show a map here, I know we're discussing this, but
we have over one hundred and twenty locations that we
have served in the last year.
Speaker 6 (07:23):
And that's I think what.
Speaker 4 (07:24):
Makes us unique is that, yes, we have a building
with an address, and you can sure come visit us
in downtown Phoenix, but you could also know that free
arts is happening where children live by.
Speaker 1 (07:33):
Design, Right, that makes sense. Can you kind of let
us know how did it start? How did you start
doing this process of providing free arts to kids.
Speaker 4 (07:48):
Yeah, we are thirty one years in the making and
I am at the tail end of that legacy right
now helping lead it go forward. But our origin story
is by a at the time, an art Board certified
art therapist named Margaret Beresford, who saw a space for subclinical,
not clinical art therapy. There are other roots for that,
(08:12):
and other people do that, and that's wonderful and great,
but she really saw an opportunity to have ordinary mentors
do group interactions with children, mostly in child welfare. And
so in nineteen ninety three that began as a series
of yard cells and rummage cells and serving fifty young people.
(08:33):
And fast forward thirty one years later, it's one hundred
and sixty five thousand plus in the one hundred and
twenty plus locations now including parts of southern Arizona and
a little bit of Prescott which is in northern Arizona.
And Free Arts itself in Arizona is one of a
few free arts concepts that are not connected in any
legal or operational way, but they have inspired one another.
(08:55):
And in our case, Margaret saw the Free Arts in
Los Angeles and that as a model and replicated that
here and we are going strong in year thirty one.
Speaker 1 (09:08):
So I just want to understand a little bit about
the process for the kids they come into the process.
Is there any expectation about what they do or how
they do it or what they gain from it.
Speaker 4 (09:21):
No, and we intentionally remove any type of grading comparison system.
This is not school. We're also not highly punitive, right.
We begin where people are ready to serve and or
get involved in a way. That can be a challenge
for some of our audience because they've been through difficult things,
sometimes very recently, and so perhaps coming into this setting
(09:45):
with new strangers, both peer and older than them, it
might be a little intimidating. So we give people a
lot of space, and we meet the young people we
serve through our partner agencies. So we partner with high welfare,
with shelters across the state, and those collective pools of
people are into twenty to thirty thousand. You're thinking individuals
(10:07):
and families impacted by either child welfare, foster care, kinship care,
and or the shelter services field. Those are all the
types of people that would qualify as our target audience,
and we begin where they are. We begin with very
accessible programming that can be done in the day up
(10:27):
to someone's ability. We also give space and also alternatives
we believe in the choice that great we came with
a visual arts design, but you really like coloring, or
you really enjoyed the sewing, and that's what you want
to do. From last week, We'll kind of get you
set up for what feels good now and helps you
(10:48):
feel comfortable enough to eventually join the group. And so
in that way, there's no grading system. One of our
significant mantras is that there are no mistakes in art,
and what we mean by that is that we can
in the arts experience the present moment, our own creation
and notice important things, which is, can we build that
(11:11):
capacity to see when I'm being self critical, when I'm
comparing myself to others.
Speaker 6 (11:17):
And I'm case in point. So even though I'm CEO
of Free.
Speaker 4 (11:20):
Arts, I'm never going to hold a gallery exhibit for
my paintings, right, I'm not at that caliber of skill. However,
there are people who serve as volunteers, some on staff
that do this. Is there, this is something they've dedicated
a lot of time and training to and guess what,
there's room for all of us. And so I'm case
and point, I am creative. I think what we're doing
(11:42):
here in this conversation creating information, creating what we hope
is entertaining, inspiring. This is an art forum, right, So
we believe that art is anything that we create, and
we believe that because there are no mistakes in art.
It's a gateway to self excit aceptance, to noticing these
feelings of comparison, of self judgment, which we hope is
(12:07):
a pathway to greater self compassion, which sounds great. And
I'm sure with your audience they've all thought about this,
maybe even heard it shared with them that this is
something they should develop. But you know, we really know
how hard it actually is to turn down some of
those self critical voices, often because they've been programmed into
(12:27):
us by other voices in our life, by important relationships.
So art is an important pathway to allowing the present
moment to accept what's in front of us and to
have even a fun and relaxing moment that's enough from
the art itself.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
As I mentioned to you before, I am a visual artist,
and one of the things that I find fascinating about
making art and putting art up and having people look
at my art, there is a whole idea of nonverbal language.
I feel that when I'm creating art, there is a
nonverbal conversation happening between me and that painting as it's
(13:09):
being created. And sometimes things are in the painting that
I never really saw. It sometimes takes me ten years
of going back and looking at a painting and go,
oh my god, I painted that, you know, back then,
not realizing I was doing it. But there's also a
nonverbal language that happens with the audience who's looking at it,
you know, because they stand in front of your painting
(13:31):
and they interpret it using their own language and their
own world and their life experiences, and so they end
up with a conversation. And I really like being able
to create something that allows people to have that conversation.
I don't even need to know what it is. And
so as you're talking, I'm realizing that, you know, very
(13:54):
you know, for kids who may not have language skills
in the same way an adults, being able to process
things even if they don't know what they're doing at
the time through art can be a very healing thing
as well, even if it's something they don't want to
talk about.
Speaker 4 (14:13):
Absolutely, And to be fair as a disclaimer, because we
are not clinically focused, because we do not do diagnosis
treatment plans. We are not directly engaging in the tough experiences.
Some of them do surface on their own because that's
what's present for the person. We have some art that
actually had neutral prompts on display that kind of tell
(14:36):
this story because that was a real important learning part
for our emerging agency, you know ten plus years ago
that we needed to be trauma response to trauma informed,
meaning we don't want to re enter spaces for people
where they're not willingly wanting to go. And that's an
important part of what we hope and what we wish
(14:58):
to do. But what you said as you started this
last segment is really powerful because the arts help us
tap into spaces beyond words. And when I think about
my own life and I've earned all my wrinkles the
old fashioned way, the reality is I look backwards and
(15:19):
I think about how I have experienced things that a
I am proud to have survived in a way, and
then also I am sad for the part of me
that was going through that that felt isolated and alone.
Speaker 6 (15:36):
And these feelings are mixed.
Speaker 4 (15:38):
So what is this So Sometimes, and maybe some of
your audience is familiar with this kind of combination feeling
of I am simultaneously bearing witness to my own suffering while.
Speaker 6 (15:48):
Also joyful about my growth through it, not wishing.
Speaker 4 (15:51):
For it to have happened, but also thankful that I'm
here to tell the story.
Speaker 6 (15:55):
That's what emotion is. That there's not necessarily.
Speaker 4 (15:59):
One word for it, because all of our experiences are
bundled in these tight spaces inside of us that are
beyond words. Yeah, and you know, I had a colleague
once who had a well they still have an Instagram
account for this, but they were a painter that was
not their primary work. But their Instagram account said, I
paint what songs look like, and if you don't understand that,
(16:20):
we can't be friends. And I get that because I'm
not saying I could paint a song, but I know
what you're getting at, which is like in someone's art,
often music and the lyrics of it. And you listen
to this in the way artists talk about their own work,
like I know what I meant, or maybe I didn't
know what I meant.
Speaker 6 (16:38):
I mean, but what did you mean? And these could
both exist and be real.
Speaker 4 (16:43):
And I think that's a really powerful way to say
there are the experiences of the creative open up for
us spaces that are difficult to access in narrative or
in words. But the expression of this and the change
over time, and who knows is the art change or
weader changing or both? And in the end does it
really matter except can I notice right now what's happening
(17:05):
as I'm being affected by my own creation or the
work that I'm enjoying. All of those blend into a
concept of where we are as a person, Our willingness
to accept our growth, and an opportunity I think on
a deep level to enjoy a little brother or sisterhood,
commonhood experience of humanity that we all you know, we
(17:29):
all go through these sufferings, some external and some self imposed.
But I think that being able to connect at a
deep level that is essentially what makes us human.
Speaker 1 (17:39):
Absolutely, And that's I couldn't have said it better. I mean,
that was beautiful. Thank you, Matt. Two of any stories
about you know, a child, I certainly don't want you
to break any confidentiality, but maybe a child who created
something that that did in fact help them move through.
Speaker 5 (18:00):
Negative material for them.
Speaker 4 (18:01):
Yeah, if we were showing video and I was doing
this in my office, there'd be a picture behind it
says free arts, and it would look like a building
with cranes. And the painting is actually the second of two.
And what had happened is the young person I think
as a teenager painted the first. And we have an
evaluation research group that works with us around our programming
and outcomes, and they were using some of our information
(18:23):
to write a chapter they were submitting for anthology about art,
and they wanted to see if there might be someone
who was now an adult who was willing to share
some of the art that they had created in the program.
So we contacted this person thinking they might be interested, and.
Speaker 6 (18:39):
They said yes.
Speaker 4 (18:41):
Ultimately, the chapter didn't get published, but this story exists,
so maybe that was the purpose of it. The book
didn't happen, but the art discussion led this person to say, yes,
you could use it, but only if I can come
in and redo it as an adult. And so in
our office are in different spaces, is the the teenage
(19:02):
version of this piece and the adult version. And I
think their insight to say, let me just measure my
own growth and change as a person by doing this
thing again for myself, but a little bit for you.
And I think That's a big part of understanding what
it means to heal, to return to well being is
(19:22):
that as we age, as we gain more experience, hopefully
we have developed a new set of skills and attitudes
and openness that we can appreciate earlier versions of.
Speaker 6 (19:36):
Ourselves in new ways.
Speaker 4 (19:37):
And I think that story of the two paintings is
symbolic of that.
Speaker 1 (19:43):
Yes, yeah, thank you Matt for coming and chatting with me.
This has been very informative, and I know that even
if people aren't in Arizona, they're going to get a
lot out of it. So I appreciate you coming and
chatting with us.
Speaker 6 (19:59):
My pleasure.
Speaker 5 (20:00):
Sure, and we'll be right back, folks.
Speaker 8 (20:02):
Tanny up Qui ge euons Queen Sna Hi, everybody. My
name is Quigate Ywon's. I'm a member of the Squamish
nation and the Yaglanis Klan of the Hyda Nation. You're
listening to co Op Radio CFRO one hundred point five FM.
We live work play and broadcast from the traditional ancestral
and unseeded territories of the Musquiam, Squamish, and slave Tooth nations.
Speaker 1 (20:26):
You're listening to Rethreading Madness on Vancouver co Op Radio
CFRO one hundred point five FM. I'm Bernadine Fox and
today I'm speaking with Gagango, who is a Actually, I
think you are one of my most interviewed people at
this point.
Speaker 5 (20:44):
You've been there.
Speaker 1 (20:45):
Since the day one, practically five years ago, so and
you've come back on for a variety of reasons and
I always look forward to having you come on. And
today we're going to talk about your film Common Law.
You're the director of producer, and it's a film about
a charismatic young poet who is finding his voice as
(21:06):
an artist when he's hit with a bipolar diagnosis which
disrupts his dreams of becoming a writer. And this life
altering diagnosis kind of upends his life, straining his relationship
with his girlfriend Daniella and his parents. He faces societal
stigma and the daunting process of applying for disability benefits.
(21:28):
Agan is faced with a gon meaning the character in
the film, but it is a film based on you,
and you're faced with the stark reality of what it
means to be human in a world not built for
disabled people. That last sentence was really striking to me
because I feel like, you know, we are living in
(21:49):
a world that is meant for basically able bodied, cisgendered.
Speaker 5 (21:55):
Men who are white.
Speaker 1 (21:57):
And if you're not that, then your job is to
somehow try and emulate that so that you can be
perceived as normal and Okay, So that last sentence was
very powerful to me.
Speaker 5 (22:12):
Again, tell people who you are.
Speaker 9 (22:15):
Well.
Speaker 7 (22:16):
I'm an Asian Canadian filmmaker, published author, spoken with poet
and mentalth advocate and activists and essentially with this film
Common Law. It's based on a true story that happened
to me when I was initially diagnosed by polar moon disorder,
which I prefer to call manic depression because it more
(22:39):
accurately describes when they're the experience of the condition. And yeah,
basically over the years, I cultivated and multi fascinated the
career and this diverse background informs my perspective as a director,
allowing me to bring depth and authenticity to my filmmaking storytelling.
(23:03):
And yeah, you know, Common Law is biographical, I mean
slightly fictionalized for dramatic purposes, but it's quite accurate to
deler the experience of what I had, what happened to
me when I was initially diagnosed with bipolar mood disorder.
In nineteen ninety three and basically after receiving a devastating,
(23:29):
devastating diagnosis of an incuble mental illness, I was applying
for disability benefits to Social Assertions for the very first time,
and I was denied the benefits because I was in
a common law relationship of three years with my then girlfriend,
and they said, she's just spouse, you can support you,
(23:51):
You're not eligible for disability benefits. And the denial of
the benefits, coupled with the double wheremme of an incurable
mental illness, led to the breakup of that relationship and
the unraveling of my family. M HM.
Speaker 1 (24:08):
When you say family, you're talking about your relationship with
Danielle or are you talking about the rest of your
family as well?
Speaker 7 (24:14):
I think all of the about both my I changed
the real name of the character from to Daniella to
hide the identity of the real person, but also to
my parents. You know, it affected everybody's not just mental
health but emotional health. It was quite traumatic, you know.
Speaker 5 (24:37):
So were you? I'm sorry?
Speaker 10 (24:39):
Go ahead, Yeah, I think this film there there's kind
of like a story money impact campaign like campaign, which
is usually done to documentary films.
Speaker 7 (24:53):
When we're doing it.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
For this.
Speaker 7 (24:57):
Dramatic film that's basically about a half hour dramatic film,
we've got a questionnaire and a QR code which you
can scan on a postcard which has a post screening
questionnaire asking questions whether you've ever been on disability or
whether you know somebody who has been on disability, How
did this film impact you in different questions because part
(25:21):
of it, too is we're trying to legislate or change
policy regarding disability benefits and how it impacts people with
disability in common law relationships. You know, it's quite common
and it's quite widespread how this impacts people with disability
that oftentimes we live in isolation, loneliness because of these
(25:45):
legislations that prevent people from you know, basically assign them
to becoming financial burdens upon their partner and oftentimes lead
to the breakup, so divorce of relationships and marriages or
common law relationships. So it's quite draconian and quite inhumane,
(26:05):
and I think it is somewhat of human rights issue,
you know, I think in society, you know, it's a
privilege to be in a relationship, but oftentimes people with disabilities.
I denied that privilege because of the position they're put
in with this legislation and policy.
Speaker 1 (26:26):
You know, So what you're saying is that to get
a person's with disability pench, which is what it's called NBC,
you cannot be in a common law relationship with somebody
else who is working. Or what if you were both
people with disabilities, what would happen?
Speaker 7 (26:48):
Then basically you're not in the past, you weren't allowed
to even be in a common law relationship or that
person would have to support you. Or if you are
in a common law relationship collectively as a couple, you're
only allowed to earn up to twenty three thousand, four
(27:10):
hundred and anything above that will be clawed back by
the government. So we'll be taken away. And how can
two people living in an expensive city like Vancouver or
British Columbia or this country Canada survive on twenty four thousand,
three hundred, You know, it's pretty much living below the
(27:32):
poverty line, and that kind of financial strain oftentimes leads
to breakups, you know, of that relationship, or.
Speaker 1 (27:42):
If somebody is working, then the person with PWG would
be disqualified for that pension. Yeah, even though they get
that pension because they are a person with the disability.
So basically they're saying, if you want to be with
this person, then you will need to support them. And
I can see that, you know, for some relationships. Certainly
(28:04):
there are relationships where people, you know, one person is working,
the other person isn't, but they want to be together
and they say, come live with me, I will support you,
and that happens. I mean, certainly it happens that one
person supports them as a couple.
Speaker 5 (28:21):
But with you, when.
Speaker 1 (28:23):
You're a person with a disability, it's not like you
have the option of going and working, right, I mean,
that's the whole point of being somebody with a disability
is It means that you cannot function in the same
way out there in the world. And although you can
make some money, but you cannot don't necessarily survive on that.
(28:44):
So it does mean that, And correct me if I'm
wrong that if you're a person with a disability, you
have to kind of be alone and get your pension
and make whatever money you can on top of that.
However much you can work, but you can't, it's kind
of hard. It would be hard to entertain a relationship
(29:06):
knowing that if you become serious in that relationship, that
you will become that person's financial burden.
Speaker 7 (29:16):
Yeah, I mean, there's the the tagline of the film
is I'm not going to support an invalid for the
rest of my life. That's what my partner and my
common law partner at the time. That was her reaction to,
you know, when she heard the bad news of what
this policy would pertain. You know that she would be
(29:38):
responsible for me financially for the rest of my life.
And she said, I'm not going to support an invalid
for the rest of my life. And those are very
hurtful words, but they were also very honest words. You know,
she wanted to that that that's a huge responsibility and
not everybody's willing to take that on.
Speaker 1 (29:56):
Yes, now, if you were living at home with your
parents and getting PWG, that wouldn't impact on your pension
with it. No, so it only impacts if you are
in a common law relationship or get married.
Speaker 5 (30:13):
Yeah, yes, okay, So tell me more about who are
the characters in the film.
Speaker 7 (30:20):
Well, the part of my character played by Australian born actor,
but then Lou plays me in my early twenties. Kegan
Go is the main character who's a charismatic young poet
who's finding his voices spoke as as an artist when
you know, this bipolar mood disorder, this rucks his trajectory
(30:45):
of realizing his dreams of becoming a writer. And then
there's his partner, common law partner Daniella, who's you know,
applying for med school and is part of this family
household for the last three years, living in a common
law relationship with Corgan, and she loves Kagan dearly, but
(31:08):
has misgivings about the prospect of being financially responsible for
him for the rest of his life. And the lynch
print of it is she's the fullcon of the film.
You know, she's really torn between supporting Kagan, loving Hergan dearly,
but being caught between a rock and hard place, and
it's a very hard decision that eventually breaks them. And
(31:30):
then there's the parents Gopos saying, who is my father?
Who kind of enables Kagan by his generous financial donations
to him, trying to support him and kind of enables
his Kagan's core dependency on him, and which causes a
strain on the relationship with his wife, Margaret, you know,
(31:54):
who holds the purse strings and is you know, uh,
oftentimes fears appearing stringent because she's in charge of the
finance family's finances. So a lot of it's this financial
pressures and stuff like that. But beyond that, it's a
very loving family that's kind of being torn apart it
(32:16):
the seams. It's a really for a half hour drama.
Berlin Lou, the lead actor, went to an incredible transformation
that was so complete that I was absolutely convinced that
he had bipolar mood disorder, which wasn't true once I
got to know him better. He basically embodied the characters
(32:38):
so completely that for a short half hour film, he
went from hypomania to mania, to psychosis to depression on
the space of thirty minutes. Absolutely powerful, moving and compelling performance.
Speaker 6 (32:57):
You know.
Speaker 7 (32:59):
And Henry J. Marr plays go posting my father who
was a Singapore literary pioneer and point novelist and playwright,
and he struggles with Parkinson's disease and major depression, and
he's he inspires Kagun to pursue writing and acts as
a role model and mentors to Kagun and Margaret Joyce Wog.
(33:23):
My mother is the lone care taker of the family
of both go post Sing and Kagan, and she feels
the burden of being the lone caregiver and oftentimes feels
resented by and resentful towards a family for that reason,
(33:43):
you know. So it's a it's a very heavy drama,
but it's essentially common law. Was made as kind of
an example of a potential pilot episode for a threeas
in television series Entitle. The Delicate Imbalance is basically like
(34:05):
a pilot episode and a calling cord film. So I'm
hoping to interest producers and broadcasters and the powers that
be that this film hopefully will open up those two
opportunities to developing this TV series.
Speaker 5 (34:23):
You know, that's a wonderful.
Speaker 1 (34:26):
We just need to take a little break here again,
but we're going to come right back, and I want
to talk a little bit more about the film and
manic Depressive as you've described it, So we'll be right back.
Speaker 9 (34:37):
Books.
Speaker 1 (34:42):
There's a whole crowd of people out there who need
to learn how to do the scar nice question.
Speaker 9 (34:49):
You don't know, my listen way too to be talking
to you. Should it take them? I'm not a look,
very comet's take what I want when I want to,
and I want you bad news. One of us has
done and lose on the powdery or confuse. Just add
(35:14):
some friction. Sure mystreames addiction, Sure my Stream's addiction. My
God can't explain the symptoms on my pay and a
strange addiction.
Speaker 7 (35:35):
I'm really really sorry. I think I was just relieved
to see that. Michael backl The movie is amazing.
Speaker 6 (35:41):
It's like one of the best movies I've ever seen
in my life.
Speaker 9 (35:45):
Favor please don't break be my really because I don't
sup medicaid and it burns like a chin and I
like it because you live some much sin and you
might igniteded hearts, but I know how to hide it
and I like it bad than nesse. One of us
(36:06):
is done and lose something like crowdy or the fuse.
Just add some friction, my Stern's addiction, my Stern's addiction.
But I just can't explain my symptoms all my plain
(36:27):
which Mysterns deddiction by my glass, set myself on fire,
catch it toe the craps, catch it toe word, tell
me less than last like I don't you could kiss
(36:52):
my skill.
Speaker 7 (36:57):
You should enter at festivals or colons.
Speaker 11 (37:01):
What pretty good reaction?
Speaker 9 (37:03):
Pretty cool.
Speaker 7 (37:05):
Right question?
Speaker 9 (37:09):
Mus dediction us addiction is trans That's simply that Paine
the street musication.
Speaker 1 (37:29):
Hi everyone, This is Bernardine Fox from Rethreading Madness that
airs on Vancouver call Out Radio every Tuesday at five pm.
Vancouver call Up Radio CFR one hundred point five FM
is a unique nonprofit community radio station and podcast recording
studio that provides a voice for those underrepresented in the
mainstream media. They provide the airwaves for Rethreading Madness to
(37:52):
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Speaker 5 (38:51):
Stay safe out there.
Speaker 1 (38:54):
You're listening to Rethreading Madness on Vancouver. Call up Radio
cfr O one hundred point five f M. I'm Burney
and Fox and I'm speaking with director producer again go
about his film, his docu drama. Is it a docu
drama or is it just considered a drama drama? A drama,
but it is based on a true story, in fact,
your true story called common Law. Yeah again, you talked
(39:18):
about manic depressive challenges and talked about how you didn't
like the term bipolar. Can you talk a little bit
more about that.
Speaker 6 (39:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 7 (39:31):
I know it's somewhat antiquated to use the old manic
depression and people have misgivings about it, but personally, speaking
from my own lived experience, is more accurately describes my
personal live experience of both the high zarmania, the terrors
of psychosis, and the loads of depression. You know, just
(39:52):
a terminal. It's just a preference, you know, to each
of their old women. That's just my own personal preference.
Speaker 1 (39:58):
I'm i applaud you for sticking to your own personal preference.
Speaker 5 (40:04):
I think we have a right to define who we
are and what we live with.
Speaker 1 (40:09):
You also talk about in the press release that you
talk about dealing with mental health challenges that are different
in the Asian Canadian community. Can you talk a little
bit about how they're different or how you see them
as being different.
Speaker 12 (40:23):
Yeah, Basically an Asian Canadian community, there's a huge stigma
about mental illness, and it's the monster and the closet
that nobody wants to talk about.
Speaker 7 (40:34):
Literally, they I don't know if they still do it,
but you know, it's almost like you're sequested away in
an attic and hidden from sight. Nobody talks about it,
nobody deals with it, and as a result, Asian men
in particular really languish from mental health challenges and rarely
seek help because of fear of us appearing weak and vulnerable,
(40:58):
you know, because it's supposed to be wrong and the
head of the family and red winners, et cetera. So
it's a real problem the Asian Canadian community, it's not
being addressed. That's why. That's one of the primary reasons
that I made the film to show an empathetic and
sensitive and frank and honest portrayal of a Chinese Canadian
(41:22):
male struggling through the challenges of navigating the mental health system,
a psychiatric system, the welfare system, you know, and hopefully
people can learn vacaviously through the trials and errors how
to navigate those systems. And you know, my book Surviving
Some Sara, which part of this story is based on,
(41:45):
which was shortlisted for the Simple Literature Prize in the
Creative Nonfiction and English category, was called by some of
the readers of the book a life saver. And I'm
hoping this TV series will be that kind of force,
you know, a positive.
Speaker 1 (42:03):
Change around people dealing with mental health challenges or families,
I suppose even families dealing with mental health challenges.
Speaker 7 (42:16):
Yeah, I mean basically the film and TV series developed,
especially this film delves into the impact of government policies
and societal stigma and cultural expectations, especially from the Asian
community and those living and mental illness. You know. But
I think it's an incredibly relevant story and I think
(42:37):
I'm hoping that this film will opened up those to
develop this TV series concept. I have a show bible,
I have, you know, three seasons of twenty seven episodes
mapped out, and I'm really hoping that this project will
take off because I think it especially mental health. People
(42:59):
pay lip service the mental health saying you know, it's
a tight geist at the times, but it really is.
And I think a series like this is timely, meaningful
and also highly original in terms of the protagonists finding
his voice as a spoken word artists and find healing
(43:20):
and transformation from being a victim or a survivor of
the mental health care system to ultimately self actualized mental
health advocate and then becomes a self proclaimed artist. You know,
So there's a transformation and a journey in a bit
of an arc.
Speaker 1 (43:40):
Yes.
Speaker 5 (43:41):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (43:42):
You talk about government policies, is that the policies that
require people who have PWD and enter a common law
relationship that they lose that pension yep. And have you
been able to talk with people within government about those
have you had conversations with them about how this is unfair?
Speaker 9 (44:05):
Uh?
Speaker 7 (44:06):
That's what I'm hoping to bring this to Victoria and
screen it. You know, if there's a way to even
get some politicians or policy makers to watch this film
on a humanistic level as opposed to just a policy
or political film. I don't want it to just be
seen as a message film or as a political film,
(44:27):
because it's not. It's primarily a fire family drama or
a mental health drama. But I think it transcends even
those definitions and those narrow definitions, and I'm hoping, you know, basically,
I've been told by the powers that be it's not
just a provincial legislation or a federal legislation, but you
(44:50):
have to go all the way to the Supreme Court
and even further than that in terms of the policy
being dictated by legislation and policy done by the United Nations.
So I feel that someone's like a mister Smith goes
to Washington, kind of like I'm Jimmy Stewart having to
march out to the United Nations. It's a bit daunting
(45:16):
that it's such an arduous and difficult process. But now
you have to start somewhere, and I don't even know
if it's possible, but at least get the conversation going, you.
Speaker 1 (45:27):
Know, absolutely, conversation, absolutely, you talk about how the mental
health getting the diagnosis impacted on your family. Can you
talk a little bit about how that happened?
Speaker 5 (45:42):
Yeah, it happened.
Speaker 7 (45:44):
Basically when I received I was told that I had
an incurble mental illness that would lost the rest of
my life.
Speaker 5 (45:51):
And let me just stop you there.
Speaker 1 (45:53):
Let me ask you what does that feel like to
be told you have an incurable disease which I hate
to talk about mental health in those terms at all,
but that it's incurable and you'll never work. Like when
you walk out of an office and that is what
you've been told, what are you left with? What does
(46:13):
that do to you?
Speaker 7 (46:15):
It's like receiving a life sentence as a prisoner for
a crime that you did not commit, right, you know,
a life sentence with no parole. Okay, that that was
the impact that it had on me, and not quite
a death sentence because I'm still alive. You know, your
life does an end, but a part of your life
(46:38):
ends and a new normal happens and suddenly, all of
a sudden, become a professional mental patient. You're seeing in
a different light as a disabled person, you know M.
Speaker 5 (46:49):
And not just disabled, I e.
Speaker 1 (46:51):
With a wheelchair because I think we live in a
society that handles the wheelchair much better than they handle
a diagnosis like bipolar, which just confuses them. Most people
don't know what that means, and they're not sure if
it's scary, and you know, I'm not sure what that
will mean. Yet you will do you know, maybe you'll
act erratically or you know.
Speaker 5 (47:12):
It's that whole.
Speaker 1 (47:12):
Social stigma stuff that happens around mental health challenges, you know,
so it impacts you on a double whammy. It's not
just what the psychiatry said, it's what you take out
and what the rest of the world deals with you.
Have you dealt with social stigma in that capacity, it continues.
Speaker 7 (47:31):
To baffle me. But yes, it's challenging day by day,
moment by moment, and you know, it used to cripple
me to certain extent that I used to really suffer
from those self esteem and shame about it. You know,
I felt that almost like I was fighting an invisible enemy.
(47:53):
The stigma of prejudicial discrimination was so prevalent and so
invisible that it was like fighting a fandom and invisible
ghosts and an invisible enemy. And then all this pent
up anger and rage and frustration but nowhere to direct
it because it's insinuated and the way you are treated
(48:13):
by family, friends, social workers, doctors, nurses, psychiatrists, welfare workers,
you know, but you can't locate it. It's so subtle
and it's supposed to be done. It's the people are
doing it are well meaning but misguided. And the way
(48:34):
I turned it that frustration and anger it became self hate.
And basically this TV series chronicles the journey from self
hate to the eight They say there are seven stages
of grief, and I returned it seven eight stages of
grief of mental illness, and from anger to bargaining to
(48:56):
you know whatever, shame, to guilt and then eventually, hopefully
towards acceptance and to finally, you know, towards unconditional self love.
If that's if that's a goal that's or a state
that's team unachievable, that's the journey that the protagonist takes,
(49:18):
and I'm hoping it will be a healing journey. That's
why I changed the title of the TV series from
Surviving some Sava. First of all, not many people know
what some sava means, which is a Buddhish Sanskrit term
for the word then round the rebirth and suffering, death
(49:40):
and rebirth, and I didn't want to have a term
that was so arsoteric and religious that nobody would understand it.
And I also didn't want to focus on the terms survival,
because you think of survival as fight, flight and hide
and the survival instincts. And I didn't want it to
focus on the making drama, the trauma, suffering puffed out
(50:03):
of pain. I wanted to focus on the transformative journey
of healing, and yeah, basically healing and recovery. You know
that it is possible, not in some kind of inspiration
one kind of way, but in the very down to earth,
every man, everyday pedestrian kind of journey of a mental
(50:28):
health patient to becoming a mental health advocate and activist
and mental health looker at the end, you know.
Speaker 1 (50:35):
Yeah, And I find that that your story is fascinating
and that you were told that it's incurable and you
will never work again, But here you are having, you know,
climbed that mountain out of these ideas and these expectations,
these non expectations put on you, and you've found a
(50:57):
way to to in fact use that diagnosis to find
a way to give back to the community and into
society and to work.
Speaker 5 (51:06):
And I just applaud you for that.
Speaker 1 (51:08):
Where can people see those film? It's if there's a
premiere coming up, the world premiere. Where is that happening
and when can people come and see it?
Speaker 7 (51:15):
Yeah, come see the world premiere of my film at
the Vancouver Asian Film Festival twenty twenty four and check
out the other great Asian films from November seventh to
the seventeenth. Let me give you some information about it.
The world premiere of Common Law schedules for Saturday, November ninth,
(51:35):
twenty twenty four, at four pm at International Village Cinemas
as part of the Reality Check West Coast Narrative Shorts
program at the twenty eighth annual Vancouver Asian Film Festival. Myself,
director and Go produces Andy Wong and Yun Joe Chen
(51:59):
and lead the Berlin who will be in attendance, offering
audience as a unique opportunity to engage with this important conversation.
Speaker 5 (52:10):
That's wonderful. Go again, Thank you. So that's again.
Speaker 1 (52:13):
That's on September ninth, which is in a few days
at four pm. Common Law scheduled at the Internationvillage Cinema
and Vancouver Asian Film Festival after November ninth. Where will
people be able to find this film.
Speaker 7 (52:29):
Hopefully on television.
Speaker 13 (52:31):
If I managed to get it picked up in green
lit by a production company, it's a long process that
might take years, but after Yeah, that's the word I'm
been taking this film.
Speaker 7 (52:45):
It's going to be it at the film festivals oh
by the way, next year in twenty twenty five. Early
in twenty twenty five, the Cattle Friendship Society is sponsoring
a community screening and fundraise of this film at the
Real Theater.
Speaker 5 (53:01):
Oh cool.
Speaker 7 (53:02):
I will keep you into when that will be happening.
It's solo film screening as opposed to a multiple squeening
of other films, and there will be the Ketl Choir
and different speakers and panels and Q and A discussions,
and it should be in some ways. I'm looking forward
to the head even more than the world premiere because
(53:25):
the whole of the Kel Friendship Society, which is a
mental health organization that I work for, will be there
and staff, the members, my spoken work community, my film
making community, and my friends, my family and my co workers.
It's really gonna be an incredible celebration. You're going to
reach out to all the mental health organizations from the
(53:47):
Coast Foundation MPa, Motivation, Power and Achievement and.
Speaker 1 (53:53):
Yeah good, that sounds great. Yeah, do come back and
let us know when that's happening. So where can people
find out more information about you again.
Speaker 7 (54:03):
Basically through my Instagram. I've got a handle common Law Film.
Speaker 1 (54:09):
Thank you.
Speaker 5 (54:10):
Okay, bye bye, and we'll be right back.
Speaker 7 (54:12):
Folks.
Speaker 11 (54:12):
Hi, folks, this is Steve ferguson your twenty first century
schizoid Man, and I'm the host of prog Rock Alley,
inviting you to come down and listen to our show
every week at Monday one am the very end of
the weekend. We will be looking at all forms of
progressive rock. I'm talking about space rock, art rock, math, rock, fusion, jazz.
(54:33):
You want it, I got it. Just name it, I'll
play it. We'll see you again. That's here on CFRORO
one hundred point five co Op Radio Monday mornings one am.
Speaker 14 (54:46):
CFRORO has the most reggae and Caribbean music of any
station in the Vancouver area. Start your week off with
some reggae oldies on Tuesdays from ten thirty am to
noon with a level of vibes. Roots Reggae is on
Fridays from midnight to seven eight The Reggae Show from
six to eight thirty pm every Saturday, followed by Caribbean
Sounds from eight thirty to eleven pm. On the first
(55:07):
and second Saturday of every month. It's a Reggae Extended
Mix from eleven pm to seven am, and then super
Mix on the third, fourth and fifth Saturday on CFRO
one hundred point five FM, Vancouver Cooperative Radio.
Speaker 5 (55:23):
And that's our show.
Speaker 1 (55:24):
My thanks to Matt Sandoval from Free Arts Arizona for
telling us about providing free art to traumatized children, and
to Gegango for chatting with us about his new film
Common Law. Music Today was by Billie Eilish and Sherry Allred.
You've just listened to Rethreading Madness, where we dare to
change how we think about mental health. We air live
on Vancouver co Op Radio CFRO one hundred point five
(55:46):
FM every Tuesday at five pm or online at co
opradio dot org. If you have questions or feedback about
this program, I want to share your story or have
something to say to us.
Speaker 5 (55:57):
We want to hear from you.
Speaker 1 (55:59):
You can reach us by email rethreading Madness at corp
Radio dot org. This is Bernardine Fox.
Speaker 5 (56:05):
We'll be back next week.
Speaker 2 (56:06):
Until now, when I've ever been further going, what the
hell I'm gonna do when I can't see him to
find my way under over to.
Speaker 3 (56:28):
Just when I'm ready to give up the fight, they
are when we turn out the lights in it's all right, it's.
Speaker 2 (56:40):
All right, go, you'll be alright.
Speaker 3 (56:47):
Why I always believe when you're telling me everything it's
gonna be our right?
Speaker 9 (56:57):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (57:03):
Why don't I wonder how you know? Surely you don't
have all of the facts. You could be just making it.
Speaker 2 (57:18):
Why don't I ever think of that? It's some god
imagin in the words that you read.
Speaker 3 (57:29):
Saying, baby, take it from me, it's all right, it's
all right. Don't too all really be alright? Why do alwaisbelieve?
Speaker 15 (57:45):
But when he tells me everything's gonna be off right,
everything's gonna be off.
Speaker 3 (57:56):
Right any one else? It's such a cliche, just words
people say to be nice somehow, and ny fall from you.
I'm convinced your when I'm weary and so tired, when
(58:45):
I'm worn out and when I fall off the why again,
no more strength they get back on. You are with
that voice in my saying the words, and neither he
(59:09):
it's all right, it's all right.
Speaker 9 (59:13):
Don't.
Speaker 3 (59:15):
Really alright.
Speaker 1 (59:19):
But a while.
Speaker 3 (59:21):
But when they tell me everything's gonna be.
Speaker 15 (59:26):
Alright, Oh everything, it's gonna be all right. Everything's gonna
be alrightkay.
Speaker 1 (01:03:46):
And as always our things goes out to you for
joining us today.
Speaker 5 (01:03:49):
Stay safe out there.
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