Black History Special: The town that spit fire and saved the matches

On this day in Black History... Karmen and Jessica discuss many of the lesser known people and important events that took place on February 20th throughout Black History, including those who also fought for disability rights. They get a little spicy when talking about current events, such as the very recent public event involving Neo Nazis in Nashville and the state of where we are today as a nation. Are we doomed to repeat ourselves? Don't miss your exit.

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Episode Transcript

(00:00):
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Usaha shockers for Charlee Challion. Hey, Jessica high Carbon. It's a beautiful

(02:38):
day in Tucson, Arizona. I'mgonna use the pool tonight. Did you
have a heated pool at least Ido? We keep it at about eighty
two. Okay, it's really nice, and then you get in the hot
tub and then just go to bed. Some people like to take a shower,
but I'm the only one who getsto use my hot tub on my
pool, so I don't do dumbthings in there. I don't do gross
things in there. I had apool party once. My husband's friends came

(02:59):
over and like they were the onlyones that were actually getting in the pool.
They were fully making out. Iwanted to train the pool after I
was just like, oh my god, water has memories, right, so
well yeah, but also the exchangeof fluids probably is intercepted by the fluid
in the water. The water.I don't like that, like we all

(03:21):
know, oh just grow I neverwant anyway. I'm not going to say
the word penetrationistic, right, Okay, So it is Black History Month,
and we haven't really done a lotto cover Black History Month this year because
there's so much This day in historyin nineteen twenty seven, a very famous,

(03:44):
very handsome man was born in Florida. Mister oh yes, mister Sidney
Potier. Do you know any SidneyVadier Poitier movies? He was in the
Heat of the Night. He wasalso in tucer with love. I mean,
there's a lot of them. Iremember seeing him as a kid.
You know, he's just the wayhe talked was amazing. I thought it

(04:04):
was funny to say Sydney Porta Potier. I was thinking that in my head.
Really Sawny was Yeah, well Igot in trouble. My mom was
like, I don't say that again. Sydney Porta Potier. You know,
I met no disrespect. It wasjust a kid. And the fact that
I could say Potier was I thoughtquite an achievement. Looking back, I

(04:27):
do it the same. So,yeah, that is one tidbit, and
not only black history but Carmen's historyhistory. Yeah, I guess you had
to be there. I think youknow who else was born this day?
Who? Sir? Charles Barkley.Charles Wade Barkley was born in nineteen sixty

(04:51):
three in Leeds, Alabama. Ilove Charles Berkley. You know, I'm
not a basketball fan per se,sure at all, I should say the
banter between Charles Barkley and Shaquille O'Nealis hilarious. Yes, yes, yes,
I do like, I do likethe banter. Yeah, what did
I see the other day from CharlesBarkley? He was saying that he was

(05:13):
talking about commercials that Shaq will doanything he doesn't use icy hot. I
know that. I've listened to anotherpodcast where Shaq was on it because I
like listening to Shaq for some he'sso funny. Yeah, but he says
like he won't do anything unless hetruly believes in the product, right,
even the commercials where he's the general. You know, the insurance company really

(05:39):
helped him out a long time ago, so he stuck with it, you
know. So I don't know ifI believe Charles Barkley on that one.
Well, maybe it's just teasing him. I'm sure they I mean, they're
they're they're funny together. And hesaid it won't be long before Shaq is
doing tampon commercials. He'll do anything. Wasn't shock like a cop? I

(06:01):
don't know, I really don't know. Yeah, I think he was like
an actual police officer for a realyes, because there was like a lot
of a lot of spoofs about it, and they showed they showed like all
of the regular cops like hiding behinda bush preparing to ascend on somebody's house
and their shack is just like seventeenfeet tall, hiding behind a bush.

(06:28):
It was hilarious. It was justfunny stuff. But yeah, I love
I love Charles Barkley. I kindof fell in love with him when I
saw him on Saturday Night Live forthe first time. It was really funny
and Happy Birthday, Charles Barkley.Oh, I love that. I remember
Charles Barkley. What was the firsttime I saw him? Oh? In
space jam Oh my god? Yes, so did you know that? Not

(06:50):
today but yesterday, yesterday, thenineteen In nineteen forty two, the one
hundredth Fighter Squadron was activated in thethree hundred and thirty second Fighter Group,
which is also better known as theTuskegee Airmen. So the Tuskie Airmen were
instrumental in World War Two. Theywere not even acknowledged, the individual men

(07:15):
and the units were not even acknowledgedor given their proper awards until recently.
And there's still some guys who havenot received, you know, their medals
of honor or valor, and it'sit's really a shame. It's really a
shame, you know, Like,and then I see them on the news

(07:35):
every once in a while, youknow, you'll see some guy that's like
one hundred and he's getting an awardand finally getting his medal. But it's
like my god, you know,like better late. Yeah, ever,
Yeah, that is crazy, itreally is that that would happen. So
there was a previous Tuskegee Airmen,which was the ninety ninth squadron to be

(07:55):
activated. So back to back theninety ninth and the one hundredth. The
nineteen forty one Skigee Airmen were thefirst African American soldiers to fly during World
War Two. Just in case thosewho are wondering or have never heard of
the Tuskegee Airmen, I hope youhave, but if you haven't, the
Tuskegee Airmen were the first African Americansoldiers to fly during World War Two.

(08:16):
They actually were, right, youknow, in the front lines. You
know, fighting really have not beenrecognized until just more recent which is just
ridiculous. A lot of the folksno longer with us, right, right,
And so they're receiving their awards posthumously. You know, their families are
getting the awards and their medals andstuff. But my mom used to say,

(08:37):
she used to say, shit fireand save the matches. The motto
of the Tuskegee Airmen was spit fire. You know. So you know how
like when they're the bomber planes areshooting out bombs. Yes, that's what
they did. They called missiles kindof like it looks like spitting fire.
Uh huh yeah, hit fire andsave the matches. Fire and save the

(08:58):
matches. Wow. Wow, that'scool. Yeah, I like that.
So I guess that's where my momgot it from. She just put her
own spin on it. One ofthe things that the Tuskegee Airmen proved to
everybody, which is something that theyshould not have had to prove. Okay,
right, they didn't have to proveanything, but because of the time,
they did prove that not only thatthey could fly, but they were

(09:18):
as good as any other American pilotsduring the war. And the Tuskegee Airmen,
whose chief role was actually the protectionof the large bombers from German fighter
planes, participated in over fifteen thousandsorties from May of nineteen forty three to
June of nineteen forty five, soapproximately one thousand pilots were trained at the

(09:39):
Duskegee Institute in Alabama. The blackpilots that were flying those combat missions.
Oftentimes they flew double the number ofcombat missions as the white pilots, yet
they were still treated poorly. Theywere still met with horrible treatment and racism,

(10:01):
and continued to do their jobs asservicemen. I just don't I don't
know where they got the the cajonesto keep doing it right. Yeah,
you know, I think it wasMuhammad Ali who said, why would I
fight for a country that won't fightfor me? And I probably screwed that
quota, but Muhammad Ali that wasone of his biggest reasons to protest the

(10:24):
war, the Vietnam Wars, becausehe didn't want he didn't feel like he
should fight for a country that doesn'teven treat him like a citizen. Can
you imagine what it was like inforty one? They also, for a
long time, they were oftentimes deniedbenefits, Oh yeah, by the VA.
So you go and you fight maybetwice as many missions or whatever.

(10:46):
Then you're you're fellow white people andyou come back and you don't get supported.
You're already being treated differently for beingblack, but then you also don't
get the support from you know,the medical attention or anything that you went
through while you were in the military. It's kind of ridiculous. And it
was actually decades yeah, before therewas more lawsuits that came out because there

(11:09):
needed to be. You know,obviously, I think over fifty years some
people didn't get benefits. The governmentwas also doing germ testing on soldiers,
black soldiers, pets. Awful.It's ridiculous they intentionally gave black soldiers for
medical testing. I mean, it'sjust if you start digging into this.

(11:30):
We've talked about this a few times, like it's it's painful and it's disgusting.
You start digging into this, andyou don't have to dig that far.
It's just like right up the surface. But it's stuff that's not talked
about. It's stuff that's just brushedover like no big deal. You know.
After the end of the Civil War, you know, there were a
lot of racial terror terrorism I guessracial terrorism. I don't know if that's

(11:52):
a term, but I'm in itit is. Yeah, And so after
the Civil War ended, these thingshappened. So a lot of like white
supremacy, lots of hierarchy happening,lots of brutal repercussions. I don't think
we've really acknowledged that in this countryfully, and one of the biggest targeted
individuals are our black veterans, youknow, who have proven their courage as

(12:16):
a soldier in any of the wars, you know, Civil War, World
War One, World War two,I'm sure in the Korean War, Vietnam
or all of these wars that theyalso fought for our country in and for
and for equality. You know,they fought for equality too. There were
a lot of dreams that this thembeing a part of this would help impact

(12:41):
racial equality. You know, ifI'm going to be fighting for America,
then I'm also fighting for the samething, and maybe that this would help
with my equality, you know,in sure this country. I'm sure that
that was probably in the hearts ofall of the people who are fighting,
you know, thinking like now ismy opportunity to stand next to my fellow

(13:01):
soldiers and be recognized as a manor woman. But that didn't happen.
In fact, right, no,it didn't happen. I was looking at
So the siphless experiment started in nineteenthirty two, and it was called the
Tuskegee Experiment, and they intentionally gaveblack men siphlis. It wasn't to try

(13:22):
out new treatments for syphilis. Itwas just to see the progression of the
disease. There's basically to see howlong it takes to progress in the human
body, what it does long term. It was the death sentence. And
they did this experiment on black soldiersin nineteen thirty two. That's not that

(13:43):
long ago. You know. It'sso easy to go down that really dark
hole when you're talking about in nineteenninety one, on this day, February
twentieth. In nineteen ninety one,African Americans won eight Grammys that year.
Whoopy Goldberg was one of them.I love Whoopy Goldberg. I don't care
what anybody says. Eartha Kit,Eartha Kit was another one. Earth The

(14:05):
Kit was born in twenty seven inSouth Carolina, and she became popular in
Paris as a nightclub singer. Andthen she returned to the US to appear
in films and on stage, andshe was treated horribly, you know,
like in our lifetime, So Iwas my lifetime. In nineteen seventy one,
Gladys Knight was made to use theservants entrance in Las Vegas. Sammy

(14:28):
Davis Junior had to stay at adifferent hotel than the other rat packers,
and then I think it was OldBlue Eyes. Frank Sinatra said no,
he's going to stay in this roomwith us. But you know, that
was a big push for Sammy DavisJunior. But all of like the staff
still had to stay at another hotel. And that was a little before my
lifetime, but not that much beforemy lifetime. Oh Edda James, she

(14:52):
won a Grammy that year where I'drather go blind and at last, that's
a good one. Well it's notgood news, but you know. Frederick
Douglas, Sir Frederick Douglas passed awayon February twentieth. He was a big
abolitionist. He escaped slavery. Hedid ran away right on February twentieth,

(15:15):
eighteen ninety five, So yeah,he was. He escaped from slavery and
he became the national leader of theabolitionist movement in Massachusetts and New York.
He was an orator, a writer, and a statesman. He had a
bestseller, really yeah, his bookwas called His second book was called My
Bondage and My Freedom. It waspublished in eighteen fifty five after the summer.

(15:37):
One of the big things that Iwork on it as well as you,
as we advocate for people who havedisabilities during the Civil Movement, in
all throughout history, we have alot of African Americans who also have disabilities,
who are fighting not just for blackrights, but also for disability rights
at the same time. And Idon't think a lot of people understand that

(16:02):
part of it. So I wantedto recognize some folks who did support that.
One is Brad Lomax. Brad Lomaxwas a part of the disability rights
movement. He was a member ofthe Black Panther Party and the East Oakland
Center for Independent Living, which providedsupport and resources to Black individuals with disabilities,

(16:23):
especially remembered for his vital role inthe nineteen seventy seven five oh four
sit ins, where the Black PantherParty supplied food and supports to the disability
protesters. Audrey Lord, I thinkI said that right. Audrey Lord.
She is a Black lesbian, feminist, mother warrior poet. That's what she

(16:45):
describes herself as. She was anaward winning activist, poet, writer,
and visionary. She wrote Sister Outsider, The Cancer Journals, The Black Unicorn,
and many other books and poems thathighlighted the intersections of her identities.
Her creative works center on black feministframe have been like a foundational piece for
social justice works against racism, classism, hetero sexism, and other systems of

(17:11):
oppression. She had breast cancer navigatedthe later years of her life in that
disability. I mean, really,once you hit cancer and you hit that
point where you can't rely on yourselfsometimes to take care of your own self,
you become disabled at that point.Right. Another individual, Claudia Gordon,
is the first deaf black woman lawyerin the United States. She is

(17:36):
a trailblazer, advocate and leader dedicatedto assisting those of disabilities in other marginalized
communities. In the last role thatshe had, she was President Obama's key
advisor on issues relating to people withdisabilities. She continues advocating in the US
Department of Labour's office. So manypeople I want to mention, but I
also want to mention one individual here. Her name is Barbara Jordan and she

(17:59):
was a famous advocate for voting rights, immigration reform, minimum wage laws,
and civil rights. She was thefirst African American woman from a southern state
in Congress in nineteen seventy three.She is most remembered for her role in
the Watergate hearings and for delivering thekeynote at the nineteen seventy six Democratic National
Convention, being the first black womanto do so, and later in life

(18:23):
she had to use a wheelchair dueto multiple sclerosis MS. And lastly,
I'm probably going to pronounce her namewrong. Haban Germa. She is a
lawyer, advocate, speaker, writer, and activist advocating for disability justice.
Habn is the first deaf blind individualto graduate from Harvard Law School. She

(18:44):
has been named a White House Championfor Change of Change Sorry, and she
has received the Helen Keller Achievement Award, a spot on Forbes thirty Under thirty
List, and Time one hundred Talks. She has also recently published her best
selling memoir, Haban, The DeafBlind Woman who Conquered Harvard Law. She
also has been globally recognized for herinfluence in leaders like Bill Clinton, Prime

(19:08):
Minister Justin Trudeau, and more so, does it just a few? There
are so many people who are activistsand continue to be activists, who are
African Americans fighting not just for theiryou know, black rights, but also
for their disability rights, which isa big thing right now too, so
I wanted to share those. I'mnot sure if there was this yesterday,

(19:30):
Carmen. There was something that happenedin Nashville. Oh God, yes,
it was Saturday. Oh was Saturday, all right, Saturday the seventeenth.
I don't know. I think it'ssomething that we ought to bring up,
something that's happening right now. Sothe Nazis were walking down the streets of
Nashville, Tennessee. You know,people were astounded that it was during Black

(19:52):
History months, but it's like,shouldn't we just be shocked as hell that
it's happening at all? Yeah,I agree, it should never happen.
Yeah, there was a war towipe out the Nazis. Hello, and
we know that they didn't wipe themout because a lot of the Nazis from
that actual war were brought to othercountries. The United States is one of

(20:15):
them, and hidden by our owngovernment. And I'm not a conspiracy theorist,
but I know this is true.I know this is true. There
was a video d L. Huglyhas I follow him on Instagram. I
love D L. Hugly. Ithink he's hilarious, but he's also incredibly
insightful and bright. I just Ilike all of his content, but the

(20:37):
video was just uncut. Them walkingthrough the town. One person with a
British accent called him out and wassaying, you know your cowards. Take
off your mask. Why won't youshow your face? Why won't you your
face? You know your cowards,And he followed them and he was yelling
cowards. Another man who just stoodthere did say, yeah, they're effing
cowards. But these guys were obviouslyunmoved by these two individuals. The rest

(21:03):
of the community with just from thatshort snippet of a video, I think
they were just in shock. Whatdo you do in a situation like that,
I'm verified, First of all,I would be scared, but I
know I would probably say something.I don't know. The individuals that are
in these groups, the fact thatthey cover themselves up it is cowardly.

(21:26):
First of all. It's like,I'm going to go have this movement,
but I'm not going to show myface. And do you know why,
It's because, you know, maybethere are some prominent people in that group.
I don't know, I'm sure thereare maybe, but even so,
like if you work for somebody andyour face was seen in this hate movement,
then you probably get fired. Probablya lot of other things could happen.

(21:48):
People would target you. So it'sjust it's not this big brave effort
that they are trying to like portraythemselves at is very cowardly to not do
that because they know what it meansto be a neo Nazi whatever it is.
Right, Well, yeah, andyou know, yeah, it's ironic
that they they're afraid of backlash,they're afraid of people targeting them. But

(22:14):
that's the exact thing they're doing.They're going out and targeting others. They're
creating fear, They're and I mean, I can't even I just I don't
know, Like I to have awhole mob of people carrying that flag with
masks on is scary enough, butthen to have them chanting their stupid chances,
well, and I think that theyprobably I don't know, maybe i'm

(22:37):
reading this, maybe I don't knowenough about being a Nazi because I'm not
one, obviously, But they didn'tjust persecute or annihilate Jewish individuals. They
weren't just focused on those folks.It was people who were arion who believe
differently. You know, like forinstance, if you were homosexual, you
were targeted. If you were disabled, you were targeted. You were Catholic,

(23:02):
you were targeted. No, it'sstill happening. It's it's not happening.
It's still happened. Yeah, sayso. Yeah, I mean it's
it's a you know, it's agroup of people that just target people that
aren't like them and who would wantto have a world with just a bunch
of hasty face white men, Likereally, is that? Is that what
they're the movement is about? Whowould want that? If you look at

(23:23):
history, and this is just goingto be like a real brief synopsis.
I'm not a historian, and Idon't know everything about this, but I
know that Hitler, when he wasin power, he'd wrote, you know,
and he read a lot of thingsabout other races that obviously were not
are not true because he believed thatthere was a superior race. He believed

(23:47):
others were closer to the evolutionary trackof not being evolved, and he was
trying to eliminate that, which isridiculous. But what was the goal?
What is the goal once you getthere? What's the goal? That's I
don't know, but I yeah,how does that make it? How does
it make it any better going forward? I don't know. I mean there
were so many things like Hitler wasonly five foot nine for starters, Yeah,

(24:10):
and he committed suicide or did he? Right? I know, I've
seen a lot of the documentaries andread a lot about like how he probably
could have escaped, especially since whenthey went to go get his body it
was a different DNA or something likethat wasn't Yeah, it was a woman's
DNA. What woman do you knowthat willingly wants to be a Nazi?

(24:30):
Like I have seen documentary. Imean seriously, like would being a woman,
I would never want to be putin a situation where I'm married to
a Nazi, because that's really whatit was all about. It was really
awful. And even today I didsee a documentary of a woman who got
out of the neo Nazi movement andhow she got into it, and just

(24:53):
the craziness of what happened to takeplace to be able to get into that
situation her to embrace and then go, oh wait a second, I need
to get out of How does thathappen? A lot I don't even I
don't understand. There's red flags obviously. So like you go on a date
with somebody. Let's say you're ona first date and they treat the weight
staff poorly, that's a huge redflag. Fucking ditchum right there. Okay,

(25:17):
sure, second, right, youknow they're going to say something.
You know they're going to say somethingstupid, because people like that can't keep
their mouths shut, you know,so even when they're in the comfort of
their own car or their home andthey don't have their mask on, they're
going to slip and say something.You know, they're going to say something
about something on television, about somebodywalking by. Also huge red flag.

(25:37):
Here's another sign. If you're datingsomebody and they have any sort of Hitler
memorabilia, run just run run,run, run, run, run,
and don't don't act surprised if youknow he comes home smelling like campfire because
he was burning crosses in somebody's yard. Like, there's so many red flags.

(26:00):
You don't accidentally get involved in that. I just don't know how that
would even happen. You know,maybe have a change of heart, which
hopefully you would have a change ofheart. I do believe that I do
believe kids who are born into that, and there's a lot of kids born
into that, and then they growup and this is what they're taught.
This is what they're taught. Samething with religions. Kids are brought up

(26:21):
to think one way. They're justinundated with this horrible misinformation about the world.
So I have to believe some ofthem must have a change of heart,
some of them must know it's wrong. Again, we can put a
finger back on education. As longas public schools in the United States are
not teaching the truth about American historyand slavery and black history. As long

(26:47):
as they're not doing that, peoplecan stay ignorant, they can continue to
push their rhetoric, they can continueto raise their children in the dark.
Will the problem will just continue.So, you know, we have to
start with our schools. It's thebest and fastest way to reach our little
kids, you know, teaching them. And there are appropriate things that we

(27:07):
can teach children when they're five,six, seven and up to you know,
twenty seven. There are appropriate things. What was what was the thing
I heard recently that white parents don'twant their children to feel bad, And
it's like, you know, Imean, there's a time when maybe they
should go, oh maybe there's anage that you bring up different things.
Yeah, absolutely right, But youknow, you go from PG to PG

(27:30):
seven to PG thirteen. I reallykeep it going. I didn't know why
seven. Maybe it's called why sevenokay, yeah, where they can say
but yeah pretty much. Yeah,yeah. So but glad that we talked
about the debacle in Nashville. Ithink I try to think, like,
what is the reason why these thingsare happening again? And the one thing

(27:51):
I think is happening and maybe somemaybe other people would agree. I don't
know. But when Hitler was actuallyappointed chancellor, it was a time there
was a lot of political and economicinstability in that country. And so you
take a look at right now andhow much of that is happening that it
makes sense that it's worsening, andthat potentially there could be someone who comes

(28:17):
in to this just like Hitler did, like Donald Trump, Oh yes,
I was, yes, yes,or anybody, I mean, not just
him. It's a time where anybodyin that realm, right, I mean
we're thinking about the presidency, butI'm talking about it could be anybody at
this point, right that takes advantageof that uses, it encourages, it

(28:38):
supports these and you know, wehave a party in this country that is
very different from where they began andwe pretty much a whole another party.
But yees. So here's what Iknow. I just want to make this
point before wed. This stuff isnot happening again. This stuff never stopped.
Here's what happened during the Civil rightsmovement when that began. And you

(29:00):
know, in the sixties and seventiesand eighties, people were forced to go
under the cloak of darkness to dotheir cross burnings. They weren't as free
to be out because it was lesssocially acceptable. Now because of certain people

(29:21):
in politics, and I'm going tosay Donald Trump, Donald Trump made it
absolutely one hundred percent socially acceptable toblow a dog whistle and get all of
those people out on the streets wherethey still cover their face. But that
that will change to if this,if this behavior continues, these people have
always been here. They had tobe more private about it. It didn't

(29:45):
it never went away. It neverno. No, you know, we
do need to be very careful becausethere is a lot of shaky ground in
the United States. There's economic issues, there are so many divisive politics happening,
you know, that are just drivingpeople further and further apart. I
used to think, you know,in the heart of all people is a

(30:07):
good person. But I don't knowthat. I think I think that all
of those people probably think they're goodpeople as long as you know, they
probably think they're really good people andthat they're absolutely one hundred percent justified,
you know, And that's that's whyit's such a problem like now now with
the people that we have had inpower and people who are trying to get

(30:30):
back into power, they're basically oneother re affirming that yeah, this is
okay, yeah, and one otherthing. This is another trend from back
in nineteen thirty with the Nazis.It was election time and that the Nazis
attracted eight times more votes than inthe previous election in the House anyways,
they did have to vote for howmany seats in the right stag. I

(30:52):
think it's cool, but anyways,so it increased the popularity from the first
to the next time, which againseems like there is that same trend here.
We are in stable, unstable economic, unstable racial stuff happening, unstable
everything. Plus we're seeing a risein You know, I do think that

(31:18):
those who don't pay attention to historyare doomed to repeat it. And I
think that a lot of what's happeninghere does seem to be happening again here
in the US, and it's veryvery comparable. Again, I'm not a
historian, but I can see andI know the trends that are happening if

(31:40):
you just take a take and payattention to the to history and just looking
back at what's really going on andseeing the commonalities the repeating of everything here.
It's a modern day, but it'sstill happening, right, and so
yeah, it is. It iskind of crazy. It is kind of
crazy to see this. I thinkit's important to stand up for what you

(32:01):
believe, but I think we allhave to be looking at what's really going
on here and not getting involved withcrazy conspiracies necessarily that people are putting out
the news outlets, you know,the social media stuff, not gatta,
but really truly just looking at internallyyourself, figuring out what it is that's

(32:22):
happening here so that we can tryto make things better for the future.
I do think there are the folkswho just continue to vote one way.
They don't pay attention to things.They have their own beliefs about why things
are happening, and they're okay withthat because they believe in something else is
going to happen. I don't know, but you and I are pretty aware
of stuff. You pick up onthings outside of you. You're very observant.

(32:45):
Not everybody has that case, Iknow, I know, but Okay,
there are people who still don't evenknow what president is in this country.
What have you ever watched his videoswhere people actually get asked questions on
the street and they have no ideawhat's going on. I mean, there
are people what a president is?Okay, who lives in the White House?

(33:13):
What's his position? They still cannottell you. There are people out
there in our country that do notknow that. Information falls on the education
exactly, the ability to discern thatpeople who vote a certain way, even
though they're like, I just hopeeverything works out, that doesn't mean that
they're a bad person. That's mythat's my stance, because I really don't.

(33:34):
I don't believe everybody's bad. Listen, I stopped talking to people in
my family because of this very thing. I'm that impassionate about it. It's
just too much. Here's the otherthing. If if somebody said on TV,
which Trump did, say he lovesunder educated people, why on earth
would you want to be in thatgroup? I mean, like, that's
not a compliment, that it's notlike a backhaded compliment and saying like,

(33:58):
I support you guys, even thoughyou're on edge. Yeah, I support
you, dummy, because guess what, You're going to pay attention to me.
You're gonna listen to me, andyou're gonna believe everything I say because
you're a dummy. And like that, right, there should have set people
going, whoa, wait, wait, wait, wait, listen, I'm
down for insurrection. But I'm notstupid, right, And I mean,
I know, like we all havethose people that we love, we do

(34:22):
that, Yeah, we can findthe good things in them. Because they
vote that way doesn't mean that theythemselves are Nazis, you know what I
mean? Like to me, Idon't want to ever say that because that's
not true, right, that's nottrue. But if we know that there's
a there is ties to this party, to the Proud Boys, to the

(34:43):
neo Nazis, to all of theseother derelict groups. I would why can't
Why can't people go just for thatreason a logo. I need to put
some distance between me and this thisperson. I think there's a lot of
people who might support a Republican partybut are unders of what's going on here.
They're like, I don't identify itwith these crazy people. I'm not

(35:04):
a Democrat either. What the heckdo I do here? And so how
do you pull out of that?There's no party and no person running right
now, nobody running in the futurethat is going to start their own party.
I mean, maybe start my ownparty. I'll call it the Party
of good people with checkered pasts.Well, you know, you could be

(35:24):
my running mate, Okay, yeah, common sense, that's what we call
ourselves, You and I, Carmen. As we go through and talk about
these things, we're able to disagreeand understand and respect each other still,
which I really love about what wedo and what we talk about. We're
able to talk about different points ofview. You can disagree without being disagreeable.

(35:46):
Yeah, I think that if Ihave. I mean, we we
agree on a lot, but there'salso a lot we disagree on. Yeah,
I'm just I'm just really glad thatwe have the ability to do that,
and we can talk about important things, and we can talk about issues
and still laugh about things, butmost of all that we can respect each
other and get through that conversation.Your opinion in my opinion doesn't take away

(36:08):
from each other. No, andit doesn't. And so it's really good
that we're able to do that.And the wish that I have everybody listening
today is that they take that away. You know, it was Ruth Bader
Ginsburg actually said you can disagree withoutbeing disagreeable. And I really hope people
take that as they go about havingthese conversations in the community or with their

(36:31):
friends or their families, have morecompass. That's really important to have more
conversations about these things. And sometimesit does feel ugly. Sometimes it feels
gross when we have to face certainrealities in our own life. No matter
what we disagree on, Jessica,I always have an immense amount of respect
for you, and I care aboutyou very much, and I think you

(36:53):
are truly one of the best peopleI've ever met. Ah Garmage, you
are thank you. You are oneof the sweetest, most sincere, honest
kind of people. I've ever met. Well, thank you. I have
the same respect for you, andwe're good friends and we're able to talk
about those things. So thank youvery much because I think having a person
to talk about those things. Butsometimes you throw in your humor, which

(37:15):
I love, or maybe just somestraight up comments honesty that you're being able
to do that is really rubbed offon me too. Oh got you know
it? Now, just for thefor the listeners, go ahead and say
the F word. She well,you already go back a couple episodes.
Okay, goodbye everybody time. Thankseveryone for joining us today on small Town

(37:39):
USA. If you want to hearmore small Town hit subscribe now, go
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